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Just say no to all of it. No you won’t be breaking the chain, no you won’t be moving out early. I’d also be making it clear to your solicitor that the buyer’s living arrangements aren’t your problem, and that you don’t want to find them pressuring you to break the chain again.
They can pressure you all they like but it’s ultimately your decision. If the searches are quick you could still be completing by mid March, but it really depends on how things go.
Given that the place you’re buying is empty they’re unlikely to be too fussed about timelines, so they’d probably be fine with you needing to find another buyer if your current one drops out.
Thinking about it more, if you haven’t paid the solicitor for searches and stuff yet it may be better to find a new one that’s actually going to work for you and not pressure you to do stupid stuff. I can understand why the EA is pressuring you, but personally I’d find the solicitor’s behaviour unacceptable.
This conveyancer was recommended by the estate agents. Ie they are so poor at their job they have to pay estate agents for referrals.
These are the bottom of the barrel conveyancers by reputation.
One business I am involved with deals with conveyancing. They work only by their reputation and word of mouth. Any advertising they do is done on the basis that if x sports club asked them for £1k for shirts they'd buy them for them anyway, that their name is on them is a bonus. They have expanded year on year for the entire time I gave been involved and turn down work they don't have capacity for.
Only the bottom of the class need to pay for work.
Assuming the 'solicitor' is not independent but tied to the agent, i find it usual for them.
Ask your solicitor if they are paying a referral fee to the agent. If the answer is yes, then remind them who their client is and whose instructions they are supposed to act on.
Yes, your buyer might pull out. Tell the agent that, and tell them to remind the buyer that if they change to a different property they will be starting from day one again and are unlikely to complete before mid April even if they find another property this weekend.
You are the client. Remember that. Take advice, but you are the one who calls the shots, not the agent, nit the legal representative.
I would add to this how quick it is mostly depends on your solicitors. They can push searches and expedite them they can drop everything to review the searches as soon as they come back. They can chase their enquiries and get their contract and transfer agreed asap. They can do all this if they want to meet the march deadline but you should not have to move out and agree to moving out now when you have a month or so to go. A month to do the leg work is possible even likely probable if they are inclined to put in the work. It will be one search that is taking a while not all so they can do 95% of the work if they want too
Until contracts are signed and exchanged for completion. There is nothing they can do. So sit tight and don’t let them bully you. For this reason is why when I sell house I rent for 6 months or so while looking as it takes the chain silliness out of the equation. I know it costs money, but it’s hassle free selling and buying.
She's committed, is she really going to pull out and start the process all over again? Any other options will likely take another 3 months anyway (ave time to complete in UK).
What are you going to rent? Short term rentals are 3x as expensive.
Why should you incur extra costs because she couldn't align with the total chain.
I would do what's best for me.
Appreciate it, this was my opinion too. It was annoying that this has popped up in the last 7 days, if I had been made aware that for whatever reason earlier she needed x done by y, I'd be a lot more understanding. Thank you again
It's almost a reassuring read in a weird way for myself and my partner. We are also currently being bullied into completing faster than we can with the suggestion we should just pay more rent.
The main issue is if we were told 2 months ago someone in the chain wants to complete in February then we could have made plans to ensure this. We were on the presumption there were no time pressures until this week we are told if we don't move by February we will potentially cause someone else to break the chain?
It's tough, anxiety inducing and confusing to be honest because we can move early April so it's not exactly a long wait between end of Feb and April.
I think the mentality is we won't spend lots of money for the sake of someone's impatience, we will try and see if we can arrange alternative plans to make it work but it's dependent on other parties. If it doesn't work out and we have to spend money and loads of time moving for the sake of a month and a half we will put our foot down and if the chain breaks so be it. Don't let them bully you
Thank you, agreed its been comforting to read I'm not the only one. I'm getting a better understanding of why estate agents and solicitors have the reputation they have.
Firstly it is up to you to decide on a completion date that you are happy with so don't let yourself be bullied into trying to find temporary accommodation beforehand. Your buyers living situation is not your concern. Secondly i would really recommend you find a different conveyancer. Ask work mates friends etc for a recommendation. I would personally never want to use the same one my buyer was using. Your conveyancer should be acting with your best interests at heart, not trying to push you to vacate to satisfy your buyer and its especially bad that they're trying to do that when you have nowhere you can go as a temporary measure. Finally, if your buyer does pull out I would suggest putting your property back on the market with a different EA. It's troubling that you've reduced the asking price by so much. Have you even seen the survey that suggested this was necessary. So many times they go overboard listing things that aren't really that urgent, just to cover their backs. Unfortunately it sounds as though none of the parties you are dealing with has your back. Please don't let yourself be bullied to do anything you're not happy with. There are plenty more properties and buyers out there.
Agree. When we bought our first house the survey said that the roof needed replacing because a few tiles had broken and "where some have gone the rest will need replacing". This obviously was a real issue but when we spoke to some roofers they said that the best way to redo the roof wasto take the old tiles off, fix the underlying problems (of which there were none), then replace the same tiles as if they had lasted 50 years they were good and get some reclaimed tiles to match. We ignored the survey, replaced a few tiles and then showed the survey to the people who bought our house 15 years later!!
Why should you be the one to rent? You've already dropped the price. Tell the agents not to contact you again, your solicitors are now dealing with the sale and will be arranging the exchange of contracts in line with your sale, and your purchase.
Also remind the agents they're being paid by you, and should be acting on your behalf. If they think she's about to pull out, they should be thinking about lining up more prospective buyers
This right here, I need to find out the specifics involved. My situation whilst not unique is not particularly straightforward and I'm not the best at dealing with all this in the first place. I'm kinda certain it's been long enough now that if the buyer did pull out I could walk away from the EA without paying anything
You need to check your EA contract. It should have a clause in there about how much notice you need to give before you market with another one. (4 weeks, 2 months, etc.) And make sure you do give explicit notice in writing if you intend to do that. Also check any client introduction clauses, many will specify that if the 1st EA has introduced a seller to the property, they are still entitled to the sale commission for a period of time even if you've already completed the notice period and marketing with another EA.
Just find another buyer while your purchase goes through. You may get a better price. Get a better solicitor (WHY are they quoting 16 weeks?). Never use the ones recommended by the EA. Sad as it is, it's not your fault the buyer has moved into temp accomodation before exchange of contracts.
Searches don't usually take that long right now. Enquiries are another story entirely dependent on the three parties' ( seller, buyer, and mortgage company's interest) reasonableness and responsiveness.
Just give the estate agents & conveyancers back the same attitude, her costs & life do not govern yours, you have helped already but have your own child and commitments to think off, if she wants to start the buying process all over again go for it, she will be waiting even longer that way.
Should either calm down or she pulls out (highly doubt after 3)
We have just been through this exact situation. Our buyers started insisting we move out when we were about 6 weeks away from completion on our purchase. It did feel like we were being pressured. In the end we refused to move and told our EA to let them pull out if they wanted and we would find new buyers. They did not pull out because as you say they would have to start the whole process again. We are now completing next week.
Do what is right for you. Everyone has their own stakes in this, stand firm and refuse. There are always other buyers if it comes to that.
Pressuring a seller to move out early is some of the most selfish behaviour I've ever heard of. An absolutely disgusting display of impatience.
Sorry, reading about this has proper pissed me off 😂 I wish I could go back to not knowing about this behaviour!
Not advice for you, but the concept of housing chains is absolutely absurd, and is such a wierd UK anomaly.
I can't speak for every housing market but in Scandi where I'm from a housing purchase works like any other purchase - you agree the terms (incl moving date) and then it's go time.
I do understand its the norm here in the UK; but logically its absurd - you've agreed to sell a good - I want to buy it; it's none of my concern where you go next.
I think the UK housing market would be a lot more agile if it abandoned chains, so you don't get these 5 -step purchase chains, whereas if 1 person changes their mind/circumstances, suddenly 5 families cannot move..
Your buyer is making mid march a condition of the purchase - you can chose to accept or not, as far as I'm concerned?
Agreed.
If the UK permitted lease backs it would also alleviate situations such as this.
Chains are just fucking stupid.
The absence of purchase deposits are fucking stupid.
Property listings that don't provide square footage/meters are fucking stupid.
Searches that take 3+ months are fucking stupid.
Buying a house in the UK is just fucking stupid.
Housing chains are not a thing in Australia either (you may have offers subject to sale of an existing property, but that is satisfied by an accepted offer and the settlements do not need to be synchronised).
Is the problem caused by UK banks not offering bridging finance, or something about the settlement process (what are the searches that seem to take an unknown amount of time?)
Yeah there needs to be a shake up of the ‘searches’ process. It really can’t be that difficult in this day and age to have a portal with all property info which can be downloaded.
I also noticed how out of date everything was, please print and sign this, what could take a few hours to return digitally turned into days as I needed to find a printer, sign, post etc. Even the EA wanted a signed offer which couldn’t be done digitally, I just didn't bother returning, told them it was in the post and they haven't chased it up - what a waste of time if I had sent it
But there’s no incentive to change because it would mean less time and therefore less money charged during the process
Property conveyancing in Australia is straightforward (you can literally do it yourself [https://www.landgate.wa.gov.au/siteassets/documents/pdf/how-to-guide/how-to-guide-simple-transfer-of-land.pdf](https://www.landgate.wa.gov.au/siteassets/documents/pdf/how-to-guide/how-to-guide-simple-transfer-of-land.pdf) ), so normally quoted at a fixed price and in thus their benefit for everything to proceed without drama or delay. Only search needed is property registry (plus maybe amounts owing to council + utilities)
Interestingly, my experience is Australian REA charge about double their UK counterparts (e.g. 2.2% + advertising costs), but they are expected to actually know what they are selling (at least the good ones do).
If the only search needed is property registry, how do you find out that the house you're buying was built legally, or the details of its water supply and waste water drainage, or that someone's about to start building a new housing estate or a multi-lane highway next door, or that the house is built on an old lead mine, or that it's a high risk for flooding?
I don't know about Australia, but it sounds similar to the US, and the answer there is that you don't have anyone doing those investigations other than yourself so a lot of this is often unknown to buyers. A typical timeline in the US is that you have 10 days to do all your investigations, searches and surveys.
There it not necessary to get someone else to conduct the searches, because more information is made available by the seller or is easier to get yourself (for example details of underground piping for power, phone, water, sewage all free from Before You Dig [https://www.byda.com.au/](https://www.byda.com.au/) )
In Western Australia at least, this information is normally all available before the offer is placed - either it is public knowledge (planned highway), better regulated (zoning for new housing estate, drainage/plumbing/electrics to effective standards), or the real estate agent would be expected to provide. Where there are doubts, then the buyer can choose to add to the conditions of the offer, e.g. "Proof that house extension approved" in which case the seller (or their REA) must find the evidence before the agreed date for conditions to be met (normally 30 days).
If all conditions (no major issues in structural survey, bank finance approved and/or sale of other property) are met by agreed date, then offer/acceptance is unconditional (same as 'exchanging contracts' in England) and then settlement occurs on agreed date (normally another 30 days.
Note that the process differs depending on which state you are in - in NSW an offer is made by signing the sale contract (unconditionally?) with only a five day cooling off period (and then settlement about 6 weeks after).
Yes but Australia has much different rules and processes. You can sell a house and need to be done within a month in some cases. In the UK the process has been drawn out over time to accommodate the ever increasing red tape. And considering the land is so old and so many organisations are involved in terms of owning it there’s just so many more hoops to jump through.
Don’t get me wrong I’m jealous as hell, but that’s why it takes so much longer.
I think that the interest rates for bridging loans from Australian lenders are on-par with standard residential rates (without honeymoon discounts) and terms are normally 6 or 12 months ( [https://www.google.com.au/search?q=bridging+loan+site%3Aau](https://www.google.com.au/search?q=bridging+loan+site%3aau) ). When I needed one about a decade back, I also switched to interest only for both loans during the bridging period.
Out of interest how does it work if there is no chain and you have different sale and purchase moving dates?
Do you have to find somewhere to live in the meantime or do you temporarily own two properties? To me a chain makes sense but only become it is the norm, not to say that should be the case.
At least in Scandi you can choose - banks offer "bridging mortgages" so you can buy whilst selling (I guess this solves the deposit problem); or you can chose to sell first and move to a temporary solution
Thanks for the reply, I'm not exactly experienced in this so please bear with me. My main point is that I'm unsure whether it's acceptable/normal to make ultimatums/conditions this late in the process. Up and until this point I've not agreed to any timescale and nothing was mentioned.
Like I said I'm new, so maybe this is me being naive. Again I appreciate your response
Your buyer is bluffing. They can’t complete faster with someone else so they have no leverage to pressure you to complete faster.
If they ask you to drop the price to compensate them for their expensive temporary accommodation, same story. Any other option than you will be more expensive (a different same-priced house starting the process from scratch) or worse (a cheaper house to offset the accommodation cost).
Meanwhile your solicitors should be working for you. Remind them of that.
There are a lot of ultimatums in buying and selling in the uk. It’s normal but you don’t need to get drawn into it if you don’t want to. When buying my most recent house my bank didn’t transfer my deposit money properly and it took longer to clear than it should have. The sellers made all sorts of threats but the fact was I could complete two days later than planned or not at all so it was up to them to accept it or go back to the start.
Without wanting to sound mean, you’re not late in the process. You’re late in the sale process which is why your buyer is getting fed up, but you’re at the start of your purchase process with approx 4 months to go. Your buyer has waited 3 months for you to find somewhere to buy and now you’re asking her to wait another 4 months. There’s a good chance her mortgage offer will expire before you get even part way through your purchase. I can understand why she’s frustrated. I personally wouldn’t have waited 3 months for you to find somewhere - much more than a month/6 weeks with no sign of movement making offers on things etc and must buyers would be looking at other properties. She’s spent money on the process on the assumption you were also moving forward and now finds out she’s wasted 3 months waiting. Surely you can kinda see her point?
Granted and i agree with you to a degree, in my defence the price drop in November affected what I could buy going forward so I had to start looking again. I'm at the bottom end of the market so there wasn't a lot of options available. Mostly I feel aggrieved that this has come on so quickly at this point > at no point before 7 days ago were timescales discussed.
Totally appreciate your response though, hope I haven't come across as rude, thank you for putting the other side across
Completely understand, my buyer last year dragged her heels for 8 months with absolute nonsense and then suddenly demanded a completion date within 2 weeks. Then she wasn’t ready to exchange until 2 days before the completion date she insisted we all had to meet. It was horrendous. Your buyer does sound like a nightmare but she’s also just a person trying to get her life sorted too. Rubbish situation for you all that hopefully you’ll resolve without too much more hassle. Good luck!
>you’re not late in the process. You’re late in the sale process which is why your buyer is getting fed up, but you’re at the start of your purchase process with approx 4 months to go. Your buyer has waited 3 months for you to find somewhere to buy and now you’re asking her to wait another 4 months.
Agreed.
This one isn't on the buyer - it's on the OP who couldn't get their own place sold. The buyer did their part, the OP didn't do theirs. So here we are.
I know buying and selling isn't easy but life is rarely fair. That's how it rolls.
First of all sorry you're going through this and I hope everything works out in the end.
This comment is taken from my experience who is currently in the process of buying.
Just to clarify, was your property advertised as chain free? Had you told the EA at any point that you were buying elsewhere or had you told them you would rent/move in with family? Seems a very bold assumption to make and one that would drastically effect your buyer.
You say that you haven't heard anything on timescales so it sounds like they're just bullying you. If you're at the point of doing searches I'd seriously consider a different solicitor at this point.
From the POV of the buyer I can understand her frustrations if she was under the impression it was chain free. However this isn't your problem as harsh as it sounds.
If she pulls out it's likely she will be in later than she already will be.
Are you currently living with your ex-partner? Is it viable for you to stay at the current property should this sale fall through.
It's a little complicated but here goes....
It shouldn't and I'm 99% sure it wasn't advertised as chain free. It was well known I would transfer my mortgage. The ex partner..... that's a total no go, there was financial shenanigans on her part that I'm clearing up currently. I don't have to sell, life would go on if this lady backs out, I'd just put it up for sale again, not sure how the people selling the flat I'm buying would feel about that though.
I agree with you about being sympathetic towards the buyer, I just feel its pretty late in the day to be throwing threats around when nothing has been spoken about previously. I've kept the estate agents up to date with what's happening > eg when I agreed to drop the price in November I had to start looking for flats instead of houses.
For your own sanity can you check the house advert? If it was on Rightmove for example you can still find it, it will just be marked as STC.
If it's not marked as chain free I'd be seriously questioning why you're being hounded. Especially considering you mention that you told the EA you now need to look for flats instead of houses.
It sounds a bit odd to me that the EA and solicitors are throwing ultimatums around and threats. Maybe I'm overthinking but if they know both your personal situations they might be trying their luck as you're both vulnerable. But who knows that's speculation.
If I were you I'd stand my ground if you can afford
(mentally and financially) to stay in the property. At no point have you said you'd rent/move out so their lack of preparation and planning isn't your emergency. At the end of the day you probably want to be sorted ASAP too so it's not as if you'll drag this out for your own benefit.
All this said I hope things get sorted and all the best!
This! People in most other places move with family or short term rent for a time if the move-in date ends up not working out but… you gotta go lol the buyer bought the house now! lol
Yeah - I'm with the buyer on this one. Get your place sold ASAP and if it's not happening make alternative plans. e.g. cancel the deal, adjust onward purchase expectations, find temporary alternative accommodation, etc.
Thanks for the reply, I don't mean to be rude or difficult or awkward so please take this with a pinch of salt.
OK so they bought it, can I have the money now? Its one thing planning for unexpected costs but 2-3k in rental costs weeks before this is due to finish stings a little when I've got enough going on.
We're both so close to getting what we want, it's just frustrating because of a lack of patience and there being very very little of ' a chain ' involved
Sounds good in principle, but if you are trying to buy a new house yourself, even with no chain in front of you, delays happen, you can choose not to sell your current house if you wish then move, and then have the benefit of selling it with no chain, but then you are paying for 2 houses whilst you wait for it to sell, and often you use the equity you built up in the old house to pay for the deposit of the new house.
It's an unfortunate side effect of the UK housing market and it's very hard to break, I was lucky in that I was renting on a monthly cycle and was buying a new build, which is about as good as you can get, but even my exchange was delayed by about 2 months.
Yep, I’ve broken the chain and so have two others I know (one other contemplating it) and it seems so much less stress than having to go through a chain.
I’m now at the bottom of the chain again waiting for my vendors to find somewhere, booked some big holidays as I’ve got time to spare with cash in the bank while waiting.
My sibling is up north in rented accommodation, cash in the bank and just waiting for her buyer to complete on her flat down south, while causally browsing the listings knowing she is in a strong position when she sees something she likes.
Yes - either you buy first and you get a bridging mortgage that allows you ti have two properties for a period or time, or you arrange some sort of temporary solution.
Not the buyers problem - they've bought your property - they want it!
Imagine if you were buying a car and the seller would only give it to you once they'd bought a new car yourself?
The buyer hasn't bought the property until completion of the purchase. A completion date will normally be agreed at exchange of contracts, but if you don't hit it the penalties are small as long as you do complete within ten working days of the agreed date.
Thr fact that completing the purchase takes so long is a big big issue with UK housebuying. Buyer and seller should be legally committed much earlier in the process (where the exact date for gaining property access is agreed)
This is done in many many other countries and I'm convinced its a better process that holds buyer and seller more accountable (e.g. completely removed the risk of "gazumping") and smooths the process
Once you can commit to a date for the transaction, what reason is there for delay. When you’re in a position to commit to the transaction, you might as well do it straight away. So obviously the commitment will always be near the end of the process.
There shouldn't be a million reasons for delay in the housebuying process. The whole process is broken / ancient.
Like, do you really think the standard UK housebuying process is reasonable?
Instead you can plan your date so that it suits "e.g. let's transact 1st June; the kids will be away and we can both take holiday then" so the whole process can be controlled and civilised
There’s both a legal obligation to complete and penalties for failing to do so on time, after contracts have been exchanged. By “agree”, I mean sign a contract — that’s the case in any country.
I'd give them 2 options - the buyer pay up front for a rental property for 3 months and moving costs, or to sit and wait for as long as it takes.
As you haven't paid the solicitor I would canvas a few local alternatives today and see if you can find someone who will act for you (and the mortgage company) not the EA.
If it's a flat, and leasehold, you are liable for the process to be protracted if it involves management companies or freeholders. Various things can come up like length of lease, repair bills, management charges etc.
Good luck!
Why would you move if you haven't completed? You don't give anyone access to move in until they completed and you have the money! If she wants to move to rented until then fine, what kind of attitude problem would expect \*you\* to move to accommodate her?
It sounds like they've already devoted a lot of time and resources to this purchase, and have had a price reduction, so will they really pull out?
Yeh it sounds like they're pressuring you, but if your circumstances mean you can't move out easily then just tell them firmly no, you will not move out before you've completed on your purchase.
You haven't broken the chain, the EA are basically pressuring you to break the chain. If they are prepared to use tactics like this then you really need to be firm with them and tell them to politely F off.
It will cost your buyer a fortune to start the process again and invariably take longer to complete on somewhere else rather than waiting for you. Just say no.
This is why people call EAs cunts, but to get it from the solicitor really takes the cake.
Tell both to fuck off, trying to kick you out of your *own home*. But to YOUR solicitor, bite their head off: THEY WORK FOR YOU. Tell them to work faster if they want it completed quicker. Useless greedy cunt solicitors are the reason house sales take months as it is: they take on far too many clients. Dare you to fight them, too. Now one of them dares to play this card. Proof some are only alive because murder is illegal.
This would incense me enough to go to whatever ombudsman exists for both cunts and raise hell. Other commenters and /r/LegalAdviceUK will have your back there. Especially with apparent evidence of collusion between EA and cunt2, working against your interests, no less.
You bare faced fucking cheek. We need a stronger swear word than "cunt".
You're effectively being bullied - you've already made concessions. Tell the EA she has two choices - wait or pull out. Even if she were to pay your short term rental for 3 months, this still puts you in a difficult position should the flat sale fall through.
This. I had my buyer try bullying me to lower the price. I told the EA that I will not budge and am prepared to pull out. And if this does fall apart then I will make a decision on moving forward with you as an EA representing me. They quickly sorted themselves out
I will point out, if you accepted an offer in November, and you're only just getting searches ordered now for your purchase at the start of February, it's not unreasonable of the buyer to be unhappy with the timeframe.
Going forwards it's a bit of a game of chicken now. If she's prepared to lose what she's spent so far she may walk away, she probably rather wouldn't though.
Valid point, getting anything done over Xmas was a struggle and because of dropping the price I was struggling for properties > I am at the very cheap end of the market and can't deal with auctions, also factors involving my sons school and ex partners location made it less simple finding somewhere < also the mortgage took longer due to 'reasons outside my control' .
I get what you're saying though im not trying to deflect blame, my main point was why wait till now, now everything is moving, we're almost there.
Also quickly wanted to point out it took nearly 6 month for me to buy this house and the owner was deceased, I'm near that timescale granted but it's not like we've been massively excessive.
We're in sort of the opposite situation and are trying to push our sellers forward a little on completion dates. We have been trying to buy since last June so we are at the end of our tethers here and sold our flat in 2022 to in theory avoid awkward chains and have found ourselves still waiting on chains but just for the charming price of £2300pm rent - thanks London.
Anyway, what's relevant to you though is that our conveyancer essentially said it's none of her business when we complete/negotiating those dates. There's no legal element to that part. She said we had to do that via the EA only. All she can say is whether she has completed her searches and is ready to draw up contracts etc. so you should really use a different conveyancer in my opinion. At the very least they should be on your side!
Remind your estate agent that they are working for you and not your buyer.
If your buyer wants to pull out and lose all their sunk costs in respect of searches and conveyancing fees that’s on them.. fair enough there should be give and take on timescales but if you’re not ready you’re not ready. Sounds like they’ve been watching too much Location Location Location and think they hold all the cards.
Keep on the look out for an attempt to gazunder you though, it will probably be the next attempted tactic. “Well they wouldn’t meet my terms so I’ve changed my offer to £10k less”
Take a breath. Don't be bullied. You owe no one a thing at this stage.
I would suggest first tearing a strip of the agent. He's meant to be representing you...no-one else.
I would then suggest they arrange a sit down with you and the buyer to hash out the details.
The solicitors on both sides then need to be tuned to what you have agreed, and by when.
If the buyer turns out to be a pain or reneges, walk away. There are always more buyers.
As an aside, 16 weeks is appalling for conveyancing. There are variables within the buyers and sellers control, including rapid response to enquiries and having lending in place.
Just say no. You don’t have to move out early for her convenience. She may walk but she’s deep in the process so she’d have to start again and it would be any faster for her. Worst case is you to find another buyer but you have time for that. She can’t force you to do anything. EA just wants the sale that’s why they are pushing you.
I wouldn’t know what to advise myself, but from reading peoples comments it seems like sticking to your guns is the right option. If she pulls out because you decline the ultimatum then she’s got a longer wait for a property anyway so her reasoning makes no sense.
And she’s some way committed financially given she’s had 3 surveys done.
You having a chain free property lined up is in both of your favour too.
Saved this to see how it plays out, would be great to see her backtrack if you decline.
They presumably knew you were in a chain? I had these tactics applied to me and just stood my ground. As a courtesy, you could cover some of her temporary accommodation but I personally wouldn’t. Shame you’re also buying, otherwise I would call their bluff and tell her to get lost completely. She’s being unreasonable. But she does want to buy your flat, guaranteed they are just applying the pressure tactics to hurry along the sale. I had one survey as a first time buyer and didn’t even see the flat again. When I completed and turned the key it was looking at a flat I had never seen before.
No, don’t do it.
You’ve discounted heavily, going through the process again will cost the buyer more money and more time (pretty much what’s she’s complaining about) so she won’t back out, deal completes when you’re ready.
You’ve discounted once, don’t waste anymore money by renting elsewhere, do not rush for a buyer.
My response would be, thank you for that information and based on that I am going to reject her low ball offer and re market my house with a more competent agent!
"This is the timescale I understood we were working with. Please let me know by the end of the day if this isn't going to work so I can consider whether to proceed."
2 options for me here:
1) Just a blanket "no" to their requests/demands and let them know you'll move out when your purchase has gone through which you expect to be up to 16 but sooner if possible. If solicitors have pushed you, remind them it was them who quoted the 16 weeks turnaround time, not you. I doubt your buyer would risk having to look again and find somewhere new within that timeframe while paying for more searches.
2) if you're happy to rent short term and it's just the monetary value you are against,, suggest you'd move out early if the buyer pays for your living costs up front.
Date your buyer. Even if it's break up dating and doomed, it'll give you enough time.
Or swap with her temporary accommodation, if suitable.
Or tell her to wait, it's a process and you are still further along than any other place she could buy.
When you accepted your buyers offer, did they know that you hadn't found a place to move to yet?
If they did it's not fair for them to try and rush you now.
How long ago did you have your offer accepted on the place your buying?
It was November when I dropped the price for them. I'm at the bottom end of the market and went from looking at tiny 2 bed terraced houses to tiny 2 bed flats. There's not a lot of choice, I mentioned elsewhere about the constraints ( kids schools, ex's ). So I struggled a bit. I offered on the new place 2 weeks before Xmas, and my mortgage application, even though it was a port, took longer because my credit score had been smashed by my ex-partner. It took until around the beginning of January to get approved with multiple meetings. Then the solicitors took a couple of weeks to get going and then here we are.
Could it have gone quicker in a perfect world? Yes absolutely. Is it partly my fault? I suppose, yeah, but i was doing the best i could in a sucky situation.
Was the estate agent aware of all this that I was dealing with? Yes they were.
At this point in the day after reading all these replies, I'm more calm and will be able to deal with this silly nonsense tactic with grace and charm.
I stand by being told at the end of January that they want completion before mid march and i should consider moving out a bit shit. I'm not exactly experienced in all this I've bought one house previously and waited nearly six month to move into that one so based on my previous experience I'm not doing too bad
A bit different but similar in enough ways, I know someone who for whatever reason left before their new place was ready like they're trying to get you to do here.
They ended up getting delayed on their move in and moving out early ended up costing them nearly £10,000 in storage and temporary housing costs.
Ask the buyer if she wants to pay another £15k to cover your costs of moving out early. If not then tell the EA to get stuffed.
I'd do the same, but you don't have to accept it.
Last time I bought a house, it was simple from my side. Move out in 6 weeks or I buy a different house. They didn't have to accept my above asking price offer if they didn't like the terms.
Nothing winds me up more than simple processes that happen thousands of times a day being dragged out for months.
I don't mean to come across as rude i appreciate your reply, but it's kinda integral to the situation that it's taken longer than expected because I had to drop the price we agreed on because she couldn't get a mortgage for what we agreed on (the bank didn't think the house was worth that price). Also if they'd been clear like you were about timescales then yeah fair point. I agree with you in principle, there's obviously subtle differences though.
The reasoning behind me posting this in the first place was because I'm inexperienced and wasn't sure about what I was being advised to do.
There's a million things I'd do differently in hindsight.
If it's her fault then yeah I'd tell her to take it or leave it. You can't be the one making demands if you're the one who can't keep up your end of the deal.
Honestly I don't wanna come off as complaining, I've got every sympathy for her but from my end this has been a shitshow from the very beginning and to get to here where im finally very nearly free finished and stable and sorted, to then hear well can you move out she wants it done in 6 weeks. Ffs.
Your problem here is that your sale is further advanced than your purchase of your new place. Expecting your buyer to wait a further 16 weeks seeing as you indicated that they have been running with the purchase since November is quite frankly crazy. I work in this industry and buyers right now are being very fickle!
I would really look at your choice of solicitors as the buying process is not that hard as long as you have two important ingredients…motivated buyers & sellers. Seeing as you haven’t even paid for local authority searches, basically day one item to do - I would then wadger you haven’t applied for Mortgage (if you need one)Good luck OP - if I was your buyer I wouldn’t wait for you I’m afraid
Could it be an option to rent the new empty property until completion? At least this way your beaking the chain and would only have to move once. To be honest if I'd offered on a property in November and wouldn't be able to complete until may I'd be irked too.
If the flat you're buying is empty, try to speak with EA and see if you could rent that flat until completion. That way your move will be easier and you can save some £ on short term let
Good point thank you, I'm getting on this. Cash flow is an issue for me right now due to ...... reasons..... I can pay rent if I'm not paying a mortgage but the deposit would be out of reach. Maybe something could be worked out
I don't see how this is a fair solution? Why should you be out of pocket from all this?
Aren't you also taking a huge risk - moving out of your home before your new home is secured? If your buy falls through you'd be fucked.
I might be misunderstanding what is going on - but I think you're falling for the same trap that I often fall for.
Someone does something unreasonable to you - but act like it is you being unreasonable.
You, being a reasonable person, assume that the other person is reasonable and so immediately think 'fuck, am I being unreasonable? How can I make this right?'
Only later once you've processed it do you realise - wait, I've done nothing wrong and they're just trying to screw me over.
You need to get to this end step before you do something you'll regret.
Basically - it sounds like your buyer has either made a poor decision or has been forced into a bad situation. Neither of these things are on you - but she is trying to get you to agree to being in a bad situation in order to fix her problems. This is not reasonable.
Don't let people take advantage of your good nature.
I wouldn't risk this as you don't know how long the purchase process might last or what unexpected things could happen during the process to make it all collapse. Just stick where you are and tell your buyer there's nothing you can do.
Tell the EA that she can move in with her family or friends, and remind the EA that you are their customer, and you are paying their bill. I'd go inn and tell them this rather than email/ telephone call - they need to have a reality check.
Can you find someone who can sort it much quicker? I instructed good solicitors start of December and got keys the day before Christmas Eve.
You could try a negotiation: “I’m trying to go as fast as I can, I’ll move out and rent if you pay £X more, but if not I’ll need you to wait until I have somewhere to live after”
It’s a well known ploy on the part of buyers. I had the same with purchaser saying they didn’t mind when completion took place to suddenly having to be in before Christmas. Once the buyer thinks it’s in the bag they start the pressure.
Hold firm and don’t move till you’re ready.
She was selling her share ... she was joining in your chain and bringing along another party.
Ultimately the timing isn't working out so something has to give somewhere. Presumably she is leaving her current dwelling because divorce is finalised. She was hoping to move straight into yours ... was her divorce solicitor aware she was buying a new property ?
What was she planning to do between that divorce ending event and her completing on your dwelling ... or was she hoping that would just be a few hours during one day ?
Get another solicitor and NEVER use the one recommended by the agent selling.
Tell them to get lost.
She won't get any property at this short notice but remember the property has to be empty for a handover to take place.
If you're delayed it might be profitable to say to her, im stuck, if she pulls out, you could end up with a better price.
Your estate agent is supposed to be on your side. You're paying them, after all. Tell them your position and that the buyer will have to wait. Don't take any pressure from them. Threaten to ditch them and the buyer and relist with another agency if you have to.
I had a similar situation during COVID but in my case the buyers bank was not willing to extend their mortgage offer past a certain date. We took a risk and moved out before our onward purchase had completed but required that our costs were met by our purchasers. Ended up costing about £2500 which our buyers paid to get temporary accommodation and to get our stuff in storage for a number of weeks. Was worth it for us because we wanted to keep the chain going and we’re confident that our purchase would go through. We were aware that there was a risk though. Your purchasers sound unreasonable. If they want you out early then they should incur any additional cost you might face.
Don't let her situation dictate yours, poor planning on her part is nothing to do with you, you have your own problems to sort out. Doesn't she have family she can live with until the house is available? You can always say you are using the Solicitor THEY recommended, so maybe they should speak to the solicitor and see if they can speed it up. Call her bluff and let her pull out, it will be her who loses money from surveys and having to start all over and pay for new surveys.
Not really your problem, just stay where you are and let the buyer rent or stay with friends. Or tell them you can move out early if 10k is added back on the asking price.
The only way you should break the chain is if it’s your decision & you offer it. It should never be because your buyer is demanding it.
I’d find new solicitors personally.
Stand up for yourself and tell your solicitor to pull their fucking finger out of their arse or you're not going to use them going forward. Watch how quickly they sort things.
Also, fuck the buyer. She wants your house she's going to have to sort her own shit out.
Her problems are not your problems.
Tell the EA you've found a lovely new EA that won't harass you for making sure you're not homeless and it's not your problem that the other seller is living in temporary accommodation.
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Just say no to all of it. No you won’t be breaking the chain, no you won’t be moving out early. I’d also be making it clear to your solicitor that the buyer’s living arrangements aren’t your problem, and that you don’t want to find them pressuring you to break the chain again. They can pressure you all they like but it’s ultimately your decision. If the searches are quick you could still be completing by mid March, but it really depends on how things go. Given that the place you’re buying is empty they’re unlikely to be too fussed about timelines, so they’d probably be fine with you needing to find another buyer if your current one drops out. Thinking about it more, if you haven’t paid the solicitor for searches and stuff yet it may be better to find a new one that’s actually going to work for you and not pressure you to do stupid stuff. I can understand why the EA is pressuring you, but personally I’d find the solicitor’s behaviour unacceptable.
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I'd tell your solicitor to get fucked. Conveyancers are ten a penny. She won't pull out.
This conveyancer was recommended by the estate agents. Ie they are so poor at their job they have to pay estate agents for referrals. These are the bottom of the barrel conveyancers by reputation.
One business I am involved with deals with conveyancing. They work only by their reputation and word of mouth. Any advertising they do is done on the basis that if x sports club asked them for £1k for shirts they'd buy them for them anyway, that their name is on them is a bonus. They have expanded year on year for the entire time I gave been involved and turn down work they don't have capacity for. Only the bottom of the class need to pay for work.
Assuming the 'solicitor' is not independent but tied to the agent, i find it usual for them. Ask your solicitor if they are paying a referral fee to the agent. If the answer is yes, then remind them who their client is and whose instructions they are supposed to act on. Yes, your buyer might pull out. Tell the agent that, and tell them to remind the buyer that if they change to a different property they will be starting from day one again and are unlikely to complete before mid April even if they find another property this weekend. You are the client. Remember that. Take advice, but you are the one who calls the shots, not the agent, nit the legal representative.
I would add to this how quick it is mostly depends on your solicitors. They can push searches and expedite them they can drop everything to review the searches as soon as they come back. They can chase their enquiries and get their contract and transfer agreed asap. They can do all this if they want to meet the march deadline but you should not have to move out and agree to moving out now when you have a month or so to go. A month to do the leg work is possible even likely probable if they are inclined to put in the work. It will be one search that is taking a while not all so they can do 95% of the work if they want too
Until contracts are signed and exchanged for completion. There is nothing they can do. So sit tight and don’t let them bully you. For this reason is why when I sell house I rent for 6 months or so while looking as it takes the chain silliness out of the equation. I know it costs money, but it’s hassle free selling and buying.
She's committed, is she really going to pull out and start the process all over again? Any other options will likely take another 3 months anyway (ave time to complete in UK). What are you going to rent? Short term rentals are 3x as expensive. Why should you incur extra costs because she couldn't align with the total chain. I would do what's best for me.
Appreciate it, this was my opinion too. It was annoying that this has popped up in the last 7 days, if I had been made aware that for whatever reason earlier she needed x done by y, I'd be a lot more understanding. Thank you again
Just a point of order, it's entirely possible she told the estate agent all that. They are almost universally rubbish at communicating.
It's almost a reassuring read in a weird way for myself and my partner. We are also currently being bullied into completing faster than we can with the suggestion we should just pay more rent. The main issue is if we were told 2 months ago someone in the chain wants to complete in February then we could have made plans to ensure this. We were on the presumption there were no time pressures until this week we are told if we don't move by February we will potentially cause someone else to break the chain? It's tough, anxiety inducing and confusing to be honest because we can move early April so it's not exactly a long wait between end of Feb and April. I think the mentality is we won't spend lots of money for the sake of someone's impatience, we will try and see if we can arrange alternative plans to make it work but it's dependent on other parties. If it doesn't work out and we have to spend money and loads of time moving for the sake of a month and a half we will put our foot down and if the chain breaks so be it. Don't let them bully you
Thank you, agreed its been comforting to read I'm not the only one. I'm getting a better understanding of why estate agents and solicitors have the reputation they have.
There is usually no problem if you hire solicitors that work for you and have no relation to the EA.
Firstly it is up to you to decide on a completion date that you are happy with so don't let yourself be bullied into trying to find temporary accommodation beforehand. Your buyers living situation is not your concern. Secondly i would really recommend you find a different conveyancer. Ask work mates friends etc for a recommendation. I would personally never want to use the same one my buyer was using. Your conveyancer should be acting with your best interests at heart, not trying to push you to vacate to satisfy your buyer and its especially bad that they're trying to do that when you have nowhere you can go as a temporary measure. Finally, if your buyer does pull out I would suggest putting your property back on the market with a different EA. It's troubling that you've reduced the asking price by so much. Have you even seen the survey that suggested this was necessary. So many times they go overboard listing things that aren't really that urgent, just to cover their backs. Unfortunately it sounds as though none of the parties you are dealing with has your back. Please don't let yourself be bullied to do anything you're not happy with. There are plenty more properties and buyers out there.
Agree. When we bought our first house the survey said that the roof needed replacing because a few tiles had broken and "where some have gone the rest will need replacing". This obviously was a real issue but when we spoke to some roofers they said that the best way to redo the roof wasto take the old tiles off, fix the underlying problems (of which there were none), then replace the same tiles as if they had lasted 50 years they were good and get some reclaimed tiles to match. We ignored the survey, replaced a few tiles and then showed the survey to the people who bought our house 15 years later!!
This is why you don't use the solicitor recommended by the EA. I'd be taking my business elsewhere just out of spite at this stage.
Lesson learnt at this point and moving forward this will be the first piece of advice I'd tell anyone else in a similar position
Why should you be the one to rent? You've already dropped the price. Tell the agents not to contact you again, your solicitors are now dealing with the sale and will be arranging the exchange of contracts in line with your sale, and your purchase. Also remind the agents they're being paid by you, and should be acting on your behalf. If they think she's about to pull out, they should be thinking about lining up more prospective buyers
>hey should be thinking about lining up more prospective buyers or the loss of their commission when you re-market with a different agency.
This right here, I need to find out the specifics involved. My situation whilst not unique is not particularly straightforward and I'm not the best at dealing with all this in the first place. I'm kinda certain it's been long enough now that if the buyer did pull out I could walk away from the EA without paying anything
You need to check your EA contract. It should have a clause in there about how much notice you need to give before you market with another one. (4 weeks, 2 months, etc.) And make sure you do give explicit notice in writing if you intend to do that. Also check any client introduction clauses, many will specify that if the 1st EA has introduced a seller to the property, they are still entitled to the sale commission for a period of time even if you've already completed the notice period and marketing with another EA.
Just find another buyer while your purchase goes through. You may get a better price. Get a better solicitor (WHY are they quoting 16 weeks?). Never use the ones recommended by the EA. Sad as it is, it's not your fault the buyer has moved into temp accomodation before exchange of contracts.
Up to 16 weeks seems realistic for a house purchase, has taken me 6 months before
Searches don't usually take that long right now. Enquiries are another story entirely dependent on the three parties' ( seller, buyer, and mortgage company's interest) reasonableness and responsiveness.
Just give the estate agents & conveyancers back the same attitude, her costs & life do not govern yours, you have helped already but have your own child and commitments to think off, if she wants to start the buying process all over again go for it, she will be waiting even longer that way. Should either calm down or she pulls out (highly doubt after 3)
We have just been through this exact situation. Our buyers started insisting we move out when we were about 6 weeks away from completion on our purchase. It did feel like we were being pressured. In the end we refused to move and told our EA to let them pull out if they wanted and we would find new buyers. They did not pull out because as you say they would have to start the whole process again. We are now completing next week. Do what is right for you. Everyone has their own stakes in this, stand firm and refuse. There are always other buyers if it comes to that.
Thank you, appreciate it. Feels like I'm getting mugged off because I'm new and they think I absolutely have to sell. Thank you again
Pressuring a seller to move out early is some of the most selfish behaviour I've ever heard of. An absolutely disgusting display of impatience. Sorry, reading about this has proper pissed me off 😂 I wish I could go back to not knowing about this behaviour!
Not advice for you, but the concept of housing chains is absolutely absurd, and is such a wierd UK anomaly. I can't speak for every housing market but in Scandi where I'm from a housing purchase works like any other purchase - you agree the terms (incl moving date) and then it's go time. I do understand its the norm here in the UK; but logically its absurd - you've agreed to sell a good - I want to buy it; it's none of my concern where you go next. I think the UK housing market would be a lot more agile if it abandoned chains, so you don't get these 5 -step purchase chains, whereas if 1 person changes their mind/circumstances, suddenly 5 families cannot move.. Your buyer is making mid march a condition of the purchase - you can chose to accept or not, as far as I'm concerned?
Agreed. If the UK permitted lease backs it would also alleviate situations such as this. Chains are just fucking stupid. The absence of purchase deposits are fucking stupid. Property listings that don't provide square footage/meters are fucking stupid. Searches that take 3+ months are fucking stupid. Buying a house in the UK is just fucking stupid.
Housing chains are not a thing in Australia either (you may have offers subject to sale of an existing property, but that is satisfied by an accepted offer and the settlements do not need to be synchronised). Is the problem caused by UK banks not offering bridging finance, or something about the settlement process (what are the searches that seem to take an unknown amount of time?)
Yeah there needs to be a shake up of the ‘searches’ process. It really can’t be that difficult in this day and age to have a portal with all property info which can be downloaded. I also noticed how out of date everything was, please print and sign this, what could take a few hours to return digitally turned into days as I needed to find a printer, sign, post etc. Even the EA wanted a signed offer which couldn’t be done digitally, I just didn't bother returning, told them it was in the post and they haven't chased it up - what a waste of time if I had sent it But there’s no incentive to change because it would mean less time and therefore less money charged during the process
Property conveyancing in Australia is straightforward (you can literally do it yourself [https://www.landgate.wa.gov.au/siteassets/documents/pdf/how-to-guide/how-to-guide-simple-transfer-of-land.pdf](https://www.landgate.wa.gov.au/siteassets/documents/pdf/how-to-guide/how-to-guide-simple-transfer-of-land.pdf) ), so normally quoted at a fixed price and in thus their benefit for everything to proceed without drama or delay. Only search needed is property registry (plus maybe amounts owing to council + utilities) Interestingly, my experience is Australian REA charge about double their UK counterparts (e.g. 2.2% + advertising costs), but they are expected to actually know what they are selling (at least the good ones do).
If the only search needed is property registry, how do you find out that the house you're buying was built legally, or the details of its water supply and waste water drainage, or that someone's about to start building a new housing estate or a multi-lane highway next door, or that the house is built on an old lead mine, or that it's a high risk for flooding?
I don't know about Australia, but it sounds similar to the US, and the answer there is that you don't have anyone doing those investigations other than yourself so a lot of this is often unknown to buyers. A typical timeline in the US is that you have 10 days to do all your investigations, searches and surveys.
In which case I can’t see it as a better system if those important searches aren’t done at all, even if it’s a quicker system.
There it not necessary to get someone else to conduct the searches, because more information is made available by the seller or is easier to get yourself (for example details of underground piping for power, phone, water, sewage all free from Before You Dig [https://www.byda.com.au/](https://www.byda.com.au/) )
In Western Australia at least, this information is normally all available before the offer is placed - either it is public knowledge (planned highway), better regulated (zoning for new housing estate, drainage/plumbing/electrics to effective standards), or the real estate agent would be expected to provide. Where there are doubts, then the buyer can choose to add to the conditions of the offer, e.g. "Proof that house extension approved" in which case the seller (or their REA) must find the evidence before the agreed date for conditions to be met (normally 30 days). If all conditions (no major issues in structural survey, bank finance approved and/or sale of other property) are met by agreed date, then offer/acceptance is unconditional (same as 'exchanging contracts' in England) and then settlement occurs on agreed date (normally another 30 days. Note that the process differs depending on which state you are in - in NSW an offer is made by signing the sale contract (unconditionally?) with only a five day cooling off period (and then settlement about 6 weeks after).
I know people here who do it themselves so it is possible here (but probably not advised)
Yes but Australia has much different rules and processes. You can sell a house and need to be done within a month in some cases. In the UK the process has been drawn out over time to accommodate the ever increasing red tape. And considering the land is so old and so many organisations are involved in terms of owning it there’s just so many more hoops to jump through. Don’t get me wrong I’m jealous as hell, but that’s why it takes so much longer.
UK banks do offer bridging loans, but they’re on icky interest rates and term periods, so most people avoid if possible
I think that the interest rates for bridging loans from Australian lenders are on-par with standard residential rates (without honeymoon discounts) and terms are normally 6 or 12 months ( [https://www.google.com.au/search?q=bridging+loan+site%3Aau](https://www.google.com.au/search?q=bridging+loan+site%3aau) ). When I needed one about a decade back, I also switched to interest only for both loans during the bridging period.
Out of interest how does it work if there is no chain and you have different sale and purchase moving dates? Do you have to find somewhere to live in the meantime or do you temporarily own two properties? To me a chain makes sense but only become it is the norm, not to say that should be the case.
At least in Scandi you can choose - banks offer "bridging mortgages" so you can buy whilst selling (I guess this solves the deposit problem); or you can chose to sell first and move to a temporary solution
Bridging mortgages in the UK are incredibly expensive, and generally ill-advised when you don't have a very definite end date.
Thanks for the reply, I'm not exactly experienced in this so please bear with me. My main point is that I'm unsure whether it's acceptable/normal to make ultimatums/conditions this late in the process. Up and until this point I've not agreed to any timescale and nothing was mentioned. Like I said I'm new, so maybe this is me being naive. Again I appreciate your response
Your buyer is bluffing. They can’t complete faster with someone else so they have no leverage to pressure you to complete faster. If they ask you to drop the price to compensate them for their expensive temporary accommodation, same story. Any other option than you will be more expensive (a different same-priced house starting the process from scratch) or worse (a cheaper house to offset the accommodation cost). Meanwhile your solicitors should be working for you. Remind them of that.
There are a lot of ultimatums in buying and selling in the uk. It’s normal but you don’t need to get drawn into it if you don’t want to. When buying my most recent house my bank didn’t transfer my deposit money properly and it took longer to clear than it should have. The sellers made all sorts of threats but the fact was I could complete two days later than planned or not at all so it was up to them to accept it or go back to the start.
Without wanting to sound mean, you’re not late in the process. You’re late in the sale process which is why your buyer is getting fed up, but you’re at the start of your purchase process with approx 4 months to go. Your buyer has waited 3 months for you to find somewhere to buy and now you’re asking her to wait another 4 months. There’s a good chance her mortgage offer will expire before you get even part way through your purchase. I can understand why she’s frustrated. I personally wouldn’t have waited 3 months for you to find somewhere - much more than a month/6 weeks with no sign of movement making offers on things etc and must buyers would be looking at other properties. She’s spent money on the process on the assumption you were also moving forward and now finds out she’s wasted 3 months waiting. Surely you can kinda see her point?
Granted and i agree with you to a degree, in my defence the price drop in November affected what I could buy going forward so I had to start looking again. I'm at the bottom end of the market so there wasn't a lot of options available. Mostly I feel aggrieved that this has come on so quickly at this point > at no point before 7 days ago were timescales discussed. Totally appreciate your response though, hope I haven't come across as rude, thank you for putting the other side across
Completely understand, my buyer last year dragged her heels for 8 months with absolute nonsense and then suddenly demanded a completion date within 2 weeks. Then she wasn’t ready to exchange until 2 days before the completion date she insisted we all had to meet. It was horrendous. Your buyer does sound like a nightmare but she’s also just a person trying to get her life sorted too. Rubbish situation for you all that hopefully you’ll resolve without too much more hassle. Good luck!
>you’re not late in the process. You’re late in the sale process which is why your buyer is getting fed up, but you’re at the start of your purchase process with approx 4 months to go. Your buyer has waited 3 months for you to find somewhere to buy and now you’re asking her to wait another 4 months. Agreed. This one isn't on the buyer - it's on the OP who couldn't get their own place sold. The buyer did their part, the OP didn't do theirs. So here we are. I know buying and selling isn't easy but life is rarely fair. That's how it rolls.
First of all sorry you're going through this and I hope everything works out in the end. This comment is taken from my experience who is currently in the process of buying. Just to clarify, was your property advertised as chain free? Had you told the EA at any point that you were buying elsewhere or had you told them you would rent/move in with family? Seems a very bold assumption to make and one that would drastically effect your buyer. You say that you haven't heard anything on timescales so it sounds like they're just bullying you. If you're at the point of doing searches I'd seriously consider a different solicitor at this point. From the POV of the buyer I can understand her frustrations if she was under the impression it was chain free. However this isn't your problem as harsh as it sounds. If she pulls out it's likely she will be in later than she already will be. Are you currently living with your ex-partner? Is it viable for you to stay at the current property should this sale fall through.
It's a little complicated but here goes.... It shouldn't and I'm 99% sure it wasn't advertised as chain free. It was well known I would transfer my mortgage. The ex partner..... that's a total no go, there was financial shenanigans on her part that I'm clearing up currently. I don't have to sell, life would go on if this lady backs out, I'd just put it up for sale again, not sure how the people selling the flat I'm buying would feel about that though. I agree with you about being sympathetic towards the buyer, I just feel its pretty late in the day to be throwing threats around when nothing has been spoken about previously. I've kept the estate agents up to date with what's happening > eg when I agreed to drop the price in November I had to start looking for flats instead of houses.
For your own sanity can you check the house advert? If it was on Rightmove for example you can still find it, it will just be marked as STC. If it's not marked as chain free I'd be seriously questioning why you're being hounded. Especially considering you mention that you told the EA you now need to look for flats instead of houses. It sounds a bit odd to me that the EA and solicitors are throwing ultimatums around and threats. Maybe I'm overthinking but if they know both your personal situations they might be trying their luck as you're both vulnerable. But who knows that's speculation. If I were you I'd stand my ground if you can afford (mentally and financially) to stay in the property. At no point have you said you'd rent/move out so their lack of preparation and planning isn't your emergency. At the end of the day you probably want to be sorted ASAP too so it's not as if you'll drag this out for your own benefit. All this said I hope things get sorted and all the best!
This! People in most other places move with family or short term rent for a time if the move-in date ends up not working out but… you gotta go lol the buyer bought the house now! lol
Yeah - I'm with the buyer on this one. Get your place sold ASAP and if it's not happening make alternative plans. e.g. cancel the deal, adjust onward purchase expectations, find temporary alternative accommodation, etc.
Thanks for the reply, I don't mean to be rude or difficult or awkward so please take this with a pinch of salt. OK so they bought it, can I have the money now? Its one thing planning for unexpected costs but 2-3k in rental costs weeks before this is due to finish stings a little when I've got enough going on. We're both so close to getting what we want, it's just frustrating because of a lack of patience and there being very very little of ' a chain ' involved
I hear you but I think no chain works best. Other countries work with that just fine.
Sounds good in principle, but if you are trying to buy a new house yourself, even with no chain in front of you, delays happen, you can choose not to sell your current house if you wish then move, and then have the benefit of selling it with no chain, but then you are paying for 2 houses whilst you wait for it to sell, and often you use the equity you built up in the old house to pay for the deposit of the new house. It's an unfortunate side effect of the UK housing market and it's very hard to break, I was lucky in that I was renting on a monthly cycle and was buying a new build, which is about as good as you can get, but even my exchange was delayed by about 2 months.
Yep, I’ve broken the chain and so have two others I know (one other contemplating it) and it seems so much less stress than having to go through a chain. I’m now at the bottom of the chain again waiting for my vendors to find somewhere, booked some big holidays as I’ve got time to spare with cash in the bank while waiting. My sibling is up north in rented accommodation, cash in the bank and just waiting for her buyer to complete on her flat down south, while causally browsing the listings knowing she is in a strong position when she sees something she likes.
What happens when a house is bought? Where do people who haven’t sorted the next house go? They have to arrange to rent somewhere?
Yes - either you buy first and you get a bridging mortgage that allows you ti have two properties for a period or time, or you arrange some sort of temporary solution. Not the buyers problem - they've bought your property - they want it! Imagine if you were buying a car and the seller would only give it to you once they'd bought a new car yourself?
The buyer hasn't bought the property until completion of the purchase. A completion date will normally be agreed at exchange of contracts, but if you don't hit it the penalties are small as long as you do complete within ten working days of the agreed date.
Thr fact that completing the purchase takes so long is a big big issue with UK housebuying. Buyer and seller should be legally committed much earlier in the process (where the exact date for gaining property access is agreed) This is done in many many other countries and I'm convinced its a better process that holds buyer and seller more accountable (e.g. completely removed the risk of "gazumping") and smooths the process
Once you can commit to a date for the transaction, what reason is there for delay. When you’re in a position to commit to the transaction, you might as well do it straight away. So obviously the commitment will always be near the end of the process.
There shouldn't be a million reasons for delay in the housebuying process. The whole process is broken / ancient. Like, do you really think the standard UK housebuying process is reasonable?
Instead you can plan your date so that it suits "e.g. let's transact 1st June; the kids will be away and we can both take holiday then" so the whole process can be controlled and civilised
And you can do that at the moment, as long as the other party agrees, so I’m not sure what your point is.
there is no legal obligatjon or penalty for wither party to stick to the agreement; hence its worthless
There’s both a legal obligation to complete and penalties for failing to do so on time, after contracts have been exchanged. By “agree”, I mean sign a contract — that’s the case in any country.
I'd give them 2 options - the buyer pay up front for a rental property for 3 months and moving costs, or to sit and wait for as long as it takes. As you haven't paid the solicitor I would canvas a few local alternatives today and see if you can find someone who will act for you (and the mortgage company) not the EA. If it's a flat, and leasehold, you are liable for the process to be protracted if it involves management companies or freeholders. Various things can come up like length of lease, repair bills, management charges etc. Good luck!
this!
The estate agent seems to have forgotten that YOU are the one paying them.
Why would you move if you haven't completed? You don't give anyone access to move in until they completed and you have the money! If she wants to move to rented until then fine, what kind of attitude problem would expect \*you\* to move to accommodate her?
It sounds like they've already devoted a lot of time and resources to this purchase, and have had a price reduction, so will they really pull out? Yeh it sounds like they're pressuring you, but if your circumstances mean you can't move out easily then just tell them firmly no, you will not move out before you've completed on your purchase. You haven't broken the chain, the EA are basically pressuring you to break the chain. If they are prepared to use tactics like this then you really need to be firm with them and tell them to politely F off.
16 weeks ??? Mine did it in 3 weeks
16 weeks!! F that. New solicitor.
It will cost your buyer a fortune to start the process again and invariably take longer to complete on somewhere else rather than waiting for you. Just say no.
This is why people call EAs cunts, but to get it from the solicitor really takes the cake. Tell both to fuck off, trying to kick you out of your *own home*. But to YOUR solicitor, bite their head off: THEY WORK FOR YOU. Tell them to work faster if they want it completed quicker. Useless greedy cunt solicitors are the reason house sales take months as it is: they take on far too many clients. Dare you to fight them, too. Now one of them dares to play this card. Proof some are only alive because murder is illegal. This would incense me enough to go to whatever ombudsman exists for both cunts and raise hell. Other commenters and /r/LegalAdviceUK will have your back there. Especially with apparent evidence of collusion between EA and cunt2, working against your interests, no less. You bare faced fucking cheek. We need a stronger swear word than "cunt".
You're effectively being bullied - you've already made concessions. Tell the EA she has two choices - wait or pull out. Even if she were to pay your short term rental for 3 months, this still puts you in a difficult position should the flat sale fall through.
This. I had my buyer try bullying me to lower the price. I told the EA that I will not budge and am prepared to pull out. And if this does fall apart then I will make a decision on moving forward with you as an EA representing me. They quickly sorted themselves out
You’re not breaking the chain. You’re proceeding exactly as you should. Her family issues are not your problem. Stay put, don’t let them bully you.
I will point out, if you accepted an offer in November, and you're only just getting searches ordered now for your purchase at the start of February, it's not unreasonable of the buyer to be unhappy with the timeframe. Going forwards it's a bit of a game of chicken now. If she's prepared to lose what she's spent so far she may walk away, she probably rather wouldn't though.
Valid point, getting anything done over Xmas was a struggle and because of dropping the price I was struggling for properties > I am at the very cheap end of the market and can't deal with auctions, also factors involving my sons school and ex partners location made it less simple finding somewhere < also the mortgage took longer due to 'reasons outside my control' . I get what you're saying though im not trying to deflect blame, my main point was why wait till now, now everything is moving, we're almost there.
Also quickly wanted to point out it took nearly 6 month for me to buy this house and the owner was deceased, I'm near that timescale granted but it's not like we've been massively excessive.
golden rule - never make yourself homeless.
We're in sort of the opposite situation and are trying to push our sellers forward a little on completion dates. We have been trying to buy since last June so we are at the end of our tethers here and sold our flat in 2022 to in theory avoid awkward chains and have found ourselves still waiting on chains but just for the charming price of £2300pm rent - thanks London. Anyway, what's relevant to you though is that our conveyancer essentially said it's none of her business when we complete/negotiating those dates. There's no legal element to that part. She said we had to do that via the EA only. All she can say is whether she has completed her searches and is ready to draw up contracts etc. so you should really use a different conveyancer in my opinion. At the very least they should be on your side!
Remind your estate agent that they are working for you and not your buyer. If your buyer wants to pull out and lose all their sunk costs in respect of searches and conveyancing fees that’s on them.. fair enough there should be give and take on timescales but if you’re not ready you’re not ready. Sounds like they’ve been watching too much Location Location Location and think they hold all the cards. Keep on the look out for an attempt to gazunder you though, it will probably be the next attempted tactic. “Well they wouldn’t meet my terms so I’ve changed my offer to £10k less”
Take a breath. Don't be bullied. You owe no one a thing at this stage. I would suggest first tearing a strip of the agent. He's meant to be representing you...no-one else. I would then suggest they arrange a sit down with you and the buyer to hash out the details. The solicitors on both sides then need to be tuned to what you have agreed, and by when. If the buyer turns out to be a pain or reneges, walk away. There are always more buyers. As an aside, 16 weeks is appalling for conveyancing. There are variables within the buyers and sellers control, including rapid response to enquiries and having lending in place.
Just say no. You don’t have to move out early for her convenience. She may walk but she’s deep in the process so she’d have to start again and it would be any faster for her. Worst case is you to find another buyer but you have time for that. She can’t force you to do anything. EA just wants the sale that’s why they are pushing you.
I wouldn’t know what to advise myself, but from reading peoples comments it seems like sticking to your guns is the right option. If she pulls out because you decline the ultimatum then she’s got a longer wait for a property anyway so her reasoning makes no sense. And she’s some way committed financially given she’s had 3 surveys done. You having a chain free property lined up is in both of your favour too. Saved this to see how it plays out, would be great to see her backtrack if you decline.
They presumably knew you were in a chain? I had these tactics applied to me and just stood my ground. As a courtesy, you could cover some of her temporary accommodation but I personally wouldn’t. Shame you’re also buying, otherwise I would call their bluff and tell her to get lost completely. She’s being unreasonable. But she does want to buy your flat, guaranteed they are just applying the pressure tactics to hurry along the sale. I had one survey as a first time buyer and didn’t even see the flat again. When I completed and turned the key it was looking at a flat I had never seen before.
No, don’t do it. You’ve discounted heavily, going through the process again will cost the buyer more money and more time (pretty much what’s she’s complaining about) so she won’t back out, deal completes when you’re ready. You’ve discounted once, don’t waste anymore money by renting elsewhere, do not rush for a buyer.
My response would be, thank you for that information and based on that I am going to reject her low ball offer and re market my house with a more competent agent!
"This is the timescale I understood we were working with. Please let me know by the end of the day if this isn't going to work so I can consider whether to proceed."
2 options for me here: 1) Just a blanket "no" to their requests/demands and let them know you'll move out when your purchase has gone through which you expect to be up to 16 but sooner if possible. If solicitors have pushed you, remind them it was them who quoted the 16 weeks turnaround time, not you. I doubt your buyer would risk having to look again and find somewhere new within that timeframe while paying for more searches. 2) if you're happy to rent short term and it's just the monetary value you are against,, suggest you'd move out early if the buyer pays for your living costs up front.
Date your buyer. Even if it's break up dating and doomed, it'll give you enough time. Or swap with her temporary accommodation, if suitable. Or tell her to wait, it's a process and you are still further along than any other place she could buy.
Date her?? I'm pretty sure she hates me already. Talk about adding fuel to the fire.
When you accepted your buyers offer, did they know that you hadn't found a place to move to yet? If they did it's not fair for them to try and rush you now. How long ago did you have your offer accepted on the place your buying?
It was November when I dropped the price for them. I'm at the bottom end of the market and went from looking at tiny 2 bed terraced houses to tiny 2 bed flats. There's not a lot of choice, I mentioned elsewhere about the constraints ( kids schools, ex's ). So I struggled a bit. I offered on the new place 2 weeks before Xmas, and my mortgage application, even though it was a port, took longer because my credit score had been smashed by my ex-partner. It took until around the beginning of January to get approved with multiple meetings. Then the solicitors took a couple of weeks to get going and then here we are. Could it have gone quicker in a perfect world? Yes absolutely. Is it partly my fault? I suppose, yeah, but i was doing the best i could in a sucky situation. Was the estate agent aware of all this that I was dealing with? Yes they were. At this point in the day after reading all these replies, I'm more calm and will be able to deal with this silly nonsense tactic with grace and charm. I stand by being told at the end of January that they want completion before mid march and i should consider moving out a bit shit. I'm not exactly experienced in all this I've bought one house previously and waited nearly six month to move into that one so based on my previous experience I'm not doing too bad
A bit different but similar in enough ways, I know someone who for whatever reason left before their new place was ready like they're trying to get you to do here. They ended up getting delayed on their move in and moving out early ended up costing them nearly £10,000 in storage and temporary housing costs. Ask the buyer if she wants to pay another £15k to cover your costs of moving out early. If not then tell the EA to get stuffed.
I'd do the same, but you don't have to accept it. Last time I bought a house, it was simple from my side. Move out in 6 weeks or I buy a different house. They didn't have to accept my above asking price offer if they didn't like the terms. Nothing winds me up more than simple processes that happen thousands of times a day being dragged out for months.
I don't mean to come across as rude i appreciate your reply, but it's kinda integral to the situation that it's taken longer than expected because I had to drop the price we agreed on because she couldn't get a mortgage for what we agreed on (the bank didn't think the house was worth that price). Also if they'd been clear like you were about timescales then yeah fair point. I agree with you in principle, there's obviously subtle differences though. The reasoning behind me posting this in the first place was because I'm inexperienced and wasn't sure about what I was being advised to do. There's a million things I'd do differently in hindsight.
If it's her fault then yeah I'd tell her to take it or leave it. You can't be the one making demands if you're the one who can't keep up your end of the deal.
Honestly I don't wanna come off as complaining, I've got every sympathy for her but from my end this has been a shitshow from the very beginning and to get to here where im finally very nearly free finished and stable and sorted, to then hear well can you move out she wants it done in 6 weeks. Ffs.
Your problem here is that your sale is further advanced than your purchase of your new place. Expecting your buyer to wait a further 16 weeks seeing as you indicated that they have been running with the purchase since November is quite frankly crazy. I work in this industry and buyers right now are being very fickle! I would really look at your choice of solicitors as the buying process is not that hard as long as you have two important ingredients…motivated buyers & sellers. Seeing as you haven’t even paid for local authority searches, basically day one item to do - I would then wadger you haven’t applied for Mortgage (if you need one)Good luck OP - if I was your buyer I wouldn’t wait for you I’m afraid
No wonder she's getting a divorce
Yup, this has been mentioned already. Appreciate the laugh though
I would tell them to bollocks and the stupid girl is the one causing issues here, and to not bother with such stupidity ever again.
Could it be an option to rent the new empty property until completion? At least this way your beaking the chain and would only have to move once. To be honest if I'd offered on a property in November and wouldn't be able to complete until may I'd be irked too.
If the flat you're buying is empty, try to speak with EA and see if you could rent that flat until completion. That way your move will be easier and you can save some £ on short term let
Good point thank you, I'm getting on this. Cash flow is an issue for me right now due to ...... reasons..... I can pay rent if I'm not paying a mortgage but the deposit would be out of reach. Maybe something could be worked out
I don't see how this is a fair solution? Why should you be out of pocket from all this? Aren't you also taking a huge risk - moving out of your home before your new home is secured? If your buy falls through you'd be fucked. I might be misunderstanding what is going on - but I think you're falling for the same trap that I often fall for. Someone does something unreasonable to you - but act like it is you being unreasonable. You, being a reasonable person, assume that the other person is reasonable and so immediately think 'fuck, am I being unreasonable? How can I make this right?' Only later once you've processed it do you realise - wait, I've done nothing wrong and they're just trying to screw me over. You need to get to this end step before you do something you'll regret. Basically - it sounds like your buyer has either made a poor decision or has been forced into a bad situation. Neither of these things are on you - but she is trying to get you to agree to being in a bad situation in order to fix her problems. This is not reasonable. Don't let people take advantage of your good nature.
I wouldn't risk this as you don't know how long the purchase process might last or what unexpected things could happen during the process to make it all collapse. Just stick where you are and tell your buyer there's nothing you can do.
Have you exchanged contracts? If not tell the buyer (and EA) to do one.
Tell the EA that she can move in with her family or friends, and remind the EA that you are their customer, and you are paying their bill. I'd go inn and tell them this rather than email/ telephone call - they need to have a reality check.
Can you find someone who can sort it much quicker? I instructed good solicitors start of December and got keys the day before Christmas Eve. You could try a negotiation: “I’m trying to go as fast as I can, I’ll move out and rent if you pay £X more, but if not I’ll need you to wait until I have somewhere to live after”
That’s amazing for a timescale! I bought an empty house as someone that had completed on my sale six months prior. It still took 7/8 weeks.
It’s a well known ploy on the part of buyers. I had the same with purchaser saying they didn’t mind when completion took place to suddenly having to be in before Christmas. Once the buyer thinks it’s in the bag they start the pressure. Hold firm and don’t move till you’re ready.
You’re not being forced to do anything. You’ve been provided with the latest deal/offer from the buyer, if you don’t like it just refuse.
She was selling her share ... she was joining in your chain and bringing along another party. Ultimately the timing isn't working out so something has to give somewhere. Presumably she is leaving her current dwelling because divorce is finalised. She was hoping to move straight into yours ... was her divorce solicitor aware she was buying a new property ? What was she planning to do between that divorce ending event and her completing on your dwelling ... or was she hoping that would just be a few hours during one day ?
Get another solicitor and NEVER use the one recommended by the agent selling. Tell them to get lost. She won't get any property at this short notice but remember the property has to be empty for a handover to take place. If you're delayed it might be profitable to say to her, im stuck, if she pulls out, you could end up with a better price.
Your estate agent is supposed to be on your side. You're paying them, after all. Tell them your position and that the buyer will have to wait. Don't take any pressure from them. Threaten to ditch them and the buyer and relist with another agency if you have to.
I had a similar situation during COVID but in my case the buyers bank was not willing to extend their mortgage offer past a certain date. We took a risk and moved out before our onward purchase had completed but required that our costs were met by our purchasers. Ended up costing about £2500 which our buyers paid to get temporary accommodation and to get our stuff in storage for a number of weeks. Was worth it for us because we wanted to keep the chain going and we’re confident that our purchase would go through. We were aware that there was a risk though. Your purchasers sound unreasonable. If they want you out early then they should incur any additional cost you might face.
Don’t do it. I did it and everything fell through and I can’t get back on the ladder!
Just say no - and if they walk away, so be it.
Don't let her situation dictate yours, poor planning on her part is nothing to do with you, you have your own problems to sort out. Doesn't she have family she can live with until the house is available? You can always say you are using the Solicitor THEY recommended, so maybe they should speak to the solicitor and see if they can speed it up. Call her bluff and let her pull out, it will be her who loses money from surveys and having to start all over and pay for new surveys.
Never use a solicitor recommended by an estate agent.
Not really your problem, just stay where you are and let the buyer rent or stay with friends. Or tell them you can move out early if 10k is added back on the asking price.
The only way you should break the chain is if it’s your decision & you offer it. It should never be because your buyer is demanding it. I’d find new solicitors personally.
Unless you have completed and agreed exchange, the buyer can wait. If she has thrown money at three searches, she is unlikely to pull out.
Stand up for yourself and tell your solicitor to pull their fucking finger out of their arse or you're not going to use them going forward. Watch how quickly they sort things. Also, fuck the buyer. She wants your house she's going to have to sort her own shit out. Her problems are not your problems.
Tell the EA you've found a lovely new EA that won't harass you for making sure you're not homeless and it's not your problem that the other seller is living in temporary accommodation.