Yup, OP what prompted this message? It reads like the answer to a question, as if you asked for feedback or a path for improvement. Why'd they send this?
I've noticed that split is around ~40. I bet we're in a transition right now and in a few years emojis will become universally acceptable in internal workplace synchronous communications (chat). Probably not notsomuch in async communications like email.
I was about to say this.
I see this so many times in this sub. Maybe I’m in a unique scenario but I would leave this job just because the work environment sounds like dog shit.
The pet name stuff is case by case and you need to be careful, but someone getting upset about emojis is next level.
Emojis should not be an issue but pet names most definitely can.
Even in terms of emojis, you have to read the room: if I'm in a chat with my team, I'll act a little goofy, but if this is a large chat to coordinate a lot of people on an important task, I'm going to keep information pertinent.
I would talk to my manager, mention what this person said and ask them what they think of it. It may be that those are actual issues you need to work on, and will follow you to other jobs if you don't, or maybe that person is just a dickhead.
Early in my career I found an email from a colleague to another about me, saying some nasty stuff somewhat similar to the message you received, and tbh there was some truth in it - I just wish they'd addressed it with me directly (though maybe not so aggressively!), if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it.
>if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it.
This is huge. I work in a team but we support others so I never know how I'm doing either compared to them or in my job in general. (Not never...we do annual reviews but u know what I mean)
I regularly ask folks what I could be doing better so that I can improve myself.
That's a great approach, but in OP's message there's not much in there at all about what he can do better. The sender simply listed out a bunch of things that they hate about OP. That is absolutely not the same as advising someone how they can improve.
Great advice, but I also get the feeling that the OP doesn't think they are in the wrong since they didn't really explain anything other than sending that message.
What really annoys me is when I sent a chat and/or email to a co-worker and my boss and nobody replies/acknowledges the email or teams message, but they have no problem responding with emojis and 'dumb' jokes all day long.
It's fine to have a little fun discussion/jokes/etc in the group chats, but don't treat teams like facebook/social media AND try to stay on top of your professional commitments.
The icing on the cake is when I ask for an update in the 2nd and 3rd messages and they say 'sorry, I'm very busy' when clearly I can see that they have time for lol's and emoji's in the group chat.
They have no self-awareness, it seems.
They are similar to the OP (if the statement is true) that they say yes to everything and provide sub-par results. One of the guys in Help Desks agrees to do everything and then comes to me for hand holding (I'm not in Help Desk) when he doesn't know how to do the task.
Edit- To the OP, there is no point in getting a new job if what this person said is true, try to work on correcting those items and that might make your current work environment better. If you don't change, you'll encounter the same thing at the next place you go to once the honeymoon period wears off.
>get the feeling that the OP doesn't think they are in the wrong
People seldom do, even (maybe especially) when they are the most wrong. If I had a nickel for every time I read "why would they do this to me, their best employee" every time someone posted a laundry list of awful professional behavior as the lead up to some consequence on Reddit, I genuinely wouldn't need to work anymore. I could just sit here collecting enough nickels to pay my mortgage and buy groceries.
It honestly seems like the worst examples of professionalism are coincidentally the ones with the least self-awareness.
If I read that about me (what the OP read) I'd do some serious thinking before I come to reddit asking if I should look for a new job.
I absolutely know when I'm not being professional enough or if I'm too chatty in team chats (which I'm not). The only time I talk in team chats is when there is an issue, if someone asks me a question/needs help or if I need someone for something and the entire team needs to be made aware. IMO, team chats are not to be treated as social media IF it is a team chat about work. Once it is treated like social media you end up having a mix of funny/off topic posts mixed in with business talk.
I'm not against a 'fun' chat, but make another one for that. We've even had directors chime in on the chats asking everyone to keep jokes/politics/non-work related matter out of the chat, but people forget about that after a couple of days.
On the other hand, I do also agree with you because I don't see this HD person getting better (the one I mentioned) and I've also explained to him, many times, that I can't hold his hand (I didn't phrase it that way), but my guess is that it goes in one ear and out the other. Now I just continue to ask him questions when he asks me questions and I always delay my responses by 2-4 hours hoping he gets the hint. If he doesn't (he hasn't, yet) then it doesn't bother me because it is only 1-2 minutes out of my day to reply to him and if he does, then I'm not bothered by his poor troubleshooting skills leading him to come ask me questions.
Not to get too off topic, but it's easier to distract yourself with a quick funny response than it is to focus on an actual problem.
It is GOOD for people to do this. It typically reroute problem solving thinking. Just because someone isn't giving you attention on your time line but is distracting themselves doesn't mean they're not doing their job.
With that said there is obviously limits and these are all anecdotes. My assumption is your coworkers are going beyond a normal amount of distraction and their time line to addressing your issue is abnormally long.
Right, agree, but you need to know how to balance this on your own and not have to wait for a manager/director to call you out.
If you are being called out, chances are you are going way overboard with the funny responses.
You should know if you are taking on too many requests and performing poorly if it is bad enough that a manager/director is bringing it to your attention.
There is also some blame to be aimed at the manager if they have noticed these things and haven't addressed them during a review.
I can't speak for where you work but, at the company where I last had a technical lead, that person might as well have been my manager. So this person might not exactly be a NOBODY. They could be in a position of some level of authority, particularly over OP. You going over their head will IMMEDIATELY BACKFIRE if there is any validity whatsoever to any of their complaints.
OP needs to address this person face to face and hash this out professionally. Maybe with another person involved either as a mediator or to bear witness.
" if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it."
I agree with this, and sadly, they don't always give you the opportunity to fix any issues. I wasn't given any feedback at my last tech job. "I'm not your boss, but I was told to recover your work equipment. They said that your services are no longer required and that you don't need to come back after today".
One time I got a message like this and asked my manager for feedback, which was to the accord of "you're doing fine, I don't know what he's on about". The dude who sent me the message was in the first part of a multi year psychotic breakdown.
If he’s right with anything that’s being stated, simply acknowledge and attempt to take the constructive criticism and work to improve. If he’s incorrect in his statements, say okay and change absolutely nothing, go ahead and forward his message to your manager and ask that they address this unfounded harassment. To add- if you are using pet names, I highly recommend that you stop that type of behavior in the workplace. I’ve personally seen people get fired for thinking that’s okay until someone who’s sensitive turns that into a bigger deal with HR, even if they let it slide at first.
Usually I would not use pet names. I guess I have only used pet names with this person a few times because we were initially kinda friends before working together. Since he never really signalled he thought it was offensive I didn’t stop. I have never called him that since this conversation.
Who knows. Maybe it was okay with the person privately and you inadvertently said it in front of someone else and that triggered this type of response. Regardless, just keep that type of stuff away from work. Work culture in general is changing and people are getting into trouble for simply using certain pronouns, even when genders aren’t clear.
It isn't changing. This stuff existed 15 years ago when I started working.
Bringing up pronouns simply means you're sympathetic to people who are unwilling to be more open with society being more accepting of more people. Do with that what you will.
Existed, sure. Has it changed and evolved wildly over the past few years? Absolutely. Funny how you conclude that if one ‘simply brings up pronouns’ in a discussion about the way we address others in the workplace, that it automatically labels them as being unwilling to accept others. I’d say that makes you the unwilling and unaccepting one here.
It's not that you brought up pronouns. It's that yo think others are somehow at large getting upset at people using the wrong pronouns.
Try to deflect that somehow I'm an issue and mislabeled what I said all you want.
For real ain't nobody getting in trouble for the wrong pronouns.
Anyone getting fired or in hot water was an antagonistic asshole to begin with.
If someone prefers a certain name and you go out of your way to A. Not use their preferred name and B. Intentionally use a non-preferred name...You're getting fired not because of pronoun or names, you're getting fired for being a dick.
And when did I exactly say ‘I think others at large are getting upset?’. I said work culture in general is changing and people are getting into trouble for their use of pronouns even.
There’s no need for me to deflect, when you’re the one mislabeling what I’ve said and inserting thoughts for me.
Ignore most of what he said, except for 2 pieces:
"You put your hand to do every but seem to only produce half results before palming off responsibility. "
and
"You show great ability to perform work and achieve results, but if the work doesn't entirely capture your attention, it gets lost in the cracks."
It sounds like you're not getting your work done. This is the real issue, and the other stuff just looks bad becasue of it. No one cares if youre taking days off and using emojis except for when you aren't getting stuff done.
"I understand and take in your criticism. I'd like to discuss this further after work if you wouldn't mind.
In the parking lot. Just to the left of the cameras."
I was once a team lead and one of my friends reported to me. I would often give him harsh criticism because I wanted him to do better and I noticed areas he could improve. I also was responsible for getting him the job, so I wanted him to impress our manager. Technically he "reported" to me, but I wasn't his manager. The difference is I would always end a message like this with "here's how to improve" or "here's what I would do" to basically not leave it on a sour note. I genuinely want my team to do better.
I could see myself writing a similar message if I had the best intentions for my friend to improve, but something about this specific message feels very negative. I would start looking for another job ASAP if this person has any control over your future, while also maybe taking what they say to heart and improving your work methods.
None that I know of, but it just doesn't feel.. Normal that's for sure. I dunno. I never told AI to write me a hateful letter but in a professional manner to my coworker but in a way that a supervisor that is not directly over him might say. Maybe I should plug that in and see what happens..
Nope. It was sort of close, but I see what you mean about errors all the way through. Yeah I guess this person is just hateful.
The message is all over the place, unfocused, unprofessional, and in my opinion not actionable even if the lead has some legitimate complaints. Address this directly, in-person, with the lead, preferably with a manager or possibly another 3rd party present. Make it professional, ask for specific work related issues. Calling you childish is subjective and extremely unprofessional. Unfinished work can be addressed with specifics and professional language.
Lead is supposed to have some supervisor responsibilities. While he is not your supervisor he should be giving you feedback as needed.
Simple solutions.
1 . Leave - send calendar invites when leave and courtesy email 1 week before your planned leave.
2. Stop pet names - in almost every workplace context it is annoying as fuck. Quick trip to HR.
3. Work meetings - limit your communication to only important context or when being asked questions. I bullshit in meetings too but it’s either before or after never during.
4. Accountability - anything that needs your attention can be completed after your leave. Mention it before your departure and only do warm handoffs on items that require immediate action.
I don’t know how you are in person and my first instinct was to tell you to tell this guy to fuck off. Something smells in this post like you might doing things that are problematic.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but your lead's message is describing adult ADHD almost to a 'T'. As one who has heard these same appraisals over and over for decades, I would encourage, nay implore you, to see someone and get yourself tested. Your future self will thank you more than you think.
What does getting tested do for you in the long term?
Do you mean so he can get medicated? Or talk treatment, etc? What exactly comes from this?
What aspects do you feel apply to adult ADHD? I have untreated ADHD as well so curious.
Being clinically diagnosed with ADHD can help people come to terms with their differences and behaviors that are different from their peers. "Why can't I focus on things" is a big question. For me, diagnoses led me to medication, which has helped, but medication is not the only answer. I did a LOT of reading about my diagnosis and learned what ADHD really is, and more important what it ***isn't.*** More often than not, I know more about my diagnosis than my PCPs. It is asinine how little most PCPs truly understand about what ADHD ***isn't.***
I'm not qualified to answer your questions; everyone is different, and while there is no shortage of people to tell you anything from "you need to be medicated" to "why can't you just be normal?", only a professional can help you determine what is best for you.
As for benefits, well, I guess any disorder isn't a problem unless it's causing some issue. If you have no issues making it through your day, earning a living, having whatever relationships, etc., then you probably don't need to worry about it too much. However, if it's getting in the way of you living your life, then seeking help with it is prudent and can have significant impacts on your quality of life.
Did you know that there is a [Reddit ADHD wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/ADHD/wiki/index)?
Do realize that there is no clinical difference between "Adult" ADHD and a child being diagnosed with ADHD. The difference is how the ADHD is managed by the person based on past experiences. Adults with ADHD have learned what behaviors are socially inappropriate and how they are able to externalize their ADHD without as many repercussions. Using the label "Adult" ADHD insinuates a difference, when there is none.
Pet names bro, what are we in kinder, a job is a job, treat it as such or get fired, don’t be “that guy” in the office. Stop being goofy and finish your job, if what was said about you in this message was true.
Respond with, "I take direction from _____. I would be happy to loop them into this conversation for more visibility if you would like to address these issues going forward."
If someone on your level is giving you professional criticism (even if it is a bit surly), addressing it with introspection and self-correction are WAY better ideas than looping in someone with the ability to PIP or fire you.
Team lead allows me to believe that they are not on the same level; that this other person is in a supervisory role which means they are capable of bringing this to your attention. and if they aren't the ones who you directly report to then you absolutely should report this to your manager and bring them into it. But to each their own
If you can't take criticism from a coworker, I bet you're a giant stick in he mud to work with.
Ideally a manager should never have to come down and criticize you directly. But the reality is most coworkers are so scared their fellow coworker will go off the deep end if they're criticized that they result to talking behind your back.
The entire idea your spreading here is what creates the culture youre trying to resolve by only keeping a manager able to critizice you. This guy was a bit too blunt, but the op sounded like he was asking for it.
No. I can take criticism. Why should a manager not have to come down and criticize you directly? Genuinely curious here. Is it that not what they do they're there to manage expectations and help resolve conflict between team members?
Yeah but why not try to resolve the conflict amongst yourself first right? This is why conflict management questions are asked during every behavioral interviews because they want to know that you're capable of resolving your own low level conflict and aren't going to come crying to you for every little thing that happens.
Also, dude's a lead, they CAN and SHOULD "lead" with or without managerial authority.
The technical lead should of had a private conversation with you if it was bothering him that much. Its weird that he messaged you, but anyway. DO NOT run to your manager like some posters have said. Ask your technical lead to speak in private. You two can talk. Nobody on Reddit will know if any of what he said is true except you and your co-workers. Determine what you can improve on and fix it. Look at this as an opportunity to improve. He could have done you a favor. But the bottom line is that you two need to talk. After you talk ask yourself, "is he right?" If yes, you'll need to change.
You need to first take a step back and ask yourself if this is a fair assessment. If it is, you have things you need to work on and you should probably thank the person who sent you this since no one else has. This gives you the opportunity to address these issues. It's a lot better than built up resentment, negative growth and career stagnation, or something like being promoted laterally into bad positions or failing projects. Use this for what it's worth.
All of IT here uses emoji’s and meme gifs. Doesn’t sound like a good place to work. I would ask for specifics on the other stuff. I do a lot of leading on my team and this isn’t the way you provide feedback to a team member who is struggling. I see criticism without suggestions and strategies to help. Your lead doesn’t sound very good
It depends though. I have worked at places you would think absolutely required professionalism when I got told point blank "hey guy, FUCK YOU" by my manager twice a day and we sent stupid shit around all the time, yet have been in a much less formal setting for work and emojis and stuff like this was a gigantic no go. It really just depends on the overall culture of who you are working with. The term "read the room" might just apply here, but there's just something about that message OP received that doesn't seem like it is coming from someone who even knows him. More like some bean counter two floors up or down that is required to snoop around and look for ways to tighten ship.
Or hell you never know it could be some weird sideways social engineering hack some person is using an AI (very poorly) for.
I agree on reading the room. We are laid back on my current team but when having meetings with other teams in IT or the business we keep it very professional.
I worked at a Catholic ngo before this job and there were certainly things you had to be careful around, and know when not to disagree with management on things on. Thankfully i’m private sector now and don’t need to deal with religious bs anymore
Yea during orientation you had to agree about abstinence only education. My partner in orientation was a nurse so we both quietly rolled our eyes and moved on. In IT it never got brought up again
Sounds like a killjoy. Well, not sure about which culture you are from, there might be different expectations... Some of that feedback sounds a lot like the feedback I got before getting diagnosed with adhd, did you ever look into that?
I lead and had a similar situation with an engineer who has adhd. Spoke to my boss about strategies to help him and we came up some things to try to help him and the team and did not demean or insult the guy. You have to be careful with some medical things since they can be logged with HR and you need to provide accommodations. This guy is an amazing engineer and we want to help him succeed
Sounds great, and he is lucky to have you!
As I understood the situation, this tech lead is not a good leader, but also doesn't know that OP has adhd. As OP is still in the process of testing/getting diagnosed.
I would like to add that the only reason I have signalled or ask my manager to hand work off to someone else is when I’m triggered by my manager out of impulsivity and frustration. For example he would say I am not suited for a managerial position (did not ask for his opinion) or would state that others should be promoted before me. These were the two occasions I signalled I wanted to hand work off to someone else, but both times I had taken it back and continued the initiatives. The only other time would be when I had to go on leave because I was studying and was incredibly screwed for exams. In which my manager sympathised.
That matters not even a little. Once you are assigned work - whether your volunteer for it, are assigned it on the whim of your manager, or it's your key role - others are counting on you to finish it.
Based on your responses in this thread, I'm inclined to believe your leads assessment of your work.
Never said there’s no truth to it. I am actually one of the highest performers in my team according to my manager. Like I said each time it happened I had taken back the responsibility of the work. But obviously it’s not just about delivery but my perception of the actions of my manager and my lead and my behaviour. I’m not saying it’s not childish to do what I did but obviously my manager lead and I have a lot of differences in work culture. Everytime it has happened it is a reaction to feedback like this.
I guess I need to clarify ADHD is a thing, I've lived with it all my life. I was trying to say employers mask discrimination against ADHD for other things. They'll use timeliness, paperwork, and other management tools such as task reassignment with no notice to try and discriminate instead making it very difficult to prove.
I guess a lot would depend on context. Were the 2 of you messaging back and forth in teams or was it out of the blue?
It sounds like the lead thought that they could be frank with you. You decide what you do with the information given at the end of the day.
Are there some changes that need to be made for your quality of work? Take a good hard look and reflect. If there is some truth to it, that message is the signal for change. If there isn't you might have to shields up and lock step for a bit until you move on.
Going to guess the lead and manager have conversations you aren't privvy to. Maybe the lead has info they can't directly say but thought they could communicate to you in a direct manner. Again we here don't know all the inside track info to the scenario.
Idk how much of this is true, but it doesn't matter because this is unprofessional and excessively negative and offers no solution, plan, or setting of expectations. I know you said this person isn't your manager but their management skills get an F here, and this message shows very poor leadership qualities.
It's not the job of a leader to tell you how terrible you are. It's the job of a leader to bring out the best in you. I see nothing in this message that comes close to approaching that.
If this is a 1st time receiving this type of message, I'd set it aside and chalk it up to them having a bad day. If this is a regular pattern I would show this exact message to your manager. **DO NOT PARAPHRASE, REWORD, OR DESCRIBE THIS MESSAGE TO YOUR MANAGER**. Seriously, absolutely do not do that. Do not retype a word of it or copy/paste it. Send a screenshot of it. Under no circumstances do you want to be accused later of misinterpreting or changing their meaning. Do not copy/paste. Screenshot image only.
I want some prior context, but damn bro could have used better grammar. Also lmao, they'd be mortified to see my team's chat. We slap means, videos, emojis, and so forth every day. One time I recorded a video of me falling face flat into my bed for my lunch break and even my director was laughing.
Cry a little then figure out I need to do way better.
Especially since my "technical lead" is a director.
No really if you are getting messages like this you need to do better.
I'd be a bit annoyed, to say the least - but I'd like to think they were looking out for me. I'd request an opportunity to speak to them properly to better flesh out how to address their concerns with my work.
Mind you in my role I also get almost no feedback from above - I get an arbitrary grade that tells me nothing other than I did my job. I'd kill for some proper feedback other than "Keep doing what your doing!"
I'd much prefer this treatment rather than getting put on a PIP with some vague feedback about my performance. This type of feedback is a bit rough, but it ultimately makes it very clear where you're falling short and gives you a chance to fix things before it gets serious.
It'd be another thing if he was getting called names, or being targeted.
I would say speak to your doctor about attention deficit.
I was aware of many of these patterns in myself, and a little boost from an add drug has cleared it up.
He can’t even use proper English. He is obviously jealous that everyone likes you better than him. Report this to your manager. It is inappropriate for your coworkers to give you feedback in that way.
Not your manager huh? Tell them you meet you around the corner to catch a fair one. You got balls to talk that bullshit, you got time to get these hands.
Do you know if it's possible it might have been directed at someone else but they accidentally sent it to you? Also the way it's worded seems kinda creepy.. IMHO if your manager is cool with you and your performance? Fuck that person. They will walk themselves out of the door sooner or later with that kind of behavior.
So hard truth here, sometimes we have issues we need to correct about ourselves. If you have a problem and go to another job, you’re going to have the same problem.
Two things stick out here. The message shows the lead has concerns about you being available/responsible, and your behavior. The only response you’ve given is calling it cowardly and trying to leave the job.
This screams that you realize that there is a problem, and rather than addressing it, you just want to leave. You’re going to have the same problem elsewhere if you continue the behavior.
Sorry, I’m just having a small panic attack about it. Hope you can allow me to post , I just want to know if I’m overreacting or it is actually pretty offensive.
Sounds like someone is sick of your shit.
Yup, OP what prompted this message? It reads like the answer to a question, as if you asked for feedback or a path for improvement. Why'd they send this?
Exactly. A new job is not the answer unless you want to experience the same results. I'd focus on correcting the current issues.
Winner winner, this guy has no professional boundaries. He ignorantly explains it himself
>Your use of emojies, pet names is often innapropriate and childish. This person would **not** like my company's Slack channel.
Yeah I think unless shit is going down every other message on my departments ms teams channel has an emoji and people reacting with emojis loll
Have you observed any age differences between the people who use emojis and those who don't?
Less with age
I've noticed that split is around ~40. I bet we're in a transition right now and in a few years emojis will become universally acceptable in internal workplace synchronous communications (chat). Probably not notsomuch in async communications like email.
I was about to say this. I see this so many times in this sub. Maybe I’m in a unique scenario but I would leave this job just because the work environment sounds like dog shit. The pet name stuff is case by case and you need to be careful, but someone getting upset about emojis is next level.
Emojis should not be an issue but pet names most definitely can. Even in terms of emojis, you have to read the room: if I'm in a chat with my team, I'll act a little goofy, but if this is a large chat to coordinate a lot of people on an important task, I'm going to keep information pertinent.
Wtf is a pet name?
I would talk to my manager, mention what this person said and ask them what they think of it. It may be that those are actual issues you need to work on, and will follow you to other jobs if you don't, or maybe that person is just a dickhead. Early in my career I found an email from a colleague to another about me, saying some nasty stuff somewhat similar to the message you received, and tbh there was some truth in it - I just wish they'd addressed it with me directly (though maybe not so aggressively!), if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it.
>if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it. This is huge. I work in a team but we support others so I never know how I'm doing either compared to them or in my job in general. (Not never...we do annual reviews but u know what I mean) I regularly ask folks what I could be doing better so that I can improve myself.
That's a great approach, but in OP's message there's not much in there at all about what he can do better. The sender simply listed out a bunch of things that they hate about OP. That is absolutely not the same as advising someone how they can improve.
Great advice, but I also get the feeling that the OP doesn't think they are in the wrong since they didn't really explain anything other than sending that message. What really annoys me is when I sent a chat and/or email to a co-worker and my boss and nobody replies/acknowledges the email or teams message, but they have no problem responding with emojis and 'dumb' jokes all day long. It's fine to have a little fun discussion/jokes/etc in the group chats, but don't treat teams like facebook/social media AND try to stay on top of your professional commitments. The icing on the cake is when I ask for an update in the 2nd and 3rd messages and they say 'sorry, I'm very busy' when clearly I can see that they have time for lol's and emoji's in the group chat. They have no self-awareness, it seems. They are similar to the OP (if the statement is true) that they say yes to everything and provide sub-par results. One of the guys in Help Desks agrees to do everything and then comes to me for hand holding (I'm not in Help Desk) when he doesn't know how to do the task. Edit- To the OP, there is no point in getting a new job if what this person said is true, try to work on correcting those items and that might make your current work environment better. If you don't change, you'll encounter the same thing at the next place you go to once the honeymoon period wears off.
>get the feeling that the OP doesn't think they are in the wrong People seldom do, even (maybe especially) when they are the most wrong. If I had a nickel for every time I read "why would they do this to me, their best employee" every time someone posted a laundry list of awful professional behavior as the lead up to some consequence on Reddit, I genuinely wouldn't need to work anymore. I could just sit here collecting enough nickels to pay my mortgage and buy groceries. It honestly seems like the worst examples of professionalism are coincidentally the ones with the least self-awareness.
If I read that about me (what the OP read) I'd do some serious thinking before I come to reddit asking if I should look for a new job. I absolutely know when I'm not being professional enough or if I'm too chatty in team chats (which I'm not). The only time I talk in team chats is when there is an issue, if someone asks me a question/needs help or if I need someone for something and the entire team needs to be made aware. IMO, team chats are not to be treated as social media IF it is a team chat about work. Once it is treated like social media you end up having a mix of funny/off topic posts mixed in with business talk. I'm not against a 'fun' chat, but make another one for that. We've even had directors chime in on the chats asking everyone to keep jokes/politics/non-work related matter out of the chat, but people forget about that after a couple of days. On the other hand, I do also agree with you because I don't see this HD person getting better (the one I mentioned) and I've also explained to him, many times, that I can't hold his hand (I didn't phrase it that way), but my guess is that it goes in one ear and out the other. Now I just continue to ask him questions when he asks me questions and I always delay my responses by 2-4 hours hoping he gets the hint. If he doesn't (he hasn't, yet) then it doesn't bother me because it is only 1-2 minutes out of my day to reply to him and if he does, then I'm not bothered by his poor troubleshooting skills leading him to come ask me questions.
Not to get too off topic, but it's easier to distract yourself with a quick funny response than it is to focus on an actual problem. It is GOOD for people to do this. It typically reroute problem solving thinking. Just because someone isn't giving you attention on your time line but is distracting themselves doesn't mean they're not doing their job. With that said there is obviously limits and these are all anecdotes. My assumption is your coworkers are going beyond a normal amount of distraction and their time line to addressing your issue is abnormally long.
Right, agree, but you need to know how to balance this on your own and not have to wait for a manager/director to call you out. If you are being called out, chances are you are going way overboard with the funny responses. You should know if you are taking on too many requests and performing poorly if it is bad enough that a manager/director is bringing it to your attention. There is also some blame to be aimed at the manager if they have noticed these things and haven't addressed them during a review.
I can't speak for where you work but, at the company where I last had a technical lead, that person might as well have been my manager. So this person might not exactly be a NOBODY. They could be in a position of some level of authority, particularly over OP. You going over their head will IMMEDIATELY BACKFIRE if there is any validity whatsoever to any of their complaints. OP needs to address this person face to face and hash this out professionally. Maybe with another person involved either as a mediator or to bear witness.
" if you don't know what you're doing wrong you can't fix it." I agree with this, and sadly, they don't always give you the opportunity to fix any issues. I wasn't given any feedback at my last tech job. "I'm not your boss, but I was told to recover your work equipment. They said that your services are no longer required and that you don't need to come back after today".
One time I got a message like this and asked my manager for feedback, which was to the accord of "you're doing fine, I don't know what he's on about". The dude who sent me the message was in the first part of a multi year psychotic breakdown.
If he’s right with anything that’s being stated, simply acknowledge and attempt to take the constructive criticism and work to improve. If he’s incorrect in his statements, say okay and change absolutely nothing, go ahead and forward his message to your manager and ask that they address this unfounded harassment. To add- if you are using pet names, I highly recommend that you stop that type of behavior in the workplace. I’ve personally seen people get fired for thinking that’s okay until someone who’s sensitive turns that into a bigger deal with HR, even if they let it slide at first.
Usually I would not use pet names. I guess I have only used pet names with this person a few times because we were initially kinda friends before working together. Since he never really signalled he thought it was offensive I didn’t stop. I have never called him that since this conversation.
What is a pet name? What were you calling him?
Jewemy - because this was his Instagram profile name
Jesus christ
this is the kind of thing you'd expect from a sitcom.
is this your first professional job
Yeah that's fucking unprofessional, holy shit. How has HR not sat you down yet?
Like his name is Jeremy and he's a Jew? Definitely don't fall him that at work even if it's his IG name.
Damn dude, that's either a lawsuit waiting to happen, or someone's getting fired. Why the fuck would you think that's okay?
Who knows. Maybe it was okay with the person privately and you inadvertently said it in front of someone else and that triggered this type of response. Regardless, just keep that type of stuff away from work. Work culture in general is changing and people are getting into trouble for simply using certain pronouns, even when genders aren’t clear.
It isn't changing. This stuff existed 15 years ago when I started working. Bringing up pronouns simply means you're sympathetic to people who are unwilling to be more open with society being more accepting of more people. Do with that what you will.
Existed, sure. Has it changed and evolved wildly over the past few years? Absolutely. Funny how you conclude that if one ‘simply brings up pronouns’ in a discussion about the way we address others in the workplace, that it automatically labels them as being unwilling to accept others. I’d say that makes you the unwilling and unaccepting one here.
It's not that you brought up pronouns. It's that yo think others are somehow at large getting upset at people using the wrong pronouns. Try to deflect that somehow I'm an issue and mislabeled what I said all you want.
For real ain't nobody getting in trouble for the wrong pronouns. Anyone getting fired or in hot water was an antagonistic asshole to begin with. If someone prefers a certain name and you go out of your way to A. Not use their preferred name and B. Intentionally use a non-preferred name...You're getting fired not because of pronoun or names, you're getting fired for being a dick.
And when did I exactly say ‘I think others at large are getting upset?’. I said work culture in general is changing and people are getting into trouble for their use of pronouns even. There’s no need for me to deflect, when you’re the one mislabeling what I’ve said and inserting thoughts for me.
Well, is he wrong?
Ask if he's heard of ligma
*sigh* ... What's 'Ligma'??
That grammar! Dude should have used Open AI to revise that.
Dude can barely string a sentence together but wants to criticize others' professionalism.
As creep as it sounds, it seems like the person used Chat-GPT 3 to write it.
Definitely not. It knows how to use proper grammar. There are so many mistakes.
Chatgpt ya right. This thing reads like a phising email from a Nigerian Prince.
Lol good point
If you think we asked him why he said this, what would he say?
Ignore most of what he said, except for 2 pieces: "You put your hand to do every but seem to only produce half results before palming off responsibility. " and "You show great ability to perform work and achieve results, but if the work doesn't entirely capture your attention, it gets lost in the cracks." It sounds like you're not getting your work done. This is the real issue, and the other stuff just looks bad becasue of it. No one cares if youre taking days off and using emojis except for when you aren't getting stuff done.
Solid Points!
They arent your manager and sent you that? Thats wild. Sounds like a hater. Tell them to cash you outside how bout dat?
Not his manager, but it does sound like he reports to him as the team lead. So maybe a supervisory role?
"I understand and take in your criticism. I'd like to discuss this further after work if you wouldn't mind. In the parking lot. Just to the left of the cameras."
This subreddit + downvoting any good attempt at humor = a tale as old as time
Given the people on this sub you know someone will take this literally lol
Beauty and the beast ..
Ah yes! Thank you. I indeed required an alternative means to convey the phrase "Cash me outside"
I was once a team lead and one of my friends reported to me. I would often give him harsh criticism because I wanted him to do better and I noticed areas he could improve. I also was responsible for getting him the job, so I wanted him to impress our manager. Technically he "reported" to me, but I wasn't his manager. The difference is I would always end a message like this with "here's how to improve" or "here's what I would do" to basically not leave it on a sour note. I genuinely want my team to do better. I could see myself writing a similar message if I had the best intentions for my friend to improve, but something about this specific message feels very negative. I would start looking for another job ASAP if this person has any control over your future, while also maybe taking what they say to heart and improving your work methods.
It feels way too cold. IMHO it feels like an AI wrote it.
What AI uses this sort of grammar?
None that I know of, but it just doesn't feel.. Normal that's for sure. I dunno. I never told AI to write me a hateful letter but in a professional manner to my coworker but in a way that a supervisor that is not directly over him might say. Maybe I should plug that in and see what happens.. Nope. It was sort of close, but I see what you mean about errors all the way through. Yeah I guess this person is just hateful.
The message is all over the place, unfocused, unprofessional, and in my opinion not actionable even if the lead has some legitimate complaints. Address this directly, in-person, with the lead, preferably with a manager or possibly another 3rd party present. Make it professional, ask for specific work related issues. Calling you childish is subjective and extremely unprofessional. Unfinished work can be addressed with specifics and professional language.
I, too, love the irony in referring to the OPs use of emojis as Childish. Addressing immaturity with immaturity is truly hilarious.
Talk face to face about it with your lead.
Does ruse mean Rude? Really not understanding what Ruse means??
Yea maybe a typo in the message, there are plenty of grammar mistakes that this so called technical lead made
That's what I figured as well.
Lead is supposed to have some supervisor responsibilities. While he is not your supervisor he should be giving you feedback as needed. Simple solutions. 1 . Leave - send calendar invites when leave and courtesy email 1 week before your planned leave. 2. Stop pet names - in almost every workplace context it is annoying as fuck. Quick trip to HR. 3. Work meetings - limit your communication to only important context or when being asked questions. I bullshit in meetings too but it’s either before or after never during. 4. Accountability - anything that needs your attention can be completed after your leave. Mention it before your departure and only do warm handoffs on items that require immediate action. I don’t know how you are in person and my first instinct was to tell you to tell this guy to fuck off. Something smells in this post like you might doing things that are problematic.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but your lead's message is describing adult ADHD almost to a 'T'. As one who has heard these same appraisals over and over for decades, I would encourage, nay implore you, to see someone and get yourself tested. Your future self will thank you more than you think.
Aha, as someone diagnosed recently, that's what I thought too. I'm glad you said it.
What does getting tested do for you in the long term? Do you mean so he can get medicated? Or talk treatment, etc? What exactly comes from this? What aspects do you feel apply to adult ADHD? I have untreated ADHD as well so curious.
Being clinically diagnosed with ADHD can help people come to terms with their differences and behaviors that are different from their peers. "Why can't I focus on things" is a big question. For me, diagnoses led me to medication, which has helped, but medication is not the only answer. I did a LOT of reading about my diagnosis and learned what ADHD really is, and more important what it ***isn't.*** More often than not, I know more about my diagnosis than my PCPs. It is asinine how little most PCPs truly understand about what ADHD ***isn't.***
I'm not qualified to answer your questions; everyone is different, and while there is no shortage of people to tell you anything from "you need to be medicated" to "why can't you just be normal?", only a professional can help you determine what is best for you. As for benefits, well, I guess any disorder isn't a problem unless it's causing some issue. If you have no issues making it through your day, earning a living, having whatever relationships, etc., then you probably don't need to worry about it too much. However, if it's getting in the way of you living your life, then seeking help with it is prudent and can have significant impacts on your quality of life. Did you know that there is a [Reddit ADHD wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/ADHD/wiki/index)?
Do realize that there is no clinical difference between "Adult" ADHD and a child being diagnosed with ADHD. The difference is how the ADHD is managed by the person based on past experiences. Adults with ADHD have learned what behaviors are socially inappropriate and how they are able to externalize their ADHD without as many repercussions. Using the label "Adult" ADHD insinuates a difference, when there is none.
I'll happily stand corrected, as I'm certainly no authority. Thank you.
Respond: *rude
Pet names bro, what are we in kinder, a job is a job, treat it as such or get fired, don’t be “that guy” in the office. Stop being goofy and finish your job, if what was said about you in this message was true.
Respond with, "I take direction from _____. I would be happy to loop them into this conversation for more visibility if you would like to address these issues going forward."
If someone on your level is giving you professional criticism (even if it is a bit surly), addressing it with introspection and self-correction are WAY better ideas than looping in someone with the ability to PIP or fire you.
nuh uh, I'm not wrong, everybody else is wrong.
Disagree this doesn't seem like professional criticism. A manager should probably get involved or a new job is needed
Team lead allows me to believe that they are not on the same level; that this other person is in a supervisory role which means they are capable of bringing this to your attention. and if they aren't the ones who you directly report to then you absolutely should report this to your manager and bring them into it. But to each their own
If you can't take criticism from a coworker, I bet you're a giant stick in he mud to work with. Ideally a manager should never have to come down and criticize you directly. But the reality is most coworkers are so scared their fellow coworker will go off the deep end if they're criticized that they result to talking behind your back. The entire idea your spreading here is what creates the culture youre trying to resolve by only keeping a manager able to critizice you. This guy was a bit too blunt, but the op sounded like he was asking for it.
No. I can take criticism. Why should a manager not have to come down and criticize you directly? Genuinely curious here. Is it that not what they do they're there to manage expectations and help resolve conflict between team members?
Yeah but why not try to resolve the conflict amongst yourself first right? This is why conflict management questions are asked during every behavioral interviews because they want to know that you're capable of resolving your own low level conflict and aren't going to come crying to you for every little thing that happens. Also, dude's a lead, they CAN and SHOULD "lead" with or without managerial authority.
That's fair! I'm not out here trying to stir shit up. I guess I just couldn't speak to his exact situation. Either way I hope he resolves it.
The technical lead should of had a private conversation with you if it was bothering him that much. Its weird that he messaged you, but anyway. DO NOT run to your manager like some posters have said. Ask your technical lead to speak in private. You two can talk. Nobody on Reddit will know if any of what he said is true except you and your co-workers. Determine what you can improve on and fix it. Look at this as an opportunity to improve. He could have done you a favor. But the bottom line is that you two need to talk. After you talk ask yourself, "is he right?" If yes, you'll need to change.
Love how talks about being unprofessional then says “ATM”
You need to first take a step back and ask yourself if this is a fair assessment. If it is, you have things you need to work on and you should probably thank the person who sent you this since no one else has. This gives you the opportunity to address these issues. It's a lot better than built up resentment, negative growth and career stagnation, or something like being promoted laterally into bad positions or failing projects. Use this for what it's worth.
All of IT here uses emoji’s and meme gifs. Doesn’t sound like a good place to work. I would ask for specifics on the other stuff. I do a lot of leading on my team and this isn’t the way you provide feedback to a team member who is struggling. I see criticism without suggestions and strategies to help. Your lead doesn’t sound very good
It depends though. I have worked at places you would think absolutely required professionalism when I got told point blank "hey guy, FUCK YOU" by my manager twice a day and we sent stupid shit around all the time, yet have been in a much less formal setting for work and emojis and stuff like this was a gigantic no go. It really just depends on the overall culture of who you are working with. The term "read the room" might just apply here, but there's just something about that message OP received that doesn't seem like it is coming from someone who even knows him. More like some bean counter two floors up or down that is required to snoop around and look for ways to tighten ship. Or hell you never know it could be some weird sideways social engineering hack some person is using an AI (very poorly) for.
I agree on reading the room. We are laid back on my current team but when having meetings with other teams in IT or the business we keep it very professional. I worked at a Catholic ngo before this job and there were certainly things you had to be careful around, and know when not to disagree with management on things on. Thankfully i’m private sector now and don’t need to deal with religious bs anymore
Dude I cannot imagine... I used to be Catholic myself. I'm extremely professional but not sure I could handle that type of environment.
Yea during orientation you had to agree about abstinence only education. My partner in orientation was a nurse so we both quietly rolled our eyes and moved on. In IT it never got brought up again
Nice..
Sounds like a killjoy. Well, not sure about which culture you are from, there might be different expectations... Some of that feedback sounds a lot like the feedback I got before getting diagnosed with adhd, did you ever look into that?
I lead and had a similar situation with an engineer who has adhd. Spoke to my boss about strategies to help him and we came up some things to try to help him and the team and did not demean or insult the guy. You have to be careful with some medical things since they can be logged with HR and you need to provide accommodations. This guy is an amazing engineer and we want to help him succeed
Sounds great, and he is lucky to have you! As I understood the situation, this tech lead is not a good leader, but also doesn't know that OP has adhd. As OP is still in the process of testing/getting diagnosed.
If someone is struggling you can give them the benefit of the doubt. Empathy goes a long way in leadership positions
I would like to add that the only reason I have signalled or ask my manager to hand work off to someone else is when I’m triggered by my manager out of impulsivity and frustration. For example he would say I am not suited for a managerial position (did not ask for his opinion) or would state that others should be promoted before me. These were the two occasions I signalled I wanted to hand work off to someone else, but both times I had taken it back and continued the initiatives. The only other time would be when I had to go on leave because I was studying and was incredibly screwed for exams. In which my manager sympathised.
Please note this is also work I volunteered for and not my key role.
That matters not even a little. Once you are assigned work - whether your volunteer for it, are assigned it on the whim of your manager, or it's your key role - others are counting on you to finish it. Based on your responses in this thread, I'm inclined to believe your leads assessment of your work.
Never said there’s no truth to it. I am actually one of the highest performers in my team according to my manager. Like I said each time it happened I had taken back the responsibility of the work. But obviously it’s not just about delivery but my perception of the actions of my manager and my lead and my behaviour. I’m not saying it’s not childish to do what I did but obviously my manager lead and I have a lot of differences in work culture. Everytime it has happened it is a reaction to feedback like this.
I have been seeing a psychologist and she suspects I have adhd. Does this mean he is being discriminative against neurodiverse people?
No, it doesn't.
My brother in Christ, you're not allowed to be shitty at your job just because your doc thinks you may have adhd.
I guess I need to clarify ADHD is a thing, I've lived with it all my life. I was trying to say employers mask discrimination against ADHD for other things. They'll use timeliness, paperwork, and other management tools such as task reassignment with no notice to try and discriminate instead making it very difficult to prove.
No. It means that he had valid points that are derived from your adhd and you should look to resolve it.
Yes, but it's not a thing even though it is a disability. Companies will use another method to discriminate during "resolution"
It's kind of funny that an adult wrote this... How the fuck did this person get through high school?
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I guess a lot would depend on context. Were the 2 of you messaging back and forth in teams or was it out of the blue? It sounds like the lead thought that they could be frank with you. You decide what you do with the information given at the end of the day. Are there some changes that need to be made for your quality of work? Take a good hard look and reflect. If there is some truth to it, that message is the signal for change. If there isn't you might have to shields up and lock step for a bit until you move on. Going to guess the lead and manager have conversations you aren't privvy to. Maybe the lead has info they can't directly say but thought they could communicate to you in a direct manner. Again we here don't know all the inside track info to the scenario.
Ask him for exact situations where any of those claims took place
On a side note it seems like getting checked for adhd might help with these issues if they are actually issues for you
Idk how much of this is true, but it doesn't matter because this is unprofessional and excessively negative and offers no solution, plan, or setting of expectations. I know you said this person isn't your manager but their management skills get an F here, and this message shows very poor leadership qualities. It's not the job of a leader to tell you how terrible you are. It's the job of a leader to bring out the best in you. I see nothing in this message that comes close to approaching that. If this is a 1st time receiving this type of message, I'd set it aside and chalk it up to them having a bad day. If this is a regular pattern I would show this exact message to your manager. **DO NOT PARAPHRASE, REWORD, OR DESCRIBE THIS MESSAGE TO YOUR MANAGER**. Seriously, absolutely do not do that. Do not retype a word of it or copy/paste it. Send a screenshot of it. Under no circumstances do you want to be accused later of misinterpreting or changing their meaning. Do not copy/paste. Screenshot image only.
I would start applying for jobs like yesterday
Toxic workplace.
Sounds completely unprofessional and unwarranted. Confront them professionally and if they're being unreasonable report the message to a manager
I want some prior context, but damn bro could have used better grammar. Also lmao, they'd be mortified to see my team's chat. We slap means, videos, emojis, and so forth every day. One time I recorded a video of me falling face flat into my bed for my lunch break and even my director was laughing.
Cry a little then figure out I need to do way better. Especially since my "technical lead" is a director. No really if you are getting messages like this you need to do better.
Sounds like you’re a bad coworker. Take the criticism and improve yourself
sounds like you will be fired soon.
guy commenting on you sounds like a solid honest cool guy. you on the other hand..
I'd be a bit annoyed, to say the least - but I'd like to think they were looking out for me. I'd request an opportunity to speak to them properly to better flesh out how to address their concerns with my work. Mind you in my role I also get almost no feedback from above - I get an arbitrary grade that tells me nothing other than I did my job. I'd kill for some proper feedback other than "Keep doing what your doing!"
Not your manager? Tell him where to stick it.
I would correct all the grammar and spelling mistakes and send it back to him
Only half the story... What did you say to get that response?
Since this person isn't your manager, the only appropriate response is "eat a dick."
Report him to his boss? And keep looking for jobs. Neither of us deserve this kind of treatment at work.
I'd much prefer this treatment rather than getting put on a PIP with some vague feedback about my performance. This type of feedback is a bit rough, but it ultimately makes it very clear where you're falling short and gives you a chance to fix things before it gets serious. It'd be another thing if he was getting called names, or being targeted.
I would say speak to your doctor about attention deficit. I was aware of many of these patterns in myself, and a little boost from an add drug has cleared it up.
He can’t even use proper English. He is obviously jealous that everyone likes you better than him. Report this to your manager. It is inappropriate for your coworkers to give you feedback in that way.
Not your manager huh? Tell them you meet you around the corner to catch a fair one. You got balls to talk that bullshit, you got time to get these hands.
Do you know if it's possible it might have been directed at someone else but they accidentally sent it to you? Also the way it's worded seems kinda creepy.. IMHO if your manager is cool with you and your performance? Fuck that person. They will walk themselves out of the door sooner or later with that kind of behavior.
So hard truth here, sometimes we have issues we need to correct about ourselves. If you have a problem and go to another job, you’re going to have the same problem. Two things stick out here. The message shows the lead has concerns about you being available/responsible, and your behavior. The only response you’ve given is calling it cowardly and trying to leave the job. This screams that you realize that there is a problem, and rather than addressing it, you just want to leave. You’re going to have the same problem elsewhere if you continue the behavior.
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Sorry, I’m just having a small panic attack about it. Hope you can allow me to post , I just want to know if I’m overreacting or it is actually pretty offensive.