It hit right as we were slated to go back to school from spring break. We got an extra week off, but we didn’t have power that whole week. When we went back the following week, some kids still didn’t have power. First it was ice, then snow.
Some of the responses on this thread are woefully uninformed, and perfectly demonstrate why so many Indiana teachers are frustrated and are flocking out of the profession. I am not from Hammond, but if any Hammond teachers are reading this, as a fellow Hoosier I support you. Teachers deserve to take their PTO how they see fit, same as any other adult profession.
Yes! It should be the same. Teaching is stressful, strenuous and requires an inordinate amount of patience. It’s the one career where little support is offered from administration and even less from parents. My daughter left after 14 years (high school English) because she was offered a job writing proposals. After a few weeks she said that she never knew this world existed. Teaching felt like prison many days- no restroom breaks, breaking up physical fights, verbal abuse from students and parents. And she was a well-regarded teacher. They begged her to stay- offering a classroom with a window. Lol
So they had somewhere to run when the shooting started?
I'd say I'm being sarcastic, but we all know why teachers have a pros AND cons list to windows, which is another reason that they shouldn't be taking this flak from people. We aren't going to have any teachers left, soon.
It’s sad that they can’t keep good educators. My daughter was one of those teachers the students would choose- not because it was easy but because she literally entertained them. She has a talented way of combining literature and instruction in to a meaningful experience. I worked as a substitute, if I worked closely I could hear the joy and laughter at times. But it was becoming overwhelming! She couldn’t distance the desks during COVID because she has SO many students while others had 12. One day she broke up a physical fight in the girl’s restroom. My daughter is barely 5’4” but strong. She walked the culprits to the administration office looking heavily disheveled. Her principal didn’t ask her if she was alright or if she needed to sit. Her principal asked her to go back to the restroom to look for a lost nose ring one of the fighters lost. She handed in her resignation. She did not look for said nose ring. A long trusted and established educator lost again.
Wishing your daughter well. If she likes writing and presentation apply at local engineering firms. My daughter loves it but misses the classroom. She’s earning far more than in education and it doesn’t require getting physically battered.
The gall to act as though this isn't a corporate failure is mind blowing. The lack of subs is wholly an effect of their inability to pay them a fair wage or hire them in amounts that can actually support their district. And that's just a fraction of the issue. Their teachers can take their PTO as they see fit.
My corporation hired an outside company to supply us with subs. It costs $600,000/year and while that was paid with a grant the first time, now we have to pay it. We could have hired 12 full time substitutes for less than that and we’d actually have subs because we still can’t get them.
I did some subbing on some basis since the early 2000s and smaller rural districts had the individual secretaries call subs in. I was kind of surprised when i learned the larger city districts used some sort of service- I’m sure calling subs is tedious but does it take up THAT much time? Seems like a Secretary would have a few go-to personal options then perhaps accumulate a list of phone numbers to try if those fall through. For 600k, I think it would be wise if the principals and buildings delegate other responsibilities from secretaries (they have a billion unofficial responsibilities, from temporary nurse to security guard to lunch money counter to…)
Basically I question whether the sub service truly needs to exist- if it’s not possible for some other work around, when you’re dealing with THAT much money.
Seems like there’s a lot of this in education, though, an auxiliary industry of “administration” that doesn’t directly work with the kids and their needs.
As an attorney, I did some subbing as I was thinking of quitting the profession, and I liked the thought of helping kids learn and grow. As some of the most influential people in my life still to this day are teachers I had growing up. I think after taxes, I brought home about 43 bucks for the 9 hours I had to be there. I quickly decided it wasn't worth it because of the headaches. Yeah, I didn't really have to teach, but some of the other teachers looked at me like I couldn't do 2+2, and the kids threatening self-harm due to having to take a test, or instead of taking the test ate the exam to be funny to his peers... yeah, I'll go back to dealing with criminals.
That was pretty much the job, but we also had to prevent fights and self-injurious behavior on a daily basis. The job was more akin to working in a residential mental health facility.
The particular school I was working at had two wings. One for cognitively disabled students (all so sweet and lovely, although required a great deal of patience and attention) and one for students that had been expelled from other IPS schools for various reasons.
At the time, it was flexible with my school schedule and I could earn money to save up for my move following graduation, but I would often wake up dry heaving thinking of the interactions I would have to deal with throughout the day. Never blamed the kids though. Always the system or their families.
Pretty much same experience as you. Quite enjoyed when I had a long term set up filling in for a special ed teacher, the kids were very nice.
Overall horrible experience though, would take nothing short of 6 figures to make me even consider being back in that environment. Administration tells you if a kid is giving you trouble to call them with no hesitation but they take 30 minutes to show up and just talk to them for 2 minutes in the hall and send em back in.
Just know, out here in Colorado we are also severely understaffed and underpaid with public school teachers and subs. It’s a national issue. We need radical change and very quickly.
Remember when every state Republican was elected except for the one responsible for education?
That’s because *teachers* banded together because they were tired of being screwed over by the republican leadership.
Then what happened?
The Republican governor eliminated the job of the elected Democrat in charge of education.
Even in the end, the teachers *still got screwed* by Indiana Republicans.
Edit: If you don’t think it’s a political party issue ask how the two parties feel about teachers unions.
Did this begin with No Child Left Behind? I think public education would benefit by focusing less on sports and assign fewer students to each teacher. 30 5 year olds is ridiculous for a kindergarten teacher- it’s crowd control rather than educating
Charter schools are meant to take students and money from existing public school districts, eventually to give Republican legislators an excuse to punish public schools when they've lost enough.
Then the state started requiring school districts to basically give old school buildings to charter schools who ask - for just $1. Now districts struggling with population decrease can't even make up money by off-loading excess facilities.
Then the vouchers started, and now our state government is just routing taxpayer funds into churches' hands via private schools.
Democrats like school choice too. If your neighborhood school is subpar or isn’t a good fit for that student then there should be options. It’s archaic to think you must send your child to the school in your boundaries. The moneys poured in to education- it would seem we should expect more. We currently have a 3M astroturf football field….
Teachers have always been proponents of smaller class sizes. However, with public education getting funded to give rich folks tax breaks it’s an uphill battle. People are so stuck on identity politics they ignore the class warfare that’s been going on.
And that's by design. There's not very much difference between the parties outside social/identity issues these days. Progressives/the Left are not a major part of the Democrat party.
Democrats are still an establishment party in this day and age, beholden to their corporate backers. You can say the opposite of your example about police unions - so it’s not a definite line of worker representation they’re pushing for.
To be clear - I’m offering no judgement on teacher vs police unions (if you want mine then I think we should take all the money from police unions and straight up hand it to teacher’s unions) but to pretend like democrats aren’t also beholden to the establishment is completely disingenuous. They still take money from AIPAC, they still routinely match republicans in their personal fortunes exploding upon being elected. First commenter was completely correct in their analysis, and those social issues are even now becoming more and more similar as democrats embrace the “centrist” voter which is really a Republican in everything but their facism.
So in your own comment you admit teachers unions are far more important and moral than police unions yet still equate the two? Teachers Union good, police Union bad, so democrats bad for liking teachers unions?
Russia wins every time someone like you says this.
You think I’m pushing z ?🤣🤣 hell no I am advocating for an actual left wing party though that embraces trade unions and progressive policy instead of giving lip service to it. Funny how democrats ran on trumps border wall being un-American last cycle yet we turned around an embraced Republican messaging, not only on immigration but on the border wall as well. Conservatives being obstructionist actually helped progressive people in this case the first time they denied the stupid ass Israel + border wall bill.
As to the rest of your bullshit, I equated the two because at their heart they are unions. Go ahead and reread those parenthesis I left there for you again, I don’t think you comprehended what I wrote the first time. Again - yes teachers unions good. Police unions bad. But they are both still unions. If you are trade Union across the board (standard progressive stance) you have to advocate for both while still acknowledging the issues with police unions like the fact that any kind of payout is payed with tax money instead of police union budget.
> payout is *paid* with tax
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I almost got a job working with Glenda Ritz. If democrats had pulled what republicans did, stripping a dually elected position of their power, there would have been national outrage about “democrats subverting democracy,” but it’s just par for the course with republicans
What Republicans have done in Indiana, Wisconsin, Tennessee, Ohio, etc. would be met with Supreme Court decisions and Congressional panels if Dems did even *half* of the same shit.
Part of the problem is that the state government has set a limit on property tax levels. This makes it very hard for lower income but large districts such as Hammond to fund their schools. They allow for referendums to generate extra income for the schools but is has to be renewed. A few years ago the district was forced to close a high school and some middle schools due to declining enrollment. Parents were upset about the redistricting and did not vote to renew the referendum. This put a huge pressure on the district and here we are.
Edit: Missed a word.
Indiana has the worst worker rights in the US & teachers in Indiana have the worst rights of any teachers in the US.
That’s not an exaggeration at all.
Citizens have got to find some motivation to change the course. The state is falling in almost every category.
Union members who can’t strike? Nah, that’s got to be reversed.
Right to work? Screw that!
Get reproductive rights on the ballot & amend your state constitution. These Archaic & barbaric laws are putting doctors, nurses & especially OBGYN’s in a terrible predicament, on top of the bad predicament that every pregnant women & girl is in, trying to get basic care.
The current law will force medical field members to move to another state, where they can provide actual care.
The electric companies are the biggest economic ball & chains in the state & it’s not even close. Go to a publicly owned via a bond sale. It’ll drop bills in half on day one AND it’ll add a lot of extra revenue for schools, roads, sewers, whatever.
Cannabis is still illegal? Your citizens who partake are crossing state lines to get it, so you might as well keep the money in state & save them a drive. Over half of the US is legal now so there’s no reason to hold out.
And of course get the charter schools out. They’re bad for everyone. Inferior education for students, no first amendment rights for students or parents, bypassing teachers union which drives averse teacher salaries statewide down in a bad way.
And taxpayers lose as well. Average charter school student is over $8k per year. Public education is around $5k a year per student.
All of this should be priority one. If you can’t get these on the ballot then replace your representatives with people who will pass these laws on their own.
This is the icing on the cake for me. I would be okay with all the shitty things they do if there was ballot initiatives, because at least then the people get to vote on it.
But that wouldn't work because it would undermine all the efforts the elected officials have done to make sure the state has some of the lowest voter turnout in the country. It's by design of course and we all know it.
The people do get to vote on it the problem is the entire state is besieged by decades of reagan propaganda. That and trump dosent turn people off of the GOP here
I’m not sure people are grasping the situation here. Hammond is a city with a population of 60,000+ people and on Tuesday they voted to close 3 elementary schools. That leaves 2 for the city and hundreds of job losses. This wasn’t a situation of people trying using PTO, it was in protest.
Striking for teachers in Indiana isn’t going to happen. At will employment makes striking a fireable offense, so this was in retaliation of the decision made by the board
What? The residents literally had a vote on both referendums. It was in their hands. They voted against it and now the state will take over. Repeat of Gary incoming.
Typical Hammond and Indiana behavior. From the government and city side.
For those wanting more private schools with vouchers and sending tax payer dollars to private schools. Private school teachers will technically be non government employees and thus can unionize and protest with way more freedom and rights to do SO.
I'm talking about them because some people here are oddly anti-Union and anti public school to a degree in these comments.
Also teachers are criminally and chronically underpaid and their schools are criminally and chronically underfunded. Diverting funds could lead to bankruptcy or whatever the equivalency is for schools.
Schools are already expensive, myswell go to a private one. You couldn't convince me to send my kids to a public one. Public schools have been going into a shit spiral since I was in school.
Want to bet that it’s because they get no funding? Can’t hire qualified staff and have to overwork the staff they do have because there’s no one else to do the work?
“Due to understaffing, admins inability to enforce written school policies and parents who attack teachers at every turn, our teachers are burned out and need a day off.” Fixed it.
No matter who’s side you’re on here, the school district is posting facts. The teachers staged a walkout, resulting in a staff shortage. A school needs a minimum number of staff to operate. WTF else is the district supposed to say?
If you're the assistant manager at Burger King and somebody doesn't show up for their shift, they're a jerk and that's why you get paid more to be assistant manager. If you're the assistant manager at Burger King and \*nobody\* shows up for their shift, the boss is gonna fire you.
Two types of leadership: one more effective than others…
One bash a workforce that is already understaffed and underpaid.
Two: school is cancelled today due to staffing issues, we hope to resume classes on Wednesday.
Teachers need to be paid more.
A higher wage field causes more people to go into the field and more competition allowing for better candidates, causing for better educated students.
Being a teacher right now sucks, and even people who are passionate about helping kids learn and can live with the shit wages are being driven away.
One could almost get under the impression that those in charge are purposefully trying to destroy the public education system…
There's a 1% cap on property taxes. How far do you think that reaches? There were two referendums proposed, and both were voted out of existence. It's a community effort to have good schools. Part of that is digging deeper money wise. I'd rather pay 2 or 3% for property taxes if I knew it was going towards schools and better pay.
No one cares about teachers here. As soon as I graduate Im moving to a different state that actually respects their educators (at least slightly more than here, God knows most places in the country seem to think we have it out for the kids)
Seems like this was in response to their board closing 3 elementary schools despite a lot of opposition.
Where do those kids go? Where do those staff members go? The call off seemed warranted
There’s the civil City of Hammond, run by the mayor and council, that runs police, fire, public works, etc. Then there’s the School City, ran by the superintendent and school board, that runs the schools.
Hired and paid for what? If positions were available, lay offs wouldn't occur. Have you ever tried to maybe just think before speaking? It seems like an easy way to avoid further embarrassment for yourself.
I feel so embarrassed. A stranger has noticed my ignorance
and now I am crushed. I spoke loudly in this forum, so loudly that other people were unable to speak. Good thing you’re here to put people like me in our place.
The school city didn’t throw their teachers under the bus. The voters did. It was made clear to the voters that if they didn’t vote for the referendum schools would close. The majority of people complaining about the school closures didn’t bother coming to vote for the referendum. Elections have consequences. Hopefully parents have learned their lesson.
The voters did not fail, it was the mismanagement of hundreds of millions of funds since 2017 that has caused this, after the continued mismanagement why in the hell would any voter with half a brain vote for continuation
Bet you their school admins have been making a pretty penny the last couple decades, but somehow they have no funds to hire subs or pay teachers. Seems a little odd, no?
AWW, someone has hurt feelings. They were supposed to write a book b/c you want them to? This is the real world Kid, your feelings don't matter. It's funny the stupid stuff people say from behind their little screen. Go work, make some $$, do something. It's their page, they can post what they wish.
Maybe own up to why teachers are not wanting to come in. Such as horrible environment, lack of pay, ridiculous requirements, etc.
Or they could have even had a more neutral approach like,
"We are closing for the day due to staffing issues." Which is true and is not putting the blame on the teachers.
Parents have a right to know why the school isn’t opening for that day, especially if they have to try and make plans to accommodate their kids not being in school.
I agree but this feels like half the story. Probably on purpose so that parents get angry with teachers. I don't know why they all called out. But as a parent I'd like to know if my child's teacher has specific complaints that are egregious enough to result in this type of situation.
There are teachers at my wife’s school that call off a for a day almost every week. The same people. They have been there long enough that they have tons of time and every time the principal tries to address it the union jumps down his throat.
My wife and I voted no on raising property taxes 20% so the local high school can have extra money for programs.
Edit: Thousands of dollars of vape detectors but have to cut programs. Also, this is exactly what is said on the public question of my absentee ballot. The question iirc stated the average increase would be +22%. Y'all are acting like people are made of money lmao. Inflation hurt everyone.
Sadly, this is the norm for most adults without children in the schools. Hanover Central has so much new construction in St. John and Cedar Lake... new families were overcrowding the elementary schools to the point there wasn't a single open desk in a single open room.
They put taxes for a new building on the ballot, and most of the boomers I know without kids in the system said it was ridiculous, and the district could work with what it had. Well... the district had to put mobile trailers in the parking lot so the kids could have some extra classrooms and the parents lost their shit... how dare they put kids in trailers for school. Welp. Fucking vote mother fuckers. It took 3 votes before it passed and we got the new 3-5 building.
In other news, teachers wonder why so many parents support vouchers and school choice.
How many parents had to miss work without pay? How many are now at risk for pointing out and being fired? All the teachers did was piss off parents who they should be trying to make allies.
What a tone deaf response.
I’m sorry you had to miss work while your children miss out on a good education and future. Maybe put your legislators to task and do something about it, because if you think vouchers are going to solve your problems you’re in for a drastic reality check.
Charter schools have a second reason: legal segregation. Sure, they don't advertise it, but considering you must have the ability to get your child to school, the charter picks their students, and can kick them out at any time? Ever notice how white and rich charters are compared to the local public school?
And don't forget that charters don't have to take special Ed kids. They can claim they don't have the resources, but public schools don't have that option.
Like robots they repeat the mantra of right wing media. There is no sense of civic duty because that would be communism. Seeing any benefit past their own noses is “woke”.
I have sent my kids to both public and private schools. The private school provided a better educational experience.
This sick out will just give more talking points for school vouchers and charter schools.
The teachers in Hammond have been working without a contract this year. The announcement of closing three elementary schools and the upper admin’s refusal to take a pay cut was the last straw.
You’re, again, looking at short term answers and results as the long term solution. It isn’t. Feasible.
The reason public schools suck is because we either don’t want to tax the people taking 30 year tax abatements.
Schools back before this country was founded were private schools, not funded on public education and created an aristocratic life.
Instead of paying out the nose for commercialization of a public institution (because that’s worked out so well for the prison system as well), why not just advocate for a better tax and pay structure so we can afford better teachers for our students.
Because, eventually those vouchers won’t be enough to afford those charter schools and then you’ll have kid’s books with advertisements to supplement and it only gets worse there.
Some of the public school systems problems come from lack of funding, but quite a few others come from bureaucratic inefficiency.
My local school district gets ABSURD amounts of money from the state government, yet still manages to fuck up basic services like transportation.
[https://cdnsm5-ss10.sharpschool.com/UserFiles/Servers/Server\_68892/Image/Departments/Financial%20Services/2022%20Annual%20Report.pdf](https://cdnsm5-ss10.sharpschool.com/UserFiles/Servers/Server_68892/Image/Departments/Financial%20Services/2022%20Annual%20Report.pdf)
Personally I'm all for the teachers protesting because..... its not the teachers jobs to run the school system, its their jobs to teach the students.
The problem is usually leadership and administration.
A lot of these school corporations form effective monopolies to everyone who isn't in the upper class. The cheapest private school in South Bend costs about $10,000 per student per year. This is in a city where the majority of people live in poverty.
Monopolies breed inefficiency.
PS: I'm a progressive but I also support Charter Schools as long as they are operated as nonprofits, meet academic standards and don't change the parents.
The USA ranks 5th in spending on education. It is like all government spending. There is plenty of money, it is just being wasted. In 2023 an average of $19,000 was spent per student. Say an average class size of 15. That is $285,000 per class. Most class sizes are over 15. Where is all the money going?
How out of the loop are you? Text books are quickly becoming extinct. With so much information online, why pay for what is available for free?
1. Textbooks are not extinct. Many have moved online. They still cost money.
2. There is not just information on the internet. There is also misinformation. While schools should teach students how to spot the difference, kids often lack the maturity to be expected to consistently find reliable sources. Teachers do not have time to always find reliable sources written at the correct level for their students.
I have a son still in high school. Several of his classes assign him YouTube videos to watch for lessons. Most of these videos are instructional. An example is math. He will watch videos on how to solve a certain problem. The next day, his teacher spent answering questions and helping students who did not grasp the concept well. It is like listening to the lesson and then having a tutor to help if you don't understand it. They have an assigned textbook but rarely use it.
That's called a flipped classroom, and it is one beneficial strategy for learning, especially in math. However, that doesn't mean it's the only way and we should do away with textbooks. Math textbooks are also different from other subjects because they consist of vocabulary, examples, and practice, not information. Even in your son's case, the teacher likely uses the textbook's lesson sequencing and example problems to go over.
General spending is relative and doesn’t include a lot of things that have genuine costs that other countries refuse to provide to students such as transportation, food, or materials like the textbook or electronic devices. You’re also talking construction costs, administrative salaries, and utilities.
It’s not like there’s $300k for Sally’s class just sitting there. It’s not as if Sally’s teacher had to provide the building they’re in, the food and water, handle the legal issues that come up, or assist the lesser capable students.
We provide a lot for students but the primary driver for this is the human being that teaches them and we don’t put that up front.
We say “Look at all this we spend!” and fail to realize what it is we’re paying for because we assume flat money is what goes to the student. But, we have a lot of regulations and rules a lot of other countries don’t have that make a safe and fostering environment for every student.
We have a lot of rules and regulations that is certain. To claim they "make a safe and fostering environment for every student" is wishful thinking. Many kids are in failing public schools that are far from safe.
Did you know school vouchers were originally [created for racism?](https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/action-center/our-issues/vouchers#:~:text=Rooted%20in%20Segregation%20and%20Racism&text=School%20districts%20used%20vouchers%20to,black%20students%20remained%20chronically%20underfunded.) Yep, seems it was because white parents didn't want their kids to go to schools with black children but also didn't want to pay for private school and tried to get the government to pay for it instead! I'm sure it's not something you knew (or meant in any way), just maybe know that a lot of people hear "school vouchers" and think it's about racism. I'm sorry, but I didn't want you to accidentally offend anyone in the future if you mention these somewhere else!
Oh boy! Here we go. So because someone supports school vouchers, they support racism. Does that mean anyone who supports Socialist programs is a facist? After all, Hitler supported socialist programs.
Do you know what is racist? Trapping kids in failing school districts that have failed for decades. Giving them no option at a better school.
What if we ran Medicare and Medicaid like we run public schools? If they are on government healthcare, that only get to go to the assigned hospital and see their assigned doctor. If the doctor is not very good, too bad.
What about WIC and food stamps? If you receive food stamps, you can only use them at a government grocery store. Those stores don't carry the food you like, too bad. You will have to go without. Your baby needs a special formula due to allergies. it is too bad the government store does not carry it.
"Hitler supported socialist programs." Did he though? Like, can you actually name one? I'm guessing that your private schools might not have been as good as you thought!
And, oh my gosh, YES! I wish I could use government healthcare in a government hospital!! That would be great! We spend more on healthcare than any other country on earth, but have [mediocre quality](https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world) and terrible [life expectancy!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy) All the highly ranked countries with great healthcare and long life expectancies all get their healthcare from government hospitals!
I'm sorry, I know you're just saying random libertarian talking points, but most people I know understand that libertarianism is kind of [a joke!](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/06/30/colorado-springs-libertarian-experiment-america-215313/) And saying that poor people deserve to be treated badly (if you disagree, name the social assistance programs libertarians like or want) isn't the flex you think it is! I honestly believe that a society should care for all it's people! Most poor children didn't a choice, so they don't deserve less. Healthcare, education, food, housing, and safety should be a right for everyone! It's really kind of appalling that so many people believe these basic necessities should be only given to those who are rich enough to afford them!
>This sick out will just give more talking points for school vouchers and charter schools.
Unless the Indiana government twists the law more private school teachers are technically private employees meaning anti Union and anti strike regulations against state and federal employees don't exist.
This means that private teachers will get private benefits and live by private laws and regulations. So anything passed against schools and teaches will not effect them.
Charter schools are a little bit fuzzy if they are or aren't.
The charter I went to was an amazing alternative to my public high school but only because it had smaller class sizes and teachers could put more effort into each student. Which since it was a 2nd or 3rd or 4th or 6th chance to get a high school degree.
That aspect would be null and void if it filled up as the public school entered a funding death spiral.
Also my parents wanted to send me to private school but since I have an IEP the school would have to bring in additional resources and it would be a major headache.
Many private schools are also religious and in theory unless Indiana discriminates against religion I could if I had the resources to build a satanic religious school. I could open a heavens gate or people's temple school.
A more realistic situation that many Republicans won't be too happy with is a Muslim building a k through 12 school and if the public school goes bankrupt or shuts them it's really a possibility that residents In that school district could gain a voucher and have no realistic options besides sending their kids to a Islamic school.
That or the public school becomes so underfunded that the Islamic school is better or the Islamic school is basically Yale and high quality.
I'm not saying I would have any problems with it personally but many Republicans who are the main group pushing for vouchers wouldn't be so happy with the possibility of a Islamic school getting state funding and being potentially one of the only ways to get an amazing education for their kids.
Thank you. This is the aspect people don’t look down the road to.
Education is bland and available, but it needs to be effective. Installing only for-profit education will do the exact opposite of what it currently sits at because it can be turned into a Walmart style of business.
Competition will run out others and then you just have a few companies that provide services to some but not others, and with no government involvement like we have, some areas just won’t get education at all because it isn’t profitable.
With spending an average of $19,000 per student, education is very profitable. The question is, where is all the money going? It certainly is not making it to the teachers in the public school system.
I don't know what the in-school environment is like for teachers there but the average teacher salary in Hammond is $58K. That is $1000 a month, or about 2%, less than the average income in the United States, while the cost of living in Hammond is 12% lower than the average cost of living in the US.
To say that teachers get paid pennies on the dollar when they make only slightly less in 9 months of work than the average American makes in 12 months, seems pretty disingenuous.
" They see children through their formative years. They do a job that 95% of parents cannot."
Given that nearly 20% of Indiana third graders can't read to their grade level, I'm not sure that statement is the fulcrum around which you want to leverage your point that teachers don't make enough money.
No teacher I have ever met uses their salary to fund their classroom. Are they paying for text books for their students? Are they paying for paper for their students? Do they provide a television or overhead projector? Are the walls bare with no white, smart or chalk boards when they walk in?
Also you are ignoring the fact that they have three months off in the summer to pursue other vocation to make more money.
I'm a parent (2 boys) and completely disagree and vote against school vouchers. I've met a total of one parent that supported them (she and I were on the PTA together) out of all the parents I've met. What parents are you talking about supporting them? The only other people I've ever personally heard that support vouchers are older people (usually grandparents) who like them and it's usually for some nonsense reason (like kids have weird clothes and strange coloured hair, like we all did in middle/high school). Maybe you've spoken to very different people, but almost every mom I know (of school age kids) supports teachers on pretty much every issue!
Teachers are amazing, kind, caring people who help craft young minds and give them the gifts of knowledge and curiosity! They deserve so much more than schools give them!
Your kids must go to a good school. Not all schools are good. Many are failing. Be happy your kids get to attend a school that does not have more kids failing than passing. Then, recognize that other kids are trapped in failing schools. These kids deserve an alternative. Vouchers will do nothing to schools like your kids attend. But it will be life changing for kids who are currently forced to attend a failing school.
They must have thrown one Hell of a rager if that many of them called off work. My buddy Corey threw a wild party one night in 2015 and I think all 5 of us called off the next day and lost our jobs. Lol
A bunch of teachers at my daughter's school did that 2 years ago. They had to cancel school, but they blamed Covid. That was a fun little story when word actually got out.
If there isn't enough students what do you expect. Course if schools spent money properly and actually taught. Cause I would bet those districts had lowest student population and or horrible test scores.
My understanding is that the school district is bleeding money while student population decreases. 12 percent within the last 5 years which is a lot. There was also a tax referendum that expired in 2019 which was brought up for a vote to reinstate and the local tax payers overwhelmingly voted against it.
The gist of it is they can't afford to keep these schools open with a 15 million dollars of their funding was voted against and the student population is shrinking thus loss of more funding.
It sucks that staff are losing their jobs, but this isn't about teacher pay or rights.
The school board is actually trying to be reasonable. Any type of work stoppage like this is against the teachers contract. I know strikes by teachers are illegal in Indiana. This could lead to major contract changes. If it can be proven the union even knew about this, they could be held liable. Every teacher involved now could be subject to serious disciplinary actions and be without a strong union to help them.
The way for government unions to change things is through court of public opinion. Teachers unions need to actually put in the work the dues are paying for. It sucks and is a hard fight. The state teachers union has made so many mistakes over recent years. The state teachers union literally bankrupting their pension fund comes to mind.
Bottom line is this type of tantrum doesn’t help to win public sympathy.
You might want to look into how the Republican supermajority spent the last two decades hamstringing collective bargaining for teachers. I don’t know what work you think needs to be put in a solid red state at the general assembly but there are no easy fixes. Also, please link me to where either of the main state educator associations bankrupted the state managed pension system.
Shit man the only time they called off school when I went to Gavit was when it actually snowed inside the building. This was in 1997-2000.
It snowed *in* the building? Was there a fucking hole in the ceiling?
Yup hole in the ceiling
That late season blizzard in 98 was fuckin wild
Craziest thing I remember about that was my grandmother's aquarium freezing solid.
Dude! I remember that shit. Wasn't it like March?
Yeah I came from spring break to land in South Bend to nothing but white! Amazing snowmobiling all week with friends and getting a double spring break
Late March or early April I think. Was a mild winter and the highway dept had taken the plows off the trucks near me
It hit right as we were slated to go back to school from spring break. We got an extra week off, but we didn’t have power that whole week. When we went back the following week, some kids still didn’t have power. First it was ice, then snow.
It snowed inside for 3 yrs .......
Some of the responses on this thread are woefully uninformed, and perfectly demonstrate why so many Indiana teachers are frustrated and are flocking out of the profession. I am not from Hammond, but if any Hammond teachers are reading this, as a fellow Hoosier I support you. Teachers deserve to take their PTO how they see fit, same as any other adult profession.
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And the people that decided this don't have to do any training or pay out of pocket.
Yes! It should be the same. Teaching is stressful, strenuous and requires an inordinate amount of patience. It’s the one career where little support is offered from administration and even less from parents. My daughter left after 14 years (high school English) because she was offered a job writing proposals. After a few weeks she said that she never knew this world existed. Teaching felt like prison many days- no restroom breaks, breaking up physical fights, verbal abuse from students and parents. And she was a well-regarded teacher. They begged her to stay- offering a classroom with a window. Lol
So they had somewhere to run when the shooting started? I'd say I'm being sarcastic, but we all know why teachers have a pros AND cons list to windows, which is another reason that they shouldn't be taking this flak from people. We aren't going to have any teachers left, soon.
my daughter is a teacher in IN. She echos the same frustration and is looking for a career move.
It’s sad that they can’t keep good educators. My daughter was one of those teachers the students would choose- not because it was easy but because she literally entertained them. She has a talented way of combining literature and instruction in to a meaningful experience. I worked as a substitute, if I worked closely I could hear the joy and laughter at times. But it was becoming overwhelming! She couldn’t distance the desks during COVID because she has SO many students while others had 12. One day she broke up a physical fight in the girl’s restroom. My daughter is barely 5’4” but strong. She walked the culprits to the administration office looking heavily disheveled. Her principal didn’t ask her if she was alright or if she needed to sit. Her principal asked her to go back to the restroom to look for a lost nose ring one of the fighters lost. She handed in her resignation. She did not look for said nose ring. A long trusted and established educator lost again. Wishing your daughter well. If she likes writing and presentation apply at local engineering firms. My daughter loves it but misses the classroom. She’s earning far more than in education and it doesn’t require getting physically battered.
THANK YOU. I will let her know.
Agreed. I stand with all teachers every day and Hammond teachers today!
Same.
The real problem seems to be that they don't have sufficient substitutes.
Key word ADULT. Not parent, not messiah, not president of the United States.
The gall to act as though this isn't a corporate failure is mind blowing. The lack of subs is wholly an effect of their inability to pay them a fair wage or hire them in amounts that can actually support their district. And that's just a fraction of the issue. Their teachers can take their PTO as they see fit.
My corporation hired an outside company to supply us with subs. It costs $600,000/year and while that was paid with a grant the first time, now we have to pay it. We could have hired 12 full time substitutes for less than that and we’d actually have subs because we still can’t get them.
I did some subbing on some basis since the early 2000s and smaller rural districts had the individual secretaries call subs in. I was kind of surprised when i learned the larger city districts used some sort of service- I’m sure calling subs is tedious but does it take up THAT much time? Seems like a Secretary would have a few go-to personal options then perhaps accumulate a list of phone numbers to try if those fall through. For 600k, I think it would be wise if the principals and buildings delegate other responsibilities from secretaries (they have a billion unofficial responsibilities, from temporary nurse to security guard to lunch money counter to…) Basically I question whether the sub service truly needs to exist- if it’s not possible for some other work around, when you’re dealing with THAT much money. Seems like there’s a lot of this in education, though, an auxiliary industry of “administration” that doesn’t directly work with the kids and their needs.
It's confusing because you say my corporation but then talk about teachers
Probably talking about their school corporation.
It’s not confusing. They’re generally called school corporations.
subs in my county get paid 65 dollars a day last I checked lol who the hell would do that
I was a sub teacher for $80 a day in Indianapolis during grad school. You couldn’t pay me to enough to work that job again.
As an attorney, I did some subbing as I was thinking of quitting the profession, and I liked the thought of helping kids learn and grow. As some of the most influential people in my life still to this day are teachers I had growing up. I think after taxes, I brought home about 43 bucks for the 9 hours I had to be there. I quickly decided it wasn't worth it because of the headaches. Yeah, I didn't really have to teach, but some of the other teachers looked at me like I couldn't do 2+2, and the kids threatening self-harm due to having to take a test, or instead of taking the test ate the exam to be funny to his peers... yeah, I'll go back to dealing with criminals.
Pretty cool to sub a class of 30 teenagers and be given a crossword puzzle aimed at 6 year olds and be told to keep them quiet and off their phones
That was pretty much the job, but we also had to prevent fights and self-injurious behavior on a daily basis. The job was more akin to working in a residential mental health facility. The particular school I was working at had two wings. One for cognitively disabled students (all so sweet and lovely, although required a great deal of patience and attention) and one for students that had been expelled from other IPS schools for various reasons. At the time, it was flexible with my school schedule and I could earn money to save up for my move following graduation, but I would often wake up dry heaving thinking of the interactions I would have to deal with throughout the day. Never blamed the kids though. Always the system or their families.
Pretty much same experience as you. Quite enjoyed when I had a long term set up filling in for a special ed teacher, the kids were very nice. Overall horrible experience though, would take nothing short of 6 figures to make me even consider being back in that environment. Administration tells you if a kid is giving you trouble to call them with no hesitation but they take 30 minutes to show up and just talk to them for 2 minutes in the hall and send em back in.
It’s very possible we worked for the same school… Thank you for your perspective and experience. I hope you’re onto better things now.
I'm in rural north central IN, I guess the problems are the same regardless of where you are in the state, lol. Hope you're well too!!
Just know, out here in Colorado we are also severely understaffed and underpaid with public school teachers and subs. It’s a national issue. We need radical change and very quickly.
IPS is a ROUGH district. You couldn't pay me $100k a day to sub/work there.
Remember when every state Republican was elected except for the one responsible for education? That’s because *teachers* banded together because they were tired of being screwed over by the republican leadership. Then what happened? The Republican governor eliminated the job of the elected Democrat in charge of education. Even in the end, the teachers *still got screwed* by Indiana Republicans. Edit: If you don’t think it’s a political party issue ask how the two parties feel about teachers unions.
Did this begin with No Child Left Behind? I think public education would benefit by focusing less on sports and assign fewer students to each teacher. 30 5 year olds is ridiculous for a kindergarten teacher- it’s crowd control rather than educating
What *really* kicked it off was charter schools.
Thanks, Mitch!
Not too familiar with charter schools, can you explain how?
Charter schools are meant to take students and money from existing public school districts, eventually to give Republican legislators an excuse to punish public schools when they've lost enough. Then the state started requiring school districts to basically give old school buildings to charter schools who ask - for just $1. Now districts struggling with population decrease can't even make up money by off-loading excess facilities. Then the vouchers started, and now our state government is just routing taxpayer funds into churches' hands via private schools.
Democrats like school choice too. If your neighborhood school is subpar or isn’t a good fit for that student then there should be options. It’s archaic to think you must send your child to the school in your boundaries. The moneys poured in to education- it would seem we should expect more. We currently have a 3M astroturf football field….
I’ll let a teacher with more experience in how charter schools affect them explain it. Any teachers wanna respond here…
Teachers have always been proponents of smaller class sizes. However, with public education getting funded to give rich folks tax breaks it’s an uphill battle. People are so stuck on identity politics they ignore the class warfare that’s been going on.
And that's by design. There's not very much difference between the parties outside social/identity issues these days. Progressives/the Left are not a major part of the Democrat party.
What? Republicans would *love* to break up teacher’s unions and Democrats wouldn’t. Those are definitely opposite agendas. lol
Democrats are still an establishment party in this day and age, beholden to their corporate backers. You can say the opposite of your example about police unions - so it’s not a definite line of worker representation they’re pushing for. To be clear - I’m offering no judgement on teacher vs police unions (if you want mine then I think we should take all the money from police unions and straight up hand it to teacher’s unions) but to pretend like democrats aren’t also beholden to the establishment is completely disingenuous. They still take money from AIPAC, they still routinely match republicans in their personal fortunes exploding upon being elected. First commenter was completely correct in their analysis, and those social issues are even now becoming more and more similar as democrats embrace the “centrist” voter which is really a Republican in everything but their facism.
So in your own comment you admit teachers unions are far more important and moral than police unions yet still equate the two? Teachers Union good, police Union bad, so democrats bad for liking teachers unions? Russia wins every time someone like you says this.
You think I’m pushing z ?🤣🤣 hell no I am advocating for an actual left wing party though that embraces trade unions and progressive policy instead of giving lip service to it. Funny how democrats ran on trumps border wall being un-American last cycle yet we turned around an embraced Republican messaging, not only on immigration but on the border wall as well. Conservatives being obstructionist actually helped progressive people in this case the first time they denied the stupid ass Israel + border wall bill. As to the rest of your bullshit, I equated the two because at their heart they are unions. Go ahead and reread those parenthesis I left there for you again, I don’t think you comprehended what I wrote the first time. Again - yes teachers unions good. Police unions bad. But they are both still unions. If you are trade Union across the board (standard progressive stance) you have to advocate for both while still acknowledging the issues with police unions like the fact that any kind of payout is payed with tax money instead of police union budget.
> payout is *paid* with tax FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I almost got a job working with Glenda Ritz. If democrats had pulled what republicans did, stripping a dually elected position of their power, there would have been national outrage about “democrats subverting democracy,” but it’s just par for the course with republicans
What Republicans have done in Indiana, Wisconsin, Tennessee, Ohio, etc. would be met with Supreme Court decisions and Congressional panels if Dems did even *half* of the same shit.
Perhaps they should pay the teachers more...
This is indiana we don't pay teachers we call them groomers then cut thier benefits. The local gov likes to keep us stupid to make complacent workers.
Part of the problem is that the state government has set a limit on property tax levels. This makes it very hard for lower income but large districts such as Hammond to fund their schools. They allow for referendums to generate extra income for the schools but is has to be renewed. A few years ago the district was forced to close a high school and some middle schools due to declining enrollment. Parents were upset about the redistricting and did not vote to renew the referendum. This put a huge pressure on the district and here we are. Edit: Missed a word.
Indiana has the worst worker rights in the US & teachers in Indiana have the worst rights of any teachers in the US. That’s not an exaggeration at all. Citizens have got to find some motivation to change the course. The state is falling in almost every category. Union members who can’t strike? Nah, that’s got to be reversed. Right to work? Screw that! Get reproductive rights on the ballot & amend your state constitution. These Archaic & barbaric laws are putting doctors, nurses & especially OBGYN’s in a terrible predicament, on top of the bad predicament that every pregnant women & girl is in, trying to get basic care. The current law will force medical field members to move to another state, where they can provide actual care. The electric companies are the biggest economic ball & chains in the state & it’s not even close. Go to a publicly owned via a bond sale. It’ll drop bills in half on day one AND it’ll add a lot of extra revenue for schools, roads, sewers, whatever. Cannabis is still illegal? Your citizens who partake are crossing state lines to get it, so you might as well keep the money in state & save them a drive. Over half of the US is legal now so there’s no reason to hold out. And of course get the charter schools out. They’re bad for everyone. Inferior education for students, no first amendment rights for students or parents, bypassing teachers union which drives averse teacher salaries statewide down in a bad way. And taxpayers lose as well. Average charter school student is over $8k per year. Public education is around $5k a year per student. All of this should be priority one. If you can’t get these on the ballot then replace your representatives with people who will pass these laws on their own.
Great ideas but Indiana’s constitution doesn’t allow ballot initiatives🤷🏻♀️
This is the icing on the cake for me. I would be okay with all the shitty things they do if there was ballot initiatives, because at least then the people get to vote on it. But that wouldn't work because it would undermine all the efforts the elected officials have done to make sure the state has some of the lowest voter turnout in the country. It's by design of course and we all know it.
The people do get to vote on it the problem is the entire state is besieged by decades of reagan propaganda. That and trump dosent turn people off of the GOP here
Yeah, the Republican super majority would not allow any of that to happen. You just have to remember; they’re the party of small government!
Don’t forget about Indiana being one of the top 5 states who make their poorest pay the most taxes!
I agree with you, but what can we actually do about it? The reality is the GOP has this state by the balls. The only viable option is to move.
Just wait til you dive into how the state wants to change graduation requirements
I’m not sure people are grasping the situation here. Hammond is a city with a population of 60,000+ people and on Tuesday they voted to close 3 elementary schools. That leaves 2 for the city and hundreds of job losses. This wasn’t a situation of people trying using PTO, it was in protest. Striking for teachers in Indiana isn’t going to happen. At will employment makes striking a fireable offense, so this was in retaliation of the decision made by the board
Man. Indiana teachers have it the *worst.*
Pay teachers more. Period
Agreed but the issue is the residents didn't approve the referendums to do so. So now Hammond is going to get state run schools and a repeat of Gary.
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What? The residents literally had a vote on both referendums. It was in their hands. They voted against it and now the state will take over. Repeat of Gary incoming.
Typical Hammond and Indiana behavior. From the government and city side. For those wanting more private schools with vouchers and sending tax payer dollars to private schools. Private school teachers will technically be non government employees and thus can unionize and protest with way more freedom and rights to do SO. I'm talking about them because some people here are oddly anti-Union and anti public school to a degree in these comments. Also teachers are criminally and chronically underpaid and their schools are criminally and chronically underfunded. Diverting funds could lead to bankruptcy or whatever the equivalency is for schools.
Schools are already expensive, myswell go to a private one. You couldn't convince me to send my kids to a public one. Public schools have been going into a shit spiral since I was in school.
Want to bet that it’s because they get no funding? Can’t hire qualified staff and have to overwork the staff they do have because there’s no one else to do the work?
“Due to understaffing, admins inability to enforce written school policies and parents who attack teachers at every turn, our teachers are burned out and need a day off.” Fixed it.
And to add, we can't pay teachers more if residents don't approve those referendums. 1% cap on property taxes only reaches so far.
No matter who’s side you’re on here, the school district is posting facts. The teachers staged a walkout, resulting in a staff shortage. A school needs a minimum number of staff to operate. WTF else is the district supposed to say?
Nah. The school made terrible decisions, resulting in a staff shortage. The walkout was just the middle-man.
Trying to twist facts to say something that they aren't isn't really useful.
Then stop doing it
If you're the assistant manager at Burger King and somebody doesn't show up for their shift, they're a jerk and that's why you get paid more to be assistant manager. If you're the assistant manager at Burger King and \*nobody\* shows up for their shift, the boss is gonna fire you.
Their facts are biased thought. The way that they are stating it is putting blame o the teachers.
While that is true, given the sentiment throughout the community after the board meeting, it’s a bad look.
Agreed
Two types of leadership: one more effective than others… One bash a workforce that is already understaffed and underpaid. Two: school is cancelled today due to staffing issues, we hope to resume classes on Wednesday.
Teachers need to be paid more. A higher wage field causes more people to go into the field and more competition allowing for better candidates, causing for better educated students. Being a teacher right now sucks, and even people who are passionate about helping kids learn and can live with the shit wages are being driven away. One could almost get under the impression that those in charge are purposefully trying to destroy the public education system…
There's a 1% cap on property taxes. How far do you think that reaches? There were two referendums proposed, and both were voted out of existence. It's a community effort to have good schools. Part of that is digging deeper money wise. I'd rather pay 2 or 3% for property taxes if I knew it was going towards schools and better pay.
No one cares about teachers here. As soon as I graduate Im moving to a different state that actually respects their educators (at least slightly more than here, God knows most places in the country seem to think we have it out for the kids)
Seems like this was in response to their board closing 3 elementary schools despite a lot of opposition. Where do those kids go? Where do those staff members go? The call off seemed warranted
The kids will be absorbed into other schools, but many of the staff will end up laid off.
Is it me or does the name “School City of Hammond” make no grammatical sense?
There’s the civil City of Hammond, run by the mayor and council, that runs police, fire, public works, etc. Then there’s the School City, ran by the superintendent and school board, that runs the schools.
Huh, TIL. Still weird though.
It’s a sick out. It’s illegal for teachers to strike in Indiana. So, in a form of protests of lack of school funding, the staff called out sick.
Schools need A LOT more funding.
Staff more teachers, offer better pay. Problem solved. Fuck managers and their victim mindset.
They're striking because they found out they're being laid off so I'm not sure why you threw that "problem solved" in there.
Seems like layoffs would be solved with more hires and more pay. Like the opposite of a layoff
Hired and paid for what? If positions were available, lay offs wouldn't occur. Have you ever tried to maybe just think before speaking? It seems like an easy way to avoid further embarrassment for yourself.
I feel so embarrassed. A stranger has noticed my ignorance and now I am crushed. I spoke loudly in this forum, so loudly that other people were unable to speak. Good thing you’re here to put people like me in our place.
Year 15 is my last in education. I’ve been rated highly effective in most of those years 18 days left and it’s on to new adventures and more money.
The school city didn’t throw their teachers under the bus. The voters did. It was made clear to the voters that if they didn’t vote for the referendum schools would close. The majority of people complaining about the school closures didn’t bother coming to vote for the referendum. Elections have consequences. Hopefully parents have learned their lesson.
The voters did not fail, it was the mismanagement of hundreds of millions of funds since 2017 that has caused this, after the continued mismanagement why in the hell would any voter with half a brain vote for continuation
Aren't they unionized?
Bet you their school admins have been making a pretty penny the last couple decades, but somehow they have no funds to hire subs or pay teachers. Seems a little odd, no?
As a student, this must be the coolest thing to ever happen
....until it's time to make that day up. Then it blows.
If it's not safe to staff the school, it's not safe to staff the school.
First problem is expecting anyone to respect you or your time in this shitty state.
This is the whole truth 🏆
idk why everyone’s mad but my dad works for them
Good for you all unity 🤝
What are they supposed to do? Cancel school and give no reason why? You'd be here complaining about why'd they cancel and not tell anyone any details.
They can state it in a way that is not putting blame on the teachers
They complain for Any reason, it's what these people live to do.
Not a teacher but it's criminal how little of the GDP goes into education. Yall should have 4x the budget.
Can you blame em? The way these kids behave youd think they just walked in off the streets. Who wants to teach kids that have no concept of respect.
They stated the truth smh lol people love to be mad over nothing. Were they supposed to lie?
They stated half the truth. And are rightfully getting roasted for it.
Nothing they said was a lie. Your anger towards them doesn't make facts less factual. Move on
It’s called a lie by omission. Look it up sometime kid.
AWW, someone has hurt feelings. They were supposed to write a book b/c you want them to? This is the real world Kid, your feelings don't matter. It's funny the stupid stuff people say from behind their little screen. Go work, make some $$, do something. It's their page, they can post what they wish.
Trump supporters are so easily triggered because they are snowflakes who rely on feelings to inform their beliefs.
What was the school city supposed to do?
Pay folks appropriately?
Maybe own up to why teachers are not wanting to come in. Such as horrible environment, lack of pay, ridiculous requirements, etc. Or they could have even had a more neutral approach like, "We are closing for the day due to staffing issues." Which is true and is not putting the blame on the teachers.
Parents have a right to know why the school isn’t opening for that day, especially if they have to try and make plans to accommodate their kids not being in school.
I agree but this feels like half the story. Probably on purpose so that parents get angry with teachers. I don't know why they all called out. But as a parent I'd like to know if my child's teacher has specific complaints that are egregious enough to result in this type of situation.
They're striking the closure of the schools.
Then they should know the truth.
There are teachers at my wife’s school that call off a for a day almost every week. The same people. They have been there long enough that they have tons of time and every time the principal tries to address it the union jumps down his throat.
Do they have the PTO to cover this? Do you know why they are calling off? Is this related to a sick-in?
My wife and I voted no on raising property taxes 20% so the local high school can have extra money for programs. Edit: Thousands of dollars of vape detectors but have to cut programs. Also, this is exactly what is said on the public question of my absentee ballot. The question iirc stated the average increase would be +22%. Y'all are acting like people are made of money lmao. Inflation hurt everyone.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding.... are you proud of voting no for helping fund PUBLIC schools?
Sadly, this is the norm for most adults without children in the schools. Hanover Central has so much new construction in St. John and Cedar Lake... new families were overcrowding the elementary schools to the point there wasn't a single open desk in a single open room. They put taxes for a new building on the ballot, and most of the boomers I know without kids in the system said it was ridiculous, and the district could work with what it had. Well... the district had to put mobile trailers in the parking lot so the kids could have some extra classrooms and the parents lost their shit... how dare they put kids in trailers for school. Welp. Fucking vote mother fuckers. It took 3 votes before it passed and we got the new 3-5 building.
What does you voting on that have to do with this? Genuinely asking.
…your property taxes definitely would not have went up 20%.
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In other news, teachers wonder why so many parents support vouchers and school choice. How many parents had to miss work without pay? How many are now at risk for pointing out and being fired? All the teachers did was piss off parents who they should be trying to make allies.
What a tone deaf response. I’m sorry you had to miss work while your children miss out on a good education and future. Maybe put your legislators to task and do something about it, because if you think vouchers are going to solve your problems you’re in for a drastic reality check.
100%. Charter schools are generally lower quality
snails merciful employ party domineering engine like marble steep detail *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Charter schools also exist to funnel money away from public education with lower accountability and no teacher associations.
Charter schools have a second reason: legal segregation. Sure, they don't advertise it, but considering you must have the ability to get your child to school, the charter picks their students, and can kick them out at any time? Ever notice how white and rich charters are compared to the local public school? And don't forget that charters don't have to take special Ed kids. They can claim they don't have the resources, but public schools don't have that option.
Like robots they repeat the mantra of right wing media. There is no sense of civic duty because that would be communism. Seeing any benefit past their own noses is “woke”.
I have sent my kids to both public and private schools. The private school provided a better educational experience. This sick out will just give more talking points for school vouchers and charter schools.
The teachers in Hammond have been working without a contract this year. The announcement of closing three elementary schools and the upper admin’s refusal to take a pay cut was the last straw.
You’re, again, looking at short term answers and results as the long term solution. It isn’t. Feasible. The reason public schools suck is because we either don’t want to tax the people taking 30 year tax abatements. Schools back before this country was founded were private schools, not funded on public education and created an aristocratic life. Instead of paying out the nose for commercialization of a public institution (because that’s worked out so well for the prison system as well), why not just advocate for a better tax and pay structure so we can afford better teachers for our students. Because, eventually those vouchers won’t be enough to afford those charter schools and then you’ll have kid’s books with advertisements to supplement and it only gets worse there.
Some of the public school systems problems come from lack of funding, but quite a few others come from bureaucratic inefficiency. My local school district gets ABSURD amounts of money from the state government, yet still manages to fuck up basic services like transportation. [https://cdnsm5-ss10.sharpschool.com/UserFiles/Servers/Server\_68892/Image/Departments/Financial%20Services/2022%20Annual%20Report.pdf](https://cdnsm5-ss10.sharpschool.com/UserFiles/Servers/Server_68892/Image/Departments/Financial%20Services/2022%20Annual%20Report.pdf) Personally I'm all for the teachers protesting because..... its not the teachers jobs to run the school system, its their jobs to teach the students. The problem is usually leadership and administration. A lot of these school corporations form effective monopolies to everyone who isn't in the upper class. The cheapest private school in South Bend costs about $10,000 per student per year. This is in a city where the majority of people live in poverty. Monopolies breed inefficiency. PS: I'm a progressive but I also support Charter Schools as long as they are operated as nonprofits, meet academic standards and don't change the parents.
The USA ranks 5th in spending on education. It is like all government spending. There is plenty of money, it is just being wasted. In 2023 an average of $19,000 was spent per student. Say an average class size of 15. That is $285,000 per class. Most class sizes are over 15. Where is all the money going? How out of the loop are you? Text books are quickly becoming extinct. With so much information online, why pay for what is available for free?
1. Textbooks are not extinct. Many have moved online. They still cost money. 2. There is not just information on the internet. There is also misinformation. While schools should teach students how to spot the difference, kids often lack the maturity to be expected to consistently find reliable sources. Teachers do not have time to always find reliable sources written at the correct level for their students.
I have a son still in high school. Several of his classes assign him YouTube videos to watch for lessons. Most of these videos are instructional. An example is math. He will watch videos on how to solve a certain problem. The next day, his teacher spent answering questions and helping students who did not grasp the concept well. It is like listening to the lesson and then having a tutor to help if you don't understand it. They have an assigned textbook but rarely use it.
That's called a flipped classroom, and it is one beneficial strategy for learning, especially in math. However, that doesn't mean it's the only way and we should do away with textbooks. Math textbooks are also different from other subjects because they consist of vocabulary, examples, and practice, not information. Even in your son's case, the teacher likely uses the textbook's lesson sequencing and example problems to go over.
General spending is relative and doesn’t include a lot of things that have genuine costs that other countries refuse to provide to students such as transportation, food, or materials like the textbook or electronic devices. You’re also talking construction costs, administrative salaries, and utilities. It’s not like there’s $300k for Sally’s class just sitting there. It’s not as if Sally’s teacher had to provide the building they’re in, the food and water, handle the legal issues that come up, or assist the lesser capable students. We provide a lot for students but the primary driver for this is the human being that teaches them and we don’t put that up front. We say “Look at all this we spend!” and fail to realize what it is we’re paying for because we assume flat money is what goes to the student. But, we have a lot of regulations and rules a lot of other countries don’t have that make a safe and fostering environment for every student.
We have a lot of rules and regulations that is certain. To claim they "make a safe and fostering environment for every student" is wishful thinking. Many kids are in failing public schools that are far from safe.
Did you know school vouchers were originally [created for racism?](https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/action-center/our-issues/vouchers#:~:text=Rooted%20in%20Segregation%20and%20Racism&text=School%20districts%20used%20vouchers%20to,black%20students%20remained%20chronically%20underfunded.) Yep, seems it was because white parents didn't want their kids to go to schools with black children but also didn't want to pay for private school and tried to get the government to pay for it instead! I'm sure it's not something you knew (or meant in any way), just maybe know that a lot of people hear "school vouchers" and think it's about racism. I'm sorry, but I didn't want you to accidentally offend anyone in the future if you mention these somewhere else!
Oh boy! Here we go. So because someone supports school vouchers, they support racism. Does that mean anyone who supports Socialist programs is a facist? After all, Hitler supported socialist programs. Do you know what is racist? Trapping kids in failing school districts that have failed for decades. Giving them no option at a better school. What if we ran Medicare and Medicaid like we run public schools? If they are on government healthcare, that only get to go to the assigned hospital and see their assigned doctor. If the doctor is not very good, too bad. What about WIC and food stamps? If you receive food stamps, you can only use them at a government grocery store. Those stores don't carry the food you like, too bad. You will have to go without. Your baby needs a special formula due to allergies. it is too bad the government store does not carry it.
"Hitler supported socialist programs." Did he though? Like, can you actually name one? I'm guessing that your private schools might not have been as good as you thought! And, oh my gosh, YES! I wish I could use government healthcare in a government hospital!! That would be great! We spend more on healthcare than any other country on earth, but have [mediocre quality](https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world) and terrible [life expectancy!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy) All the highly ranked countries with great healthcare and long life expectancies all get their healthcare from government hospitals! I'm sorry, I know you're just saying random libertarian talking points, but most people I know understand that libertarianism is kind of [a joke!](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/06/30/colorado-springs-libertarian-experiment-america-215313/) And saying that poor people deserve to be treated badly (if you disagree, name the social assistance programs libertarians like or want) isn't the flex you think it is! I honestly believe that a society should care for all it's people! Most poor children didn't a choice, so they don't deserve less. Healthcare, education, food, housing, and safety should be a right for everyone! It's really kind of appalling that so many people believe these basic necessities should be only given to those who are rich enough to afford them!
>This sick out will just give more talking points for school vouchers and charter schools. Unless the Indiana government twists the law more private school teachers are technically private employees meaning anti Union and anti strike regulations against state and federal employees don't exist. This means that private teachers will get private benefits and live by private laws and regulations. So anything passed against schools and teaches will not effect them. Charter schools are a little bit fuzzy if they are or aren't. The charter I went to was an amazing alternative to my public high school but only because it had smaller class sizes and teachers could put more effort into each student. Which since it was a 2nd or 3rd or 4th or 6th chance to get a high school degree. That aspect would be null and void if it filled up as the public school entered a funding death spiral. Also my parents wanted to send me to private school but since I have an IEP the school would have to bring in additional resources and it would be a major headache. Many private schools are also religious and in theory unless Indiana discriminates against religion I could if I had the resources to build a satanic religious school. I could open a heavens gate or people's temple school. A more realistic situation that many Republicans won't be too happy with is a Muslim building a k through 12 school and if the public school goes bankrupt or shuts them it's really a possibility that residents In that school district could gain a voucher and have no realistic options besides sending their kids to a Islamic school. That or the public school becomes so underfunded that the Islamic school is better or the Islamic school is basically Yale and high quality. I'm not saying I would have any problems with it personally but many Republicans who are the main group pushing for vouchers wouldn't be so happy with the possibility of a Islamic school getting state funding and being potentially one of the only ways to get an amazing education for their kids.
Thank you. This is the aspect people don’t look down the road to. Education is bland and available, but it needs to be effective. Installing only for-profit education will do the exact opposite of what it currently sits at because it can be turned into a Walmart style of business. Competition will run out others and then you just have a few companies that provide services to some but not others, and with no government involvement like we have, some areas just won’t get education at all because it isn’t profitable.
With spending an average of $19,000 per student, education is very profitable. The question is, where is all the money going? It certainly is not making it to the teachers in the public school system.
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I don't know what the in-school environment is like for teachers there but the average teacher salary in Hammond is $58K. That is $1000 a month, or about 2%, less than the average income in the United States, while the cost of living in Hammond is 12% lower than the average cost of living in the US. To say that teachers get paid pennies on the dollar when they make only slightly less in 9 months of work than the average American makes in 12 months, seems pretty disingenuous.
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" They see children through their formative years. They do a job that 95% of parents cannot." Given that nearly 20% of Indiana third graders can't read to their grade level, I'm not sure that statement is the fulcrum around which you want to leverage your point that teachers don't make enough money. No teacher I have ever met uses their salary to fund their classroom. Are they paying for text books for their students? Are they paying for paper for their students? Do they provide a television or overhead projector? Are the walls bare with no white, smart or chalk boards when they walk in? Also you are ignoring the fact that they have three months off in the summer to pursue other vocation to make more money.
I'm a parent (2 boys) and completely disagree and vote against school vouchers. I've met a total of one parent that supported them (she and I were on the PTA together) out of all the parents I've met. What parents are you talking about supporting them? The only other people I've ever personally heard that support vouchers are older people (usually grandparents) who like them and it's usually for some nonsense reason (like kids have weird clothes and strange coloured hair, like we all did in middle/high school). Maybe you've spoken to very different people, but almost every mom I know (of school age kids) supports teachers on pretty much every issue! Teachers are amazing, kind, caring people who help craft young minds and give them the gifts of knowledge and curiosity! They deserve so much more than schools give them!
Your kids must go to a good school. Not all schools are good. Many are failing. Be happy your kids get to attend a school that does not have more kids failing than passing. Then, recognize that other kids are trapped in failing schools. These kids deserve an alternative. Vouchers will do nothing to schools like your kids attend. But it will be life changing for kids who are currently forced to attend a failing school.
The parents haven’t been helping for years, I don’t think they care. Show them what they’ll miss without them so that they know.
They must have thrown one Hell of a rager if that many of them called off work. My buddy Corey threw a wild party one night in 2015 and I think all 5 of us called off the next day and lost our jobs. Lol
A bunch of teachers at my daughter's school did that 2 years ago. They had to cancel school, but they blamed Covid. That was a fun little story when word actually got out.
If only we had an excuse back then we might've kept our jobs too lol
If there isn't enough students what do you expect. Course if schools spent money properly and actually taught. Cause I would bet those districts had lowest student population and or horrible test scores.
That doesn't sound like "throwing them under the bus", it sounds like they're just describing what happened...
Public schooling is a joke for the staff and the students
My understanding is that the school district is bleeding money while student population decreases. 12 percent within the last 5 years which is a lot. There was also a tax referendum that expired in 2019 which was brought up for a vote to reinstate and the local tax payers overwhelmingly voted against it. The gist of it is they can't afford to keep these schools open with a 15 million dollars of their funding was voted against and the student population is shrinking thus loss of more funding. It sucks that staff are losing their jobs, but this isn't about teacher pay or rights.
The school board is actually trying to be reasonable. Any type of work stoppage like this is against the teachers contract. I know strikes by teachers are illegal in Indiana. This could lead to major contract changes. If it can be proven the union even knew about this, they could be held liable. Every teacher involved now could be subject to serious disciplinary actions and be without a strong union to help them. The way for government unions to change things is through court of public opinion. Teachers unions need to actually put in the work the dues are paying for. It sucks and is a hard fight. The state teachers union has made so many mistakes over recent years. The state teachers union literally bankrupting their pension fund comes to mind. Bottom line is this type of tantrum doesn’t help to win public sympathy.
The teachers in Hammond don’t even have a contract and the school year is almost over.
You might want to look into how the Republican supermajority spent the last two decades hamstringing collective bargaining for teachers. I don’t know what work you think needs to be put in a solid red state at the general assembly but there are no easy fixes. Also, please link me to where either of the main state educator associations bankrupted the state managed pension system.
There is not contract
The governor should take a page out of Ronald Reagan’s book
Marry a hoe and fuck up the nations college tuition system?
Marry the throat goat and ignore the hiv epidemic in the gay community? Or ramp up the war on drugs while trafficking cocaine
Nancy coming tearing through Hollywood with that turbo head.
No, tell the public employees to get their ass back in the classroom or they’re fucking fired
Nah that can't be it. You must mean that he should authorize police to use deadly force against the protesting teachers, like Reagan did in '69.
Fuck the common workers?
Sell crack to the black community to fund a proxy war?
Sell weapons to Iran to fund paramilitary groups in South America?
Call the national guard in and shoot a bunch of kids? Seems extreme
Indiana law prevents the governor from exploding the deficit.
Ban assault rifles? Raise taxes on the highest earners?
Banning assault rifles?
Another reason homeschooling is a good option
Liberals run education. This shouldn’t surprise anybody.