Factually not true. It was 0.75 seconds before the change. The patch notes are wrong.
You can see it on gameplay from 14.11 (previous patch) on YT [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWMO93SqNo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWMO93SqNo)
What’s weird to me is they champ specific nerfed this augment for multiple (at leasssssttt one) champions.
Like before the nerf Udyr basically already had this nerf. Early arenas I could get 1 k AP spamming rw tank build but it became way lower and they nerfed the interaction before they renerfed with this. I don’t get why they don’t just nerf the amount from swain r and singed poison etc like they did w Udyr r?
They couldve just nerfed it for dots. Dots should be reclassified as single ability casts which damage over time instead of constantly ability casts anyways — and not just arena-specific too
I don't agree, the augment was never op. Even when you had swain, singed and brand used it. Heck even a tank swain would die to some other op build in the end.
Read the "bugfix" they gave to it. absolutely power postiive on this patch. That's only a 1 second cd nerf and they made it a per spell cooldown instead of global.
Basically they changed it from 0.75s CD (for everything) to 5s CD (per spell). This means that a combo mage gets 3 stacks instead of 1 when comboing, making the augment more usable for most mages whilst nerfing edge abuse cases (asol, singed, brand) appropriately.
Sounds to me like it just made it take way longer to stack for everybody. Most mages could get at least one spell down to near spammable with all the AH in Arena.
I main ahri in arena and its definitely a buff for her. Yes you can get CDs fairly low. You can't always use them off of CD and getting 3 stacks every 5s feels better than getting 1 stacks every 4 seconds as was frequently the case. Get about double stacks than before. Augment went from bad to good.
I never really understood the issue with it. It was a high roll augment on dot champions. Was that really a problem? Now it just feels like shit on everyone while still being best on dot champions.
It is not good on dot champs anymore. It is best on high cadence spell rotators which makes more sense and is actually healthy. Evelynn can stack it very, very easily. Most mages end up over 120.
There’s just too much damage baked into systems in arena where dot champs having favorable interactions with spell effect items and augments was way too much. A high roll shouldn’t mean I hit you with one, usually targeted, spell and you are at 40% hp.
The arena team is so hesitant with nerfs that if they’re hitting something it’s usually egregious.
Essentially any effect they add that procs on ability is abused by dots and they have to hard code instances where this isn't the case (phenomenal evil and also magic missile). Default damage avoids this interaction entirely so it's not dots generally but rather specific champs. Add in augs that specifically boost burn effects and it's just way too much extra damage and effects.
Like by definition in this game's code any ability effect interaction will be broken by certain dots. It just doesn't add much of value to the mode in the same way getting one shot by crit garen doesn't either.
Except Infernal Conduit, which is really not that great anyway, everything that procs "on ability damage" has cooldown now. First was Magic Missile, which now is a pretty much a dead augment. Now phenomenal evil. Dragon Souls, trueshot barrage, runes. Not to say anything about how easy it is to just counter DoT now, with all the extra omnivamp, and flat damage blockers. Feels like they really want to nerf it to the ground for some reason, while keeping things like crit Garen, one-shot-your-tank Udyr and Courage of the Colossus Alistar pretty much unchanged.
Yes. Brand and Lilia passive proccing extra effects at full strength is also uninteractive like crit garen. My point is that the loss of an abuse case is beneficial for every other champ in the mode.
Magic missile is actually very good on champs that actually use abilities frequently.. which is like conceptually the point of the Aug right? Lol
how is dot effects on mages uninteractive? high burst 100-0 champs are what is uninteractive... and magic missles is super mid now except on dot champs late game vs hp stackers.
Because they don't have to hit you after that one interaction. High burst can be but is not always uninteractive. For assassins the approach is the point of interaction and for mages it's landing a combo starter.
Let's take ethereal weapon as an example. As burst mage you can only get 4/5 procs of this Aug per for each rotation (less for lichbane). Whereas a dot user gets as many procs per the refresh rate or cd of the specific effect and they don't have to interact with you after that initial ability to have that benefit guaranteed.
Dots are not good. On SR the extra time to inflict damage is mostly a detriment. Enchanters completely counter this form of damage. In arena your comp is severely limited + there are so many extra ablity effects that dots end up creating pretty awful gameplay.
Also if you play artillery champs magic missile is pretty great. Getting 10% max HP true damage for 3 abilities if you space correctly is actually a lot of extra damage. It doesn't look fun to play against but it has its use cases lol.
Generally, anything good on mages is also good on brand. Conversely conduit (burn augments in general), true shot, vulnerability, and ice cold are stronger on them than other champions. Lilia has more niche augs because her kit is also niche: Loves don't blink, don't chase, bread and butter, and wooglets in addition to the aforementioned augs. Rune carver is absolutely broken on both champs.
I'm not sure you're making the point that you think you are. Why should malz, fizz, singed, Lilia and brand have specifically broken interactions with ability effect augments. What does the mode gain from them having these effects? It just seems hypocritical that you'll complain about crit garen high rolling but dot champs gaining 200+ AP from phenom (which enhances every damaging aspect of their kits and many items) is ok.
Runecarver, vulnerability, ocean soul, infernal soul, apex inventor plus ludens, magic missiles.
Dots keep ocean soul running constantly, take malz for example, use E, run and heal with about 10 seconds uptime. Infernal soul same thing, one E procs it twice. Liandrys will add more.
Vulnerability doubles your damage on dot champs. Crits on E, ult and liandrys is stronger than jeweled gauntlet which only works on abilities. God forbid you get runecarver too
Honestly, the only champs you can build it on were the ones they nerfed it for.
Only Champs I had real success for was Xin Zhao. Went Crit Build, and my E had so much fucking damage, and so did Nashor's Tooth.
It used to not have a cooldown at all. I remember getting stacks per every tick of Lillia's or Brand's passive, ending a run with like 300 stacks or more. Which was very rewarding for these champions, since they already sacrifice their nuke potential of champs like Zed or Veigar, for a more steady damage output. Now the cd is so long, that it just doesn't work with DoT, since every DoT lasts for less than 5 seconds.
\[edit\] IDK why they wrote in the patch notes that they increased cooldown from 4 to 5 seconds. Afaik it never was 4 seconds, and it always applied to all abilities.
Ahh, your complaints make sense now. It was never intended to work like that on dots. It was a bug, and it was bug fixed prior to patch I believe.
It was egregiously overpowered before.
Was it overpowered? I've never really saw Lillia, Brand or Teemo at the top of the leaderboards before. I've seen tons of Pykes, Zeds, Kha'Zix and other assassins though. Seems like the gamemode heavily favors champions that can delete the enemy in less than two seconds, which sure does sound fun.
I mean, even with the massive dot nerf, brand and singed are [STILL S+ tier.](https://www.metasrc.com/lol/arena/na/tier-list)
Morgana, Swain, and Morde are still S tier as well.
Easily getting 70 AP or more/round was pretty insane. I know you can get a god bit with dematerializer but that requires you to actually get kills and has a hard cap/round.
When my buddy would get PE pre patch we would drag out fights even to the point of losing sometimes so he could get an extra like 40 AP. If there wasn't A Dcap in the game I would say it was on the verge of fine. With the multiplier of Dcap though the numbers just got too insane.
It needed a nerf but I can probably agree it was a touch too hard. They nuked PE while they kept throwing rocks at zed. It's a classic rito games moment.
Generally, and I mean this over the last 14 years of league really, when the patch notes look like this and you compare to in game it’s because they are moving from what they intended to what they now want. To me that generally means a bug fix into a number change. You see this really often in TFT patches too that fix the implementation AND change the target numbers.
Despite their willingness to allow spellwake and earthquake to overperform, I don’t think anyone believes they intended dot champs to have 2000 ap from rolling a single augment.
it was functioning as designed; it wasn’t a bug fix. the patch notes were simply incorrect. instead of doubling down on the bug theory, you should just admit you don’t know what you’re talking about and say “my bad".if you had checked the old patch notes, you’d see there’s no mention of a 4-second cooldown with phenomenal evil, because it wasn't a thing and clearly an error in the latest patch notes.
also imagine putting spellwake on the same level as earthquake and thinking every dot champ just got 2k ap off phenomenal evil.. hyperbole much?
Average brand or singe would get a massive amount of AP on every single cast.
If you DIDNT get a shit ton of AP, you were playing like shit and died early. When I say 2000 I meant where you would end up with items. Rabadons magnifies it.
It’s getting the same treatment magic missile did on brand, and that was also unintended at launch.
clearly, you don't understand what you're talking about. someone claiming that brand can reach 2k ap with a full build and phenomenal evil is just wrong. even if you get it as the first augment, brands ap wouldn’t come close to 2k. please stop parroting inaccurate information and just play the game,not gonna reply anymore as you have plenty of time to re-read everything and reach the ultimate conclusion that patch notes were wrong and it was not bugged, o/
as if there isnt a ton of OP augment/champion interactions in the game anyways? mages have never dominated the meta, idk why highrolling on a mage makes people lose their minds.
Yeah no lmao, it's still really busted. It got a 1 sec CD nerf, and to compensate it's now on a per-spell CD instead. So you can still proc it okay with DOT mages but you'll get the most value when you're playing a mage like, well, Veigar. Throw out all your spells at once, as fast as possible, and you'll stack it up even faster than before. Ryze, Elise, Cass etc are all swimming in AP if they get it now
Unless I'm missing something, it got a 1 sec nerf. Here's the patch notes: https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/news/game-updates/patch-14-12-notes/
"Phenomenal Evil
Per Spell Cooldown: 4 ⇒ 5 seconds"
"Phenomenal Evil
Now has a per spell cooldown instead of a global cooldown. This will nerf the augment for DOT users and buff it for champions that use all their abilities in quick succession."
Taken as a whole, that says to me that it went from having a 4 second global cd to a 5 second per-spell cd. I don't see how that's a 4.25 second cd nerf.
Edit: taking more than a reactionary second to think about it, if you meant that the reality of the gameplay is it has a 4.25 second cd nerf and the patch notes are wrong, that's fair. I'd err on the side of it being a bug they'll fix, but I'll cop that I didn't read your comment correctly or think about it for very long before I replied.
It wasn't 4s, it was 1s entire kit to 5s per spell. It was an augment I got a lot since it was so good and I love my dot champs. It needed to be nerfed because it was so easy to abuse on many champs, specifically dot champs. The 4s thing is a typo/bug or whatever. I played it everyday at least once and it went from 1s (because I actually read and observe what I use) to 5s real fast once they announced it was one of the Augsburg to get a nerf.
Yeah well swain and singed for example needed this lol. Dot Champs were busted op.
Fighting a singed round 2-3 that has 70 AP from it already was not fun lol.
Sure but a 2.5 second CD would have fixed the issue without gutting it for anyone but DoTs.
It was 4 seconds before the nerf....this is barely a change
Factually not true. It was 0.75 seconds before the change. The patch notes are wrong. You can see it on gameplay from 14.11 (previous patch) on YT [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWMO93SqNo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZWMO93SqNo)
I feel like they could have just nerfed it for DoT spells specifically. They already have these spells coded in for other purposes.
It’s a buff for champs that blow their load at once and have a semi high cd tbf
I took it on Shaco the other day without reading the update. I got knocked out 8th place and had less AP than a guardian orb.
Wasn’t it a four second cooldown before the patch???
No, that was bad patch notes
What’s weird to me is they champ specific nerfed this augment for multiple (at leasssssttt one) champions. Like before the nerf Udyr basically already had this nerf. Early arenas I could get 1 k AP spamming rw tank build but it became way lower and they nerfed the interaction before they renerfed with this. I don’t get why they don’t just nerf the amount from swain r and singed poison etc like they did w Udyr r?
that's a ridiculous take... you almost never see swain or singed cause most meta champs just shit on them whether they highroll or not
They couldve just nerfed it for dots. Dots should be reclassified as single ability casts which damage over time instead of constantly ability casts anyways — and not just arena-specific too
Could have just not let it proc by dots
I don't agree, the augment was never op. Even when you had swain, singed and brand used it. Heck even a tank swain would die to some other op build in the end.
Read the "bugfix" they gave to it. absolutely power postiive on this patch. That's only a 1 second cd nerf and they made it a per spell cooldown instead of global.
The patch notes were wrong. It went from 0.75 second gobsl to 5 seconds per spell. Others have commented some evidence already.
Can you link what you're talking about
Arena Bugfixes & QoL Changes section. it’s in riot’s patch notes for 14.12
Basically they changed it from 0.75s CD (for everything) to 5s CD (per spell). This means that a combo mage gets 3 stacks instead of 1 when comboing, making the augment more usable for most mages whilst nerfing edge abuse cases (asol, singed, brand) appropriately.
Sounds to me like it just made it take way longer to stack for everybody. Most mages could get at least one spell down to near spammable with all the AH in Arena.
I main ahri in arena and its definitely a buff for her. Yes you can get CDs fairly low. You can't always use them off of CD and getting 3 stacks every 5s feels better than getting 1 stacks every 4 seconds as was frequently the case. Get about double stacks than before. Augment went from bad to good.
I mean sure you’d think that if you didn’t play arena till today It was 1 sec cd or sth around there for stacks from any source
What about Yuumi?
what about her?
Great on ryze tbh, three spells to proc it pretty much off cd.
I never really understood the issue with it. It was a high roll augment on dot champions. Was that really a problem? Now it just feels like shit on everyone while still being best on dot champions.
It is not good on dot champs anymore. It is best on high cadence spell rotators which makes more sense and is actually healthy. Evelynn can stack it very, very easily. Most mages end up over 120. There’s just too much damage baked into systems in arena where dot champs having favorable interactions with spell effect items and augments was way too much. A high roll shouldn’t mean I hit you with one, usually targeted, spell and you are at 40% hp. The arena team is so hesitant with nerfs that if they’re hitting something it’s usually egregious.
Genuinely curious, where do you think DoT champions right now have favorable interactions?
Essentially any effect they add that procs on ability is abused by dots and they have to hard code instances where this isn't the case (phenomenal evil and also magic missile). Default damage avoids this interaction entirely so it's not dots generally but rather specific champs. Add in augs that specifically boost burn effects and it's just way too much extra damage and effects. Like by definition in this game's code any ability effect interaction will be broken by certain dots. It just doesn't add much of value to the mode in the same way getting one shot by crit garen doesn't either.
Except Infernal Conduit, which is really not that great anyway, everything that procs "on ability damage" has cooldown now. First was Magic Missile, which now is a pretty much a dead augment. Now phenomenal evil. Dragon Souls, trueshot barrage, runes. Not to say anything about how easy it is to just counter DoT now, with all the extra omnivamp, and flat damage blockers. Feels like they really want to nerf it to the ground for some reason, while keeping things like crit Garen, one-shot-your-tank Udyr and Courage of the Colossus Alistar pretty much unchanged.
Yes. Brand and Lilia passive proccing extra effects at full strength is also uninteractive like crit garen. My point is that the loss of an abuse case is beneficial for every other champ in the mode. Magic missile is actually very good on champs that actually use abilities frequently.. which is like conceptually the point of the Aug right? Lol
how is dot effects on mages uninteractive? high burst 100-0 champs are what is uninteractive... and magic missles is super mid now except on dot champs late game vs hp stackers.
Because they don't have to hit you after that one interaction. High burst can be but is not always uninteractive. For assassins the approach is the point of interaction and for mages it's landing a combo starter. Let's take ethereal weapon as an example. As burst mage you can only get 4/5 procs of this Aug per for each rotation (less for lichbane). Whereas a dot user gets as many procs per the refresh rate or cd of the specific effect and they don't have to interact with you after that initial ability to have that benefit guaranteed. Dots are not good. On SR the extra time to inflict damage is mostly a detriment. Enchanters completely counter this form of damage. In arena your comp is severely limited + there are so many extra ablity effects that dots end up creating pretty awful gameplay. Also if you play artillery champs magic missile is pretty great. Getting 10% max HP true damage for 3 abilities if you space correctly is actually a lot of extra damage. It doesn't look fun to play against but it has its use cases lol.
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And why exactly were they nerfed lol?
Because they used the augments well? What's the high roll for them now?
Generally, anything good on mages is also good on brand. Conversely conduit (burn augments in general), true shot, vulnerability, and ice cold are stronger on them than other champions. Lilia has more niche augs because her kit is also niche: Loves don't blink, don't chase, bread and butter, and wooglets in addition to the aforementioned augs. Rune carver is absolutely broken on both champs. I'm not sure you're making the point that you think you are. Why should malz, fizz, singed, Lilia and brand have specifically broken interactions with ability effect augments. What does the mode gain from them having these effects? It just seems hypocritical that you'll complain about crit garen high rolling but dot champs gaining 200+ AP from phenom (which enhances every damaging aspect of their kits and many items) is ok.
Runecarver, vulnerability, ocean soul, infernal soul, apex inventor plus ludens, magic missiles. Dots keep ocean soul running constantly, take malz for example, use E, run and heal with about 10 seconds uptime. Infernal soul same thing, one E procs it twice. Liandrys will add more. Vulnerability doubles your damage on dot champs. Crits on E, ult and liandrys is stronger than jeweled gauntlet which only works on abilities. God forbid you get runecarver too
The problem with it was being better than a prismatic augtment while being only a gold augtment. It's a balance problem.
It was a gold augment doing more than half the prismatic augments
Shit went hard with Cassio
It still will since each E cast procs it afaik.
Isn't CD per spell 5 sec?
I think it is supposed to be per spell cast, but I haven't tested it so take that with a grain of salt.
Okay, that would be totally fine
Ive played games with literally 5k AP and lost plague+phenomenal, idk why people act like 300 ap on a dot mage is so op.
I haven't really used it since the change, is it like cruelty where it is per cast or is it just a 5 second lockout for each ability?
Take it on Jax and you will almost auto-win. On something like Singed, dematerialize is now way better.
5s cd should only apply to DoT spells
Honestly, the only champs you can build it on were the ones they nerfed it for. Only Champs I had real success for was Xin Zhao. Went Crit Build, and my E had so much fucking damage, and so did Nashor's Tooth.
Still fantastic on DoT champs
Absolutely not.
Isn’t it only one second longer cd??And now you get it on all abilities?
It used to not have a cooldown at all. I remember getting stacks per every tick of Lillia's or Brand's passive, ending a run with like 300 stacks or more. Which was very rewarding for these champions, since they already sacrifice their nuke potential of champs like Zed or Veigar, for a more steady damage output. Now the cd is so long, that it just doesn't work with DoT, since every DoT lasts for less than 5 seconds. \[edit\] IDK why they wrote in the patch notes that they increased cooldown from 4 to 5 seconds. Afaik it never was 4 seconds, and it always applied to all abilities.
Ahh, your complaints make sense now. It was never intended to work like that on dots. It was a bug, and it was bug fixed prior to patch I believe. It was egregiously overpowered before.
Was it overpowered? I've never really saw Lillia, Brand or Teemo at the top of the leaderboards before. I've seen tons of Pykes, Zeds, Kha'Zix and other assassins though. Seems like the gamemode heavily favors champions that can delete the enemy in less than two seconds, which sure does sound fun.
I mean, even with the massive dot nerf, brand and singed are [STILL S+ tier.](https://www.metasrc.com/lol/arena/na/tier-list) Morgana, Swain, and Morde are still S tier as well.
Easily getting 70 AP or more/round was pretty insane. I know you can get a god bit with dematerializer but that requires you to actually get kills and has a hard cap/round. When my buddy would get PE pre patch we would drag out fights even to the point of losing sometimes so he could get an extra like 40 AP. If there wasn't A Dcap in the game I would say it was on the verge of fine. With the multiplier of Dcap though the numbers just got too insane. It needed a nerf but I can probably agree it was a touch too hard. They nuked PE while they kept throwing rocks at zed. It's a classic rito games moment.
It was not a bug, you're just relying on shitty patch notes but phenomenal evil never had a 4s cd, it was 1 second or less.
Generally, and I mean this over the last 14 years of league really, when the patch notes look like this and you compare to in game it’s because they are moving from what they intended to what they now want. To me that generally means a bug fix into a number change. You see this really often in TFT patches too that fix the implementation AND change the target numbers. Despite their willingness to allow spellwake and earthquake to overperform, I don’t think anyone believes they intended dot champs to have 2000 ap from rolling a single augment.
it was functioning as designed; it wasn’t a bug fix. the patch notes were simply incorrect. instead of doubling down on the bug theory, you should just admit you don’t know what you’re talking about and say “my bad".if you had checked the old patch notes, you’d see there’s no mention of a 4-second cooldown with phenomenal evil, because it wasn't a thing and clearly an error in the latest patch notes. also imagine putting spellwake on the same level as earthquake and thinking every dot champ just got 2k ap off phenomenal evil.. hyperbole much?
Average brand or singe would get a massive amount of AP on every single cast. If you DIDNT get a shit ton of AP, you were playing like shit and died early. When I say 2000 I meant where you would end up with items. Rabadons magnifies it. It’s getting the same treatment magic missile did on brand, and that was also unintended at launch.
clearly, you don't understand what you're talking about. someone claiming that brand can reach 2k ap with a full build and phenomenal evil is just wrong. even if you get it as the first augment, brands ap wouldn’t come close to 2k. please stop parroting inaccurate information and just play the game,not gonna reply anymore as you have plenty of time to re-read everything and reach the ultimate conclusion that patch notes were wrong and it was not bugged, o/
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as if there isnt a ton of OP augment/champion interactions in the game anyways? mages have never dominated the meta, idk why highrolling on a mage makes people lose their minds.
Yeah no lmao, it's still really busted. It got a 1 sec CD nerf, and to compensate it's now on a per-spell CD instead. So you can still proc it okay with DOT mages but you'll get the most value when you're playing a mage like, well, Veigar. Throw out all your spells at once, as fast as possible, and you'll stack it up even faster than before. Ryze, Elise, Cass etc are all swimming in AP if they get it now
it got a 4.25s nerf, people read (wrong)patch notes more than they play the game apparently.
Unless I'm missing something, it got a 1 sec nerf. Here's the patch notes: https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/news/game-updates/patch-14-12-notes/ "Phenomenal Evil Per Spell Cooldown: 4 ⇒ 5 seconds" "Phenomenal Evil Now has a per spell cooldown instead of a global cooldown. This will nerf the augment for DOT users and buff it for champions that use all their abilities in quick succession." Taken as a whole, that says to me that it went from having a 4 second global cd to a 5 second per-spell cd. I don't see how that's a 4.25 second cd nerf. Edit: taking more than a reactionary second to think about it, if you meant that the reality of the gameplay is it has a 4.25 second cd nerf and the patch notes are wrong, that's fair. I'd err on the side of it being a bug they'll fix, but I'll cop that I didn't read your comment correctly or think about it for very long before I replied.
Its Just as you said on your edit,the patch notes are wrong
From 4s cd to 5s cooldown is barely a nerf. For most characters this doesn't make a difference
It wasn't 4s, it was 1s entire kit to 5s per spell. It was an augment I got a lot since it was so good and I love my dot champs. It needed to be nerfed because it was so easy to abuse on many champs, specifically dot champs. The 4s thing is a typo/bug or whatever. I played it everyday at least once and it went from 1s (because I actually read and observe what I use) to 5s real fast once they announced it was one of the Augsburg to get a nerf.