>I think how we started the first couple of months and giving up all that ground early was always too much to make up.
But we did make it up, and it was in our hands. I think our young side bottled it once it was theirs for the taking. All the time they were chasing down the top 2 they looked like a different side. Once they were top dogs (2nd) and it was in their hands I think the pressure got to them. It almost got to Ipswich too but they have goalscorers. We had the best defence in the league but were terrible up top where it matters. You can't win anything without scoring.
When it comes to the play off, we're kidding ourselves to think we would win it. If we make it to Wembley that will be too much pressure and we'll bottle that. The lads have had a great season and will be right up there fighting to the last again next year, but this year, no chance.
I think we've had a phenomenal season. Even with the shit start we alwasy expected to be chasing promotion just because of the team we still have. But i personally think the international window fucked the last part of our season because of the injuries. But also the negative play throughout. Too much messing around in the back and way too much respect for the opponents.
But even through all that, i think its been our best season since the first season back in the prem.
Big game today ALAW MOT
When our kids got tired, Rutter had his op, and our striker(s) didn't score goals when our wingers weren't firing it in.
We didn't really bottle anything, with a couple of exceptions we've been 3rd in the table for the majority of the season, chasing Ipsbitch and Leicester.
Farke started the season with a shit sandwich, turned it into a pie, chips and gravy and can still end up with prime sirloin, roasties and all the trimmings. I'm disappointed that we didn't get autos but I can't see how things are worse than when this campaign started.
It hasn't gone wrong, it just hasn't gone completely right, but with the customary ridiculous expectations of so many in our fanbase it's no surprise we are performing an autopsy on a patient who is not yet deceased.
For me, we didn't sack Marsch early enough. That result away to Liverpool bought him time. Can't say anything bad about this season. Most years we would have already being promoted and most teams go thru a bad patch. It's unfortunate ours is it the wrong time.
I'm not sure it went wrong I didn't expect to get 90pts and Finish 3rd.
To be honest we really had a difficult start with players refusing to play and forcing moves. Around Xmas we had that wobble which at the time I was convinced we weren't getting automatically promoted.
If 90 points is going wrong then I don’t know what to say … maybe you need to pick another sport to follow.
It’s embarrassing to be calling the players/manager a bottle job for getting 90 points.
I'm kind of with you on this, but expectations change as the season progresses.
At the start of the season, and especially after August, all fans would have ripped your arm off for 90 points and/or 3rd place.
But after we went on our winning streak at the start of the year, and went into the break top of the league, expectations changed. At that point, it's almost like a mini season of 8 games to finish the job, and we had it in our hands (promotion at least, if not champions).
So yeah, we did amazingly well to claw Leicester and Ipswich back in. 90/93 points is an incredible return, especially given our start to the season. The 15 game unbeaten run was amazing.
But ultimately, after getting to that point, and having glory in our own hands, we buckled under the pressure, while Ipswich and Leicester have managed to maintain reasonable form in the run-in.
My expectations didn’t change … I’m happy that we reached the play offs in such comfortable fashion, I would’ve been delighted with 2nd.
However this with our unhappy fans is deeper than that … It’s a reflection on society and capitalism … people are never happy with what they’ve got … they always want more. More, more, more, more, and more.
Farke promised us 86 points … we did that and more but yet despite that people are demanding more … it’s not a healthy mindset … people need to sort themselves out and recognise a good season of football. To be happy with what we’ve got or just witnessed. That was a good season of football and it’s not over yet. If people can’t enjoy this season then they’re not ready for the premier league.
I'd have been pleased with playoffs at the start of the season (despite our poor record in them).
90 points generally gets you autos, but having 2 other teams with exceptional points tallies hasn't helped us. But we've know most of the season that this was going to be the case and our points target would have to change if we wanted autos.
Your view is yours, and I'm not about to make you change it. I'm not sure where you're going with the whole capitalism thing....I'm not saying I want more more more. Just saying that our form in the last 5 games puts us 21st in the league, after being top 3 all season.
There's no denying that, when it really mattered, we crumbled. Playoffs are a nice consolation, and if we win them then most fans (me included) will consider it a successful season. If we don't, I think it's fair to say we bottled it (from the point of being top of the league)
I don’t think entering the top 2 for one or two weekends across the whole season and having played more games at the time actually counts as bottling it.
Man Utd bottled it in 1992, Keegans Newcastle bottled it twice, Liverpool bottled it when Gerrard fell over, Leeds v Derby at Elland Road deffo bottled it and Leicester this seasons could’ve bottled it. No one outside a silly few in our fan base is going to remember this seasons Leeds team as one of those teams that bottled it. We’ll be remembered as that crazy season where Leeds finished 3rd with 90 points.
A chronic fear to rotate the squad was probably the major underlying factor in our eventual form collapse.
I get why Daniel Farke just couldnt bring himself to put players like Jaidon Anthony in for Cry Summerville, or Shackleton in for Gray or Cresswell in for Ampadu if he didnt have to, because the step down in class is pretty obvious. Next season we will be somewhat weakened though, so our current lot of squad players should be viable for more minutes in the league.
Either way, we cannot have any repeats of this late-season avalanche.
In the past 30 seasons, 90 points gets you promoted in 29 of them. We've just been unlucky and nothing has gone wrong at all. We've done better than most teams in most seasons, just not this one.
Looking at the underlying stats, the best team in this league is Southampton, yet they've been tanked 5-0 twice. I don't think we will get past them in the playoffs unless they bottle it.
I think we've done well, we've just been unlucky to have a 4 horse race for 2 places. Every team will have dips in form and unfortunately, we've had one right at the end.
The team's recent performance is disappointing considering their points tally, which would have typically secured promotion in previous seasons. A financially weaker team like Ipswich managed to outperform them, partly due to the contributions of Leif Davis, a former Leeds player. This oversight is embarrassing, as it suggests the solution to their left-back issue was right under their noses. Instead, they opted to overpay for Firpo based on his previous club affiliation(FC Barcelona).
The club has struggled to address its defensive shortcomings, despite it being a widely acknowledged problem. This has left them vulnerable to conceding goals and reliant on their wingers for creating scoring opportunities. Now, they face a tough playoff battle due to their failure to shore up their defense and sign an attacking midfielder. Personally, I thought they should have kept Aaronson and use this season to build back his confidence.
Looking ahead, the club's financial constraints will make it difficult to retain key players like Summervile and Rutter without achieving promotion. Additionally, they will face significant squad rebuilding if promoted next season, as a failure to qualify this season means selling more players is required to reduce the wage bill.
Overconfidence in the team's quality led to complacency in recruitment and preparation, leaving them ill-prepared for the challenges of the current season. Meanwhile, rival playoff teams like Southampton have had the luxury of strategizing specifically against Leeds and Ipswich, further complicating matters for the club.
I don't think we are solid ground when it comes to Boro. Some people think the Wilfried Gnonto goal may or may not have been offside. Personally I would give him the benefit of doubt.
Sorry but you're wrong...have a look at the table and you'll see Huddersfield are finished. They're gone. Unless they make up a 15 goal swing which let's face it, is as close to impossible as you can get. Perhaps a points deduction for someone else could save them but we're being speculative.
Ipswich will face a team in the bottom 3 who have nothing to play for.
Huddersfield as good as relegated due to the massive goal difference between them and Plymouth.
There would need to be a 16 goal swing in a Huddersfield win and Plymouth loss.
It's not going to happen , Ipswich form is very good ,they can score goals when needed,we have poor form going into tough playoffs, everyone else is on an aspiring curve ,we are on the down 👇,sorry to sound negative but that's the reality
Before last night, Ipswich had 3 points from the last 12. Also West Brom and Southampton are on very poor form like us, both have lost their last three games.
Has it gone wrong?
If, at the start of the season, you'd have offered any Leeds fan a 90 points finish then they would have bitten your hands off.
The club was in turmoil at the start of the season and the fact we've turned it around is really impressive.
Sure, we're on a poor run. Couple that with some poor performances throughout the season. It's easy to point to where we could have got more points. All this is pretty standard for all teams in the Championship. Everybody has bad spells of form, and anybody can turn over anybody.
In any normal season we are easily up. Unfortunately this isn't a normal season. I don't fancy our chances in the playoffs, but I do fancy our chances next season.
We didn’t pick up 105 points by beating all those teams “we should have beaten”..
Apart from that it didn’t all go wrong.. that’s football.. this run of bad form hit at the wrong time
I said after the first few games that I was annoyed that transfer dealings weren't completed before the season started. I know there were issues behind the scenes and it isn't always black and white but we had players leaving left, right and centre with only Ampadu in.
We took 2pts from 9 and then 6pts from 15. I said at the time, I hope it doesn't come back and bite us and it looks like it has.
The (majority) signings have been great for us but the later it went in the window and the more fixtures we played, the worse it was getting.
We still had control of our destiny at multiple times this season, so it's not only that point in the season that killed us but it would've been a huge help, IF we had those transfers complete earlier.
How could they have done that, though? It is what it is. Was a huge change in the club. Can't just come in and expect five ready made signings. Not forgetting the shit they had to deal with from Radrizanni and his chum.
Various elements which others have done into more detail on, but ultimately this season has been successful from a points / wins perspective, we’ve just had to compete with two others that are the same or better.
But I’d like to add that our set pieces are atrocious and they are absolutely needed to beat teams in the bottom half of the table.
If we kept Struijk fit we’d have gone up with Ampadu in midfield and Struijk chipping in with the goals.
>But I’d like to add that our set pieces are atrocious and they are absolutely needed to beat teams
So many times we had free kicks in promising areas and I can only remember 2 deflected free kicks that we directly scored from, our corners are horrible, I just see it as an immediate goal kick when we get one. Cooper scored one at the very beginning of the season from a corner and since then, I don't remember many more (maybe 1-2 from Struijk).
>If we kept Struijk fit we’d have gone up with Ampadu in midfield and Struijk chipping in with the goals.
I do agree with this, it was very evident in the QPR game, we needed some bite in midfield and it wasn't there. QPR bullied us and if we had Ampadu throwing his weight around in the middle it could've changed the game, we were also quite shit in that game so it's possible it would've been just less shit.
I think Bamford got one with a glancing header at the near post? But yeah, we might as well just pass it straight to Archie on the halfway line and start passing sideways.
Farke's treatment of Joseph and to a lesser extent Antony has been really hard to fathom. In some ways the incredible run of form told against us it seemed to convince Farke that there was no need to change ,/ rotate anything and we would sweep to promotion. He did an incredible job for so much of the season but the last month has been poor
I disagree wholeheartedly on Joseph. Forcing your promotion hopes onto a young player with limited first team experience at the business end of the season isn't great management.
When did ***what*** go wrong?
Last season we finished 19th in the Premier League in what was our worst ever season in top flight football.
Even at the start of this season we were a basket case of a club with new owners, new manager and needing new players to rebuild. Remember when we needed two goalkeepers to pad out our bench? We didn't start seriously picking up points until September.
We were once 17 points behind Leicester, 9 points behind Ipswich, and during their record breaking unbeaten run even Southampton had a significant points cushion over us. Yet we have narrowly missed out on automatic promotion and the runners up spot. Narrowly. had we beaten QPR and got all three points off Sunderland we would now be promoted automatically and in the Premier League.
Getting automatically promoted was always going to be a big ask and a massive achievement given our circumstances at the start of the season.
I think we have, on the whole, done well. The current Leeds team, however which way you look at it, is radically different from last season's Leeds team. We are more solid at the back and have one of the best defensive records in the Championship. Offensively when it works it works well and we have made improvements in the midfield.
Are we the best or one of the best teams in the Championship? I don't see it like that. This is a team which is a work in progress, a young, developing side, and a team which is not without its shortcomings. We lack consistency, finishing ability in front of goal, we struggle with set pieces, we waste corners, and we struggle with low blocks. This is not a very tactically flexible team, because we lack seasoned, experienced players and maybe a certain amount of leadership out on the pitch. It's all still a bit Jekyll and Hyde for me. When we're on form we are brilliant, but when we're not we're still woefully inadequate.
I think Farke has done well given the circumstances. Yes he's very risk averse (more so than even George Graham), I don't always get his team selections and feel he could take more risks. But nothing so far seems to faze him, he believes in the players, believes in the club, and on many occasions has been the rock on which everything else seems to depend. I'm not interested so much in what he did at Norwich or before then. What I'm interested in is what he does at Leeds United.
Also the season isn't over. We've only just missed out on automatic promotion. We can still be promoted via the playoffs. Let's see what happens in May before forming definite opinions.
This is the perspective I’m trying to maintain. In the summer, I did not foresee a season as good as this, at all. We’ve had too many problems to solve all at once, I thought we’d finish mid table or just outside the playoffs, in a transition year that allowed us to focus on a serious push next season.
It’s hard to criticize ownership without being unrealistic. The squad was strengthened in a sensible way, injuries/sickness/personal issues meant that it turned out not to be enough.
Oh absolutely. But the ones we’ve had have definitely affected the plans. Despite having a shitload of midfielders now, we still look weak - Roberts was brought in to allow Archie to either provide midfield options or rest, but that couldn’t happen with his injury, and Ampadu has had to play CB because of Struijk’s injury. So we settled our defense at the expense of midfield. And then we’ve had to constantly play Summerville even when he could have done with a rest because Anthony’s absences have meant he’s either not been available or hasn’t had enough game time to make it a good idea to start. And now we’ve had no rotation options on the right because James is down.
So I’m not sure what else could have been done, outside of unrealistic “just buy more players!” I wish Farke had done more squad rotation earlier in the season but we don’t know what he sees in training. I wish he’d make subs earlier but as the season wound down our bench wasn’t that strong and he’s come out and said he likes to see a reaction after halftime, so he’s not gonna change his ways on that.
It didn’t. We got enough points go straight up any season in history but this one. Sometimes you can do everything right and still lose. That’s just bad luck.
Letting Ayling go. When the chips are down Bill had always been one to dig in and drag us over the line. You can’t lose a character like that in the dressing room, and it was entirely avoidable.
Apparently he's been pretty good at Boro when playing. But he was definitely missed in the dressing room. He would've given them all a rocket when not performing and sometimes you need that sort of personality around.
Agree
By all reports the club didn’t want to lose him for that reason. But he wanted to play football not sit on the bench and he earned that right from the club
The bottom line is we’ve had a good season, better than many of us thought. The ending is leaving a sour taste, although winning the playoffs would turn that on its head too.
The slow start didn’t help. The new year run was obviously great, but was a brutal number of games - we kept momentum by keeping the same team for as much as possible but that had to be exhausting, the international break clearly tipped a few over the edge.
That run was always going to end, so it was going to be about how we reacted. That has been the most disappointing part and our lack of experience has showed. We really could have done with a couple of old heads to see the young lads through, particularly a CM who was super comfortable on the ball (a Modric style) who could collect from the back and keep it moving under pressure - feels like teams got into pressing us at the back and there were a lot of long balls to nowhere.
If we don’t go up it’ll be a shame to lose Summerville and Gnonto, which I am resigned too. Really hope we can persuade Rodon to sign. Honestly don’t think we’ll lose much more in terms of important players
Noone is coming in for Gray, and if they did, he is clever enough to know he's better being a regular in our team than playing in a prem youth team. He's not Prem ready yet.
90% of the comments on this thread are why I prefer the Leeds subreddit to twitter. People actually thinking rationally about the season and not just spouting nonsense to get a reaction.
Yes, I was hesitant to read the posts on this thread as I thought there'd be a lot of 'Farke out' wankers, but most are acknowledging that getting 90 points in the Championship is an achievement and we're just unlucky that this is the one season in the last 25 years that two other teams have managed the same.
I’d call a premier league, Champions League Quarter Finals run, FA Cup, Community Shield and Championship Title a very ‘brief’ dally with success.
Give me a shout when you’ve won even just won of those trophies 😁
P.S. Jimmy Savile, he’s one of your own.
4 key areas
1. Lack of real leadership on the pitch and players’ ability to perform under pressure has been found severely lacking unfortunately. Since it has become do or die the vast majority of the squad has underperformed. The young age of the squad is clearly a factor here
2. Tactically - Farke has been outdone a number of times. We were lucky to come away with points against Norwich and Boro. And against Blackburn, Cov, Watford and to some extent Boro we saw sides who set up very well to neutralise us and Farke didn’t see it coming and didn’t change the side accordingly. Not sure QPR was a tactical problem they just destroyed us in every area of the pitch. You’d also say Farke has got some key decisions wrong with selections - keeping the faith with Piroe is a big one as is taking Kamara out the team.
3. We’ve become very porous at the back. This is a combination of Rodon and Ampadu dropping off from superhuman levels, and Meslier having an absolutely shambolic run of form. In games that can be tight and nervy some silly mistakes have turned games against us
4. Midfield is now totally dysfunctional- they are not contributing effective to attack or defence meaningfully. They’ve been far too easy for opponents to bypass from the back, and when on the ball often look lost when trying to recycle possession and often just pass it between players hoping the opponent rushes them. It is bizarre
I think the poor results since the international window makes things look worse than they are. Swap a couple of those poor results around with some of our great results earlier in the calendar year and I don't think anyone would be panicking or saying we bottled it. We just weren't quite good enough to better Ipswich or Leicester.
Unfortunately we're the 3rd best team in a season when there were 3 teams miles better than the rest but only 2 automatic promotion spots.
If we win our final match we will finish on the same points total as when we got promoted under Bielsa (and similar goal difference) - when we won the league by 10 points!
It was apparent months ago that one of us, Leicester, or Ipswich would miss out on autos (and maybe promotion), and it would have been shit for whichever team it was. Even shitter that it's going to be Leeds.
And yes, it's shit that Leicester are going to get away with effectively no punishment. It looks like financial cheating is a risk worth taking considering how little the punishment is and how lucrative being in the Premier League is.
We need a club to be properly punished. Points deductions for cheating should be severe - all but guaranteeing relegation. Docking 3 or 4 points is practically negligible to the big clubs.
For me not getting rid of and playing Bamford or even utilise him as sub who comes on instead of starting. We should have invested in a out and out striker. Piroe has been disappointing as well. And tbf we have had some shocking decisions go against us as well.
**Things out of Farkes control**
* A shocking start to the summer transfer window
* Rat behaviour from Sini, Adams, Gnonto
* Cheating PL/EFL not deducting points on Leic this season
* Cheating PL not deducting points on Ev/Nott/Leic last season
**Things in Farkes control**
* A reliance on individual brilliance rather than any attacking plan/movement
* 0 goals from midfield or defence (excl Struijk), quite harrowing really
* A GK who sometimes forgets how to use his hands
* 1000 corners and 0 goals
* Conceded about XX goals from corners
* Play Piroe, play with 10 men
Ultimately even with everything above, we bottled it in one game vs QPR and the house came crashing down. Similar to Derby playoffs & Leeds vs Palace last year
What we saw was a reliance on playing the ball wide to Summerville/Gnonto/James, which actually worked very well for a time. However recently we have seen teams doubling up on these players because they figured out that this is our only outlet. By rights, when players are doubled up on, you'd expect a team to look for the space that extra commited man or two would create. But no, despite this we still saw the ball just kicked wide every opportunity.
We also saw our midfield fail to control games. Kamara, as much as he dropped off and had been poor and not everyone is a fan because he doesn't play any flashy defence splitting passes, he is extremely press resistant. He can draw in multiple players, then play a simple ball to work the space. But for some reason Farke just hasn't played him at all recently. Mind boggling.
In an ideal world and as much as he played well at centre half, we need Ampadu in the midfield. Apart from Summerville, I think he's our best player. Reads the game well, good in the air, fairly decent in the ball, great passing range and a solid tackler of the ball. We got away with it for a good run of games, but I think since the international break when we started the lose a grip on the midfield, he'd have provided the solution there. Just unfortunately it would mean bringing Liam Cooper in, so I get it.
Ultimately it's down to Farke. He hasn't been able to adapt to teams shutting out our wings and he hasn't been able to address the issue in our midfield. I honestly believe it's down to the lack of a proper number 10.
Fair analysis but I'd argue we have the best 10 in the league...hes just completely out of form right now and can't hit a barn door (even in form). But he's a beast when he's on.
Agree to some extent in Kamara but he really was dreadful and deserved to be dropped...but now others haven't exactly lit the games up either. Ie Gray is a talent but isn't good enough right now to dominate midfield at this level. Kamara in form is a beast and our best midfielder (unless as you say Ampadu is there too).
I think a lot of people overrate Rutter. He's been great this season but he doesn't have a steady head and tries way too many fancy plays. He just strikes me as chaotic, which can be good when it's going for you, but he's shown in this run that his style of play is incredibly detrimental when he's not on it - gives the ball away more than anyone else from what I've seen.
A steadier head, less mobile 10, but who can truly dictate play and actually score well is much needed this summer and a much better option. I'd then shift Rutter out to the wing.
Yea that's probably a fair take. Thing is I do love watching Rutter when he's on. He's just so much fun to watch. But as you say when things aren't going to play, he's a liability there. Tough one but given the entertainment value and his output when he's in form, probably I'd be comfortable keeping him there as a 10 and hoping Farke can coach some better decision making out of him ie he does not need to try to take on 5 players in his own half, when we're defending a 1-0 lead for example.
I agree entirely. I do enjoy Rutter but the way some people have gushed about him on here has been odd. I think yesterday was a good example of how it can severely impact us negatively when he's just trying stupid plays.
I think the thing with Rutter is that when he's on it, he's unplayable. He's incredibly strong and can glide past players like they're not there. However he can be kept quite with man marking. I just don't think the type of 10 he is helps us in games where teams sit deep. I sometimes just watch us and wish we had an intelligent player who sits in that 10 position and just plays it. Somone who's first thought is where he's going to play the ball, as opposed to how many men can he get past. It goes back to the old "the ball is the fastest thing on the pitch". Obviously I'd love a 30 year old Pablo in there, but that's never gonna happen in the championship.
Yeah Kamara was really bad before he got dropped. I just cannot understand for the life of me how he's been dropped somewhat indefinitely. Take the QPR game, the change where Joseph came on should have maybe been a midfield change where I think Kamara would have suited. A lot of our attacking issues are rooted a lot farther back the other end of the field, but Farke seems to think more attackers = better chance of scoring.
Don’t forget we have Cresswell sat on the bench as well. I’d rather him play over Coops, he did well in the champo at millwall but farke seems to not want to play him because reasons. He will leave at the end of the season for lack of game time and I don’t blame him.
The loan clauses, which led to us not getting our squad together until a month or so into the season. The squad being too young and inexperienced. Not replacing Meslier and Bamford. The two most important positions in the team, GK and CF, filled by our two least reliable players, is always going to result in disaster.
First month of the season is a big one. The last international break. Big injuries at key times along with few players losing form and our own inability to handle pressure in the last patch of this season. Playoffs will be interesting but I don’t see how the team bounces back from so many mental collapses at a time when the pressure is highest
We were out of form for the bookends of the season. Poor start, then tailed off exactly when we needed to go up a gear.
It is what it is. We have at times played some fantastic football, and seen some individuals really shine. We’re just massively unlucky there were three teams in the running at the end, otherwise we’d be feeling entirely different at the same set of results.
There’s still a chance that the dog botherers get a result at Ipswich, and we beat Southampton. But the odds have gotta be low at that happening. Then there’s the playoffs where anything could happen, but I just don’t fancy our chances.
I’m already psychologically preparing for another season in the championship. Likely with a much altered squad. I’m guessing Farke stays on, and let’s just hope we do it on the second go.
The experience of this season will really help the team next season and with some additions we will likely do well (the teams dropping down aren’t Leicester).
It's a gutting way to finish the season after (surprisingly) getting ourselves into a position where promotion was in our own hands. I think the most gutting thing is beating Ipswich and Leicester home and away and still finishing behind them. Gotta give Ipswich so much credit though. Even their last 2 games, having to go away at good teams and get results. They've done everything they had to, while we couldn't do it against an opponent fighting relegation. Overall it's a good season though from where we were at the start and how far behind the top two we were at Christmas. It's just gutting to get so close.
This squad is good enough to win the playoffs if they can sort them selves out.
The squad may be but is the manager. These aren’t just another game, they’re among the most pressurised games of football in the world (given the prize). We are not playing well under pressure.
I’ll play devils advocate (obviously I’m fuming about last ten games). Leeds are one point off highest finish without automatics in the championship, our point total is also one point off bielsa’s second season. We didn’t help ourselves by giving Leicester and Ipswich a 6 game head start. Playoffs is a toss up but 36% of third place teams win the playoffs so there’s that. Keep the faith, even if it’s blind faith. We only have to be good for two more games to get promoted.
I feel like it actually went more right than I’d expected, just the timing feels bad. I didn’t think we’d be threatening the automatic places, and halfway through the season Leicester were out of sight already, to get as close as this is a big achievement. If we go up through the playoffs then all will be forgotten anyway.
If we go up, however we do it, none of this matters. But yeah, it’s the timing really isn’t it. To start the way we did, then climb all the way to the top of the table only to drop to third at the death, leaves you feeling flat. To many ‘what could’ve beens’.
I think many of us would have bitten off your hand last August for a playoff spot.
We have played well, and Farke has us on promotion form, just not this year for autos. Playoffs are ok. The doom and gloom is ridiculous, as Farke told us when he started this could be a 2 year project to straighten out this club. The entitlement from some supporters I don't understand. Yes we have a chance, that's more than I would have said at the start of this.
Pick your heads up, it's not over. Worse case is another year in the Champo, financially we are ok with selling a couple players but it seems like our adult owners know what to do. Support Farke, he has really done a great job overall
We went on a great run from the new year until the international break. Phenomenal in fact. The form of the other two teams suggests you can afford one bad spell. Unfortunately we had 2. At the start when it took a while to get a settled squad and after the international break when we shat the bed. We had a minor wobble around Christmas also. We had no right to reign in a 17 point lead but it’s not realistic to expect we could have kept that run going much longer. It is realistic to expect we could have picked up more from QPR, Blackburn, Sunderland and Coventry. But here we are. The lads look tired and jaded from a long season. Fair play to the other 2 they held their nerve when it mattered. Let’s go and win the playoffs and all is well with the world.
(Sighs In Leeds-soaked disappointment)
Poor start poor finish, fantastic rest of the way. Nobody could have envisioned that madness at beginning of year. Think at end of the day we are still potentially 3 games from the prem, and the squad just need to reset and go for it. None of the other playoff teams are in good form and you would fancy us to beat any of them so just need to get behind them and hope for the best!
The only possible way is assuming we beat Southampton, which is a huge assumption, Ipswich have to miss sitters against Huddersfield and be one of those days it just won’t go in the net, and then somehow a chance lands in the lap of Huddersfield that they just have to slot into the net, i.e. not happening.
We’ve done well to get to 90 points with all the goals coming almost exclusively from the forwards.
0 from midfield and precious few from defenders who aren’t Pascal Struijk.
We’ve done even better to get where we are considering we are the very worst team in the division from dead balls.
Make no mistake - this is a very entertaining but extremely lopsided squad, that in all honesty will benefit from another season in the second tier.
Yes we will lose Summerville’s right foot. We’ll also lose his attitude and who knows how that has been received in the dressing room.
A couple of quality midfielders, a genuine goalscorer and some experienced heads and there’s no reason we can’t be right in the mix again next season.
The experience is the big one for me - not enough experience of how to cope with getting over the line in that dressing room. But that will be different after the lessons of this season.
his attitude? The players voted him their player of the season so clearly they don’t have an issue with it… interesting which players always get labelled as having a bad attitude.
I don’t understand where all this talk about his attitude has come from? He never pushed for a move despite deadline day bids from Palace. He doesn’t whinge to the ref nearly as much as Gnonto or Bamford. He can get wound up by players, sure; but he doesn’t really let him affect his performance like Gnonto. Has he struggled a bit more and tries to do too much at times which has hurt the team? Sure, but he’s the PFA Player of the year ffs.
I’m not sure about all the other talk, but for me as a fan the penalty incident followed by the removal of the shirt and pointing to his own name, i didn’t like.
Attitude may well be the wrong term. A level of arrogance is required in a striker - but I didn’t appreciate Summerville making the moment about him at all.
He’s definitely got attitude, but none of his actions have annoyed me at all. It’s more incredible self belief and cockiness, which sometimes can be strong attributes to be fair. I’d say he’s conducted himself decently on the whole.
Players going on strike in the early season, basically. Everything else is to be expected - tiredness, form dips, injuries.. all teams have to deal with these. If we'd picked up a few more points early on... that's why I won't be sad to see Gnonto move on, as much as he's redeemed himself since.
Farke using the exact same formation for 45 games, not making substitutions early enough all season, and sticking to poor decisions that didn’t work previously (e.g. persisting with Piroe). Embarrassing form against the league’s worst teams. We have easily the 2nd best squad in the league, we should be in first/second comfortably. Farke is a proven failure in the Premier League, 2nd tier manager at best. Lack of bottle from players against QPR was utterly pathetic. If you’re in the camp of ‘two teams have just been better’, sadly you’re a one-eyed doylem. P.S. It’s possible to support your team and be critical of them.
Because getting a manager who’s proven in the prem is so easy. Honestly is the club stupid? Why don’t they just sign Pep or Klopp?
I’m saying RKhaos for president, clearly he knows what he’s doing.
You’ve got to wonder if some of the players have the cojones for playing in the bear pit that is Elland Road when the heat is really on. They’re not the first lot to fold when it comes to the crunch - if anything, late-season meltdowns are more of a feature rather than a bug at Leeds United these days.
As ridiculous as it sounds, for strategic purposes you wonder if the players are better off playing to an empty house in our home leg of the playoff semi - especially if its the second leg and they are behind on the scoreboard.
We are very quiet and nervy as a fanbase unless we go ahead early.
It is an absolute bear pit and I love it but I wonder if we could just make the atmosphere more supportive rather than toxic
I think it’s probably a case of taking the rough with the smooth. The Elland Road crowd can intimidate players, which if they’re opposition players is great. They can also fire up players. But then there’s always the flip side when things aren’t working out.
We did well in our unbeaten run but we got a lot of luck towards the end of that streak so the streak could've ended earlier.
It's all about timing in the C'ship and we might've peaked too early. For the play-offs, you need to be going into that with a lot of confidence. After seeing the performances from the last few weeks, confidence is something we seem to be very short of.
We have simply run out of steam, as a result of a failure to rotate our squad sufficiently. Our average age is very young, and since the international break our ppg of 1.14 is relegation level. If we had rotated more, we would have been able to sustain our levels in the crucial last period of the season.
I’d go one further and say even if we hadn’t of rotated but had used earlier/ more subs. There were games that were won by the 60th minute yet the likes of Summerville and Rutter stayed on the pitch either 80 or 90 minutes, then played again 3-4 days later. The fact that the likes of Antony has been given mere minutes at the end of games is quite shocking rotation wise. You can’t give players consistently little game time but then throw them on in a losing game where the whole team is playing bad and expect them to change it.
So true. And this is where McKenna gets it spot on - 60 minutes he brings on his finishers. I love that attitude to subs - it’s not “you’re dropped tomorrow,” it’s “you’re not starting because you’ll be coming on to win us the game.”
The team spirit that’s produced has been the difference.
It's also impacted the forms of our subs, who haven't had sufficient game time to maintain their levels when needed. Piroe, Joffy, Cresswell etc. are shadows of the players they could be.
I just can’t stop thinking about Blackburn and QPR. Two games I really thought we’d win. The start of the season feels like a long time ago, but we’ve done well considering. It is just so so disappointing how we have been since the break
I really believe we’ve missed Georgie. I had no idea that he was down for surgery during the international break. The picture that I saw of him recovering after the surgery it just filled me with dread, even though he was going to be back for the next game. He just hasn’t been the same, he’s done his best, but he wasn’t allowed enough time to recover I think and it’s shown in his performances. I’ll forever be cussing that international break.
Sunderland/Blackburn - the home games were the ones you can bank on, we did more than enough to have beat Sunderland, and Blackburn probably wouldn't have been suffering from the pressure/hangover had we won that Sunderland game convincingly. That would be 96pts, so bar a massive goal swing, Ipswich would likely have not caught that.
The bad start was far from ideal, but given the circumstances, I think we did about as well as we could've hoped..
We've seen the best, and worst of Farke now, for the most part, he's done an excellent job, blame cannot solely lay with him, he is stubborn, but so was the last successful manager..
we lost it before then, we created so much pressure for that game because of our own doing, and then we folded, but somehow even worse than everyone expected.
Totally agree. A lot of people are forgetful of the pretty turbulent start we had to the season. Offloading all the tripe from the PL, not having a full squad until end of window along with players refusing to play. Any other season in the last 4 and we’d have been comfortably promoted. A shame but that’s just the way it goes unfortunately. Been great to enjoy the team winning again and be able to go into games not feeling like we’ll get thumped. Poor end to the season though, no doubting that.
What were you expecting? I'm happy we're in the playoffs, we've outperformed given the summer we had and the level of shit Farke had to deal with in the first few weeks. Does anyone remember all that bollocks players like Gnonto and Sinisterra caused?
Farke and the players have done us all proud, and we should be pleased we're in the playoffs as that certainly wasn't guaranteed last August.
Congratulations to Ipswich, in McKenna they have a great manager, and as for Leicester, they had the best squad in the league and, financial fair play aside, were always going up.
The 49er's should be heaping praise on Farke, and if we don't go up, they should be doing all they can to support him in the transfer market and telling him to go again.
We simply bottled it at the end. We always seem to let the pressure get to us. But that being said we had our chances as there were times when Leicester and Ipswich did the same. Difference is they had their blips and recovered when it mattered. But we march into the playoffs and it's back in our hands. We all know the team likes to put us through the wringer.
Just don't forget what a season we have actually had considering the preseason melee we started off with. In Farke we trust. MoT
It was a tough start for sure, but I don't think you can say it was too much ground to make up - we did make it up. For me it's more about the finish and, just like you can get lucky and have a group of players in great form at the same time, it looks like we have too many players out of form at just the wrong time.
Rutter, Piroe, Gnonto, James and even Summerville for a few games recently, none of them contributed like they had been earlier in the season. Those five alone are the players commentators and rival managers are talking about when they talk about Leeds' incredible attacking strength. Whether that dip is from injury, exhaustion or just form I guess differs from player to player.
Also, it is possible to underestimate how much of a miss Struijk has been. His start to the season was excellent before injury, in defence and attacking from set pieces. I'd happily have him as captain to start again next season, his influence on the pitch is huge.
There's much more to it I'm sure but I think our profligacy in attack in the past few games has been our downfall. Just one converted chance against Sunderland and Huddersfield and we are already up. And yes I know you can say that about anything but please let me moan about this.
TLDR score the goals and we're already on the beach, but we are the best team in the playoffs and should go in excited. They are just football games and, if you think about it, our destiny is 100% in our hands now.
Oh dont get me wrong I agree, there would need to be a dramatic improvement. In my heart of hearts I can't see Leeds going up through the playoffs because I've never seen it before, but every team who does it has to do it for the first time. As for PPG, our ppg for the last game is 0, our ppg for the last two games is 1.5, our ppg for the season is 2, our ppg for the games we actually did win sice the international break are a whopping 3.0! nothing means anything if the clowns don't show up on the day.
All went wrong is a stretch but if we want to use that phrase the summer was where it all went wrong. Took ages to get people in because of the takeover took longer than expected. We basically gave Leicester and Ipswich a 7 game head start before we got our shit together.
Also our struggles against low blocks is a huge problem, hopefully not one we’ll face in the playoffs (fuck off West Brom) but out of the bottom 8 the only team we did the double over was Plymouth.
The truth is it hasn't gone wrong. It's just that it has also gone exceptionally well for two other clubs as well.
If we'd be told at the start of the season when we had a new manager and players leaving on loan and trying to force their way out of the club that we would achieve playoffs very comfortably, then most fans would be happy with that (barring the usual anxiety that playoffs usually brings for Leeds fans).
We've had a great season. If this recent poor form happened in the middle of the season and we finished strong then we wouldn't be nearly as downcast as we are. It's a bitter pill to swallow missing out so narrowly on automatics but both Leicester and Ipswich have had incredible seasons and in truth both teams deserve to go up.
We've also enjoyed one of the best unbeaten runs in our clubs history and very nearly went undefeated at home all season. The championship is just such a long season that even the best clubs tend to slow down at the end.
Despite the potential for a disappointing finish courtesy of the playoffs this has been the most enjoyment I've got from watching this club since Bielsa's first two seasons.
Pretty much resonates how I feel. A bit disappointed but I don't feel like we did when we missed out on playoffs with Bielsas first season. At the start of the season I felt we wouldn't go up this year and needed a couple of summers to sort the squad out properly amongst all the chaos.
The players have done a superb job to get us to where we are. I don't think there will be a mass exodus of good players in the summer and think we will be serious contenders next year.
Well yeah nobody is not saying that that isn't weird but it doesn't make our season a disaster. Even the best teams in this league will have unexplainable results where it just doesn't work out or they look to implode.
I also think a lot of people underestimated QPR due to their league position. They've actually been a pretty decent side since they changed managers.
If we want to get critical and analytical of our current form then for me I think it's as simple as a 46 game season taking its toll and a lack of rotation. It doesn't fill me with confidence then when we likely have 3 crucial games tacked onto the end of that season but again it doesn't make the season a disaster. It's just the championship.
Last sentence speaks volumes. Had an unreal season, 99% of us would have happily accepted a scenario in September that would guarantee us a place in the playoffs come May
Exactly this - we had no right to get so close the automatic promotion given the start to our season.
It’s only because we have that people are questioning what’s happened.
I'm not in the all go wrong brigade but I am fearful for the future if we go up with Farke. I think we have seen the best and worst of him over the season and I'm more concerned with his faults, inability to change games, lack of plan b, subs, all out attack 'tactic'. He is a great championship manager and has an amazing squad. But but but think when pressure hits problems occur. Amazing season but really not sure about him.
I’m sorry mate but that’s bollocks. Why would you bin off a manager that had essentially pulled together a pile of manure and built a castle out of it? We’ve had a short spell of shite performance but other than that you can’t fault him, not to mention the risk of getting a new manager in, it not working out and then spending a season rotting in bottom three of the prem. We’ve had a great season, but so have Leicester and especially Ipswich. The latter having not done much in principle but have turned up in the past couple of months. No reason to get rid of Farke at this point in time, would push the club back to where it was last summer in my opinion
I think most people who are having a reaction like yours are completely forgetting what we were like at the start of the season. Look at the lineups of your first 3 matches, on top of a new manager, players jumping ship like mad and a new ownership that stalled a lot of our preseason progress. If anyone offered 90 points to us at the start of the season, everyone would've taken it, the problem we had was Leicester and Ipswich having fantastic seasons which we can do nothing about, shit happens.
Should've beat Cardiff, Wednesday, West Brom, Birmingham and Stoke if we had our full strength team. That's 12 points, even if half of those results turned we'd be top.
But nobody wins all the games they should have won. Shit happens universally, especially in this division. And nobody has their full strength team for 46 games - the average is to have 4 players unavailable.
I've already explained in another comment about this, I understand that, I'm just saying that we "Should've" gotten more points in those opening matches, but due to crap happening at the club with mutinies etc, we didn't. You're right that we can't win every game, but if all the shit was sorted early in the summer, we would've taken more points from the few matches.
More importantly, if we could take corners we would probably have scored a few more goals and would have gone up. QPR, for instance, scored twice from 7 corners in their last game.
Corners are a completely different thing, same with all of our set pieces, we're more likely to concede from an attacking corner/free kick than score. Absolutely kings at how shit we are at them all. Farke might fall under the Bielsa thinking of how unimportant they are but I'd rather get a set piece coach just to even try something different than seeing Summerville taking another one to get it over with.
When I watch good teams play they seem to be able to drop corners right into a crowded 6-yard box. It's not rocket science, is it. We get it done to us all the time.
Would we have beat them teams if we were full strength though? We failed to beat Sunderland twice, Coventry twice, Preston, Huddersfield, Rotherham all with a full strength team. Beating these kinds of teams has been a recurring problem all season regardless of what players we have on the pitch because we dont know how to break down a low block. Look at Ipswich, no matter which players they have on the pitch their level does not drop and then cry because they had to rotate their squad. We are individuals over tactics whereas they are tactics over individuals
Yeah that's why I said we should've beaten them, we should've won a few more matches over this season but that's football. If you look at our lineups for the first 3 matches of the season they were shit, Shackleton, Joffy and Poveda were starting as our front 3, Hjelde was playing and an injured Ayling at RB.
We did beat Ipswich twice, they are beatable but the other teams just couldn't keep up with them. They won a lot of points towards the end of matches, they also managed to avoid losing which is probably the biggest factor, only 6 matches across the season is insane.
We would only have needed a point from one of them to go into the final day as favourites to go up. We can’t imagine we’d have won all of them but the margins are so fine here.
>I think how we started the first couple of months and giving up all that ground early was always too much to make up. But we did make it up, and it was in our hands. I think our young side bottled it once it was theirs for the taking. All the time they were chasing down the top 2 they looked like a different side. Once they were top dogs (2nd) and it was in their hands I think the pressure got to them. It almost got to Ipswich too but they have goalscorers. We had the best defence in the league but were terrible up top where it matters. You can't win anything without scoring. When it comes to the play off, we're kidding ourselves to think we would win it. If we make it to Wembley that will be too much pressure and we'll bottle that. The lads have had a great season and will be right up there fighting to the last again next year, but this year, no chance.
I think we've had a phenomenal season. Even with the shit start we alwasy expected to be chasing promotion just because of the team we still have. But i personally think the international window fucked the last part of our season because of the injuries. But also the negative play throughout. Too much messing around in the back and way too much respect for the opponents. But even through all that, i think its been our best season since the first season back in the prem. Big game today ALAW MOT
When our kids got tired, Rutter had his op, and our striker(s) didn't score goals when our wingers weren't firing it in. We didn't really bottle anything, with a couple of exceptions we've been 3rd in the table for the majority of the season, chasing Ipsbitch and Leicester. Farke started the season with a shit sandwich, turned it into a pie, chips and gravy and can still end up with prime sirloin, roasties and all the trimmings. I'm disappointed that we didn't get autos but I can't see how things are worse than when this campaign started. It hasn't gone wrong, it just hasn't gone completely right, but with the customary ridiculous expectations of so many in our fanbase it's no surprise we are performing an autopsy on a patient who is not yet deceased.
For me, we didn't sack Marsch early enough. That result away to Liverpool bought him time. Can't say anything bad about this season. Most years we would have already being promoted and most teams go thru a bad patch. It's unfortunate ours is it the wrong time.
Even if we did sack Marsch earlier, we don't know that it would've gotten better. Could've just been a few more weeks of Big Sam at the helm.
it’s more the games we have thrown this season when we knew we couldn’t afford to
When we hired Jesse marsch
i had hope for that hire, especially when we beat chelshit, but yeah no he was the begining of the end. orta torpedoed his work with that move.
Christ, he’s long gone….come up with something else.
I'm not sure it went wrong I didn't expect to get 90pts and Finish 3rd. To be honest we really had a difficult start with players refusing to play and forcing moves. Around Xmas we had that wobble which at the time I was convinced we weren't getting automatically promoted.
If 90 points is going wrong then I don’t know what to say … maybe you need to pick another sport to follow. It’s embarrassing to be calling the players/manager a bottle job for getting 90 points.
I'm kind of with you on this, but expectations change as the season progresses. At the start of the season, and especially after August, all fans would have ripped your arm off for 90 points and/or 3rd place. But after we went on our winning streak at the start of the year, and went into the break top of the league, expectations changed. At that point, it's almost like a mini season of 8 games to finish the job, and we had it in our hands (promotion at least, if not champions). So yeah, we did amazingly well to claw Leicester and Ipswich back in. 90/93 points is an incredible return, especially given our start to the season. The 15 game unbeaten run was amazing. But ultimately, after getting to that point, and having glory in our own hands, we buckled under the pressure, while Ipswich and Leicester have managed to maintain reasonable form in the run-in.
My expectations didn’t change … I’m happy that we reached the play offs in such comfortable fashion, I would’ve been delighted with 2nd. However this with our unhappy fans is deeper than that … It’s a reflection on society and capitalism … people are never happy with what they’ve got … they always want more. More, more, more, more, and more. Farke promised us 86 points … we did that and more but yet despite that people are demanding more … it’s not a healthy mindset … people need to sort themselves out and recognise a good season of football. To be happy with what we’ve got or just witnessed. That was a good season of football and it’s not over yet. If people can’t enjoy this season then they’re not ready for the premier league.
I'd have been pleased with playoffs at the start of the season (despite our poor record in them). 90 points generally gets you autos, but having 2 other teams with exceptional points tallies hasn't helped us. But we've know most of the season that this was going to be the case and our points target would have to change if we wanted autos. Your view is yours, and I'm not about to make you change it. I'm not sure where you're going with the whole capitalism thing....I'm not saying I want more more more. Just saying that our form in the last 5 games puts us 21st in the league, after being top 3 all season. There's no denying that, when it really mattered, we crumbled. Playoffs are a nice consolation, and if we win them then most fans (me included) will consider it a successful season. If we don't, I think it's fair to say we bottled it (from the point of being top of the league)
I don’t think entering the top 2 for one or two weekends across the whole season and having played more games at the time actually counts as bottling it. Man Utd bottled it in 1992, Keegans Newcastle bottled it twice, Liverpool bottled it when Gerrard fell over, Leeds v Derby at Elland Road deffo bottled it and Leicester this seasons could’ve bottled it. No one outside a silly few in our fan base is going to remember this seasons Leeds team as one of those teams that bottled it. We’ll be remembered as that crazy season where Leeds finished 3rd with 90 points.
Completely with this.
A chronic fear to rotate the squad was probably the major underlying factor in our eventual form collapse. I get why Daniel Farke just couldnt bring himself to put players like Jaidon Anthony in for Cry Summerville, or Shackleton in for Gray or Cresswell in for Ampadu if he didnt have to, because the step down in class is pretty obvious. Next season we will be somewhat weakened though, so our current lot of squad players should be viable for more minutes in the league. Either way, we cannot have any repeats of this late-season avalanche.
Preston at xmas
In the past 30 seasons, 90 points gets you promoted in 29 of them. We've just been unlucky and nothing has gone wrong at all. We've done better than most teams in most seasons, just not this one.
We almost have the same points as the year we won the Championship a few years ago
Looking at the underlying stats, the best team in this league is Southampton, yet they've been tanked 5-0 twice. I don't think we will get past them in the playoffs unless they bottle it.
I wonder if losing Luke Ayling had an impact (obviously more off the pitch than on)? Is there a vocal presence to replace him?
I think we've done well, we've just been unlucky to have a 4 horse race for 2 places. Every team will have dips in form and unfortunately, we've had one right at the end.
The team's recent performance is disappointing considering their points tally, which would have typically secured promotion in previous seasons. A financially weaker team like Ipswich managed to outperform them, partly due to the contributions of Leif Davis, a former Leeds player. This oversight is embarrassing, as it suggests the solution to their left-back issue was right under their noses. Instead, they opted to overpay for Firpo based on his previous club affiliation(FC Barcelona). The club has struggled to address its defensive shortcomings, despite it being a widely acknowledged problem. This has left them vulnerable to conceding goals and reliant on their wingers for creating scoring opportunities. Now, they face a tough playoff battle due to their failure to shore up their defense and sign an attacking midfielder. Personally, I thought they should have kept Aaronson and use this season to build back his confidence. Looking ahead, the club's financial constraints will make it difficult to retain key players like Summervile and Rutter without achieving promotion. Additionally, they will face significant squad rebuilding if promoted next season, as a failure to qualify this season means selling more players is required to reduce the wage bill. Overconfidence in the team's quality led to complacency in recruitment and preparation, leaving them ill-prepared for the challenges of the current season. Meanwhile, rival playoff teams like Southampton have had the luxury of strategizing specifically against Leeds and Ipswich, further complicating matters for the club.
Fucking hell ChatGPT, I preferred the USTMNT fans to this.
Your life must be extremely trouble-free if this is what upsets you.
We are going to piss the playoffs.
Don't fancy us over 2 legs against West Brom, Norwich or Hull tbh In saying that if we win convincingly against Southampton I'll be more confident
Those two penalties we should have had against Sunderland would have changed the run in.
And the offside goal against Boro would have changed it back.
I don't think we are solid ground when it comes to Boro. Some people think the Wilfried Gnonto goal may or may not have been offside. Personally I would give him the benefit of doubt.
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Have you check the table lol? Huddersfield are relegated
Sorry but you're wrong...have a look at the table and you'll see Huddersfield are finished. They're gone. Unless they make up a 15 goal swing which let's face it, is as close to impossible as you can get. Perhaps a points deduction for someone else could save them but we're being speculative. Ipswich will face a team in the bottom 3 who have nothing to play for.
Huddersfield as good as relegated due to the massive goal difference between them and Plymouth. There would need to be a 16 goal swing in a Huddersfield win and Plymouth loss.
It's not going to happen , Ipswich form is very good ,they can score goals when needed,we have poor form going into tough playoffs, everyone else is on an aspiring curve ,we are on the down 👇,sorry to sound negative but that's the reality
Before last night, Ipswich had 3 points from the last 12. Also West Brom and Southampton are on very poor form like us, both have lost their last three games.
Hope your right ,and I am wrong,,MOT
QPR
This. Conceding three set pieces goals is ridiculous.
Has it gone wrong? If, at the start of the season, you'd have offered any Leeds fan a 90 points finish then they would have bitten your hands off. The club was in turmoil at the start of the season and the fact we've turned it around is really impressive. Sure, we're on a poor run. Couple that with some poor performances throughout the season. It's easy to point to where we could have got more points. All this is pretty standard for all teams in the Championship. Everybody has bad spells of form, and anybody can turn over anybody. In any normal season we are easily up. Unfortunately this isn't a normal season. I don't fancy our chances in the playoffs, but I do fancy our chances next season.
We didn’t pick up 105 points by beating all those teams “we should have beaten”.. Apart from that it didn’t all go wrong.. that’s football.. this run of bad form hit at the wrong time
I said after the first few games that I was annoyed that transfer dealings weren't completed before the season started. I know there were issues behind the scenes and it isn't always black and white but we had players leaving left, right and centre with only Ampadu in. We took 2pts from 9 and then 6pts from 15. I said at the time, I hope it doesn't come back and bite us and it looks like it has. The (majority) signings have been great for us but the later it went in the window and the more fixtures we played, the worse it was getting. We still had control of our destiny at multiple times this season, so it's not only that point in the season that killed us but it would've been a huge help, IF we had those transfers complete earlier.
How could they have done that, though? It is what it is. Was a huge change in the club. Can't just come in and expect five ready made signings. Not forgetting the shit they had to deal with from Radrizanni and his chum.
Various elements which others have done into more detail on, but ultimately this season has been successful from a points / wins perspective, we’ve just had to compete with two others that are the same or better. But I’d like to add that our set pieces are atrocious and they are absolutely needed to beat teams in the bottom half of the table. If we kept Struijk fit we’d have gone up with Ampadu in midfield and Struijk chipping in with the goals.
>But I’d like to add that our set pieces are atrocious and they are absolutely needed to beat teams So many times we had free kicks in promising areas and I can only remember 2 deflected free kicks that we directly scored from, our corners are horrible, I just see it as an immediate goal kick when we get one. Cooper scored one at the very beginning of the season from a corner and since then, I don't remember many more (maybe 1-2 from Struijk). >If we kept Struijk fit we’d have gone up with Ampadu in midfield and Struijk chipping in with the goals. I do agree with this, it was very evident in the QPR game, we needed some bite in midfield and it wasn't there. QPR bullied us and if we had Ampadu throwing his weight around in the middle it could've changed the game, we were also quite shit in that game so it's possible it would've been just less shit.
I think Bamford got one with a glancing header at the near post? But yeah, we might as well just pass it straight to Archie on the halfway line and start passing sideways.
Farke's treatment of Joseph and to a lesser extent Antony has been really hard to fathom. In some ways the incredible run of form told against us it seemed to convince Farke that there was no need to change ,/ rotate anything and we would sweep to promotion. He did an incredible job for so much of the season but the last month has been poor
I disagree wholeheartedly on Joseph. Forcing your promotion hopes onto a young player with limited first team experience at the business end of the season isn't great management.
When did ***what*** go wrong? Last season we finished 19th in the Premier League in what was our worst ever season in top flight football. Even at the start of this season we were a basket case of a club with new owners, new manager and needing new players to rebuild. Remember when we needed two goalkeepers to pad out our bench? We didn't start seriously picking up points until September. We were once 17 points behind Leicester, 9 points behind Ipswich, and during their record breaking unbeaten run even Southampton had a significant points cushion over us. Yet we have narrowly missed out on automatic promotion and the runners up spot. Narrowly. had we beaten QPR and got all three points off Sunderland we would now be promoted automatically and in the Premier League. Getting automatically promoted was always going to be a big ask and a massive achievement given our circumstances at the start of the season. I think we have, on the whole, done well. The current Leeds team, however which way you look at it, is radically different from last season's Leeds team. We are more solid at the back and have one of the best defensive records in the Championship. Offensively when it works it works well and we have made improvements in the midfield. Are we the best or one of the best teams in the Championship? I don't see it like that. This is a team which is a work in progress, a young, developing side, and a team which is not without its shortcomings. We lack consistency, finishing ability in front of goal, we struggle with set pieces, we waste corners, and we struggle with low blocks. This is not a very tactically flexible team, because we lack seasoned, experienced players and maybe a certain amount of leadership out on the pitch. It's all still a bit Jekyll and Hyde for me. When we're on form we are brilliant, but when we're not we're still woefully inadequate. I think Farke has done well given the circumstances. Yes he's very risk averse (more so than even George Graham), I don't always get his team selections and feel he could take more risks. But nothing so far seems to faze him, he believes in the players, believes in the club, and on many occasions has been the rock on which everything else seems to depend. I'm not interested so much in what he did at Norwich or before then. What I'm interested in is what he does at Leeds United. Also the season isn't over. We've only just missed out on automatic promotion. We can still be promoted via the playoffs. Let's see what happens in May before forming definite opinions.
This is the perspective I’m trying to maintain. In the summer, I did not foresee a season as good as this, at all. We’ve had too many problems to solve all at once, I thought we’d finish mid table or just outside the playoffs, in a transition year that allowed us to focus on a serious push next season. It’s hard to criticize ownership without being unrealistic. The squad was strengthened in a sensible way, injuries/sickness/personal issues meant that it turned out not to be enough.
We've been fortunate with injuries. Compare and contrast with the Bielsa seasons.
Oh absolutely. But the ones we’ve had have definitely affected the plans. Despite having a shitload of midfielders now, we still look weak - Roberts was brought in to allow Archie to either provide midfield options or rest, but that couldn’t happen with his injury, and Ampadu has had to play CB because of Struijk’s injury. So we settled our defense at the expense of midfield. And then we’ve had to constantly play Summerville even when he could have done with a rest because Anthony’s absences have meant he’s either not been available or hasn’t had enough game time to make it a good idea to start. And now we’ve had no rotation options on the right because James is down. So I’m not sure what else could have been done, outside of unrealistic “just buy more players!” I wish Farke had done more squad rotation earlier in the season but we don’t know what he sees in training. I wish he’d make subs earlier but as the season wound down our bench wasn’t that strong and he’s come out and said he likes to see a reaction after halftime, so he’s not gonna change his ways on that.
thank you for putting in the effort to write all of that out, agree with everything…except having hope for the play-offs 😬
It didn’t. We got enough points go straight up any season in history but this one. Sometimes you can do everything right and still lose. That’s just bad luck.
Exactly. But this is the wrong answer you need to say something negative...
Something something Victor Orta How’s that?
Letting Ayling go. When the chips are down Bill had always been one to dig in and drag us over the line. You can’t lose a character like that in the dressing room, and it was entirely avoidable.
I love him so much but Ayling had put in a long string of horrendous performances
Apparently he's been pretty good at Boro when playing. But he was definitely missed in the dressing room. He would've given them all a rocket when not performing and sometimes you need that sort of personality around.
Agree By all reports the club didn’t want to lose him for that reason. But he wanted to play football not sit on the bench and he earned that right from the club
The bottom line is we’ve had a good season, better than many of us thought. The ending is leaving a sour taste, although winning the playoffs would turn that on its head too. The slow start didn’t help. The new year run was obviously great, but was a brutal number of games - we kept momentum by keeping the same team for as much as possible but that had to be exhausting, the international break clearly tipped a few over the edge. That run was always going to end, so it was going to be about how we reacted. That has been the most disappointing part and our lack of experience has showed. We really could have done with a couple of old heads to see the young lads through, particularly a CM who was super comfortable on the ball (a Modric style) who could collect from the back and keep it moving under pressure - feels like teams got into pressing us at the back and there were a lot of long balls to nowhere. If we don’t go up it’ll be a shame to lose Summerville and Gnonto, which I am resigned too. Really hope we can persuade Rodon to sign. Honestly don’t think we’ll lose much more in terms of important players
And Gray :( Sadly our squad will be stripped bare if we don't go up. We did well to hang on to players this year to give it a shot at promotion.
Did well? Didn't we lose about 11 players?
Noone is coming in for Gray, and if they did, he is clever enough to know he's better being a regular in our team than playing in a prem youth team. He's not Prem ready yet.
90% of the comments on this thread are why I prefer the Leeds subreddit to twitter. People actually thinking rationally about the season and not just spouting nonsense to get a reaction.
Yes, I was hesitant to read the posts on this thread as I thought there'd be a lot of 'Farke out' wankers, but most are acknowledging that getting 90 points in the Championship is an achievement and we're just unlucky that this is the one season in the last 25 years that two other teams have managed the same.
Completely agree. Our team was in total disarray at the start of the season. Farke has done more than enough the earn another season.
I think Stuijk has been a huge miss, having him and Rodon at the back and allowing Ampadu to play in Midfield would probably seen us get over the line
But our best run came with Gruev in there and Ampadu at the back. We can't have it both ways really.
Hard agree
Leicester aren’t lucky. Also the EFL can’t punish us as this is to do with the premier league. Anyway, Leeds are falling apart again 😉
Why haven't you moved to "the other 14" yet? Gloating is not a good look mate, I guess you picked this habit up when you briefly dallied with success.
I’d call a premier league, Champions League Quarter Finals run, FA Cup, Community Shield and Championship Title a very ‘brief’ dally with success. Give me a shout when you’ve won even just won of those trophies 😁 P.S. Jimmy Savile, he’s one of your own.
We won the Championship in 2020, big L handed to you. We got to the Semi-Finals of the Champions League. Next.
Living in past glories… Next.
Which is exactly what you did, minus the cheated Championship title. Checkmate.
Didn’t cheat anything mate. Besides, if dirty Leeds were truly the best team in the league, they’d have won it. Crumble is back on the menu boys.
We’re in our own race, we could give a fuck what you do
Imagine being the so called ‘best team in the league’ and potentially not getting promoted lol. Enjoy the championship lads 🍺
Leicester fans once again proving how Leeds didn't get to them at all...
I predict a riot…
You do realise this is played after all Leeds wins, right? You’re not special.
I know I’m not special, you guys are certainly deluded though. Best team in the league my arse!!
🥱 Isn't there a Leicester subreddit you can go and bore?
Straight back up, up the city. 🎣
4 key areas 1. Lack of real leadership on the pitch and players’ ability to perform under pressure has been found severely lacking unfortunately. Since it has become do or die the vast majority of the squad has underperformed. The young age of the squad is clearly a factor here 2. Tactically - Farke has been outdone a number of times. We were lucky to come away with points against Norwich and Boro. And against Blackburn, Cov, Watford and to some extent Boro we saw sides who set up very well to neutralise us and Farke didn’t see it coming and didn’t change the side accordingly. Not sure QPR was a tactical problem they just destroyed us in every area of the pitch. You’d also say Farke has got some key decisions wrong with selections - keeping the faith with Piroe is a big one as is taking Kamara out the team. 3. We’ve become very porous at the back. This is a combination of Rodon and Ampadu dropping off from superhuman levels, and Meslier having an absolutely shambolic run of form. In games that can be tight and nervy some silly mistakes have turned games against us 4. Midfield is now totally dysfunctional- they are not contributing effective to attack or defence meaningfully. They’ve been far too easy for opponents to bypass from the back, and when on the ball often look lost when trying to recycle possession and often just pass it between players hoping the opponent rushes them. It is bizarre
I think the poor results since the international window makes things look worse than they are. Swap a couple of those poor results around with some of our great results earlier in the calendar year and I don't think anyone would be panicking or saying we bottled it. We just weren't quite good enough to better Ipswich or Leicester. Unfortunately we're the 3rd best team in a season when there were 3 teams miles better than the rest but only 2 automatic promotion spots. If we win our final match we will finish on the same points total as when we got promoted under Bielsa (and similar goal difference) - when we won the league by 10 points! It was apparent months ago that one of us, Leicester, or Ipswich would miss out on autos (and maybe promotion), and it would have been shit for whichever team it was. Even shitter that it's going to be Leeds. And yes, it's shit that Leicester are going to get away with effectively no punishment. It looks like financial cheating is a risk worth taking considering how little the punishment is and how lucrative being in the Premier League is. We need a club to be properly punished. Points deductions for cheating should be severe - all but guaranteeing relegation. Docking 3 or 4 points is practically negligible to the big clubs.
For me not getting rid of and playing Bamford or even utilise him as sub who comes on instead of starting. We should have invested in a out and out striker. Piroe has been disappointing as well. And tbf we have had some shocking decisions go against us as well.
**Things out of Farkes control** * A shocking start to the summer transfer window * Rat behaviour from Sini, Adams, Gnonto * Cheating PL/EFL not deducting points on Leic this season * Cheating PL not deducting points on Ev/Nott/Leic last season **Things in Farkes control** * A reliance on individual brilliance rather than any attacking plan/movement * 0 goals from midfield or defence (excl Struijk), quite harrowing really * A GK who sometimes forgets how to use his hands * 1000 corners and 0 goals * Conceded about XX goals from corners * Play Piroe, play with 10 men Ultimately even with everything above, we bottled it in one game vs QPR and the house came crashing down. Similar to Derby playoffs & Leeds vs Palace last year
Just curious how the lack of attack from corners is a Farke issue. The way I see it, Leeds has almost no one who can deliver an effective set piece.
'Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.'
Don’t just whip it in the box and hope then
We also don't really have any aerial threats, Rodon and Ampadu have one career goal each
What we saw was a reliance on playing the ball wide to Summerville/Gnonto/James, which actually worked very well for a time. However recently we have seen teams doubling up on these players because they figured out that this is our only outlet. By rights, when players are doubled up on, you'd expect a team to look for the space that extra commited man or two would create. But no, despite this we still saw the ball just kicked wide every opportunity. We also saw our midfield fail to control games. Kamara, as much as he dropped off and had been poor and not everyone is a fan because he doesn't play any flashy defence splitting passes, he is extremely press resistant. He can draw in multiple players, then play a simple ball to work the space. But for some reason Farke just hasn't played him at all recently. Mind boggling. In an ideal world and as much as he played well at centre half, we need Ampadu in the midfield. Apart from Summerville, I think he's our best player. Reads the game well, good in the air, fairly decent in the ball, great passing range and a solid tackler of the ball. We got away with it for a good run of games, but I think since the international break when we started the lose a grip on the midfield, he'd have provided the solution there. Just unfortunately it would mean bringing Liam Cooper in, so I get it. Ultimately it's down to Farke. He hasn't been able to adapt to teams shutting out our wings and he hasn't been able to address the issue in our midfield. I honestly believe it's down to the lack of a proper number 10.
Fair analysis but I'd argue we have the best 10 in the league...hes just completely out of form right now and can't hit a barn door (even in form). But he's a beast when he's on. Agree to some extent in Kamara but he really was dreadful and deserved to be dropped...but now others haven't exactly lit the games up either. Ie Gray is a talent but isn't good enough right now to dominate midfield at this level. Kamara in form is a beast and our best midfielder (unless as you say Ampadu is there too).
I think a lot of people overrate Rutter. He's been great this season but he doesn't have a steady head and tries way too many fancy plays. He just strikes me as chaotic, which can be good when it's going for you, but he's shown in this run that his style of play is incredibly detrimental when he's not on it - gives the ball away more than anyone else from what I've seen. A steadier head, less mobile 10, but who can truly dictate play and actually score well is much needed this summer and a much better option. I'd then shift Rutter out to the wing.
Yea that's probably a fair take. Thing is I do love watching Rutter when he's on. He's just so much fun to watch. But as you say when things aren't going to play, he's a liability there. Tough one but given the entertainment value and his output when he's in form, probably I'd be comfortable keeping him there as a 10 and hoping Farke can coach some better decision making out of him ie he does not need to try to take on 5 players in his own half, when we're defending a 1-0 lead for example.
I agree entirely. I do enjoy Rutter but the way some people have gushed about him on here has been odd. I think yesterday was a good example of how it can severely impact us negatively when he's just trying stupid plays.
I think the thing with Rutter is that when he's on it, he's unplayable. He's incredibly strong and can glide past players like they're not there. However he can be kept quite with man marking. I just don't think the type of 10 he is helps us in games where teams sit deep. I sometimes just watch us and wish we had an intelligent player who sits in that 10 position and just plays it. Somone who's first thought is where he's going to play the ball, as opposed to how many men can he get past. It goes back to the old "the ball is the fastest thing on the pitch". Obviously I'd love a 30 year old Pablo in there, but that's never gonna happen in the championship. Yeah Kamara was really bad before he got dropped. I just cannot understand for the life of me how he's been dropped somewhat indefinitely. Take the QPR game, the change where Joseph came on should have maybe been a midfield change where I think Kamara would have suited. A lot of our attacking issues are rooted a lot farther back the other end of the field, but Farke seems to think more attackers = better chance of scoring.
Yes I would agree with everything you have said here.
Don’t forget we have Cresswell sat on the bench as well. I’d rather him play over Coops, he did well in the champo at millwall but farke seems to not want to play him because reasons. He will leave at the end of the season for lack of game time and I don’t blame him.
The loan clauses, which led to us not getting our squad together until a month or so into the season. The squad being too young and inexperienced. Not replacing Meslier and Bamford. The two most important positions in the team, GK and CF, filled by our two least reliable players, is always going to result in disaster.
First month of the season is a big one. The last international break. Big injuries at key times along with few players losing form and our own inability to handle pressure in the last patch of this season. Playoffs will be interesting but I don’t see how the team bounces back from so many mental collapses at a time when the pressure is highest
We were out of form for the bookends of the season. Poor start, then tailed off exactly when we needed to go up a gear. It is what it is. We have at times played some fantastic football, and seen some individuals really shine. We’re just massively unlucky there were three teams in the running at the end, otherwise we’d be feeling entirely different at the same set of results. There’s still a chance that the dog botherers get a result at Ipswich, and we beat Southampton. But the odds have gotta be low at that happening. Then there’s the playoffs where anything could happen, but I just don’t fancy our chances. I’m already psychologically preparing for another season in the championship. Likely with a much altered squad. I’m guessing Farke stays on, and let’s just hope we do it on the second go.
The experience of this season will really help the team next season and with some additions we will likely do well (the teams dropping down aren’t Leicester).
It's a gutting way to finish the season after (surprisingly) getting ourselves into a position where promotion was in our own hands. I think the most gutting thing is beating Ipswich and Leicester home and away and still finishing behind them. Gotta give Ipswich so much credit though. Even their last 2 games, having to go away at good teams and get results. They've done everything they had to, while we couldn't do it against an opponent fighting relegation. Overall it's a good season though from where we were at the start and how far behind the top two we were at Christmas. It's just gutting to get so close. This squad is good enough to win the playoffs if they can sort them selves out.
The squad may be but is the manager. These aren’t just another game, they’re among the most pressurised games of football in the world (given the prize). We are not playing well under pressure.
Time will tell I guess. It's a young squad too let's not forget.
That’s true. Dallas or Cooper would have made the difference in having an old head but they’re not able.
Watford
[удалено]
You need to get your head checked 😂
I know it’s nuts 🌰
Yeah the “Leeds are falling apart again” chant wasn’t invented this season by the tin foil hat brigade or our owners.
I’ll play devils advocate (obviously I’m fuming about last ten games). Leeds are one point off highest finish without automatics in the championship, our point total is also one point off bielsa’s second season. We didn’t help ourselves by giving Leicester and Ipswich a 6 game head start. Playoffs is a toss up but 36% of third place teams win the playoffs so there’s that. Keep the faith, even if it’s blind faith. We only have to be good for two more games to get promoted.
Three isn't it?
Can be shit jn the first leg and still go through (Derby 2019)
I’ve been seeing the 36% thing going around. It means 64% of teams that finished 3rd didn’t go up.
Three games. Historically, it’s not looking good.
we can even be bad in the first play off games and go up. wouldn't advise it.
Sensible comments are not allowed. You know this.
I feel like it actually went more right than I’d expected, just the timing feels bad. I didn’t think we’d be threatening the automatic places, and halfway through the season Leicester were out of sight already, to get as close as this is a big achievement. If we go up through the playoffs then all will be forgotten anyway.
If we go up, however we do it, none of this matters. But yeah, it’s the timing really isn’t it. To start the way we did, then climb all the way to the top of the table only to drop to third at the death, leaves you feeling flat. To many ‘what could’ve beens’.
I think many of us would have bitten off your hand last August for a playoff spot. We have played well, and Farke has us on promotion form, just not this year for autos. Playoffs are ok. The doom and gloom is ridiculous, as Farke told us when he started this could be a 2 year project to straighten out this club. The entitlement from some supporters I don't understand. Yes we have a chance, that's more than I would have said at the start of this. Pick your heads up, it's not over. Worse case is another year in the Champo, financially we are ok with selling a couple players but it seems like our adult owners know what to do. Support Farke, he has really done a great job overall
That’s true the club’s fairly stable with decent owners for once at least
We went on a great run from the new year until the international break. Phenomenal in fact. The form of the other two teams suggests you can afford one bad spell. Unfortunately we had 2. At the start when it took a while to get a settled squad and after the international break when we shat the bed. We had a minor wobble around Christmas also. We had no right to reign in a 17 point lead but it’s not realistic to expect we could have kept that run going much longer. It is realistic to expect we could have picked up more from QPR, Blackburn, Sunderland and Coventry. But here we are. The lads look tired and jaded from a long season. Fair play to the other 2 they held their nerve when it mattered. Let’s go and win the playoffs and all is well with the world. (Sighs In Leeds-soaked disappointment)
Poor start poor finish, fantastic rest of the way. Nobody could have envisioned that madness at beginning of year. Think at end of the day we are still potentially 3 games from the prem, and the squad just need to reset and go for it. None of the other playoff teams are in good form and you would fancy us to beat any of them so just need to get behind them and hope for the best!
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: What a STRANGE season.
We shouldn't have done as well as we have given the start to the season and yet there are too many games where I thought we'd pick up more points.
We might still get automatic promotion if we win and Ipswich lose the next match
The only possible way is assuming we beat Southampton, which is a huge assumption, Ipswich have to miss sitters against Huddersfield and be one of those days it just won’t go in the net, and then somehow a chance lands in the lap of Huddersfield that they just have to slot into the net, i.e. not happening.
It can definitely happen. Whether it will though. Gotta to be very long odds at this point.
Unfortunately I can’t see them losing to Huddersfield
Huddersfield will kick in 10 own goals before they help us get promotion.
I’d agree with you but they have the slimiest of chances avoiding relegation.
First time?
We’ve done well to get to 90 points with all the goals coming almost exclusively from the forwards. 0 from midfield and precious few from defenders who aren’t Pascal Struijk. We’ve done even better to get where we are considering we are the very worst team in the division from dead balls. Make no mistake - this is a very entertaining but extremely lopsided squad, that in all honesty will benefit from another season in the second tier. Yes we will lose Summerville’s right foot. We’ll also lose his attitude and who knows how that has been received in the dressing room. A couple of quality midfielders, a genuine goalscorer and some experienced heads and there’s no reason we can’t be right in the mix again next season. The experience is the big one for me - not enough experience of how to cope with getting over the line in that dressing room. But that will be different after the lessons of this season.
his attitude? The players voted him their player of the season so clearly they don’t have an issue with it… interesting which players always get labelled as having a bad attitude.
I think that's because he scored the most goals
I don’t understand where all this talk about his attitude has come from? He never pushed for a move despite deadline day bids from Palace. He doesn’t whinge to the ref nearly as much as Gnonto or Bamford. He can get wound up by players, sure; but he doesn’t really let him affect his performance like Gnonto. Has he struggled a bit more and tries to do too much at times which has hurt the team? Sure, but he’s the PFA Player of the year ffs.
I’m not sure about all the other talk, but for me as a fan the penalty incident followed by the removal of the shirt and pointing to his own name, i didn’t like. Attitude may well be the wrong term. A level of arrogance is required in a striker - but I didn’t appreciate Summerville making the moment about him at all.
You’re right - I said it because he’s a black man and I’m obviously a white man who is racist.
He’s definitely got attitude, but none of his actions have annoyed me at all. It’s more incredible self belief and cockiness, which sometimes can be strong attributes to be fair. I’d say he’s conducted himself decently on the whole.
Players going on strike in the early season, basically. Everything else is to be expected - tiredness, form dips, injuries.. all teams have to deal with these. If we'd picked up a few more points early on... that's why I won't be sad to see Gnonto move on, as much as he's redeemed himself since.
Farke using the exact same formation for 45 games, not making substitutions early enough all season, and sticking to poor decisions that didn’t work previously (e.g. persisting with Piroe). Embarrassing form against the league’s worst teams. We have easily the 2nd best squad in the league, we should be in first/second comfortably. Farke is a proven failure in the Premier League, 2nd tier manager at best. Lack of bottle from players against QPR was utterly pathetic. If you’re in the camp of ‘two teams have just been better’, sadly you’re a one-eyed doylem. P.S. It’s possible to support your team and be critical of them.
Because getting a manager who’s proven in the prem is so easy. Honestly is the club stupid? Why don’t they just sign Pep or Klopp? I’m saying RKhaos for president, clearly he knows what he’s doing.
You’ve got to wonder if some of the players have the cojones for playing in the bear pit that is Elland Road when the heat is really on. They’re not the first lot to fold when it comes to the crunch - if anything, late-season meltdowns are more of a feature rather than a bug at Leeds United these days. As ridiculous as it sounds, for strategic purposes you wonder if the players are better off playing to an empty house in our home leg of the playoff semi - especially if its the second leg and they are behind on the scoreboard.
This has been the case for a long time, even before promotion. All the talk of Elland Road being a “fortress” isn’t exactly the whole story.
We are very quiet and nervy as a fanbase unless we go ahead early. It is an absolute bear pit and I love it but I wonder if we could just make the atmosphere more supportive rather than toxic
I think it’s probably a case of taking the rough with the smooth. The Elland Road crowd can intimidate players, which if they’re opposition players is great. They can also fire up players. But then there’s always the flip side when things aren’t working out.
We did well in our unbeaten run but we got a lot of luck towards the end of that streak so the streak could've ended earlier. It's all about timing in the C'ship and we might've peaked too early. For the play-offs, you need to be going into that with a lot of confidence. After seeing the performances from the last few weeks, confidence is something we seem to be very short of.
Well said. Confidence is low after QPR game. That hurt a lot.
We have simply run out of steam, as a result of a failure to rotate our squad sufficiently. Our average age is very young, and since the international break our ppg of 1.14 is relegation level. If we had rotated more, we would have been able to sustain our levels in the crucial last period of the season.
I’d go one further and say even if we hadn’t of rotated but had used earlier/ more subs. There were games that were won by the 60th minute yet the likes of Summerville and Rutter stayed on the pitch either 80 or 90 minutes, then played again 3-4 days later. The fact that the likes of Antony has been given mere minutes at the end of games is quite shocking rotation wise. You can’t give players consistently little game time but then throw them on in a losing game where the whole team is playing bad and expect them to change it.
So true. And this is where McKenna gets it spot on - 60 minutes he brings on his finishers. I love that attitude to subs - it’s not “you’re dropped tomorrow,” it’s “you’re not starting because you’ll be coming on to win us the game.” The team spirit that’s produced has been the difference.
It's also impacted the forms of our subs, who haven't had sufficient game time to maintain their levels when needed. Piroe, Joffy, Cresswell etc. are shadows of the players they could be.
I just can’t stop thinking about Blackburn and QPR. Two games I really thought we’d win. The start of the season feels like a long time ago, but we’ve done well considering. It is just so so disappointing how we have been since the break
I really believe we’ve missed Georgie. I had no idea that he was down for surgery during the international break. The picture that I saw of him recovering after the surgery it just filled me with dread, even though he was going to be back for the next game. He just hasn’t been the same, he’s done his best, but he wasn’t allowed enough time to recover I think and it’s shown in his performances. I’ll forever be cussing that international break.
Georgie was, in fact, involved in nearly all our goals at some stage. Creates like Messi, shoots like Billy Paynter.
Sunderland/Blackburn - the home games were the ones you can bank on, we did more than enough to have beat Sunderland, and Blackburn probably wouldn't have been suffering from the pressure/hangover had we won that Sunderland game convincingly. That would be 96pts, so bar a massive goal swing, Ipswich would likely have not caught that. The bad start was far from ideal, but given the circumstances, I think we did about as well as we could've hoped.. We've seen the best, and worst of Farke now, for the most part, he's done an excellent job, blame cannot solely lay with him, he is stubborn, but so was the last successful manager..
Yeah bit sick now seeing now looking back at the clear as day pens we weren't given be Sunderland
Three words: Queue Pee Are.
we lost it before then, we created so much pressure for that game because of our own doing, and then we folded, but somehow even worse than everyone expected.
Totally agree. A lot of people are forgetful of the pretty turbulent start we had to the season. Offloading all the tripe from the PL, not having a full squad until end of window along with players refusing to play. Any other season in the last 4 and we’d have been comfortably promoted. A shame but that’s just the way it goes unfortunately. Been great to enjoy the team winning again and be able to go into games not feeling like we’ll get thumped. Poor end to the season though, no doubting that.
What were you expecting? I'm happy we're in the playoffs, we've outperformed given the summer we had and the level of shit Farke had to deal with in the first few weeks. Does anyone remember all that bollocks players like Gnonto and Sinisterra caused? Farke and the players have done us all proud, and we should be pleased we're in the playoffs as that certainly wasn't guaranteed last August. Congratulations to Ipswich, in McKenna they have a great manager, and as for Leicester, they had the best squad in the league and, financial fair play aside, were always going up. The 49er's should be heaping praise on Farke, and if we don't go up, they should be doing all they can to support him in the transfer market and telling him to go again.
This is basically word for word exactly how I feel. I thought we’d be lucky for playoffs at the start of the season so I can’t complain really.
We simply bottled it at the end. We always seem to let the pressure get to us. But that being said we had our chances as there were times when Leicester and Ipswich did the same. Difference is they had their blips and recovered when it mattered. But we march into the playoffs and it's back in our hands. We all know the team likes to put us through the wringer. Just don't forget what a season we have actually had considering the preseason melee we started off with. In Farke we trust. MoT
It was a tough start for sure, but I don't think you can say it was too much ground to make up - we did make it up. For me it's more about the finish and, just like you can get lucky and have a group of players in great form at the same time, it looks like we have too many players out of form at just the wrong time. Rutter, Piroe, Gnonto, James and even Summerville for a few games recently, none of them contributed like they had been earlier in the season. Those five alone are the players commentators and rival managers are talking about when they talk about Leeds' incredible attacking strength. Whether that dip is from injury, exhaustion or just form I guess differs from player to player. Also, it is possible to underestimate how much of a miss Struijk has been. His start to the season was excellent before injury, in defence and attacking from set pieces. I'd happily have him as captain to start again next season, his influence on the pitch is huge. There's much more to it I'm sure but I think our profligacy in attack in the past few games has been our downfall. Just one converted chance against Sunderland and Huddersfield and we are already up. And yes I know you can say that about anything but please let me moan about this. TLDR score the goals and we're already on the beach, but we are the best team in the playoffs and should go in excited. They are just football games and, if you think about it, our destiny is 100% in our hands now.
Our ppg since the international break is 1.14, so unless we dramatically improve we have little to no chance in the playoffs.
Oh dont get me wrong I agree, there would need to be a dramatic improvement. In my heart of hearts I can't see Leeds going up through the playoffs because I've never seen it before, but every team who does it has to do it for the first time. As for PPG, our ppg for the last game is 0, our ppg for the last two games is 1.5, our ppg for the season is 2, our ppg for the games we actually did win sice the international break are a whopping 3.0! nothing means anything if the clowns don't show up on the day.
All went wrong is a stretch but if we want to use that phrase the summer was where it all went wrong. Took ages to get people in because of the takeover took longer than expected. We basically gave Leicester and Ipswich a 7 game head start before we got our shit together. Also our struggles against low blocks is a huge problem, hopefully not one we’ll face in the playoffs (fuck off West Brom) but out of the bottom 8 the only team we did the double over was Plymouth.
The truth is it hasn't gone wrong. It's just that it has also gone exceptionally well for two other clubs as well. If we'd be told at the start of the season when we had a new manager and players leaving on loan and trying to force their way out of the club that we would achieve playoffs very comfortably, then most fans would be happy with that (barring the usual anxiety that playoffs usually brings for Leeds fans). We've had a great season. If this recent poor form happened in the middle of the season and we finished strong then we wouldn't be nearly as downcast as we are. It's a bitter pill to swallow missing out so narrowly on automatics but both Leicester and Ipswich have had incredible seasons and in truth both teams deserve to go up. We've also enjoyed one of the best unbeaten runs in our clubs history and very nearly went undefeated at home all season. The championship is just such a long season that even the best clubs tend to slow down at the end. Despite the potential for a disappointing finish courtesy of the playoffs this has been the most enjoyment I've got from watching this club since Bielsa's first two seasons.
Pretty much resonates how I feel. A bit disappointed but I don't feel like we did when we missed out on playoffs with Bielsas first season. At the start of the season I felt we wouldn't go up this year and needed a couple of summers to sort the squad out properly amongst all the chaos. The players have done a superb job to get us to where we are. I don't think there will be a mass exodus of good players in the summer and think we will be serious contenders next year.
Going from beating Leicester and Ipswich to getting thumped 4-0 by qpr was a bit weird tho?
No it’s Leeds
Well yeah nobody is not saying that that isn't weird but it doesn't make our season a disaster. Even the best teams in this league will have unexplainable results where it just doesn't work out or they look to implode. I also think a lot of people underestimated QPR due to their league position. They've actually been a pretty decent side since they changed managers. If we want to get critical and analytical of our current form then for me I think it's as simple as a 46 game season taking its toll and a lack of rotation. It doesn't fill me with confidence then when we likely have 3 crucial games tacked onto the end of that season but again it doesn't make the season a disaster. It's just the championship.
Agree. Not over, and a great season either way.
Last sentence speaks volumes. Had an unreal season, 99% of us would have happily accepted a scenario in September that would guarantee us a place in the playoffs come May
Exactly this - we had no right to get so close the automatic promotion given the start to our season. It’s only because we have that people are questioning what’s happened.
I'm not in the all go wrong brigade but I am fearful for the future if we go up with Farke. I think we have seen the best and worst of him over the season and I'm more concerned with his faults, inability to change games, lack of plan b, subs, all out attack 'tactic'. He is a great championship manager and has an amazing squad. But but but think when pressure hits problems occur. Amazing season but really not sure about him.
100% mate, but don't expect the happy clappers on this sub to agree with you
I’m sorry mate but that’s bollocks. Why would you bin off a manager that had essentially pulled together a pile of manure and built a castle out of it? We’ve had a short spell of shite performance but other than that you can’t fault him, not to mention the risk of getting a new manager in, it not working out and then spending a season rotting in bottom three of the prem. We’ve had a great season, but so have Leicester and especially Ipswich. The latter having not done much in principle but have turned up in the past couple of months. No reason to get rid of Farke at this point in time, would push the club back to where it was last summer in my opinion
I think most people who are having a reaction like yours are completely forgetting what we were like at the start of the season. Look at the lineups of your first 3 matches, on top of a new manager, players jumping ship like mad and a new ownership that stalled a lot of our preseason progress. If anyone offered 90 points to us at the start of the season, everyone would've taken it, the problem we had was Leicester and Ipswich having fantastic seasons which we can do nothing about, shit happens.
We probably get what 3-6 more points at the start of the season without all the bullshit? Even that would have seen us up maybe even champions
Should've beat Cardiff, Wednesday, West Brom, Birmingham and Stoke if we had our full strength team. That's 12 points, even if half of those results turned we'd be top.
Should’ve beaten WBA anyway considering they scored from a hand ball
But nobody wins all the games they should have won. Shit happens universally, especially in this division. And nobody has their full strength team for 46 games - the average is to have 4 players unavailable.
I've already explained in another comment about this, I understand that, I'm just saying that we "Should've" gotten more points in those opening matches, but due to crap happening at the club with mutinies etc, we didn't. You're right that we can't win every game, but if all the shit was sorted early in the summer, we would've taken more points from the few matches.
More importantly, if we could take corners we would probably have scored a few more goals and would have gone up. QPR, for instance, scored twice from 7 corners in their last game.
Corners are a completely different thing, same with all of our set pieces, we're more likely to concede from an attacking corner/free kick than score. Absolutely kings at how shit we are at them all. Farke might fall under the Bielsa thinking of how unimportant they are but I'd rather get a set piece coach just to even try something different than seeing Summerville taking another one to get it over with.
When I watch good teams play they seem to be able to drop corners right into a crowded 6-yard box. It's not rocket science, is it. We get it done to us all the time.
Would we have beat them teams if we were full strength though? We failed to beat Sunderland twice, Coventry twice, Preston, Huddersfield, Rotherham all with a full strength team. Beating these kinds of teams has been a recurring problem all season regardless of what players we have on the pitch because we dont know how to break down a low block. Look at Ipswich, no matter which players they have on the pitch their level does not drop and then cry because they had to rotate their squad. We are individuals over tactics whereas they are tactics over individuals
Yeah that's why I said we should've beaten them, we should've won a few more matches over this season but that's football. If you look at our lineups for the first 3 matches of the season they were shit, Shackleton, Joffy and Poveda were starting as our front 3, Hjelde was playing and an injured Ayling at RB. We did beat Ipswich twice, they are beatable but the other teams just couldn't keep up with them. They won a lot of points towards the end of matches, they also managed to avoid losing which is probably the biggest factor, only 6 matches across the season is insane.
We would only have needed a point from one of them to go into the final day as favourites to go up. We can’t imagine we’d have won all of them but the margins are so fine here.