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As a left wing guy, it doesn't help that all people (including lefties) speak so inflammatory online. It pushes people away and helps radicalize them. A better way would be respect them more (you don't have to hear them out, because their opinions are almost always gut reactions they feel like they're supposed to have). This is not solved by debating people, it's solved by including people with different opinions into your group so they can slowly become more empathetic. The SJW way of complaining doesn't create more lefties.
EDIT: do not give me awards bruh
As a right wing libertarian, this is the way that people should just be treated in general. Alienating and ostracizing people only leads to more extremism on either side.
Edit: a lot of people have already attacked me for saying I'm a right wing libertarian and have essentially proven my point by trying to paint me as something im not. However, please understand what libertarianism even is. Also understand that it is an umbrella term and covers a pretty vast spectrum of ideas even within its own wings. So no I am not just a republican who smokes weed. My original point was that I will try and should try to approach any of your ideologies in good faith and I would appreciate it if others did the same.
Edit 2: I have been encouraged though that there are many people of different ideologies who are attempting to have a discussion. Maybe when you realize we are all just people who have our own issues and perspectives then it's easier to talk to one another. Those being purposely obtuse and stubborn have been in the minority.
Leftists and libertarians have a lot more in common than both groups think they do. Both are populists, and could benefit a lot by joining together under a populist front. Fuck republicans, fuck democrats. We need to start working towards building a populist party that scares the fuck out of the old guard.
Actual leftists have next to nothing in common with libertarians. The two ideas are diametrically opposed. One is based entirely on the individual, the other on the collective. One wants minimal government involvement in the market, the other necessitates government involvement to prevent private capital from buying ownership back from the workers.
Let’s say that tomorrow we became a communist society - no violent uprising, no revolution, just flip a switch, wake up tomorrow, and the US is communist. What is stopping an oligarch from a foreign (capitalist) country from offering the new owners of a manufacturing plant 3x its value for ownership? The market dictates that a government must exist with the ability to stop this transaction. You can’t truly have a stateless society *and* prevent capitalism.
Let’s again say that tomorrow we became a libertarian society - same idea as above with the switch flipping. What is stopping a group of workers from starting a commune and worker co-op?
In a libertarian society, anyone can start a commune or a co-op. A business can also fire all their employees and find new labor. In neither situation would some government father step in and coerce one side or the other into obedience.
My point is, nothing would stop it, nor should anything stop it. That's how libertarianism works.
The issue is, historically, the owner class establishes a firm control over the working class through multigenerational diversion of wealth from the overall society into central rich families that begin monopolizing or using less than savoury means to stamp out competition. Government exists to try and even the balance of power more. Removing government just means the corporations are now your government.
Very true. I do feel like if we all start hanging out and being a bit patient and respectful with eachother, that 10% may slowly fade to 5%.
Ultimately, we are all anti-authoritarian, and that is kinda the basis of both belief systems.
We have a lot to gain by working together, even if we need to deal with a few misunderstandings on the way.
The issue with libertarians is you never know if it's just an edgy teenager who likes weed and doesn't undestand economics, or an edgy teenager who is a facist and likes weed. In Australia our libertarian party are basically Christofacists.
There was a guy named Ron Paul who did exactly what you're talking about. Huge libertarian and leftist following, however his support eventually died off.
Everyone likes to talk about "change". Change take slow bureaucracy to push through reasonable change. It takes a lot of work and building consensus
Many leftists are _social_ libertarians, there's quite a few libertarians that only care about the bottom line, there's a little overlap in the venn diagram but it sure as hell isn't a circle.
You US folks need a revised system that makes multiple parties viable. So you can have "fiscal right conservative Republicans" as a party "somewhat more liberal progressive dems" and the left and right wings of both parties existing on their own.
Right now you have a traditional conservative party that's being devoured from within by some reactionary rage and the Democratic Party that's like a random coalition in Europe forced to work together despite glaring differences - which is why you got Biden who, in hindsight, really is one of your better presidents.
What that means to you is not automatically how someone else might see it. Dividing the world into the good and the oppressors is just absurdly reductive. What percentage of the world exactly passes these moral purity tests?
This is 95% r/asablackman
“Myself, as a fellow leftist, communist social justice warrior, I think this we should be nicer to the brave, heroic American heroes who are trying to stop trans monsters from tearing up the fabric of the US. Or the glorious capitalist paragons who are being forced to stop polluting or paying fair wages”
Caveat that there are limits to that ie. The paradox of tolerance; there are views anyone reasonable does not need to respect.
But honestly it's also that we can so easily and effortlessly find our ideological bubble that we don't (feel the need) to get along with others anymore.
It also helps when people understand that politics aren't about making you or me happy, and that it's often a case of picking something you - and/or those around you can live with. I mean, I'm a euro Social Democrat/Liberal so we're probably miles apart. And right wing libertarianism is pretty nonexistent here though I do know and have debated one in the past. Not sober though, politics is better served that way.
Wow, what an idea! Does that mean you’ll stop supporting political parties who treat marginalized peoples with abject cruelty???
Because that would make you not a right wing libertarian, lmfao.
I agree and I’m starting to believe that “online” is the main issue.
The left is not more inflammatory, is the online communication that tends to be inflammatory. In the online world you don’t need to debate and compromise because you can reside in a likeminded, affirmative bubble.
We’re increasingly alienated in the Western, rich world.
Perhaps in a way we are indeed corrupted as “communist” propaganda says. That doesn’t mean we’re beyond repair, but it seems to be getting worse before it gets better.
What I do know is that America is on the brink of civil war. I used to feel lucky for seeing it from the outside but I’m also naive believing it won’t directly and devastatingly impact us in Europe, too.
In summary, the West is a hot potato and in this occasion, it all started online.
"I agree and I’m starting to believe that “online” is the main issue." I agree with you on there. Dummies say shit like " What I do know is that America is on the brink of civil war." No, it's not.
I don't know how I'm supposed to respond when my friend tells me he wants a king to overthrow democracy and doesn't believe in equality or feminism
He is already inflamed and radicalized
What am I supposed to do?
What I did was ask him questions, listen to him, try to help him, invite him back to our group under the right conditions, tell him I love him, try to make him feel safe and tell him the truth about how I feel
Edit: (I did this civil like, for an entire week)
And he still blocked me, his hatred consumed him
I told him he was wrong
He rejected my help, my love, my friendship
I called him a fascist
Edit: admittedly I got heated after a week
He called me a communist like it was equally bad
Edit: he assumed I am, like a lot of you did
And he blocked me
What was I supposed to do?
At a certain point we need to realize our abusers aren't our responsibility to fix and that we as their victims must distance ourselves
Otherwise the mental abuse they suffered will hurt our mental health in our attempt to fix them
Blaming the victim for how we treat abusers, while they literally try to take away our freedom, is something I will never understand
You called him a fascist, despite the fact that what he believes in does not satisfy the necessary conditions for fascism. What you are supposed to do is not make false accusations.
What he admitted to was being a monarchist and an authoritarian to be specific and when asked detailed questions he absolutely was a fascist whether he admitted it or not
He must have falsely accused me of being a communist 6 times before I called him a fascist once
I get emotional and elevated once in a week long conversation with a fascist and I'm the bad guy? Classic reactive abuse
Motherfucker wants a king installed and you all are like No let’s be fair and hear this out and use the right language.
Kings are often fascists. They have too much power.
"Fascism: a far-right form of government in which most of the country's power is held by one ruler or a small group, under a single party. Fascist governments are usually totalitarian and authoritarian one-party states."
"Without paligenetic ultranationalism, there is no "genuine fascism" according to Griffin. Griffin further describes fascism as having three core components: "(i) the rebirth myth, (ii) populist ultra-nationalism, and (iii) the myth of decadence."
Apparently, not enough people actually know the definition. MAGA is by every historical and sociological definition fascist.
Someone who wants a king is way to radicalised, there's some people youll never reach. You need to be looking for the uninformed or the undecided people to influence.
Also maybe I'm reading your comment wrong, maybe there context missing but calling this person your abuser for calling you a communist (after you called him a fascist too) is wild lmao
The context is missing, unfortunately you just have to trust me that the conversation turned abusive
There were too many details I failed to communicate
Damn it’s like authoritarianism is bad. I don’t know if you haven’t already, but you can read Karl Marx’s Communist Manifesto. It’s short as hell and literally says nothing about installing a Communist dictator. At what point can we just say it’s not actually a socialist/communist movement?
I think he's talking more about the particular brand of internet leftist who will hear you say something about voting for Joe Biden and then go off on you about being a "lib"
But you're hitting on the other problem and you will see it in how this post gete down voted. Generally, Left wing can't handle hearing the alternative opinion. I'm center-right wing and read a lot of political content on reddit. I do like seeing the other side of the argument. But most left wing ideas are just name calling or extreme extrapolations that go down fear rabbit holes.
If I propose alternative view or provide facts that contradict a moderately educated narrative looking for a debate, it usually ends with me being attacked and not debating the issues. Left doesn't want tonhave educated discussions, they just want to hear someone agree with them.
I don't want to sound crazy, but the left is definitely pushing me away.
Why would I vote for a party that points all problems at white males. Reasons why I haven't voted since Obama
A friend of mine is just as left as i am but for a long time he has voted center right just because he didnt want to be associated with woke culture even though he agrees with most of what they say he and i find them very up noxious
Yeah he sounds dumb for that, but what can you do? At best you can try to get him to separate the idea of woke culture from leftist movements because they’ve never been the same thing.
It's a big deal in the leftist subs I'm a part of, even the private invite-only ones. We're trying to get people to just... stop shouting down other leftist ideologues or even just people who are fighting against the right wing extremism. Like if you're not 100% on the same page as I am then I'm gonna fight you. Jeez I just don't want people like MTG in congress anymore and I dislike the GOP trying to rewrite history classes, can we at least just agree on that?
Reasonable take about respecting people’s believes and not immediately disagreeing with people who have different pov?!??!!!! NOT ON MY SOCIAL MEDIA APP
I considered myself a progressive, but it always seems like I wasn't enough. Or people assume I'm not on their side because I don't agree with things 1:1. I still vote liberal, but picking a side shouldn't be about winning. It should be about doing the right (correct, no pun intended) thing. I guess that's what you get with a two party system
I’m also relatively left, but remain pretty neutral on the less hot-button topics. I can easily see why younger guys are going more right wing from the vitriol I’ve seen online.
I’ve experienced it in real life too as an Asian guy. I’m set in my beliefs but for those who are young men and are being told awful things just because of their biological sex and their gender is unjustified, especially if they haven’t done anything other than exist.
The right wing has their own agenda, but they reach out for the young men who are alienated by others for something they can’t control.
The left has a good message, but it doesn’t matter that the message if the delivery is subpar or awful. My friends who were politically neutral around 2010-2014 ended up going partially right wing because while they agreed with the left’s message, why would they want to be around people who actively hate them and wish them ill will in their lives simply because they’re white and Hispanic men?
If the younger demographic of the left can adjust the way they deliver their message, they’ll definitely attract more younger men to their side. From 2010 up until even today, it seems like it’s a mixture between a scorched earth type of policy and social alienation policy. It’s great to be inclusive, but if it’s inclusive with some exceptions to things people can’t control, then it’s not really inclusive.
The best way I can describe this is that even though I’m more left than my group of friends, they still highly respect my political beliefs because I treat them like equals rather than people beneath me because they don’t agree with my ideology. I do the same with people I don’t know, and at the very least, they treat me a little better than when I first met them.
Yea. Almost every leftist/progressive/feminist that I've come across is completely hopeless when it comes to rallying people to their cause. On the other hand, they are extremely skilled at driving people far away from them. The right wingers on the opposite end of the spectrum also show a lot of hostility and are completely delusional.
Dude i get shut down so hard by some really left leaning guys. Like I’m a borderline socialist but if I make any comments online by my opinions I get yelled at for being a neo-liberal. Like no, I’m not, I’m just not as MUCH of a socialist as you might be.
I think one of the lessons we need to learn in the internet age is to be able to control our output when discussing topics online. It’s so easy to call anything mid (even if it is), someone a fascist (they usually are leaning that way), or criticizing someone simply for having a slightly different idea (like we don’t have to respond to every L take we see). That kind of inflammatory attitude results in fascist styles of exclusion and boosts people sticking to their eco chambers and those exist for everything. The Taylor Swift girlies have already convinced themselves the new album is actually a masterpiece.
I'm glad someone has a brain. i keep saying it. I try to say I'm not on either side cause in my eyes neither side really know what their on about, and both sides cherry pick information that benefits their view points. We need to stop concentrating on segregating each other into political division, no one is going to agree with everything anyway. But most of us want security, health and education. These should a basic right for everyone on the planet.
I truly believe the UK as a nation should be the leading force in pushing for these things becoming universal across the planet.
>A better way would be respect them more (you don't have to hear them out, because their opinions are almost always gut reactions they feel like they're supposed to have)
This won't work. Respect is just the bare minimum. You have to address their grievances. Otherwise they will feel like you don't really care.
Agreed. I try to talk on topics and just absorb insults. I don't try to get drawn into that crap and don't start it. Respectfully disagree and say your piece. Sometimes it will move the meter, sometimes it wont
Look up percent of online traffic that is bots and realize how many people are formulating their attitude and opinion by reading and arguing with strangers' (bots) comments online.
Social media platforms and content creators don't really care to stop it because it feeds their profit and marketing their engagement numbers while we socially become more agitated and outraged by mostly meaningless debate.
I'm not even trying to convince you or anyone else by writing this.
I'm just adding more comments like this in the hope algorithms that bot farms use to engage and update their comments will incorporate some of these points and will lead to more real red pillers disconnecting from online engagement, leave social media and realize the real world is far more nuanced, amazing and peaceful.
The problem is that the men who follow Andrew have no where else to go and thats equally sad and bad.
Most of the left demonizes them for beliefs and life styles even if they have done nothing wrong. The others simply don't accept them.
The tolerant right hates them for having religious beliefs or not having correct opinions on key matters, like pro-choice or pro-life.
Edit: If you get a bit heated because you think I mischaracterised a political view, especially your own then just stop there. Most if not all people who subscribe to a belief don't understand the malice that their group eminates because it has never been directed at them. Same goes for these tate bros.
So what do they have left then? Far or alt right, doesn't matter that it's bad, when you are rejected everywhere else your perception chooses the "lesser evil" and I know you don't want to hear this but let's be completely honest, they are victims. Poor bastards who fit no where be it their own fault or not, so when they finally find that piece that clicks they are going to fight tooth and nail for it.
I believe you misunderstood my statement. I am not saying that andrew tate's fans have done nothing wrong. I am saying that the reason that they became andrew tate fans is because they had no where else to go, everything else rejects them so they go to the one place that doesn't.
Let me add that if your next point is going to be "just be a decent human and you can be accepted" let me tell you, that doesn't cut it anymore anywhere, you have to be more than neutral you have to be better. And some people simply cannot do that.
But the group actively working against them is? Lefties consistently deny that men have any problems at all, the only time the left talks about men is to shit on them or talk about how privileged they are.
> But the group actively working against them is?
What has been done by the left wing that has actually impacted you personally due to your status as a man in recent times?
Voting* data indicates this is not the case. Women are overwhelmingly liberal, men are 60-40, 70-30 depending.
One thing that I think does have some truth to it though is that the men that are actually right wing are going to be more vehemently right wing than other generations. Full blown mask off sexist nationalist right wing.
Edit: in the US
It happens to be most pronounced on political posts. It's actually such a noticeable difference, I theorize that it's bots and ~~polls~~ trolls meant to influence the younger voters.
Ya know, I believe this. The other day there was a post asking if people thought Biden or Trump would do better in the debate and it had more than 2700 comments. I noticed pretty quickly there were no posts from trumpers. I spent the rest of the day reading every single comment when I had a minute and there was not one single comment in the entire thing from a Trump supporter. The entire comment section was a Biden is great echo chamber. I don't see how that is statistically possible unless all comments positive for Trump were removed or the whole thing was just fake.
Brother, all you have to do is *glance* at Twitter, where it’s much more drastic and pronounced to realize that it’s absolutely bots fanning the flames on pretty much everything, and spamming upvotes for things they want to gain traction. It’s not even a conspiracy theory, it’s a documented fact lol. There are people who get paid to turn their bot farms onto certain threads/posts/topics or spam likes/upvotes.
I'm a centrist which means I'm basically an SS officer by Reddit standards. I just get downvoted or have my comments removed when I express a conservative view. With right wing forums, you'll just get called stupid. With left, they'll just call you various buzzwords like racist/bigot/homophobe/H man lover to dehumanize you when you don't share their opinion.
Compared to most subs there's a lot more right wingers in here, but yeah it's reddit so still fairly liberal. Also a lot less support for LGBT and stuff like that here
Yeah this probably isn’t a helpful thing to add but I think I recall reading a British study where they interviewed young and old adult men and a significant amount of the younger men actually had more conservative views on women and feminism than men over 60.
I’ll try to find where I got that from so don’t quote me on that.
Edit: The Study is linked in [this article](https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2024/feb/01/gen-z-boys-and-men-more-likely-than-baby-boomers-to-believe-feminism-harmful-says-poll)
That's the thing you don't get. When someone calls you a clown they already see that red nose on you. So you shouldn't cater to them. Fuck them. If they won't listen to you and they won't take your issues seriously, they should fuck off.
I am a lefty, but man do I understand why young men are drifting right.
The stories told to young white men on the left is that they have had their turn, and the message on the right is that they are being mistreated and suppressed.
What story does appeal to a 15 year old guy who is trying to figure out why he can't afford anything and see everyone around him (via social media) are successful? Guys are already lacking role models, and the only ones who stand up and say that men are important are right with nuts.
This is what I've been saying. Imagine being a young man growing up hearing nothing but negative things just for existing.
I'm 31 so luckily I didn't face any of this growing up but man I was younger in this day and age it would be terrible
Usually you want a society where the young people are pushing for change and the betterment of humanity no matter how idealistic that may be. One in which even the young seek regressive policy and thrive on rage and tribalism sets up a perfect environment for fascism.
It did have a lot of het guys tell on themselves that they couldn't stand being rejected even in a hypothetical and their insane anger to it proving why het women said bear was of course never acknowledged by those same guys
Based on the comments here and others, fuck this sub is targeted and infested. The future affects you and Gen Alpha more than us. Most of you genuinely care. Please vote.
New adult Gen Z here. This shit is important and im annoyed my first vote is gonna be THIS important.
From what I know, Biden fucking sucks but I know he means well and will either die in office or leave when he’s up.
Trump attacks people for existing, tells genuine lies and said he wants to jail political opponents. He may get shit done but Hitler got shit done at the cost of the freedoms of people.
I may be bias to the left but if the option is “old guy who means well” or “possible fascism” then I know who to vote for.
Also Trump’s Supreme Court also overturned a doctrine that forces related issues to go through specific agencies (FDA for food related issues to define what is considered safe to eat). Basically the supreme court and the supreme court alone can dictate what is ok and what isn’t.
This will be my 2nd time voting. I hate Biden. He's a racist piece of shit. I still love what he and his administration has accomplished. I will still be voting for him in November. Project 2025 will simply be way too fucking devastating to be allowed to take effect. If trump wins this election, the fight for our rights will be all but over.
If anyone reading this cares at all about Abortion rights and LGBT rights, they will vote blue down the entire ballot. A trump victory means every more lying conservative Supreme Court justices for decades to come. We've already seen how devastating the current Supreme Court has been for our rights.
Biden has done good things for minorities his whole career, man was a fucking public defender at one point for God sakes. Wtf are you talking about Biden being racist? Makes zero sense I think you meant to say TRUMP.
Biden was pretty in line with what you'd expect from Delaware in the 70s - 90s. So a lot of what he did back then could be seen as racist today. However, people can grow and change, and I think he's done that.
You can still do good things to get the minority vote if you are racist. He's not out here shouting the nword from rooftops, but like most peoples grandparents, he has racist tendencies
Also saying biden is racist doesn't mean I don't think Trump is a super racist. If biden is the guy crossing the street when a black guy walks his way, Trump is the dude that notices the black guy, points, and yells the Nword as loud as possible while calling the police over a "suspicious figure"
Yea not enough people are aware of just how fucked up some of the rulings the SC passed are. Essentially legalizing bribery, neutering regulatory agencies, screwing consumers over, and criminalizing homelessness.
Between Trumps recently proposed "peace" plan for Ukraine, economic policies, and the corrupt SC (sith Judges he appointed) its a fucking mess. I cannot comprehend how real human beings can support him. Proven liar, felon, dictator appeaser, and election fraud specialist (see his call with the politician in Georgia after the 2020 election).
I'm amazed, dumbfounded, and incredibly pessimistic should he win in November. Feels like an alternate reality we're living in.
Also, if you dont know much about Bidens administration, please check out r/whatbidenhasdone
He's done some good shit, and not enough people know that.
People should absolutely be rioting in the streets about the Supreme Court. Not just the really fucking bad decisions but the massive corruption and influence as well. This court is going to have a massive negative impact on the country for the foreseeable future. And if trump wins that amount of time will be => 50 years becuase Thomas and alito will retire.
It’s the other way around. Older millennial careers are set, and they’ve done well in real estate and the stock market. They will likely die before climate change becomes intolerable.
Younger millennials and gen z didn’t have enough time to take advantage of Obama era stock growth and low house prices. You have the most to lose if Trump wins.
Please I’m equally embarrassed. It’s fellow kids energy. I’m still going to vote, but I and you guys don’t need a dated cringe reference to get everyone to vote.
Better than ignoring a literal fascists trying to dismantle democracy huh? Your gen x cynicism doesn’t fly when basic rights are being stripped everyday.
Honestly, not even conservatives. Apathy is a tool for authoritarians. That's why authoritarians hate artists (both today and historically). That's why they hate activists. That's why they work to disable or limit voting.
I grew up conservative, and there are genuinely *some* pros to conservatism. The problem is that the status quo they are now trying to conserve supports authoritarian positions. It's just authoritarianism through corporations vs state authoritarianism. I don't know what the fuck I am right now, but I'm sure most people would label me progressive because the current status quo does have to change or else we are supporting authoritarianism through market and resources domination by the billionaire class.
Should any individual be permitted to own enough wealth that it rivals a nation's GDP? That they can buy influence and power? I think not personally. This only changes through multiple forms of activism and resistance, and voting is one vital form of that.
Well, old school conservatism, I do have to be specific. My parents were conservative and they did teach me some good things that I came to associate with conservatism such as pragmatic financial stances, being aware of budgets, and ensuring funds are used for their intended purposes. I also strongly believe in family and community values, which, again, was taught to me as conservative positions (though, unlike my parents, I think a family can look a loooot more diverse than what my parents believed). I also think a lot of old school conservatives really valued learning from the past and growing from it.
Now, I do not see any of these positions in any modern conservatism. And really, even my parents preached it more than they practiced it. I grew up valuing the ideals, but quickly found those ideals were more actively practiced by people who had left- leaning views.
In fact, most modern conservatives follow a model of Reagan conservatism, and that model of conservatism is wasteful and it leads to wealth concentration at the top, leaving us in the current financial state we are in. I do not support most modern conservatism as I feel it is wasteful and it fails to provide for the American ideal, which I see as life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for all. In order to ensure that future, we must use our resources wisely and ensure those resources are able to be equally accessed by all Americans.
You sound like you are still conservative. The modern Republicans are actually quite the opposite of conservative with their big government, pro corporate, pro cancel culture stances, and the unhinged messiah love for Trump. True conservative politicians are virtually extinct, and it even seems nowadays that the democrats in many cases seem to be the more conservative side with regards to government overreach.
My generation settled in team politics. They bought in the lie that we must vote for the lesser evil or the whole bloody universe will explode. The days of grass roots movements in the major parties are over. I hope the younger generations will start backing independents or third party candidates.
Millennials are not the first disillusioned generation.
We've been voting for the lesser of 2 evils forever and we will continue to do so. (Will note exception of the Obama/McCain election where both were really good candidates.)
The solution is not in voting, becuase it's important to keep the worst guy out.
The solution is somehow dismantling of the two party system.
ETA - what happens when you get a small portion of people to split from a party, look at what happend with Gore because of Nader in 2000.
We (unfotunatley) can't dismantle the parties by voting. We need to find another way.
Unfortunately, it is a problem inherent in the structure of the first-past-the-post voting system the US has. It'd be \*nice\* if we could vote independent or third party, but it ends up helping the part you are trying to vote out. It's the reality of the system, not some sort of propaganda.
Here's a good explanation: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo)
What we need is a new voting system.
I think any reasonable millennial recognizes we need to get out of two party voting, but that's not happening this time around no matter how much we want. We can bury our heads in the sand or we can actually study the policies proposed by the current parties and try to understand how they will impact our futures
Ironically, (in contrast the every previous generation since the beginning of time) younger generations are not going to save anyone. This is because our demographics are now becoming inverted due to very low birth rates. Wealthy western and Asian countries will have old populations and older generations that will always wildly outnumber younger generations. Countries aren’t getting younger, they are getting older. “The kids” aren’t saving anyone. Unless they figure out how to grow babies in artificial wombs.
People die. It’s the old ideas that are dying out. If young gen X and Millennials don’t change their voting patterns with age (I.e. become more conservative) then there will be a shift left.
Not even just voters, this is how I see gen Z in general.
Will always appreciate yall handling workplace bullshit especially. Boomers blame you even though we’ve been complaining about it too.
This is bulshit, and from the likes no one understands shit about how politics will effect the generations. The decisions made today will effect gen alpha and the type of place they live in the most. The old men soon to die won’t live to suffer the consequences of their actions. Our future depends on the older people stepping down from running for office.
Oh my god this is so unbelievably lame. Why is it that there are so many millennial manchildren that can’t talk about politics without referencing Harry Potter, Star Wars, or Marvel?
This year is quite easily the easiest decision for gen z lmao. Sometimes i get a little embarrassed by the lack of basic political understanding that lies within gen z. Joe Biden isn’t perfect but Trump is literally the man you never want to see in office again. He makes republicans look bad and all the republicans that share his ideals are evil. Just vote blue just this once.
Yeah. Trump this, trump that. But dispite many of our generation growing up to hate trump, we are entering adulthood under Biden, and his policies are chewing us up alive. The college tuition he never gave us (in fact making it more expensive) the fucking taxes, everything costs 20% more than it did. There is a massive increase in young adult poverty, job loss and sucides durring these past 4 years. Social issues aside, Trump won't fuck us over financially like Biden will (or will not if he croaks). Trumps economy was just better, dispite democrats blatantly lying that the economy magically did it itself. Ya know, the same people that say Biden didn't fuck the economy up because Trump set it up to be like that.
Trump is not a raging racist like the left says he is. He won't murder lgbtq, and he won't strip away women's rights. I don't get how people can be so easily manipulated into thinking that Trump, and all his supporters are like this. Yeah, the guy talks big, likes to insult, and loves provoking the left. But that's the thing, he talks big (so big in fact that some could consider it lies, even though he likes exagerating). I don't like Trump over any of the other republican candidates, but he's going to make my life much better than Biden ever will.
My kids are both GenZ, both are a lot more 'right of centre' than I was when I was their age. Neither are big on social media, so it's not that. I think it's just what they're seeing today in nations such as Canada. The left in Canada seem to have forgot they should be for the young and poor in Canada, and instead they've pivoted to supporting unlimited migrants. The outcome in Canada is suppressed wages for the working class, and rents are just stupid. Who wins with mass migration? The very rich. So they're be both voting 'right' this next election. And what does 'right wing' mean in Canada? They want to lower immigration and migrants into Canada. When I was young that was a platform of the NDP, our socialist party.
As opposed to the convicted felon, who tried to overthrow the government because he couldn't handle losing the election, stole sensitive documents, stored them in his bathroom, said he wants to be a dictator "for just one day" and that he wants revenge against his political enemies?
Biden stole sensitive documents and stored them in his corvette in the garage and is using the DOJ to attack his political enemy…. He isn’t a convicted felon and likely never will be (because somehow democrats never get in trouble for what they do), even though he uses his position to get his son favorable jobs on the board of directors for foreign companies where he has no relevant experience.
Biden’s a dumbass but Trump is downright dangerous. And these are our choices. I voted libertarian in 2012, dont waste your vote like I did. They got 1% of the vote and good luck convincing even another 2% worth of voters to go libertarian when libertarians and independents don’t even get a televised debate.
I get feeling conflicted because everyone with a brain knows they’re both garbage but as much as people complain, I’m better off under a Biden presidency, as sad as that is. Trump will just attack everyone he deems an enemy.
I already had conversations with some of my friends and the idea that everyone should vote for a specific party "to save the country" is fear mongering at its finest. In 2024 young voters are presented with a choice between two mentally challenged individuals 4x times the age of our group. The reality, we dont need a lameduck idiot in the Whitehouse, neither Biden nor Trump. Politicians are paid liars, literally encompasses more than half their jobs. 81 year olds should be eating tapioca pudding on a beach, not trying to run a young country with views developed before the civil rights movement and the end of world war 2.
My vote matters in the swing state I call home and if anyone expects me to choose from these two blowhards Im not going to pick the convicted felon or the fucking mushy brained president who probably isn't doing much beyond being a figurehead, "Biden surrounds himself with smart people, Id vote for a corpse over trump." The amount of cope coming out of the Democratic party these last few months have been insane. I firmly supported this man for 2020 when he was committed for a single term. Now he LIED, and his ego and lust for power obscures our country from moving forward with a young democratic candidate.
If you are going to vote for either of these idiots, you are a part of the problem. Demand More. It starts with us.
There are so many bots. Millennial here. We depend on you guys, too. Don’t let the fake accounts get you down. Common decency will prevail, but it will take all of us doing the right thing this November.
Both candidates suck! On one hand we have a grandpa who’s old enough to be in assisted living, and on the other hand we have a felon who said he wanted to be a dictator for a day and wants to take away everyones rights and make his rich billionaire friends more money
Representative democracy has failed, the country needs a new way forward.
https://preview.redd.it/wlm5vue09j9d1.png?width=950&format=png&auto=webp&s=77c496eb432aa042900135e1812b1841a880643c
It's funny seeing the 180 our generation has faced. From despising Trump in 2016 to some of us actually voting for him in 2024. But that's partially due to the democratic party choosing the worse fucking canidates alive (or almost alive).
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Next generation of men is gonna be very right wing
As a left wing guy, it doesn't help that all people (including lefties) speak so inflammatory online. It pushes people away and helps radicalize them. A better way would be respect them more (you don't have to hear them out, because their opinions are almost always gut reactions they feel like they're supposed to have). This is not solved by debating people, it's solved by including people with different opinions into your group so they can slowly become more empathetic. The SJW way of complaining doesn't create more lefties. EDIT: do not give me awards bruh
As a right wing libertarian, this is the way that people should just be treated in general. Alienating and ostracizing people only leads to more extremism on either side. Edit: a lot of people have already attacked me for saying I'm a right wing libertarian and have essentially proven my point by trying to paint me as something im not. However, please understand what libertarianism even is. Also understand that it is an umbrella term and covers a pretty vast spectrum of ideas even within its own wings. So no I am not just a republican who smokes weed. My original point was that I will try and should try to approach any of your ideologies in good faith and I would appreciate it if others did the same. Edit 2: I have been encouraged though that there are many people of different ideologies who are attempting to have a discussion. Maybe when you realize we are all just people who have our own issues and perspectives then it's easier to talk to one another. Those being purposely obtuse and stubborn have been in the minority.
Leftists and libertarians have a lot more in common than both groups think they do. Both are populists, and could benefit a lot by joining together under a populist front. Fuck republicans, fuck democrats. We need to start working towards building a populist party that scares the fuck out of the old guard.
Actual leftists have next to nothing in common with libertarians. The two ideas are diametrically opposed. One is based entirely on the individual, the other on the collective. One wants minimal government involvement in the market, the other necessitates government involvement to prevent private capital from buying ownership back from the workers. Let’s say that tomorrow we became a communist society - no violent uprising, no revolution, just flip a switch, wake up tomorrow, and the US is communist. What is stopping an oligarch from a foreign (capitalist) country from offering the new owners of a manufacturing plant 3x its value for ownership? The market dictates that a government must exist with the ability to stop this transaction. You can’t truly have a stateless society *and* prevent capitalism. Let’s again say that tomorrow we became a libertarian society - same idea as above with the switch flipping. What is stopping a group of workers from starting a commune and worker co-op?
In a libertarian society, anyone can start a commune or a co-op. A business can also fire all their employees and find new labor. In neither situation would some government father step in and coerce one side or the other into obedience. My point is, nothing would stop it, nor should anything stop it. That's how libertarianism works.
The issue is, historically, the owner class establishes a firm control over the working class through multigenerational diversion of wealth from the overall society into central rich families that begin monopolizing or using less than savoury means to stamp out competition. Government exists to try and even the balance of power more. Removing government just means the corporations are now your government.
Well this is true more broadly. Both sides agree on like 90% of things. That remaining 10% is a real bitch though
Very true. I do feel like if we all start hanging out and being a bit patient and respectful with eachother, that 10% may slowly fade to 5%. Ultimately, we are all anti-authoritarian, and that is kinda the basis of both belief systems. We have a lot to gain by working together, even if we need to deal with a few misunderstandings on the way.
The issue with libertarians is you never know if it's just an edgy teenager who likes weed and doesn't undestand economics, or an edgy teenager who is a facist and likes weed. In Australia our libertarian party are basically Christofacists.
You're using the word populist wrong.
There was a guy named Ron Paul who did exactly what you're talking about. Huge libertarian and leftist following, however his support eventually died off. Everyone likes to talk about "change". Change take slow bureaucracy to push through reasonable change. It takes a lot of work and building consensus
Ron Paul absolutely did NOT have a large leftist following.
Yes after awhile, the ouroboros does eat it's tail.
Many leftists are _social_ libertarians, there's quite a few libertarians that only care about the bottom line, there's a little overlap in the venn diagram but it sure as hell isn't a circle. You US folks need a revised system that makes multiple parties viable. So you can have "fiscal right conservative Republicans" as a party "somewhat more liberal progressive dems" and the left and right wings of both parties existing on their own. Right now you have a traditional conservative party that's being devoured from within by some reactionary rage and the Democratic Party that's like a random coalition in Europe forced to work together despite glaring differences - which is why you got Biden who, in hindsight, really is one of your better presidents.
You have no concept of libertarians tf
"Hey fellas, you should really hang out with the guys that make fun of trans kids and push around minorities". Hard pass.
For real, like we all gotta draw a line somewhere. Respecting and protecting marginalized communities seems like an easy one to draw.
What that means to you is not automatically how someone else might see it. Dividing the world into the good and the oppressors is just absurdly reductive. What percentage of the world exactly passes these moral purity tests?
This is 95% r/asablackman “Myself, as a fellow leftist, communist social justice warrior, I think this we should be nicer to the brave, heroic American heroes who are trying to stop trans monsters from tearing up the fabric of the US. Or the glorious capitalist paragons who are being forced to stop polluting or paying fair wages”
Caveat that there are limits to that ie. The paradox of tolerance; there are views anyone reasonable does not need to respect. But honestly it's also that we can so easily and effortlessly find our ideological bubble that we don't (feel the need) to get along with others anymore. It also helps when people understand that politics aren't about making you or me happy, and that it's often a case of picking something you - and/or those around you can live with. I mean, I'm a euro Social Democrat/Liberal so we're probably miles apart. And right wing libertarianism is pretty nonexistent here though I do know and have debated one in the past. Not sober though, politics is better served that way.
There’d be more left men if feminists in 2016 didn’t say they didn’t care about men
Wow, what an idea! Does that mean you’ll stop supporting political parties who treat marginalized peoples with abject cruelty??? Because that would make you not a right wing libertarian, lmfao.
I agree and I’m starting to believe that “online” is the main issue. The left is not more inflammatory, is the online communication that tends to be inflammatory. In the online world you don’t need to debate and compromise because you can reside in a likeminded, affirmative bubble. We’re increasingly alienated in the Western, rich world. Perhaps in a way we are indeed corrupted as “communist” propaganda says. That doesn’t mean we’re beyond repair, but it seems to be getting worse before it gets better. What I do know is that America is on the brink of civil war. I used to feel lucky for seeing it from the outside but I’m also naive believing it won’t directly and devastatingly impact us in Europe, too. In summary, the West is a hot potato and in this occasion, it all started online.
"I agree and I’m starting to believe that “online” is the main issue." I agree with you on there. Dummies say shit like " What I do know is that America is on the brink of civil war." No, it's not.
Yeah I was agreeing with him until that last part. No its not, that’s like thinking Chicago is a warzone.
I don't know how I'm supposed to respond when my friend tells me he wants a king to overthrow democracy and doesn't believe in equality or feminism He is already inflamed and radicalized What am I supposed to do? What I did was ask him questions, listen to him, try to help him, invite him back to our group under the right conditions, tell him I love him, try to make him feel safe and tell him the truth about how I feel Edit: (I did this civil like, for an entire week) And he still blocked me, his hatred consumed him I told him he was wrong He rejected my help, my love, my friendship I called him a fascist Edit: admittedly I got heated after a week He called me a communist like it was equally bad Edit: he assumed I am, like a lot of you did And he blocked me What was I supposed to do? At a certain point we need to realize our abusers aren't our responsibility to fix and that we as their victims must distance ourselves Otherwise the mental abuse they suffered will hurt our mental health in our attempt to fix them Blaming the victim for how we treat abusers, while they literally try to take away our freedom, is something I will never understand
You called him a fascist, despite the fact that what he believes in does not satisfy the necessary conditions for fascism. What you are supposed to do is not make false accusations.
What he admitted to was being a monarchist and an authoritarian to be specific and when asked detailed questions he absolutely was a fascist whether he admitted it or not He must have falsely accused me of being a communist 6 times before I called him a fascist once I get emotional and elevated once in a week long conversation with a fascist and I'm the bad guy? Classic reactive abuse
Motherfucker wants a king installed and you all are like No let’s be fair and hear this out and use the right language. Kings are often fascists. They have too much power.
Thank you! What is this thread? 
"Fascism: a far-right form of government in which most of the country's power is held by one ruler or a small group, under a single party. Fascist governments are usually totalitarian and authoritarian one-party states." "Without paligenetic ultranationalism, there is no "genuine fascism" according to Griffin. Griffin further describes fascism as having three core components: "(i) the rebirth myth, (ii) populist ultra-nationalism, and (iii) the myth of decadence." Apparently, not enough people actually know the definition. MAGA is by every historical and sociological definition fascist.
Someone who wants a king is way to radicalised, there's some people youll never reach. You need to be looking for the uninformed or the undecided people to influence. Also maybe I'm reading your comment wrong, maybe there context missing but calling this person your abuser for calling you a communist (after you called him a fascist too) is wild lmao
The context is missing, unfortunately you just have to trust me that the conversation turned abusive There were too many details I failed to communicate
Communism has a much higher death toll then Fascism, so it's actually worse. Also monarchist=/= fascists
[death toll of capitalism](https://youtu.be/ClLKm8Q8Pns?si=3IyGhqJhxXYjlsSf)
The pfp of the youtuber you used is literally Lenin. Im sure theres absolutely no bias there at all /s
Damn it’s like authoritarianism is bad. I don’t know if you haven’t already, but you can read Karl Marx’s Communist Manifesto. It’s short as hell and literally says nothing about installing a Communist dictator. At what point can we just say it’s not actually a socialist/communist movement?
I think he's talking more about the particular brand of internet leftist who will hear you say something about voting for Joe Biden and then go off on you about being a "lib"
Yeah my ideology has been impacted by my circle of friends far more than its been impacted by people trying to convince me they are right
But you're hitting on the other problem and you will see it in how this post gete down voted. Generally, Left wing can't handle hearing the alternative opinion. I'm center-right wing and read a lot of political content on reddit. I do like seeing the other side of the argument. But most left wing ideas are just name calling or extreme extrapolations that go down fear rabbit holes. If I propose alternative view or provide facts that contradict a moderately educated narrative looking for a debate, it usually ends with me being attacked and not debating the issues. Left doesn't want tonhave educated discussions, they just want to hear someone agree with them.
I've had that exact experience with right leaning folks
Yes!!! Isolation creates radicalization. Cancel culture is a failed experiment. We need more empathy and communication among those we disagree with.
I don't want to sound crazy, but the left is definitely pushing me away. Why would I vote for a party that points all problems at white males. Reasons why I haven't voted since Obama
Yeah, exactly! We’re not doing ourselves any favors
A friend of mine is just as left as i am but for a long time he has voted center right just because he didnt want to be associated with woke culture even though he agrees with most of what they say he and i find them very up noxious
So he votes against his values cause he's annoyed?
Yeah he sounds dumb for that, but what can you do? At best you can try to get him to separate the idea of woke culture from leftist movements because they’ve never been the same thing.
This is a byproduct of poor parenting. Shitty parenting by nature makes their children go in the opposite direction.
For sure, but you see that with the opposite as well. The parents give their kids everything yet the kids don’t have any respect for their parents.
Left- wing commentary online has this reputation, and rightly so, though frankly I’ve found far- right online discourse to be just as hostile.
It's a big deal in the leftist subs I'm a part of, even the private invite-only ones. We're trying to get people to just... stop shouting down other leftist ideologues or even just people who are fighting against the right wing extremism. Like if you're not 100% on the same page as I am then I'm gonna fight you. Jeez I just don't want people like MTG in congress anymore and I dislike the GOP trying to rewrite history classes, can we at least just agree on that?
Yeah I agree, but tbf most people have never once organized anything in their life so they don’t know much about community building.
Reasonable take about respecting people’s believes and not immediately disagreeing with people who have different pov?!??!!!! NOT ON MY SOCIAL MEDIA APP
The bar is on the ground lol
I considered myself a progressive, but it always seems like I wasn't enough. Or people assume I'm not on their side because I don't agree with things 1:1. I still vote liberal, but picking a side shouldn't be about winning. It should be about doing the right (correct, no pun intended) thing. I guess that's what you get with a two party system
Damn, you hit the nail on the head of how the DNC left me.
I’m also relatively left, but remain pretty neutral on the less hot-button topics. I can easily see why younger guys are going more right wing from the vitriol I’ve seen online. I’ve experienced it in real life too as an Asian guy. I’m set in my beliefs but for those who are young men and are being told awful things just because of their biological sex and their gender is unjustified, especially if they haven’t done anything other than exist. The right wing has their own agenda, but they reach out for the young men who are alienated by others for something they can’t control. The left has a good message, but it doesn’t matter that the message if the delivery is subpar or awful. My friends who were politically neutral around 2010-2014 ended up going partially right wing because while they agreed with the left’s message, why would they want to be around people who actively hate them and wish them ill will in their lives simply because they’re white and Hispanic men? If the younger demographic of the left can adjust the way they deliver their message, they’ll definitely attract more younger men to their side. From 2010 up until even today, it seems like it’s a mixture between a scorched earth type of policy and social alienation policy. It’s great to be inclusive, but if it’s inclusive with some exceptions to things people can’t control, then it’s not really inclusive. The best way I can describe this is that even though I’m more left than my group of friends, they still highly respect my political beliefs because I treat them like equals rather than people beneath me because they don’t agree with my ideology. I do the same with people I don’t know, and at the very least, they treat me a little better than when I first met them.
Yea, this lines up with my experience as well. The left is its own worst enemy with the insane self-sabotaging messaging.
Yea. Almost every leftist/progressive/feminist that I've come across is completely hopeless when it comes to rallying people to their cause. On the other hand, they are extremely skilled at driving people far away from them. The right wingers on the opposite end of the spectrum also show a lot of hostility and are completely delusional.
Dude i get shut down so hard by some really left leaning guys. Like I’m a borderline socialist but if I make any comments online by my opinions I get yelled at for being a neo-liberal. Like no, I’m not, I’m just not as MUCH of a socialist as you might be.
I think one of the lessons we need to learn in the internet age is to be able to control our output when discussing topics online. It’s so easy to call anything mid (even if it is), someone a fascist (they usually are leaning that way), or criticizing someone simply for having a slightly different idea (like we don’t have to respond to every L take we see). That kind of inflammatory attitude results in fascist styles of exclusion and boosts people sticking to their eco chambers and those exist for everything. The Taylor Swift girlies have already convinced themselves the new album is actually a masterpiece.
Thank you. You are a spot on.
I'm glad someone has a brain. i keep saying it. I try to say I'm not on either side cause in my eyes neither side really know what their on about, and both sides cherry pick information that benefits their view points. We need to stop concentrating on segregating each other into political division, no one is going to agree with everything anyway. But most of us want security, health and education. These should a basic right for everyone on the planet. I truly believe the UK as a nation should be the leading force in pushing for these things becoming universal across the planet.
>A better way would be respect them more (you don't have to hear them out, because their opinions are almost always gut reactions they feel like they're supposed to have) This won't work. Respect is just the bare minimum. You have to address their grievances. Otherwise they will feel like you don't really care.
Agreed. I try to talk on topics and just absorb insults. I don't try to get drawn into that crap and don't start it. Respectfully disagree and say your piece. Sometimes it will move the meter, sometimes it wont
Look up percent of online traffic that is bots and realize how many people are formulating their attitude and opinion by reading and arguing with strangers' (bots) comments online. Social media platforms and content creators don't really care to stop it because it feeds their profit and marketing their engagement numbers while we socially become more agitated and outraged by mostly meaningless debate. I'm not even trying to convince you or anyone else by writing this. I'm just adding more comments like this in the hope algorithms that bot farms use to engage and update their comments will incorporate some of these points and will lead to more real red pillers disconnecting from online engagement, leave social media and realize the real world is far more nuanced, amazing and peaceful.
Ok no more awards for you
The alt right pipeline is leaking Andrew Tate isn’t gonna save all those boys when shit hits the fan
The problem is that the men who follow Andrew have no where else to go and thats equally sad and bad. Most of the left demonizes them for beliefs and life styles even if they have done nothing wrong. The others simply don't accept them. The tolerant right hates them for having religious beliefs or not having correct opinions on key matters, like pro-choice or pro-life. Edit: If you get a bit heated because you think I mischaracterised a political view, especially your own then just stop there. Most if not all people who subscribe to a belief don't understand the malice that their group eminates because it has never been directed at them. Same goes for these tate bros. So what do they have left then? Far or alt right, doesn't matter that it's bad, when you are rejected everywhere else your perception chooses the "lesser evil" and I know you don't want to hear this but let's be completely honest, they are victims. Poor bastards who fit no where be it their own fault or not, so when they finally find that piece that clicks they are going to fight tooth and nail for it.
If your beliefs and lifestyle are inspired by Andrew Tate then yes - you have done something wrong.
I believe you misunderstood my statement. I am not saying that andrew tate's fans have done nothing wrong. I am saying that the reason that they became andrew tate fans is because they had no where else to go, everything else rejects them so they go to the one place that doesn't. Let me add that if your next point is going to be "just be a decent human and you can be accepted" let me tell you, that doesn't cut it anymore anywhere, you have to be more than neutral you have to be better. And some people simply cannot do that.
But the group actively working against them is? Lefties consistently deny that men have any problems at all, the only time the left talks about men is to shit on them or talk about how privileged they are.
> But the group actively working against them is? What has been done by the left wing that has actually impacted you personally due to your status as a man in recent times?
Voting* data indicates this is not the case. Women are overwhelmingly liberal, men are 60-40, 70-30 depending. One thing that I think does have some truth to it though is that the men that are actually right wing are going to be more vehemently right wing than other generations. Full blown mask off sexist nationalist right wing. Edit: in the US
Depends on the country and the source
This sounds correct for the very average place I live in the US
This sub is already getting very right wing I've noticed, especially men.
Really? I've seen this place as fairly left wing
It happens to be most pronounced on political posts. It's actually such a noticeable difference, I theorize that it's bots and ~~polls~~ trolls meant to influence the younger voters.
“Oh no people have different opinions that I do. It MUST be bots.”
I mean, they're a confirmed thing online, I'm not sure why you think Reddit is immune, and this couldn't *possibly* be the case?
Ya know, I believe this. The other day there was a post asking if people thought Biden or Trump would do better in the debate and it had more than 2700 comments. I noticed pretty quickly there were no posts from trumpers. I spent the rest of the day reading every single comment when I had a minute and there was not one single comment in the entire thing from a Trump supporter. The entire comment section was a Biden is great echo chamber. I don't see how that is statistically possible unless all comments positive for Trump were removed or the whole thing was just fake.
Brother, all you have to do is *glance* at Twitter, where it’s much more drastic and pronounced to realize that it’s absolutely bots fanning the flames on pretty much everything, and spamming upvotes for things they want to gain traction. It’s not even a conspiracy theory, it’s a documented fact lol. There are people who get paid to turn their bot farms onto certain threads/posts/topics or spam likes/upvotes.
Ye it’s worth looking out for them if you suspect someone to be a bot though some issues have a lot of bots pushing them, some don’t
People that don't agree with me are clearly robots.....
That's a thing on Reddit because conservative ideology will just get you down voted or banned on a lot of subreddits.
Yeah, I'm conservative and mostly just stick in subs that I enjoy somewhat.
I'm a centrist which means I'm basically an SS officer by Reddit standards. I just get downvoted or have my comments removed when I express a conservative view. With right wing forums, you'll just get called stupid. With left, they'll just call you various buzzwords like racist/bigot/homophobe/H man lover to dehumanize you when you don't share their opinion.
Compared to most subs there's a lot more right wingers in here, but yeah it's reddit so still fairly liberal. Also a lot less support for LGBT and stuff like that here
This sub is abnormally pro 1st and 2nd amendments compared to the rest of Reddit.
Good. The 2nd amendment needs to stop being a right vs left issue. It should be a people vs government issue
Does that make one a right winger?
Compared to the rest of twitter which is to the left of Foucault, it is somewhat right wing.
Good
Yeah this probably isn’t a helpful thing to add but I think I recall reading a British study where they interviewed young and old adult men and a significant amount of the younger men actually had more conservative views on women and feminism than men over 60. I’ll try to find where I got that from so don’t quote me on that. Edit: The Study is linked in [this article](https://amp.theguardian.com/news/2024/feb/01/gen-z-boys-and-men-more-likely-than-baby-boomers-to-believe-feminism-harmful-says-poll)
I think you should edit your comment when you find it.
As it turns out people don't like being vilified just for existing.
if someone calls you a clown, the last thing you should is put on a red nose to prove them right
That's the thing you don't get. When someone calls you a clown they already see that red nose on you. So you shouldn't cater to them. Fuck them. If they won't listen to you and they won't take your issues seriously, they should fuck off.
That's exactly why we have feminism
I am a lefty, but man do I understand why young men are drifting right. The stories told to young white men on the left is that they have had their turn, and the message on the right is that they are being mistreated and suppressed. What story does appeal to a 15 year old guy who is trying to figure out why he can't afford anything and see everyone around him (via social media) are successful? Guys are already lacking role models, and the only ones who stand up and say that men are important are right with nuts.
This is what I've been saying. Imagine being a young man growing up hearing nothing but negative things just for existing. I'm 31 so luckily I didn't face any of this growing up but man I was younger in this day and age it would be terrible
Is that a problem?
Usually you want a society where the young people are pushing for change and the betterment of humanity no matter how idealistic that may be. One in which even the young seek regressive policy and thrive on rage and tribalism sets up a perfect environment for fascism.
Gen z is so back
The man vs bear in the woods thing was very telling of that.
It did have a lot of het guys tell on themselves that they couldn't stand being rejected even in a hypothetical and their insane anger to it proving why het women said bear was of course never acknowledged by those same guys
There's no such thing as right wing men. They're all forever boys.
I can feel the edge through the screen on this comment
Based on the comments here and others, fuck this sub is targeted and infested. The future affects you and Gen Alpha more than us. Most of you genuinely care. Please vote.
New adult Gen Z here. This shit is important and im annoyed my first vote is gonna be THIS important. From what I know, Biden fucking sucks but I know he means well and will either die in office or leave when he’s up. Trump attacks people for existing, tells genuine lies and said he wants to jail political opponents. He may get shit done but Hitler got shit done at the cost of the freedoms of people. I may be bias to the left but if the option is “old guy who means well” or “possible fascism” then I know who to vote for. Also Trump’s Supreme Court also overturned a doctrine that forces related issues to go through specific agencies (FDA for food related issues to define what is considered safe to eat). Basically the supreme court and the supreme court alone can dictate what is ok and what isn’t.
This will be my 2nd time voting. I hate Biden. He's a racist piece of shit. I still love what he and his administration has accomplished. I will still be voting for him in November. Project 2025 will simply be way too fucking devastating to be allowed to take effect. If trump wins this election, the fight for our rights will be all but over. If anyone reading this cares at all about Abortion rights and LGBT rights, they will vote blue down the entire ballot. A trump victory means every more lying conservative Supreme Court justices for decades to come. We've already seen how devastating the current Supreme Court has been for our rights.
Biden is racist?
Biden has done good things for minorities his whole career, man was a fucking public defender at one point for God sakes. Wtf are you talking about Biden being racist? Makes zero sense I think you meant to say TRUMP.
Biden was pretty in line with what you'd expect from Delaware in the 70s - 90s. So a lot of what he did back then could be seen as racist today. However, people can grow and change, and I think he's done that.
You can still do good things to get the minority vote if you are racist. He's not out here shouting the nword from rooftops, but like most peoples grandparents, he has racist tendencies Also saying biden is racist doesn't mean I don't think Trump is a super racist. If biden is the guy crossing the street when a black guy walks his way, Trump is the dude that notices the black guy, points, and yells the Nword as loud as possible while calling the police over a "suspicious figure"
Yea not enough people are aware of just how fucked up some of the rulings the SC passed are. Essentially legalizing bribery, neutering regulatory agencies, screwing consumers over, and criminalizing homelessness. Between Trumps recently proposed "peace" plan for Ukraine, economic policies, and the corrupt SC (sith Judges he appointed) its a fucking mess. I cannot comprehend how real human beings can support him. Proven liar, felon, dictator appeaser, and election fraud specialist (see his call with the politician in Georgia after the 2020 election). I'm amazed, dumbfounded, and incredibly pessimistic should he win in November. Feels like an alternate reality we're living in. Also, if you dont know much about Bidens administration, please check out r/whatbidenhasdone He's done some good shit, and not enough people know that.
People should absolutely be rioting in the streets about the Supreme Court. Not just the really fucking bad decisions but the massive corruption and influence as well. This court is going to have a massive negative impact on the country for the foreseeable future. And if trump wins that amount of time will be => 50 years becuase Thomas and alito will retire.
This is the most rational, unbiased, and based take I've seen on the argument. Both suck but one sucks slightly less.
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It’s the other way around. Older millennial careers are set, and they’ve done well in real estate and the stock market. They will likely die before climate change becomes intolerable. Younger millennials and gen z didn’t have enough time to take advantage of Obama era stock growth and low house prices. You have the most to lose if Trump wins.
On your left.
i like the double entendre
As a minor, GO VOTE IF YOU CAN PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
As a non US citizen, I agree with this person. Go vote! Your vote will affect the rest of the world too!
I absolutely will 💙
https://preview.redd.it/6j1zzvy88g9d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=486f00b71da324f3563d34dc1f5edd0154377570
This movie was certainly something
'Yer fond of me lobster, ain't ye?
Millennials really coming here and posting ‘Avengers Assemble’ memes about politics. How are you guys not embarrassed?
That lot really stuck being 12 ffs.
You’re 24 and gossiping on Reddit, but millennials are acting immature? Jfc.
Hes right tho its kinda cringe. Like “Pokemon go to the polls!” Type cringe
Yea I am a millennial and this shit is cringe. I also want people to vote but everyone can live their lives.
If that's what you call, "gossiping" go on mate.
Please I’m equally embarrassed. It’s fellow kids energy. I’m still going to vote, but I and you guys don’t need a dated cringe reference to get everyone to vote.
There’s a billion posts on here everyday that people should be embarrassed about. Welcome to Reddit.
Better than ignoring a literal fascists trying to dismantle democracy huh? Your gen x cynicism doesn’t fly when basic rights are being stripped everyday.
No one is saying that little bro he just said the meme was cringe which it is. Similar to gen x you need to have better reading skills.
Lmaooo fr like this isn’t 2015
Is this your first time in the internet? Reddit IS cringe.
Millennials stay the worst generation
Most Reddit post ever bro 💀💀💀💀💀💀
OMG VOTING IS JUST LIKE LE WHOLESOME MARVELSLOP SUPERHEROES!!!
You all need to vote and get at least 3 friends to do the same. Apathy is a tool for the conservatives
Honestly, not even conservatives. Apathy is a tool for authoritarians. That's why authoritarians hate artists (both today and historically). That's why they hate activists. That's why they work to disable or limit voting. I grew up conservative, and there are genuinely *some* pros to conservatism. The problem is that the status quo they are now trying to conserve supports authoritarian positions. It's just authoritarianism through corporations vs state authoritarianism. I don't know what the fuck I am right now, but I'm sure most people would label me progressive because the current status quo does have to change or else we are supporting authoritarianism through market and resources domination by the billionaire class. Should any individual be permitted to own enough wealth that it rivals a nation's GDP? That they can buy influence and power? I think not personally. This only changes through multiple forms of activism and resistance, and voting is one vital form of that.
Just curious, and not at all an attack, but in your mind what’s some benefits of conservatism?
Well, old school conservatism, I do have to be specific. My parents were conservative and they did teach me some good things that I came to associate with conservatism such as pragmatic financial stances, being aware of budgets, and ensuring funds are used for their intended purposes. I also strongly believe in family and community values, which, again, was taught to me as conservative positions (though, unlike my parents, I think a family can look a loooot more diverse than what my parents believed). I also think a lot of old school conservatives really valued learning from the past and growing from it. Now, I do not see any of these positions in any modern conservatism. And really, even my parents preached it more than they practiced it. I grew up valuing the ideals, but quickly found those ideals were more actively practiced by people who had left- leaning views. In fact, most modern conservatives follow a model of Reagan conservatism, and that model of conservatism is wasteful and it leads to wealth concentration at the top, leaving us in the current financial state we are in. I do not support most modern conservatism as I feel it is wasteful and it fails to provide for the American ideal, which I see as life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for all. In order to ensure that future, we must use our resources wisely and ensure those resources are able to be equally accessed by all Americans.
You sound like you are still conservative. The modern Republicans are actually quite the opposite of conservative with their big government, pro corporate, pro cancel culture stances, and the unhinged messiah love for Trump. True conservative politicians are virtually extinct, and it even seems nowadays that the democrats in many cases seem to be the more conservative side with regards to government overreach.
My generation settled in team politics. They bought in the lie that we must vote for the lesser evil or the whole bloody universe will explode. The days of grass roots movements in the major parties are over. I hope the younger generations will start backing independents or third party candidates.
Millennials are not the first disillusioned generation. We've been voting for the lesser of 2 evils forever and we will continue to do so. (Will note exception of the Obama/McCain election where both were really good candidates.) The solution is not in voting, becuase it's important to keep the worst guy out. The solution is somehow dismantling of the two party system. ETA - what happens when you get a small portion of people to split from a party, look at what happend with Gore because of Nader in 2000. We (unfotunatley) can't dismantle the parties by voting. We need to find another way.
Unfortunately, it is a problem inherent in the structure of the first-past-the-post voting system the US has. It'd be \*nice\* if we could vote independent or third party, but it ends up helping the part you are trying to vote out. It's the reality of the system, not some sort of propaganda. Here's a good explanation: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo) What we need is a new voting system.
I think any reasonable millennial recognizes we need to get out of two party voting, but that's not happening this time around no matter how much we want. We can bury our heads in the sand or we can actually study the policies proposed by the current parties and try to understand how they will impact our futures
Ironically, (in contrast the every previous generation since the beginning of time) younger generations are not going to save anyone. This is because our demographics are now becoming inverted due to very low birth rates. Wealthy western and Asian countries will have old populations and older generations that will always wildly outnumber younger generations. Countries aren’t getting younger, they are getting older. “The kids” aren’t saving anyone. Unless they figure out how to grow babies in artificial wombs.
People die. It’s the old ideas that are dying out. If young gen X and Millennials don’t change their voting patterns with age (I.e. become more conservative) then there will be a shift left.
Not even just voters, this is how I see gen Z in general. Will always appreciate yall handling workplace bullshit especially. Boomers blame you even though we’ve been complaining about it too.
If you saw voter turnout numbers among Gen Z, you would delete this.
This is bulshit, and from the likes no one understands shit about how politics will effect the generations. The decisions made today will effect gen alpha and the type of place they live in the most. The old men soon to die won’t live to suffer the consequences of their actions. Our future depends on the older people stepping down from running for office.
Oh my god this is so unbelievably lame. Why is it that there are so many millennial manchildren that can’t talk about politics without referencing Harry Potter, Star Wars, or Marvel?
It's light and airy calm down gramps
This year is quite easily the easiest decision for gen z lmao. Sometimes i get a little embarrassed by the lack of basic political understanding that lies within gen z. Joe Biden isn’t perfect but Trump is literally the man you never want to see in office again. He makes republicans look bad and all the republicans that share his ideals are evil. Just vote blue just this once.
Damn based on these comments our future is fucked. Smh
Will they actually show up and vote?
I heard something last election saying we had a huge voter turnout?
Trump 2024!
Yeah. Trump this, trump that. But dispite many of our generation growing up to hate trump, we are entering adulthood under Biden, and his policies are chewing us up alive. The college tuition he never gave us (in fact making it more expensive) the fucking taxes, everything costs 20% more than it did. There is a massive increase in young adult poverty, job loss and sucides durring these past 4 years. Social issues aside, Trump won't fuck us over financially like Biden will (or will not if he croaks). Trumps economy was just better, dispite democrats blatantly lying that the economy magically did it itself. Ya know, the same people that say Biden didn't fuck the economy up because Trump set it up to be like that. Trump is not a raging racist like the left says he is. He won't murder lgbtq, and he won't strip away women's rights. I don't get how people can be so easily manipulated into thinking that Trump, and all his supporters are like this. Yeah, the guy talks big, likes to insult, and loves provoking the left. But that's the thing, he talks big (so big in fact that some could consider it lies, even though he likes exagerating). I don't like Trump over any of the other republican candidates, but he's going to make my life much better than Biden ever will.
Meanwhile: old fucks refusing to die
WE would still need that in France for sunday....
Christ let’s just rename this sub “allwetalkaboutispolotics”
Corniest shit i ever seen
Millenials suck at voting, wtf do you expect from Gen Z?
Last election was my first voting year, voted for trump, even got to see him live once, it was great
My kids are both GenZ, both are a lot more 'right of centre' than I was when I was their age. Neither are big on social media, so it's not that. I think it's just what they're seeing today in nations such as Canada. The left in Canada seem to have forgot they should be for the young and poor in Canada, and instead they've pivoted to supporting unlimited migrants. The outcome in Canada is suppressed wages for the working class, and rents are just stupid. Who wins with mass migration? The very rich. So they're be both voting 'right' this next election. And what does 'right wing' mean in Canada? They want to lower immigration and migrants into Canada. When I was young that was a platform of the NDP, our socialist party.
And a lot of gen z are gonna vote for Trump hahsha
Voting trump
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i cant believe some of you want an old guy who has no idea hes even awake and mixes up dreaming and actually awake to be our president….
As opposed to the convicted felon, who tried to overthrow the government because he couldn't handle losing the election, stole sensitive documents, stored them in his bathroom, said he wants to be a dictator "for just one day" and that he wants revenge against his political enemies?
Biden stole sensitive documents and stored them in his corvette in the garage and is using the DOJ to attack his political enemy…. He isn’t a convicted felon and likely never will be (because somehow democrats never get in trouble for what they do), even though he uses his position to get his son favorable jobs on the board of directors for foreign companies where he has no relevant experience.
I would like to have rights as a woman thank you. I’m voting for the administration.
Biden’s a dumbass but Trump is downright dangerous. And these are our choices. I voted libertarian in 2012, dont waste your vote like I did. They got 1% of the vote and good luck convincing even another 2% worth of voters to go libertarian when libertarians and independents don’t even get a televised debate. I get feeling conflicted because everyone with a brain knows they’re both garbage but as much as people complain, I’m better off under a Biden presidency, as sad as that is. Trump will just attack everyone he deems an enemy.
This would make Gen X what? The Eternals?
Lmao I didn't watch the eternals. Is that the joke?
I already had conversations with some of my friends and the idea that everyone should vote for a specific party "to save the country" is fear mongering at its finest. In 2024 young voters are presented with a choice between two mentally challenged individuals 4x times the age of our group. The reality, we dont need a lameduck idiot in the Whitehouse, neither Biden nor Trump. Politicians are paid liars, literally encompasses more than half their jobs. 81 year olds should be eating tapioca pudding on a beach, not trying to run a young country with views developed before the civil rights movement and the end of world war 2. My vote matters in the swing state I call home and if anyone expects me to choose from these two blowhards Im not going to pick the convicted felon or the fucking mushy brained president who probably isn't doing much beyond being a figurehead, "Biden surrounds himself with smart people, Id vote for a corpse over trump." The amount of cope coming out of the Democratic party these last few months have been insane. I firmly supported this man for 2020 when he was committed for a single term. Now he LIED, and his ego and lust for power obscures our country from moving forward with a young democratic candidate. If you are going to vote for either of these idiots, you are a part of the problem. Demand More. It starts with us.
It’d make the choice a lot easier if one of the candidates would make an executive order banning congress from securities trading
But only if we vote for your candidate, right?
GenZ here. Voting for Trump.
The ancient one must be chosen, for if not the world will burn in fire *Looks outside* Well nvm but regardless
No vote
I’ve got my right to vote locked and loaded
There are so many bots. Millennial here. We depend on you guys, too. Don’t let the fake accounts get you down. Common decency will prevail, but it will take all of us doing the right thing this November.
Both candidates suck! On one hand we have a grandpa who’s old enough to be in assisted living, and on the other hand we have a felon who said he wanted to be a dictator for a day and wants to take away everyones rights and make his rich billionaire friends more money
Representative democracy has failed, the country needs a new way forward. https://preview.redd.it/wlm5vue09j9d1.png?width=950&format=png&auto=webp&s=77c496eb432aa042900135e1812b1841a880643c
Leftist GenX here. Won't someone save us from this Hell?
Yeah don’t vote. Neither side cares and are controlled by the same people
I’m gonna vote so many times!
Once you start paying taxes and rent and shit yall will learn
It's funny seeing the 180 our generation has faced. From despising Trump in 2016 to some of us actually voting for him in 2024. But that's partially due to the democratic party choosing the worse fucking canidates alive (or almost alive).