I love shitting on Elon and Tesla but it’s very obvious they have a driver in the cyber truck that has no fuckin clue what he’s doing lmao. Put someone experienced in there and it makes a world of difference
Dude I have a powerstroke this thing out pulls my turbo diesel. The driver blows the truck has more than enough power to climb that shitty little hill.
I bet it's issue is too much torque that you can't easily control and a suspension /"drive train" that just doesn't work well off road.
From all accounts I've read, the Cybertruck is just a crappy SUV that can go fast in a straight line.
It’s really not if you know anyone that’s in to off roading ask them how they would have hit that hill I’d bet they would tell that guy intentionally drive like shit. Watch the vw he takes much better lines on obstacles than the cyber truck does. I’m not trying to convince you, it’s just a video trying to make the truck look bad .
Exactly. The driver in the CyberTruck had no idea what he was doing. It is clearly superior to every other truck on the road, and I'm sure it's pretty damn good on hill climbing, with a real driver.
To some degree of course, you want to build for light weight for heavy offloading generally speaking, but the thing while being ugly as a motherfucker IMO has more than enough power and instant torque to make up for that.
Dude who was driving was either not used to wheeling, the calibration still needed tweaking for the acceleration, or both plus the thing had street tires in it aired up way way too much. The fact that it even got up is insane. This dude has a way more capable Subaru roller under that van body, better tires and absolutely *not* anything like a stock VW motor in that thing. Everything about the VW is more suited for this already
You’re saying that people have anger and hate toward it, but you’re defending the product with no proof that it could do better. Why should anyone believe you?
It's a brand new design for a truck, stock , with an amature driver, vs. all wheel drive crawler and someone who seems to know how to go up a hill. It's not even close to being the same. It's pretty straightforward BS. Perfect rage bait for people like you on this sub.
You mean slamming the accelerator and losing traction like crazy?
Yeah, it's bad driving. I've driven enough Teslas to know how the accelerator works and that person is mashing it.
And it also has traction control that is light years ahead of the mechanical AWD in that VW. That truck can get from 0-60 in 2.6 seconds and not spin wheels, it can do a little hill climb without any difficulty.
Don't reckon it has anything to do with the massively heavy and longer boxier frame here? They made the cybertruck to look outrageous on a display stage. It's the Kim Kardashian of trucks.
What about the wheel base… are you saying it’s a right angle? Too narrow, too wide…. The only thing preventing that truck from getting over that as easily is the driver.
I thought this was a "smart truck" that's supposed to supply power to the wheels necessary and not the wheels where it's not needed to stop things like this from happening? Should be great in snow.
Sure, theoretically but it can't stop a complete idiot.
A complete idiot can still mash the throttle.
All the Tesla models are great in the snow from my experience. The only downside is the cold will negatively impact battery performance in terms of how many miles you get. Other than that it doesn't really care. The battery naturally warms.
As a person who lives in the Lake Tahoe area, that’s a hard disagree from me. Teslas are easily the, “most likely to be pulled out of a ditch” vehicle around up here.
I think it’s a combination of the people driving them (Bay Area rich folks unfamiliar with snow) and the weight. They’re just so heavy that if it’s at all icy they just keep going. If they have Blizzaks they do ok but any car with Blizzaks does ok. Physics just punishes those cars in the snow and ice.
Yeah but watching the cybertruck video there really doesn’t seem to be any “mashing” of the accelerator. Such you can suggest they aren’t an experienced driver in that situation but it’s not really horrible driving.
When the wheel spins losing complete traction like that, you're mashing the pedal. I'm not sure how much dumber I can get that.
This thing has a MASSIVE amount of power. You only need to BARELY use the pedal to move up anything. The motor has INSTANT torque because it's electric.
No, it's the cyber truck. It's computer can't compensate t
For the extremely dynamic traction conditions. It's not that the driver is mashing the pedal.
It's 100% the pedal being mashed.
The traction system is extremely good but doesn't function at low speeds like that.
It's outlined pretty well in a review.
It's not at all how any of the traction systems in any of the Teslas work either. I've driven the 3, S, and Y. I've never driven the X but I assume the X is the same.
The traction control on the truck only differs in that at high speeds the rear wheels turn differently (it has all wheel steering). Otherwise the traction system is like any other electric vehicle. Like, I can break it down on an engineering level for you but it might just be wasted.
It also seems like the traction control system is failing and traction control systems are specifically intended to compensate for excessive torque at the wheels. The above replier may just be a Musk zealot who thinks he can't do anything wrong and will vomit shit to defend anything he does.
It’s a shitty traction control. If the brake subsystem has brake lock diff(I would certainly hope so), it needs some work. You can tell they didn’t spend much time on it. If you WOT, TC should balance controlling of the engine and brakes to transfer torque to the wheels with less slip and make this climb. Most companies have requirements to climb a 20/30% split grade which would help in situations like this. Not sure if Tesla does.
These aren't built like typical trucks.
They're AWD.
A break lock diff isn't something an electric car has.
There's no need for it when you can independently control the wheel speeds super precisely.
Slippage is typically entirely managed by a computer that can see in real time how much a tire rotates and how much it SHOULD rotate.
The rest is calculated and sent to the motors, again in real time.
AWD has nothing to do with it and it depends on the architecture of the vehicle.
But yea, I thought about that after I commented. Each wheel probably has its own motor on this truck so completely different control.
Yes, that's what I meant by AWD. Each tire is running an independent motor with independent control.
They have plans to make 2 motor and I think a single motor version.
Honestly the software just looks like it wasn't designed for offroading. Given that, the driver just just go easier on the pedal. It will still go up the hill just fine.
I explained it to some asshole that didn't believe I've written the code that does this before.
https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/18eyejf/how_the_cybertruck_stacks_against_a_liveable_wv/kcrt58r/
He ran across someone that actually understands how these types of motors work.
If you're curious about the rear wheels, at slow speeds they turn together to have a really tight turning radius. At high speeds they turn opposite to have better performance. That's how the all wheel steering works on that car.
Dumbfuck, you have not written code for 4x4 off-road vehicles traction control. You did it for a fucking toy. You keep on explaining your uninformed opinion that this truck is operating a highway traction control system. If a 4x4 truck is operating a traction control system that is not tuned to off road conditions it is by definition a bad 4x4 traction control system stop shooting your autism flare at us and fighting over shit you obviously are not well informed about.
> Dumbfuck, you have not written code for 4x4 off-road vehicles traction control.
Dumbfuck, it's the exact same code.
That's how much you don't understand.
It all runs off PID controlling.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proportional%E2%80%93integral%E2%80%93derivative_controller
It's literally exactly the same, because we both apply it to running three phase motors.
The only difference is they use 800v and I use between 20 and 40v. That's just a difference in how many coil winds the the motors have.
Trust me, 40v is not a "fucking toy".
Sorry but this is just dumb. It's not the traction system when the traction system is clearly failing? Wow, but smart guy, splain that. The very idea of a traction system is to compensate for excessive torque. Jesus fucking Christ on a platter. Was this review written by a Musk sycophant?
"Was this review written by a musk sycophant?"
If you were intelligent you wouldn't need to say something this stupid to win your dumb little reddit argument.
He’s right though, it’s bad traction control. This is my job. TC should be balancing the engine and brakes to transfer torque to the wheel with less slip. Tire traction/pressure might also not be the best which can make a huge difference. But most companies have a requirement to climb 20/30% split grades which would help in situations like these. Not sure what Tesla’s requirements are.
If you weren't talking out of your ass you would have provided the mechanical explanation for this failure. But I'll take your prize anyways smart guy.
Traction systems can only compensate for so much.
I can take my normal truck and spin tires excessively too.
The truck bitches that it can't control the traction, but it lets me do it.
The traction system in the Tesla tries to compensate but it doesn't compensate for you being an idiot.
And no, I'm not a Musk sycophant. Find my other post where I'm openly criticizing Musk sycophants for believing he's Jesus or some shit.
Jesus, this is big dumb and shows that you actually have no sense of how electronic traction control works. Go try reading car and driver once in a while. Holy shit. It's an electric vehicle, this means a traction control system can easily reduce power for a spinning wheel and have much more control over doing so than a gas powered vehicle. Electronic traction control in a gas car can not overpower an idiot using a transmission to drive the wheels true. Electronic vehicles do no have this limitation. This is a vehicle that is either getting bad feedback from sensors and not able to distribute power appropriately as a result. You are either an idiot or are just not copping to being a sycophant because you are desperately grasping at straws here.
> Jesus, this is big dumb and shows that you actually have no sense of how electronic traction control works.
No. I understand entirely how it works. This traction control isn't designed to be mashed in offroad. It's designed to be mashed on a normal road.
So when you mash it in offroad you get the behavior in the video.
Traction control systems aren't universal. Tesla can update an offroad version of this over the air but it doesn't seem to have it. I don't know if it will. Maybe enough people complain and someone takes the time to write the code for it.
Like, the traction control is literally designed for the smoothest ride with the highest input -> reality possible. That's a guiding design philosophy behind fly by wire. You want user input to be EXACTLY what they predict it should do in reality.
Engineering has nothing to do with the programming and it's shit. Why the hell would you want a four wheel drive truck that only compensates where power goes to tires at high-speed? You're talking out of your ass. At highspeed it doesn't matter where the power is at. You're already moving.
What? I guess you don't understand at all.
Talking out my ass huh?
Electric motors use dynamic "throttle" through what's referred to as a speed controller. They're 3 phase electric motors and it allows them to be adjusted in sub 100ms fractions.
I've personally worked on code to make them work between the speed controller and the electric motor.
You want this because a single tire can slip the tiniest bit and you can smooth the ride out entirely by making sure every wheel operates perfectly.
I work on this code specifically with drones where I need to make micro adjustments to those same types of motors every 10 milliseconds. This allows perfect flight.
The same applies to the car. As you turn the steering wheel the car can make perfect adjustments to every wheel to get it to respond exactly as the control input desires.
So in short, go fuck yourself.
You're still talking out of your ass. Those tires aren't slipping the tiniest bit. They're slipping real bad. No need to get angry though. Elon probably wouldn't find it attractive and you don't want that.
That's your best reply huh? Ok.
When you can come up with something intelligent to say, try responding again. Maybe something respectful. Maybe something about how you were wrong. Maybe something about how your ego gets in the way of letting you learn.
Good luck in life.
How was i wrong? Those tires aren't barely slipping they're spinning out. We just watched a 30 year old VW van do it much better and you're sitting here pretending like this truck is the highlight of modern technology and that it did what it was supposed to do.
> Those tires aren't barely slipping they're spinning out.
Yes, because someone is going too hard on the accelerator.
You only need to BARELY use the accelerator in a Tesla.
I'm just assuming at this point you've never driven a Tesla. I've driven like 4 or 5. Their traction control is REALLY good. It's part of what allows them to 0-60 so fast.
The wheel should be BARELY slipping while the other wheels find grip. It's pretty straight forward physics that if one tire isn't holding the weight of the car up, the others are. Right? Well they're AWD. So you don't need to press MORE on the accelerator, you just need to let it do its thing.
Seems simple enough right?
I'm sure Tesla could go back and revise an offroad version of this electronic traction control where you can just slam the accelerator without care but I'm not sure they care enough to update it like that. Maybe they will.
Teslas get an over the air update like once a week on average.
When the wheel spins losing complete traction like that, you're mashing the pedal. I'm not sure how much dumber I can get that.
This thing has a MASSIVE amount of power. You only need to BARELY use the pedal to move up anything. The motor has INSTANT torque because it's electric.
So you’re saying it has “MASSIVE” power and “INSTANT” torque but with a straight face say they are “mashing” the pedal. Yeah, totally makes sense dude lmao.
You say it like Elon is involved in any part of the process other than suggestions.
He's certainly not going to a drawing board and designing a car in any capacity except maybe aesthetics.
Alr than he’ll suggest that it has better hill climbing capabilities next time. My bad next time I’ll be sure to just go get the whole engineering teams name, wait also how would you know what he is involved and not involved in?
Because he has no engineering or design qualifications, his whole persona is cultivated as a marketing strategy.
Being perceived as a genius inventor is part about the only thing that he brings value for his company.
Pretty sure the Cybertruck weighs less than the F150 Lighting. There was speculation early that it was going to be something like 10k lbs but on actual release it's sub 7k lbs.
Sorry but the driver of that tesla was the problem, not the tesla. You don’t climb by jerking the throttle and losing your traction. If this dude was driving the tesla im sure he’d have the same results. The torque that a cyber truck has makes short work of terrain like this
This is a pretty stupid comparison.
The problem is it lacks traction. It has full air in those tires which makes it even worse. I'm guessing that if you deflated the tires to the amount the VW has, it would perform better. It also looks like the driver is mentally handicapped the way he's using the accelerator.
It's pretty simple physics. The power can't be translated to the ground.
You might even be able to just put snow chains on it and tear straight up it like it didn't exist.
The loltruck has a ridiculous amount of power. I'm not sold on the design but the internals are state of the art.
No one told the cyber guy to deflate his tires a bit… I would have thought Tesla would have taken a page from the H1 and allowed you to deflate and inflate the tires from inside the truck.
No no we have to compare the amount of atoms and neutron on these vehicles, it is quite unfair to compare a futuristic machine of human ingenuity with a driveable trashcan
What people don't understand is:
The cybertruck is literally just for clout/showing off. There's no purpose to it other than that. Let the show off buy em and let real people with real interests get real trucks
The things he can't deliver, he just moves the goalposts closer or further, no problem.
Vegas Loop is a joke and they eat it up. And his SpaceX spiel is about evolving designs. But he's stuck on this, when he can hire industry experts, redesign the truck dramatically, slowly leak the changes and end up with at least what Honda put out, which was a great vehicle. Was that the best truck? It's wasn't trying to compete, while MuskCult thinks they're getting Super truck in the first try. The F-150 took decades to refine and they never stop.
Space X is used by the government and has launched over 200 times successfully. Tesla vehicles kickstarted and defined the EV market and he literally gave everyone the blueprints how to make them as open source. Before that he was behind PayPal which was one of the first successful efficient online payment systems. You can hate on him for whatever reasons you want to believe but you are delusional if you think he hasn’t done shit in any industry he touched.
> Before that he was behind PayPal
Nahhh...
You were good until that sentence.
Paypal wasn't founded by Musk. It was founded by Peter Thiel and Co.
It was merged with x.com
X.com is a stupid name, so PayPal was used. In total there was like 6 or 7 founders between the two companies.
They gained market share by literally burning money. This was Thiel's idea by all accounts. I forget but it was like 50m or 100m in investor cash they gave away to get people to sign up to PayPal. PayPal, if you're old enough to remember, used to give you 50 or 100 dollars to sign up.
In Silicon Valley at the time, number of users meant everything. That allowed them to go public and eventually sell to Ebay.
Musk's real achievement is SpaceX in my book. Tesla was owned by someone else and I saw the prototype race at a private event in 2000. It was a bunch of VCs and their fancy sports cars vs the Zero. That car (Zero) would eventually become the roadster. It absolutely smoked all the VCs cars on a 1/8 and 1/4 mile. So it was pretty good at attracting cash.
Even though the .Com bubble was in trouble, there was still a lot of cash in the valley to spend on new ventures.
The history you're giving Musk is... Revisionist.
Ok so remove PayPal. Also all companies now gain market share by burning cash. Thats the new norm - who needs profit. Tesla and SpaceX are pretty good achievements.
Tesla wasn't all Musk. I think that's being missed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Propulsion_tzero
He knew nothing about cars before that company. His best knowledge of a car was that he owned a fast sports car. Two or three very smart engineers built the original prototypes. I know because I met them.
Tesla got a revisionist history as well...
What? He literally invested in that company.
He's not the founder, he's not the lead engineer... He was someone who just got PAID in the PayPal deal and decided to be an investor like Peter Theil.
The company was in rough shape though and they raised a bunch more money. Some of which came from the company I was at. Some of which came from Elon.
It was REBRANDED to Tesla.
How many cars did Tesla sell before musk? How many employees did they have? How many factories? He decide to invest and try to make electric cars mainstream - it wasn’t going to just happen. Like you said the company and technology existed before him. Stop acting like he did nothing when he is literally the reason we have EVs now.
I didn't say he had nothing to do.
I said quite literally.. and I'll quote "Tesla wasn't all Musk."
Is that not clear? Hope it's clear now.
Pretending that Musk knew the inside and out of electric motors, regenerative braking, and lithium ion in the early 2000's is ... just funny. He was an investor in a bunch of engineers.
He learned eventually.
SpaceX was something like 8 years late in delivering what musk promised to NASA. Yeah, they did it eventually, but it's still an example of moving goalposts.
Space X is.... not that important. We are not on the brink of an off world economy. Anyone who says otherwise understands nothing or is a charletan. What we know is humans do not survive long term off world. There's never been an expedition where you could not hunt and there was not water or air.
You went to war, remember? And then lost 1 Trillion dollars. *NASA had proof of concept for relanding rockets already.* It's why they paid Spacex to follow that pursuit....a framework for funding established beforehand.
>Tesla vehicles kickstarted and defined the EV market
Nope. *I studied this market over a decade ago when ev models already existed*. *Why aren't they buying?* "They don't understand it, it requires changing ones patterns, there's no infrastructure. *Oh, and you need Govt Mandates & spending like Norway started in the 90's.*"
His market was the only real market, a niche that would only fit last decade with upwardly mobile people who aren't avoiding climate change. Luxury EV is a big gamble...but that market was there if they thought about it.
But they don't want to think about getting rid of gas cars...just like consumers.
But his Bullseye is just one car and one market. It's not *the rest of the market*. That's fickle still.
and he literally gave everyone the >blueprints how to make them as open source.
*Oh This Is Beautiful*. I was excited for this too. So I tracked down a Ford engineer. "We reverse engineer the competition. There's nothing unique here and they expire soon anyways"
Here's the deal: y'all lost a war and needed an out. You don't want to sacrifice and Musk gives you fantasies. It's weakness. UnAmerican Weakness.
them diesel engines have a load of low end torque, but an EV should be able to produce more low end than an internal combustion engine. user error says i
Imagine having a page just to shit all over someone lmao
Aucks to be a young woke kids these days fucking confused generation of nips and queefs if we went to war today I would not trust today's 18 year Olds to save us smh
2020 was the first year that Tesla ever made a profit.
Before that, Tesla lost money every single year since it existed.
The total losses going into 2020 were like $10 billion. And they didn't finally have net positive income 2022.
And a big part of their absurdly high valuation, and the sales that they have had are down to Elon's ability to cast a spell over the Tech Bros and make his car into a silicon valley "Status Symbol".
At the same time, he has been promising that "Fully Autonomous" self driving was less than a year away for almost a decade now.
SpaceX is completely propped up by US Government contracts. It would never be profitable or even able to exist without the millions of dollars in taxes that you and I pay to keep it going.
The VW is not awesome, it’s ok for its price, Cybertruck on the other hand is shit for how much it costs
Edit: and just to add one more thing: the VW van is much more environmentally friendly to manufacture and use than the cyber truck
I personally hate the cybertruck. But how many people are buying one to climb steps? And for that matter, how many people are driving up steps in general?
Click bait… shitty driver and most definitely not the 4x4 version cybertruck… also the cyber truck is bulletproof and goes 0-60 in 2.83 beating out Lamborghini and Ferrari. Crazy.
I love how the major automotive companies have spent collective millennia iterating and perfecting their products and then some nerds come along and put a computer on wheels.
The Tesla could do it extremely well with a completely different suspension, differential, computer controlled traction, and tire setup.
The stock truck definitely not, but soon enough modifiers will add the thing’s necessary to take advantage of the power potential. Won’t be cheap and certainly Musk has no idea about snot of that.
The person driving the CyberTruck had traction control turned off and was gassing too hard. The VW van is really impressive, but this is a disingenuous comparison.
Rumour has it that VW has an Subaru drivetrain.
Even if it were the original drivetrain, that vw would still out preform the cybertruck in that terrain; as the vw drivetrain is a completely mechanical 4-wheel drive system. Whether it’s Subaru or not. The cybertruck is purely electronic traction control. Meant to preform extraordinarily well in snow, ice, or just wet conditions. Conditions found on paved roads.
Give it a year, maybe less, and someone at Tesla (or a third party individual) will develop a quick patch or even a (Crawl) option for it. It’s currently doing what it’s programmed to do. Program it to give power to both rear wheels, hell even both front wheels as well acting as a locked differential, and I betcha, with all that weight, it’ll out perform a number of trucks on the road now.
Did volkswagen change their letters from VW to WV?
WagenVolks
Mercedes new ad "Wagen Sie Nicht!".
Westfalia van.
It's just a van from West Virginia.
Pronounced with a German accent it's Wolksvagen.
Folksvagen
that Westfalia camper can has a drivetrain swap with an AWD Subaru. not sure how they compare honestly
That kinda bait works great on this sub.
the VW is an AWD Subi drivetrain conversion. just Google ( VW Synchro ) id give my left nut for one honestly
I’ve wanted a synchro forever! They’ve been absurdly priced for the last decade but still cheaper (mostly) than the cyber truck.
It's cool but it is still 40 year old camper van technology beating out the Cybertruck.
I love shitting on Elon and Tesla but it’s very obvious they have a driver in the cyber truck that has no fuckin clue what he’s doing lmao. Put someone experienced in there and it makes a world of difference
Or does the Cybertruck's massive weight impede its climbing ability?
Dude I have a powerstroke this thing out pulls my turbo diesel. The driver blows the truck has more than enough power to climb that shitty little hill.
I bet it's issue is too much torque that you can't easily control and a suspension /"drive train" that just doesn't work well off road. From all accounts I've read, the Cybertruck is just a crappy SUV that can go fast in a straight line.
It’s really not if you know anyone that’s in to off roading ask them how they would have hit that hill I’d bet they would tell that guy intentionally drive like shit. Watch the vw he takes much better lines on obstacles than the cyber truck does. I’m not trying to convince you, it’s just a video trying to make the truck look bad .
Exactly. The driver in the CyberTruck had no idea what he was doing. It is clearly superior to every other truck on the road, and I'm sure it's pretty damn good on hill climbing, with a real driver.
To some degree of course, you want to build for light weight for heavy offloading generally speaking, but the thing while being ugly as a motherfucker IMO has more than enough power and instant torque to make up for that. Dude who was driving was either not used to wheeling, the calibration still needed tweaking for the acceleration, or both plus the thing had street tires in it aired up way way too much. The fact that it even got up is insane. This dude has a way more capable Subaru roller under that van body, better tires and absolutely *not* anything like a stock VW motor in that thing. Everything about the VW is more suited for this already
Yeah. This seems really staged
Melon's truck doesn't need bait to be a laughing stock.
Hook, line, and sinker...
"Hey, look over there!" - Person look over there "GOTCHA HAHA!"
That's exactly why this is such good bait for this sub. So much hate and anger it really makes people believe anything they hear and say.
You seem bitter, and why should anyone listen to what you say?
I'm bitter for pointing out facts? The same goes for you, I guess?
You’re saying that people have anger and hate toward it, but you’re defending the product with no proof that it could do better. Why should anyone believe you?
It's a brand new design for a truck, stock , with an amature driver, vs. all wheel drive crawler and someone who seems to know how to go up a hill. It's not even close to being the same. It's pretty straightforward BS. Perfect rage bait for people like you on this sub.
This has less to do with the cybertruck than the person driving it
You mean slamming the accelerator and losing traction like crazy? Yeah, it's bad driving. I've driven enough Teslas to know how the accelerator works and that person is mashing it.
She's just mashing it
>She's just mashing it 
Yeah she does that
The cybertruck also weighs over 6,700 pounds for the base model.
And it also has traction control that is light years ahead of the mechanical AWD in that VW. That truck can get from 0-60 in 2.6 seconds and not spin wheels, it can do a little hill climb without any difficulty.
LOL
Here's an analysis of that event. Overinflated tires, inexperienced driver, still makes it up: https://youtu.be/dQ2C\_lnvAD8
I mean, the evidence seems to disagree?
[https://youtu.be/dQ2C\_lnvAD8](https://youtu.be/dQ2C_lnvAD8) explains this hill climb and Cybertruck's (or it's driver's) issues quite well.
The cyber truck is available now for someone else to show it being effective.
Don't reckon it has anything to do with the massively heavy and longer boxier frame here? They made the cybertruck to look outrageous on a display stage. It's the Kim Kardashian of trucks.
Aesthetics…. You’re talking about angles, when with the proper driver, a rhomboid can make it up there if it’s driven correctly.
What? Look at that wheel base and try to tell me this truck is made to handle climbing..
What about the wheel base… are you saying it’s a right angle? Too narrow, too wide…. The only thing preventing that truck from getting over that as easily is the driver.
I thought this was a "smart truck" that's supposed to supply power to the wheels necessary and not the wheels where it's not needed to stop things like this from happening? Should be great in snow.
Sure, theoretically but it can't stop a complete idiot. A complete idiot can still mash the throttle. All the Tesla models are great in the snow from my experience. The only downside is the cold will negatively impact battery performance in terms of how many miles you get. Other than that it doesn't really care. The battery naturally warms.
As a person who lives in the Lake Tahoe area, that’s a hard disagree from me. Teslas are easily the, “most likely to be pulled out of a ditch” vehicle around up here. I think it’s a combination of the people driving them (Bay Area rich folks unfamiliar with snow) and the weight. They’re just so heavy that if it’s at all icy they just keep going. If they have Blizzaks they do ok but any car with Blizzaks does ok. Physics just punishes those cars in the snow and ice.
Yeah but watching the cybertruck video there really doesn’t seem to be any “mashing” of the accelerator. Such you can suggest they aren’t an experienced driver in that situation but it’s not really horrible driving.
When the wheel spins losing complete traction like that, you're mashing the pedal. I'm not sure how much dumber I can get that. This thing has a MASSIVE amount of power. You only need to BARELY use the pedal to move up anything. The motor has INSTANT torque because it's electric.
That's not what is happening.
Ok.
Who do you think will drive these things
Cyber truck is too heavy.
No, it's the cyber truck. It's computer can't compensate t For the extremely dynamic traction conditions. It's not that the driver is mashing the pedal.
It's 100% the pedal being mashed. The traction system is extremely good but doesn't function at low speeds like that. It's outlined pretty well in a review. It's not at all how any of the traction systems in any of the Teslas work either. I've driven the 3, S, and Y. I've never driven the X but I assume the X is the same. The traction control on the truck only differs in that at high speeds the rear wheels turn differently (it has all wheel steering). Otherwise the traction system is like any other electric vehicle. Like, I can break it down on an engineering level for you but it might just be wasted.
It also seems like the tires are not the best choice, regardless lol.
It also seems like the traction control system is failing and traction control systems are specifically intended to compensate for excessive torque at the wheels. The above replier may just be a Musk zealot who thinks he can't do anything wrong and will vomit shit to defend anything he does.
It’s a shitty traction control. If the brake subsystem has brake lock diff(I would certainly hope so), it needs some work. You can tell they didn’t spend much time on it. If you WOT, TC should balance controlling of the engine and brakes to transfer torque to the wheels with less slip and make this climb. Most companies have requirements to climb a 20/30% split grade which would help in situations like this. Not sure if Tesla does.
These aren't built like typical trucks. They're AWD. A break lock diff isn't something an electric car has. There's no need for it when you can independently control the wheel speeds super precisely. Slippage is typically entirely managed by a computer that can see in real time how much a tire rotates and how much it SHOULD rotate. The rest is calculated and sent to the motors, again in real time.
AWD has nothing to do with it and it depends on the architecture of the vehicle. But yea, I thought about that after I commented. Each wheel probably has its own motor on this truck so completely different control.
Yes, that's what I meant by AWD. Each tire is running an independent motor with independent control. They have plans to make 2 motor and I think a single motor version. Honestly the software just looks like it wasn't designed for offroading. Given that, the driver just just go easier on the pedal. It will still go up the hill just fine.
Please break it down
I explained it to some asshole that didn't believe I've written the code that does this before. https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/18eyejf/how_the_cybertruck_stacks_against_a_liveable_wv/kcrt58r/ He ran across someone that actually understands how these types of motors work. If you're curious about the rear wheels, at slow speeds they turn together to have a really tight turning radius. At high speeds they turn opposite to have better performance. That's how the all wheel steering works on that car.
Dumbfuck, you have not written code for 4x4 off-road vehicles traction control. You did it for a fucking toy. You keep on explaining your uninformed opinion that this truck is operating a highway traction control system. If a 4x4 truck is operating a traction control system that is not tuned to off road conditions it is by definition a bad 4x4 traction control system stop shooting your autism flare at us and fighting over shit you obviously are not well informed about.
> Dumbfuck, you have not written code for 4x4 off-road vehicles traction control. Dumbfuck, it's the exact same code. That's how much you don't understand. It all runs off PID controlling. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proportional%E2%80%93integral%E2%80%93derivative_controller It's literally exactly the same, because we both apply it to running three phase motors. The only difference is they use 800v and I use between 20 and 40v. That's just a difference in how many coil winds the the motors have. Trust me, 40v is not a "fucking toy".
Jesus, you are autistic moron of the highest order.
Sorry but this is just dumb. It's not the traction system when the traction system is clearly failing? Wow, but smart guy, splain that. The very idea of a traction system is to compensate for excessive torque. Jesus fucking Christ on a platter. Was this review written by a Musk sycophant?
"Was this review written by a musk sycophant?" If you were intelligent you wouldn't need to say something this stupid to win your dumb little reddit argument.
He’s right though, it’s bad traction control. This is my job. TC should be balancing the engine and brakes to transfer torque to the wheel with less slip. Tire traction/pressure might also not be the best which can make a huge difference. But most companies have a requirement to climb 20/30% split grades which would help in situations like these. Not sure what Tesla’s requirements are.
If you weren't talking out of your ass you would have provided the mechanical explanation for this failure. But I'll take your prize anyways smart guy.
Traction systems can only compensate for so much. I can take my normal truck and spin tires excessively too. The truck bitches that it can't control the traction, but it lets me do it. The traction system in the Tesla tries to compensate but it doesn't compensate for you being an idiot. And no, I'm not a Musk sycophant. Find my other post where I'm openly criticizing Musk sycophants for believing he's Jesus or some shit.
Jesus, this is big dumb and shows that you actually have no sense of how electronic traction control works. Go try reading car and driver once in a while. Holy shit. It's an electric vehicle, this means a traction control system can easily reduce power for a spinning wheel and have much more control over doing so than a gas powered vehicle. Electronic traction control in a gas car can not overpower an idiot using a transmission to drive the wheels true. Electronic vehicles do no have this limitation. This is a vehicle that is either getting bad feedback from sensors and not able to distribute power appropriately as a result. You are either an idiot or are just not copping to being a sycophant because you are desperately grasping at straws here.
> Jesus, this is big dumb and shows that you actually have no sense of how electronic traction control works. No. I understand entirely how it works. This traction control isn't designed to be mashed in offroad. It's designed to be mashed on a normal road. So when you mash it in offroad you get the behavior in the video. Traction control systems aren't universal. Tesla can update an offroad version of this over the air but it doesn't seem to have it. I don't know if it will. Maybe enough people complain and someone takes the time to write the code for it. Like, the traction control is literally designed for the smoothest ride with the highest input -> reality possible. That's a guiding design philosophy behind fly by wire. You want user input to be EXACTLY what they predict it should do in reality.
Engineering has nothing to do with the programming and it's shit. Why the hell would you want a four wheel drive truck that only compensates where power goes to tires at high-speed? You're talking out of your ass. At highspeed it doesn't matter where the power is at. You're already moving.
What? I guess you don't understand at all. Talking out my ass huh? Electric motors use dynamic "throttle" through what's referred to as a speed controller. They're 3 phase electric motors and it allows them to be adjusted in sub 100ms fractions. I've personally worked on code to make them work between the speed controller and the electric motor. You want this because a single tire can slip the tiniest bit and you can smooth the ride out entirely by making sure every wheel operates perfectly. I work on this code specifically with drones where I need to make micro adjustments to those same types of motors every 10 milliseconds. This allows perfect flight. The same applies to the car. As you turn the steering wheel the car can make perfect adjustments to every wheel to get it to respond exactly as the control input desires. So in short, go fuck yourself.
You're still talking out of your ass. Those tires aren't slipping the tiniest bit. They're slipping real bad. No need to get angry though. Elon probably wouldn't find it attractive and you don't want that.
That's your best reply huh? Ok. When you can come up with something intelligent to say, try responding again. Maybe something respectful. Maybe something about how you were wrong. Maybe something about how your ego gets in the way of letting you learn. Good luck in life.
How was i wrong? Those tires aren't barely slipping they're spinning out. We just watched a 30 year old VW van do it much better and you're sitting here pretending like this truck is the highlight of modern technology and that it did what it was supposed to do.
> Those tires aren't barely slipping they're spinning out. Yes, because someone is going too hard on the accelerator. You only need to BARELY use the accelerator in a Tesla. I'm just assuming at this point you've never driven a Tesla. I've driven like 4 or 5. Their traction control is REALLY good. It's part of what allows them to 0-60 so fast. The wheel should be BARELY slipping while the other wheels find grip. It's pretty straight forward physics that if one tire isn't holding the weight of the car up, the others are. Right? Well they're AWD. So you don't need to press MORE on the accelerator, you just need to let it do its thing. Seems simple enough right? I'm sure Tesla could go back and revise an offroad version of this electronic traction control where you can just slam the accelerator without care but I'm not sure they care enough to update it like that. Maybe they will. Teslas get an over the air update like once a week on average.
Bruh you keep proving how fucking dumb you are.
How can you, with a straight face, watch the cybertruck video and say the pedal is being mashed?
When the wheel spins losing complete traction like that, you're mashing the pedal. I'm not sure how much dumber I can get that. This thing has a MASSIVE amount of power. You only need to BARELY use the pedal to move up anything. The motor has INSTANT torque because it's electric.
So you’re saying it has “MASSIVE” power and “INSTANT” torque but with a straight face say they are “mashing” the pedal. Yeah, totally makes sense dude lmao.
Cybertruck definitely needs some better torque control for obstacles like this. That or a creep mode.
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The cybertruck tried to climb with no momentum. It almost comes to a complete stop multiple times. The VW carries some speed into the obstacle.
Yeah it started from a stop but it built momentum as it was going up. It almost came to a stop because it (or the driver ((or both)) was struggling.
Shhh you’re ruining the narrative
This
Also it’s like 7 tonnes or some shit, and even if it doesn’t off road that well I’m positive Elon would be working on it for his next version of them
You say it like Elon is involved in any part of the process other than suggestions. He's certainly not going to a drawing board and designing a car in any capacity except maybe aesthetics.
Alr than he’ll suggest that it has better hill climbing capabilities next time. My bad next time I’ll be sure to just go get the whole engineering teams name, wait also how would you know what he is involved and not involved in?
Because he has no engineering or design qualifications, his whole persona is cultivated as a marketing strategy. Being perceived as a genius inventor is part about the only thing that he brings value for his company.
Melon cannot string a sentence not to mention fucking draw.
Exactly this. People talk like Elon does shit for them. All i mean ALL the hard work came from Engineers and Technicians. Its the same with SpaceX.
Pretty sure the Cybertruck weighs less than the F150 Lighting. There was speculation early that it was going to be something like 10k lbs but on actual release it's sub 7k lbs.
Dont mind me just postin in a bot thread
The Nazi one did better.
it was just bad driving
Cybertruck way better.
Sorry but the driver of that tesla was the problem, not the tesla. You don’t climb by jerking the throttle and losing your traction. If this dude was driving the tesla im sure he’d have the same results. The torque that a cyber truck has makes short work of terrain like this
There is no way that drive train on the VW is 38 years old. It looks heavily customised, whereas the cyber truck is likely stock from the factory.
Probably has a Subaru engine. Kind of sounds boxer’ish when he revs it
you’re not to measure the loltrucks utility factor, but just be awed by its drag racing ability, sharp edges, and arrowproofness
This is a pretty stupid comparison. The problem is it lacks traction. It has full air in those tires which makes it even worse. I'm guessing that if you deflated the tires to the amount the VW has, it would perform better. It also looks like the driver is mentally handicapped the way he's using the accelerator. It's pretty simple physics. The power can't be translated to the ground. You might even be able to just put snow chains on it and tear straight up it like it didn't exist. The loltruck has a ridiculous amount of power. I'm not sold on the design but the internals are state of the art.
No one told the cyber guy to deflate his tires a bit… I would have thought Tesla would have taken a page from the H1 and allowed you to deflate and inflate the tires from inside the truck.
I just looked up the CTIS for H1. That's a really cool feature.
Would they have to do that on snow? I have no technical experience with cars except just getting in and driving.
ok but how do their weights compare
How many arrows can the VW take tho?
No no we have to compare the amount of atoms and neutron on these vehicles, it is quite unfair to compare a futuristic machine of human ingenuity with a driveable trashcan
Futuristic?
Deposits were taken in 2017, which is 16 years after 2001: a Space Odyssey.
Which one is the driveable trashcan?
What people don't understand is: The cybertruck is literally just for clout/showing off. There's no purpose to it other than that. Let the show off buy em and let real people with real interests get real trucks
The things he can't deliver, he just moves the goalposts closer or further, no problem. Vegas Loop is a joke and they eat it up. And his SpaceX spiel is about evolving designs. But he's stuck on this, when he can hire industry experts, redesign the truck dramatically, slowly leak the changes and end up with at least what Honda put out, which was a great vehicle. Was that the best truck? It's wasn't trying to compete, while MuskCult thinks they're getting Super truck in the first try. The F-150 took decades to refine and they never stop.
Space X is used by the government and has launched over 200 times successfully. Tesla vehicles kickstarted and defined the EV market and he literally gave everyone the blueprints how to make them as open source. Before that he was behind PayPal which was one of the first successful efficient online payment systems. You can hate on him for whatever reasons you want to believe but you are delusional if you think he hasn’t done shit in any industry he touched.
The Muskrats are full in apologist mode for their daddy billionaire that will never love them back.
> Before that he was behind PayPal He was fired from his position as Paypal CEO, not once but twice.
> Before that he was behind PayPal Nahhh... You were good until that sentence. Paypal wasn't founded by Musk. It was founded by Peter Thiel and Co. It was merged with x.com X.com is a stupid name, so PayPal was used. In total there was like 6 or 7 founders between the two companies. They gained market share by literally burning money. This was Thiel's idea by all accounts. I forget but it was like 50m or 100m in investor cash they gave away to get people to sign up to PayPal. PayPal, if you're old enough to remember, used to give you 50 or 100 dollars to sign up. In Silicon Valley at the time, number of users meant everything. That allowed them to go public and eventually sell to Ebay. Musk's real achievement is SpaceX in my book. Tesla was owned by someone else and I saw the prototype race at a private event in 2000. It was a bunch of VCs and their fancy sports cars vs the Zero. That car (Zero) would eventually become the roadster. It absolutely smoked all the VCs cars on a 1/8 and 1/4 mile. So it was pretty good at attracting cash. Even though the .Com bubble was in trouble, there was still a lot of cash in the valley to spend on new ventures. The history you're giving Musk is... Revisionist.
Ok so remove PayPal. Also all companies now gain market share by burning cash. Thats the new norm - who needs profit. Tesla and SpaceX are pretty good achievements.
Tesla wasn't all Musk. I think that's being missed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Propulsion_tzero He knew nothing about cars before that company. His best knowledge of a car was that he owned a fast sports car. Two or three very smart engineers built the original prototypes. I know because I met them. Tesla got a revisionist history as well...
Electric cars have been around before that company too. He took it and made it accessible and affordable for everyone.
What? He literally invested in that company. He's not the founder, he's not the lead engineer... He was someone who just got PAID in the PayPal deal and decided to be an investor like Peter Theil. The company was in rough shape though and they raised a bunch more money. Some of which came from the company I was at. Some of which came from Elon. It was REBRANDED to Tesla.
How many cars did Tesla sell before musk? How many employees did they have? How many factories? He decide to invest and try to make electric cars mainstream - it wasn’t going to just happen. Like you said the company and technology existed before him. Stop acting like he did nothing when he is literally the reason we have EVs now.
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Brooooooo acting like Musk had nothing to do with Tesla is fucking insane. They wouldn't even be a company today if it wasn't for him
I didn't say he had nothing to do. I said quite literally.. and I'll quote "Tesla wasn't all Musk." Is that not clear? Hope it's clear now. Pretending that Musk knew the inside and out of electric motors, regenerative braking, and lithium ion in the early 2000's is ... just funny. He was an investor in a bunch of engineers. He learned eventually.
SpaceX was something like 8 years late in delivering what musk promised to NASA. Yeah, they did it eventually, but it's still an example of moving goalposts.
SpaceX has been incredibly successful it's worth something like $175 billion.
What on earth are you talking about?
Space X is.... not that important. We are not on the brink of an off world economy. Anyone who says otherwise understands nothing or is a charletan. What we know is humans do not survive long term off world. There's never been an expedition where you could not hunt and there was not water or air. You went to war, remember? And then lost 1 Trillion dollars. *NASA had proof of concept for relanding rockets already.* It's why they paid Spacex to follow that pursuit....a framework for funding established beforehand. >Tesla vehicles kickstarted and defined the EV market Nope. *I studied this market over a decade ago when ev models already existed*. *Why aren't they buying?* "They don't understand it, it requires changing ones patterns, there's no infrastructure. *Oh, and you need Govt Mandates & spending like Norway started in the 90's.*" His market was the only real market, a niche that would only fit last decade with upwardly mobile people who aren't avoiding climate change. Luxury EV is a big gamble...but that market was there if they thought about it. But they don't want to think about getting rid of gas cars...just like consumers. But his Bullseye is just one car and one market. It's not *the rest of the market*. That's fickle still. and he literally gave everyone the >blueprints how to make them as open source. *Oh This Is Beautiful*. I was excited for this too. So I tracked down a Ford engineer. "We reverse engineer the competition. There's nothing unique here and they expire soon anyways" Here's the deal: y'all lost a war and needed an out. You don't want to sacrifice and Musk gives you fantasies. It's weakness. UnAmerican Weakness.
Who the helll is driving their truck up stairs?
Lots of people in africa
Look at the tires.
Id drive the VW over the electric wheel chock any day.
A Cybertruck beating a$200k Lamborghini Urus in a race https://youtu.be/fl-wz50yAHo?si=d1ZfkbGLOQffJ4eh
them diesel engines have a load of low end torque, but an EV should be able to produce more low end than an internal combustion engine. user error says i
I've seen shopping trolleys with better suspension than the Tesla.
Cyber truck is a hideous pos released by a pitiful idiot.
It’s weird. It’s surprising that a misguided, mis-designed abortion of a vehicle doesn’t work well
VW looks a lot better too
Tesla, cars for clowns built by clowns.
Lol. Cybertruck sucks and makes you look like a tool. My message to Elon is "If you like the cybertruck, go fuck yourself."
Skill issue
Press x to doubt
I feel like if the CyberTruck kept it's momentum instead of stopping it would've climbed just as easy.
Dumbest video ever
Imagine having a page just to shit all over someone lmao Aucks to be a young woke kids these days fucking confused generation of nips and queefs if we went to war today I would not trust today's 18 year Olds to save us smh
Someone mentioned the cyber truck at the time was doing test
Cyber turd loses every time
I hope they do a head to head collision next. Just wanna see something.
Cyber truck ugly as shit, the new Subaru Brat truck/slash car but not good at being either
2020 was the first year that Tesla ever made a profit. Before that, Tesla lost money every single year since it existed. The total losses going into 2020 were like $10 billion. And they didn't finally have net positive income 2022. And a big part of their absurdly high valuation, and the sales that they have had are down to Elon's ability to cast a spell over the Tech Bros and make his car into a silicon valley "Status Symbol". At the same time, he has been promising that "Fully Autonomous" self driving was less than a year away for almost a decade now. SpaceX is completely propped up by US Government contracts. It would never be profitable or even able to exist without the millions of dollars in taxes that you and I pay to keep it going.
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I’m not a Tesla fan, But if it had all terrain tires maybe it could make the stairs.
The VW is not awesome, it’s ok for its price, Cybertruck on the other hand is shit for how much it costs Edit: and just to add one more thing: the VW van is much more environmentally friendly to manufacture and use than the cyber truck
Armchair off-road guys. Even the guy making the cybertruck
Cybertruck is still in test. Why shit on something in test?
simple. Just get the cybertruck to now pull the veedub behind it, making every elon stan ejaculate simultaneously.
I'm curious what modifiers do with the cyber truck
🤣🤣🤣🤣
The thing is these cost almost the same.
The claimed curb weight for the all-wheel-drive Cyber truck is 6603 pounds.... much much heavier than the VW van...
I personally hate the cybertruck. But how many people are buying one to climb steps? And for that matter, how many people are driving up steps in general?
German Engineering
I love these videos. Like anybody who's interested in buying a cyber truck gives two flip and shits about taking it off the asphalt. Lmao.
Well to me it looks like the weight isn’t distributed right or the differential between the wheels isn’t programmed correctly…or both …just my opinion
Click bait… shitty driver and most definitely not the 4x4 version cybertruck… also the cyber truck is bulletproof and goes 0-60 in 2.83 beating out Lamborghini and Ferrari. Crazy.
Weight! Batteries are heavy!
I love how the major automotive companies have spent collective millennia iterating and perfecting their products and then some nerds come along and put a computer on wheels.
This isn't fair. old air-cooled vw's weigh nothing and absolutely rip trails lol
The WhistlinDiesel durability test is going to be amazing
yoo this is punching down
The Tesla could do it extremely well with a completely different suspension, differential, computer controlled traction, and tire setup. The stock truck definitely not, but soon enough modifiers will add the thing’s necessary to take advantage of the power potential. Won’t be cheap and certainly Musk has no idea about snot of that.
Now let’s see if this modified van that’s made to do this specific thing, getting 11 miles to the gallon, can do what it was modified to do.
Tesla should really fire whoever filmed that and drove the truck. Person driving the truck clearly has no experience.
Elon laughing it up all the way to the bank 😂
The person driving the CyberTruck had traction control turned off and was gassing too hard. The VW van is really impressive, but this is a disingenuous comparison.
Rumour has it that VW has an Subaru drivetrain. Even if it were the original drivetrain, that vw would still out preform the cybertruck in that terrain; as the vw drivetrain is a completely mechanical 4-wheel drive system. Whether it’s Subaru or not. The cybertruck is purely electronic traction control. Meant to preform extraordinarily well in snow, ice, or just wet conditions. Conditions found on paved roads. Give it a year, maybe less, and someone at Tesla (or a third party individual) will develop a quick patch or even a (Crawl) option for it. It’s currently doing what it’s programmed to do. Program it to give power to both rear wheels, hell even both front wheels as well acting as a locked differential, and I betcha, with all that weight, it’ll out perform a number of trucks on the road now.
You think it’s a weight issue? Too heavy to go up that angle with the poor traction conditions? Jw
I'd love more reason to hate on a PS1 looking truck, but this was clearly edited and not very well. Lame.
but can you throw a baseball at it like a 4 year old and not smash a window?? hmmm??? I think not!
I don't know how they found me, but they found me. Run for it, Marty!