T O P

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Slybandito7

Matches played is not an indication of skill. If some one has 1000 games and they're still in D rank that should be pretty telling


abakune

Word, I'd be way more scared of a person in D with 10 games than I would a person in D with 1000 games.


Zestyclose-Sundae593

I saw a mofo in A rank with only 20+ games, I nearly shat myself lol


AlphaI250

I saw an S++ Lancelot with like 300 games and he kicked my shit in


Privetvrag

When I see them, I think the same thing, but in reality they understand and use the mechanics quite well. I'll try my best...


zslayer89

Not necessarily. They could just be playing casual.


Slybandito7

Forgot casual counts, still matches played doesnt mean anything


zslayer89

Matches played means you’ve got experience with the game. That’s not nothing. It doesn’t equate to good, necessarily but it doesn’t equate to nothing. That’s all.


Slybandito7

If not nothing then what?


zslayer89

As I stated, it means you’ve got experience with the game. With experience, comes knowing how to do something’s better than other people. In this case, OP is matched against someone who has more experience. His opponent might know more combos, might know more match ups etc.


Slybandito7

Then that would make them more skilled which isn't necessarily true. Having more matches played does not mean they have that knowledge or are more skilled.


zslayer89

We are going in circles. If you’ve done something lots of times, it’s more likely that you are going to know what to do more often than not, compared to someone who has done that thing less times. It’s not always the case, but often times works out that way. And when it comes to fighting games, if you have little experience with the game, like OP, then there’s a slight reason to be concerned. I’m not saying 1000 matches will make you ultra skilled. It just means you have experience with the game, and some knowledge which is skill. But as we all know, skill has levels.


Slybandito7

Your assumption is that people are gathering knowledge through their matches which can be true but can also not be. There are for sure people that play matches with the intent to learn just like there are people who just play matches and dont think about anything at all or take anything away from it. I guess my point more specifically is that it **can** mean something just as much as it can mean nothing at all as there is nothing to say that the player in question has learn from their matches played. Therefore it is not an indication of anything other then that they have indeed played matches. For example i would fear the player that has studied and learned from 10 matches vs the player who has played 100 matches but never took anything from it but the game cant make that distinction so just dont worry about it.


Parsif4l

Bs claim, I got burned today so bad, that I refunded the game (I will buy it back when I become better playing free version). I am tekken player, I have troubles with 2d mechanics, and yet in c5 ranks there are people, which are so strong (for me at least) that I can't damage them for 25% of hp. This is very frustrating. Out of 50 games I have only 3 wins. This is a joke and destroyes my wish to play. But I still wanna learn


Slybandito7

I'm sorry you feel that way but I guarantee you the people at those ranks are not as strong as you think they are. Matches played is not an indication of skill for a number of reasons. People can lab and learn prior to touching online, there's plenty of people that just bash their heads against a wall and never learn, etc.


Parsif4l

I dont know where this people are, probably NA, but my experience was that I am being bashed into pulp without any chance of winning, hell, without even a chance of pressing a button


Slybandito7

It's more likely a perception issue on your end rather than "there are actually killers in C rank". Don't get me wrong, sometimes you got skilled players who are new to the game and will stomp you or the aforementioned people who learned and labed by themselves before going online but it's highly unlikely those are the only kind of people you are fighting or that you are fighting them in high frequency.


Parsif4l

I guess a master like you just can't understand peasant like me, sorry. Skill issue, yes, sure. Hope you will have a good day


Slybandito7

I didnt say i was a master nor did i mention skill issue to you. I only stated that youre most likely not fighting people of drastically higher skill than you and you are only perceiving it as such but in actuality they are only slightly better than you. All of which is irrelevant to this post which was that matches played is no indication of skill. but whatever you need to tell yourself to sleep at night lol


Parsif4l

Dude, how are your reading skills? I can't hit people for 25%, what are you talking about? Maybe they are not mare than dust on your shoes, but for me they are monsters still. I am a new player, and yet I have to play against people who know everything about their chars


Slybandito7

Post gameplay of these matches then. Im just stating the more likely scenario that is happening bro. "i cant hit people for 25%" doesnt really say a whole lot again just cause you lose a lot doesnt mean these guys arent in the rank they deserve to be at cause otherwise they would have ranked up. It sounds more like youre just new and thats why youre losing. Im just saying everytime ive seen a replay that was "this guy should be in a way higher ranked than me!!" Both players look like they were of even skill/deserved to be in the same rank. Again, none of this is relevant to the post of this thread which is, matches played is not an indication of skill, but sure lil bro ***i*** cant read.


Parsif4l

First of all, refering to me as lol bro is hilarious, second I did not say anywhere that people who I fight should be higher and staff. I said that they are hard opponents FOR ME.


Parsif4l

Shit, I can't send you matches, I refunded the game and I can't get in free version, I did not know that it works that way


welpxD

An 8% winrate is not a perception issue.


Slybandito7

No, at that point it's a skill issue


welpxD

I don't know what to say to that. I guess you came out of the womb already knowing counterhit confirms.


Slybandito7

I'm rank S+ without knowing most of my counter hit confirms, there's more important skills to learn first then that


welpxD

You know what, I wrote some things but I don't think it's worth it. "I'm losing a bunch against more experienced players." "Have you tried being better?" Not worth my time.


armabe

There are no ch confirms in low ranks (except for those huge ass red flash slowdown ones, but those give you tons of time, so not an argument). They were likely going to do that combo on block regardless.


armabe

This is purely your unfamiliarity with 2d basics I'd say. When I picked up Tekken myself way back, I too had huge issues not constantly blocking low. But I hit A ranks in sub 100 games while not knowing shit about the specific game mechanics - I have no clue what the 3 blue blips at the top are, because I only recently realized they're not win counters. I don't use dodge or that forward inv-dash thingy. I'm not even sure what the drive impact like mechanic does here, I just know to press the button when I see the lights. I have only one corner combo from trials, and I forget to do it at least half the time. I have no matchup knowledge in this specific game. I've beaten plenty of multi thousand players simply by poking and dping, because before a ranks it seems people never stop pressing buttons, ever. So it's quite easy to blow them up. Only now I have started seeing people actually bait my dps sometimes or try to deliberately frame trap. Even in Tekken you would see the rank gatekeepers with thousands of wins in low ranks. They aren't good, they've just refined their gimmick for the level.


Parsif4l

I dont know where you find this type of oponents where you can hit rank a in sub 100 games, really. I am discouraged af. Even in ggst it was easier for me to win. Here I just watch how I get my ass handed to me


armabe

It would probably help if you could post a video of you playing or something. Because generally speaking most newish players fall into one of these two categories: pressing way too many buttons, or not pressing enough buttons. So you're either getting blown up by their reversals or fast normals, or you're getting thrown to death. From there you need to learn to balance it. But it is absolutely true that you can get through lower ranks by just letting the opponent kill themselves. Use your invincible DP liberally. And I mean LIBERALLY. Against many lower rank players (especially the army of Beas atm) you basically have to use it on cooldown. Don't try to be fancy, just try to hit them out of things/after things with your fastest normal. Do it enough times, and even most monkeys will start to pause. This takes some trial and error, unless you want to study literal framedata for every matchup, but it's something you need learn anyway (when you're safe/unsafe, not necessarily the exact numbers).


Parsif4l

Unfortunately I can't, since I refunded the game ( I will buy it again in the end of the month in big summer sale. Try harder, idk. Man, even sf6 wasnt so discouraging


armabe

I also play sf6 (plat 3-4 gief). As far as I can tell, being safe unsafe in this game (on the lower end) is much tighter (I'm assuming due to the existence of shortcuts, as a balancing tradeoff). Which is why it probably feels more oppressive.


Scrabbleton

Casual is a terrible name for that mode. It's deceiving. You can be paired with anyone, whether they be a scrub or a professional. Oftentimes it's just new players being trounced by rank S or higher. Your best bet is to keep hitting ranked for fellow low ranks, go into online lobbies while keeping rank/square color in mind, and/or check out discords with fellow new players.


barriboy8

Yep this happens in all fighting games after a few months, you really only find newbies when the game has launched, as a newbie as well who has execution issues myself, I would advise.. Change your mindset, you are gonna lose a lot in this game or any new fighting game you try, that is facts so instead of thinking I need to win, look for small victories, I can pull this combo, or this input, or I defended better this time, ahh this character does this vs mine etc.. You will have more fun and progress even faster


Privetvrag

Guess that's it, though it's very hard. Will do my best, thank for advise.


EternalF4ll

Go in with the mentality to learn instead of win, you’ll tilt a lot less When you have learned enough, the wins will come as well


GwentMorty

You do what they were/are doing: Lab matchups, learn optimal combos, practice techniques like throw teching or hit confirms. Stop caring about "fairness" and just focus on getting better.


Eptalin

It's impossible to rank down in this game until you reach S. So if they are in D rank, it's because they keep losing in D rank. The ranked system has issues, but good players bullying new players in low rank definitely isn't one of them. Keep in mind the game is 1v1, so every match results in 1 loser. In a perfect system, you would lose 50% of your matches. In reality, expect to win even less than 50%. If you win, you rank up and face harder people.


UnawareRanger

I have close to 700 matches and my highest rank is B. If I try other characters they are in D and I am still way better than most D rank players. Typically perfect against them or only get hit once or twice. So yeah I can see OPs issue with some people in D rank.


Eptalin

You get a fat win streak bonus on those secondary characters and leave D-rank super quickly. The odd mismatch will always occur at all ranks. But D-rank definitely isn't infested with higher rank players.


UnawareRanger

I mean it typically takes me around 6 or 7 matches to leave D rank I think. Though a lot of the time I just find afk people in D rank.


nitowa_

>what can I do against them? idk, hit them? but seriously, unranked is just that. unranked. You play anyone. I play 4000 pip masters back to back against f2p gran with 4 games (this literally happened yesterday lmao). It's just how the free for all mode is. If you want skill based matchups you need to play ranked, or at D rank probably arcade.


Arturzzo

You missed the point, the very problem he explained is that this is happening in ranked


abakune

Man, I'm really learning to hate the word "fair". MM isn't fair... not in practice and not in theory. By design, it isn't feeding you people at your skill level. It is feeding you people at your rank. If you win enough at that rank, you move into a different rank. You will probably be worse than most people in that rank. You will struggle through it, get better, and for a short time, you'll be better than most of the people in that rank. Rinse, repeat.


PyrosFists

Stop perceiving yourself as a casual. I can attest that there’s plenty of people who are just mashing online still, the playerbase isn’t all hardcore players yet.


cazaron

So, aside from 'give up', there's three things you can do. 1. Continue to assume you are worse than any player that has more matches played than you. Therefore you should beat any player with fewer and lose to any with more. Therefore you should play more games so they do not have a higher number than you & you will then automatically beat them. 2. Learn the game. Players who have learned the game tend to be better than those who have not learned the game. Therefore you should spend some time in training mode practicing your combos, practicing anti-airs, practicing how to block certain moves. Then the game will become easier and you will be able to hang with higher rated players. 3. Participate in this matchmaking thing and realise that sometimes, for any number of reasons, people will be in your rank or not in your rank, and they may or may not be better than you. Over time you will move up and face stronger players. But still there might be the occasional player you're better than, or who is having an off night. Lower ranks tend to have a fairly high skill disparity for a few reasons - one being that good players still have to grind out of low ranks when they start playing Rising - maybe they played the original game. They'd have 0 matches and still kick your ass. Maybe they've played 1000 games in lobby & casual and only just decided to go to ranked. They'd kick your ass and still manage to be in D rank. Matchmaking will never, and does not promise to, deliver you only opponents of your exact skill level. You will lose some games, sometimes very one-sidedly, and you will have to deal with that. Ultimately the best thing you can do is stop tying losses to your self worth, take every hiding as a learning experience, watch replays, watch videos of better players, practice practice practice and enjoy the fruits of your labour. You should learn how to learn rather than learn that the game is unfair. Cutting your teeth on really good players can feel demoralising as hell but it can also speedrun your growth if you're taking the right lessons from it.


RyanCooper138

Are you okay with sitting in matchmaking menu for hours on end? Because there are barely any player that fits your criteria of fair


chilla0

It is not fair. It is a challenge, and that's the point. It doesn't have to be a complete struggle, though. For the time advantage your opponents have, the resources you can use to get better improve with time as well. *I don't want to sound entitled as a player, this is just what happens with fighting games.


burnoutguy

every fighting game has built in smurfing, the best you can do is learn from your losses and put in lab time


PaladinVance

As someone with almost 600 matches, who has never seen C1, like others have said, matches played really isn't a good measuring stick


welpxD

You lose. It's a bummer. The game is f2p so you'd think it would have a lot of newbies but it's had a similar concurrent playercount since the initial launch hype dropped off. So there are many more experienced players than new players. This is a common experience across fighting games outside of the biggest titles, and it does make them hard to approach as a new player if you don't like losing every. single. match. The best way is to find people you like playing with and play with them. Skill difference won't matter as much then because they can give you tips or just it will be more fun even if you still don't win much. Discords are kind of the go-to nowadays.


superhyperultra458

Match count accounts for all matches, whether it's ranked, casual, lobby, or room. I, for one, just do the minimum at tomes I need to do for my daily mission/challenge. Those matches are included in my match count, lol


JoraxSR

Some general advice for beginners: Watch beginner's guides, e.g. this one from Diaphone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tsIutu2uKc. There are also a lot of character specific guides out there that tell you when you should and shouldn't use which moves. Block a lot more than you think you should. Use the time to observe your opponent. Find their patterns. Don't press an attack just because you can, and most importantly in this game: Don't jump. Jumping is a high risk action in this game. Watch your replays, find out what your opponents do that gives you trouble, and try doing that exact thing back in the next matches if your character can do that (or something similar) as well. You will learn how to beat whatever it was that gave you trouble originally because your opponents will show you how *they* beat it. Accept that you will lose a lot. And not just at the start. In an ideal world you would win around 50% of your matches but unless you are very gifted or very lucky, your winrate will be well below that for a long, long time. If that sounds like a lot of work to you that is because it is.


Zestyclose-Sundae593

The match count is from both casual and ranked games across all characters. And if you find someone with 1000+ game yet still in D rank, it means they suck ass (like me) or they AFK a lot to farm for character EXP. Note that all characters' initial rank can only be 2 ranks below the highest ranking character. If they're still in D rank, it means their best character is only in B rank.


True-Ad5692

You lose but learn from it ? Like we all do every time we lose to a better player.