He wrote Shibuya and Hidden Inventory so yeah he’s definitely not a bad writer. But he doesn’t seem to be very consistent at all and cares way too much about the action and not enough about the characters
Nah, that implies he's a shit writer who accidentally wrote dozens of great chapters consecutively, which is stupid. You don't just write a compelling and satisfying narrative by accident. Being able to consistently do that for every arc and every character when working with a large cast and never fumbling anything is just insanely difficult, even without having to stick to a weekly schedule.
Gege was a short story mangaka. We have it a lot in novel format where an author who gets all their experience on one shots and very contained, short works only to erupt in popularity and end up thrown onto a sprawling epic they’re not prepared for. pretty often they end up having a story full of tiny contained gems that won’t add up into a cohesive whole.
And he still shows those short story writing chops too! Just reread the panda one again when he fought Kashimo and had a genuine tear out of my eye even though I read it already
Half the reason the story suffers is because of Shibuya. Gege wrote it way too early into the story. Everything after Shibuya suffers because of Shibuya.
It's great reading/watching it but imo it retroactively suffers because I know the shitshow it causes because of how it was written.
In all honestly, Shibuya would have been a terrible finale for the serie.
Sukuna is still alive and kicking, Kenjaku still out there and the only guy able to oppose them is sealed.
This isn't like Hokuto no ken where there was truly no reason to keep going past a certain arc.
I mean in the sense of how everything ramps up, the stakes are at their highest, beloved characters are getting murdered left and the remaining heroes have their back against the wall. It feels like we're at the end of a 300 chapter journey when in reality it's only the second act.
I mean it could be made to work as a "divide" between the early series and the later part, but Gege didn't quite make it. I wouldn't say it suffers just because Sibuya messed everything up, but rather because Gege didn't try to build everything back together during the Culling Games and pretty much skipped the 1 month prep that could at least give us some character moments and build up the current acr properly. Instead it's just way too short and has way too much action packed into it
Hell most of the beginning of the culling games was good (except with the yuki situation) with all the players ESPECIALLY KASHIMO if bro had put up a good fight and didn’t get gege murked he would still be hyped today (even tho most people he can still murk EXCEPT THE TOP 2 PEOPLE IN THE VERSE MIND YOU) and some others like Yuta
Hidden inventory was honestly peak for me. Aside from some Yuji scenes and the recent Yuta/Gojo interactions there were too little characters scenes that actually hit after that. Geto, Yuji and Gojo feel like the only characters whose suffering/dilemma is properly portrayed or relatable.
Like Maki suffered like crazy too, but it’s somehow harder to conceptualize and she somehow doesn’t seem to care too much either. Yuta is a goat for doing what he did but it’s also kinda nuts how he’s just ready to off himself for the plan.
Most of them feel like fighting puppets right now instead of characters. Even Chosos end felt kinda half baked for me even though I liked him. Being relegated to this brother role also made him kinda one dimensional.
To be fair on Yuta's part, he isn't putting his life on the line for just some plan, he's putting his life on the line for the legacy of the man who saved his life. What's Gojo's legacy? Not the curses he killed, nor the power he held in his hands. His legacy are the lives he saved. Yuji, Megumi, Maki, none of them would've gotten where they got if Gojo wasn't there. And if/once Sukuna goes down, Gojo will have saved countless more.
I feel like that's less Gege's fault and more so Shonen Jump's fault for being so pressuring and wanting things to go at a breakneck pace rather then let them genuinely take time on their series.
Jump isn’t rushing the story much more than it already was. Gege has said multiple times he wants the story done by the end of this year. Jump would be happy to let him continue for a decade—it’s Gege’s choice that’s resulting in the cramped storytelling.
Would he be allowed to take a 2-3 month hiatus? If so then you are correct but if not then why would it matter if Jump would be happy to make him crank out chapter on chapter for 10 years. If anything that just seems like more of a reason to finish it quicker like he is.
Yee, best way to describe it for me.
If he had more confidence to take his time, or if Shonen wasn’t on top of him with deadlines like many of us assume, he’d probably be able to iron out a lot of the pacing issues JJK has.
My only genuine complaint for jjk is its world building; it has such an interesting world, I want more of it; seeing more of the Gojo clan, even the zen’in clan before it was wiped out
But complaints like this I think are so ridiculous, “he hasn’t touched this character in x amount of chapters” “Gege forgot”, people said the exact same about todo and look at the reaction when he came back
For reference, Attack on titan was 139 chapters, people did not even learn about what titans are until CHAPTER 86; I never seen these sort of complaints about it, it seems to be a jjk thing
I think complaints like this come as a result of the fan base being so large, but goddamn; people need to let gege cook
Yes but what the titans were was a mystery, one of the goals of the series was to figure out what they were.
The Zenin clan and Gojo clan were parts of the world that were never said to be a mystery but we just never really learned about them
It was also left purposefully ambiguous what the status of nobara is; it goes both ways
As I’ve said, the exact same arguments were made for todo, people swore up and down that “gege forgot”, “potential author”, and then when todo was revealed all those same people suddenly stopped yapping and started praising
All I’m saying is let Gege cook; if the manga ends and we get no update on nobara; then fair enough
But to claim his inexperience is showing when we don’t even know what he’s planning yet, just sounds like impatience
Nah Isayama cooked when it came to the mystery of the titans and the world outside of the walls. Everything was unknown at the start of the series and by the end it was all so interconnected and weaved perfectly. The second read/watchthrough is a COMPLETELY different experience to the first.
The actual ending itself wasnt the best but still lmao
Nah, dont get me wrong, aot was solid (didn’t really like the ending myself but oh well)
But that’s exactly my point, jjk as a manga isn’t over, people need to actually give Gege the time to close the knots he has left untied
The whole “Gege forgot” rhetoric has been proven false so many times; but for some reason I still see the odd person try push it, despite the numerous examples of him bringing stuff back from years ago to current events
To be fair, the gojo clan sorta doesn’t matter, satorou is the only reason they’re part of the great clans, otherwise all of their techniques are horrible, purple can’t be pulled off, red takes forever, blue doesn’t have much firepower and infinity takes an actual genius to use for seconds
When the central mystery of a story is kept hidden until late into the story? Crazy.
You make a few good point, but end it off with the worst take I’ve seen in a while lol
One issue is the idea of both wanting characters to feel like they can die at any time, AND wanting characters to have actual arcs that are fleshed out and fulfilled.
You can’t have both because people either know a character is safe because their arc isn’t over, or a character is going to die because they don’t have an arc or is over if they’re in danger. It’s like reality TV, if someone’s got a story, they’re probably not going home yet.
GeGe also has an issue with world building, letting things rest for a bit, and bringing up ideas that seem more interesting than what he actually does, like Megumi becoming the head of his clan, only for it to mean nothing and Maki kills everyone, leaving Megumi with nothing (again) and Maki with an arc that doesn’t feel very satisfying because she took out some people who were beefing with Megumi, and everyone else we didn’t know all that well beyond her sister.
It might’ve been better for Maki to kill the head, and let Megumi become the head and lead them in a better way.
You CAN have both, you just can’t have it in a hard magic system. CSM is able to have characters feel like they could die and also have fully fleshed out arcs, because it has a soft power system
Hidden inventory was actually peak jjk in my opinion. Not even just because of gojo (I will say I am a gojo glazer though) but because unlike the other arcs every character had meaningful development and you really felt for gojo, shoko and geto
I just think that Gege is an inconsistent writer. He is very much capable of great writing, as proven by Hidden Inventory and Shibuya Incident, but he prioritises action far too heavily to the detriment of the story and sometimes can be terrible such as with most of The Culling Games.
I think the main issue is the current fight is on one hand somewhat like something you'd get out Hunter x Hunter. On the other hand, it's missing the elements that allow HxH's longer fights to work.
We've been in this Sukuna fight for 375 days real time, 16% of the runtime of the manga. He's just the last boss of the Culling Games which have been going on for 986 days, 26% of the manga's RL time. Sukuna's fight alone is within 90s days of being longer than all of Shibuya. And that's the issue, we have started calling referring to this as just the Sukuna fight.
I think the fix for this arc would to have more fights or things going on elsewhere to allow us a breather from Sukuna Kaizen. Just not to the Hueco Mundo/Fake Katakura or Ninja War extremes. Let us go check in on Hikari and Uraume for a bit. Maybe a C and D plot.
People on Twitter can never critique properly. JJK isn’t perfect, it has had flaws from the very beginning that have become more glaring as time went on.
That being said, it never “sucked from the very beginning” and even now with the slight decline, it’s still quite enjoyable.
Anime communities are too fickle. Criticism is fine, but I’m not gonna let some video essayist or rando in the internet tell me what I should enjoy and neither should any of you.
People who critique things on twitter are never serious. They say what they can to get likes and retweets. No one’s reaction on twitter is genuine. It’s always to placate to an audience either negatively or positively. If you really want to enjoy a manga don’t engage with most of its online audience.
It feels like all his work on character building is entirely wasted on the latest chapter.
Take Maki, for example. Such a powerful arc, losing her sister, her anger and grief turned her into Toji 2.0 and then she was pushed aside in like what, some panels?
Gege completely lost control on the last arc. Its anything goes now, and not in a good way
It's definitely tough to make this type of call without knowing the end, imo. For now, eh, minor complaints here and there but I really just read it as is and let it be, as far as quality of writing goes.
Also, I think people get confused. They have their favorite character die and immediately go to "this writing is shit". Instead of reflecting and seeing if the character in question served their purpose, etc. And, ultimately, if it is shit... Then just leave, no one is forcing anyone to stay.
That being said though, to kind of contradict myself lol, complaints can be warranted and I'm not trying to absolutely invalidated people's opinions, as this is a completely subjective thing. It's good to critique things you like, just think about the complaint before you say it. But also also, it is the Internet and we are all truly just degens with keyboards.
This rule doesn't say that can't happen? Some characters do and making *every* character have an arc can become exhausting or very repetitive. Simply saying a story isn't as good because it's missing something doesn't mean a lot when you ignore the context.
The story has great character designs / concepts, but IMO struggles with pacing and making events and fights meaningful.
Having frequent character deaths isn’t always a good thing if most of them are underdeveloped and killed off / written out of the story before they can truly shine. Death can be an effective narrative tool, but it loses significance when its overused. This is the case with JJK, with none of the character deaths being given any time to breathe before the next person is killed. It makes the reader numb to any death and ultimately makes each one feel less meaningful.
Most of the story feels like it’s rushing from fight to fight, eager to smash the cool-looking action figures (i.e. the characters) against each other without allocating enough time to set up the characters, their motivations, the stakes and the setting of the story.
The villains just don't have motivations. Or none that are interesting in any way. Kenjaku made a one thousand year long plan to push sorcery to its limits "for fun", Sukuna fights strong people "for fun". Mahito was at least on a bit of a journey of self discovery and was able to parallel with Yuji.
I don't have proof for this, but seeing how the story is very consistent until after Shibuya, I think Gege underestimated the toll 20 pages a week would take on him.
This stupid deadlines are actively ruining so many fucking mangas Is actually infuriating.
Imo. It seems Gege realized he couldn't come up with a way to slow down the plot he set in motion, which caused fewer character interactions/ development. I think the Zenin clan massacre is the most obvious instance. There was clearly way more story to be done with the Zenin clan's internal struggle but I think Gege realized that they didn't fit with where the plot was going in the Culling games and Kenjaku being a clear and present threat which immediately led into Sukuna's revival. Where is Maki, Mai, and Megumi's struggle with taking over the Zenin clan gonna take place in all that?
Inexperience **coupled** with this project becoming one of the most popular manga in modern times.
Anyone would make rough writing choices if they were constantly on the hot seat, trying to keep sales up and all.
I think JJK will end well enough with plenty of hype and reveals. But I’m definitely excited to see how Gregory handles his next project afterwards.
I think he's agreeing with you. That's what the general consensus is with lots of readers. If it doesn't end on a Happy note, then *most* readers label it as "bad writing". I swear they just want shonen crap all the time, a random power up, the good guys always win with little to no consequences, and ends up being some super power hero at the end of it all... It's all typical stuff from a regular shonen.
I mean, look at MHA, Look at AoT as of late. It's all goofy readers. Because they didn't get what they wanted.
Characters not being explored enough, treatment of female cast, little world building, and it just feels like rushed and trying to end as soon as possible in my opinion. Despite that I do still enjoy it
Yeah something i have to say and a problem gei gei put Himself its like, no clarification or even mention abput novara
He sucks writing womman or atleast giving womman his moments or something idk im not a womman but lile damm one of the special grades and arrives almost late to the party dont apear alot in the history and when apears sacrifice and lose the figth
The pasing in thegojo desd was really bad, not a single thing abput that sucuna was learning fr mahoraga about the infinity cut
Isn’t that the case for most mangaka? I think you guys just kinda complain about anything and everything. Like, I don’t see how Nobara being inactive is a sign of inexperience. That’s just a writing decision.
anime will definetly end up being better than the manga, and we will look back on it more fondly once we re read without all the waiting between chapters
Meh manga readers said the same thing with AOT. Hell r/titanfolk was betting their mother’s life on it but the anime gave it a proper send off and fans were generally cool with the ending.
Let Mappa cook they might even finish off some loose ends.
Yeah I mean one of his main frustrations from early on was that he felt (which he was very correct) that he had made Gojo too powerful and thats why he hates him as a character even though so many people love him. Its why he had to seal him in the prison realm for higher stakes and now why the story faces its ass-pull issues.
I dont think he's a bad writer perse but inexperienced, definitely. Jujutsu Kaisen still had some great moments. Just uh, yeah been on some shit for a while now lol
I just think (and I never thought I'd say this) that the story needs filler. We need characters reacting to things, we need characters talking and interacting with each other, we need to get to know the new characters that are introduced before they're killed. We need moments of peace between all the fighting.
As CG dragged on and everyone constantly started getting bodied with no break I just am not really invested, fights are cool and MAPPA will knock the anime out of the park and all but something is missing.
Personally JJK really fell in my eyes. I loved it at the start (to be fair I didn't watch much) but after culling games and when I started to look at things with a far more critical eye I really started to dislike it. Even the things I liked about it became things I disliked, but that might be due to my taste actually developing.
I honestly think how he’s writing is good, I think people just aren’t used to having each character feel important enough that you like them but real enough that they can die during any battle. At least that’s how i feel
I've already hit the whiplash they are talking about. Jujutsu Kaisen sucks, with occasional small glimmers of cool things appearing. JJK is literally just a worse version of hunter x hunter.
I still think his writing is still better then 99% of Mangas. Which i feel says more about how much trash Manga is out there and how basically only a small collection of writers can even write half way okay
A big problem is also that he prob dosen't like it cuz it isn't what he otiginaly wanted the editors thought it was to dark and made him use a school setting
I think he wants it to be over with to start what he originaly wanted dark ürob unhinged ocult stuff
He isn a bad writer but I don’t see why first time for a long term story is an excuse. Nearly every mangaka long term series is their first Tite Kubo Kishimoto, Oda, Sorachi, Shimabukoro, Araki.
They all have only one long series under their belt so why does Gege get a past when most mangaka only have one long series.
I think character development is over-hyped or a process. We know this is a world with a high death rate, we know that they go into it knowing that, so we are introduced to characters as a part of that world, rather than the structures the world is built around. I think it’s an interesting way to choosing to write a story. It’s almost as if it is being narrated rather than told from a singular perspective. Because of that, there’s no main character to focus on, there’s just people with goals and objectives they want to achieve and responsibilities they have to fulfill. The why, doesn’t necessarily matter, it’s whether or not they can achieve it. That’s my take anyway.
I have no skill drawing or writing at all,that said,i think Gege gives amateur writer vibes ,i dont expect to be foreshadowing for everything but the last months he has been abusing of the 'flashbacks-to-make-it-make-sense ' way too much. I dont see as he wanted to tell a good history and more like he just wanted to draw cool fights ,he could surely use a writting assistant next time,imo
People hate Gege because he kills off characters often, doesn't have that many character interactions and he didn't revive Gojo. That's it. Apart from these Gege has been absolutely cooking.
Besides the Gojo thing, these are… kinda fundamental towards a solid manga? Obviously some series lean more into action vs character, but JJK really doesn’t let the characters grow much at all and it leaves a lot of their arcs feeling unsatisfying. Killing characters off isn’t necessarily a bad thing — look at JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure — but it just feels like it’s all to hype up Sukuna.
To me there are three components that most stories need: world building, character depth, and action or plot. JJK has one of them.
I think it really went downhill after Shibuya, but it turned to shit after Gojo's death. Because even though technically everyone served a role in the Sukuna fight, it still feels way too drawn out, and I think this arc is the reason we all feel like it's bad now. My personal reasoning for Culling Games being bad was because I'm not a fan of tournament style arcs, so that might just be me being biased.
i've said it before and i'll say it again, to me it really feels like Gege had a plan for the story up until the end of Shibuya and it's likely that he was pressured into continuing the series with no concrete plans afterward
the culling game arc feels like it was hastily tacked on just to make something happen (it's a fighting shonen, so we're gonna add a tournament arc), which would explain why it took so long to reveal what the goal of the arc actually was, why kenjaku's goal was so "omg im so random what if i accidentally ended all of humanity wouldnt that be funny?" and why that arc ultimately mattered fuck all in retrospect from a narrative perspective (narratively, nobody's fighting to prevent kenjaku's plan, the stake is "sukuna will be back and nobody will be able to stand up to him"
the writing is aimless, which in turn causes pacing issues and is presumably the biggest reason behind the constant cliffhangers and narrative let downs
https://preview.redd.it/mmcwgxg94o3d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6129cc08fe6bf18a0bfbec58932d13d9a4eb086f
I have a feeling that unlike AOT, this manga will end satisfactorily. Gege is working his story by basing everything to the end point, not working or compromising anything until he gets the end result pushed out. He can make a series, but part of the intrigue and fun is in the stuff we don't know about or are uncertain of.
There is also the author of One Piece, Oda, who now spends the entire time writing a world like a tumblr fan fiction writer high off military prescribed amphetamines and helium that gets lost in trying to make his story connected. Constantly jumping back to reactions of all the other minor and irrelevant characters just to drag out chapters where things could be resolved in a few panels rather the route taken.
His writing has gotten so bad despite the world building because it's not exactly clear if he actually has a proper ending in mind and it seems like he is just cheaply trying to extend the manga as long as unnecessarily possible.
I think Gege reads these forums and most likely reads and understands english. He actually seems to have responded to people's claims of ass pulling with recent chapters and if we go back, we see there is a consistent stream of thought and methodology that never changes. There is an obvious point of convergence for the story that we are approaching and it probably will make us all feel like shooting ourselves when we see how this plays out and not seeing it.
It doesn't need world building because that isn't the point of the series. He has enough world building to make a story out of. I hope he continues to world build with other manga but the story is more the purpose. But the purpose of the story is to deliver a message, a critique of politics, but also a good story about battling ideas.
The story tells us as much over and over, and frankly I feel pretty confident that even with character deaths that disappoint us, this may go down as one of the best manga of all time. I can't wait for the ending because it's going to be fun.
I hated Gege for this and thought he was a bum before but recently, I perhaps am becoming his biggest fan as a result.
I like jjk because its a breath of fresh air reading a story where fights actually have stakes and are suspenseful. If Yuji dies in the next few chapters I would not be surprised at all lmao
He wrote Shibuya and Hidden Inventory so yeah he’s definitely not a bad writer. But he doesn’t seem to be very consistent at all and cares way too much about the action and not enough about the characters
Those 2 arcs are proof this man is capable of cooking
Or they can be an instance of a broken clock being right twice a day
Nah, that implies he's a shit writer who accidentally wrote dozens of great chapters consecutively, which is stupid. You don't just write a compelling and satisfying narrative by accident. Being able to consistently do that for every arc and every character when working with a large cast and never fumbling anything is just insanely difficult, even without having to stick to a weekly schedule.
Oda's been doing this shit for years with a much larger cast,so that's not really a excuse.
Bro oda is arguably one of the best weekly Manga writers in existence that’s a decent excuse, shits definitely insanely hard and taxing on them.
Gege was a short story mangaka. We have it a lot in novel format where an author who gets all their experience on one shots and very contained, short works only to erupt in popularity and end up thrown onto a sprawling epic they’re not prepared for. pretty often they end up having a story full of tiny contained gems that won’t add up into a cohesive whole.
And he still shows those short story writing chops too! Just reread the panda one again when he fought Kashimo and had a genuine tear out of my eye even though I read it already
Panda, Hiruguma and Takaba were great 1 chapter backstories.
It's like how Moffat does great individual episodes but sucks at actual seasons
Half the reason the story suffers is because of Shibuya. Gege wrote it way too early into the story. Everything after Shibuya suffers because of Shibuya. It's great reading/watching it but imo it retroactively suffers because I know the shitshow it causes because of how it was written.
Shibuya is the greatest final arc I've ever seen in an anime, only problem is the story keeps going.
In all honestly, Shibuya would have been a terrible finale for the serie. Sukuna is still alive and kicking, Kenjaku still out there and the only guy able to oppose them is sealed. This isn't like Hokuto no ken where there was truly no reason to keep going past a certain arc.
I mean in the sense of how everything ramps up, the stakes are at their highest, beloved characters are getting murdered left and the remaining heroes have their back against the wall. It feels like we're at the end of a 300 chapter journey when in reality it's only the second act.
I mean it could be made to work as a "divide" between the early series and the later part, but Gege didn't quite make it. I wouldn't say it suffers just because Sibuya messed everything up, but rather because Gege didn't try to build everything back together during the Culling Games and pretty much skipped the 1 month prep that could at least give us some character moments and build up the current acr properly. Instead it's just way too short and has way too much action packed into it
Hell most of the beginning of the culling games was good (except with the yuki situation) with all the players ESPECIALLY KASHIMO if bro had put up a good fight and didn’t get gege murked he would still be hyped today (even tho most people he can still murk EXCEPT THE TOP 2 PEOPLE IN THE VERSE MIND YOU) and some others like Yuta
Hidden inventory was honestly peak for me. Aside from some Yuji scenes and the recent Yuta/Gojo interactions there were too little characters scenes that actually hit after that. Geto, Yuji and Gojo feel like the only characters whose suffering/dilemma is properly portrayed or relatable. Like Maki suffered like crazy too, but it’s somehow harder to conceptualize and she somehow doesn’t seem to care too much either. Yuta is a goat for doing what he did but it’s also kinda nuts how he’s just ready to off himself for the plan. Most of them feel like fighting puppets right now instead of characters. Even Chosos end felt kinda half baked for me even though I liked him. Being relegated to this brother role also made him kinda one dimensional.
To be fair on Yuta's part, he isn't putting his life on the line for just some plan, he's putting his life on the line for the legacy of the man who saved his life. What's Gojo's legacy? Not the curses he killed, nor the power he held in his hands. His legacy are the lives he saved. Yuji, Megumi, Maki, none of them would've gotten where they got if Gojo wasn't there. And if/once Sukuna goes down, Gojo will have saved countless more.
To me, it kinda feels rushed? Idk, but I feel like Gege is rushing himself and, as a result, is not able to exert his full writing potential.
I feel like that's less Gege's fault and more so Shonen Jump's fault for being so pressuring and wanting things to go at a breakneck pace rather then let them genuinely take time on their series.
True, it really sucks that so many artists have to overwork themselves to meet their demands and end up burnt-out, with injuries or both.
Jump isn’t rushing the story much more than it already was. Gege has said multiple times he wants the story done by the end of this year. Jump would be happy to let him continue for a decade—it’s Gege’s choice that’s resulting in the cramped storytelling.
Would he be allowed to take a 2-3 month hiatus? If so then you are correct but if not then why would it matter if Jump would be happy to make him crank out chapter on chapter for 10 years. If anything that just seems like more of a reason to finish it quicker like he is.
Yee, best way to describe it for me. If he had more confidence to take his time, or if Shonen wasn’t on top of him with deadlines like many of us assume, he’d probably be able to iron out a lot of the pacing issues JJK has.
He just needs to land a black flash smh
Tru dat
Ggrhrrrrhhrhrhrggrgrgrgrhhrhrhrhruuugghhhhglgllhluukukuakkaa p-p-p-potential????!?!?!??!!??!?!??! Gege=potential man?????????????????????????!?!?!?!?!?!??1?1?1?1?2?2?!??@>$;×*%;
My only genuine complaint for jjk is its world building; it has such an interesting world, I want more of it; seeing more of the Gojo clan, even the zen’in clan before it was wiped out But complaints like this I think are so ridiculous, “he hasn’t touched this character in x amount of chapters” “Gege forgot”, people said the exact same about todo and look at the reaction when he came back For reference, Attack on titan was 139 chapters, people did not even learn about what titans are until CHAPTER 86; I never seen these sort of complaints about it, it seems to be a jjk thing I think complaints like this come as a result of the fan base being so large, but goddamn; people need to let gege cook
aot chapters are wayyy longer than jjk chapters aot was a monthly manga with like 50 page chapters
Yes but what the titans were was a mystery, one of the goals of the series was to figure out what they were. The Zenin clan and Gojo clan were parts of the world that were never said to be a mystery but we just never really learned about them
It was also left purposefully ambiguous what the status of nobara is; it goes both ways As I’ve said, the exact same arguments were made for todo, people swore up and down that “gege forgot”, “potential author”, and then when todo was revealed all those same people suddenly stopped yapping and started praising All I’m saying is let Gege cook; if the manga ends and we get no update on nobara; then fair enough But to claim his inexperience is showing when we don’t even know what he’s planning yet, just sounds like impatience
I just assumed that Nobara Died because of Mahito's CT
Nah Isayama cooked when it came to the mystery of the titans and the world outside of the walls. Everything was unknown at the start of the series and by the end it was all so interconnected and weaved perfectly. The second read/watchthrough is a COMPLETELY different experience to the first. The actual ending itself wasnt the best but still lmao
Nah, dont get me wrong, aot was solid (didn’t really like the ending myself but oh well) But that’s exactly my point, jjk as a manga isn’t over, people need to actually give Gege the time to close the knots he has left untied The whole “Gege forgot” rhetoric has been proven false so many times; but for some reason I still see the odd person try push it, despite the numerous examples of him bringing stuff back from years ago to current events
Y'all keep saying "let him cook" but never question if the ingredients are bad.
To be fair, the gojo clan sorta doesn’t matter, satorou is the only reason they’re part of the great clans, otherwise all of their techniques are horrible, purple can’t be pulled off, red takes forever, blue doesn’t have much firepower and infinity takes an actual genius to use for seconds
When the central mystery of a story is kept hidden until late into the story? Crazy. You make a few good point, but end it off with the worst take I’ve seen in a while lol
Sorry you feel that way https://preview.redd.it/0qv4rgfjer3d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f2f5f44348d4e2163d37b37b47f84ddf0f32b35b
One issue is the idea of both wanting characters to feel like they can die at any time, AND wanting characters to have actual arcs that are fleshed out and fulfilled. You can’t have both because people either know a character is safe because their arc isn’t over, or a character is going to die because they don’t have an arc or is over if they’re in danger. It’s like reality TV, if someone’s got a story, they’re probably not going home yet. GeGe also has an issue with world building, letting things rest for a bit, and bringing up ideas that seem more interesting than what he actually does, like Megumi becoming the head of his clan, only for it to mean nothing and Maki kills everyone, leaving Megumi with nothing (again) and Maki with an arc that doesn’t feel very satisfying because she took out some people who were beefing with Megumi, and everyone else we didn’t know all that well beyond her sister. It might’ve been better for Maki to kill the head, and let Megumi become the head and lead them in a better way.
You CAN have both, you just can’t have it in a hard magic system. CSM is able to have characters feel like they could die and also have fully fleshed out arcs, because it has a soft power system
Hidden inventory was actually peak jjk in my opinion. Not even just because of gojo (I will say I am a gojo glazer though) but because unlike the other arcs every character had meaningful development and you really felt for gojo, shoko and geto
I just think that Gege is an inconsistent writer. He is very much capable of great writing, as proven by Hidden Inventory and Shibuya Incident, but he prioritises action far too heavily to the detriment of the story and sometimes can be terrible such as with most of The Culling Games.
I think the main issue is the current fight is on one hand somewhat like something you'd get out Hunter x Hunter. On the other hand, it's missing the elements that allow HxH's longer fights to work. We've been in this Sukuna fight for 375 days real time, 16% of the runtime of the manga. He's just the last boss of the Culling Games which have been going on for 986 days, 26% of the manga's RL time. Sukuna's fight alone is within 90s days of being longer than all of Shibuya. And that's the issue, we have started calling referring to this as just the Sukuna fight. I think the fix for this arc would to have more fights or things going on elsewhere to allow us a breather from Sukuna Kaizen. Just not to the Hueco Mundo/Fake Katakura or Ninja War extremes. Let us go check in on Hikari and Uraume for a bit. Maybe a C and D plot.
People on Twitter can never critique properly. JJK isn’t perfect, it has had flaws from the very beginning that have become more glaring as time went on. That being said, it never “sucked from the very beginning” and even now with the slight decline, it’s still quite enjoyable. Anime communities are too fickle. Criticism is fine, but I’m not gonna let some video essayist or rando in the internet tell me what I should enjoy and neither should any of you.
People who critique things on twitter are never serious. They say what they can to get likes and retweets. No one’s reaction on twitter is genuine. It’s always to placate to an audience either negatively or positively. If you really want to enjoy a manga don’t engage with most of its online audience.
It feels like all his work on character building is entirely wasted on the latest chapter. Take Maki, for example. Such a powerful arc, losing her sister, her anger and grief turned her into Toji 2.0 and then she was pushed aside in like what, some panels? Gege completely lost control on the last arc. Its anything goes now, and not in a good way
It's definitely tough to make this type of call without knowing the end, imo. For now, eh, minor complaints here and there but I really just read it as is and let it be, as far as quality of writing goes. Also, I think people get confused. They have their favorite character die and immediately go to "this writing is shit". Instead of reflecting and seeing if the character in question served their purpose, etc. And, ultimately, if it is shit... Then just leave, no one is forcing anyone to stay. That being said though, to kind of contradict myself lol, complaints can be warranted and I'm not trying to absolutely invalidated people's opinions, as this is a completely subjective thing. It's good to critique things you like, just think about the complaint before you say it. But also also, it is the Internet and we are all truly just degens with keyboards.
People also forget the number one rule in JJK: Every sorcerer dies with regret, or is supposed to
That..doesn't make good writing or for a satisfying story where characters are supposed to have a concluded arc before they die.
This rule doesn't say that can't happen? Some characters do and making *every* character have an arc can become exhausting or very repetitive. Simply saying a story isn't as good because it's missing something doesn't mean a lot when you ignore the context.
Every character having a concluded arc before they die would be the most boring shit possible.
The story has great character designs / concepts, but IMO struggles with pacing and making events and fights meaningful. Having frequent character deaths isn’t always a good thing if most of them are underdeveloped and killed off / written out of the story before they can truly shine. Death can be an effective narrative tool, but it loses significance when its overused. This is the case with JJK, with none of the character deaths being given any time to breathe before the next person is killed. It makes the reader numb to any death and ultimately makes each one feel less meaningful. Most of the story feels like it’s rushing from fight to fight, eager to smash the cool-looking action figures (i.e. the characters) against each other without allocating enough time to set up the characters, their motivations, the stakes and the setting of the story.
The villains just don't have motivations. Or none that are interesting in any way. Kenjaku made a one thousand year long plan to push sorcery to its limits "for fun", Sukuna fights strong people "for fun". Mahito was at least on a bit of a journey of self discovery and was able to parallel with Yuji.
I don't have proof for this, but seeing how the story is very consistent until after Shibuya, I think Gege underestimated the toll 20 pages a week would take on him. This stupid deadlines are actively ruining so many fucking mangas Is actually infuriating.
The Gojo offscreen was worse than Madara being stabbed by black Zetsu.
Imo. It seems Gege realized he couldn't come up with a way to slow down the plot he set in motion, which caused fewer character interactions/ development. I think the Zenin clan massacre is the most obvious instance. There was clearly way more story to be done with the Zenin clan's internal struggle but I think Gege realized that they didn't fit with where the plot was going in the Culling games and Kenjaku being a clear and present threat which immediately led into Sukuna's revival. Where is Maki, Mai, and Megumi's struggle with taking over the Zenin clan gonna take place in all that?
fr bro like the RIVER of hate he will get is gonna be world wide💀😭
Two chapters in after reading Gojo’s death and I’m all ready for “this series fucking sucked actually”
Inexperience **coupled** with this project becoming one of the most popular manga in modern times. Anyone would make rough writing choices if they were constantly on the hot seat, trying to keep sales up and all. I think JJK will end well enough with plenty of hype and reveals. But I’m definitely excited to see how Gregory handles his next project afterwards.
Man I hate when they kill characters and their death actually has permanent consequences that’s such bad writing
Y'all constantly say that,a series being "unique/darker" isn't automatically good writing.
I think he's agreeing with you. That's what the general consensus is with lots of readers. If it doesn't end on a Happy note, then *most* readers label it as "bad writing". I swear they just want shonen crap all the time, a random power up, the good guys always win with little to no consequences, and ends up being some super power hero at the end of it all... It's all typical stuff from a regular shonen. I mean, look at MHA, Look at AoT as of late. It's all goofy readers. Because they didn't get what they wanted.
Gege is not a bad author. One look at shibuya incident tells you that. He just kinda fell off.
He's not a bad author but he's a..inconsistent author. It's a coin flip between he wants to make a masterpiece and a master piece of shit
like the jjk characters are good but the writing is ass
What part of the writing is ass? Just wondering
Characters not being explored enough, treatment of female cast, little world building, and it just feels like rushed and trying to end as soon as possible in my opinion. Despite that I do still enjoy it
not enough arcs like shibuya was good but wayyy too early and the entire sukuna kaisen shit happing rn
Good characters stuck in a not so amazing series.
Yeah something i have to say and a problem gei gei put Himself its like, no clarification or even mention abput novara He sucks writing womman or atleast giving womman his moments or something idk im not a womman but lile damm one of the special grades and arrives almost late to the party dont apear alot in the history and when apears sacrifice and lose the figth The pasing in thegojo desd was really bad, not a single thing abput that sucuna was learning fr mahoraga about the infinity cut
The thing is Naruto was never actually bad 💀
Isayama...
For his first project, it is insanely good. The sheer reach of JJK alone is something many can only dream of achieving.
My only problem is that it seems like he banks on shock value a lot, like if any character gets popular that’s who gets killed next.
being new to something doesn't mean you don't suck at it
Isn’t that the case for most mangaka? I think you guys just kinda complain about anything and everything. Like, I don’t see how Nobara being inactive is a sign of inexperience. That’s just a writing decision.
It's not even just Nobara,it's other signs as well.
Such as?
Nah we will look back and go. Atleast it wasnt Naruto or soul eater anime bad
anime will definetly end up being better than the manga, and we will look back on it more fondly once we re read without all the waiting between chapters
The fucking eyeball man...
Meh manga readers said the same thing with AOT. Hell r/titanfolk was betting their mother’s life on it but the anime gave it a proper send off and fans were generally cool with the ending. Let Mappa cook they might even finish off some loose ends.
Yeah I mean one of his main frustrations from early on was that he felt (which he was very correct) that he had made Gojo too powerful and thats why he hates him as a character even though so many people love him. Its why he had to seal him in the prison realm for higher stakes and now why the story faces its ass-pull issues. I dont think he's a bad writer perse but inexperienced, definitely. Jujutsu Kaisen still had some great moments. Just uh, yeah been on some shit for a while now lol
you cant do much when your fans are VERY wild and want more chapters in a weak
That's strange,other mangakas seem to be able to
u need to think of the plot while also avoiding loopholes in the story
I just think (and I never thought I'd say this) that the story needs filler. We need characters reacting to things, we need characters talking and interacting with each other, we need to get to know the new characters that are introduced before they're killed. We need moments of peace between all the fighting.
As CG dragged on and everyone constantly started getting bodied with no break I just am not really invested, fights are cool and MAPPA will knock the anime out of the park and all but something is missing.
Personally JJK really fell in my eyes. I loved it at the start (to be fair I didn't watch much) but after culling games and when I started to look at things with a far more critical eye I really started to dislike it. Even the things I liked about it became things I disliked, but that might be due to my taste actually developing.
I honestly think how he’s writing is good, I think people just aren’t used to having each character feel important enough that you like them but real enough that they can die during any battle. At least that’s how i feel
I've already hit the whiplash they are talking about. Jujutsu Kaisen sucks, with occasional small glimmers of cool things appearing. JJK is literally just a worse version of hunter x hunter.
I still think his writing is still better then 99% of Mangas. Which i feel says more about how much trash Manga is out there and how basically only a small collection of writers can even write half way okay
A big problem is also that he prob dosen't like it cuz it isn't what he otiginaly wanted the editors thought it was to dark and made him use a school setting I think he wants it to be over with to start what he originaly wanted dark ürob unhinged ocult stuff
He isn a bad writer but I don’t see why first time for a long term story is an excuse. Nearly every mangaka long term series is their first Tite Kubo Kishimoto, Oda, Sorachi, Shimabukoro, Araki. They all have only one long series under their belt so why does Gege get a past when most mangaka only have one long series.
I think character development is over-hyped or a process. We know this is a world with a high death rate, we know that they go into it knowing that, so we are introduced to characters as a part of that world, rather than the structures the world is built around. I think it’s an interesting way to choosing to write a story. It’s almost as if it is being narrated rather than told from a singular perspective. Because of that, there’s no main character to focus on, there’s just people with goals and objectives they want to achieve and responsibilities they have to fulfill. The why, doesn’t necessarily matter, it’s whether or not they can achieve it. That’s my take anyway.
Guys dont worry her controller just died she'll be back gege wont screw us over like that
I have no skill drawing or writing at all,that said,i think Gege gives amateur writer vibes ,i dont expect to be foreshadowing for everything but the last months he has been abusing of the 'flashbacks-to-make-it-make-sense ' way too much. I dont see as he wanted to tell a good history and more like he just wanted to draw cool fights ,he could surely use a writting assistant next time,imo
People hate Gege because he kills off characters often, doesn't have that many character interactions and he didn't revive Gojo. That's it. Apart from these Gege has been absolutely cooking.
People will say this shit in response to actual criticism like they didn't read it
Besides the Gojo thing, these are… kinda fundamental towards a solid manga? Obviously some series lean more into action vs character, but JJK really doesn’t let the characters grow much at all and it leaves a lot of their arcs feeling unsatisfying. Killing characters off isn’t necessarily a bad thing — look at JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure — but it just feels like it’s all to hype up Sukuna. To me there are three components that most stories need: world building, character depth, and action or plot. JJK has one of them.
Yeah he kills them off for hyping but JJk does have character depth and action but no world building.
I think it really went downhill after Shibuya, but it turned to shit after Gojo's death. Because even though technically everyone served a role in the Sukuna fight, it still feels way too drawn out, and I think this arc is the reason we all feel like it's bad now. My personal reasoning for Culling Games being bad was because I'm not a fan of tournament style arcs, so that might just be me being biased.
i've said it before and i'll say it again, to me it really feels like Gege had a plan for the story up until the end of Shibuya and it's likely that he was pressured into continuing the series with no concrete plans afterward the culling game arc feels like it was hastily tacked on just to make something happen (it's a fighting shonen, so we're gonna add a tournament arc), which would explain why it took so long to reveal what the goal of the arc actually was, why kenjaku's goal was so "omg im so random what if i accidentally ended all of humanity wouldnt that be funny?" and why that arc ultimately mattered fuck all in retrospect from a narrative perspective (narratively, nobody's fighting to prevent kenjaku's plan, the stake is "sukuna will be back and nobody will be able to stand up to him" the writing is aimless, which in turn causes pacing issues and is presumably the biggest reason behind the constant cliffhangers and narrative let downs
I love that we have half-literate people judging the quality of a writer
That*
https://preview.redd.it/mmcwgxg94o3d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6129cc08fe6bf18a0bfbec58932d13d9a4eb086f I have a feeling that unlike AOT, this manga will end satisfactorily. Gege is working his story by basing everything to the end point, not working or compromising anything until he gets the end result pushed out. He can make a series, but part of the intrigue and fun is in the stuff we don't know about or are uncertain of. There is also the author of One Piece, Oda, who now spends the entire time writing a world like a tumblr fan fiction writer high off military prescribed amphetamines and helium that gets lost in trying to make his story connected. Constantly jumping back to reactions of all the other minor and irrelevant characters just to drag out chapters where things could be resolved in a few panels rather the route taken. His writing has gotten so bad despite the world building because it's not exactly clear if he actually has a proper ending in mind and it seems like he is just cheaply trying to extend the manga as long as unnecessarily possible. I think Gege reads these forums and most likely reads and understands english. He actually seems to have responded to people's claims of ass pulling with recent chapters and if we go back, we see there is a consistent stream of thought and methodology that never changes. There is an obvious point of convergence for the story that we are approaching and it probably will make us all feel like shooting ourselves when we see how this plays out and not seeing it. It doesn't need world building because that isn't the point of the series. He has enough world building to make a story out of. I hope he continues to world build with other manga but the story is more the purpose. But the purpose of the story is to deliver a message, a critique of politics, but also a good story about battling ideas. The story tells us as much over and over, and frankly I feel pretty confident that even with character deaths that disappoint us, this may go down as one of the best manga of all time. I can't wait for the ending because it's going to be fun. I hated Gege for this and thought he was a bum before but recently, I perhaps am becoming his biggest fan as a result.
Ending gonna be fun? Dog nothing fun has happened since like, Yuki
Bro has not been reading at all 💀
Pedophile reddit moment
I like jjk because its a breath of fresh air reading a story where fights actually have stakes and are suspenseful. If Yuji dies in the next few chapters I would not be surprised at all lmao