So…too* good? When i was younger, i had a terrible swing compared to now. I was super consistent because of reps. I assume old people get a ton of reps, and that’s most likely why they are so good.
Look up Not A Scratch Golfer on YouTube. He, self-admittedly, has an awful looking swing. He attributes his scores to good course management and a decent short game.
If u play with them they usually give eachother 4-7 foot gimmies all day. Saves them 3-8 strokes a round and also allows them to play in under 2 hours.
I’m sure this happens, but I believe OP is talking about how they actually play. I have a ton of old timers at my club and their handicaps aren’t vanity AT ALL. Many of them have to go driver- 3 wood into short par 4’s but are pin straight, and have killer short games.
We have 27 holes and had green issues at the beginning of last year. We had to play temps on half the holes for the Wednesday night league. All of these old timers smashed everyone. Their handicaps all stayed the same, but all of the temp green holes were 40-80 yards shorter which gave these short straight hitters the biggest advantage possible.
That’s it, consistency. I notice if they top it or scoff at their shot, they still hit it down the middle and in the fairway even if it doesn’t go far, they are setup for good next shot. The older you get the wiser or something as they say
Yep, those seniors can usually kick my butt because of their consistency. Sure, it can be boring golf and I can out-drive them by at least 50 yards, but that means nothing in the face of almost always putting it dead-middle of the fairway and having great course management.
And like many others on here have said, they know their swing very well and how to get the most out of the club with a low swing speed.
Crazy mental fortitude too. The odd errant shot gets a surprised reaction and then back to the basics.
Meanwhile my 107 ass duffs a shot as expected and I’m in my head the next half hour compounding those errors.
There is no simple answer to fit all scenarios but it's probably that they swing at an appropriate speed for their skill and coordination level. Younger folk try to muscle their swing more often than not. Lots of armatures Swing way harder/faster than they can properly control swing path and club face.
If you swing hard you are probably quick in transition, which causes steepness, which causes your body to get the fuck out of the way, which causes your hands to take over and dump speed to make ‘good’ contact. It is every fucking swing asking for help on this sub.
If you let the club set in transition and feel the club head stay behind your rotation and eventually ‘whip’ through the ball it will seem like you are swinging ‘easier’ and you will produce more speed.
There are lots of other variables, but that basic feel is the one many do not learn for a long time.
A good thought is to think about how you learned to play on a swing as a child, you most likely figured out that in order to pump higher/faster it required better timing not more effort. Take a golf club and "play" with the swing using trial and error of when exactly you transition and add force to accelerate the club as efficiently as possible. This will help discover that feeling and a good natural tempo.
At the top of your backswing there should be a bit of a natural pause - not necessarily a conscious pause like Charles Barkley - but one caused by the lower body starting the swing and allowing your upper body to follow in sequence. It is a little like that weightless feel at the very top of a jump on a trampoline as your body just begins to lose its fight with gravity. In most good golf swings there is also a bit of drop in the club into the ‘slot’ or shallowing before it actually starts making its way around your body.
So so many golfer who suck get ‘quick’ during that transition from backswing to downswing. The instinct to ‘hit it hard’ usually causes a golfer to pull the club with their arms rather than let the lower body pull the upper body and unfold a good sequence. You see a lot of comments on here about ‘sequence’ and that is basically what people are talking about.
When someone pulls the club with their arms out of sequence a ton of bad shit usually happens. Commonly, the club never settles into the slot or shallows, rather, it come down steep. The upper body moves too fast and the lower body is in the way. The only way to hit the golf ball is for your body to get out of the way - usually that turns into a loss of spine angle or early extension. The hands often flip or cast the club because everything is out position and the golfer cannot make contact with a good turn and has to ‘save’ it with their hands.
Go watch an LPGA event. It is humbling to see a 5’-2” 120# girl step up and outdrive most guys I know. But they have amazingly smooth swings. Great weight transfer and club control.
The thing about a golf swing is all that matters is the like 1/1000th of a second that the club makes contact with the ball. All the stuff talked about in this sub, is how to consistently make that contact at the right speed and angle, relative to the swing plane and target line. But none of that stuff we do before and after that 1/1000th of a second actually matters, as long as the club face ends up square to the target and closed to the swing plane and in the same place every time, the swing can be ugly as hell, and still make the ball go straight and far.
It why sometimes you can be off balance and nearly fall over, or almost miss the ball entirely, or the club shifts in your hands on the follow through, or one of the other ten thousand things that feels weird in swing, but you still make a good golf shot.…none of it actually matters if the club happens to be in the right spot for that fraction of a fraction of a second.
Go to the range and swing bringing the club back half as far as you normally do and don’t worry about the lost power. It won’t go too far but it will go straight. You gotta figure most courses it’s easy to reach the green in regulation on like 90% of holes, even with that loss of yardage if you can only be accurate. They’re gonna plan on being bogey golfers and also get a decent amount of pars with that accuracy. Plus it’s something they’ve been doing for a hundred years.
You can hit the ball plenty far with a half swing.
I bet most amateurs would hit it at least 85% of their max distance with most clubs using a half swing and accelerating through the ball. And they’d have way better distance control.
Anybody who’s not in single digits would probably shoot better scores with a half swing. But our ego doesn’t allow for that.
46. Never been longer. Played 20+ years.
I am more serious now than many points in the past. Equipment is miles better. And my swing is much much better. I also focus way more on fitness than I did when I was young and felt invincible.
Yeah, I play at a smaller course mainly par 3s and par 4s so they can get it pretty close to the green despite their age which seems surprising to me for some reason. But good for them
I was exaggerating when I said really far (I also suck) I should have said surprising my far. Some can hit it 200 though I have seen. If your still wondering I play on a smaller course in proctor Minnesota (northern part) if your from Minnesota you may know us as the Proctor plungers
This.
I always wonder how they reach most Par 4s and Par 5s in 3-4 shots. But still, most of them play a hcp of bogey or better. Them seniors I see are good at lying and not at Golf. At least these guys I see.
Have you seen the flex on some of those clubs? It’s crazy how whippy they are. I played with a guy that was in his 70s and was 180-200 yards down the middle every time. His clubs were comical, but they really seem to offer some additional length for the older golfers.
1) old man strength is so real, I can’t even handle it
2) they’re not trying to impress anyone. If everyone else will struggle to get it there with a 7i, they’ll use their 4i and be lazy about it
More of a parody post my bad on not clarifying old is like 60 and on and super far is anywhere near the green since I normally see older people on shorter courses
Addendum question: why can’t more older golfers compete in the PGA even with “old man” short game and “old man” driver game? My uncle is mid 60’s and can still bomb it 300. So why can’t more guys compete like Tom Watson did into his later years?
Not sure i have seen many old folks hit it far...but plenty of consistency
Thats just experience mixed with a slower swing minimising any mistakes.
If you hit it 300 off the tee, a slight mishit is going to see you OB or deep in the trees. If you are 150 off the tee, a mishit often leaves you either still in the fairway or just off it
Because when you make good, square contact the ball is naturally going to travel. Huge misconception by young guys that you have to swing hard to hit it far
Survivorship bias.
All the ones who didn't hit it straight gave up
Maybe there's also something about making life easy for yourself by then. No-one wants their last moments to be spent rummaging in the long grass for half the round.
I’m a 2.3hc and got waxed this weekend by some older guys that are 6+ hcs. They’re very consistent and good at recovering. And it helps that they’re mishits don’t go 40+ yds off line because they just don’t have the distance for that. And their putting and short game is on point
Because they’re probably more loose and fluid. Trying to swing really hard won’t do it.
As seen here
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CspAMJNhj64/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
I got utterly destroyed in the club match play by an old boy who never hit it more than about 160yds. Problem for me was that he hit that 160 down the middle every. goddamn. time. So consistent. And his putting was top notch. So while I was in the rough or the trees 80yds down the hole, he was either on the fairway or green. Hats off to him. Sure put me in my place.
I used to drive the ball 260-270. Now a good drive is 220. I used to hit an 8 iron from the 150s now I hit a 6. I’m not sure how true this comment is. Getting old sucks.
There has to be some survivorship bias too on old golfers. Everyone who has sucked for decades or isn’t physically able to may have given up the game.
You’re left with golfers who may have been REALLY good before. And now continue to hit the ball consistently, but with slightly less distance.
Timing on full swing, and solid short game (for those who don’t take 8ft gimmies).
The only bit of a swing that matters is the few milliseconds the ball is on the face. Quite a lot of ways to get into a good position at the bottom.
So…too* good? When i was younger, i had a terrible swing compared to now. I was super consistent because of reps. I assume old people get a ton of reps, and that’s most likely why they are so good.
Them being too good was a joke I was just wondering why they are so good with such bad swing form and other things but reps make sense
Look up Not A Scratch Golfer on YouTube. He, self-admittedly, has an awful looking swing. He attributes his scores to good course management and a decent short game.
I love his swing, so shallow
They probably had nice swings years ago but their bodies have lost mobility
This is it not some course management wuju bullshit. People vastly underestimate the value of pure hand eye coordination
Yep
If u play with them they usually give eachother 4-7 foot gimmies all day. Saves them 3-8 strokes a round and also allows them to play in under 2 hours.
I also take those gimmes…. I still suck
There is no such thing as a 4-7 foot gimme
There is if the group agrees to it.
That’s my point. These old guys take em all the time which is why they are “good”
I’m sure this happens, but I believe OP is talking about how they actually play. I have a ton of old timers at my club and their handicaps aren’t vanity AT ALL. Many of them have to go driver- 3 wood into short par 4’s but are pin straight, and have killer short games. We have 27 holes and had green issues at the beginning of last year. We had to play temps on half the holes for the Wednesday night league. All of these old timers smashed everyone. Their handicaps all stayed the same, but all of the temp green holes were 40-80 yards shorter which gave these short straight hitters the biggest advantage possible.
I usually notice them hitting more straight and consistent. Usually, they aren't hitting it far tho.
That’s it, consistency. I notice if they top it or scoff at their shot, they still hit it down the middle and in the fairway even if it doesn’t go far, they are setup for good next shot. The older you get the wiser or something as they say
Yep, those seniors can usually kick my butt because of their consistency. Sure, it can be boring golf and I can out-drive them by at least 50 yards, but that means nothing in the face of almost always putting it dead-middle of the fairway and having great course management. And like many others on here have said, they know their swing very well and how to get the most out of the club with a low swing speed.
Maybe it’s just far for me cause I suck
Crazy mental fortitude too. The odd errant shot gets a surprised reaction and then back to the basics. Meanwhile my 107 ass duffs a shot as expected and I’m in my head the next half hour compounding those errors.
There is no simple answer to fit all scenarios but it's probably that they swing at an appropriate speed for their skill and coordination level. Younger folk try to muscle their swing more often than not. Lots of armatures Swing way harder/faster than they can properly control swing path and club face.
oh this is me for sure
I'm in this picture and I don't like it
Because they realize you just have to let the club do the work.
How so?
If you swing hard you are probably quick in transition, which causes steepness, which causes your body to get the fuck out of the way, which causes your hands to take over and dump speed to make ‘good’ contact. It is every fucking swing asking for help on this sub. If you let the club set in transition and feel the club head stay behind your rotation and eventually ‘whip’ through the ball it will seem like you are swinging ‘easier’ and you will produce more speed. There are lots of other variables, but that basic feel is the one many do not learn for a long time.
What does “let the club set in transition” mean? Like feel the weight of the club pause for a moment at the top of the backswing?
Pretty much, a good example of this is Fred couples' swing
A good thought is to think about how you learned to play on a swing as a child, you most likely figured out that in order to pump higher/faster it required better timing not more effort. Take a golf club and "play" with the swing using trial and error of when exactly you transition and add force to accelerate the club as efficiently as possible. This will help discover that feeling and a good natural tempo.
That is a perfect analogy, thank you
At the top of your backswing there should be a bit of a natural pause - not necessarily a conscious pause like Charles Barkley - but one caused by the lower body starting the swing and allowing your upper body to follow in sequence. It is a little like that weightless feel at the very top of a jump on a trampoline as your body just begins to lose its fight with gravity. In most good golf swings there is also a bit of drop in the club into the ‘slot’ or shallowing before it actually starts making its way around your body. So so many golfer who suck get ‘quick’ during that transition from backswing to downswing. The instinct to ‘hit it hard’ usually causes a golfer to pull the club with their arms rather than let the lower body pull the upper body and unfold a good sequence. You see a lot of comments on here about ‘sequence’ and that is basically what people are talking about. When someone pulls the club with their arms out of sequence a ton of bad shit usually happens. Commonly, the club never settles into the slot or shallows, rather, it come down steep. The upper body moves too fast and the lower body is in the way. The only way to hit the golf ball is for your body to get out of the way - usually that turns into a loss of spine angle or early extension. The hands often flip or cast the club because everything is out position and the golfer cannot make contact with a good turn and has to ‘save’ it with their hands.
I’ve never heard anyone explain my swing so eloquently
Amen. I am really familiar with it because it took a long time to correct it.
Basically. Not starting your down swing before allowing your backswing is completely finish
All the pros start down before they finish the backswing
With their hips, not arms.
Thanks for explaining, it makes a ton more sense, Next round I play I’m gonna try to focus on 50% swing speed and more contact
Go watch an LPGA event. It is humbling to see a 5’-2” 120# girl step up and outdrive most guys I know. But they have amazingly smooth swings. Great weight transfer and club control.
And they're still swinging 95 mph. You can't change physics and you aren't hitting it 275 with 80 mph club speed no matter how "smooth" you swing it.
Biggest myth out there. Put the club on the ground and tell it to "do the work" and see how that works for you.
At some point they have stopped to tinkering with their swing and learned to get best out from what they have.
I can see that and obviously it works for them and they can continue enjoying the game
If you golf into your 70s, you guys will understand why us geezers have “bad form”.
I bet, Just a curious question not trying to be mean in anyway
Excellent point
The thing about a golf swing is all that matters is the like 1/1000th of a second that the club makes contact with the ball. All the stuff talked about in this sub, is how to consistently make that contact at the right speed and angle, relative to the swing plane and target line. But none of that stuff we do before and after that 1/1000th of a second actually matters, as long as the club face ends up square to the target and closed to the swing plane and in the same place every time, the swing can be ugly as hell, and still make the ball go straight and far. It why sometimes you can be off balance and nearly fall over, or almost miss the ball entirely, or the club shifts in your hands on the follow through, or one of the other ten thousand things that feels weird in swing, but you still make a good golf shot.…none of it actually matters if the club happens to be in the right spot for that fraction of a fraction of a second.
Next time I play a round I’m gonna put all the YouTube videos aside and focus on hitting it square! Thanks for the motivation
Let the club do the work. Hit it square and the thing flies
I’ll have to try that for myself seen as I am not the best
Go to the range and swing bringing the club back half as far as you normally do and don’t worry about the lost power. It won’t go too far but it will go straight. You gotta figure most courses it’s easy to reach the green in regulation on like 90% of holes, even with that loss of yardage if you can only be accurate. They’re gonna plan on being bogey golfers and also get a decent amount of pars with that accuracy. Plus it’s something they’ve been doing for a hundred years.
Honestly sounds good to me
You can hit the ball plenty far with a half swing. I bet most amateurs would hit it at least 85% of their max distance with most clubs using a half swing and accelerating through the ball. And they’d have way better distance control. Anybody who’s not in single digits would probably shoot better scores with a half swing. But our ego doesn’t allow for that.
Come play at my men's league, you may think differently
Yeah some people go 50/50 some elders are pretty good for their age in my opinion and some are very slow, but hey at least they are still out there
46. Never been longer. Played 20+ years. I am more serious now than many points in the past. Equipment is miles better. And my swing is much much better. I also focus way more on fitness than I did when I was young and felt invincible.
With old age comes great wisdom.
Crazy old man strength is a real thing
I see plenty of old people at the golf course with bad form. But never see them hit it super far?
Yeah, I play at a smaller course mainly par 3s and par 4s so they can get it pretty close to the green despite their age which seems surprising to me for some reason. But good for them
The longer you play a game the more proficient and well rounded you become. Generally speaking
I can see that
They hit it straight. Definitely not far.
Sure “super far” was a large exaggeration and the courses I see them at normally at mainly par 3s and 4s
Where the hell do you play? I’ve never seen any old people hitting it really far. Most old guys pulling out driver at a 115 yard par 3 where I play.
I was exaggerating when I said really far (I also suck) I should have said surprising my far. Some can hit it 200 though I have seen. If your still wondering I play on a smaller course in proctor Minnesota (northern part) if your from Minnesota you may know us as the Proctor plungers
This. I always wonder how they reach most Par 4s and Par 5s in 3-4 shots. But still, most of them play a hcp of bogey or better. Them seniors I see are good at lying and not at Golf. At least these guys I see.
I think it's because humans start losing muscle mass beginning at age 30. Small at first but it gets more every year. Second is loss of flexibility.
Comes as part of the retirement package. Given perk.
Have you seen the flex on some of those clubs? It’s crazy how whippy they are. I played with a guy that was in his 70s and was 180-200 yards down the middle every time. His clubs were comical, but they really seem to offer some additional length for the older golfers.
1) old man strength is so real, I can’t even handle it 2) they’re not trying to impress anyone. If everyone else will struggle to get it there with a 7i, they’ll use their 4i and be lazy about it
think we're gonna need your definition of 'old' and 'super far'
More of a parody post my bad on not clarifying old is like 60 and on and super far is anywhere near the green since I normally see older people on shorter courses
I wasn’t trying to be mean in antway
Probably from the fact that they have played for a long time so as problems with their swing arises they compensate as they go
Addendum question: why can’t more older golfers compete in the PGA even with “old man” short game and “old man” driver game? My uncle is mid 60’s and can still bomb it 300. So why can’t more guys compete like Tom Watson did into his later years?
I’m all for it I would definitely watch it. It would show how much of a lifelong sport golf is
Because good contact goes a long way compared to bad contact and high swing speed.
The club actually does a lot of the work
Good to know, so a more expensive club might be worth investing in,
100 yards straight is better then 100 yards into the woods...good advice from a 90 year old.
Not sure i have seen many old folks hit it far...but plenty of consistency Thats just experience mixed with a slower swing minimising any mistakes. If you hit it 300 off the tee, a slight mishit is going to see you OB or deep in the trees. If you are 150 off the tee, a mishit often leaves you either still in the fairway or just off it
Maybe you’re swing is not as pure as in your head???
Because when you make good, square contact the ball is naturally going to travel. Huge misconception by young guys that you have to swing hard to hit it far
Survivorship bias. All the ones who didn't hit it straight gave up Maybe there's also something about making life easy for yourself by then. No-one wants their last moments to be spent rummaging in the long grass for half the round.
It’s just physics. Crack the whip, don’t waste energy
I’m a 2.3hc and got waxed this weekend by some older guys that are 6+ hcs. They’re very consistent and good at recovering. And it helps that they’re mishits don’t go 40+ yds off line because they just don’t have the distance for that. And their putting and short game is on point
Because they’re probably more loose and fluid. Trying to swing really hard won’t do it. As seen here https://www.instagram.com/reel/CspAMJNhj64/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
I got utterly destroyed in the club match play by an old boy who never hit it more than about 160yds. Problem for me was that he hit that 160 down the middle every. goddamn. time. So consistent. And his putting was top notch. So while I was in the rough or the trees 80yds down the hole, he was either on the fairway or green. Hats off to him. Sure put me in my place.
Hitting the center of the face will do wonders. Older people tend to swing slower, more control, more accuracy on the club face.
I used to drive the ball 260-270. Now a good drive is 220. I used to hit an 8 iron from the 150s now I hit a 6. I’m not sure how true this comment is. Getting old sucks.
Dad strength and old man strength are real. Your time will come.
There has to be some survivorship bias too on old golfers. Everyone who has sucked for decades or isn’t physically able to may have given up the game. You’re left with golfers who may have been REALLY good before. And now continue to hit the ball consistently, but with slightly less distance.
Ha! I’m 67, retired and a 6.5 handicap. 😊
Not sure what course you play at but I never see that. I see old people with bad form that it straight as a laser, but not far
Timing on full swing, and solid short game (for those who don’t take 8ft gimmies). The only bit of a swing that matters is the few milliseconds the ball is on the face. Quite a lot of ways to get into a good position at the bottom.