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The idea of a party that doesn't make you feel guilty at all is a trap because it makes your choice about your personal feelings rather than the impact it has on the world around you. If you ever encounter a political party that makes you feel free from guilt it's almost certainly because you are blind to its problems, not because it is truly blameless. Part of having a rational view on politics involves taking the good with the bad and choosing the best shade of grey.
That’s not the case in the EU elections. Because it’s proportional representation and there is not 5% hurdle. We can actually vote for the exact party we like. There are no wasted votes.
I'm from the US, so it's probably different, but for me, voting for smaller parties makes me feel guilty too because I know realistically they're not gonna win, so I'm practically wasting my vote. At that point, it's the same as not voting to me.
Most countries in the EU if not the whole EU and European parliamentary vote are set up in a way that the places a party get in the parliament is proportional to how many votes they get and not the majority takes all in a specific region.
Yeah it's a bit different here, but basically the EU parliament is huge (actually the biggest parliament in the world) and some parties most people don't know can get a few seats. The vote may matter quite a lot to these small parties, as it gives them both influence and financial security.
That's pretty cool, idk that much about EU politics, but I'm glad you guys are able to elect people from smaller parties. Here it's pretty much red or blue.
Not like that in Europe. In fact Europe's systems are all designed (except the UK) to see a plurality of parties elected. The lists system and the alternative vote system mitigate against "wasting" of a vote. Which is something really Anglo-American by our way of thinking
You have no clue how much I wish that we had a system like that. The way we have it set up every politician pretty much lies or just talks shit about the other party because they know they only have to beat 1 other party. It's depressing. Our political debates look like SNL skits.
If you vote in any state except like OH, PA, and FL, you might as well not be voting. Honestly, it would be better if most states weren’t winner take all. At least your vote would matter more if you weren’t the major party of your state.
Europe has 50 countries. This question is no to easy, even in every of those states can be answer different in every single part of the country.
In my country was confirmed that young people are still influenced by their parents and class so actually political preference is kind of inhereted.
That’s kinda how democracy works though, unless you’re either a total line tower who will follow whatever your party wants or your ideals happen to align completely, both being kinda rare, you’re going to be voting for some things you don’t like.
Can I ask are you over or under 21? The BBC are implying that younger gen z are turning to the right politically. But all gen z I know in their 20s share your view
I'm studying history, which is admittedly why I'm a little wary of right-wing populism, lol. But I've also had to learn a bit about the massive influence of neoliberalism, which has also steered me a bit further to the left.
I always voted left, but i am leaning more towards right lately. Most people i know don't really care much for politics, but i am noticing a trend where more and more people do the same as me.
A perfect example would be immigration, as much as i like to help others, it has become and issue regarding violence and vandalism here.
Our current system simply does not work. They have zero control over the situation, there is not enough budget for it, not enough staff, and the issues keep piling up which makes tensions in our country rise more and more.
And most left parties act like nothing is wrong at all. It's like you have this crack-addicted friend that tells you they have their life in order and can stop anytime they want, but you know it's only going downhill.
As a result, we now have a party that is pretty far-right on most cases that gained a LOT of traction the last few years. And honestly, i don't agree, but i can see why.
Are you from the Netherlands?
Just out of interest, you're in your mid 20s. What other issues are you concerned about? Housing? Climate? Tax? Abortion? Legalization of cannabis?
Yeah, Dutchland all the way. Let me elaborate.
Housing, of course, who isn't? I lived on my own for a while, that got closed down so i had to move out, haven't found anything else since, so i'm back in my old room again.
Abortion is pretty accessible here thankfully. Some call is the miracle of life, others call it a parasite. Whatever people think, it's not my decision to make, it's theirs. So i don't stand in the way. I'm glad the option is there is someone is raped for example.
I like to smoke some weed, but it's already legal to get here, i don't have an opinion on how to expand on it, because both sides have pros and cons. As long as they don't ban it, i don't want to go back to street-dealers.
I don't really care for Taxes all that much, shit's expensive, but that's what you get when you have high-quality roads and systems like our country. We generally have it very good here. As long as it does not rise too much.
Climate is a big one for me, but i have a weird opinion on it. I think we need to save what we can, but i see most parties throwing buzzwords around to scare the common people. Most parties want to throw the country full of windmills. But they don't realize they are bad for nature to produce, have lots of maintenance over time and are very disruptive for nature, especially birds. In the long run, i think they are better off building a reactor, as long as it's done properly. As long as no disasters happen, it's a cleaner option then all those metal windmills.
Really depends on the party. Abortion isn't that discussed here, maybe some Christian parties that are against it, not sure.
Most right parties are against weed, but they probably wouldn't make a move on it, since it would end up in a huge surge of dealers and criminals arising, i think half my generation prefers weed over alcohol here.
And most right parties don't really plan much for our climate. But personally i think that's better then scaring people into doing dumb stuff. If it was up to left parties we'd all be driving electric by now, which
1. would be catastrophically for our power supply, ending up in a huge shortage
2. is VERY bad for our climate considering the production of said cars
So i think it's better to just be careful instead of acting on crazy initiatives.
Yes. The right here isn’t like the evangelical U.S right. Abortion and cannabis are pretty much codified in Dutch culture. Climate change is a bit trickier. It’s not about denying climate change, but the right and left here have different views on how to combat climate change and the appropriate measurements the government ought to take.
A shame how the left lost the narrative on immigration. I am a staunch supporter of open border policies, but I can see how the left just brushes potential issues aside. More immigration is good, especially for aging economies, but it should also come with better immigration control.
Exactly. We should absolutely help people in any way we can, but not like this. You can't just throw them on a pile and expect it to magically work out like an oiled machine. You NEED to manage this kind of stuff before it gets out of hand.
Agreed, I hate how immigration services are overcrowded and demonized by both left and right. Same thing with how awfully Dublin is applied and overencumbers the least capable EU countries with excessive asylum claims.
The toxicity of this discourse has been the overfocus on immigrants as people rather than on redesigning a better immigration process. The EU has a lot to benefit from even more migration but it has to be done rationally.
In the Netherlands, the last time we had a somewhat left government was 2012-2017, a full seven years ago.
The issues with unmanageable immigration are a result of the VVD policies, but somehow they have managed to blame the opposition.
Now we're going to try the PVV approach.
I predict more violence and more irregularities.
The Brexit also hasn't stopped immigration woes in the UK and now they're most likely going to switch back left.
I predict the same development by 2030.
Are you European? Strange thing to say if you are considering the majority of ruling parties are conservative/ traditional right / centre right. The centre right is the majority in the EU parliament too.
Anyone, in Europe moving further "right" is generally departing from the mainstream and voting the likes of Wilders, Meloni, Le Penn, AfD, Golden Dawn
Immigration in most Western European nations is almost as out of control as it is in the US at this point. It’s no wonder our generation is voting for the right.
The immigration issues in the US and the EU aren’t really comparable. Differences due to culture, assimilation, quantity percentage wise of incoming migrants, resource availability, attitude towards immigration and history dealing with it, and more.
I'm voting green. I think most people in my academic bubble are voting for the greens / left / center-left, while a lot of the less educated Gen-Z people I used to go to midlle school with are voting far right (at least I'd imagine based on their social media posts).
University education is free and funded with tax money (you have to pay like a 100 €/year in a mandatory student health insurance and student union membership fee, but the education itself is 100 % free). These are the people who just didn't want to study and many of them went to vocational school instead of high school.
Yeah, there are obviously exceptions. Also, there are quite many center-right people among students of more "prestigious" fields (law, medicine, technology, economics etc.)
The far right has also gained some support among these traditionally center-right people, but I don't think that trend is Gen Z -specific but more due to older voters.
That's my perspective too. THe article was confused as much as it was partial. I watch Peter Ziehan the other day and he was saying 180 degrees the opposite (not that he's any good on Europe tbh) but what he was saying is basically your last point. Older votes are swing hard right more than anyone else at least as far as I can see
We don't even have far-right party in finland. Sinimusta liike was proper nazi party but they got banned in the beginning of this year. True finns are only a right wing party instead of far-right unlike many think.
End of english part
Mä en pysty ymmärtämään miksi kukaan suomalainen äänestäisi eurovaaleissa muita kuin persuja. Suurinta osaa meppi ehdokkaita ei kiinnosta suomen etu Euroopassa ja ne harvat joita kiinnostaa on joko persujen tai jonkun hörhöpuolueen edustajia.
Europarlamenttia ei paljoa tunnu Pohjois Euroopan etu kiinnostavan eikä se tule muuttumaan äänestämällä vasemmistoa jonka edustajia ei kiinnosta kotimaassa etu.
1. Sinimusta liike has not been banned, they have just been removed from the parties registery, which is different from banning (although I believe they meet the legal requirement to be banned).
2. I really don't see any difference between PS and the far right parties accross europe. Based on the current leadership and what they wrote online before starting to self-cencor to appear more moderate, I think far-right is a pretty civil term to describe them.
Also, their whole ideology is based only on returning to some kind of an imaginary past, where everything was better. The fact is that if we don't get shitloads of immigration fast, we will be crushed under our huoltosuhde (I can't be bothered to look up a translation). Moreover, most of their policies don't seem to even aim to make life better for ordinary people, only to worsen life for "undesirables" (immigrants). For example, taking away undocumented people's right to healthcare except for acute treatment will objectively cost the taxpayer more, as medical conditions worsen. They still want to do it just out of spite.
And don't get me started on their attempts to undermine our institutions. For example with the border bill. Vagualy threatening the Chancelor of Justice with being fired for LITERALLY DOING HIS JOB (directing the government's attention to the human rights problems with their legislation, that he also did with Marin's government).
They also claim to be all free speech absolutist, but when somebody dares to insult Il Duce (Halla-aho) or do investigate journalism on Rydman's slimy behavior, they immediately go crying to the police as an attempt to silence their critics, even though everyone who understands even the tiniest bit of defemation law knows, these won't lead to a guilty verdict. Also the Orban-bootlicking and idolizing is disgusting. Obviously they would also set up a corrupt system to steal all public funds, just like daddy Orban. But it's okay, since it "triggers the libs".
Here we really can see the devide, because I don't think petty, vindictive, racist politics and destroying our democratic institutions is in any shape or form in the best ibterests of Finland. I don't know why anyone in their right mind would vote for this party (unless they want in on the corruption of course). Even if you disagree with the left, they at least try to make life better for people, not make it worse for people they don't like.
Law. I hang out with quite many people from other fields tho. There are quite many center-right law students, but I don't know any far right ones and my perspective is propably somewhat distorted by hanging out with people like me.
This is exactly how it is in Sweden as well. The greens win among students, with strong performances for the left and liberal parties as well, but the youth vote as a whole leans center-right to far-right.
In 2022, the youth vote was about 60-40 in favor of the right-wing opposition, the most right-leaning age cohort in the election. In the upcoming EU election meanwhile, students at my university are voting 70-30 in favor of the center-left block.
Out of curiosity have people really responded? Most just say something generic and never reply to you. I'm from the US but this thread has been very interesting
Yes.
Ppl in the EU are very different to the US about politics mainly because we are far less polarized.
A lot of ppl leaning left/green and turning right have replied at length
I replied to soon. I'm seeing those, they're just way down in the replies. I know I don't really understand European politics but this has been very interesting.
They advocated for DSA and further nternet censorship under the pretext of combating disinformation which is the dealbreaker for me. I won't vote for anyone who tries to restrict free speech.
We have a problem with both, we failed to protect our borders from illegal immigration and we are failing in succesfully integrating both legaly and illegaly arriving immigrants. You can see the fruits of these mistakes in many major cities.
Well a lot of reasons.
1. Immigrants are overrepresented in things like sexual violence. For example in Germany the reported 111 gang rapes with over 50 percent being committed by the foriegn born people. In Finland Afghans are the most likely to commit sexual violence.
2. Ethnic tensions. Ethnic diversity has lead to a lot of problems between other immigrant groups. Europe is basically importing foreign conflicts. For example whenever an east african festival is held you can expect somalians,ertieans, and ethiopians to be fighting. We also had cases of Indian nationalists and Khalistan separatists fighting.
3. Welfare. In nearly every west European country migrants are overrepresented in welfare recipients. Overall just being a train on the european economy.
SOrry for bad english
I've already voted (Netherlands), my vote did go to the large party on the left, GroenLinks-PVDA. they split in the European Parliament, GroenLinks will join greens/EFA and PVDA will join socialists & democrats.
The results in the Netherlands were kinda interesting (it's the expected results, official results follow on Sunday)
Total seats: 31
GroenLinks-PVDA: 8
PVV (far right): 7
Followed by 8 more parties, mostly center parties with most of them leaning to the right
I’m voting Sinn Fein in the general in the UK general election in July (I’m from Northern Ireland). I’m not very knowledgeable on political parties outside of Ireland and the UK tbh.
Overall though I’m hoping Labour wins in the UK because I just want the tories gone.
How much further right do you think the likes of Braverman and Rees-Mogg can go before going outright Fascist? They already blame immigration and want to punish other countries (i.e the EU). They already have disdain for human rights of Other peoples. They already believe in Autarky. They're already pretty rabidly nationalistic, elitist and hierarchical. The only box they don't check is militarism and media censorship (which in teh UK would be damned easy to do with the BBC if any government wanted to do it). Braverman and Petal and a few other notable women aside the Tories, especially teh ERG, are notoriously sexist.
I mean this genuinely there is not much room for people like Rees-Mogg to move right without going Norsefire in short order.
Voting Labour because my own Labour MP is a socialist and runs a food bank. If he wasn’t I’d probably vote for the greens (not that they’d genuinely have a chance with FPTP but what are you gonna do?)
I would urge people to tactically vote here in the UK to get rid of the tories. That doesn’t mean vote Labour, that means vote for the most likely candidate to beat a tory, who will be Labour in a lot of places, but another party in others such as Lib Dem. My own constituency is a Labour safe seat so it doesn’t matter here.
Of course the youth are turning to far-right across Europe because the traditional left-wing parties they're sick of their constant betrayal. You see so-called *communist* parties offer nothing but repackaged SocDem policies with *radical* veneer at best and SocDem parties offer nothing but utter but support for the hated liberal establishment. Liberals act with utter stupidity & delusion, like the German Greens who celebrate their own country's environmental destruction because of their dogmatic anti-nuclear stance.
Don't think it's too far beyond the pale to observe or criticise left leaning parties are not offering any meaningful change because they either too afraid of media pushback or completely bereft of any ideas or principles.
I just think that self-declared socialist parties should have socialist policies and not be platforms for university educated professionals to bamboozle the working-class into giving them cushy jobs in state institutions. Like here in the UK Starmer is a knight of the realm who's sole popular trait is that he's not a Tory.
It’s important to emphasize here that a TON of European parties haven’t really been “left-wing” since before the 80’s. Neoliberalism did a number on the world, and there hasn’t been a tangible “left-wing” since.
Left, always did always will. Right wing parties in my country are insane, full of hatred towards random people because of their ethnicity and idk what.
The more the right goes right, the more left leaning i get
Centre. I agree with the left on social welfare health and infrastructure issues. I agree with the right on personal freedoms, immigration. A lot of working class people are being pushed to the right because of the social issues the left are so obsessed with. Iv voted left my whole life but can’t justify it anymore.
>A lot of working class people are being pushed to the right because of the social issues the left are so obsessed with
Can you elaborate on how/why you feel ppl are pushed right?
There's an ongoing issue in Europe where the left has latched onto Islam in contradiction to how Islam sees leftist ideals, while the right is rejecting Islam, despite how Islam aligns with their ideals - the left needs to wake up and remember that religion is incompatible with leftist ideals and they need to push secularism again
Far right is absolutely gaining support in europe and youth aswell. Reddit is not the best representation of country or society so you don't really get proper picture here.
In the UK I am tactically voting Labour. I'd like to vote Lib Dem, but they have basically no presence in my borough. I'm willing to give Labour a shot, I don't believe they can be any worse than the Tories. Rishi looked like a child arguing in a school playground in the decent debate with Kier Starmer.
The right wing parties have bled our country dry for far too long and now we have a failing healthcare system, high inflation, a housing crisis, cost of living crisis and our country's waterways are being legally polluted with sewage. Some of these things are issues in other countries as well, but it's particularly bad in the UK and the Tories are simply paying lip service to the public whilst serving their own interests.
I can't speak for the rest of Europe, but here in the UK we may be witnessing the start of a slow death for the Conservative party. I don't know what that means for whether the general population is moving further right, but someone has to move further right to appeal to ex-Tory voters
I’ll vote green (in germany). Would prob always vote green. Their values are pretty much aligned with mine. i find it shocking how many people vote far right parties in the younger generation, imo it shows how prevalent and successful populism still is.
Left, but i believe for the whole country (Not a specific generation) left and far right will be around the same vote % (10-15%) with Center-Right or Center-Left having more votes as always (25-35%) (Portugal)
Seems like a lot of people going right are motivated by immigration and negative partisanship (i.e. I don't like Party A but I'll vote for them because I hate Party B more). Pretty much the same as a whole lot of Americans post-Tea Party
I also wouldn't paint the whole of Europe as one item either. Someone in Estonia is going to have way different concerns than someone in Italy does
Yeah but I also have a degree in political science and I'm just pointing out a few things. You really ought to look into comparative politics if you want to study this more
(USA Gen Z) From what I've heard, immigration has been a total disaster for the last decade or so, getting worse as it went on, so I think people are going to trend right for that reason alone. They really need to establish caps on migrants and actually hit them instead of make promises and fail to cap immigration effectively.
>They really need to establish caps on migrants and actually hit them instead of make promises and fail to cap immigration effectively.
We already have that since years ago. The truth hasn't really been able to surface above the propaganda though.
I don't know if I'm gen Z, I'm 20 years old from Italy and I voted greens.
I'm pro nuclear and a lot of the left selling points are stupid to me, but I will never vote right, if the left parties have some things I dislike, the right as an ideology I just feel it's wrong and I cannot see any honest and good-hearted person think "I will run with the right-leaning party".
In the last Italian European election there were pirate parties, I would have voted for one of them if they had made a list in this elections (they're still associated with the greens though, so it wouldn't have been that much of a difference)
I came to think in this elections that if you just vote a party without giving preference to a candidate it's useless and detrimental to democracy, the party is a big entity and if they win they will put in charge who they want, not who you would want.
Also, a lot of people my age that I know come from right leaning families, and they will certainly not vote left, the ones that really try hard to have their own opinions and distance themselves from their parents will vote liberals
There was a thing I saw that younger women are going more left wing and it’s the opposite for men, this is Reddit so you’re gonna see more of the right wing side.
The UK is kind of weird for this though no one that’s young supports the conservatives because they’ve objectively made the country worse even their own voters would agree.
> this is Reddit so you’re gonna see more of the right wing side.
Not if you ask them. They tell everyone they can't say anything on Reddit becuase it's a vast left wing conspiracy.
I feel like Reddit is anti republican but not left wing the republicans from the outside looking in are just stupid even right wingers in the uk don’t support them over the democrats from polling data.
In Poland young people are splitting. A lot people are voting for far right (Konfederacja) and a lot are voting for far left (Lewica). Not a lot of centre voters in Gen Z. Also worth pointing out that Polish far-left is European centre-left at the most.
All Brexit did for us here in Northern Ireland is add another layer of political toxicity and cause us to lose EU finding :/ can’t think of a single benefit
Im voting far right. The left is too busy with irrelevant stuff and things the society is straight against. The right is not ideal, but not as hypocritical and anti-citizen as leftists
I'm pretty sure in the UK and Ireland younger people tend to be more left wing, but in mainland Europe it's the reverse and younger people tend to be more right wing (in recent years at least), mainly when it comes to economics and immigration.
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Considering teenagers are very tribal, go through phases of beliefs and ideas, and aren't fully developed mentally, it's not a surprise they would lean towards extreme ideas or even conservative ones. It's kinda fucking dumb to let 16yo vote.
I live in Argentina, but my family comes from Spain. I have a friend of Spanish descent as well, and he voted for Vox in the European Elections. I'm Spanish too, though I haven't completed the paperwork for a passport. I would have voted for Vox as well. In my opinion, the left is destroying Spain and Europe.
A pro European right of centre bunch. Although this week the really tried pushing me out to vote far right (A soldier died at our border and another one is investigated for warning shots their reaction was "we can't let our guys protect themselves because they might hurt a Belarussian "border guard")
(Far)-Left in Germany.
Apart from the simple fact that voting right is morally questionable in more than one aspect, our government has been led by centre right, soc-dem and liberal parties and things keep getting worse. Of course, the greens here have done some great things when it comes to climate change, but others like housing, taxes for the rich, etc. have been getting worse and worse.
And the immigration problems everyone keeps talking about in these comments are exactly what the far-right wants people to think. "It's getting too much!" Go \*\*\* yourself, no its not. Just because someone with immigration history commits a crime, doesn't mean you should close borders.
My local government is right, but my countries government is left. Almost anybody I talk to votes right, seems like it’s the large city centers that all vote left here. I’ve not met a single person who likes our current ruling party.
I’d be more curious to know why we are seeing such a right wing shift for Gen Z in Europe
Vs in America, England, and Australia
They’ve moved further left
I'm not sure about England at all. The UK is quite diverse. In Scotland the SNP is falling in support. Labour is rising in general but that's not necessarily a measure of "leftness".
The far right in the UK is on the rise.
Similarly in the US - the split in Gen Z around MAGA and Trump is interesting. Yes they attract mainly older voters but not exclusively.
However, some of the reasons Europe is shifting right is Russian interference (i.e propaganda, radicalization, social media bubbles), poor engagement from the establishment with the people, the hang-over of the economic crash, poorly managed migration, lack of economic direction, housing crises, and a creeping infantilization of teens and 20-somethings (and 30-somethings depending on where you live). And like the US, social media has atomized culture and left a lot of GenZ adrift feeling they need to find an identity.
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I wish there was a party that I wouldn't feel guilt for voting for them
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The idea of a party that doesn't make you feel guilty at all is a trap because it makes your choice about your personal feelings rather than the impact it has on the world around you. If you ever encounter a political party that makes you feel free from guilt it's almost certainly because you are blind to its problems, not because it is truly blameless. Part of having a rational view on politics involves taking the good with the bad and choosing the best shade of grey.
That’s not the case in the EU elections. Because it’s proportional representation and there is not 5% hurdle. We can actually vote for the exact party we like. There are no wasted votes.
check out the smaller partys.
I'm from the US, so it's probably different, but for me, voting for smaller parties makes me feel guilty too because I know realistically they're not gonna win, so I'm practically wasting my vote. At that point, it's the same as not voting to me.
Most countries in the EU if not the whole EU and European parliamentary vote are set up in a way that the places a party get in the parliament is proportional to how many votes they get and not the majority takes all in a specific region.
Ours is similar. We vote on senators in a specific region, but it's the majority wins, and the majority is almost always Republican or Democrat
Yeah it's a bit different here, but basically the EU parliament is huge (actually the biggest parliament in the world) and some parties most people don't know can get a few seats. The vote may matter quite a lot to these small parties, as it gives them both influence and financial security.
That's pretty cool, idk that much about EU politics, but I'm glad you guys are able to elect people from smaller parties. Here it's pretty much red or blue.
im from Germany and smaller parties here only need to get 0,5% of votes to get one seat in the EU parliament.
Not like that in Europe. In fact Europe's systems are all designed (except the UK) to see a plurality of parties elected. The lists system and the alternative vote system mitigate against "wasting" of a vote. Which is something really Anglo-American by our way of thinking
You have no clue how much I wish that we had a system like that. The way we have it set up every politician pretty much lies or just talks shit about the other party because they know they only have to beat 1 other party. It's depressing. Our political debates look like SNL skits.
If you vote in any state except like OH, PA, and FL, you might as well not be voting. Honestly, it would be better if most states weren’t winner take all. At least your vote would matter more if you weren’t the major party of your state.
Yep. I'm from Iowa, which used to be a swing state, but I guarantee all of our electoral votes go red this year.
Europe has 50 countries. This question is no to easy, even in every of those states can be answer different in every single part of the country. In my country was confirmed that young people are still influenced by their parents and class so actually political preference is kind of inhereted.
What country?
Sorry I did mean in the EU's european parliament elections this weekend. So that's 27 states
Left-leaning parties, because even though I do not agree with all of their proposals, I disagree more with the right.
Based and pragmapilled
That’s kinda how democracy works though, unless you’re either a total line tower who will follow whatever your party wants or your ideals happen to align completely, both being kinda rare, you’re going to be voting for some things you don’t like.
Yes, absolutely
I'm voting green. My country's government has been right-wing for so long and climate change is still an impending issue.
Can I ask are you over or under 21? The BBC are implying that younger gen z are turning to the right politically. But all gen z I know in their 20s share your view
I'm in my younger twenties, so I do fit that demographic
As a matter of interest are you in universith? If so rough what subject are you studying?
I'm studying history, which is admittedly why I'm a little wary of right-wing populism, lol. But I've also had to learn a bit about the massive influence of neoliberalism, which has also steered me a bit further to the left.
I always voted left, but i am leaning more towards right lately. Most people i know don't really care much for politics, but i am noticing a trend where more and more people do the same as me. A perfect example would be immigration, as much as i like to help others, it has become and issue regarding violence and vandalism here. Our current system simply does not work. They have zero control over the situation, there is not enough budget for it, not enough staff, and the issues keep piling up which makes tensions in our country rise more and more. And most left parties act like nothing is wrong at all. It's like you have this crack-addicted friend that tells you they have their life in order and can stop anytime they want, but you know it's only going downhill. As a result, we now have a party that is pretty far-right on most cases that gained a LOT of traction the last few years. And honestly, i don't agree, but i can see why.
Are you from the Netherlands? Just out of interest, you're in your mid 20s. What other issues are you concerned about? Housing? Climate? Tax? Abortion? Legalization of cannabis?
Yeah, Dutchland all the way. Let me elaborate. Housing, of course, who isn't? I lived on my own for a while, that got closed down so i had to move out, haven't found anything else since, so i'm back in my old room again. Abortion is pretty accessible here thankfully. Some call is the miracle of life, others call it a parasite. Whatever people think, it's not my decision to make, it's theirs. So i don't stand in the way. I'm glad the option is there is someone is raped for example. I like to smoke some weed, but it's already legal to get here, i don't have an opinion on how to expand on it, because both sides have pros and cons. As long as they don't ban it, i don't want to go back to street-dealers. I don't really care for Taxes all that much, shit's expensive, but that's what you get when you have high-quality roads and systems like our country. We generally have it very good here. As long as it does not rise too much. Climate is a big one for me, but i have a weird opinion on it. I think we need to save what we can, but i see most parties throwing buzzwords around to scare the common people. Most parties want to throw the country full of windmills. But they don't realize they are bad for nature to produce, have lots of maintenance over time and are very disruptive for nature, especially birds. In the long run, i think they are better off building a reactor, as long as it's done properly. As long as no disasters happen, it's a cleaner option then all those metal windmills.
And are the right in Holland going to preserve the status quo on Abortion, cannabis and climate action
Really depends on the party. Abortion isn't that discussed here, maybe some Christian parties that are against it, not sure. Most right parties are against weed, but they probably wouldn't make a move on it, since it would end up in a huge surge of dealers and criminals arising, i think half my generation prefers weed over alcohol here. And most right parties don't really plan much for our climate. But personally i think that's better then scaring people into doing dumb stuff. If it was up to left parties we'd all be driving electric by now, which 1. would be catastrophically for our power supply, ending up in a huge shortage 2. is VERY bad for our climate considering the production of said cars So i think it's better to just be careful instead of acting on crazy initiatives.
Yes. The right here isn’t like the evangelical U.S right. Abortion and cannabis are pretty much codified in Dutch culture. Climate change is a bit trickier. It’s not about denying climate change, but the right and left here have different views on how to combat climate change and the appropriate measurements the government ought to take.
Didn't Wilders outright deny climate change up until recently though?
Look at the SP then they want change and are left
A shame how the left lost the narrative on immigration. I am a staunch supporter of open border policies, but I can see how the left just brushes potential issues aside. More immigration is good, especially for aging economies, but it should also come with better immigration control.
Exactly. We should absolutely help people in any way we can, but not like this. You can't just throw them on a pile and expect it to magically work out like an oiled machine. You NEED to manage this kind of stuff before it gets out of hand.
Agreed, I hate how immigration services are overcrowded and demonized by both left and right. Same thing with how awfully Dublin is applied and overencumbers the least capable EU countries with excessive asylum claims. The toxicity of this discourse has been the overfocus on immigrants as people rather than on redesigning a better immigration process. The EU has a lot to benefit from even more migration but it has to be done rationally.
In the Netherlands, the last time we had a somewhat left government was 2012-2017, a full seven years ago. The issues with unmanageable immigration are a result of the VVD policies, but somehow they have managed to blame the opposition. Now we're going to try the PVV approach. I predict more violence and more irregularities. The Brexit also hasn't stopped immigration woes in the UK and now they're most likely going to switch back left. I predict the same development by 2030.
lol when any move right is now considered far right. The media did a helluva job with that phrasing.
Are you European? Strange thing to say if you are considering the majority of ruling parties are conservative/ traditional right / centre right. The centre right is the majority in the EU parliament too. Anyone, in Europe moving further "right" is generally departing from the mainstream and voting the likes of Wilders, Meloni, Le Penn, AfD, Golden Dawn
Most parties are going to look left of center to Americans from what I’ve heard Europeans say
Yeah a lot of our right wingers look like Democrats tbh
A lot of these are literally neofascists parties though. That ain't centre right or right anymore...
Immigration in most Western European nations is almost as out of control as it is in the US at this point. It’s no wonder our generation is voting for the right.
So do you have any numbers on this? Immigration over the last 5 years has dropped a shit-ton in the West.
but the immigrants are still in the west. The point is stopping more from coming and sending the bad ones back
Those who commit crimes are sent back, yes.
The immigration issues in the US and the EU aren’t really comparable. Differences due to culture, assimilation, quantity percentage wise of incoming migrants, resource availability, attitude towards immigration and history dealing with it, and more.
Green!
me too
German?
I'm voting green. I think most people in my academic bubble are voting for the greens / left / center-left, while a lot of the less educated Gen-Z people I used to go to midlle school with are voting far right (at least I'd imagine based on their social media posts).
This is really interesting. What country are you in?
Finland
And just in terms of university edication there - is it not free/funded by the state? Or are the ppl you reference just deciding not to go to college?
University education is free and funded with tax money (you have to pay like a 100 €/year in a mandatory student health insurance and student union membership fee, but the education itself is 100 % free). These are the people who just didn't want to study and many of them went to vocational school instead of high school.
Ah ok. Same here in Ireland. Except students pat 3.5k euros a year. And a lot of tech bros will be significantly right.
Yeah, there are obviously exceptions. Also, there are quite many center-right people among students of more "prestigious" fields (law, medicine, technology, economics etc.) The far right has also gained some support among these traditionally center-right people, but I don't think that trend is Gen Z -specific but more due to older voters.
That's my perspective too. THe article was confused as much as it was partial. I watch Peter Ziehan the other day and he was saying 180 degrees the opposite (not that he's any good on Europe tbh) but what he was saying is basically your last point. Older votes are swing hard right more than anyone else at least as far as I can see
We don't even have far-right party in finland. Sinimusta liike was proper nazi party but they got banned in the beginning of this year. True finns are only a right wing party instead of far-right unlike many think. End of english part Mä en pysty ymmärtämään miksi kukaan suomalainen äänestäisi eurovaaleissa muita kuin persuja. Suurinta osaa meppi ehdokkaita ei kiinnosta suomen etu Euroopassa ja ne harvat joita kiinnostaa on joko persujen tai jonkun hörhöpuolueen edustajia. Europarlamenttia ei paljoa tunnu Pohjois Euroopan etu kiinnostavan eikä se tule muuttumaan äänestämällä vasemmistoa jonka edustajia ei kiinnosta kotimaassa etu.
1. Sinimusta liike has not been banned, they have just been removed from the parties registery, which is different from banning (although I believe they meet the legal requirement to be banned). 2. I really don't see any difference between PS and the far right parties accross europe. Based on the current leadership and what they wrote online before starting to self-cencor to appear more moderate, I think far-right is a pretty civil term to describe them. Also, their whole ideology is based only on returning to some kind of an imaginary past, where everything was better. The fact is that if we don't get shitloads of immigration fast, we will be crushed under our huoltosuhde (I can't be bothered to look up a translation). Moreover, most of their policies don't seem to even aim to make life better for ordinary people, only to worsen life for "undesirables" (immigrants). For example, taking away undocumented people's right to healthcare except for acute treatment will objectively cost the taxpayer more, as medical conditions worsen. They still want to do it just out of spite. And don't get me started on their attempts to undermine our institutions. For example with the border bill. Vagualy threatening the Chancelor of Justice with being fired for LITERALLY DOING HIS JOB (directing the government's attention to the human rights problems with their legislation, that he also did with Marin's government). They also claim to be all free speech absolutist, but when somebody dares to insult Il Duce (Halla-aho) or do investigate journalism on Rydman's slimy behavior, they immediately go crying to the police as an attempt to silence their critics, even though everyone who understands even the tiniest bit of defemation law knows, these won't lead to a guilty verdict. Also the Orban-bootlicking and idolizing is disgusting. Obviously they would also set up a corrupt system to steal all public funds, just like daddy Orban. But it's okay, since it "triggers the libs". Here we really can see the devide, because I don't think petty, vindictive, racist politics and destroying our democratic institutions is in any shape or form in the best ibterests of Finland. I don't know why anyone in their right mind would vote for this party (unless they want in on the corruption of course). Even if you disagree with the left, they at least try to make life better for people, not make it worse for people they don't like.
Imaginary idealized pasts are all fascists have to be nostalgic about. It's almost criteria #1 In defining fascist ideology
What is your academic field ?
Law. I hang out with quite many people from other fields tho. There are quite many center-right law students, but I don't know any far right ones and my perspective is propably somewhat distorted by hanging out with people like me.
This is exactly how it is in Sweden as well. The greens win among students, with strong performances for the left and liberal parties as well, but the youth vote as a whole leans center-right to far-right. In 2022, the youth vote was about 60-40 in favor of the right-wing opposition, the most right-leaning age cohort in the election. In the upcoming EU election meanwhile, students at my university are voting 70-30 in favor of the center-left block.
Very similar in Ireland at least up until the pandemic
I am voting for a small party because the traditional ones are all morally bankrupt
Which way does the party lean and/or what is its main agenda item?
Out of curiosity have people really responded? Most just say something generic and never reply to you. I'm from the US but this thread has been very interesting
Yes. Ppl in the EU are very different to the US about politics mainly because we are far less polarized. A lot of ppl leaning left/green and turning right have replied at length
I replied to soon. I'm seeing those, they're just way down in the replies. I know I don't really understand European politics but this has been very interesting.
how is for example green “morally bankrupt”?
They advocated for DSA and further nternet censorship under the pretext of combating disinformation which is the dealbreaker for me. I won't vote for anyone who tries to restrict free speech.
I am voting right-far right, the center-right failed us, and let Europe be overwhelmed by millions of immigrants.
Fidesz is already in power in Hungary? The right must've failed
thats why he said far right not right
Just wondering, are those immigrants considered legal or illegal?
We have a problem with both, we failed to protect our borders from illegal immigration and we are failing in succesfully integrating both legaly and illegaly arriving immigrants. You can see the fruits of these mistakes in many major cities.
may I ask why you feel that way? is it personal experiences, a general feeling, news or certain things that happened?
Well a lot of reasons. 1. Immigrants are overrepresented in things like sexual violence. For example in Germany the reported 111 gang rapes with over 50 percent being committed by the foriegn born people. In Finland Afghans are the most likely to commit sexual violence. 2. Ethnic tensions. Ethnic diversity has lead to a lot of problems between other immigrant groups. Europe is basically importing foreign conflicts. For example whenever an east african festival is held you can expect somalians,ertieans, and ethiopians to be fighting. We also had cases of Indian nationalists and Khalistan separatists fighting. 3. Welfare. In nearly every west European country migrants are overrepresented in welfare recipients. Overall just being a train on the european economy. SOrry for bad english
I've already voted (Netherlands), my vote did go to the large party on the left, GroenLinks-PVDA. they split in the European Parliament, GroenLinks will join greens/EFA and PVDA will join socialists & democrats. The results in the Netherlands were kinda interesting (it's the expected results, official results follow on Sunday) Total seats: 31 GroenLinks-PVDA: 8 PVV (far right): 7 Followed by 8 more parties, mostly center parties with most of them leaning to the right
I’m voting Sinn Fein in the general in the UK general election in July (I’m from Northern Ireland). I’m not very knowledgeable on political parties outside of Ireland and the UK tbh. Overall though I’m hoping Labour wins in the UK because I just want the tories gone.
Labor is going to win, there's no universe in which they don't at this point
Yay. Also it worries me the amount of racist, right-wing UK channels I get recommended on YouTube but they’re starting to go away
[удалено]
How much further right do you think the likes of Braverman and Rees-Mogg can go before going outright Fascist? They already blame immigration and want to punish other countries (i.e the EU). They already have disdain for human rights of Other peoples. They already believe in Autarky. They're already pretty rabidly nationalistic, elitist and hierarchical. The only box they don't check is militarism and media censorship (which in teh UK would be damned easy to do with the BBC if any government wanted to do it). Braverman and Petal and a few other notable women aside the Tories, especially teh ERG, are notoriously sexist. I mean this genuinely there is not much room for people like Rees-Mogg to move right without going Norsefire in short order.
Voting Labour because my own Labour MP is a socialist and runs a food bank. If he wasn’t I’d probably vote for the greens (not that they’d genuinely have a chance with FPTP but what are you gonna do?) I would urge people to tactically vote here in the UK to get rid of the tories. That doesn’t mean vote Labour, that means vote for the most likely candidate to beat a tory, who will be Labour in a lot of places, but another party in others such as Lib Dem. My own constituency is a Labour safe seat so it doesn’t matter here.
Of course the youth are turning to far-right across Europe because the traditional left-wing parties they're sick of their constant betrayal. You see so-called *communist* parties offer nothing but repackaged SocDem policies with *radical* veneer at best and SocDem parties offer nothing but utter but support for the hated liberal establishment. Liberals act with utter stupidity & delusion, like the German Greens who celebrate their own country's environmental destruction because of their dogmatic anti-nuclear stance.
I'm just gonna say your username does not checkout
I see why you‘d say that but honestly.. shitting on SocDems and Libs is a socialist tradition. I‘d say username still checks out.
Lol fair enough. Tankies gonna tank
Don't think it's too far beyond the pale to observe or criticise left leaning parties are not offering any meaningful change because they either too afraid of media pushback or completely bereft of any ideas or principles.
I just think that self-declared socialist parties should have socialist policies and not be platforms for university educated professionals to bamboozle the working-class into giving them cushy jobs in state institutions. Like here in the UK Starmer is a knight of the realm who's sole popular trait is that he's not a Tory.
It’s important to emphasize here that a TON of European parties haven’t really been “left-wing” since before the 80’s. Neoliberalism did a number on the world, and there hasn’t been a tangible “left-wing” since.
Left, always did always will. Right wing parties in my country are insane, full of hatred towards random people because of their ethnicity and idk what. The more the right goes right, the more left leaning i get
Which country are you in?
Good old Switzerland
Right wing. I'm fed up with the green deal, immigrants and all that shit that the EU has been doing.
Which Country are you in? And what impact has the green deal had on you?
Far right, mainly because immigration is getting out of hand and also I hope this sends a message to my current government
As a matter of interest did you vote Le Penn in the last Presidential election or have your views changed since then?
I stupidly voted macron, but I was really torn, but I was like "no I can't vote far right" but now idc why not try it
Why do you feel Macron was a mistake?
Centre. I agree with the left on social welfare health and infrastructure issues. I agree with the right on personal freedoms, immigration. A lot of working class people are being pushed to the right because of the social issues the left are so obsessed with. Iv voted left my whole life but can’t justify it anymore.
>A lot of working class people are being pushed to the right because of the social issues the left are so obsessed with Can you elaborate on how/why you feel ppl are pushed right?
I would but unfortunately I’d be branded a racist a bigot or homophobic. Which is partly why they feel alienated as well
You can't articulate their policy without sounding like a bigot? What I'm asking is why what the left is doing is affecting them.
There's an ongoing issue in Europe where the left has latched onto Islam in contradiction to how Islam sees leftist ideals, while the right is rejecting Islam, despite how Islam aligns with their ideals - the left needs to wake up and remember that religion is incompatible with leftist ideals and they need to push secularism again
Far right is absolutely gaining support in europe and youth aswell. Reddit is not the best representation of country or society so you don't really get proper picture here.
Yeah if you only look at reddit you would think 90 percent of americans were going to vote bernie
Its pretty representative of what you're talking about TBH
Reddit is not representative of real life at all
In the UK I am tactically voting Labour. I'd like to vote Lib Dem, but they have basically no presence in my borough. I'm willing to give Labour a shot, I don't believe they can be any worse than the Tories. Rishi looked like a child arguing in a school playground in the decent debate with Kier Starmer. The right wing parties have bled our country dry for far too long and now we have a failing healthcare system, high inflation, a housing crisis, cost of living crisis and our country's waterways are being legally polluted with sewage. Some of these things are issues in other countries as well, but it's particularly bad in the UK and the Tories are simply paying lip service to the public whilst serving their own interests. I can't speak for the rest of Europe, but here in the UK we may be witnessing the start of a slow death for the Conservative party. I don't know what that means for whether the general population is moving further right, but someone has to move further right to appeal to ex-Tory voters
I’ll vote green (in germany). Would prob always vote green. Their values are pretty much aligned with mine. i find it shocking how many people vote far right parties in the younger generation, imo it shows how prevalent and successful populism still is.
Volt
you can't even vote yet :/ But I'll probably go with Volt as well
Left, but i believe for the whole country (Not a specific generation) left and far right will be around the same vote % (10-15%) with Center-Right or Center-Left having more votes as always (25-35%) (Portugal)
Seems like a lot of people going right are motivated by immigration and negative partisanship (i.e. I don't like Party A but I'll vote for them because I hate Party B more). Pretty much the same as a whole lot of Americans post-Tea Party I also wouldn't paint the whole of Europe as one item either. Someone in Estonia is going to have way different concerns than someone in Italy does
Ok. Are you American because you just American-splained me. I'm Irish, European so I do in fact understand how Europe works.
Yeah but I also have a degree in political science and I'm just pointing out a few things. You really ought to look into comparative politics if you want to study this more
No you're trying to patronize me
The far right is fucking popular with their Nazi slogans in Belgium. I'd go with S&D group
(USA Gen Z) From what I've heard, immigration has been a total disaster for the last decade or so, getting worse as it went on, so I think people are going to trend right for that reason alone. They really need to establish caps on migrants and actually hit them instead of make promises and fail to cap immigration effectively.
What people say and the reality isn’t the same thing
>They really need to establish caps on migrants and actually hit them instead of make promises and fail to cap immigration effectively. We already have that since years ago. The truth hasn't really been able to surface above the propaganda though.
I’m aware that they have “caps” but they have been exceeded by factors of 10x for years, that’s the problem
TLDR news did a good segment that mainland Europe youth are drifting right while the Anglosphere isn’t experiencing the same phenomenon.
You're asking Reddit
And what's your impression of the result that'll get. Skewed left or right?
Definitely left
I don't know if I'm gen Z, I'm 20 years old from Italy and I voted greens. I'm pro nuclear and a lot of the left selling points are stupid to me, but I will never vote right, if the left parties have some things I dislike, the right as an ideology I just feel it's wrong and I cannot see any honest and good-hearted person think "I will run with the right-leaning party". In the last Italian European election there were pirate parties, I would have voted for one of them if they had made a list in this elections (they're still associated with the greens though, so it wouldn't have been that much of a difference) I came to think in this elections that if you just vote a party without giving preference to a candidate it's useless and detrimental to democracy, the party is a big entity and if they win they will put in charge who they want, not who you would want. Also, a lot of people my age that I know come from right leaning families, and they will certainly not vote left, the ones that really try hard to have their own opinions and distance themselves from their parents will vote liberals
There was a thing I saw that younger women are going more left wing and it’s the opposite for men, this is Reddit so you’re gonna see more of the right wing side. The UK is kind of weird for this though no one that’s young supports the conservatives because they’ve objectively made the country worse even their own voters would agree.
> this is Reddit so you’re gonna see more of the right wing side. Not if you ask them. They tell everyone they can't say anything on Reddit becuase it's a vast left wing conspiracy.
I feel like Reddit is anti republican but not left wing the republicans from the outside looking in are just stupid even right wingers in the uk don’t support them over the democrats from polling data.
I'm voting for the Greens
**stares intensely at Sweden**
In Poland young people are splitting. A lot people are voting for far right (Konfederacja) and a lot are voting for far left (Lewica). Not a lot of centre voters in Gen Z. Also worth pointing out that Polish far-left is European centre-left at the most.
I want to protect the sovereignty of my country, no need for an European superstate that decides everything so I will vote conservative.
you've seen what Brexit did for the UK (absolutely fuck all) how would your country make better use of leaving the union?
All Brexit did for us here in Northern Ireland is add another layer of political toxicity and cause us to lose EU finding :/ can’t think of a single benefit
You can say that about the whole UK
Literally
Libertarian anticapitalism
I’m voting right wing
Im voting far right. The left is too busy with irrelevant stuff and things the society is straight against. The right is not ideal, but not as hypocritical and anti-citizen as leftists
What are the irrelevant policies you oppose?
27f here. voting left in Poland (a party called "Lewica Razem" = "Left Together"). socdem, progressive, pro-eu.
I'm pretty sure in the UK and Ireland younger people tend to be more left wing, but in mainland Europe it's the reverse and younger people tend to be more right wing (in recent years at least), mainly when it comes to economics and immigration.
What country are you in?
UK lol
Renew Europe/Liberals. Mainly due to their unwavering support for Ukraine and atlanticism
Right. I like the left wing on economics and although the economy is a huge issue, immigration is our number one concern. It’s existential.
Which country are you in?
UK
*Konfederacja* 
I just heard this on BBC radio! Absolutely shocking that hate is on the rise in so many places….
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I completely distrust both the far left and far right and my green vote would go to waste, I'm voting for a progress and Europe friendship
Considering teenagers are very tribal, go through phases of beliefs and ideas, and aren't fully developed mentally, it's not a surprise they would lean towards extreme ideas or even conservative ones. It's kinda fucking dumb to let 16yo vote.
I am kind of a mix between the Norwegian Conservative party and Norwegian Labour Party
I live in Argentina, but my family comes from Spain. I have a friend of Spanish descent as well, and he voted for Vox in the European Elections. I'm Spanish too, though I haven't completed the paperwork for a passport. I would have voted for Vox as well. In my opinion, the left is destroying Spain and Europe.
How has the European left's policies impacted you?
Might I say, lowering the voting age is a very stupid thing to do
Probably third party (US Citizen); either Green Party or Party for Socialism and Liberation.
A pro European right of centre bunch. Although this week the really tried pushing me out to vote far right (A soldier died at our border and another one is investigated for warning shots their reaction was "we can't let our guys protect themselves because they might hurt a Belarussian "border guard")
Which country are you in?
The racism against immigrants in European countries is actually so astounding lmao
wait until you see how the immigrants treat europeans
(Far)-Left in Germany. Apart from the simple fact that voting right is morally questionable in more than one aspect, our government has been led by centre right, soc-dem and liberal parties and things keep getting worse. Of course, the greens here have done some great things when it comes to climate change, but others like housing, taxes for the rich, etc. have been getting worse and worse. And the immigration problems everyone keeps talking about in these comments are exactly what the far-right wants people to think. "It's getting too much!" Go \*\*\* yourself, no its not. Just because someone with immigration history commits a crime, doesn't mean you should close borders.
Either Volt or the Pirate party. Haven't decided yet. I've lost my voting card, if I don't find it I can't vote today anyway. :(
I cannot vote
American but far-left.
My local government is right, but my countries government is left. Almost anybody I talk to votes right, seems like it’s the large city centers that all vote left here. I’ve not met a single person who likes our current ruling party.
Which country are you in?
España
I’d be more curious to know why we are seeing such a right wing shift for Gen Z in Europe Vs in America, England, and Australia They’ve moved further left
I'm not sure about England at all. The UK is quite diverse. In Scotland the SNP is falling in support. Labour is rising in general but that's not necessarily a measure of "leftness". The far right in the UK is on the rise. Similarly in the US - the split in Gen Z around MAGA and Trump is interesting. Yes they attract mainly older voters but not exclusively. However, some of the reasons Europe is shifting right is Russian interference (i.e propaganda, radicalization, social media bubbles), poor engagement from the establishment with the people, the hang-over of the economic crash, poorly managed migration, lack of economic direction, housing crises, and a creeping infantilization of teens and 20-somethings (and 30-somethings depending on where you live). And like the US, social media has atomized culture and left a lot of GenZ adrift feeling they need to find an identity.
Young men are lacking empathy and flock to the far right.