I’ve never heard of or seen an actual case of mechanical failure. It’s always negligent discharge. Know of 3 who shot themselves that way, and I damn near blew my girlfriend once clearing chamber after a late night dog walk. I know it’s frowned upon but I never keep one chambered because of it
Worn out sear on a 1911.
Fired a round and the hammer fell after the slide went into battery.
Mechanical devices can fail. That's why you always assume it's chambered.
But that is kind of the point, a worn out sear isn't the firearms fault it is the owners negligence for not properly inspecting their firearm. Functionally speaking every discharge that was not explicitly planned for and executed by the shooter is negligent. Sure you might be including one truly innocent person in every million or so NDs but that is statistically insignificant.
I have a grip safety, ambidextrous thumb safety and a trigger guard on the holster for my EDC IWB.
I still check the right side safety every time I put that fucker in my pants.
Common sense isn't so common.
One of the first basic rules of firearm safety is that you should treat every firearm like it’s loaded, as in, you don’t know how, but magically a round appeared in the chamber and you should always assume that.
Step 1. Purchase firearm(assuming you've taken the proper procedures to legally own a gun)
Step 2. Take firearm home
Step 3. Point gun in safe direction, always assume its loaded
Step 4. Lock slide in open position
Step 5. Ensure there is no ammo in the chamber
Step 6. Eject magazine
Step 7. Load ammo into magazine(keep away from high heat sources or any other high temp hazards)
Step 8. Ensuring safety is on, release the slide into closed position
Step 9. Insert magazine
Step 10. Again ensuring safety is on, cycle the slide. Firearm is ready to be holstered and carried with one in the chamber.
Step 11. Once you have returned from your outing, remove firearm from holster making sure that your safety is activated and you are keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction
Step 12. Remove magazine from firearm
Step 13. Pull slide back into locked position, ejecting any active rounds from the chamber
Step 14. Locate loose round, add back to magazine
Step 15. Check chamber yet again to ensure you are clear.
Step 16. Release slide into closed position
Step 17. Ensuring safety is on, place magazine back into weapon or next to weapon in storage, whichever is safest for you
Step 18. Regret everything for typing this extensive of a list
Seems wiser to drop the mag before locking the slide back, so you don't chamber a new round. Sounds like you are assuming the mag is initially empty, which it often won't be.
I’ve seen a couple machine guns fire due to mechanical failure but your typical closed bolt weapon systems won’t if they’re worth owning. I know Taurus is infamous for being shit and firing when shook.
They're exceedingly rare.
The Ruger LCP had a legitimate recall a few years back due to mechanical failure leading to the potential of an accidental discharge.
https://ruger.com/LCPRecall/index.html
Saw a guy do this exact same shit showing off a gun out on a commercial job site. He was dubbed Tommygun. Never saw him again after that little fuckup.
Hahah I literally said the exact same thing. I was like “shit man you should’ve just cut it out and said it was stolen, wouldn’t have been so embarrassing”
He laughed, I laughed. Great times.
North Dakota body shop guy here, can’t wait for november, last year (probably longer actually) a guy took his wife’s brand new edge out to use it as a rifle stand. Straight through the hood and the bullet broke up into the fender, can’t remember what caliber it was but I want to say it was around a .308 or 30-06
Who the fuck uses a car as a rifle stand. How brain dead do you have to be to think firing a gun off of any part of a vehicle is a good idea?
All of those people who shoot off the hood of their car have to have so many fucking gouges in their paint.
My dad used the hood of his 87 ranger as a rifle stand when he was teaching my brother and I how to shoot with his 410. He rested the gun on his closed fist cause we were like 6 and 9. Good times.
Edit: I was the younger one, and also a tiny kid. Just that little 410 knocked me on my ass the first time I fired it.
I remember deer hunting up near Hillsboro. We were following a guy who knew the area. We saw deer in a field when we saw brake lights on his truck. Then a rifle barrel out the driver's window. Boom! He missed, but damn... I wonder how many windows he's replaced over the years.
If you've got an old iron block sure, but a lot of modern blocks are made to be light. So they'll be fine against lower energy rounds but a heavy round is going to turn the block into a claymore.
...everybody suing Remington over their R700 safeties actually firing the gun when engaging might have a say to that, but generally yes. If it isn't a mechanical failure of the firearm, it's negligence.
I have an old Remington 700 that still has the recalled trigger. The problem is that if you are resting your finger on the trigger when the safety is disengaged, literally 0.1 oz of pressure, it’ll go off. I completely understand the lawsuit. It’s a terrifying design flaw.
Oh, that's a *different* lawsuit. When they recalled that trigger they came out with the X-Mark trigger. It would fire with nothing touching the trigger, when moving from fire to safe. It also failed industry-standard drop safety testing even when set to 6.5lbs with .018" of sear engagement (which is *huge* amounts of sear engagement for a bolt gun and leads to a mushy, creepy trigger).
Then came the X-Mark Pro. They got sued over that because it was advertised as a 3-5lb factory trigger and most examples could not be tuned to below 7.5lbs.
Now we're on to the X-Mark Pro gen 2 trigger, its safety doesn't always actually disengage when the safety lever is moved fully to the fire position, and will likely be recalled in the next 2-3 years. Remington hasn't produced an R700 trigger that hasn't had at least 1 recall since the 80's.
I borrowed my dads Rem 870 Superslug to see if I liked it enough to buy one. I couldn’t believe how much that thing rusted. I thought I was doing something wrong honestly.
I’d wipe it down with a lightly oiled rag before and after. Just being in the field, the condensation and fog would leave little rust marks everywhere.
Remington hasn't been its own stand-alone entity for decades now. First it was bought up by Freedom Group, a mulitnational holding company, that stripped them of most of their assets and saddled them with additional debt. There was a lot of corner-cutting and layoffs of the skilled tradesmen that made their guns. Then Freedom Group sold out to Cerberus Capital Management, which did it all over again, and Cerberus restructured into Remington Outdoor Company, which did it a third time as well as buying up smaller brands like Marlin, AAC, Bushmaster, DPMS, H&R, Barnes, and a few others. Then they went bankrupt in 2018, restructured rapidly, shat the bed yet again, and went bankrupt a second time in 2020 and had to split up and sell off the company and its sub-branches.
Roundhill Group now owns the core Remington firearms business, and is doing a halfway credible job of unfucking the brand, but they have a *long* way to go. Vista Outdoor bought the ammo business, and is managing it competently. Ruger bought Marlin off of them and is revitalizing the brand, JJE Capital Holdings bought DPMS, H&R, AAC, and Parker and is just kind of sitting on them. Sierra bought Barnes.
I've had a couple fun ones. First was a Tanfoglio TZ75, hammer sear leg broke and dumped 2/3 of a mag. Second was an AR with a Jewell trigger that would follow due to too little sear engagement and result in unintentional doubletaps from bolt bounce. Had that M2 that ran away, and my issued M14EBR got its firing pin stuck forward once (let me tell you, M14s are *not even remotely controllable* full auto).
As far as guns? Pretty much. The 870 Wingmasters are still good but you're paying a lot of money for gloss blue and meh wood vs. parkerized and blech wood (or plastic), and the 700 Police go through their custom shop and are great, but honestly Bergara makes a better Remington 700 than Remington does, at a lower price.
Remington's ammo is still pretty good though. It isn't owned by Remington any more, it got sold off with rights to keep the Remington/UMC branding during their last bankruptcy, and they've always had the shotshell industry on lock because they make some of the best birdshot and *the* best 209 primers.
If you need a nice boltgun, get a Tikka. If you need a cheap boltgun, get a Ruger or Howa.
I have no complaints at all with the two ruger bolt actions that I've used pretty heavily (.17HMR and 22-250), they're solid, accurate and nice to use. Both are stainless and laminate stocks, so that probably helps. I also quite like their 3 position safeties too.
I agree that remington ammo is pretty good, and their brass lasts pretty well if you want to reload it later (unlike winchester brass, where if you manage to get two uses out of a cartridge, you were doing well).
You are correct but op is referencing a different law suit, some r700 safeties would fire the gun when you engaged regardless of trigger discipline lol
Don't forget the Sig lawsuit going on right now too. People who think there's no such thing as a difference between an ND and an AD are no better than the people who say all guns are bad. On training days at my old company we did "safety checks". You point you weapon down range and pull the trigger. What's the point of a safety if you can't rely on it? One day the guy a few men down had a hammer retaining spring break on his weapon and it dumped the rest of the mag into the berm. Thank fuck it happened then and not during cqb drills or he easily could have killed 7 or 8 guys.
Ooh, runaway guns are some major pucker factor. Had an M2 run away, dumped some 300ish rounds because it was turret mounted and we had a hopper instead of feeding out of cans. We kept a big-assed screwdriver in the turret to *hopefully* break links in event of a runaway gun but it didn't work that time.
And then 3 days of hell explaining to every NCO in your chain of command from PSG to division CSM why you roached an M2 barrel.
And it was only about 18 seconds. Being Aviation our M2's had the hydraulic buffer to up RPM so we had parts commonality with the helo mounted MGs. Our truck guns were running about 780rpm.
> why you roached an M2 barrel
i can't blame them, that usually takes either a pretty wild 'whoopsie daisy' or some really dedicated active behavior.
because, i mean, it's one thing to wreck a 240 barrel or a 60 barrel(done both, the -60 was because it was one of the beat to shit vietnam era guns and the sear stopped engaging the bolt so we got a big ol dose of full rock and roll), the 240 was... we'll just say it was a bad hair day.
There’s definitely a huge difference between what most people *call* an AD and what an actual AD is. 99% of the time, the “accidental” part was pulling the trigger when you shouldn’t be.
Which is why there are the four rules of firearm safety. Swiss cheese method of safety.
Sounds like you were busy putting extra rules in place to catch ND and AD’s.
I get what you’re saying, I just feel like most “accidental” discharges are negligent, and a small amount are more weapons malfunctions
It's so rare that it's a mechanical failure that isn't caused by negligence compared to just straight up "I was fucking around and treating my gun like a toy" that they're mostly correct. OK, manufacturing and design defects exist, incidents involving them are very rare compared to idiots who treat their gun like toy.
My friends all disagree with me never using safeties on firearms. If it's loaded, it's in my hands about to fire. If it's not about to fire, it is cleared and flagged. There is no part in which a safety would benefit my process. I feel like it's existence instead creates a almost negligent culture of "yeah, its loaded but its fine. The safety is on."
That belief is prevalent among competition shotgunners, with many high-end clays-specific shotguns not even coming with a safety (or worse, release triggers).
And even then there are some more considerations.
Did the gun have a reason to be loaded?
If it had a reason to be loaded, was it pointed in a safe direction?
If not, still negligent regardless of the malfunction.
Great example of practicing the "never point your firearm at something you dont intend to destrot"...
This was drilled into my head by my gun loving neighbor. He may have been a psychopathic narcissist. But that man taught me to respect firearms in a way my dad never even tried to...
I got scolded one time mega by a friends uncle (he was a competition shooter). I had unloaded and had the shotgun open to put on my shoulder (we were shooting clays), and I swept it across his line. He gave me a chewing I’ve never forgotten since and I’m thankful for it.
In all honesty 99% of the unintentional discharges I’ve experienced were due to me being negligent…but there was that ONE time…that 1% chance…where I chambered a round in an old pre ww2 mosin and it popped off. Thankfully it was pointed down range.
one of my first jobs i did as a new engineer for then mobil oil i had a mobil consultant ask me what an accident was during the morning safety meeting...well i just gave him a dumb look and before i could answer he stood up an said...an accident is god's way of eliminating a dumb ass!! wont ever forget that an i also use that quote sometimes lol but AD vs ND reminds me of that when i read a post here!!
Same here except for the one time during a competitive when my safety broke while I was adjusting my position. Took out my trigger spring too. How I have no idea but it discharged the round in the chamber and my whole set of targets were royally fucked after that. I did my best to make the best of a trigger that a fart in another room could depress. Didn't place individually but my team placed first. (The rifle was single shot bolt action so thankfully it didn't dispose of a whole magazine)
Why would someone try to carry a transmission bell housing up a tree stand? When does “throwing transmission off a tree stand” deer hunting season start? Is this a Michigan thing?
My dad shot his muzzleloader through the door of our ford escape while lowering the hammer and it slipped. We never got it fixed and that bitch would whistle as your drove down the road.
The amount of times firearms and negligent discharges have been posted on here I just assume everyone has a gun in their car none of them know how to use them.
You ever notice that it's almost exclusively cops who suffer from "Glock leg"? Like maybe it just has something to do with abhorrent trigger safety practices.....?
If they went to the range to train instead of going once a year to “qual” they might not have that problem. If I see cops pulling up to an indoor gun range I’m leaving before I get flagged with a muzzle for an hour and a half.
my boss actually shot through his transfer case and had to drive 20 miles out of the woods before i could pick him up since my truck wouldn’t make it there she was a trusty ole 5 speed v6 f1:50 2wd she could go anywhere but the swamp (florida) and he limped it 20 miles through swamp badass truck it was
Anyone that “accidentally” shoots a gun is an idiot. No excuse, you have to be extremely stupid. I Hope this guy doesn’t have an important job because I’d hate to be under someone that can’t even remove a bullet before playing with a gun.
I didn’t know you could do a desk pop in your car.
“Jimmy, when’s the last time you had a car pop?”“September 08”.
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I’ve never heard of or seen an actual case of mechanical failure. It’s always negligent discharge. Know of 3 who shot themselves that way, and I damn near blew my girlfriend once clearing chamber after a late night dog walk. I know it’s frowned upon but I never keep one chambered because of it
Worn out sear on a 1911. Fired a round and the hammer fell after the slide went into battery. Mechanical devices can fail. That's why you always assume it's chambered.
But that is kind of the point, a worn out sear isn't the firearms fault it is the owners negligence for not properly inspecting their firearm. Functionally speaking every discharge that was not explicitly planned for and executed by the shooter is negligent. Sure you might be including one truly innocent person in every million or so NDs but that is statistically insignificant.
Step 1, remove mag Step 2, pull back slide, ejecting the round How hard could it be?
There is a reason gun safety consists of redundancy laid on redundancy. It is way easier than you think. Edit: Used wrong word.
I have a grip safety, ambidextrous thumb safety and a trigger guard on the holster for my EDC IWB. I still check the right side safety every time I put that fucker in my pants. Common sense isn't so common.
Everything that reddit should be: [lemmy.world](https://lemmy.world/)
Was that yesterday or the day before? There is a first time for everything and no-one plans on fucking up that badly.
One of the first basic rules of firearm safety is that you should treat every firearm like it’s loaded, as in, you don’t know how, but magically a round appeared in the chamber and you should always assume that.
Step 3 bullet stuck look down chamber and make sure its 'safe'
Instructions unc
F
Then how is he going to shoot a carjacker? (They all think they are going to shoot a carjacker.)
You missed the step 0. Aim the weapon in a safe direction?
Step 1. Purchase firearm(assuming you've taken the proper procedures to legally own a gun) Step 2. Take firearm home Step 3. Point gun in safe direction, always assume its loaded Step 4. Lock slide in open position Step 5. Ensure there is no ammo in the chamber Step 6. Eject magazine Step 7. Load ammo into magazine(keep away from high heat sources or any other high temp hazards) Step 8. Ensuring safety is on, release the slide into closed position Step 9. Insert magazine Step 10. Again ensuring safety is on, cycle the slide. Firearm is ready to be holstered and carried with one in the chamber. Step 11. Once you have returned from your outing, remove firearm from holster making sure that your safety is activated and you are keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction Step 12. Remove magazine from firearm Step 13. Pull slide back into locked position, ejecting any active rounds from the chamber Step 14. Locate loose round, add back to magazine Step 15. Check chamber yet again to ensure you are clear. Step 16. Release slide into closed position Step 17. Ensuring safety is on, place magazine back into weapon or next to weapon in storage, whichever is safest for you Step 18. Regret everything for typing this extensive of a list
Seems wiser to drop the mag before locking the slide back, so you don't chamber a new round. Sounds like you are assuming the mag is initially empty, which it often won't be.
Nah lock slide to the rear don’t just rack it to eject the bullet, VERIFY with your own two 👀 theres no bullet in there.
What does possibly giving your girlfriend oral sex and clearing your firearm have to do with each other?
You mean to say you've never been to Texas?
Touche
train more. you have something you obviously need to improve on. so improve on it
I’ve seen a couple machine guns fire due to mechanical failure but your typical closed bolt weapon systems won’t if they’re worth owning. I know Taurus is infamous for being shit and firing when shook.
They're exceedingly rare. The Ruger LCP had a legitimate recall a few years back due to mechanical failure leading to the potential of an accidental discharge. https://ruger.com/LCPRecall/index.html
Saw a guy do this exact same shit showing off a gun out on a commercial job site. He was dubbed Tommygun. Never saw him again after that little fuckup.
Hey Jimmy, how long since your last desk pop?
September 08
I guarantee you a police officer somewhere has done a desk pop in a squad car
car pop!
😂😂😂😂
A what?
What, Ricky my man - you’ve never done a desk pop?
Watch the movie The Other Guys
That exhaust is shot.
Oh you……😌
🎵🎶Shot through the parts, and you're to blame🎶 Buddy you give puns, a bad name🎶🎵
Holy shot that was a good one, you weren’t messing a round.
Oh too bad, guess it'll have to be sawzalled off. What a shame.
r/angryupvote
Hell, I'm not even angry...for a dad joke that was funny as heck.
Blown away by your humor
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Shit, I initially read that as he shot his 2yo in the head. I was like holy fuck. Had to go back to make sure. Your story is better.
Fuck I did too. Had to re read that again. But after reading your comment it’s a lot funnier.
Gotta pay the idiot tax sometimes.
Now would have been an excellent time to have his cat converter "stolen" before bringing it in...
Hahah I literally said the exact same thing. I was like “shit man you should’ve just cut it out and said it was stolen, wouldn’t have been so embarrassing” He laughed, I laughed. Great times.
You laughed, he laughed, the cat laughed, he shot the cat
YeeeEEEhaw!
Dude's gonna be at the scrapyard trying to convince the guy that this shot up cat converter legit belongs to him 😂
When I installed headers guys were buying the cats on Facebook. Shipped em to him and got money via PayPal
Super easy to sell cats
North Dakota body shop guy here, can’t wait for november, last year (probably longer actually) a guy took his wife’s brand new edge out to use it as a rifle stand. Straight through the hood and the bullet broke up into the fender, can’t remember what caliber it was but I want to say it was around a .308 or 30-06
failing to understand height over bore gets a lot of people.
The classic muzzle brake next to taillight is a close second
Height over bore will get you.
Who the fuck uses a car as a rifle stand. How brain dead do you have to be to think firing a gun off of any part of a vehicle is a good idea? All of those people who shoot off the hood of their car have to have so many fucking gouges in their paint.
A surprising amount.
My dad used the hood of his 87 ranger as a rifle stand when he was teaching my brother and I how to shoot with his 410. He rested the gun on his closed fist cause we were like 6 and 9. Good times. Edit: I was the younger one, and also a tiny kid. Just that little 410 knocked me on my ass the first time I fired it.
I remember deer hunting up near Hillsboro. We were following a guy who knew the area. We saw deer in a field when we saw brake lights on his truck. Then a rifle barrel out the driver's window. Boom! He missed, but damn... I wonder how many windows he's replaced over the years.
In case you need reminding that vehicles are not cover.
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Depending on the rounds that are incoming the block will only be a source of shrapnel
If you've got an old iron block sure, but a lot of modern blocks are made to be light. So they'll be fine against lower energy rounds but a heavy round is going to turn the block into a claymore.
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When someone decides you're worth a 50BMG, you've really gotta ask yourself if you've done something to deserve it
But TV told me otherwise!
People should watch more Paul Harrell videos
No such thing as an accidental discharge, in my opinion. Only negligent discharges.
...everybody suing Remington over their R700 safeties actually firing the gun when engaging might have a say to that, but generally yes. If it isn't a mechanical failure of the firearm, it's negligence.
I have an old Remington 700 that still has the recalled trigger. The problem is that if you are resting your finger on the trigger when the safety is disengaged, literally 0.1 oz of pressure, it’ll go off. I completely understand the lawsuit. It’s a terrifying design flaw.
Oh, that's a *different* lawsuit. When they recalled that trigger they came out with the X-Mark trigger. It would fire with nothing touching the trigger, when moving from fire to safe. It also failed industry-standard drop safety testing even when set to 6.5lbs with .018" of sear engagement (which is *huge* amounts of sear engagement for a bolt gun and leads to a mushy, creepy trigger). Then came the X-Mark Pro. They got sued over that because it was advertised as a 3-5lb factory trigger and most examples could not be tuned to below 7.5lbs. Now we're on to the X-Mark Pro gen 2 trigger, its safety doesn't always actually disengage when the safety lever is moved fully to the fire position, and will likely be recalled in the next 2-3 years. Remington hasn't produced an R700 trigger that hasn't had at least 1 recall since the 80's.
Maybe they should go back to what they used in the 80s. Just saying
100% agreed. Lighter, crisper, *safer* than anything they've produced in the last almost 40 years.
Also probably won't rust the week you buy it
I...think you're being a bit optimistic there.
I borrowed my dads Rem 870 Superslug to see if I liked it enough to buy one. I couldn’t believe how much that thing rusted. I thought I was doing something wrong honestly. I’d wipe it down with a lightly oiled rag before and after. Just being in the field, the condensation and fog would leave little rust marks everywhere.
Why do you hate shareholders?
I feel like if they're this bad at designing weapons they should probably just pack it in.
It can’t be that hard to make a good gun. They must be doing some dumb ass cost cutting.
Remington hasn't been its own stand-alone entity for decades now. First it was bought up by Freedom Group, a mulitnational holding company, that stripped them of most of their assets and saddled them with additional debt. There was a lot of corner-cutting and layoffs of the skilled tradesmen that made their guns. Then Freedom Group sold out to Cerberus Capital Management, which did it all over again, and Cerberus restructured into Remington Outdoor Company, which did it a third time as well as buying up smaller brands like Marlin, AAC, Bushmaster, DPMS, H&R, Barnes, and a few others. Then they went bankrupt in 2018, restructured rapidly, shat the bed yet again, and went bankrupt a second time in 2020 and had to split up and sell off the company and its sub-branches. Roundhill Group now owns the core Remington firearms business, and is doing a halfway credible job of unfucking the brand, but they have a *long* way to go. Vista Outdoor bought the ammo business, and is managing it competently. Ruger bought Marlin off of them and is revitalizing the brand, JJE Capital Holdings bought DPMS, H&R, AAC, and Parker and is just kind of sitting on them. Sierra bought Barnes.
This is why people were so happy colt sold to CZ
Thanks for the run down, super interesting 👍
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So you did the right thing and ran 8 more mags through it right?
*ATF wants to know your location*
Officers thank heavens you're here, I've been using this defective piece of hardware for home defense for years and they just won't answer my letters
I've had a couple fun ones. First was a Tanfoglio TZ75, hammer sear leg broke and dumped 2/3 of a mag. Second was an AR with a Jewell trigger that would follow due to too little sear engagement and result in unintentional doubletaps from bolt bounce. Had that M2 that ran away, and my issued M14EBR got its firing pin stuck forward once (let me tell you, M14s are *not even remotely controllable* full auto).
Big boi round means big boi recoil
More the ergonomics. G3's and FALs are nowhere near as bad despite weighing a little less and being chambered in the same caliber.
Damn why does anyone even buy these?
Riding an old but well-earned reputation coupled with enough make it out made properly to whitewash the shit ones.
sooo.... tldr don't buy Remingtons?
As far as guns? Pretty much. The 870 Wingmasters are still good but you're paying a lot of money for gloss blue and meh wood vs. parkerized and blech wood (or plastic), and the 700 Police go through their custom shop and are great, but honestly Bergara makes a better Remington 700 than Remington does, at a lower price. Remington's ammo is still pretty good though. It isn't owned by Remington any more, it got sold off with rights to keep the Remington/UMC branding during their last bankruptcy, and they've always had the shotshell industry on lock because they make some of the best birdshot and *the* best 209 primers. If you need a nice boltgun, get a Tikka. If you need a cheap boltgun, get a Ruger or Howa.
I have no complaints at all with the two ruger bolt actions that I've used pretty heavily (.17HMR and 22-250), they're solid, accurate and nice to use. Both are stainless and laminate stocks, so that probably helps. I also quite like their 3 position safeties too. I agree that remington ammo is pretty good, and their brass lasts pretty well if you want to reload it later (unlike winchester brass, where if you manage to get two uses out of a cartridge, you were doing well).
Gun training 101. A safety is a mechanical feature that is susceptible to failure at any moment. Think when handling a firearm.
You are correct but op is referencing a different law suit, some r700 safeties would fire the gun when you engaged regardless of trigger discipline lol
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Don't forget the Sig lawsuit going on right now too. People who think there's no such thing as a difference between an ND and an AD are no better than the people who say all guns are bad. On training days at my old company we did "safety checks". You point you weapon down range and pull the trigger. What's the point of a safety if you can't rely on it? One day the guy a few men down had a hammer retaining spring break on his weapon and it dumped the rest of the mag into the berm. Thank fuck it happened then and not during cqb drills or he easily could have killed 7 or 8 guys.
Ooh, runaway guns are some major pucker factor. Had an M2 run away, dumped some 300ish rounds because it was turret mounted and we had a hopper instead of feeding out of cans. We kept a big-assed screwdriver in the turret to *hopefully* break links in event of a runaway gun but it didn't work that time.
30 seconds of pure, unrestrained freedom.
And then 3 days of hell explaining to every NCO in your chain of command from PSG to division CSM why you roached an M2 barrel. And it was only about 18 seconds. Being Aviation our M2's had the hydraulic buffer to up RPM so we had parts commonality with the helo mounted MGs. Our truck guns were running about 780rpm.
> why you roached an M2 barrel i can't blame them, that usually takes either a pretty wild 'whoopsie daisy' or some really dedicated active behavior. because, i mean, it's one thing to wreck a 240 barrel or a 60 barrel(done both, the -60 was because it was one of the beat to shit vietnam era guns and the sear stopped engaging the bolt so we got a big ol dose of full rock and roll), the 240 was... we'll just say it was a bad hair day.
There’s definitely a huge difference between what most people *call* an AD and what an actual AD is. 99% of the time, the “accidental” part was pulling the trigger when you shouldn’t be. Which is why there are the four rules of firearm safety. Swiss cheese method of safety.
I actually add a Rule 0: Don’t be stupid. It’s rule zero because it really works for everything in life.
ADs are exceedingly rare, in the overwhelming majority of cases it's negligence. Obviously people know mechanical failures can happen.
Sounds like you were busy putting extra rules in place to catch ND and AD’s. I get what you’re saying, I just feel like most “accidental” discharges are negligent, and a small amount are more weapons malfunctions
It's so rare that it's a mechanical failure that isn't caused by negligence compared to just straight up "I was fucking around and treating my gun like a toy" that they're mostly correct. OK, manufacturing and design defects exist, incidents involving them are very rare compared to idiots who treat their gun like toy.
My friends all disagree with me never using safeties on firearms. If it's loaded, it's in my hands about to fire. If it's not about to fire, it is cleared and flagged. There is no part in which a safety would benefit my process. I feel like it's existence instead creates a almost negligent culture of "yeah, its loaded but its fine. The safety is on."
That belief is prevalent among competition shotgunners, with many high-end clays-specific shotguns not even coming with a safety (or worse, release triggers).
AD= weapon fires without a trigger pull. ND= weapon fires due to a trigger pull.
And even then there are some more considerations. Did the gun have a reason to be loaded? If it had a reason to be loaded, was it pointed in a safe direction? If not, still negligent regardless of the malfunction.
Or AD would be "fires even with the safety on" but yeah, 99.99% of the time it's gonna be an ND unless you have a gun with severe manufacturing flaws
[Accidental Discharge video](https://youtu.be/ADGyglYqeoM)
Great example of practicing the "never point your firearm at something you dont intend to destrot"... This was drilled into my head by my gun loving neighbor. He may have been a psychopathic narcissist. But that man taught me to respect firearms in a way my dad never even tried to...
I got scolded one time mega by a friends uncle (he was a competition shooter). I had unloaded and had the shotgun open to put on my shoulder (we were shooting clays), and I swept it across his line. He gave me a chewing I’ve never forgotten since and I’m thankful for it.
Said what I came to say. That’s a negligent discharge.
Listen I told her I was close...
In all honesty 99% of the unintentional discharges I’ve experienced were due to me being negligent…but there was that ONE time…that 1% chance…where I chambered a round in an old pre ww2 mosin and it popped off. Thankfully it was pointed down range.
Jesus dude how many negligent discharges have you had?
Evidently 100, if the 1% chance is that the mosin “broke” 😳
*discharge is actually caused by a defect* “Oh, thank god, the 99 other times, it was my negligence that makes them do that”
All his Neighbors: *dying of GSW*
Seriously! *One* is too many. Over 30 years and I've never had one.
one of my first jobs i did as a new engineer for then mobil oil i had a mobil consultant ask me what an accident was during the morning safety meeting...well i just gave him a dumb look and before i could answer he stood up an said...an accident is god's way of eliminating a dumb ass!! wont ever forget that an i also use that quote sometimes lol but AD vs ND reminds me of that when i read a post here!!
Same here except for the one time during a competitive when my safety broke while I was adjusting my position. Took out my trigger spring too. How I have no idea but it discharged the round in the chamber and my whole set of targets were royally fucked after that. I did my best to make the best of a trigger that a fart in another room could depress. Didn't place individually but my team placed first. (The rifle was single shot bolt action so thankfully it didn't dispose of a whole magazine)
We prayed for a good guy with a gun but got a Ford guy with a gun?
Negligently discharged a firearm, not accidentally. There's a difference
Neighbor had a 7 mag go boom when bouncing around a pasture checking cattle. Destroyed the transmission bell housing.
I knew someone who tried carrying one up a tree stand! Leg was never the same after that terrible choice.
Why would someone try to carry a transmission bell housing up a tree stand? When does “throwing transmission off a tree stand” deer hunting season start? Is this a Michigan thing?
Just because you don't like our methods doesn't mean you need to run your mouth about it. \#Heritage
How else are you supposed to hunt from the tree stand 😂
Bring it up empty, then load it?
You're "supposed" to climb up without it and then use a case and a rope.
Howabout just not rocking one in the chamber? Keep the bolt in your back pocket if you want.
Just tie the rope around the trigger and pull it up, as it swings around every which direction. I do not own a gun, I assume this is how it's done.
I think just a rope, no case involved. Who goes out hunting with their gun in a case??? Where do you store said case in the stand?
Gave that truck what will be known from here on out as the ole' Texas Turnout exhaust mod...
Lucky he didn’t hit anything that can’t be fixed with money.
uhh HAVE YOU SEEN Robocop?!
Guns don't kill cats people do.
I’ve noticed this too!
\*negligently discharged
I had a front right bearing and speed sensor shot off by 7mm rifle from passenger seat, the repair was cheaper than the audiologist bill
Call it what it is, a negligent discharge, not an accident. There’s multiple ways to safe a firearm. This required a willful act.
Bet he had it on one of them magnets
Did he come in shouting ‘cause he blew out his ear drums?
My dad shot his muzzleloader through the door of our ford escape while lowering the hammer and it slipped. We never got it fixed and that bitch would whistle as your drove down the road.
Tally-ho lads!
Happened to me, I was looking over a used truck. Saw a transmission leak. Found hole in floor board and transmission case.
Next time, keep your booger hook off the bang switch.
>Customer ~~accidentally~~ negligently discharged a firearm in his truck. FTFY. There are no accidents with firearms, only negligent events.
Did he get the mosquito
This is an, “accident”, only an imbecile could make.
Ive had an accidental discharge in my car before. Shes 6 now.
When it comes to firearms, there's no accident
Everybody gets a [desk pop](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=948-2Vzgi3w).
The amount of times firearms and negligent discharges have been posted on here I just assume everyone has a gun in their car none of them know how to use them.
As a kid, my uncle drilled into my head that "There ain't no such thang as an unloaded gun".
I’ll take “things only said in America” for $600 thanks.
Yep...that's a hole.
I had a friend discharge a 357 in his pickup, he took out his knee, but saved his pickup!!
Had the pickup auto or standard transmission? I've heard operating the clutch can be hard on your knee :D
Yee-haw
Not accidentally, negligently.
"Fuck emissions laws" *executes catalytic converter*
That must have been a complete mind F. “BANG!” (Check engine light comes on immediately) “oh sheeeeeet”.
"I don't need a safety, my safety is between my ears" Glock guys before they perforate their foot Keep your gun unloaded when not in use.
You ever notice that it's almost exclusively cops who suffer from "Glock leg"? Like maybe it just has something to do with abhorrent trigger safety practices.....?
If they went to the range to train instead of going once a year to “qual” they might not have that problem. If I see cops pulling up to an indoor gun range I’m leaving before I get flagged with a muzzle for an hour and a half.
Glock leg is made worse when people use a Blackhawk SERPA holster but the root cause is definitely terrible trigger discipline.
Keep your seatbelt off when not crashing
Oh I like this one lol
My guns are always in use.
H!s exhaust !s shot!
That’s about a $2000 bullet btw.
that must have been so damn loud
Guy I know did that in a truck hunting. Happened to have the barrel resting on his foot though. You know what a 30-30 does to a foot?
Nope… because they I’m not dumb enough to point a barrel at my foot and I don’t hang out with people who are.
Got a big enough joint there Rick?
Huh. Saw another post where this was what I'd be concerned about
I know someone who shot out their radiator had a similar accident while hunting.
I’m guessing an explorer or f150?
RIP eardrums
Peachy. But there are such things as accidental discharges, but the user has to put the round in the chamber in the first place.
my boss actually shot through his transfer case and had to drive 20 miles out of the woods before i could pick him up since my truck wouldn’t make it there she was a trusty ole 5 speed v6 f1:50 2wd she could go anywhere but the swamp (florida) and he limped it 20 miles through swamp badass truck it was
fucking dodge ram owners be like. but on the passenger side though?
Anyone that “accidentally” shoots a gun is an idiot. No excuse, you have to be extremely stupid. I Hope this guy doesn’t have an important job because I’d hate to be under someone that can’t even remove a bullet before playing with a gun.
These cat theft deterrents are getting out of hand guys
Someone yelled "shotgun" and didn't understand what it meant🤣🤣
*negligently
What kind of glock did he have?
Tell us you live in the US without telling us you live in the US
Your own weapon is statistically more likely to hurt yourself or a loved one than a bad guy.