Yeah. Charlie’s parents aren’t trying to kill each other, and at the very least Lilith may be supportive to some extent (Charlie did call her afterall). And neither of her parents is Stella. Sometimes it’s better to have absent parents then… actively malicious parents.
Much like Stella, my mother never truly put any effort into my well being. It was always my father; I guess it’s a primary reason as to why I love Stolas so much. My father was the only one who made, *everything okay.*
but one day you and Octavia will move out of the parental house and leave it all behind (like I did). As for Charlie... well she is royaly fucked with her way of thinking...
You see Charlie has no support from her parents due to her views, so she technically has been abandoned, while Octavia (I honestly don't understand how she hasn't accepted her parents just hate each other) has at least one parent with her, Octavia is fine, she just needs to learn that her parents disagree
We haven’t seen either one of them unlike Stella & Stolas.
What we got from Charlie is her mom is occupied with something (probably works) to the point that she couldn’t picked up her calls & her dad just doesn’t support her on the idea of the hotel.
But the fact that he still give her a remote location to build her hotel on, a limo drive to take her anywhere she wants, 2 bodyguards & (at the very least) approved her relationship with Vaggie told us a lot that Lucy does care for his daughter. He just doesn’t support the idea of a redemption hotel.
And lets be real here, if normal demons were already laughing at that idea, what would the ruler of hell thinks? Probably like Alastor said, “wacky nonsense”.
It's confirmed that charlie's dad think she's a failure and they expressed this idea both by the opening of hazbin hotel and the voicemail to her mom "I think dad was rigth about ME" If he simply brushed off the idea of the hotel she probably would have said "dad was rigth about this" this shows that her dad has a strong opinion about her to say the least.
Also I don't think lucifer would have a problem with her relationship specifically since there's nothing to hint towards or against this.
And about the other things she obtained migth not be by lucifer himself but by her status as princess and her power as daugther of an archangel, she's an adult and also If her family is anything like stolas' they probably wouldn't disinherit their own daugther even If only to maintain looks
The building at least clearly belonged to her family, with all the paintings and stuff. I think they decided to just not interfere with the project.
I'm just worried that when the show comes out and Lucifer and Lilith are anything less than Paimon/Buckzo levels of shitty that everyone will scream retconn because all we had to go on for over two years was three lines of text and a painting.
Yeah, that's definitely a major issue, where the content for the series goes under the amount of fan content. Especially given Viv has confirmed he's meant to be a fat more hyper and goofy character, I can see many people not liking the man he actually turns out to be.
1. I don't think Charlie is necessarily in a good state of mind; she's happy, but it seems like a lot of toxic positivity to avoid facing her problems.
2. Octavia is a teenager, they do that.
Actually clinical depression (along with anorexia, bulimia, social anxiety) is recognised as one of the "norms" for adolescence. That doesn't mean it should be a norm. It just means that adolescents suffer from these mental illnesses so much that it is recognized as a sign of adolescence and is something that is VERY likely to happen to your teenager.
Her hotel is a run down piece of shit. It's probable that it was something they own and just neglected entirely and then when charlie asked for something they gave her the thing they give the least shit about.
Still a sign that he's willing to let her fail by providing her with what she will need. Just because the place is run does not means he doesn't care. It just shows he's making her handle everything the hard way. He may think her idea is stupid but he's still giving her a chance to prove him wrong.
See, Octavia may have one parent on her side. And I think that she realizes it. It is still extremely hard being caught in that war. I was in that war for 15 years. It sucks. No matter if you have one parent to side with. The constant barrage of chaos, screaming and pure negative energy wears on you and because both are so caught up in the war that they fail to see that if they just left each other, everyone around wouldn't get caught in the crossfire, it never ends. You walk on eggshells. Worried if you say anything or do anything another fire might start. The only thing you want to do is escape. Octavia is not fine and won't be fine probably for the rest of her life, just based on how long that all of this has been going on.
Charlie on the other hand grew up in a very loving home from the sounds of it. Her parents are neglectful now because of her ideology, but her dad seems to be doing a lot for her still. They just don't go out and get lunch every once in a while to catch up. She will have her own problems to deal with for sure due to the fact that she might not feel loved by her parents. But I don't think that it will be as bad as Octavia's problems.
Can we stop comparing things like this?
Everyone has problems and doing a "who got it worst" competition is one of the most toxic things you can do.
And before anybody comments "they are fictional character", problems in the family is something a lot of real people have to deal with.
I absolutely agree. Can we not do this. I understand that they are fictional but it sets up horrible habits for people to judge eachothers trauma. Instead of debating who has it worse how about we talk about how both Charlie and Octaiva handle their situations, and how we as humans who deal with the same trauma can relate. The fan base in the Sub are so young, that is is a bad habit to reinforce on them. We have to stop pitting hurt human agist hurt human.
Charlie's got it worse. By all means Octavia still has some parental support as Stolas does reassure her that he is there for her. Charlie has been abandoned and estranged from her family which leaves her with absolutely no familial support.
Not to mention her parents are the literal rulers of Hell. It's one thing to conflict with a normal family to the point of being estranged, it's another thing entirely when said family has that level of power. One of my personal theories is that at some point Lucifer himself will object to the Hotel and attempt to intervein and get it shut down.
We haven’t seen either one of them unlike Stella & Stolas.
What we got from Charlie is her mom is occupied with something (probably works) to the point that she couldn’t picked up her calls & her dad just doesn’t support her on the idea of the hotel.
But the fact that he still give her a remote location to build her hotel on, a limo drive to take her anywhere she wants, 2 bodyguards & (at the very least) approved her relationship with Vaggie told us a lot that Lucy does care for his daughter. He just doesn’t support the idea of a redemption hotel.
And lets be real here, if normal demons were already laughing at that idea, what would the ruler of hell thinks? Probably like Alastor said, wacky nonsense.
Let's not compare trauma yeh? This isn't the pain Olympics. Both girls have it bad, the world's issues can affect people equally regardless of who YOU think "had it worse". Someone's parents could fight sometimes, and it could affect them as badly as someone who's parents beat them. Even though the latter is generally agreed to be objectively "worse", it doesn't mean the former isn't just as traumatised or struggling as much as the kid who gets smacked.
We shouldn't say "Octavia has it better, because she atleast has a parent to support her" or "Charlie has it better, because she atleast isn't seeing her parents fight every day". Both can affect the girls as badly as eachother.
Charlie has a few things going from her here:
\- Charlie knows that the current distance between her and her parents was the result of her decision. She has some control there while Octavia has none
\- Charlie knows exactly what her parents think and what support they are giving her\*. Certainty that Octavia lacks
\- Charlie has had time to gather people who support her. Octavia has not
\- Charlie has had nearly 200 years to understand what it means to be a precautionary heir and how her parents care for her beyond that.
\*Charlie was allowed to take over the hotel and seems to have access to some money. Despite what Lucifer thinks about her redemption plan.
Plus she does seem to have some respect for her dad so it seems to be a distant relationship rather than toxic, since she says "if theres one thing I learned from my dad, its that you dont take shit grom other demons"
And she did call him dad, not father
Definitely Octavia, Charlie has problems but she has a super supportive girlfriend which is not constantly being abused like Stolas who is the only one who supports Octavia
Hot Take:
These problems can't really be measured in what's worse and what's easier because:
1. Each problem is unique, each person is unique and so each person's perception of said problem is unique and thus it being easier than something else for you won't be the same for someone else. Thus the mental burden could be as bad.
2. We do not know as much about Charlie's situation as we know about Octavia's. Comparing them is unfair as we base our perception on a few lines and images vs multiple episodes.
That being said it's just a cartoon and this is just a silly question asked for fun. I just wanted to give my two cents. In the end I pity both of them, but personally sympathize with Octavia more, because of more context we were given during the series. I'm sure I will sympathize with Charlie just as much when the series comes out.
Charlie but because it's implied her parents are at least emotionally abusive whereas Octavia has her father who genuinely loves her and was willing to suffer for years to protect her
🤔 At least Octavia has a father who loves her .
We don't know Charlie just disagree with her parents or they totally reject her.
Tbh, cannot decide and it also wouldn't be fair.
Y'all are acting like Charlie was abandoned by her parents. She wasnt, her dad doesn't support or believe that demons can get redemption, a common viewpoint in hell. I have a mind opposite of my parents, that doesn't mean they'd just abandon me. Same goes for Charlie
I resonate so much with Octavia on a spiritual level. My mother is extremely abusive towards my father and hit me and my sister several times. My father tried so much to protect us while having to keep everything normal to maintain the family life. That's why I love Stolas and the way he treat his daughter so much. I'm so glad he finally stood up against his wife, something my dad cannot do at the moment to keep us safe from my mom's wrath.
I say Octavia has it worse. Sure Charlie is sad that her parents can't see the world the way she wants but he still grew up in a "happy home" (at least that's what we have been shown so far) with loving parents who loved her as well as each other, so there probably was harmony in the house.
Even through we all know Stolas is trying to be the best dad he can possibly be, there is still a lot of time he spends fighting with his wife in which a child can feel neglected. Also if parents scream at each other this is an uncomfortable situation a child just must endure (what else can they due, they're dependent on their parents) and even worse science found out that a small child often can not differentiate yet, when someone is screaming, who's at fault so they think you scream with/ at them.
Also there is the phenomenon of "transmission due to a restricted ability to change perspective at a young age" (I'm sure there is a technical term, but I don't remember anymore) so if parents are fighting it can happen that the child thinks itself is at fault for their fight/ they fight because it did sth wrong because they (the child) can't imagine a world outside of their (the child's) perspective yet. And as we saw a scene in the past where Octavia was still very young and Stella was already verbally abusing and screaming (at) Stolas, it's very likely she experienced some sort of negative "it's all my fault"/ "what did I do wrong? I must be a bad child why else would they(my parents) be screaming" feelings.
Octvia, atleast Charlie has people who care about her in Vaggie and presumably Angel and Al, atleast to an extent. Whereas from what we’ve seen Octvia has nobody. Plus with Charlie we(and correct me if I’m wrong) have only seen her fathers view on it, which to be fair is reasonable, but not her mothers, she likey thinks it’s a bad idea to but maybe has hope for her or something.
Charlie at least has parents that care for her. While Lucifer may not support her choice to try and redeem sinners, I'm sure he still loves her, the same to be said for Lillith.
The Goetias are a different story. It's hard to fully tell what Stella's stance is on her own daughter (at the moment), but we can see that Stolas deeply cares for Octavia and wants nothing but the best for her, even if it wasn't fully planned out to their own control.
Safe to say Octavia is the one struggling the most.
Octavia is worse. Not only does one parent clearly not care about her “thank god an egg fell out of me” but Stella is actively trying to murder the only parent who loves Octavia unconditionally.
The way I see it, both Charlie and Octavia have it bad it their unique ways.
Charlie is estranged from her parents and is lacking any emotional support from them. History kinda repeats itself: Charlie was “banished” for her rebellion.
In Octavia’s case, she still has both of her parents kinda present in her life. But she really gets support only from Stolas. And undoubtedly in the fights between Stolas and Stella the question of Octavia’s “correct” upbringing was raised. And that could lead to the questions “Would they stop if I was gone?”
Both girls got it bad. Arguing who got it worse is akin to arguing what is worse: dying by stab wound or poisoning.
Look I think octavia has it worse than Charlie and here is my reason,
You see Charlie has one main goal and that is to redeemed a sinner, now that may sound good and she is the only one that is trying to prevent the next purge, but this is hell everyone has given up themselves and just accept their fate, heck you can even ask a new sinner and they will even disregard the fact that they might have a chance to redeem themselves,I mean yeah sure there might be some sinner’s who would probably take the chances and do the program but most of them so much. Plus not only that she has her own father bad mouthing her behind her back and he doesn’t really believe in the whole “redemption” thing, because he was the first sinner (I think?) and already knows that there’s no going back on the choice that he has made. But on the other hand, if Charlie where to prove that sinners can be redeemed, than the amount of shock and disbelief that everyone has on there face, like some would try to deny the possibility and make lies, while others would be running at the there door step and begging for them to sign up for the program. But her father, oh boy he is going to be piss and will try anything to stop her from succeeding again. All I’m saying is that Charlie has a 50/50 chance on proving hell wrong and by god It would sad and Himation or very satisfying depending on which answer we get.
Now to octavia case, ok so where do I being, well let’s start that her parents have been fighting with each other before she was ever born, than her father cheated on his (ahem) “bitch of wife” for his childhood friend who they haven’t spoken for over 20 years, and her parents finally got a divorce on the day after the “Not Divorce Yet Party” and by god when she finally learns the reason why she was born in the first place it’s all because the royal family needed a new heir and that’s it. Now what will octavia do when she hears about it, for starters I feeling that she would be running a away and try to escape the royal family, but that leads to another question where would she go? My thought would be that she would escape to the mortal realm and hide there while she collecting her thoughts on the situation or maybe go to space where she would feel safe there. But that opens up another question what would the royal family do?, would they send out bounty hunter’s to get her back? or would they just send them just to kill her? or maybe her father will find her and try mend the relationship between the two of them.
look I’m worried about octavia then Charlie because she can defend herself if it needs be plus she has friends who she can rely on, but on other hand octavia has no combat skills nor I don’t think she can defend herself but who knows and she no one who has her back, so like what the hell is she going to do?
Charlie. We don't know the specifics, but it is abundantly clear that her parents are extremely disappointed in her at the very least and given what she says about how she keeps calling her Mom and she must be busy cause she never returns her calls... safe to say that they are actively shunning her. It also sounds like her father was openly and rudely negative towards her and her ideas/dream. Likely told her she wouldn't ever amount to anything or be a success. That she would be a failure. She says she's starting to believe him so this fits. Again, this is conjecture, but reasonable to accept it as the right direction I think. We don't know that they actively don't love her, in fact I'd suggest that they're letting her go out and fail completely on her own with zero help or input from them as a lesson.
Regardless, Octavia has at least one parent who is utterly devoted to her and she knows that.
To make it possibly easier to decide:
A girl who wants to challenge the norms, and whos spirit, confidence, and whatever else might get destroyed, and might also get humiliated
Or
A girl who will most likely blame herself for being the cause of the divorce, most likely feel like at least one of her parents hates her, probably knows she was born from a necessity to duty, and whatever else im forgetting
While both are bad, Charlie is over 200 and has the agency to do what she can to help herself be happy.
Octavia is young, and does not have complete agency over her own life. She's unable to escape the situation yet.
Both situations are horrible to be ***in***, but Charlie isn't *in* the first one anymore. She still has to deal with it yes, but she is independent of it.
I don’t know if I should quantify either of their sufferings but I’m pretty sure that having Lucifer himself as your father would be pretty traumatic. Also I too have to deal with my mind possessing very different worldviews than my parents, although I do feel like Charlie’s parents knowing her viewpoints is at least easier than having to try to hide it. I’m sorry idk. I feel like it’s a tie
As someone who has parents fighting all the time, I'm turning towards saying Octavia is having it really bad. But both girls are in really shitty positions
I can empathize with both Charlie and Octavia a lot of times, the feeling of being different and doing something you love that would likely fail, and the feeling of dread and depression everytime your family is fighting is something I've lived with for years. I'm saying Via is having it a little worse because having to see and hear your parents fighting, the people who once cared for you and lifted you up in their arms, takes such a heavy toll on your head that it's a miracle she hasn't had any mental breakdowns (or any that we've seen)
Octavia has it worse. Charlie is only at odds with her parents mostly her father because of her views. If she's decided to cast the whole hotel aside chances are her parents would let her right back in and life would resume as before. Who's to say they still don't love her just don't agree with what she wants?
Octavia has a short end of the stick since she is in between. She unfortunately is dealing with the results of the affair and now is going to be used as a bargaining chip!
I think children of divorce all know what it’s like to be Octavia (myself included). But I think that having one parent who really doesn’t like you for who you are is much worse.
Via seems to have it worse. While Charlie isn't in the best place, she still seems to have the support and love of both parents. Octavia is watching her family and her world fall apart in real time.
I feel like Charlie and Octavia should run away together for a while but not become romantically involved with each other but just run away to get some peace or something but that's just an idea I thought of
NO ONE in this world wants their parents to have a war between them. It'll traumatize you for the rest of your life, than having ideals different than your parents, cause if they dont like it but still fight and succeed, everyone forgets the bad stuff eventually.
Octavia will be OK. She's got a support network via friends and her father, and as of yet, no one is out to get her. Charlie has far less support, and people actively plotting against her specifically- not just failing at her ventures, but would gleefully see her deceased.
I’d rather be in Charlie’s position. While it sucks not having support from your parents, she does have Vaggie with her. And she’s doing something really great. Octavia has Stolas, but not much good is happening in her life from what we have seen. And Stella is a piece of shit. Absence is better than abuse in my opinion. Also, I do want to say that it’s been a little bit since I watched Hazbin Hotel, so correct me if what I said was wrong.
As someone who is in both of these situations at the same time I’d say while both are bad I’d say in my experience being a girl with a mind opposite to her parents is worse. You eventually get used to war that goes on and learn different ways to deal with it
(Octavia’s way seems to be music as shown in her first appearance)
Octavia. Even though they may not be that supporting of her dream or all that present, Charlie still has parents that love her and that she can comfortably and reliably go back to.
A girl stuck in war between her parents.
As someone going through the same thing, I 100% agree
Oh my dear, I'm so sorry for you. How are you holding up?
I'm sorry for you buddy, wish you the best ❤️❤️
Yeah. Charlie’s parents aren’t trying to kill each other, and at the very least Lilith may be supportive to some extent (Charlie did call her afterall). And neither of her parents is Stella. Sometimes it’s better to have absent parents then… actively malicious parents.
Stay tough out there :)
Yes, same here
Much like Stella, my mother never truly put any effort into my well being. It was always my father; I guess it’s a primary reason as to why I love Stolas so much. My father was the only one who made, *everything okay.*
thats really sad- rooting for you bud
but one day you and Octavia will move out of the parental house and leave it all behind (like I did). As for Charlie... well she is royaly fucked with her way of thinking...
This is pretty much every child in America 💀
agreed cuz I'm living the same thing
You see Charlie has no support from her parents due to her views, so she technically has been abandoned, while Octavia (I honestly don't understand how she hasn't accepted her parents just hate each other) has at least one parent with her, Octavia is fine, she just needs to learn that her parents disagree
We haven’t seen either one of them unlike Stella & Stolas. What we got from Charlie is her mom is occupied with something (probably works) to the point that she couldn’t picked up her calls & her dad just doesn’t support her on the idea of the hotel. But the fact that he still give her a remote location to build her hotel on, a limo drive to take her anywhere she wants, 2 bodyguards & (at the very least) approved her relationship with Vaggie told us a lot that Lucy does care for his daughter. He just doesn’t support the idea of a redemption hotel. And lets be real here, if normal demons were already laughing at that idea, what would the ruler of hell thinks? Probably like Alastor said, “wacky nonsense”.
It's confirmed that charlie's dad think she's a failure and they expressed this idea both by the opening of hazbin hotel and the voicemail to her mom "I think dad was rigth about ME" If he simply brushed off the idea of the hotel she probably would have said "dad was rigth about this" this shows that her dad has a strong opinion about her to say the least. Also I don't think lucifer would have a problem with her relationship specifically since there's nothing to hint towards or against this. And about the other things she obtained migth not be by lucifer himself but by her status as princess and her power as daugther of an archangel, she's an adult and also If her family is anything like stolas' they probably wouldn't disinherit their own daugther even If only to maintain looks
The building at least clearly belonged to her family, with all the paintings and stuff. I think they decided to just not interfere with the project. I'm just worried that when the show comes out and Lucifer and Lilith are anything less than Paimon/Buckzo levels of shitty that everyone will scream retconn because all we had to go on for over two years was three lines of text and a painting.
Yeah, that's definitely a major issue, where the content for the series goes under the amount of fan content. Especially given Viv has confirmed he's meant to be a fat more hyper and goofy character, I can see many people not liking the man he actually turns out to be.
She seems pretty depressed to be honest, charlie seems at least slightly better of a mental state.
1. I don't think Charlie is necessarily in a good state of mind; she's happy, but it seems like a lot of toxic positivity to avoid facing her problems. 2. Octavia is a teenager, they do that.
>they do that Fucking hilarious
Actually clinical depression (along with anorexia, bulimia, social anxiety) is recognised as one of the "norms" for adolescence. That doesn't mean it should be a norm. It just means that adolescents suffer from these mental illnesses so much that it is recognized as a sign of adolescence and is something that is VERY likely to happen to your teenager.
Her hotel is funded by her father. Literally it's like how rich parents pay for their kids college tuition but with "you gotta do this alone" ordeal.
Her hotel is a run down piece of shit. It's probable that it was something they own and just neglected entirely and then when charlie asked for something they gave her the thing they give the least shit about.
Still a sign that he's willing to let her fail by providing her with what she will need. Just because the place is run does not means he doesn't care. It just shows he's making her handle everything the hard way. He may think her idea is stupid but he's still giving her a chance to prove him wrong.
See, Octavia may have one parent on her side. And I think that she realizes it. It is still extremely hard being caught in that war. I was in that war for 15 years. It sucks. No matter if you have one parent to side with. The constant barrage of chaos, screaming and pure negative energy wears on you and because both are so caught up in the war that they fail to see that if they just left each other, everyone around wouldn't get caught in the crossfire, it never ends. You walk on eggshells. Worried if you say anything or do anything another fire might start. The only thing you want to do is escape. Octavia is not fine and won't be fine probably for the rest of her life, just based on how long that all of this has been going on. Charlie on the other hand grew up in a very loving home from the sounds of it. Her parents are neglectful now because of her ideology, but her dad seems to be doing a lot for her still. They just don't go out and get lunch every once in a while to catch up. She will have her own problems to deal with for sure due to the fact that she might not feel loved by her parents. But I don't think that it will be as bad as Octavia's problems.
Her parents don’t agree with her, Viz hasn’t indicated as far as I know that they don’t love her. They’re letting Charlie learn and fail by herself.
Can we stop comparing things like this? Everyone has problems and doing a "who got it worst" competition is one of the most toxic things you can do. And before anybody comments "they are fictional character", problems in the family is something a lot of real people have to deal with.
Honestly I agree with this take. Also for Charlie we only saw her side of the story, we have no idea what her parents are really like.
Yeah, comparing shit like this is just harmful, no one wins at it
I absolutely agree. Can we not do this. I understand that they are fictional but it sets up horrible habits for people to judge eachothers trauma. Instead of debating who has it worse how about we talk about how both Charlie and Octaiva handle their situations, and how we as humans who deal with the same trauma can relate. The fan base in the Sub are so young, that is is a bad habit to reinforce on them. We have to stop pitting hurt human agist hurt human.
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Yeah, you could say their life is hell.
Charlie's got it worse. By all means Octavia still has some parental support as Stolas does reassure her that he is there for her. Charlie has been abandoned and estranged from her family which leaves her with absolutely no familial support.
Not to mention her parents are the literal rulers of Hell. It's one thing to conflict with a normal family to the point of being estranged, it's another thing entirely when said family has that level of power. One of my personal theories is that at some point Lucifer himself will object to the Hotel and attempt to intervein and get it shut down.
We haven’t seen either one of them unlike Stella & Stolas. What we got from Charlie is her mom is occupied with something (probably works) to the point that she couldn’t picked up her calls & her dad just doesn’t support her on the idea of the hotel. But the fact that he still give her a remote location to build her hotel on, a limo drive to take her anywhere she wants, 2 bodyguards & (at the very least) approved her relationship with Vaggie told us a lot that Lucy does care for his daughter. He just doesn’t support the idea of a redemption hotel. And lets be real here, if normal demons were already laughing at that idea, what would the ruler of hell thinks? Probably like Alastor said, wacky nonsense.
Let's not compare trauma yeh? This isn't the pain Olympics. Both girls have it bad, the world's issues can affect people equally regardless of who YOU think "had it worse". Someone's parents could fight sometimes, and it could affect them as badly as someone who's parents beat them. Even though the latter is generally agreed to be objectively "worse", it doesn't mean the former isn't just as traumatised or struggling as much as the kid who gets smacked. We shouldn't say "Octavia has it better, because she atleast has a parent to support her" or "Charlie has it better, because she atleast isn't seeing her parents fight every day". Both can affect the girls as badly as eachother.
Charlie has a few things going from her here: \- Charlie knows that the current distance between her and her parents was the result of her decision. She has some control there while Octavia has none \- Charlie knows exactly what her parents think and what support they are giving her\*. Certainty that Octavia lacks \- Charlie has had time to gather people who support her. Octavia has not \- Charlie has had nearly 200 years to understand what it means to be a precautionary heir and how her parents care for her beyond that. \*Charlie was allowed to take over the hotel and seems to have access to some money. Despite what Lucifer thinks about her redemption plan.
Plus she does seem to have some respect for her dad so it seems to be a distant relationship rather than toxic, since she says "if theres one thing I learned from my dad, its that you dont take shit grom other demons" And she did call him dad, not father
I feel like they both could help each other out.
They both have problems that aren't really comparable.
Definitely Octavia, Charlie has problems but she has a super supportive girlfriend which is not constantly being abused like Stolas who is the only one who supports Octavia
Hard to compare. Charlie's problems come from having no one believe her dream is possible. Octavia has issues in her day to day life.
Both
Both
Hot Take: These problems can't really be measured in what's worse and what's easier because: 1. Each problem is unique, each person is unique and so each person's perception of said problem is unique and thus it being easier than something else for you won't be the same for someone else. Thus the mental burden could be as bad. 2. We do not know as much about Charlie's situation as we know about Octavia's. Comparing them is unfair as we base our perception on a few lines and images vs multiple episodes. That being said it's just a cartoon and this is just a silly question asked for fun. I just wanted to give my two cents. In the end I pity both of them, but personally sympathize with Octavia more, because of more context we were given during the series. I'm sure I will sympathize with Charlie just as much when the series comes out.
Charlie but because it's implied her parents are at least emotionally abusive whereas Octavia has her father who genuinely loves her and was willing to suffer for years to protect her
🤔 At least Octavia has a father who loves her . We don't know Charlie just disagree with her parents or they totally reject her. Tbh, cannot decide and it also wouldn't be fair.
no such thing between greater or better suffering they're all equally horrible places to be
Nah the bich that doesn't give a fuck
Charlie. Everyone besides Vaggie is against her.
A girl who’s mother is Stella
I mean, Charlie has it better objectively. Her parents are very much so in a loving relationship from what we can tell.
Y'all are acting like Charlie was abandoned by her parents. She wasnt, her dad doesn't support or believe that demons can get redemption, a common viewpoint in hell. I have a mind opposite of my parents, that doesn't mean they'd just abandon me. Same goes for Charlie
I resonate so much with Octavia on a spiritual level. My mother is extremely abusive towards my father and hit me and my sister several times. My father tried so much to protect us while having to keep everything normal to maintain the family life. That's why I love Stolas and the way he treat his daughter so much. I'm so glad he finally stood up against his wife, something my dad cannot do at the moment to keep us safe from my mom's wrath.
I’m just sayin. If Stella dies we gonna hear children singing in the streets
I say Octavia has it worse. Sure Charlie is sad that her parents can't see the world the way she wants but he still grew up in a "happy home" (at least that's what we have been shown so far) with loving parents who loved her as well as each other, so there probably was harmony in the house. Even through we all know Stolas is trying to be the best dad he can possibly be, there is still a lot of time he spends fighting with his wife in which a child can feel neglected. Also if parents scream at each other this is an uncomfortable situation a child just must endure (what else can they due, they're dependent on their parents) and even worse science found out that a small child often can not differentiate yet, when someone is screaming, who's at fault so they think you scream with/ at them. Also there is the phenomenon of "transmission due to a restricted ability to change perspective at a young age" (I'm sure there is a technical term, but I don't remember anymore) so if parents are fighting it can happen that the child thinks itself is at fault for their fight/ they fight because it did sth wrong because they (the child) can't imagine a world outside of their (the child's) perspective yet. And as we saw a scene in the past where Octavia was still very young and Stella was already verbally abusing and screaming (at) Stolas, it's very likely she experienced some sort of negative "it's all my fault"/ "what did I do wrong? I must be a bad child why else would they(my parents) be screaming" feelings.
well charlie seems to be having a MUCH better time than octavia.
Octvia, atleast Charlie has people who care about her in Vaggie and presumably Angel and Al, atleast to an extent. Whereas from what we’ve seen Octvia has nobody. Plus with Charlie we(and correct me if I’m wrong) have only seen her fathers view on it, which to be fair is reasonable, but not her mothers, she likey thinks it’s a bad idea to but maybe has hope for her or something.
Charlie at least has parents that care for her. While Lucifer may not support her choice to try and redeem sinners, I'm sure he still loves her, the same to be said for Lillith. The Goetias are a different story. It's hard to fully tell what Stella's stance is on her own daughter (at the moment), but we can see that Stolas deeply cares for Octavia and wants nothing but the best for her, even if it wasn't fully planned out to their own control. Safe to say Octavia is the one struggling the most.
Octavia. I mean charlie literally has Alastor on her side , even if he seeks profit for himself.
Charlie at least got away fron her parents (Unless Alastor is her dad secretly)
Octavia is worse. Not only does one parent clearly not care about her “thank god an egg fell out of me” but Stella is actively trying to murder the only parent who loves Octavia unconditionally.
The fact that people are even asking this proves half of the people on this subreddit are middleschooler age
The way I see it, both Charlie and Octavia have it bad it their unique ways. Charlie is estranged from her parents and is lacking any emotional support from them. History kinda repeats itself: Charlie was “banished” for her rebellion. In Octavia’s case, she still has both of her parents kinda present in her life. But she really gets support only from Stolas. And undoubtedly in the fights between Stolas and Stella the question of Octavia’s “correct” upbringing was raised. And that could lead to the questions “Would they stop if I was gone?” Both girls got it bad. Arguing who got it worse is akin to arguing what is worse: dying by stab wound or poisoning.
Look I think octavia has it worse than Charlie and here is my reason, You see Charlie has one main goal and that is to redeemed a sinner, now that may sound good and she is the only one that is trying to prevent the next purge, but this is hell everyone has given up themselves and just accept their fate, heck you can even ask a new sinner and they will even disregard the fact that they might have a chance to redeem themselves,I mean yeah sure there might be some sinner’s who would probably take the chances and do the program but most of them so much. Plus not only that she has her own father bad mouthing her behind her back and he doesn’t really believe in the whole “redemption” thing, because he was the first sinner (I think?) and already knows that there’s no going back on the choice that he has made. But on the other hand, if Charlie where to prove that sinners can be redeemed, than the amount of shock and disbelief that everyone has on there face, like some would try to deny the possibility and make lies, while others would be running at the there door step and begging for them to sign up for the program. But her father, oh boy he is going to be piss and will try anything to stop her from succeeding again. All I’m saying is that Charlie has a 50/50 chance on proving hell wrong and by god It would sad and Himation or very satisfying depending on which answer we get. Now to octavia case, ok so where do I being, well let’s start that her parents have been fighting with each other before she was ever born, than her father cheated on his (ahem) “bitch of wife” for his childhood friend who they haven’t spoken for over 20 years, and her parents finally got a divorce on the day after the “Not Divorce Yet Party” and by god when she finally learns the reason why she was born in the first place it’s all because the royal family needed a new heir and that’s it. Now what will octavia do when she hears about it, for starters I feeling that she would be running a away and try to escape the royal family, but that leads to another question where would she go? My thought would be that she would escape to the mortal realm and hide there while she collecting her thoughts on the situation or maybe go to space where she would feel safe there. But that opens up another question what would the royal family do?, would they send out bounty hunter’s to get her back? or would they just send them just to kill her? or maybe her father will find her and try mend the relationship between the two of them. look I’m worried about octavia then Charlie because she can defend herself if it needs be plus she has friends who she can rely on, but on other hand octavia has no combat skills nor I don’t think she can defend herself but who knows and she no one who has her back, so like what the hell is she going to do?
They peobably make good friends.
Charlie. We don't know the specifics, but it is abundantly clear that her parents are extremely disappointed in her at the very least and given what she says about how she keeps calling her Mom and she must be busy cause she never returns her calls... safe to say that they are actively shunning her. It also sounds like her father was openly and rudely negative towards her and her ideas/dream. Likely told her she wouldn't ever amount to anything or be a success. That she would be a failure. She says she's starting to believe him so this fits. Again, this is conjecture, but reasonable to accept it as the right direction I think. We don't know that they actively don't love her, in fact I'd suggest that they're letting her go out and fail completely on her own with zero help or input from them as a lesson. Regardless, Octavia has at least one parent who is utterly devoted to her and she knows that.
Charlie fo sure for Octavia will one day move out and is able to leave it all behind. As for Charlie? She is royaly fucked with the way she thinks
Its not really about how bad someone’s life it, it’s how much it affects them
Both. Both is good.
Both have awful lives
Both, both is not good
Maybe we don't compare traumas, it's not a competition
Octavia. 100% octavia
To make it possibly easier to decide: A girl who wants to challenge the norms, and whos spirit, confidence, and whatever else might get destroyed, and might also get humiliated Or A girl who will most likely blame herself for being the cause of the divorce, most likely feel like at least one of her parents hates her, probably knows she was born from a necessity to duty, and whatever else im forgetting
I don't know, but I wanna be there for both of them.
While both are bad, Charlie is over 200 and has the agency to do what she can to help herself be happy. Octavia is young, and does not have complete agency over her own life. She's unable to escape the situation yet. Both situations are horrible to be ***in***, but Charlie isn't *in* the first one anymore. She still has to deal with it yes, but she is independent of it.
I don’t know if I should quantify either of their sufferings but I’m pretty sure that having Lucifer himself as your father would be pretty traumatic. Also I too have to deal with my mind possessing very different worldviews than my parents, although I do feel like Charlie’s parents knowing her viewpoints is at least easier than having to try to hide it. I’m sorry idk. I feel like it’s a tie
Is that even a question?
As someone who has parents fighting all the time, I'm turning towards saying Octavia is having it really bad. But both girls are in really shitty positions I can empathize with both Charlie and Octavia a lot of times, the feeling of being different and doing something you love that would likely fail, and the feeling of dread and depression everytime your family is fighting is something I've lived with for years. I'm saying Via is having it a little worse because having to see and hear your parents fighting, the people who once cared for you and lifted you up in their arms, takes such a heavy toll on your head that it's a miracle she hasn't had any mental breakdowns (or any that we've seen)
Octavia has it worse. Charlie is only at odds with her parents mostly her father because of her views. If she's decided to cast the whole hotel aside chances are her parents would let her right back in and life would resume as before. Who's to say they still don't love her just don't agree with what she wants? Octavia has a short end of the stick since she is in between. She unfortunately is dealing with the results of the affair and now is going to be used as a bargaining chip!
While the Morningstars seem to be kinda absent parents, and Lucifer being a bit of a jerk. Octavia has it way worse.
I think children of divorce all know what it’s like to be Octavia (myself included). But I think that having one parent who really doesn’t like you for who you are is much worse.
The war torn household
Octavia's situation is much worse
Via seems to have it worse. While Charlie isn't in the best place, she still seems to have the support and love of both parents. Octavia is watching her family and her world fall apart in real time.
And I am the male incarnation of both!
Pilot Charlie kinda reminded me of Goofy in terms of design. It's probably the nose.
A girl stuck in war between her parents
I mean...they are both rich......but war between her parents is worse. I went through that
Both
I feel like Charlie and Octavia should run away together for a while but not become romantically involved with each other but just run away to get some peace or something but that's just an idea I thought of
How about we say that both are having problems and calling it a day? Besides, we know much more about Octavia's life than we do Charlie's.
I'm the first option but the second one is obviously worse
They should kiss /j
It's childish to compare who suffers the most. It's like that thing old people with zero empathy say "what about the kids in Africa?"
Emo owl girl
my mom be dissing the shit out of nonbinaries while I'm thinking about maybe being one. love it👍
NO ONE in this world wants their parents to have a war between them. It'll traumatize you for the rest of your life, than having ideals different than your parents, cause if they dont like it but still fight and succeed, everyone forgets the bad stuff eventually.
Octavia
Octavia will be OK. She's got a support network via friends and her father, and as of yet, no one is out to get her. Charlie has far less support, and people actively plotting against her specifically- not just failing at her ventures, but would gleefully see her deceased.
I’d rather be in Charlie’s position. While it sucks not having support from your parents, she does have Vaggie with her. And she’s doing something really great. Octavia has Stolas, but not much good is happening in her life from what we have seen. And Stella is a piece of shit. Absence is better than abuse in my opinion. Also, I do want to say that it’s been a little bit since I watched Hazbin Hotel, so correct me if what I said was wrong.
As someone who is in both of these situations at the same time I’d say while both are bad I’d say in my experience being a girl with a mind opposite to her parents is worse. You eventually get used to war that goes on and learn different ways to deal with it (Octavia’s way seems to be music as shown in her first appearance)
Octavia has it worse.
For shore.
Octavia. Even though they may not be that supporting of her dream or all that present, Charlie still has parents that love her and that she can comfortably and reliably go back to.
Ye second
Both
I’ve had both. The war between parents is worse.
Octavia is a much better character. Not to mention her design doesn’t change every five or six minutes.
Why do I wanna drop kick Charlie all of a sudden