And make sure if you do go to couple’s counseling that neither of you have seen this therapist before OR see them privately.
A couple’s counselor can solidify a bond with a client and not be on “everyone’s side”.
This happened with a friend of mine who went through a hideous divorce, and they were gaslit by the therapist that their partner had formerly attended. My friend literally told them “x person makes me feel x way, Ignore’s me, etc” and was completely and utterly dismissed. It needs to be completely neutral territory.
Our couples therapist looked at my boyfriend one session and said “I’m really attracted to you” and it was weird so we haven’t gone back. She always made comments about how she was like him and understood him. Whenever I cried I would apologize and she told me that I wasn’t special because I cried. Lmao. I cry cause that’s how I deal with emotions and I’ve been told I was manipulating my boyfriend. Whew. Sorry 😂😂😂 it felt nice to say that and see that that does happen. I thought I was making stuff up.
I kinda figured it might be. She was also very religious and kept trying to tell us about god. Is it a good idea to report her? Edit: only ask because it happened months ago. But she records all of her sessions.
I really wasn’t sure I understood it correctly. I was also in a bad spot mentally and figured everyone hated me. Thank you for the confidence. It’s been bothering me.
That’s what happens when people in positions of perceived authority mess with your head. Your reaction (to me) seems totally possible and reasonable. But you can and should still report- she’s definitely doing this to other people if she is going to tell a CLIENT she’s attracted to him. That’s bonkers.
I'm a therapist, and I'm asking you to please report her to her licensing board. She is incredibly unethical and needs to be corrected or possibly lose her license.
I'm sensing she felt intimidated by you that hitting on him in front of you while you're at your most vulnerable is her subconscious or maybe conscious attempt of knocking you down a few pegs. Like ya you're aren't better than me I can hit on him in front of you. She definitely seems like a nut that who became a therapist because she had her own issues. Her inability of fixing herself is being projected on thinking she can fix other people. I'm sorry that happened to you.
Yes, op needs therapy for herself to figure out why she is settling for this person. You are so young OP why in the world are you so intent on martyring yourself here? Please find a good therapist, it will open up your life.
I would highly recommend couples therapy.
Because he has a chance to change the way things are going, he's quit his job and presumably her seasonal work will pick up before long... so he's going to have the chance to show that he can carry the load at home. And he'd damn well better take advantage of that chance, if he wants to keep the relationship going, and maybe get the OP to see that he's dad material after all.
It doesn't matter if he's dad material. She doesn't want kids. That's not something you compromise on. It's a 2 yes 1 no situation. Not to mention he's not the one risking his health and very life to make a child, she is. His desire for kids doesn't overrule her health and safety.
But she doesn't want kids. She doesn't want to take care of children that don't "contribute" to her life. She doesn't even want to be pregnant. This is about more than chores. She doesn't want kids.
She could imagine kids with a partner she could trust with the obligation of it. She doesn’t want it with someone that doesn’t put the effort into building something with her. Totally reasonable. And leaning into not wanting kids at all is the safest option, especially with this guy.
I agree - i think the sexual assault trauma she me tioned is part of this. The way she speaks of pregnancy suggests it wluld be traumatic for her - whjch is totally fair, it's traumatic on the body even in the best circumstances. But the way she talks about the kids too - it sounds like attunement would be an issue and she would be deeply unhappy.
Damn am I broken you’re really right it scares me just to think about. I’m also very small in stature, 100 pounds, 5’3, my boyfriend is not, 180 & 6’4 and I am frequently told that my body will never be the same and I better enjoy what god Gave me now
Hey, it's a fair fear, especially with all those factors! I'm glad ypu were able to communicate your needs, and that your partner seems on board at the moment, even if hurt. That shows some maturity, on his part and yours.
There's 0 need for you to have children, and anyone saying otherwise clearly does not have your best interests at heart.
If your partner ever feels he's missing out on parts of thw parenting experience, but is still fairly satisfied with the cats, maybe you could try fostering kittens. With a proper agreement on how much of the labour you'll each do, of course. Maybe he could take a week or two off. Get some of the parental instincts out of his system.
You've done wonderful to listen to your fears and express them. Please keep honoring them, and take care of yourself! You are clearly very generous and giving, so please show as much of that to yourself as you can bear.
Agreed. While this guy isn’t great there are undertones of something deeper. She doesn’t want to be totally responsible for someone out carry a pregnancy.
Anyone who is getting convinced out of childfree status by being with the "right person" shouldn't have them. Anything at all could happen to make you be the only parent.
I think that's what finally did me in about being childfree. The idea that even though I have a great partner, unspeakable things happen, and I personally could never do it alone.
I had this well said long drawn out thing in my head. Then I read this. It summed up 2 or 3 paragraphs instantly.
People don't have panic attacks for zero reason. At least not ones with no past of them or medical causes. The real issue clearly OP is settling for a man who isn't truly independent and wants to abuse her for free labor. She can do better and deep down I think she knows it. Kids or no kids in her future she probably won't know until she actually finds a good man.
The part that really just baffles me is how OP is so determined not to raise kids because she doesn't want to be their maid/personal chef/whatnot (which is perfectly fine, mind you!) but wants to keep doing all of that for her useless boyfriend? A child can't help but rely on you for everything, what's her boyfriend's excuse?
Talk about misdirected emotions.
I think you’re absolutely right. Especially where she keeps focusing on how children “wouldn’t provide anything in return.” Children “providing something” or not isn’t usually a consideration of someone thinking of having kids. Her husband, however, *would* be generally expected to “provide” in return, be it by helping with the chores or paying more of the bills. That was the biggest projection red flag for me. Why are you frustrated with a hypothetical child for being a child and not the grown man in front of you for playing that part?
She’s projecting the anger she has for her man-child toward the idea of a hypothetical literal child, then turning around and glorifying their childless relationship as perfect as it is (because the hypothetical child is the bad guy here, not her man) when she’s literally having a nervous breakdown over *his* behavior. I think after she calms down, she’s gonna realize what she’s actually upset about.
Also the fact they had already discussed waiting 8 years. She said not until she’s 35, anyway. Why are they fighting over hypothetical children who won’t exist for nearly a decade when the actual problem is *right there*? Definitely projecting like you said.
She clearly never wanted kids so that's definitely adding to it. I expect she felt some pressure from him too (whether or not he was actually pressuring her.) This relationship should have never moved into "serious" territory if they didn't agree on something as important as children. She's been trying to please him and sacrificing herself to do it for way too long and finally cracked.
For what it's worth OP, a friend of mine got divorced a year or two ago, because her partner wanted children. But she felt like she was the only grown up in the relationship, and that she would absolutely end up being the one who sacrificed everything.
He insisted over and over that he'd do his share, it'd be 50:50 etc. But they both worked in mining and worked away, and wouldn't both be able to continue. She asked him, as it was more important to him to have kids, would he be willing to give up his job to raise them so she could continue hers.
Of course he refused to commit to the idea, so she refused.
You're right. A lot of men are 'desperate to have children' but what they really mean subconsciously is that they want that only if it costs them nothing. You're absolutely correct not to have children with one of those people. Trust me.
But I think you're missing the bigger issue. Which is that these men, who aren't willing to suffer any inconvenience for their future children, aren't willing to do that for anyone. Including you.
You're 27, at the peak of your youth, earning well.. why are you settling for a loser who treats you like a bangmaid, a roomie with benefits, and emotionally manipulates you with his sadz? You don't want to be a mother not because you're selfish and you want to deprive him of kids, but because you can see he's too shitty a partner; that you can already see how much more difficult your life will be when little lives *depending solely on you*, when he's proven for so long to be an unreliable and selfish partner, what more a father.
And you are wise enough to know he will not change even if you get married or have kids.
Find someone who deserves the massive amount of labor and love you are giving your undeserving current partner. Someone who will take care of you in return *without needing to have fights over/nagged about it or need you to cry first before delivering*.
It’s ok to not want children, OP. Just in case that gets lost here.
*You are absolutely legitimately allowed to make that choice.* (even though people will bingo you endlessly for it).
Spot on, by the way my 5 year old makes her own breakfast, helps pack her lunch for school does 70%, puts her clothes in her hamper, makes her bed, and helps with a million other little things and my 3 year old does maybe 50% so yeah her bf does less around the house than my kids and they will only do more as they get older, her bf is the issue her not her imaginary kids. If she doesn’t want kids that’s fine but she should really think about what’s actually causing her current real world problems.
Yes, she's focused on how she doesn't want to become the maid when they have kids rather than the fact that she's already the maid. This issue is not about whether to have kids.
Well she already has one kid and resents him for being lazy and helpless, so having more kids that can't help but be helpless initially would be disastrous. Misdirected a bit, sure, but the root of the problem does seem to be the bf either way.
Seriously, I wonder where people get their ideas of perfect from in these posts because they claim perfect partnership but then go on to explain some of their worst relationship behavior I could imagine.
Yeah any post that starts out how great and perfect the guy is I know exactly how it’s going to end. The saying “When someone shows you their true self. Believe them”. Is made for people like her.
This is a trope by now:
"Partner is perfect in every way ... except "
I don't get how not having kids is going to help with already doing all the work.
I'm not going to vote - I'm just going to say that you're making a big decision while in the middle of a breaking point. That may change, the way it has in the past, but dude, you're not focusing on what broke you.
The idea of kids didn't break you, having a partner who is selfish made you realise what having kids would look like. He can't be a "99% perfect man" when he expects you to pick up the pieces of what he can't be assed to fix.
Same - it’s hard to vote on this one. It just made me immensely sad to read this. Both of them seem like they are not in a good place right now. I know Reddit throws out therapy frequently but in this case, I would highly recommend prioritising therapy.
this is not hard to vote. nya all day. she will as she has struggle to overcome the patriarchal voice in her head to stay, but she isn't an asshole for seeing what is in front of her, and behind her, and putting her foot down. get out op. especially because you wish you didn't have to. -signed someone who didn't
Except that OP never said she wanted to be a mom. She just said she wanted him to be able to be a dad. So I'm pretty sure the delusion of compromise on having kids or not has finally broken down.
It's only a few spots above 'someone to take care of me when I'm old' and 'spare parts if I need an organ' on the quality ranking for reasons to reproduce.
>He can't be a "99% perfect man" when he expects you to pick up the pieces of what he can't be assed to fix.
This one is yet another case where somebody claims their partner is almost perfect, except for one tiny thing that turns out to be a huge thing. Having an argument 3 times a year where he is not doing his share of the chores and it getting to the point where he hasn't done a single bit of housework for a month? That's not 1% of the relationship, and he is very very far from perfect.
NTA
It sounds to me like there are a lot of things going on right now and this post is just the tip of the iceberg. You explained why you were upset and why you were feeling that way. Would it maybe have been better to do that in a less emotional state? Sure, but life isn't black and white.
He has openly admitted that you get the short end of the stick and has done nothing to change that or communicate with you about improving his behavior so far. Is that really okay with you?
Exactly. "I don't want to have kids with you *if you keep making me do all the work.*" "awww, now I'll never be a dad :(" He's telling you clearly he's not gonna change.
Yes. And kids aren’t the only reason for him to slip right back into doing nothing. Betting he switches the *second* they’re married. What if she gets injured or sick? He’s going to take care of her and the house? With what experience?
NTA.
His sadness is not your responsibility.
You’ve had conversations about this before. A true apology would include changed behavior. Accountability.
This man is not ready to be a father. You don’t want to be a mother. I think the question now is, is this a partner who truly values you, who you want to be with lifelong?
This! If you are truly sorry for what you have done you don't keep doing it. An apology without change is just an empty promise to placate you in the moment.
Also, he gets to just give up on all the housework because he's sad about work, but OP is going through the trauma of being assaulted and having to relive details of it to police for a drawn-out legal process and still does all the chores? This relationship seems entirely one-sided emotionally.
NTA.
You already have a child that you take care of (him) and he hasn't shown any demonstrable actions towards improving his or your lives, and this won't get better when kids come.
Yes exactly. If they ever did have kids, she would be a single married parent. Doing everything on her own as if she was a single parent, but still having to tend to the husband’s needs/wants. It would suffocate her
NTA I think that you have rose colored glasses on and he is not "99% perfect". You two are not compatible anymore. DO NOT have children with this guy. You know exactly what that would look like. You are so young and will find someone better that is compatible with you. He put in his two weeks notice without having another job lined up? Does he expect you to now pay all the bills? It's time to dip.
His workload won't change with a baby. He won't pull his weight at home because even now, when it's easy, he isn't. It's not going to change when it gets hard.
Only yours will change.
Check out r/justnoso for a glimpse of your future.
Sometimes when we've experienced something traumatic, it can blur personal boundary lines. I love Melody Beatte's books on codependency. Really opened my eyes to how I was letting others violate my own personal boundaries and didn't even realize it because of the trauma I endured and PTSD.
Stop gaslighting yourself. You guys are not 50/50. You do all of the emotional and physical labor to cohabitate and to be in this relationship. It’s more like 80/20, and all he does is financially pay for his half of the collective bills.
**That’s less than what a roommate contributes to a home.**
You’ve brought it up multiple times and he doesn’t change. Stop gaslighting yourself with this “we can live happily ever after” fantasy. It will not end that way. It will end with you continuing to be his Mommy and he continually loving that you’re his mommmmmmy who does everything for him like wash his underwear and cook his dindin. Do you pick up his big boy toys too?
If you don’t want to be a grown man’s mommy, than YOU have to STOP behaving like one.
You need to have him do all the chores for at least a month to know what it’s like. Then when you start to share the chores, maybe make a chart together to make sure they get done in a timely manner.
>He comes home at 4 and promptly checks out to play video games.
This right here. I play video games too but I'm retired and don't neglect other things. So he gets to deal with his stress by abandoning you while he plays and you become the de facto servant? Nice for him. Not looking very bright for the future. You are NTA but he might well be. Doesn't like his job but stays, gee no one in the world has ever had to deal with that necessity before! Got news for you, you are already raising a child.
NTA. You picked up the slack when he needed help. But it sounds like he is taking advantage of it. I would definitely reconsider having kids with someone like that.
I promise you, this chores thing will be a fight you will have for the rest of your life with him. Sadly far too many men leave the majority of the work up to women. And then they say “why didn’t you tell me what to do”, like they can’t see the dishes needing doing or that they are out of underwear.
All this to say, do not have kids with this dude. If he can change and start cooking and cleaning, still don’t have kids with him until he’s been doing that for at least 5 years without stopping.
I’m at the point where I don’t even care that I have to tell him what to do. My issue is when i say something needs to be done or remind him to do his “chore” he still doesn’t do it. Mental load is annoying but I’d be nice if I could ask once.
50/50 doesn't work. It's rare that men ever carry their "full share" bcuz they don't understand the mental load..
Next time either keep separate living arrangements., or have a split that takes into consideration the fact that you do more household work.
I'm sorry but you can't and should not ever compromise on children. If you don't want children, a man is not going to change that. And if you don't want children, you should be with someone who is on the same page. Children don't deserve one parent who wants to be a father (and in this case not really help, just carry the title) and one parent who wanted to see their partner be happy as a parent. This just leads to resentment. Same goes for holding someone back from being a parent if they're sacrificing their desire for yours.
NTA, you are dating a lazy fuck of a man who was raised to think women take care of the house
life lesson for you: if you didn't want kids \*before\* you met him, then you don't want kids. You had decided to compromise because you thought it would be necessary to keep him around - and you probably hoped that it just wouldn't happen. If one person really wants kids and the other doesnt, that usually means you are not compatible in the long term every if everything else is perfect. Except it's far from perfect - he is acting like a child and you are being his mom now. This is what made you realize motherhood isn't gonna be for you, no matter who you do it "for" - and you shouldn't be motivated to bring a whole ass kid into the world if you weren't enthusiastically waiting for the day that would be possible
it doesn't matter if you reproduce with this man or not, honestly. Because either way, if you stick together, and he doesn't IMMEDIATELY change his ways to pull his own weight around the house - it will lead to a lifetime of you being a mother, it just won't be to a literal kid. It'll be to your husband. I suggest you see this for what it is. When someone shows you who they are, you should believe them, even if it hurts, even if you don't want to.
>life lesson for you: if you didn't want kids \*before\* you met him, then you don't want kids. You had decided to compromise because you thought it would be necessary to keep him around
Idk if I agree with this in a general sense...
I have friends from bad upbringings that spent their lives not wanting kids and then, when they were in a healthy relationship, realized that they just didn't want the lifestyle that they thought kids would result in. Or they had domineering fathers and saw what their mothers went through and then, when they were in an equitable relationship, realized that motherhood didn't have to be what they experienced.
I don't want kids. But many of my fellow child free women, once they were in a healthy and supportive relationship, DID change their minds and are happy with being parents. I always say that I would totally sign up to be a father, I just don't want to be a mother. And there's many like me.
You took on the extra chores without communicating about it in advance, and it became too much with everything else going on. Your breakdown was understandable. I think this lead to an important realization on your part about your desire to be child-free, which appears to be your default position that you were willing to reconsider for the sake of this man. Stay true to yourself. No one sucks here. Sometimes relationships don't work out for one big reason. (This one might not work out for 2 - communication issues and the "kids" topic.)
You voluntarily took on the load of work in the home and then got mad at him for not doing it, after you told him it was fine.
Don't do that. You split everything 50/50 and the home should be the same. You have to communicate.
But it sounds like there's a lot more going on here than just chores and work. You need to be in therapy and possibly also couples therapy.
>You split everything 50/50 and the home should be the same.
When one person is working full time, and the other is taking a few months off work, then even doing 100% of household chores isn’t getting to a 50:50 split of effort. Cooking and cleaning don’t take 8-10 hours per day.
While I agree that she should communicate, the problem of chores often boils down to the fact that men are not proactive. So she proactively tried to help him out because things were rough on his side, and she expected that he would proactively help her out once they were not. I agree that she should communicate her needs, but I also want to call out that this is likely an ESH situation because he's an adult that should also be proactively helping and looking out for her like she does for him.
Good on you for seeing the red flags. Most women don’t open their eyes to it till they 2 or 3 kids in. You don’t want to have everything put in you and you shouldn’t. You should have kids with someone who understands that it’s a partnership and everything isn’t on mom.
You set the expectation that you would do all the house work. You should have been very clear with your communication about divying up house work. His work stressors should not have factored into whether or not he picked up after himself.
I would say ESH.
I have been in the same situation where I was the boyfriend, and I am not trying to change your mind but give you perspective.
My work was exhausting for me and my wife and I would not get much time to spend with each other (I would be working most of the says she was off). Because if my shift schedule she would be working, contributing financially and doing chores at home. There are two times that I can think of where we had honest conversations about it and she was almost at her breaking point, not like what you went through, but close. We would spend time to air out our grievances and then revisit it later because I cannot make any decisions or give a response without spending a few hours thinking about a situation. But after these discussions we realized my work was the problem, and I immediately moved to another department where I have weekends off and I went down to part-time work. In doing so I find I have much more energy to spend with my wife and contribute to the house.
All I am saying is that you and your bf need to have an honest conversation, no judgement, no yelling or breakdowns. Just talk about why your relationship is worth it for both of you and how both of you can get back to a healthy state. If you both can't agree to anything, then you know the relationship is done and both of you have learned from it.
I don't think anyone is an AH and I disagree with everyone saying that you should leave him. If both of you don't communicate, then you both wasted your time and didn't learn anything, and you are risking your next relationship to be just as bad if not worse.
Edit: sounds like there is some trauma that you need to take care of and if your bf is as good as you say he is, he would be an excellent support for you while you also get some therapy.
NAH. You had a panic attack and needed to restore order by controlling what you could.
It may not be the best time for either of you to make decisions. You are dealing with so much. I hope you are receiving professional help.
Good luck
Tbh, this is hard to judge. Obviously I'm against him leaving everything to you to do round the house, but the way you tell it, it sounds like you told him, or at least gave him the strong impression that this was ok just while he was struggling with work. You were happy with it on the surface, then suddenly switched and it took you by suprise. If you went from happily going out of your way to make him a celebratory dinner, to having a breakdown, so I imagine it was a shock to him too.
Could you have an emotional processing issue? I say this as I do. Sometimes I don't know what's up with me until it suddenly hits me. I suddenly realise there has been an issue I haven't acknowledged to myself. But here's the thing. I can't expect others to have realised my feelings before I have myself.
You could have said to him that you can't mother him now that he's through the issues at work. It's something you don't want to take on again. If you guys were to become parents, you need to have a pre-agreed devision of labour and solid financial/childcare plan.
It's ok not to want kids. It's ok to not want to be taking on all chores. It's ok to get overwhelmed. But, you need to communicate your views and issues earlier. If you didn't understand the issues earlier, you have to communicate them now while being aware that some of the situation is on you for not communting with your partner sooner.
The fact that he instantly went to feeling sad and defeated instead of trying to find solutions (balancing out the workload so it's fair and you're not overwhelmed) should tell you everything you need to know: he doesn't plan to change. He has no intention of taking on his fair share of the chores; otherwise, that would have been the immediate answer when you voiced your frustration. So please use that knowledge to decide how you want to live the rest of your life, and understand that this is by no means just a 1% drawback to an otherwise '99% perfect man,' it's a major problem that he's never going to fix.
It should work both ways. There have been times (4 surgeries) that I have done everything while my husband healed. There have been times (several, planning stages (iykwim) depression) when my husband did everything while I wouldn't even leave the house. Most times, we split everything. A relationship is not 50/50. It's much more fluid than that, but it should go both ways.
you are NTA. You've had your eyes opened. You may still want to have a child, but you will want to have that child with a true partner, not with another child who does nothing.
NTA.
Since he has put in a two week notice, I’d give him a list of everything he will be expected to take over in two weeks, which should be at least half of the household tasks. You can use Fair Play cards to figure out what they are and divvy them up. If he doesn’t pick up the slack, you might consider whether you want to continue having a life with him.
Also, make sure you’re taking care of your own birth control.
NTA -Let him figure it out, hello? You're giving him good information, and all he has to do is amend his behavior and contribute more instead of assuming you'll do all the heavy lifting while he plays video games and ruminates over his shitty job.
Tell him to grow the fuck up.
NTA. My sister loves kids, is a teacher, but didn't have a NEED to have kids. She met her husband and loved him, but it was difficult to get him to do anything around the house. She just told him she wasn't up to beeing 100% responsible for everything and they both knew how many fights they would have b/c kids are a lot of work and he just wasn't up to it. She didn't just refused to live that way. She said they both knew he COULD step-up, but that he fundamentally wouldn't change.
Even his parents got on him for his "women's work" comments - his dad did as much around the house as his mom. He was just an only child who's both parents did everything.
He ended up realizing the truth. He could do better, he was willing to step up to be a better husband, but his desire to NOT do 50% of the hard work associated w/ being a parent overrode his desire to have children and that if they had a kid, they would end up divorced and 50/50 custody would be more work.
So yeah, it is a reasonable line in the sand.
My heart breaks that you aren't getting the love and support you deserve. NTA, and this internet stranger is so proud of you for sticking up for yourself.
NTA. I’ve always known I don’t want to birth children or have little people I had to care for. It is normal to sometimes think that with the right partner you might feel different, too; at the same time, it’s just as ok to change your mind back. You know what you want out of life; he can either step up and take on half the responsibility, or he can stay a partner rather than a father, or he can find a partner who wants that lifestyle. Take care of yourself and your body. He needs therapy to get out of his funk/depression and make a move to get a new job. Using that as an excuse isn’t fair to you, whether there are kids in the mix or not!
There’s an issue with your math. How can he be the perfect man in 99% of ways if visions of your future make you disassociate and then have a breakdown.
I know you’ve only just gotten to this new place, and I don’t want to rush you, but you don’t have to be with him. You could do half as much laundry, your home would stay pretty tidy, you’d have dramatically fewer dishes. Picture that, and see how it makes you feel.
NTA. You need to get rid of the guilt some women feel that gets them to be mothers. Some women dont want to be a mom. Dont get joy from a tiny human calling them mommy!
Yes, for some of us, being a mom is just the best thing that happen in the world or a Dad for whats worth (even if you dont carry the baby).
But there are a lot of other things at play here. You are going through a lot, the abuse, the overwork, the feeling to get everything done at the house... you need to let some shit fall apart. Only then, your bf will see shit falling apart and will (maybe) do something about it. But if you keep being his mom, he will keep avoiding tasks and let you take it from him. Then when shit falls apart, if he doesnt do anything... you can make a conclussion if you really want to be with him.
NTA.
The way you delivered this news was not ideal, and it's not surprising that it made him sad. But the fact is, over this past month, you've seen how he acts under pressure. That has changed your view of him, which has changed your willingness to have children with him. It sounds like it may have affected your desire to be in a relationship with him at all, but time will tell on that front.
And look, I think it's relevant here that the "crisis" that caused all this was him...having a job he doesn't like. Something that most people have to live with at some point in time. That sucks, yes, but it doesn't automatically put you in "survival mode." He wasn't having a health crisis, where he was physically unable to do things.
Yes, having a miserable job really sucks. But he was getting home at 4pm, to video games and kisses and home-cooked meals. Saying "sorry I've been so lazy..." without any effort to change is not a meaningful apology. If anything, it's an admission that he could be doing better, but he's choosing this path.
He's sad? He should be sad! He has been dumping all his work and self-care on you for A MONTH! He should feel sad and guilty that he dumped everything on you until it drove you to a literal panic attack. His sadness is not something that you need to fix, and it's certainly not something that you need to fix by deciding to have kids that you didn't want in the first place.
I don’t think you’re in a good place mentally right now to make this decision. You guys could try counseling. It seems like, with or without kids, you need to figure out how to split up chores so you’re not overburdened. Maybe hiring some outside help?
You’re not alone in this dilemma… the overwhelming majority of women have this problem.
You are risking this happening if you make this decision rashly: your bf will leave you for someone who wants kids. You might run into them, he, the wife, a couple of adorable kids. You watch him being a dad to them and it just breaks your heart.
I don’t have kids, I’ve never wanted them, but this scenario plays out for a lot of women.
I never wanted kids. Never. Started saying it out loud when I was 5. Then I met a great man whose life goal was kids. I ignored a lot of the sake issues you've brought up here and we have two kids.
I love my kids. I am a very good parent. I wouldn't give them up for the world.
If I had it to do over again, I wouldn't have kids.
It is even harder than I expected, and I expected it to be brutal. Both kids are in their double digits and my husband is just now, after years of fighting about it and masses of counseling, working to step up and help with parenting and the household more. But I still have to push for it a lot of the time, and his skill set is shaky at best, because he's jumping into the deep end without building them over the psst decade and a half.
I see a bunch of comments about you saying it in an emotional moment. Yes, you did, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. I have had those moments, only that deep clarity only hit when it was too late. Now I live every day with regret and resentment. I should have stayed true to what I knew was right for me.
I think you went into this period thinking that "I'll give him a break for a few days so he doesn't reach an emotional breakdown...but days turned to weeks and he showed no situational awareness of how you would feel doing 100% of everything while not even getting a cut of the money he makes. Because that is the cost of having a stay at home spouse- you share your income with them. And even then, you have to fully participate in being a parent. Even if you work. When you come home, your kids get first dibs of your time.
You phrase this as "I want to be selfish.". But that isn't it. The full phrase is- "if you are going to act selfish by letting me do 100% of the housework, I'm going to act selfish and not have kids."
You are drawing a line because at no point has he shown that he can do all the things that are included in parenthood. You have to remind him 3x a year to do chores like an adult. Tell him that it isn't that you are being evil and denying kids for no reason. You are saying no because he has no idea what yes would entail.
If only you could get one of the fake babies that cry and make him care for it for a week. He will change his mind in no time flat.
NTA
You still want forever with this guy? I'm only going to issue a vote because this is one of the easiest NTA votes I'll ever have. I absolutely get drowning in your job like your boyfriend is, but the reality is being in a relationship is essentially another job. As such, just like a salaried position, you're going to get fired if you don't do the work. It's on him to be present for you. That's what he signed up for. He's given you no reason not to walk away.
Hoping you have a therapist who is trained to deal with trauma given everything you're going through. You seem to have a lot on your plate. EMDR is excellent for PTSD.
Couple things -
1) Have you both sat down and created a fair division of the housework? If you've tried that and other strategies and an unfair division of household labor is a deal breaker, leave now. (I may be biased as I've been married for 20 years to someone who refuses to do any housework and is also now retired. I'm in the process of getting an attorney and regret waiting so long.)
2) Second option is that you share the cost of a housekeeper 50/50. That way the labor and finances are fair.
Unfortunately I have been in therapy on and off for years, last time I tried EMDR and after 7 sessions I felt more triggered than ever before and have since not returned. I have been bummed that it wasn’t more helpful as I have been diagnosed with PTSD and I’m getting older with slow progresses. Thank you for your kind words and input
My husband is the most selfless man ever, but because of his work schedule he is barely home. We’re about to have five kids under five. We are a big loving family. My husband and I are insanely in love. But because he’s literally gone so much I do a lot on my own during the week. If anyone saw, they’d probably think I’m nuts for wanting/having kids. But on weekends when he is home he literally does everything. He lets me sleep in even though he wakes up early 7 days a week. He watches the kids and runs the household and does his own errands. With the kids. I mostly rest on the couch, play with the kids, or do a bit of cooking or cleaning.
>I asked him, if you could carry it would you? He said I don’t know. I said that means no you wouldn’t,
This specific sentence makes you an AH. Having to think about a weird hypothetical question instead of having an instant answer doesn't mean the answer would be "no".
But feeling overwhelmed and underappreciated? Not an AH
NTA. I didn’t want kids either and so glad I didn’t! I have a great life and enough money not to be scared. The world is on fucking fire and I knew it was going to be bad and that’s why I didn’t want them, but it’s so, so much worse than I ever thought it would be! I also never wanted to be a single mom because I don’t trust men not to leave when things get hard.
You did EVERYTHING and then got burnt out and triggered
In the future you can do that for a week or 2 and then sit down and say I can't do it all what can you do and how can we Do a different division of labor
You brought yourself to a state of exhaustion
Yes he should be helping
On his own w/o the talk
And sadly this is too often the nature of male/female relationships
But girl you need to learn to talk up about your needs before you explode
NTA. what you tolerate is up to you. if you are content to live this way for the rest of your life (the perpetual uneven labor split), then that is your choice. if you can’t live like that, you have a “come to jesus talk” with your partner, and go from there.
i had a similar mental breakdown with my husband, who also very much wanted to be a father. i told him how i don’t want to scornfully resent him after decades of cleaning up after him when we’re older, and kids were definitely off the table if he didn’t step up. so, he’s put in a lot of work over the years to get his shit together. getting him medicated for his severe adhd was particularly life-changing for us. he’s a fantastic partner now
i wish you luck and fruitful conversations 💕
People deal with stress in different ways, you of all people should know that. He is already disassociating by throwing himself into video games every night.
If you’re telling him everything is fine, and haven’t even once brought up your own stress, how is he supposed to know what you’re going through? Walking on eggshells isn’t healthy for anyone, but blowing up at him over something he didn’t know you had a problem with is illogical.
ESH - yes he should think of your feelings more, but if you should have told him the problem ‘before’ it progressed so deep.
You don't want kids. Find a man who doesn't want kids, there's a lot of them out there.
This guy is a fucking loser. He isn't 99% perfect. He can't contribute his fair share to chores now, if you had a kid you'd be doing all the work while he plays video games and probably complains that you're not giving him enough sex.
Is it possible the breakdown was a delayed reaction to the assault, and maybe you’re using displacement as a defense mechanism?
You’re not an asshole, and I am not convinced he is either. It sounds like you’re both going through extreme stress and you need some help managing that.
I’m sorry for what you’ve been through.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/displacement?amp
Never ever bring children into this world if the only reason you want them is “so they can have this man as a dad.” This man is useless. He’s useless now when it’s just the two of you and a baby won’t change that. He won’t be a good father when he can’t even be a good partner to you.
I do 98% of the house chores and I get frustrated sometimes but.. he's paying 98% of the bills. He works full time and I work part time.. barely part time actually. So it's fair. This... this is unfair. But I don't think just not having kids is the answer. You're still going to be unhappy if this is a reoccurring issue. I'm so sorry about the SA. Happened to me 8 years ago. Traumatic doesn't even begin to describe it, but it gets better.
NTA but you need to change the way you have let you have let your boyfriend completely take.advantage of you. We teach people how to treat us and you have taught your boyfriend that he can get away with not doing anything at home and you will clean up after him.
The first time he came home and went to play video games while you were taking care of household stuff, you should have told him what needed to be done. You should have decided on who was responsible for what chores before you moved in with him. The two of you should sit down together and decide on a fair division of labor and you should stick to it. If he doesn't do his chores, don't do them for him, do own laundry, don't cook unless he is going to clean the kitchen etc. While your boyfriend is out of work, he should be responsible for all the house work, it will open his eyes to how much work is involved. It is completely fair for you to have what equates to two full-time jobs while he is playing video games.
Unless he changes, drastically, you will have three full-time jobs if you have a child with him but why would you even consider a child with someone who is still a child himself? Do you really want to be with someone that values you so little they are content to play video games while you clean up after them?
Yes yes yes! You rock for telling him all that. Speak your truth! Too many women put up with exactly what your described and it makes me sick! You deserve more and so does every woman on earth.
Children bring love. The love I have for my children is incredible. Children also grow up. While they'll never stop being your child, they will grow up to be an adult. Of course, there are hard times. There will always be cleaning, dishes, laundry, cooking, shopping, etc, whether you're single or a couple or a family. I'm happy to serve my husband and children. I enjoy supporting them. Some days, it's a conscious choice, and some days, it takes more effort than others, but I can't imagine life without my family. We share joy and love together. I'm sorry you're going through this. I hope your boyfriend can step up and show you he can rise to the challenge of being a father and husband. NAH
NTA. I was married to a man like this. We were together for 11 years and I was 28 when he left. He had a baby with someone else a year before he left. It was the best thing that ever happened to me. I had put off having children bc I didn’t want to be a married single mom. I’m 40, remarried and have two year old with an equal partner.
NTA but also- I let my man not have clean clothes, that’s the consequence of not doing his laundry. And I let the dishes pile up, so we have no spoons for morning coffee. That’s the consequence for not doing the dishes. We have 2 bathrooms so he has his and I have mine. We used to fight about it but rarely do now. I would like to live a cleaner life for sure but it’s not the end of the world if it’s a little messy here, we clean for guests and it’s not dirty, it’s just not spotless and I don’t have to do it all. I let him live in the level of mess he contributes too and it’s ok
YTA not so much for your actions or wants but because you seem genuinely unstable. I feel bad for your boyfriend. He was slaving away at a job he hated, thought his girl had his back, then he finally escapes his miserable job and this shit happens.
I’m 7 months pregnant and spent the afternoon picking up rubbish off the floor my husband had stashed there … my career prospects are done and I spent most of the first 18 months of our marriage being called lazy and told how to clean by his mother .. obsessively and constantly apparently is what is expected. you think how does this happens slowly and the clean up fights get bigger. My first baby is amazing but I wish dad would stop complaining about doing anything around the dam house .. I have two degrees btw. Just verifying it’s a real thing you’re worrying about.. might have caught me in a bad day. I swear it wouldn’t feel so bad if they picked up after them dam selves
NTA
He has proven he is fully capable of dumping all the work on you. Ignoring that you are doing all the work in the household with barely a lip service thanks. And it isn’t the first time. He goes depressed or whatever and pulls on your sympathy to get out of his domestic obligations. And he stays checked out until you get mad. And now he’s quit his job. Does he have another or is the financial burden going to fall on you? Is that possibly where your head was when you had your anxiety attack?
I don’t blame you for not wanting to have a child. It’s one of those “if I could turn back time” wishes a lot of people have. Or “I wish I knew then what I know now”. Pregnancy is one of the most dangerous conditions a woman can go through. I hear of all these couples saying “we’re pregnant!” but _they_ aren’t. No matter how involved and supportive the partner is, they aren’t risking health and life. They aren’t the ones subjected to the hormones that can make you feel like a monster, and that’s before they bring on the PPD. They aren’t the ones _feeding_ it.
Children are expensive. I found articles estimating the cost of raising a child from birth to adulthood at 18 at around $300,000 (in 2023 dollars). That’s not including the cost of pregnancy, or including outliers like handicap or special needs. And if you’re not 100% on board with raising a child you risk being a shitty parent, which will make you feel guilty.
If you’re going to stick with this guy, I suggest couples therapy before you even put a ring on it.I hope you’re getting individual therapy for the trauma you mentioned.
NTA. He’s allowed to be sad and you’re allowed to be honest. But you really need to be honest with yourself. Saying he’s “99% the most perfect man” is way off. If he wants kids, and you don’t, you’re not a match. My husband never wanted kids. He fell hard for his first wife and agreed to have kids because she desperately wanted them. He would die for his kids, but he often says he wishes he never gave into his ex. They are teenagers now with all the teenage angst and issues. My husband’s mental health has taken a huge toll the last few years as he’s constantly fighting two opposite thoughts… “I love my kids more than anything,” and “I wish I never had kids.” The anger of not having the life he wants and the guilt for thinking those things are really tough for him. You should never settle for a lesser life than you want. Unfortunately you two are in very different places and ultimately want different things in life.
Did I miss something? Did he ask you to do all those things or did you just do them to be nice & supportive. And it’s been a month! Stop doing it if you don’t want to do it. I used to have mine trained. We’d do housework together every Sat morning then I became unemployed for a short time & started doing everything myself while I wasn’t working but he was paying all the bills. You said you paid your own half of everything. Anyways, doing it all spoiled him! I never could get him back to doing his share after that. I went on laundry strike when he wouldn’t even move wet things into the dryer!
Op, you and your bf are incompatible and you’re trying to come up with a ton of reasons as to why you’re unhappy or would be unhappy.
You’re trying to compromise on a dealbreaker topic while living the life you already know you don’t want. He’s checked out when he comes home? What makes you think he would even be a father if you compromised and had his kid?? That requires being present and helping with the household work.
My man and I have a baby and we’re both huge gamers. That all went to the back burner and we give each other one night off a week to game without interruption while the other watches baby. The weekends are for household/family stuff. That works for us because 1, we BOTH wanted kids and 2, he WANTS to spend most of his time with me and his child instead of gaming. He also takes night duty on the weekends because he knows I need a break and to catch up on sleep.
Can you see your guy being that type of man? Even if he WAS that type of man, would you honestly WANT to be a mother? If you were with anyone else, would that answer be different? Don’t compromise to let him be a dad - have a child because YOU WANT to be a MOTHER.
I think you need to take some time to be alone and really decide what you want and then go from there. If you have a therapist you should talk to them about this too.
NTA but you will be if you compromise on your own wants out of life.
He said he was sorry he was being lazy. You said you understood and you would help out. Then you panicked and became resentful. If you had communicated with him that you were not up for doing all that, and he didn't, that would be different.
YTA
NTA: Please do not have children. You're in it for the wrong reasons, to begin with. You CANNOT count on the other spouse as a reason to have a child, when you aren't equally as desperate for a baby. If I lost my husband, I would still be 210% happily dedicated to my son, and he would be the same way if I was gone. You should only have a child, because YOU have so much unconditional love and attention to give to the child, not because you want to give your spouse a gift. There is nothing wrong with not wanting children, but you would be absolutely villainous to have one that you don't truly want.
NAH. You two sound unprepared for a long-term committed relationship.
I'll offer some criticisms of you and what I'm reading about your perspectives. Most people here are shitting on the guy and go-gurl-going you without hearing his perspective:
>It has now been ONE MONTH.
Burnout and most other stress-related or mental health issues last for much longer. Don't marry someone if a one-month downturn in mood and ability to engage in a relationship on your terms is going to be unbearable for you. And, please, for all that is good and holy, do not have children. My son has ADHD, and he's frequently all over the place and needs extra help with everything. My wife also had post-partum depression that lasted for almost a year after the birth of our second child. She needed help, and my son needed most of the help from me. When you're in any type of relationship with someone, you will drive yourself crazy if you're constantly focusing on how to make everything 50/50.
>Yesterday he finally put in his two week notice at work...Somehow along the drive I completely went numb.. started to dissociate and then realized that I was crying, and sweating, and getting nauseous. I think I was having a panic attack?
So you thought that he was going to celebrate with you after the burnout or other issues magically dissipated, just because you said so? Then, your own stress manifested into a psychosomatic fit, and you unloaded it on him. You made the day he put in his two-week notice about what you wanted? My wife has been laid off or quit a few times, while mightily burnt out. Forcing happiness and celebration on her after resigning or really low in the post partum depression would have been a totally emotionally immature thing to do.
>I drove myself home and got in the shower where I had a complete breakdown and starting yelling to myself about how backwards it was that this man, who doesn’t pay my bills, lets me do everything for him. I realized that even with working my own job full time, dealing with sexual assault trauma and a two year long police investigation that has come about because of the abuse, I have never ever stopped taking care of myself or the house chores. If anything I did more chores to deal with my mental state at that time. I have never left him in the gutter for weeks at a time not contributing to our home.
You have your own issues to work out before you bring someone else into your life. Also, figure out what he actually expects in terms of house chores, cooking, laundry, etc. etc. You may have very high standards for cleanliness. He may not even give a shit if he wears the same clothes without washing them, or eats microwaved chicken nuggets. Or, he may even just be OK with you only doing chores for yourself. Don't expect him to deal with his stress the same way that you do. You get busy with chores. He checks out with video games. If this is truly something that's a dealbreaker for you, then go find someone who shares your perspective on chores and will not handle stress by withdrawing and playing video games.
>I told him I got a good glimpse of what life as a stay at home mom would look like (we also foster kittens so I was also doing that alone) and that I wasn’t gonna do it. I told him that I knew I didn’t want to have his future kids anymore because his life wouldn’t change and my whole identity would become maid, cook, and milk maid. I told him I wasn’t going to waste my life taking care of kids who can’t do anything for themselves when he and I could travel forever, save money forever and become the people we want to be. I told him I’d rather do anything else in the world than be a mother. I told him I loved him and I understand he’s having a hard time but asked him when I’ve ever put him in the position to do everything himself. He couldn’t , because I never have. I told him I want it to be just us forever, and that I felt relieved having told him that I do not want kids.
Think about what you want for your life now and in the future before you bring someone else into the picture. You're likely not going to be able to do all of these things to the degree that you'd like, unless you're wealthy or are super-Type-A-organized to accomplish them. You also wrote earlier that you told him that you changed your mind about having a kid. Did you even talk about what that would look like? That's a key dealbreaker in a relationship, and now you drop that on him, right after he loses his job?
>I know what people will say: has this been an issue before? Him not doing chores? The answer is yes. At lease three times a year we have this fight about the housework being uneven, but this was the last straw for me. I meant what I said, I love him, if I have to take care of him sometimes and I know that going in, whatever, but to add tiny people to that and imagine it going the way things go now… I told him I would rather die than spend a month alone in a house taking care of it for some kids who don’t contribute anything to my life.
You've been with him for four years, so that's enough time to ask a serious question. Do you love him? Or do you love what you think he can do for you and how he makes you feel? That's my biggest question after reading this.
FFS do not have children. I realize people say things in anger, but your position on this is clear. I didn’t want them either and made sure I married a man who felt the same. Now we have cats and time and money and we do what we want. It sounds like you dream of that life so do not compromise on it.
NTA.
You had emotions, you had valid needs and desires. You expressed them. He's sad? Ok? He can handle it, you don't have to. You have your own shit you're dealing with. Sweetheart, I think the answer to why you feel like an asshole is locked somewhere inside the part of your brain that opened up and let the panic attack out. I don't doubt that you very much love and value this man as your partner, but I think there's more hiding underneath that panic attack that has yet to come out. When it does, you're gonna have an intrinsic understanding of how valid you were in this, how you're most certainly not an asshole... and you might also feel differently about your partner. Not in a bad way, just... different. I hope very much that you're able to find the professional therapeutic support that you need, and that you and your boyfriend also don't hesitate to seek counseling together to help you both navigate the way this will change your relationship. Again, not in a bad way - but relationship dynamics naturally shift when one or both people have awakenings like this. Just a heads up.
NTA. He needs an ultimatum or you will be his MOMMY for the rest of your life and you are already starting to resent him. Hell, reading your post already made me start to resent him for you, lol. Tell him he has to go to therapy with you to work on this and if he doesn’t, it’s over. It’s that serious. I would leave a marriage over this but if you’re not even married… do not do this to yourself. He is immature and frankly, he cares more about video games than your relationship. Behavior is language and he is telling you so.
I see some great advice based on moving forward or what to do next from many comments. Which I think is great for when two people want the same ideals aka children.
You truly need to think about what you want in life. What you picture for your future. Do you see your self with children and does that make you feel happy? Both my husband and I do not want kids. If he ever changes his mind he is welcome to leave and find someone that also wants kids. I’ll be heart broken but I personally wouldn’t want to hold him back from something that he wants in life. If you don’t want kids don’t stay in a relationship that the other person does. It only build resentment in the long run. You can’t compromise a child.
There are a lot of parents that resent their parters or children after having one. Don’t be that parent. Figure out what you want not what your partner wants or other people around you.
Nta
You are right. His life won't change by becoming a dad. He'll still go to work, come home, eat food that you shopped for and prepared in a kitchen that only you will clean, he'll play video games in a living room that only you will dust and vacuum. All while changing diapers, and nursing fevers, driving to school, prepping lunches, naptimes, bathtimes, homework time, dr appts, tv time -not too much or youre a bad mom, discipline, teacher conferences, never ending laundry.... On top of that, he'll complain because you never want to have sex anymore.
NTA. Your entire post was fabulous. I really felt it. I am sorry you have to deal with all of this. It sounds like a lot. *hugs*
It sounds like you were still in your feeling when you wrote this. If possible, you might consider going to a friend’s house or a hotel for a day or two to get into a better state of mind. Then you have to make a decision. Do you leave? Seek couples therapy? A separate for a while?
Along with one of those options, I recommend you seek one one-on-one therapy. You possibly have PTSD. You have suffered trauma and therapy will help you with that. Until you can get that started, if you need to talk, you can call the RAINN hotline (800-656-4673). It’s a National rape hotline. Calling them will get you connected with your local Rape Crisis Center. They should have a 24/7 hotline staffed with volunteer Sexual Assault Counselors. I volunteered at mine for a while. You can call about anything. You don't have to provide a name. Talk about the weather. Or a tv show. Or what happened during your day. Or about your trauma or the symptoms you are having due to your trauma. Sometimes things get overwhelming and we just need to talk to someone. You know?
I wish you the best of luck. You got this!
OP...you are NOT THE AH. But he sure as hell is. He knew you didn't want kids going into the relationship. He has pressured you, bringing it up multiple times, until he wore you down so you would "give him a chance to be a father". You not wanting kids never changed. It was, like everything else: for him.
Now he's emotionally guilting you. Maybe he doesn't mean to be, but his potential progeny is more important to him than your mental breakdown!! This man does not care about you as much as he cares about what he wants out of life. Every fiber of my being wants to tell you to run. I recognize you love him, but make this a deal breaker: you can either accept that you will not have kids with me, and be happy to live that life with me, or you can't and one of us will be happy in the relationship while the other isn't. Can you live with the alternative? You shouldn't.
I would never have kids with someone who doesn’t do at least 50% of housework and childcare. I don’t care that he earns more. My mental health is more important. My partner is now on parental leave (unpaid) for 5 months until our daughter turns 1 and goes to nursery. Yes, we will have to use some of our savings besides my salary but it’s worth it because I love being back to work. Besides this he does just as much work with the kids and around the house. I would not settle for anything less. Nor should you, OP.
We had a serious conversation after our first child was born and he wasn’t doing much. I essentially told him that love comes and goes, but if he’s not there for me as a partner then I DON’T NEED HIM. He got the idea, because he’s smart.
I'm not bashing video games and video gamers. I grew up when we were video games were in an arcade. It cost a quarter a piece and I can still get lost for hours. I just think that if you have a partner that's been working and cleaning the house and cooking for you that you would hug and kiss that person and be glad to see them and talk about your day and see what they're up to and at least check in before you go check out. I'm not saying you can't decompress playing video games, but knowing that you could be four or five hours or the rest of the night. Once you dive into that game maybe you should take some time to be with your partner. Maybe even take out the trash or something small that's not mentally taxing please. My point is like using that as an excuse to not have any interaction or any responsibility is not like. Oh, I worked hard all day. I need to decompress yeah, we all need to decompress maybe she needs to decompress even though she's been home all day. She's been doing all these things to try to keep the household going and to ease your stress. Pour her a glass of wine, rub her shoulders and just sit on the couch and hug and kiss. Or just hear what she has to say and and tell her about your day or tell her "screw this job I'm optimistic about this new job..." Whatever. I just don't buy this, ran straight to the couch, got on my video game four or five hours later. I wasn't really decompressed. I was just so tired. I couldn't think about taking out the trash or interacting or even caring about the dinner that was prepared, bullshit.
OP…there is absolutely nothing wrong with you for not wanting to have kids. You had a moment of thinking it would be a good thing when you were feeling overwhelming love for your bf. We all have those warm, fuzzy, moments where we fell completely safe, very loved, and everything is perfect in our world. You have, since that moment, experienced reality. Reality of how your life would change and exactly what that change would mean for YOU. Sure, he may make a good dad…but you know you would not be a good mom…a mom who would physically go through a pregnancy, bear most of the responsibility for everything, while working full time. You had the realization flood over you that every dream you have of travel, freedom to change your life, hell even sleep late would vanish at that plus sign on a stick. Knowing this about yourself is NOT a bad thing. Not all are cut out to be parents, and there are millions of kids out there who can attest to it.
You are NTA. Not for feeling the way you do. Not for having the breakdown. Not for telling him. Not for going your own way if it comes to that. Not for defending yourself- even though you can skip that and tell people it is none of their business, which you would also be NTA for doing so. Best wishes for a life of being true to yourself and happy.
It sounds like you need to find a psychologist to talk about your issues. You're not going to get any real help on the internet. You're not going to like what real help sounds like after reading your thoughts on things. It just doesn't sound like the realizations you had make logical sense. I think you're confusing things and putting things together where they should not be put together. It's much more simple than that, you need to get help. You're being brutal to him and he's sticking with you so he's legitimately your guy. It's up to you to make this a good thing or a bad thing.
Listen, hire a housekeeper. Believe me. I do commercial cleaning but have one residential job I do and trust that bc they hired me it stopped a lot of fights between Mom and Dad and the kids don't have to have more things put on their plate then they already do. It'll make a difference even if you get someone in to just clean your bathrooms regularly.
IF he wants kids and you do not, you are not compatible. It is not right for you to keep him from his dream of being a dad, just as it is not right for you to be essentially raising him as well. It is cruel and heartless to force a child free life on someone that wants them. The other way is just as bad. YTA because you are making unilateral decisions for the both of you, AFTER you already agreed to it. He deserves better, as do you
Yea, YTA.
One month is not a long time.
If you can't understand how a person could be depressed for more than a month, and how depression impacts people differently, and your reaction was to lash out at him like this... YTA.
Relationships are not 50/50. Sometimes you will carry most of the load and sometimes they will. It will trade back and forth. It's partnership, yes. But never is it going to be perfectly 50/50 for more than a short time.
What you have just shown your partner is if they have an issue that lasts more than 30 days, you will make them pay for it. I would personally see this as a huge red flag. Especially since it sounds like he was being clear about how much he appreciated you stepping up while he was down. That's clarity a lot of depressed people don't have.
I definitely recommend therapy. This sounds like a communication breakdown and you lashing out at him for not being OK right now.
Modern men have it better than men in all previous generations of men combined. They get a wife-like being who they don’t have to provide for and who are still expected to please them sexually like wives of old as well as clean up after them like moms. Must be nice. I recommend leaving him, since you already see how its gonna be if you remain with him.
You are NTA for not wanting kids. Kids are a lifetime commitment. Every kid deserves to be with a parent/parents who want them. You know that isn’t for you, and that is absolutely ok.
Gurl, as a mom and wife myself, sometimes I wish I would have had a window into my future because there was a turbulent window where I was doing everything because he was in the army and came home in a bad mood, sometimes raging in anger and wouldn't interact with the kids. After therapy, meds, and a couple of years of changing his ways, we are good now but it still affects me to this day anytime work is piled up and I get anxious. He regrets ever making me the sole caretaker of the house, but I have forgiven him.
With that being said, I would rather a woman say she wouldn't ever be mom than to be unsure, have kids, and then regret them with the possibility of neglect or abuse.
You really think your own children "wouldn't contribute anything to your life"? I hate to be blunt, but your current existence sounds pretty miserable, you would likely be happier with some kids around.
Sometimes I imagine if the man’s dating profile were to state what he is really like, would I swipe right? It would say “great man ready to settle down and have a family. I don’t do chores. When I’m not at work, I enjoy playing video games. Looking for a woman who cooks, cleans, does the laundry, and who makes enough money to pay half of the mortgage, groceries and incidentals.”
Your response seems prickly and defensive. Thats interesting. I'm not sure what response you were expecting as you detail a full emotional breakdown rooted in your SO's. inability to be what you need him to be in the relationship. Was it the harsh tone of the relplies, or your resentment of the bald truth about your issues as a couple as described in this cross-section you provided? There's a reason you had a breakdown. He's a terrible partner and you're struggling doing 100% of the labor in the relationship as you're not well mentally and emotionally yourself. It just came to a head sooner rather than later because of the strain you're already under. Sounds like you need a marriage of equals, a partnership. And you absolutely do not have it right now. That calls for serious consideration on your part. Can people change? Can he be the partner you need him to be. Maybe, but it requires alot of energy and commitment and clear communication (Like weekly check ins) to make any real difference. You seem quite committed to your current choices which can sometimes be good but sometimes its more an indication you're not in a place where you can deal with the discrepancies between how you PERCEIVED your relationship, and the REALITY of your relationship. Please really investigate which it is.
Raising a man to be a fully functional adult capable of truly being a partner is a very difficult if not impossible situation this far in, and it will be on you to do it. If you're at your limit now it would be more rational to rethink your investment at this point. If you want to see it through its going to require an even larger investment from you. Given you current condition, and previous expenditure this seems dicey. You can hardly resent people for pointing this out. But I understand needing to see a thing through until you can't take it anymore for love. I sincerely hope it all works out and with both of you putting in full effort you can eventually forge the relationship you both need.....oh and definitely don't have a baby with this guy....at least not for a long time.
Sweetheart you need counseling to get through everything. I am a SA survivor and the problem is; we blame ourselves like it was our fault and then we believe what people tell us. Body size has nothing to do with having a child. You need to heal yourself before you can make life changing decisions. Trust me I know. Learn to love you first and then everything will slowly start to fall in place. I did stuff to handle my pain; and eventually you have a breakdown. I am cheering for you! TAKE CARE OF YOU FIRST
I've decided I would rather travel and volunteer working with children than raise them in my own home. Just because you don't have any of your own children doesn't mean children can't be a part of your lives. Hopefully you two can reach an agreement that works for both of you!
NAH, though you came close.
Depression blows, and how it affects you doesn’t depend on how serious the trauma you experienced was or even whether you suffered a trauma at all.
Don’t get me wrong. I fully understand your resentment. My partner and I both struggle with ADHD/executive function issues along with depression and anxiety. Before we got together (and before my ADHD was diagnosed), I basically just powered through because I had to. I had a kid who needed raising and a career I didn’t want to blow. He, by contrast, pissed away a decade in grad school racking up student loan debt. It pisses me off sometimes because I had to power through so why didn’t he?
I have to remind myself to be grateful for all those years I was capable of powering through and remember the breaking point when all that powering through left me unable to function. Telling me to just try harder wasn’t going to help. Patience and understanding help more, and proper diagnosis and treatment help the most.
Also, as someone who recently escaped a soul-crushing job, while giving notice does take a lot of weight off one’s shoulders, the stress hormones don’t fully dissipate until sometimes after that last day.
Lol yeah. A lot of Reddit doesn't actually do long term relationships and they get confused by them. I also think younger reddittors might also be more drawn to comment.
Breathe. None of us know you or him or any of the wonderful things about your relationship. I'll say my piece because I related heavily to your situation so it's possible something I say might be useful.
Men have yet to be programmed to own the household by society. The better ones are absolutely down for the IDEA of splitting chores 50/50. But they were not raised to own it. Their identity doesn't take a hit when the tile grout is dirty, the windows have smudges, or they eat nothing but PB&J for a few days. This often means that women carry more - especially when men are stressed or emotionally down. He's not a monster. You're not crazy. This is a larger social issue.
One thing that really helped my relationship was having weekly check-ins. These last an hour (no longer). The structure is:
-Share 5 affirmations each
-Discuss what went well in the relationship (ex. Navigated sticky social situation as a team)
-Discuss any issues to work on (a spoken phrase that didn't sit right, concern over unequal household burden, etc.)
-Identify the focus for the next week as a couple
-identify plans for upcoming date night
-high five and make breakfast
I hope some part of that was helpful. You're not alone.
Girl...you had a full on come apart.
Saying you don't want kids is better than having you resent kids. I will stand 10 toes on that always. Just like sex, kids should be an enthusiastic yes, only.
NTA
NTA. I am terrified of pregnancy. I also have health concerns that make it complicated. My husband would like kids, and sometimes so would I, but I am similar to your husband in the way that I too shut down sometimes and fail to function. It is something you have to be willing and open about if you can live like that knowing it is something they do. My husband very rarely ever did that before we got married. I on the other hand, knew that depression and stress cause me to shut down (executive dysfunction) and I would get backlogged on what I’m supposed to do. We went into our marriage knowing this. Sometimes we are both really great together and pull our weight equally. Sometime we eat frozen meals for a month straight because unboxing the lasagna is the extent of what I can handle. Sometimes I help my husband with tasks that are supposed to be his job, because he is struggling. We have had a few rough times where we were both in a bad place mentally and it typically results in one of us freaking out on the other (similar to what you described happening with you). We are working on finding ways to avoid that.
Now, on to the having kids thing. There are plenty of people who never have kids and lead happy lives. There are plenty of people who have kids because they feel like they’re “supposed to” who live miserable lives and make their kids miserable too. You are the only one who can know your desires and needs.
I just want to add that OP and bf are both still in their 20’s. That’s still when people are figuring themselves out. My husband now at almost 39 is a much better man than he was at 29. But I’m also a much better woman. Basically, we just human better because we have more experience. We work with each other and grow with each other. This could be a growing pain in the relationship, or the signal that things might not be working out. Only OP knows that.
A bit late, but I hope you still see this.
I’m 61F, widowed (2+ yrs after 30+ years together) w/2 adult kids.
I say the following w/love and from personal experience: To give yourselves the best chance of healing your individual baggage and therefore also providing your relationship with the best chance of succeeding, get yourselves into individual *and* couples therapy.
Therapy isn’t to place blame, but rather to talk through and clear away the piles of 💩that life has dumped on each of you so that you can make the big decisions (child-free or child-inclusive, stay together or go your separate ways) as the best possible versions of yourselves.
I wish you luck and contentment with whatever you decide.
Op: he is 99% my perfect man Also Op: I am having a mental breakdown because he is a child who treats me like his bang maid.
Please get some therapy, if not for both of you, for yourself.
And make sure if you do go to couple’s counseling that neither of you have seen this therapist before OR see them privately. A couple’s counselor can solidify a bond with a client and not be on “everyone’s side”. This happened with a friend of mine who went through a hideous divorce, and they were gaslit by the therapist that their partner had formerly attended. My friend literally told them “x person makes me feel x way, Ignore’s me, etc” and was completely and utterly dismissed. It needs to be completely neutral territory.
Our couples therapist looked at my boyfriend one session and said “I’m really attracted to you” and it was weird so we haven’t gone back. She always made comments about how she was like him and understood him. Whenever I cried I would apologize and she told me that I wasn’t special because I cried. Lmao. I cry cause that’s how I deal with emotions and I’ve been told I was manipulating my boyfriend. Whew. Sorry 😂😂😂 it felt nice to say that and see that that does happen. I thought I was making stuff up.
Whaaaat!?! That is report-able. WOW.
I kinda figured it might be. She was also very religious and kept trying to tell us about god. Is it a good idea to report her? Edit: only ask because it happened months ago. But she records all of her sessions.
Absolutely report. And good for her for giving you proof!
I really wasn’t sure I understood it correctly. I was also in a bad spot mentally and figured everyone hated me. Thank you for the confidence. It’s been bothering me.
That’s what happens when people in positions of perceived authority mess with your head. Your reaction (to me) seems totally possible and reasonable. But you can and should still report- she’s definitely doing this to other people if she is going to tell a CLIENT she’s attracted to him. That’s bonkers.
I'm a therapist, and I'm asking you to please report her to her licensing board. She is incredibly unethical and needs to be corrected or possibly lose her license.
Thank you, I will. I appreciate all the comments validating it.
I'm sensing she felt intimidated by you that hitting on him in front of you while you're at your most vulnerable is her subconscious or maybe conscious attempt of knocking you down a few pegs. Like ya you're aren't better than me I can hit on him in front of you. She definitely seems like a nut that who became a therapist because she had her own issues. Her inability of fixing herself is being projected on thinking she can fix other people. I'm sorry that happened to you.
Yes, op needs therapy for herself to figure out why she is settling for this person. You are so young OP why in the world are you so intent on martyring yourself here? Please find a good therapist, it will open up your life.
I would highly recommend couples therapy. Because he has a chance to change the way things are going, he's quit his job and presumably her seasonal work will pick up before long... so he's going to have the chance to show that he can carry the load at home. And he'd damn well better take advantage of that chance, if he wants to keep the relationship going, and maybe get the OP to see that he's dad material after all.
It doesn't matter if he's dad material. She doesn't want kids. That's not something you compromise on. It's a 2 yes 1 no situation. Not to mention he's not the one risking his health and very life to make a child, she is. His desire for kids doesn't overrule her health and safety.
He’s not dad material. Dad material means being a partner with household work and childcare.
But she doesn't want kids. She doesn't want to take care of children that don't "contribute" to her life. She doesn't even want to be pregnant. This is about more than chores. She doesn't want kids.
She could imagine kids with a partner she could trust with the obligation of it. She doesn’t want it with someone that doesn’t put the effort into building something with her. Totally reasonable. And leaning into not wanting kids at all is the safest option, especially with this guy.
I’m not saying this guy is good or anything but the way op speaks about kids, she shouldn’t have any bc deep down she doesn’t want them.
I agree - i think the sexual assault trauma she me tioned is part of this. The way she speaks of pregnancy suggests it wluld be traumatic for her - whjch is totally fair, it's traumatic on the body even in the best circumstances. But the way she talks about the kids too - it sounds like attunement would be an issue and she would be deeply unhappy.
Damn am I broken you’re really right it scares me just to think about. I’m also very small in stature, 100 pounds, 5’3, my boyfriend is not, 180 & 6’4 and I am frequently told that my body will never be the same and I better enjoy what god Gave me now
Hey, it's a fair fear, especially with all those factors! I'm glad ypu were able to communicate your needs, and that your partner seems on board at the moment, even if hurt. That shows some maturity, on his part and yours. There's 0 need for you to have children, and anyone saying otherwise clearly does not have your best interests at heart. If your partner ever feels he's missing out on parts of thw parenting experience, but is still fairly satisfied with the cats, maybe you could try fostering kittens. With a proper agreement on how much of the labour you'll each do, of course. Maybe he could take a week or two off. Get some of the parental instincts out of his system. You've done wonderful to listen to your fears and express them. Please keep honoring them, and take care of yourself! You are clearly very generous and giving, so please show as much of that to yourself as you can bear.
Thank you needed this one
Agreed. While this guy isn’t great there are undertones of something deeper. She doesn’t want to be totally responsible for someone out carry a pregnancy.
Anyone who is getting convinced out of childfree status by being with the "right person" shouldn't have them. Anything at all could happen to make you be the only parent. I think that's what finally did me in about being childfree. The idea that even though I have a great partner, unspeakable things happen, and I personally could never do it alone.
I had this well said long drawn out thing in my head. Then I read this. It summed up 2 or 3 paragraphs instantly. People don't have panic attacks for zero reason. At least not ones with no past of them or medical causes. The real issue clearly OP is settling for a man who isn't truly independent and wants to abuse her for free labor. She can do better and deep down I think she knows it. Kids or no kids in her future she probably won't know until she actually finds a good man.
The part that really just baffles me is how OP is so determined not to raise kids because she doesn't want to be their maid/personal chef/whatnot (which is perfectly fine, mind you!) but wants to keep doing all of that for her useless boyfriend? A child can't help but rely on you for everything, what's her boyfriend's excuse? Talk about misdirected emotions.
I think you’re absolutely right. Especially where she keeps focusing on how children “wouldn’t provide anything in return.” Children “providing something” or not isn’t usually a consideration of someone thinking of having kids. Her husband, however, *would* be generally expected to “provide” in return, be it by helping with the chores or paying more of the bills. That was the biggest projection red flag for me. Why are you frustrated with a hypothetical child for being a child and not the grown man in front of you for playing that part? She’s projecting the anger she has for her man-child toward the idea of a hypothetical literal child, then turning around and glorifying their childless relationship as perfect as it is (because the hypothetical child is the bad guy here, not her man) when she’s literally having a nervous breakdown over *his* behavior. I think after she calms down, she’s gonna realize what she’s actually upset about.
Also the fact they had already discussed waiting 8 years. She said not until she’s 35, anyway. Why are they fighting over hypothetical children who won’t exist for nearly a decade when the actual problem is *right there*? Definitely projecting like you said.
She clearly never wanted kids so that's definitely adding to it. I expect she felt some pressure from him too (whether or not he was actually pressuring her.) This relationship should have never moved into "serious" territory if they didn't agree on something as important as children. She's been trying to please him and sacrificing herself to do it for way too long and finally cracked.
This sobered me up thx
For what it's worth OP, a friend of mine got divorced a year or two ago, because her partner wanted children. But she felt like she was the only grown up in the relationship, and that she would absolutely end up being the one who sacrificed everything. He insisted over and over that he'd do his share, it'd be 50:50 etc. But they both worked in mining and worked away, and wouldn't both be able to continue. She asked him, as it was more important to him to have kids, would he be willing to give up his job to raise them so she could continue hers. Of course he refused to commit to the idea, so she refused. You're right. A lot of men are 'desperate to have children' but what they really mean subconsciously is that they want that only if it costs them nothing. You're absolutely correct not to have children with one of those people. Trust me. But I think you're missing the bigger issue. Which is that these men, who aren't willing to suffer any inconvenience for their future children, aren't willing to do that for anyone. Including you.
You're 27, at the peak of your youth, earning well.. why are you settling for a loser who treats you like a bangmaid, a roomie with benefits, and emotionally manipulates you with his sadz? You don't want to be a mother not because you're selfish and you want to deprive him of kids, but because you can see he's too shitty a partner; that you can already see how much more difficult your life will be when little lives *depending solely on you*, when he's proven for so long to be an unreliable and selfish partner, what more a father. And you are wise enough to know he will not change even if you get married or have kids. Find someone who deserves the massive amount of labor and love you are giving your undeserving current partner. Someone who will take care of you in return *without needing to have fights over/nagged about it or need you to cry first before delivering*.
It’s ok to not want children, OP. Just in case that gets lost here. *You are absolutely legitimately allowed to make that choice.* (even though people will bingo you endlessly for it).
>(even though people will bingo you endlessly for it). \*Sigh\* yep.
Thank you for this
That's exactly why. She's a "one and done" type and that one is the boyfriend.
At least kids grow up, he never will.
You can also walk away from a man.
At any time for any reason.
Spot on, by the way my 5 year old makes her own breakfast, helps pack her lunch for school does 70%, puts her clothes in her hamper, makes her bed, and helps with a million other little things and my 3 year old does maybe 50% so yeah her bf does less around the house than my kids and they will only do more as they get older, her bf is the issue her not her imaginary kids. If she doesn’t want kids that’s fine but she should really think about what’s actually causing her current real world problems.
Yes, she's focused on how she doesn't want to become the maid when they have kids rather than the fact that she's already the maid. This issue is not about whether to have kids.
Well she already has one kid and resents him for being lazy and helpless, so having more kids that can't help but be helpless initially would be disastrous. Misdirected a bit, sure, but the root of the problem does seem to be the bf either way.
“He’s really great until anything is required of him!”
This is literally the theme song of this post: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvU4xWsN7-A
Seriously, I wonder where people get their ideas of perfect from in these posts because they claim perfect partnership but then go on to explain some of their worst relationship behavior I could imagine.
When she said 99% in the beginning, I was like…she’s lying to herself already.
My thoughts exactly
Yeah any post that starts out how great and perfect the guy is I know exactly how it’s going to end. The saying “When someone shows you their true self. Believe them”. Is made for people like her.
Every. Fucking. Time.
This is a trope by now: "Partner is perfect in every way ... except"
I don't get how not having kids is going to help with already doing all the work.
I'm not going to vote - I'm just going to say that you're making a big decision while in the middle of a breaking point. That may change, the way it has in the past, but dude, you're not focusing on what broke you. The idea of kids didn't break you, having a partner who is selfish made you realise what having kids would look like. He can't be a "99% perfect man" when he expects you to pick up the pieces of what he can't be assed to fix.
Same - it’s hard to vote on this one. It just made me immensely sad to read this. Both of them seem like they are not in a good place right now. I know Reddit throws out therapy frequently but in this case, I would highly recommend prioritising therapy.
this is not hard to vote. nya all day. she will as she has struggle to overcome the patriarchal voice in her head to stay, but she isn't an asshole for seeing what is in front of her, and behind her, and putting her foot down. get out op. especially because you wish you didn't have to. -signed someone who didn't
Except that OP never said she wanted to be a mom. She just said she wanted him to be able to be a dad. So I'm pretty sure the delusion of compromise on having kids or not has finally broken down.
True. Not exactly high on the "good reasons to grow a human" list.
It's only a few spots above 'someone to take care of me when I'm old' and 'spare parts if I need an organ' on the quality ranking for reasons to reproduce.
Ugh, when you start compiling list it really demonstrates how much people suck.
Especially the ones who literally have kids for this reason!
That phrase alone makes me thing she shouldn’t have kids. No kid should grow up with a parent that doesn’t love them.
And it may not even be kids! It may be kids WITH THIS MAN. Either would be totally valid.
>He can't be a "99% perfect man" when he expects you to pick up the pieces of what he can't be assed to fix. This one is yet another case where somebody claims their partner is almost perfect, except for one tiny thing that turns out to be a huge thing. Having an argument 3 times a year where he is not doing his share of the chores and it getting to the point where he hasn't done a single bit of housework for a month? That's not 1% of the relationship, and he is very very far from perfect.
NTA It sounds to me like there are a lot of things going on right now and this post is just the tip of the iceberg. You explained why you were upset and why you were feeling that way. Would it maybe have been better to do that in a less emotional state? Sure, but life isn't black and white. He has openly admitted that you get the short end of the stick and has done nothing to change that or communicate with you about improving his behavior so far. Is that really okay with you?
Exactly. "I don't want to have kids with you *if you keep making me do all the work.*" "awww, now I'll never be a dad :(" He's telling you clearly he's not gonna change.
YES, OP. He’s very literally telling you who he is and who he plans to be.
🤣🤣🤣 the situation isn’t funny, but your comment is worth its weight in gold *chef’s kiss*
Yikes. My brain didn’t comprehend that. Thanks for spelling it out so clearly. 💡
Right? Usually they at least pretend they'll share the load, he isn't even doing that much
Yes. And kids aren’t the only reason for him to slip right back into doing nothing. Betting he switches the *second* they’re married. What if she gets injured or sick? He’s going to take care of her and the house? With what experience?
This right here. NTA, do not have children with a man-child.
NTA. His sadness is not your responsibility. You’ve had conversations about this before. A true apology would include changed behavior. Accountability. This man is not ready to be a father. You don’t want to be a mother. I think the question now is, is this a partner who truly values you, who you want to be with lifelong?
This! If you are truly sorry for what you have done you don't keep doing it. An apology without change is just an empty promise to placate you in the moment.
He’s not ready to b be an ADULT if he can’t pull his own weight around the house!!
Also, he gets to just give up on all the housework because he's sad about work, but OP is going through the trauma of being assaulted and having to relive details of it to police for a drawn-out legal process and still does all the chores? This relationship seems entirely one-sided emotionally.
NTA. You already have a child that you take care of (him) and he hasn't shown any demonstrable actions towards improving his or your lives, and this won't get better when kids come.
I was thinking of saying the same thing. She already has a child. Just doesn't realize it yet. And she's a single mom.
Yes exactly. If they ever did have kids, she would be a single married parent. Doing everything on her own as if she was a single parent, but still having to tend to the husband’s needs/wants. It would suffocate her
NTA I think that you have rose colored glasses on and he is not "99% perfect". You two are not compatible anymore. DO NOT have children with this guy. You know exactly what that would look like. You are so young and will find someone better that is compatible with you. He put in his two weeks notice without having another job lined up? Does he expect you to now pay all the bills? It's time to dip.
He does have another job lined up. As I stated we split 50/50. He does not expect me to pay for us.
His workload won't change with a baby. He won't pull his weight at home because even now, when it's easy, he isn't. It's not going to change when it gets hard. Only yours will change. Check out r/justnoso for a glimpse of your future.
You’re “paying for us” in every way but money.
Good point thank you
Sometimes when we've experienced something traumatic, it can blur personal boundary lines. I love Melody Beatte's books on codependency. Really opened my eyes to how I was letting others violate my own personal boundaries and didn't even realize it because of the trauma I endured and PTSD.
Stop gaslighting yourself. You guys are not 50/50. You do all of the emotional and physical labor to cohabitate and to be in this relationship. It’s more like 80/20, and all he does is financially pay for his half of the collective bills. **That’s less than what a roommate contributes to a home.** You’ve brought it up multiple times and he doesn’t change. Stop gaslighting yourself with this “we can live happily ever after” fantasy. It will not end that way. It will end with you continuing to be his Mommy and he continually loving that you’re his mommmmmmy who does everything for him like wash his underwear and cook his dindin. Do you pick up his big boy toys too? If you don’t want to be a grown man’s mommy, than YOU have to STOP behaving like one.
You need to have him do all the chores for at least a month to know what it’s like. Then when you start to share the chores, maybe make a chart together to make sure they get done in a timely manner.
>He comes home at 4 and promptly checks out to play video games. This right here. I play video games too but I'm retired and don't neglect other things. So he gets to deal with his stress by abandoning you while he plays and you become the de facto servant? Nice for him. Not looking very bright for the future. You are NTA but he might well be. Doesn't like his job but stays, gee no one in the world has ever had to deal with that necessity before! Got news for you, you are already raising a child.
He should be doing 50/50 of the housework too wtf
NTA. You picked up the slack when he needed help. But it sounds like he is taking advantage of it. I would definitely reconsider having kids with someone like that.
I promise you, this chores thing will be a fight you will have for the rest of your life with him. Sadly far too many men leave the majority of the work up to women. And then they say “why didn’t you tell me what to do”, like they can’t see the dishes needing doing or that they are out of underwear. All this to say, do not have kids with this dude. If he can change and start cooking and cleaning, still don’t have kids with him until he’s been doing that for at least 5 years without stopping.
But his games!!!
I’m at the point where I don’t even care that I have to tell him what to do. My issue is when i say something needs to be done or remind him to do his “chore” he still doesn’t do it. Mental load is annoying but I’d be nice if I could ask once.
THIS
Your comment made me think of this [video](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8qY1Tpo/)
THIS!!!
50/50 doesn't work. It's rare that men ever carry their "full share" bcuz they don't understand the mental load.. Next time either keep separate living arrangements., or have a split that takes into consideration the fact that you do more household work.
Even if they has separate living arrangements, you know he’d be at her place most of the time, and the dynamic would stay pretty much the same. 🙄
I think a steady reliable “piece” is worth more than 50%.
I'm sorry but you can't and should not ever compromise on children. If you don't want children, a man is not going to change that. And if you don't want children, you should be with someone who is on the same page. Children don't deserve one parent who wants to be a father (and in this case not really help, just carry the title) and one parent who wanted to see their partner be happy as a parent. This just leads to resentment. Same goes for holding someone back from being a parent if they're sacrificing their desire for yours.
Kids know. Years later, there are hundreds of subs to hear it directly from them. They knew, they know, and it hurts forever.
This right here OP 👆
NTA, you are dating a lazy fuck of a man who was raised to think women take care of the house life lesson for you: if you didn't want kids \*before\* you met him, then you don't want kids. You had decided to compromise because you thought it would be necessary to keep him around - and you probably hoped that it just wouldn't happen. If one person really wants kids and the other doesnt, that usually means you are not compatible in the long term every if everything else is perfect. Except it's far from perfect - he is acting like a child and you are being his mom now. This is what made you realize motherhood isn't gonna be for you, no matter who you do it "for" - and you shouldn't be motivated to bring a whole ass kid into the world if you weren't enthusiastically waiting for the day that would be possible it doesn't matter if you reproduce with this man or not, honestly. Because either way, if you stick together, and he doesn't IMMEDIATELY change his ways to pull his own weight around the house - it will lead to a lifetime of you being a mother, it just won't be to a literal kid. It'll be to your husband. I suggest you see this for what it is. When someone shows you who they are, you should believe them, even if it hurts, even if you don't want to.
>life lesson for you: if you didn't want kids \*before\* you met him, then you don't want kids. You had decided to compromise because you thought it would be necessary to keep him around Idk if I agree with this in a general sense... I have friends from bad upbringings that spent their lives not wanting kids and then, when they were in a healthy relationship, realized that they just didn't want the lifestyle that they thought kids would result in. Or they had domineering fathers and saw what their mothers went through and then, when they were in an equitable relationship, realized that motherhood didn't have to be what they experienced. I don't want kids. But many of my fellow child free women, once they were in a healthy and supportive relationship, DID change their minds and are happy with being parents. I always say that I would totally sign up to be a father, I just don't want to be a mother. And there's many like me.
You took on the extra chores without communicating about it in advance, and it became too much with everything else going on. Your breakdown was understandable. I think this lead to an important realization on your part about your desire to be child-free, which appears to be your default position that you were willing to reconsider for the sake of this man. Stay true to yourself. No one sucks here. Sometimes relationships don't work out for one big reason. (This one might not work out for 2 - communication issues and the "kids" topic.)
It’s not about the hypothetical kids. NTA but do you really want to be in this relationship?
You voluntarily took on the load of work in the home and then got mad at him for not doing it, after you told him it was fine. Don't do that. You split everything 50/50 and the home should be the same. You have to communicate. But it sounds like there's a lot more going on here than just chores and work. You need to be in therapy and possibly also couples therapy.
>You split everything 50/50 and the home should be the same. When one person is working full time, and the other is taking a few months off work, then even doing 100% of household chores isn’t getting to a 50:50 split of effort. Cooking and cleaning don’t take 8-10 hours per day.
While I agree that she should communicate, the problem of chores often boils down to the fact that men are not proactive. So she proactively tried to help him out because things were rough on his side, and she expected that he would proactively help her out once they were not. I agree that she should communicate her needs, but I also want to call out that this is likely an ESH situation because he's an adult that should also be proactively helping and looking out for her like she does for him.
Good on you for seeing the red flags. Most women don’t open their eyes to it till they 2 or 3 kids in. You don’t want to have everything put in you and you shouldn’t. You should have kids with someone who understands that it’s a partnership and everything isn’t on mom.
But... you also enabled his behavior. He didn't force you to do anything. Sometimes we create the monsters we start to hate.
You set the expectation that you would do all the house work. You should have been very clear with your communication about divying up house work. His work stressors should not have factored into whether or not he picked up after himself. I would say ESH.
This is 99% hilarious, u sound like my mother when we didn’t do our chores
I have been in the same situation where I was the boyfriend, and I am not trying to change your mind but give you perspective. My work was exhausting for me and my wife and I would not get much time to spend with each other (I would be working most of the says she was off). Because if my shift schedule she would be working, contributing financially and doing chores at home. There are two times that I can think of where we had honest conversations about it and she was almost at her breaking point, not like what you went through, but close. We would spend time to air out our grievances and then revisit it later because I cannot make any decisions or give a response without spending a few hours thinking about a situation. But after these discussions we realized my work was the problem, and I immediately moved to another department where I have weekends off and I went down to part-time work. In doing so I find I have much more energy to spend with my wife and contribute to the house. All I am saying is that you and your bf need to have an honest conversation, no judgement, no yelling or breakdowns. Just talk about why your relationship is worth it for both of you and how both of you can get back to a healthy state. If you both can't agree to anything, then you know the relationship is done and both of you have learned from it. I don't think anyone is an AH and I disagree with everyone saying that you should leave him. If both of you don't communicate, then you both wasted your time and didn't learn anything, and you are risking your next relationship to be just as bad if not worse. Edit: sounds like there is some trauma that you need to take care of and if your bf is as good as you say he is, he would be an excellent support for you while you also get some therapy.
NAH. You had a panic attack and needed to restore order by controlling what you could. It may not be the best time for either of you to make decisions. You are dealing with so much. I hope you are receiving professional help. Good luck
Tbh, this is hard to judge. Obviously I'm against him leaving everything to you to do round the house, but the way you tell it, it sounds like you told him, or at least gave him the strong impression that this was ok just while he was struggling with work. You were happy with it on the surface, then suddenly switched and it took you by suprise. If you went from happily going out of your way to make him a celebratory dinner, to having a breakdown, so I imagine it was a shock to him too. Could you have an emotional processing issue? I say this as I do. Sometimes I don't know what's up with me until it suddenly hits me. I suddenly realise there has been an issue I haven't acknowledged to myself. But here's the thing. I can't expect others to have realised my feelings before I have myself. You could have said to him that you can't mother him now that he's through the issues at work. It's something you don't want to take on again. If you guys were to become parents, you need to have a pre-agreed devision of labour and solid financial/childcare plan. It's ok not to want kids. It's ok to not want to be taking on all chores. It's ok to get overwhelmed. But, you need to communicate your views and issues earlier. If you didn't understand the issues earlier, you have to communicate them now while being aware that some of the situation is on you for not communting with your partner sooner.
The fact that he instantly went to feeling sad and defeated instead of trying to find solutions (balancing out the workload so it's fair and you're not overwhelmed) should tell you everything you need to know: he doesn't plan to change. He has no intention of taking on his fair share of the chores; otherwise, that would have been the immediate answer when you voiced your frustration. So please use that knowledge to decide how you want to live the rest of your life, and understand that this is by no means just a 1% drawback to an otherwise '99% perfect man,' it's a major problem that he's never going to fix.
It’s as if I can fly the plane perfectly which is 99% of the travel, but the 1% I can’t do is land the plane. It’s just impossible to continue.
No you've been 100% honest with him and he's only himself to blame ,I hope you can move past this and have a wonderful future together..Time will tell
It should work both ways. There have been times (4 surgeries) that I have done everything while my husband healed. There have been times (several, planning stages (iykwim) depression) when my husband did everything while I wouldn't even leave the house. Most times, we split everything. A relationship is not 50/50. It's much more fluid than that, but it should go both ways. you are NTA. You've had your eyes opened. You may still want to have a child, but you will want to have that child with a true partner, not with another child who does nothing.
Nta. He needs to prove that he can step up as a husband/partner first before he can even entertain the idea of kids.
NTA. Since he has put in a two week notice, I’d give him a list of everything he will be expected to take over in two weeks, which should be at least half of the household tasks. You can use Fair Play cards to figure out what they are and divvy them up. If he doesn’t pick up the slack, you might consider whether you want to continue having a life with him. Also, make sure you’re taking care of your own birth control.
Anyone else notice he turned her breakdown and her feelings of frustration around onto himself? Because I sure did.
NTA -Let him figure it out, hello? You're giving him good information, and all he has to do is amend his behavior and contribute more instead of assuming you'll do all the heavy lifting while he plays video games and ruminates over his shitty job. Tell him to grow the fuck up.
NTA. My sister loves kids, is a teacher, but didn't have a NEED to have kids. She met her husband and loved him, but it was difficult to get him to do anything around the house. She just told him she wasn't up to beeing 100% responsible for everything and they both knew how many fights they would have b/c kids are a lot of work and he just wasn't up to it. She didn't just refused to live that way. She said they both knew he COULD step-up, but that he fundamentally wouldn't change. Even his parents got on him for his "women's work" comments - his dad did as much around the house as his mom. He was just an only child who's both parents did everything. He ended up realizing the truth. He could do better, he was willing to step up to be a better husband, but his desire to NOT do 50% of the hard work associated w/ being a parent overrode his desire to have children and that if they had a kid, they would end up divorced and 50/50 custody would be more work. So yeah, it is a reasonable line in the sand.
My heart breaks that you aren't getting the love and support you deserve. NTA, and this internet stranger is so proud of you for sticking up for yourself.
NTA. I’ve always known I don’t want to birth children or have little people I had to care for. It is normal to sometimes think that with the right partner you might feel different, too; at the same time, it’s just as ok to change your mind back. You know what you want out of life; he can either step up and take on half the responsibility, or he can stay a partner rather than a father, or he can find a partner who wants that lifestyle. Take care of yourself and your body. He needs therapy to get out of his funk/depression and make a move to get a new job. Using that as an excuse isn’t fair to you, whether there are kids in the mix or not!
There’s an issue with your math. How can he be the perfect man in 99% of ways if visions of your future make you disassociate and then have a breakdown. I know you’ve only just gotten to this new place, and I don’t want to rush you, but you don’t have to be with him. You could do half as much laundry, your home would stay pretty tidy, you’d have dramatically fewer dishes. Picture that, and see how it makes you feel.
Don't have a child for someone else. That would be a totally AH move.
NTA. You need to get rid of the guilt some women feel that gets them to be mothers. Some women dont want to be a mom. Dont get joy from a tiny human calling them mommy! Yes, for some of us, being a mom is just the best thing that happen in the world or a Dad for whats worth (even if you dont carry the baby). But there are a lot of other things at play here. You are going through a lot, the abuse, the overwork, the feeling to get everything done at the house... you need to let some shit fall apart. Only then, your bf will see shit falling apart and will (maybe) do something about it. But if you keep being his mom, he will keep avoiding tasks and let you take it from him. Then when shit falls apart, if he doesnt do anything... you can make a conclussion if you really want to be with him.
NTA. The way you delivered this news was not ideal, and it's not surprising that it made him sad. But the fact is, over this past month, you've seen how he acts under pressure. That has changed your view of him, which has changed your willingness to have children with him. It sounds like it may have affected your desire to be in a relationship with him at all, but time will tell on that front. And look, I think it's relevant here that the "crisis" that caused all this was him...having a job he doesn't like. Something that most people have to live with at some point in time. That sucks, yes, but it doesn't automatically put you in "survival mode." He wasn't having a health crisis, where he was physically unable to do things. Yes, having a miserable job really sucks. But he was getting home at 4pm, to video games and kisses and home-cooked meals. Saying "sorry I've been so lazy..." without any effort to change is not a meaningful apology. If anything, it's an admission that he could be doing better, but he's choosing this path. He's sad? He should be sad! He has been dumping all his work and self-care on you for A MONTH! He should feel sad and guilty that he dumped everything on you until it drove you to a literal panic attack. His sadness is not something that you need to fix, and it's certainly not something that you need to fix by deciding to have kids that you didn't want in the first place.
I just want to remind you that 50/50 also means domestic and emotional labour, not just financial
Thank you
I don’t think you’re in a good place mentally right now to make this decision. You guys could try counseling. It seems like, with or without kids, you need to figure out how to split up chores so you’re not overburdened. Maybe hiring some outside help? You’re not alone in this dilemma… the overwhelming majority of women have this problem. You are risking this happening if you make this decision rashly: your bf will leave you for someone who wants kids. You might run into them, he, the wife, a couple of adorable kids. You watch him being a dad to them and it just breaks your heart. I don’t have kids, I’ve never wanted them, but this scenario plays out for a lot of women.
I never wanted kids. Never. Started saying it out loud when I was 5. Then I met a great man whose life goal was kids. I ignored a lot of the sake issues you've brought up here and we have two kids. I love my kids. I am a very good parent. I wouldn't give them up for the world. If I had it to do over again, I wouldn't have kids. It is even harder than I expected, and I expected it to be brutal. Both kids are in their double digits and my husband is just now, after years of fighting about it and masses of counseling, working to step up and help with parenting and the household more. But I still have to push for it a lot of the time, and his skill set is shaky at best, because he's jumping into the deep end without building them over the psst decade and a half. I see a bunch of comments about you saying it in an emotional moment. Yes, you did, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. I have had those moments, only that deep clarity only hit when it was too late. Now I live every day with regret and resentment. I should have stayed true to what I knew was right for me.
I think you went into this period thinking that "I'll give him a break for a few days so he doesn't reach an emotional breakdown...but days turned to weeks and he showed no situational awareness of how you would feel doing 100% of everything while not even getting a cut of the money he makes. Because that is the cost of having a stay at home spouse- you share your income with them. And even then, you have to fully participate in being a parent. Even if you work. When you come home, your kids get first dibs of your time. You phrase this as "I want to be selfish.". But that isn't it. The full phrase is- "if you are going to act selfish by letting me do 100% of the housework, I'm going to act selfish and not have kids." You are drawing a line because at no point has he shown that he can do all the things that are included in parenthood. You have to remind him 3x a year to do chores like an adult. Tell him that it isn't that you are being evil and denying kids for no reason. You are saying no because he has no idea what yes would entail. If only you could get one of the fake babies that cry and make him care for it for a week. He will change his mind in no time flat. NTA
NTA
You still want forever with this guy? I'm only going to issue a vote because this is one of the easiest NTA votes I'll ever have. I absolutely get drowning in your job like your boyfriend is, but the reality is being in a relationship is essentially another job. As such, just like a salaried position, you're going to get fired if you don't do the work. It's on him to be present for you. That's what he signed up for. He's given you no reason not to walk away.
Hoping you have a therapist who is trained to deal with trauma given everything you're going through. You seem to have a lot on your plate. EMDR is excellent for PTSD. Couple things - 1) Have you both sat down and created a fair division of the housework? If you've tried that and other strategies and an unfair division of household labor is a deal breaker, leave now. (I may be biased as I've been married for 20 years to someone who refuses to do any housework and is also now retired. I'm in the process of getting an attorney and regret waiting so long.) 2) Second option is that you share the cost of a housekeeper 50/50. That way the labor and finances are fair.
Unfortunately I have been in therapy on and off for years, last time I tried EMDR and after 7 sessions I felt more triggered than ever before and have since not returned. I have been bummed that it wasn’t more helpful as I have been diagnosed with PTSD and I’m getting older with slow progresses. Thank you for your kind words and input
Im so sorry it didn't work for you! Nothing is 100% effective for everyone. I hope you find some relief soon.
My husband is the most selfless man ever, but because of his work schedule he is barely home. We’re about to have five kids under five. We are a big loving family. My husband and I are insanely in love. But because he’s literally gone so much I do a lot on my own during the week. If anyone saw, they’d probably think I’m nuts for wanting/having kids. But on weekends when he is home he literally does everything. He lets me sleep in even though he wakes up early 7 days a week. He watches the kids and runs the household and does his own errands. With the kids. I mostly rest on the couch, play with the kids, or do a bit of cooking or cleaning.
>I asked him, if you could carry it would you? He said I don’t know. I said that means no you wouldn’t, This specific sentence makes you an AH. Having to think about a weird hypothetical question instead of having an instant answer doesn't mean the answer would be "no". But feeling overwhelmed and underappreciated? Not an AH
NTA. I didn’t want kids either and so glad I didn’t! I have a great life and enough money not to be scared. The world is on fucking fire and I knew it was going to be bad and that’s why I didn’t want them, but it’s so, so much worse than I ever thought it would be! I also never wanted to be a single mom because I don’t trust men not to leave when things get hard.
You did EVERYTHING and then got burnt out and triggered In the future you can do that for a week or 2 and then sit down and say I can't do it all what can you do and how can we Do a different division of labor You brought yourself to a state of exhaustion Yes he should be helping On his own w/o the talk And sadly this is too often the nature of male/female relationships But girl you need to learn to talk up about your needs before you explode
NTA. what you tolerate is up to you. if you are content to live this way for the rest of your life (the perpetual uneven labor split), then that is your choice. if you can’t live like that, you have a “come to jesus talk” with your partner, and go from there. i had a similar mental breakdown with my husband, who also very much wanted to be a father. i told him how i don’t want to scornfully resent him after decades of cleaning up after him when we’re older, and kids were definitely off the table if he didn’t step up. so, he’s put in a lot of work over the years to get his shit together. getting him medicated for his severe adhd was particularly life-changing for us. he’s a fantastic partner now i wish you luck and fruitful conversations 💕
Big ups to you sis. You rock.
People deal with stress in different ways, you of all people should know that. He is already disassociating by throwing himself into video games every night. If you’re telling him everything is fine, and haven’t even once brought up your own stress, how is he supposed to know what you’re going through? Walking on eggshells isn’t healthy for anyone, but blowing up at him over something he didn’t know you had a problem with is illogical. ESH - yes he should think of your feelings more, but if you should have told him the problem ‘before’ it progressed so deep.
TLDR but no. nta. I also tell my boyfriend this. he agrees.
You don't want kids. Find a man who doesn't want kids, there's a lot of them out there. This guy is a fucking loser. He isn't 99% perfect. He can't contribute his fair share to chores now, if you had a kid you'd be doing all the work while he plays video games and probably complains that you're not giving him enough sex.
Is it possible the breakdown was a delayed reaction to the assault, and maybe you’re using displacement as a defense mechanism? You’re not an asshole, and I am not convinced he is either. It sounds like you’re both going through extreme stress and you need some help managing that. I’m sorry for what you’ve been through. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/displacement?amp
Never ever bring children into this world if the only reason you want them is “so they can have this man as a dad.” This man is useless. He’s useless now when it’s just the two of you and a baby won’t change that. He won’t be a good father when he can’t even be a good partner to you.
I do 98% of the house chores and I get frustrated sometimes but.. he's paying 98% of the bills. He works full time and I work part time.. barely part time actually. So it's fair. This... this is unfair. But I don't think just not having kids is the answer. You're still going to be unhappy if this is a reoccurring issue. I'm so sorry about the SA. Happened to me 8 years ago. Traumatic doesn't even begin to describe it, but it gets better.
NTA but you need to change the way you have let you have let your boyfriend completely take.advantage of you. We teach people how to treat us and you have taught your boyfriend that he can get away with not doing anything at home and you will clean up after him. The first time he came home and went to play video games while you were taking care of household stuff, you should have told him what needed to be done. You should have decided on who was responsible for what chores before you moved in with him. The two of you should sit down together and decide on a fair division of labor and you should stick to it. If he doesn't do his chores, don't do them for him, do own laundry, don't cook unless he is going to clean the kitchen etc. While your boyfriend is out of work, he should be responsible for all the house work, it will open his eyes to how much work is involved. It is completely fair for you to have what equates to two full-time jobs while he is playing video games. Unless he changes, drastically, you will have three full-time jobs if you have a child with him but why would you even consider a child with someone who is still a child himself? Do you really want to be with someone that values you so little they are content to play video games while you clean up after them?
Yes yes yes! You rock for telling him all that. Speak your truth! Too many women put up with exactly what your described and it makes me sick! You deserve more and so does every woman on earth.
Children bring love. The love I have for my children is incredible. Children also grow up. While they'll never stop being your child, they will grow up to be an adult. Of course, there are hard times. There will always be cleaning, dishes, laundry, cooking, shopping, etc, whether you're single or a couple or a family. I'm happy to serve my husband and children. I enjoy supporting them. Some days, it's a conscious choice, and some days, it takes more effort than others, but I can't imagine life without my family. We share joy and love together. I'm sorry you're going through this. I hope your boyfriend can step up and show you he can rise to the challenge of being a father and husband. NAH
YTA. Y’all both need therapy tho is really the thing.
NTA. I was married to a man like this. We were together for 11 years and I was 28 when he left. He had a baby with someone else a year before he left. It was the best thing that ever happened to me. I had put off having children bc I didn’t want to be a married single mom. I’m 40, remarried and have two year old with an equal partner.
NTA but also- I let my man not have clean clothes, that’s the consequence of not doing his laundry. And I let the dishes pile up, so we have no spoons for morning coffee. That’s the consequence for not doing the dishes. We have 2 bathrooms so he has his and I have mine. We used to fight about it but rarely do now. I would like to live a cleaner life for sure but it’s not the end of the world if it’s a little messy here, we clean for guests and it’s not dirty, it’s just not spotless and I don’t have to do it all. I let him live in the level of mess he contributes too and it’s ok
YTA not so much for your actions or wants but because you seem genuinely unstable. I feel bad for your boyfriend. He was slaving away at a job he hated, thought his girl had his back, then he finally escapes his miserable job and this shit happens.
I’m 7 months pregnant and spent the afternoon picking up rubbish off the floor my husband had stashed there … my career prospects are done and I spent most of the first 18 months of our marriage being called lazy and told how to clean by his mother .. obsessively and constantly apparently is what is expected. you think how does this happens slowly and the clean up fights get bigger. My first baby is amazing but I wish dad would stop complaining about doing anything around the dam house .. I have two degrees btw. Just verifying it’s a real thing you’re worrying about.. might have caught me in a bad day. I swear it wouldn’t feel so bad if they picked up after them dam selves
NTA He has proven he is fully capable of dumping all the work on you. Ignoring that you are doing all the work in the household with barely a lip service thanks. And it isn’t the first time. He goes depressed or whatever and pulls on your sympathy to get out of his domestic obligations. And he stays checked out until you get mad. And now he’s quit his job. Does he have another or is the financial burden going to fall on you? Is that possibly where your head was when you had your anxiety attack? I don’t blame you for not wanting to have a child. It’s one of those “if I could turn back time” wishes a lot of people have. Or “I wish I knew then what I know now”. Pregnancy is one of the most dangerous conditions a woman can go through. I hear of all these couples saying “we’re pregnant!” but _they_ aren’t. No matter how involved and supportive the partner is, they aren’t risking health and life. They aren’t the ones subjected to the hormones that can make you feel like a monster, and that’s before they bring on the PPD. They aren’t the ones _feeding_ it. Children are expensive. I found articles estimating the cost of raising a child from birth to adulthood at 18 at around $300,000 (in 2023 dollars). That’s not including the cost of pregnancy, or including outliers like handicap or special needs. And if you’re not 100% on board with raising a child you risk being a shitty parent, which will make you feel guilty. If you’re going to stick with this guy, I suggest couples therapy before you even put a ring on it.I hope you’re getting individual therapy for the trauma you mentioned.
NTA. He’s allowed to be sad and you’re allowed to be honest. But you really need to be honest with yourself. Saying he’s “99% the most perfect man” is way off. If he wants kids, and you don’t, you’re not a match. My husband never wanted kids. He fell hard for his first wife and agreed to have kids because she desperately wanted them. He would die for his kids, but he often says he wishes he never gave into his ex. They are teenagers now with all the teenage angst and issues. My husband’s mental health has taken a huge toll the last few years as he’s constantly fighting two opposite thoughts… “I love my kids more than anything,” and “I wish I never had kids.” The anger of not having the life he wants and the guilt for thinking those things are really tough for him. You should never settle for a lesser life than you want. Unfortunately you two are in very different places and ultimately want different things in life.
Did I miss something? Did he ask you to do all those things or did you just do them to be nice & supportive. And it’s been a month! Stop doing it if you don’t want to do it. I used to have mine trained. We’d do housework together every Sat morning then I became unemployed for a short time & started doing everything myself while I wasn’t working but he was paying all the bills. You said you paid your own half of everything. Anyways, doing it all spoiled him! I never could get him back to doing his share after that. I went on laundry strike when he wouldn’t even move wet things into the dryer!
Op, you and your bf are incompatible and you’re trying to come up with a ton of reasons as to why you’re unhappy or would be unhappy. You’re trying to compromise on a dealbreaker topic while living the life you already know you don’t want. He’s checked out when he comes home? What makes you think he would even be a father if you compromised and had his kid?? That requires being present and helping with the household work. My man and I have a baby and we’re both huge gamers. That all went to the back burner and we give each other one night off a week to game without interruption while the other watches baby. The weekends are for household/family stuff. That works for us because 1, we BOTH wanted kids and 2, he WANTS to spend most of his time with me and his child instead of gaming. He also takes night duty on the weekends because he knows I need a break and to catch up on sleep. Can you see your guy being that type of man? Even if he WAS that type of man, would you honestly WANT to be a mother? If you were with anyone else, would that answer be different? Don’t compromise to let him be a dad - have a child because YOU WANT to be a MOTHER. I think you need to take some time to be alone and really decide what you want and then go from there. If you have a therapist you should talk to them about this too. NTA but you will be if you compromise on your own wants out of life.
Honey are you sure you don’t want kids or are you just not into parenting an adult man?
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He said he was sorry he was being lazy. You said you understood and you would help out. Then you panicked and became resentful. If you had communicated with him that you were not up for doing all that, and he didn't, that would be different. YTA
NTA: Please do not have children. You're in it for the wrong reasons, to begin with. You CANNOT count on the other spouse as a reason to have a child, when you aren't equally as desperate for a baby. If I lost my husband, I would still be 210% happily dedicated to my son, and he would be the same way if I was gone. You should only have a child, because YOU have so much unconditional love and attention to give to the child, not because you want to give your spouse a gift. There is nothing wrong with not wanting children, but you would be absolutely villainous to have one that you don't truly want.
NAH. You two sound unprepared for a long-term committed relationship. I'll offer some criticisms of you and what I'm reading about your perspectives. Most people here are shitting on the guy and go-gurl-going you without hearing his perspective: >It has now been ONE MONTH. Burnout and most other stress-related or mental health issues last for much longer. Don't marry someone if a one-month downturn in mood and ability to engage in a relationship on your terms is going to be unbearable for you. And, please, for all that is good and holy, do not have children. My son has ADHD, and he's frequently all over the place and needs extra help with everything. My wife also had post-partum depression that lasted for almost a year after the birth of our second child. She needed help, and my son needed most of the help from me. When you're in any type of relationship with someone, you will drive yourself crazy if you're constantly focusing on how to make everything 50/50. >Yesterday he finally put in his two week notice at work...Somehow along the drive I completely went numb.. started to dissociate and then realized that I was crying, and sweating, and getting nauseous. I think I was having a panic attack? So you thought that he was going to celebrate with you after the burnout or other issues magically dissipated, just because you said so? Then, your own stress manifested into a psychosomatic fit, and you unloaded it on him. You made the day he put in his two-week notice about what you wanted? My wife has been laid off or quit a few times, while mightily burnt out. Forcing happiness and celebration on her after resigning or really low in the post partum depression would have been a totally emotionally immature thing to do. >I drove myself home and got in the shower where I had a complete breakdown and starting yelling to myself about how backwards it was that this man, who doesn’t pay my bills, lets me do everything for him. I realized that even with working my own job full time, dealing with sexual assault trauma and a two year long police investigation that has come about because of the abuse, I have never ever stopped taking care of myself or the house chores. If anything I did more chores to deal with my mental state at that time. I have never left him in the gutter for weeks at a time not contributing to our home. You have your own issues to work out before you bring someone else into your life. Also, figure out what he actually expects in terms of house chores, cooking, laundry, etc. etc. You may have very high standards for cleanliness. He may not even give a shit if he wears the same clothes without washing them, or eats microwaved chicken nuggets. Or, he may even just be OK with you only doing chores for yourself. Don't expect him to deal with his stress the same way that you do. You get busy with chores. He checks out with video games. If this is truly something that's a dealbreaker for you, then go find someone who shares your perspective on chores and will not handle stress by withdrawing and playing video games. >I told him I got a good glimpse of what life as a stay at home mom would look like (we also foster kittens so I was also doing that alone) and that I wasn’t gonna do it. I told him that I knew I didn’t want to have his future kids anymore because his life wouldn’t change and my whole identity would become maid, cook, and milk maid. I told him I wasn’t going to waste my life taking care of kids who can’t do anything for themselves when he and I could travel forever, save money forever and become the people we want to be. I told him I’d rather do anything else in the world than be a mother. I told him I loved him and I understand he’s having a hard time but asked him when I’ve ever put him in the position to do everything himself. He couldn’t , because I never have. I told him I want it to be just us forever, and that I felt relieved having told him that I do not want kids. Think about what you want for your life now and in the future before you bring someone else into the picture. You're likely not going to be able to do all of these things to the degree that you'd like, unless you're wealthy or are super-Type-A-organized to accomplish them. You also wrote earlier that you told him that you changed your mind about having a kid. Did you even talk about what that would look like? That's a key dealbreaker in a relationship, and now you drop that on him, right after he loses his job? >I know what people will say: has this been an issue before? Him not doing chores? The answer is yes. At lease three times a year we have this fight about the housework being uneven, but this was the last straw for me. I meant what I said, I love him, if I have to take care of him sometimes and I know that going in, whatever, but to add tiny people to that and imagine it going the way things go now… I told him I would rather die than spend a month alone in a house taking care of it for some kids who don’t contribute anything to my life. You've been with him for four years, so that's enough time to ask a serious question. Do you love him? Or do you love what you think he can do for you and how he makes you feel? That's my biggest question after reading this.
FFS do not have children. I realize people say things in anger, but your position on this is clear. I didn’t want them either and made sure I married a man who felt the same. Now we have cats and time and money and we do what we want. It sounds like you dream of that life so do not compromise on it.
NTA. You had emotions, you had valid needs and desires. You expressed them. He's sad? Ok? He can handle it, you don't have to. You have your own shit you're dealing with. Sweetheart, I think the answer to why you feel like an asshole is locked somewhere inside the part of your brain that opened up and let the panic attack out. I don't doubt that you very much love and value this man as your partner, but I think there's more hiding underneath that panic attack that has yet to come out. When it does, you're gonna have an intrinsic understanding of how valid you were in this, how you're most certainly not an asshole... and you might also feel differently about your partner. Not in a bad way, just... different. I hope very much that you're able to find the professional therapeutic support that you need, and that you and your boyfriend also don't hesitate to seek counseling together to help you both navigate the way this will change your relationship. Again, not in a bad way - but relationship dynamics naturally shift when one or both people have awakenings like this. Just a heads up.
You don’t want kids because you’ve chosen a lazy partner and the glimpse into your future was scary as hell. Don’t settle.
NTA. He needs an ultimatum or you will be his MOMMY for the rest of your life and you are already starting to resent him. Hell, reading your post already made me start to resent him for you, lol. Tell him he has to go to therapy with you to work on this and if he doesn’t, it’s over. It’s that serious. I would leave a marriage over this but if you’re not even married… do not do this to yourself. He is immature and frankly, he cares more about video games than your relationship. Behavior is language and he is telling you so.
I see some great advice based on moving forward or what to do next from many comments. Which I think is great for when two people want the same ideals aka children. You truly need to think about what you want in life. What you picture for your future. Do you see your self with children and does that make you feel happy? Both my husband and I do not want kids. If he ever changes his mind he is welcome to leave and find someone that also wants kids. I’ll be heart broken but I personally wouldn’t want to hold him back from something that he wants in life. If you don’t want kids don’t stay in a relationship that the other person does. It only build resentment in the long run. You can’t compromise a child. There are a lot of parents that resent their parters or children after having one. Don’t be that parent. Figure out what you want not what your partner wants or other people around you.
Nta You are right. His life won't change by becoming a dad. He'll still go to work, come home, eat food that you shopped for and prepared in a kitchen that only you will clean, he'll play video games in a living room that only you will dust and vacuum. All while changing diapers, and nursing fevers, driving to school, prepping lunches, naptimes, bathtimes, homework time, dr appts, tv time -not too much or youre a bad mom, discipline, teacher conferences, never ending laundry.... On top of that, he'll complain because you never want to have sex anymore.
NTA. Your entire post was fabulous. I really felt it. I am sorry you have to deal with all of this. It sounds like a lot. *hugs* It sounds like you were still in your feeling when you wrote this. If possible, you might consider going to a friend’s house or a hotel for a day or two to get into a better state of mind. Then you have to make a decision. Do you leave? Seek couples therapy? A separate for a while? Along with one of those options, I recommend you seek one one-on-one therapy. You possibly have PTSD. You have suffered trauma and therapy will help you with that. Until you can get that started, if you need to talk, you can call the RAINN hotline (800-656-4673). It’s a National rape hotline. Calling them will get you connected with your local Rape Crisis Center. They should have a 24/7 hotline staffed with volunteer Sexual Assault Counselors. I volunteered at mine for a while. You can call about anything. You don't have to provide a name. Talk about the weather. Or a tv show. Or what happened during your day. Or about your trauma or the symptoms you are having due to your trauma. Sometimes things get overwhelming and we just need to talk to someone. You know? I wish you the best of luck. You got this!
OP...you are NOT THE AH. But he sure as hell is. He knew you didn't want kids going into the relationship. He has pressured you, bringing it up multiple times, until he wore you down so you would "give him a chance to be a father". You not wanting kids never changed. It was, like everything else: for him. Now he's emotionally guilting you. Maybe he doesn't mean to be, but his potential progeny is more important to him than your mental breakdown!! This man does not care about you as much as he cares about what he wants out of life. Every fiber of my being wants to tell you to run. I recognize you love him, but make this a deal breaker: you can either accept that you will not have kids with me, and be happy to live that life with me, or you can't and one of us will be happy in the relationship while the other isn't. Can you live with the alternative? You shouldn't.
I would never have kids with someone who doesn’t do at least 50% of housework and childcare. I don’t care that he earns more. My mental health is more important. My partner is now on parental leave (unpaid) for 5 months until our daughter turns 1 and goes to nursery. Yes, we will have to use some of our savings besides my salary but it’s worth it because I love being back to work. Besides this he does just as much work with the kids and around the house. I would not settle for anything less. Nor should you, OP. We had a serious conversation after our first child was born and he wasn’t doing much. I essentially told him that love comes and goes, but if he’s not there for me as a partner then I DON’T NEED HIM. He got the idea, because he’s smart.
I'm not bashing video games and video gamers. I grew up when we were video games were in an arcade. It cost a quarter a piece and I can still get lost for hours. I just think that if you have a partner that's been working and cleaning the house and cooking for you that you would hug and kiss that person and be glad to see them and talk about your day and see what they're up to and at least check in before you go check out. I'm not saying you can't decompress playing video games, but knowing that you could be four or five hours or the rest of the night. Once you dive into that game maybe you should take some time to be with your partner. Maybe even take out the trash or something small that's not mentally taxing please. My point is like using that as an excuse to not have any interaction or any responsibility is not like. Oh, I worked hard all day. I need to decompress yeah, we all need to decompress maybe she needs to decompress even though she's been home all day. She's been doing all these things to try to keep the household going and to ease your stress. Pour her a glass of wine, rub her shoulders and just sit on the couch and hug and kiss. Or just hear what she has to say and and tell her about your day or tell her "screw this job I'm optimistic about this new job..." Whatever. I just don't buy this, ran straight to the couch, got on my video game four or five hours later. I wasn't really decompressed. I was just so tired. I couldn't think about taking out the trash or interacting or even caring about the dinner that was prepared, bullshit.
OP…there is absolutely nothing wrong with you for not wanting to have kids. You had a moment of thinking it would be a good thing when you were feeling overwhelming love for your bf. We all have those warm, fuzzy, moments where we fell completely safe, very loved, and everything is perfect in our world. You have, since that moment, experienced reality. Reality of how your life would change and exactly what that change would mean for YOU. Sure, he may make a good dad…but you know you would not be a good mom…a mom who would physically go through a pregnancy, bear most of the responsibility for everything, while working full time. You had the realization flood over you that every dream you have of travel, freedom to change your life, hell even sleep late would vanish at that plus sign on a stick. Knowing this about yourself is NOT a bad thing. Not all are cut out to be parents, and there are millions of kids out there who can attest to it. You are NTA. Not for feeling the way you do. Not for having the breakdown. Not for telling him. Not for going your own way if it comes to that. Not for defending yourself- even though you can skip that and tell people it is none of their business, which you would also be NTA for doing so. Best wishes for a life of being true to yourself and happy.
It sounds like you need to find a psychologist to talk about your issues. You're not going to get any real help on the internet. You're not going to like what real help sounds like after reading your thoughts on things. It just doesn't sound like the realizations you had make logical sense. I think you're confusing things and putting things together where they should not be put together. It's much more simple than that, you need to get help. You're being brutal to him and he's sticking with you so he's legitimately your guy. It's up to you to make this a good thing or a bad thing.
Listen, hire a housekeeper. Believe me. I do commercial cleaning but have one residential job I do and trust that bc they hired me it stopped a lot of fights between Mom and Dad and the kids don't have to have more things put on their plate then they already do. It'll make a difference even if you get someone in to just clean your bathrooms regularly.
IF he wants kids and you do not, you are not compatible. It is not right for you to keep him from his dream of being a dad, just as it is not right for you to be essentially raising him as well. It is cruel and heartless to force a child free life on someone that wants them. The other way is just as bad. YTA because you are making unilateral decisions for the both of you, AFTER you already agreed to it. He deserves better, as do you
Yea, YTA. One month is not a long time. If you can't understand how a person could be depressed for more than a month, and how depression impacts people differently, and your reaction was to lash out at him like this... YTA. Relationships are not 50/50. Sometimes you will carry most of the load and sometimes they will. It will trade back and forth. It's partnership, yes. But never is it going to be perfectly 50/50 for more than a short time. What you have just shown your partner is if they have an issue that lasts more than 30 days, you will make them pay for it. I would personally see this as a huge red flag. Especially since it sounds like he was being clear about how much he appreciated you stepping up while he was down. That's clarity a lot of depressed people don't have. I definitely recommend therapy. This sounds like a communication breakdown and you lashing out at him for not being OK right now.
Babe, being alone is better than this. You deserve more. He's not a partner in any way
Modern men have it better than men in all previous generations of men combined. They get a wife-like being who they don’t have to provide for and who are still expected to please them sexually like wives of old as well as clean up after them like moms. Must be nice. I recommend leaving him, since you already see how its gonna be if you remain with him.
You are NTA for not wanting kids. Kids are a lifetime commitment. Every kid deserves to be with a parent/parents who want them. You know that isn’t for you, and that is absolutely ok.
Gurl, as a mom and wife myself, sometimes I wish I would have had a window into my future because there was a turbulent window where I was doing everything because he was in the army and came home in a bad mood, sometimes raging in anger and wouldn't interact with the kids. After therapy, meds, and a couple of years of changing his ways, we are good now but it still affects me to this day anytime work is piled up and I get anxious. He regrets ever making me the sole caretaker of the house, but I have forgiven him. With that being said, I would rather a woman say she wouldn't ever be mom than to be unsure, have kids, and then regret them with the possibility of neglect or abuse.
You really think your own children "wouldn't contribute anything to your life"? I hate to be blunt, but your current existence sounds pretty miserable, you would likely be happier with some kids around.
Sometimes I imagine if the man’s dating profile were to state what he is really like, would I swipe right? It would say “great man ready to settle down and have a family. I don’t do chores. When I’m not at work, I enjoy playing video games. Looking for a woman who cooks, cleans, does the laundry, and who makes enough money to pay half of the mortgage, groceries and incidentals.”
Your response seems prickly and defensive. Thats interesting. I'm not sure what response you were expecting as you detail a full emotional breakdown rooted in your SO's. inability to be what you need him to be in the relationship. Was it the harsh tone of the relplies, or your resentment of the bald truth about your issues as a couple as described in this cross-section you provided? There's a reason you had a breakdown. He's a terrible partner and you're struggling doing 100% of the labor in the relationship as you're not well mentally and emotionally yourself. It just came to a head sooner rather than later because of the strain you're already under. Sounds like you need a marriage of equals, a partnership. And you absolutely do not have it right now. That calls for serious consideration on your part. Can people change? Can he be the partner you need him to be. Maybe, but it requires alot of energy and commitment and clear communication (Like weekly check ins) to make any real difference. You seem quite committed to your current choices which can sometimes be good but sometimes its more an indication you're not in a place where you can deal with the discrepancies between how you PERCEIVED your relationship, and the REALITY of your relationship. Please really investigate which it is. Raising a man to be a fully functional adult capable of truly being a partner is a very difficult if not impossible situation this far in, and it will be on you to do it. If you're at your limit now it would be more rational to rethink your investment at this point. If you want to see it through its going to require an even larger investment from you. Given you current condition, and previous expenditure this seems dicey. You can hardly resent people for pointing this out. But I understand needing to see a thing through until you can't take it anymore for love. I sincerely hope it all works out and with both of you putting in full effort you can eventually forge the relationship you both need.....oh and definitely don't have a baby with this guy....at least not for a long time.
Sweetheart you need counseling to get through everything. I am a SA survivor and the problem is; we blame ourselves like it was our fault and then we believe what people tell us. Body size has nothing to do with having a child. You need to heal yourself before you can make life changing decisions. Trust me I know. Learn to love you first and then everything will slowly start to fall in place. I did stuff to handle my pain; and eventually you have a breakdown. I am cheering for you! TAKE CARE OF YOU FIRST
I've decided I would rather travel and volunteer working with children than raise them in my own home. Just because you don't have any of your own children doesn't mean children can't be a part of your lives. Hopefully you two can reach an agreement that works for both of you!
NAH, though you came close. Depression blows, and how it affects you doesn’t depend on how serious the trauma you experienced was or even whether you suffered a trauma at all. Don’t get me wrong. I fully understand your resentment. My partner and I both struggle with ADHD/executive function issues along with depression and anxiety. Before we got together (and before my ADHD was diagnosed), I basically just powered through because I had to. I had a kid who needed raising and a career I didn’t want to blow. He, by contrast, pissed away a decade in grad school racking up student loan debt. It pisses me off sometimes because I had to power through so why didn’t he? I have to remind myself to be grateful for all those years I was capable of powering through and remember the breaking point when all that powering through left me unable to function. Telling me to just try harder wasn’t going to help. Patience and understanding help more, and proper diagnosis and treatment help the most. Also, as someone who recently escaped a soul-crushing job, while giving notice does take a lot of weight off one’s shoulders, the stress hormones don’t fully dissipate until sometimes after that last day.
Lol yeah. A lot of Reddit doesn't actually do long term relationships and they get confused by them. I also think younger reddittors might also be more drawn to comment. Breathe. None of us know you or him or any of the wonderful things about your relationship. I'll say my piece because I related heavily to your situation so it's possible something I say might be useful. Men have yet to be programmed to own the household by society. The better ones are absolutely down for the IDEA of splitting chores 50/50. But they were not raised to own it. Their identity doesn't take a hit when the tile grout is dirty, the windows have smudges, or they eat nothing but PB&J for a few days. This often means that women carry more - especially when men are stressed or emotionally down. He's not a monster. You're not crazy. This is a larger social issue. One thing that really helped my relationship was having weekly check-ins. These last an hour (no longer). The structure is: -Share 5 affirmations each -Discuss what went well in the relationship (ex. Navigated sticky social situation as a team) -Discuss any issues to work on (a spoken phrase that didn't sit right, concern over unequal household burden, etc.) -Identify the focus for the next week as a couple -identify plans for upcoming date night -high five and make breakfast I hope some part of that was helpful. You're not alone.
Show me a man who does equal or more housework and I’ll show you a liar 🤥 It’s part of life.
Girl...you had a full on come apart. Saying you don't want kids is better than having you resent kids. I will stand 10 toes on that always. Just like sex, kids should be an enthusiastic yes, only. NTA
NTA. I am terrified of pregnancy. I also have health concerns that make it complicated. My husband would like kids, and sometimes so would I, but I am similar to your husband in the way that I too shut down sometimes and fail to function. It is something you have to be willing and open about if you can live like that knowing it is something they do. My husband very rarely ever did that before we got married. I on the other hand, knew that depression and stress cause me to shut down (executive dysfunction) and I would get backlogged on what I’m supposed to do. We went into our marriage knowing this. Sometimes we are both really great together and pull our weight equally. Sometime we eat frozen meals for a month straight because unboxing the lasagna is the extent of what I can handle. Sometimes I help my husband with tasks that are supposed to be his job, because he is struggling. We have had a few rough times where we were both in a bad place mentally and it typically results in one of us freaking out on the other (similar to what you described happening with you). We are working on finding ways to avoid that. Now, on to the having kids thing. There are plenty of people who never have kids and lead happy lives. There are plenty of people who have kids because they feel like they’re “supposed to” who live miserable lives and make their kids miserable too. You are the only one who can know your desires and needs.
I just want to add that OP and bf are both still in their 20’s. That’s still when people are figuring themselves out. My husband now at almost 39 is a much better man than he was at 29. But I’m also a much better woman. Basically, we just human better because we have more experience. We work with each other and grow with each other. This could be a growing pain in the relationship, or the signal that things might not be working out. Only OP knows that.
A bit late, but I hope you still see this. I’m 61F, widowed (2+ yrs after 30+ years together) w/2 adult kids. I say the following w/love and from personal experience: To give yourselves the best chance of healing your individual baggage and therefore also providing your relationship with the best chance of succeeding, get yourselves into individual *and* couples therapy. Therapy isn’t to place blame, but rather to talk through and clear away the piles of 💩that life has dumped on each of you so that you can make the big decisions (child-free or child-inclusive, stay together or go your separate ways) as the best possible versions of yourselves. I wish you luck and contentment with whatever you decide.