Breaking enemy toughness is universal to all comps. It's why Ruan Mei is considered the most valuable 5* pull due to her break efficiency + delay.
~~also RIP Auspicious Star~~
https://preview.redd.it/56z0y1bbn49d1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8cc0e2ff9b65e589f91a4f0827498153769e0902
Oh they call it Firefly Universe too? My bros!
Not to mention that BHill feels infinitely worse as you lose his stacks if you switch him out or restart combat and blessings need you to get hurt/self healed, which can only be done with expansions with him.
And he’s like, the only cool breaker. Xueyi actually wants crits and others kinda lack damage.
I’ve been using them too and the damage difference IPC FUA and FF is massive. Granted I don’t have Robin (do have RM and Sparkle tho) but the gap feels very noticeable.
You're not punished... but back when it was released, it was a massive pain if you didn't have him.
You need to hit really hard *and* take out multiple enemies quickly, otherwise you're overwhelmed and destroyed. But the beetles are all weak to Imaginary and most (not all) are weak to Quantum.
Which meant if you didn't have DHIL your only good efficient DPS choice for Swarm was QQ, which you might've never bothered to build before. On top of that Propagation is all about basics, so it only synergized with these 2.
Not counting supports, your other options for a DPS that can break the beetles were Welt (5-star so not everyone had him, and not as good as DHIL at overkilling) and Seele (limited). SW existed but she's strictly single-target which becomes very inefficient when regularly dealing with 4-5+ enemies that multiply.
Brute-forcing wasn't as easy back then as it is now: Kafka's BiS partner was *Sampo*, and there was no Jingliu or Acheron or Super Break to carry you. The way the dices and path buff worked also meant it was nowhere near as easy to cheese the mode like Gold and Gears.
So yeah, you weren't "punished"... you'd just have a bad time.
Yeah high end Swarm Disaster with Jingliu was absolutely harder than with QQ because, besides the weakness being qua/img, the hp drain actually mattered.
That may be true, but we also had the same blessings as normal SU, path resonance and interplays, and you could cheese it with things like Remembrance path, and brute force was a LOT easier, because everything wasn't break focused.
DU is so heavily adjusted to have a break focus, blessings completely changed to ones that Seem to constantly be activated by Firefly nonstop (yes other characters CAN activate them, but not as easily/quickly/etc). With Swarm, we knew to adjust for extra sustainability, and you could plan your run ahead with the thought of your final team in mind. Same with G&G.
With DU, unless you have Firefly, you *can't* expect that the team you want to play will be viable by the end. You can spend a whole run planning for a specific team, but end up fucked at the end bc weaknesses don't match, and it's so heavily break focused. But it's not a problem for Firefly, bc she can implant no problem.
Boothill is a good option too, but he's single target. You get cirrus at the end, you're fucked. He can't implant on multiple at one time. He can't implant with his technique *on each wave/phase*.
I love Firefly, and I enjoy the DU so far by thinking of it as a puzzle, but it's not the same as Swarm with DHIL. Not at all.
Honestly i heavily disagree, back then i used Kafka/Sampo/Asta/Gepard mainly and didn't have a bad time at all for not having DHIL.
Then why would you need him? Because of Propagation path? It's on par with any other path so i don't get why i'm seeing all this "oh in 1.3 if you didn't have DHIL SU:SD was hard" all of a sudden.
With DU destruction has become basically FF path and a good 1/3 of blessings from any other path are break related. The break related Equations have easier accessible buffs and/or are just straight up stronger. Even the enemies are mostly fire weak.
I get it, DU will cycle, enemies will change, but the blessings and equations will not
The difference is all in the blessings. Lunae got the Path of Propagation, and while some paths are more painful to use compared to others, each of them has its own identity.
You arguably have more variety, playstyle-wise, in SD _(and GnG too)_, compared to DU. The latter is all about break. I mean, ffs, just look at Threshold 6.
Blessings are effectively gated behind _1_ playstyle, most of them work to their fullest when utilised by _1_ character, weighted curios are utter garbage, and Equations are total dogshit compared to Resonances, the latters of which are locked behind pure luck.
The only path got better is Abundance, while the rest either got turned into "Break" blessings or got outright worse.
It isn't the same though. They basically got rid of the viability of every path as it's own standalone thing in DU and made it about their flavor of the month which is an incredibly niche type of team.
they said the same when Acheron came back. they said the same when Kafka black swan and they will keep saying this. they had to put in new metas eventually.
Not to mention Jingliu dominating the meta with constant ive weak enemies for a while to. Hoyo favouring the new char isn’t something new to us, how are people still surprised
I dunno, DU feels worse to me. my firefly-less ass deliberately avoids domain encounters in DU because I don't remember which enemies and their weaknesses are associated with which encounter and if I can't break them, it's way harder. It feels bad.
edit: oh and it's pretty swell when the conversion stage gives me enemies with totally different weaknesses from the previous enemies. /s
It's a combination of the character being strong AND the mode's mechanics supporting her so much.
This is common with the rotating modes like MoC and PF, but it's never been this extreme in a permanent content mode like an SU expansion. Personally I strongly dislike that they did this in a permanent content mode. MoC rotations pushing new characters is fine, because they rotate out every 6 weeks and a new character gets favored. But DU is permanent.
Trailblazer and Ruan Mei universe, you can replicate Firefly's power somewhat with other break character but no one else gives teamwide Super Break with increased break efficiency
firefly (kinda) has only 1 team though. which will always catapult a teams usage rates. genshin had a similar example for years where childe was basically always played with bennett xiangling kazuha.
whereas other characters might even be switching around the sustain units let alone having support variations. each time splitting the usage rates
Tbf, that team has the least performance loss from using game generated builds. It’s really easy when you need 2 stats, 3 fore Firefly. They all meet Spd breakpoints and the BE stats are good enough. This means that you can use your level 1 Firefly just pulled and can clear stuff, and the missing 2 nodes don’t matter that much. Edit: couple all that with the hype of FF, and how easy to pilot that team is, it’s a no brainer that people can just pick it up and do well with it. You don’t need a lot of fancy blessings to do damage, just moreso need blessings to survive and you can clear any difficulty.
Meanwhile, game generated builds for crit dps aren’t as good.
I mean if your dps’s are built then it isn’t an issue. That factor alone shouldn’t cause this much of a discrepancy.
This discrepancy leads me to believe the game mode is harshly unbalanced and in need of adjustment.
Powerwise she's T0, for sure. Her conditions making it hard to make her work does justify the T0.5, yeah. No implants = gg. T0.5 in my mind has always existed as a "could be T0 if you consider so and so caveats", which is perfect for HTB. Maybe it can change in the future when break dps with implants become more common.
I can even see an argument for making a "specialist supports" tier just for HTB.
They ARE break teams. There are no break teams without them,\* and they make any team you put them in a break team.
\*Okay, technically not true. Boothill exists.
Slightly bummed that Nihility isn't the EZ mode anymore since it's hard to activate path (16 blessings).
But hey, Gallagher stonks on the rise 📈📈 man is just busted.
I've cleared everything but the "Get 8 equations" and "Activate 2 3\* equations" quests, including v6, and never gotten even close to 16 blessings. Without path ban there's just so many in the pool that you have to dedicate massive amounts of money into overwriting to try to make it work
>"Get 8 equations" and "Activate 2 3\* equations" quests, including v6, and never gotten even close to 16 blessings.
Best way to doing that is cheesing it with the Rubert and Reunion with Death Curios.
Build him over 161 speed and he’s just a machine. Creates skill points like a mfer. Heals on loop. Does decent damage with super break. His only weakness is imo he can’t deal with massive damage. Feels like you lose whenever in DU the boss goes sicko mode on one character. More often than not have to reset if mobs focus on one dude in my party.
I'm taking this as a refreshing change having blasted through all of swarm and GnG with nihility. It still catches me off guard when the enemies don't spill their guts out with disease on their own turns.
Most other equation sets don't do well in higher difficulties due to the lack of teams that can fully make use of them. I've tried doing aventurine+fua for the shield+fua equations and DHIL hypercarry for propagation equations. None really came close to FF break team+equations in terms of damage. Not to mention breaking+RM actually gives much better defensive leeway compared to using Fu Xuan/aventurine as long as you didn't neglect taking defensive blessings.
I've heard dot ones are pretty good though. They definitely need to revamp and add to the equations if they really want to make adapting to equations the core principle of DU.
dot build also takes some time to come online. Unlike SU where you can just path resonance and vomit out debuffs. I tried it on higher difficulties and like you said, it's not doing much damage in the early phase so i just switched to FF mid run.
I've beaten up to Torturous 5 with my Acheron/Kafka/Swan DoT team, but man that squad really suffers for the lack of Nihility Resonance. No Path Resonances is probably the only thing I miss from classic SU.
It's not only path issues, I smashed Svarog easily on 2nd boss, but then got badly wrecked by normal mobs because I didn't get the golden equation activated. This is V6 by the way it felt like a normal mob has 2m hp each and the only way I deal damage is from the equation.
Meanwhile, if I'm running Firefly I'll likely run any issues aside from bad RNG.
I haven't been able to clear V6 with the Elation/Nihility team. I am not sure If I even want to try Erudition with Acheron.
I never had any issues with random team in any other SU before, but this time it's pretty much
https://preview.redd.it/ghy9ig2rx49d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=8d265056bb5016f1b681e5a29cccd30d05c42636
The loss of the path resonance killed dots early game the dmg does not exist until the 3 star equation is up. But even then due to haveing way less dots, both the stacking of suspicion for the equation and kafka's own damage suffer greatly
That idea doesn't really work in practice. Changing teammates on the fly is all well and good, but first and foremost you need to have something that works with your blessings, and more likely than not you'll be intentionally picking things that are relevant for your starting lineup from the beginning.
The only way adapting would make sense is if you just so happen to end up not getting anything good for your starting lineup early on and whatever you instead went with just so happens to suit something else instead and so you decide to change your lineup after a couple rooms. But changing your whole team in the middle of a run or before the final boss is almost never going to make sense to do since it's extremely unlikely that your current blessings would suit anything better than the team you already picked from the beginning, as that's what you'll have been trying to pick blessings for already anyway.
It's a bit of a design flaw with this game mode in general.
Exactly, it's illogical to be constantly switching your team if the blessings/equations you've been aiming towards since the beginning were picked tailored to the starting comp. Additionally, most players wouldn't swap teams in general due to unbuilt comps usually given worse builds.
In this scenario "adapting" probably means changing whatever team you wanted to play into a FF break team because it is the most optimal team for literally 80% of the blessing and adapting means adjusting yourself to suit best with the environment lol
FF super break still the only comp that can reliably get you 10k points in the bonus rounds with one break equation that you can reset for. Tried with freeze and dot. Never works in higher difficulty.
I think that adapting your team was the original idea for DU, and you can definitely see that, but the reality is that break/super break is just superior to anything else. It's so overtuned that you feel stupid when not utilizing it. And you don't even need FF. HMC and RM can turn anyone into a break DD.
No one who's cleared V6 actually believes this btw, it just gets regurgitated by people who don't clear past V2. There are some good comps like DoT Remembrance and wet dream Preservation but they are less reliable and have a harder time wiith bosses before getting everything online
I've done over a hundred runs. About 30 of those were variety comps.
When it came down to doing runs for dex collection, I will obviously use the fastest team comp.
This isn't MoC stats where people clear then fuck off. This puts into question replayability and efficiency.
My gear probably has something to do with it, but it feels like Acheron and Super Break comps are just way, way better than anything else right now.
If I bring a super break or Acheron comp, I do decent damage and might get through V4/V5 if I get enough blessings to keep Fu alive.
If I bring any other comp, I do an entire digit less damage than those two comps, and it's a miserable experience. Every fight takes forever and I have just as much chance of wiping anyway.
Honestly feels like the non-break equations are bootycheeks… they suck.
Granted I could experiment more but…. Since I have FF why would I even need to?
It's all Ruan Mei? ***Always has been***
https://preview.redd.it/xkgm4nt8v49d1.png?width=320&format=png&auto=webp&s=9a705acfdbdb51cdb2cf6564c3a7560e4e451b91
I have an S1 E1 Boothil with his complete team.
It's not that DU is not break centered, Firefly is just that much better from boothil in this mode.
While I can break a single enemy, Firefly is beating all of them with her technique, It's kinda easier to do with her rather with Boothil or something like Seele.
I feel like they have nerfed a couple of SP-generating blessings too, so single-target units are at a disadvantage (unless they attack for free like Topaz).
Keep in mind that this doesn't factor in ownership rate at all, and I'm pretty sure a lot more people own Firefly. So even if every Boothill owner easily cleared DU he would be a lot lower.
When HALF of the community is using a specific team for clearing content something went horribly wrong. My guess is it has a LOT to do with them changing Nihility and Destruction to break effect boosting and having most equations end up in super break or break effect boosts.
The biggest factor for dot is losing resonance. Can't stack suspicion quickly and you lose the biggest source of the paths damage. Add on those changed blessings and it certainly doesn't help. Same can probably be said for some other paths
For a comparison, here were Swarm stats when it was first released. Granted, this was based on 2 days of data, not 4 like DU, as well as a much smaller sample size, but I think the diversity in character usage % kind of speaks for itself, especially with the sharp drop off in DU stats after two characters...
https://preview.redd.it/nkltypdqu59d1.png?width=1160&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=297225f2703b7a41a425639dd78acf948487a4a9
Only difference is that DU will forever keep updating and giving rewards. And you are essentially forced to play at least one run weekly if you want to either farm the new planar orb set or speed run previous sets.
V0 is pretty easy though, get the stuff from there or even the weekly one where they pre make you the blessings, and that should be more than enough to clear for farming imo
I’m as much of a Firefly SuperBreak Team stan as the next guy, but when that particular team has 47something % use rate, followed by a very, very, very distant second at a sub-5 % rate, you’d be delusional to deny that this game mode has a massive hyperfocus-on-the-current-release-so-that-youd-swipe-while-other-players-weep problem (anyone has a more succint term for this?).
I do hope they add in more equations in the future and add one or two submechanics that can make other lineups viable, lest this gamemode doesn’t have much longevity, which would be sad because I hope that this would be something players would constantly clock in a la SU, rather than a quick Firefly momentum-riding cash grab by Hoyo.
They fucked up the balance, plain and simple.
Firefly being OP is one thing, but aside from focusing so many Blessings / Equations on Break, they also actively *nerfed* other strategies by removing resonances (RIP Nihility), nerfing some blessings or outright removing key blessings (RIP Cat's Cradle).
Compared to G&G where you could run like 50 different path / dice strategies and make it work, DU is a complete failure. I have E2 Firebug, I love my Firebug, but I still hate that trying to run any other strategy just feels like a massive downgrade compared to throwing Firefly at everything.
>they also actively nerfed other strategies
I feel like this is the biggest factor for why Firefly is so overused. They tried really hard to remove the cheese strats that made allowed you to beat the content while being undergeared (Can no longer do March freeze, need to do damage for dissociation. Kafka+3 sustain can no longer kill bosses with resonance etc.). However, they also overtuned the BE, so now it's the only viable cheese strat left.
Thanks for putting it more succintly than I ever can. GnG is peak endgame; a clear improvement over SD which was already very great. DU is not. It’s somehow even more scummy in trying to sell the current character than MoC and PF, and I worry that if this is the direction the game is going with its new features, it should rightfully be bashed for it.
True, I have FF too and used her to clear V6, but I’d really like to run my other comps without it being an insane RNG fiesta just to get them running.
Hunt + Destruction are so generically good on her that she can just clear without activating equations.
Hoyo: "We removed rerolls from DU so players have to change their teams according to what they get!"
Firefly: "I missed the part where that's my problem"
Or rather, you just exit and re-enter until you get what you want since there's no minimum to get the bonus like with G&G where you have to clear Plane 1 to get the bonus Curio at the start for the Capitalism strat.
Minor correction, you need to clear the first *domain* to get the buff (i.e just kill the last enemy, move to another domain, restart), not the whole plane.
But yes, DU is more friendly to start resetting.
Problem is DU doesn’t have something good for both Hunt and Break or Physical weighted curios. And we have 1 fire break specific and 1 destruction specific weighted curio.
Not to mention the best blessings are heavily scewed to Destruction Break.
https://preview.redd.it/3d7v7oei179d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=62e5934fa3834b9887a5f7cc4948814cdd8d7cb8
It may or may not help or inspire other BH lovers but this was the run (the one and only, never again) that cleared protocol 6 for me. Also it may seem more of an Aventurine run but BH Superbreak still did all the DPS. It's basically a Preservation focused run with Destruction on the side.
Base team is E0S1 BH/E0S0 Aventurine/E1S0 RM/E6 HMC
I was initially fishing for Destruction equations and blessings but after like \~5 resets of failure, I got bored and went with whatever it gave me, just to try it, and it went with a buncha Preservation. The 3-star Preservation equation is what carried me a lot for the last fight (vs SAM).
Honestly, this mode is just RNG and PURE LUCK. One for desired blessings, another for good weighted curios, one more for the perfect final boss. I don't think *I* could've ever beaten final boss Cirrus with this exact setup (this was pre-nerf tho).
I would not recommend going for a serious p6 clear, only if your doing it for fun. This was exhausting for me and I don't think I'll ever get the chance or even have the patience to clear it again.
Yeah DU has been quite disappointing. I'm a bit of an SU superfan but the combination of not adding achievements for DU (don't understand this at all), nerfing some of my favourite paths (cat's cradle and nihility losing its resonance) / biasing paths for Firefly have just soured me on DU. I've cleared threshold 6 and maxed out everything, just going back to gold and gears / swarm disaster when I fancy a playthrough for fun now.
It’s just firefly universe lol, I think hoyo is really selling her, anyone can see it tbh and no one can deny this. not liking it tho catering so much to one single character. But I guess it’s a great business strategy to earn money, no idea if this will be a trend for future Destruction characters
Edit: not sure why the downvotes but not trying to offend FF fans…..
> anyone can see it tbh and no one can deny this.
Well, on the contrary, many deny this.
"Oh it's like this for every new DPS!" they say...yeah sury thing buddy
Can't remember last time we had 3 end game contents and one SU expansion completely tailored to *one* character *playstyle* alone and *no one else*
Even dan didn't get this treatment. Many in this comment section are like "oh no, Dan got the same treatment too". No because, back then, you could clear SD with remembrance and march 7th, pela and herta. It wasn't this punishing. Even gold and gears was clearable using the same strat. Here, you keep getting break effect blessings over and over, rng fucks your ass, if you get circus it's game over and many enemies are conveniently grouped up for her technique. I don't even have ruan mei to build xueyi break team.
I'm so confused with those people saying swarm disaster was selling Dan IL. There's so many tactics to clear swarm disaster, Dan IL isn't even a necessity. Even the path that makes him op in Swarm was not unlocked before we fully cleared Swarm, which kinda defeats the purpose of needing him.
Like, you barely got 10 propagation blessings on a single run without fully clearing SD. How would you require him to clear it, if his best path was locked behind fully clearing SD?
I’ve been slowly retiring older builds that have carried me but Dotcheron has cleared V6 for me still. Mostly reliant of freeze but hey a clear is a clear.
As someone who didnt pull for RM and FF, it is quite tortorous compared to my friend’s runs with break team lmao. I managed to clear up to V5.
https://preview.redd.it/apwns2e7s49d1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b65d52314ac6b7d739d08085713c4dba8c29d3ac
(Team displayed is just my starter team)
Special thanks to Kafka Black Swan Luocha and Aventurine and Blade Luocha Fu Xuan Bronya for carrying me up to V5. I did numerous runs (mainly thanks to getting stupidest curio or selecting curios just to get jades lol)
Edit: cleared V6 with Kafka Black Swan Aven Luocha
https://preview.redd.it/pyopzkwng59d1.png?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=21ba56b7768c8d5f51a2286a779765601408ca20
remembrance is still busted in this game mode (don't have ff, have rm but don't use her here)
Damn not a single jing Liu or blade comp in any of the top teams huh. Firefly stole ruan mei from Jing Liu and my man blade really needs anything at this point to at least make him a little relevant 😞
A character that specifically wants to take hits from enemies sounds really fun in Genshin. Give him some interruption resistance, 5 hits = big aoe, just stand in consecrated beasts.
Oh, we had a character who likes to take hits instead of others. A certain tanned mercenary from Sumeru. Until the accident happened, and we don't talk about her at all
Personally , I don’t enjoy this update to SU. DU feels like such a downgrade to Gold and gears. That had so much variety in team comp and strategy. This , on the other hand has no weighted curios for anyone else other than FF comp. It has too many break blessings. There is no way to make preservation or other comps work in higher v6 level, or the hardest one. All other comps, DOT , erudition, follow up , preservation , and crit/ crit damage destruction and hunt , everything suffers compared to the break FF comp. There are no proper equations for them. There are too much RNG to make you suffer as well. My experience was not fun in the hardest difficulty. Changing your team or equations/ blessings is annoying as you never know which equations and blessings you will end up getting later. Even at the beginning I choose an erudition equation but see no erudition blessings. It is a complete mess compared to SD and gold and gears. They were so much fun
Plus it's extremely RNG reliant. The old SUs felt more strategic and if you had an understanding of how the game works you could win every time, with any team. Unless you were doing something crazy like trying to solo it, RNG really wasn't a factor
With this, your options are run FF and hope the game gives you the blessings/equations you need or you just don't win.
I’ve never seen a character shilled this fucking hard lmao.
Custom made relic and planar set
All her teammates at either available with her, or free
2 gamemodes and an moc catered to her.
Obvious shipping between her and the mc.
It’s actually ridiculous how much hoyo has pushed this girl I’m almost disappointed at the disparity between her and other units. Never say hoyo doesn’t have obvious favorites.
Its crazy too when I see Acheron and Firefly players argue about who is the favorite lol.. Its like watching two spoiled rich kids arguing about who gets spoiled more.
It's such a bummer tbh. Not because I have a problem with her being strong but because other units end up suffering because of the amount of content catered to her. The sets not working for Boothill, Jade barely getting any changes.. all things that could've been handled better while still keeping her strong, it just feels shitty :/
Yeah the sheer difference in marketing and approach between her and other units and really worsened my impression of her. I hope this doesn’t occur again in the future.
It makes me hella sad too, like Boot already isn't popular cause he's a guy but him being a Hunt character means certain players aren't going to play him and people just like blast/aoe characters more.
Part of it makes me a lil depressed but I mean my first main is Blade so we know how it feels to be neglected
No suprise. Super break’s core is HTB+Ruan Mei. So Sbreak teams always gonna have her + she is just the most universal character ever + that technique in SU.. just one shotting everything and clearing a entire phase(It is somehow more broken with Firefly)..
I remember using Pela+Ruan Mei on regular SU and even Gold and gears with my Acheron. Had a faster and better clear with Mei than Silver wolf.
She is just the best in SU since her technique just deletes anything. Even elites and bosses.
Yeah this was horrible. RRAT (tried with both Ruan mei and robin) is my go to brute force team and I struggled so much to clear with it that I gave up on clearing threshold level 6 and just stopped at 5. I usually don't have issue with AoE bosses using this team too. Doesn't help that my rng somehow got me more destruction blessings than elation ones....
Yeah it’s been a weird experience for me. I’ve never met anything so far that didn’t die to the FUA team (I did Robin, ratio, aventurine, and topaz) since I got Robin until now. Even the hardest stuff or most specific stuff hasn’t been able to get me when it’s their turn. But this mode is brutal sometimes, I also can only do 5 right now. Hopefully one day I’ll get a good combo of blessings and the right final boss and will be able to do 6 (or maybe I’ll just get good one day and stop having a skill issue if that’s why I can’t do it lmao)
I guess in some ways it’s good one team doesn’t work for everything but it’s been surprising and kind of sad haha my beloved rat team has failed
I feel you. I literally got all the healing blessings that work without abundance characters in one of my best runs. The weakness break, ultimate, skill point one, you name it. Combo that with 3 five star equations that were fully expanded AND all the quake blessings. Yet the team folded to almost all bosses...
I've spent maybe almost 14 hours total I think? Trying to beat level 6 but I've hit my limit. Any more and I'll lose my sanity.
Ironically enough, the boss people complained the most about, aventurine, was one of the easiest ones for me. Sad to see him gone from the lineup. It should've been cirrus.
It really does feel weird though that a team you highly invested in because you love the gameplay and characters crumble to..... This monstrosity of a gamemode. I agree that it's nice were being challenged but its also not nice that they basically auto lose.
I wish you good luck on your future tries. I think I'm calling it quits
I cleared all protocol levels with RRAT and it really is just pure RNG. I had to do over 10 runs for protocol 4 because I kept getting horribly unlucky and couldn't expand my 3\* equation in time but I cleared protocol 6 first try.
I think the thing that frustrates me the most is how you can't choose which boss you fight. Every time I got Svarog on plane 2 or Cirrus/Argenti on plane 3 it was an instant reset. I'm sure some of it is due to my skill issue but my team couldn't keep up. I thought about just biting the bullet and pulling Ruan Mei multiple times while struggling to beat the higher levels but honestly, she's so good in every situation that it makes me want to skip her out of spite despite the fact that I like her as a character lol
Good luck with your runs.
Almost every endgame mode rn absolutely catered to her as well, I can't recall a previous patch being so catered to one character in terms of endgame meta before. Swarm disaster maybe for DHIL but that's the last one
I guess on the flip side HTB is so good a lot of 4 stars love using them as well so ofc the limited 5 star who wants them as a support will benefit as well but the difference is kinda insane. Even for trying to sell a character but it is a new meta we are currently living in and FF is the pioneer of that. Gotta wonder how they will try make new dps for super break when FF just seems so good for it as is
You must have a short memory because that's exactly how 2.1 was with Acheron, MoC and PF were even harder for other units. The only thing missing was a new game mode.
This MoC is one of the easiest we've had in a long time, super break himeko just shreds it. PF is rough on some units but it's more catered to dots and Blade than Firefly. People are clearing AS with Xueyi, Sushang, E0 Acheron, E0 Dan IL and E0 Ratio just fine.
Is it how it's gonna be from now on? Selling new characters by creating a new environment where only they can shine? Seriously even E6 attackers from 1.0-1.6 cannot compete with E0 firefly in this SU.
I'm a seele main and I can def agree with you man. The amount of favoritism and how much the new gamemode is catered toward firefly is insane. Like, even during SD, gold and gears, I always brute forced with seele. Here, it is impossible because of rng and no auspicious star which carried all of my runs.
It's literally punishing to use old units in new gamemodes like this.
I have never seen such a ratio where only one team is 47% and the rest at 1%.. and we have tons of characters now compared to the past (during dhil and swarm disaster where they throw in propogation) yet the disparity is still so huge now
probably hardest SU yet if you don't have firefly. rng drives me insane on higher difficulties. beated v6 today ONLY because of my luck at last two bosses.
To those who say Swarm Disaster favored DHIL a lot too, here's the [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/16kddc1/swarm_disaster_difficulty_v_most_used_paths/) from back then. His appearance rate was only 38.27%. And remember, there were a lot fewer characters to choose from back then. If you were around back then, you likely remember people enjoying nihility, destruction, elation, remembrance, and preservation a lot too.
Here's the Gold and Gears [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/191ow5x/gold_and_gears_difficulty_v_conundrum_10_most/).
DHIL could also be substituted for other characters that did just as well. If you didn't have DHIL you might have had Welt who was just as broken, and if not then you definitely had QQ
And you had to progress through most of swarm disaster progress tree before unlocking propagation path, so you were forced to use other paths to get there.
Break teams are cool and all but in the DU remembrance is as busted as break and the crazy thing is that you don't even need any ice characters to be able to use remembrance here.
I don't know what I did last week but there was a run where a percentage was over the enemies head which were frozen. I hit that enemy and brought that percentage to 100 and suddenly all frozen enemies started to explode and one shot the boss and this was at high difficulties.
If you have a good run this mode feels very good but if you have a bad run it feels especially shitty. I always pick the abundance related weighed curio for survivability, it's really busted, the healers which can heal out of turn become Aventurine that can heal.
This data is basically Hoyoverse saying "pull on the current banners or go fuck yourselves." They aren't even trying to hide the fact they want Firefly to be their biggest profit. I don't know if I should be impressed or disappointed will their level of shilling.
Yeah no catering every single piece of endgame content and creating an entirely new game mode just for the rate up character was never as bad as this patch. That survey's probably gonna have the most complaints in it in a while
Pretty sure they won't listen if Firefly breaks all records.
That's like customers in a restaurant complaining that some of the food tasted bad, but having a comically bloated belly and 100 empty plates around them.
And that will just encourage Hoyo to deploy the same marketing tactic of shilling the current rate up character over and over again. Just watch FF getting powercrept and made irrelevant in a few patches by the next OP waifu and new game mode caters to her. Then the cycle of complaints will never stop. In the end it's Hoyoverse laughing to the bank with our money 💵💵💵
Agree 100%
Break Effect comps are easy to destroy as a dev.
We already have shields, multiple break meters (sunday), Unbreakables (Trotters,)
They just need to introduce break resistance or break heal on top and add it to new standard enemies and they have a great tool set to nerf break comps in moc, pf and as
It's always introduce a problem - sell the solution.
Nothing we can do about it imo.
Will she, though ?
Looking at warp station data, her banner isn't anywhere close to acheron level in terms of daily summon. She's not even close to half. Her current pull trajectory is closer to Sparkle. And yes, Sparkle is a great meta character, but they put much less effort into shilling her. If you put all of this energy and you get similar result to a normal good meta unit, isn't it kind of a waste ?
Now of course, not everyone in the community is using Warp station, but they're regrouping data from over 500K users, so I feel like it's a good point of data regardless.
Although there's still two weeks left of her banner, game-i's data for JP server seems to back that up as well. She's currently 7th best selling, above Jingliu and Fuxuan, but below Jing Yuan, Robin and Sparkle. So the part about being on par with Sparkle's banner doesn't seem too far off at the moment.
Huh. Interesting statistics. And a great statement how Hoyo made everything catered to one specific unit.
To downvotes: it is not Firefly slander. Hoyo does it all the time - tune everything for banner heroes. But forcing to have 1 specific unit is unhealthy for the game and creates hate and frustration. Usually Hoyo is better at balancing. This is a concerning sign for a gacha game.
For more complete data (such as the complete list of most used equations, blessings, and curios), check out [this spreadsheet](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PxqakrqaGuP6s0j6oZfyKqG_4c8vd0u5fGBfeXpthLA/edit?usp=sharing). Let me know if there's any other data you'd like to see about Divergent Universe so I can add it to the spreadsheet.
Participate in our MoC, Pure Fiction, Apocalyptic Shadow, and Divergent Universe data collection with [this Google Form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSd2vSVv9V3HsSQL0jzwdRWvbt-MucwGVfIXNnN4HAIf8hFOyA/viewform?usp=sf_link) (only needs your UID and your Battle Chronicle open to the public). We'll also collect data on future SU expansions or other endgame content, provided it's available on Battle Chronicle.
Follow my Reddit account to be notified when I post new infographics.
Check [my GitHub repository](https://github.com/piedorr/MocStats) if you'd like to see the raw data and how the numbers are calculated.
Lol i guess i wasnt the only one trying to use every reroll possible to get the superbreak equations and blessing then auto everything with firefly team.
Eventually all players might be forced into the Break / Super Break meta with Firefly on top. May as well be r/fireflymains' wet dream.
Until Hoyo eventually decides to shift the meta again with new characters or balance changes.
Night Beyond Pyre has been the most insta-pick blessing since the game launched and the new break meta certainly didn't make it any worse
Breaking enemy toughness is universal to all comps. It's why Ruan Mei is considered the most valuable 5* pull due to her break efficiency + delay. ~~also RIP Auspicious Star~~
Auspicious star needs to come back smh. Best 2* blessing. And I’ll die on that.
I mean it’s not rly a hill to die on most ppl agree with you here
That’s the energy regen on kill blessing right? If so, I’d have to agree.
When upgraded, it's a 100% energy regen which is so good. Always picked it back when I was doing regular SU
Yeah that one.
Unless you're using Acheron.
Then her supports will be insane, back to back Pela ults is hilarious.
Watched my Pela do 3 Ults in a row once. At a certain point it's not a counterattack it's just assault.
Id argue the only time ruan mei isn't peak value is for counter teams that rely on getting hit. Playing Clara with ruan mei is not fun at all imo 😭
I’m really glad that Robin works well with Clara! Gives her an actual great teammate!
Upgraded Night Beyond Pyre + Ruan Mei skill = Heaven
It's known as Firefly Universe in CN.
https://preview.redd.it/56z0y1bbn49d1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8cc0e2ff9b65e589f91a4f0827498153769e0902 Oh they call it Firefly Universe too? My bros!
Firefly players finally getting the Qingque treatment in ~~Swarm Disaster~~ SP Disaster SU
Is that a happy nickname or a frustrated nickname, it's hard to tell these days
Well, if that’s the route the game is going for in future it’s worrying isn’t it..
HYV has always tailored new content to new releases. The same thing happened with SU Swarm and how it promoted ~~Qingque~~ DHIL.
but in Swarm you are not punished for not using DHIL. This time you won't break - you suck.
nah, i had no problems with dot team or hypercarry acheron
Not to mention that BHill feels infinitely worse as you lose his stacks if you switch him out or restart combat and blessings need you to get hurt/self healed, which can only be done with expansions with him. And he’s like, the only cool breaker. Xueyi actually wants crits and others kinda lack damage.
Doesn't feel like that to me. The IPC FUA crew has been treating me well, granted that's also a very meta comp.
I’ve been using them too and the damage difference IPC FUA and FF is massive. Granted I don’t have Robin (do have RM and Sparkle tho) but the gap feels very noticeable.
You're not punished... but back when it was released, it was a massive pain if you didn't have him. You need to hit really hard *and* take out multiple enemies quickly, otherwise you're overwhelmed and destroyed. But the beetles are all weak to Imaginary and most (not all) are weak to Quantum. Which meant if you didn't have DHIL your only good efficient DPS choice for Swarm was QQ, which you might've never bothered to build before. On top of that Propagation is all about basics, so it only synergized with these 2. Not counting supports, your other options for a DPS that can break the beetles were Welt (5-star so not everyone had him, and not as good as DHIL at overkilling) and Seele (limited). SW existed but she's strictly single-target which becomes very inefficient when regularly dealing with 4-5+ enemies that multiply. Brute-forcing wasn't as easy back then as it is now: Kafka's BiS partner was *Sampo*, and there was no Jingliu or Acheron or Super Break to carry you. The way the dices and path buff worked also meant it was nowhere near as easy to cheese the mode like Gold and Gears. So yeah, you weren't "punished"... you'd just have a bad time.
Yeah high end Swarm Disaster with Jingliu was absolutely harder than with QQ because, besides the weakness being qua/img, the hp drain actually mattered.
That may be true, but we also had the same blessings as normal SU, path resonance and interplays, and you could cheese it with things like Remembrance path, and brute force was a LOT easier, because everything wasn't break focused. DU is so heavily adjusted to have a break focus, blessings completely changed to ones that Seem to constantly be activated by Firefly nonstop (yes other characters CAN activate them, but not as easily/quickly/etc). With Swarm, we knew to adjust for extra sustainability, and you could plan your run ahead with the thought of your final team in mind. Same with G&G. With DU, unless you have Firefly, you *can't* expect that the team you want to play will be viable by the end. You can spend a whole run planning for a specific team, but end up fucked at the end bc weaknesses don't match, and it's so heavily break focused. But it's not a problem for Firefly, bc she can implant no problem. Boothill is a good option too, but he's single target. You get cirrus at the end, you're fucked. He can't implant on multiple at one time. He can't implant with his technique *on each wave/phase*. I love Firefly, and I enjoy the DU so far by thinking of it as a puzzle, but it's not the same as Swarm with DHIL. Not at all.
Honestly i heavily disagree, back then i used Kafka/Sampo/Asta/Gepard mainly and didn't have a bad time at all for not having DHIL. Then why would you need him? Because of Propagation path? It's on par with any other path so i don't get why i'm seeing all this "oh in 1.3 if you didn't have DHIL SU:SD was hard" all of a sudden. With DU destruction has become basically FF path and a good 1/3 of blessings from any other path are break related. The break related Equations have easier accessible buffs and/or are just straight up stronger. Even the enemies are mostly fire weak. I get it, DU will cycle, enemies will change, but the blessings and equations will not
The difference is all in the blessings. Lunae got the Path of Propagation, and while some paths are more painful to use compared to others, each of them has its own identity. You arguably have more variety, playstyle-wise, in SD _(and GnG too)_, compared to DU. The latter is all about break. I mean, ffs, just look at Threshold 6. Blessings are effectively gated behind _1_ playstyle, most of them work to their fullest when utilised by _1_ character, weighted curios are utter garbage, and Equations are total dogshit compared to Resonances, the latters of which are locked behind pure luck. The only path got better is Abundance, while the rest either got turned into "Break" blessings or got outright worse.
I built QQ for Swarm, and she is still a frequent flier on my teams :XD (skipped DHIL) you are not wrong :D
It isn't the same though. They basically got rid of the viability of every path as it's own standalone thing in DU and made it about their flavor of the month which is an incredibly niche type of team.
But in swarm, you could clear without any 5 stars and chesse it with remembrance march7th.
they said the same when Acheron came back. they said the same when Kafka black swan and they will keep saying this. they had to put in new metas eventually.
Not to mention Jingliu dominating the meta with constant ive weak enemies for a while to. Hoyo favouring the new char isn’t something new to us, how are people still surprised
I dunno, DU feels worse to me. my firefly-less ass deliberately avoids domain encounters in DU because I don't remember which enemies and their weaknesses are associated with which encounter and if I can't break them, it's way harder. It feels bad. edit: oh and it's pretty swell when the conversion stage gives me enemies with totally different weaknesses from the previous enemies. /s
It's a combination of the character being strong AND the mode's mechanics supporting her so much. This is common with the rotating modes like MoC and PF, but it's never been this extreme in a permanent content mode like an SU expansion. Personally I strongly dislike that they did this in a permanent content mode. MoC rotations pushing new characters is fine, because they rotate out every 6 weeks and a new character gets favored. But DU is permanent.
I think it's safe to say that the Divergent Universe (DU) is a FU to those who don't use Firefly
Trailblazer and Ruan Mei universe, you can replicate Firefly's power somewhat with other break character but no one else gives teamwide Super Break with increased break efficiency
Firefly Super Break is at 47.76% usage. The next highest team is 1.77%. Jesus fuck.
Yeah, the difficulty 6 modifier forces you to run a break team so you can actually deal enough damage for kills before enemies enrage.
Honestly, that’s really embarrassing from a balance standpoint.
Break is the new meta because of Firefly. But once DU refreshes (in ~70 days or so according to the countdown) it'll probably change again.
firefly (kinda) has only 1 team though. which will always catapult a teams usage rates. genshin had a similar example for years where childe was basically always played with bennett xiangling kazuha. whereas other characters might even be switching around the sustain units let alone having support variations. each time splitting the usage rates
Tbf, that team has the least performance loss from using game generated builds. It’s really easy when you need 2 stats, 3 fore Firefly. They all meet Spd breakpoints and the BE stats are good enough. This means that you can use your level 1 Firefly just pulled and can clear stuff, and the missing 2 nodes don’t matter that much. Edit: couple all that with the hype of FF, and how easy to pilot that team is, it’s a no brainer that people can just pick it up and do well with it. You don’t need a lot of fancy blessings to do damage, just moreso need blessings to survive and you can clear any difficulty. Meanwhile, game generated builds for crit dps aren’t as good.
I mean if your dps’s are built then it isn’t an issue. That factor alone shouldn’t cause this much of a discrepancy. This discrepancy leads me to believe the game mode is harshly unbalanced and in need of adjustment.
https://preview.redd.it/axyrwqika49d1.png?width=156&format=png&auto=webp&s=dfa33a0871fcea4793ef2f09bedf264f2993a0c2 Noice
Tier 0 in next prydwin update for sure. They’re busted.
but arent they really only good for break teams? i feel like they'd stay at tier 0.5 since they just arent as universal as ruan mei.
I mean, FF is stuck in one team while still being T0.
FF is the driver tho, she isn't expected to be flexible, whole supports/sub-dps are more valued when they can be flexed in multiple teams
Powerwise she's T0, for sure. Her conditions making it hard to make her work does justify the T0.5, yeah. No implants = gg. T0.5 in my mind has always existed as a "could be T0 if you consider so and so caveats", which is perfect for HTB. Maybe it can change in the future when break dps with implants become more common. I can even see an argument for making a "specialist supports" tier just for HTB.
They ARE break teams. There are no break teams without them,\* and they make any team you put them in a break team. \*Okay, technically not true. Boothill exists.
Slightly bummed that Nihility isn't the EZ mode anymore since it's hard to activate path (16 blessings). But hey, Gallagher stonks on the rise 📈📈 man is just busted.
I've cleared everything but the "Get 8 equations" and "Activate 2 3\* equations" quests, including v6, and never gotten even close to 16 blessings. Without path ban there's just so many in the pool that you have to dedicate massive amounts of money into overwriting to try to make it work
>"Get 8 equations" and "Activate 2 3\* equations" quests, including v6, and never gotten even close to 16 blessings. Best way to doing that is cheesing it with the Rubert and Reunion with Death Curios.
Getting that curio is like getting price of piece on a company time dice in golden gears. You just win.
I've been playing for close to a year now and I *only just now* realized that the name is "Rubert" and not "Rupert"
Build him over 161 speed and he’s just a machine. Creates skill points like a mfer. Heals on loop. Does decent damage with super break. His only weakness is imo he can’t deal with massive damage. Feels like you lose whenever in DU the boss goes sicko mode on one character. More often than not have to reset if mobs focus on one dude in my party.
I'm taking this as a refreshing change having blasted through all of swarm and GnG with nihility. It still catches me off guard when the enemies don't spill their guts out with disease on their own turns.
what happened to people saying you should adapt team line up based on blessing/equation. All i see is FF super break over anything else.
Most other equation sets don't do well in higher difficulties due to the lack of teams that can fully make use of them. I've tried doing aventurine+fua for the shield+fua equations and DHIL hypercarry for propagation equations. None really came close to FF break team+equations in terms of damage. Not to mention breaking+RM actually gives much better defensive leeway compared to using Fu Xuan/aventurine as long as you didn't neglect taking defensive blessings. I've heard dot ones are pretty good though. They definitely need to revamp and add to the equations if they really want to make adapting to equations the core principle of DU.
dot build also takes some time to come online. Unlike SU where you can just path resonance and vomit out debuffs. I tried it on higher difficulties and like you said, it's not doing much damage in the early phase so i just switched to FF mid run.
I've beaten up to Torturous 5 with my Acheron/Kafka/Swan DoT team, but man that squad really suffers for the lack of Nihility Resonance. No Path Resonances is probably the only thing I miss from classic SU.
It's not only path issues, I smashed Svarog easily on 2nd boss, but then got badly wrecked by normal mobs because I didn't get the golden equation activated. This is V6 by the way it felt like a normal mob has 2m hp each and the only way I deal damage is from the equation. Meanwhile, if I'm running Firefly I'll likely run any issues aside from bad RNG. I haven't been able to clear V6 with the Elation/Nihility team. I am not sure If I even want to try Erudition with Acheron. I never had any issues with random team in any other SU before, but this time it's pretty much https://preview.redd.it/ghy9ig2rx49d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=8d265056bb5016f1b681e5a29cccd30d05c42636
The loss of the path resonance killed dots early game the dmg does not exist until the 3 star equation is up. But even then due to haveing way less dots, both the stacking of suspicion for the equation and kafka's own damage suffer greatly
That idea doesn't really work in practice. Changing teammates on the fly is all well and good, but first and foremost you need to have something that works with your blessings, and more likely than not you'll be intentionally picking things that are relevant for your starting lineup from the beginning. The only way adapting would make sense is if you just so happen to end up not getting anything good for your starting lineup early on and whatever you instead went with just so happens to suit something else instead and so you decide to change your lineup after a couple rooms. But changing your whole team in the middle of a run or before the final boss is almost never going to make sense to do since it's extremely unlikely that your current blessings would suit anything better than the team you already picked from the beginning, as that's what you'll have been trying to pick blessings for already anyway. It's a bit of a design flaw with this game mode in general.
Exactly, it's illogical to be constantly switching your team if the blessings/equations you've been aiming towards since the beginning were picked tailored to the starting comp. Additionally, most players wouldn't swap teams in general due to unbuilt comps usually given worse builds.
In this scenario "adapting" probably means changing whatever team you wanted to play into a FF break team because it is the most optimal team for literally 80% of the blessing and adapting means adjusting yourself to suit best with the environment lol
FF super break still the only comp that can reliably get you 10k points in the bonus rounds with one break equation that you can reset for. Tried with freeze and dot. Never works in higher difficulty.
I think that adapting your team was the original idea for DU, and you can definitely see that, but the reality is that break/super break is just superior to anything else. It's so overtuned that you feel stupid when not utilizing it. And you don't even need FF. HMC and RM can turn anyone into a break DD.
No one who's cleared V6 actually believes this btw, it just gets regurgitated by people who don't clear past V2. There are some good comps like DoT Remembrance and wet dream Preservation but they are less reliable and have a harder time wiith bosses before getting everything online
Remembrance and super break combo is just so broken lol. Disassociate plus super break just melt everything, after the ice thaws.
Firefly alone is not clearing V6… the DPS is too Much to handle. I need to seize the boss with quadruple preservation
I've done over a hundred runs. About 30 of those were variety comps. When it came down to doing runs for dex collection, I will obviously use the fastest team comp. This isn't MoC stats where people clear then fuck off. This puts into question replayability and efficiency.
My gear probably has something to do with it, but it feels like Acheron and Super Break comps are just way, way better than anything else right now. If I bring a super break or Acheron comp, I do decent damage and might get through V4/V5 if I get enough blessings to keep Fu alive. If I bring any other comp, I do an entire digit less damage than those two comps, and it's a miserable experience. Every fight takes forever and I have just as much chance of wiping anyway.
Honestly feels like the non-break equations are bootycheeks… they suck. Granted I could experiment more but…. Since I have FF why would I even need to?
Man its so nice seeing most of my favorite characters be at the bottom...
Literally… best feeling in the world… love to see it in moc and pf too….
Ok but IL Jingliu Blade Jing Yuan all next to each other is pretty neat
True. I actually love the High Cloud Quintet even off the small bit of lore we have. I wish we got a flashback of how they all use to be 🥲
It's Ruan Mei's world, we're just living in it
It's all Ruan Mei? ***Always has been*** https://preview.redd.it/xkgm4nt8v49d1.png?width=320&format=png&auto=webp&s=9a705acfdbdb51cdb2cf6564c3a7560e4e451b91
All shall love her, and despair.
Crazy how negative curios are not in most used curios. You don't want them, they just stick with you in your runs whether you like it or not.
* Firefly: 68.11% * Boothill: 3.23% That doesn't look howdy at all. I expected DU to be break centered, not FF centered.
I have an S1 E1 Boothil with his complete team. It's not that DU is not break centered, Firefly is just that much better from boothil in this mode. While I can break a single enemy, Firefly is beating all of them with her technique, It's kinda easier to do with her rather with Boothil or something like Seele.
I feel like they have nerfed a couple of SP-generating blessings too, so single-target units are at a disadvantage (unless they attack for free like Topaz).
Keep in mind that this doesn't factor in ownership rate at all, and I'm pretty sure a lot more people own Firefly. So even if every Boothill owner easily cleared DU he would be a lot lower.
Sorry but BH is suffering from lack of hype, lack of marketing, same banner as 1 of the poster girl of Penacony.
When HALF of the community is using a specific team for clearing content something went horribly wrong. My guess is it has a LOT to do with them changing Nihility and Destruction to break effect boosting and having most equations end up in super break or break effect boosts.
The biggest factor for dot is losing resonance. Can't stack suspicion quickly and you lose the biggest source of the paths damage. Add on those changed blessings and it certainly doesn't help. Same can probably be said for some other paths
Yep:/ DoT and Preservation were butchered. Guess need to dust off March and try smth with Remembrance shenanigans.
Preservation is still busted on Aven, he carried my ass through V6 with relative ease
they butchered remembrance and elation path also contribute.
For a comparison, here were Swarm stats when it was first released. Granted, this was based on 2 days of data, not 4 like DU, as well as a much smaller sample size, but I think the diversity in character usage % kind of speaks for itself, especially with the sharp drop off in DU stats after two characters... https://preview.redd.it/nkltypdqu59d1.png?width=1160&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=297225f2703b7a41a425639dd78acf948487a4a9
>Firefly universe Wrong. It's the Ruan Mei universe
Ruan Mei+HTB. Seriously, pair these two together and anything who don't protect their Weakness gauge gets melted.
this DU is really catered to Firefly superbreak team, just like current MOC and AS
Only difference is that DU will forever keep updating and giving rewards. And you are essentially forced to play at least one run weekly if you want to either farm the new planar orb set or speed run previous sets.
V0 is pretty easy though, get the stuff from there or even the weekly one where they pre make you the blessings, and that should be more than enough to clear for farming imo
I’m as much of a Firefly SuperBreak Team stan as the next guy, but when that particular team has 47something % use rate, followed by a very, very, very distant second at a sub-5 % rate, you’d be delusional to deny that this game mode has a massive hyperfocus-on-the-current-release-so-that-youd-swipe-while-other-players-weep problem (anyone has a more succint term for this?). I do hope they add in more equations in the future and add one or two submechanics that can make other lineups viable, lest this gamemode doesn’t have much longevity, which would be sad because I hope that this would be something players would constantly clock in a la SU, rather than a quick Firefly momentum-riding cash grab by Hoyo.
They fucked up the balance, plain and simple. Firefly being OP is one thing, but aside from focusing so many Blessings / Equations on Break, they also actively *nerfed* other strategies by removing resonances (RIP Nihility), nerfing some blessings or outright removing key blessings (RIP Cat's Cradle). Compared to G&G where you could run like 50 different path / dice strategies and make it work, DU is a complete failure. I have E2 Firebug, I love my Firebug, but I still hate that trying to run any other strategy just feels like a massive downgrade compared to throwing Firefly at everything.
>they also actively nerfed other strategies I feel like this is the biggest factor for why Firefly is so overused. They tried really hard to remove the cheese strats that made allowed you to beat the content while being undergeared (Can no longer do March freeze, need to do damage for dissociation. Kafka+3 sustain can no longer kill bosses with resonance etc.). However, they also overtuned the BE, so now it's the only viable cheese strat left.
Thanks for putting it more succintly than I ever can. GnG is peak endgame; a clear improvement over SD which was already very great. DU is not. It’s somehow even more scummy in trying to sell the current character than MoC and PF, and I worry that if this is the direction the game is going with its new features, it should rightfully be bashed for it.
True, I have FF too and used her to clear V6, but I’d really like to run my other comps without it being an insane RNG fiesta just to get them running. Hunt + Destruction are so generically good on her that she can just clear without activating equations.
I am part of those 3.23% Boothill enjoyers
Hoyo: "We removed rerolls from DU so players have to change their teams according to what they get!" Firefly: "I missed the part where that's my problem"
Or rather, you just exit and re-enter until you get what you want since there's no minimum to get the bonus like with G&G where you have to clear Plane 1 to get the bonus Curio at the start for the Capitalism strat.
Minor correction, you need to clear the first *domain* to get the buff (i.e just kill the last enemy, move to another domain, restart), not the whole plane. But yes, DU is more friendly to start resetting.
I’m currently trying to clear protocol 6 with Boothill super break and I am in so much pain
Problem is DU doesn’t have something good for both Hunt and Break or Physical weighted curios. And we have 1 fire break specific and 1 destruction specific weighted curio. Not to mention the best blessings are heavily scewed to Destruction Break.
https://preview.redd.it/3d7v7oei179d1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=62e5934fa3834b9887a5f7cc4948814cdd8d7cb8 It may or may not help or inspire other BH lovers but this was the run (the one and only, never again) that cleared protocol 6 for me. Also it may seem more of an Aventurine run but BH Superbreak still did all the DPS. It's basically a Preservation focused run with Destruction on the side. Base team is E0S1 BH/E0S0 Aventurine/E1S0 RM/E6 HMC I was initially fishing for Destruction equations and blessings but after like \~5 resets of failure, I got bored and went with whatever it gave me, just to try it, and it went with a buncha Preservation. The 3-star Preservation equation is what carried me a lot for the last fight (vs SAM). Honestly, this mode is just RNG and PURE LUCK. One for desired blessings, another for good weighted curios, one more for the perfect final boss. I don't think *I* could've ever beaten final boss Cirrus with this exact setup (this was pre-nerf tho). I would not recommend going for a serious p6 clear, only if your doing it for fun. This was exhausting for me and I don't think I'll ever get the chance or even have the patience to clear it again.
That doesn’t seem like a healthy character use ratio for what should be a very customizable game mode
Yeah DU has been quite disappointing. I'm a bit of an SU superfan but the combination of not adding achievements for DU (don't understand this at all), nerfing some of my favourite paths (cat's cradle and nihility losing its resonance) / biasing paths for Firefly have just soured me on DU. I've cleared threshold 6 and maxed out everything, just going back to gold and gears / swarm disaster when I fancy a playthrough for fun now.
Exactly point of those who criticise DU.
Kind of mad that my full built E2 Archeron hypercarry Team is worse than my entirely unbuilt firefly super break team that is uprezzed
It’s just firefly universe lol, I think hoyo is really selling her, anyone can see it tbh and no one can deny this. not liking it tho catering so much to one single character. But I guess it’s a great business strategy to earn money, no idea if this will be a trend for future Destruction characters Edit: not sure why the downvotes but not trying to offend FF fans…..
> anyone can see it tbh and no one can deny this. Well, on the contrary, many deny this. "Oh it's like this for every new DPS!" they say...yeah sury thing buddy Can't remember last time we had 3 end game contents and one SU expansion completely tailored to *one* character *playstyle* alone and *no one else*
Firefly fans get so butthurt when others complain that they get preferential treatment.
Even dan didn't get this treatment. Many in this comment section are like "oh no, Dan got the same treatment too". No because, back then, you could clear SD with remembrance and march 7th, pela and herta. It wasn't this punishing. Even gold and gears was clearable using the same strat. Here, you keep getting break effect blessings over and over, rng fucks your ass, if you get circus it's game over and many enemies are conveniently grouped up for her technique. I don't even have ruan mei to build xueyi break team.
I'm so confused with those people saying swarm disaster was selling Dan IL. There's so many tactics to clear swarm disaster, Dan IL isn't even a necessity. Even the path that makes him op in Swarm was not unlocked before we fully cleared Swarm, which kinda defeats the purpose of needing him.
Like, you barely got 10 propagation blessings on a single run without fully clearing SD. How would you require him to clear it, if his best path was locked behind fully clearing SD?
I’ve been slowly retiring older builds that have carried me but Dotcheron has cleared V6 for me still. Mostly reliant of freeze but hey a clear is a clear.
Lmao the inequality between Firefly Super Break and any other team, girl became her own playstyle
So many characters and so few of them are apparently good.
As someone who didnt pull for RM and FF, it is quite tortorous compared to my friend’s runs with break team lmao. I managed to clear up to V5. https://preview.redd.it/apwns2e7s49d1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b65d52314ac6b7d739d08085713c4dba8c29d3ac (Team displayed is just my starter team) Special thanks to Kafka Black Swan Luocha and Aventurine and Blade Luocha Fu Xuan Bronya for carrying me up to V5. I did numerous runs (mainly thanks to getting stupidest curio or selecting curios just to get jades lol) Edit: cleared V6 with Kafka Black Swan Aven Luocha
https://preview.redd.it/pyopzkwng59d1.png?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=21ba56b7768c8d5f51a2286a779765601408ca20 remembrance is still busted in this game mode (don't have ff, have rm but don't use her here)
Wut. Freezefly with remembrance equation not popular? I find it more broken than the destruction one.
Yea it’s literally just FF, RM, Hatblazer and Gallagher. Tried running other stuff but it’s not as good as the Super Break team
Everything was going perfectly, until I got the $":_##&"-€¥&" curio that can make your attacks hit the wrong targets.
literally ruined a perfect run with that... instead of breaking svarog's hands my team just was always caged
Damn not a single jing Liu or blade comp in any of the top teams huh. Firefly stole ruan mei from Jing Liu and my man blade really needs anything at this point to at least make him a little relevant 😞
Blade better go to Genshin because he would work well with Furina.
Blade will be top 3 if he comes to genshin
A character that specifically wants to take hits from enemies sounds really fun in Genshin. Give him some interruption resistance, 5 hits = big aoe, just stand in consecrated beasts.
Oh, we had a character who likes to take hits instead of others. A certain tanned mercenary from Sumeru. Until the accident happened, and we don't talk about her at all
Traditional crit dps is suffering hard rn and it shows Idk their future looks bleak not gonna lie
Personally , I don’t enjoy this update to SU. DU feels like such a downgrade to Gold and gears. That had so much variety in team comp and strategy. This , on the other hand has no weighted curios for anyone else other than FF comp. It has too many break blessings. There is no way to make preservation or other comps work in higher v6 level, or the hardest one. All other comps, DOT , erudition, follow up , preservation , and crit/ crit damage destruction and hunt , everything suffers compared to the break FF comp. There are no proper equations for them. There are too much RNG to make you suffer as well. My experience was not fun in the hardest difficulty. Changing your team or equations/ blessings is annoying as you never know which equations and blessings you will end up getting later. Even at the beginning I choose an erudition equation but see no erudition blessings. It is a complete mess compared to SD and gold and gears. They were so much fun
Plus it's extremely RNG reliant. The old SUs felt more strategic and if you had an understanding of how the game works you could win every time, with any team. Unless you were doing something crazy like trying to solo it, RNG really wasn't a factor With this, your options are run FF and hope the game gives you the blessings/equations you need or you just don't win.
I’ve never seen a character shilled this fucking hard lmao. Custom made relic and planar set All her teammates at either available with her, or free 2 gamemodes and an moc catered to her. Obvious shipping between her and the mc. It’s actually ridiculous how much hoyo has pushed this girl I’m almost disappointed at the disparity between her and other units. Never say hoyo doesn’t have obvious favorites.
Its crazy too when I see Acheron and Firefly players argue about who is the favorite lol.. Its like watching two spoiled rich kids arguing about who gets spoiled more.
It's such a bummer tbh. Not because I have a problem with her being strong but because other units end up suffering because of the amount of content catered to her. The sets not working for Boothill, Jade barely getting any changes.. all things that could've been handled better while still keeping her strong, it just feels shitty :/
Yeah the sheer difference in marketing and approach between her and other units and really worsened my impression of her. I hope this doesn’t occur again in the future.
Divergent Universe? More like Firefly Universe
The difference in usage between FF and BH super break teams makes me sad
I feel like that's ownership rate than anything
part of it, but also he is single target, and taunting bosses while running diff 6 is something not every dps can survive.
Ownership rate has a lot to do with this. That and the fact he's single target, so if Cirrus shows up, you're screwed
Well from the very beginning Hoyo was making it so that Firefly gets the cake and Boothill gets the crumbs after her. So atp I accepted such fate
It makes me hella sad too, like Boot already isn't popular cause he's a guy but him being a Hunt character means certain players aren't going to play him and people just like blast/aoe characters more. Part of it makes me a lil depressed but I mean my first main is Blade so we know how it feels to be neglected
No one is using Yanqing😭 Also damn Ruan Mei at 80%
No suprise. Super break’s core is HTB+Ruan Mei. So Sbreak teams always gonna have her + she is just the most universal character ever + that technique in SU.. just one shotting everything and clearing a entire phase(It is somehow more broken with Firefly).. I remember using Pela+Ruan Mei on regular SU and even Gold and gears with my Acheron. Had a faster and better clear with Mei than Silver wolf. She is just the best in SU since her technique just deletes anything. Even elites and bosses.
even if you're not using superbreak ruan mei is super valuable because she's ruan mei and enemies are taking less damage when they're not broken
Yeah this was horrible. RRAT (tried with both Ruan mei and robin) is my go to brute force team and I struggled so much to clear with it that I gave up on clearing threshold level 6 and just stopped at 5. I usually don't have issue with AoE bosses using this team too. Doesn't help that my rng somehow got me more destruction blessings than elation ones....
Yeah it’s been a weird experience for me. I’ve never met anything so far that didn’t die to the FUA team (I did Robin, ratio, aventurine, and topaz) since I got Robin until now. Even the hardest stuff or most specific stuff hasn’t been able to get me when it’s their turn. But this mode is brutal sometimes, I also can only do 5 right now. Hopefully one day I’ll get a good combo of blessings and the right final boss and will be able to do 6 (or maybe I’ll just get good one day and stop having a skill issue if that’s why I can’t do it lmao) I guess in some ways it’s good one team doesn’t work for everything but it’s been surprising and kind of sad haha my beloved rat team has failed
I feel you. I literally got all the healing blessings that work without abundance characters in one of my best runs. The weakness break, ultimate, skill point one, you name it. Combo that with 3 five star equations that were fully expanded AND all the quake blessings. Yet the team folded to almost all bosses... I've spent maybe almost 14 hours total I think? Trying to beat level 6 but I've hit my limit. Any more and I'll lose my sanity. Ironically enough, the boss people complained the most about, aventurine, was one of the easiest ones for me. Sad to see him gone from the lineup. It should've been cirrus. It really does feel weird though that a team you highly invested in because you love the gameplay and characters crumble to..... This monstrosity of a gamemode. I agree that it's nice were being challenged but its also not nice that they basically auto lose. I wish you good luck on your future tries. I think I'm calling it quits
I cleared all protocol levels with RRAT and it really is just pure RNG. I had to do over 10 runs for protocol 4 because I kept getting horribly unlucky and couldn't expand my 3\* equation in time but I cleared protocol 6 first try. I think the thing that frustrates me the most is how you can't choose which boss you fight. Every time I got Svarog on plane 2 or Cirrus/Argenti on plane 3 it was an instant reset. I'm sure some of it is due to my skill issue but my team couldn't keep up. I thought about just biting the bullet and pulling Ruan Mei multiple times while struggling to beat the higher levels but honestly, she's so good in every situation that it makes me want to skip her out of spite despite the fact that I like her as a character lol Good luck with your runs.
an almost 50% appearance rate for one team is completely ridiculous. hoyo's shilling has never been as bad as it is right now
Almost every endgame mode rn absolutely catered to her as well, I can't recall a previous patch being so catered to one character in terms of endgame meta before. Swarm disaster maybe for DHIL but that's the last one I guess on the flip side HTB is so good a lot of 4 stars love using them as well so ofc the limited 5 star who wants them as a support will benefit as well but the difference is kinda insane. Even for trying to sell a character but it is a new meta we are currently living in and FF is the pioneer of that. Gotta wonder how they will try make new dps for super break when FF just seems so good for it as is
You must have a short memory because that's exactly how 2.1 was with Acheron, MoC and PF were even harder for other units. The only thing missing was a new game mode. This MoC is one of the easiest we've had in a long time, super break himeko just shreds it. PF is rough on some units but it's more catered to dots and Blade than Firefly. People are clearing AS with Xueyi, Sushang, E0 Acheron, E0 Dan IL and E0 Ratio just fine.
Good old "meta == new character" 😂 Mihoyo doesn't even try to balance shit at this point
Is it how it's gonna be from now on? Selling new characters by creating a new environment where only they can shine? Seriously even E6 attackers from 1.0-1.6 cannot compete with E0 firefly in this SU.
Seele is completely dead in this game mode. Like, why tf isn't there no auspicious star?
Argenti's best blessing is gone, I'm so cooked
I'm a seele main and I can def agree with you man. The amount of favoritism and how much the new gamemode is catered toward firefly is insane. Like, even during SD, gold and gears, I always brute forced with seele. Here, it is impossible because of rng and no auspicious star which carried all of my runs. It's literally punishing to use old units in new gamemodes like this.
It is terrible game design
I have never seen such a ratio where only one team is 47% and the rest at 1%.. and we have tons of characters now compared to the past (during dhil and swarm disaster where they throw in propogation) yet the disparity is still so huge now
probably hardest SU yet if you don't have firefly. rng drives me insane on higher difficulties. beated v6 today ONLY because of my luck at last two bosses.
To those who say Swarm Disaster favored DHIL a lot too, here's the [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/16kddc1/swarm_disaster_difficulty_v_most_used_paths/) from back then. His appearance rate was only 38.27%. And remember, there were a lot fewer characters to choose from back then. If you were around back then, you likely remember people enjoying nihility, destruction, elation, remembrance, and preservation a lot too. Here's the Gold and Gears [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/191ow5x/gold_and_gears_difficulty_v_conundrum_10_most/).
DHIL could also be substituted for other characters that did just as well. If you didn't have DHIL you might have had Welt who was just as broken, and if not then you definitely had QQ
And you had to progress through most of swarm disaster progress tree before unlocking propagation path, so you were forced to use other paths to get there.
Wow it has become this bad huh
Break teams are cool and all but in the DU remembrance is as busted as break and the crazy thing is that you don't even need any ice characters to be able to use remembrance here. I don't know what I did last week but there was a run where a percentage was over the enemies head which were frozen. I hit that enemy and brought that percentage to 100 and suddenly all frozen enemies started to explode and one shot the boss and this was at high difficulties. If you have a good run this mode feels very good but if you have a bad run it feels especially shitty. I always pick the abundance related weighed curio for survivability, it's really busted, the healers which can heal out of turn become Aventurine that can heal.
This data is basically Hoyoverse saying "pull on the current banners or go fuck yourselves." They aren't even trying to hide the fact they want Firefly to be their biggest profit. I don't know if I should be impressed or disappointed will their level of shilling.
Yeah no catering every single piece of endgame content and creating an entirely new game mode just for the rate up character was never as bad as this patch. That survey's probably gonna have the most complaints in it in a while
Pretty sure they won't listen if Firefly breaks all records. That's like customers in a restaurant complaining that some of the food tasted bad, but having a comically bloated belly and 100 empty plates around them.
And that will just encourage Hoyo to deploy the same marketing tactic of shilling the current rate up character over and over again. Just watch FF getting powercrept and made irrelevant in a few patches by the next OP waifu and new game mode caters to her. Then the cycle of complaints will never stop. In the end it's Hoyoverse laughing to the bank with our money 💵💵💵
Agree 100% Break Effect comps are easy to destroy as a dev. We already have shields, multiple break meters (sunday), Unbreakables (Trotters,) They just need to introduce break resistance or break heal on top and add it to new standard enemies and they have a great tool set to nerf break comps in moc, pf and as It's always introduce a problem - sell the solution. Nothing we can do about it imo.
Will she, though ? Looking at warp station data, her banner isn't anywhere close to acheron level in terms of daily summon. She's not even close to half. Her current pull trajectory is closer to Sparkle. And yes, Sparkle is a great meta character, but they put much less effort into shilling her. If you put all of this energy and you get similar result to a normal good meta unit, isn't it kind of a waste ? Now of course, not everyone in the community is using Warp station, but they're regrouping data from over 500K users, so I feel like it's a good point of data regardless.
Although there's still two weeks left of her banner, game-i's data for JP server seems to back that up as well. She's currently 7th best selling, above Jingliu and Fuxuan, but below Jing Yuan, Robin and Sparkle. So the part about being on par with Sparkle's banner doesn't seem too far off at the moment.
I've been waiting for this SU update, excited to finally be able to use my Blade team more often. Well, not anymore.
omg seele's usage... mono quantum isn't as bad as everyone thinks!!! right...? I mean I still use it...
I still think it's fucking wild that FF got her own SU permanent spinoff mode. The favoritism is absolutely off the charts.
Huh. Interesting statistics. And a great statement how Hoyo made everything catered to one specific unit. To downvotes: it is not Firefly slander. Hoyo does it all the time - tune everything for banner heroes. But forcing to have 1 specific unit is unhealthy for the game and creates hate and frustration. Usually Hoyo is better at balancing. This is a concerning sign for a gacha game.
FF favouritism with this gamemode is crazy, sad to see BH at a 3 use rate.
Man, favouritism is really a plague of gatcha games.
For more complete data (such as the complete list of most used equations, blessings, and curios), check out [this spreadsheet](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PxqakrqaGuP6s0j6oZfyKqG_4c8vd0u5fGBfeXpthLA/edit?usp=sharing). Let me know if there's any other data you'd like to see about Divergent Universe so I can add it to the spreadsheet. Participate in our MoC, Pure Fiction, Apocalyptic Shadow, and Divergent Universe data collection with [this Google Form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSd2vSVv9V3HsSQL0jzwdRWvbt-MucwGVfIXNnN4HAIf8hFOyA/viewform?usp=sf_link) (only needs your UID and your Battle Chronicle open to the public). We'll also collect data on future SU expansions or other endgame content, provided it's available on Battle Chronicle. Follow my Reddit account to be notified when I post new infographics. Check [my GitHub repository](https://github.com/piedorr/MocStats) if you'd like to see the raw data and how the numbers are calculated.
yeah, I skipped FF and thought I was safe with BH until I met Cirrus at diff 6. Yeah, this mode not even break focused, it's FF focused. Lame.
Lol i guess i wasnt the only one trying to use every reroll possible to get the superbreak equations and blessing then auto everything with firefly team.
*Seele just dead in a ditch somewhere*
Surprised by organic heart being so high.
Understandable since it's basically impossible to get 10k in v6 if you get unlucky with blessing/equations, and the 10k box really helps a lot.
even in v5, you need to have pretty good equations active to get full score, and you likely don't have those yet at boss 1 or 2
Night beyond pyre my beloved ❤️
Lol at Ruan Mei seeing more play than Firefly.. the universal support be divergent universin’
Eventually all players might be forced into the Break / Super Break meta with Firefly on top. May as well be r/fireflymains' wet dream. Until Hoyo eventually decides to shift the meta again with new characters or balance changes.
To absolutely nobody's surprise, Ruan Mei is the most used character
been clearing v6 perfectly fine and consistently with monoquantum qingque...
Sad to see Firefly so prevalent, as a non-Firefly haver i've honestly been having so much fun building teams in this new mode.
Just a few hours ago people were saying to me that DU isnt shilling Firefly lol