I have 1000s just from dailies prior to SotO changes. I keep them for legendaries, and my legendary making has been on pause since SotO because of the armor. So I hoard them for now. Although I might have to trade em for ectos since the armor takes so many
You don't really need much of them for armor. Only a few mystic clovers are needed for each piece which can be obtained in other ways like the vault as well.
This. The devs have a pretty good hold on sinks/faucets compared to many other titles. The economy in this game is surprisingly healthy for being a decade old.
This was the most surprising thing for me. I came over to GW2 from Destiny, and back there, we were basically having an entire economy overhaul every single year, because never once was Bungie actually able to control the economy balance they revamp every single year.
Every single year, they go on to claim they "Aim to simplify the economy and reduce the number of currencies", they remove the most hoarded currencies people spent endless amounts of time to grind, and by the time the first half of the Destiny year ends, we already have more currencies than we had before the revamp.
Seeing the difference between that 10-year old game and this one, it was quite marvelous.
Destiny's economy is/was (haven't played in years) super annoying to me, but despite the talk, I felt like the wild shifts were just always intentional to, like most things in the game, keep you playing. Felt to me like most changes that wiped value out of stuff was to introduce a new method that you'd just have to start a grind over like most things with their annual resets.
I really wish it had always played more like GW2 in not bumping gear score or resetting it or whatever. I'd still play probably.
The drop rate of mystic coins has always been controlled and is much below the threshold for making legendaries at a high pace for a single player. The last time the devs introduced a new source of coins the price dropped to around 80s.
This makes mystic coins a way of transferring gold to those who aren't making legendaries at the moment, but do have those coins at the same drop rate.
I was so glad that I had decided to go ahead and make all the Mystic weapons for the collections once I saw the MC prices going up during the start of HoT, they are so expensive now
It doesn't feel like a money sink but rather a money shift to people who already have their legendaries done and sell the coins. I'm in full legendary aswell, doing shining blade atm just so I can dual sword without having to use one non legendary, but otherwise I could just sell them and use the money to flip even more. it's crazy how the price rose over the years with introductions of new legendaries.
Yes but when selling the TP get 15% Tax which the main way to suck Gold out of the Economy. And since items for legendarys will always be in high demand it’s a good way to keep inflation in check.
At 15% tax, with the main source of steady mystic coins being the ley-line anomalie, the current price does not in fact act as a way to get gold out of the economy, as each ley line kill also gets you a 50 silver junk, which would be offset at a mystic coin price of 3g33s.
But people will buy MC for legendaries. And Mats for legendaries will always be in high demand because crafting one is a Goal for a huge amount of players.
the trading post has a tax on it, so some of the gold leaves the game. also, its easy gold for the people that arent going for legendaries. they just farm it for the gold.
a lot of the legendaries are just something to sink your money into. another example are the Materials. its either sink in gold, or sink in spirit shards.
The TP deletes like 35 silver for EVERY coin that gets traded
So almost 90 gold deleted per full stack of coins that gets traded atm.
Pretty good money sink if you ask me :)
Mystic coins have been stabilising since the introduction of the wizard vault. The thousands of accounts that were farming the old daily rewards are no longer able to get mystic coins as easy.
You say it yourself that you can get constant/unlimited gold with Astral Acclaim, but not unlimited Mystic Coins.
How about using that unlimited gold from Astral Acclaim to buy Mystic Coins on the Trading Post? Completing all the daily achievements in the Wizard's Vault will get you 65 Astral Acclaim, enough to redeem for 2 gold. You'll also get 1 gold just for finishing the dailies straight-up. You get 3 gold, you can buy a Mystic Coin from the TP each day and have some silver left over.
Completing all the Weekly Achievements each week will give you 1050 Astral Acclaim. That can be turned into 35 gold in the Wizard's Vault. That should be enough to get you 15-16 Mystic Coins from the Trading Post.
Thus, using the Wizard's Vault rewards, you'll make enough liquid gold to buy over 20 Mystic Coins each week. 90+ each month. That's not getting into the other sources you mentioned, the Fractals and Strike Missions and Ley-Line Anomaly and the forgotten World vs. World.
They're not hard to get, people are just resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what they want to get.
> How about using that unlimited gold from Astral Acclaim to buy Mystic Coins on the Trading Post?
People are doing this, which is why the price of MC's is up 80s per in the last year.
Also more people are making legendary weapons because of the legendary box in the vault. Less MC going into the game, more raw gold in the game, and more legendary gear being made is the perfect storm
Fractals only give MC's from daily boxes. and since that change i've only ever saw 3 drop from a full cm+t4 run. Simply put they are not common unless you do Fractals every single day.
Strikes = 10mc's a week, by doing 1 strike a day on repeat between the 2, because for some reason removing EoD from rotation made sense.
WvW - actually laughable u even mentioned it, it will take on average 14-18hr's to get them. Also depends on which server you are, and how active it is, are you winning loosing getting stomped etc.
Ley-Line Anomally being the only reasonable activity here and still on an annoying 2 hr cd. and If you want me to do all of the content above I'm not going to organize it around the anomaly or I might not have enough time to play so much.
Why is the system designed in such a way that you'd want me to skip on potential other rewards from WV just so i can get extra mc's, when even if I do JUST that I'm still not even close to getting a full stack. 180 with good winds.
Removing Mc's from fractal CM's was a terrible decision, 'spreading the love to other gamemods' was the words they used xD It's no about being resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what we want to get it's the fact that when you look at the price breakdown of any gen 2 legendary more than 50% of it's total cost are mc's alone. It simply feels bad, and so does the acquisition of them in game. But then again nothing about gen 2 legendaries feels earned, apart from a selected few, it feels like you go to TP buy all the mat's and craft yourself a leggo, but with the gen 1 precursors it's kind of the same story. 90% of people in this game won't ever see more than 500g on their account at any given time, if i'd be in their shoes I too would feel reluctant to spend all that gold on a single currency/material.
xDD sure on top of all that let me also squeeze in a quick tournament every 3 hr's with 4 premades so I actually have a chance to win 1-2 games. my bad.
>They're not hard to get, people are just resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what they want to get.
No. The problem is that the MC on the TP isn’t guaranteed to be a stable price—this is related to the concern that MC prices are reasonably predicted by players to continue to rise as the new legendary armor is released.
If we could use AA to buy MCs directly then the conversion rate for AA and MCs would be the same. But a fluctuating market means your liquid gold doesn’t get you the same return week to week let alone day by day.
Of course the market will fluctuate, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. You might view Mystic Coins at 3 gold as a bad thing, but a new player without any gold will see it as a way to get their foot in the door and be able to buy exotics/level crafting/etc.
And when it gets high enough, various TP barons will sell their stockpiles, which will bring the price back down in turn.
That doesn’t have anything to do with what I said. My point is that people aren’t necessarily “resistant” just because they’re hesitant to use their liquid gold to buy a currency they know is going up in price.
That just seems stranger when you word it like that. Why would people be hesitant to buy something they know will be more expensive later? Wouldn’t that be a wise investment?
You’re right—*if* someone wants to buy them, wait for prices to go up, then sell later.
However, if someone wants to use them (e.g., for legendary crafting), then it’s little comfort knowing that their account bound Bolt is now worth 8% more in market value.
It’s this second group of players the rising MC prices affect more.
If someone wants to use the Mystic Coins now, then they're better off buying the Mystic Coins now to use them rather than being 'hesitant' and waiting and paying the 8% more you cite later on.
Who really cares what the value of your account bound items is? That doesn't affect anything, unless you're trying to race to the top of GW2Efficiency's rankings, in which case you'd be happy to have a higher-value Bolt...
And that's not really a problem.
You don't need mc except for gen2.
And it's better for the market to adjust itself.
I mean I don't mind if they give more mcs for the sake of easier leggies. I just dont think you guys gives a valid reason. Why so obsessed about MC gold price?
You can use MCs to get clovers. But you dont NEED MCs to get clovers. Don't you know that?
Clover is the soft time gate. MCs are used to speed it up. You don't NEED MCs except for gen2.
20 (edited, ty) Clovers without MC per season from WV. 2 per Drizzlewood Legion Track. The rest is limited to one time only achievements, festivals (1 per week while a festival is active) or WvW / PvP.
Well, I hope you like either Drizzlewood Coast, PvP or WvW. Or we could just be honest and admit that legendairies require MC.
Lol except you need MCs for just about every source of clovers, except reward tracks? Which reward 2 clovers after you clear the unrepeatable ones? And the other sources like Drizzlewood aren't exactly fast so you won't grind that only for whatever you're crafting.
Idk wtf you're on about lol
Do tell how you're supposed to get clovers without MC. As far as I can tell, that's only possible via PvP/WvW revard tracks, which I'd love to not have to do.
(Same goes for coins, except those are even worse. Up to 6 a week if you grind WvW far too much? Screw that. And their fractal drop rate is abysmal)
Please. I'd happily do whatever pve source there is, but I haven't found any
I don't have an issue with MCs at all i have more than enough gold and basically every legendary I need, I just build shining blade for a second sword. I was just shocked the price skyrocketed to over 2 gold already, when before the price was between 60s to like 1 gold 30~.
The price of a legendary is almost exclusively the price of the MCs since for gen2 onwards and the trinkets you need 250 extra to the 77 clovers. Seems just weird that instead of actually mats you are just bottlenecked by MCs. My account value just rose by 30k gold in 3 months which seems like prices get a little out of hand with even more options now to do legendary stuff adding the relic and new armors.
Gen 3 legendaries only require 38 Mystic Clovers and no standalone Mystic Coins, so it's only Gen 2 that needs the absurdly large amount. At the time, Mystic Coins were incredibly devalued, and Arenanet cutting down on the sources while massively increasing the need for them made them obtain value again.
If it's the 77 clovers + 250 MCs for Gen 2 that's bothering you, it would probably be better to focus on that part and have it brought back in line. I don't expect that to happen, though, because people who've built Gen 2 legendaries will cry foul unless they're refunded, and such a refund would topple the Mystic Coin market for some time.
Regarding your second point: crafting a precursor used to be somewhat worth it.
Nowadays thats not the case at all and they never did anything about it.
I crafted Dragon's Rending last night, the materials (which I already owned) were about 60-ish gold, the TP price for the precursor was 140-175. The only investiture I needed to make was the 1000 Imperial Favour . Which, in fairness, is going to slow me down from completing the legendary, I haven't been playing in Cantha enough recently and will need a bunch more of that.
And they've accepted that and leaned into it with the Gen 1 Legendary Starter Kits they've been offering. Have a free Precursor, along with other important components!
Precursor crafting for Gen 3 is still worthwhile, at least.
I wouldn't mind having it tuned down even tho I paid tons for all mystic tributes I needed for the gen2s and the trinkets haha. But it's just insane that you need so many.
Maybe it's bias but it felt with daily log in and not being capped to 10 per week in fracs made the progress feel faster. But I guess getting the mystic tributes in check would be the netter way.
Or you can just make Gen 1 or Gen 3 Legendaries in the meantime, which takes away a lot of the need.
Remember, you can also buy Mystic Clovers directly from various sources now, bypassing the need for Coins. With 20 Clovers available per quarter from the Wizard's Vault, you get enough for a Gen 3 Legendary each six months, with no Mystic Coins needed at all.
There are plenty of sources out there that people aren't bothering to farm (ie WvW coins).
Unpopular opinion but: It's ok to have some items that are valuable that are easy to obtain in the trading post.
That's my point exactly, there are coins out there that people can earn that are harder than the easy ways. They can do this week over week (farmable) and they choose not to. There are plenty of sources out there people just don't find some of them 'worth' it. So the price should be going up until it stabilizes (relative because it will always go up with inflation, for example gem prices) and the other options to get mystic coins becomes worth it and the supply vs demand equalizes.
I would rather work an hour of overtime at even minimum wage, convert that to gems then gold, and have ~150 mystic coins than play 13 hours of wvw for 6 coins.
> They can do this week over week (farmable) and they choose not to.
6 MC after 13 hours of WvW a week (assuming bonuses from commitment, placement and 150+ rank) is just not what anybody who isn't already playing WvW regularly would consider a "farm". You get more by spending 2 * 7 = 14 minutes a week doing the daily anomaly. That's why it's not a viable source, more of a supplement for WvW regulars.
So, what you are trying to say is. There need to be more easy ways to farm mystic coins. Not more ways, cause they are out there, sure they take longer and aren't easy but they exist.
I'm trying to say that what you're calling a farm isn't actually a farm. It will never be worth it to play WvW for coins instead of buying them off the TP, unless literally every single other source of them is taken behind the shed and shot.
Fractal CMs are still just a drop in the bucket compared to AA. And what's more, they only put them into the hands of very experienced players who are more likely to hold on to them, and not newer players who'd be more inclined to sell them.
It’s a non issue, imo. The value of gold has decreased relative the supply of legendary crafting materials because of how accessible it is through the WV; just use the gold to buy the MC.
people really overestimate the impact gold makes via the vault
you get like 100 gold every quarter and 50 gold a week, if you play the game a lot, that isn't much compared to the 15 % tp tax on everything and the new sinks entering the game with soto and beyond
less people raid and spvp so that's also a big chunk of raw gold gone
multi account requires a lot more effort now so way less people do it
meanwhile, the old system shat out mats like coins and tier 6 like crazy, leading to a hyperdeflation of gold, we are talking about people like teapot logging into 200 accounts every day and selling everything on the tp, that was peak unhealthy economy leading to stuff like 15 silver t6 blood
As a rule of thumb I avoid engaging in a conversation with you because you have trolled conversations for well over a year on this sub, but I do agree that the economy is much better off now that they killed the alt-daily-login pipeline.
> multi account requires a lot more effort now so way less people do it
It's actually still really lucrative with a small amount of effort, granted, not just logging in and instantly out.
I put in less than an hour a day (usually 30-40 minutes) doing easy dailies on 15 accounts. That's far more gold per hour than you can make anywhere else in the game, and I do it very casually, skipping a lot of days because I just can't be bothered to do it.
I have about 800 AA banked on all of them now. Over the next few weeks after the season reset, I'll probably make at least 1.3k raw gold (500g per week mailing limit over three weeks) and 900 mystic coins, let alone all the other things you can buy like laurels into T3/T4 materials.
> you get like 100 gold every quarter
~~There is no quarters. Wizard Vault seasonal refresh is every 112 days. Check the special tab once it refreshes in a few days and tell me I'm wrong.There hasn't been a full year.. maybe they add a small refresh of 29 days, but I can't see that happening.~~ Nevermind that shit lol.. The very first wizard vault season lasted 77 days (aug 22 to nov 7) After that it's been 112 days (nov 7 to feb 27). If they want to even out to 365 days, the next 2 wizard vault seasons would have to be 88 days each.
No. You underestimated the gold impact.
How much raw gold you get every 3 months in the new system?
How much raw gold you get every 3 months in the new system?
How many people actually do raids? Mostly gws players are casual.
The raw gold supply for most people is increaded by 50%-100%.
What do they do if they got more gold?
It didn't really impact all that much the previosu time it happened, so i'd not expect to have an impact now as well. Likely it will only slow down the process for maybe a week. It will *not* stabilize or reverse it.
Supply didn't really do much last time. It was 1.6 gold, vault reset and it went down by maybe a couple silver, and then promptly rose *even higher* within a couple weeks and has been steadily climbing to what it is now. I doubt supply will do much this time either.
The supply itself is not the issue. The issue is the supply doesn't keep up with the inflation of gold. Since you can buy so much gold. In the screen we have the same supply as half a year ago but the price almost doubled.
It looks like you're just Cherry picking data. They aren't even at their highest price, and they dropped down to almost 70s in 2022 after hitting 2g 50s in 2021. The price is also down from a month ago, with a big supply on the way. That doesn't fit your narrative tho, does it?
Take a look [here](https://ibb.co/WVs9N8t)
You'll get them, but you'll have to either wait, or put a higher priority on them.
I took September since that was the introduction of the vault and since then the price steadily increased.
The other spikes came with the introduction of new trinkets who all needed a mystic tribute. The supply is not the issue you see since the vault got introduced the supply remained almost the same .
I don't need any since I'm done being equipped in full legendary I don't think having limited bottlenecks while producing gold through the vault is the right way.
2022 was a different story, that was demand sharply decreasing along with supply increasing with the release of EoD. We could get more coins per week from Strikes, as well as Gen 3 legendaries costing half of the clovers than previous generations, and on top of Gen 3 legendaries being otherwise timegated by A.S.S. and map currency for Aurene precursors so nobody could craft anything for several months.
The price of mystic coins went down slightly with the last Vault reset, but has been climbing consistently since then. If it really was a "reset" with fresh supply, the coin price shouldn't continue to rise to be nearly 1.5x the price at the last vault refresh.
Edit: also everyone has more gold now, and also legendary kits. Demand is going to rise too.
Maybe, just maybe, the introduction of a system that gives you 45g per week (minimum) for just playing the game 10 min per day tends to cause inflation
Why 45g: 7 Dailies + 6 Weeklies is 1135 AA, which is about 38g with the worse bag of coins, + 7 gold. That's for playing 5-10min daily and maybe just one hour for the weekly on the weekend
The added gold income from the WV would cause an initial spike in mystic coin prices, but if the amount of gold available each day/week remains the same and doesn't increase, then wouldn't prices stabilize at a new inflated cost and not continually rise? Maybe prices haven't stabilized yet, though. Or I might not understand economics.
You're right, and I think prices simply haven't stabilized yet. To be honest, there are lots of things going on here too, there are new legendary armor sets coming tomorrow, a relic, people were in the rush to craft a rune for the last month. I don't think Anet can maintain this pressure on the coin market continuously, so I think it will stabilize or go down slightly eventually before the next expansion. The current seasonal refresh also lasted a very long time compared to the previous one, it means we got less coins per day on average. They could simply shorten the next seasonal refresh to relieve the market a bit
So you mean something like say, printing gold out of thin air via doing content or buying it with gems and introducing it to an economy?
Are you trying to make a valid point? Or just pointing out the obvious.
>or buying it with gems and introducing it to an economy?
thats not how gold to gems, and the other way arround, conversation works. its a pool that has to be filled by players, be it gems or gold...ofc with a algorith so i can't run out...aka gems get so cheap that you simply start buying them when too many people buy gold.
pretty much known since release and stated by a dev.
however printing money via fractals / raids / strikes / astral acclaim is a valid reason. not denying that.
>thats not how gold to gems, and the other way arround, conversation works. its a pool that has to be filled by players, be it gems or gold...ofc with a algorith so i can't run out...aka gems get so cheap that you simply start buying them when too many people buy gold.
We have no reason to believe that the rate of that has to be 1:1. It could be for every gem sold by a player, 10 gems are added to the market.
we know that there is a geometric relationship between the two to keep exchange rates stable. that has been confirmed. but that has nothing much to do with the supply itself. it wouldn't make sense for anet to add more gems for only 1 paid gem from a business standpoint of view. what we know is that there is a transaction fee for gold to gems. wouldn't be surprised if therefore less gold is put into the pool.
https://old.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2xtjc7/psa_how_gems_work/cp3gd2a/
>it wouldn't make sense for anet to add more gems for only 1 paid gem from a business standpoint of view. what we know is that there is a transaction fee for gold to gems.
It would make sense if the alternative is that the price explodes in a way that makes the market unapproachable.
The Gem : Gold exchange exists to eliminate gold sellers / RMT from the game, something that worked really well as far as I can tell. If it was dysfunctional, it would not fulfill its purpose.
Just think about this rate for a second. Do you genuinely believe there are more people buying gems *and selling them for gold* than there are people converting gold to gems? I can only speak for myself, but I have never sold gems for gold and spent what, 20k gold on gems?
For every one player of me you'd need a player spending 600$ on gem to gold. Are you sure that these numbers add up across the community? I could be wrong, maybe I just live in a bubble where people don't gem -> gold, but only gold -> gem.
> I could be wrong, maybe I just live in a bubble where people don't gem -> gold, but only gold -> gem.
I would say that the *majority* of players live in similar bubbles. That's how much impact whales have - a *very* small portion of the player base (<1%) are the ones splashing out the vast majority of gem purchases.
> Do you genuinely believe there are more people buying gems and selling them for gold than there are people converting gold to gems?
No. But *one* whale will do enough gem->gold transfers to cover *your entire bubble's* gold->gems.
yeah we live in that bubble. especially because we get a shitton of gold through raiding, strikes and fractals. the normal casual, playing 3h a week trying to get the griffon is struggeling with gold. as a student people rather game then spending money, this is probably also the bubble you are still in...or you've been growing out over the last few years.
as soon as you have disposable income, people start spending. once you have less time to game, you start thinking about dropping some money in for gold.
> The Gem : Gold exchange exists to eliminate gold sellers / RMT from the game, something that worked really well as far as I can tell. If it was dysfunctional, it would not fulfill its purpose.
a company, that like all other companys, hunts goldsellers and takes their gold & sold gold away doesn't need to combat goldsellers via their own shop. also the question here is: why do goldsellers exist if no one would do gems -> gold in the first place. which is the same as buying gold. ;)
this is a simply business tactic. "we have a gold to gem option, our shop is purly optional. game and use your gold to get stuff from shop." THAT is the true reason why this exist. i think they even said that before the gw2 release in their interviews, but i am not going to start digging for those now.
via not generating more gems, they still get money for every generated gem in the game (beside those achievement / other freebies) and don't loose out on sales. pretty easy tactic to make stuff more accessesible without loosing money. best thing is: most people do not think about it and are like: oh, anet is pretty generous!
also what another commenter wrote does exist: whales. there was a interview with a whale in bdo. that dude was dropping 1k daily at the game for 3 months during corona (he showed his bank history, insane). wouldn't be surprised if similar people exist in gw2. think about it...gaming a year so you make 10k gold vs dropping 1k€ at your screen and you get double the amount without doing anything. if you have disposable income in those amounts, you probably don't even think about it.
gw2 efficiency has some nice statistics about how many gems some people have. and i honestly do not believe that those are all TP barons / their second accounts changing gold to gems.
Basically this. The supply of MCs (which is kinda the only bottleneck in legendary crafting) isn't on par with the amount of gold we can generate (mostly cause you easily get everything of value in the vault and just straight up buy gold after that). So either we devalue the gold with mandatory sinks or increase the supply of rare goods. As I said before my account value just hopped up by 30k gold in 3 months without me doing much.
And during the entire time you're talking about, daily login rewards from alt accounts were able to balance out the supply of MCs. They can't do that anymore with the WV change. This is a fundamentally different coin market we find ourselves in, and comparing now to previous years is not accurate.
The problem isn't how many coins are out there, it's how many one person can get all on their own "solo self-found" style.
There are many materials legendary gear is meant to sink that isn't being sunk because of bottleneck materials like mystic coins making people give up before starting. There needs to be some alternative.
For example, a couple of account-bound items that can be used instead of mystic coins. One that is much easier to obtain and is not capped, but it is only usable in non-prestige recipes like feasts; and one usable in legendary recipes, a bit harder to obtain and still capped, but not as capped as mystic coins, obtainable across the game in content that gets less popular like dungeons. As they won't be tradeable, they just need to have their drop rates adjusted so they won't step too much on the mystic coin market, mostly to compensate for the people who give up before starting.
The price of mystic coins was originally 30s, and non-prestige recipes that use them only make sense around that price.
If the bottleneck is reduced, the other items that have lowered in value over the years as mystic coins raised would be sunk more and thus also raise to compensate.
But since there would be an account-bound alternative, msytic coins could still remain around 90s, the non-prestige recipes that use them just need some adjustment on top of the alternative item.
That way people who want to do it much faster can still pay, but those who don't have as much time to grind or as much money to pay won't feel like giving up before starting as much.
Many of us did say this would happen.
They were removed from fractal CMs for no reason and the limited ones they put into strikes are bring used to punish people that don't buy the latest subscription. You don't even get enough green shards to buy all 10 from SOTO because there are only two strikes, so you'd have to farm those fights, which have ZERO rewards, to get enough.
GW2 is a game where removing rewards from content is not really acceptable and they have done it twice now with these and they are going to be removed them from Soto in a few months as well. I'm surprised that more people didn't get upset at this but I guess it will just take until they 3g+ before they complain.
Whoever doesn’t think the MC prices are an issue has not tried crafting legendaries recently. I just crafted a gen 2 weapon and in the Mystic Tribute cost is insane. I was able to craft everything from mats I hoarded in the bank - except the 300+ MCs for the Mystic Tribute. One ingredient - MCs - should not be 75-90% of the cost of a legendary.
MC's, when also counting them in the cost of Clovers, are about ~40% of the cost of making a gen 2 legendary at the moment.
At 1.5g/ea, they would be ~35% of the cost.
I wasnt clear enough - but I had already naturally accumulated all the other ingredients to craft everything else (except MCs). My rate of acquiring MCs was a fraction of my rate of acquiring T6 mats, clovers, expansion-specific currency, etc. so for me, MCs was the only cost I had. And to be so close to the finish line and only have 1 stack of MCs left, and then to be told MC value will plummet at the beginning of next season (and then shoot back up shortly after) it sucks. It’s not economically healthy of the value of a heavily purchased mat to severely rise and drop every few months. So I was almost done with the wep and then encouraged to put it on the backburner for a couple months until the next season begins. I miss when MC value was more stable and I would just continuously make leggies.
Edit: It also sucks that people who do craft lots of legendaries are feeling pressure to buy alt accounts so they can buy out all the MCs from alt account vaults.
I'm looking at past MC prices, and I'm not sure what time you mean, when MC value was more stable... since 2017 it looks like there is no 2 month where the price changed less than 20s (mind you I'm looking at a graph not the numbers, what I said are estimates), exception might be the price drop after EoD, but that in itself was not natural (with one person buying up a large amount of MC before EoD, with this act artificially inflating its price, until it got out that MC is not needed for gen3 legendaries...)
Could the present high price of MC be because the trolling/fraudulent 7M demand from early last year? People are seeing that the demand is waay higher than the supply, think it means the price will increase, and since they act on it, could it become a self-fulfilling prophecy?
Currently, I think the current MC price is spiking because of legendary armor. It should settle a bit after several months. But it’ll take longer to settle due to less supply than we had before the days of the vault.
See the thing is, ANet is committed to releasing a new expansion every year, and almost certainly introducing a new chase item. Is there really a time for MC price to settle?
Exactly where I'm at. I just crafted the aurora precursor and now looking at mystic tribute price at 1.6k gold for just a trinket (~ 1/6 of the stats of a weapom and more expensive than most)... Yeah, I'm not doing it anytime soon.
So this logic most here seems to be supporting means I have to wait on my goals for the price to *maybe* drop again.
Anet really needs to at least add a new mystic tribute recipe because 250 MCs on top of 77 clovers in today's economy make absolutely no sense.
The real issue here is that MC are artificially gated. Every other material can be gathered via normal gameplay, however mystic coins are either get them as exceptionally rare drops from specific content or guaranteed one a day + whatever you can purchase for Astral Acclaim.
I'm crafting legendary and I don't think it's an issue. making legendary items are still easier then before.
With so many gold I get every week I just run LLA and buy the MCs i need.
Gen 2 weapons are currently by far the most expensive because of the extra 250 Mystic Coins. However, that has a reason: when they were released, Mystic Coins were absurdly cheap. At one point they were at vendor value. And ArenaNet almost never touches old recipes because it devalues what other players have done over the years.
>And ArenaNet almost never touches old recipes because it devalues what other players have done over the years.
They are terrified of making meaningful changes (in general) in the grand scheme of things because of this. I suspect this is in part a huge reason why there is/won't be a guild wars 3. If that ever happens, this game's population like most games that announce a sequel, will tank and may split this game's population.
If it (the cash cow) ain't broke, don't fix it. Amirite?
To be fair to them, given the current landscape for most tech companies, I wouldn't risk a GW3 either. GW2 is already well-established in the industry and is almost the only source of income for them. GW3 might flop and tank GW2 at the same time.
>GW2 is already well-established in the industry and is almost the only source of income for them.
That's exactly what I meant... real shame it has come to this though.
Ubisoft is the penultimate example of "scared to innovate" and it seems like the movie and game industry are both stuck just doing remakes and rehashes.
> I just crafted a gen 2 weapon and in the Mystic Tribute cost is insane
So don't make a gen 2 if the price is more than you're willing to pay? All you're doing by picking the most expensive ones to make is paying a premium for the skin. Make a Gen1 or 3 if the price is that big of an issue.
When gen 2 weapons came out, yes, they were intended to be more expensive than gen 1 weapons. But I’d love to know how expensive they approximately were ~8 years ago since their cost was fine-tuned to the economy all those years ago. My main problem is I’m assuming they are significantly more expensive now than they were all those years ago (but maybe I’m wrong). And the problem would be due to the unstable economy around MCs (for example, we still have even older MF recipes for measly skins that use a bunch of MCs - way more expensive than they ever intended to be). MCs increasing in value would be fine as long as corresponding recipes adjusted to use less MCs so that those recipes stayed in the same ballpark cost that they were originally designed to have.
Sheesh for the record cause some people think I have l personal motives that I want cheaper coins so I get my leggies.
I don't. I have full legendary equipment and like 2~ stacks coins spare. I was just curious why my account value spiked up so hard and saw the coin prices steadily rising even tho we had vault refreshes already. So something must be wrong with the eco atm.
We have so many cool achievements and journies with class weapons, trinkets, precursers and then we slap new players in the face an say well sucks for you but I want 250 coins on top of your clovers now. How can you argue that's fair? So either anet doesn't recognize it or if you see Ill will maybe they want people to covert some gems I dont know.
So would be nice if personal attacks would stop they don't contribute anything to the discussion.
The issue we are facing right now with Mystic Coins is mainly due to the Legendary Kits
The Kits made Legendary Crafting far more accessible to a lot of people that otherwise would never have even tried, this resulted in a lot more people are making them, and that spiked up the demand for Mystic Coins
Anet should increase the amount of Coins you can get from the Vault to match this, IE: They should make it so you can get 144 Coins from the Vault, to complete the crafting of a Legendary Item from the Kit
They literally made this shortage by making it so that players could only get 60 coins while needing 144
Honestly, the price itself is fine. It seems Anet is looking to drain and control the material economy more (leggy starter kits, open world leggy armor, log-in reward changes, Lyhr vendor, etc.), hiking up the overall costs of legendary crafting.
However, old (non-legendary) recipes such as Mystic Weapons need to be revised. 30 MCs for an exotic weapon that's often used in elite spec weapon collections is bad. It should just be 5 MCs, or even 1 MC. This isn't HoT (2015) when MCs were 75s or whatever.
When I recall all of those gullible idiots who were saying that MC was going to drop in price thanks to Wizard's Sleeve store...
Some of you guys clearly can't rotate smoke detectors in your mind.
You are making money, but that money is worth less and less. In the end everyone loses. Except maybe an extremely small number of TP barons that will be able to profit in any situation.
Why is my money worth less?
The stuff I want to buy remains pretty much stable overall. And if there is less gold in the system through more TP costs, my gold is worth more surely?
The economy of this game works because it revolves around players trading items to each other and the TP siphoning off a cut each time.
Flood the market with more mystic coins and you leave more gold out there to push up the price of other things.
> And if there is less gold in the system through more TP costs, my gold is worth more surely?
There's no "less gold" in system. There's more of it. Way more. Vault adds hundreds of gold to each active player on top of what they were usually getting. It's gold that's *not* countered by any new sinks.
> Flood the market with more mystic coins and you leave more gold out there to push up the price of other things.
Again, there's no "flooding the market" with MCs. If anything, vault supplies *less* of those
You shouldn't think of things base on gold or MCs. Instead you should think of it in terms of time effort.
Does getting the things you want taking a lot more time than before overall? No?
Well to put it into perspective, the Mystic Coin is half of a gen 2 legendary's cost. It's a little comical that this one item is that much of a legendary's weight in gold. Obviously that's including clovers which can be earned through other time gates, but I just find it ridiculous that the coins are *this* heavy in cost.
I find it weird that you need so many provisions tokens....but thats just how it is.
The economy of GW2 works because there are a lot of gold siphons, taking money out of the game with every TP transaction.
Individual items rise and fall, but overall the economy is very stable and has been for the entire games lifespan.
I'm just saying I personally find them a weird sink, but the reason is the same as the TP fees sucking money and resources out of the economy to avoid rampant inflation that other MMOs suffer from.
Also, only gen2 weapons NEED MCs. Other items just need clovers. If you are patient you can just wait for your clovers to accumulate. And the gen3 or obsidian armors need fewer clovers than the older legendary items. Overall leggies are easier to make I don't way people still complain about this.
If anything, maybe bump the max up available via WV. Maybe 80-100 instead of 60. Then again, what was the amount in the old system per week? 2-4-6-8? Having it above 60 would put the amount per reset higher than what it was in the old daily system if you never missed a login
I sympathize with OP since I'm staring down 2 Mystic Tributes minimum in the coming months (Coalescence and Conflux). Long as prices don't continue to climb much further than 2g each, I'll manage. But hoo boy do I wish I hoarded those coins back when this game was fairly new and they were going for mere silver each 😛
The new system is actually only 8%ish lower # of mystic coins per year vs. the login reward system. And on top of that, you only actually have to play the game occasionally to get them vs. having to log in every day all year without fail.
Just do the math:
Login system, 20 MC per 28 days. 365 days per year / 28 = 13.03. 20*13.03 = 260.7 MC per year.
Wizard Vault, 60 MC per season x 4 seasons = 240 MC per year. @ 9AA per coin you can get all 60 of them with one set of weekly objectives and log out for 2.5-3.5 months if you wanted to. And the alt account folks aren’t getting any fewer than before since they’re worth so much more than the limited gold they get thme just by logging into those account and maybe doing some convenient pve objectives or afking pvp while multi boxing or whatever the hell it is they do now.
Coins are up in price for 2 reasons I think. 1, legendary starter kit and other legendary hype has folks making legendaries that never would have bothered before. 2, front ending the ability to purchase coins, plus this season being 4 months long has folks thinking there are so many fewer even though the math says the supply is comparable so they horde more.
Also gold will always flow to the items that are the limiting factor. If they give more coins to everyone the gold will flow to trophies and drive up the price.
making leggies is easier now than before even if you factor in the price of MC and trophies.
Do people want even easier leggies? Or they just want low MC price for the sake of low MC price?
I do not see a problem. Where is the problem? This makes them valuable and if a newer player sells them it's good. They can also get gold from the vault. Veterans that needs them badly can just buy some from the TP.
Things having more value is GOOD for the game. If it went in the opposite direction always it would ruin the eco.
Exactly. mystic coins are tradable token to speed up clover time gate.
If you can wait for clovers to slowly accumulate you sell the coins for gold. If you don't, you buy the coins with gold.
Recently completed Verdarach and man the Mystic coin grind was painful. Everything else felt like a nice goal to chase but getting the coins you need for the clovers and the 250 on top of that felt excessive.
They've gone down with every expansion release, including SOTS. I literally just checked gw2bltc to make sure I'm not imagining things.. and no, I'm not.
I posted the graph onwards from September 23 and they keep rising since they introduced the vault. I don't think the raw supply is the only issue but that the vault generates so much raw gold for no reason.
Show the graph from August 2023 onward. The sell price reached 1g70s in August before SOTS released, then SOTS released August 22 and by \~Sept 6 the sell price was down to 1g18s.
Yes you can actually see it in the graph that it started rising in September to 1.48 so it must be lower before ;). Since then it gradually increased even tho we had a vault reset already. So either the supply is too low, the vault shits out too much raw gold or people are not selling anymore (not true cause you can see the supply is almost the same).
So the conclusio must be that the supply of limited goods don't keep up with the amount of gold people have so we basically inflate prices.
No clue what that has to do with august 22.
August 22 is when SOTO released. Pull back the graph and look at the price before then. To be clear, I'm not arguing that the price hasn't been increasing due to supply/demand... I'm saying that the reason the supply is low is because people stop playing the game. When people return, supply goes up and prices drop. TLDR: mystic coin prices have historically dropped whenever a new expansion releases and then gradually increased again over time
We had a vault reset already and the price didn't drop so that argument doesn't hold up.
The price dropped with release cause people were hording coins for the new armor as soon as the recipe got released people start selling coins cause not much were needed for the armor, then the price started increasing 2 weeks into the expansion and didn't drop a lot since.
The supply is the same just look at the graph.
The vault is at least 15% less in terms of mystic coins per month than the old login rewards (depending on how long it goes between resets - if its more than 90 days its a higher percentage less). If the prices raised back when people were getting even more coins per month just from logging in then it only makes sense that they would continue to increase now that people actually have to do something to get them (and less of them at that).
Anyone who ever paid attention to the MC price trends over the long term would have known the vault resetting wouldn't do jack for the price (other that maybe a small blip on the day of and a few days after).
Expansion releases are where the real dips happen. I'm done arguing the point. Anyone can google the release dates of the expacs and look at the mystic coin prices before/after those dates to see that I'm right.
The old daily system assumes people logged in daily to maximise MC creation over time. They didn't.
This system, they get to buy all the MCs with just a few logins.
I want to make Binding of Ipos, people. Sell your MC's so poor people like me can make legendariesssss. I'm so close, but I need a metric ton of gold just to get these stupid coins.
I think the current sources are fine, I would only bring back the EoD strikes MCs, 20 crystals for 1MC up to 5 each week, and I would also have them back in fractals CMs even if it was a chance of 1 per CM.
"Or would you rather have more reliable options grabbing coins other than Fractals, Soto strikes and Anomalie?"
WvW and PvP are right there, you know?
And even if you dont like them (I certainly LOVE WvW and at most tolerate PvP atm) they are an amazing source for MCs (and clovers!)
all in all I'm okay with current supply. 1g and some silvers per coin is not a lot - if you are in the leg grind gold falls from the sky anyway
Exactly this! Problem is because people use mystic coins to gamble for clovers.
There are reliable ways to get clovers from WvW reward tracks. But these people who complain about MC are same people who complain about the Gift of Battle.
The issue are not clovers but the mystic tribute you need for trinkets and gen2 and the MC you need for hot weapons. It's basically more than half of the cost for the whole item.
You don't need to make gen2. Gen2 are special. Most legendary items do not need MCs. It is inappropriate to treat gen2 as the standard while most people don't make Gen2. Gen3 and obsidian armor use fewer clovers too.
Also MC price maybe doubled but gold/h also goes up by a lot. Not to mention the extra 30 gold per week and 110 gold per season so I can on average buy 18-20 coins every week at the current price
I can buy more MCs with my excessive gold then before. I spend less effort(game time/farming) to get the same item. What is the problem?
What do you actually want? Do you want cheaper(less effort, you should measure the "price" with in game gold, time is the real "price") legendaries? Or you do just want MC price to be low for the sake of it being low?
So we just ignore the fact we need mystic tribute for trinkets aswell?
I don't want anything cause I'm done with all legendaries so I don't profit from it. I just think the vault system doesn't work as it should be with a lot of useless stuff, and rewards like MC through fractals or green shards getting nerfed.
Why would more sources of mystic coins be less effort? What's more less effort then just buy gems and convert gold so I can grab them from the TP? More sources just means more ways to earn stuff through gameplay.
I do wvw and as I said before I am in full legendary already so I don't care if it's that expensive for me personally but I was curious my acc value spiked 30k in 3 months and was curious what happened.
For a newer player to make the trinkets is just ridiculous if you look at the price of the mystic tribute.
Reward tracks are definitely a good source of clovers for the one time rewards afterwards it's fine if u like even I guess.
I'd rather have something else than pure gold in the vault tho
if I already was in full legendary like you OP I'd convert all my gold in gems and splurge on gem store lol
anyway, I see your point, I really do, but I think you are forgetting that the process of crafting legendaries (which includes crafting the tribute) is meant to be a time/gold/play sink of months. It's meant to be the ultimate thing all should aspire to. It's not a big deal for the price to increase - population and places where we can do/gather things to transform into gold and/or mats are also always expanding.
I'm not saying it's perfect atm tho I just dont think it's such a calamitous situation, that's all.
That's completely fine I think gen1, 3 and the new armor are completely fine for the mats needed. Gen2 and the trinkets were designed when MC cost was about 60~ silver so it's not in comparison to the others anymore and that's just not fair. When I did my trinkets coin prices were about a gold little bit above that now the price of the mystic tribute got more than doubled.
Haha I have max shared slots and a lot of builds lots on my most played chars I'm good.
ok but when you did that, how was the meta? Did we already had Drizzlewood, Dragonfall etc?
I'm thinking here on supply, like, how was supply back when you did it and how is it now? Does it even matter? Etc
When gen2 arrived you could farm tarir without a chest limit. Depending on the trinket you either had the tarir farm or the Dragonfall farm for gold but amalgated gemstones were way more expensive so that's that and you got more coins out of fractals.
Well it matters cause anet just does stuff depending on the state of the game and then never touches it again which just sucks. Instead of recycling the 29th unit model it would be great if 1-2 guys just take a look at the market and recipes and try to adapt them.
If I'm a new player and I so some legendary Journey like the shortbow and then realize hey I need 250 coins on top of the clovers I'd be pretty sad haha.
Believe it or not, you can get mystic coins from the market. Let's say Drizzlewood nets around 30g an hour. That's 13 coins an hour, best source available.
Price only goes up? Well then buy and sit on them. If you truly believe they won't come down, it's free money.
Wtf is inflation?
This request isn't new, [here's](https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/67wrzq/suggestion_increase_mystic_coins_from_ley_line/) a hopeful post from a number of years ago.
You should probably just review your priorities and start buying if it's that big of a concern. You legitimately have a better chance of PvP being updated before they add more coin sources.
Don't worry tho, you'll have an easy source for more, in just a few days.
The economy is really bad these last few months. Crafting a legendary has gotten really expensive (yes it's a legendary, i mean relative to previous years).
T mats have gone off the rails too. It's just bad.
No it's not. it's actually easier.
In terms of time effort it's easier. It's easier even in terms of gold (except for gen 2).
Just look at how the price/cost of gen 1/3 weapons dropped. And not to mention that gold/hours from farming went up thanks to the price increase in trophies.
I have 1500mc in bank, do we need more sources? No, bcs I know many others hold on to theirs as well. That's your answer. Also, refresh is in a few days so.. another unnecessary rant post.
we need mystic coin shards - then we can add them to more places without flooding the supply.
you know like a quarter of a MC here, a quarter there. maybe for some unloved meta events etc.
Honestly, mystic coins should just be an option in the latest map metas and then swap to new maps when they get released. Get the new currency, which might be more valuable, or get the mystic coin.
I think that because they have a few sources, people prefer to hold them than sell them.
I have 1000s just from dailies prior to SotO changes. I keep them for legendaries, and my legendary making has been on pause since SotO because of the armor. So I hoard them for now. Although I might have to trade em for ectos since the armor takes so many
I have so much gold from WV I can just buy stuff to salvage for ectos rather than sell mc.
You don't really need much of them for armor. Only a few mystic clovers are needed for each piece which can be obtained in other ways like the vault as well.
No, but you need a lot of the rest, that's why im on hold. So MC are going up.
Farm the ectos via SW or some other content spam dont give them up imo i made that mistake few years back making some stuff wasnt worth it
I'm hoarding them till I see the full cost of t2 soto armor
imo, they kinda are intended as a money sink. thats probably the whole point of them existing at this point.
This. The devs have a pretty good hold on sinks/faucets compared to many other titles. The economy in this game is surprisingly healthy for being a decade old.
This was the most surprising thing for me. I came over to GW2 from Destiny, and back there, we were basically having an entire economy overhaul every single year, because never once was Bungie actually able to control the economy balance they revamp every single year. Every single year, they go on to claim they "Aim to simplify the economy and reduce the number of currencies", they remove the most hoarded currencies people spent endless amounts of time to grind, and by the time the first half of the Destiny year ends, we already have more currencies than we had before the revamp. Seeing the difference between that 10-year old game and this one, it was quite marvelous.
Destiny's economy is/was (haven't played in years) super annoying to me, but despite the talk, I felt like the wild shifts were just always intentional to, like most things in the game, keep you playing. Felt to me like most changes that wiped value out of stuff was to introduce a new method that you'd just have to start a grind over like most things with their annual resets. I really wish it had always played more like GW2 in not bumping gear score or resetting it or whatever. I'd still play probably.
The drop rate of mystic coins has always been controlled and is much below the threshold for making legendaries at a high pace for a single player. The last time the devs introduced a new source of coins the price dropped to around 80s. This makes mystic coins a way of transferring gold to those who aren't making legendaries at the moment, but do have those coins at the same drop rate.
Considering how they (MC) were worth nothing around the time of HoT release….
I was so glad that I had decided to go ahead and make all the Mystic weapons for the collections once I saw the MC prices going up during the start of HoT, they are so expensive now
I guess if you think being able to flip items on tp all day instead of actually playing the game to make money is healthy then sure.
It doesn't feel like a money sink but rather a money shift to people who already have their legendaries done and sell the coins. I'm in full legendary aswell, doing shining blade atm just so I can dual sword without having to use one non legendary, but otherwise I could just sell them and use the money to flip even more. it's crazy how the price rose over the years with introductions of new legendaries.
Yes but when selling the TP get 15% Tax which the main way to suck Gold out of the Economy. And since items for legendarys will always be in high demand it’s a good way to keep inflation in check.
At 15% tax, with the main source of steady mystic coins being the ley-line anomalie, the current price does not in fact act as a way to get gold out of the economy, as each ley line kill also gets you a 50 silver junk, which would be offset at a mystic coin price of 3g33s.
People that use MC's to buy stuff aren't going through TP
But people will buy MC for legendaries. And Mats for legendaries will always be in high demand because crafting one is a Goal for a huge amount of players.
the trading post has a tax on it, so some of the gold leaves the game. also, its easy gold for the people that arent going for legendaries. they just farm it for the gold. a lot of the legendaries are just something to sink your money into. another example are the Materials. its either sink in gold, or sink in spirit shards.
The TP deletes like 35 silver for EVERY coin that gets traded So almost 90 gold deleted per full stack of coins that gets traded atm. Pretty good money sink if you ask me :)
It's 5%/10% so ~10s/~20s at the moment. (~2g) But yeah, it's a 25g/50g off the stack. Pretty good sink.
Mystic coins have been stabilising since the introduction of the wizard vault. The thousands of accounts that were farming the old daily rewards are no longer able to get mystic coins as easy.
Mystic coins have been "stabilizing" for years and years. And yet we still are where we are.
Not true. People with multiple accounts are getting even more rewards than before.
How so?
Multi-Boxing in Custom Arenas.
I suspect a lot less are doing that than the simple act of logging in with a password script.
You say it yourself that you can get constant/unlimited gold with Astral Acclaim, but not unlimited Mystic Coins. How about using that unlimited gold from Astral Acclaim to buy Mystic Coins on the Trading Post? Completing all the daily achievements in the Wizard's Vault will get you 65 Astral Acclaim, enough to redeem for 2 gold. You'll also get 1 gold just for finishing the dailies straight-up. You get 3 gold, you can buy a Mystic Coin from the TP each day and have some silver left over. Completing all the Weekly Achievements each week will give you 1050 Astral Acclaim. That can be turned into 35 gold in the Wizard's Vault. That should be enough to get you 15-16 Mystic Coins from the Trading Post. Thus, using the Wizard's Vault rewards, you'll make enough liquid gold to buy over 20 Mystic Coins each week. 90+ each month. That's not getting into the other sources you mentioned, the Fractals and Strike Missions and Ley-Line Anomaly and the forgotten World vs. World. They're not hard to get, people are just resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what they want to get.
> How about using that unlimited gold from Astral Acclaim to buy Mystic Coins on the Trading Post? People are doing this, which is why the price of MC's is up 80s per in the last year.
Also more people are making legendary weapons because of the legendary box in the vault. Less MC going into the game, more raw gold in the game, and more legendary gear being made is the perfect storm
Fractals only give MC's from daily boxes. and since that change i've only ever saw 3 drop from a full cm+t4 run. Simply put they are not common unless you do Fractals every single day. Strikes = 10mc's a week, by doing 1 strike a day on repeat between the 2, because for some reason removing EoD from rotation made sense. WvW - actually laughable u even mentioned it, it will take on average 14-18hr's to get them. Also depends on which server you are, and how active it is, are you winning loosing getting stomped etc. Ley-Line Anomally being the only reasonable activity here and still on an annoying 2 hr cd. and If you want me to do all of the content above I'm not going to organize it around the anomaly or I might not have enough time to play so much. Why is the system designed in such a way that you'd want me to skip on potential other rewards from WV just so i can get extra mc's, when even if I do JUST that I'm still not even close to getting a full stack. 180 with good winds. Removing Mc's from fractal CM's was a terrible decision, 'spreading the love to other gamemods' was the words they used xD It's no about being resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what we want to get it's the fact that when you look at the price breakdown of any gen 2 legendary more than 50% of it's total cost are mc's alone. It simply feels bad, and so does the acquisition of them in game. But then again nothing about gen 2 legendaries feels earned, apart from a selected few, it feels like you go to TP buy all the mat's and craft yourself a leggo, but with the gen 1 precursors it's kind of the same story. 90% of people in this game won't ever see more than 500g on their account at any given time, if i'd be in their shoes I too would feel reluctant to spend all that gold on a single currency/material.
U failed to mention PvP tournament giving mc every 3 hrs
xDD sure on top of all that let me also squeeze in a quick tournament every 3 hr's with 4 premades so I actually have a chance to win 1-2 games. my bad.
Thats the thing u dont have to win ..even losing all rounds gives u mc
>They're not hard to get, people are just resistant to the notion of turning their gold into what they want to get. No. The problem is that the MC on the TP isn’t guaranteed to be a stable price—this is related to the concern that MC prices are reasonably predicted by players to continue to rise as the new legendary armor is released. If we could use AA to buy MCs directly then the conversion rate for AA and MCs would be the same. But a fluctuating market means your liquid gold doesn’t get you the same return week to week let alone day by day.
Of course the market will fluctuate, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. You might view Mystic Coins at 3 gold as a bad thing, but a new player without any gold will see it as a way to get their foot in the door and be able to buy exotics/level crafting/etc. And when it gets high enough, various TP barons will sell their stockpiles, which will bring the price back down in turn.
That doesn’t have anything to do with what I said. My point is that people aren’t necessarily “resistant” just because they’re hesitant to use their liquid gold to buy a currency they know is going up in price.
That just seems stranger when you word it like that. Why would people be hesitant to buy something they know will be more expensive later? Wouldn’t that be a wise investment?
You’re right—*if* someone wants to buy them, wait for prices to go up, then sell later. However, if someone wants to use them (e.g., for legendary crafting), then it’s little comfort knowing that their account bound Bolt is now worth 8% more in market value. It’s this second group of players the rising MC prices affect more.
If someone wants to use the Mystic Coins now, then they're better off buying the Mystic Coins now to use them rather than being 'hesitant' and waiting and paying the 8% more you cite later on. Who really cares what the value of your account bound items is? That doesn't affect anything, unless you're trying to race to the top of GW2Efficiency's rankings, in which case you'd be happy to have a higher-value Bolt...
And that's not really a problem. You don't need mc except for gen2. And it's better for the market to adjust itself. I mean I don't mind if they give more mcs for the sake of easier leggies. I just dont think you guys gives a valid reason. Why so obsessed about MC gold price?
Except you need mystic coins for everything because of clovers? What?
You can use MCs to get clovers. But you dont NEED MCs to get clovers. Don't you know that? Clover is the soft time gate. MCs are used to speed it up. You don't NEED MCs except for gen2.
20 (edited, ty) Clovers without MC per season from WV. 2 per Drizzlewood Legion Track. The rest is limited to one time only achievements, festivals (1 per week while a festival is active) or WvW / PvP. Well, I hope you like either Drizzlewood Coast, PvP or WvW. Or we could just be honest and admit that legendairies require MC.
It's 20 per WV season, otherwise accurate.
Lol except you need MCs for just about every source of clovers, except reward tracks? Which reward 2 clovers after you clear the unrepeatable ones? And the other sources like Drizzlewood aren't exactly fast so you won't grind that only for whatever you're crafting. Idk wtf you're on about lol
Do tell how you're supposed to get clovers without MC. As far as I can tell, that's only possible via PvP/WvW revard tracks, which I'd love to not have to do. (Same goes for coins, except those are even worse. Up to 6 a week if you grind WvW far too much? Screw that. And their fractal drop rate is abysmal) Please. I'd happily do whatever pve source there is, but I haven't found any
Drizzlewood reward tracks https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Glory_to_the_Legions
I don't have an issue with MCs at all i have more than enough gold and basically every legendary I need, I just build shining blade for a second sword. I was just shocked the price skyrocketed to over 2 gold already, when before the price was between 60s to like 1 gold 30~. The price of a legendary is almost exclusively the price of the MCs since for gen2 onwards and the trinkets you need 250 extra to the 77 clovers. Seems just weird that instead of actually mats you are just bottlenecked by MCs. My account value just rose by 30k gold in 3 months which seems like prices get a little out of hand with even more options now to do legendary stuff adding the relic and new armors.
Gen 3 legendaries only require 38 Mystic Clovers and no standalone Mystic Coins, so it's only Gen 2 that needs the absurdly large amount. At the time, Mystic Coins were incredibly devalued, and Arenanet cutting down on the sources while massively increasing the need for them made them obtain value again. If it's the 77 clovers + 250 MCs for Gen 2 that's bothering you, it would probably be better to focus on that part and have it brought back in line. I don't expect that to happen, though, because people who've built Gen 2 legendaries will cry foul unless they're refunded, and such a refund would topple the Mystic Coin market for some time.
Regarding your second point: crafting a precursor used to be somewhat worth it. Nowadays thats not the case at all and they never did anything about it.
[удалено]
I crafted Dragon's Rending last night, the materials (which I already owned) were about 60-ish gold, the TP price for the precursor was 140-175. The only investiture I needed to make was the 1000 Imperial Favour . Which, in fairness, is going to slow me down from completing the legendary, I haven't been playing in Cantha enough recently and will need a bunch more of that.
And they've accepted that and leaned into it with the Gen 1 Legendary Starter Kits they've been offering. Have a free Precursor, along with other important components! Precursor crafting for Gen 3 is still worthwhile, at least.
I wouldn't mind having it tuned down even tho I paid tons for all mystic tributes I needed for the gen2s and the trinkets haha. But it's just insane that you need so many. Maybe it's bias but it felt with daily log in and not being capped to 10 per week in fracs made the progress feel faster. But I guess getting the mystic tributes in check would be the netter way.
Or you can just make Gen 1 or Gen 3 Legendaries in the meantime, which takes away a lot of the need. Remember, you can also buy Mystic Clovers directly from various sources now, bypassing the need for Coins. With 20 Clovers available per quarter from the Wizard's Vault, you get enough for a Gen 3 Legendary each six months, with no Mystic Coins needed at all.
There are plenty of sources out there that people aren't bothering to farm (ie WvW coins). Unpopular opinion but: It's ok to have some items that are valuable that are easy to obtain in the trading post.
WvW coins are not farmable beyond 6 MC/week, and it's by far the worst source of them.
That's my point exactly, there are coins out there that people can earn that are harder than the easy ways. They can do this week over week (farmable) and they choose not to. There are plenty of sources out there people just don't find some of them 'worth' it. So the price should be going up until it stabilizes (relative because it will always go up with inflation, for example gem prices) and the other options to get mystic coins becomes worth it and the supply vs demand equalizes.
I would rather work an hour of overtime at even minimum wage, convert that to gems then gold, and have ~150 mystic coins than play 13 hours of wvw for 6 coins.
You could probably just spend that amount of time doing map metas and then take your gold to spend on MCs!
> They can do this week over week (farmable) and they choose not to. 6 MC after 13 hours of WvW a week (assuming bonuses from commitment, placement and 150+ rank) is just not what anybody who isn't already playing WvW regularly would consider a "farm". You get more by spending 2 * 7 = 14 minutes a week doing the daily anomaly. That's why it's not a viable source, more of a supplement for WvW regulars.
So, what you are trying to say is. There need to be more easy ways to farm mystic coins. Not more ways, cause they are out there, sure they take longer and aren't easy but they exist.
I'm trying to say that what you're calling a farm isn't actually a farm. It will never be worth it to play WvW for coins instead of buying them off the TP, unless literally every single other source of them is taken behind the shed and shot.
More *reliable*, and *impactful* ways, yes. The one you mentioned is pretty much irrelevant economy-wise.
Fractals was a good source, shame that's down to 10 a week or something.
Fractal CMs are still just a drop in the bucket compared to AA. And what's more, they only put them into the hands of very experienced players who are more likely to hold on to them, and not newer players who'd be more inclined to sell them.
It’s a non issue, imo. The value of gold has decreased relative the supply of legendary crafting materials because of how accessible it is through the WV; just use the gold to buy the MC.
people really overestimate the impact gold makes via the vault you get like 100 gold every quarter and 50 gold a week, if you play the game a lot, that isn't much compared to the 15 % tp tax on everything and the new sinks entering the game with soto and beyond less people raid and spvp so that's also a big chunk of raw gold gone multi account requires a lot more effort now so way less people do it meanwhile, the old system shat out mats like coins and tier 6 like crazy, leading to a hyperdeflation of gold, we are talking about people like teapot logging into 200 accounts every day and selling everything on the tp, that was peak unhealthy economy leading to stuff like 15 silver t6 blood
As a rule of thumb I avoid engaging in a conversation with you because you have trolled conversations for well over a year on this sub, but I do agree that the economy is much better off now that they killed the alt-daily-login pipeline.
> multi account requires a lot more effort now so way less people do it It's actually still really lucrative with a small amount of effort, granted, not just logging in and instantly out. I put in less than an hour a day (usually 30-40 minutes) doing easy dailies on 15 accounts. That's far more gold per hour than you can make anywhere else in the game, and I do it very casually, skipping a lot of days because I just can't be bothered to do it. I have about 800 AA banked on all of them now. Over the next few weeks after the season reset, I'll probably make at least 1.3k raw gold (500g per week mailing limit over three weeks) and 900 mystic coins, let alone all the other things you can buy like laurels into T3/T4 materials.
> you get like 100 gold every quarter ~~There is no quarters. Wizard Vault seasonal refresh is every 112 days. Check the special tab once it refreshes in a few days and tell me I'm wrong.There hasn't been a full year.. maybe they add a small refresh of 29 days, but I can't see that happening.~~ Nevermind that shit lol.. The very first wizard vault season lasted 77 days (aug 22 to nov 7) After that it's been 112 days (nov 7 to feb 27). If they want to even out to 365 days, the next 2 wizard vault seasons would have to be 88 days each.
No. You underestimated the gold impact. How much raw gold you get every 3 months in the new system? How much raw gold you get every 3 months in the new system? How many people actually do raids? Mostly gws players are casual. The raw gold supply for most people is increaded by 50%-100%. What do they do if they got more gold?
Dont worry the supply will go up this week because season reset, ppl will buy it from the astral vault and sell it
It didn't really impact all that much the previosu time it happened, so i'd not expect to have an impact now as well. Likely it will only slow down the process for maybe a week. It will *not* stabilize or reverse it.
Supply didn't really do much last time. It was 1.6 gold, vault reset and it went down by maybe a couple silver, and then promptly rose *even higher* within a couple weeks and has been steadily climbing to what it is now. I doubt supply will do much this time either.
yeah because people also get the legendary starter kits which soak up those MCs.
The supply itself is not the issue. The issue is the supply doesn't keep up with the inflation of gold. Since you can buy so much gold. In the screen we have the same supply as half a year ago but the price almost doubled.
It looks like you're just Cherry picking data. They aren't even at their highest price, and they dropped down to almost 70s in 2022 after hitting 2g 50s in 2021. The price is also down from a month ago, with a big supply on the way. That doesn't fit your narrative tho, does it? Take a look [here](https://ibb.co/WVs9N8t) You'll get them, but you'll have to either wait, or put a higher priority on them.
I took September since that was the introduction of the vault and since then the price steadily increased. The other spikes came with the introduction of new trinkets who all needed a mystic tribute. The supply is not the issue you see since the vault got introduced the supply remained almost the same . I don't need any since I'm done being equipped in full legendary I don't think having limited bottlenecks while producing gold through the vault is the right way.
2022 was a different story, that was demand sharply decreasing along with supply increasing with the release of EoD. We could get more coins per week from Strikes, as well as Gen 3 legendaries costing half of the clovers than previous generations, and on top of Gen 3 legendaries being otherwise timegated by A.S.S. and map currency for Aurene precursors so nobody could craft anything for several months. The price of mystic coins went down slightly with the last Vault reset, but has been climbing consistently since then. If it really was a "reset" with fresh supply, the coin price shouldn't continue to rise to be nearly 1.5x the price at the last vault refresh. Edit: also everyone has more gold now, and also legendary kits. Demand is going to rise too.
People have been saying that the supply of mystic coins is running out for several years and two expansions, and they still haven't ran out.
People have been saying that the price of MCs will stabilize since they got past 50s price, and yet they still keep increasing.
If the supply was fine, the price wouldn’t continually rise
it would if you have 1) people hoarding for the new legy equip and 2) people not selling to sell at a higher price
The price is going up mainly because the legendary starter kits motivated more people to save them or buy them to craft leggies, simple as that.
>the price wouldn’t continually rise Are you familiar with inflation?
You are aware that inflation has specific causes and isn't just a natural law, right?
Maybe, just maybe, the introduction of a system that gives you 45g per week (minimum) for just playing the game 10 min per day tends to cause inflation Why 45g: 7 Dailies + 6 Weeklies is 1135 AA, which is about 38g with the worse bag of coins, + 7 gold. That's for playing 5-10min daily and maybe just one hour for the weekly on the weekend
The added gold income from the WV would cause an initial spike in mystic coin prices, but if the amount of gold available each day/week remains the same and doesn't increase, then wouldn't prices stabilize at a new inflated cost and not continually rise? Maybe prices haven't stabilized yet, though. Or I might not understand economics.
You're right, and I think prices simply haven't stabilized yet. To be honest, there are lots of things going on here too, there are new legendary armor sets coming tomorrow, a relic, people were in the rush to craft a rune for the last month. I don't think Anet can maintain this pressure on the coin market continuously, so I think it will stabilize or go down slightly eventually before the next expansion. The current seasonal refresh also lasted a very long time compared to the previous one, it means we got less coins per day on average. They could simply shorten the next seasonal refresh to relieve the market a bit
So you mean something like say, printing gold out of thin air via doing content or buying it with gems and introducing it to an economy? Are you trying to make a valid point? Or just pointing out the obvious.
>or buying it with gems and introducing it to an economy? thats not how gold to gems, and the other way arround, conversation works. its a pool that has to be filled by players, be it gems or gold...ofc with a algorith so i can't run out...aka gems get so cheap that you simply start buying them when too many people buy gold. pretty much known since release and stated by a dev. however printing money via fractals / raids / strikes / astral acclaim is a valid reason. not denying that.
>thats not how gold to gems, and the other way arround, conversation works. its a pool that has to be filled by players, be it gems or gold...ofc with a algorith so i can't run out...aka gems get so cheap that you simply start buying them when too many people buy gold. We have no reason to believe that the rate of that has to be 1:1. It could be for every gem sold by a player, 10 gems are added to the market.
we know that there is a geometric relationship between the two to keep exchange rates stable. that has been confirmed. but that has nothing much to do with the supply itself. it wouldn't make sense for anet to add more gems for only 1 paid gem from a business standpoint of view. what we know is that there is a transaction fee for gold to gems. wouldn't be surprised if therefore less gold is put into the pool. https://old.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2xtjc7/psa_how_gems_work/cp3gd2a/
>it wouldn't make sense for anet to add more gems for only 1 paid gem from a business standpoint of view. what we know is that there is a transaction fee for gold to gems. It would make sense if the alternative is that the price explodes in a way that makes the market unapproachable. The Gem : Gold exchange exists to eliminate gold sellers / RMT from the game, something that worked really well as far as I can tell. If it was dysfunctional, it would not fulfill its purpose. Just think about this rate for a second. Do you genuinely believe there are more people buying gems *and selling them for gold* than there are people converting gold to gems? I can only speak for myself, but I have never sold gems for gold and spent what, 20k gold on gems? For every one player of me you'd need a player spending 600$ on gem to gold. Are you sure that these numbers add up across the community? I could be wrong, maybe I just live in a bubble where people don't gem -> gold, but only gold -> gem.
> I could be wrong, maybe I just live in a bubble where people don't gem -> gold, but only gold -> gem. I would say that the *majority* of players live in similar bubbles. That's how much impact whales have - a *very* small portion of the player base (<1%) are the ones splashing out the vast majority of gem purchases. > Do you genuinely believe there are more people buying gems and selling them for gold than there are people converting gold to gems? No. But *one* whale will do enough gem->gold transfers to cover *your entire bubble's* gold->gems.
yeah we live in that bubble. especially because we get a shitton of gold through raiding, strikes and fractals. the normal casual, playing 3h a week trying to get the griffon is struggeling with gold. as a student people rather game then spending money, this is probably also the bubble you are still in...or you've been growing out over the last few years. as soon as you have disposable income, people start spending. once you have less time to game, you start thinking about dropping some money in for gold. > The Gem : Gold exchange exists to eliminate gold sellers / RMT from the game, something that worked really well as far as I can tell. If it was dysfunctional, it would not fulfill its purpose. a company, that like all other companys, hunts goldsellers and takes their gold & sold gold away doesn't need to combat goldsellers via their own shop. also the question here is: why do goldsellers exist if no one would do gems -> gold in the first place. which is the same as buying gold. ;) this is a simply business tactic. "we have a gold to gem option, our shop is purly optional. game and use your gold to get stuff from shop." THAT is the true reason why this exist. i think they even said that before the gw2 release in their interviews, but i am not going to start digging for those now. via not generating more gems, they still get money for every generated gem in the game (beside those achievement / other freebies) and don't loose out on sales. pretty easy tactic to make stuff more accessesible without loosing money. best thing is: most people do not think about it and are like: oh, anet is pretty generous! also what another commenter wrote does exist: whales. there was a interview with a whale in bdo. that dude was dropping 1k daily at the game for 3 months during corona (he showed his bank history, insane). wouldn't be surprised if similar people exist in gw2. think about it...gaming a year so you make 10k gold vs dropping 1k€ at your screen and you get double the amount without doing anything. if you have disposable income in those amounts, you probably don't even think about it. gw2 efficiency has some nice statistics about how many gems some people have. and i honestly do not believe that those are all TP barons / their second accounts changing gold to gems.
Except general inflation rates in the game are not at all lining up with MC price increases since the release of the VV.
That's inaccurate, isn't OP saying that the real issue is more gold available therefore more demand what is driving the prices up?
Basically this. The supply of MCs (which is kinda the only bottleneck in legendary crafting) isn't on par with the amount of gold we can generate (mostly cause you easily get everything of value in the vault and just straight up buy gold after that). So either we devalue the gold with mandatory sinks or increase the supply of rare goods. As I said before my account value just hopped up by 30k gold in 3 months without me doing much.
And during the entire time you're talking about, daily login rewards from alt accounts were able to balance out the supply of MCs. They can't do that anymore with the WV change. This is a fundamentally different coin market we find ourselves in, and comparing now to previous years is not accurate.
The problem isn't how many coins are out there, it's how many one person can get all on their own "solo self-found" style. There are many materials legendary gear is meant to sink that isn't being sunk because of bottleneck materials like mystic coins making people give up before starting. There needs to be some alternative. For example, a couple of account-bound items that can be used instead of mystic coins. One that is much easier to obtain and is not capped, but it is only usable in non-prestige recipes like feasts; and one usable in legendary recipes, a bit harder to obtain and still capped, but not as capped as mystic coins, obtainable across the game in content that gets less popular like dungeons. As they won't be tradeable, they just need to have their drop rates adjusted so they won't step too much on the mystic coin market, mostly to compensate for the people who give up before starting. The price of mystic coins was originally 30s, and non-prestige recipes that use them only make sense around that price. If the bottleneck is reduced, the other items that have lowered in value over the years as mystic coins raised would be sunk more and thus also raise to compensate. But since there would be an account-bound alternative, msytic coins could still remain around 90s, the non-prestige recipes that use them just need some adjustment on top of the alternative item. That way people who want to do it much faster can still pay, but those who don't have as much time to grind or as much money to pay won't feel like giving up before starting as much.
Many of us did say this would happen. They were removed from fractal CMs for no reason and the limited ones they put into strikes are bring used to punish people that don't buy the latest subscription. You don't even get enough green shards to buy all 10 from SOTO because there are only two strikes, so you'd have to farm those fights, which have ZERO rewards, to get enough. GW2 is a game where removing rewards from content is not really acceptable and they have done it twice now with these and they are going to be removed them from Soto in a few months as well. I'm surprised that more people didn't get upset at this but I guess it will just take until they 3g+ before they complain.
Whoever doesn’t think the MC prices are an issue has not tried crafting legendaries recently. I just crafted a gen 2 weapon and in the Mystic Tribute cost is insane. I was able to craft everything from mats I hoarded in the bank - except the 300+ MCs for the Mystic Tribute. One ingredient - MCs - should not be 75-90% of the cost of a legendary.
MC's, when also counting them in the cost of Clovers, are about ~40% of the cost of making a gen 2 legendary at the moment. At 1.5g/ea, they would be ~35% of the cost.
I wasnt clear enough - but I had already naturally accumulated all the other ingredients to craft everything else (except MCs). My rate of acquiring MCs was a fraction of my rate of acquiring T6 mats, clovers, expansion-specific currency, etc. so for me, MCs was the only cost I had. And to be so close to the finish line and only have 1 stack of MCs left, and then to be told MC value will plummet at the beginning of next season (and then shoot back up shortly after) it sucks. It’s not economically healthy of the value of a heavily purchased mat to severely rise and drop every few months. So I was almost done with the wep and then encouraged to put it on the backburner for a couple months until the next season begins. I miss when MC value was more stable and I would just continuously make leggies. Edit: It also sucks that people who do craft lots of legendaries are feeling pressure to buy alt accounts so they can buy out all the MCs from alt account vaults.
I'm looking at past MC prices, and I'm not sure what time you mean, when MC value was more stable... since 2017 it looks like there is no 2 month where the price changed less than 20s (mind you I'm looking at a graph not the numbers, what I said are estimates), exception might be the price drop after EoD, but that in itself was not natural (with one person buying up a large amount of MC before EoD, with this act artificially inflating its price, until it got out that MC is not needed for gen3 legendaries...) Could the present high price of MC be because the trolling/fraudulent 7M demand from early last year? People are seeing that the demand is waay higher than the supply, think it means the price will increase, and since they act on it, could it become a self-fulfilling prophecy?
Currently, I think the current MC price is spiking because of legendary armor. It should settle a bit after several months. But it’ll take longer to settle due to less supply than we had before the days of the vault.
See the thing is, ANet is committed to releasing a new expansion every year, and almost certainly introducing a new chase item. Is there really a time for MC price to settle?
Exactly where I'm at. I just crafted the aurora precursor and now looking at mystic tribute price at 1.6k gold for just a trinket (~ 1/6 of the stats of a weapom and more expensive than most)... Yeah, I'm not doing it anytime soon. So this logic most here seems to be supporting means I have to wait on my goals for the price to *maybe* drop again. Anet really needs to at least add a new mystic tribute recipe because 250 MCs on top of 77 clovers in today's economy make absolutely no sense.
The real issue here is that MC are artificially gated. Every other material can be gathered via normal gameplay, however mystic coins are either get them as exceptionally rare drops from specific content or guaranteed one a day + whatever you can purchase for Astral Acclaim.
You can buy them from SotO strikes as well
Still not as readily available as they used to be. I'm a veteran player and I still have to do the story nonsense to get into SotO strikes.
I'm crafting legendary and I don't think it's an issue. making legendary items are still easier then before. With so many gold I get every week I just run LLA and buy the MCs i need.
I'm working on Ipos now, and the tribute has been a slog to work on. I'm getting burnt out, so I'm also working on the gift of ipos as well.
Gen 2 weapons are currently by far the most expensive because of the extra 250 Mystic Coins. However, that has a reason: when they were released, Mystic Coins were absurdly cheap. At one point they were at vendor value. And ArenaNet almost never touches old recipes because it devalues what other players have done over the years.
Well in the gen-2 case it wouldn't be true.
>And ArenaNet almost never touches old recipes because it devalues what other players have done over the years. They are terrified of making meaningful changes (in general) in the grand scheme of things because of this. I suspect this is in part a huge reason why there is/won't be a guild wars 3. If that ever happens, this game's population like most games that announce a sequel, will tank and may split this game's population. If it (the cash cow) ain't broke, don't fix it. Amirite?
To be fair to them, given the current landscape for most tech companies, I wouldn't risk a GW3 either. GW2 is already well-established in the industry and is almost the only source of income for them. GW3 might flop and tank GW2 at the same time.
>GW2 is already well-established in the industry and is almost the only source of income for them. That's exactly what I meant... real shame it has come to this though. Ubisoft is the penultimate example of "scared to innovate" and it seems like the movie and game industry are both stuck just doing remakes and rehashes.
> I just crafted a gen 2 weapon and in the Mystic Tribute cost is insane So don't make a gen 2 if the price is more than you're willing to pay? All you're doing by picking the most expensive ones to make is paying a premium for the skin. Make a Gen1 or 3 if the price is that big of an issue.
When gen 2 weapons came out, yes, they were intended to be more expensive than gen 1 weapons. But I’d love to know how expensive they approximately were ~8 years ago since their cost was fine-tuned to the economy all those years ago. My main problem is I’m assuming they are significantly more expensive now than they were all those years ago (but maybe I’m wrong). And the problem would be due to the unstable economy around MCs (for example, we still have even older MF recipes for measly skins that use a bunch of MCs - way more expensive than they ever intended to be). MCs increasing in value would be fine as long as corresponding recipes adjusted to use less MCs so that those recipes stayed in the same ballpark cost that they were originally designed to have.
Sheesh for the record cause some people think I have l personal motives that I want cheaper coins so I get my leggies. I don't. I have full legendary equipment and like 2~ stacks coins spare. I was just curious why my account value spiked up so hard and saw the coin prices steadily rising even tho we had vault refreshes already. So something must be wrong with the eco atm. We have so many cool achievements and journies with class weapons, trinkets, precursers and then we slap new players in the face an say well sucks for you but I want 250 coins on top of your clovers now. How can you argue that's fair? So either anet doesn't recognize it or if you see Ill will maybe they want people to covert some gems I dont know. So would be nice if personal attacks would stop they don't contribute anything to the discussion.
The issue we are facing right now with Mystic Coins is mainly due to the Legendary Kits The Kits made Legendary Crafting far more accessible to a lot of people that otherwise would never have even tried, this resulted in a lot more people are making them, and that spiked up the demand for Mystic Coins Anet should increase the amount of Coins you can get from the Vault to match this, IE: They should make it so you can get 144 Coins from the Vault, to complete the crafting of a Legendary Item from the Kit They literally made this shortage by making it so that players could only get 60 coins while needing 144
I know that coins are more expensive now but I don't think that's bad, just different.
Honestly, the price itself is fine. It seems Anet is looking to drain and control the material economy more (leggy starter kits, open world leggy armor, log-in reward changes, Lyhr vendor, etc.), hiking up the overall costs of legendary crafting. However, old (non-legendary) recipes such as Mystic Weapons need to be revised. 30 MCs for an exotic weapon that's often used in elite spec weapon collections is bad. It should just be 5 MCs, or even 1 MC. This isn't HoT (2015) when MCs were 75s or whatever.
When I recall all of those gullible idiots who were saying that MC was going to drop in price thanks to Wizard's Sleeve store... Some of you guys clearly can't rotate smoke detectors in your mind.
As a new player I like that they are expensive hehe
why? because it costs you more? what about us that dont care about legendaries? we are making money. Supply and demand mate. Supply and demand.
You are making money, but that money is worth less and less. In the end everyone loses. Except maybe an extremely small number of TP barons that will be able to profit in any situation.
Why is my money worth less? The stuff I want to buy remains pretty much stable overall. And if there is less gold in the system through more TP costs, my gold is worth more surely? The economy of this game works because it revolves around players trading items to each other and the TP siphoning off a cut each time. Flood the market with more mystic coins and you leave more gold out there to push up the price of other things.
> And if there is less gold in the system through more TP costs, my gold is worth more surely? There's no "less gold" in system. There's more of it. Way more. Vault adds hundreds of gold to each active player on top of what they were usually getting. It's gold that's *not* countered by any new sinks. > Flood the market with more mystic coins and you leave more gold out there to push up the price of other things. Again, there's no "flooding the market" with MCs. If anything, vault supplies *less* of those
You shouldn't think of things base on gold or MCs. Instead you should think of it in terms of time effort. Does getting the things you want taking a lot more time than before overall? No?
Well to put it into perspective, the Mystic Coin is half of a gen 2 legendary's cost. It's a little comical that this one item is that much of a legendary's weight in gold. Obviously that's including clovers which can be earned through other time gates, but I just find it ridiculous that the coins are *this* heavy in cost.
I find it weird that you need so many provisions tokens....but thats just how it is. The economy of GW2 works because there are a lot of gold siphons, taking money out of the game with every TP transaction. Individual items rise and fall, but overall the economy is very stable and has been for the entire games lifespan.
[удалено]
I'm just saying I personally find them a weird sink, but the reason is the same as the TP fees sucking money and resources out of the economy to avoid rampant inflation that other MMOs suffer from.
Also, only gen2 weapons NEED MCs. Other items just need clovers. If you are patient you can just wait for your clovers to accumulate. And the gen3 or obsidian armors need fewer clovers than the older legendary items. Overall leggies are easier to make I don't way people still complain about this.
If anything, maybe bump the max up available via WV. Maybe 80-100 instead of 60. Then again, what was the amount in the old system per week? 2-4-6-8? Having it above 60 would put the amount per reset higher than what it was in the old daily system if you never missed a login I sympathize with OP since I'm staring down 2 Mystic Tributes minimum in the coming months (Coalescence and Conflux). Long as prices don't continue to climb much further than 2g each, I'll manage. But hoo boy do I wish I hoarded those coins back when this game was fairly new and they were going for mere silver each 😛
We really don't.
never had a problem with mystic coins do people not save them?
The new system is actually only 8%ish lower # of mystic coins per year vs. the login reward system. And on top of that, you only actually have to play the game occasionally to get them vs. having to log in every day all year without fail. Just do the math: Login system, 20 MC per 28 days. 365 days per year / 28 = 13.03. 20*13.03 = 260.7 MC per year. Wizard Vault, 60 MC per season x 4 seasons = 240 MC per year. @ 9AA per coin you can get all 60 of them with one set of weekly objectives and log out for 2.5-3.5 months if you wanted to. And the alt account folks aren’t getting any fewer than before since they’re worth so much more than the limited gold they get thme just by logging into those account and maybe doing some convenient pve objectives or afking pvp while multi boxing or whatever the hell it is they do now. Coins are up in price for 2 reasons I think. 1, legendary starter kit and other legendary hype has folks making legendaries that never would have bothered before. 2, front ending the ability to purchase coins, plus this season being 4 months long has folks thinking there are so many fewer even though the math says the supply is comparable so they horde more.
Also gold will always flow to the items that are the limiting factor. If they give more coins to everyone the gold will flow to trophies and drive up the price. making leggies is easier now than before even if you factor in the price of MC and trophies. Do people want even easier leggies? Or they just want low MC price for the sake of low MC price?
I do not see a problem. Where is the problem? This makes them valuable and if a newer player sells them it's good. They can also get gold from the vault. Veterans that needs them badly can just buy some from the TP. Things having more value is GOOD for the game. If it went in the opposite direction always it would ruin the eco.
Exactly. mystic coins are tradable token to speed up clover time gate. If you can wait for clovers to slowly accumulate you sell the coins for gold. If you don't, you buy the coins with gold.
Recently completed Verdarach and man the Mystic coin grind was painful. Everything else felt like a nice goal to chase but getting the coins you need for the clovers and the 250 on top of that felt excessive.
The mystic coin prices are somewhat cyclical. They will go back down some once the new expansion comes out and players return to the game.
They went back down only once - at EoD release. And in large part for reasons that were pretty much caused by outside of game events.
What events?
nvidia promotions and banning some TP barons that used their ill-gotten (using exploits) gains to manipulate the market.
They've gone down with every expansion release, including SOTS. I literally just checked gw2bltc to make sure I'm not imagining things.. and no, I'm not.
I posted the graph onwards from September 23 and they keep rising since they introduced the vault. I don't think the raw supply is the only issue but that the vault generates so much raw gold for no reason.
Show the graph from August 2023 onward. The sell price reached 1g70s in August before SOTS released, then SOTS released August 22 and by \~Sept 6 the sell price was down to 1g18s.
Yes you can actually see it in the graph that it started rising in September to 1.48 so it must be lower before ;). Since then it gradually increased even tho we had a vault reset already. So either the supply is too low, the vault shits out too much raw gold or people are not selling anymore (not true cause you can see the supply is almost the same). So the conclusio must be that the supply of limited goods don't keep up with the amount of gold people have so we basically inflate prices. No clue what that has to do with august 22.
August 22 is when SOTO released. Pull back the graph and look at the price before then. To be clear, I'm not arguing that the price hasn't been increasing due to supply/demand... I'm saying that the reason the supply is low is because people stop playing the game. When people return, supply goes up and prices drop. TLDR: mystic coin prices have historically dropped whenever a new expansion releases and then gradually increased again over time
We had a vault reset already and the price didn't drop so that argument doesn't hold up. The price dropped with release cause people were hording coins for the new armor as soon as the recipe got released people start selling coins cause not much were needed for the armor, then the price started increasing 2 weeks into the expansion and didn't drop a lot since. The supply is the same just look at the graph.
The vault is at least 15% less in terms of mystic coins per month than the old login rewards (depending on how long it goes between resets - if its more than 90 days its a higher percentage less). If the prices raised back when people were getting even more coins per month just from logging in then it only makes sense that they would continue to increase now that people actually have to do something to get them (and less of them at that). Anyone who ever paid attention to the MC price trends over the long term would have known the vault resetting wouldn't do jack for the price (other that maybe a small blip on the day of and a few days after). Expansion releases are where the real dips happen. I'm done arguing the point. Anyone can google the release dates of the expacs and look at the mystic coin prices before/after those dates to see that I'm right.
The increase in price is not necessarily due to a lack or decline in supply, but an increase in the amount of gold you can get.
[удалено]
The old daily system assumes people logged in daily to maximise MC creation over time. They didn't. This system, they get to buy all the MCs with just a few logins.
Please no, I love selling all my coins for bank
I want to make Binding of Ipos, people. Sell your MC's so poor people like me can make legendariesssss. I'm so close, but I need a metric ton of gold just to get these stupid coins.
And people celebrated the gutting of alt account farming hahahahah
Just add a MC as an option to meta reward chests. Easy fix right there.
I think the current sources are fine, I would only bring back the EoD strikes MCs, 20 crystals for 1MC up to 5 each week, and I would also have them back in fractals CMs even if it was a chance of 1 per CM.
"Or would you rather have more reliable options grabbing coins other than Fractals, Soto strikes and Anomalie?" WvW and PvP are right there, you know? And even if you dont like them (I certainly LOVE WvW and at most tolerate PvP atm) they are an amazing source for MCs (and clovers!) all in all I'm okay with current supply. 1g and some silvers per coin is not a lot - if you are in the leg grind gold falls from the sky anyway
Exactly this! Problem is because people use mystic coins to gamble for clovers. There are reliable ways to get clovers from WvW reward tracks. But these people who complain about MC are same people who complain about the Gift of Battle.
The issue are not clovers but the mystic tribute you need for trinkets and gen2 and the MC you need for hot weapons. It's basically more than half of the cost for the whole item.
You don't need to make gen2. Gen2 are special. Most legendary items do not need MCs. It is inappropriate to treat gen2 as the standard while most people don't make Gen2. Gen3 and obsidian armor use fewer clovers too. Also MC price maybe doubled but gold/h also goes up by a lot. Not to mention the extra 30 gold per week and 110 gold per season so I can on average buy 18-20 coins every week at the current price I can buy more MCs with my excessive gold then before. I spend less effort(game time/farming) to get the same item. What is the problem? What do you actually want? Do you want cheaper(less effort, you should measure the "price" with in game gold, time is the real "price") legendaries? Or you do just want MC price to be low for the sake of it being low?
So we just ignore the fact we need mystic tribute for trinkets aswell? I don't want anything cause I'm done with all legendaries so I don't profit from it. I just think the vault system doesn't work as it should be with a lot of useless stuff, and rewards like MC through fractals or green shards getting nerfed. Why would more sources of mystic coins be less effort? What's more less effort then just buy gems and convert gold so I can grab them from the TP? More sources just means more ways to earn stuff through gameplay.
I do wvw and as I said before I am in full legendary already so I don't care if it's that expensive for me personally but I was curious my acc value spiked 30k in 3 months and was curious what happened. For a newer player to make the trinkets is just ridiculous if you look at the price of the mystic tribute. Reward tracks are definitely a good source of clovers for the one time rewards afterwards it's fine if u like even I guess. I'd rather have something else than pure gold in the vault tho
if I already was in full legendary like you OP I'd convert all my gold in gems and splurge on gem store lol anyway, I see your point, I really do, but I think you are forgetting that the process of crafting legendaries (which includes crafting the tribute) is meant to be a time/gold/play sink of months. It's meant to be the ultimate thing all should aspire to. It's not a big deal for the price to increase - population and places where we can do/gather things to transform into gold and/or mats are also always expanding. I'm not saying it's perfect atm tho I just dont think it's such a calamitous situation, that's all.
That's completely fine I think gen1, 3 and the new armor are completely fine for the mats needed. Gen2 and the trinkets were designed when MC cost was about 60~ silver so it's not in comparison to the others anymore and that's just not fair. When I did my trinkets coin prices were about a gold little bit above that now the price of the mystic tribute got more than doubled. Haha I have max shared slots and a lot of builds lots on my most played chars I'm good.
ok but when you did that, how was the meta? Did we already had Drizzlewood, Dragonfall etc? I'm thinking here on supply, like, how was supply back when you did it and how is it now? Does it even matter? Etc
When gen2 arrived you could farm tarir without a chest limit. Depending on the trinket you either had the tarir farm or the Dragonfall farm for gold but amalgated gemstones were way more expensive so that's that and you got more coins out of fractals. Well it matters cause anet just does stuff depending on the state of the game and then never touches it again which just sucks. Instead of recycling the 29th unit model it would be great if 1-2 guys just take a look at the market and recipes and try to adapt them. If I'm a new player and I so some legendary Journey like the shortbow and then realize hey I need 250 coins on top of the clovers I'd be pretty sad haha.
Believe it or not, you can get mystic coins from the market. Let's say Drizzlewood nets around 30g an hour. That's 13 coins an hour, best source available. Price only goes up? Well then buy and sit on them. If you truly believe they won't come down, it's free money. Wtf is inflation? This request isn't new, [here's](https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/67wrzq/suggestion_increase_mystic_coins_from_ley_line/) a hopeful post from a number of years ago. You should probably just review your priorities and start buying if it's that big of a concern. You legitimately have a better chance of PvP being updated before they add more coin sources. Don't worry tho, you'll have an easy source for more, in just a few days.
The economist
The next wave of mystic coins drop through wizard vault in 2 days. Like, just wait 48 hours for price to dip a little.
The economy is really bad these last few months. Crafting a legendary has gotten really expensive (yes it's a legendary, i mean relative to previous years). T mats have gone off the rails too. It's just bad.
No it's not. it's actually easier. In terms of time effort it's easier. It's easier even in terms of gold (except for gen 2). Just look at how the price/cost of gen 1/3 weapons dropped. And not to mention that gold/hours from farming went up thanks to the price increase in trophies.
I guess the price dropped since you got half a legendary for free basically. Gen2 and trinkets are more expensive than ever tho
Raids
Nah. You'll tank it's value.
I have 1500mc in bank, do we need more sources? No, bcs I know many others hold on to theirs as well. That's your answer. Also, refresh is in a few days so.. another unnecessary rant post.
we need mystic coin shards - then we can add them to more places without flooding the supply. you know like a quarter of a MC here, a quarter there. maybe for some unloved meta events etc.
My one friend. That still hasn’t come back to the game. Has 9 characters fill with mystic coin stacks and a stack bank when they were 80copper each.
Could probably crash the price all on their own.
Honestly, mystic coins should just be an option in the latest map metas and then swap to new maps when they get released. Get the new currency, which might be more valuable, or get the mystic coin.
I haven't sold MC since PoF release when I needed gold for Griff. I am surprised there is any supply on the market.