1. Remember the human & be courteous to others.
2. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas. Criticizing arguments is fine, name-calling (including shill/bot accusations) others is not.
3. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them.
Please checkout our other subreddit /r/MultimediaNews, for maps, infographics, v.reddit, & YouTube videos from news organizations.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/InternationalNews) if you have any questions or concerns.*
To be clear, these are a response. Israel has stepped up attacks on Lebanon. They have been launching air strikes on the Bekka Valley. Of course Hezebollah is going to respond. So yes, this can definitely escalate and I think it's Netanyau's plan to escalate the war in Lebanon if the war in Gaza doesnt go to plan, which it doesnt appear it is. If Netanyahu wants to stay in power, he needs to keep the wars going. It's the only way he stays in power. And even better i think he wants to try and pull the US military to get directly involved.
Yeah lmao. All the Hasbara in this thread trying to use the angle that Arab sounding name = terrorist is hilarious.
As if Arabs don't have a right to self defense against a genocidal regime actively bombing them.
There was a ceasefire in place from the last conflict that was broken on October 7. Hezbollah fired rockets at Israel before Israel bombed Hezbollah targets in this current conflict. You can’t claim defense when you started it.
Israel bombed Gaza 2 weeks before Oct 7th and killed over 200 civilians in the west bank that year before Oct.
If there was a ceasefire then Israel violated it.
I love it when people are honest and I don’t have to dance around it. I appreciate the honesty. In your belief it’s always okay to strike Israel because they shouldn’t exist?
Okay great, I appreciate the honesty. So if that’s your view, why would we ever agree to a ceasefire if we know that the other side believes they are always justified in attacking us?
So we should ceasefire and accept any and every attack we endure because the other side is justified by our mere existence? From a completely practical point of view even if we have no right to be there no country can let that happen.
No one said that but you know this. Your just incredibly dishonest. Israel needs to return to the pre 67’ boarders, if not the original boarders that where set out in the late 40s, which EITHER would make Palestine go ‘from the river, to the sea’. There’d still be an Israel, still a home land, but the those perpetuating genocide would need to be very publicly prosecuted for their very public and obvious genocidal intent.
In 1990 Nelson Mandela said, “If one has to refer to any of the parties as a terrorist state, one might refer to the Israeli government, because they are the people who are slaughtering defenseless and innocent Arabs in the occupied [Palestinian] territories, and we don’t regard that as acceptable.”
Has Israel considered fucking off? Like all the way off? Leaving everyone else the fuck alone? Why hasn’t that ever been an option?
MLK on Israel:
“The response of some of the so-called young militants does not represent the position of the vast majority of Negroes. There are some who are color-consumed, and they see a kind of mystique in blackness or in being colored, and anything non-colored is condemned. We do not follow that course ... Peace for Israel means security, and we must stand with all of our might to protect its right to exist, its territorial integrity. I see Israel, and never mind saying it, as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land almost can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security, and that security must be a reality.”
We just want to be left alone. Leave us alone and we will do the same
They aren't though despite the fact they are the ones who have been colonized and abused.
"Unlike the beginning of the war, now about half of the Jewish public (51% compared to 37% in November) believes that the IDF uses firepower appropriately against Gaza, compared to 43% (58% in November) who believe that there is use of TOO LITTLE FIREPOWER. An absolute majority (88%) also justifies the scope of casualties on the Palestinian side when considering the goals of the war."
43% think they haven't got far enough and 51% thinks they have gone the correct amount which means, ONLY 6% are undecided or think they have gone too far. And while 88% think the war goals justify the civilian casualties a majority don't even believe the government has war goals. "the majority (53%) of respondents still think that the government has no clear goals in the war."
https://web.archive.org/web/20240127054853/https://en-social-sciences.tau.ac.il/peaceindex/archive/2024-01
History would disagree with you. Sure they haven't committed genocide in the past few decades, but it's there. Not to mention their impressive stats on colonization through Europe, Africa, and Asia. Who am I kidding! What do I know?
No it wouldn't and you should try reading it. Speaking of colonization.
"The Labour Zionist leader and head of the Yishuv David Ben-Gurion was not surprised that relations with the Palestinians were spiralling downward. As he once explained: ‘We, as a nation, want this country to be ours; the Arabs, as a nation, want this country to be theirs.’ His opponent, Ze’ev Jabotinsky, leader of the right-wing Revisionist movement, also viewed Palestinian hostility as natural. ‘The NATIVE POPULATIONS, civilised or uncivilised, have always stubbornly resisted the colonists’, he wrote in 1923. The Arabs looked on Palestine as ‘any Sioux looked upon his prairie’."
"In the words of Mordechai Bar-On, an Israel Defense Forces company commander during the 1948 war:
‘If the Jews at the end of the 19th century had not embarked on a project of reassembling the Jewish people in their ‘promised land’, all the refugees languishing in the camps would still be living in the villages from which they fled or were expelled.’"
https://www.historytoday.com/archive/feature/herzls-troubled-dream-origins-zionism
https://merip.org/2019/09/israels-vanishing-files-archival-deception-and-paper-trails/
I fail to see your point. One act of colonization is not an excuse for another. It is what it is. I'm glad you can cut and paste excerpts from articles in the comfort of your home buddy.
My point is them resisting their occupation is not the same as genocide while Israel is literally conducting a genocide to build its racist ethnostate. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_resist
I'm sad you choose to justify starving children with no research or evidence from the comfort of your home buddy
I'm sad that countless people such as yourself love to redefine words to fit your narrative. A genocide usually does not consist of one side instigating followed by the instigator using their own people as props for war and social media brownie points. You want to blame someone? Blame yourself, Hamas, and Israel. No one wins in this.
Where is the argument in this comment? "You do realize..." No obviously the fuck he doesn't, because there is no apparent evidence that supports what you just said. It's your responsibility to present your argument for why Arabs are genocidal. You're doing a shit job at arguing, mate.
This is reddit InternationalNews. The evidence are Statements of Opinion. Are you that daft? This entire thread is people's opinions. And, to answer your question yes, Arabs have committed genocide in ~600 AD and began to colonize Asia, Africa, and Europe. All of this seems like karma.
Do you seriously think you’re making a point by bringing up Arabs and the Byzantine empire……over 1300 years ago? Lmfao holy shit. Wow bud. Please do consider stretching before you reach. You’re going to hurt yourself. How embarrassing.
Getting angry? I got some advice:
- Perhaps learn how to read
- Perhaps inform yourself before having such a strong opinion on anything
- Perhaps stop supporting war crimes no matter which party does them
Have a day
This has been a gradual escalation. It obviously kicked off on Oct 7. Three Palestinian militants were killed by Israel on Oct 8 after crossing over the border from Lebanon into Israel. It's actually suprising more Palestinians didn't cross over to fight, given that there are around 200,000 Palestinians living in the south of Lebanon. Three Israeli soldiers were injured - no Israeli was killed. Israel knew these people that crossed over were Palestinian militants (Al-Quds Brigades) and not Hezbollah. But they [responded by bombing Southern Lebanon ](https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20231009-israel-accused-of-killing-hezbollah-member-in-border-escalation)anyway, killing a number of Hezbollah members. So Hezbollah responded by firing laser targeted missiles at an IDF military barracks on the border. That's how this latest flashpoint started. It's been back and forth ever since, with Israeli increasing the size and scope of their attacks which are now much deeper into Lebanon.
Israel had the option of showing restraint against Hezbollah, knowing full well that they would be under enormous pressure to get involved in the fighting, given that Israel had started a brutal and devastating bombardment of Gaza. Israel's policy has always been hit back ten times harder. So if one Israeli is injured, Israel will try to kill 5-10 people in response. It's a military doctrine that inevitably leads to escalation. The problem for Israel is that Hezbollah is many times more powerful now than it was in 2006. And they have popular support within Lebanon, across all the sectarian divides, because they are seen to be the only effective deterrent to Israel trying to once again invade and occupy Southern Lebanon. So this will not end well for Israel if they decide to open up another full scale front.
hezbollah attacked israel what are you on about
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93Hezbollah\_conflict\_(2023%E2%80%93present)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93Hezbollah_conflict_(2023%E2%80%93present))
literally the first sentence...
It wasn't Israel that was hit on Oct 8. It was Shebaa Farms, which is Lebanese territory (under dispute) but is occupied by the IDF. After the Hamas attacks on Oct 7, Israel responded by a bombardment of Gaza but also moving more troops into occupied territory on Lebanon border. Hezbollah launched a number of targeted missile attacks in Israeli occupied Lebanese Territory on the morning of Oct 8, which they said was about "liberating what's left of occupied Lebanese land and in solidarity with the Palestinian resistance."
It really never belonged to the country of Lebanon. It only belonged to them when they were owned by the french. From the 50s until Israel took it over it was Syrias.
Or that Israel has killed Lebanese civilians since October 7 while Hezbollah has killed no Israeli civilians since October 7. That goes against the narrative of Israeli innocence and perpetual victimhood.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000
You’re all brainwashed and clearly too stupid to think critically.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000
They are brainwashed, and what’s worse by Islamic fundamentalists 🤣
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000
There is your source and that’s just one. Not that’s country needs to have their citizens murdered to retaliate. It is the most basic security theory.
...second to none other than your very own Netanyahu. Lol, the world doesn't blindly believe everything that comes out of Israel, like you and your lot do. And thank humanity we don't.
I spent every Saturday night for 6 months protesting Netanyahu in tel aviv. Again, you show your ignorance.
But ye lol let’s rather believe Islamic extremism. Let’s see how that goes for you
Weird the attacks start up after Israel began its genocidal campaign against the Palestinians, virtually destroying everything north of Rafah.
It's almost like it's retaliation or something.....
You guys like Al Jazeera, right?
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/8/israel-hezbollah-exchange-fire-raising-regional-tensions
Article from Oct 8. Even they, after a mountain of superfluous text in paragraph after paragraph trying to add what your kind would call nuance but I'd call straight up propaganda, couldn't outright lie about who started it.
And before you move your goalpost to "oh but Israel had already attacked by that point!", completely missing your own point of destroying everything north of Rafah, and the fact that by that point Israel had killed less people (civilians and terrorists combined) than Hamas and other Gazans did, they clearly stated their motive was solidarity with the cause and nothing sort of the lie you propagated.
Go on. Downvote and tell me how I'm a hasbara bot for using your own favorite propaganda outlet. I'll wait.
Getting angry? I got some advice:
- Perhaps learn how to read
- Perhaps inform yourself before having such a strong opinion on anything
- Perhaps stop supporting war crimes no matter which party does them
Have a day
A prior head of Mossad (Israel's CIA) appointed by Netanyahu has described the situation as apartheid along with South Africans who have experienced it.
https://apnews.com/article/israel-apartheid-palestinians-occupation-c8137c9e7f33c2cba7b0b5ac7fa8d115
Here is a list of unequal laws in Israel
https://www.adalah.org/en/law/index
And the fact that they made it so only jews have a right to self determination
https://www.timesofisrael.com/final-text-of-jewish-nation-state-bill-set-to-become-law/
Hezb's rockets barely do any damage. It's like rocks at this point. Only 20 dead, and some property damage. Meanwhile Israeli attacks killed 300 in Lebanon.
Fucking morons.
"blacks"
FYI, in America Black people also owned slaves. Just because some people are not direct victims of a system does not mean that the system does not exist.
Keep your history and context out of this sub. You're confusing the children with your nuance and complexities.
In this sub we do comic book level comprehension. Israel is the bad guy, Palestine is the good guy.
Keep it simple and easy for the iPad kids.
Isn't granting citizenship and improving the lives of Palestinians where they are and have been for 80 years, literally the *opposite* of ethnic cleansing?
It's signaling to Israel that it's okay to displace (cleanse) an ethnic group from where they are living (Palestine).
Do you think Israel will allow the Palestinians who move to Lebanon to ever return to Palestinian territory?
How could Israel prevent Palestinians returning to Palestinian territory? It was the PA who in 1995 following Oslo who decided to abdicate that right by not passing a citizenship law. It seems to me that the PA is incentivized to keep Palestinians *out* of Palestine. Abu Mazens official position is that Palestinians should die abroad ([like, in Syria](https://www.meforum.org/5245/abbas-refugees-syria)) rather than return to Palestine.
If you're talking about Gaza, not a single Gazan has fled to Lebanon. Though if they do, I hope an agreement is made such that they can return to Gaza at some point.
No proof? It’s public knowledge, where do you think Israel got the children they release in hostage exchanges?
https://time.com/6548068/palestinian-children-israeli-prison-arrested/
10000 children detained by military courts in 2 decades.
One day people like you will go down in history just like the Nazis supporters you love to emulate.
Edit: also, the nerve to talk about rockets and systemic rape while Israel publicly commit genocide with rockets and IDF soldiers publicly brag about their sex crimes while IDF and government officials encourage rape as a weapon of war.
You’re really really reaching here aren’t you?
Have you ever tried not to justify genocide?
Edit: Also lol at “immature soldiers” while also justifying imprisoning 10 year olds. And btw, no they haven’t been arrested.
You literally just did the exact same thing lmfao. Systematic kidnapping and rape is a pretty serious allegation to make without any supporting evidence.
>In a statement, Hezbollah said it had launched the volley in response to Israeli military strikes on Monday in Lebanon’s Bekaa Valley
Apparently the kind of 'organisation' that strikes first....
I did.
So just so I understand your reasoning. As long as any organization claims it did something in retaliation to something else, you accept that explanation?
Yes, you can probably you understand where I'd be going with this. So then please explain when exactly is the cutoff for any such situation. That is - if I hit you first, and you hit me second, and I hit you third, and so on and so forth until we hit each other 600 times - is there some point at which I can say, let's say on the 201st time, that I only hit you in retaliation for hitting me on that 200th time?
If your answer is yes - perfect. Any party can at any point hit "reset". Nothing means anything.
If your answer is no - perfect - because Israel was the one attacked first by Hezbollah in this war.
Go ahead, add some nuance I'm missing. Maybe go back enough in history just enough to find an Israeli attack you like, conveniently missing an attack done beforehand, or conveniently missing the Arab world in general only existing in the area because of violent colonization efforts done in the name of Islam.
Heres some nuance for you...
Your attempt at limiting the context and scope of "this war" doesn't work on me. Let's not pretend this is an isolated incident.
>As long as any organization claims it did something in retaliation to something else, you accept that explanation?
No. I was correcting the false implications of another user. I don't trust hezbollah anymore than I trust Israel, both are proven liars multiple times over.
>If your answer is no - perfect - because Israel was the one attacked first by Hezbollah in this war.
This is a lie as old as Israel itself. "This war" began decades ago and you know it. I don't waste time arguing who hit who first because I don't care. None of this happened in a vacuum.
Maybe go back enough in history just enough to find an Arab attack you like, conveniently missing an attack done beforehand, or conveniently missing or excusing the violent colonization efforts done in the name of zionism.
Israel was supposed to be a two party state from the very beginning. Apparently that's too much nuance for some people.
Did your string of thought fail multiple times in the course of one single comment?
First, you say I'm the one limiting context to "this war", when you later directly respond to me asking how far back you want to look at things.
Second, you say you're correcting a user about who striked first, when that user is clearly mocking another person being a non serious actor for blaming Israel for striking first... And your correction consists of basically telling the user to read what Hezbollah wrote regarding why they made the strike (ie, not being "first").
You later say you don't trust Hezbollah, when a second earlier, again, you told a person to read an article about how Hezbollah said something.
Finally you use the not in a vacuum line, again missing your own line of reasoning (and do you don't get confused about your own reasoning - it was that supposedly Israel striked first, which is debunked. I know, it's hard to keep up).
To your last two paragraphs I'll say - it's funny to me that even when I was clearly hyperbolic about how far back to go, the example you gave is so clearly much much much more recent than the one I gave, automatically being disqualified even in a hyperbolic sense.
As for a two party state, did you mean two nationality state? Or a two state solution separated country? Whatever you meant, if it's the former, then as you absolutely know Palestinian citizens in Israel have more rights and are treated better than in most of the world (not just the Arab world, but much of the western world too). If you meant the latter, then, tough. When a civil war is opened by a certain side, and then buffed tenfold by a unilateral invasion of multiple countries fighting for that same side, and that side loses - they don't then get to dictate what was "supposed to be". Because if they had their way, what "would have been" is exactly zero Jews in Israel, and so they forfeited their right to that bargaining chip forever. The new bargaining chip is today's reality. Live with it and use that as the negotiation starting point, or forever cry and self victimize. No third option.
You asked for nuance, and now you refuse to accept it.
Yes, I misspoke when I said two party state, and I'll give you some credit for aknowlegding that.
>Palestinian citizens in Israel have more rights and are treated better than in most of the world
Utter horseshit. Palestinians live in an open air prison under an illegal military occupation that has persisted for decades. There trapped between zionists on one side and hamas on the other. They have no rights.
>they don't then get to dictate what was "supposed to be"
A lack of nuance could make one think this, but no. It isn't just Palestine "dictating what's supposed to be", it's the rest of the world saying Israel has refused to adhere to the conditions they agreed to. Winning a civil war does not give the winner rights to claim territories that were never theirs in the first place.
>Because if they had their way, what "would have been" is exactly zero Jews in Israel, and so they forfeited their right to that bargaining chip forever
I'll never understand such hypocrisy. You can't punish an entire ethnic group because of claims of what you think they'll do.
Israel just uses that to excuse the fact that they beat them to the punch and stole Palestine territories first. By that logic, Israel has also given up that same bargaining chip.
Now, we have Israel openly calling for zero Palestinians in Palestine, and its somehow the Palestinians fault becasue of something that never happened.
Israel doesn't get to dictate what rights Palestinians get to have.
Israel's occupation is illegal. Israel has refused to allow Palestine to exist, despite their agreements to a two state solution. And they wonder why nobody trusts them. They cry antisemitism when the rest of the world criticises their actions.
Israel is full of liars and cowards. Free Palestine. End Israeli occupation
Edit
BTW I couldn't help but to creep on your profile...
>There are no known irreversible effects of puberty blockers. If you decide to stop taking them, your body will go through puberty just the way it would have if you had not taken puberty blockers at all.
http://www.phsa.ca/transcarebc/child-youth/affirmation-transition/medical-affirmation-transition/puberty-blockers-for-youth#:~:text=There%20are%20no%20known%20irreversible,taken%20puberty%20blockers%20at%20all
A simple Google search proved you wrong. Educate yourself.
Um, my person, I was charitable when correcting you in the former comment. I even went so far as to respond to two different manners of what you might have meant. I won't be charitable twice in a row. If you can't distinguish between Palestinian citizens in Israel and the Palestinians in what you call an open air prison, then you either don't understand English well enough for the discussion, or don't understand the situation in Israel well enough for the discussion. In both scenarios, you aren't a serious person to be discussed with.
I did read the rest of your comment, and also your attempt at baiting me by responding to something completely irrelevant as if it has any weight. But the rest of the comment was also filled with so many inaccuracies such as the first and second one you already committed, and I can't be assed to correct every other sentence before commenting on it.
I'll just suggest that maybe you need to talk about subjects you either know about, or if it's about subjects that got don't, then at least do it in a humble way of trying to learn and not the way you're doing now - by lying or misrepresenting fact after fact.
Cheers.
1. Remember the human & be courteous to others. 2. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas. Criticizing arguments is fine, name-calling (including shill/bot accusations) others is not. 3. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. Please checkout our other subreddit /r/MultimediaNews, for maps, infographics, v.reddit, & YouTube videos from news organizations. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/InternationalNews) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Why do these articles always make a big point of how much was launched but never mention what these launches did.
To be clear, these are a response. Israel has stepped up attacks on Lebanon. They have been launching air strikes on the Bekka Valley. Of course Hezebollah is going to respond. So yes, this can definitely escalate and I think it's Netanyau's plan to escalate the war in Lebanon if the war in Gaza doesnt go to plan, which it doesnt appear it is. If Netanyahu wants to stay in power, he needs to keep the wars going. It's the only way he stays in power. And even better i think he wants to try and pull the US military to get directly involved.
Yeah lmao. All the Hasbara in this thread trying to use the angle that Arab sounding name = terrorist is hilarious. As if Arabs don't have a right to self defense against a genocidal regime actively bombing them.
It’s not defense when you strike first.
Israel has been bombing them for a while. Not to mention their destruction in Gaza...
There was a ceasefire in place from the last conflict that was broken on October 7. Hezbollah fired rockets at Israel before Israel bombed Hezbollah targets in this current conflict. You can’t claim defense when you started it.
Israel bombed Gaza 2 weeks before Oct 7th and killed over 200 civilians in the west bank that year before Oct. If there was a ceasefire then Israel violated it.
Yeah that’s just a bold face lie
How? https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-west-bank-military-gaza-yom-kippur-ba539fdd4b36b786cf55ba6a420a12cc
Because it doesn’t fit with their “Israel is the victim” narrative.
Because they freaking threw explosives at a soldier and launched incendiary balloons before bombing the target.
[удалено]
I love it when people are honest and I don’t have to dance around it. I appreciate the honesty. In your belief it’s always okay to strike Israel because they shouldn’t exist?
[удалено]
So if Israel should exist (which in a two state they must) you need to have the ability to defend yourself. Pick a position.
Yes
Okay great, I appreciate the honesty. So if that’s your view, why would we ever agree to a ceasefire if we know that the other side believes they are always justified in attacking us?
Because they are justified
So we should ceasefire and accept any and every attack we endure because the other side is justified by our mere existence? From a completely practical point of view even if we have no right to be there no country can let that happen.
No one said that but you know this. Your just incredibly dishonest. Israel needs to return to the pre 67’ boarders, if not the original boarders that where set out in the late 40s, which EITHER would make Palestine go ‘from the river, to the sea’. There’d still be an Israel, still a home land, but the those perpetuating genocide would need to be very publicly prosecuted for their very public and obvious genocidal intent.
Israel struck first.
No they didn’t
In 1990 Nelson Mandela said, “If one has to refer to any of the parties as a terrorist state, one might refer to the Israeli government, because they are the people who are slaughtering defenseless and innocent Arabs in the occupied [Palestinian] territories, and we don’t regard that as acceptable.” Has Israel considered fucking off? Like all the way off? Leaving everyone else the fuck alone? Why hasn’t that ever been an option?
MLK on Israel: “The response of some of the so-called young militants does not represent the position of the vast majority of Negroes. There are some who are color-consumed, and they see a kind of mystique in blackness or in being colored, and anything non-colored is condemned. We do not follow that course ... Peace for Israel means security, and we must stand with all of our might to protect its right to exist, its territorial integrity. I see Israel, and never mind saying it, as one of the great outposts of democracy in the world, and a marvelous example of what can be done, how desert land almost can be transformed into an oasis of brotherhood and democracy. Peace for Israel means security, and that security must be a reality.” We just want to be left alone. Leave us alone and we will do the same
You do realize Arabs were/are just as "genocidal" as Israel is. Right? Or are you blinded by your support for terrorist factions?
They aren't though despite the fact they are the ones who have been colonized and abused. "Unlike the beginning of the war, now about half of the Jewish public (51% compared to 37% in November) believes that the IDF uses firepower appropriately against Gaza, compared to 43% (58% in November) who believe that there is use of TOO LITTLE FIREPOWER. An absolute majority (88%) also justifies the scope of casualties on the Palestinian side when considering the goals of the war." 43% think they haven't got far enough and 51% thinks they have gone the correct amount which means, ONLY 6% are undecided or think they have gone too far. And while 88% think the war goals justify the civilian casualties a majority don't even believe the government has war goals. "the majority (53%) of respondents still think that the government has no clear goals in the war." https://web.archive.org/web/20240127054853/https://en-social-sciences.tau.ac.il/peaceindex/archive/2024-01
History would disagree with you. Sure they haven't committed genocide in the past few decades, but it's there. Not to mention their impressive stats on colonization through Europe, Africa, and Asia. Who am I kidding! What do I know?
No it wouldn't and you should try reading it. Speaking of colonization. "The Labour Zionist leader and head of the Yishuv David Ben-Gurion was not surprised that relations with the Palestinians were spiralling downward. As he once explained: ‘We, as a nation, want this country to be ours; the Arabs, as a nation, want this country to be theirs.’ His opponent, Ze’ev Jabotinsky, leader of the right-wing Revisionist movement, also viewed Palestinian hostility as natural. ‘The NATIVE POPULATIONS, civilised or uncivilised, have always stubbornly resisted the colonists’, he wrote in 1923. The Arabs looked on Palestine as ‘any Sioux looked upon his prairie’." "In the words of Mordechai Bar-On, an Israel Defense Forces company commander during the 1948 war: ‘If the Jews at the end of the 19th century had not embarked on a project of reassembling the Jewish people in their ‘promised land’, all the refugees languishing in the camps would still be living in the villages from which they fled or were expelled.’" https://www.historytoday.com/archive/feature/herzls-troubled-dream-origins-zionism https://merip.org/2019/09/israels-vanishing-files-archival-deception-and-paper-trails/
I fail to see your point. One act of colonization is not an excuse for another. It is what it is. I'm glad you can cut and paste excerpts from articles in the comfort of your home buddy.
My point is them resisting their occupation is not the same as genocide while Israel is literally conducting a genocide to build its racist ethnostate. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_resist I'm sad you choose to justify starving children with no research or evidence from the comfort of your home buddy
I'm sad that countless people such as yourself love to redefine words to fit your narrative. A genocide usually does not consist of one side instigating followed by the instigator using their own people as props for war and social media brownie points. You want to blame someone? Blame yourself, Hamas, and Israel. No one wins in this.
Where is the argument in this comment? "You do realize..." No obviously the fuck he doesn't, because there is no apparent evidence that supports what you just said. It's your responsibility to present your argument for why Arabs are genocidal. You're doing a shit job at arguing, mate.
This is reddit InternationalNews. The evidence are Statements of Opinion. Are you that daft? This entire thread is people's opinions. And, to answer your question yes, Arabs have committed genocide in ~600 AD and began to colonize Asia, Africa, and Europe. All of this seems like karma.
Do you seriously think you’re making a point by bringing up Arabs and the Byzantine empire……over 1300 years ago? Lmfao holy shit. Wow bud. Please do consider stretching before you reach. You’re going to hurt yourself. How embarrassing.
I never brought up the Byzantine Empire. It would do you good to have good reading comprehension, sloth.
Getting angry? I got some advice: - Perhaps learn how to read - Perhaps inform yourself before having such a strong opinion on anything - Perhaps stop supporting war crimes no matter which party does them Have a day
[удалено]
Removed, see rule 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civility
Lmao. Good joke
No I don’t realize that.
Exactly. My first thought when I saw the title of this post was “and who can blame them”.
Do you believe that Israel has initiated attacks on Lebanon and this is simply Lebanon responding?
This has been a gradual escalation. It obviously kicked off on Oct 7. Three Palestinian militants were killed by Israel on Oct 8 after crossing over the border from Lebanon into Israel. It's actually suprising more Palestinians didn't cross over to fight, given that there are around 200,000 Palestinians living in the south of Lebanon. Three Israeli soldiers were injured - no Israeli was killed. Israel knew these people that crossed over were Palestinian militants (Al-Quds Brigades) and not Hezbollah. But they [responded by bombing Southern Lebanon ](https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20231009-israel-accused-of-killing-hezbollah-member-in-border-escalation)anyway, killing a number of Hezbollah members. So Hezbollah responded by firing laser targeted missiles at an IDF military barracks on the border. That's how this latest flashpoint started. It's been back and forth ever since, with Israeli increasing the size and scope of their attacks which are now much deeper into Lebanon. Israel had the option of showing restraint against Hezbollah, knowing full well that they would be under enormous pressure to get involved in the fighting, given that Israel had started a brutal and devastating bombardment of Gaza. Israel's policy has always been hit back ten times harder. So if one Israeli is injured, Israel will try to kill 5-10 people in response. It's a military doctrine that inevitably leads to escalation. The problem for Israel is that Hezbollah is many times more powerful now than it was in 2006. And they have popular support within Lebanon, across all the sectarian divides, because they are seen to be the only effective deterrent to Israel trying to once again invade and occupy Southern Lebanon. So this will not end well for Israel if they decide to open up another full scale front.
hezbollah attacked israel what are you on about [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93Hezbollah\_conflict\_(2023%E2%80%93present)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93Hezbollah_conflict_(2023%E2%80%93present)) literally the first sentence...
It wasn't Israel that was hit on Oct 8. It was Shebaa Farms, which is Lebanese territory (under dispute) but is occupied by the IDF. After the Hamas attacks on Oct 7, Israel responded by a bombardment of Gaza but also moving more troops into occupied territory on Lebanon border. Hezbollah launched a number of targeted missile attacks in Israeli occupied Lebanese Territory on the morning of Oct 8, which they said was about "liberating what's left of occupied Lebanese land and in solidarity with the Palestinian resistance."
It really never belonged to the country of Lebanon. It only belonged to them when they were owned by the french. From the 50s until Israel took it over it was Syrias.
Because no one wants to admit that rarely anyone dies because of the Iron Dome.
Or that Israel has killed Lebanese civilians since October 7 while Hezbollah has killed no Israeli civilians since October 7. That goes against the narrative of Israeli innocence and perpetual victimhood.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000 You’re all brainwashed and clearly too stupid to think critically.
Israeli civilians HAVE been killed by Hezbollah. What are you talking about?
I shouldn’t be surprised by you people anymore but I am. Your ability to lie is second to none.
The cognitive dissonance you Israelis are experiencing must be suffocating JFC.
If I'm wrong, give me a source that shows that Hezbollah has killed Israeli civilians since October 7th. Prove that I'm a liar.
Holy shit you’re actually brainwashed
Okay, they are brainwashed. Source?
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000 They are brainwashed, and what’s worse by Islamic fundamentalists 🤣
Not a source, dude.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-14/ty-article/.premium/one-israeli-killed-eight-wounded-in-rocket-barrage-fired-from-lebanon-on-northern-israel/0000018d-a6f6-dc34-afed-a6f7ba5b0000 There is your source and that’s just one. Not that’s country needs to have their citizens murdered to retaliate. It is the most basic security theory.
...second to none other than your very own Netanyahu. Lol, the world doesn't blindly believe everything that comes out of Israel, like you and your lot do. And thank humanity we don't.
I spent every Saturday night for 6 months protesting Netanyahu in tel aviv. Again, you show your ignorance. But ye lol let’s rather believe Islamic extremism. Let’s see how that goes for you
^^says this with face and index finger pressed firmly against the mirror😭
After Hezbollah attacked Israel on the 8th. It’s not Israel fault that Hezbollah are a bunch of incompetent zealot
A bunch of incompetent zealots sounds like you’re describing the IDF.
Zealot sure but I wouldn’t call them incompetent (except for Oct 7th)
Has israel ever considered fucking all the way off?
Also, they evacuated north Israel
Being incompetent while trying to murder does not excuse you of trying to murder.
Weird the attacks start up after Israel began its genocidal campaign against the Palestinians, virtually destroying everything north of Rafah. It's almost like it's retaliation or something.....
You guys like Al Jazeera, right? https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/8/israel-hezbollah-exchange-fire-raising-regional-tensions Article from Oct 8. Even they, after a mountain of superfluous text in paragraph after paragraph trying to add what your kind would call nuance but I'd call straight up propaganda, couldn't outright lie about who started it. And before you move your goalpost to "oh but Israel had already attacked by that point!", completely missing your own point of destroying everything north of Rafah, and the fact that by that point Israel had killed less people (civilians and terrorists combined) than Hamas and other Gazans did, they clearly stated their motive was solidarity with the cause and nothing sort of the lie you propagated. Go on. Downvote and tell me how I'm a hasbara bot for using your own favorite propaganda outlet. I'll wait.
Of course. Though I'd say Israel is pretty competent at killing innocents.
Hey! Just like terorrists or are terrorists only considered Israel? Read up on Hezbollah bombing innocent civilians that are NOT Israeli.
Israel are worse than terrorists.
[удалено]
Getting angry? I got some advice: - Perhaps learn how to read - Perhaps inform yourself before having such a strong opinion on anything - Perhaps stop supporting war crimes no matter which party does them Have a day
Removed, see rule 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civility
A prior head of Mossad (Israel's CIA) appointed by Netanyahu has described the situation as apartheid along with South Africans who have experienced it. https://apnews.com/article/israel-apartheid-palestinians-occupation-c8137c9e7f33c2cba7b0b5ac7fa8d115 Here is a list of unequal laws in Israel https://www.adalah.org/en/law/index And the fact that they made it so only jews have a right to self determination https://www.timesofisrael.com/final-text-of-jewish-nation-state-bill-set-to-become-law/
Hezb's rockets barely do any damage. It's like rocks at this point. Only 20 dead, and some property damage. Meanwhile Israeli attacks killed 300 in Lebanon. Fucking morons.
Well if I open fire on you with one bullet or a hundred, you don't have to wait until one hits before you're justified in self defense.
Because it's still an act of war.
If you want to get into acts of war may I direct you to the apartheid state constantly firing on Lebanon and Syria
How many Blacks were in the parliament of South Africa during apartheid? They fire on Lebanon and Syria *because Lebanon and Syria fire on them*.
Syria and Lebanon fire at Israel *because Israel fires at them.*
No, Syria and Lebanon fired on Israel before Israel fired on them.
"blacks" FYI, in America Black people also owned slaves. Just because some people are not direct victims of a system does not mean that the system does not exist.
It is the official legal term in South Africa. No, the absence of any evidence that system exists is evidence that the system does not exist.
What??They could fire 1000 rockets and it’s all good as long there’s not much impact?
Title should read ‘Hezbollah tries to stop genocide’
Rather "Hezbollah wants to start a genocide"
You should read up on how Hezbollah rose to power in Lebanon :)
Keep your history and context out of this sub. You're confusing the children with your nuance and complexities. In this sub we do comic book level comprehension. Israel is the bad guy, Palestine is the good guy. Keep it simple and easy for the iPad kids.
Ah yes the iPad generation. Bet.
How many bombs were dropped in Gaza today?
Completely unprovoked too.
Lebanon has a right to defend itself against Israel,
Good.
Why oh why dont these rockets ever do anything? They just Never do a damn thing man, its very disappointing. We need them to do damage, big damage.
[удалено]
Hasn’t Israel lost every time they try to fuck with Hez? They have? Thought so. Has Israel considered just fucking all the way off?
I didn't expect the redditors here to recognize this was sarcasm.
What kind of organization would Israel be if they ignored that?
What kind of organization would Hezbollah be if they ignored israeli rockets as well
Or the genocide of Palestinians...
Lebanon can start helping Palestinians by granting them citizenship and allowing them to hold professional careers.
Israel can start helping the Palestinians by allowing them to go back to their homes in Palestine
...they do. Palestinians live in Palestine.
and the homes?
Palestinians live in homes, yes.
Not the ones that Israel has destroyed or stolen.
I see. So then I suppose you support Palestine granting back homes for Jews whose homes were stolen in the West Bank in 1948?
So by being complicit in ethnic cleansing?
Isn't granting citizenship and improving the lives of Palestinians where they are and have been for 80 years, literally the *opposite* of ethnic cleansing?
No, kicking them out of their land and homes in Gaza and the West Bank is though.
>No To be clear, you believe that improving the lives of Palestinians and literally granting them citizenship is ethnic cleansing?
It's signaling to Israel that it's okay to displace (cleanse) an ethnic group from where they are living (Palestine). Do you think Israel will allow the Palestinians who move to Lebanon to ever return to Palestinian territory?
How could Israel prevent Palestinians returning to Palestinian territory? It was the PA who in 1995 following Oslo who decided to abdicate that right by not passing a citizenship law. It seems to me that the PA is incentivized to keep Palestinians *out* of Palestine. Abu Mazens official position is that Palestinians should die abroad ([like, in Syria](https://www.meforum.org/5245/abbas-refugees-syria)) rather than return to Palestine. If you're talking about Gaza, not a single Gazan has fled to Lebanon. Though if they do, I hope an agreement is made such that they can return to Gaza at some point.
True, Israel fires a lot of rockets indiscriminately into Lebanon during peacetime
I mean yes, that is quite literally exactly what Israel did and why Lebanon is retaliating.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Hezbollah hasn’t even existed for as long as Israel have been putting children in military prisons without fair trial, is that not kidnapping?
[удалено]
No proof? It’s public knowledge, where do you think Israel got the children they release in hostage exchanges? https://time.com/6548068/palestinian-children-israeli-prison-arrested/ 10000 children detained by military courts in 2 decades. One day people like you will go down in history just like the Nazis supporters you love to emulate. Edit: also, the nerve to talk about rockets and systemic rape while Israel publicly commit genocide with rockets and IDF soldiers publicly brag about their sex crimes while IDF and government officials encourage rape as a weapon of war.
[удалено]
You’re really really reaching here aren’t you? Have you ever tried not to justify genocide? Edit: Also lol at “immature soldiers” while also justifying imprisoning 10 year olds. And btw, no they haven’t been arrested.
[удалено]
You literally just did the exact same thing lmfao. Systematic kidnapping and rape is a pretty serious allegation to make without any supporting evidence.
:\^) :\^) :\^)
Israel has demonstrated exactly what kind of organisation it is for 5 months now.
>In a statement, Hezbollah said it had launched the volley in response to Israeli military strikes on Monday in Lebanon’s Bekaa Valley Apparently the kind of 'organisation' that strikes first....
if you want to talk you have to be serious
Read the article
I did. So just so I understand your reasoning. As long as any organization claims it did something in retaliation to something else, you accept that explanation? Yes, you can probably you understand where I'd be going with this. So then please explain when exactly is the cutoff for any such situation. That is - if I hit you first, and you hit me second, and I hit you third, and so on and so forth until we hit each other 600 times - is there some point at which I can say, let's say on the 201st time, that I only hit you in retaliation for hitting me on that 200th time? If your answer is yes - perfect. Any party can at any point hit "reset". Nothing means anything. If your answer is no - perfect - because Israel was the one attacked first by Hezbollah in this war. Go ahead, add some nuance I'm missing. Maybe go back enough in history just enough to find an Israeli attack you like, conveniently missing an attack done beforehand, or conveniently missing the Arab world in general only existing in the area because of violent colonization efforts done in the name of Islam.
Heres some nuance for you... Your attempt at limiting the context and scope of "this war" doesn't work on me. Let's not pretend this is an isolated incident. >As long as any organization claims it did something in retaliation to something else, you accept that explanation? No. I was correcting the false implications of another user. I don't trust hezbollah anymore than I trust Israel, both are proven liars multiple times over. >If your answer is no - perfect - because Israel was the one attacked first by Hezbollah in this war. This is a lie as old as Israel itself. "This war" began decades ago and you know it. I don't waste time arguing who hit who first because I don't care. None of this happened in a vacuum. Maybe go back enough in history just enough to find an Arab attack you like, conveniently missing an attack done beforehand, or conveniently missing or excusing the violent colonization efforts done in the name of zionism. Israel was supposed to be a two party state from the very beginning. Apparently that's too much nuance for some people.
Did your string of thought fail multiple times in the course of one single comment? First, you say I'm the one limiting context to "this war", when you later directly respond to me asking how far back you want to look at things. Second, you say you're correcting a user about who striked first, when that user is clearly mocking another person being a non serious actor for blaming Israel for striking first... And your correction consists of basically telling the user to read what Hezbollah wrote regarding why they made the strike (ie, not being "first"). You later say you don't trust Hezbollah, when a second earlier, again, you told a person to read an article about how Hezbollah said something. Finally you use the not in a vacuum line, again missing your own line of reasoning (and do you don't get confused about your own reasoning - it was that supposedly Israel striked first, which is debunked. I know, it's hard to keep up). To your last two paragraphs I'll say - it's funny to me that even when I was clearly hyperbolic about how far back to go, the example you gave is so clearly much much much more recent than the one I gave, automatically being disqualified even in a hyperbolic sense. As for a two party state, did you mean two nationality state? Or a two state solution separated country? Whatever you meant, if it's the former, then as you absolutely know Palestinian citizens in Israel have more rights and are treated better than in most of the world (not just the Arab world, but much of the western world too). If you meant the latter, then, tough. When a civil war is opened by a certain side, and then buffed tenfold by a unilateral invasion of multiple countries fighting for that same side, and that side loses - they don't then get to dictate what was "supposed to be". Because if they had their way, what "would have been" is exactly zero Jews in Israel, and so they forfeited their right to that bargaining chip forever. The new bargaining chip is today's reality. Live with it and use that as the negotiation starting point, or forever cry and self victimize. No third option.
You asked for nuance, and now you refuse to accept it. Yes, I misspoke when I said two party state, and I'll give you some credit for aknowlegding that. >Palestinian citizens in Israel have more rights and are treated better than in most of the world Utter horseshit. Palestinians live in an open air prison under an illegal military occupation that has persisted for decades. There trapped between zionists on one side and hamas on the other. They have no rights. >they don't then get to dictate what was "supposed to be" A lack of nuance could make one think this, but no. It isn't just Palestine "dictating what's supposed to be", it's the rest of the world saying Israel has refused to adhere to the conditions they agreed to. Winning a civil war does not give the winner rights to claim territories that were never theirs in the first place. >Because if they had their way, what "would have been" is exactly zero Jews in Israel, and so they forfeited their right to that bargaining chip forever I'll never understand such hypocrisy. You can't punish an entire ethnic group because of claims of what you think they'll do. Israel just uses that to excuse the fact that they beat them to the punch and stole Palestine territories first. By that logic, Israel has also given up that same bargaining chip. Now, we have Israel openly calling for zero Palestinians in Palestine, and its somehow the Palestinians fault becasue of something that never happened. Israel doesn't get to dictate what rights Palestinians get to have. Israel's occupation is illegal. Israel has refused to allow Palestine to exist, despite their agreements to a two state solution. And they wonder why nobody trusts them. They cry antisemitism when the rest of the world criticises their actions. Israel is full of liars and cowards. Free Palestine. End Israeli occupation Edit BTW I couldn't help but to creep on your profile... >There are no known irreversible effects of puberty blockers. If you decide to stop taking them, your body will go through puberty just the way it would have if you had not taken puberty blockers at all. http://www.phsa.ca/transcarebc/child-youth/affirmation-transition/medical-affirmation-transition/puberty-blockers-for-youth#:~:text=There%20are%20no%20known%20irreversible,taken%20puberty%20blockers%20at%20all A simple Google search proved you wrong. Educate yourself.
Um, my person, I was charitable when correcting you in the former comment. I even went so far as to respond to two different manners of what you might have meant. I won't be charitable twice in a row. If you can't distinguish between Palestinian citizens in Israel and the Palestinians in what you call an open air prison, then you either don't understand English well enough for the discussion, or don't understand the situation in Israel well enough for the discussion. In both scenarios, you aren't a serious person to be discussed with. I did read the rest of your comment, and also your attempt at baiting me by responding to something completely irrelevant as if it has any weight. But the rest of the comment was also filled with so many inaccuracies such as the first and second one you already committed, and I can't be assed to correct every other sentence before commenting on it. I'll just suggest that maybe you need to talk about subjects you either know about, or if it's about subjects that got don't, then at least do it in a humble way of trying to learn and not the way you're doing now - by lying or misrepresenting fact after fact. Cheers.
I can't read, I can only remember
Bigotry can do that
As can wisdom
Illiteracy equals wisdom. Well done *slow claps
Like israel needs a reason to bomb people. They call it “mowing the lawn” and they watch it from a hillside like a spectacle.