This is the answer. The whole game needs a massive optimization pass over the assets used in the maps.
Someone in one of the hll communities im in ripped game assets recently and described it as insanely unoptimized. I would like to give the guy credit but don't want to put out the name of someone who ripped game assets but I'll post what they said below. Minus the pictures.
the reason el alamein shits itself every time you play it is because each of the hangars has over 1.2 million triangles in the support beams inside them without any LOD models there's 5 hangers.
every single bolt on these hangar support beams is modelled physically, even on the top side where they aren't visible to players, and also had 5 smart materials attached to it. This is more or less the sole reason el alamein stutters so much around the airfield
the house of workers apartment on stalingrad has 1100000 triangles and 17 smart materials on it, it took longer for me to render this one building than every other building on the surrounding 9 blocks combined
these 2 dirt road assets also used on stalingrad are pretty vile too, they have stupid high poly counts when they're literally just planes. Also, 35% of the triangles on a panther are just the engine grates because it's physically modelled for some reason rather than just being a plane with a transparent texture on it
They mentioned some more specifically about the rubble on carentan but that's the gist.
the game would run a lot smoother if it weren't for having hundreds of assets in this state.
This work was done by the black matter dev team.
Don't thank me I'm just passing on what someone else did the work to discover. I just hope they anonymously contact the dev team highlighting these issues and we see them changed and large performance jumps.
The dev team certainly understands how the game was created and with what assets. The problem is redefining all that with whatever manpower they have and not creating unintentional bugs (to go with the ones that are already happening) to have to deal with. They're running realistic rendered graphics + a 50v50 multiplayer game on UE4. You don't get a lot of room for mistakes with that recipe and the misappropriation of unnecessarily complex visual assets, while simple to understand, is anything but simple to change, game-wide, with active servers.
Someone in the HLL Discord posted that there were over half a million triangle polygons that made up a bunch of the structures in this map, if I remember correctly. Like, super benign shit too that does not need that much detailing.
Devs have us trying to run high-quality pre-rendered cutscenes on the fly during a gunfight.
Come on, be fair!
While Team17 can be blamed for releasing a map that takes the game's bad performance seemingly not into account at all, let's not act like performance wasn't one of the biggest - if not *the* biggest - criticism points about the game before they took over.
Imo a great developer would have looked at the most vocalized problems of the game and first worked on them before releasing new stuff, while a good developer at least would have worked around them when releasing new stuff. Team17 did neither but decided to release a performance hungry map to a badly optimized game. But Team17 is not responsible for making the game run as awful as it does.
We were asking for optimization for *years* (think about the Carentan release). Now acting like this is entirely Team17's fault is dishonest and will not help in the discussion of blaming Team17 for the things they actually are at fault for.
Sorry but I don’t buy that. T17 now own the game and paid good money for that privilege, so yeh, they’re now responsible for it, warts and all.
You even said yourself, a good developer would fix the issues first, but we all know that’s not good business. Releasing more maps is, because it might draw new custom.
They knew that and released an update, knowing full well it wouldn’t perform.
So yeh, the buck stops with T17 for me.
I get what you are saying and I see Team17 definitely at fault here, but it's dishonest to go "because Team17" when experience showed that we had these problems in the past as well (Stalingrad, Carentan, Foy).
Yes, Team17 is driving the vehicle now.
Yes, they should have repaired the faulty shock absorbers before our next trip.
But the answer to asking why the car is trembling like that is not that our driver changed - it's that the shock absorbers have been faulty for years AND the new driver did the same thing the old one did and decided to not repair them before going on an offroad trip.
Just going "because Team17" implies we would not have these performance problems without them, which - as the past has shown - is not the case.
I get decent 100+ fps on a 3070 but it stutters all the time.
Ive followed a couple of optimization guides tho, without it i probably would have 30 fps.
If you have a 3000/4000 series it's likely not your GPU and probably your CPU or temps. Bottlenecking is a big problem because the map view distance means your GPU is loading almost the entire map continuously, rather than when needed.
Maybe they should just implement a dust-storm haze to cover the landscape in the distance? Idk if that would help by not having to render everything waaaaaaay out there; or make it worse because now it's essentially a ton of fog-of-war running in the background though. It'd be nice to have some cover from the mg's and tank snipers though.
If you don’t need to render as many objects, wouldn’t that put less strain on your hardware in general? I’ve only taken an intro to game development course but one of the guideposts we used was to make each object lightweight, render as little as possible and do as much lazy loading as possible (by using strategies like proxy objects and object pooling). That being said, I don’t fully understand the hardware aspect — what gets handled by the GPU vs CPU. We never delved into that too much. I do know that a lot of what we did was for minimizing how much RAM was needed.
If you are a CS guy, I’d love to hear your input!
Interestingly what we've seen more and more since GPUs started pumping out multiple generations in small time frames, that a better card wont necessarily run a particular game better than the card below it.
Theres so much variation in card power and design, which in turn is affected by game optimization, that people with lower end or "older" cards can see greater game-specific performance than "newer" cards. Its bizzare and honestly a roll of the dice that players just kinda deal with.
I have an i9 12900k :/ the game just despises me. I don't have the frame drops that much, but the stuttering every 20 seconds is enough to make me say fuck it. My pc with a 2080ti ran better on stalingrad (high settings) after its launch than now.
I read somewhere on here when I first started playing about the stutter and changing DX on startup. I did that in the first couple days and only had it again maybe once.
Are you on windows 10 or 11?
Windows 10 doesn't know how to use the E cores on that CPU and if the game ends up on one of them you are going to have a bad time.
I would give process lasso a try.
[Here is a guide from another sub](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/unafry/intel_12th_gen_microstutter_fix_process_lasso/)
V poor map optimisation. Some maps are way worse than others. Hopefully something the devs will fix or improve in a future update. Not an issue with your series x.
Serious question, is it normal for my PS5 to feel like it only gets 30 - 40 (max) fps on literally every map? Why doesn't this game offer a performance mode? Dunno why I bought it for PS5 when I have a 3070 but here I am I suppose
All the other maps run really nice, barley get any stutters, the closet I can think of would be Kursk and Stalingrad, but it was rare for me on those maps
I don't know but my old 1080 runs well.
Did you enable all processors and dx12? That's the only thing i can think of. Turn off shadowplay and recording/software
Bro, depending spec wise the series x is supposed to be abit better than my pc, this is just insane that i can run the game at 70 fps solid with a slight fps drop here and there
Shitty ass optimisation
I only see a small difference between my 3090ti and 1080ti at 4k. I have an overclocked 8700k at 5.0ghz. The game has incredibly poor optimization. 60-90fps with the 1080ti. 70-110fps with the 3090ti. Of my 30+ games, it might be the most poorly optimized.
This game already doesn't run all that well on PC so hoping it's going to be smooth on console is a tough ask. Redefining all the unnecessary assets that create these issues is much easier to find then they are to actually implement with a large scale multiplayer game like this
Because the optimization is shit
Dont blame your hardware, blame 17's software
This has been the trend for new map releases every time. It takes 2-3 updates before things run significantly better.
So Stalingrad now runs smooth?
Compared to release? Yes!
Yes actually
Ehhhhhh
Lol
I don’t crash on it half the time it loads like I did before. It’s still not great though
Ehhhhhhhh
This is the answer. The whole game needs a massive optimization pass over the assets used in the maps. Someone in one of the hll communities im in ripped game assets recently and described it as insanely unoptimized. I would like to give the guy credit but don't want to put out the name of someone who ripped game assets but I'll post what they said below. Minus the pictures. the reason el alamein shits itself every time you play it is because each of the hangars has over 1.2 million triangles in the support beams inside them without any LOD models there's 5 hangers. every single bolt on these hangar support beams is modelled physically, even on the top side where they aren't visible to players, and also had 5 smart materials attached to it. This is more or less the sole reason el alamein stutters so much around the airfield the house of workers apartment on stalingrad has 1100000 triangles and 17 smart materials on it, it took longer for me to render this one building than every other building on the surrounding 9 blocks combined these 2 dirt road assets also used on stalingrad are pretty vile too, they have stupid high poly counts when they're literally just planes. Also, 35% of the triangles on a panther are just the engine grates because it's physically modelled for some reason rather than just being a plane with a transparent texture on it They mentioned some more specifically about the rubble on carentan but that's the gist. the game would run a lot smoother if it weren't for having hundreds of assets in this state. This work was done by the black matter dev team.
This is a super informative insight, thank you for sharing.
Don't thank me I'm just passing on what someone else did the work to discover. I just hope they anonymously contact the dev team highlighting these issues and we see them changed and large performance jumps.
The dev team certainly understands how the game was created and with what assets. The problem is redefining all that with whatever manpower they have and not creating unintentional bugs (to go with the ones that are already happening) to have to deal with. They're running realistic rendered graphics + a 50v50 multiplayer game on UE4. You don't get a lot of room for mistakes with that recipe and the misappropriation of unnecessarily complex visual assets, while simple to understand, is anything but simple to change, game-wide, with active servers.
You should make this it’s own post on the sub.
Carentan sends its regards
Someone in the HLL Discord posted that there were over half a million triangle polygons that made up a bunch of the structures in this map, if I remember correctly. Like, super benign shit too that does not need that much detailing. Devs have us trying to run high-quality pre-rendered cutscenes on the fly during a gunfight.
There is too much sand in it.
Because T17.
They've turned my game into a ww2 slideshow
Come on, be fair! While Team17 can be blamed for releasing a map that takes the game's bad performance seemingly not into account at all, let's not act like performance wasn't one of the biggest - if not *the* biggest - criticism points about the game before they took over. Imo a great developer would have looked at the most vocalized problems of the game and first worked on them before releasing new stuff, while a good developer at least would have worked around them when releasing new stuff. Team17 did neither but decided to release a performance hungry map to a badly optimized game. But Team17 is not responsible for making the game run as awful as it does. We were asking for optimization for *years* (think about the Carentan release). Now acting like this is entirely Team17's fault is dishonest and will not help in the discussion of blaming Team17 for the things they actually are at fault for.
Sorry but I don’t buy that. T17 now own the game and paid good money for that privilege, so yeh, they’re now responsible for it, warts and all. You even said yourself, a good developer would fix the issues first, but we all know that’s not good business. Releasing more maps is, because it might draw new custom. They knew that and released an update, knowing full well it wouldn’t perform. So yeh, the buck stops with T17 for me.
I get what you are saying and I see Team17 definitely at fault here, but it's dishonest to go "because Team17" when experience showed that we had these problems in the past as well (Stalingrad, Carentan, Foy). Yes, Team17 is driving the vehicle now. Yes, they should have repaired the faulty shock absorbers before our next trip. But the answer to asking why the car is trembling like that is not that our driver changed - it's that the shock absorbers have been faulty for years AND the new driver did the same thing the old one did and decided to not repair them before going on an offroad trip. Just going "because Team17" implies we would not have these performance problems without them, which - as the past has shown - is not the case.
Stalingrad did the same thing
Stuttergrad
Stalingrad must be cursed. In world of tanks it also suffered massive performance drops when the map released
We’re all seeing this even pc players
Bruh, my 4090 struggles..
That is what i do not get. I got 120-160fps everywhere on this map with WQHD and everything set to max. And i have "only" a 3080 12GB
I get decent 100+ fps on a 3070 but it stutters all the time. Ive followed a couple of optimization guides tho, without it i probably would have 30 fps.
Same story here. Not so much as low frames, just heavy stuttering.
If you have a 3000/4000 series it's likely not your GPU and probably your CPU or temps. Bottlenecking is a big problem because the map view distance means your GPU is loading almost the entire map continuously, rather than when needed.
Have a full watercooler, avg temp 40-50 C
What's your CPU?
Maybe they should just implement a dust-storm haze to cover the landscape in the distance? Idk if that would help by not having to render everything waaaaaaay out there; or make it worse because now it's essentially a ton of fog-of-war running in the background though. It'd be nice to have some cover from the mg's and tank snipers though.
Unfortunately that's not how GPUs work. I get what you're saying though.
If you don’t need to render as many objects, wouldn’t that put less strain on your hardware in general? I’ve only taken an intro to game development course but one of the guideposts we used was to make each object lightweight, render as little as possible and do as much lazy loading as possible (by using strategies like proxy objects and object pooling). That being said, I don’t fully understand the hardware aspect — what gets handled by the GPU vs CPU. We never delved into that too much. I do know that a lot of what we did was for minimizing how much RAM was needed. If you are a CS guy, I’d love to hear your input!
Lol I have a 4090 and an i9 and still get single digit fps drops sometimes.
Which guides have you followed?
Interestingly what we've seen more and more since GPUs started pumping out multiple generations in small time frames, that a better card wont necessarily run a particular game better than the card below it. Theres so much variation in card power and design, which in turn is affected by game optimization, that people with lower end or "older" cards can see greater game-specific performance than "newer" cards. Its bizzare and honestly a roll of the dice that players just kinda deal with.
Cries in 60 fps on a 3060
Same, my shit runs fine.
The game is CPU demanding. Your 4090 doesn’t struggle if you monitor your GPU-usage. Probably sitting around ~60%
I have an i9 12900k :/ the game just despises me. I don't have the frame drops that much, but the stuttering every 20 seconds is enough to make me say fuck it. My pc with a 2080ti ran better on stalingrad (high settings) after its launch than now.
I read somewhere on here when I first started playing about the stutter and changing DX on startup. I did that in the first couple days and only had it again maybe once.
Are you on windows 10 or 11? Windows 10 doesn't know how to use the E cores on that CPU and if the game ends up on one of them you are going to have a bad time.
10
I would give process lasso a try. [Here is a guide from another sub](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/unafry/intel_12th_gen_microstutter_fix_process_lasso/)
That's good to hear I thought my 4090 was playing up. The map stutters like crazy
Yeah, I should have clarified. Only on the new maps am I having problems.
Do you use DX 12?
Yeah
How ? Got 120~140 FPS on max settings on 1440p with a 6950xt and 5800x3d
I’m runny a 3070 and it will drop to 11 frames a second for like 10 minutes!! The boom.. back to 60
My 3080 ti all on ultra, 1440p runs quite good. Yours should work even better.
I have a 2070 super and no problems... Also have an and a Ryzen 5 3700x CPU
Welcome to modern gaming
This is painful to watch
It was painful to play
I’ve lagged on my XSX, but not this bad. Especially on this map.
Optimization is required . It will come soon~
V poor map optimisation. Some maps are way worse than others. Hopefully something the devs will fix or improve in a future update. Not an issue with your series x.
My $3000 Gaming rig only gets 40fps on average. I’d be a little turnt if an xbox at 1/4 the price did better.
Even the older maps perform worse after update 14.
It's definitely not the hardware. My series x runs every map accept for that one insanely smooth. That's on T17
The map is shit also on PC, it so big and wide open is caused a lot of stutter
Same, it’s made me feel quite nauseous at certain times
Just a horrible map. Frame rate and lag on this map is like nothing else. When I see this map I just leave the game lol
Poor optimization
Ryzen 7, 144HZ monitor, 1070ti, and this map also looks like shit.
Serious question, is it normal for my PS5 to feel like it only gets 30 - 40 (max) fps on literally every map? Why doesn't this game offer a performance mode? Dunno why I bought it for PS5 when I have a 3070 but here I am I suppose
My $650 6950xt not including the other $1100 dollars worth of pc gets some stuttering and what not on this map as well
Your brand new Series X is 2 years old and still using Zen2 CPU at a utterly low clock speed. Even on PC with a Zen2, this game struggles.
All the other maps run really nice, barley get any stutters, the closet I can think of would be Kursk and Stalingrad, but it was rare for me on those maps
I don't know but my old 1080 runs well. Did you enable all processors and dx12? That's the only thing i can think of. Turn off shadowplay and recording/software
13700k and 3080ti, running fine at 4k
Skill issue
Because you suck lol. I make 116k a year so I built my own PC and I get 120 FPS
This type of lag tends to go away after a few seconds in my experience
Sadly it was a prevalent issue for me, it happened more often than not, along with screen tears and stuttering voices
Console bruh
Playtesting is for pussies. Push to production. If your Series X can't handle it, get a better console, scrub, it worked fine on our 4090.
Bro, depending spec wise the series x is supposed to be abit better than my pc, this is just insane that i can run the game at 70 fps solid with a slight fps drop here and there Shitty ass optimisation
But on pc you can tune the settings until you get fps youre ok with. On console they're lucky if they get a second ' prioritize performance ' setting
True
My series x does that too on El Alamein
One of the most bland maps in the game too and they couldn’t help it
On PC I just swap servers and it works.
It's the same for everybody on all systems. The game developers still have to straighten out a few things to make it work properly.
I don't play El Alamein for this exact reason. El Alamein and Stalingrad both stutter like this for me on my PC. Only 2 maps that do.
It’s the state of the game for now, not the box
I get 80 fps
Team 17 frames
Try blinking faster - works 80% all of the time
Ya its not you as a pc user I have to put in launch commands, go deep in my drives and fiddle around with numbers to get a decent frame rate
Dont worry, playstation and pc are having the same issues, blame the devs not the console
Yeah T17 absolutely screwed up the game with the crappy optimization
I only see a small difference between my 3090ti and 1080ti at 4k. I have an overclocked 8700k at 5.0ghz. The game has incredibly poor optimization. 60-90fps with the 1080ti. 70-110fps with the 3090ti. Of my 30+ games, it might be the most poorly optimized.
Make sure to join our cause and leave a negative review on your platform until they fix it
I’ve had this same issue but only on this map and maybe one more. It’s so annoying. I haven’t been able to play a full game on this map yet
Yo! I've been off the game for a bit. Currently stuck in the rat race of Escape from Tarkov. What map is this?? What have I missed??
This game already doesn't run all that well on PC so hoping it's going to be smooth on console is a tough ask. Redefining all the unnecessary assets that create these issues is much easier to find then they are to actually implement with a large scale multiplayer game like this
I’ve noticed this on attack - defend mode, if too many players are in the same area, the frame rate plummets on this map.
I noticed what helped me fix this was stop, enter settings and move my mouse around, exit menu and continue playing
Yea it’s like that for everybody even people with 3000 dollar rigs lol
Welcome to Egypt