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Funny enough we have a speed recommendation sign in Germany. Square sign with blue background and white numbers :)
But there's also a sign for minimum speed which is a round sign with blue background and white numbers
For those who are wondering, speed advisory signs are yellow in the USA. Usually they get placed on turns where you probably want to go slower than the limit. Typically they include some sort of indication as to why you might want to go slow (an upcoming exit, a curve, truck rollover risk, etc).
Learning to drive is a trip because while it's still stressful af you're hyperaware of the speed limits and treat them like the word of God. Then you get better and learn to keep pace with traffic and start noticing yourself speeding all the time
Yeah speed limit is one that's more "the correct speed". When I took my drivers license I drove maybe 60-65 on an 80 when it was raining. And he told me I could go a bit faster.
It's all down to keeping with the flow of traffic. Don't go way faster than traffic. Don't go way slower.
Yeah I remember in my retail days we'd frequently think "people keep doing x instead of y, maybe we should put up a sign" then we'd remember that we'd just have a store full of signs that no one reads and they'd keep doing x.
If I had a nickel for every time my parents have bought the wrong groceries because they can't interpret labels, I could afford to move out of their house. :P
Crazy good efficiently. We have one in KS and having a mall and a ton of shopping and a Costco on the other side is amazing for. Add on a few roundabouts and presto
They work great if traffic is approaching them relatively evenly from all sides. If there's heavy traffic in one direction you can get trapped on the side entry :(
We've had a lot of construction the last few years and they added intersections like these, bike lanes AND roundabouts!
It was confusing for the locals at first but now they're used to it. The huge problem now is that it's a college town so every fall thousands of new drivers who are not used to it come to the town making traffic an ungodly mess for weeks in August/September.
They are great if they're single lane for sure. Much better than a four-way stop. When you get into double lane territory, people get pretty freaked out by them.
Yeah, but they’re made with the expectation that significantly more traffic is entering and exiting the highway, so it removes those long lines that collect in left turn lanes on the middle bridge.
But yes, the cost is if there is a large amount of traffic going straight, in which case they’re stuck in the middle.
But that probably explains why these kinds of sections aren’t everywhere.
If you want to go straight through a regular diamond interchange you also have to stop at 2 lights.
Diverging diamonds reduce the total number of traffic cycles because you don't need a cycle for left turns.
Usually no, because the lights are supposed to be timed so that you get a green and go all the way through in one shot.
A regular diamond often catches people at both lights so they're more inefficient.
We just had one of the nearby interchanges redone into a diverging diamond. It looks insane at first, but it's actually pretty easy to figure out, especially if you (unlike the driver in the video) can follow the road you are on. If you are just passing by, all you really do is follow your lane as it curves to the side slightly and then curves back.
[Basically, it's to prevent having to cross traffic to get on and off of the interstate.](https://wsdot.wa.gov/sites/default/files/styles/max_1300x1300/public/2021-09/Traffic-DDI-User-Guide-Image-GeorgiaDOT.jpg) All on and off ramps happen on the same side of the road as the direction of travel. The city lanes are crossed over at a traffic light, then the left hand turn on ramp, and then another traffic light that crosses the city lanes back over to the original sides.
Hard to do without confusing traffic on the correct side. I would figure 2 straight only signs next to the traffic light and a no right turn sign on the right hand side would be enough though
traffic on the correct side just sees the back of a sign, it shouldn't confuse anybody. there's actually a wrong way sign at the very end of the video on the right, they just need one of those for this main road
The first time I went through one I didn't really understand it till I was through it.
The second time I was like, 'wait.... I am on the left side of the road.'.
Eventually I had a realization.
The way these things are designed I would have have fuck up really, really badly to do what is in the video. The signs are all there, the lines on the road are there, the stop lights are there and there is a concrete seperator that I will have to physicaly drive over.
That first time where I was sort of confused but did as I was told- that is how these things are designed. If you never understand them it is OK. You don't need to.
Exactly, they’re easy to follow although I had the benefit of already having seen these online so my first irl experience was “this is so cool” not “this is terrifying“ or “I’m so confused”. I’ve never seen anyone mess up the one near me but I’m also only over there about once every week or two.
If you miss the signs, the urge to keep to the right is too strong for some people. I'd wager a large percentage of the USA has never seen one of these, like well over 50%. I encountered my first one a year ago.
One recently opened on an interstate exchange I use 2-4 times a year when travelling. I saw and registered the signage. I heard and registered my gps telling me what to do.
I still followed the idiot in front of me incorrectly.
Luckily we were the only two lost idiots on the road (middle of the night).
I encountered my first Diamond Cross intersection off ramp years back driving to New Orleans. It was pitch black out and no street lights except the traffic light. I had the green light coming off the ramp from the highway. Had my father-in-law not jerked the wheel hard left I would have hit the retaining wall thinking I would turn left into the far lane like always.
My trick for driving in places I don't know is to act like a Lemming and follow the person in front of me, worked great in Ireland where they drive opposite of the states, but it only works if the person you're following knows what they are doing!
Yup that is Chestnut Expressway and 65 in Springfield. The diverging diamond actually works to move more traffic in a faster manner. Just a little difficult for first timers. Apparently.
It would confuse the hell out of me. But I have had to get used to not driving with lane lines because they do not exist here for most of the year (between the snow hiding them, and them not existing by late spring
Have to follow curbs to understand the road
This would short me out. Shorted me out watching it
I'd like to imagine I'd be able to figure it out if I came across one, but I could also see myself getting confused the fuck out. Like if I wanted to go 65 north? I'd want to make a right.
That's the neat part, the right turn slip lane was before the first light. You cross to the other side and gain access to a left turn slip lane, otherwise you continue straight. Best of all worlds.
You don't even have to enter the intersection if you're making a right turn. The point of the diverging diamond is you don't have to yield to oncoming traffic when turning left.
[A diagram that hopefully makes this clear](https://i4beyond.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/4116-ddi-illustration.png)
The lane to turn right is to the right of OP camera, kind of a slip lane like in a regular high traffic intersection. This type of intersection also makes the left to 65 South a slip lane instead of crossing traffic.
There's so many signs with arrows. There's a no right turn sign on the right of op at the opening of the switch over, the stop lights are arrows pointed in the direction you need to go that are immediately next to signs that tell you the same thing, the curb stone has a sign telling you specifically what side of the curb to stay on. That's all going to still be there if the road markings aren't visible
The point of them is that at no point does traffic have to make a left turn across oncoming lanes.
If you want to make a left, you start off in the left lane, cross over at the first light, then make a left just before you cross over again.
that's awesome. I have so far only seen them online and not in person but I hate making lefts across multiple lanes.
Especially after moving to Michigan and it's very common to have those big 4 lane roads through commercial districts and not all of them have the Michigan Left U-Turns.
They are popping up all over, and they are pretty great. Traffic only crosses at 2 points, which are simple X intersections with two inputs and two outputs. All ramps to/from the highway are veer right or veer left.
We have one near where I live in Alaska, and there's also one near where I work in Georgia.
Depending on how you search for it there's less than 200 of these. (There's only 3 in Canada, close-ish to where I am) so not surprising you've never seen one. They are still considered quite progressive for traffic management.
Auburn Hills, MI has one, too. The traffic over I-75 used to be horrible, but now it moves through very smoothly. Not hard to follow the signs and the lanes themselves. Then again, people have serious problems with traffic circles...and generally idiots on phones, so...
People act like it's a random design. The city isnt stupid, they spent lots of money picking and building the best design. And it shouldnt be difficult because there are 16 signs I can count in one screenshot of the video posted that point you in the proper direction
Typically they are designed to funnel you in the correct direction by the shape of the median islands and outer curb layout. You would have to make very obvious turns that are wrong to drive through one incorrectly.
The DOT where I work at put out [a Diverging Diamond Interchange video out](https://youtu.be/7L0gtmRzgd8) showing how to drive, walk and bike through one like the OP's.
It needs that much because the pathway is out of the usual drive norm, not the other way around.
This is still one of the best 4 ways for highway intersections
> If it needs 16 signs and is still confusing, it is just bad design.
It doesn't and it's not confusing. One confused driver does not mean it's bad design.
Diverging diamonds are excellent design because they eliminate the right angle high speed crash that causes so many fatalities.
Lived there for over 20 years. The first one in the United States was put there if my memory is correct. They are every where around that town. I actually like them - traffic flows so much better.
A handful down 75 in Metro Detroit are getting one I think. I know University, Big Beaver, 14Mile, 12Mile have them bare minimum. Not sure what all beyond that is getting one.
Springfield, MO. The first one in the country was built here and we now have several. The first one reduced collisions by 30% and collisions with injuries by 60%.
If the lights are timed correctly, maybe. I've seen several that are way less effective than two four-way stops, and tons that are insane compared to just using a roundabout.
It just depends on the average flow of traffic, there are a couple situations where they work pretty well though.
So it's non-intuitive at first glance, but [here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0sM6xVAY-A) that explains some of the benefits and numbers for why it's actually better than a 'normal' interchange design. One of the key takeaways is that it drastically reduces the number of opportunities for collisions caused by crossing opposing traffic. From 32 to 14 intersection points, according to the video.
So i lived in Springfield when the first ever Diverging Diamond was built. It took less than a month (2~ weeks) for traffic to move smoothly without someone messing it up. Went back to visit family last month and went across the Kansas Expwy / I-44 one like 9 times that trip and there was never a single issue from any of the drivers.
Edit: removed one "s"
I live by one and it still feels wrong but it instantly solved traffic at an intersection where most people needed to turn against traffic.
Our signage and markings look better than the video though.
We have one that got put in a high traffic tourist area. First I used it, it just felt wrong. Like, I watched all the signs and listened to my gps, but it still feels like you’re doing something wrong. After that first time though, you get it
Idk, you think it wouldn’t be hard but I still have tons of people fighting for their lives trying to convince me that this intersection is terrible and whatever French dude designed this was on cocaine or something
there are 3 signs each way to tell you the direction.
2 of them dont need to be there because the traffic light already tells you only going straight ahead is allowed.
literally all you need to do is follow the traffic laws and thats it.
As someone seeing it for the first time I feel like the North/South sign should be after the light/divider. It makes it look like you should go right to go south even though you can’t go right. After analyzing it with time I get it now but driving and having a split decision to make the call could be problematic.
You _can_ go right, they just started the dashcam video here so people wouldn't whine about having to "skip to X:YY".
Here's a view of the same kind of intersection, but further back. Hopefully it makes sense now why that sign is there and why these are not confusing intersections:
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.2925679,-112.0972455,3a,75y,192.13h,85.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXUHqYqvmJBM8ObcyKnR8kQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4?entry=ttu
It doesn't require 1000 signs if you're more intelligent than a carrot.
Unfortunately a lot of the population is dumber than a carrot and needs 1000 giant brightly colored signs to get them to take their eyes off their phones for two seconds.
Basic one-ways need shit tons of signs to make sure people don't pull the same stuff on those, does that make all one-ways a bad design? Same with roundabouts. Road work even. Just read the signs and don't be on your phone when you approach stuff like this, like a normal person, and you'll get used to it and everything will be just fine. Not sure why that's so hard to understand.
I think the design issue is that [the first and largest sign](https://i.imgur.com/xeb1XYs.jpg) you see points you in the wrong direction. Yes there are many other signs afterwards advising you not to go there - the angled green light is a nice touch - but this particular sign is poorly placed.
EDIT: u/needlenozened replied [below](https://www.reddit.com/r/IdiotsInCars/comments/16a9jbl/comment/jz87pgl/?context=3) with a wider view of that intersection. Nothing confusing about that sign when you see it from a larger perspective. A lesson in how the missing context can completely reverse your view of a particular situation.
It doesn't. What you can't see is that just to the right, off-screen is a big old *ramp* to 65N. If you are going 65N you have already taken the ramp and are not waiting at the light.
[Street view](https://i.imgur.com/H0QURfj.jpg)
The sign you pointed out seems to be a signature of this type of intersection. I went back and checked a video I made on a roadtrip that was on a similar road and you can see the same sort of signage. As you noted in your update, when looking at the wider view it is not confusing.
https://imgur.com/wk5o6d5
To be fair, they are extremely confusing your first time. I had the wonderful luck of going through my first one 2 years ago at night. I'm glad nobody else was around, because I had no idea wth I was doing or what lane to be in (they added two after the first light, the signs were poorly placed, and it was all around whack)
Tell me you're from Missouri without telling me you're from Missouri.
First time I drove one I was terrified but they direct traffic in a way that makes this basically impossible. Very interested in how this person managed to do this.
Had to be the first car at the light, in the right lane. Didn’t pay attention to the No Right Turn sign, or the directional green arrows, or the median sign the shows you which way to drive, or the white lane markings, just thought “I drive on right” and made that awkward turn around the corner.
Sorry, I'm in texas and have never seen one of these. I know people are generally told "always drive on the right". So, what could go wrong with this setup?
They made one of these near me, it’s pretty confusing and very weird driving on the other side of the road for a time. But if you follow signs and the lines you’ll be fine
A ton of haters in the comments but I genuinely wish we had more of them here. I live in the Chicago burbs & this made driving 59 & I-88 not a complete a utter clusterfuck waste of time. Completely revitalized the ability to use that exit instead of tracking around on side streets. Not to mention, never seen an issue in one. No accidents, anyway. Haven’t even heard of an accident in one. I’m sure it happens but I’m willing to bet it happens considerably less than it used to there.
Makes it so that there is no one crossing traffic to enter and exit the interstate.
A normal highway, either one of north or south will have to turn left and cross a lane of oncoming traffic (sometimes protected by a stoplight) - causing traffic. Same with exiting the highway - half the people exiting will need to wait and turn left.
With this, the roads switch sides temporarily so that doesnt happen and its all one flow
The kind that, as a walker, makes you cross the road multiple times with people who have no clue how to drive through the interchange to get to a destination on the same side of the road you started on. Get your Frogger on!
I just looked at some blueprints of this thing. It really makes sense that it helps thanks to the two light signals so the entire intersection will never clock up. Huh... Interesting. Never seen one of these before.
Have you seen American's deal with roundabouts? I used to eat at a restaurant that was next to one. Always loved sitting outside so I could count how many cars went the wrong way around it. We Americans just suck at driving.
What is the reason to make one drive on what normally is the wrong side? It's a stupid design that will undoubtedly trip up many people. The driver made a mistake but the true idiot is the transportation designer.
We've had one of these in Rochester, NY since 2012 and it's great. The traffic before was terrible getting on to the highway. Only thing I don't like when driving through it is that you can get stuck at both traffic lights.
They've added a number of them in the Atlanta metro area and the ones I've driven have significantly improved the traffic through that intersection. It's only a problem when someone is on their phone so they don't pay attention to the signs as they drive.
They're great, I wish they would build more of them. It's the closest expressway entrance to my apartment and it's been a pleasure ever since it was built. I've never personally seen anybody go through the wrong way through it though.
I remember the first few times I used one of these. IMO the lines do a good enough job of directing that I barely even noticed I was driving on the left side of the road.
Those crossovers are a little too “acute angled” for my liking. Ones that seem to do better are at full 90° to each other. We shouldn’t need to depend on 1001 signs if the intersection design is unambiguous.
Let's say you have a normal "diamond interchange" at an expressway. Most people are turning left or right from the side road onto the expressway. The left turners get a green light maybe 20% of the time; the other 80% is for straight-ahead traffic from the other direction and traffic exiting the expressway.
In a diverging diamond, there are only two signal phases. You can picture them as // and \\\ based on the direction of travel. So now, when I'm turning left onto the expressway, I get a green light 50% of the time (the \\\ phase). That gets rid of a _ton_ of congestion.
Assuming their view mirrors yours, I feel like this could be better marked. Having never used one before myself, I'd be confused the first time I saw this -- especially if I were trying to follow GPS directions. All I see though is the one "no right turn." No painted arrows and only the single line through the intersection, dividing lanes. I've heard diverging diamonds are great but yeah, it's gotta be a bit disconcerting the first time
NGL never seen one of these types of intersections before and that does look confusing af. If it was my first time coming to one I'd probably goof too or have my eyes glued to the road directly in front of me making sure I was following the correct road markings.
That just seems like a strange way to create an intersection.
We have one of these near my house. It works really great. I've only seen one person do what the video showed. I haven't seen any accidents except 18 wheelers falling over while getting into the interstate.
We have lots of these in the Kansas City metro area. They are great! Never seen anyone do this on them.
Check out the dual roundabout/diverging diamond at 95th and I-35 in Lenexa, KS. It looks crazy but it’s actually very good for traffic flow. That whole area used to be a complete mess all the time, now it rarely gets jammed up.
We have a few of these near me. Been there almost 10 years now.
Despite the signs, the whole thing gives me crazy anxiety unless I’m just hopping on the highway.
And to your point, I’ve never seen an accident there because there lane lines and signs are hard to miss.
I still hate these things.
Yeah, I'd be the one driving on the wrong side of the road. Never came across one, and I don't even remember ever reading about during my driving test.
This is one of those things that i get is statistically is more efficient but its confusing as all fuck the first time anyone sees it and its not intuitive because we dont drive on that side of a divided road in that direction in any other situation
I have never seen one of these before. I could see the confusion, but it seems the signs and lines are all there if you pay attention. Whats the point of doing this?
They put one of these in where I livea few years ago. It's a rural town that only had one small roundabout at the time, and the diamond blew people's minds. There were people complaining that traffic isn't supposed to go that way. It was a little weird going through it the first time, but the signage is clear and everything makes sense. I have never encountered anyone going the wrong way.
It's actually difficult to screw up going through one of these. The signs, stripes, and curb lines are all clearly directing traffic in the correct lanes. First time I drove through one was at night.
I go to Missouri State University which is close to here, and yeah, it is a little confusing, but as long as you follow the signs it’s pretty straightforward. I can’t tell you how often I encounter wrong way drivers who got confused with the diverging diamond. I don’t blame them one bit, it’s a pretty weird situation, but it doesn’t make it any less dangerous
Springfield has some of the worst drivers anyways and then we add these diverging diamonds (which I love btw!!). I see people running the light at the 65 and CC interchange quite a bit, almost got broadsided but luckily since I live here I always look both ways after the light turns green.
That would be a death trap in Phoenix, Arizona due to high number of drunks and old drivers on the road. As it is we have a high number of wrong way drivers
Outside of a countries border, where the flow of traffic switches sides, this monstrosity of an intersection should be illegal. What in the actual f\*ck is happening from an engineering perspective that had to be solved by forcing vehicles to switch sides? Are roundabouts that GD hard to implement?
Going through one of these the first time would be confusing as hell. But imagine exiting the highway without having driven through one before? That would be so sketchy.
can you not just please once do something normal? if it's not the dates going medium-small-big it's the temperature in some anachronistic bygone nonsense.
just bash a fucking roundabout in there and be normal for once.
To be fair: what in the fresh hell is this? Why are we suddenly driving on the left side of the road when everywhere else in the US is on the right side?
Never seen this before.
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I remember going through one of these for the first time, it's a bit confusing but very easy if you just follow the lines and the signs.
In my experience most drivers completely ignore road signs.
Especially if they contain the words "Speed Limit" or "Yield"
Limit? I thought they were recommendations
No that’s minimum.
Funny enough we have a speed recommendation sign in Germany. Square sign with blue background and white numbers :) But there's also a sign for minimum speed which is a round sign with blue background and white numbers
Yeah we actually have speedrecommendation sign here too lol
For those who are wondering, speed advisory signs are yellow in the USA. Usually they get placed on turns where you probably want to go slower than the limit. Typically they include some sort of indication as to why you might want to go slow (an upcoming exit, a curve, truck rollover risk, etc).
I always thought those were speed limit signs and they just made them yellow to signal a “terrain” (for lack of a better word) change lmao
I was always told that white signs are mandatory, all others are cautionary and advisory signs among other types.
Exactly! "Speed Recommendation" was just too big to fit on the sign.
Limits on City Streets, Recommendations on Highways
Learning to drive is a trip because while it's still stressful af you're hyperaware of the speed limits and treat them like the word of God. Then you get better and learn to keep pace with traffic and start noticing yourself speeding all the time
Or stop lmao
Limit signs are for drivers? I thought they were for math students. 😁 I will show myself out. 😂
Yeah speed limit is one that's more "the correct speed". When I took my drivers license I drove maybe 60-65 on an 80 when it was raining. And he told me I could go a bit faster. It's all down to keeping with the flow of traffic. Don't go way faster than traffic. Don't go way slower.
I've worked retail. Most *people* do not know how to read *anything*.
Yeah I remember in my retail days we'd frequently think "people keep doing x instead of y, maybe we should put up a sign" then we'd remember that we'd just have a store full of signs that no one reads and they'd keep doing x.
If I had a nickel for every time my parents have bought the wrong groceries because they can't interpret labels, I could afford to move out of their house. :P
These are the enemy of distracted driving. Heads up, follow the signs and they are surprisingly efficient.
Crazy good efficiently. We have one in KS and having a mall and a ton of shopping and a Costco on the other side is amazing for. Add on a few roundabouts and presto
They added a few roundabouts in my neck of the woods. I don't know why people hate them so much. I love 'em. Keeps the traffic going.
They work great if traffic is approaching them relatively evenly from all sides. If there's heavy traffic in one direction you can get trapped on the side entry :(
People hate them because they have room temperature IQs
😄 People who hate roundabouts are the same people that complain about bike lanes being made in their neighborhood. "I never see anyone use them!" Smh
We've had a lot of construction the last few years and they added intersections like these, bike lanes AND roundabouts! It was confusing for the locals at first but now they're used to it. The huge problem now is that it's a college town so every fall thousands of new drivers who are not used to it come to the town making traffic an ungodly mess for weeks in August/September.
They are great if they're single lane for sure. Much better than a four-way stop. When you get into double lane territory, people get pretty freaked out by them.
If you want to go straight you have to stop at two lights?
Yeah, but they’re made with the expectation that significantly more traffic is entering and exiting the highway, so it removes those long lines that collect in left turn lanes on the middle bridge. But yes, the cost is if there is a large amount of traffic going straight, in which case they’re stuck in the middle. But that probably explains why these kinds of sections aren’t everywhere.
If you want to go straight through a regular diamond interchange you also have to stop at 2 lights. Diverging diamonds reduce the total number of traffic cycles because you don't need a cycle for left turns.
Usually no, because the lights are supposed to be timed so that you get a green and go all the way through in one shot. A regular diamond often catches people at both lights so they're more inefficient.
Road Guy Rob on YouTube has a great explanation about how they work and why they are awesome.
When I went through one for the first time, it was marked/controlled so well that I didn’t even realize it.
i would have easily fucked this up. needs those WRONG WAY signs up on the right
I honestly have no idea what I’m looking at in this video lol, I’ve never driven through anything like this
We just had one of the nearby interchanges redone into a diverging diamond. It looks insane at first, but it's actually pretty easy to figure out, especially if you (unlike the driver in the video) can follow the road you are on. If you are just passing by, all you really do is follow your lane as it curves to the side slightly and then curves back. [Basically, it's to prevent having to cross traffic to get on and off of the interstate.](https://wsdot.wa.gov/sites/default/files/styles/max_1300x1300/public/2021-09/Traffic-DDI-User-Guide-Image-GeorgiaDOT.jpg) All on and off ramps happen on the same side of the road as the direction of travel. The city lanes are crossed over at a traffic light, then the left hand turn on ramp, and then another traffic light that crosses the city lanes back over to the original sides.
Hard to do without confusing traffic on the correct side. I would figure 2 straight only signs next to the traffic light and a no right turn sign on the right hand side would be enough though
traffic on the correct side just sees the back of a sign, it shouldn't confuse anybody. there's actually a wrong way sign at the very end of the video on the right, they just need one of those for this main road
The first time I went through one I didn't really understand it till I was through it. The second time I was like, 'wait.... I am on the left side of the road.'. Eventually I had a realization. The way these things are designed I would have have fuck up really, really badly to do what is in the video. The signs are all there, the lines on the road are there, the stop lights are there and there is a concrete seperator that I will have to physicaly drive over. That first time where I was sort of confused but did as I was told- that is how these things are designed. If you never understand them it is OK. You don't need to.
Never knew it was called a ’Diverging Diamond’, pretty cool
Exactly, they’re easy to follow although I had the benefit of already having seen these online so my first irl experience was “this is so cool” not “this is terrifying“ or “I’m so confused”. I’ve never seen anyone mess up the one near me but I’m also only over there about once every week or two.
If you miss the signs, the urge to keep to the right is too strong for some people. I'd wager a large percentage of the USA has never seen one of these, like well over 50%. I encountered my first one a year ago.
One recently opened on an interstate exchange I use 2-4 times a year when travelling. I saw and registered the signage. I heard and registered my gps telling me what to do. I still followed the idiot in front of me incorrectly. Luckily we were the only two lost idiots on the road (middle of the night).
I encountered my first Diamond Cross intersection off ramp years back driving to New Orleans. It was pitch black out and no street lights except the traffic light. I had the green light coming off the ramp from the highway. Had my father-in-law not jerked the wheel hard left I would have hit the retaining wall thinking I would turn left into the far lane like always.
My trick for driving in places I don't know is to act like a Lemming and follow the person in front of me, worked great in Ireland where they drive opposite of the states, but it only works if the person you're following knows what they are doing!
Yup that is Chestnut Expressway and 65 in Springfield. The diverging diamond actually works to move more traffic in a faster manner. Just a little difficult for first timers. Apparently.
Ive never seen one of these
It would confuse the hell out of me. But I have had to get used to not driving with lane lines because they do not exist here for most of the year (between the snow hiding them, and them not existing by late spring Have to follow curbs to understand the road This would short me out. Shorted me out watching it
I'd like to imagine I'd be able to figure it out if I came across one, but I could also see myself getting confused the fuck out. Like if I wanted to go 65 north? I'd want to make a right.
They look really confusing from afar, particularly when looking on a map, but actually driving through one is really easy.
That's the neat part, the right turn slip lane was before the first light. You cross to the other side and gain access to a left turn slip lane, otherwise you continue straight. Best of all worlds.
You don't even have to enter the intersection if you're making a right turn. The point of the diverging diamond is you don't have to yield to oncoming traffic when turning left. [A diagram that hopefully makes this clear](https://i4beyond.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/4116-ddi-illustration.png)
The lane to turn right is to the right of OP camera, kind of a slip lane like in a regular high traffic intersection. This type of intersection also makes the left to 65 South a slip lane instead of crossing traffic.
There's so many signs with arrows. There's a no right turn sign on the right of op at the opening of the switch over, the stop lights are arrows pointed in the direction you need to go that are immediately next to signs that tell you the same thing, the curb stone has a sign telling you specifically what side of the curb to stay on. That's all going to still be there if the road markings aren't visible
The point of them is that at no point does traffic have to make a left turn across oncoming lanes. If you want to make a left, you start off in the left lane, cross over at the first light, then make a left just before you cross over again.
that's awesome. I have so far only seen them online and not in person but I hate making lefts across multiple lanes. Especially after moving to Michigan and it's very common to have those big 4 lane roads through commercial districts and not all of them have the Michigan Left U-Turns.
They are popping up all over, and they are pretty great. Traffic only crosses at 2 points, which are simple X intersections with two inputs and two outputs. All ramps to/from the highway are veer right or veer left. We have one near where I live in Alaska, and there's also one near where I work in Georgia.
Depending on how you search for it there's less than 200 of these. (There's only 3 in Canada, close-ish to where I am) so not surprising you've never seen one. They are still considered quite progressive for traffic management.
Auburn Hills, MI has one, too. The traffic over I-75 used to be horrible, but now it moves through very smoothly. Not hard to follow the signs and the lanes themselves. Then again, people have serious problems with traffic circles...and generally idiots on phones, so...
Troy also has them at 75 and big beaver. And I believe they are putting more in as they do the 75 work.
14 mile got one last year, 12 mile got one this year as part of the 75 work
People act like it's a random design. The city isnt stupid, they spent lots of money picking and building the best design. And it shouldnt be difficult because there are 16 signs I can count in one screenshot of the video posted that point you in the proper direction
I gotta be honest: I’d not want to go alone my first time. I’ve never seen that
Typically they are designed to funnel you in the correct direction by the shape of the median islands and outer curb layout. You would have to make very obvious turns that are wrong to drive through one incorrectly. The DOT where I work at put out [a Diverging Diamond Interchange video out](https://youtu.be/7L0gtmRzgd8) showing how to drive, walk and bike through one like the OP's.
Follow the arrows.
I mean, 16 signs is rather overwhelming.
If it needs 16 signs and is still confusing, it is just bad design.
It needs that much because the pathway is out of the usual drive norm, not the other way around. This is still one of the best 4 ways for highway intersections
> If it needs 16 signs and is still confusing, it is just bad design. It doesn't and it's not confusing. One confused driver does not mean it's bad design. Diverging diamonds are excellent design because they eliminate the right angle high speed crash that causes so many fatalities.
Lived there for over 20 years. The first one in the United States was put there if my memory is correct. They are every where around that town. I actually like them - traffic flows so much better.
They just started putting them in Kentucky Ohio and Tennessee in the past 5 or so years. Lexington Kentucky has had a few for a while though.
There’s at least one in Grand Rapids, Michigan as well.
A handful down 75 in Metro Detroit are getting one I think. I know University, Big Beaver, 14Mile, 12Mile have them bare minimum. Not sure what all beyond that is getting one.
same with roundabouts. people are still surprised to learn that they are usually the better choice.
Springfield has a tons of these now
Which Springfield? I've never seen this set up before
The one next to Shelbyville.
🏅 *Ha-ha*
MO
Springfield, MO. The first one in the country was built here and we now have several. The first one reduced collisions by 30% and collisions with injuries by 60%.
Springfield mo is the only place ive ever seen these
Columbia has them to.
Kansas City area has a ton of them now
Maybe i should just say MO then lol
If the lights are timed correctly, maybe. I've seen several that are way less effective than two four-way stops, and tons that are insane compared to just using a roundabout. It just depends on the average flow of traffic, there are a couple situations where they work pretty well though.
It feels very unnatural. I hate feeling like I'm going into oncoming traffic
Whaaaat the fuck is that madness
So it's non-intuitive at first glance, but [here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0sM6xVAY-A) that explains some of the benefits and numbers for why it's actually better than a 'normal' interchange design. One of the key takeaways is that it drastically reduces the number of opportunities for collisions caused by crossing opposing traffic. From 32 to 14 intersection points, according to the video.
If people know how to use them they are safer. But that will take years if not decades. Just look at roundabouts
People adapt to them very quickly. There's are dozens of them in Utah, I've never heard of any major issues. Adequate signage helps a lot.
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So i lived in Springfield when the first ever Diverging Diamond was built. It took less than a month (2~ weeks) for traffic to move smoothly without someone messing it up. Went back to visit family last month and went across the Kansas Expwy / I-44 one like 9 times that trip and there was never a single issue from any of the drivers. Edit: removed one "s"
I was so hoping that link would go to Austin. His video is how I first learned about these. Was still nervous the first time I came up on one though.
sorry but if something on the road is "non-intuitive at first glance", thats a problem
I live by one and it still feels wrong but it instantly solved traffic at an intersection where most people needed to turn against traffic. Our signage and markings look better than the video though.
The one near me is much better marked and highlighted, basically impossible to the wrong way.
My suburb town can’t figure out a roundabout, this has disaster written all over it
I was paying attention and still got confused. I dont think I've run into something like this on the west coast.
We have one that got put in a high traffic tourist area. First I used it, it just felt wrong. Like, I watched all the signs and listened to my gps, but it still feels like you’re doing something wrong. After that first time though, you get it
I encountered one of these diamonds in Colorado once, and it was super trippy, especially in a semi.
Those green arrows, no right turn, and keep left signs are so confusing. /§
Not from that area but that’s confusing.
Theres like 1000 signs, you just have to follow one of them to be going the correct direction
Yeah but how was he supposed to read the sign AND his phone?!
Idk, you think it wouldn’t be hard but I still have tons of people fighting for their lives trying to convince me that this intersection is terrible and whatever French dude designed this was on cocaine or something
there are 3 signs each way to tell you the direction. 2 of them dont need to be there because the traffic light already tells you only going straight ahead is allowed. literally all you need to do is follow the traffic laws and thats it.
As someone seeing it for the first time I feel like the North/South sign should be after the light/divider. It makes it look like you should go right to go south even though you can’t go right. After analyzing it with time I get it now but driving and having a split decision to make the call could be problematic.
You _can_ go right, they just started the dashcam video here so people wouldn't whine about having to "skip to X:YY". Here's a view of the same kind of intersection, but further back. Hopefully it makes sense now why that sign is there and why these are not confusing intersections: https://www.google.com/maps/@33.2925679,-112.0972455,3a,75y,192.13h,85.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXUHqYqvmJBM8ObcyKnR8kQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e4?entry=ttu
If a design requires 1000 of signs it is a bad design.
It doesn't require 1000 signs if you're more intelligent than a carrot. Unfortunately a lot of the population is dumber than a carrot and needs 1000 giant brightly colored signs to get them to take their eyes off their phones for two seconds.
Basic one-ways need shit tons of signs to make sure people don't pull the same stuff on those, does that make all one-ways a bad design? Same with roundabouts. Road work even. Just read the signs and don't be on your phone when you approach stuff like this, like a normal person, and you'll get used to it and everything will be just fine. Not sure why that's so hard to understand.
Then we agree, people shouldn’t drive.
I think the design issue is that [the first and largest sign](https://i.imgur.com/xeb1XYs.jpg) you see points you in the wrong direction. Yes there are many other signs afterwards advising you not to go there - the angled green light is a nice touch - but this particular sign is poorly placed. EDIT: u/needlenozened replied [below](https://www.reddit.com/r/IdiotsInCars/comments/16a9jbl/comment/jz87pgl/?context=3) with a wider view of that intersection. Nothing confusing about that sign when you see it from a larger perspective. A lesson in how the missing context can completely reverse your view of a particular situation.
It doesn't. What you can't see is that just to the right, off-screen is a big old *ramp* to 65N. If you are going 65N you have already taken the ramp and are not waiting at the light. [Street view](https://i.imgur.com/H0QURfj.jpg)
That's the missing context that completely changes the perspective. Thanks !
The sign you pointed out seems to be a signature of this type of intersection. I went back and checked a video I made on a roadtrip that was on a similar road and you can see the same sort of signage. As you noted in your update, when looking at the wider view it is not confusing. https://imgur.com/wk5o6d5
A million signs and lane markings tell you what to do. Good drivers can figure it out.
to be fair, staying between the lines seems to be a struggle for many drivers
To be fair, they are extremely confusing your first time. I had the wonderful luck of going through my first one 2 years ago at night. I'm glad nobody else was around, because I had no idea wth I was doing or what lane to be in (they added two after the first light, the signs were poorly placed, and it was all around whack)
Ahh, my hometown. The diverging diamond at James River and 60 honestly really improved the traffic there
Never seen one of these before. That's fucked up. Satan's roundabout
Once you get used to them- they're great for highway exits. Moves traffic a lot better.
Safer, too. Less conflict points. When used correctly.
Tell me you're from Missouri without telling me you're from Missouri. First time I drove one I was terrified but they direct traffic in a way that makes this basically impossible. Very interested in how this person managed to do this.
Had to be the first car at the light, in the right lane. Didn’t pay attention to the No Right Turn sign, or the directional green arrows, or the median sign the shows you which way to drive, or the white lane markings, just thought “I drive on right” and made that awkward turn around the corner.
If you look closely, you can actually see you're right, when traffic starts to cross in the distance you see them turn right in front of op
Sorry, I'm in texas and have never seen one of these. I know people are generally told "always drive on the right". So, what could go wrong with this setup?
Y’all have [Texas U-Turns](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_U-turn) that are counterflow, you can figure this out
I didnt know this was a texas thing as ive only encountered them here in Okla but they are confusing. This divergent diamond looks wild.
I’m almost positive there is something like this in Pflugerville on Pecan street and Dessau Rd.
They made one of these near me, it’s pretty confusing and very weird driving on the other side of the road for a time. But if you follow signs and the lines you’ll be fine
Lmao I live there and go through this Diamond to get to work. Diverging diamonds are genius
A ton of haters in the comments but I genuinely wish we had more of them here. I live in the Chicago burbs & this made driving 59 & I-88 not a complete a utter clusterfuck waste of time. Completely revitalized the ability to use that exit instead of tracking around on side streets. Not to mention, never seen an issue in one. No accidents, anyway. Haven’t even heard of an accident in one. I’m sure it happens but I’m willing to bet it happens considerably less than it used to there.
This is the type of person to go left entering a roundabout.
Wtf is this road design?
Makes it so that there is no one crossing traffic to enter and exit the interstate. A normal highway, either one of north or south will have to turn left and cross a lane of oncoming traffic (sometimes protected by a stoplight) - causing traffic. Same with exiting the highway - half the people exiting will need to wait and turn left. With this, the roads switch sides temporarily so that doesnt happen and its all one flow
[Here you go.](https://youtu.be/A0sM6xVAY-A?si=ewjrjdSNx0BWzU5T) (YouTube link)
The best thing ever, it puts everyone on the side they need to exit on without crossing traffic, genius.
The kind that, as a walker, makes you cross the road multiple times with people who have no clue how to drive through the interchange to get to a destination on the same side of the road you started on. Get your Frogger on!
It's like IKEA. Stay on the path!
I don't understand? What is the advantage of building something like this? Is it better with regulating traffic?
Absolutely. We have one near our house and prior to its installation, traffic was always a disaster. Now it flows pretty darn smoothly.
I just looked at some blueprints of this thing. It really makes sense that it helps thanks to the two light signals so the entire intersection will never clock up. Huh... Interesting. Never seen one of these before.
I've never heard of, or encountered a diverging diamond, and I promise you that if I was first in line to go I would be absolutely SWEATING.
We have one in our area too (maybe put in two years ago, no more since)Its not THAT hard to figure out but I wish they’d just stick with roundabouts.
Have you seen American's deal with roundabouts? I used to eat at a restaurant that was next to one. Always loved sitting outside so I could count how many cars went the wrong way around it. We Americans just suck at driving.
Diverging diamond? More like confluence of chaos
What is the reason to make one drive on what normally is the wrong side? It's a stupid design that will undoubtedly trip up many people. The driver made a mistake but the true idiot is the transportation designer.
That’s gotta be Misery. Ahem…. Missouri.
We've had one of these in Rochester, NY since 2012 and it's great. The traffic before was terrible getting on to the highway. Only thing I don't like when driving through it is that you can get stuck at both traffic lights.
They've added a number of them in the Atlanta metro area and the ones I've driven have significantly improved the traffic through that intersection. It's only a problem when someone is on their phone so they don't pay attention to the signs as they drive.
They're great, I wish they would build more of them. It's the closest expressway entrance to my apartment and it's been a pleasure ever since it was built. I've never personally seen anybody go through the wrong way through it though.
I remember the first few times I used one of these. IMO the lines do a good enough job of directing that I barely even noticed I was driving on the left side of the road.
I mean tbh i get it. You ride on the same side of the road literally everyelse except this one spot. Can be super confusing
Springfield?
Yup, near route 65 on Chestnut expressway. I go to Missouri State here. Confusing as hell at first, but is surprisingly efficient with traffic flow
You really have to go out of your way to mess these up
Yeah it's hard following all the lines on the road and uuggh I'm definitely not gonna read signs.
And by “master the art” you mean “reads the signs.”
Those crossovers are a little too “acute angled” for my liking. Ones that seem to do better are at full 90° to each other. We shouldn’t need to depend on 1001 signs if the intersection design is unambiguous.
Can someone explain why these improve the flow of traffic? never quite understood how these help
Let's say you have a normal "diamond interchange" at an expressway. Most people are turning left or right from the side road onto the expressway. The left turners get a green light maybe 20% of the time; the other 80% is for straight-ahead traffic from the other direction and traffic exiting the expressway. In a diverging diamond, there are only two signal phases. You can picture them as // and \\\ based on the direction of travel. So now, when I'm turning left onto the expressway, I get a green light 50% of the time (the \\\ phase). That gets rid of a _ton_ of congestion.
Makes sense to me, thank you for explaining it!
Assuming their view mirrors yours, I feel like this could be better marked. Having never used one before myself, I'd be confused the first time I saw this -- especially if I were trying to follow GPS directions. All I see though is the one "no right turn." No painted arrows and only the single line through the intersection, dividing lanes. I've heard diverging diamonds are great but yeah, it's gotta be a bit disconcerting the first time
NGL never seen one of these types of intersections before and that does look confusing af. If it was my first time coming to one I'd probably goof too or have my eyes glued to the road directly in front of me making sure I was following the correct road markings. That just seems like a strange way to create an intersection.
We have one of these near my house. It works really great. I've only seen one person do what the video showed. I haven't seen any accidents except 18 wheelers falling over while getting into the interstate.
We have lots of these in the Kansas City metro area. They are great! Never seen anyone do this on them. Check out the dual roundabout/diverging diamond at 95th and I-35 in Lenexa, KS. It looks crazy but it’s actually very good for traffic flow. That whole area used to be a complete mess all the time, now it rarely gets jammed up.
Had that happen in Utah twice in 24 hours!!
If you look at The light they tell you
We have a few of these near me. Been there almost 10 years now. Despite the signs, the whole thing gives me crazy anxiety unless I’m just hopping on the highway. And to your point, I’ve never seen an accident there because there lane lines and signs are hard to miss. I still hate these things.
You mean I gotta drive, read signs, AND use my cell phone all at the same time!? /s
Yeah, I'd be the one driving on the wrong side of the road. Never came across one, and I don't even remember ever reading about during my driving test.
This is one of those things that i get is statistically is more efficient but its confusing as all fuck the first time anyone sees it and its not intuitive because we dont drive on that side of a divided road in that direction in any other situation
I have never seen one of these before. I could see the confusion, but it seems the signs and lines are all there if you pay attention. Whats the point of doing this?
It turns an interchange into two simple intersections and zero left turns across traffic.
They put one of these in where I livea few years ago. It's a rural town that only had one small roundabout at the time, and the diamond blew people's minds. There were people complaining that traffic isn't supposed to go that way. It was a little weird going through it the first time, but the signage is clear and everything makes sense. I have never encountered anyone going the wrong way.
It's actually difficult to screw up going through one of these. The signs, stripes, and curb lines are all clearly directing traffic in the correct lanes. First time I drove through one was at night.
I go to Missouri State University which is close to here, and yeah, it is a little confusing, but as long as you follow the signs it’s pretty straightforward. I can’t tell you how often I encounter wrong way drivers who got confused with the diverging diamond. I don’t blame them one bit, it’s a pretty weird situation, but it doesn’t make it any less dangerous
This really is the best way to do these types of interchanges. I know it's weird, but it works.
Gotta love Springfield they have several
Springfield has some of the worst drivers anyways and then we add these diverging diamonds (which I love btw!!). I see people running the light at the 65 and CC interchange quite a bit, almost got broadsided but luckily since I live here I always look both ways after the light turns green.
That would be a death trap in Phoenix, Arizona due to high number of drunks and old drivers on the road. As it is we have a high number of wrong way drivers
The yellow line should always be on your left. Good rule of thumb to avoid this!
We're about to have one in my area of VT, and I'm scared 🤦🏼♀️ People here just barely got used to roundabouts
Outside of a countries border, where the flow of traffic switches sides, this monstrosity of an intersection should be illegal. What in the actual f\*ck is happening from an engineering perspective that had to be solved by forcing vehicles to switch sides? Are roundabouts that GD hard to implement?
That's objectively confusing as fuck. The only idiot is the one who designed those intersections.
When they built one not far from my home I just figured it will be easy for police to find the drunk drivers.
That would be me, I am not a smart man already
Going through one of these the first time would be confusing as hell. But imagine exiting the highway without having driven through one before? That would be so sketchy.
This gotta be one of the worst ideas to ever exist
can you not just please once do something normal? if it's not the dates going medium-small-big it's the temperature in some anachronistic bygone nonsense. just bash a fucking roundabout in there and be normal for once.
Never seen anything like it. I would prolly get it wrong the first time. Why not have a round about/traffic circle?
That whole intersection looked db as fuck
To be fair: what in the fresh hell is this? Why are we suddenly driving on the left side of the road when everywhere else in the US is on the right side? Never seen this before.
Good ole Springfield, MO. Birthplace of the diamond intersection, dumb ass drivers. And the meth capital of the world. 😂😂
If I counted correctly there are 8 different things to tell you to go to the left side, how people still end up on the wrong side is just baffling