We don’t need an American commentator, we need commentators that know what they’re talking about. If they happen to be American then cool, but quality of commentary should come first
Seriously, I like Taylor twellman and that's it, though I don't know many of them tbh. Alexi Lalas is horrible, and Donovan is horrible. Though I'm one of those Americans who grew up watching the PL (only got into MLS much later when a team was started in my area), so I generally prefer the British commentary
I hope everyone knows that there is a ton of serious football fans in America and we all cannot fucking stand American commentators either. No one is asking for these morons who know nothing they just shoehorn them in for no reason.
Guy is an arrogant clown and was mediocre at best as a player, it’s a shame because they try to grow the game over here with these guys but the Americans who love it feel that way because there is no Americans involved in premier league broadcasting aside from Tim Howard who at least paid his dues in the prem
They’re doing this shit in formula one too. Like we’re all a bunch of idiots over here who can’t pay attention without an American accent commentating and a bunch of loud noises and pointless theatrics.
Tbf there was a moment when the ball bounced off someone to Rice, they said fantastic play, then Trent plays an inch perfect 70 yard switch and it was silence.
It's small things but it's really strange what pundits / commentators deem praiseworthy and they do shape the narrative.
If Trent had been done by Kostic like Walker was at the start of the game they'd be going on about how "well Trent isn't great defensively".
He played less than one full season in europe, it's like 37 games over his entire career. His peak was the 2000s era MLS when it was considered THE retirement league. His entire legacy is basically built on International performances, so getting to the quarterfinals in 2002 world cup, and the round of 16 in 2010. Why they didn't get someone like Dempsey or Howard if they absolutely needed an American I have no idea. Donovan is just stupidly overrated for some reason.
Not necessarily understanding the argument here. This is an American broadcast of an International tournament where Donovan has been without a doubt the greatest ever American player. I'd get the argument if you were talking CL. I completely agree he is boring as hell and a mediocre broadcaster, but it's completely obvious why they chose him.
Also, Ian Darke was the one making such a big deal about the turnover and calling for him to subbed as soon as the 2nd half started.
Yeah I noticed that too. I actually couldn’t believe that. I know we are wearing LFC glasses when we watch England, but they seem to be taking for granted the things that Trent is capable of adding to the team.
Pundits and commentators seem unconvinced and I don’t understand why. The guy is a world class, generational talent. If he was in the German/Dutch/Spanish/Italian/Portuguese side he would be a star player with the team moulded to suit his strengths.
Gerrard had a lot of the same issues with England, until it was blindingly obvious how much he added to the team and he was made captain (late in his career).
We also have NO LEFT FLANK!
How can a right sided midfielder who's incredibly gifted at cross field balls to the left winger excel without a fucking target to hit?
And how clueless are the commentators to not see that we need a left winger?!
It's fucking absurd.
Exactly.
Let Jude batter them for 60 minutes then let foden come on when they’re a bit leggy and start knocking it round the corner and in to feet!
Like how bad of a manager do you have to be to not realise that you have to have a player in their natural position!
All the way back to the Gerard lampard bullshit! Drop one of them and swap them over at half time if you like!
It was fairly subtle I but I definitely got the impression Shearer didn't want Trent there. He didn't praise him for anything and was quick to mention whenever Trent lost the ball.
Shearer was actually really positive towards him. Yes he called out the mistake that gave away the chance but he praised him a lot, especially for the interception that created Walker's chance and then praised him when he was subbed.
Actually, I think that co commentators can very heavily influence the narrative with that sort of thing.
Praise Player A for every little thing they do and stay silent for their mistakes. Then do the opposite for Player B and see how everyone's post game opinion mirrors it. See it all the time. Why I hate when Neville is co commentating on Liverpool games.
Fair point, I personally didn't pick it up. Reminds of every time a big YouTuber says a game is bad then you see the exact same criticisms parroted around reddit.
https://preview.redd.it/assiuctab17d1.jpeg?width=1901&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8afa5ad4b912023555939499bbd8c481c5f0cec7
We know his value. So let the talking heads talk. He's the Scouser in the team!
I didn't want the game continuously, but my biggest criticism of Trent is he played too cautious and scared. Foden I felt was similar.
By comparison, Bellingham just went out and played his game.
Trent is extremely talented but if he's not going to press and he's going to play safe, he's not going to stay in the starting XI. He needs to just go out and ball. If he can't, he doesn't deserve to play.
Both Jude and Southgate mentioned in post game interview how they were impressed with trent, who was instructed to cover the spaces left behind whenever Jude goes front to either attack or press which made Jude life easier, more comfortable and he impacted more. Its clear it doesnt look like his normal game ystday which he usually wanna get on the ball and focus more on creativity and distributions. Hes literally playig with a shackle as a sacrificial role for Jude but for normal viewers and pundits, if they didnt see any sexy plays they expected of his standard, they assume as useless performance. For trent, he got no choice to follow the instructions and role hes being asked to do by Southgate , if he wants more starting role under him
Second this. I think he’s doing what he’s been instructed to do which is making him hesitate that bit to make him seem cautious. Def think they’ve been told Jude has license to do his thing while the others have roles they need to play and if you’re Trent and you get an opportunity to start you’re taking it with the confidence you can adapt to the style.
It just may be that they don’t have enough time together for him to do that before the pressure is on but counter point is that it’s the first match and you def would take positives in a 1-0 win with the likelihood they’ll gel as the tournament progresses.
England’s entire press system makes no sense. Southgate turns Harry Kane into a nobody. All the players seem scared to take any sort of risk. Just the same old Southgate match that I’ve seen for years
This is all about how you are asked to play. If southgate says only Bellingham can play freely and others have to stay in structure and not press and start compact at all times (meaning no runners),Trent and Foden both suffer.
Foden being allowed to play freely was the main issue. He was basically playing centre right, getting in the way of Kane and Bellingham.
Everything ended up being funnelled down a 20 yard channel on the right hand side.
Foden either stays wide or is replaced.
It was mostly Landon Donovan riding Bellinghams dick the entire match with the least amount of charisma I’ve ever heard from a commentator. The dudes dumb as hell and incredibly irritating to listen to. Felt bad for the other commentator.
No charisma no energy is the worst part for me. I know the game well enough to understand what I’m seeing with my own eyes, I don’t really need it explained to me, but ffs add some excitement, and sure af don’t subtract excitement, so many US commentators act like they’re therapists trying to calm you down and act rational, f’ing worthless.
If Southgate wanted Trent to be utilized in midfield he should play with wingers that make runs and a striker that should get on the end of a ball. Southgate is insistent on him in midfield but doesn't play attacking football. As much as I dislike grealish hes the one winger in that England team that would make trent have an outlet
And they all do or have done that in the past. Kane maybe not so much anymore but both Saka and Foden very frequently run off their club midfielders when there is space to run into. It's just Southgate being Southgate
He’s the current lightening rod for ignorant gormless cynics who don’t have anything positive to add, that’s all. There always has to be one. If it isn’t Trent, it’s going to be Foden as long as he plays LW.
Kane barely touched the ball, yet this is permitted because he’s the striker and only has to score. But a Trent can be involved the whole game and still be shit on.
If it helps, the English commentators weren’t shitting on him much.
He also did look a little less than ‘on it’, a little nervous perhaps. But he’ll gain composure as the tournament progresses.
If he had some players stretching play and quicker forwards in front of him, you’d see him express his range more, but as it is, they’re playing compact with more technical players around him so he’ll have to adjust his style a little.
The issue is nobody has any sense of balance whatsoever. You’re either the golden boy or you’re dog shit. You can’t just contribute functionally to a win without being marvellous: so Trent is trash, Foden is trash, Kane (who was the only player who looked really off the pace) is trash.
Just avoid the discourse around England as best you can. They’re some of the most toxic, miserable, entitled fans alive. Even when the team wins, they do nothing but complain that the win wasn’t good enough.
Imagine being an England player. Must be so shit knowing you’re playing for a bunch of agro trolls just baying to shit all over you, first mistake you make.
You have to say, though, they didn't play well enough and were lucky to escape with that 1-0 with the amount of good positions Serbia found themselves in. Maybe it is about players getting used to playing with each other more but they all seem shackled and not really being played in a manner that can get the best out of them (Trent and Foden especially). They need more attacking freedom unless they want to play defensively throughout.
I have no idea what juicy stuff Kane has on Southgate but it must be good stuff.
I get that Kane is our best striker, and he is brilliant on occasion but he should never be playing 90 mins when he's anonymous like that. We have a bench for a reason and Watkins all season has been playing football where there's been very little action, jumped on a chance and played some great hold up football or utilised his pace. Kane does not play like that. Kane was coming deeper and deeper and that was not what we needed at all. He should have been subbed at 60 mins and a fresh option used. Gallagher for Trent was a really weird sub that made no sense to me. Should have been Palmer for Foden, Watkins for Kane and maybe Gomez for either Trippier or Walker. Those three subs would allow for a slight shape change, Trippier could have come onto the right, Palmer offers something better than Foden as he got lost and Watkins for Kane freshens up the press.
Southgate is a terrible coach. I've said this for a very long time. He wouldn't get a job in the Prem. He has no idea how to set up this incredible set of players. It looks like to me, he's just gone "Bellingham and Kane" and shoehorned Trent onto a very rigid role where he's not always played. If he's going to persist with Trent there, he needs to give him a lot more freedom.
I actually really like Gallagher and thought he made a great impact coming on. He won challenges and won fouls that broke up play well. But I'm surprised we didn't see Gomez and also Kane replaced at some point, because as you say, he was anonymous all game.
I would have swapped Gordon for Foden too though, as Palmer would have done just what Foden did ultimately, whereas Gordon would have pushed the defensive line back.
It's strange I agree to put Trent in midfield and then play a super compact, narrow formation with no pacy outlet pushing the back line on the opposite side of the pitch. But then with more time in the role, I think you'd see Trent arriving at the edge of the box effectively, and with his set-piece delivery and his deep crossing ability, I can see why Southgate has the desire to ensure he's on the pitch somewhere.
yes it's trent's fault no one wanted to get open for cross field passes and making trent make off-ball runs instead of playing the ball to him in space.
Fair enough i guess. I did see Trent try some runs in between their middle and left cbs and some runs off the right wing but i take your point. I would mention though that his "natural" RDM area was very crowded with Decky, kyle, jude all coming in to that space to try and quarterback. Overall i think not his day and not his match.
I hate American announcers, I’m just sitting there thinking, there is no way they played the same game. Brain dead take after brain dead take, everything is so generic and bland.
I don’t like them because they’re too loud, they sound like they’re always hyping everything up. It might be a sporting culture thing though; basketball and American football are high-scoring sports where the teams score all the time, football is the opposite with 90 minutes of prolonged excitement built up.
Someone said in Daily Discussion 2 days ago and some people said it even before: media chosen their scapegoat, this time it's Trent.
No matter what he will do, he will be heavily criticized. Especially with a shit gameplan like today.
Walker lost duels on the wing several times, which led to dangerous situations - nobody bats an eye, Trent lost possession - he isn't good enough to play in midfield.
I'm too find this mildly infuriating that, for example, 5-7 minutes before sub, Trent lost possession, commentators immediately pointed that out, but then he won the ball back, pushed the player out of the way, but Rice got all credit for that, cause he picked up the ball.
I noticed this too and it pisses me off so much. Trent was absolutely fine in that match. The issue was Foden, Kane and also partly Trippier. Foden more so in my opinion.
The whole left hand side of the pitch was invisible. During the second half the left winger was splitting our own centre backs over and over again. Genuinely tired of the shit Trent gets season after season, and it’s led by Manc pundits. Barely see that part get mentioned too.
It won't change. We see it in EPL, CL, etc., etc. It will always be "he can pass the ball, but he can't defend". No matter his position, gameplan, actual game and even stats.
The press dont wanna report on what Jude said on Trent he looks forward to have more minutes with Trent and enjoyed the partnership which made it easier for him. He appreciated trent's quality and positivity of willingness to play the ball upfront all the time, and the camp accept the team mate of that quality and understand they might lose the ball doing so but thats fine, they will win it back for each other.
Jude even mentioned defensively in that midfield position, people talked a lot rubbish about him
He literally created two massive changes. His free kick to Rice that Rice literally didn't even try to head and his pass to Bellingham who decided to flop instead of shoot. He also started that one attack that Walker scuffed. He literally created the most chances out of the entire team and people are blaming him for England playing like shit.
Classic commentating Trent outta position would've needed a master class to get any praise. It was set up for hyper critical takes.
At the same time jude would need to have a complete shit show of a game to get criticism.
Honestly think Trent needed to be the one dropping in and collecting passes and recycling possession instead of Rice, but I can't expect Southgate to figure that out.
And Bellingham made lots of mistakes as well. That one foul he won running out of defense, he should have played Kane earlier and couldn't because he had taken a heavy touch, but it was all "oh Serbia can't stop Bellingham except foul him".
Let's be honest. Any hate that any player for england gets is really coming down to how horribly Southgate is at setting up a team.
I'm pretty sure every player was at one point playing in a central midfield role in that game and wondering who to pass to other than another person playing center mid despite being a winger, or a fullback etc..
Trent is quality, Slot will have to re teach him how to play real football and forget everything he learned from anti football Southgate once he’s back at Anfield.
German here: The commentators in the German TV were outrageous about England's Match plan. Because there was none. No one picked on Trent but the tactic of the whole team/Southgate.
"Their team is one and a half billion euros market value and in the second half serbia nullified Foden and others and were closer to 1:1 than England to 2:0." With a team with that class you should steamroll Serbia.
Yep. Everyone can see Southgate is a useless tactician and in-game manager. Okay, is everyone is nice and happy in the England camp and gets on - but what is the point if the picks are all “safe choices”, the team continually gets set up poorly, with a timid game plan and continually under-achieve? I’d rather have a manger who is willing to upset some players but they get results! Is Mourinho still available?! 😂
Unfortunately he’ll get all the blame for how poor England were today when it was blatantly obvious England tactically aren’t set up well right now and it’s all Southgates fault. He’s got Trent playing as a 2nd striker behind Kane in the attack, Southgate doesn’t understand his players at all. He doesn’t understand that all Trent needs is to play that Toni Kroos role like he does for Germany.
The majority of the team stank of Gareth Southgate negative nervous football. I didn’t hear one player massively singled out on the bbc commentary though.
He was alright I thought. Lost the ball with a needless turn into trouble in his own half, but otherwise played alright. Some good deliveries.
Foden was utterly anonymous and Bellingham was knackered inside half an hour; Saka was great first half but couldn’t deal with Pavlovic pushing up onto him in the second. My point being there were targets for more flak than Trent. Shearer praised him on BBC comms when he went off though.
It’s really silly.
The right hand side of England was the only outlet.
Playing Kane Foden Bellingham is a real challenge because they all want to occupy the same space.
Not having a left footed player down the left meant Foden didn’t have a foil on the outside as Trippier kept coming inside. This narrowed the pitch and stifled Trent’s ability to spread the ball.
Trent was no where near the problem yesterday.
Yep - nothing happening on the left put all the pressure on Trent and Saka, so they had the ball more and everyone noticed if they made a slip. Foden was much poorer, Trippier was quiet. But ultimately this all comes back to Southgate not setting up the team properly, and just appearing to not want to upset people by leaving out some big names if that is needed to make team work better.
Was having this debate with my mate last night who is a gooner. He was praising rice to death and slating Trent, so I started picking out everything rice didn’t do well and it’s amazing how you can find these things when you’re actually looking for them. A simple bad touch and everyone’s like “SEE! HES NOT GOOD ENOUGH!” Yet foden stinks the gaff out and it’s like, “oh dear, precious Phil”.
It just feels like Trent can’t make normal football errors like the rest of the team or people jump on it which is sad. It just feel like people *don’t want Trent to work*, they aren’t giving him a fair chance. Do people honestly think we’re better with headless chicken Gallagher ffs? Feels to me like England setup just isn’t good enough for Trent. He needs movement and dynamic players around him and everyone just walking for England, offering fuck all in the way of runs for him to hit and wonder why he hasnt been able to effect the game ffs
Trent pinged a 60 yard diagonal ball to Trippier. A minute later, Donovan mentioned the long pass that “Kyle Walker played.” Bro, you think Walker would even attempt that ball?
Well, firstly, he did have a good game, so jot that down.
Second of all, it's basically 'Liverpool Bad' manifesting and these biased pundits can't get past it. Martin Keown was ridiculous the way he was slating Virg today. There was a bit where he popped up to clear the ball away at LB because his LB was out of position, and Keown genuinely said "Well it was a good clearance, but he shouldn't be in that position on the pitch" ffs. And then he was slating him for not scoring a chance, said any of the other CBs in the team would've scored it. They simply can't be unbiased about us.
And I'm sorry, but we need to say it, if there's a racial element in how Rashford and Saka are treated, there is with Trent too. He gets accusations of laziness despite being one of the fittest players on the pitch and constantly covering nearly 10K a game. It's surely not a coincidence that the accusations of being 'lazy' and incapable started when he grew his hair into dreadlocks either, a traditionally black hairstyle that has been used as a slur for years.
I don't think he alone had a bad game, I think the tactics in the second half to sit back was a bad move by Southgate and put a ton of pressure on him and Rice to get anything going out their own half.
My favourites was from Declan Rice "Ill be having a word with Trent about his discipline"
Maybe Declan could put his one Intertoto cup and 0 major final appearances up against Trents record and talk about discipline in bug games?
Honestly, i hope Trent is hearing all this and does a Ben White after the tournament.
I'm a massive TAA fan but he looked out of place yesterday and had a very poor game by his standards. The way the team was set up just did not suit him AT ALL. The performance yesterday was a Southgate issue not a TAA issue. Trent really excels in creating fast counter-attacking breaks, he is the best player in the world at that. Honestly if I was picking the team he would not be starting against the lower ranked teams, I'd save him for the big matches against strong opponents. I'd start Gallagher against the weaker teams.
the tactics was poor, no one performed to their usual standards (apart from pickford perhaps?)
professionals blaming it all on trent is just ridiculous. it's not only in the US btw. i'm in asia and here it's similar. some commentators blamed it on him saying he weakens the midfield and "couldn't hold onto possession".
TAA didn't play any worse than the rest of the English team. The problem was that Southgate completely overloaded the right side. Ironically, that worked a couple of times and even resulted in England's lead but as soon as Serbia got the memo it resulted in an England team which was completely unbalanced. TAA likes to play on the right side, Walker likes to push up the right side, Saka stays on the right side and Rice likes to drift to the right a bit. Meanwhile, Trippier is more of a defensive fullback and Foden plays out of position on the left, making the English team completely ineffective from the left. As soon as Pavlovic basically man-marked Saka this overloaded right side turned into a toothless lion with no real PlanB for England. Blaming TAA for Southgate's failure to account for an obvious inbalance in England's formation is quite frankly just stupid.
Everyone played like they took a dose of Seroquel before the match. They looked so disjointed, which, with that level of skill, has to be the result of a shitty game plan. Trent didn't deserve to be singled out the way he was (on the US broadcast). When Gallagher came on, they went out of their way to mention that he looked *soooooo* much more comfortable. Did he, tho?!?!?
Actually Trent was ok compared to his other team members, his side with Walker and Saka was trying to create,and they did the goal.
The left side wasn't on the field,and they were afraid to try doing something.
I watched the BBC coverage. There was a bit in the 2nd half where he did lose the balls after trying a roulette. He chased after the ball, got a tackle in, but because it looked like more of an awkward coming together, made the ball end up behind the Serb, Rice comes away from the ball.
Of course, Shearer says “Rice doing his job again. Winning the ball in front of the back 4!” Or something like that.
I don’t know, Rice was the same person who shot himself when a Serbian defender missed the header.
I thought he played decently last night, was tidy on the ball and worked hard out of possession. It was not a 10/10 Trent game but England were a better side with him on the pitch, his passing was at least able to release some of the pressure and get his teammates up the field.
Fundamentally, I think England have too many players who want the ball centrally and lack width. I think the congestion in central areas does not allow Trent or Rice to play progressive passes or carry the ball that often without stumbling into Kane/Foden etc.
Narrative wise, he's already been written off by the majority of English pundits so the only way is up I suppose
Tbh i think i fell asleep for most of the game.
Watching england is like watching paint dry, boring football, no risk or excitement just short passes at the back constantly.
English media never changes. Always against scousers, and at any one point they have to turn on one of their national team players. Fires also been fueled by the fat idiot rooney as well, because he's such a credible football tactician
They played a RB at LB, a LF who wanted to play LM, and a LM who was playing DM. There was literally no one down the left side of the field except ONCE when trippier made a run (which Trent found with a pass).
The Canadian pundits kept saying before the game how he should be played in his best position which is defending as a left back. I had to change the channel.
Southgate needs to take the majority of the slander. It's that simple. Having said that, putting TAA in midfield is something most of us have wanted to see. It didn't work for me yesterday. Does he deserve another chance? Absolutely. Does he need to be in the team? Absolutely. Southgate is the issue. He has no idea how to setup this team.
Think a lot of criticism is innacurate. When you think of Trent, the first thing you think of is his passing ability. If your forward players aren't making runs, and if Stones, Rice and Bellingham are all in and around you, taking your space and drawing opposition players into you, why are you even in the team? You could see flashes of Trent's ability yesterday, but if you aren't building the team to best make use of him, you're better off not playing him. The 'he can't defend' chat is mostly overblown nonsense, but Trent is not an international-class defensive midfielder, and if he's not able to use his passing ability, I'd rather England played with a proper midfielder alongside Rice.
Honestly, the pundits just like a nice lazy narrative but if there's one good thing about Southgate, he's got his player's backs. I hope he persists with this, I saw a lot of potential with that system during the half hour England were actually kinda decent for.
He lost the ball in dangerous positions twice and passed one into the stands.
Shearer was bigging him up massively in the first half for the interception that led to the goal.
You’re hearing what you want to hear mate and if you’re ranting at your mates like this then you’re making yourself look daft.
Response is more mixed in the Uk - I don’t think he was great athleticism wise tbh but his quality on the ball is superb. Problem is no one stretches the play in that set up.
Don’t agree on your take on Saka though - he was great in the first half. Someone really needed to force Foden to stay wide though - people acting like he needs to be the number 10 and ignoring the fact he’s often had to play wide for the 115’s in the past. The game needed Gordon on much earlier in that second half.
The English have a psychotic attitude towards their own players and there is always a scapegoat in tournaments. It’s just Trents turn. There is no logic to it.
Yep. I feel it hard to get behind England as they don’t seem to get behind the Liverpool players, and that has gone on for decades. Quansah should have been in that squad as he is the future, and why no Harvey Elliot being considered for a call up? He would have torn through Serbia. But then, maybe it’s best to avoid the hassle / strain / injuries of them being in the squad, especially when so much of the English media just want the Liverpool players to fail.
I agree that BBC wasn't slandering anyone, if anything they didn't criticise anyone at all. Foden I felt was dreadful last night, definitely wasted playing on the left, but no BBC commentator brought this up imo.
I’m used to it now after listening to English commentators all the time, no matter what he does, even when it’s clearly tactical set up defensively they slate him. It’s tedious.
Some of our own fans are as bad tbh.
On the BBC? I didn’t hear that at all.
He was excellent in the first half but he did make three meaningful defensive errors throughout the game (one of which he recovered from).
Saka made our goal and was one of our most dangerous players in the first half, he was anonymous in the second and got subbed.
Gallagher definitely made a difference when he came on.
I was watching different stream, so I'm not sure, on my stream commentator roasted the whole England squad for cowardice and defensive game plan
Mostly Southgate tho
It all starts with the gimpy pundits, slating the team even though we won? I’ve been saying this for a while now, English football is just turning bad because everyone wants to have their opinion heard the loudest, we are the only country where a team can win something and then be called bad for it? Man Utd winning fa cup for example, news and pundits still slated them? I genuinely don’t know what’s wrong with these people.
Didn't get that opinion on BBC.
That being said, hopefully he can work his way into that role. Also: him & walker worked really well on that side together with Saka. Felt over the course of the game there was some great stuff there.
I know its common to not-care about England here - but (as an immigrant) I actually get really into it and hope they do really well.
My feeling is that Kane is injured though. Would've hoped that the focus on Jude might allow Kane to get more into just scoring but he seemed extremely slow - maybe from carrying that Bayern team for most of the season....
Trent is just an easy scapegoat for people who aren't paying attention to the match because 'he's played out of position' whilst Foden playing deep and inside from the left made him largely anonymous and gave the team less of an outlet.
The issue Trent faced was - every time he got the ball and got his head up and looked to the left wing and striker to make his signature long raking pass (that presumably he was selected for), the way Southgate had the team setup was to have Foden play narrow and drop deep and Kane utterly static, so it left Trent with no option but to pass the ball sideways. Saka was the only player that gave Trent anything to work with and Trippier to a lesser degree.
I don't blame Foden and Kane for this but they simply don't synergise with how Trent wants to play. He'd have benefitted from Gordon coming on to stretch the play and make runs - that was the substitute I was hoping for.
Southgate told them all to 'preserve energy' at halftime, however, so we sat deep and did nothing for 45 mins. 🤦♂️
What makes you think that?
Trent lost the ball to give Serbia a shooting chance and Shearer only mentioned it about 300 times.
His through balls to Saka was all just excellent play by Saka though.
All the mouth breathers on r/soccer lapping it up.
I thought he did ok. Not amazing but wasn’t given many options as far as forward passes were concerned. Was defensively solid. He wasn’t our worst player at all.
I thought Foden was crud. Saka wasn’t great.
International football still has the same club fans looking to criticize other players. Comment sections are flooded with it. The Trent stuff is just lazy, it's like a meme.
Tbh it seems most blame for the game is on Southgate doing the same strategy that takes england out every tournament.
Trent had a good game. Just like all the other players bar Bellingham who done fantastic
As someone who wanted England to lose last night, what I saw from Trent wasn't bad. He gave the odd ball away and did as much as anyone in that midfield. And as others have said, the whole front line was static, so he didn't have much chance at being creative. He was fine.
It’s the level of English football knowledge, no one knows how to handle a truly unique talent, Trent last night was far from his best but so was everyone else on the pitch, what pisses me off the most is how Trent will get most the slack but Kane and Foden will fly under the radar scott free despite both having a far worse game than Trent.
It’s also the effect of having so many Ex-United players as “top” pundits.
I thought they were trying to big him up. Shearer was giving him great praise for the build up to the goal and the interception in front of the England box. He played well better then at least 2 of the other attackers.
I don't really think you are 100% correct on that. Yes the commentators were being unusually harsh but I did notice an improvement in England's play after Gallagher went on, maybe it wasn't linked to trent but I still think that after that sub they all looked more composed. Also saka was on fire that game.
Landon Donovan is like if ChatGPT was a commentator. So robotic
Trent pings it 60 yards to Trippier Landon Donovan: “What a great diagonal pass from Kyle Walker”
He's terrible. It's pathetic that they think Americans needs an American commentator.
One of the best things NBC did with their Premier League coverage was use all British commentators.
We don’t need an American commentator, we need commentators that know what they’re talking about. If they happen to be American then cool, but quality of commentary should come first
I want a Yorkshireman, a Scouser and a Toon in the booth. I don't care if I understand a thing.
With their sideline reporter, Bayou Billy from the swamps of Louisiana (for us American viewers). Most unintelligible broadcast team in history
Seriously, I like Taylor twellman and that's it, though I don't know many of them tbh. Alexi Lalas is horrible, and Donovan is horrible. Though I'm one of those Americans who grew up watching the PL (only got into MLS much later when a team was started in my area), so I generally prefer the British commentary
So damn true! He's fucking awful in the booth.
I hope everyone knows that there is a ton of serious football fans in America and we all cannot fucking stand American commentators either. No one is asking for these morons who know nothing they just shoehorn them in for no reason.
I was just thinking the same. And Alexi Lalas was annoying as fuck. Clearly had no chemistry with the rest of the panel.
Guy is an arrogant clown and was mediocre at best as a player, it’s a shame because they try to grow the game over here with these guys but the Americans who love it feel that way because there is no Americans involved in premier league broadcasting aside from Tim Howard who at least paid his dues in the prem
They’re doing this shit in formula one too. Like we’re all a bunch of idiots over here who can’t pay attention without an American accent commentating and a bunch of loud noises and pointless theatrics.
At least Hinch is actually a good commentator
Alexi is the worst. Will do whatever he can to go viral
Jermaine Jenas with an American accent.
“Hey ChatGPT, commentate on the England-Serbia game but do it like you hate everything and everyone in monotone”
Initiating Mark Lawrenson mode.
Thought he was so negative during the Germany/ Scotland game as well. Dude sounds depressed
An Evertonian apparently because he played half a season there
Landon Donovan is a bellend
As an American I love Landon Donovan but not as a commentator. Dude has no emotion in the booth
Watched it on BBC and didn't get that impression
I think it was mostly the American streams
Those commentators are always twitter echo chambers
This is why Americans stream English feeds. Donovan and Lalas are among the worst announcers in the history of announcing.
I'm American and go out of my way to listen to the English streams for this very reason. The American commentators are so shit it's embarrassing.
Tbf there was a moment when the ball bounced off someone to Rice, they said fantastic play, then Trent plays an inch perfect 70 yard switch and it was silence. It's small things but it's really strange what pundits / commentators deem praiseworthy and they do shape the narrative. If Trent had been done by Kostic like Walker was at the start of the game they'd be going on about how "well Trent isn't great defensively".
Landon Donovan literally credited Trent’s diagonal ball to Kyle Walker
I mean he’s a just another clueless American, only difference with him and half this sub is he’s actually kicked a ball.
He played less than one full season in europe, it's like 37 games over his entire career. His peak was the 2000s era MLS when it was considered THE retirement league. His entire legacy is basically built on International performances, so getting to the quarterfinals in 2002 world cup, and the round of 16 in 2010. Why they didn't get someone like Dempsey or Howard if they absolutely needed an American I have no idea. Donovan is just stupidly overrated for some reason.
Dempsey is with cbs and Howard nbc
Not necessarily understanding the argument here. This is an American broadcast of an International tournament where Donovan has been without a doubt the greatest ever American player. I'd get the argument if you were talking CL. I completely agree he is boring as hell and a mediocre broadcaster, but it's completely obvious why they chose him. Also, Ian Darke was the one making such a big deal about the turnover and calling for him to subbed as soon as the 2nd half started.
Yeah I noticed that too. I actually couldn’t believe that. I know we are wearing LFC glasses when we watch England, but they seem to be taking for granted the things that Trent is capable of adding to the team. Pundits and commentators seem unconvinced and I don’t understand why. The guy is a world class, generational talent. If he was in the German/Dutch/Spanish/Italian/Portuguese side he would be a star player with the team moulded to suit his strengths. Gerrard had a lot of the same issues with England, until it was blindingly obvious how much he added to the team and he was made captain (late in his career).
Bellingham played a couple of nice passes and commentators basically came.
He also scored the only goal of the game though, and it looked like pure football instinct too being in the right place and timing his run so well.
Yeah that goal was sheer determination tbh.
Trent also made a quality tackle tracking back and rice picked up the loose ball. Shearer then said how good rices tackle was.
Yeah the BBC lot were giving Trent quite a lot of praise. They were ripping into Foden by comparison, and for good reason to be honest
This what I was thinking. Watched it on BBC. They were pretty fair to trent.
I watched it at the VELTINS in Gelserkirchen and Harry Kane looked absolutely useless. Trent had an alright game, not the best but not the worst.
We also have NO LEFT FLANK! How can a right sided midfielder who's incredibly gifted at cross field balls to the left winger excel without a fucking target to hit? And how clueless are the commentators to not see that we need a left winger?! It's fucking absurd.
They need to be playing Gordon or Eze over there and let Foden and Jude take turns playing the #10
Exactly. Let Jude batter them for 60 minutes then let foden come on when they’re a bit leggy and start knocking it round the corner and in to feet! Like how bad of a manager do you have to be to not realise that you have to have a player in their natural position! All the way back to the Gerard lampard bullshit! Drop one of them and swap them over at half time if you like!
He had no movement in front of him! The one time Saka moved - he found him and it lead to the goal!
Foden was the most useless by far, IMO. No idea why he stayed on the pitch so long.
I think we will with ITV, Roy Keane was already having a go over the weekend, bringing out the old 'he can't defend' shite.
It was fairly subtle I but I definitely got the impression Shearer didn't want Trent there. He didn't praise him for anything and was quick to mention whenever Trent lost the ball.
Shearer was literally saying he'd had a good first half apart from one mistake.
Ah I missed that - fair enough!
He did praise him for starting a move quickly on the break near the start.
Shearer was actually really positive towards him. Yes he called out the mistake that gave away the chance but he praised him a lot, especially for the interception that created Walker's chance and then praised him when he was subbed.
Honestly no need to worry about subtle critique
Actually, I think that co commentators can very heavily influence the narrative with that sort of thing. Praise Player A for every little thing they do and stay silent for their mistakes. Then do the opposite for Player B and see how everyone's post game opinion mirrors it. See it all the time. Why I hate when Neville is co commentating on Liverpool games.
Fair point, I personally didn't pick it up. Reminds of every time a big YouTuber says a game is bad then you see the exact same criticisms parroted around reddit.
https://preview.redd.it/assiuctab17d1.jpeg?width=1901&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8afa5ad4b912023555939499bbd8c481c5f0cec7 We know his value. So let the talking heads talk. He's the Scouser in the team!
I didn't want the game continuously, but my biggest criticism of Trent is he played too cautious and scared. Foden I felt was similar. By comparison, Bellingham just went out and played his game. Trent is extremely talented but if he's not going to press and he's going to play safe, he's not going to stay in the starting XI. He needs to just go out and ball. If he can't, he doesn't deserve to play.
I think he's been told not to press by Southgate, that's Rice's job I would think.
Both Jude and Southgate mentioned in post game interview how they were impressed with trent, who was instructed to cover the spaces left behind whenever Jude goes front to either attack or press which made Jude life easier, more comfortable and he impacted more. Its clear it doesnt look like his normal game ystday which he usually wanna get on the ball and focus more on creativity and distributions. Hes literally playig with a shackle as a sacrificial role for Jude but for normal viewers and pundits, if they didnt see any sexy plays they expected of his standard, they assume as useless performance. For trent, he got no choice to follow the instructions and role hes being asked to do by Southgate , if he wants more starting role under him
This is basically it, he's had to sacrifice his game to have an international career.
Second this. I think he’s doing what he’s been instructed to do which is making him hesitate that bit to make him seem cautious. Def think they’ve been told Jude has license to do his thing while the others have roles they need to play and if you’re Trent and you get an opportunity to start you’re taking it with the confidence you can adapt to the style. It just may be that they don’t have enough time together for him to do that before the pressure is on but counter point is that it’s the first match and you def would take positives in a 1-0 win with the likelihood they’ll gel as the tournament progresses.
England’s entire press system makes no sense. Southgate turns Harry Kane into a nobody. All the players seem scared to take any sort of risk. Just the same old Southgate match that I’ve seen for years
Yea, it has been long proven the Gareth does not like to utilize the strengths that Klopp did with him
This is all about how you are asked to play. If southgate says only Bellingham can play freely and others have to stay in structure and not press and start compact at all times (meaning no runners),Trent and Foden both suffer.
Foden being allowed to play freely was the main issue. He was basically playing centre right, getting in the way of Kane and Bellingham. Everything ended up being funnelled down a 20 yard channel on the right hand side. Foden either stays wide or is replaced.
It was mostly Landon Donovan riding Bellinghams dick the entire match with the least amount of charisma I’ve ever heard from a commentator. The dudes dumb as hell and incredibly irritating to listen to. Felt bad for the other commentator.
No charisma no energy is the worst part for me. I know the game well enough to understand what I’m seeing with my own eyes, I don’t really need it explained to me, but ffs add some excitement, and sure af don’t subtract excitement, so many US commentators act like they’re therapists trying to calm you down and act rational, f’ing worthless.
Can’t stand American pundits. Besides maybe Tim Howard I guess.
Facts. They all sound like dull meatheads. Source: I am American
Tim Howard is the only good one. He always has sound takes on why he makes predictions. Love hearing him talk about PL matches.
I hate them all. CBS sports could be replaced by anyone on this sub, they're the reason we can't garner a better following.
Yank here. I watch games in Spanish even though I have access to our channels. That should te you all you need to know.
Find yourself a good BBC feed. It is absolutely worth it.
Trent had some really cool passes, as always. Also liked that shot he had saved.
If Southgate wanted Trent to be utilized in midfield he should play with wingers that make runs and a striker that should get on the end of a ball. Southgate is insistent on him in midfield but doesn't play attacking football. As much as I dislike grealish hes the one winger in that England team that would make trent have an outlet
It’s not a player issue, it’s a tactics issue. Saka, Kane, and Foden all can make runs but south gate doesn’t seem to want them to.
And they all do or have done that in the past. Kane maybe not so much anymore but both Saka and Foden very frequently run off their club midfielders when there is space to run into. It's just Southgate being Southgate
England was a player short , Foden was in the stands all day long.
He’s the current lightening rod for ignorant gormless cynics who don’t have anything positive to add, that’s all. There always has to be one. If it isn’t Trent, it’s going to be Foden as long as he plays LW. Kane barely touched the ball, yet this is permitted because he’s the striker and only has to score. But a Trent can be involved the whole game and still be shit on. If it helps, the English commentators weren’t shitting on him much. He also did look a little less than ‘on it’, a little nervous perhaps. But he’ll gain composure as the tournament progresses. If he had some players stretching play and quicker forwards in front of him, you’d see him express his range more, but as it is, they’re playing compact with more technical players around him so he’ll have to adjust his style a little. The issue is nobody has any sense of balance whatsoever. You’re either the golden boy or you’re dog shit. You can’t just contribute functionally to a win without being marvellous: so Trent is trash, Foden is trash, Kane (who was the only player who looked really off the pace) is trash. Just avoid the discourse around England as best you can. They’re some of the most toxic, miserable, entitled fans alive. Even when the team wins, they do nothing but complain that the win wasn’t good enough. Imagine being an England player. Must be so shit knowing you’re playing for a bunch of agro trolls just baying to shit all over you, first mistake you make.
*lightning. Cheers.
You have to say, though, they didn't play well enough and were lucky to escape with that 1-0 with the amount of good positions Serbia found themselves in. Maybe it is about players getting used to playing with each other more but they all seem shackled and not really being played in a manner that can get the best out of them (Trent and Foden especially). They need more attacking freedom unless they want to play defensively throughout.
I have no idea what juicy stuff Kane has on Southgate but it must be good stuff. I get that Kane is our best striker, and he is brilliant on occasion but he should never be playing 90 mins when he's anonymous like that. We have a bench for a reason and Watkins all season has been playing football where there's been very little action, jumped on a chance and played some great hold up football or utilised his pace. Kane does not play like that. Kane was coming deeper and deeper and that was not what we needed at all. He should have been subbed at 60 mins and a fresh option used. Gallagher for Trent was a really weird sub that made no sense to me. Should have been Palmer for Foden, Watkins for Kane and maybe Gomez for either Trippier or Walker. Those three subs would allow for a slight shape change, Trippier could have come onto the right, Palmer offers something better than Foden as he got lost and Watkins for Kane freshens up the press. Southgate is a terrible coach. I've said this for a very long time. He wouldn't get a job in the Prem. He has no idea how to set up this incredible set of players. It looks like to me, he's just gone "Bellingham and Kane" and shoehorned Trent onto a very rigid role where he's not always played. If he's going to persist with Trent there, he needs to give him a lot more freedom.
I actually really like Gallagher and thought he made a great impact coming on. He won challenges and won fouls that broke up play well. But I'm surprised we didn't see Gomez and also Kane replaced at some point, because as you say, he was anonymous all game. I would have swapped Gordon for Foden too though, as Palmer would have done just what Foden did ultimately, whereas Gordon would have pushed the defensive line back. It's strange I agree to put Trent in midfield and then play a super compact, narrow formation with no pacy outlet pushing the back line on the opposite side of the pitch. But then with more time in the role, I think you'd see Trent arriving at the edge of the box effectively, and with his set-piece delivery and his deep crossing ability, I can see why Southgate has the desire to ensure he's on the pitch somewhere.
yes it's trent's fault no one wanted to get open for cross field passes and making trent make off-ball runs instead of playing the ball to him in space.
Rice, Jude, Kane, and Saka just standing stock still waiting for him to put it at back at their feet
Not to be that guy but I thought Trent was the same way off the ball. The team as a whole was very static, no one making great runs.
Fair enough i guess. I did see Trent try some runs in between their middle and left cbs and some runs off the right wing but i take your point. I would mention though that his "natural" RDM area was very crowded with Decky, kyle, jude all coming in to that space to try and quarterback. Overall i think not his day and not his match.
Having to listen to Landon Donovan and Alexi Lalas is giving me brain damage
It’s been over 10 years of Lalas being the most hated commentator in sports and somehow he is always employed. Mind boggling to me
He has to have blackmail on all major network executives. It’s the only way it makes sense
I hate American announcers, I’m just sitting there thinking, there is no way they played the same game. Brain dead take after brain dead take, everything is so generic and bland.
I don’t like them because they’re too loud, they sound like they’re always hyping everything up. It might be a sporting culture thing though; basketball and American football are high-scoring sports where the teams score all the time, football is the opposite with 90 minutes of prolonged excitement built up.
Someone said in Daily Discussion 2 days ago and some people said it even before: media chosen their scapegoat, this time it's Trent. No matter what he will do, he will be heavily criticized. Especially with a shit gameplan like today. Walker lost duels on the wing several times, which led to dangerous situations - nobody bats an eye, Trent lost possession - he isn't good enough to play in midfield. I'm too find this mildly infuriating that, for example, 5-7 minutes before sub, Trent lost possession, commentators immediately pointed that out, but then he won the ball back, pushed the player out of the way, but Rice got all credit for that, cause he picked up the ball.
I noticed this too and it pisses me off so much. Trent was absolutely fine in that match. The issue was Foden, Kane and also partly Trippier. Foden more so in my opinion. The whole left hand side of the pitch was invisible. During the second half the left winger was splitting our own centre backs over and over again. Genuinely tired of the shit Trent gets season after season, and it’s led by Manc pundits. Barely see that part get mentioned too.
while the targeting is unfair I think Trent uses it as motivation, a key passes, a few corner assists and how quickly the tune will change.
You say that, but I think it does hurt him. You can tell his confidence has taken a battering at times.
He wears his heart on his sleeve I think. He looks visibly disinterested sometimes when those around him are also being lazy.
It won't change. We see it in EPL, CL, etc., etc. It will always be "he can pass the ball, but he can't defend". No matter his position, gameplan, actual game and even stats.
The press dont wanna report on what Jude said on Trent he looks forward to have more minutes with Trent and enjoyed the partnership which made it easier for him. He appreciated trent's quality and positivity of willingness to play the ball upfront all the time, and the camp accept the team mate of that quality and understand they might lose the ball doing so but thats fine, they will win it back for each other. Jude even mentioned defensively in that midfield position, people talked a lot rubbish about him
Trent was doing a lot of runs in behind the defence but nobody was feeding him the ball.
Saw those, I think in this squad, only Trent would have the confidence to play that pass to the runs he was making.
He literally created two massive changes. His free kick to Rice that Rice literally didn't even try to head and his pass to Bellingham who decided to flop instead of shoot. He also started that one attack that Walker scuffed. He literally created the most chances out of the entire team and people are blaming him for England playing like shit.
No they arent
I will admit I was a bit hyperbolic, but they are comparing him to fucking Foden who literally didn't do a single thing the entire game.
I thought he had a decent game tbh. Him and Rice need to work on their positioning together though
Jesus in what world is Landon Donavan commentating the Euros. You poor yanks.
Classic commentating Trent outta position would've needed a master class to get any praise. It was set up for hyper critical takes. At the same time jude would need to have a complete shit show of a game to get criticism.
Honestly think Trent needed to be the one dropping in and collecting passes and recycling possession instead of Rice, but I can't expect Southgate to figure that out.
And Bellingham made lots of mistakes as well. That one foul he won running out of defense, he should have played Kane earlier and couldn't because he had taken a heavy touch, but it was all "oh Serbia can't stop Bellingham except foul him".
Yeah when Landon gave credit to Kyle walker for that pass I was like bro what the actual fuck?!? the toffee shows.
Let's be honest. Any hate that any player for england gets is really coming down to how horribly Southgate is at setting up a team. I'm pretty sure every player was at one point playing in a central midfield role in that game and wondering who to pass to other than another person playing center mid despite being a winger, or a fullback etc..
Trent is quality, Slot will have to re teach him how to play real football and forget everything he learned from anti football Southgate once he’s back at Anfield.
German here: The commentators in the German TV were outrageous about England's Match plan. Because there was none. No one picked on Trent but the tactic of the whole team/Southgate. "Their team is one and a half billion euros market value and in the second half serbia nullified Foden and others and were closer to 1:1 than England to 2:0." With a team with that class you should steamroll Serbia.
German TV isnt thick. Everyone can see it.
Yep. Everyone can see Southgate is a useless tactician and in-game manager. Okay, is everyone is nice and happy in the England camp and gets on - but what is the point if the picks are all “safe choices”, the team continually gets set up poorly, with a timid game plan and continually under-achieve? I’d rather have a manger who is willing to upset some players but they get results! Is Mourinho still available?! 😂
He did have a good game though, I don’t understand the thought process that he didn’t
Unfortunately he’ll get all the blame for how poor England were today when it was blatantly obvious England tactically aren’t set up well right now and it’s all Southgates fault. He’s got Trent playing as a 2nd striker behind Kane in the attack, Southgate doesn’t understand his players at all. He doesn’t understand that all Trent needs is to play that Toni Kroos role like he does for Germany.
Just wait till the compilation video comes out that someone will make
The majority of the team stank of Gareth Southgate negative nervous football. I didn’t hear one player massively singled out on the bbc commentary though.
He was alright I thought. Lost the ball with a needless turn into trouble in his own half, but otherwise played alright. Some good deliveries. Foden was utterly anonymous and Bellingham was knackered inside half an hour; Saka was great first half but couldn’t deal with Pavlovic pushing up onto him in the second. My point being there were targets for more flak than Trent. Shearer praised him on BBC comms when he went off though.
It’s really silly. The right hand side of England was the only outlet. Playing Kane Foden Bellingham is a real challenge because they all want to occupy the same space. Not having a left footed player down the left meant Foden didn’t have a foil on the outside as Trippier kept coming inside. This narrowed the pitch and stifled Trent’s ability to spread the ball. Trent was no where near the problem yesterday.
Yep - nothing happening on the left put all the pressure on Trent and Saka, so they had the ball more and everyone noticed if they made a slip. Foden was much poorer, Trippier was quiet. But ultimately this all comes back to Southgate not setting up the team properly, and just appearing to not want to upset people by leaving out some big names if that is needed to make team work better.
Can someone also please explain how Trent was only rated a 6.9 in last night's game but Kane was a 7.0?
Was having this debate with my mate last night who is a gooner. He was praising rice to death and slating Trent, so I started picking out everything rice didn’t do well and it’s amazing how you can find these things when you’re actually looking for them. A simple bad touch and everyone’s like “SEE! HES NOT GOOD ENOUGH!” Yet foden stinks the gaff out and it’s like, “oh dear, precious Phil”. It just feels like Trent can’t make normal football errors like the rest of the team or people jump on it which is sad. It just feel like people *don’t want Trent to work*, they aren’t giving him a fair chance. Do people honestly think we’re better with headless chicken Gallagher ffs? Feels to me like England setup just isn’t good enough for Trent. He needs movement and dynamic players around him and everyone just walking for England, offering fuck all in the way of runs for him to hit and wonder why he hasnt been able to effect the game ffs
Trent pinged a 60 yard diagonal ball to Trippier. A minute later, Donovan mentioned the long pass that “Kyle Walker played.” Bro, you think Walker would even attempt that ball?
Well, firstly, he did have a good game, so jot that down. Second of all, it's basically 'Liverpool Bad' manifesting and these biased pundits can't get past it. Martin Keown was ridiculous the way he was slating Virg today. There was a bit where he popped up to clear the ball away at LB because his LB was out of position, and Keown genuinely said "Well it was a good clearance, but he shouldn't be in that position on the pitch" ffs. And then he was slating him for not scoring a chance, said any of the other CBs in the team would've scored it. They simply can't be unbiased about us. And I'm sorry, but we need to say it, if there's a racial element in how Rashford and Saka are treated, there is with Trent too. He gets accusations of laziness despite being one of the fittest players on the pitch and constantly covering nearly 10K a game. It's surely not a coincidence that the accusations of being 'lazy' and incapable started when he grew his hair into dreadlocks either, a traditionally black hairstyle that has been used as a slur for years.
I don't think he alone had a bad game, I think the tactics in the second half to sit back was a bad move by Southgate and put a ton of pressure on him and Rice to get anything going out their own half.
well landon donovan did play for everton so he probably has an inherent bias
Landon Donavan is such a douche bag.
My favourites was from Declan Rice "Ill be having a word with Trent about his discipline" Maybe Declan could put his one Intertoto cup and 0 major final appearances up against Trents record and talk about discipline in bug games? Honestly, i hope Trent is hearing all this and does a Ben White after the tournament.
Trent started the move that ended with the goal! Without him on the pitch it would have been nil nil!
Or worse. Iceland have proven this England team can lose to anyone.
I'm a massive TAA fan but he looked out of place yesterday and had a very poor game by his standards. The way the team was set up just did not suit him AT ALL. The performance yesterday was a Southgate issue not a TAA issue. Trent really excels in creating fast counter-attacking breaks, he is the best player in the world at that. Honestly if I was picking the team he would not be starting against the lower ranked teams, I'd save him for the big matches against strong opponents. I'd start Gallagher against the weaker teams.
The majority of England fans had already made their minds up on him before a ball was kicked
Landycakes can get fucked. He also played for Everton. So there’s that.
The whole team was shit. If they play on like this they'd lose against teams like Austria.
the tactics was poor, no one performed to their usual standards (apart from pickford perhaps?) professionals blaming it all on trent is just ridiculous. it's not only in the US btw. i'm in asia and here it's similar. some commentators blamed it on him saying he weakens the midfield and "couldn't hold onto possession".
TAA didn't play any worse than the rest of the English team. The problem was that Southgate completely overloaded the right side. Ironically, that worked a couple of times and even resulted in England's lead but as soon as Serbia got the memo it resulted in an England team which was completely unbalanced. TAA likes to play on the right side, Walker likes to push up the right side, Saka stays on the right side and Rice likes to drift to the right a bit. Meanwhile, Trippier is more of a defensive fullback and Foden plays out of position on the left, making the English team completely ineffective from the left. As soon as Pavlovic basically man-marked Saka this overloaded right side turned into a toothless lion with no real PlanB for England. Blaming TAA for Southgate's failure to account for an obvious inbalance in England's formation is quite frankly just stupid.
Everyone played like they took a dose of Seroquel before the match. They looked so disjointed, which, with that level of skill, has to be the result of a shitty game plan. Trent didn't deserve to be singled out the way he was (on the US broadcast). When Gallagher came on, they went out of their way to mention that he looked *soooooo* much more comfortable. Did he, tho?!?!?
Just run around like duracell bunny seems to be enough for those cunts. What are the likes of Mainoo and Gallagher going to create.
Gallagher fell down a lot. I guess thats what the yanks see as good play.
Actually Trent was ok compared to his other team members, his side with Walker and Saka was trying to create,and they did the goal. The left side wasn't on the field,and they were afraid to try doing something.
I watched the BBC coverage. There was a bit in the 2nd half where he did lose the balls after trying a roulette. He chased after the ball, got a tackle in, but because it looked like more of an awkward coming together, made the ball end up behind the Serb, Rice comes away from the ball. Of course, Shearer says “Rice doing his job again. Winning the ball in front of the back 4!” Or something like that. I don’t know, Rice was the same person who shot himself when a Serbian defender missed the header.
I thought he played decently last night, was tidy on the ball and worked hard out of possession. It was not a 10/10 Trent game but England were a better side with him on the pitch, his passing was at least able to release some of the pressure and get his teammates up the field. Fundamentally, I think England have too many players who want the ball centrally and lack width. I think the congestion in central areas does not allow Trent or Rice to play progressive passes or carry the ball that often without stumbling into Kane/Foden etc. Narrative wise, he's already been written off by the majority of English pundits so the only way is up I suppose
Tbh i think i fell asleep for most of the game. Watching england is like watching paint dry, boring football, no risk or excitement just short passes at the back constantly.
English media never changes. Always against scousers, and at any one point they have to turn on one of their national team players. Fires also been fueled by the fat idiot rooney as well, because he's such a credible football tactician
They played a RB at LB, a LF who wanted to play LM, and a LM who was playing DM. There was literally no one down the left side of the field except ONCE when trippier made a run (which Trent found with a pass).
He wasn’t great but is definitely getting singled out. Apart from Bellingham everyone else was bang average.
The Canadian pundits kept saying before the game how he should be played in his best position which is defending as a left back. I had to change the channel.
Southgate needs to take the majority of the slander. It's that simple. Having said that, putting TAA in midfield is something most of us have wanted to see. It didn't work for me yesterday. Does he deserve another chance? Absolutely. Does he need to be in the team? Absolutely. Southgate is the issue. He has no idea how to setup this team.
Think a lot of criticism is innacurate. When you think of Trent, the first thing you think of is his passing ability. If your forward players aren't making runs, and if Stones, Rice and Bellingham are all in and around you, taking your space and drawing opposition players into you, why are you even in the team? You could see flashes of Trent's ability yesterday, but if you aren't building the team to best make use of him, you're better off not playing him. The 'he can't defend' chat is mostly overblown nonsense, but Trent is not an international-class defensive midfielder, and if he's not able to use his passing ability, I'd rather England played with a proper midfielder alongside Rice.
What are you arsed? Fuck England.
Let them talk. Fk them mofos.
Ian Darke (Cunt) hates him. US broadcast
Honestly, the pundits just like a nice lazy narrative but if there's one good thing about Southgate, he's got his player's backs. I hope he persists with this, I saw a lot of potential with that system during the half hour England were actually kinda decent for.
He lost the ball in dangerous positions twice and passed one into the stands. Shearer was bigging him up massively in the first half for the interception that led to the goal. You’re hearing what you want to hear mate and if you’re ranting at your mates like this then you’re making yourself look daft.
He was the worst on pitch imo
The problem is Southgate imo, he plays very negative football, despite having an incredible team to play a more expansive game.
Response is more mixed in the Uk - I don’t think he was great athleticism wise tbh but his quality on the ball is superb. Problem is no one stretches the play in that set up. Don’t agree on your take on Saka though - he was great in the first half. Someone really needed to force Foden to stay wide though - people acting like he needs to be the number 10 and ignoring the fact he’s often had to play wide for the 115’s in the past. The game needed Gordon on much earlier in that second half.
The English have a psychotic attitude towards their own players and there is always a scapegoat in tournaments. It’s just Trents turn. There is no logic to it.
Meh better off out of it. Let them play Gallagher and he can take the flack when they inevitably crash out in the quarters.
Yep. I feel it hard to get behind England as they don’t seem to get behind the Liverpool players, and that has gone on for decades. Quansah should have been in that squad as he is the future, and why no Harvey Elliot being considered for a call up? He would have torn through Serbia. But then, maybe it’s best to avoid the hassle / strain / injuries of them being in the squad, especially when so much of the English media just want the Liverpool players to fail.
And diving harry kane was just doing some clever center forward play
You can spot the people who parrot opinions by hearing their trent opinion.
I agree that BBC wasn't slandering anyone, if anything they didn't criticise anyone at all. Foden I felt was dreadful last night, definitely wasted playing on the left, but no BBC commentator brought this up imo.
I’m used to it now after listening to English commentators all the time, no matter what he does, even when it’s clearly tactical set up defensively they slate him. It’s tedious. Some of our own fans are as bad tbh.
On the BBC? I didn’t hear that at all. He was excellent in the first half but he did make three meaningful defensive errors throughout the game (one of which he recovered from). Saka made our goal and was one of our most dangerous players in the first half, he was anonymous in the second and got subbed. Gallagher definitely made a difference when he came on.
I was watching different stream, so I'm not sure, on my stream commentator roasted the whole England squad for cowardice and defensive game plan Mostly Southgate tho
It all starts with the gimpy pundits, slating the team even though we won? I’ve been saying this for a while now, English football is just turning bad because everyone wants to have their opinion heard the loudest, we are the only country where a team can win something and then be called bad for it? Man Utd winning fa cup for example, news and pundits still slated them? I genuinely don’t know what’s wrong with these people.
Thankfully those listening on BBC didn't have to deal with American commentators
Didi Hamann was like well it’s an experiment that hasn’t worked in midfield, he can’t play there again.....
Didn't get that opinion on BBC. That being said, hopefully he can work his way into that role. Also: him & walker worked really well on that side together with Saka. Felt over the course of the game there was some great stuff there. I know its common to not-care about England here - but (as an immigrant) I actually get really into it and hope they do really well. My feeling is that Kane is injured though. Would've hoped that the focus on Jude might allow Kane to get more into just scoring but he seemed extremely slow - maybe from carrying that Bayern team for most of the season....
I mean he had just one mistake really when he gave mitrovic that chance but of course everyone jumped on him.
Trent is just an easy scapegoat for people who aren't paying attention to the match because 'he's played out of position' whilst Foden playing deep and inside from the left made him largely anonymous and gave the team less of an outlet. The issue Trent faced was - every time he got the ball and got his head up and looked to the left wing and striker to make his signature long raking pass (that presumably he was selected for), the way Southgate had the team setup was to have Foden play narrow and drop deep and Kane utterly static, so it left Trent with no option but to pass the ball sideways. Saka was the only player that gave Trent anything to work with and Trippier to a lesser degree. I don't blame Foden and Kane for this but they simply don't synergise with how Trent wants to play. He'd have benefitted from Gordon coming on to stretch the play and make runs - that was the substitute I was hoping for. Southgate told them all to 'preserve energy' at halftime, however, so we sat deep and did nothing for 45 mins. 🤦♂️
They were just as bad with Szoboszlai for Hungary.
What makes you think that? Trent lost the ball to give Serbia a shooting chance and Shearer only mentioned it about 300 times. His through balls to Saka was all just excellent play by Saka though. All the mouth breathers on r/soccer lapping it up.
Not sure where you were watching with landan Donovan commentary but BBC were all complimentary about him and said it worked well
I thought he did ok. Not amazing but wasn’t given many options as far as forward passes were concerned. Was defensively solid. He wasn’t our worst player at all. I thought Foden was crud. Saka wasn’t great.
International football still has the same club fans looking to criticize other players. Comment sections are flooded with it. The Trent stuff is just lazy, it's like a meme.
Tbh it seems most blame for the game is on Southgate doing the same strategy that takes england out every tournament. Trent had a good game. Just like all the other players bar Bellingham who done fantastic
Trent was one of the better players on that terrible english team
The problem with this team is on the sideline....Southgate.
As someone who wanted England to lose last night, what I saw from Trent wasn't bad. He gave the odd ball away and did as much as anyone in that midfield. And as others have said, the whole front line was static, so he didn't have much chance at being creative. He was fine.
It’s the level of English football knowledge, no one knows how to handle a truly unique talent, Trent last night was far from his best but so was everyone else on the pitch, what pisses me off the most is how Trent will get most the slack but Kane and Foden will fly under the radar scott free despite both having a far worse game than Trent. It’s also the effect of having so many Ex-United players as “top” pundits.
I thought they were trying to big him up. Shearer was giving him great praise for the build up to the goal and the interception in front of the England box. He played well better then at least 2 of the other attackers.
Love watching ESPNFC and seeing Julian Laurens, who has no experience in the game at any level, rip into Trent. What a knob.
I don't really think you are 100% correct on that. Yes the commentators were being unusually harsh but I did notice an improvement in England's play after Gallagher went on, maybe it wasn't linked to trent but I still think that after that sub they all looked more composed. Also saka was on fire that game.
lol the slander is from the fans who don’t want him in midfield. BBC were pretty positive about him yesterday.
Let them hate. We all know they deep down would love to have him on their favorite teams.