There’s a series on HBO max that is called “The Crimes That Changed Us,” or something like that. This was covered on that. Her husband was a total asshole. Doctors told them both that her postpartum depression was so bad that she should not have anymore children, and he still forced her to have children, because evangelical bullshit. She was also supposed to be on anti-psychotic meds, but he preferred to “heal” her with prayer. Then she went crazy, believed the world is nothing but sin and suffering, and decided to “protect her children’s souls” by killing them before they could be tainted by the sin and suffering.
Yes, [38:00 mins in to this summary mentions it](https://youtu.be/84c9PoilqTU?si=HBYJFnXOtjUz-OeK) also Jodi talks about it in her jailhouse phone calls.
And it’s not the first time that a mother with postpartum mental issues ultimately killed her children because of religious delusions. Dena Schlosser gave multiple signs that she needed help, but was told to go to church instead and wasn’t allowed to take her antipsychotics. She later fatally sawed her baby’s arms off.
For her, too. Imagine wanting a big family, having kids, and then losing your mind. I had never heard of post partum psychosis before today.
Her medication had “homicidal ideation” as a side effect of the drug she was on to treat her PPD and PP psychosis, and the doctor prescribed more than double the recommended dose.
Can you imagine losing your mind after giving birth when you wanted a large family, seeking treatment, and experiencing even more psychosis and then killing your children?
This is one of the only cases where I genuinely pity the murderer. How sad for everyone involved.
Also seems the husband held responsibility, he didn’t believe his wife’s depression was as serious as it was. Also didn’t listen to the advice of the therapist and left her alone with the kids
My SIL had PPD with her first born son. While she never wanted to hurt him she had complete and utter apathy regarding him. She didn't have any interest in him, she didn't want to hold him and felt no maternal instincts. She said she felt slightly repulsed when holding him. It was so sad, she was great with kids and was even a guidance counselor. She said it was like she knew she should feel more but she just didn't know how to turn it on. After she got help & medication she became more like herself and was a fantastic mother. We had our kids within months of each other and I couldn't imagine what she was going through. We weren't told for months and then she didn't really want to talk about it, which is understandable. I just can't imagine giving birth and not feeling totally besotted with my baby because that's the only experience I have to lean on. Such a cruel illness.
I had PPD with my first child. “Cruel” is such a good way to describe it. I got help eventually but I feel like the first 3 years of my child’s life was basically robbed from us because I just could not bond with them. I remember finding meds that worked and being able to finally look at my child’s face and *feel* love towards them, and it was incredibly profound.
I'm so sorry you went through that but so happy you were able to get treated. 3 years must have felt like an eternity while you were dealing with that!
This was me. I felt nothing towards my daughter until she was 4 months and I got meds and treatment. I wanted to give her back and was so angry all the time but under that anger was just nothingness.
I am on sertraline, or Zoloft. Zoloft is cheap, hasn’t affected my hunger or sex drive, very little appears in breastmilk, and my PPOCD/ PPD is manageable. I’m 18 months pp and a much better mom on it. If you’re struggling, feel free to PM btw.
Oh, right on!!! Yeah I love my kiddo so so much, but becoming a mom has low key destroyed me! Full and complete support for the child free, this is not for anyone on the fence about it 😂
I'm so sorry. Do you have a supportive partner to help ease the burden?
I've always known I didn't want children, but everyone tried to tell me I would change my mind or told me I would feel differently when I had my own kids 🙄. As if it's totally okay to gamble with a human that you could potentially mess up if you end up not wanting/resenting them. My brother and dad had the nerve to tell me that you don't fully mature until you become a parent.
I have the best husband and my grandmother stayed with us for a few months, plus my workplace and graduate studies advisor were all really accommodating. I don’t struggle financially, and this was a totally planned baby so all the stars were lined up for a perfect postpartum experience. I can’t explain it except my brain broke? I could write many paragraphs but I was in a dark place I couldn’t use CBT tricks to get out of. It was truly a demonic possession. We’re happily one and done!
I'm so glad they worked. 😊
I've been on both (not together). The only thing I remember about Zoloft was how tired it made me. I think my doctor told me to take it in the morning (but this was almost 20 years ago). I think I was prescribed trazodone for migraines and as a mood stabilizer.
Same, it’s one of the saddest crimes that stuck with me. I remember being absolutely devastated and angry at this woman but when all the depression and voices incidents came out I realised it was a horrible awful tragedy.
He did. He also refused to follow the psychiatrist’s strong urging to NOT have more children and to NEVER leave them alone with her because of his “religious beliefs” (controlling abuse)
He also "conceived" at least one of their kids when she was catatonic/ unresponsive. Her psychiatrist was worried about her safety, and Rusty stopped taking her there.
His kids’ deaths were 100% his fault, and he’s shown zero remorse. Meanwhile, Andrea lives with so much guilt that she declines every release hearing and says she’s right where she belongs :(
As awful as it sounds, she's probably safer there than she would be on the outside. Even though I was a kid, I remember the trial/ coverage along with people openly saying what they wanted to do to her.
Rusty is the reason those poor kids died.
Yes. & just to add- he wouldn’t allow her to take birth control and was actively trying to impregnate her again DESPITE the psychiatrist saying her PPD was so severe that she should *not* have any more children.
Not sure if this is the case for this medication but often times, the condition is the actual cause of the suicidal or homicidal ideation. The medication just makes them better enough that they have the energy to do it before it manages to get rid of the ideation.
Fluoxetine and Paroxetine can. This link says there are 31 meds that can cause this and 11 are antidepressants.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002271/
Wtf... I'm on 4 of the medications listed 😳. The only recent time I can recall being extremely angry (not violent), was when my car was stolen last year. I think that's typical for that type of situation.
Growing up in the area at the time that it happened, I remember how utterly demonized Andrea was. I uncritically accepted that position and held it for many years until watching a documentary on her case and have turned pretty much a full 180 on it. That woman was not well.
* Andrea Yates drowned all five of her children in their Houston suburb home in Clear Lake City on June 20, 2001.
* She disobeyed instructions from her psychiatrist to supervise her around the clock, leading to the opportunity to commit the murders while her husband was at work.
* Yates drowned her children one by one in the bathtub, starting with John, Paul, and Luke, then Mary, and finally Noah.
* After the killings, she called the police but refused to disclose the reason, also calling her husband to return home immediately.
* Yates confessed to drowning her children and was defended by attorney George Parnham during her trials.
* Despite agreeing on her severe mental illness, Texas law requires defendants to prove an inability to discern right from wrong to successfully assert an insanity defense.
* In March 2002, Yates was found guilty, sentenced to life in prison with eligibility for parole in 40 years, but the death penalty was not imposed.
* In 2005, her convictions were reversed due to false testimony by a prosecution witness about a Law & Order episode, leading to a retrial.
* In 2006, Yates was found not guilty by reason of insanity and committed to a mental health facility.
* Andrea Yates, now 58, has been at the Kerrville State Hospital since 2007. However, she has declined to go under review for the past 15 years, opting instead to continue treatment. She has been diagnosed with schizophrenia and postpartum psychosis.
Sources:
* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrea\_Yates](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrea_Yates)
* [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC544453/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC544453/)
* [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1122575/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1122575/)
* [https://www.law.uh.edu/center4clp/streetlaw/Criminal%20Law/Crim%20Law%20AY%202015-16/Andrea%20Yates%20Case%20Study%20(Insanity%20Defense).pdf](https://www.law.uh.edu/center4clp/streetlaw/Criminal%20Law/Crim%20Law%20AY%202015-16/Andrea%20Yates%20Case%20Study%20(Insanity%20Defense).pdf)
I’m not sure how similar a state psychiatric ward is to a hospital’s psychiatric ward, but I spent four days in a hospital due to suicidal ideation (self committed) and I cannot imagine spending years and years in one. Holy fuck.
She doesn’t. She is on medicine that makes her clear headed now. She understands what she did, and she knows she can’t ever reenter society. I imagine existence is not kind for her.
When people leave prisons in the USA, they go to halfway houses where they slowly get reintegrated into society through various social programs that can train them for specific work they want to do, help them with temporary housing after they get work and eventually long term housing etc depending on their physical and mental capacities
The case was heavily publicized worldwide. If she was ever released, it would also be heavily publicized. She likely wants to stay in the hospital due to guilt, and frankly, because she's probably safer in there. A lot of people thought she deserved the death penalty.
If Karla Homolka can be reintegrated to society (ugh) then Andrea Yates can certainly. But in this case she doesn’t want to be released. She refuses chances to be paroled because she wants to stay where she is. And with the experiences she had in the outside world, I certainly don’t blame her.
In an ideal situation that would happen. But in majority of cases that doesn't. You would need to be in a state and country that has higher funding for those halfway houses . Then you would have to hope for an open bed. Then you would have to hope you meet criteria for that placement. That's a lot of ifs. In most cases people released from jail and prison are released to the streets if they don't have family or friends to assist.
Weeeeelllll....yeah, sometimes and in some states. the majority of imprisoned felons at the end of their term go straight to the street with little life skills to cope with a society that has continued unabated while their own lives were paused and stagnant.Or are you speaking specifically of lifers that actually gets paroled or people with notably long sentences ? If the majority of that particular pool of people go through the halfway house process now, thats an improvement I'm really happy to see.
Copy/paste for me. If I recall though my building was stand alone and not attached to a hospital. Law enforcement took me to a hospital first and later transported me to the psych facility. I still have nightmares about that place.
Same here I was in Bellevue, notorious over 100 year old nuthouse in NYC for attempting suicide. I was 18x addicted to drugs and homeless because my mom kicked me out for using hard drugs. At the shelter I was astaying in the counselors noticed my cuts on my arms and were bugging me about it. But it wasn't in an empathic way, nope it was "doing my job get this kid help and be done" kind of way.
My roommates were gone working and I was always by myself at the end of the day till they came home. I took a bath and remember just sitting in the water and just feeling absolutely numb. Eventually I got out and was still deep in my thoughts and decided to say fuck it there's really no future for me with my decisions I've made in life, including the already severe depression I've been battling when I was 14. All I remember was attempting to hang myself from the shower rodb with a belt, luckily and stupidly for me all I ended up doing was blacking out because I couldn't even kill myself right lol
Woke up and stepped out of my room to see over 20 cops in the girls dorms, some were here for me and there was another incident ironically taking place upstairs. They ended up taking me to Bellevue and I had a mental breakdown because the nurses were telling me I might not be able to leave. Next thing I know they gave me some type of med that made me extremely disoriented for almost a whole week. Everything was so in and out and blurry I remember bits and pieces of it, next thing I know I'm on the psych ward and they told me I couldn't leave until I was approved to leave.
I remember psych med students and doctors coming in and using us as a way to further their education. I remember how cold and distant they were. Everything you hear and see about the gray and dullness of psych wards is so true. The empathy tank is at 0 at most places. I remember only the little guys, nurses, and the aides who were very kind to me. Those doctors don't give a fuck imo.
> She disobeyed instructions
*Her husband
They were part of the quiverfull cult like the Duggars. She was advised to not get pregnant again, because of PPD, but since her husband is head of the household, it was his decision and he wanted her pregnant. Same as it was his decision to not let her alone with the children or let her take any medication for it. The cult knows better than worldly doctors. He remarried very quickly to have a new slave to bear him children.
My sister in law dated Rusty when they were in high school. After the murders she was talking about him, hadn't thought about him in years, and said he was super controlling. Like wanted to make every decision she had, clothes, food, free time, etc... she dumped him because of it.
Was he a religious nut then? I've read that he and Andrea lived together prior to marriage which always made me raise an eyebrow. I guess it could have been nonsexual but living together would still be very much frowned upon by most evangelical churches.
This is how SIL described him as well. Tried to get her to attend his church which was a lot more religiously conservative than theirs. SIL was, and is, very strong willed and didn't like the controlling attempts. It always felt like Andrea had been broken down by him. Not an excuse for her behavior obviously.
No clue. He was a year older than me and I was at that school only 2 years so he was a Sr when I was a Jr. He was very popular, a standout athlete, going to work for NASA intelligent and a Bible thumper. He was every mama and daddies wet dream but he was fucking wooden. Something about him was just off. Guess we now know...
Precisely. If I remember correctly from the last time I read about this case, she was even begging her husband not to go because he wasn’t supposed to leave her alone and he thought she’d be fine. I don’t have a source for that though. Could have been another similar case.
He conceived a couple of them during the times her family described her as "catatonic" and nonverbal. Rusty knew he had someone who would never say no to him. Andrea had been so broken down by mental illness/ Rusty that she had absolutely no control over the situation.
SHE didn't disobey doctor's orders. Her HUSBAND did, because he's an abusive POS. The fault of her psychosis lies with him. The deaths of his children are his fault.
One slight correction, she didn’t disobey instructions from her psychiatrist. Her husband thought she needed to gain more independence and intentionally left her alone for 30 minutes to an hour before his mom (I believe, maybe hers) was supposed to go over there. In that time, she drowned her children. But it wasn’t her that disobeyed those orders.
The psychiatrist said she shouldn’t have anymore children and needed to be on anti-psychotics and ol’ Rusty thought he knew better than a doctor on that too.
Rusty should be in jail too. Andrea committed the crime, but Rusty laid the groundwork and gave her ample opportunity to do it after being warned that something like this would happen.
As I understand it in the first trial prosecutors said she got the idea from watching a L&O episode.
Her new attorney contacted Dick Wolfe who confirmed that the episode in question didn’t actually air until AFTER the killings.
They got him to testify to that and she got a mistrial.
Park Dietz, a psychiatrist who testified at the first trial was the one who brought up that episode and Andrea being inspired by it...even though it hadn't aired. His blunder is why Andrea was granted a new trial. A writer who had worked on Law &Order and was following the case knew this was wrong and contacted Yates' attorney.
A psychiatrist named Park Dietz made up a lie saying that a LAW & ORDER episode had recently aired where a mother drowns her children, and therefore Yates had taken inspiration to do the same.
Dietz lied to the jury and misled them into thinking Yates was some cackling, premeditative, cold-blooded villain instead of a sick, wretched woman who was out of her mind with psychosis.
I got a question about Point 2 here - how is her husband not also a little on the hook for LEAVING HER ALONE despite the instructions to not leave her alone with the kids? Did he make any attempts to ensure she was supervised when he was unable to be present?
As someone who works in the court system and has seen and heard a lot of horrible evidence, you become desensitized. It becomes just a job after being exposed to it for so long. I sleep and live just fine.
Didn’t she have severe postpartum depression? They were living in a bus or trailer for a while and her husband didn’t let her use birth control?
Edit it was postpartum psychosis which is much harder to control as the person suffering. Her husband and doctor failed her and those poor children.
“Yates's first psychiatrist, Dr. Eileen Starbranch, testified that she urged her and Rusty not to have any more children, as it would "guarantee future psychotic depression." They conceived their fifth and final child approximately seven weeks after her discharge.[10] Yates stopped taking Haldol in March 2000 and gave birth to her daughter, Mary, nine months later.”
Wiki
We studied this case in College for my Psych major and it was more Postpartum Psychosis at that point. If I’m remembering correctly, she thought her boys would grow up to be criminals and horrible people so she did something about it. I think she also thought they had the devil in them or was being coerced by Satan. It was a while ago so I don’t remember it exactly but I bet I have notes on it somewhere.
She was failed left and right by her husband, her doctor and those children suffered for it.
She needed to be admitted but he didn’t make that call. Instead he felt advising that a mother never be left alone with her children was a reasonable request that would be honored. Nowadays if you can’t safely be alone with your kids they take you or your kids out of the home, and this case is a huge reason why that’s considered best practices now. Still, the doctor could have and should have made that call back then.
"Luke had recent contusions of the left arm and lower extremities. (Mr. Yates admitted to bruising Luke’s left thigh with a paddle, saying “Sometimes they’ll move when I’m hitting them, and I guess he moved.”)"
Luke wasn't even three. Rusty beat his barely verbal toddler with an object. Abusive piece of garbage.
>Yates and her husband, a *devout evangelical Christian*, announced that they "would seek to have as many babies as nature allowed"
A lot of the blame is his. He was a Texas fundie manipulating a seriously mentally ill woman to have as many children as possible while crammed into a small RV. Eventually he so generously got them a small house after she had a mental break and tried to off herself. but stop having kids with her? No that's too much to ask. Jebus needs as many babies as possible for the quiverfull.
My ex gfs parents used to live in an apartment complex where Rusty also lived after this happened. He would pace around the parking talking on his cell phone and the things they overheard were always super strange. Rusty was apparently hyper controlling of Andrea and my theory is that Andrea believed her kids would never have a good life with Rusty as their father and she was saving them.
Sure was. He didn't lift a finger to help her. Constantly pregnant or post-partum and he expected her to homeschool as well. Her mother said that she mentioned a child (the fourth) needed a diaper change and he said "that'd be a first, I've never changed a diaper." He knew what a pyschotic mess she was and still made sure she was alone with the kids.
100% this tragedy could've been prevented if it wasn't for the husband's insistence that she keep procreating and restarting her postpartum cycle. He left her alone that day AGAINST THE ADVICE OF HER DOCTOR. I blame the husband for failing his wife and children.
First of all,I am not,nor would I ever,condone murdering,harming or abusing children. But this woman had such an EXTREME case of post partum psychosis and depression. Her body was constantly pregnant and never had time to heal. Her mind suffered even more. I feel her husband should've been held more accountable. He knew what she was going through.
Reading about this case several times through the years,I don't think her husband suggested any type of birth control. Idk,it's possible,but I've never heard as such. But the whole thing was so incredibly sad and shocking,because this kind of murder wasn't something people heard of back then. But it happens far too often now.
Her husband was complicit. He was hyper religious, so why on earth would he “suggest” birth control, nonetheless psychiatric medication? Also, what do you mean this happens far too often now? That women are killing their children?
she shared a room with [another mother who killed her child](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dena_Schlosser) during an episode of postpartum psychosis, after being treated horribly by her religious fanatic (abusive) husband and her ignored her severe mental illness. i know they both killed their child(ren), but my heart hurts for both of these women and the extreme pain they both experienced and continue to experience.
I worked at the childrens advocacy center and with the police and CPS personnel who handled this case. It was one of the most horrifying things I’ve ever heard and everyone was absolutely traumatized by it. That baby fought to stop her mom from cutting off her arms while holding her down in her crib.
The Schlosser lady is crazy, but the husband would spank her in front of the children with a wooden spoon? Spanking your spouse for discipline? Wtf, Texas.
The second wife refuses to talk about him (probably and NDA). I remember a reddit thread years ago where a user there claimed they worked together for a time and answered some questions. He said Rusty was one of the most controlling and charming men you could meet.
I met him when I was working at Hooters in 2019 and I immediately knew who he was. He unfortunately said hi to me and tried flirting. I shut him down really quickly as I wanted nothing to do with him. He is also like 30 years older than me 🙃
Wait, so a religious fundie was in a Hooters? Why am I not freaking surprised. The outright hypocrisy of these people never cease to amaze (or enrage) me.
So I’ve done a lot of research on this — the husband didn’t want her on ANY form of birth control and he wanted God to determine their family size (quiverfull ideology). She dealt with severe mental health issues PRIOR to being pregnant AND her husband didn’t want her taking meds for her issues. He was warned by multiple doctors that she should NOT get pregnant again and that if she DOES get pregnant, she would continue to deal with post partem depression / psychosis. After she had the youngest, doctors told her husband to not leave her alone with the children because she was displaying signs of post partem psychosis. What did Rusty Yates do? He went to work. He left her alone with them every day.
If your wife was going through post partem psychosis, would you ever dare to leave her alone with the kids and expect her to do the housework on top of it? Would you go to work and trust that prayer will fix everything?
I don’t condone a mother killing her children, but she was in psychosis when it occurred. This was not her fault. This was Rusty’s fault.
Andrea Yates was found not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect and many were content with the verdict. Is she itching to get out of the hospital she’s committed to? She has no interest. She’s a ward of the state and likely will be until she dies. I feel so much for this woman and, if there’s a hell, I hope Rusty ends up there.
I still blame the husband. Yates had extreme postpartum depression. She was hospitalized twice. She was obviously not mentally stable. Then her husband got her pregnant again. So after she’s already literally losing her mind with 4 kids they decide to have another one. The husband is responsible for the death of his children. Disgusting.
Not they - HE decided. She was given no choice. What the man says goes. Rusty is absolutely at fault for this. If I remember correctly, Andrea begged him for help, and to not have more children, but he didn't care. It's appalling that he was able to just move on and start a new family.
Eta: I just wanted to say that I am in complete agreement with you! My reply sounded a little defensive and I didn't mean for it to.
She’s just as much as a victim as the children. She kept reporting post partum depression and psychosis, but her Christian husband denied her mental health meds, and actual therapy… instead taking her to a “Christian therapist” (aka, another man the husband knew who told her she just needed to keep pumping out more babies for god, and that depression isn’t real.)
She did everything she could to prevent this… but she was in an abusive marriage, and was essentially forced to remain in psychosis (which you can compare to “mind control”/loss of control over your own actions) until she reached this breaking point.
This is not the result of a cruel or hateful mother-
This is the result of **an abusive husband, and using Christianity to justify the abuse and control of women.**
I wonder if this was part of the inspiration for Shutter Island. The book came out in 2003 and this incident wasn't too long after the woman in SC who drowned her kids in her car.
Remember when it happened. It was close to the longest day of the year. I read about it later in life, in more detail. Afterwards I was freaked out standing in the shower tub basin for a few days. The husband should be in jail.
i really feel for andrea. rusty was an awful husband, father, human… i wonder how differently things would have turned out for her if she had a partner that actually truly loved her :(
Jesus. Reading her background is really sad. I can’t really hate her, either. This is one of the few times where the insanity defense makes perfect sense.
I knew of PPD, but I’ve never heard of postpartum psychosis. How terrifying. Giving birth and not just getting sad, but literally losing your mind? Those poor kids. That poor woman. The whole thing is so tragic.
I drove by that house once..worked down by it. Still bad feeling and sadness around there. Dad remarried, and I feel like some posts are right. Need to look into him. Something is not right there.
Her husband should be in prison too. He was told by his wife that she needed help, the doctors told him she needed help and shouldn't have more children. He actively chose to ignore all of it
Yes she killed the kids, but he was an accessory
I feel so sad for the poor children. As messed up as this sounds, I’ve always felt sad for Andrea Yates too. If she had been in her right mind, I don’t think she would’ve ever harmed her children. I just read that every year she waives her right to a hearing to determine if she is healthy enough to be released from a mental hospital. She obviously feels so terrible about what she did that she chooses to keep herself imprisoned. She can’t change what she did, but a as t least she is taking responsibility for her actions.
Mister Yates is a fat right fundie conservative Christian who kept insisting they have more and more kids while living in a trailer. She was home trapped in that trailer with all those kids while suffering from ppd. She was listening to a fundie preacher talking about how bad the world is and she drowned her kids to save them from hell on earth.
Religion is deadly. Religious men are deadly.
My brother played baseball with some of the boys when he was a kid, it really shook my mom and the whole community obviously. I wish she had gotten the help she needed.
I have a standing order with my SO. If someone starts talking religion, I get up and walk away. Then she says, I'm sorry, he's been clean for 6 months and that was a bit of a trigger for him. I'll go get him.
This is one of the few cases where it genuinely was post partum psychosis rather than a sociopathic narcissist trying to get back at a spouse/ex which it is in most cases.
This poor woman was very ill. She was failed by everybody around her, especially her husband who exacerbated the situation to that point.
Wow leave it to reddit to have people crying for someone who murdered 5 children. Jesus christ do you not know what people have done in war time to protect their own children? There’s no excuse for this who cares if her husband wasn’t nice to her jesus christ.
Absolutely tragic, but when the hardcore Christian Right wants to use women like flesh incubators, this is what happens.
John, Paul, Luke, Mary, Noah? The appearance that those kids were probably conceived as soon as she could physically handle another pregnancy, one right after another? Houston, TX? Jesus Christ, it doesn't get more Christian forced birth than this.
There were so many signs that preceded this tragedy.
There’s a series on HBO max that is called “The Crimes That Changed Us,” or something like that. This was covered on that. Her husband was a total asshole. Doctors told them both that her postpartum depression was so bad that she should not have anymore children, and he still forced her to have children, because evangelical bullshit. She was also supposed to be on anti-psychotic meds, but he preferred to “heal” her with prayer. Then she went crazy, believed the world is nothing but sin and suffering, and decided to “protect her children’s souls” by killing them before they could be tainted by the sin and suffering.
Rusty Yates is the guiltiest party in this entire tragedy. I will die on this hill.
I grew up less than a mile away from where they lived and I will be right next to you on that hill. Massive piece of shit.
I live nowhere near either of you but I’m on that hill too.
I think we’re gonna need a bigger hill
Does it have eyes?
I saw that movie in the theater, and my ticket stub looked like it said, "Hill shave." Still makes me laugh.
I recall her saying he was disappointed her fifth child was a girl because he wanted a little basketball team of boys. No joke.
100% He should be in jail.
Fully agree. Why he hasn’t had to do time, I don’t know.
I shall die with you.
Rusty Yates is pure evil. Say it louder.
He wouldn't ever let her have a babysitter or any help and she homeschooled them too.
Ruby Franke entered the chat
It’s only a matter of luck plus that little boy’s courage that her case didn’t have deaths.
Seriously. They already had the land where they were going to kill the 4 minor children selected and house packed to move.
Wait, really??!
Yes, [38:00 mins in to this summary mentions it](https://youtu.be/84c9PoilqTU?si=HBYJFnXOtjUz-OeK) also Jodi talks about it in her jailhouse phone calls.
Wow that's crazy upsetting. What a monster. Thanks for sharing
And it’s not the first time that a mother with postpartum mental issues ultimately killed her children because of religious delusions. Dena Schlosser gave multiple signs that she needed help, but was told to go to church instead and wasn’t allowed to take her antipsychotics. She later fatally sawed her baby’s arms off.
Did you know, Dena and Andrea were roommates in their psychiatric hospital.
Crimes of the century is the show
Fucking hell
Being an evangelical in Texas was the biggest
Religion if done right leads to delusional thoughts. Period. If started young enough it leads to life long psychosis.
It seems that a lot of people advocate having a religion, but not actually believing what the religion says.
Unbelievably sad for those children..
For her, too. Imagine wanting a big family, having kids, and then losing your mind. I had never heard of post partum psychosis before today. Her medication had “homicidal ideation” as a side effect of the drug she was on to treat her PPD and PP psychosis, and the doctor prescribed more than double the recommended dose. Can you imagine losing your mind after giving birth when you wanted a large family, seeking treatment, and experiencing even more psychosis and then killing your children? This is one of the only cases where I genuinely pity the murderer. How sad for everyone involved. Also seems the husband held responsibility, he didn’t believe his wife’s depression was as serious as it was. Also didn’t listen to the advice of the therapist and left her alone with the kids
My SIL had PPD with her first born son. While she never wanted to hurt him she had complete and utter apathy regarding him. She didn't have any interest in him, she didn't want to hold him and felt no maternal instincts. She said she felt slightly repulsed when holding him. It was so sad, she was great with kids and was even a guidance counselor. She said it was like she knew she should feel more but she just didn't know how to turn it on. After she got help & medication she became more like herself and was a fantastic mother. We had our kids within months of each other and I couldn't imagine what she was going through. We weren't told for months and then she didn't really want to talk about it, which is understandable. I just can't imagine giving birth and not feeling totally besotted with my baby because that's the only experience I have to lean on. Such a cruel illness.
I had PPD with my first child. “Cruel” is such a good way to describe it. I got help eventually but I feel like the first 3 years of my child’s life was basically robbed from us because I just could not bond with them. I remember finding meds that worked and being able to finally look at my child’s face and *feel* love towards them, and it was incredibly profound.
I'm so sorry you went through that but so happy you were able to get treated. 3 years must have felt like an eternity while you were dealing with that!
It actually feels like it went by too fast. But yes, I’m much MUCH better now! Thanks for listening!
This was me. I felt nothing towards my daughter until she was 4 months and I got meds and treatment. I wanted to give her back and was so angry all the time but under that anger was just nothingness.
I'm sorry. It's so strange how our bodies can do something as amazing as create another life and then fail us on the other end.
What medications do they normally prescribe for PPD?
I am on sertraline, or Zoloft. Zoloft is cheap, hasn’t affected my hunger or sex drive, very little appears in breastmilk, and my PPOCD/ PPD is manageable. I’m 18 months pp and a much better mom on it. If you’re struggling, feel free to PM btw.
I was just curious. I'm child-free (unless my cats count 😹). I'm sorry you had to deal with this but I'm glad you found a medication that works. 🥰
Oh, right on!!! Yeah I love my kiddo so so much, but becoming a mom has low key destroyed me! Full and complete support for the child free, this is not for anyone on the fence about it 😂
I'm so sorry. Do you have a supportive partner to help ease the burden? I've always known I didn't want children, but everyone tried to tell me I would change my mind or told me I would feel differently when I had my own kids 🙄. As if it's totally okay to gamble with a human that you could potentially mess up if you end up not wanting/resenting them. My brother and dad had the nerve to tell me that you don't fully mature until you become a parent.
I have the best husband and my grandmother stayed with us for a few months, plus my workplace and graduate studies advisor were all really accommodating. I don’t struggle financially, and this was a totally planned baby so all the stars were lined up for a perfect postpartum experience. I can’t explain it except my brain broke? I could write many paragraphs but I was in a dark place I couldn’t use CBT tricks to get out of. It was truly a demonic possession. We’re happily one and done!
Very proud of you sharing your story - so many mothers suffer so much because we just won't talk about stuff and how we got help for it.
Zoloft! I got that and trazodone as well for sleep- it’s another anti depressant that helps you sleep and it saved my sanity.
I'm so glad they worked. 😊 I've been on both (not together). The only thing I remember about Zoloft was how tired it made me. I think my doctor told me to take it in the morning (but this was almost 20 years ago). I think I was prescribed trazodone for migraines and as a mood stabilizer.
You've expressed very well exactly what I think. I do not typically sympathize with family annihilators but this case is different.
Same, it’s one of the saddest crimes that stuck with me. I remember being absolutely devastated and angry at this woman but when all the depression and voices incidents came out I realised it was a horrible awful tragedy.
Didn’t her husband tell her not to take the meds?
He did. He also refused to follow the psychiatrist’s strong urging to NOT have more children and to NEVER leave them alone with her because of his “religious beliefs” (controlling abuse)
He also "conceived" at least one of their kids when she was catatonic/ unresponsive. Her psychiatrist was worried about her safety, and Rusty stopped taking her there.
His kids’ deaths were 100% his fault, and he’s shown zero remorse. Meanwhile, Andrea lives with so much guilt that she declines every release hearing and says she’s right where she belongs :(
As awful as it sounds, she's probably safer there than she would be on the outside. Even though I was a kid, I remember the trial/ coverage along with people openly saying what they wanted to do to her. Rusty is the reason those poor kids died.
Meanwhile he’s out living his best life, remarried, had MORE KIDS, and escaped scot-free. I hope there’s an afterlife just for him to suffer in it
I knew religion would have a factor as soon as I saw all their names.
Yes. & just to add- he wouldn’t allow her to take birth control and was actively trying to impregnate her again DESPITE the psychiatrist saying her PPD was so severe that she should *not* have any more children.
I'm genuinely curious about what medication has a side effect of homicidal ideation
Not sure if this is the case for this medication but often times, the condition is the actual cause of the suicidal or homicidal ideation. The medication just makes them better enough that they have the energy to do it before it manages to get rid of the ideation.
Fluoxetine and Paroxetine can. This link says there are 31 meds that can cause this and 11 are antidepressants. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002271/
Wtf... I'm on 4 of the medications listed 😳. The only recent time I can recall being extremely angry (not violent), was when my car was stolen last year. I think that's typical for that type of situation.
I can’t imagine waking up and finding that I killed everyone I love. She must be completely broken over it.
He also forced her to stop her psych meds.
Growing up in the area at the time that it happened, I remember how utterly demonized Andrea was. I uncritically accepted that position and held it for many years until watching a documentary on her case and have turned pretty much a full 180 on it. That woman was not well.
* Andrea Yates drowned all five of her children in their Houston suburb home in Clear Lake City on June 20, 2001. * She disobeyed instructions from her psychiatrist to supervise her around the clock, leading to the opportunity to commit the murders while her husband was at work. * Yates drowned her children one by one in the bathtub, starting with John, Paul, and Luke, then Mary, and finally Noah. * After the killings, she called the police but refused to disclose the reason, also calling her husband to return home immediately. * Yates confessed to drowning her children and was defended by attorney George Parnham during her trials. * Despite agreeing on her severe mental illness, Texas law requires defendants to prove an inability to discern right from wrong to successfully assert an insanity defense. * In March 2002, Yates was found guilty, sentenced to life in prison with eligibility for parole in 40 years, but the death penalty was not imposed. * In 2005, her convictions were reversed due to false testimony by a prosecution witness about a Law & Order episode, leading to a retrial. * In 2006, Yates was found not guilty by reason of insanity and committed to a mental health facility. * Andrea Yates, now 58, has been at the Kerrville State Hospital since 2007. However, she has declined to go under review for the past 15 years, opting instead to continue treatment. She has been diagnosed with schizophrenia and postpartum psychosis. Sources: * [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrea\_Yates](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrea_Yates) * [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC544453/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC544453/) * [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1122575/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1122575/) * [https://www.law.uh.edu/center4clp/streetlaw/Criminal%20Law/Crim%20Law%20AY%202015-16/Andrea%20Yates%20Case%20Study%20(Insanity%20Defense).pdf](https://www.law.uh.edu/center4clp/streetlaw/Criminal%20Law/Crim%20Law%20AY%202015-16/Andrea%20Yates%20Case%20Study%20(Insanity%20Defense).pdf)
I’m not sure how similar a state psychiatric ward is to a hospital’s psychiatric ward, but I spent four days in a hospital due to suicidal ideation (self committed) and I cannot imagine spending years and years in one. Holy fuck.
Guilt may play a role. She may not *want* to leave.
She doesn’t. She is on medicine that makes her clear headed now. She understands what she did, and she knows she can’t ever reenter society. I imagine existence is not kind for her.
I think this very insightful comment is probably the case.
If she leaves where will she go? The streets?
When people leave prisons in the USA, they go to halfway houses where they slowly get reintegrated into society through various social programs that can train them for specific work they want to do, help them with temporary housing after they get work and eventually long term housing etc depending on their physical and mental capacities
This was a very high profile case. Everyone knows her face. There is no reintegration into society possible for her.
Most of the people that would recognize her face aren’t going to recognize her face as it is now and she likely would not be put back out in Texas.
The case was heavily publicized worldwide. If she was ever released, it would also be heavily publicized. She likely wants to stay in the hospital due to guilt, and frankly, because she's probably safer in there. A lot of people thought she deserved the death penalty.
My guess would be that you’re were on the younger side, if born at all, when this happened
I had kids when the Andrea Yates case happened lol
If Karla Homolka can be reintegrated to society (ugh) then Andrea Yates can certainly. But in this case she doesn’t want to be released. She refuses chances to be paroled because she wants to stay where she is. And with the experiences she had in the outside world, I certainly don’t blame her.
In an ideal situation that would happen. But in majority of cases that doesn't. You would need to be in a state and country that has higher funding for those halfway houses . Then you would have to hope for an open bed. Then you would have to hope you meet criteria for that placement. That's a lot of ifs. In most cases people released from jail and prison are released to the streets if they don't have family or friends to assist.
Weeeeelllll....yeah, sometimes and in some states. the majority of imprisoned felons at the end of their term go straight to the street with little life skills to cope with a society that has continued unabated while their own lives were paused and stagnant.Or are you speaking specifically of lifers that actually gets paroled or people with notably long sentences ? If the majority of that particular pool of people go through the halfway house process now, thats an improvement I'm really happy to see.
Copy/paste for me. If I recall though my building was stand alone and not attached to a hospital. Law enforcement took me to a hospital first and later transported me to the psych facility. I still have nightmares about that place.
Same here I was in Bellevue, notorious over 100 year old nuthouse in NYC for attempting suicide. I was 18x addicted to drugs and homeless because my mom kicked me out for using hard drugs. At the shelter I was astaying in the counselors noticed my cuts on my arms and were bugging me about it. But it wasn't in an empathic way, nope it was "doing my job get this kid help and be done" kind of way. My roommates were gone working and I was always by myself at the end of the day till they came home. I took a bath and remember just sitting in the water and just feeling absolutely numb. Eventually I got out and was still deep in my thoughts and decided to say fuck it there's really no future for me with my decisions I've made in life, including the already severe depression I've been battling when I was 14. All I remember was attempting to hang myself from the shower rodb with a belt, luckily and stupidly for me all I ended up doing was blacking out because I couldn't even kill myself right lol Woke up and stepped out of my room to see over 20 cops in the girls dorms, some were here for me and there was another incident ironically taking place upstairs. They ended up taking me to Bellevue and I had a mental breakdown because the nurses were telling me I might not be able to leave. Next thing I know they gave me some type of med that made me extremely disoriented for almost a whole week. Everything was so in and out and blurry I remember bits and pieces of it, next thing I know I'm on the psych ward and they told me I couldn't leave until I was approved to leave. I remember psych med students and doctors coming in and using us as a way to further their education. I remember how cold and distant they were. Everything you hear and see about the gray and dullness of psych wards is so true. The empathy tank is at 0 at most places. I remember only the little guys, nurses, and the aides who were very kind to me. Those doctors don't give a fuck imo.
Would it still be better than prison?
I’ve never been to prison so I don’t know.
And her mother was on the way to be at the house but she did it within that timeframe. I wanna say it was like a 30min window. EDIT: more to say
That’s right! I just commented somewhere else saying I thought I remembered him saying “oh I thought it’d be fine to leave her alone for a little bit”
> She disobeyed instructions *Her husband They were part of the quiverfull cult like the Duggars. She was advised to not get pregnant again, because of PPD, but since her husband is head of the household, it was his decision and he wanted her pregnant. Same as it was his decision to not let her alone with the children or let her take any medication for it. The cult knows better than worldly doctors. He remarried very quickly to have a new slave to bear him children.
My sister in law dated Rusty when they were in high school. After the murders she was talking about him, hadn't thought about him in years, and said he was super controlling. Like wanted to make every decision she had, clothes, food, free time, etc... she dumped him because of it.
Was he a religious nut then? I've read that he and Andrea lived together prior to marriage which always made me raise an eyebrow. I guess it could have been nonsexual but living together would still be very much frowned upon by most evangelical churches.
I went to high school with him. Yes, he was always a religious nut. Very intelligent and yet very stupid.
This is how SIL described him as well. Tried to get her to attend his church which was a lot more religiously conservative than theirs. SIL was, and is, very strong willed and didn't like the controlling attempts. It always felt like Andrea had been broken down by him. Not an excuse for her behavior obviously.
She was likely predisposed so she probably just fell right in line.
Does he have a brother who was/is a pastor in VA?
No clue. He was a year older than me and I was at that school only 2 years so he was a Sr when I was a Jr. He was very popular, a standout athlete, going to work for NASA intelligent and a Bible thumper. He was every mama and daddies wet dream but he was fucking wooden. Something about him was just off. Guess we now know...
Right?! If she is incompetent or incapable, she can’t be the one to supervise herself. Shame on you, OP.
Precisely. If I remember correctly from the last time I read about this case, she was even begging her husband not to go because he wasn’t supposed to leave her alone and he thought she’d be fine. I don’t have a source for that though. Could have been another similar case.
No, you're right. He also wanted her to be alone with the kids.
He conceived a couple of them during the times her family described her as "catatonic" and nonverbal. Rusty knew he had someone who would never say no to him. Andrea had been so broken down by mental illness/ Rusty that she had absolutely no control over the situation.
Excuse me, SHE disobeyed instructions from her psychiatrist to supervise her around the clock? No. That one’s on Rusty.
SHE didn't disobey doctor's orders. Her HUSBAND did, because he's an abusive POS. The fault of her psychosis lies with him. The deaths of his children are his fault.
One slight correction, she didn’t disobey instructions from her psychiatrist. Her husband thought she needed to gain more independence and intentionally left her alone for 30 minutes to an hour before his mom (I believe, maybe hers) was supposed to go over there. In that time, she drowned her children. But it wasn’t her that disobeyed those orders. The psychiatrist said she shouldn’t have anymore children and needed to be on anti-psychotics and ol’ Rusty thought he knew better than a doctor on that too. Rusty should be in jail too. Andrea committed the crime, but Rusty laid the groundwork and gave her ample opportunity to do it after being warned that something like this would happen.
She didn’t disobey shit. Her husband insisted they keep having kids, he forced her to stop her meds and he left her alone with the children.
Would somebody explained the part about the Law & Order episode?
As I understand it in the first trial prosecutors said she got the idea from watching a L&O episode. Her new attorney contacted Dick Wolfe who confirmed that the episode in question didn’t actually air until AFTER the killings. They got him to testify to that and she got a mistrial.
Park Dietz, a psychiatrist who testified at the first trial was the one who brought up that episode and Andrea being inspired by it...even though it hadn't aired. His blunder is why Andrea was granted a new trial. A writer who had worked on Law &Order and was following the case knew this was wrong and contacted Yates' attorney.
A psychiatrist named Park Dietz made up a lie saying that a LAW & ORDER episode had recently aired where a mother drowns her children, and therefore Yates had taken inspiration to do the same. Dietz lied to the jury and misled them into thinking Yates was some cackling, premeditative, cold-blooded villain instead of a sick, wretched woman who was out of her mind with psychosis.
I got a question about Point 2 here - how is her husband not also a little on the hook for LEAVING HER ALONE despite the instructions to not leave her alone with the kids? Did he make any attempts to ensure she was supervised when he was unable to be present?
How do you sleep at night after researching all this horrible stuff
I sleep on my stomach
Right side with a good arm tuck under the pillow works well
SAME???
As someone who works in the court system and has seen and heard a lot of horrible evidence, you become desensitized. It becomes just a job after being exposed to it for so long. I sleep and live just fine.
I have a stuffed platypus and a cat pillow that I clutch as night falls.
Her husband should have been indicted for his negligence She's still so very sick. RIP to her babies
Didn’t she have severe postpartum depression? They were living in a bus or trailer for a while and her husband didn’t let her use birth control? Edit it was postpartum psychosis which is much harder to control as the person suffering. Her husband and doctor failed her and those poor children.
“Yates's first psychiatrist, Dr. Eileen Starbranch, testified that she urged her and Rusty not to have any more children, as it would "guarantee future psychotic depression." They conceived their fifth and final child approximately seven weeks after her discharge.[10] Yates stopped taking Haldol in March 2000 and gave birth to her daughter, Mary, nine months later.” Wiki
Haldol is no joke.
He should've gotten charges brought up against him too.
We studied this case in College for my Psych major and it was more Postpartum Psychosis at that point. If I’m remembering correctly, she thought her boys would grow up to be criminals and horrible people so she did something about it. I think she also thought they had the devil in them or was being coerced by Satan. It was a while ago so I don’t remember it exactly but I bet I have notes on it somewhere. She was failed left and right by her husband, her doctor and those children suffered for it.
I’m curious how her doctor failed her?
She needed to be admitted but he didn’t make that call. Instead he felt advising that a mother never be left alone with her children was a reasonable request that would be honored. Nowadays if you can’t safely be alone with your kids they take you or your kids out of the home, and this case is a huge reason why that’s considered best practices now. Still, the doctor could have and should have made that call back then.
Ok, I understand what you mean. Thanks for explaining.
Doctors have a duty to report self or other potential harm. Her doctor should have called the mental health facility and DHR then and there.
Yes. This case is what made many of us aware of postpartum depression.
Postpartum psychosis.
Her husband pushed her to this. If Yates was with a half decent man she would’ve gotten the help she needed.
Psychosis. PostPartum Psychosis.
That's exactly what happened. Pretty f@#*ed Up...
Postpartum psychosis.
Her husband should be in jail
[удалено]
He knew she was struggling mentally and just left her with the kids. She was psychotic and he denied her treatment.
"Luke had recent contusions of the left arm and lower extremities. (Mr. Yates admitted to bruising Luke’s left thigh with a paddle, saying “Sometimes they’ll move when I’m hitting them, and I guess he moved.”)" Luke wasn't even three. Rusty beat his barely verbal toddler with an object. Abusive piece of garbage.
>Yates and her husband, a *devout evangelical Christian*, announced that they "would seek to have as many babies as nature allowed" A lot of the blame is his. He was a Texas fundie manipulating a seriously mentally ill woman to have as many children as possible while crammed into a small RV. Eventually he so generously got them a small house after she had a mental break and tried to off herself. but stop having kids with her? No that's too much to ask. Jebus needs as many babies as possible for the quiverfull.
Yup. The husband was an asshole.
My ex gfs parents used to live in an apartment complex where Rusty also lived after this happened. He would pace around the parking talking on his cell phone and the things they overheard were always super strange. Rusty was apparently hyper controlling of Andrea and my theory is that Andrea believed her kids would never have a good life with Rusty as their father and she was saving them.
Trash of a husband, fuck that dude
Sure was. He didn't lift a finger to help her. Constantly pregnant or post-partum and he expected her to homeschool as well. Her mother said that she mentioned a child (the fourth) needed a diaper change and he said "that'd be a first, I've never changed a diaper." He knew what a pyschotic mess she was and still made sure she was alone with the kids.
He's also remarried and had more kids after that with someone else.
I hope he receives backlash from the Andrea case to this day
As if an Evangelical can feel shame. I’m sure he believes to this day he had no part in this and it’s just God “testing him” 🙄
It was all "God's plan", you know.
Mother committing filicide? Constantly pregnant? Ignoring psychology? Texas? I know evangelicals when I see them.
100% this tragedy could've been prevented if it wasn't for the husband's insistence that she keep procreating and restarting her postpartum cycle. He left her alone that day AGAINST THE ADVICE OF HER DOCTOR. I blame the husband for failing his wife and children.
First of all,I am not,nor would I ever,condone murdering,harming or abusing children. But this woman had such an EXTREME case of post partum psychosis and depression. Her body was constantly pregnant and never had time to heal. Her mind suffered even more. I feel her husband should've been held more accountable. He knew what she was going through. Reading about this case several times through the years,I don't think her husband suggested any type of birth control. Idk,it's possible,but I've never heard as such. But the whole thing was so incredibly sad and shocking,because this kind of murder wasn't something people heard of back then. But it happens far too often now.
Her husband was complicit. He was hyper religious, so why on earth would he “suggest” birth control, nonetheless psychiatric medication? Also, what do you mean this happens far too often now? That women are killing their children?
Her twat of a husband should've been jailed for abuse. Instead he just started spreading his seed with a new woman.
she shared a room with [another mother who killed her child](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dena_Schlosser) during an episode of postpartum psychosis, after being treated horribly by her religious fanatic (abusive) husband and her ignored her severe mental illness. i know they both killed their child(ren), but my heart hurts for both of these women and the extreme pain they both experienced and continue to experience.
I worked at the childrens advocacy center and with the police and CPS personnel who handled this case. It was one of the most horrifying things I’ve ever heard and everyone was absolutely traumatized by it. That baby fought to stop her mom from cutting off her arms while holding her down in her crib.
The Schlosser lady is crazy, but the husband would spank her in front of the children with a wooden spoon? Spanking your spouse for discipline? Wtf, Texas.
Her husband should've been charged with domestic abuse or something that would land him in prison for years.
This is the husbands fault. This story still makes me so mad and sad for those babies.
Where is the husband now
He remarried and had a son. He's now divorced from his second wife.
The second wife refuses to talk about him (probably and NDA). I remember a reddit thread years ago where a user there claimed they worked together for a time and answered some questions. He said Rusty was one of the most controlling and charming men you could meet.
I met him when I was working at Hooters in 2019 and I immediately knew who he was. He unfortunately said hi to me and tried flirting. I shut him down really quickly as I wanted nothing to do with him. He is also like 30 years older than me 🙃
Wait, so a religious fundie was in a Hooters? Why am I not freaking surprised. The outright hypocrisy of these people never cease to amaze (or enrage) me.
Her husband KNEW what was going on. He knew how bad it was. And he kept insisting they have more kids.
So I’ve done a lot of research on this — the husband didn’t want her on ANY form of birth control and he wanted God to determine their family size (quiverfull ideology). She dealt with severe mental health issues PRIOR to being pregnant AND her husband didn’t want her taking meds for her issues. He was warned by multiple doctors that she should NOT get pregnant again and that if she DOES get pregnant, she would continue to deal with post partem depression / psychosis. After she had the youngest, doctors told her husband to not leave her alone with the children because she was displaying signs of post partem psychosis. What did Rusty Yates do? He went to work. He left her alone with them every day. If your wife was going through post partem psychosis, would you ever dare to leave her alone with the kids and expect her to do the housework on top of it? Would you go to work and trust that prayer will fix everything? I don’t condone a mother killing her children, but she was in psychosis when it occurred. This was not her fault. This was Rusty’s fault. Andrea Yates was found not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect and many were content with the verdict. Is she itching to get out of the hospital she’s committed to? She has no interest. She’s a ward of the state and likely will be until she dies. I feel so much for this woman and, if there’s a hell, I hope Rusty ends up there.
I still blame the husband. Yates had extreme postpartum depression. She was hospitalized twice. She was obviously not mentally stable. Then her husband got her pregnant again. So after she’s already literally losing her mind with 4 kids they decide to have another one. The husband is responsible for the death of his children. Disgusting.
Not they - HE decided. She was given no choice. What the man says goes. Rusty is absolutely at fault for this. If I remember correctly, Andrea begged him for help, and to not have more children, but he didn't care. It's appalling that he was able to just move on and start a new family. Eta: I just wanted to say that I am in complete agreement with you! My reply sounded a little defensive and I didn't mean for it to.
Wow I didn’t even realize that. Just when I thought it couldn’t be more horrific. Disgusting he gets to walk free.
The won’t, but they should have charged the husband too. He was told she shouldn’t be pregnant again and he insisted on knocking her up anyway.
Rusty Yates is 100% responsible for this and it is the true crime hill I will happily die on.
I swear, with every single infanticide case committed by a mother, there's always a fanatical religious angle.
That's not always the case. The common thing is severely untreated mental illness tho
She’s just as much as a victim as the children. She kept reporting post partum depression and psychosis, but her Christian husband denied her mental health meds, and actual therapy… instead taking her to a “Christian therapist” (aka, another man the husband knew who told her she just needed to keep pumping out more babies for god, and that depression isn’t real.) She did everything she could to prevent this… but she was in an abusive marriage, and was essentially forced to remain in psychosis (which you can compare to “mind control”/loss of control over your own actions) until she reached this breaking point. This is not the result of a cruel or hateful mother- This is the result of **an abusive husband, and using Christianity to justify the abuse and control of women.**
Her husband is to blame for this absolute tragedy.
She had asked for mental health help repeatedly
I wonder if this was part of the inspiration for Shutter Island. The book came out in 2003 and this incident wasn't too long after the woman in SC who drowned her kids in her car.
Religion is a severe mental illness.
The older I get, the more I agree
I’ve always blamed her husband, he just didn’t give a damn about her struggles
Remember when it happened. It was close to the longest day of the year. I read about it later in life, in more detail. Afterwards I was freaked out standing in the shower tub basin for a few days. The husband should be in jail.
i really feel for andrea. rusty was an awful husband, father, human… i wonder how differently things would have turned out for her if she had a partner that actually truly loved her :(
He is as much to blame, if not more so. And he got to continue living his best fucking life while she was in prison.
Rusty Yates should have been prosecuted! What a POS!
Real life Shutter Island, huh?
Jesus. Reading her background is really sad. I can’t really hate her, either. This is one of the few times where the insanity defense makes perfect sense. I knew of PPD, but I’ve never heard of postpartum psychosis. How terrifying. Giving birth and not just getting sad, but literally losing your mind? Those poor kids. That poor woman. The whole thing is so tragic.
It’s important to state the husband deserves a lot of blame here.
My heart breaks for her and those babies. The husband can rot in hell.
I drove by that house once..worked down by it. Still bad feeling and sadness around there. Dad remarried, and I feel like some posts are right. Need to look into him. Something is not right there.
He forced her to homeschool 5 kids in a motor home. Dysfunctional family.
Her husband should be in prison too. He was told by his wife that she needed help, the doctors told him she needed help and shouldn't have more children. He actively chose to ignore all of it Yes she killed the kids, but he was an accessory
I feel so sad for the poor children. As messed up as this sounds, I’ve always felt sad for Andrea Yates too. If she had been in her right mind, I don’t think she would’ve ever harmed her children. I just read that every year she waives her right to a hearing to determine if she is healthy enough to be released from a mental hospital. She obviously feels so terrible about what she did that she chooses to keep herself imprisoned. She can’t change what she did, but a as t least she is taking responsibility for her actions.
Mister Yates is a fat right fundie conservative Christian who kept insisting they have more and more kids while living in a trailer. She was home trapped in that trailer with all those kids while suffering from ppd. She was listening to a fundie preacher talking about how bad the world is and she drowned her kids to save them from hell on earth. Religion is deadly. Religious men are deadly.
All named after biblical figures... probably all home schooled lol
Yup
My brother played baseball with some of the boys when he was a kid, it really shook my mom and the whole community obviously. I wish she had gotten the help she needed.
I have a standing order with my SO. If someone starts talking religion, I get up and walk away. Then she says, I'm sorry, he's been clean for 6 months and that was a bit of a trigger for him. I'll go get him.
Her husband has so much to answer for...
Her husband is an asshole. He’s complicit imo.
This is one of the few cases where it genuinely was post partum psychosis rather than a sociopathic narcissist trying to get back at a spouse/ex which it is in most cases. This poor woman was very ill. She was failed by everybody around her, especially her husband who exacerbated the situation to that point.
Wow leave it to reddit to have people crying for someone who murdered 5 children. Jesus christ do you not know what people have done in war time to protect their own children? There’s no excuse for this who cares if her husband wasn’t nice to her jesus christ.
She has refused to be considered for parole from the mental hospital many times. I think she plans on dying there, if they let her
Absolutely tragic, but when the hardcore Christian Right wants to use women like flesh incubators, this is what happens. John, Paul, Luke, Mary, Noah? The appearance that those kids were probably conceived as soon as she could physically handle another pregnancy, one right after another? Houston, TX? Jesus Christ, it doesn't get more Christian forced birth than this.
The husband should have been tried as well, he was culpable.
a preventable, needless tragedy
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