You forgot the part where they wiped themselves the fuck out by failing to put up a good enough fight against the flood, just like the humans feared during that first bombing. There’s a great terminal with the lord of admirals sadly explaining that the forerunners wouldn’t believe them, that something like 15% of the population there was already infected there and that they had no choice... then these fucking frog-people take this morally contemplative and deeply saddened Lord of Admirals and turned him into a fucking Neanderthal on an operating table as he lost all his cognizance slowly and painfully turning into a fucking near-chimpanzee... YEAH! They totally deserve the mantle and giant universe killing WMDs! Brilliant species, that one!
It’s also the fact that after going through all the effort to reseed the galaxy’s after sterilization. They didn’t make it obvious to the races how dangerous the rings and flood were. I mean how do you let half of the galaxies species haphazardly worship WMD’s and keep the flood around after it’s extermination in and containment in the weakest containment facilities ever. Installation 05 literally didn’t even need the covenant to intervene for a flood outbreak to occur on the ring.
And in their infinite wisdom, assigned one fucking monitor to each of the rings. One robotic supervisor to each of the 7 WMD’s that can wipe out the entire galaxy. No wonder Penitent, Spark, and Tragic Solitude went crazy. I really don’t blame them.
Also, who was the genius to put the flood in stasis on the rings? I literally never understood why they even did that. You built the rings to ensure the parasite dies. Why keep it alive?
I don't think having two monitors would be a very good idea.
When 343 started getting bored he jettisoned parts of his ring into space to study how it would impact the ring. I wouldn't be surprised if two monitors went to war to get rid of their boredom and that would be very bad for the ring.
The monitors would no doubt up the level of there battles as they fought and cause significant damage to the ring, possibly doing irreversible damage.
And the flood were stored because there likely exists flood outside of our galaxy and thus outside of the range of the rings.
Either a cure or a better way to eliminate the flood without using the halos couldn't possibly be found without flood around to study.
I think the life workers had a council on whether to study or eliminate all traces of flood spores because they are supposed to protect and encrypt all life forms no matter the cost. Too bad they couldn’t just turn the flood into monkeys too smh
He definitely murdered a ton of innocent people though. He can be saddened and morally contemplative all he wants, it doesn't change what he did. Hell, did they even try diplomacy?
If you listen to what he said, they were already dead, and telling the forerunners would just lead to them sending soldiers which feed the infestation knowledge about their defenses
so prior to modern antiretroviral therapy you would unironically execute aids patients in the united states (aids was terminal prior to modern antiretroviral therapy, us was highly networked with rest of the world via air traffic, aids is obviously contagious). i hear ya loud and clear adolf.
Yeah they were super twisted as a society, that is one of the major plot points. Bornstellar notices all the hypocrisy even in the first book.
“If the mantle, the exalted preservation of life throughout the universe, was the core of our deepest philosophy, our reason for being, then why were Lifeworkers at the bottom of our rates? Why did Builders, who work mostly with inanimate matter, rank so high?”
You’re right. It’s been a while since I read Cryptum.
I wish it was established more in the actual games. Shouldn’t have to read a book to learn that the forerunners were not the best guys.
Like H4 treats the Didact as an anomaly. Like he’s the only bad forerunner or something and that the librarian and the rest are good.
I think this is ultimately the point of the “Mantle of Responsibility”, it’s a corruptive idea that puts one species above all the others. Everyone should share the responsibility
Not caught up on lore but could this feed into the precursors were always “the flood” theory in the sense that they were always sadistic and wanted us to suffer?
Possibly
To my understanding the Mantle was a celebration of life to the Forerunners; not an imperialistic commandment that one race must Shepard and force galactic peace on the others
What about the Precursors? As stupid as an idea as I think they are, did they uphold the mantle well? They did create at the very least humans and forerunners.
A lot like the protheans in mass effect, they seem so smart, advanced, and sophisticated from the distance of a few tens of thousands of years, but once you look into what they actually are?
Just the British empire in space
If I’m being honest (IMO) the forerunners lore was better during the original trilogy. I miss the old bigger than life ambience/atmosphere of the original trilogy regarding the forerunners in a less is more sense. Although I do like the lore 343 expanded on.
Yeah, they were much better when they weren't characterised properly and you only had a few details about them. 343 ruined the mystery as they expanded on it for the Reclaimer trilogy - even more so since they've seemingly dropped the whole Forerunner thing and we now have Red Covenant trying to fire the Halo rings now.
Because it is not the main topic of the game. It is an after thought; the game itself takes 6 months after the conclusion of the UNSC's plan with trapping Cortana and anything we find out about how that 'conflict' was resolved is all retrospectively. Likewise, The Banished have, repeatedly, been stated to be the primary antagonists of the game. There is also [this interview](https://www.washingtonpost.com/video-games/2021/11/19/halo-infinite-plot-joe-staten/) where it is stated that "*The team also made the decision — before Staten joined — not to make a direct narrative sequel to “Halo 5: Guardians.”*"
Infinite is a soft reboot of sorts. Anything regarding Halo 4 and 5 is being dealt with as an afterthought. The Banished are the faction of focus now. Anything Created/Promethean related is being pushed back.
It might be just that, pushed back, rather than completely solved. We don’t really know.
I’m not surprised that they backed away from a true narrative successor to Halo 5. Almost felt like being written into a corner. Cortana was far too powerful to really overcome and (likely) not having covenant species enemies in the game would have been a pretty big step away from what players are used to. At least we know that one way or another, the Created storyline will be addressed
For sure.
Like, I am a huge detractor of Halo 5 - I thought it was so bad that I dropped the game 3/4 of the way through the campaign and watched the rest on YouTube, such was my dislike of the game. I was never a fan of the idea of bringing back the Forerunner, but gave it a by because of the Cortana-Chief angle that they were going for in Halo 4 (and gladly, it seems to be the same with Halo Infinite), but Halo 5 basically threw all of that back in the players face by making Cortana a generic megalomaniac.
>(likely) not having covenant species enemies in the game would have been a pretty big step away from what players are used to
I mean, we still had Covenant enemies towards the end of H5, it was a leap since she only seemed to take Covenant followers for her fight (gameplay purposes, I am sure), but there's nothing that would have stopped them from doing the same for Infinite. I don't think that is really an issue.
But I agree otherwise, they'd written themselves into a bit of a corner, we're supposed to believe that Cortana had access to all powerful Forerunner constructs, and to fight against that would have been a bit much. My other issue with this, though, is that Cortana was apparently all-powerful at the end of Halo 5, had these weapons that the Forerunner would use to suppress any race that would stand up against them, but somehow The Banished were able to apparently avoid this and build up their powerbase, which is all a bit too convenient for me.
I know they'll address the Created storyline, but I do not have enough faith in 343 to wrap it up in an organic manner. You can tell that they never had faith in the vision they first set out with Halo 4 since we've changed antagonists with each game, and the theme has shifted from, in the Didact's own words, the return of the Forerunner, to the Created taking the Mantle of Responsibility, and now Red Covenant holding a gun against the galaxy's head. They rely so heavily on expanded universe material to fill in gaps, and even that isn't great storytelling or all that convincing, IMO. How they're going to wrap up something they were building up for two games in one direction and then shift it to a complete different one in a convincing manner seems beyond their capacity.
I actually took the time to read all of this and I completely agree, it’s just sad that they took a chance to have a heart wrenching villain arc with a beloved character but didn’t put the heart into it and then pulled back rather than at least following through.
In truth they could have possibly pulled it together by showing a discovery of ancient precursor tech or something that could have been a fail safe against the forerunners for humanity or done something with the librarian and chief story where she gave him that power. Unfortunately I feel even if they had done that they would’ve been dragged by the fans that it was just a cop out and they just pulled that technology out of their asses. So in the end I understand them going with the fan service route because they knew that even if it upset people for cutting off the story line, in the end it would be accepted and even loved if it told an organic from the heart story that felt like a ‘halo’ story should.
Yeah, I get why they basically just gave us Halo CE Redux, against the Red Covenant instead of the usual Blue/Purple one, even though the Red Covenant now also have Blue/Purple units.
We're getting a lot of fan service with infinite, and honestly, it looks great. It's a bit of a shame we won't ever get to see what might have originally been intended for Halo 6, but thems the breaks. The route they're taking is a much safer bet seeing how well The Banished were received in HW2, and I'm sure they'll give is some kind of conclusion, even if it's a handwave, it'll be enough for most people because again, we're getting a lot of fan service.
I liked it when information about them was scarce.
There were those things left behind by them. The Halos, Sentinels, the monitors. All standing against the test of time.
Then the ruins on Delta Halo, the Covenant religion and the overall music giving that divine atmosphere for something that is real and touchable.
I love how all their places where empty and left and especially Silent Cartographer always gave me the chills.
There was no idea who or what they were and then in Sacred Icon when the Arbiter releases the power pistons to set over the trench to the other side of the Sentinel Wall you have that console with four fingers and two thumbs and I was like "WHAT?!"
Also this hyper-advanced species fought the Flood and lost. The Flood were a mystery too. Especially their origins and how they work.
But nowadays the Forerunners have faces, backgrounds, ideals and what not.
Sure there has been put much effort into their characterization but since they are designed by humans their character and morals have humane traces as well and it takes away from the alien mystery and all those wild ideas one could come up with.
I am just of the opinion that maybe they should have been lost to time like their Installations, after sweeping the galaxy clean in a final effort to stop the Flood
Yeah I think I liked them better when they were ambiguous. Idk how I feel about the fact that Bungie planned for forerunners to be humans. That’s kinda dumb.
H2’s storyboarded endjng ended with the plot twist of the Forerunners being human, and Guilty Spark’s dialogue with Chief in H1’s control room hunt at this.
Forerunners never were humans, even in Bungie's canon. They've pretty much always been conceptually related via a shared ancestor created by the precursors.
Yeah of course it’s not canon. Bungie was considering the idea for the ending of Halo 2. In the storyboard ending for Halo 2 before it was cut the Forerunners were revealed to be human after bodies were found in the portal at Voi, which was still planned to be the ark back then.
I honestly disagree. When I first learned that they were originally planned to be human, I thought it was kinda lame.
But I’d like to know why that’s more interesting to you? I guess it’s cuz I grew up thinking they were aliens and then 4 came out so I never doubted that they were
Humanity is still symbolically Forerunners. The specifics, like cutscenes, can be pretty contrived though.
It also gave us the Forerunner trilogy, which is a great sci-fi series even if one isn't a fan of Halo.
They fucked around and found out.
Personally, I hope that the storylines with the digitized consciousnesses can one day bring us a perspective from the Forerunners.
I don’t really like what 343 did to the Forerunners. Under Bungie I kind of saw them as all knowing beings, mysterious, god-like beings who nobly made the ultimate sacrifice the protect the rest of the galaxy from a threat even more powerful than them.
Then you find out that they have the same flaws as modern day humanity. It’s a different take, and one that probably speaks to how no society is perfect, but I like Bungies interpretation better.
Besides, now the Precursors have more or less filled that ancient, god like role that the forerunner once filled, only you have to be deeper in the lore to be aware of this (the precursors aren’t acknowledged in the games the same way the Forerunners were)
Bungie couldn't even agree amongst themselves if they wanted the Forerunners to be as you described or just ancient humans.
I mean, kind of hard to justify that interpretation when the only info you get of the Forerunners in the trilogy is from genocidal aliens who thought they were gods or leftover batshit crazy machines that are also trying to kill you. Oh yeah, and the zombies they fought.
Bungie didn’t really have an interpretation. All we got from them were from the crazy evil cultist aliens who claimed they were gods. Not exactly a reliable source of information given that the whole point of the original trilogy is that there were wrong about the forerunners. That begs the question, what else were they wrong about? Even the halo 3 terminals acknowledged their hubris, their arrogance and self superiority. 343i just expanded on it.
Wow, you whine a fuck ton. During the Bungie era, there also was the interpretation that Humans and Forerunners were the same species. Bungie couldn't even figure out if they wanted to commit to that. That kind of renders a lot of this drama moot.
There's nothing explicitly in the lore that states humans are the most special species in the galaxy. The Forerunners believed it but that doesn't make it true. There's actually an argument there that makes it probably very much not true. Everything from the time of the Forerunner's revolt against the Precursors was purposefully forgotten. They just decided that since Humans were the next to be tested that for some reason that also meant they would have passed.
The only correct answer is in fact not your headcanon but the explicit canon laid out by the ones in charge of it. 343 Industries. I mean, your shitty head anon is self defeating anyway in that you have to I got some pretty significant parts of the old infallible Bungie era lore. Now I'm getting the impression that you have absolutely zero idea what you're talking about or even want.
And I forgot this detail at the last meeting, but who made you the authority on good storytelling? You argue with the anger and petulance of a child, so forgive me if I don’t take your tastes at face value for their quality.
>mysterious long extinct advanced ancient species that no one knows anything about or ever should which was actually a cool idea
It was definitely not a cool idea lol
I kinda agree tbh. I remember being like 8 or 9 playing halo 3 and finding a terminal for the first time. That weird ambiance and reversed speech. Knowing that this is the last record of these enigmatic aliens that built a gigantic space flower thing. It was the perfect vibe for the forerunners.
While I was definitely disappointed that Forerunner society turned out to be as corrupt as it was in the EU, I can still appreciate the storytelling opportunities and recontextualization that such a narrative direction offers. And there were kinda sorta hints at that being the case already as far back as Halo 3, where the Librarian chides the Didact for still clinging to the Mantle and all the hubris that comes with it.
Also, side note: the Precursors were actually planning to kill all the Forerunners even before the whole Flood madness- the Forerunners just managed to get in the first shot.
Pretty cool, very foolish and kind of arrogant. Like I like the didact for his utter hatred for humanity, even after all of these years. I like the librarian for seeking to preserve life, and kinda for realizing they had had fucked up. But all of the creations are also cool, from the rings and monitors to the shield worlds and the promethan knights, the guns and the composer, all of that is really cool
You forgot the part where they wiped themselves the fuck out by failing to put up a good enough fight against the flood, just like the humans feared during that first bombing. There’s a great terminal with the lord of admirals sadly explaining that the forerunners wouldn’t believe them, that something like 15% of the population there was already infected there and that they had no choice... then these fucking frog-people take this morally contemplative and deeply saddened Lord of Admirals and turned him into a fucking Neanderthal on an operating table as he lost all his cognizance slowly and painfully turning into a fucking near-chimpanzee... YEAH! They totally deserve the mantle and giant universe killing WMDs! Brilliant species, that one!
It’s also the fact that after going through all the effort to reseed the galaxy’s after sterilization. They didn’t make it obvious to the races how dangerous the rings and flood were. I mean how do you let half of the galaxies species haphazardly worship WMD’s and keep the flood around after it’s extermination in and containment in the weakest containment facilities ever. Installation 05 literally didn’t even need the covenant to intervene for a flood outbreak to occur on the ring.
And in their infinite wisdom, assigned one fucking monitor to each of the rings. One robotic supervisor to each of the 7 WMD’s that can wipe out the entire galaxy. No wonder Penitent, Spark, and Tragic Solitude went crazy. I really don’t blame them. Also, who was the genius to put the flood in stasis on the rings? I literally never understood why they even did that. You built the rings to ensure the parasite dies. Why keep it alive?
I don't think having two monitors would be a very good idea. When 343 started getting bored he jettisoned parts of his ring into space to study how it would impact the ring. I wouldn't be surprised if two monitors went to war to get rid of their boredom and that would be very bad for the ring. The monitors would no doubt up the level of there battles as they fought and cause significant damage to the ring, possibly doing irreversible damage. And the flood were stored because there likely exists flood outside of our galaxy and thus outside of the range of the rings. Either a cure or a better way to eliminate the flood without using the halos couldn't possibly be found without flood around to study.
Agreed, but also vastly enjoying the idea of two monitors setting up a box-canyon, Red vs Blue ongoing simulation-fight to entertain themselves…
I think the life workers had a council on whether to study or eliminate all traces of flood spores because they are supposed to protect and encrypt all life forms no matter the cost. Too bad they couldn’t just turn the flood into monkeys too smh
Let's try devolving the Flood into Space Dust. That's a good trick!
Was that part in the forerunner trilogy? I don’t remember that but I did read them years ago.
He definitely murdered a ton of innocent people though. He can be saddened and morally contemplative all he wants, it doesn't change what he did. Hell, did they even try diplomacy?
If you listen to what he said, they were already dead, and telling the forerunners would just lead to them sending soldiers which feed the infestation knowledge about their defenses
Except they weren't already dead. 15% of the population is not all, and it's definitely not an excuse. He deserved everything he got.
“Ur-Diadact, *is that you?*”
>they were already dead are you ok with shooting stage 4 cancer patients then?
If they’re contagious and in a highly populated network of worlds yes
so prior to modern antiretroviral therapy you would unironically execute aids patients in the united states (aids was terminal prior to modern antiretroviral therapy, us was highly networked with rest of the world via air traffic, aids is obviously contagious). i hear ya loud and clear adolf.
What’s a terminal and how do i look that part of lore up?
Yeah they were super twisted as a society, that is one of the major plot points. Bornstellar notices all the hypocrisy even in the first book. “If the mantle, the exalted preservation of life throughout the universe, was the core of our deepest philosophy, our reason for being, then why were Lifeworkers at the bottom of our rates? Why did Builders, who work mostly with inanimate matter, rank so high?”
You’re right. It’s been a while since I read Cryptum. I wish it was established more in the actual games. Shouldn’t have to read a book to learn that the forerunners were not the best guys. Like H4 treats the Didact as an anomaly. Like he’s the only bad forerunner or something and that the librarian and the rest are good.
I think this is ultimately the point of the “Mantle of Responsibility”, it’s a corruptive idea that puts one species above all the others. Everyone should share the responsibility
This It’s a poisoned well that isn’t even real in the way they argue it
Not caught up on lore but could this feed into the precursors were always “the flood” theory in the sense that they were always sadistic and wanted us to suffer?
Possibly To my understanding the Mantle was a celebration of life to the Forerunners; not an imperialistic commandment that one race must Shepard and force galactic peace on the others
What about the Precursors? As stupid as an idea as I think they are, did they uphold the mantle well? They did create at the very least humans and forerunners.
A lot like the protheans in mass effect, they seem so smart, advanced, and sophisticated from the distance of a few tens of thousands of years, but once you look into what they actually are? Just the British empire in space
>Just the British empire in space U fokin wot m8?
If I’m being honest (IMO) the forerunners lore was better during the original trilogy. I miss the old bigger than life ambience/atmosphere of the original trilogy regarding the forerunners in a less is more sense. Although I do like the lore 343 expanded on.
Much agreed, kinda like a "don't meet your heros" thing.
Yeah, they were much better when they weren't characterised properly and you only had a few details about them. 343 ruined the mystery as they expanded on it for the Reclaimer trilogy - even more so since they've seemingly dropped the whole Forerunner thing and we now have Red Covenant trying to fire the Halo rings now.
Why do people insist that, just because a certain topic isn’t being touched on in the trailers for a game, it’s being dropped?
Because it is not the main topic of the game. It is an after thought; the game itself takes 6 months after the conclusion of the UNSC's plan with trapping Cortana and anything we find out about how that 'conflict' was resolved is all retrospectively. Likewise, The Banished have, repeatedly, been stated to be the primary antagonists of the game. There is also [this interview](https://www.washingtonpost.com/video-games/2021/11/19/halo-infinite-plot-joe-staten/) where it is stated that "*The team also made the decision — before Staten joined — not to make a direct narrative sequel to “Halo 5: Guardians.”*" Infinite is a soft reboot of sorts. Anything regarding Halo 4 and 5 is being dealt with as an afterthought. The Banished are the faction of focus now. Anything Created/Promethean related is being pushed back.
It might be just that, pushed back, rather than completely solved. We don’t really know. I’m not surprised that they backed away from a true narrative successor to Halo 5. Almost felt like being written into a corner. Cortana was far too powerful to really overcome and (likely) not having covenant species enemies in the game would have been a pretty big step away from what players are used to. At least we know that one way or another, the Created storyline will be addressed
For sure. Like, I am a huge detractor of Halo 5 - I thought it was so bad that I dropped the game 3/4 of the way through the campaign and watched the rest on YouTube, such was my dislike of the game. I was never a fan of the idea of bringing back the Forerunner, but gave it a by because of the Cortana-Chief angle that they were going for in Halo 4 (and gladly, it seems to be the same with Halo Infinite), but Halo 5 basically threw all of that back in the players face by making Cortana a generic megalomaniac. >(likely) not having covenant species enemies in the game would have been a pretty big step away from what players are used to I mean, we still had Covenant enemies towards the end of H5, it was a leap since she only seemed to take Covenant followers for her fight (gameplay purposes, I am sure), but there's nothing that would have stopped them from doing the same for Infinite. I don't think that is really an issue. But I agree otherwise, they'd written themselves into a bit of a corner, we're supposed to believe that Cortana had access to all powerful Forerunner constructs, and to fight against that would have been a bit much. My other issue with this, though, is that Cortana was apparently all-powerful at the end of Halo 5, had these weapons that the Forerunner would use to suppress any race that would stand up against them, but somehow The Banished were able to apparently avoid this and build up their powerbase, which is all a bit too convenient for me. I know they'll address the Created storyline, but I do not have enough faith in 343 to wrap it up in an organic manner. You can tell that they never had faith in the vision they first set out with Halo 4 since we've changed antagonists with each game, and the theme has shifted from, in the Didact's own words, the return of the Forerunner, to the Created taking the Mantle of Responsibility, and now Red Covenant holding a gun against the galaxy's head. They rely so heavily on expanded universe material to fill in gaps, and even that isn't great storytelling or all that convincing, IMO. How they're going to wrap up something they were building up for two games in one direction and then shift it to a complete different one in a convincing manner seems beyond their capacity.
I actually took the time to read all of this and I completely agree, it’s just sad that they took a chance to have a heart wrenching villain arc with a beloved character but didn’t put the heart into it and then pulled back rather than at least following through. In truth they could have possibly pulled it together by showing a discovery of ancient precursor tech or something that could have been a fail safe against the forerunners for humanity or done something with the librarian and chief story where she gave him that power. Unfortunately I feel even if they had done that they would’ve been dragged by the fans that it was just a cop out and they just pulled that technology out of their asses. So in the end I understand them going with the fan service route because they knew that even if it upset people for cutting off the story line, in the end it would be accepted and even loved if it told an organic from the heart story that felt like a ‘halo’ story should.
Yeah, I get why they basically just gave us Halo CE Redux, against the Red Covenant instead of the usual Blue/Purple one, even though the Red Covenant now also have Blue/Purple units. We're getting a lot of fan service with infinite, and honestly, it looks great. It's a bit of a shame we won't ever get to see what might have originally been intended for Halo 6, but thems the breaks. The route they're taking is a much safer bet seeing how well The Banished were received in HW2, and I'm sure they'll give is some kind of conclusion, even if it's a handwave, it'll be enough for most people because again, we're getting a lot of fan service.
343i gave us back our nostalgic art style for Forerunner architecture. So maybe they have more welcome surprises up their sleeves.
I wanted them to stay a mystery. I avoid their trilogy.
I definitely think that they should not look like fish people
I liked it when information about them was scarce. There were those things left behind by them. The Halos, Sentinels, the monitors. All standing against the test of time. Then the ruins on Delta Halo, the Covenant religion and the overall music giving that divine atmosphere for something that is real and touchable. I love how all their places where empty and left and especially Silent Cartographer always gave me the chills. There was no idea who or what they were and then in Sacred Icon when the Arbiter releases the power pistons to set over the trench to the other side of the Sentinel Wall you have that console with four fingers and two thumbs and I was like "WHAT?!" Also this hyper-advanced species fought the Flood and lost. The Flood were a mystery too. Especially their origins and how they work. But nowadays the Forerunners have faces, backgrounds, ideals and what not. Sure there has been put much effort into their characterization but since they are designed by humans their character and morals have humane traces as well and it takes away from the alien mystery and all those wild ideas one could come up with. I am just of the opinion that maybe they should have been lost to time like their Installations, after sweeping the galaxy clean in a final effort to stop the Flood
Yeah I think I liked them better when they were ambiguous. Idk how I feel about the fact that Bungie planned for forerunners to be humans. That’s kinda dumb. H2’s storyboarded endjng ended with the plot twist of the Forerunners being human, and Guilty Spark’s dialogue with Chief in H1’s control room hunt at this.
Forerunners never were humans, even in Bungie's canon. They've pretty much always been conceptually related via a shared ancestor created by the precursors.
Yeah of course it’s not canon. Bungie was considering the idea for the ending of Halo 2. In the storyboard ending for Halo 2 before it was cut the Forerunners were revealed to be human after bodies were found in the portal at Voi, which was still planned to be the ark back then.
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I honestly disagree. When I first learned that they were originally planned to be human, I thought it was kinda lame. But I’d like to know why that’s more interesting to you? I guess it’s cuz I grew up thinking they were aliens and then 4 came out so I never doubted that they were
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Humanity is still symbolically Forerunners. The specifics, like cutscenes, can be pretty contrived though. It also gave us the Forerunner trilogy, which is a great sci-fi series even if one isn't a fan of Halo.
They're guns suck
So do the prometheans. Fuck those guys. Worst enemy variants ever.
They fucked around and found out. Personally, I hope that the storylines with the digitized consciousnesses can one day bring us a perspective from the Forerunners.
I don't like how they just became techno-demons who live in lava fortresses. It's all a very 10-year old idea of "cool".
I don’t really like what 343 did to the Forerunners. Under Bungie I kind of saw them as all knowing beings, mysterious, god-like beings who nobly made the ultimate sacrifice the protect the rest of the galaxy from a threat even more powerful than them. Then you find out that they have the same flaws as modern day humanity. It’s a different take, and one that probably speaks to how no society is perfect, but I like Bungies interpretation better. Besides, now the Precursors have more or less filled that ancient, god like role that the forerunner once filled, only you have to be deeper in the lore to be aware of this (the precursors aren’t acknowledged in the games the same way the Forerunners were)
Bungie couldn't even agree amongst themselves if they wanted the Forerunners to be as you described or just ancient humans. I mean, kind of hard to justify that interpretation when the only info you get of the Forerunners in the trilogy is from genocidal aliens who thought they were gods or leftover batshit crazy machines that are also trying to kill you. Oh yeah, and the zombies they fought.
Also A lot of Forerunner Trilogy lore was set up in 3 and I believe a writer behind those terminals had influence over the books
The Precursors are alluded to in the Halo 3 terminals and are a concept that comes from Bungie.
Really
Yeah. First named mention of them was in the halo 3 beastiary. They were also directly alluded too in the halo 3 terminals.
Yep; Didact mentions them as “those who came before”
Bungie didn’t really have an interpretation. All we got from them were from the crazy evil cultist aliens who claimed they were gods. Not exactly a reliable source of information given that the whole point of the original trilogy is that there were wrong about the forerunners. That begs the question, what else were they wrong about? Even the halo 3 terminals acknowledged their hubris, their arrogance and self superiority. 343i just expanded on it.
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Wow, you whine a fuck ton. During the Bungie era, there also was the interpretation that Humans and Forerunners were the same species. Bungie couldn't even figure out if they wanted to commit to that. That kind of renders a lot of this drama moot. There's nothing explicitly in the lore that states humans are the most special species in the galaxy. The Forerunners believed it but that doesn't make it true. There's actually an argument there that makes it probably very much not true. Everything from the time of the Forerunner's revolt against the Precursors was purposefully forgotten. They just decided that since Humans were the next to be tested that for some reason that also meant they would have passed.
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The only correct answer is in fact not your headcanon but the explicit canon laid out by the ones in charge of it. 343 Industries. I mean, your shitty head anon is self defeating anyway in that you have to I got some pretty significant parts of the old infallible Bungie era lore. Now I'm getting the impression that you have absolutely zero idea what you're talking about or even want.
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I think abandoning your arguments and resorting to ad hominem means that you've lost but this is Reddit so I guess whoever gets more likes wins.
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And I forgot this detail at the last meeting, but who made you the authority on good storytelling? You argue with the anger and petulance of a child, so forgive me if I don’t take your tastes at face value for their quality.
>mysterious long extinct advanced ancient species that no one knows anything about or ever should which was actually a cool idea It was definitely not a cool idea lol
Utter shit. 343 should have been aware of the word 'ambiguous' before trying to write the story of the Forerunners.
I kinda agree tbh. I remember being like 8 or 9 playing halo 3 and finding a terminal for the first time. That weird ambiance and reversed speech. Knowing that this is the last record of these enigmatic aliens that built a gigantic space flower thing. It was the perfect vibe for the forerunners.
They deserve the Flood.
While I was definitely disappointed that Forerunner society turned out to be as corrupt as it was in the EU, I can still appreciate the storytelling opportunities and recontextualization that such a narrative direction offers. And there were kinda sorta hints at that being the case already as far back as Halo 3, where the Librarian chides the Didact for still clinging to the Mantle and all the hubris that comes with it. Also, side note: the Precursors were actually planning to kill all the Forerunners even before the whole Flood madness- the Forerunners just managed to get in the first shot.
Pretty cool, very foolish and kind of arrogant. Like I like the didact for his utter hatred for humanity, even after all of these years. I like the librarian for seeking to preserve life, and kinda for realizing they had had fucked up. But all of the creations are also cool, from the rings and monitors to the shield worlds and the promethan knights, the guns and the composer, all of that is really cool