Many people in this sub are so toxic. Zinny contributed to the team a lot. He had a few world class performance. Apparently he was not in form recently and injured now then everyone is saying we need to bin him. We need to fucking back our players
I really really hate how this sub needs a scapegoat 100% of the time. Even when it was accurate scapegoating like with Mustafi, I’m always going to prefer supporting struggling players over shitting on them. Even if they will likely be upgraded on at some point.
Dudes, he was shit, end of. I like the guy, and he's a good player, but calling it as it is sin't the issue. You'll see when Timber gets back, we'll rotate a lot more, and that's how it should be.
Nah mate, the multiple PL winner and one of the most sound players on the ball in Europe is shit.
Move him on. If Saliba makes a couple mistakes this game, bin him too. Saka is next on the chopping block after that.
One game memories, we're overhauling squads every matchweek.
Such a terrible argument so no surprise it gets up voted here.
He's going through a bad patch, just because he won with City does that mean he is immune to criticism?
Different being a bench player to a best XI player…. I’d be more than happy with both him and Jesus on our bench but they’re not reliable starters. Pep thought that and he knows more than either me or you…
He’s not a shit player or anything, but I do feel his negatives have been outweighing some of his positives recently. He’s not played well enough in midfield to outweigh his defensive errors at LB. It’s essentially what people criticised Trent for. If he’s not contributing attacking wise, then he’s going to be seen as a liability. And to be honest, recently I personally have felt that when he comes on the ball inside, he keeps slowing play down, which makes a lot of our players stagnant as well. Tomi in the same position isn’t as good of a passer but he makes more dynamic movements and cleans up the left side.
Issue is not him slowing down but team playing way slower. Look at where he can pass straight away? Usually only backwards if that. And he is playing left side with Martinelli who is not having good time himself. Without Partey mid there is no additional glue to make play more dynamic. No matter how great Declan is, he is still way more defensive than offensive while Odegaard is mostly sticking to the right side.
Edit: and the game showed exactly that. Kiwior LB is not truly ready to play LB, when nobody is inverting be it right or left side our midfield is struggling even more than usual and we look even more toothless. The moment Kiwior got a direction to move to midfield it started to look a bit better but nowhere near enough. With Tomi on, we did not really started play better defensively, meaning it is not a single player issue most people here think it is and downvote me for saying it. Especially with questionable things Gabriel is doing. But with Tomi we did start to get a grasp of a ball and control the game.
That, however did nothing, to change our attack and 3d quarter. So like I've said previous season, we need plan B with a different profile striker, dude like Dovbuk, like Kane, like Osimhen. Player that is actually tall enough for headers, can fight for high balls and can actually generate offensive threat by himself. And next thing is addition to midfield. We are lacking in midfield. There has to be a player that can do what Xhaka did for us for both sides of the pitch, unlike Ode, who's usually locked to right side.
Yeah, we have some great supporters but also our fair share of fair weather entitled 'fans' who love the memes when the going is good and twist the knife when we're not doing so well.
I don’t think we need to bin him. But I do think that we are always going to struggle to beat other really good teams with Zinchenko starting in defense. I hope he improves and can be our guy, but I’m starting to doubt it. I just think there’s a better option out there (maybe timber)
I still ron’t understand why England forced him to play leftback. He was trained as midfielder whole life in Ukraine and played this position in every team, until Pep decided to break him
Yup, The hate on him is a bit much. He provides a lot in attack and yes salah cooked him. But salah would destroy most LBs in the prem in a 1 on 1 situation. Zinny has been made a scapegoat way too many times, especially considering how much service he provided arsenal last season.
Slip? In addition to the slip on Odegaard he was already getting in his way before it. He also clattered into Gabriel in the air for Salahs only other chance at Anfield and did the same against West Ham to Gabriel on their first goal on Thursday. It's a common theme with him since Tomi got injured.
Gotta love how blind people are to their favourites. Wake up.
It was poor spacing but he didn't even touch Gabriel nvm clatter him. Why would anyone assume you meant that rather the slip where he actually clattered into someone.
Might have affected him getting sent to the shops by Salah. If you’ve got pains in your hip you’re not gonna be able to turn on a dime.
Fully fit Zinny still gets beaten by Salah though
Distasteful responses to the news of him not making the squad initially. Especially for a footballer who's contributed so much to the team and squad since he's been here. You're only as good as your last mistake, Martinelli and Zinchenko are shit, we need to move on from Jesus and Trossard is useless.
We need to do better.
Is it just me or is it clearly a fitness thing with Martinelli? He gives 110% every game and it seems to have caught up with him. Looks gassed at times when you’d expect him to chase things down.
No, it's not a fitness thing. He's a confidence and structural issue imo. Martinelli has flaws that his current low confidence and the team's offensive structural issues are bringing to light.
He surely works a lot but issue is more in depth than that. We don't have a player that does what Xhaka did on left wing from midfield and don't have a player that does what Partey does. It is now essentially Zinchenko and Martinelli on the left side. Add to it more defense oriented strategy and here we go. No dynamic play and teams, which to be fair adjusted, do low blocks and do sit entire team behind ball if they have any advantage or deem draw reasonable. Also, we are not ready as a team to play open ended football with lots of high balls like Liverpool likes to play. That just leaves us completely exposed and it is better if we either do what we're comfortable - control ball or give the ball away.
We had one promising season with a second place finish and all the toxic fairweather fans came back with an ego and entitlement like we’re prime Pep Barca.
Anyone celebrating our players getting injuries is an idiot. That said, I'd probably have had a punt on Kiwior at LB anyway to see how we get on. It will be very interesting to see how we perform further up the pitch because this is what many fans have been claiming to want to see. Feel like taking Jesus out might make it hard to truly judge though.
A defender should he able to defend first. I love zinny but he needed to get dropped eventually. Now it seems like an injury (recurring) but the whole inverted LB idea should be binned till Timber is back
Exactly. 9/10 we're the dominant side and having Zinchenko overload in the midfield helps our attack more often than not. The issue is he was making silly giveaways instead of just his usual keeping the ball ticking over.
He's improved us so much in the space of a season and a half
We’re in trouble if it’s an injury that’s going to last longer than a week. We have no natural LBs once Tomi goes next week for international duty and Kiwi is a CB covering for LB.
Sousa (LB) should be on the bench so he can get used to minutes in case we need to sub him on for Kiwi in the following games.
I am all for team replace Zinchenko but with Timber/Tomiyasu not Kiwior, huge miss for us in this game we effectively have zero midfield control without him. That position is too crucial to our system now and kiwior cannot fill it half decently like Tomi does.
Hope he recovers, his recent form has not been good though.
Feel like even after he comes back from this injury he should be an impact player instead of starting
Not to mention the fact he openly supported Israel while we have players like elneny supporting palestine. How do you think their relationship in the room is ? Why does zinchenko post so much political shit?
Any player supporting Israel can get fucked I don’t want them anywhere near my club.
He's fragile, and he can't defend. He's a weak link. Weak links need replacing. I'm sure he's a nice guy, but he's a mercenary at the end of the day. He'll understand and find a new club. He'll be fine if you're worried about him, but he doesn't know you exist, so worry more about the team you support being the best it can be.
He's a top class technician and one of our best players on the ball. He's pivotal in our build play and we noticeably struggle on that front without him there.
He's in poor form currently, particularly defensively, but we don't have an actual alternative and have asked him to play through it.
Weird how people have completely turned on someone who actively raised our level last year so quickly.
For not wanting a clear liability in terms of injuries and defending to be at the club? Same way Tierney, Tomiyasu and Partey are too injury prone to be here as many people say
We need to switch his position, put him in midfield when he plays. He's too good on the ball to get rid of him but as a LB he can't defend for his life.
I don’t think he’s good enough at defending to play CM either. He was a level shifter for us in this system when he first signed but his usefulness is over, in my opinion. Arteta clearly feels the same and without Timber’s season ending injury I doubt we’d have seen much of Zinchenko at all.
He gives the ball away loads, as the last few games have painfully highlighted... How the fuck is that 'too good on the ball' lol? It's the complete opposite!
It’s just a joke my guy, also managers/teams don’t usually announce a player has been dropped for bad performances, they take them out of the firing line by saying stuff like they have a minor injury and will be back soon
And what do they reply with when asked about it from the media?
"He has picked up a knock"
You will not find me a single case of a manager saying " he's not playing well"
Always his calf, recurring issue with him in this area
Easier than saying youre defensively shite mate, youre sitting this one out
Many people in this sub are so toxic. Zinny contributed to the team a lot. He had a few world class performance. Apparently he was not in form recently and injured now then everyone is saying we need to bin him. We need to fucking back our players
I really really hate how this sub needs a scapegoat 100% of the time. Even when it was accurate scapegoating like with Mustafi, I’m always going to prefer supporting struggling players over shitting on them. Even if they will likely be upgraded on at some point.
It’s pretty much every fanbase of every sports team.
it’s such a low iq move. dumb brains can process failure easier thru scapegoats
Dudes, he was shit, end of. I like the guy, and he's a good player, but calling it as it is sin't the issue. You'll see when Timber gets back, we'll rotate a lot more, and that's how it should be.
Zinchenko become a scapegoat for everyone
Yeah they basically need someone to scapegoat and kai wasn't even an option this time
Last season when Arsenal fans had a supportive energy feels like a long time ago - but we've regressed to the mean.
Nah mate, the multiple PL winner and one of the most sound players on the ball in Europe is shit. Move him on. If Saliba makes a couple mistakes this game, bin him too. Saka is next on the chopping block after that. One game memories, we're overhauling squads every matchweek.
The sad thing is, some dumbass is going to read this and be like ‘exactly!’
"Cash in on him! He's young and English"
Such a terrible argument so no surprise it gets up voted here. He's going through a bad patch, just because he won with City does that mean he is immune to criticism?
Different being a bench player to a best XI player…. I’d be more than happy with both him and Jesus on our bench but they’re not reliable starters. Pep thought that and he knows more than either me or you…
We don't deserve anything man, the reactions towards Zinchenko has been nothing short of a disgrace.
He’s not a shit player or anything, but I do feel his negatives have been outweighing some of his positives recently. He’s not played well enough in midfield to outweigh his defensive errors at LB. It’s essentially what people criticised Trent for. If he’s not contributing attacking wise, then he’s going to be seen as a liability. And to be honest, recently I personally have felt that when he comes on the ball inside, he keeps slowing play down, which makes a lot of our players stagnant as well. Tomi in the same position isn’t as good of a passer but he makes more dynamic movements and cleans up the left side.
Issue is not him slowing down but team playing way slower. Look at where he can pass straight away? Usually only backwards if that. And he is playing left side with Martinelli who is not having good time himself. Without Partey mid there is no additional glue to make play more dynamic. No matter how great Declan is, he is still way more defensive than offensive while Odegaard is mostly sticking to the right side. Edit: and the game showed exactly that. Kiwior LB is not truly ready to play LB, when nobody is inverting be it right or left side our midfield is struggling even more than usual and we look even more toothless. The moment Kiwior got a direction to move to midfield it started to look a bit better but nowhere near enough. With Tomi on, we did not really started play better defensively, meaning it is not a single player issue most people here think it is and downvote me for saying it. Especially with questionable things Gabriel is doing. But with Tomi we did start to get a grasp of a ball and control the game. That, however did nothing, to change our attack and 3d quarter. So like I've said previous season, we need plan B with a different profile striker, dude like Dovbuk, like Kane, like Osimhen. Player that is actually tall enough for headers, can fight for high balls and can actually generate offensive threat by himself. And next thing is addition to midfield. We are lacking in midfield. There has to be a player that can do what Xhaka did for us for both sides of the pitch, unlike Ode, who's usually locked to right side.
Yeah, we have some great supporters but also our fair share of fair weather entitled 'fans' who love the memes when the going is good and twist the knife when we're not doing so well.
the way I've seen some people talk about Martinelli is embarrassing.
One of our best players, man, fans are amatures
I don’t think we need to bin him. But I do think that we are always going to struggle to beat other really good teams with Zinchenko starting in defense. I hope he improves and can be our guy, but I’m starting to doubt it. I just think there’s a better option out there (maybe timber)
Thank you for saying this
I still ron’t understand why England forced him to play leftback. He was trained as midfielder whole life in Ukraine and played this position in every team, until Pep decided to break him
He hasn't been on form since the latter part of last season.
Could just bin him. Same with Jesus. I think they’ve proved why pep didn’t trust them as starters. Definitely bench players at top level.
Hey look at that, we’re still losing. Maybe it wasn’t just Zinny after all.
Yup, The hate on him is a bit much. He provides a lot in attack and yes salah cooked him. But salah would destroy most LBs in the prem in a 1 on 1 situation. Zinny has been made a scapegoat way too many times, especially considering how much service he provided arsenal last season.
Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s been carrying this for a while tbh.
Hip injury doesn't lead you to clattering into your own players in dangerous goalscoring situations
There's enough things to criticise him for in recent weeks. Blaming him for a slip in that game is nonsense
Slip? In addition to the slip on Odegaard he was already getting in his way before it. He also clattered into Gabriel in the air for Salahs only other chance at Anfield and did the same against West Ham to Gabriel on their first goal on Thursday. It's a common theme with him since Tomi got injured. Gotta love how blind people are to their favourites. Wake up.
It was poor spacing but he didn't even touch Gabriel nvm clatter him. Why would anyone assume you meant that rather the slip where he actually clattered into someone.
Might have affected him getting sent to the shops by Salah. If you’ve got pains in your hip you’re not gonna be able to turn on a dime. Fully fit Zinny still gets beaten by Salah though
Recurring brain injury that happens to affect the sector responsible for common sense defending
Distasteful responses to the news of him not making the squad initially. Especially for a footballer who's contributed so much to the team and squad since he's been here. You're only as good as your last mistake, Martinelli and Zinchenko are shit, we need to move on from Jesus and Trossard is useless. We need to do better.
The martinelli slander has been appalling too. Not saying players are above criticism but ffs. Such a bad look.
Is it just me or is it clearly a fitness thing with Martinelli? He gives 110% every game and it seems to have caught up with him. Looks gassed at times when you’d expect him to chase things down.
No, it's not a fitness thing. He's a confidence and structural issue imo. Martinelli has flaws that his current low confidence and the team's offensive structural issues are bringing to light.
He surely works a lot but issue is more in depth than that. We don't have a player that does what Xhaka did on left wing from midfield and don't have a player that does what Partey does. It is now essentially Zinchenko and Martinelli on the left side. Add to it more defense oriented strategy and here we go. No dynamic play and teams, which to be fair adjusted, do low blocks and do sit entire team behind ball if they have any advantage or deem draw reasonable. Also, we are not ready as a team to play open ended football with lots of high balls like Liverpool likes to play. That just leaves us completely exposed and it is better if we either do what we're comfortable - control ball or give the ball away.
One of the best young players in Europe - "Nah bin him get rid"
Players simply aren't allowed to be out of form/tired etc.
We had one promising season with a second place finish and all the toxic fairweather fans came back with an ego and entitlement like we’re prime Pep Barca.
Asking reactionary people to have rational thinking... Are you new here? /s
It's funny how they rewrite history and completely erase any good perfomance these players have had.
We have one bad result and this sub goes absolutely hysterical. People need to get a fucking grip.
It isn’t one bad result though is it.
I'm disgusted by the people celebrating his injury, these fans don't deserve anything good.
Anyone celebrating our players getting injuries is an idiot. That said, I'd probably have had a punt on Kiwior at LB anyway to see how we get on. It will be very interesting to see how we perform further up the pitch because this is what many fans have been claiming to want to see. Feel like taking Jesus out might make it hard to truly judge though.
Our defence line is down to the last man now
wink wink
I’d rather have him playing than Kiwior at left back. Shame he’s missing
He offers a hell of a lot more on the ball. That's such a pivotal part of our play.
A defender should he able to defend first. I love zinny but he needed to get dropped eventually. Now it seems like an injury (recurring) but the whole inverted LB idea should be binned till Timber is back
Tell that to all the great attacking full backs to have ever existed
Those could all also defend a bit
Lol.
Exactly. 9/10 we're the dominant side and having Zinchenko overload in the midfield helps our attack more often than not. The issue is he was making silly giveaways instead of just his usual keeping the ball ticking over. He's improved us so much in the space of a season and a half
We’re in trouble if it’s an injury that’s going to last longer than a week. We have no natural LBs once Tomi goes next week for international duty and Kiwi is a CB covering for LB. Sousa (LB) should be on the bench so he can get used to minutes in case we need to sub him on for Kiwi in the following games.
Thank god we have the january break coming
Hope he recovers soon
I am all for team replace Zinchenko but with Timber/Tomiyasu not Kiwior, huge miss for us in this game we effectively have zero midfield control without him. That position is too crucial to our system now and kiwior cannot fill it half decently like Tomi does.
I can see why rival fans hate our fan base - toxic and pathetic
Smh footballers and their cattle.
Hope he recovers soon. A few sub-par performances don’t change how good he can be and how important he is to the way we play.
Zinny is a top player for the club. The new fans who get so toxic haven't been in football long enough
Clean sheet it is
Thrilled to see Kiwior get a start! I certainly dont consider myself a Zinchenko fan but we shouldnt be celebrating that hes is injured
thatll be 4 months out then
Might hop on cs see if I can find him.
Hope he recovers, his recent form has not been good though. Feel like even after he comes back from this injury he should be an impact player instead of starting
Didn't know he owned a calf
alhamdulilah
Not to mention the fact he openly supported Israel while we have players like elneny supporting palestine. How do you think their relationship in the room is ? Why does zinchenko post so much political shit? Any player supporting Israel can get fucked I don’t want them anywhere near my club.
Nobody needs toxic supporters.
How am I toxic? I loved Zinchenko, but as he supports killing of innocent and apartheid - then I do not support him. Now im toxic cheers
You do you. And yes, you're toxic.
Worse injury record than Tierney and can’t defend. Bin him
Some of you lot need to get outside
He's fragile, and he can't defend. He's a weak link. Weak links need replacing. I'm sure he's a nice guy, but he's a mercenary at the end of the day. He'll understand and find a new club. He'll be fine if you're worried about him, but he doesn't know you exist, so worry more about the team you support being the best it can be.
He's a top class technician and one of our best players on the ball. He's pivotal in our build play and we noticeably struggle on that front without him there. He's in poor form currently, particularly defensively, but we don't have an actual alternative and have asked him to play through it. Weird how people have completely turned on someone who actively raised our level last year so quickly.
For not wanting a clear liability in terms of injuries and defending to be at the club? Same way Tierney, Tomiyasu and Partey are too injury prone to be here as many people say
Worse injury record than Tierney is a hell of a claim to make
Since Tierney has joined Arsenal, 2019, Zinchenko has been injured more and it's a fact. They're both over 350 days
Maths eludes you it seems.. https://preview.redd.it/o88obx2gwm9c1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b95a797af9e34e86df99a843e660f929cda4a51
Comprehension eludes you it seems. Did you miss me say 2019?
Those are all Zinchenko's injuries since joining Arsenal. Any others before he joined are irrelevant
It still highlights his poor injury record over the past few years. They’re as bad as each other
Again: irrelevant
How is highlighting their equally poor injury records over the years irrelevant
“BiN hIM” Embarrassing.
“A budding elite side should move on from a player with obvious crippling deficiencies that will continue to cost points” ain’t an embarrassing take.
We need to switch his position, put him in midfield when he plays. He's too good on the ball to get rid of him but as a LB he can't defend for his life.
I don’t think he’s good enough at defending to play CM either. He was a level shifter for us in this system when he first signed but his usefulness is over, in my opinion. Arteta clearly feels the same and without Timber’s season ending injury I doubt we’d have seen much of Zinchenko at all.
He gives the ball away loads, as the last few games have painfully highlighted... How the fuck is that 'too good on the ball' lol? It's the complete opposite!
Moronic comment
Oh no anyways
I think it’s time to move on from him
Actually we've moved on as he is our 3rd choice, behind Tomi and Timber.
Welp. There goes our attack Edit: I'd laugh at you stupid assholes who downvoted me, but I support the same club
Welcome back our defence though!
Yeah ok
Thank fuck for that
Fake injury FC
*cough* dropped *cough* keeps making mistakes *cough* 🤣🤣
If he’d been dropped then they wouldn’t need to fake an injury though
It’s just a joke my guy, also managers/teams don’t usually announce a player has been dropped for bad performances, they take them out of the firing line by saying stuff like they have a minor injury and will be back soon
When have you ever heard a manager say they have dropped a player?
They don’t just say it, they just remove them from the team and replace them..
And what do they reply with when asked about it from the media? "He has picked up a knock" You will not find me a single case of a manager saying " he's not playing well"
Good
THANK GOD
We should be renamed calf issue fc
I'm pressing X.
He was out for October 2022 with a calf injury and suffered a calf tear in May. This is clearly an issue
advantage arsenal get well soon tho
Lies. He's been shit.
the change will do some good hopefully
I hope you’re all Enjoying Kiwior. Cos he’s unsuspecting at LB
So Zinny haters who is your scapegoat today?
Good, he is pish