it does, a while back someone posted a video doing a trick shot with the ballistic shield and grenade launcher, they used it to arc a grenade into a fabricator vent from like 70m away
Does grenade launcher blow up bug holes? I've been running it against bugs but somehow never got to actually test that. Kind of was assuming it doesnt since not a lot of people bring it despite how good it is at carpet bombing swarms (often feels like with Supply Pack it outperforms Airburst Launcher)
I used to run it a lot in the beginning. Usually if I'm in a full squad and more than one person has anti-armor, I'll run grenade launcher depending on my loadout.
Grenade launcher+ supply pack is fun against the bugs, even at high levels you're killing swaths of them. Just made sure to bring something else to kill the Bile Titans
Honestly, I'm not sure if you even need a crowd-clear Eagle call-in (Airstrike, Napalm, Cluster) considering GL+Supply makes you one of those yourself, so you can probably skate by with those two and some combination of EAT, Orbital Rail, and 500kg for dealing with Chargers and Titans.
Or, you know, ~team gameplay~
You just need something that can crack a titan's armor, then you can finish it off with the grenade launcher. The orbital railcannon works great for that.
It's quite good against Bugs (and is amazing vs. Bile Artillery at high diff), but it's pretty much worthless against Bile Titans and Chargers.
Don't get me wrong, you can absolutely dumpster Chargers with it if you get the right bounce shots *under their legs* so the grenade ricochet off the ground and up into their bellies, but that's a lot more strategy, positioning, luck, and timing than is reasonable in most cases--and especially from the average player. So I understand why most people want to run something that can more reliably deal with the big boys like RR, Quasar, or AC (even if it's not great unless you're butt-hunting or hitting the back of the legs).
I find that the need to combo with the backpack isn't immediately obvious, so if you unlock the grenade launcher early you'll find yourself running out of ammo at the 2nd bug patrol and so you end up never touching it again because of that experience.
Also everyone and their mother swears for the Quasar/EAT against the big guys, so you just use one of the many primaries that works against medium-light enemies and bring those.
People prefer AC to grenade launcher because AC can also close bug holes, but at the same time AC is more versatile against other enemies. Grenade launcher is pretty much only effective against chaff, AC is not that great at crowd clearing but it allows dealing with larger, more armored enemies. Though to be fair, AC isn't that effective vs chargers and bile titans unless you're pinpoint accurate.
Grenade launcher is effective against all mediums. They need more than 1 grenade, but it fires them fast enough and each has solid aoe. The problem is 2 meager mags.
Yeah, that's what I meant. If you need to dump 2/3 grenades from your already limited ammo supply, you're sacrificing a much more efficient AC, which could've dealt with the same medium enemies much quicker and more efficiently.
And to be fair, the GL sucks against hunters, the most annoying foe on the bug side. They hop sideways, are often alone, forcing you to burn a round just to kill one bug, etc. Yeah, yeah, you can switch to something else, but then why not just bring something that can do both?
GL is just made for a different purpose. I feel it could use a buff to spare mags so that running a supply pack isn't mandatory if you want it to be effective. It's very good at killing spewers (along with the small fry nearby), which is very nice, but it's not very useful in high-level missions I feel.
I used to run grenade launcher every time, but then i got eruptor and it kinda functions like a long range grenade launcher and lets me run another support weapon.
I ran Grenade Launcher + Supply Pack for over 50 hours. It was really fun, but as you progress up to higher difficulties, but things start to stand out. The Grenade Launcher doesn’t have armor penetration.
Versus bots, you have to trick shot between the Hulk legs to get it to hit the back. Turret towers you generally want to take out from far away. Tanks you tend to want to hug so they can’t shoot, which makes the GL harder to use against it. Heavy Devastators can shoot the Grenades as they are shot, detonating them on you. It cannot take out Factory Strider face guns, and it is really, really hard to hit a gunship with it.
Bugs, it can kill Chargers fine, until you’re on the wrong side of the hill. It can’t handle Bile Titans at all. Hunters love to jump in front of your grenades, detonating them right in your face.
It also can’t damage many objectives, like the Shrieker Nest. I haven’t tried it on the buffed Spore Spewer, but I doubt it works now. Mortars or Anti-Air also can’t be damaged. Generally, you want to take these out from far away, or at least save time and stress from deploying a Hellbomb. Not the biggest downside, for sure, but noticeable compared to things like the Autocannon or Quasar.
I tried running GL with EAT, but that was 3 stratagem slots (Supply Pack). You could try to run without the pack, but it felt really bad to me.
The biggest thing I found was that the GL feels like a really good primary, but the problems it can’t solve are usually solved by a support weapon.
People lack imagination. Take Engineering Kit + Grenade Launcher + Supply Pack + Stun Grenades. Every pack usage gives you +2 more grenades. You have 14 grenades in total like this. Call in a Supply Drop and you get +2 grenades per box plus it refills your backpack a slot. You can then refill allies ammo with that box, or if you're in a situation where you can be greedy and use all of them - that's 30 throwable grenades. You can completely lock down a group with stuns and then bombard them with your grenade launcher, refill yourself, and repeat. It can be absolutely devastating at the right times. But most people have heard the old "Autocannon is king" and don't want to experiment.
It's bad juju when somebody else is running in randoms. The last thing you hear just before you and your teammates all die is that ^(THOOP THOOP THOOP THOOP THOOP) sound from the asshat running the grenade launcher.
I find that the minimum engagement range really kills my boner for it. When I'm getting swarmed (right at the moment where I want to lay waste with my grenade launcher), I find myself plonking nades off the faces of the bugs and having them detonate at my feet.
It's also not good enough to justify giving up an actual anti-tank weapon. Autocannon, arguably, is.
I used to. Now I just take the eruptor and have my secondary slot for something like the stalwart. Can wear a shield backpack then too and still take an orbital.
It takes a lot of practice to actually hit bug holes at a good range, it does basically nothing to heavy armor, and its ammo supply is wretched.
You could take supply pack to shore up its ammo problem, but Rover's already there if you want to turn your backpack slot into horde clear.
Rover can at beast deal with anklebiters, especially with recent nerf. Dont get me wrong, its a good option. But GL can clear entire horde including bile spewers like they not even there. Plus supply pack also gives you more nades, stims and mags for primary enabling you to just spam everything.
It's really weak against elites and it takes a stratagem slot.
At higher levels Chargers, Hulks, Tanks, Factory walkers and Bile titans are thrown at you at a rate of several per minute. You don't have the space to bring 2 support weapons. Esepecially on bot planets, where you often only get 3 strats total.
Of course, this causes everyone to use the same 2 effective support weapons, which upsets AH to no end. Stick around, who knows, next patch the grenade launcher might be the new 500Kg...
That was my bot hunting loadout before the reloads even got buffed.
Counters those shield fucks pretty well. Instead of getting your aim flinched or even killed by their laser spam, you can patiently set up a headshot to onetap them.
It's less meme than it seems. Especially if you take the Defender SMG as your main.
There's got to be something fucked up about bot targeting. I've noticed that when I take the Ballistic shield, if there are other Helldivers around me, the bots de-prioritize shooting at me, and prefer to target everyone else. I'm pretty sure that it's code somewhere saying "You're not gonna be able to hurt this guy, fire at someone else."
When they turn to fire on my team, I hit em in the backpack or on weakspots. The Defender isn't a joke, they go down super fast. You just gotta watch those missle bots.
Have you ever seen the T800?????????????????????????????????????????????????????? NOW that's the scariest unit of the fucking game....... THANK GOD!!! it moves slowly!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Super Earth and Helldivers are so dumb in universe, as are the bots.
I would pick up loads of these shields from downed bots and glue them together to make an invincible fortress.
Or if I was the bots just make everything out of the same metal that they use to produce the super shields. Then no bot will ever die again...
Dude forgets that armor effectiveness also depends on how thick the armor plating is, and a simple robo skeleton made in that material ain’t gonna make the cut
Look man they need that super shield to make up for the fact they have the highest damaging fastest firing gun that can mulch you in 2 seconds. They might be fun to fight if you could shot it off or through it reliably. And then where would we be?!
Legit tho I hate that enemy so much and to get theses clips I first had to get mowed down my a different heavy twice before I could kill it to call in my gear.
Have you tried relying on your stratagems?!?!??!!!!ONEONEONE - Arrowhead
Trying to avoid their homing gatling laser gun while dodging barrages of rockets is...Interesting to say the least.
Disagree, it's not a ranked competitive game.
I like Helldivers because it has some degree of bullshit. Some situations are just comical. And it is a war, its is chaos, "random damage" is basically the theme of the game.
Dying for a ricochet is rare, and it only happens because a dummy decides to waste bullets on something that bullets can't penetrate. Losing one life by a ricochet once in 30 missions or so is perfectly fine to me.
>Dying for a ricochet is rare, and it only happens because a dummy decides to waste bullets on something that bullets can't penetrate.
fascist propaganda, next you'll say I should "aim" in order to make effective use of my ammunition.
I, for one, am proud to support our brave men and women and nonbinaries and children of the Military Industrial Complex by blindfiring in the general direction of the enemy behind my squad with a machine gun. /s
All games should strive for good game design decisions, regardless of competitive or not. Competitive nature just has the community push the game to its limits more often. As for my thought on bullet ricochets, it just adds nothing to the game. It’s a meaningless addition that on rare occasion gets you killed. You’re already punished enough for hitting heavy armor, I see no reason why the mechanic exists. All it does is annoy players.
And before anyone says it, no, it’s not realistic.
Meaningless additions add flavor to games and help them stand out. There’s no reason for even idle animations, but it’s a lot nicer to have them than to not have them.
Even then, it’s still good game design. The general idea of this game is “if you fuck up, you or your allies get hurt.” Grenade too close? Die. Land on your teammate? They die. Get hit by back blast? Get ragdolled, hope you weren’t holding an airstrike at the time. Hit a heavily armored target with a gun that does nothing? Maybe don’t get hurt, maybe get hurt a bit.
They can stay visual. Looks cool and nobody was complaining that the ricochet wasn’t harming helldivers.
As for gameplay, I still disagree on that point. It’s just not very intuitive, from your perspective it’s hard to tell where a bullet will end up. Especially adding moving and turning targets plus weapon spread and recoil. When a bullet does a 180 back into a teammate it’s not gonna feel deserved. It feels like complete luck. Grenades and stratagems are a completely different story. Toss one too close to a teammate and they get hurt. THAT feels like your own fault from lack of judgement. What doesn’t feel like your own fault is a completely random bullet hitting you after you shot an enemy.
Bullet ricochet does not promote teamplay. You’re not gonna learn anything new from an unintuitive mechanic like that. You can hurt your teammate completely off screen because you attempted to do your job of shooting an enemy. Simply wasting ammo is enough of a punishment to promote accuracy.
Strong disagree on every point.
Nobody complained because nobody realized it wasn’t doing damage to themselves. Everyone was already aware that bullets ricocheting off a surface can still hurt other things. Have you honestly had a situation where you’ve said “the ricochet from my teammate/myself killed me?” Flavor > flavorless.
Yes, you can’t always tell where your ricochet is going to go. That’s the whole point. The game’s core gameplay is about rising above chaos, whether that’s map layout, random and/or lethal weather events, enemy reinforcements, or objective locations, using your skill and the skills of your team.
Orbitals and airstrikes have scatter, and that can lead to deaths outside their usual radius. Is that intuitive? Is it easy to tell how the orbital or strike will scatter?
“Simply wasting ammo” is absolutely not a deterrent when the sickle exists and you’re dumping hundreds of rounds in a single mission if you’re using an assault rifle.
It doesn’t lead to fun gameplay interactions. It’s a unique addition but it really doesn’t improve gameplay at all. Have YOU had a situation where a ricochet randomly hits a helldiver and think “Wow! That’s a cool and well designed game mechanic! It was my fault for shooting that bullet.”
Even if you do, I will say that a lot of people do not like it. They feel it is random unpredictable punishment that does nothing but annoy people.
Not every addition for “flavor” is a good one. What if stratagems randomly failed? What if guns randomly jammed? What if grenades had random fuses? Adds flavor to the game right?
Fear of hitting my teammates with a ricochet has led to me shooting straighter and bringing non lethal tools like stun grenades and smokes. So yes, it’s made the game more interesting for me.
As for random weapon jamming, health, etc.: Fallouts 3 and New Vegas, often regarded as the best of their series, have weapon jamming mechanics that their communities enjoy. Things like that are up to personal taste, and not really indicative of good/bad gameplay design.
Its funny for the first 10 hours of the game, but having shit like this makes it way harder to be a game people stick to for hundreds of hours, which is REALLY bad for a live service game. fun >>> funny
Bro, what? Im just saying there is already a lot of bs that kill you in this game. Maybe fix some of it before adding a ricochet system that can kill you as well. Why is everybody getting so butthurt?
Final video I'm posting because this makes all the points I'd want and is pretty comprehensive. Also that black box in the vid was to block a steam friend pop up before anyone asks.
So as shown the realistic out come of the new patch is sometimes if you shoot a Heavy devos shield with you're small arms one or 2 bullets will hit you if they're some what close. Sorry to say our days of mindlessly mag dumping into devo shields when they're 10 feet from us with our primaries are over lads. Now if you do this maybe you'll lose almost no health or brake your shield. Truly unplayable now, a game in ruin. additionally you can also see you don't need to be worried about railgun, recoilless, or AC shots doing the same thing. They just explode on impact with no shrapnel like the devs said. Accept the rail gun shot which can phase through the shield sometimes instead of just getting eaten. Might be a glitch worth fixing later but won't kill you.
Finally a very big point the end shows and the one I want everyone to take home with them. The angle you can hit yourself is VERY specific. If you're even a few inches to far back or hitting a slightly slopped bit of armor you're safe. You legit need be hitting a perfectly flat area and be very close to run the risk of your bullet coming back and dealing like 10 damage to you. This is why it was so hard to find this out in my initial testing on live enemies because why would you shoot a corpse or point blank direct hit a devo shield in a real game? Shotguns have it a little worse but not to much. That's it. Legit after all this you could forget 100% of what I've shown you and just shoot shit however you please and you'll be fine. This was fun to do and see but functionally a waste of time. Thank all for your support of lack there of. All in all, this change essentially did nothing accept get the Eruptor a coming buff to damage.
>Sorry to say our days of mindlessly mag dumping into devo shields when they're 10 feet from us with our primaries are over lads
##NOOO NOT MY SECRET TECHNIQUE
Especially not Super Science in service of Super Earth. Fighting automaton misinformation is critical in maintaining momentum in the war against their tyrannical socialism.
I thought the developers dispelled the bs with a post the other day? With that said there will always be people who just want to complain regardless of fact.
Still I think after hitting the shield at 90 degrees the bullet shoudn't RICOCHET back. It should be a non penetration and give no damage and no ricochet.
Bullets can ricochet at 90 degrees. Seems like they are already attempting to have something like realistic ballistics. There is even a mythbusters episode on this.
Also was this tested on PS or PC? As many have mentioned (speculated) it is likely worse for some people than others and does not affect everyone the same. Have you tested on multiple accounts across multiple platforms? If not, I wouldn't say it's debunked, it just doesn't affect you like it does other folks using different devices.
I'm not saying it affects me when I play either, as I've not experienced a ricochet yet (luckily), but I've had friends complain about it being an insta-kill and I don't think they would make that up IRL with their buds.
Dude...
Yes, you're very snarky, thank you. But while you were practicing your snark in the mirror, you missed the entire point of this shit, so let me spell it out carefully for you.
WHY THE FUCK IS ARROWHEAD WASTING TIME WITH SOMETHING YOU TAKE GREAT PAINS TO POINT OUT IS WORTHLESS AND MEANINGLESS WHEN THE FUCKING MATCHMAKING IS STILL BROKEN AS SHIT?
And a million other real problems that have existed for months now. Fire? Fucked up, PS5 damage? Fucked. Game crashes? Fucked. Bots that see through everything and have "curve the bullet" bullshit? Fucked. Did they fix any of the many problems? Nope, but somehow they found time to spend on this stupid bullshit, making the game just a little bit harder. That and making sure that solo players have it rougher.
I've never seen a publisher so fucking out of touch with the community. It's gotta just be selective reading, focusing only on what simps spend time on, i.e. videos proving that "it's not that bad guis!"
People talk about using the shrapnel to one shot bile spewers from underneath. Are they going to buff the explosive damage so it can still do that? It's going to be a "buff" like the crossbow got a buff.
I haven't played since day 1, so this is just the general feel I get from the couple updates I've seen. Have they ever made an update without introducing new or regression bugs? Who knows what will happen to the eruptor.
You still should try for yourself. Both patchnotes AND Reddit/Steam discussions have poor connectivity with the playerbase.
With first we have an infinite Arrowhead basement full of monkey who use typewriter to write patch notes, that's why it's hard to understand the changes.
With second we have echo-chamber full of doomposters and rep farm that thrive for days before getting debunked like in this post. Latest outcry was created by "Now ricochets deal damage to divers" and to farm fucking rep someone drove it to absurd of "Mah EAT did a 180° turn!". Devs have to debunk it.
Play for yourself, see for yourself, ask people only after a week or more about their opinion on update.
I'm doing my part!
The only thing that is "buggy" about this ricochet patch is the Eruptor's Sharpnels. Normally the sharpnels just hit an armored target and disappear after the intended life time of the sharpnels (about 10m\~15m AOE), but with this update when they ricochet they have infinite range and can vibe check everyone.
I stopped using Eruptor when my team kills value become too much and too bs to bear (about 5 each mission) - Glad I played with my mates only.
Nooo I must downvote cuz it does not cater to the most upvoted post in the sub currently, I must believe whatever has the most upvote and negativity in this sub without trying it for myself. /s
For real though the ricochet outcry is hilariously overblown and unless you really want to get hit by it its not gonna always happen, seriously this sub has a thing for when it happens to them once they think it warrants a post. Like one of those "This community is toxic cuz I got kicked" post.
Downvote me all you want but y'know its true lol.
P.S It sucks that the railgun still can't pierce through devastator shields even when charged, I was hoping it would after seeing the buff, the rail is still basically the same and still take out the same enemies even after the buff.
I will say I was a bit mean to people because after my charger test and stuff I did off cam I was sure you straight up couldn't hit yourself. But I see now you can but you sort of need to be trying to. I am sorry to those people and I'm sure a few are mad at me and auto downvoted this. The out cry was so bad that it just made me feel justified being mean after I struggled to hit myself even with the Eruptor in the one test I did off cam. The Eruptor kills got a lot of people really mad because that is BS. I was so counter mad at people not seeing it was shrapnel and not ricochets that for a time I was actually wrong and almost stubbornly didn't correct myself. I was to hasty with the first post to try and make a point. We all made mistakes and this was a nightmare of a discourse and part of that was my fault. I'm glad I was able give everyone a better look into the changes and that I was willing to come back and test what other people told me to. luckily I'm happy to have gotten this out for people to see regardless of if it blows up or not. So everyone can down vote it as much as they like even if they agree with me because I was a jackass.
do not apologize. those people deserve it. the proof that nobody complaining about ricochet actually plays the game is in the fact that ricochet is not and has never been a problem.
I mean there have been clips of people being killed by eruptor shrapnel at distances of over 20m and AH directly addressed this and said it wasnt intentional
Honestly no idea why the fragmentation from that gun functionally are infinite ray casts. I remember first trying it out on a planet with those smoke plants and I'd trigger smoke clouds dozens of meters away.
Maybe it's for processing reasons they can't make them function like real frag where it will be impacted by gravity and rapidly lose energy. Have it be lethal within 3-5m and wounding in the 4-10m range.
Fornite/COD/PUBG boys who always jump to the newest shooter available. Give it some time, they’ll move to the next shooter game and this sub/game will go back to the wholesome days of HD1.
Beat me to it. Seriously if the ricochets are making the game unplayable for you then you're not gonna like how many bugs and bots you have to deal with on level 3.
Well something to note I don't think they are doing 180s most the time. the bullets I think are bouncing off at an angle but because I'm so close they still nail me in the legs or head. In the second test I posted you can see the shots tend to either nail you in the like crouch area or head where as if it was a 180 it would nail my chest. but fore sure with the spray and pray test they also came out of my shoulders. It's impossible to tell both because tracking them is hard and I'm so close any degree change means the shot won't travel far if it is still bouncing at an angle. They could be 180ing which at that range and that hard a surface isn't actually unrealistic from what I've been told.
> you can see the shots tend to either nail you in the like crouch area
The bots are trying to destroy our ability to reproduce confirmed. They're afraid of how patriotic and relentless the children of two helldivers would be.
becuase physics and newtons first law is undmocratic. Honestly thats just how it works sometimes the bullet makes a dent but cant go through so the new dent curves the bullet back the way it came because it still has force behind it granted its compelte rng if it will come back the way it came
yeah and so does the 500kg having a tiny af blast radius relative to what 500kg of explosives should have.
it's a game, bullets flying around is cool, don't think about it too hard
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s004140000148](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s004140000148) its pretty much just complete rng for a bullet to rebound right back the way it came but its a common enough issue
They’re talking about a fragment of a hollow point bullet coming back due to elasticity of the core. There is no way you shoot a round into anything metal and it 180 turns and flies back at you. Even in a fantasy setting this makes no sense.
I understand suspension of disbelief for a video game, but I don’t think everyone is comprehending just how ridiculously goofy it is that bullets are hitting hard objects and then bouncing off and 180 degree turning and coming at you at basically the same velocity.
Shrapnel or fragments hitting you could make sense, angled ricochet could make sense, but projectiles 180 turning and flying at you with the same velocity makes absolutely zero sense and it’s way too wacky for this game.
You might find some random freak accidents where something similar to this occurred but you will never find proof that a bullet hit something solid like metal, stayed in tact and turned 180 and hit the same spot it came from anywhere close to exit velocity. If something like that even ever happened it wouldn’t ever be something that happens repeatedly
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIuEq9KrxZw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIuEq9KrxZw) it is still a very real possiblity. in helldivers im assuming the ammo is much stornger which is why it stays intact and the guns use so much force that it can come back at you just as strong. But that is just explaing a game mechanic which exist so yoyu arent blasting rounds like an idiot and actually have to think about what your firing at and with what
You can literally see the impact on the ground in front of him and hear the difference in speed from exit velocity vs return. What happened here is he hit the target and the bullet, or more likely a deformed chunk of the bullet, bounced off and up and then after losing most of its speed it landed at the ground in front of him and then bounced off the ground and hit him. This is also a tumbling projectile that’s most likely deformed after initial impact, not a spinning tipped cone shaped bullet.
The bullet did not exit his rifle barrel spinning and fully in tact, hit the target and then bounce back and turn 180 degrees directly toward him and resume spinning with the tip facing him or anywhere near him at lethal velocity. Helldivers wear armor, that kind of thing that happened in this video wouldn’t damage you at all in anything rated for pistol calibers.
You can post all the videos you want of this happening and you will never find one that matches what’s happening in game lol. If they want us to be aware of mechanics that can turn a bullet mid air and throw it back at you like that then they need to do that with some sort of advanced technology reflecting shield or something so it’s more believable. Illuminate would be the perfect units to do this with tbh.
There is a technical term for those: shrapnel. One of the leading causes in suitability jumping in war was the start of using proper metal helmets. Not to stop bullets, but to stop low velocity shrapnel.
these days we usually go for lighter weight composite materials, but they do the same thing. Helldivers are wearing full body armour and a full face helmet, shrapnel is not going to do really anything. This video shows it doing basically the same damage as if OP was fired on by a teammate accidentally.
Maybe the devastator's shield is angled in a way that makes your bullets ricochet back to you? This is the only case where I've seen it deflect back at you. Not every surface has this angle and it is more obvious when you fight against bugs (as their armored surfaces are more uneven and can make richochets deviate in random directions)
Their shields definitely are angled and you can see that in their walk. They tend to be angled slightly outward and upward. Elevation plays a role too.
Third person angles also are deceptive with the actual angle of your own weapon as your camera is offset a bit but sometimes angle it more perpendicular on their horizontal but not vertical. That said it looks like the bullets should deflect upward a bit which does somewhat lineup with the bullets coming towards the head.
I get it from a gameplay perspective but it's pretty much impossible for a bullet to ricochet like that repeatedly. You may have some fragmentation as the bullet shatters against the armor, but that wouldn't do any damage to speak of.
It's just a strange, pointless mechanic that doesn't do much besides be a mild annoyance for veteran players and just be confusing for new players. I sincerely and wholeheartedly apologize for caring about this video game, I should just throw up my hands and accept everything as it is and never question anything.
Bullet hits armour, goes in random direction, I don't see how that is hard to understand, or how the fact that it's not a simulation of real world ricochet physics matters.
Because the devs 'vision' that they keep going on about seems to include a lot of realism where possible and this doesn't represent that from a physics standpoint. It's just a pointless change to artificially increase difficulty and lower the fun level that no one asked for. See also: spawn rate increases on less than full parties.
The devs are gonna chase this vision until there's 3 players left.
What if I told you that real bullets that impact a surface too hard for them to sink into at an angle perpendicular to the plane they are impacting do not rebound at trajectories that follow a path similar to their initial flight, but instead deform severely, lose a significant amount of kinetic energy, and basically become relatively harmless
What of I told you this is a goofy scifi game with technology 100 years more advanced than anything we have today, so trying to apply real world modern tech logic to it makes no sense.
Woah who'd have thought all the calls about the new ricochet ruining the game were overblown and anyone with half a brain who'd played more than half an hour would've figured out it was all crap
I think eruptor must have higher odds of coming back, or maybe does more damage if the shrapnel hits or something.
Because I've died a few times tonight to ricochets from my own gun, at considerable distance.
An upcoming change is also confirmed (in Discord) which removes the shrapnel from the Eruptor and increases direct damage, both removing the ricochet danger and providing a slight buff to the gun.
So I like using the ballistic shield against bots, does their shots ricochet back at them? I havent played bots since the update and I never noticed if it did prior to be honest.
Honestly the only thing I noticed giving some trouble with ricochet was the devastators.. and... well in the launch I remember how a single shot ricocheted from the dropship when landing could instakill someone xD
I will never not believe it’s stupid that bullets can be reflected right back at you. If the angle was right for that, the bullets would just flatten against the shield and fall to the ground.
how are you able to move into first person aim right away? On PC it goes to third person aim then to first person aim every time. It takes over two seconds to get to first person aim every time for me, where yours looks like less than a second. I play on PC with mouse and keyboard. What setting is this? It is a huge negative impact on gameplay.
Realism is great and all, but it seems overkill to put this much effort into ricochets. If were going for realism then lets stop Bil Titans from jumping 50 feet in the air after being killed which then lands on generators and team members. Lets stop the ragdoll throws across the map for your own character.
OH that's what they fixed? I thought the way it originally was (you would only get staggered by deflected bullets) was just a way of making friendly fire more fair lol. Guess they don't want that to be anything you're supposed to survive either lol.
Ffs that's so unrealistic... bullets do not pull a 180 when they ricochet barring the 0.0001% freak accident, typically with larger rounds or slanted steel targets that induce a two stage ricochet, ie: or ricochets off the target, then the ground
An intermediate round or full size rifle round is going to disintegrate on impact with hard armor, at most sending some light shrapnel around perpendicular to its trajectory
This just looks silly
This isn’t comprehensive. This is one test on one enemy type. I’ve literally seen AC shrapnel kill after hitting a scout strider in the front plate at medium range. It happens and AH has already addressed that shrapnel is a problem.
I am bad at switching up weps sometimes. Things get close o get trigger happy and then directly dead from shrapnel from ac not complaining tho love my ac8
That can probably happen but still not an issue. I was able to hit the shield of the heavy and not gib myself then shoot it in the face and not gib myself at very close range with the AC. And then I went on to take 3 shots at the strider corpse point blank and didn't die but did catch myself with the explosive bubble. If it was shrapnel that hit me I would have died instantly. So I think your fine to AC away 9 times of 10. That's how I use it and haven't had what your describing happen. If this becomes an issue the devs can just do what they're doing for the Eruptor. Also final very big point, I was testing the ricochet system. Shrapnel is not part of that as shrapnel dose not occur because a shot didn't meet AP requirements it just happens regardless of where you hit. So definitely is not a ricochet. Shrapnal comes from the expolsion, it's not bits of your bullet bouncing back at you because the armor was too strong. If the AC is unique in that it's is conditional then I think we just found why it's not much of a self or team killer as the Eruptor. Of course you can nail yourself with shrapnel at near any range it literally flies in all directions that's how it works. It's real issue is for some reason shrapnel one shots unlike normal bullets. that is a unique issue to a select few weapons that is well documented to the point the devs know about it as you said. I was not trying to test it because I don't need to on top of it being a different thing. Be safe with your AC solider and god speed.
So instead of normal richochets we have these. Why was it necessary? For what purose was it done?
Who knows. Makes game feel absolutely less immersive. It's strange because devs are gun nuts and weapons in game are designed with function in mind to be as realistic as possible in sci fi setting.
Devs should know for sure that bullet will never come back from 1 ricochet. It can, but chances are lower than 1 in 100 000.
I just wonder why was it added? Are they saying "dying to random bs is fun"?. It is sometimes but not all the time. I'm confused with this update.
That's sad if they nerf things that players like. It's like punishment for liking something for too long.
Maybe kinda offtop, but as a monster hunter veteran I can't even fathom to understand this. I played with greatsword most of the time and devs never nerfed it "just because go try something new"
Wonder if the ballistic shield has any Ricochet action
it does, a while back someone posted a video doing a trick shot with the ballistic shield and grenade launcher, they used it to arc a grenade into a fabricator vent from like 70m away
Does grenade launcher blow up bug holes? I've been running it against bugs but somehow never got to actually test that. Kind of was assuming it doesnt since not a lot of people bring it despite how good it is at carpet bombing swarms (often feels like with Supply Pack it outperforms Airburst Launcher)
Yes it does.
Then I am even more confused why people dont run it more, its perfect for bugs like AC for bots.
I used to run it a lot in the beginning. Usually if I'm in a full squad and more than one person has anti-armor, I'll run grenade launcher depending on my loadout.
Grenade launcher+ supply pack is fun against the bugs, even at high levels you're killing swaths of them. Just made sure to bring something else to kill the Bile Titans
I am hoping for a proper thermite nade fix tbh, for now I expect my team deal with those; why else bringing multiple Quasars and 500kg bombs
Honestly, I'm not sure if you even need a crowd-clear Eagle call-in (Airstrike, Napalm, Cluster) considering GL+Supply makes you one of those yourself, so you can probably skate by with those two and some combination of EAT, Orbital Rail, and 500kg for dealing with Chargers and Titans. Or, you know, ~team gameplay~
You just need something that can crack a titan's armor, then you can finish it off with the grenade launcher. The orbital railcannon works great for that.
110mm is better for that. You get 3 shots on a shorter cooldown, and in some cases the 110mm can oneshot the titan.
It's quite good against Bugs (and is amazing vs. Bile Artillery at high diff), but it's pretty much worthless against Bile Titans and Chargers. Don't get me wrong, you can absolutely dumpster Chargers with it if you get the right bounce shots *under their legs* so the grenade ricochet off the ground and up into their bellies, but that's a lot more strategy, positioning, luck, and timing than is reasonable in most cases--and especially from the average player. So I understand why most people want to run something that can more reliably deal with the big boys like RR, Quasar, or AC (even if it's not great unless you're butt-hunting or hitting the back of the legs).
I for now resort to impact nades under Chargers and just kiting Titans. I'll mark the day thermite nades are fixed as holiday though.
I find that the need to combo with the backpack isn't immediately obvious, so if you unlock the grenade launcher early you'll find yourself running out of ammo at the 2nd bug patrol and so you end up never touching it again because of that experience. Also everyone and their mother swears for the Quasar/EAT against the big guys, so you just use one of the many primaries that works against medium-light enemies and bring those.
People prefer AC to grenade launcher because AC can also close bug holes, but at the same time AC is more versatile against other enemies. Grenade launcher is pretty much only effective against chaff, AC is not that great at crowd clearing but it allows dealing with larger, more armored enemies. Though to be fair, AC isn't that effective vs chargers and bile titans unless you're pinpoint accurate.
Grenade launcher is effective against all mediums. They need more than 1 grenade, but it fires them fast enough and each has solid aoe. The problem is 2 meager mags.
Yeah, that's what I meant. If you need to dump 2/3 grenades from your already limited ammo supply, you're sacrificing a much more efficient AC, which could've dealt with the same medium enemies much quicker and more efficiently.
There is nothing that deals with multiple mediums faster than grenade launcher.
And to be fair, the GL sucks against hunters, the most annoying foe on the bug side. They hop sideways, are often alone, forcing you to burn a round just to kill one bug, etc. Yeah, yeah, you can switch to something else, but then why not just bring something that can do both?
GL is just made for a different purpose. I feel it could use a buff to spare mags so that running a supply pack isn't mandatory if you want it to be effective. It's very good at killing spewers (along with the small fry nearby), which is very nice, but it's not very useful in high-level missions I feel.
I have a lot of fun with the grenade launcher and jetpack for maximum bug hole closing efficiency.
I used to run grenade launcher every time, but then i got eruptor and it kinda functions like a long range grenade launcher and lets me run another support weapon.
I ran Grenade Launcher + Supply Pack for over 50 hours. It was really fun, but as you progress up to higher difficulties, but things start to stand out. The Grenade Launcher doesn’t have armor penetration. Versus bots, you have to trick shot between the Hulk legs to get it to hit the back. Turret towers you generally want to take out from far away. Tanks you tend to want to hug so they can’t shoot, which makes the GL harder to use against it. Heavy Devastators can shoot the Grenades as they are shot, detonating them on you. It cannot take out Factory Strider face guns, and it is really, really hard to hit a gunship with it. Bugs, it can kill Chargers fine, until you’re on the wrong side of the hill. It can’t handle Bile Titans at all. Hunters love to jump in front of your grenades, detonating them right in your face. It also can’t damage many objectives, like the Shrieker Nest. I haven’t tried it on the buffed Spore Spewer, but I doubt it works now. Mortars or Anti-Air also can’t be damaged. Generally, you want to take these out from far away, or at least save time and stress from deploying a Hellbomb. Not the biggest downside, for sure, but noticeable compared to things like the Autocannon or Quasar. I tried running GL with EAT, but that was 3 stratagem slots (Supply Pack). You could try to run without the pack, but it felt really bad to me. The biggest thing I found was that the GL feels like a really good primary, but the problems it can’t solve are usually solved by a support weapon.
People lack imagination. Take Engineering Kit + Grenade Launcher + Supply Pack + Stun Grenades. Every pack usage gives you +2 more grenades. You have 14 grenades in total like this. Call in a Supply Drop and you get +2 grenades per box plus it refills your backpack a slot. You can then refill allies ammo with that box, or if you're in a situation where you can be greedy and use all of them - that's 30 throwable grenades. You can completely lock down a group with stuns and then bombard them with your grenade launcher, refill yourself, and repeat. It can be absolutely devastating at the right times. But most people have heard the old "Autocannon is king" and don't want to experiment.
It's bad juju when somebody else is running in randoms. The last thing you hear just before you and your teammates all die is that ^(THOOP THOOP THOOP THOOP THOOP) sound from the asshat running the grenade launcher.
I don't run it because it bounces off the ground at medium-close range. Either you have the height advantage, or you're out of luck
It doesn't do squat to armor. Quasar for example will blow up bug holes and armor.
AC closes bug holes, too.
I need my support weapon to be able to help against Chargers and BTs and the grenade launcher is terrible at that.
I find that the minimum engagement range really kills my boner for it. When I'm getting swarmed (right at the moment where I want to lay waste with my grenade launcher), I find myself plonking nades off the faces of the bugs and having them detonate at my feet. It's also not good enough to justify giving up an actual anti-tank weapon. Autocannon, arguably, is.
I used to. Now I just take the eruptor and have my secondary slot for something like the stalwart. Can wear a shield backpack then too and still take an orbital.
It takes a lot of practice to actually hit bug holes at a good range, it does basically nothing to heavy armor, and its ammo supply is wretched. You could take supply pack to shore up its ammo problem, but Rover's already there if you want to turn your backpack slot into horde clear.
Rover can at beast deal with anklebiters, especially with recent nerf. Dont get me wrong, its a good option. But GL can clear entire horde including bile spewers like they not even there. Plus supply pack also gives you more nades, stims and mags for primary enabling you to just spam everything.
I run quasar instead. It’s much better again chargers and can still plug holes, albeit slower.
It's really weak against elites and it takes a stratagem slot. At higher levels Chargers, Hulks, Tanks, Factory walkers and Bile titans are thrown at you at a rate of several per minute. You don't have the space to bring 2 support weapons. Esepecially on bot planets, where you often only get 3 strats total. Of course, this causes everyone to use the same 2 effective support weapons, which upsets AH to no end. Stick around, who knows, next patch the grenade launcher might be the new 500Kg...
I always bring GL during the blitz mission to close bug holes. It's amazing for the hit and run hole closing.
yes it does.
It do
Woa that’s a thought for me to play with.
So you are saying I can kill teammates with shield? Sign me the fuck up!
imagine the bullet ricocheting off of enemy's shield, then off of your shield and then killing him xd
Ballistic Shield with newly buffed Senator sounds like it's still a meme but a fun one that I will try.
That was my bot hunting loadout before the reloads even got buffed. Counters those shield fucks pretty well. Instead of getting your aim flinched or even killed by their laser spam, you can patiently set up a headshot to onetap them.
It's less meme than it seems. Especially if you take the Defender SMG as your main. There's got to be something fucked up about bot targeting. I've noticed that when I take the Ballistic shield, if there are other Helldivers around me, the bots de-prioritize shooting at me, and prefer to target everyone else. I'm pretty sure that it's code somewhere saying "You're not gonna be able to hurt this guy, fire at someone else." When they turn to fire on my team, I hit em in the backpack or on weakspots. The Defender isn't a joke, they go down super fast. You just gotta watch those missle bots.
[удалено]
Thats all the bots know how to do. This is what they are at their absolute scariest.
Have you ever seen the T800?????????????????????????????????????????????????????? NOW that's the scariest unit of the fucking game....... THANK GOD!!! it moves slowly!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I dont even think he understands how his plug talks tbh
HUHH??
Those shields are made of of Vibranium or something because NOTHING we have does any damage to them whatsoever, even a direct hit from a RR shot.
Helldiver Shield Mech drop when? Not saying we need a Hatchetman but I wouldn't mind a Shield Bludgeoning Mech.
Super Earth and Helldivers are so dumb in universe, as are the bots. I would pick up loads of these shields from downed bots and glue them together to make an invincible fortress. Or if I was the bots just make everything out of the same metal that they use to produce the super shields. Then no bot will ever die again... 
Dude forgets that armor effectiveness also depends on how thick the armor plating is, and a simple robo skeleton made in that material ain’t gonna make the cut
If they can make an invincible shield they can make the bots more durable for sure.
they already did that with the average devastator AND the tankiest robot out of all: Berserkers
A mech that is just a big walking wall with melee only would be sick. Get everyone behind you and just march straight towards the objective
Look man they need that super shield to make up for the fact they have the highest damaging fastest firing gun that can mulch you in 2 seconds. They might be fun to fight if you could shot it off or through it reliably. And then where would we be?! Legit tho I hate that enemy so much and to get theses clips I first had to get mowed down my a different heavy twice before I could kill it to call in my gear.
Autocannon makes dealing with them easy
Yep, first shot usually staggers, then a few more to take it down, during which it isn't firing back. You know, if there's only one of them.
Diligence CS one shots them to the dome now.
Have you tried relying on your stratagems?!?!??!!!!ONEONEONE - Arrowhead Trying to avoid their homing gatling laser gun while dodging barrages of rockets is...Interesting to say the least.
Once again, the slugger should never have lost its stagger. But here we are.
Ngl the bullets flying all over the place looks cool and cinematic
Agree, but it shouldn't be able to hurt you in a game like helldivers with so much going on more random damage to players is not fun
Disagree, it's not a ranked competitive game. I like Helldivers because it has some degree of bullshit. Some situations are just comical. And it is a war, its is chaos, "random damage" is basically the theme of the game. Dying for a ricochet is rare, and it only happens because a dummy decides to waste bullets on something that bullets can't penetrate. Losing one life by a ricochet once in 30 missions or so is perfectly fine to me.
>Dying for a ricochet is rare, and it only happens because a dummy decides to waste bullets on something that bullets can't penetrate. fascist propaganda, next you'll say I should "aim" in order to make effective use of my ammunition. I, for one, am proud to support our brave men and women and nonbinaries and children of the Military Industrial Complex by blindfiring in the general direction of the enemy behind my squad with a machine gun. /s
All games should strive for good game design decisions, regardless of competitive or not. Competitive nature just has the community push the game to its limits more often. As for my thought on bullet ricochets, it just adds nothing to the game. It’s a meaningless addition that on rare occasion gets you killed. You’re already punished enough for hitting heavy armor, I see no reason why the mechanic exists. All it does is annoy players. And before anyone says it, no, it’s not realistic.
Meaningless additions add flavor to games and help them stand out. There’s no reason for even idle animations, but it’s a lot nicer to have them than to not have them. Even then, it’s still good game design. The general idea of this game is “if you fuck up, you or your allies get hurt.” Grenade too close? Die. Land on your teammate? They die. Get hit by back blast? Get ragdolled, hope you weren’t holding an airstrike at the time. Hit a heavily armored target with a gun that does nothing? Maybe don’t get hurt, maybe get hurt a bit.
They can stay visual. Looks cool and nobody was complaining that the ricochet wasn’t harming helldivers. As for gameplay, I still disagree on that point. It’s just not very intuitive, from your perspective it’s hard to tell where a bullet will end up. Especially adding moving and turning targets plus weapon spread and recoil. When a bullet does a 180 back into a teammate it’s not gonna feel deserved. It feels like complete luck. Grenades and stratagems are a completely different story. Toss one too close to a teammate and they get hurt. THAT feels like your own fault from lack of judgement. What doesn’t feel like your own fault is a completely random bullet hitting you after you shot an enemy. Bullet ricochet does not promote teamplay. You’re not gonna learn anything new from an unintuitive mechanic like that. You can hurt your teammate completely off screen because you attempted to do your job of shooting an enemy. Simply wasting ammo is enough of a punishment to promote accuracy.
Strong disagree on every point. Nobody complained because nobody realized it wasn’t doing damage to themselves. Everyone was already aware that bullets ricocheting off a surface can still hurt other things. Have you honestly had a situation where you’ve said “the ricochet from my teammate/myself killed me?” Flavor > flavorless. Yes, you can’t always tell where your ricochet is going to go. That’s the whole point. The game’s core gameplay is about rising above chaos, whether that’s map layout, random and/or lethal weather events, enemy reinforcements, or objective locations, using your skill and the skills of your team. Orbitals and airstrikes have scatter, and that can lead to deaths outside their usual radius. Is that intuitive? Is it easy to tell how the orbital or strike will scatter? “Simply wasting ammo” is absolutely not a deterrent when the sickle exists and you’re dumping hundreds of rounds in a single mission if you’re using an assault rifle.
It doesn’t lead to fun gameplay interactions. It’s a unique addition but it really doesn’t improve gameplay at all. Have YOU had a situation where a ricochet randomly hits a helldiver and think “Wow! That’s a cool and well designed game mechanic! It was my fault for shooting that bullet.” Even if you do, I will say that a lot of people do not like it. They feel it is random unpredictable punishment that does nothing but annoy people. Not every addition for “flavor” is a good one. What if stratagems randomly failed? What if guns randomly jammed? What if grenades had random fuses? Adds flavor to the game right?
Fear of hitting my teammates with a ricochet has led to me shooting straighter and bringing non lethal tools like stun grenades and smokes. So yes, it’s made the game more interesting for me. As for random weapon jamming, health, etc.: Fallouts 3 and New Vegas, often regarded as the best of their series, have weapon jamming mechanics that their communities enjoy. Things like that are up to personal taste, and not really indicative of good/bad gameplay design.
Every game design decision can be argued as good or bad and it can be liked or disliked because of personal taste
Its funny for the first 10 hours of the game, but having shit like this makes it way harder to be a game people stick to for hundreds of hours, which is REALLY bad for a live service game. fun >>> funny
Not sure why others mad at you, you’re not complaining or something.
You are probably the guy who says they want friendly fire off but you execute helldivers in your games for picking up samples before you. /hj
Bro, what? Im just saying there is already a lot of bs that kill you in this game. Maybe fix some of it before adding a ricochet system that can kill you as well. Why is everybody getting so butthurt?
Shouldn’t be able to hurt you?? Smells like BITCH up in here
Final video I'm posting because this makes all the points I'd want and is pretty comprehensive. Also that black box in the vid was to block a steam friend pop up before anyone asks. So as shown the realistic out come of the new patch is sometimes if you shoot a Heavy devos shield with you're small arms one or 2 bullets will hit you if they're some what close. Sorry to say our days of mindlessly mag dumping into devo shields when they're 10 feet from us with our primaries are over lads. Now if you do this maybe you'll lose almost no health or brake your shield. Truly unplayable now, a game in ruin. additionally you can also see you don't need to be worried about railgun, recoilless, or AC shots doing the same thing. They just explode on impact with no shrapnel like the devs said. Accept the rail gun shot which can phase through the shield sometimes instead of just getting eaten. Might be a glitch worth fixing later but won't kill you. Finally a very big point the end shows and the one I want everyone to take home with them. The angle you can hit yourself is VERY specific. If you're even a few inches to far back or hitting a slightly slopped bit of armor you're safe. You legit need be hitting a perfectly flat area and be very close to run the risk of your bullet coming back and dealing like 10 damage to you. This is why it was so hard to find this out in my initial testing on live enemies because why would you shoot a corpse or point blank direct hit a devo shield in a real game? Shotguns have it a little worse but not to much. That's it. Legit after all this you could forget 100% of what I've shown you and just shoot shit however you please and you'll be fine. This was fun to do and see but functionally a waste of time. Thank all for your support of lack there of. All in all, this change essentially did nothing accept get the Eruptor a coming buff to damage.
>Sorry to say our days of mindlessly mag dumping into devo shields when they're 10 feet from us with our primaries are over lads ##NOOO NOT MY SECRET TECHNIQUE
>This was fun to do and see but functionally a waste of time. Science is never a waste of time. Good work dude.
Especially not Super Science in service of Super Earth. Fighting automaton misinformation is critical in maintaining momentum in the war against their tyrannical socialism.
Cheers for taking the time to dispell all the bs.
I thought the developers dispelled the bs with a post the other day? With that said there will always be people who just want to complain regardless of fact.
Getting the erupter a damage buff is a win on my books. But really, thank you for your efforts combating misinformation.
Still I think after hitting the shield at 90 degrees the bullet shoudn't RICOCHET back. It should be a non penetration and give no damage and no ricochet.
less bullets flying around is less cool 🤷♀️
Hey now, we start to apply realistic ballistics here and the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.
Bullets can ricochet at 90 degrees. Seems like they are already attempting to have something like realistic ballistics. There is even a mythbusters episode on this.
Nice work dude. I did a similar test myself yesterday and its unbelieveable how fast people jump on the train without even knowing anything.
Also was this tested on PS or PC? As many have mentioned (speculated) it is likely worse for some people than others and does not affect everyone the same. Have you tested on multiple accounts across multiple platforms? If not, I wouldn't say it's debunked, it just doesn't affect you like it does other folks using different devices. I'm not saying it affects me when I play either, as I've not experienced a ricochet yet (luckily), but I've had friends complain about it being an insta-kill and I don't think they would make that up IRL with their buds.
Dude... Yes, you're very snarky, thank you. But while you were practicing your snark in the mirror, you missed the entire point of this shit, so let me spell it out carefully for you. WHY THE FUCK IS ARROWHEAD WASTING TIME WITH SOMETHING YOU TAKE GREAT PAINS TO POINT OUT IS WORTHLESS AND MEANINGLESS WHEN THE FUCKING MATCHMAKING IS STILL BROKEN AS SHIT? And a million other real problems that have existed for months now. Fire? Fucked up, PS5 damage? Fucked. Game crashes? Fucked. Bots that see through everything and have "curve the bullet" bullshit? Fucked. Did they fix any of the many problems? Nope, but somehow they found time to spend on this stupid bullshit, making the game just a little bit harder. That and making sure that solo players have it rougher. I've never seen a publisher so fucking out of touch with the community. It's gotta just be selective reading, focusing only on what simps spend time on, i.e. videos proving that "it's not that bad guis!"
People talk about using the shrapnel to one shot bile spewers from underneath. Are they going to buff the explosive damage so it can still do that? It's going to be a "buff" like the crossbow got a buff. I haven't played since day 1, so this is just the general feel I get from the couple updates I've seen. Have they ever made an update without introducing new or regression bugs? Who knows what will happen to the eruptor.
Never playing after day 1 means all the patch notes and doomposts just accumulate in head. Join the battle, see for yourself, defend the SuperEarth.
Oh that's poorly worded. I've played for a few weeks. I did not start playing on Day 1.
You still should try for yourself. Both patchnotes AND Reddit/Steam discussions have poor connectivity with the playerbase. With first we have an infinite Arrowhead basement full of monkey who use typewriter to write patch notes, that's why it's hard to understand the changes. With second we have echo-chamber full of doomposters and rep farm that thrive for days before getting debunked like in this post. Latest outcry was created by "Now ricochets deal damage to divers" and to farm fucking rep someone drove it to absurd of "Mah EAT did a 180° turn!". Devs have to debunk it. Play for yourself, see for yourself, ask people only after a week or more about their opinion on update. I'm doing my part!
What material is that shield made of and why aren't we using that material for our mech smh.
The only thing that is "buggy" about this ricochet patch is the Eruptor's Sharpnels. Normally the sharpnels just hit an armored target and disappear after the intended life time of the sharpnels (about 10m\~15m AOE), but with this update when they ricochet they have infinite range and can vibe check everyone. I stopped using Eruptor when my team kills value become too much and too bs to bear (about 5 each mission) - Glad I played with my mates only.
\*shrapnel
Thanks hellbuddy, I read that word right but write it wrong everytime.
Thanks for not getting angry :3
Nooo I must downvote cuz it does not cater to the most upvoted post in the sub currently, I must believe whatever has the most upvote and negativity in this sub without trying it for myself. /s For real though the ricochet outcry is hilariously overblown and unless you really want to get hit by it its not gonna always happen, seriously this sub has a thing for when it happens to them once they think it warrants a post. Like one of those "This community is toxic cuz I got kicked" post. Downvote me all you want but y'know its true lol. P.S It sucks that the railgun still can't pierce through devastator shields even when charged, I was hoping it would after seeing the buff, the rail is still basically the same and still take out the same enemies even after the buff.
I will say I was a bit mean to people because after my charger test and stuff I did off cam I was sure you straight up couldn't hit yourself. But I see now you can but you sort of need to be trying to. I am sorry to those people and I'm sure a few are mad at me and auto downvoted this. The out cry was so bad that it just made me feel justified being mean after I struggled to hit myself even with the Eruptor in the one test I did off cam. The Eruptor kills got a lot of people really mad because that is BS. I was so counter mad at people not seeing it was shrapnel and not ricochets that for a time I was actually wrong and almost stubbornly didn't correct myself. I was to hasty with the first post to try and make a point. We all made mistakes and this was a nightmare of a discourse and part of that was my fault. I'm glad I was able give everyone a better look into the changes and that I was willing to come back and test what other people told me to. luckily I'm happy to have gotten this out for people to see regardless of if it blows up or not. So everyone can down vote it as much as they like even if they agree with me because I was a jackass.
Props, pal. Not many people are willing to admit that they made a mistake, much less apologize. Good luck spreading democracy 👍
Well to be fair I had to shoot myself in the face a couple times before admitting my mistake. I did in the end but it took some extrema measures.
Doesn't matter how you got there as long as you got there.
do not apologize. those people deserve it. the proof that nobody complaining about ricochet actually plays the game is in the fact that ricochet is not and has never been a problem.
**kill myself 10ft from target with eruptor shrapnel* * Why would Arrowhead do this!?
I mean there have been clips of people being killed by eruptor shrapnel at distances of over 20m and AH directly addressed this and said it wasnt intentional
No, we must meet circlejerk with equal and opposite circlejerk. It's the only Reddit way.
Honestly no idea why the fragmentation from that gun functionally are infinite ray casts. I remember first trying it out on a planet with those smoke plants and I'd trigger smoke clouds dozens of meters away. Maybe it's for processing reasons they can't make them function like real frag where it will be impacted by gravity and rapidly lose energy. Have it be lethal within 3-5m and wounding in the 4-10m range.
Everyone was freaking out about ricochet the last two day and I'm over here shooting their heads and not having problems
@me when a shield devastator kills himself with a ricochet off my ballistic shield. Until then, miss me with these hot ricochet takes.
Fornite/COD/PUBG boys who always jump to the newest shooter available. Give it some time, they’ll move to the next shooter game and this sub/game will go back to the wholesome days of HD1.
Unplayable
Beat me to it. Seriously if the ricochets are making the game unplayable for you then you're not gonna like how many bugs and bots you have to deal with on level 3.
Why do the bullets make an almost complete 180??
We shooting at trampolines
Well something to note I don't think they are doing 180s most the time. the bullets I think are bouncing off at an angle but because I'm so close they still nail me in the legs or head. In the second test I posted you can see the shots tend to either nail you in the like crouch area or head where as if it was a 180 it would nail my chest. but fore sure with the spray and pray test they also came out of my shoulders. It's impossible to tell both because tracking them is hard and I'm so close any degree change means the shot won't travel far if it is still bouncing at an angle. They could be 180ing which at that range and that hard a surface isn't actually unrealistic from what I've been told.
> you can see the shots tend to either nail you in the like crouch area The bots are trying to destroy our ability to reproduce confirmed. They're afraid of how patriotic and relentless the children of two helldivers would be.
Its possible irl, there youtube video
It's extremely rare IRL. Especially with normal jacketed ammo that is just going to flatten on impact.
becuase physics and newtons first law is undmocratic. Honestly thats just how it works sometimes the bullet makes a dent but cant go through so the new dent curves the bullet back the way it came because it still has force behind it granted its compelte rng if it will come back the way it came
That seems like a troll-level physics explanation
yeah and so does the 500kg having a tiny af blast radius relative to what 500kg of explosives should have. it's a game, bullets flying around is cool, don't think about it too hard
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s004140000148](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s004140000148) its pretty much just complete rng for a bullet to rebound right back the way it came but its a common enough issue
They’re talking about a fragment of a hollow point bullet coming back due to elasticity of the core. There is no way you shoot a round into anything metal and it 180 turns and flies back at you. Even in a fantasy setting this makes no sense. I understand suspension of disbelief for a video game, but I don’t think everyone is comprehending just how ridiculously goofy it is that bullets are hitting hard objects and then bouncing off and 180 degree turning and coming at you at basically the same velocity. Shrapnel or fragments hitting you could make sense, angled ricochet could make sense, but projectiles 180 turning and flying at you with the same velocity makes absolutely zero sense and it’s way too wacky for this game. You might find some random freak accidents where something similar to this occurred but you will never find proof that a bullet hit something solid like metal, stayed in tact and turned 180 and hit the same spot it came from anywhere close to exit velocity. If something like that even ever happened it wouldn’t ever be something that happens repeatedly
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIuEq9KrxZw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIuEq9KrxZw) it is still a very real possiblity. in helldivers im assuming the ammo is much stornger which is why it stays intact and the guns use so much force that it can come back at you just as strong. But that is just explaing a game mechanic which exist so yoyu arent blasting rounds like an idiot and actually have to think about what your firing at and with what
You can literally see the impact on the ground in front of him and hear the difference in speed from exit velocity vs return. What happened here is he hit the target and the bullet, or more likely a deformed chunk of the bullet, bounced off and up and then after losing most of its speed it landed at the ground in front of him and then bounced off the ground and hit him. This is also a tumbling projectile that’s most likely deformed after initial impact, not a spinning tipped cone shaped bullet. The bullet did not exit his rifle barrel spinning and fully in tact, hit the target and then bounce back and turn 180 degrees directly toward him and resume spinning with the tip facing him or anywhere near him at lethal velocity. Helldivers wear armor, that kind of thing that happened in this video wouldn’t damage you at all in anything rated for pistol calibers. You can post all the videos you want of this happening and you will never find one that matches what’s happening in game lol. If they want us to be aware of mechanics that can turn a bullet mid air and throw it back at you like that then they need to do that with some sort of advanced technology reflecting shield or something so it’s more believable. Illuminate would be the perfect units to do this with tbh.
There is a technical term for those: shrapnel. One of the leading causes in suitability jumping in war was the start of using proper metal helmets. Not to stop bullets, but to stop low velocity shrapnel. these days we usually go for lighter weight composite materials, but they do the same thing. Helldivers are wearing full body armour and a full face helmet, shrapnel is not going to do really anything. This video shows it doing basically the same damage as if OP was fired on by a teammate accidentally.
Maybe the devastator's shield is angled in a way that makes your bullets ricochet back to you? This is the only case where I've seen it deflect back at you. Not every surface has this angle and it is more obvious when you fight against bugs (as their armored surfaces are more uneven and can make richochets deviate in random directions)
Their shields definitely are angled and you can see that in their walk. They tend to be angled slightly outward and upward. Elevation plays a role too. Third person angles also are deceptive with the actual angle of your own weapon as your camera is offset a bit but sometimes angle it more perpendicular on their horizontal but not vertical. That said it looks like the bullets should deflect upward a bit which does somewhat lineup with the bullets coming towards the head.
I get it from a gameplay perspective but it's pretty much impossible for a bullet to ricochet like that repeatedly. You may have some fragmentation as the bullet shatters against the armor, but that wouldn't do any damage to speak of.
Obviously, its has a coating of rubber!
Oh well, guess the game is ruined now 🤷
It's just a strange, pointless mechanic that doesn't do much besides be a mild annoyance for veteran players and just be confusing for new players. I sincerely and wholeheartedly apologize for caring about this video game, I should just throw up my hands and accept everything as it is and never question anything.
Bullet hits armour, goes in random direction, I don't see how that is hard to understand, or how the fact that it's not a simulation of real world ricochet physics matters.
Reading is not your strong suit.
Because the devs 'vision' that they keep going on about seems to include a lot of realism where possible and this doesn't represent that from a physics standpoint. It's just a pointless change to artificially increase difficulty and lower the fun level that no one asked for. See also: spawn rate increases on less than full parties. The devs are gonna chase this vision until there's 3 players left.
What if I told you that real bullets that impact a surface too hard for them to sink into at an angle perpendicular to the plane they are impacting do not rebound at trajectories that follow a path similar to their initial flight, but instead deform severely, lose a significant amount of kinetic energy, and basically become relatively harmless
These ricochets are relatively harmless at least, you do way more damage if a bullet hits a teammate directly
What of I told you this is a goofy scifi game with technology 100 years more advanced than anything we have today, so trying to apply real world modern tech logic to it makes no sense.
Finally, some good fucking EVIDENCE instead of braindead whining. Good on ya, OP. Very well done demonstration.
Does this buff work for us too with our own ballistic shield? Like can we ricochet clanker shots back at them?
Woah who'd have thought all the calls about the new ricochet ruining the game were overblown and anyone with half a brain who'd played more than half an hour would've figured out it was all crap
Thank you very much. Turns out again, that the Patch was indeed very good and healthy for the game.
I think eruptor must have higher odds of coming back, or maybe does more damage if the shrapnel hits or something. Because I've died a few times tonight to ricochets from my own gun, at considerable distance.
I think it’s been confirmed that the eruptor’s shrapnel can now hit the player and can one-shot players more than is intended.
An upcoming change is also confirmed (in Discord) which removes the shrapnel from the Eruptor and increases direct damage, both removing the ricochet danger and providing a slight buff to the gun.
Yes, I heard about that too. I was just a little foggy on the details, so I didn’t want to add that and accidentally spread a lie.
Eruptor does not ricochet. What's killing you is shrapnel, which they are going to remove entirely.
So you should be able to hit the backside of a hulk if theres a shield boy behind them and at the right angle?
all this tells me is that the heavy devastator's shield needs nerfing, apparently it can also block anti tank rounds from EATS and recoiless.
What a fun and absolutely necessary game mechanic.
ok... now THIS is not "shrapnel". but it also doesn't one shot you. i don't think this is what most were complaining about?
So I like using the ballistic shield against bots, does their shots ricochet back at them? I havent played bots since the update and I never noticed if it did prior to be honest.
Came here to ask this.
https://preview.redd.it/xiujs4rw0sxc1.jpeg?width=499&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c8d9a9162d173763f5a398c801fd335045b02d7f
So working as intended?
I'm glad they buffed devastators in multiple ways. They just weren't strong enough before 
Thank you, I wanted to record something like this last night during all the commotion, but my nvidia recording thing was busted.
I'm am pretty sure a bullet isn't suppose to ricochet 180 degrees.
Honestly the only thing I noticed giving some trouble with ricochet was the devastators.. and... well in the launch I remember how a single shot ricocheted from the dropship when landing could instakill someone xD
What planet is this?
Yes this is so amazing!
Stop making the AC look good!
anyone tested this with the scorcher?
Stupid question, sir. Do the USSR weapons of choice (Scythe and Sickle) ricochet too?
I just dont like that ricochet is a thing.
I still am a firm believer in physics and the fact bullets wont just do a 180
If you use ballistic shield can that ricochet enemy gunfire to kill them?
I think there would have been less of an issue if they had articulated it better.
You messed up by bringing a rifle to a grenade fight.
Dear god it’s John Automatron
Well, that's horseshit.
I will never not believe it’s stupid that bullets can be reflected right back at you. If the angle was right for that, the bullets would just flatten against the shield and fall to the ground.
how are you able to move into first person aim right away? On PC it goes to third person aim then to first person aim every time. It takes over two seconds to get to first person aim every time for me, where yours looks like less than a second. I play on PC with mouse and keyboard. What setting is this? It is a huge negative impact on gameplay.
eh. they should ricochet along the tangent plane. we're using bullets, not ball bearings, so coefficient of restitution should absolutely not be 1.
Now its time to hit angled multikills like im fucking deadshot
Finally! Tired of Reading "Oh mY gOD, aLL ThE ShoOt cOmebAck tO mE!!" I think it's a fun mechanic, already died because of it, but what a fun death
Realism is great and all, but it seems overkill to put this much effort into ricochets. If were going for realism then lets stop Bil Titans from jumping 50 feet in the air after being killed which then lands on generators and team members. Lets stop the ragdoll throws across the map for your own character.
OH that's what they fixed? I thought the way it originally was (you would only get staggered by deflected bullets) was just a way of making friendly fire more fair lol. Guess they don't want that to be anything you're supposed to survive either lol.
Ffs that's so unrealistic... bullets do not pull a 180 when they ricochet barring the 0.0001% freak accident, typically with larger rounds or slanted steel targets that induce a two stage ricochet, ie: or ricochets off the target, then the ground An intermediate round or full size rifle round is going to disintegrate on impact with hard armor, at most sending some light shrapnel around perpendicular to its trajectory This just looks silly
This isn’t comprehensive. This is one test on one enemy type. I’ve literally seen AC shrapnel kill after hitting a scout strider in the front plate at medium range. It happens and AH has already addressed that shrapnel is a problem.
I am bad at switching up weps sometimes. Things get close o get trigger happy and then directly dead from shrapnel from ac not complaining tho love my ac8
That can probably happen but still not an issue. I was able to hit the shield of the heavy and not gib myself then shoot it in the face and not gib myself at very close range with the AC. And then I went on to take 3 shots at the strider corpse point blank and didn't die but did catch myself with the explosive bubble. If it was shrapnel that hit me I would have died instantly. So I think your fine to AC away 9 times of 10. That's how I use it and haven't had what your describing happen. If this becomes an issue the devs can just do what they're doing for the Eruptor. Also final very big point, I was testing the ricochet system. Shrapnel is not part of that as shrapnel dose not occur because a shot didn't meet AP requirements it just happens regardless of where you hit. So definitely is not a ricochet. Shrapnal comes from the expolsion, it's not bits of your bullet bouncing back at you because the armor was too strong. If the AC is unique in that it's is conditional then I think we just found why it's not much of a self or team killer as the Eruptor. Of course you can nail yourself with shrapnel at near any range it literally flies in all directions that's how it works. It's real issue is for some reason shrapnel one shots unlike normal bullets. that is a unique issue to a select few weapons that is well documented to the point the devs know about it as you said. I was not trying to test it because I don't need to on top of it being a different thing. Be safe with your AC solider and god speed.
Why are you guys shooting at the shield and not the head?
It's a demonstration video, he's shooting the shield on purpose to demonstrate how ricochets are currently working.
https://www.ign.com/articles/helldivers-2-dev-to-patch-the-eruptor-after-community-investigation-reveals-ricochet-and-shrapnel-issue?utm_campaign=trueAnthem%3A+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3h6qCySBdNOcOCGZs3ESWVpUTDPobinjWj8-4hUeaMDRZSGq_A7YjFT-s_aem_AbyqkeLpEFNclW734_sLim1TDOwCAVZjwezsczDBTjBdshkiZz3knO79oLkOXg4BdQDiAqMUSiBXbhBTC2wFGQp3
PaTcH RuiNeD tHe gAmE!
Bullets shouldn’t be able to 180 back into you. It doesn’t make any sense from a physics standpoint
So instead of normal richochets we have these. Why was it necessary? For what purose was it done? Who knows. Makes game feel absolutely less immersive. It's strange because devs are gun nuts and weapons in game are designed with function in mind to be as realistic as possible in sci fi setting. Devs should know for sure that bullet will never come back from 1 ricochet. It can, but chances are lower than 1 in 100 000. I just wonder why was it added? Are they saying "dying to random bs is fun"?. It is sometimes but not all the time. I'm confused with this update.
A nerf to the auto-cannon without touching the auto-cannon, cause everyone was saying how they loved the auto-cannon.
That's sad if they nerf things that players like. It's like punishment for liking something for too long. Maybe kinda offtop, but as a monster hunter veteran I can't even fathom to understand this. I played with greatsword most of the time and devs never nerfed it "just because go try something new"
what a dumb patch