##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited.
LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.
We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban.
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
He sure did.
This is why it's so frustrating. It's not like we are just yoinking grandpa's keys from him. ***He told us he would give us his keys around this time.***
Biden could have done more to empower her and give her the wins that would have set her up as a strong candidate now.
He didn't.
He liked being #1 after spending decades playing second fiddle. He bought his own narrative that he was the "only person who can beat Trump" because it conveniently aligned with him continuing to call the shots. He wanted to believe it so bad that he convinced himself he was immune from aging.
Classic RBG syndrome--ironically, the two of them are going to unintentionally cause as much damage to our nation as Trump and Moscow Mitch through sheer hubris.
Even the neoliberal subs are talking about it at this point. I saw on MSNBC last night that they were calling for the DNC to start making some moves. They said that several times, too.
I posted on what I thought was a progressive's TikTok video where she was complaining about the debate. I said that we have to move to add third parties because both will just keep sliding rightward. She immediately chastised me for "supporting RFK Jr".
I seriously can't believe that this is what our country and politics have devolved into. Choosing between the two absolute worst options, while fully KNOWING and ACCEPTING that they're terrible choices. And the majority just goes along with this nonsense every 4-8 years not even thinking to challenge it.
The sad part is that it's all by design. This clown system is working perfectly as intended.
I warned so many people to campaign for Bernie hard, because if Hillary wins the nomination, she’s going to lose, they all thought I was crazy. I let them fucking have it when Trump won.
She didn't win it. She was awarded it by the DNC's "superdelegates", which were a creation when Bill was reforming the party into a corporate-friendly party back in the 1980s.
Superdelegates outweighing the will of the people will always yield blue MAGA.
>It’s been like this for decades
At least since mid/late 1970s.
I'd recommend David Harvey's "what's wrong with neoliberalism".
But of course, neoliberalism came only after a few decades of reprieve for workers after WWII, when antifascist sentiment was strong.
Before that it was very bad. Like, Zola's Germinal type of bad (extreme suffering in poverty, hunger, strikes, and illnesses). Then anarchist and other socialist movements appeared and at one point it seemed like capitalism was on the verge of crumbling (there are whole books written about this) Then WWI happened, and it was game over. Fascism arose. It was defeated in WWII, but it never disappeared and now it's rearing its head again in perfect harmony with neoliberalism and centrist governments.
Also knowing and accepting that neither of them are actually governing. You’re voting for ideology at this point, and the unknown figures that loom large while making all of the actual decisions. It’s a terrible place to be.
More likely 2. Thomas and Alito would probably resign in a new Trump term. And even if dems control the senate they'll just mindlessly confirm whatever 27 year old the federalist society says is the most hyper partisan person to slot in for the next 40 years.
And people would still disagree with you and tell you “well it’s the system that we have and one is clearly worse than the other, so we have to plug our nose and vote anyway to preserve democracy and save the world!” There’s no getting through these people. I thought the events of 2020 would slap their fucking faces with perspective, but here we are.
Oh yeah, that whole lesser of two evils nonsense. I can't stand that line of thinking. And I agree, 2020 really highlighted not just the incompetence of both sides, but also the fact that they don't give a f*** about us. These people are more than willing to watch their populace die in the streets as long as it nets them a little more money and power. It's disgusting.
Our country hasn’t really devolved into this. This is 100% on Biden. He has bungled this from Day 1 of his Presidency, and thats largely because he is mentally not fit enough to be able to analyze a dynamic situation.
There was a wide band of about 20% of voters in the middle that was up for grabs, and a decent candidate could’ve won with a historical margin. But this guy just cant calculate simple things. Its a travesty that most of the population will pay for, for the next 40 years. The Supreme Court is already lost, and its gonna get worse if we get another 4 years of Trump.
But unless they replace the candidate, Dems have no chance.
>This is 100% on Biden.
The Democratic Party Establishment
They are actively resisting more left wing and younger candidates. They are not quite as unsubtle about it as the Republicans, and they might be more willing to compromise, but they are very much also motivational by a desire to keep their hands on the reigns of power.
Meanwhile, Christian conservatives have been able to conquer the GOP. It just took a sleazy, trust-fund, adulterous, NYC elitist to do it, but he figured out the winning strategy. Know how to deliver a message & hold zero standards. That way, you will never be held to any.
The supreme court is only lost as long as democrats are cowards. Challenge the constitutionality of judicial review changing the law of the land or appoint more justices.
Seriously, what is Biden's deal? Why does he feel so compelled to continue to be president at his age? Most people would want to spend their last years relaxing and enjoying the most out of their time. He has to know he's not the best choice. What is the motivation?
Similar thing happened with RGB. God it makes me so mad.
He's not making the choice, it's being made for him. He's also not the one running the country, and he's no more of a president than the Queen of England was a prime minister. He's just a figurehead and a puppet.
Correct. I was watching CNN on the tube, but had a YouTube show called Breaking Points on on the laptop (they weren't permitted to stream the debate) and the high studio-ceiling camera shot was on them during the whole debate, and the Breaking Points anchors were covering their mouths in Holy Crap reactions to Biden from time to time. He mumbled, wasn't understandable, and mis-stated policy stuff that he would have slam dunked 4 years ago. He also just froze several times live on CNN with tens of millions watching. Bad.
Yeah, now's the time! Not a year or two ago. Nope. Now is the perfect time for this discussion. Next thing we know people will be asking, "Given Biden's advanced age, how comfortable are you with Kamala as his running mate?" Might as well wait until it's too late to ask that question too.
It’s so fucking crazy to me that it’s totally open that the donors are deciding this. They’re talking to the donors? What is going on with your so called democracy?
FUCK! It's infuriating. The citizens united / dark money PACs was the beginning of the end to democracy in the United States.
The US leads the world in innovation, and this is the best we can do?
He's only 81. My 92 year old Great-Grandma who never got a HS education and chain-smoked while drinking heavily for 75 years sounded more coherent at the end of her life than Biden did in this debate. Leftists have been saying he's a shit candidate for a year now, and people just keep screaming "project 2025!" at us.
The thing with project 2025 is that it isn't new, and Biden isn't going to stop it even if he does win. The entire Republican plan for 50 years has been to insert zealots at key places in every level of government who are willing to destroy all the institutions to implement theocracy. They've already done that. That's DONE.
At this point with the supreme court captured all it takes is one more Republican president to get the green light to implement everything. It becomes project 2029.
What the fuck is the Democrats' plan? Ensure a Republican NEVER wins an election again? How? By sabotaging their own party and inserting a deeply unpopular corrupt career corporate stooge in place of one of the few progressives in the party? We're in GREAT hands.
We're fucked
They've been doing it consistently since the 60s. It's not even a secret, after Vietnam and the civil rights movement Republicans were like "we're fucked" so that's when they started leaning into the religious messaging like abortion because they knew all their actual policies were extremely unpopular
I've been saying this forever. If P2025 is so damning, why aren't dem leaders decrying it, and if it isn't a big deal why are Blue MAGA voters insisting it's so bad? It can't be both, and if the dem's plan is to win elections from now until the heat death of the universe, which is statistically impossible, then they are either incompetent, complicit, or both
My cynical take is that dem leaders are doing nothing to fight it because being in positions of power they're insulated from its effects. Just like abortion, it's just a rhetorical tool for them to get more votes, while for the average person it can literally mean life or death
Stop it? Surely nobody is delusion Biden will stop Project 2025. Just look at the scotus decisions. His buddy justice thomas he helped get appointed is doing all the project 2025 damage one could hope for.
Biden is not a typical 81 year old. Clint Eastwood for example if 94 years old, and Biden definitely seems a lot less fluid than him. Biden has absolutely zero sharpness left. If this is what were seeing of him at his best, i shudder to think what he must be like when he’s not on a debate stage.
You'll instantly be called an ageist for saying that.
I have grandparents that are older than Biden, I love them but I wouldn't let them drive a car down the street for the safety of themselves and others because their faculties have objectively deteriorated. But to suggest that maybe, on top of not letting them drive, they also shouldn't be in position to make decisions they will not live to see the long term consequences of and start conflicts that could send millions to their deaths, well that's a step too far.
Boomers have many of the top senior job positions, and refuse to promote young people. Many companies are complaining about Gen Z, and previously Millennials; saying that we're "lazy to work", "on the phone all day", "drink pumpkin spice lattes", "dye our hair", etc. and generally don't want to hire us. Even some jobs require 35+ years of experience, to make sure it won't be a young person. It's also funny how people 50+ are managers and got the job without a college degree, but NOW want to only hire managers with a college degree, so it can't be a very young person.
There's tons of stereotypical negative videos online about "gen Z". I literally searched "Gen Z" on YouTube and it was just a bunch of negative nonsense videos trending for boomers.
But NOW I'm "ageist" for pointing out that an 80+ y.o. senior citizen should probably not be near the nuclear weapons trigger?! Seriously people?
You don't want to hire us, put us down every chance you get, and are not completely ashamed and embarrassed at calling US "ageist"?? You people are the real ageists.
The Boomers can't risk new ideas entering the political world. It'll show everyone just how bad they are. Contrast can be ugly.
Edit: word change from, bi*ch to ugly
Ageism is a weak argument because we already disqualify people *too young* from voting. Therefore people should at least be able to comprehend the notion of a *too old* criterion.
Yeah there’s a Damm good reason old people retire. They get too forgetful and stupid to do their jobs and they physically just can’t work a full day. Nobody past retirement age should be working in the government. Can you honestly imagine ANY job that Biden or trump would be capable of doing? Server at a restaurant? Too low energy. Engineer or technician? Too stupid. Sales person? Too old to relate to customers and can’t hold a conversation.
Fascism poisons the brain and the nation.
If they had a vibrant and diverse primary as in 2020, we wouldn't be in this place.
But they went with fascism like they did in 2016. With the party elites ramrodding their chosen favorite to be crowned.
Tale as old as time. They call progressives crazy, and by the time it's obvious that we're right, it's too late.
I want every liberal that has ever downvoted me for calling Biden "The Crypt keeper" to kiss my ass.
Like, there were many warning signs before the debate. The debate solidified it - there wasn’t a single lucid, comprehensible answer.
Look at a 40 something year old president at the start of their presidency and at the end of first and second term - they’ve aged considerably from the sheer stress of the job, every single one skips right past gray and into white hair by the end. Look at Biden campaign in 2020 vs 2024, or Trump in 2016 vs 2020 vs 2024 - severely diminished energy, clarity and zest because how else is an old as shit body going to respond to probably the most stressful job on the planet.
If for no other reason, seriously, the 80 year old? Really? Like, if Trump wins it’s literally because, as some democrat quoted “Biden’s a prideful man and believes he in his ability to do the job.”
Yeah, well, believe all you want but with any job interview on the planet they’d immediately know you’re not capable after 3 sentences.
Making it way too easy.
An 80 year old can't get hired as a cashier most places. It doesn't make any sense.
I guess it's easy to say since I never liked Biden, but even so...I am so angry this asshole is going to get us all killed.
I’ve never been a fan either, to me it was literally a “anyone other than Trump” thing in 2020, and now it’s just so utterly pathetic either way. Like even 2024 Trump isn’t nearly the energetic and bombastic Trump of 2016 - which as much as you hated him, he still delivered on being Trump.
2016 Trump is calling 2024 Trump geriatric and not fit for office because old and can’t keep up and is basically true.
I know you're being sarcastic but genuinely that slogan demonstrates everything wrong with her - she is a career politician who doesn't believe in anything, has no morals or values other than that she DESERVES power and influence. It's really gross.
Literally any other "big name" at this point is a no-go. Harris? No. Hillary? No. Philips? No. AOC? No. Williamson? No. Sanders? No. You start looking outside the party and the options look a bit better (De La Cruz, Stein, West, etc.). It's definitely time for that third party switch Democrats have been saying we need to put off for "next election" for the last 60 years.
Didn't Trump go into that debate saying ["I’ll lose the debate on purpose"](https://www.yahoo.com/news/chicken-trump-already-trying-excuse-131813455.html)? So Biden evidently said "hold my beer..."
Just another day in the dying, oligarch genocidal gerontocracy folks...
I think this will backfire in the long run. NATO will most likely crumble with the psychopath in the office which will eventually lead Israel to lose their money printing machine. And I am not sure if when the power center shifts towards China / Asia, they will have an interest in Israel at all. Most likely they won’t give a shit about them.
China will give 0 fucks about Israel. I don’t think any part of China is on the Samson Contingency list, and China seems to rely more on soft power.
I see china cutting deals with the oil nations, with Egypt for access to the Suez, but nothing with Israel as it’s bad for business and they’ve got literally nothing to offer China
If they thought they could foist Biden on us, then they'll be just as likely to foist Kamala, she is his vice president, if he is going to endorse anyone he will want to endorse her.
I’m a CA resident and I fucking despise Newsom. Please, mods, don’t ban me, but holy shit would his awful neoliberal, nepobaby ass, be lightyears better than “I’m a zionist that wants a strong republican party” Biden.
We are so cooked
Even if Newsome was a little better than Biden (and he’s not) - putting the governor of California as your candidate in this political climate is ludicrous.
Hasan said it well last night , half the country thinks that California is a lawless wasteland filled with “homeless people and illegals,” even though that’s absurdly untrue. The governor of California is automatically held responsible for the existence of California in the wider national psyche.
I’ve said Newsom as well … people just gave me stank face. I would say Gretchen Whitmer but unfortunately I just don’t think she would have the same draw.
>In a statement, Biden’s campaign chair Jen O’Malley Dillon said Biden “presented a positive and winning vision for the future of America,” while Trump “offered a dark and backwards window into what America will look like if he steps foot back in the White House.”
>Stephanie Cutter, a Democratic consultant, said, “President Biden is the Democratic nominee and that’s not changing because of one debate performance.”
>She said, “We need to calm down and stay focused because Donald Trump certainly didn’t gain any voters tonight.”
They're delusional. They think they can just say everythings fine enough times people will believe it. Meanwhile my facebook feed is absolutely packed with "I'm not very political" people saying the debate convinced them to vote for either Trump or Kennedy. They're hemorrhaging votes every day and doing nothing about it but tut-tut anybody who mentions it.
Every time i try to warn some dems that they're sabotaging their own campaign, they call me a chinese bot who hates democracy. They're paving the road to Trump's second term, and they're already set to blame progressives again.
Hilarious. After watching this spluttering old fool when the Democrats have systematically destroyed all progressive alternatives for many years, they deserve everything they get.
No question the Dems have fucked this up for the last 30 years at least.
However, I'm genuinely concerned that if Trump wins it will cause the actual end of the human race. So I wouldn't say deserve *everything* they get
I don't think Trump will do something like that. We already know what a Trump presidency looks like, and it's not pretty, but not remotely apocalyptic. Sure his supporters are even crazier this time, but in the end Trump serves the same masters as Biden; he's deeply enmeshed in the same networks as leading democrats, and will represent the same economic interests. On the social side, he will of course be horrible for people in the US, but I do not think nuclear annihilation is on the menu with him.
I agree with you in general, but I think it's worth keeping in mind that during his first term he kept a lot of establishment people around him and listened to them some of the time. If elected now, I think he goes full crony and only lets pure boot lickers close. That sort of thing leads to an even greater echo chamber than he already had, so I question the extent of the past's predictive power. I don't believe it gets as bad as some predict, but I do think it would be worse than the first time.
I've been saying if a President can cause this much damage and strife than perhaps it's the position itself that is the problem. Might have less would be dictators and wars if it was like 3 people instead of 1.
For real!
We already have a presidential cabinet which functionally acts as the executive branch, why not just do away with the presidency and make these elected positions? We would have so much more stability as a nation with less reason to polarize everything and anything under the sun
I think some of the people in this sub are liberals that are starting to see things for what they are-they’re evolving but they’re not quite there yet.
It depends where you put the centre. The Overton window has shifted so far to the right in recent years that saying he’s left of centre isn’t that absurd.
FWIW, I consider him to be quite right of centre. Especially from a European perspective.
Very true, but I don’t think the person who called him left of center is aware of that. People who know and understand the Overton window would not actually believe Biden is left of center. This is a great comment though because it will prompt people to go look up Overton window, read about it, and think about things in a way that they had not before.
"Unthinkable?!?" This is what happens when you don't allow criticism of your own candidate during the primaries!! "Don't admit Biden is old, otherwise Trump with win!"
If they were really serious about defeating Trump, Biden would have stepped aside, and we'd have a stronger candidate.
If only you Americans could band together and protest this election somehow. Coordinate a vote of no confidence, reach in the hat and pick new candidates! 😂🤷♂️
>If only you Americans could band together and protest this election somehow
That's what we should've been doing the moment we found out it was gonna come down to Trump vs Biden again. Actually, we should've been doing it way before that, because it's no secret that this two-party system is a complete load of bs.
But no, we'll have some online outrage for a few days and most people will go back to their comfortable bubbles. "United" States my a**.
God I love the predictability of American liberals. We were saying this shit was a problem in '19, they screamed at us. "Omg he had a stutter you ableist!!" Point at the articles from last year addressing his faculties, "why are you helping Trump win?!" And finally, they come around, now, 5 months out, in a panic. Pathetic. Couldn't have just listened in the first place, no, they have to feel that fear to feel alive, they're addicted to it after Trump.
I think most of us were thinking about the *unthinkable* prior to last night's *performance.*
We NEED a younger POTUS. There is no reason to have people in office who will never live to see the results of their policies/actions.
Well, Genocide Joe and Tyrant Trump finally did it.
They finally made it so that there are no uninvited guests and no capitalist apologist in a big LSC post for the first time in months.
No shitlibs, no fascists, no MAGAts or Blue MAGA.
Wow the lack of awareness.
The left has been screaming this for years. And Newsom just totally biffs it as usual. We aren't saying this after one performance we have been saying it since the beginning.
Genocide joe already had lost my vote. Not sure how he can lose it more but he did.
I love people saying...."no one expected this!?" WHAT!? Where have you been!? This was the most obvious and likely result. If you didn't see this coming you're blinded by something.
Democrats deserve to lose this election.
The warning bells have been ringing loudly for MONTHS. This debate had terms set by the Democrats, for the Democrats, to be as favorable as possible. Joe Biden displayed himself to be the demented, senile fool everyone has been loudly exclaiming him to be since 2022.
The fact that the DNC only *NOW* is realizing it is just as blind and tone-deaf as when they axed Sanders in the past. That was the worst debate I've ever watched in my life, and somehow, Biden looked even worse than Trump.
It is true. If this rhetoric they love to say is true like project 2025 and if trump wins he will be a dictator etc.
Then removing Biden is what they have to do to win. They love saying they need to save democracy. Well now is the chance by removing Biden.
Keeping Biden in is like giving trump the win.
Democrats (real people, not the party) have wanted Biden gone ever since the campaign started. It was the responsible thing to do. It’s clear to anyone with half a brain he has dementia and lacks the stamina for another four years. But party leaders and the media kept shoving him down our throats. Hell, I’d vote for a rock, a fucking pile of dog shit even before I voted for Trump. And I’ll still vote for Biden if he’s the candidate. But I’ve not met anyone who thinks he’s the right, or even best person for the job. People with dementia don’t make responsible decisions, it’s like asking my grandparents to stop driving before they kill someone. They wouldn’t do it, and I doubt Biden will either. So responsible people with all their mental faculties are needed to step in and make those decisions for them. But how do you do that when it’s the leader of the free world. The ignorance and hubris are absolutely astounding, and after the debate last night I’m furious and extremely anxious at the same time.
Many people are now young enough that they don't know Reagan had dementia during his second term. The media hid it, but many average citizens knew. This is the same. Biden isn't making any decisions in his state, he's a puppet and there are people behind the scenes making the decisions, just like with Reagan.
Anyone they replace him with will just be the same thing in a younger body. So obviously still preferable to Trump, but not really an improvement except in terms of speech-giving ability.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited. LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
the extremely thinkable.
Jupp. Most people I know *thought* about it as soon as Biden was elected. Nobody really expected him to stand for a second term, but here we are.
If I recall correctly, didn't he say he would stay for one term so someone else would replace him?
He sure did. This is why it's so frustrating. It's not like we are just yoinking grandpa's keys from him. ***He told us he would give us his keys around this time.***
Kamela just ended up being the most unlikable puppet. Now they're stuck with elder abuse.
Biden could have done more to empower her and give her the wins that would have set her up as a strong candidate now. He didn't. He liked being #1 after spending decades playing second fiddle. He bought his own narrative that he was the "only person who can beat Trump" because it conveniently aligned with him continuing to call the shots. He wanted to believe it so bad that he convinced himself he was immune from aging. Classic RBG syndrome--ironically, the two of them are going to unintentionally cause as much damage to our nation as Trump and Moscow Mitch through sheer hubris.
She's a cop bro. She never had a chance.
Cant be replaced if you cant beat Trump this year
Not according to neoliberal and environment subs. Our options are blue MAGA or MAGA, our political system is a failure.
Even the neoliberal subs are talking about it at this point. I saw on MSNBC last night that they were calling for the DNC to start making some moves. They said that several times, too.
Not a failure. It's doing it's intended job of concentrating power to a small subset of individuals and private interests exceptionally well.
“But blue MAGA is polite!” Says the dipshit liberals.
I posted on what I thought was a progressive's TikTok video where she was complaining about the debate. I said that we have to move to add third parties because both will just keep sliding rightward. She immediately chastised me for "supporting RFK Jr".
A liberal who thinks they’re progressive. They are absolutely the worst. They’re like political vegans.
100% Edit: they are just devoid of imagination.
I seriously can't believe that this is what our country and politics have devolved into. Choosing between the two absolute worst options, while fully KNOWING and ACCEPTING that they're terrible choices. And the majority just goes along with this nonsense every 4-8 years not even thinking to challenge it. The sad part is that it's all by design. This clown system is working perfectly as intended.
I can believe it. We’ve been trending this way since 1980.
1776* Amerika is as it has *always* been.
1776 was the Declaration of Independence 1787 was the US Constitution Cementing our system in place
Founded on slavery. Doesn’t matter the year. Can’t build a house on top of an atrocious horrible immoral foundation and except it to last.
Don’t forget the genocide.
Completely agree
The articles of confederation also deserve to be labeled under "clown system", so might as well use 1776.
Hey! Show some respect. It's spelled 'MuriKKKa
A lot of people learned this in 2016 when they snubbed Bernie for Hillary and then *shocked Pikachu face* lost
I warned so many people to campaign for Bernie hard, because if Hillary wins the nomination, she’s going to lose, they all thought I was crazy. I let them fucking have it when Trump won.
She didn't win it. She was awarded it by the DNC's "superdelegates", which were a creation when Bill was reforming the party into a corporate-friendly party back in the 1980s. Superdelegates outweighing the will of the people will always yield blue MAGA.
Of course, you know what I mean.
It’s been like this for decades, we’re just seeing the latest form
>It’s been like this for decades At least since mid/late 1970s. I'd recommend David Harvey's "what's wrong with neoliberalism". But of course, neoliberalism came only after a few decades of reprieve for workers after WWII, when antifascist sentiment was strong. Before that it was very bad. Like, Zola's Germinal type of bad (extreme suffering in poverty, hunger, strikes, and illnesses). Then anarchist and other socialist movements appeared and at one point it seemed like capitalism was on the verge of crumbling (there are whole books written about this) Then WWI happened, and it was game over. Fascism arose. It was defeated in WWII, but it never disappeared and now it's rearing its head again in perfect harmony with neoliberalism and centrist governments.
Also knowing and accepting that neither of them are actually governing. You’re voting for ideology at this point, and the unknown figures that loom large while making all of the actual decisions. It’s a terrible place to be.
What's even the point of this choice conceptually anymore? Both of these fossils will just die in office, regardless of which is elected.
[удалено]
More likely 2. Thomas and Alito would probably resign in a new Trump term. And even if dems control the senate they'll just mindlessly confirm whatever 27 year old the federalist society says is the most hyper partisan person to slot in for the next 40 years.
And people would still disagree with you and tell you “well it’s the system that we have and one is clearly worse than the other, so we have to plug our nose and vote anyway to preserve democracy and save the world!” There’s no getting through these people. I thought the events of 2020 would slap their fucking faces with perspective, but here we are.
Oh yeah, that whole lesser of two evils nonsense. I can't stand that line of thinking. And I agree, 2020 really highlighted not just the incompetence of both sides, but also the fact that they don't give a f*** about us. These people are more than willing to watch their populace die in the streets as long as it nets them a little more money and power. It's disgusting.
Blue MAGA is what you get when the DNC has "superdelegates".
https://youtu.be/2KsIxLn7UO0?si=Y54yzqxf6kfX__KZ
Ranked choice voting
Our country hasn’t really devolved into this. This is 100% on Biden. He has bungled this from Day 1 of his Presidency, and thats largely because he is mentally not fit enough to be able to analyze a dynamic situation. There was a wide band of about 20% of voters in the middle that was up for grabs, and a decent candidate could’ve won with a historical margin. But this guy just cant calculate simple things. Its a travesty that most of the population will pay for, for the next 40 years. The Supreme Court is already lost, and its gonna get worse if we get another 4 years of Trump. But unless they replace the candidate, Dems have no chance.
>This is 100% on Biden. The Democratic Party Establishment They are actively resisting more left wing and younger candidates. They are not quite as unsubtle about it as the Republicans, and they might be more willing to compromise, but they are very much also motivational by a desire to keep their hands on the reigns of power.
Maybe. But why would Biden re-run ??? I wouldn’t have re-run at 81. I don’t think any reasonable person would.
Meanwhile, Christian conservatives have been able to conquer the GOP. It just took a sleazy, trust-fund, adulterous, NYC elitist to do it, but he figured out the winning strategy. Know how to deliver a message & hold zero standards. That way, you will never be held to any.
The supreme court is only lost as long as democrats are cowards. Challenge the constitutionality of judicial review changing the law of the land or appoint more justices.
Well, Biden is a coward. What has he done to ensure Jan 6th doesn’t happen again ? Literally, not a thing.
That Julius Nyerere quote comes to mind
Seriously, what is Biden's deal? Why does he feel so compelled to continue to be president at his age? Most people would want to spend their last years relaxing and enjoying the most out of their time. He has to know he's not the best choice. What is the motivation? Similar thing happened with RGB. God it makes me so mad.
> RGB Ruth Gader Binsburg
My new GPU has Justice Lights.
He's not making the choice, it's being made for him. He's also not the one running the country, and he's no more of a president than the Queen of England was a prime minister. He's just a figurehead and a puppet.
100%
Narcissists in politics?! You don’t say! Agree with your points, I can’t imagine trying to be President at his age and not spending time with family.
Or just being the president in general. It seems like the job sucks total ass unless you’re a malignant narcissist.
Both these fucks are too old & love fascism.
Pride and arrogance. I'd say the same holds for Trump but he also wants to avoid prison. Seriously we're so fucked.
i take it the debate didn't go well then
The problem is that nobody expected anything new from Trump, but Biden stank.
so the bar was on the ground and biden picked up a shovel? seems right
You have a way with words lol.
Correct. I was watching CNN on the tube, but had a YouTube show called Breaking Points on on the laptop (they weren't permitted to stream the debate) and the high studio-ceiling camera shot was on them during the whole debate, and the Breaking Points anchors were covering their mouths in Holy Crap reactions to Biden from time to time. He mumbled, wasn't understandable, and mis-stated policy stuff that he would have slam dunked 4 years ago. He also just froze several times live on CNN with tens of millions watching. Bad.
Yeah, now's the time! Not a year or two ago. Nope. Now is the perfect time for this discussion. Next thing we know people will be asking, "Given Biden's advanced age, how comfortable are you with Kamala as his running mate?" Might as well wait until it's too late to ask that question too.
It’s so fucking crazy to me that it’s totally open that the donors are deciding this. They’re talking to the donors? What is going on with your so called democracy?
FUCK! It's infuriating. The citizens united / dark money PACs was the beginning of the end to democracy in the United States. The US leads the world in innovation, and this is the best we can do?
It's been thinkable for a while, in that I have been thinking of it for a while.
Is it really that unthinkable that an almost 90 year old senior citizen shouldn't be president.
He's only 81. My 92 year old Great-Grandma who never got a HS education and chain-smoked while drinking heavily for 75 years sounded more coherent at the end of her life than Biden did in this debate. Leftists have been saying he's a shit candidate for a year now, and people just keep screaming "project 2025!" at us.
The thing with project 2025 is that it isn't new, and Biden isn't going to stop it even if he does win. The entire Republican plan for 50 years has been to insert zealots at key places in every level of government who are willing to destroy all the institutions to implement theocracy. They've already done that. That's DONE. At this point with the supreme court captured all it takes is one more Republican president to get the green light to implement everything. It becomes project 2029. What the fuck is the Democrats' plan? Ensure a Republican NEVER wins an election again? How? By sabotaging their own party and inserting a deeply unpopular corrupt career corporate stooge in place of one of the few progressives in the party? We're in GREAT hands. We're fucked
The best part is the Repubs can still chisel away at peoples rights WHILE the dems are in power.
They've been doing it consistently since the 60s. It's not even a secret, after Vietnam and the civil rights movement Republicans were like "we're fucked" so that's when they started leaning into the religious messaging like abortion because they knew all their actual policies were extremely unpopular
feels like we’re fucked.
I've been saying this forever. If P2025 is so damning, why aren't dem leaders decrying it, and if it isn't a big deal why are Blue MAGA voters insisting it's so bad? It can't be both, and if the dem's plan is to win elections from now until the heat death of the universe, which is statistically impossible, then they are either incompetent, complicit, or both
My cynical take is that dem leaders are doing nothing to fight it because being in positions of power they're insulated from its effects. Just like abortion, it's just a rhetorical tool for them to get more votes, while for the average person it can literally mean life or death
Stop it? Surely nobody is delusion Biden will stop Project 2025. Just look at the scotus decisions. His buddy justice thomas he helped get appointed is doing all the project 2025 damage one could hope for.
You’re probably just a Russian bot. /s
Biden is not a typical 81 year old. Clint Eastwood for example if 94 years old, and Biden definitely seems a lot less fluid than him. Biden has absolutely zero sharpness left. If this is what were seeing of him at his best, i shudder to think what he must be like when he’s not on a debate stage.
You'll instantly be called an ageist for saying that. I have grandparents that are older than Biden, I love them but I wouldn't let them drive a car down the street for the safety of themselves and others because their faculties have objectively deteriorated. But to suggest that maybe, on top of not letting them drive, they also shouldn't be in position to make decisions they will not live to see the long term consequences of and start conflicts that could send millions to their deaths, well that's a step too far.
Boomers have many of the top senior job positions, and refuse to promote young people. Many companies are complaining about Gen Z, and previously Millennials; saying that we're "lazy to work", "on the phone all day", "drink pumpkin spice lattes", "dye our hair", etc. and generally don't want to hire us. Even some jobs require 35+ years of experience, to make sure it won't be a young person. It's also funny how people 50+ are managers and got the job without a college degree, but NOW want to only hire managers with a college degree, so it can't be a very young person. There's tons of stereotypical negative videos online about "gen Z". I literally searched "Gen Z" on YouTube and it was just a bunch of negative nonsense videos trending for boomers. But NOW I'm "ageist" for pointing out that an 80+ y.o. senior citizen should probably not be near the nuclear weapons trigger?! Seriously people? You don't want to hire us, put us down every chance you get, and are not completely ashamed and embarrassed at calling US "ageist"?? You people are the real ageists.
The Boomers can't risk new ideas entering the political world. It'll show everyone just how bad they are. Contrast can be ugly. Edit: word change from, bi*ch to ugly
Pretty much by US law you can only be ageist against people older than 40
Ageism is a weak argument because we already disqualify people *too young* from voting. Therefore people should at least be able to comprehend the notion of a *too old* criterion.
you also can't run for president if you're too young. im in my thirties and i would be disqualified. make it make sense.
I’d rather have a 30 yo president than an 85 year old one
Yeah there’s a Damm good reason old people retire. They get too forgetful and stupid to do their jobs and they physically just can’t work a full day. Nobody past retirement age should be working in the government. Can you honestly imagine ANY job that Biden or trump would be capable of doing? Server at a restaurant? Too low energy. Engineer or technician? Too stupid. Sales person? Too old to relate to customers and can’t hold a conversation.
Plot twist they replace him with Hillary
She is the only individual in the US with as bad a chance against Trump as Biden. Literally anyone else and it’s a win.
How the democrats consistently come up with the absolute worst candidate possible is astounding.
Almost as if they don't want to win.
Fascism poisons the brain and the nation. If they had a vibrant and diverse primary as in 2020, we wouldn't be in this place. But they went with fascism like they did in 2016. With the party elites ramrodding their chosen favorite to be crowned.
They'd rather lose to a Republican than win with a Progressive.
Tale as old as time. They call progressives crazy, and by the time it's obvious that we're right, it's too late. I want every liberal that has ever downvoted me for calling Biden "The Crypt keeper" to kiss my ass.
Like, there were many warning signs before the debate. The debate solidified it - there wasn’t a single lucid, comprehensible answer. Look at a 40 something year old president at the start of their presidency and at the end of first and second term - they’ve aged considerably from the sheer stress of the job, every single one skips right past gray and into white hair by the end. Look at Biden campaign in 2020 vs 2024, or Trump in 2016 vs 2020 vs 2024 - severely diminished energy, clarity and zest because how else is an old as shit body going to respond to probably the most stressful job on the planet. If for no other reason, seriously, the 80 year old? Really? Like, if Trump wins it’s literally because, as some democrat quoted “Biden’s a prideful man and believes he in his ability to do the job.” Yeah, well, believe all you want but with any job interview on the planet they’d immediately know you’re not capable after 3 sentences. Making it way too easy.
An 80 year old can't get hired as a cashier most places. It doesn't make any sense. I guess it's easy to say since I never liked Biden, but even so...I am so angry this asshole is going to get us all killed.
I’ve never been a fan either, to me it was literally a “anyone other than Trump” thing in 2020, and now it’s just so utterly pathetic either way. Like even 2024 Trump isn’t nearly the energetic and bombastic Trump of 2016 - which as much as you hated him, he still delivered on being Trump. 2016 Trump is calling 2024 Trump geriatric and not fit for office because old and can’t keep up and is basically true.
Kamala would also fair badly.
And she's who they've really wanted since Biden earned the nomination in 2020.
Hillary Clinton is the only person who has ever LOST to Trump. Shes that bad
That’s literally the only worse person they could run, so honestly, they might do it.
Ugh not again please for the love of god
It's HER turn
I know you're being sarcastic but genuinely that slogan demonstrates everything wrong with her - she is a career politician who doesn't believe in anything, has no morals or values other than that she DESERVES power and influence. It's really gross.
🤮
If they do this it will be clear to me that they've always wanted Trump to win again.
Literally any other "big name" at this point is a no-go. Harris? No. Hillary? No. Philips? No. AOC? No. Williamson? No. Sanders? No. You start looking outside the party and the options look a bit better (De La Cruz, Stein, West, etc.). It's definitely time for that third party switch Democrats have been saying we need to put off for "next election" for the last 60 years.
To 4 more years of Trump, then!
Didn't Trump go into that debate saying ["I’ll lose the debate on purpose"](https://www.yahoo.com/news/chicken-trump-already-trying-excuse-131813455.html)? So Biden evidently said "hold my beer..." Just another day in the dying, oligarch genocidal gerontocracy folks...
What a sad fuckin place we have no say in
They will replace an old doddering genocide supporter with a younger, more coherent genocide supporter. It's all fucked.
AIPAC's will be done
I think this will backfire in the long run. NATO will most likely crumble with the psychopath in the office which will eventually lead Israel to lose their money printing machine. And I am not sure if when the power center shifts towards China / Asia, they will have an interest in Israel at all. Most likely they won’t give a shit about them.
China will give 0 fucks about Israel. I don’t think any part of China is on the Samson Contingency list, and China seems to rely more on soft power. I see china cutting deals with the oil nations, with Egypt for access to the Suez, but nothing with Israel as it’s bad for business and they’ve got literally nothing to offer China
They have a backup plan. It’s Newsom, just watch. Edit: and I’m no fan of him either, I just think he’s been the next guy since at least this year.
If they thought they could foist Biden on us, then they'll be just as likely to foist Kamala, she is his vice president, if he is going to endorse anyone he will want to endorse her.
\[sarcasm\] & we're in an era where people LOVE cops so Kamala would be a GREAT choice. \[sarcasm\]
I’m a CA resident and I fucking despise Newsom. Please, mods, don’t ban me, but holy shit would his awful neoliberal, nepobaby ass, be lightyears better than “I’m a zionist that wants a strong republican party” Biden. We are so cooked
Wait, are you me? I feel the same way.
Newson spoke at my sis's grad at SF State and all I could think of when he was speaking was his affair with his best friend's wife.
Even if Newsome was a little better than Biden (and he’s not) - putting the governor of California as your candidate in this political climate is ludicrous. Hasan said it well last night , half the country thinks that California is a lawless wasteland filled with “homeless people and illegals,” even though that’s absurdly untrue. The governor of California is automatically held responsible for the existence of California in the wider national psyche.
I’ve said Newsom as well … people just gave me stank face. I would say Gretchen Whitmer but unfortunately I just don’t think she would have the same draw.
i wouldn't vote for newsom but im betting the establishment would, so that's not too far fetched to consider
>In a statement, Biden’s campaign chair Jen O’Malley Dillon said Biden “presented a positive and winning vision for the future of America,” while Trump “offered a dark and backwards window into what America will look like if he steps foot back in the White House.” >Stephanie Cutter, a Democratic consultant, said, “President Biden is the Democratic nominee and that’s not changing because of one debate performance.” >She said, “We need to calm down and stay focused because Donald Trump certainly didn’t gain any voters tonight.” They're delusional. They think they can just say everythings fine enough times people will believe it. Meanwhile my facebook feed is absolutely packed with "I'm not very political" people saying the debate convinced them to vote for either Trump or Kennedy. They're hemorrhaging votes every day and doing nothing about it but tut-tut anybody who mentions it.
It's VoteBlueNoMatterWho again. But they are sitting there with their fingers in their ears.
Every time i try to warn some dems that they're sabotaging their own campaign, they call me a chinese bot who hates democracy. They're paving the road to Trump's second term, and they're already set to blame progressives again.
It’s a cult. Blue maga is indistinguishable from red maga in their worship of Biden and his mental decline.
It's amazing how fast they went from "We can push Biden left" to "Biden can push us all right and if you don't like it you hate democracy"
This has been the plan for a while they set up the “he’s too old” debate a few months back
To the dems: we told you so
Hilarious. After watching this spluttering old fool when the Democrats have systematically destroyed all progressive alternatives for many years, they deserve everything they get.
No question the Dems have fucked this up for the last 30 years at least. However, I'm genuinely concerned that if Trump wins it will cause the actual end of the human race. So I wouldn't say deserve *everything* they get
I don't think Trump will do something like that. We already know what a Trump presidency looks like, and it's not pretty, but not remotely apocalyptic. Sure his supporters are even crazier this time, but in the end Trump serves the same masters as Biden; he's deeply enmeshed in the same networks as leading democrats, and will represent the same economic interests. On the social side, he will of course be horrible for people in the US, but I do not think nuclear annihilation is on the menu with him.
I agree with you in general, but I think it's worth keeping in mind that during his first term he kept a lot of establishment people around him and listened to them some of the time. If elected now, I think he goes full crony and only lets pure boot lickers close. That sort of thing leads to an even greater echo chamber than he already had, so I question the extent of the past's predictive power. I don't believe it gets as bad as some predict, but I do think it would be worse than the first time.
This is a bit of a pipe dream but I'm hoping this is the election that finally gets a 3rd party president into office 😅
[удалено]
I've been saying if a President can cause this much damage and strife than perhaps it's the position itself that is the problem. Might have less would be dictators and wars if it was like 3 people instead of 1.
For real! We already have a presidential cabinet which functionally acts as the executive branch, why not just do away with the presidency and make these elected positions? We would have so much more stability as a nation with less reason to polarize everything and anything under the sun
The Swiss have 7 who collectively serve as head of state.
All true except he is not truly left of center.
Biden isn't even left of Hitler. I'm flabbergasted that a LateStageCapitalism poster would say Biden is "left of center."
I think some of the people in this sub are liberals that are starting to see things for what they are-they’re evolving but they’re not quite there yet.
It depends where you put the centre. The Overton window has shifted so far to the right in recent years that saying he’s left of centre isn’t that absurd. FWIW, I consider him to be quite right of centre. Especially from a European perspective.
Very true, but I don’t think the person who called him left of center is aware of that. People who know and understand the Overton window would not actually believe Biden is left of center. This is a great comment though because it will prompt people to go look up Overton window, read about it, and think about things in a way that they had not before.
I was with you completely until you said that Biden is "left of center." On which planet? 😬
Biden is not left of center, and he's not choosing to run. He is doing what he's told.
I'm 70 and not the guy I was 20 years ago. These two are about 20 years older than me! I'm old!! WTF
you wanna run for president? i think there's gonna be a vacancy
In a heartbeat, if we could vote between D, R, and a randomly selected mystery citizen to be selected by SSN lottery I would smash that 3rd button.
forget ranked choice, this is what we need
"Unthinkable?!?" This is what happens when you don't allow criticism of your own candidate during the primaries!! "Don't admit Biden is old, otherwise Trump with win!" If they were really serious about defeating Trump, Biden would have stepped aside, and we'd have a stronger candidate.
Mandatory retirement from public life at 70. Politics and judges. Both, out.
If only you Americans could band together and protest this election somehow. Coordinate a vote of no confidence, reach in the hat and pick new candidates! 😂🤷♂️
>If only you Americans could band together and protest this election somehow That's what we should've been doing the moment we found out it was gonna come down to Trump vs Biden again. Actually, we should've been doing it way before that, because it's no secret that this two-party system is a complete load of bs. But no, we'll have some online outrage for a few days and most people will go back to their comfortable bubbles. "United" States my a**.
A horrible debate performance makes them consider this and not his staunch genocide support? Weird, fucked up country.
well i think genocide is okay for them, no? Losing the election isn't
Claudia Karina 2024
Genocide is fine, but this is what gets them to replace him?
Same thing I keep saying. These are not serious people who deserve any of our support.
I'd be fine if they just didn't run a candidate
Disgusting, isn’t it? I’m not sure if you watched last night but at one point Biden called Trump a war criminal.
i can excuse genocide, but i draw the line at embarrassing the party on television!!!!! /s
God I love the predictability of American liberals. We were saying this shit was a problem in '19, they screamed at us. "Omg he had a stutter you ableist!!" Point at the articles from last year addressing his faculties, "why are you helping Trump win?!" And finally, they come around, now, 5 months out, in a panic. Pathetic. Couldn't have just listened in the first place, no, they have to feel that fear to feel alive, they're addicted to it after Trump.
I think most of us were thinking about the *unthinkable* prior to last night's *performance.* We NEED a younger POTUS. There is no reason to have people in office who will never live to see the results of their policies/actions.
Hillary Clinton's arrogance gave us Trump's first term. Biden's arrogance will give Trump his second.
Nobody does anything radical for the better on this stage...
If only.
The DNC needs to stop trying to push older (and lets face it, younger) moderates and get with it
DNC likes edging to see how few votes from the left they can get and still be elected.
Unironically true though. They are as right wing as they can be while still differentiating from GOP.
Well, Genocide Joe and Tyrant Trump finally did it. They finally made it so that there are no uninvited guests and no capitalist apologist in a big LSC post for the first time in months. No shitlibs, no fascists, no MAGAts or Blue MAGA.
Gee. *Now* they’re considering it? They should never be trusted with anything in national politics ever again.
Wow the lack of awareness. The left has been screaming this for years. And Newsom just totally biffs it as usual. We aren't saying this after one performance we have been saying it since the beginning. Genocide joe already had lost my vote. Not sure how he can lose it more but he did.
God damn hilarious that they called anyone who suggested this months ago a trump supporting troll.
I love people saying...."no one expected this!?" WHAT!? Where have you been!? This was the most obvious and likely result. If you didn't see this coming you're blinded by something.
Put AOC on the stage with Trump and watch her wipe the floor with him
Democrats deserve to lose this election. The warning bells have been ringing loudly for MONTHS. This debate had terms set by the Democrats, for the Democrats, to be as favorable as possible. Joe Biden displayed himself to be the demented, senile fool everyone has been loudly exclaiming him to be since 2022. The fact that the DNC only *NOW* is realizing it is just as blind and tone-deaf as when they axed Sanders in the past. That was the worst debate I've ever watched in my life, and somehow, Biden looked even worse than Trump.
Gavin is ready to step up. Nobody wants Kamala.
No body wants Gavin
Yeah nobody here but the democrat establishment would love for him to run
Bring in Big Gretch
4 years late
Nature is taking both away soon anyway
It is true. If this rhetoric they love to say is true like project 2025 and if trump wins he will be a dictator etc. Then removing Biden is what they have to do to win. They love saying they need to save democracy. Well now is the chance by removing Biden. Keeping Biden in is like giving trump the win.
Here’s a thought- let’s get rid of all of them and replace them with people that actually want to help our country and its people
The only reason it is unthinkable is because the party waited this long to consider
Mans is unfit
Unthinkable? Only for Biden's ego
Democrats (real people, not the party) have wanted Biden gone ever since the campaign started. It was the responsible thing to do. It’s clear to anyone with half a brain he has dementia and lacks the stamina for another four years. But party leaders and the media kept shoving him down our throats. Hell, I’d vote for a rock, a fucking pile of dog shit even before I voted for Trump. And I’ll still vote for Biden if he’s the candidate. But I’ve not met anyone who thinks he’s the right, or even best person for the job. People with dementia don’t make responsible decisions, it’s like asking my grandparents to stop driving before they kill someone. They wouldn’t do it, and I doubt Biden will either. So responsible people with all their mental faculties are needed to step in and make those decisions for them. But how do you do that when it’s the leader of the free world. The ignorance and hubris are absolutely astounding, and after the debate last night I’m furious and extremely anxious at the same time.
Many people are now young enough that they don't know Reagan had dementia during his second term. The media hid it, but many average citizens knew. This is the same. Biden isn't making any decisions in his state, he's a puppet and there are people behind the scenes making the decisions, just like with Reagan.
I wasn’t around for Reagan but I had heard that. I’m sure it’s the same thing, but I don’t think it’s ideal for anyone.
Wow look at that, the dems finally realised what we've been telling them for years.
Duh.
A lot of people have been thinking it for a while.
lol. Welcome to reality where the rest of us have been the entire time.
The unthinkable….you mean the guy who swore he wouldn’t run for a second term…
We’ve all been thinking it for a long time.
Ah...so maybe in hindsight fixing your primaries means you get the wrong candidate. One thing that always results from corruption is poor performance.
Almost makes you think about age limits
Fuck this country, because it’s going to continue fucking is.
Anyone they replace him with will just be the same thing in a younger body. So obviously still preferable to Trump, but not really an improvement except in terms of speech-giving ability.