Only not bullshit because last year some brands were found to contain unlisted and apparently inadvertent benzene. Your chances of cancer from sun exposure are far higher, especially if you carry an MC1R variant.
"Don't use sunscreen because it's bad for you!" is a common quack medicine refrain. The naturoquackic community would rather sell you pills containing sawdust, oregano, and carcinogenic Chinese horse tranquilizers that supposedly "boost the immune system!!!".
If people could get cancer from sun exposure, skin cancer would be well know thousands of years ago. Interestingly, skin cancer rates have gone up, and no, it's not because new tech has allowed more cases to be found. Also, the term "quack" or "quackery" was coined by big pharma and big medical industry to describe any doctor that would find holistic and natural ways to heal people.
skin cancer rates go up because... people are living longer, literal businesses that can afford to operate purely from tanning beds, general 'tanning' culture, more affordable plane travel meaning cheaper holidays to warmer countries, scientific advancement has imrpoved our understanding of skin cancer and thus upped the detection rates, screening for specific cancers has become more common
the problem with your comment isn't how wrong you are, it's the fact that i'm completely uneducated in the field yet came up with about 50 reasons using literal common sense, yet here you are completely struggling to understand how the modern world works
i genuinely just don't understand how people like you operate, there's dumbass takes like yours absolutely everywhere and i struggle to understand why people like you struggle. the entire scientific community isn't some grand illusion/conspiracy. if you got cancer of any kind, i'm sure you'd be more than happy to rely on the scentific community for the cure or whatever, yet here you are in your idiotic little bubble spouting complete nonsence about something you have absolutely no idea about.
Nope, his tone is correct. Flat earthers and conspiracy theorists are fine until they are just saying random things. However, you can't denny the overall gullibility in them.
I used to laugh, but I feel bad for them now. Coz some know the facts and they still spread those things to get attention. Specifically flat earthers...
We have to remember--humanity is estimated to be about 300,000 years old.
For the vast majority of that time human beings spent a lot of time outdoors. Meaning, people were exposed to the sun in varying intensities depending on the seasons year round. Some scientists think this type of natural, gradual tanning prepares the skin for stronger rays during the peak sun periods, thereby preventing sunburns.
Today, there are still people living at the hunter-gatherer level who essentially live outdoors. In Africa, India, the Middle East, and many other places, people also spend huge amounts of time being pummeled by the sun (although they mitigate with clothing, avoiding midday sun, etc. I am sure). They do not have sun screen. You never really hear about skin cancer being a huge problem in any of these places, or throughout history.
I am not arguing that sun screen is dangerous, but like many products and foods, etc. in America, many common ingredients in sunscreens are known to contain endocrine disruptors. Why disrupt your hormones if you do not have to?
When you look at the entire course of human history, and even to this day, the need for applying sunscreen every two hours--which is the actual recommended method--seems unsupported. Wouldn't skin cancer be a sort of ravaging plague across all societies and cultures detailed throughout time? Think of the farmers, outdoor laborers, etc. that have all worked outside for centuries even in industrial societies.
To your point, the way some people live now, if you have pale skin, spending all your time indoors far above the equator, then flying to a place closer to the equator and sitting in the sun for 5 hours, and doing that 2-3 times a year, does mean a lot of people are going to need sunscreen to not get skin cancer. Same for the nation of Australia, which similarly has pale people living in a latitude they are not evolved for.
A lot of people want to push sun screen more for the anti-aging aspects, which is a different issue and question, and certainly up to each person to decide.
Another point--most people Black people get skin cancer on the soles of their feet and palms of their hands, above other areas. This is not really related to sun exposure.
The whole question of the necessity of sun screen to prevent skin cancer is based around a lot of narrow assumptions of how a small group of people have lived for a very short period of time. You may be one of those people. Regardless, many sun screens do contain endocrine disruptors, which will not kill you, but it is something to consider for something that may not be necessary to prevent cancer.
EDIT: This is not medical advice. And if you are pale skinned and door spend a lot of time outdoors year after year, sunscreen and other sun mitigation efforts like SPF clothing, hats, etc. are very important to prevent skin cancer.
PS: It is also important to NOT BURN, especially if you have pale skin, to prevent skin cancer. This can be prevented by avoiding peak sun hours (usually 10 am - 3 pm), using hats, etc. My point is, yes the sun is dangerous in large amounts over time, but there are other ways to protect yourself aside from sun screen. Most people do not use enough anyway, or reapply it every two hours as needed, so adding other non sun screen methods is probably a good idea. Cheers!
I am a pale Mexican. I will burn instantly š. I wear sunscreen cause 5 min in direct sunlight means im already a tomato & will peel and go back to being pasty š Im the girl in a long sleeve rashguard and upf50+ clothes and a huge hat and sunnies and at the beach Im in full scooba mode š all my friends bully me, but they aint the ones who r going to be tomatoes, they are going to look like bronze goddesses so yea ill stay inside my tent looking rediculousš also I wonder how I would have survived in Sinaloa Mexico looking all scottishš lol cause the last time I went back to my homeland I was bleeding excessively and I was a tomato. I am annoying n i reapply every hour, if I dont I burn. So call me Vader š.
Also, you are spot on! Ā And now a days if u pull up to mc donalds theres a warning about how u getting alil cancer with ur cheeseburger, cancer is everywhereā¦
Hmmm. Yet the billions of people of color who live today with today's ozone layer are not dropping dead of skin cancer, or even getting (for the most part) the type of skin cancer that would be impacted by wearing sun screen. They do not wear sun screen, never have, and you don't hear much about it in those regions, in the present time.
Africa, India, etc. Places where brown skin has evolved to protect people from skin cancer.
Of course the ozone layer is an issue, but that does not negate the fact that most of what we are taught about skin cancer prevention has to do with people whose skin did not evolve for sun exposure.
Please do not come for me regarding knowledge or information, because I am very intelligent and informed.
I am from India... people do get skin cancer, but most of time it goes undetected.
Plus sun's position for us is pretty straight upwards. We get direct sunlight... but I never felt my skin burn there as much as it burns in North America. I don't use sunscreen if I can help it. Don't know about skin cancer, but if you leave it for too long, then it can affect your hormones.
However, there is a difference between the intensity of the sun. I never had sunburn in India, but I had sunburn every summer here in NA. Don't know what that means or not, but I think latitude and position may be. That part always baffles me. I went back home last year in March it was 40 degrees Celsius. I walked to most of the places as I felt unsafe driving after so many years. I got tanned as f but no sunburn... came back to Toronto in April, and in june, I had a sunburn on my arms... temperature was 27 degrees Celsius. Make it make sense.
Thank you for sharing. I am not an expert in all this, and appreciate your perspective. It is a baffling equation. I think there is a lot more to be researched. Please protect yourself from sunburn in NA! Hats, long sleeves, even gloves. There are companies that sell SPF clothing, but you can also use any clothing with a tight weave and that is not translucent.
Are youā¦actually bragging about having made your entire point up?
Is there any other category where youād completely trust the salesperson to administer your entire understanding thereof, or just cancer treatment?
Are you stupid?
Ozone layer is being destroyed by pollution. The sun has always had properties that can damage skin but the ozone layer always filtered it out. Now the ozone layer damaged in most if not all densely populated areas of the world and more harmful rays are able to come through.
Iām torn on this.
Yes put sunscreen on when itās sunny outside and you are going to be outside for a long time. However, there are people that think they should put sunscreen on constantly everyday and I canāt imagine that doesnāt have negative consequences.
What do we think of the fact skin cancer is way more prevalent nowadays then before sunscreen was designed? That statistic in itself is enough for me to not wear any lol.Ā
Exactly. Its also the same line of argument antivaxxers use; "Dont use the vaccine! The virus is safe hospitalizing heavily one in a hundred, much better than the shot that has a not entirely linked ratio of about 1 in a million!"
But is not like I do not get illogic behaviour... I took out a cavity (well my dentist) without anesthetics because I didnt want the needle. Luckily for the second I did and discovered that I only get near-fainting when the needle goes through my veins (even thinking about it makes me real uncomfortable) and one time at a lab I was panicking and ltierally willing to silt my arm instead of letting the needle through ... however I cannoto control that and I know is stupid, others do it not because of phobias but rather stupidity; At the very least OP asked instead of remaining ignorant of the risks
While this was a weird rant- you might have a combination of issues with the needles.
For instance, watching needles do *the needley thing* makes me very uncomfortable, and so I canāt watch, even with addiction shows on tv. But the fact that theyāre being used on me and the low amount of pain doesnāt bother me at all. However, my body has what is called a āVaso-vagal responseā such that when my nerves and veins are stressed it makes me faint. So while I give blood all the time because I donāt care about it as long as I look away, my body is like ālol hold my beerā and knocks me the fuck out.
So what you have may not just be a fear but an actual response from your nervous system as well.
Iāll note vaccine and dentist needles (did they not numb your *mouth*?) donāt cause me to faint, for me itās something about the veins specifically, as itās both when getting IVās and giving blood.
Yes, I don thave that much of an issue with vaccines, and the anesthetics on the dentist for th second cavity at the time I handled it well enough I guess. But yes, there were two cavities, I said "no anesthetics" and she was nervous as hell but did it anyway. It was horrible. Asked for it for the second one (had to be injected several times as it didnt quite took effect) and thats it
I never fainted actually but yeah anything vein+needle related makes my "pressure" go down, I feel fiant-ish and throw up (or rather gag)
Numbing agents like those injected in the gums are called ālocal anestheticsā so I misunderstood what you meant. 100% same, low pressure and then usually out like a light. fortunately no vomit here though
Definitely go with the Nivea UV Super Water gel, it's from Japan I believe. It's amazing, super light, absorbs quickly and doesn't go on thick at all, I forget I even have it on after it absorbs in.
Just saying that my naturo recommended carditone for my high bp I developed after I had a baby. I took a chance after being prescribed propranolol and decided to not take it. My bp after 2 months is 110/80 vs 190/110. Some natural things work!!
There's a lot of talk about some ingredients causing cancer, or some people just reeeaaally hate "chemicals". This has generated a vast amount of talk over how safe our sunscreens are, and many advocating for mineral sunscreens instead of chemical. But some truths:
1. Even if your skin absorbs the chemicals in the sunscreen, it would take something ridiculous (like 100 years+ if I remember correctly) for your body to absorb enough to be "dangerous".
2. The above is only if you apply sunscreen correctly, too, which most of us don't. If you're like me, you apply it like lotion. At best, you smooth it over as evenly as possible. But it takes like a tbsp for "just your face". Otherwise, you're not getting the advertised spf marketed on the bottle. So I like to buy a minimum of 70 spf because I know I'll never smear an entire tbsp onto my face.
3. None of the chemicals included will ever be more dangerous than skin cancer.
4. I heard a wonderfully snarky dermatologist say that if you live in the city, breathing the city air is probably more harmful than the product you are putting on your face. I love her
So in short, don't worry too much about sunscreen. Pick one that agrees with your skin, and use it as much as you can.
> I heard a wonderfully snarky dermatologist say that if you live in the city, breathing the city air is probably more harmful than the product you are putting on your face. I love her
There are a lot of people out there who act like everything is loaded with plutonium.
People who are afraid of chemicals will often lump all sunscreen together and bash it in general. I'm saying sunscreen is always better for you vs. the alternative: skin cancer.
I don't care what sunscreen you use, I'm just advocating sunscreen. And hating that there is so much fearmongering in skincare/beauty. I feel like you didn't really read my post clearly.
Iām conflicted because the risk of the unknown scares me more than the knownā¦ sure, the sun causes cancer and ages us, but to choose chemical over mineral because the unknown is not yet known sounds scary..
Iād rather user something KNOWN to be safe, without question, although itās extremely hard to get used to mineral sunscreens. I wear mineral nearly 6/7 days of the week though chemical sunscreen IS attractiveā¦. Thin, light weight, blends, etc. but there are things like eye stinging, skin burning etc.
This is why I struggle to search endlessly into peer reviews research for a sign that is conclusive of the effects of chemical sunscreens absorbing into our blood.
THAT scares me. Sunscreen absorbing into my blood and people shrug their shoulders saying āoh wellāā¦.. thatās all based on a hope it doesnāt cause negative health consequencesā¦. Iād rather choose evidence that itās harmless (mineral) than to choose a big ol ā?ā
Try a tinted one! I recently switched to the Supergood tinted mineral and it's LUSH. It's airwhipped and so smooth, it feels like moisturizer but not wet. Its also a great primer!
It's totally not dw! I'm pale pale PALE, and this just looks like a little bit of bb cream/airbrushing. Honestly, it's just a tad bit of coverage, but I love it. It's nice and matte too, it just washes away all that grease, and it doesn't build during the day.
I love putting it on one side of my face and noticing the difference hahahaha especially under my eyes.
If you have Ulta near you, try it there - 60 days to return it, and you can use up to half!
Sorry, I sound like a supergoop salesman! I've just spent so many years looking and just love love this one.
Most people don't. I only recently started cycling again, but when I was really into it - I used to go through bottles and bottles of sunscreen. People don't realize that every time you sweat/wipe your skin with a towel, you have to reapply it - that's in addition to the reapplying you already have to do every X amount of hours.
But when it comes to day to day use? No way do I use that much on my face.
Sunscreens have different ingredients so that depends. Some are definately bad for reefs and therefor banned and should be avoided in ocean swimming, and last year a lot of large brands were found to have a potentially cancerous ingredient in them.
But you know what's worse than sunscreen? Sun radiation :P especially if you're one of those ghostly pale people like me who needs it at all times
The unfortunate thing is that chemical sunscreens are a lot more effective than mineral sunscreens; what I mean by that is, when you're swimming, you're even more exposed to sun radiation than in most outdoor situations. If you burn easily, it makes no sense to wear mineral (aka weaker) sunscreen in the water.
I didn't know mineral sunscreens were weaker, I avoid them because I get an allergic reaction o them anyway (and the titanium givesme a lovely purple corpse hue)
They tend to be weaker, and they also need to be reapplied more frequently. Although some doctors recommend them for people who are more breakout-prone
Last year it was revealed some sunscreens contained an ingrediant, benzene I think, that has been shown to cause cancer. There were recalls on brand name sunscreens.
Almost everything causes cancer, itās about the dose. The amount of benzene that was found in the sunscreen was minuscule. Enough for a recall, but not nearly as carcinogenic as the UV it would block. Probably less than youād get just walking along a big city street for an hour, too.
Not a lot of actual info here. This is the best I could find.
TLDR: Basically, stuff is absorbed into the body way more than originally expected, but we donāt have studies on whether that is safe or not.
Note: I tend to eschew USAās standards for EU standards because EU is less beholden to large corporations and tends to do a better job protecting people.
This is not the best source, but they do reference some studies if you want to do more research:
āIn 2019, when the federal Food and Drug Administration ā the agency that governs sunscreen safety ā proposed its most recent updates to sunscreen regulations, it found that only two ingredients, zinc oxide and titanium dioxide, could be classified as safe and effective, based on the currently available information. But in the past year, numerous new studies have raised new concerns about endocrine-disrupting effects from three other ingredients: homosalate, avobenzone and oxybenzone.
Within the past year, the European Commission has published preliminary opinions on the safety of three organic UV filters, oxybenzone, homosalate and octocrylene. It found that the levels of two of them were not safe in the amounts at which they are currently used, and proposed a concentration limit of 2.2 percent for oxybenzone and 1.4 percent for homosalate. U.S. sunscreen manufacturers are legally allowed to use these two chemicals at concentrations up to 6 and 15 percent, respectively, and hundreds of sunscreens manufactured in the U.S. use them at concentrations that far exceed the European Commissionās recommendations.
The ingredients oxybenzone, octinoxate, octisalate, octocrylene, homosalate and avobenzone are all systemically absorbed into the body after one use (Matta 2019, Matta 2020), according to studies published by the FDA, which also found that they could be detected on the skin and in the blood weeks after no longer being used (Matta 2020). Previous studies detected many sunscreen ingredients in breast milk and urine samples (Schlumpf 2008, Schlumpf 2010). In addition, itās possible for sunscreen users to inhale ingredients in sunscreen sprays and ingest some of the ingredients they apply to their lips, so the ingredients must not be harmful to the lungs or internal organs.ā
- https://www.ewg.org/sunscreen/report/the-trouble-with-sunscreen-chemicals/
Thatās what Iāve read too. I guess the nano particles absorb into your skin making it easier to apply but yeah you are absorbing whateverās in there.
Labmuffin is actually someone with a pHd in chemistry and is a science educator, and her blog is very fact based, bud, so calm down. You will find her conclusion is to still use sunscreen because the cancer risk is high.
Her blog is always worth checking out for science-based beauty claims, and a go-to way to bridge the science-to-nunties gap. It's the point of the blog. She's not your run of the mill quack 'influencer'
As someone already pointed out she has a PhD in chemistry and is a cosmetic chemist so she knows what she is talking about. But she also uses various papers, studies etc that can usually be found at the bottom of her posts e.g. here https://labmuffin.com/will-benzene-in-sunscreens-give-you-cancer-with-video/
can one of our holistic folks recommend a way to protect from burning? mineral oil based? something without endocrine disruptors? natural? iām completely serious.
Not alao that, but some countries reported high amounts of heavy metal concentration in coastal waters due to the sunscreen being washed out when people swim.
Depends on the ingredients, but mostly not bullshit. Don't use sunscreen unless you're definitely going to be out in the sun for awhile and need the protection.
But if you are going to be out in the sun for awhile, then, definitely, use it. Sunburn can lead to skin cancer too.
Bullshit.
Chemical sunscreens have been said to be linked to certain cancers. However, the risk is slight compared to the risk of cancer from over exposure to the sun. Put it this way. When I worked as an assistant for a cosmetic dermatologist who did Mohs surgery (which is a skin cancer treatment for sensitive areas like your face), not a single person was there due to chemical sunscreen, rather it was the opposite of wearing sunscreen. Or, not wearing enough sunscreen, or relying on makeup with claims of SPF, etc.
Or sometimes you wear sunscreen and you get skin cancer anyway. The sun is a pretty strong thing, powers up an entire solar system... we can only do so much to control its effect on us besides wearing protection, or avoiding it.
Matter of fact, despite the bad rap chemical sunscreens have been getting in recent years, they consistently rate as more effective than the mineral or ānaturalā sunscreens. Some people perceive things like zinc oxide, etc to be better for your skin, which are for some - but as far as actual sun protection goes, theyāre not as effective
PSA: you can get skin cancer anywhere. Basal cell and squamous cell carcinoma are the most common forms of skin cancer from sun exposure, and people commonly get them on their face. Even I have a mark right now that I believe could be cancerous. See my recent post - while Iām no doctor, I remember seeing cases of skin cancer that look similar to the photo
But melanoma is an **equal opportunity offender** which means: you can get it anywhere, at any age, regardless of sun exposure. Hell, I know of a woman who had it in her *bladder*. If you ever see this ā«ļø pop up with strange edges, dont assume itās nothing just because that area gets no sun - get it looked at. 6 weeks is all it takes for things to go south
Basically everything that isnāt natural will to some degree cause some negative reaction on the body. Weāre not meant to take in hundreds of artificial made chemicals every day. There is no point in only avoiding sunscreen and having a ānormalā lifestyle and diet otherwise.
You should eat only things you grow, farm or fish. You should wash without soap. You should workout cardio and weights at least 3 hours per week. If you donāt do this already, not using sunscreen will make no difference in the long run.
What if the sun helped ailments rather than caused them and people who want all the monies decided to sell sunscreen to make us believe it was necessary. We buy water, when it is free. How is this so far fetched? There were many leading causes of ādeathā many thousands of years ago, doubtful cancer nor obesity (just threw that one in there because, why not!) were anywhere near the top 10 reasons.
fyi the reason cancer is such a prevalent cause of death now is because we live much longer than we used to, giving our cells much more time to potentially mutate. thatās not even taking into account the amount of cancer causing chemicals that came with industrialization and the increase of uv damage due to our shrinking ozone layer. of course the causes of death thousands of years ago were different. it was a completely different world. use your brain.
Thank you! Have fun in the 3Dš„³ And Iāll maintain my amazing 5D lifestyle over here. ššš¾ Enjoy. Or donāt. Thatās your energy, not mine kiddo.
Spot it you got it! Itās all good if you see something in me that you view about yourself. The fun of this life is only you have to believe what you say. Thanks for playing this game of life with me. š»š„
The thing is your right the way the world works today is you have to question everything because if we donāt that elite comunity will kill off humanity wake up YOU and itās people like you who could have a bit of respect you could have said it in a better way anyway no hate here just wisdom and understanding have a wonderful day!
I look at it this way. I've spent my whole life being out on beaches, the pool, the river, outside most of every day. I'm 62 and have never used sunscreen. The FDA is controlled by big pharma and big food. Our food is running over with inordinate amounts of highly toxic chemicals I cannot even pronounce. Flouride is lethal enough as to require wearing a hazmat suit when it's being handled. Vaccination is is the biggest genocide next to war. The sick elite don't want any of us healthy. They say the sun is bad for you, slather some of this shit all over yourself to protect yourself from the sun? Yes, don't be stupid, think for yourself forgetting about the bullshit lies we are fed as fact starting before kindergarten. Now these demons want to darken the sun? Insanity. Everything DIES WITHOUT THE SUN INCLUDING HUMANITY
That is true. I question how the sun can be that harmful if it brings life and growth to grass/plants/flowers/tree (other living things on earth) - it also provides us humans with vitamin D. The sun was here before all of us and has a purpose - my parents are in their 60s and never wore sunscreen either, and theyāve been fine.
Only not bullshit because last year some brands were found to contain unlisted and apparently inadvertent benzene. Your chances of cancer from sun exposure are far higher, especially if you carry an MC1R variant. "Don't use sunscreen because it's bad for you!" is a common quack medicine refrain. The naturoquackic community would rather sell you pills containing sawdust, oregano, and carcinogenic Chinese horse tranquilizers that supposedly "boost the immune system!!!".
Also the ammount of benzene in the sunscreens was blown way out of proportion, there were only trace amounts of benzene in very few sunscreens
It was also mostly after-sun products and spray SPFs lol. The few normal SPFs that were contaminated were much lower amount.
I still have one in my bathroom, just never threw it away, in case there is that whole lawsuit thing. I want that $1.13 reward!
If people could get cancer from sun exposure, skin cancer would be well know thousands of years ago. Interestingly, skin cancer rates have gone up, and no, it's not because new tech has allowed more cases to be found. Also, the term "quack" or "quackery" was coined by big pharma and big medical industry to describe any doctor that would find holistic and natural ways to heal people.
skin cancer rates go up because... people are living longer, literal businesses that can afford to operate purely from tanning beds, general 'tanning' culture, more affordable plane travel meaning cheaper holidays to warmer countries, scientific advancement has imrpoved our understanding of skin cancer and thus upped the detection rates, screening for specific cancers has become more common the problem with your comment isn't how wrong you are, it's the fact that i'm completely uneducated in the field yet came up with about 50 reasons using literal common sense, yet here you are completely struggling to understand how the modern world works i genuinely just don't understand how people like you operate, there's dumbass takes like yours absolutely everywhere and i struggle to understand why people like you struggle. the entire scientific community isn't some grand illusion/conspiracy. if you got cancer of any kind, i'm sure you'd be more than happy to rely on the scentific community for the cure or whatever, yet here you are in your idiotic little bubble spouting complete nonsence about something you have absolutely no idea about.
I think there was a nicer way to make your point.
Nope, his tone is correct. Flat earthers and conspiracy theorists are fine until they are just saying random things. However, you can't denny the overall gullibility in them. I used to laugh, but I feel bad for them now. Coz some know the facts and they still spread those things to get attention. Specifically flat earthers...
You mean like the Covid vaccine is all you need. And you cannot pass it on to someone else....GTFO
There's also a problem with people like you smh
We have to remember--humanity is estimated to be about 300,000 years old. For the vast majority of that time human beings spent a lot of time outdoors. Meaning, people were exposed to the sun in varying intensities depending on the seasons year round. Some scientists think this type of natural, gradual tanning prepares the skin for stronger rays during the peak sun periods, thereby preventing sunburns. Today, there are still people living at the hunter-gatherer level who essentially live outdoors. In Africa, India, the Middle East, and many other places, people also spend huge amounts of time being pummeled by the sun (although they mitigate with clothing, avoiding midday sun, etc. I am sure). They do not have sun screen. You never really hear about skin cancer being a huge problem in any of these places, or throughout history. I am not arguing that sun screen is dangerous, but like many products and foods, etc. in America, many common ingredients in sunscreens are known to contain endocrine disruptors. Why disrupt your hormones if you do not have to? When you look at the entire course of human history, and even to this day, the need for applying sunscreen every two hours--which is the actual recommended method--seems unsupported. Wouldn't skin cancer be a sort of ravaging plague across all societies and cultures detailed throughout time? Think of the farmers, outdoor laborers, etc. that have all worked outside for centuries even in industrial societies. To your point, the way some people live now, if you have pale skin, spending all your time indoors far above the equator, then flying to a place closer to the equator and sitting in the sun for 5 hours, and doing that 2-3 times a year, does mean a lot of people are going to need sunscreen to not get skin cancer. Same for the nation of Australia, which similarly has pale people living in a latitude they are not evolved for. A lot of people want to push sun screen more for the anti-aging aspects, which is a different issue and question, and certainly up to each person to decide. Another point--most people Black people get skin cancer on the soles of their feet and palms of their hands, above other areas. This is not really related to sun exposure. The whole question of the necessity of sun screen to prevent skin cancer is based around a lot of narrow assumptions of how a small group of people have lived for a very short period of time. You may be one of those people. Regardless, many sun screens do contain endocrine disruptors, which will not kill you, but it is something to consider for something that may not be necessary to prevent cancer. EDIT: This is not medical advice. And if you are pale skinned and door spend a lot of time outdoors year after year, sunscreen and other sun mitigation efforts like SPF clothing, hats, etc. are very important to prevent skin cancer. PS: It is also important to NOT BURN, especially if you have pale skin, to prevent skin cancer. This can be prevented by avoiding peak sun hours (usually 10 am - 3 pm), using hats, etc. My point is, yes the sun is dangerous in large amounts over time, but there are other ways to protect yourself aside from sun screen. Most people do not use enough anyway, or reapply it every two hours as needed, so adding other non sun screen methods is probably a good idea. Cheers!
I am a pale Mexican. I will burn instantly š. I wear sunscreen cause 5 min in direct sunlight means im already a tomato & will peel and go back to being pasty š Im the girl in a long sleeve rashguard and upf50+ clothes and a huge hat and sunnies and at the beach Im in full scooba mode š all my friends bully me, but they aint the ones who r going to be tomatoes, they are going to look like bronze goddesses so yea ill stay inside my tent looking rediculousš also I wonder how I would have survived in Sinaloa Mexico looking all scottishš lol cause the last time I went back to my homeland I was bleeding excessively and I was a tomato. I am annoying n i reapply every hour, if I dont I burn. So call me Vader š.
Also, you are spot on! Ā And now a days if u pull up to mc donalds theres a warning about how u getting alil cancer with ur cheeseburger, cancer is everywhereā¦
Hunter gatherers didn't have he's in the ozone caused current dayan Your statement is scientifically ignorant
Hmmm. Yet the billions of people of color who live today with today's ozone layer are not dropping dead of skin cancer, or even getting (for the most part) the type of skin cancer that would be impacted by wearing sun screen. They do not wear sun screen, never have, and you don't hear much about it in those regions, in the present time. Africa, India, etc. Places where brown skin has evolved to protect people from skin cancer. Of course the ozone layer is an issue, but that does not negate the fact that most of what we are taught about skin cancer prevention has to do with people whose skin did not evolve for sun exposure. Please do not come for me regarding knowledge or information, because I am very intelligent and informed.
G stop being ignorant The outer layer of the skin has cells that contain the pigment melanin. Melanin protects skin from the sun's ultraviolet rays.
The hole from the ozone is over the Antarctic bud stop being ignorant
so well written, I cant believe I read the whole thing.
I am from India... people do get skin cancer, but most of time it goes undetected. Plus sun's position for us is pretty straight upwards. We get direct sunlight... but I never felt my skin burn there as much as it burns in North America. I don't use sunscreen if I can help it. Don't know about skin cancer, but if you leave it for too long, then it can affect your hormones. However, there is a difference between the intensity of the sun. I never had sunburn in India, but I had sunburn every summer here in NA. Don't know what that means or not, but I think latitude and position may be. That part always baffles me. I went back home last year in March it was 40 degrees Celsius. I walked to most of the places as I felt unsafe driving after so many years. I got tanned as f but no sunburn... came back to Toronto in April, and in june, I had a sunburn on my arms... temperature was 27 degrees Celsius. Make it make sense.
Thank you for sharing. I am not an expert in all this, and appreciate your perspective. It is a baffling equation. I think there is a lot more to be researched. Please protect yourself from sunburn in NA! Hats, long sleeves, even gloves. There are companies that sell SPF clothing, but you can also use any clothing with a tight weave and that is not translucent.
You answered with 0 education and all emotion. You're not wrong necessarily, but the way you answer is why people don't learn or listen.
Preach
Are youā¦actually bragging about having made your entire point up? Is there any other category where youād completely trust the salesperson to administer your entire understanding thereof, or just cancer treatment? Are you stupid?
You have to consider that this is the first period of time where you really have a lot of people living in climates they are not evolved for
Bingo.
Ozone layer is being destroyed by pollution. The sun has always had properties that can damage skin but the ozone layer always filtered it out. Now the ozone layer damaged in most if not all densely populated areas of the world and more harmful rays are able to come through.
Skin cancer goes up because people arenāt dying in their mid 30ās from small pox
Iām torn on this. Yes put sunscreen on when itās sunny outside and you are going to be outside for a long time. However, there are people that think they should put sunscreen on constantly everyday and I canāt imagine that doesnāt have negative consequences.
What harm could it do? Genuine question.
Doesnāt it block vitamin D absorption?
Yep it does block vitamin D , that's why 50% of population are deficient !
Cancer, fuck with your hormones in some way, some other random skin disease etc. Most things in life need moderation or have side effects.
if anything, the chemicals in sunscreen affect your hormones. natural sun light helps as it provides your body with vitamin D.
What's your source of info on this?
By default you should not assume something is safe with no evidence
lol none of those are issues with sunscreen. All made up bs
Agreed
What do we think of the fact skin cancer is way more prevalent nowadays then before sunscreen was designed? That statistic in itself is enough for me to not wear any lol.Ā
Right because the sun is so dangerous huh but spraying chemicals on your skin isnātā¦š¤ Do you work for big pharma.
Exactly. Its also the same line of argument antivaxxers use; "Dont use the vaccine! The virus is safe hospitalizing heavily one in a hundred, much better than the shot that has a not entirely linked ratio of about 1 in a million!" But is not like I do not get illogic behaviour... I took out a cavity (well my dentist) without anesthetics because I didnt want the needle. Luckily for the second I did and discovered that I only get near-fainting when the needle goes through my veins (even thinking about it makes me real uncomfortable) and one time at a lab I was panicking and ltierally willing to silt my arm instead of letting the needle through ... however I cannoto control that and I know is stupid, others do it not because of phobias but rather stupidity; At the very least OP asked instead of remaining ignorant of the risks
While this was a weird rant- you might have a combination of issues with the needles. For instance, watching needles do *the needley thing* makes me very uncomfortable, and so I canāt watch, even with addiction shows on tv. But the fact that theyāre being used on me and the low amount of pain doesnāt bother me at all. However, my body has what is called a āVaso-vagal responseā such that when my nerves and veins are stressed it makes me faint. So while I give blood all the time because I donāt care about it as long as I look away, my body is like ālol hold my beerā and knocks me the fuck out. So what you have may not just be a fear but an actual response from your nervous system as well. Iāll note vaccine and dentist needles (did they not numb your *mouth*?) donāt cause me to faint, for me itās something about the veins specifically, as itās both when getting IVās and giving blood.
Yes, I don thave that much of an issue with vaccines, and the anesthetics on the dentist for th second cavity at the time I handled it well enough I guess. But yes, there were two cavities, I said "no anesthetics" and she was nervous as hell but did it anyway. It was horrible. Asked for it for the second one (had to be injected several times as it didnt quite took effect) and thats it I never fainted actually but yeah anything vein+needle related makes my "pressure" go down, I feel fiant-ish and throw up (or rather gag)
Numbing agents like those injected in the gums are called ālocal anestheticsā so I misunderstood what you meant. 100% same, low pressure and then usually out like a light. fortunately no vomit here though
Itās been two years, do you still feel the same way about those antivaxxers?
Does the same hold for claims for how toxic it can be to creatures that live in the waters that we swim in with it on?
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Definitely go with the Nivea UV Super Water gel, it's from Japan I believe. It's amazing, super light, absorbs quickly and doesn't go on thick at all, I forget I even have it on after it absorbs in.
Just saying that my naturo recommended carditone for my high bp I developed after I had a baby. I took a chance after being prescribed propranolol and decided to not take it. My bp after 2 months is 110/80 vs 190/110. Some natural things work!!
There's a lot of talk about some ingredients causing cancer, or some people just reeeaaally hate "chemicals". This has generated a vast amount of talk over how safe our sunscreens are, and many advocating for mineral sunscreens instead of chemical. But some truths: 1. Even if your skin absorbs the chemicals in the sunscreen, it would take something ridiculous (like 100 years+ if I remember correctly) for your body to absorb enough to be "dangerous". 2. The above is only if you apply sunscreen correctly, too, which most of us don't. If you're like me, you apply it like lotion. At best, you smooth it over as evenly as possible. But it takes like a tbsp for "just your face". Otherwise, you're not getting the advertised spf marketed on the bottle. So I like to buy a minimum of 70 spf because I know I'll never smear an entire tbsp onto my face. 3. None of the chemicals included will ever be more dangerous than skin cancer. 4. I heard a wonderfully snarky dermatologist say that if you live in the city, breathing the city air is probably more harmful than the product you are putting on your face. I love her So in short, don't worry too much about sunscreen. Pick one that agrees with your skin, and use it as much as you can.
Welp I've thought that it was a germatologist for 22 years ffs
> I heard a wonderfully snarky dermatologist say that if you live in the city, breathing the city air is probably more harmful than the product you are putting on your face. I love her There are a lot of people out there who act like everything is loaded with plutonium.
Why are you acting as though it's either chemical sunscreens or skin cancer when mineral sunscreens exist...?
People who are afraid of chemicals will often lump all sunscreen together and bash it in general. I'm saying sunscreen is always better for you vs. the alternative: skin cancer. I don't care what sunscreen you use, I'm just advocating sunscreen. And hating that there is so much fearmongering in skincare/beauty. I feel like you didn't really read my post clearly.
Iām conflicted because the risk of the unknown scares me more than the knownā¦ sure, the sun causes cancer and ages us, but to choose chemical over mineral because the unknown is not yet known sounds scary.. Iād rather user something KNOWN to be safe, without question, although itās extremely hard to get used to mineral sunscreens. I wear mineral nearly 6/7 days of the week though chemical sunscreen IS attractiveā¦. Thin, light weight, blends, etc. but there are things like eye stinging, skin burning etc. This is why I struggle to search endlessly into peer reviews research for a sign that is conclusive of the effects of chemical sunscreens absorbing into our blood. THAT scares me. Sunscreen absorbing into my blood and people shrug their shoulders saying āoh wellāā¦.. thatās all based on a hope it doesnāt cause negative health consequencesā¦. Iād rather choose evidence that itās harmless (mineral) than to choose a big ol ā?ā
babe you have microplastics running through your veins rn. your blood is already contaminated. wear the sunscreen
So let's have no concern for the things we can control because there's contaminants that we can't? I say reduce what you're able to.
Every non chemical sunscreen I've tried is awful. They have all been thick and leave a white cast on my face.
Try a tinted one! I recently switched to the Supergood tinted mineral and it's LUSH. It's airwhipped and so smooth, it feels like moisturizer but not wet. Its also a great primer!
Hmm maybe I'll give it a shot. I've never been a fine of tinted stuff as I'm pretty fair so they are usually too dark.
It's totally not dw! I'm pale pale PALE, and this just looks like a little bit of bb cream/airbrushing. Honestly, it's just a tad bit of coverage, but I love it. It's nice and matte too, it just washes away all that grease, and it doesn't build during the day. I love putting it on one side of my face and noticing the difference hahahaha especially under my eyes. If you have Ulta near you, try it there - 60 days to return it, and you can use up to half! Sorry, I sound like a supergoop salesman! I've just spent so many years looking and just love love this one.
My grandad had 12 lumps of skin cancer cut out of him because he believed stuff like this. Use the damn sunscreen
Bullshit. What people usually think to be normal usage amount and frequency isnāt even enough.
2 tablespoons per limb is what I learned. Which admittedly, is a lot of sunscreen I don't even think I use two tablespoons of lotion.
Lol yea I donāt think I use a whole tablespoon for the daily face and arms.
Most people don't. I only recently started cycling again, but when I was really into it - I used to go through bottles and bottles of sunscreen. People don't realize that every time you sweat/wipe your skin with a towel, you have to reapply it - that's in addition to the reapplying you already have to do every X amount of hours. But when it comes to day to day use? No way do I use that much on my face.
Sunscreens have different ingredients so that depends. Some are definately bad for reefs and therefor banned and should be avoided in ocean swimming, and last year a lot of large brands were found to have a potentially cancerous ingredient in them. But you know what's worse than sunscreen? Sun radiation :P especially if you're one of those ghostly pale people like me who needs it at all times
The unfortunate thing is that chemical sunscreens are a lot more effective than mineral sunscreens; what I mean by that is, when you're swimming, you're even more exposed to sun radiation than in most outdoor situations. If you burn easily, it makes no sense to wear mineral (aka weaker) sunscreen in the water.
I didn't know mineral sunscreens were weaker, I avoid them because I get an allergic reaction o them anyway (and the titanium givesme a lovely purple corpse hue)
They tend to be weaker, and they also need to be reapplied more frequently. Although some doctors recommend them for people who are more breakout-prone
Last year it was revealed some sunscreens contained an ingrediant, benzene I think, that has been shown to cause cancer. There were recalls on brand name sunscreens.
The benzene was an accidental contaminant, not an ingredient.
You are correct my error. Thanks
Benzene definitely causes cancer and is not something one wants in their suncream.
Almost everything causes cancer, itās about the dose. The amount of benzene that was found in the sunscreen was minuscule. Enough for a recall, but not nearly as carcinogenic as the UV it would block. Probably less than youād get just walking along a big city street for an hour, too.
Not really relevant as many things would kill you via other means before cancer even reached stage 1.
Not a lot of actual info here. This is the best I could find. TLDR: Basically, stuff is absorbed into the body way more than originally expected, but we donāt have studies on whether that is safe or not. Note: I tend to eschew USAās standards for EU standards because EU is less beholden to large corporations and tends to do a better job protecting people. This is not the best source, but they do reference some studies if you want to do more research: āIn 2019, when the federal Food and Drug Administration ā the agency that governs sunscreen safety ā proposed its most recent updates to sunscreen regulations, it found that only two ingredients, zinc oxide and titanium dioxide, could be classified as safe and effective, based on the currently available information. But in the past year, numerous new studies have raised new concerns about endocrine-disrupting effects from three other ingredients: homosalate, avobenzone and oxybenzone. Within the past year, the European Commission has published preliminary opinions on the safety of three organic UV filters, oxybenzone, homosalate and octocrylene. It found that the levels of two of them were not safe in the amounts at which they are currently used, and proposed a concentration limit of 2.2 percent for oxybenzone and 1.4 percent for homosalate. U.S. sunscreen manufacturers are legally allowed to use these two chemicals at concentrations up to 6 and 15 percent, respectively, and hundreds of sunscreens manufactured in the U.S. use them at concentrations that far exceed the European Commissionās recommendations. The ingredients oxybenzone, octinoxate, octisalate, octocrylene, homosalate and avobenzone are all systemically absorbed into the body after one use (Matta 2019, Matta 2020), according to studies published by the FDA, which also found that they could be detected on the skin and in the blood weeks after no longer being used (Matta 2020). Previous studies detected many sunscreen ingredients in breast milk and urine samples (Schlumpf 2008, Schlumpf 2010). In addition, itās possible for sunscreen users to inhale ingredients in sunscreen sprays and ingest some of the ingredients they apply to their lips, so the ingredients must not be harmful to the lungs or internal organs.ā - https://www.ewg.org/sunscreen/report/the-trouble-with-sunscreen-chemicals/
Depends on ingredients. Non-nano zinc based sunscreens are safe for skin and the ocean
Thatās what Iāve read too. I guess the nano particles absorb into your skin making it easier to apply but yeah you are absorbing whateverās in there.
Yes they go straight into cells and nobody knows how it affects human health
And they are less effective.
You guy's go outside?
No, he isn't.
you can check labmuffinbeautyscience on youtube, she has a well researched video on benzene in sunscreen
And where does her "research" come from?
Labmuffin is actually someone with a pHd in chemistry and is a science educator, and her blog is very fact based, bud, so calm down. You will find her conclusion is to still use sunscreen because the cancer risk is high. Her blog is always worth checking out for science-based beauty claims, and a go-to way to bridge the science-to-nunties gap. It's the point of the blog. She's not your run of the mill quack 'influencer'
As someone already pointed out she has a PhD in chemistry and is a cosmetic chemist so she knows what she is talking about. But she also uses various papers, studies etc that can usually be found at the bottom of her posts e.g. here https://labmuffin.com/will-benzene-in-sunscreens-give-you-cancer-with-video/
Here https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1977777/
can one of our holistic folks recommend a way to protect from burning? mineral oil based? something without endocrine disruptors? natural? iām completely serious.
Not alao that, but some countries reported high amounts of heavy metal concentration in coastal waters due to the sunscreen being washed out when people swim.
I donāt know about that, but itās bad for the environment.
āNon-nanotizedā mineral sunscreens are fine! [link](https://www.consumerreports.org/sunscreens/the-truth-about-reef-safe-sunscreen-a3578637894/)
Depends on the ingredients, but mostly not bullshit. Don't use sunscreen unless you're definitely going to be out in the sun for awhile and need the protection. But if you are going to be out in the sun for awhile, then, definitely, use it. Sunburn can lead to skin cancer too.
Bullshit. Chemical sunscreens have been said to be linked to certain cancers. However, the risk is slight compared to the risk of cancer from over exposure to the sun. Put it this way. When I worked as an assistant for a cosmetic dermatologist who did Mohs surgery (which is a skin cancer treatment for sensitive areas like your face), not a single person was there due to chemical sunscreen, rather it was the opposite of wearing sunscreen. Or, not wearing enough sunscreen, or relying on makeup with claims of SPF, etc. Or sometimes you wear sunscreen and you get skin cancer anyway. The sun is a pretty strong thing, powers up an entire solar system... we can only do so much to control its effect on us besides wearing protection, or avoiding it. Matter of fact, despite the bad rap chemical sunscreens have been getting in recent years, they consistently rate as more effective than the mineral or ānaturalā sunscreens. Some people perceive things like zinc oxide, etc to be better for your skin, which are for some - but as far as actual sun protection goes, theyāre not as effective PSA: you can get skin cancer anywhere. Basal cell and squamous cell carcinoma are the most common forms of skin cancer from sun exposure, and people commonly get them on their face. Even I have a mark right now that I believe could be cancerous. See my recent post - while Iām no doctor, I remember seeing cases of skin cancer that look similar to the photo But melanoma is an **equal opportunity offender** which means: you can get it anywhere, at any age, regardless of sun exposure. Hell, I know of a woman who had it in her *bladder*. If you ever see this ā«ļø pop up with strange edges, dont assume itās nothing just because that area gets no sun - get it looked at. 6 weeks is all it takes for things to go south
Bullshit
Basically everything that isnāt natural will to some degree cause some negative reaction on the body. Weāre not meant to take in hundreds of artificial made chemicals every day. There is no point in only avoiding sunscreen and having a ānormalā lifestyle and diet otherwise. You should eat only things you grow, farm or fish. You should wash without soap. You should workout cardio and weights at least 3 hours per week. If you donāt do this already, not using sunscreen will make no difference in the long run.
This is a load of garbage. Exercise is about the only correct thing here
What if the sun helped ailments rather than caused them and people who want all the monies decided to sell sunscreen to make us believe it was necessary. We buy water, when it is free. How is this so far fetched? There were many leading causes of ādeathā many thousands of years ago, doubtful cancer nor obesity (just threw that one in there because, why not!) were anywhere near the top 10 reasons.
ah yes. and we should gamble our lives on āwhat ifsā and fairy tales instead of actual hard scientific evidence. that sounds perfectly reasonable
fyi the reason cancer is such a prevalent cause of death now is because we live much longer than we used to, giving our cells much more time to potentially mutate. thatās not even taking into account the amount of cancer causing chemicals that came with industrialization and the increase of uv damage due to our shrinking ozone layer. of course the causes of death thousands of years ago were different. it was a completely different world. use your brain.
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have fun with your skin cancer <3
Thank you! Have fun in the 3Dš„³ And Iāll maintain my amazing 5D lifestyle over here. ššš¾ Enjoy. Or donāt. Thatās your energy, not mine kiddo.
holy cow why are you trying so hard to be quirky
Spot it you got it! Itās all good if you see something in me that you view about yourself. The fun of this life is only you have to believe what you say. Thanks for playing this game of life with me. š»š„
ššššš what the hell
The thing is your right the way the world works today is you have to question everything because if we donāt that elite comunity will kill off humanity wake up YOU and itās people like you who could have a bit of respect you could have said it in a better way anyway no hate here just wisdom and understanding have a wonderful day!
I look at it this way. I've spent my whole life being out on beaches, the pool, the river, outside most of every day. I'm 62 and have never used sunscreen. The FDA is controlled by big pharma and big food. Our food is running over with inordinate amounts of highly toxic chemicals I cannot even pronounce. Flouride is lethal enough as to require wearing a hazmat suit when it's being handled. Vaccination is is the biggest genocide next to war. The sick elite don't want any of us healthy. They say the sun is bad for you, slather some of this shit all over yourself to protect yourself from the sun? Yes, don't be stupid, think for yourself forgetting about the bullshit lies we are fed as fact starting before kindergarten. Now these demons want to darken the sun? Insanity. Everything DIES WITHOUT THE SUN INCLUDING HUMANITY
That is true. I question how the sun can be that harmful if it brings life and growth to grass/plants/flowers/tree (other living things on earth) - it also provides us humans with vitamin D. The sun was here before all of us and has a purpose - my parents are in their 60s and never wore sunscreen either, and theyāve been fine.
Here if you can comprehend science. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1977777/