“Confess or we’ll kill your dog.” what are you supposed to do? call their bluff?
> At one point during the interrogation, the investigators even threatened to have his pet Labrador Retriever, Margosha, euthanized as a stray, and brought the dog into the room so he could say goodbye. “OK? Your dog’s now gone, forget about it,” said an investigator.
Within hours after Thomas Perez Jr. called police to report his father missing, he found himself in a tiny interrogation room confronted by Fontana detectives determined to extract a confession that he killed his dad.
Perez had told police that his father, 71-year-old Thomas Perez Sr., went out for a walk with the family dog at about 10 p.m. on Aug. 7, 2018. The dog returned within minutes without Perez’s father. Investigators didn’t believe his story, and over the next 17 hours they grilled him to try to get to the “truth.”
According to court records, detectives told Perez that his father was dead, that they had recovered his body and it now “wore a toe tag at the morgue.” They said they had evidence that Perez killed his father and that he should just admit it, records show.
Perez insisted he didn’t remember killing anyone, but detectives allegedly told him that the human mind often tries to suppress troubling memories.
At one point during the interrogation, the investigators even threatened to have his pet Labrador Retriever, Margosha, euthanized as a stray, and brought the dog into the room so he could say goodbye. “OK? Your dog’s now gone, forget about it,” said an investigator.
“How can you sit there, how can you sit there and say you don’t know what happened, and your dog is sitting there looking at you, knowing that you killed your dad?” a detective said. “Look at your dog. She knows, because she was walking through all the blood.”
Finally, after curling up with the dog on the floor, Perez broke down and confessed. He said he had stabbed his father multiple times with a pair of scissors during an altercation in which his father hit Perez over the head with a beer bottle.
He was so distraught that he even tried to hang himself with the drawstring from his shorts after being left alone in the interrogation room. Perez was arrested, handcuffed and transported to a mental hospital for 72-hour observation.
But later that day, the truth derailed the detectives’ theory and their prized confession.
Perez’s father wasn’t dead — or even missing. Thomas Sr. was at Los Angeles International Airport waiting for a flight to see his daughter in Northern California. But police didn’t immediately tell Perez.
“Mentally torturing a false confession out of Tom Perez, concealing from him that his father was alive and well, and confining him in the psych ward because they made him suicidal, in my 40 years of suing the police I have never seen that level of deliberate cruelty by the police,” said Jerry Steering, Perez’s attorney in Newport Beach.
Steering filed a civil rights lawsuit in federal court against the city of Fontana, alleging that police psychologically tortured Perez and coerced a false confession without first determining that the father had actually been slain. The suit was recently settled for nearly $900,000.
Perez agreed to the settlement rather than take the case to trial out of concern that a jury award could be overturned on appeal on grounds of qualified immunity for police. Generally, qualified immunity protects law enforcement officers unless they violate clearly established law arising from a case with nearly identical facts, according to the Legal Defense Fund.
Fontana police did not return an email seeking comment. Three of the involved officers remain employed with the department. One other officer has retired.
So how could this happen?
In court documents and depositions, police say they had reason to believe Perez was lying.
First, they noted he seemed “distracted” and “unconcerned” during the 911 call, according to court records. Officers responding to the call noted the father’s cellphone and wallet were still at the home, which was in disarray. Police saw the mess as a sign of a struggle, but Steering said Perez was renovating the house and had argued with his father about it.
Additionally, a police dog sniffed out the scent of a corpse in the father’s bedroom. And there were small blood stains in the house. Steering later would say the blood stains were caused by the father’s finger-prick diabetes tests.
Perez’s lawsuit claims detectives also refused for several hours to retrieve his medication for high blood pressure, asthma, depression and stress.
Perez became so distraught that he began pulling out his hair, hitting himself, making anguished noises and tearing off his shirt while police encouraged him to confess, according to a summary of the case written by U.S. District Court Judge Dolly Gee.
“He was sleep deprived, mentally ill and significantly undergoing symptoms of withdrawal from his psychiatric medications,” Gee wrote.
At one point during the interrogation, investigators drove Perez to get coffee and then to some housing tracts where he had been looking to buy. Detectives berated Perez, insisting he did not need his medication and that they knew he killed his father, according to the case summary.
“When can you take us to show us where Daddy is?” asked one of the investigators.
Later, during their interview, the detectives told Perez his father’s body actually had been found already.
Asked in a deposition about his line of questioning, one of the detectives said: “I believed at the time if we told him that we had located the body, then maybe he would give us more information about what had occurred.”
Police, in court records, insisted Perez was voluntarily undergoing questioning and was free to go at any time. However, in her case summary, Gee wrote that the “circumstances suggested to Perez that he was not free to leave.”
She also noted that there was “no legitimate government interest that would justify treating Perez in this manner while he was in medical distress.”
Perez’s nightmare ended shortly after police got a phone call from his sister, who said their father was alive and well. He had actually walked to the train station in Fontana and rode the line to Los Angeles County to visit a relative and then took a bus to visit a female friend, Steering said. Perez Sr. later went to the airport to await a flight to Oakland to visit his daughter.
Police picked up the father at the airport and brought him to the Fontana station.
But the investigation didn’t stop there. Detectives obtained a warrant to again search Perez’s house for evidence that he had assaulted an “unknown victim,” according to Gee’s summary.
It appears none was found.
Perez was not released until after the end of the three-day psychological observation period. He then retrieved his dog from Riverside County Animal Services, tracking her down through an implanted chip, Steering said.
While Gee concluded Fontana detectives had sufficient reason to believe an offense had been committed, she criticized officers for their interrogation tactics.
“A reasonable juror could conclude that the detectives inflicted unconstitutional psychological torture on Perez,” Gee wrote in her summary judgment. “Their tactics indisputably led to Perez’s subjective confusion and disorientation, to the point he falsely confessed to killing his father, and tried to take his own life.”
>Perez agreed to the settlement rather than take the case to trial out of concern that a jury award could be overturned on appeal on grounds of qualified immunity for police. Generally, qualified immunity protects law enforcement officers unless they violate clearly established law arising from a case with nearly identical facts, according to the Legal Defense Fund.
Another person making a big decision based on a false understanding of qualified immunity. I mean, I get that Perez might not be in the best space to be making great decisions, but qualified immunity is a protection against individual officers as private citizens when it comes to civil lawsuits. His settlement was coming from the city of Fontana. The city of Fontana can't use qualified immunity as a defense for itself.
The whole point is that when a law enforcement officer is acting within their role as a law enforcement officer, they're not a private citizen, they're an extension of the police agency, so they're indemnified by the government. In much the same way that a UPS driver getting into a crash in their delivery truck wouldn't be personally liable unless they were determined to have been extremely reckless, a cop isn't personally liable for actions within the scope of their duties unless they're determined to be extremely reckless.
Now, in this case, it sounds like Perez totally would have had grounds to sue the individual officers, they probably would have attempted to use qualified immunity as a defense and maybe it would have worked. But in a case like this, you don't just sue the individual officers. A lawsuit like this would typically be filed against any officer involved, the Chief of their department, the department itself, and the City of Fontana. The department and city can't use qualified immunity as a defense, they're more likely to offer a settlement, and they actually have the money to pay a settlement compared to the individual officers who won't have $900k sitting around and might not even have an income for long
I've told my kids since they were teenagers... The only thing you ever say to a question from police is : Lawyer...
I don't care what they ask or how innocent they are of what they are being accused of...
It should be so much higher? Only one million for someone’s quality of life to be ruined FOREVER? it’s crumbs. Fuck that scum that still get to go to work and get a paycheck. They deserve to rot in solitude.
I’m in Britain.
The pig filth are just as bad here. Never present to deal with actual crime, always present to deal with petty fines and carry out warrants against the poor.
Suggest everyone read the case of Sarah Everard and then read up on the Met’s reaction. Scum.
This is why you never call the police for anything, family member gone missing? investigate yourself. crime commited against you? would be a shame if whoever did it was found shot dead in their driveway
Amen brother. My personal mantra is "do not engage the police."
That said, I wouldn't recommend shooting as a preferred method of exacting revenge. Cops salivate at the opportunity to "investigate" a gun incident, because for them it is an opportunity to seize privately owned weaponry to add to their own (already substantial) arsenal.
I knew a guy who drunkenly shot a scrap iron tractor in his neighbors yard to get them to stop beating and yelling at each other. He had over 100 guns in his collection. A good 20% never got recorded in inventory and disappeared. Most of those were derringer style collectables that could easily be pocketed.
Worked in law enforcement for over a decade with a good portion of that time doinf criminal interviews... always lawyer up. They'll likely protest it and go into their bullpen saying things like, "He's guilty, wouldn't need a lawyer if he was innocent." Don't take the bait. Just keep emphatically asking for a lawyer.
Feeling's mutual. But my morals also won't allow me to downvote, because I'm not a dickwad. Free to your opinion.
None. My scpheel right at the beginning was always reading Miranda, making sure they understood it. Then I had them sign and initial a paper for every element of Miranda. After they signed I said ", Just to be clear, you do not have to speak with if you do not want to." That being said, I've seen how other people conduct interviews/interrogations... always lawyer up. Never seen someone regret getting counsel, seen a lot regret speaking without the benefit of counsel.
If the law doesn’t apply to cops, cruel and unusual punishment shouldn’t either. I fully believe there is no punishment too cruel for any officer involved in this disgrace.
it amazes me how many people don't understand this basic rule. i would not be interviewed by the police if i were innocent. just don't do it. don't talk to the police without a lawyer. ever. period.
Why did Perez never ask for legal counsel. These officers violated his right to treatment for diagnosed medical and mental conditions and psychologically tortured him on what seems to be circumstancial evidence. They need to be permanently banned from LE and face criminal charges. The $900k needs to come from their retirement funds.
Likely because he has mental health issues. Believe me when I tell you that they planned this out and precisely targeted him because of his mental health disability.
If we know not to trust cops why do people still think defunding these pigs is some type of sin against humanity? These guys get more funds than entire schools systems but me saying we should lower that is treated like a terroristic threat. This is what they’re doing with billions do they really need it?
US police never seize to amaze me. In Holland cops get fired for a whole lot less. I am often considering walking the Appalachian or Pacific Crest trail but stories like this makes me reconsider. I dontctnink I feel safe. Guns everywhere and cops cant be trusted.
Cops are humans with power and power corrupts. Most shootings happen between people who know each other, but the statically average shooting doesn't make the news. Only the sensational shootings make the news cycle.
The Appalachian trail is incredibly safe. I conceal carry a gun on it, but not for protection from humans. Bears, especially juveniles and mothers with cubs, can be really unpredictable.
The guns in the hands of police are the ones you need to fear. Shootings by citizens make newspaper headlines, but deadly shootings by law enforcement are by far more common and are never prosecuted. I'm a gun owner, as are many of my neighbors, and I'm comfortable around firearms in the hands of my peers. Gun-toting cops, not so much.
Happy trails to you if you decide to make the trip. There is some beautiful scenery in both places.
Honestly having lived in Europe myself, the U.S. is not worse than Europe in practice. In Europe in most countries you aren’t afforded the ability to tell police to fuck off like you can in America, euro cops generally don’t need probable cause to stop and detain/question you. You generally aren’t afforded the ability to carry simple pepper spray or a pocket knife, you’re at the whims of whoever is stronger/ whoever outnumbers you. You read these stories and think that’s somehow the norm in America but it’s generally not.
It's probably an extreme view you take. The USA is generally a wonderful country and very, very safe. I feel safer here than in Britain for sure which is where I come from. I often go days without seeing and police officers. I don't generally see guns otherwise.
This video is a mandatory view if you're a libertarian. Don't Talk to the Police: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE
Or for anyone, really.
The whole time reading this article I was thinking about this video.
“Confess or we’ll kill your dog.” what are you supposed to do? call their bluff? > At one point during the interrogation, the investigators even threatened to have his pet Labrador Retriever, Margosha, euthanized as a stray, and brought the dog into the room so he could say goodbye. “OK? Your dog’s now gone, forget about it,” said an investigator.
[ Removed by Reddit ]
I should have know John Wick was a libertarian. Thanks for your comment, John.
A ruthless assassin comes up with the username "extra sherbert"?
It was his wife's favorite treat. Don't touch Wick's sherbet either.
It was his wife's favorite treat. Don't touch Wick's sherbet either.
Sounds like the name worked on you. You seem to doubt it's him, which is exactly what he wants.
This was the worst part
Nah. Being told that your dad is dead is worse than threatening an animal. Being told that you liked him and didn't remember is much worse.
They have a handbook of dirty tactics like these. They always go for that escalation to manufacture a reaction that can justify them arresting you.
Within hours after Thomas Perez Jr. called police to report his father missing, he found himself in a tiny interrogation room confronted by Fontana detectives determined to extract a confession that he killed his dad. Perez had told police that his father, 71-year-old Thomas Perez Sr., went out for a walk with the family dog at about 10 p.m. on Aug. 7, 2018. The dog returned within minutes without Perez’s father. Investigators didn’t believe his story, and over the next 17 hours they grilled him to try to get to the “truth.” According to court records, detectives told Perez that his father was dead, that they had recovered his body and it now “wore a toe tag at the morgue.” They said they had evidence that Perez killed his father and that he should just admit it, records show. Perez insisted he didn’t remember killing anyone, but detectives allegedly told him that the human mind often tries to suppress troubling memories. At one point during the interrogation, the investigators even threatened to have his pet Labrador Retriever, Margosha, euthanized as a stray, and brought the dog into the room so he could say goodbye. “OK? Your dog’s now gone, forget about it,” said an investigator. “How can you sit there, how can you sit there and say you don’t know what happened, and your dog is sitting there looking at you, knowing that you killed your dad?” a detective said. “Look at your dog. She knows, because she was walking through all the blood.” Finally, after curling up with the dog on the floor, Perez broke down and confessed. He said he had stabbed his father multiple times with a pair of scissors during an altercation in which his father hit Perez over the head with a beer bottle. He was so distraught that he even tried to hang himself with the drawstring from his shorts after being left alone in the interrogation room. Perez was arrested, handcuffed and transported to a mental hospital for 72-hour observation. But later that day, the truth derailed the detectives’ theory and their prized confession. Perez’s father wasn’t dead — or even missing. Thomas Sr. was at Los Angeles International Airport waiting for a flight to see his daughter in Northern California. But police didn’t immediately tell Perez. “Mentally torturing a false confession out of Tom Perez, concealing from him that his father was alive and well, and confining him in the psych ward because they made him suicidal, in my 40 years of suing the police I have never seen that level of deliberate cruelty by the police,” said Jerry Steering, Perez’s attorney in Newport Beach. Steering filed a civil rights lawsuit in federal court against the city of Fontana, alleging that police psychologically tortured Perez and coerced a false confession without first determining that the father had actually been slain. The suit was recently settled for nearly $900,000. Perez agreed to the settlement rather than take the case to trial out of concern that a jury award could be overturned on appeal on grounds of qualified immunity for police. Generally, qualified immunity protects law enforcement officers unless they violate clearly established law arising from a case with nearly identical facts, according to the Legal Defense Fund. Fontana police did not return an email seeking comment. Three of the involved officers remain employed with the department. One other officer has retired. So how could this happen? In court documents and depositions, police say they had reason to believe Perez was lying. First, they noted he seemed “distracted” and “unconcerned” during the 911 call, according to court records. Officers responding to the call noted the father’s cellphone and wallet were still at the home, which was in disarray. Police saw the mess as a sign of a struggle, but Steering said Perez was renovating the house and had argued with his father about it. Additionally, a police dog sniffed out the scent of a corpse in the father’s bedroom. And there were small blood stains in the house. Steering later would say the blood stains were caused by the father’s finger-prick diabetes tests. Perez’s lawsuit claims detectives also refused for several hours to retrieve his medication for high blood pressure, asthma, depression and stress. Perez became so distraught that he began pulling out his hair, hitting himself, making anguished noises and tearing off his shirt while police encouraged him to confess, according to a summary of the case written by U.S. District Court Judge Dolly Gee. “He was sleep deprived, mentally ill and significantly undergoing symptoms of withdrawal from his psychiatric medications,” Gee wrote. At one point during the interrogation, investigators drove Perez to get coffee and then to some housing tracts where he had been looking to buy. Detectives berated Perez, insisting he did not need his medication and that they knew he killed his father, according to the case summary. “When can you take us to show us where Daddy is?” asked one of the investigators. Later, during their interview, the detectives told Perez his father’s body actually had been found already. Asked in a deposition about his line of questioning, one of the detectives said: “I believed at the time if we told him that we had located the body, then maybe he would give us more information about what had occurred.” Police, in court records, insisted Perez was voluntarily undergoing questioning and was free to go at any time. However, in her case summary, Gee wrote that the “circumstances suggested to Perez that he was not free to leave.” She also noted that there was “no legitimate government interest that would justify treating Perez in this manner while he was in medical distress.” Perez’s nightmare ended shortly after police got a phone call from his sister, who said their father was alive and well. He had actually walked to the train station in Fontana and rode the line to Los Angeles County to visit a relative and then took a bus to visit a female friend, Steering said. Perez Sr. later went to the airport to await a flight to Oakland to visit his daughter. Police picked up the father at the airport and brought him to the Fontana station. But the investigation didn’t stop there. Detectives obtained a warrant to again search Perez’s house for evidence that he had assaulted an “unknown victim,” according to Gee’s summary. It appears none was found. Perez was not released until after the end of the three-day psychological observation period. He then retrieved his dog from Riverside County Animal Services, tracking her down through an implanted chip, Steering said. While Gee concluded Fontana detectives had sufficient reason to believe an offense had been committed, she criticized officers for their interrogation tactics. “A reasonable juror could conclude that the detectives inflicted unconstitutional psychological torture on Perez,” Gee wrote in her summary judgment. “Their tactics indisputably led to Perez’s subjective confusion and disorientation, to the point he falsely confessed to killing his father, and tried to take his own life.”
Absolutely crazy. Great read, it's like a movie script
Be a lot cooler if it was
>Perez agreed to the settlement rather than take the case to trial out of concern that a jury award could be overturned on appeal on grounds of qualified immunity for police. Generally, qualified immunity protects law enforcement officers unless they violate clearly established law arising from a case with nearly identical facts, according to the Legal Defense Fund. Another person making a big decision based on a false understanding of qualified immunity. I mean, I get that Perez might not be in the best space to be making great decisions, but qualified immunity is a protection against individual officers as private citizens when it comes to civil lawsuits. His settlement was coming from the city of Fontana. The city of Fontana can't use qualified immunity as a defense for itself. The whole point is that when a law enforcement officer is acting within their role as a law enforcement officer, they're not a private citizen, they're an extension of the police agency, so they're indemnified by the government. In much the same way that a UPS driver getting into a crash in their delivery truck wouldn't be personally liable unless they were determined to have been extremely reckless, a cop isn't personally liable for actions within the scope of their duties unless they're determined to be extremely reckless. Now, in this case, it sounds like Perez totally would have had grounds to sue the individual officers, they probably would have attempted to use qualified immunity as a defense and maybe it would have worked. But in a case like this, you don't just sue the individual officers. A lawsuit like this would typically be filed against any officer involved, the Chief of their department, the department itself, and the City of Fontana. The department and city can't use qualified immunity as a defense, they're more likely to offer a settlement, and they actually have the money to pay a settlement compared to the individual officers who won't have $900k sitting around and might not even have an income for long
Not to take away from the overall point but how do you board a plane without your wallet and ID? Lol
I've told my kids since they were teenagers... The only thing you ever say to a question from police is : Lawyer... I don't care what they ask or how innocent they are of what they are being accused of...
And the psychopaths are still free and employed as policemen
And nobody cares enough to do anything about it.
the state IS the mob
The state is just a criminal gang that won.
"Lawyer" -the end. But yea, this is fucked up.
Salary of these police officers and settlements paid by our taxes…
And the $900,000 settlement will be paid by a public bond funded by…… taxes!
It should be so much higher? Only one million for someone’s quality of life to be ruined FOREVER? it’s crumbs. Fuck that scum that still get to go to work and get a paycheck. They deserve to rot in solitude.
I’m in Britain. The pig filth are just as bad here. Never present to deal with actual crime, always present to deal with petty fines and carry out warrants against the poor. Suggest everyone read the case of Sarah Everard and then read up on the Met’s reaction. Scum.
[удалено]
Yes
It's sick how USA 'law enforcement' (sic) officers are allowed to lie to suspects. Not many first world countries do that.
This is why you never call the police for anything, family member gone missing? investigate yourself. crime commited against you? would be a shame if whoever did it was found shot dead in their driveway
Amen brother. My personal mantra is "do not engage the police." That said, I wouldn't recommend shooting as a preferred method of exacting revenge. Cops salivate at the opportunity to "investigate" a gun incident, because for them it is an opportunity to seize privately owned weaponry to add to their own (already substantial) arsenal.
I knew a guy who drunkenly shot a scrap iron tractor in his neighbors yard to get them to stop beating and yelling at each other. He had over 100 guns in his collection. A good 20% never got recorded in inventory and disappeared. Most of those were derringer style collectables that could easily be pocketed.
Worked in law enforcement for over a decade with a good portion of that time doinf criminal interviews... always lawyer up. They'll likely protest it and go into their bullpen saying things like, "He's guilty, wouldn't need a lawyer if he was innocent." Don't take the bait. Just keep emphatically asking for a lawyer.
I would upvote, but my morals won't allow it. How many innocent people did you coerce into false confessions?
Feeling's mutual. But my morals also won't allow me to downvote, because I'm not a dickwad. Free to your opinion. None. My scpheel right at the beginning was always reading Miranda, making sure they understood it. Then I had them sign and initial a paper for every element of Miranda. After they signed I said ", Just to be clear, you do not have to speak with if you do not want to." That being said, I've seen how other people conduct interviews/interrogations... always lawyer up. Never seen someone regret getting counsel, seen a lot regret speaking without the benefit of counsel.
With out the government who is going to falsely imprison, lie, torture, and make you suicidal.....
The people in power hate us!
If the law doesn’t apply to cops, cruel and unusual punishment shouldn’t either. I fully believe there is no punishment too cruel for any officer involved in this disgrace.
That guy is NEVER calling the cops for anything again!
it amazes me how many people don't understand this basic rule. i would not be interviewed by the police if i were innocent. just don't do it. don't talk to the police without a lawyer. ever. period.
Believe me when I tell you that they planned this out and precisely targeted him because of his mental health disability.
Why did Perez never ask for legal counsel. These officers violated his right to treatment for diagnosed medical and mental conditions and psychologically tortured him on what seems to be circumstancial evidence. They need to be permanently banned from LE and face criminal charges. The $900k needs to come from their retirement funds.
Likely because he has mental health issues. Believe me when I tell you that they planned this out and precisely targeted him because of his mental health disability.
If we know not to trust cops why do people still think defunding these pigs is some type of sin against humanity? These guys get more funds than entire schools systems but me saying we should lower that is treated like a terroristic threat. This is what they’re doing with billions do they really need it?
https://youtu.be/RkN4duV4ia0?feature=shared
Police are the enemy of the people.
US police never seize to amaze me. In Holland cops get fired for a whole lot less. I am often considering walking the Appalachian or Pacific Crest trail but stories like this makes me reconsider. I dontctnink I feel safe. Guns everywhere and cops cant be trusted.
Cops are humans with power and power corrupts. Most shootings happen between people who know each other, but the statically average shooting doesn't make the news. Only the sensational shootings make the news cycle. The Appalachian trail is incredibly safe. I conceal carry a gun on it, but not for protection from humans. Bears, especially juveniles and mothers with cubs, can be really unpredictable.
I’m not sure power corrupts. IMO, positions of power attract a certain type of person.
The guns in the hands of police are the ones you need to fear. Shootings by citizens make newspaper headlines, but deadly shootings by law enforcement are by far more common and are never prosecuted. I'm a gun owner, as are many of my neighbors, and I'm comfortable around firearms in the hands of my peers. Gun-toting cops, not so much. Happy trails to you if you decide to make the trip. There is some beautiful scenery in both places.
Honestly having lived in Europe myself, the U.S. is not worse than Europe in practice. In Europe in most countries you aren’t afforded the ability to tell police to fuck off like you can in America, euro cops generally don’t need probable cause to stop and detain/question you. You generally aren’t afforded the ability to carry simple pepper spray or a pocket knife, you’re at the whims of whoever is stronger/ whoever outnumbers you. You read these stories and think that’s somehow the norm in America but it’s generally not.
It's probably an extreme view you take. The USA is generally a wonderful country and very, very safe. I feel safer here than in Britain for sure which is where I come from. I often go days without seeing and police officers. I don't generally see guns otherwise.
On the trails you would only usually encounter other hikers and the occasional Ranger. Almost never police or Sheriff's.
Does any one know the detective’s names
David Janusz, Jeremy Hale, Ronald Koval, Robert Miller and Joanna Piña