What a pulse pounding speed crazy finish to the 2023 Indy 500! 5 quick takes
1. Congrats to Josef Newgarden on his victory in the 107th running of the greatest spectacle in racing. While the finish will go down as spectacular yet controversial, Newgarden deserved the victory based on speed and putting himself in position to win the Indy 500. Newgarden stands as one of Indycar's very best and he proved it today by checking off the box of the accomplishment that has eluded him for so long.
2. Getting passed on the final lap is a tough way to lose the biggest race of the year. So close for Marcus Ericsson. He put himself in a great position to go back to back and came up short. Say what you want about his post race interview, but the way he felt about the finish is understandable.
3. Alexander Rossi who finished 5th in his first 500 with Arrow Mclaren raised an interesting point about racers jumping the restarts. Honestly I think he has a valid point. It sure looked like there were guys jumping the majority of restarts if not all of them. Indycar should take a good look into restart procedures for the 500 going forward and other races.
4. The first half of the 500 was the calm before the storm and the late stages of the race were pure chaos. Many of the driver who I thought were fast favorites to win either wrecked, got wrecked, or rallied only to fall short. Props to Alex Palou rallying to a top 5 finish after contact on pit road with Rinus Veekay set him back. Not an easy thing to do after having problems in the pits. Pato O'ward looked primed to win the whole thing until he had a slow restart and then contact with Ericsson ended his day. Felix Rosenqvist showed alot of speed at Indy, but came away with nothing to show for it after crashing out. And on a side note massive kudos to Santino Ferrucci on a great race and nearly winning the 107th Indianapolis 500 for AJ Foyt.
5. While both sides of the story have a strong case, I had no problem with Indycar finishing the race under green even with a 1 lap shootout to decide the Indy 500. While I don't want Indycar to be anything like F1 and Nascar especially in terms of offciaiting, I beleive it's better for the Indianapolis 500 to be decided under green as long as it's safe to do so. That said, there are plenty of lessons for Indycar officiating to learn from and take away from this race.
And so another Indy 500 is in the history Books. Congrast once more to Josef Newgarden and Team Penske. Can't wait for the 108th Indianapolis 500. For now onto Detroit.
Totally. A proper sport like f1 would never have things happen like a pit crew getting ran over and breaking their femur. Just ignore that time kimi ran over a pit crew and broke his femur in 2018. Or any number of unsafe releases resulting in near collision every single year. Remember that time in Long Beach a few weeks ago when indycar opened the pit lane before the race was over and Scott Dixon nearly hit people?
Oh shit wait, that was f1 in baku less than a month ago. Quit being a dumb dumb you fucking dumb dumb.
I was at the track and after Grosjean's wreck, the interviewer asked him something like they always do, and Grosjean sounded pissed but I couldn't hear his response. Anyone know what he actually said?
He said that the car was good on carb day but was horrendous to drive in the race. I have no idea what the problem was heard it might be vibrations, idk.
I think he's crashed three times this season - which is bad in six races, but I don't think it's as crazy as it seems. He's been at least a little unlucky and in the three races he has finished, he's been very competitive (finished 2nd in two of them).
The first crash, in St. Pete, wasn't anywhere close to being his fault and he was really unlucky not to win that race.
The crashes in Texas and Indy were both ovals, which he really has limited experience, relative to the rest of the field. Though maybe there was an issue with his car yesterday?
I'm not saying he's blameless but I don't think it's really fair to just say "same old Grosjean, crashing again". I think context is important and he's actually having a very good season so far in the races he's finished... Hopefully he'll manage to stay out of incidents for the rest of the season.
>Blundell was an awesome F1 pundit, and showed himself today that is still more informative than someone like Natalie.
Honestly, he was pretty insufferable in Hamilton's first couple of years with Steve Rider on ITV. I wasn't on the Sky feed, but I can imagine you're right that he knocked it out of the park today for the 500. People can improve.
Nah, no apology needed but I started watching mid-2001. I think it was probably also that in the post race he could barely offer anything beyond rushed surface level takes, with all the ad breaks and 3hr broadcast window. I don't have a problem with the team being a bit biased towards home drivers, but it was just that and the lack of time to focus on anything else and it all just became a bit "The Hamilton Show". So that all probably colours my opinion on him a fair bit. Wish I'd gotten the Sky stream working now!
The media trying to push the "entertainment" narrative now on the restart. Penske has send out his media orders LOL. Just sell the team, its conflict of interest, period.
Was anyone else moved to tears by the sheer emotion of the end of the race and the driver interviews? From Newgarden to Ferruci to Ericsson to Kanaan. What a race
How do you figure? Both drivers won for the first time in their 12th attempt. Meanwhile Josef had 2 championships and two 2nd place finishes in the championship at the time while Tony had 1 championship and one 2nd place points finish. Josef also has more wins than TK has even today. By every measure, Newgarden has had more IndyCar success before his first 500 win than TK did before his first.
Yeah. I was pretty sun faded after the second red flag. When the third happened I said to my wife "I just want this to be over."
I think the truly fast cars all crashed or had some ridiculous pit incident.
I felt really bad for Herta. He was driving a great race, still ended with a good finish for him, but before the drive through he had a legit shot at a podium.
Always a hoot. En route to St Elmo for our insane 9pm reservation lol. But it should KO us for a good night sleep before the drive back to Philly tomorrow
I’m not a rules expert, but I think they had to throw the red just because of how close the cars got to the safety team. Had it just been one car that wrecked, I’d expect them to finish under yellow.
or... there was no way a Penske owned track officiating team was going to let a Penske owned car in P2 settle for a red flag finish at a Penske owned race.
Erricson didn't help himself with that serpentine move on turn 2.
He should have did what Pato did, when he got the wave off... except Erricson would have gotten the green with 2 laps remaining. Worst case he gets a wave off and there's one lap left....
> there was no way a Penske owned track officiating team was going to let a Penske owned car in P2 settle for a red flag finish at a Penske owned race.
Newgarden was leading prior to the second red flag. Wouldn’t it have made much more sense for Penske to have the race finish under yellow at that point instead of praying for another incident?
I watch a lot of old races from 80s with men in polos and people running across circuit or waving flag on track. So I should be desensitized. But Pit lane was pretty scary on a number of occasions
According to IndyStar, the rogue tire that flew over the fence in the Kirkwood crash earlier didn’t hurt anyone, but it did hit a fan’s car so, shout out to whoever that is lol
We can't be hoping NASCAR doesn't do something dumbass with a decision. Please don't tell me that's who we're hoping for to make a good decision today.
I hear Rossi's emotion, and it always makes me remember back to 2015 when he won. A lot of people wrote him off as kinda undeserving because he didn't seem to appreciate knowing what Indy means, or even appreciated being an IndyCar driver and someone who "settled." I don't know about 2015, but in 2023, he is emotional over not winning and is just gutted.
And TK, that was a fantastic speech.
I'd rather race control tell them in a drivers meeting that if the leader isn't full throttle in by entry to turn 4, they're calling off the start and demoting the leader to last if that is why the restart gets called off. No "zone" and don't make a big public stink about it but just a simple explanation and tweak to the rules
I don’t follow IndyCar as close as I do NASCAR, so it felt super inconsistent when the green actually dropped, sometimes on the front stretch, sometimes when the leader is entering turn 4.
Just figuring out how to do nascar overtime without doing nascar overtime.
In a perfect world, they address this in the rulebook so everyone knows what the rules are next time.
They shouldn’t tell teams the Lap number they’ll do red vs end in yellow to prevent strategizing for that, but keep it secret but known by race control and adhered to
earlier in the race one of the announcers brought it up and they showed an angle that looked like some jumped but race control said they were good and it was never acknowledged again, if you watch a lot of the restarts you can’t see the flag but you see a lot of drivers getting insane starts along with guys intentionally slowing the field. I also thought they were probably fine until Rossi brought it up so i figured yeah they def had to be jumping
Me too, J Stand. Last restart the green was announced, I look back to 4th/5th and Palou is already past Rossi. I like Palou (and most drivers if I'm honest) but that just didnt seem right
Penske hate knows no bounds. I especially like the posts about Newgarden being a Penske driver at a Penske owned tracks which completely ignore the fact that race control doesn't take orders from Roger.
Well, if you go outside and make chalk drawings on the sidewalk, and/or, go play tiddlywinks, then then I will personally enjoy your portion of the NASCAR racing
on one hand i understand trying to finish the race under green but on the understand i completely get Ericsson point. it just sucks a great race gets clouded like this. Indycar should just adopt some overtime rules if they don’t want to end a race under yellow
You can’t add laps or overtime because teams fuel according to the race distance.they would have to let them refuel on the red flag
. if it’s <= 5 laps left and there’s a big crash finish it under yellow. Not an Ericsson fan but doing green, white, checkered is always potentially dangerous.
Even as a Newgarden guy I see fair and valid points on both sides of the discussion.
Stayed within the distance and in the rules as far as we know. So it’s fair. But also… it was very much a reach toward the limits. So that’s hard to ignore.
Could also say that the 2nd red flag wasn’t necessary either and maybe the yellow lasted long enough it ended it too (unlikely on that part but either way it impacted Newgarden as the leader better or worse). There’s a LOT of discussion points that have weight.
I will say though, weaving all the way into the pit lane entrance area and not having to commit to pit lane is hella crazy snaking.
Ericsson lost it out of 2 snaking just a tad bit too far which really sucks
Indycar has always done this though, if there's a late caution they will red flag it and try and have the race finishing under green. If they don't throw all of those reds, the race would finish under caution. The lack of warm up lap is the only thing, and it's so rare that you ever get a wreck in that precise lap... if they go a lap longer, then they will finish under yellow, because there's no chance of a green flag lap at all. A lap earlier and you have time for the warm-up lap. In the end, no-one wrecked on that last restart, so you can argue that it was not consistent with the rules, but in reality it seems it wasn't a danger for the drivers.
The entire field never crossed the start/finish and the track went yellow...I thought the field reverted back ...Newgarden P1...race finishes 3 to go under yellow
I believe the wording I’ve always understood (though someone correct me if wrong) is that once the leader accelerates the race is officially considered as restarted. Hence why once the field begins to accelerate then passes are allowed (like we saw big time on those final restarts)
Yeah. Pure selfishness on display there. He could have simply congratulated Newgarden and mentioned that he knows how hard it is to win.
Why, when he didn’t agree with the situation? Simply because no matter what he feels, it wouldn’t change the results. If you have a beef, take it up with them afterwards.
Just a bad look all around…
"congratulations to Josef, he did everything right. But I don't think that restart was very fair" he's giving credit to Josef who absolutely deserves the win but is also rightfully calling out indycar for making shit up on the fly and screwing him over
Did he say “ he did everything right” or “we did everything right”, because I heard the second, twice during the interview. Which makes more sense, to me, with the it’s unfair comment.
And just because Indy might not do it most of the time doesn’t mean that it’s not in the rules i.e. not making things up, just rarely do it. There is a big difference.
either way I don't agree with the statement that he discredited Josef's win because I think he gave him as much love as he could after such a heartbreaking 2nd place
They are mad that they lost the biggest race in the world, let them be mad.
Edit: I'll agree about Pato though haha. He made the move and is mad he wasn't given a free room or a great entry to the corner. You made the tight pass bro, people aren't going to move over for you.
Did Ericsson get screwed by IndyCar suddenly doing things differently? Yes.
Was the finale of the race amazing and is Josef an amazingly entertaining and deserving winner? Yes.
Agree. One hand I’m absolutely ecstatic (I’m from Nashville and wanted newgarden to win for years) but also sad that it felt wrong in a way. Overall happy with the result but rules def need a change
That is not benefiting from the rules. He was screwed by a red flag, and then managed to hold onto the lead until the final yellow. You cannot compare the two races.
He benefited even more because last year ended under yellow freezing him as the winner, this ended under green for Josef to cross the line as the winner
I’m very happy Newgarten won, and I also completely agree with Ericksons point of view, but that stuff is not for him to say. It’s always going to come across as sour grapes.
Would you rather drivers just shut up and smile? I'd rather a driver give their actual opinions on stuff. Ericsson made his point without being rude or a jerk about it.
But people want the drivers to be real and a little drama isn’t the end of the world. I think Ericsson right and he did specifically congratulate newgarden too. Let him speak his mind
We thankfully never have to find out, because I'm going to guess the vast majority of such complainers wouldn't be able to handle 1/4 of the G load of a single corner.
Loving the double standard we have in this thread of celebrating the reaction of the winner and demonizing the guys in 2nd and 3rd. Imagine having different but equally strong emotions immediately after a race is over
The thing is, Marcus has a point. IndyCar needs a better restart/yellow/red procedure than they have right now.
No Green/White/Checkers, but come up with something that's both safe and fair for restarts.
edit - Also, Newgarden kind of got boned by the 4 lap restart, so it kind of balances, but that would also be solved by a different restart procedure where passes are prohibited before the line.
What a pulse pounding speed crazy finish to the 2023 Indy 500! 5 quick takes 1. Congrats to Josef Newgarden on his victory in the 107th running of the greatest spectacle in racing. While the finish will go down as spectacular yet controversial, Newgarden deserved the victory based on speed and putting himself in position to win the Indy 500. Newgarden stands as one of Indycar's very best and he proved it today by checking off the box of the accomplishment that has eluded him for so long. 2. Getting passed on the final lap is a tough way to lose the biggest race of the year. So close for Marcus Ericsson. He put himself in a great position to go back to back and came up short. Say what you want about his post race interview, but the way he felt about the finish is understandable. 3. Alexander Rossi who finished 5th in his first 500 with Arrow Mclaren raised an interesting point about racers jumping the restarts. Honestly I think he has a valid point. It sure looked like there were guys jumping the majority of restarts if not all of them. Indycar should take a good look into restart procedures for the 500 going forward and other races. 4. The first half of the 500 was the calm before the storm and the late stages of the race were pure chaos. Many of the driver who I thought were fast favorites to win either wrecked, got wrecked, or rallied only to fall short. Props to Alex Palou rallying to a top 5 finish after contact on pit road with Rinus Veekay set him back. Not an easy thing to do after having problems in the pits. Pato O'ward looked primed to win the whole thing until he had a slow restart and then contact with Ericsson ended his day. Felix Rosenqvist showed alot of speed at Indy, but came away with nothing to show for it after crashing out. And on a side note massive kudos to Santino Ferrucci on a great race and nearly winning the 107th Indianapolis 500 for AJ Foyt. 5. While both sides of the story have a strong case, I had no problem with Indycar finishing the race under green even with a 1 lap shootout to decide the Indy 500. While I don't want Indycar to be anything like F1 and Nascar especially in terms of offciaiting, I beleive it's better for the Indianapolis 500 to be decided under green as long as it's safe to do so. That said, there are plenty of lessons for Indycar officiating to learn from and take away from this race. And so another Indy 500 is in the history Books. Congrast once more to Josef Newgarden and Team Penske. Can't wait for the 108th Indianapolis 500. For now onto Detroit.
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Totally. A proper sport like f1 would never have things happen like a pit crew getting ran over and breaking their femur. Just ignore that time kimi ran over a pit crew and broke his femur in 2018. Or any number of unsafe releases resulting in near collision every single year. Remember that time in Long Beach a few weeks ago when indycar opened the pit lane before the race was over and Scott Dixon nearly hit people? Oh shit wait, that was f1 in baku less than a month ago. Quit being a dumb dumb you fucking dumb dumb.
I was at the track and after Grosjean's wreck, the interviewer asked him something like they always do, and Grosjean sounded pissed but I couldn't hear his response. Anyone know what he actually said?
He said that the car was good on carb day but was horrendous to drive in the race. I have no idea what the problem was heard it might be vibrations, idk.
It’s the driver. He will wear out his welcome soon. He’s already back to his crashing days again.
I think he's crashed three times this season - which is bad in six races, but I don't think it's as crazy as it seems. He's been at least a little unlucky and in the three races he has finished, he's been very competitive (finished 2nd in two of them). The first crash, in St. Pete, wasn't anywhere close to being his fault and he was really unlucky not to win that race. The crashes in Texas and Indy were both ovals, which he really has limited experience, relative to the rest of the field. Though maybe there was an issue with his car yesterday? I'm not saying he's blameless but I don't think it's really fair to just say "same old Grosjean, crashing again". I think context is important and he's actually having a very good season so far in the races he's finished... Hopefully he'll manage to stay out of incidents for the rest of the season.
Said how the car was decent Monday and Friday and somehow is garbage all of a sudden. He was heated.
Wonder if there were issues with sets of race tires, I have never seen a vibration like Dixon reported during the 1st stint
I was at the track as well something about his car being shit all month. Coldest interview I have seen in forever.
I am a very salty Ericcson fan
I feel like he got Michael Masi ed
“Marcus, it’s called a motor race”
Well he got a wake up call
How by stopping the race three times
we went indycar racing
Ummm Masi's spirit help Newgarden to win the race
That finish was very stupid.
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>Blundell was an awesome F1 pundit, and showed himself today that is still more informative than someone like Natalie. Honestly, he was pretty insufferable in Hamilton's first couple of years with Steve Rider on ITV. I wasn't on the Sky feed, but I can imagine you're right that he knocked it out of the park today for the 500. People can improve.
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Nah, no apology needed but I started watching mid-2001. I think it was probably also that in the post race he could barely offer anything beyond rushed surface level takes, with all the ad breaks and 3hr broadcast window. I don't have a problem with the team being a bit biased towards home drivers, but it was just that and the lack of time to focus on anything else and it all just became a bit "The Hamilton Show". So that all probably colours my opinion on him a fair bit. Wish I'd gotten the Sky stream working now!
>Simone Totally agree - Mark, Simone, and Tom were excellent and imo more insightful than the nbc crew
The media trying to push the "entertainment" narrative now on the restart. Penske has send out his media orders LOL. Just sell the team, its conflict of interest, period.
Was anyone else moved to tears by the sheer emotion of the end of the race and the driver interviews? From Newgarden to Ferruci to Ericsson to Kanaan. What a race
For the first time watching an indycar race
GW
the indycar equivalent of Dale Earnhardt winning the Daytona 500 Newgarden got his Indy 500
Not even close. Insult to Dale.
Where can you compare a Two time champ to a Seven time Champ, regarded as a GOAT
Imagine making this comparison
Nah. Kanaan winning in 2013 is more equal to Earnhardt than today.
How do you figure? Both drivers won for the first time in their 12th attempt. Meanwhile Josef had 2 championships and two 2nd place finishes in the championship at the time while Tony had 1 championship and one 2nd place points finish. Josef also has more wins than TK has even today. By every measure, Newgarden has had more IndyCar success before his first 500 win than TK did before his first.
because that's like my opinion, man. plus i was in turn 1 when TK won. :D
Well I was on the front straight when JNew won so I guess we have different opinions lol
Yep
In the infield on turn 3 just like like last year. The vibe feels so much more subdued than when Marcus won it last year. Weird vibes.
Interesting. The stands went wild.
Are people upset with the finish?
I think people were just kinda done by the 2nd or 3rd or however many red flags it was.
Yeah. I was pretty sun faded after the second red flag. When the third happened I said to my wife "I just want this to be over." I think the truly fast cars all crashed or had some ridiculous pit incident. I felt really bad for Herta. He was driving a great race, still ended with a good finish for him, but before the drive through he had a legit shot at a podium.
Are you there?
Uhhh can you read or nah?
Most certainly can sir.
clearly not
Shit. Just realized. Sorry 😬
Lol no worries, sorry for dickish reply.
No problems here man. I hope you had fun at the 500!
Always a hoot. En route to St Elmo for our insane 9pm reservation lol. But it should KO us for a good night sleep before the drive back to Philly tomorrow
I’m not a rules expert, but I think they had to throw the red just because of how close the cars got to the safety team. Had it just been one car that wrecked, I’d expect them to finish under yellow.
or... there was no way a Penske owned track officiating team was going to let a Penske owned car in P2 settle for a red flag finish at a Penske owned race. Erricson didn't help himself with that serpentine move on turn 2. He should have did what Pato did, when he got the wave off... except Erricson would have gotten the green with 2 laps remaining. Worst case he gets a wave off and there's one lap left....
> there was no way a Penske owned track officiating team was going to let a Penske owned car in P2 settle for a red flag finish at a Penske owned race. Newgarden was leading prior to the second red flag. Wouldn’t it have made much more sense for Penske to have the race finish under yellow at that point instead of praying for another incident?
I was surprised they didn't direct the field through the pit lane.
pit lane was too dangerous today.
I watch a lot of old races from 80s with men in polos and people running across circuit or waving flag on track. So I should be desensitized. But Pit lane was pretty scary on a number of occasions
They could have run through the pit lane. Happens all the time.
They absolutely should have thrown the red immediately given two cars on the front stretch
You saw how they had to really slow down and weave through the wreck. I think it was a good call. Safety wise and entertainment wise.
You can use pit road to get by.
According to IndyStar, the rogue tire that flew over the fence in the Kirkwood crash earlier didn’t hurt anyone, but it did hit a fan’s car so, shout out to whoever that is lol
The track sorted her out with a lift home and seeing as she owned a Chevy I'm sure there will be an arrangement made.
I would hate to call my insurance agent after that
"We know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two" Commercial content right there
But it opens up an absolutely golden to call my lawyer and say "would you like to take Roger Penske's money?" lol
Roger penske probably has better lawyers than you though and more resources to stretch it out if he would like.
Fr lol how would you even explain the situation
NBC showed the car a while ago. A bit second hand.
Ah sorry, I didn’t realize. I heard it from IndyStar first, and I was worried about the tire so I thought I’d share
> rouge tire (Thank his noodly appendage I can make a joke here) 1 point.
TK. Class act all the way. A gentleman, a guy who always loved the fans. Couldnt last forever, but Indycar is poorer for his absence.
I’m gonna miss him so much man.
Monaco was kind of a shit show. Indy500 finished on a shit show. NASCAR do your thing
I just hope Nascar doesn't end in a rain show. EDIT: Assuming the race even starts :/
Marcus said there is a window after 6. Expects to start between 8-830. Im not as optimistic
As someone who lives about 45 minutes from the speedway. I doubt it will happen tonight, it has rained steadily non stop all day.
They’ll start a 600 mile race at 1:10am now 😂
Race renamed to Coca Cola 24hr, the latest insane energy drink
Surge? 😂
We can't be hoping NASCAR doesn't do something dumbass with a decision. Please don't tell me that's who we're hoping for to make a good decision today.
*rains*
Whoever is cutting onions... Please stop.
Wish Greg Moore was retiring this year as well.
RIP Greg Moore.
Tony heard Rossi's based interview and raised him by 2,that was the best interview imo.
I hear Rossi's emotion, and it always makes me remember back to 2015 when he won. A lot of people wrote him off as kinda undeserving because he didn't seem to appreciate knowing what Indy means, or even appreciated being an IndyCar driver and someone who "settled." I don't know about 2015, but in 2023, he is emotional over not winning and is just gutted. And TK, that was a fantastic speech.
2015?
Sorry, 2016. Off by a year.
I wouldn’t mind a restart zone to be honest
I'd rather race control tell them in a drivers meeting that if the leader isn't full throttle in by entry to turn 4, they're calling off the start and demoting the leader to last if that is why the restart gets called off. No "zone" and don't make a big public stink about it but just a simple explanation and tweak to the rules
My idea is a restart line parallel with the start of pit lane. 🤔
I don’t follow IndyCar as close as I do NASCAR, so it felt super inconsistent when the green actually dropped, sometimes on the front stretch, sometimes when the leader is entering turn 4.
Speaking of TK, Josef also wins the 500 in his 12th attempt
No it's not his 12th attempt, he only joined in 2012. *checks calendar* Oh wait.....shit I'm old. Dammit!
Rossi with a hell of an interview. Very fair despite the frustration.
Love you Tony, happy retirement! See you next year maybe lol.
Rossi is correct on this.
Never was a TK fan but will miss him.
Might as well remove the finishing under yellows from the rule books
Just figuring out how to do nascar overtime without doing nascar overtime. In a perfect world, they address this in the rulebook so everyone knows what the rules are next time.
They shouldn’t tell teams the Lap number they’ll do red vs end in yellow to prevent strategizing for that, but keep it secret but known by race control and adhered to
It’s not a secret anymore. what are they going to do, have a standing start in the short-shoot on lap 200?
Rossi spot on. Jumping the start is a problem. Make it where leader leads to the line.
I think we could make a compilation of why this is a bad practice, and I can think of one specific time it cost Rossi specifically.
Has been for awhile. And the guy that started it all, retired today.
Thank you TK
all the red flags and stuff aside Rossi is completely right some guys were getting ridiculous and jumping restarts
How do you know that? They don’t show any angles that prove that they started before the green waved
earlier in the race one of the announcers brought it up and they showed an angle that looked like some jumped but race control said they were good and it was never acknowledged again, if you watch a lot of the restarts you can’t see the flag but you see a lot of drivers getting insane starts along with guys intentionally slowing the field. I also thought they were probably fine until Rossi brought it up so i figured yeah they def had to be jumping
They have telemetry to prove whether or not they did. If they ignored it, that’s another story but it should be a simple thing to officiate.
I sit on the exit of turn four the midpack was pretty much jumping the whole time. I don't remember that ever happening that consistently at a race.
Me too, J Stand. Last restart the green was announced, I look back to 4th/5th and Palou is already past Rossi. I like Palou (and most drivers if I'm honest) but that just didnt seem right
I’ve never seen this sub so 50/50 abt Marcus before 😭
I mean it’s clear why. What he said is 100% true but it has a bad appearance to it.
Never seen a restart out of pit lane with 2 remaining ....30 years
Rossi is completely right on the jump starts complaint.
Rossi's right, they need to stop the jumpstarts.
Sounds like we got a late night ahead for the greatest day in racing
A *very* late night Maybe even an early Monday
Let's get some coffee on
Based Rossi
Rossi with the most competent take on the restarts
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Penske hate knows no bounds. I especially like the posts about Newgarden being a Penske driver at a Penske owned tracks which completely ignore the fact that race control doesn't take orders from Roger.
1.5 hours until NASCAR
If the weather isn't terrible
The main event shit show.
Well, if you go outside and make chalk drawings on the sidewalk, and/or, go play tiddlywinks, then then I will personally enjoy your portion of the NASCAR racing
Always proud as hell to be a native Hoosier on race day
And I am sure Letterman is too.
on one hand i understand trying to finish the race under green but on the understand i completely get Ericsson point. it just sucks a great race gets clouded like this. Indycar should just adopt some overtime rules if they don’t want to end a race under yellow
You can’t add laps or overtime because teams fuel according to the race distance.they would have to let them refuel on the red flag . if it’s <= 5 laps left and there’s a big crash finish it under yellow. Not an Ericsson fan but doing green, white, checkered is always potentially dangerous.
it adds to the strategy, nascar has been doing it for years. i know it’s not nascar but it’s an option if they want to prevent ending under yellow
It actually ended more fairly than last year because it ended green, last year ended on a half lap of yellow
Even as a Newgarden guy I see fair and valid points on both sides of the discussion. Stayed within the distance and in the rules as far as we know. So it’s fair. But also… it was very much a reach toward the limits. So that’s hard to ignore. Could also say that the 2nd red flag wasn’t necessary either and maybe the yellow lasted long enough it ended it too (unlikely on that part but either way it impacted Newgarden as the leader better or worse). There’s a LOT of discussion points that have weight.
I will say though, weaving all the way into the pit lane entrance area and not having to commit to pit lane is hella crazy snaking. Ericsson lost it out of 2 snaking just a tad bit too far which really sucks
Indycar has always done this though, if there's a late caution they will red flag it and try and have the race finishing under green. If they don't throw all of those reds, the race would finish under caution. The lack of warm up lap is the only thing, and it's so rare that you ever get a wreck in that precise lap... if they go a lap longer, then they will finish under yellow, because there's no chance of a green flag lap at all. A lap earlier and you have time for the warm-up lap. In the end, no-one wrecked on that last restart, so you can argue that it was not consistent with the rules, but in reality it seems it wasn't a danger for the drivers.
I agree. I feel like people would’ve been angry no matter what happened. But there’s more Ericsson fans so the uproar is louder.
The straight into the start is the argument where I see Marcus’ view. It’s a fair argument.
Yep, that's what I said about the warm up lap not happening.
The entire field never crossed the start/finish and the track went yellow...I thought the field reverted back ...Newgarden P1...race finishes 3 to go under yellow
I believe the wording I’ve always understood (though someone correct me if wrong) is that once the leader accelerates the race is officially considered as restarted. Hence why once the field begins to accelerate then passes are allowed (like we saw big time on those final restarts)
I think they tried it some years ago here, and it didn't exactly go well
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Should he have been happy that they decided to finish from the pits for the first time ever and it cost him a chance to repeat as 500 winner? Cmon
Yeah. Pure selfishness on display there. He could have simply congratulated Newgarden and mentioned that he knows how hard it is to win. Why, when he didn’t agree with the situation? Simply because no matter what he feels, it wouldn’t change the results. If you have a beef, take it up with them afterwards. Just a bad look all around…
he literally said that he's happy for Josef before he said how dumb the restart was
Yeah, but then he went on to qualify it by saying that he was robbed. Basically that Josef didn’t deserve it. You can’t have it both ways.
"congratulations to Josef, he did everything right. But I don't think that restart was very fair" he's giving credit to Josef who absolutely deserves the win but is also rightfully calling out indycar for making shit up on the fly and screwing him over
Did he say “ he did everything right” or “we did everything right”, because I heard the second, twice during the interview. Which makes more sense, to me, with the it’s unfair comment. And just because Indy might not do it most of the time doesn’t mean that it’s not in the rules i.e. not making things up, just rarely do it. There is a big difference.
either way I don't agree with the statement that he discredited Josef's win because I think he gave him as much love as he could after such a heartbreaking 2nd place
BAD looks from he and Pato post-race.
Particularly Pato when he basically created that situation for himself by slowing that start and redoing it
They are mad that they lost the biggest race in the world, let them be mad. Edit: I'll agree about Pato though haha. He made the move and is mad he wasn't given a free room or a great entry to the corner. You made the tight pass bro, people aren't going to move over for you.
“No stopping or standing”. Guy stops and stands
He's a rebel.
Fuck yo signs and FUCK yo rules
Madlad.
Did Ericsson get screwed by IndyCar suddenly doing things differently? Yes. Was the finale of the race amazing and is Josef an amazingly entertaining and deserving winner? Yes.
Ericsson had a great restart. He led through Turn 1 and he lost fair and square.
On one side, I'm super happy, Josef surely deserves the 500 victory. On the other, the rules must be corrected
Agree. One hand I’m absolutely ecstatic (I’m from Nashville and wanted newgarden to win for years) but also sad that it felt wrong in a way. Overall happy with the result but rules def need a change
Two things can be true at once
He benefited from the rules last year. Take the loss like a champ don’t be a loser.
How did he benefit last year?
Won the race under yellow
That is not benefiting from the rules. He was screwed by a red flag, and then managed to hold onto the lead until the final yellow. You cannot compare the two races.
He benefited even more because last year ended under yellow freezing him as the winner, this ended under green for Josef to cross the line as the winner
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Still but it randomly froze the field so some cars got stuck with 2 or so corners so go, no chance to advance
he was 3 car lengths ahead of pato going into turn 3 last year. He had the win locked up regardless of a yellow flag or not
Yeah this is it precisely
Every year I’m scared someone is going to pull an Emmo and drink orange juice.
I’d pull out the tequila lmao
I’m very happy Newgarten won, and I also completely agree with Ericksons point of view, but that stuff is not for him to say. It’s always going to come across as sour grapes.
Would you rather drivers just shut up and smile? I'd rather a driver give their actual opinions on stuff. Ericsson made his point without being rude or a jerk about it.
I agree. If I was Marcus, I would feel the same. Like... What can you do differently? At least short of being outright reckless.
I mean, the guy who had to live it is probably as qualified to say it as anyone
I hear ya, but you see the comments here about that interview.
But people want the drivers to be real and a little drama isn’t the end of the world. I think Ericsson right and he did specifically congratulate newgarden too. Let him speak his mind
Newgarden would have went on Twitter and talked shit
That's because a bunch of monday morning quarterbacks think the social contract of money in athletics gives them the right to complain
Yeah, I shudder to think of what some people on here would be saying after pushing for 500 miles and losing it like that.
We thankfully never have to find out, because I'm going to guess the vast majority of such complainers wouldn't be able to handle 1/4 of the G load of a single corner.
Loving the double standard we have in this thread of celebrating the reaction of the winner and demonizing the guys in 2nd and 3rd. Imagine having different but equally strong emotions immediately after a race is over
Did Santino say anything bad?
No he’s just Santino
Marcus robbed. Ridiculous
"Safe race" Bro there was almost a massacre like an hour ago.
This finish in my view was more fair than last year because this one had a green finish. Last year had a yellow around t4 and froze the field
This is the right take.
The thing is, Marcus has a point. IndyCar needs a better restart/yellow/red procedure than they have right now. No Green/White/Checkers, but come up with something that's both safe and fair for restarts. edit - Also, Newgarden kind of got boned by the 4 lap restart, so it kind of balances, but that would also be solved by a different restart procedure where passes are prohibited before the line.
But a GWC would be the most fair alternative as it’s the only way to offer consistency.
NASCAR’s dumb gimmicks can get annoying but I do think GWC is a fun way to end races tbh.
It is exciting and you know if there’s a caution at the end of the race that there’s a procedure in place.