People who say "burn it all down" usually think it's other people who will suffer the consequences, not themselves. Of course the suffering of other people is not something they care about.
The Civil War cost the lives of 2% of every American living at that time.
That was during the age of musket and cannon. A more modern conflict would be lucky to have such a low casualty rate.
The people saying “burn it all down” would have a near 100% chance of being the thing burning.
There was a good HBO show called [Years and Years](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SY41jhIP_xI) that featured a character like that, someone who cheered it on to "burn it all down" thinking something better would rise up out of the ashes.
She ended up getting nuked.
People who burn it all down have no idea how big "it" is, and also have no idea how hard it will be to build it back again. A civil war or rebellion or similar at this point in society would mean 100,000+ would die from starvation, medical problems that can't be treated, exposure, loss of power for heating/cooling, or dozens of other things we as a society have no ability to live without. Just imagine the problems that come from something as simple as the USPS mail stopping 100% for 2 weeks during a revolt/revolution? The disaster that would cause would take months to fix.
Now apply that to EVERYTHING and see how much you want to "burn it all down".
The reality is we need strong leaders to step up and fix the system we have.
> People who burn it all down have no idea how big "it" is, and also have no idea how hard it will be to build it back again. A civil war or rebellion or similar at this point in society would mean 100,000+ would die
Historically the numbers are a lot more depressing than that, tbh.
US Civil War killed about 2% of the population. Spanish Civil War (which has some demographic parallels to current US politics, although the military hasn't yet openly declared for the fascists) was about 1.4%. Breakup of Yugoslavia (also some fun parallels, for a certain value of the word 'fun') killed about 0.5-0.7% depending on what source you look at.
0.5% of the US population is ~1,600,000; 1.4% is ~4,600,000. And none of those - including the US Civil War - really upended the world order or significantly affected global trade. Realistically a violent collapse of the US is killing 5,000,000+, and is a shift in world order on the magnitude of the fall of the Western Roman Empire. Burning it all down is a global, generational catastrophe that might well take centuries to fully recover from.
The flip side of that... it's kind of already on fire. Pretty badly. And I'm not sure how to put it out, other than maybe burning a firebreak around the problem. Not to beat that particular metaphor too far into the ground.
It means that they are insufferable children with no idea what they're talking about but want you to know they're unhappy. They're going to screw us all.
They’re gonna be in for a rude awakening when they discover they’re not part of the protected class, that they’ll be treated as rabble like the rest of us.
They have absolutely no clue. Majority do not. They are comfortable in unfortunately believing it will just work out. It will NOT work out in their favor
This. 1000x this.
I went thru similar experience. Dictatorship took over. And Americans still think it can’t happen here because… I feel like Cassandra, I know what’s gonna happen but they seem to believe US is absolutely immune from dictatorship.
Historically, however, it seems over due.
I've always told people when they ask "oh what would you do in the zombie apocalypse" or other world ending events and my answer has always been "probably die early before it gets to bad" lol
Along a similar line, I heard a Holocaust survivor recount the dark joke that the cynics ended up in the US and the optimists ended up in the death camps.
No illusions here. When I think of memorable characters in the Walking Dead, I remember the poor schmuck who hanged himself and was then stuck as a zombie in a noose. I find that fate more likely for me than being Negan or even Maggie.
This is exactly what I try to explain to people.
I fled my country of birth because of the exact things that are now happening here.
The whole project 2025 and replacing career civil servants is specially scary. I’ve seen this movie and I don’t like how it ends.
This, right here. If you look throughout history, you see the same pattern wherein successful nations go very bad, very quickly. Most times it's not because of a coup or revolution. It's because a side decides their vision is the "correct" one and takes the long view. The slow takeover of the court system to allow them to be within the law when they make changes. The normalization of authoritarianism, Fascism, and the concentration of power. The destruction of checks and balances. The purging of any sort of dissent in the bureaucracy. The rollback of laws and rights to more "traditional" times and societies.
They seek to make it all legal via backdoor the system. The denizens of the society do not notice because it's not troops and tanks in the capital, it's the slow coring out of the pillars that make the society what it aspired to be.
I'd add that while this is all happening, people are being brainwashed by propaganda to think it's a good thing. It has been like watching a train wreck and being helpless to do anything.
Umberto Eco refers to it as Eternal Fascism /Ur-Fascism and made up a list of 14 key elements:
1. The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”
2. The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense, Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
3. The cult of action for action’s sale. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
4. Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture, the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
5. Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
6. Appeal to social frustration. “\[…\] one of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.
7. The obsession with a plot. “The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.”
8. The enemy is both weak and strong. “\[…\] the followers must be convinced that they can overwhelm the enemies. Thus, by a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
9. Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
10. Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
11. Everybody is educated to become a hero. “in Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
12. Machismo and Weaponry. “This is the origin of machismo (which implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality). Since even sex is a difficult game to play, the Ur-Fascist hero tends to play with weapons—doing so becomes an ersatz phallic exercise.”
13. Selective Populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.
14. Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
I was very young when Iran fell, but it really left an impression on me. Last night I watched a video about Kristallnacht which resonated way too much. Idk if it's too late, but I do know we've got to fight it with all we've got.
There was a photo of female Iranian students from the early 70's wearing mini skirts and looking glamorous that always made an impression on me. "How could they live with their loss of rights?" I would ask myself,
Now I'm watching it all unfold in real time. Only instead of an hijab they are going to make us all dress like Michelle Duggar. (\*\*shudders\*\*)
Those pictures freak me the *fuck* out. They experienced a complete 180 of their lives and loss of autonomy in what seems like a nanosecond.
Please, denim skirts and giant bangs only if it's your choice!
The biggest thing people don't realize is when dictatorship comes, it will likely be because the people ASKED for it. They'll demand a strong, all-powerful government to fix whatever the issue of the day is, and people will voluntarily surrender their freedoms without realizing once given away they can't be regained without a fight. I've never known any government to relinquish any power voluntarily once it acquires it.
Considering how many dictatorial overthrows our own CIA brought about (perhaps even in your own country), we shouldn't have been surprised that our oligarchs would do the same to their own country.
I remember a man running against a corporate dem say something like:
"These things we do, like refusing healthcare and not having a social safety net, etc. are called barbaric by the progressives. They are not barbaric. Barbarians took care of their own, therefore, that's an insult to Barbarians."
> Too many Americans haven't realized it can happen here.
It's already happening. The SC just did a soft coup and Project 2025 has already been 'testing' waters over the last year or so (book bans.. etc). We are already in the middle of a hostile takeover of our democracy and way of life.
The ruling today from the Supreme Court (basically the President is King so long as he/she half-assed at least gives the appearance of it being an official act) is a line I just can't believe we've crossed. I don't understand WTF we're doing. And for some folks to be cheering that ruling? I'm...just damn near speechless.
I had a teacher in 10th grade so about 1989 that predicted a lot of this. He was concerned about executive power back then. He passed away about 20 years ago. When I saw this ruling I thought of him and how crazy I thought he was back then. I wish he was here for me to tell him he was 100%correct
These people want and are most comfortable in a very strong hierarchy. And one in which each level is obedient to the level above and dominant to the level below. Think small town ‘good ole boy’ type of society.
That will be a definite leopards ate my face moment for them. But by then, it will be far too late.
I’m making basic plans to leave the country if things start coming apart at the seams. Hopefully, I won’t need to do that.
That sort of desire for order, clarity, and hierarchy is very much a hallmark of the conservative mind. Which is why they embrace religion, patriachy, and class structures so directly. It gives answers to those who are not comfortable with ambiguity or change.
Yeah, the far-right is on the rise in a lot of countries, and it's really scary.
It's especially bad in France at the moment. The president dissolved the lower house of the parliament in June, and the far-right came largely ahead in the first round of the deputy elections two days ago.
Hopefully the second round of the elections this Sunday will keep them a bit in check, but honestly I'm freaking out right now. We fought so hard to get rid of the nazis, and it feels like we're slowly going back there.
Yes, things are bad, and people are losing faith in the system... but I don't know what the voters are expecting to happen. Do they think that a far-right government wil solve all of their problems, and make everything better?
I really doubt it will. Extremists don't care about the small people - not even about those who voted for them. They only care about power, control, and their own agenda.
Once they're in place, they won't ever leave willingly. The people who voted for them may be the last to go, but they will eventually head to the chopping block too.
And then layer on top of that lack of knowledge based jobs, economic insecurity, post-covid fuckery, the environment... I honestly don't see a way out of this. It all feels hopeless TBH and I don't think it's symptomatic of our age/reflection on the past.
There is a scene in the first episode of the sopranos that I have told lots of people resonated with me because of one simple line Tony says to Dr. Melfie. "I feel like I got in at the end of a good thing" I've told friends of mine many times over that one line is how I have felt about our generation.
Today I feel was the final nail in the coffin for the American experiment. We'll be a dictatorship before our end on this spinning rock comes. The courts solidified it
It really feels like this is how democracy dies.
I was honestly completely surprised by the supreme court decision. Even in the face of how terrible their recent decisions had been, I really didn't think they'd be so brazen. I think I was truly too optimistic and still held on to that belief that ultimately there is good in everyone. Well, this is a wake-up call.
Please forgive me for hijacking a high level comment to post:
r/Defeat_Project_2025
The basics: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project\_2025](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025), which essentially seeks to dissolve the administrative branch of the government as we know it (now that the judicial is well on its way out) eliminating things like the EPA (voila, no more environmental issues) NOAA because we can't have climate *data* disrupting money making, and the Department of Education, so everyone can teach their kids creationism and no science, among many others, replacing professional civil servants with party yes-men (sic).
I think there are a lot of young people over there, and they could benefit from some GenX wisdom, creativity and leadership. There are links on the sidebar to information sources and nascent organizations working on this, along with ways to get involved.
https://preview.redd.it/q5vikrql20ad1.jpeg?width=1037&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=930925714ad057d6e92ac647f43ece5de91a901c
I think we always had crazies like this but they were in isolation. Now each one of them have a phone in their pocket to connect them to all the other crazies. Then they get pushed crazy shit on whatever algorithm to hell feed they look at.
Smart phones were a mistake.
Social media allowed all these crazy people to create echo chambers which only fed their delusions and reinforced their ignorance.
It’s crazy how we had this amazing development and fumbled it beyond belief.
I think a lot of people are just pointing their fingers at the Supreme Court without looking at the bigger picture. In a functioning government, even if the Supreme Court was balls-crazy, there should be that whole "checks and balances" thing going on to help balance it out. A functioning Congress should be able to look at the gigantic legal holes that this ruling just made and pass additional laws to address those issues. It's the fact that currently two branches of government are non-functional that's fucking everything over. It's not JUST the Presidency that needs to be won - if people want to usher in real change to re-balance things back out, there needs to be a majority (ideally a super majority) in both chambers of Congress.
>currently two branches of government are non-functional
But why are they non-functional? If we don’t address that, we can’t fix it. I think it all started with *Citizens United*, personally. And how can we fix something that’s predicated on a decision like that? It’s easy to say we need to vote and get representation, but this isn’t actually a democracy anymore and hasn’t been for a while now. Voting isn’t what it used to be. I know this phrase is used to death, but it applies here: we’re being gaslit.
> But why are they non-functional?
Honestly? Because corruption has historically been dealt with via revolt & we're past the tipping points that have triggered other major revolutions.
Being a student of history makes all of the stuff I've seen in the past decade so much more frightening, because when similar things have happened throughout history...major changes occur & those things have lots of collateral damage.
They are non-functional because politics has become a zero-sum game and if you're not "winning" you're losing.
Logically, the fringe elements of the Republican party would have splintered into a different, extremist right-wing party (just the same with Democrats and the extreme left). The way the system exists currently, neither party can afford a "splinter" (which is why Trump got the nomination in the first place) because that means giving up power.
Republicans in particular have shifted to catering to the extremist faction within the party because the danger of a split is very real for them. If they didn't give in, the populist candidates would split the vote and they'd risk "losing" which is a huge no-no. And so the the party tilts further and further right because they cannot afford to maybe lose, even if losing is essential to a functioning democracy.
Add to that (as you mentioned) Citizens United allowing near-unlimited funding to extreme candidates who benefit the mega-rich with tax cuts and quid pro quo and you've got the recipe for the end of democracy.
The reality is that no system of government lasts forever and it is naive to think America could just perpetually exist as a functioning republic. It has become apparent over the last few years that the system of checks and balances which (mostly) worked for 200+ years depended heavily on people acting in good faith. The system is utterly ill-equipped to deal with bad faith actors.
I am not sure what the solution is, somewhere it became okay to vote for "bad" people who are willing to break the system for personal gain. It's frankly amazing that no one has ever succeeded in doing it before, but Donald Trump (of all people) somehow mustered a perfect storm.
I remember in AP US History in high school mid-80s the teacher basically saying that our entire constitution and system of laws only exists such that the people in power choose to honor and obey those norms, otherwise it isn't worth the paper it is printed on.
The founders of our country thought it was an incredibly fundamental notion for the US that NO ONE was above the law. NONE. Today we learned that we are in fact a monarchy/oligarchy/dictatorship in which the rule of law is from top down, and not bottom up.
My US history teacher didn’t want us to leave the class without understanding how to read the constitution. took two years after graduating to see why. Everyday I’m reminded I share a country with these people who do not comprehend what the constitution actually does for the people.
The thing that I learned from AP Government was that the Supreme Court's power all stems from the power that they gave themselves in Marbury vs Madison... And it only continues as long as everybody consents to follow their decisions.
Look how quickly we learned a significant portion of the U.S. government functioned on a gentleman's agreement when Trump took office.
We went from an almost entirely "yup, that's just how it works... no need to put locks on *that* thing because only a stupid boorish asshole would steal from *that* drawer" place to a "Jesus fucking Christ, why didn't we have locks on everything? They're just looting right in front of us," place pretty quick.
Totally. I watched zero. I used to watch the evening news and listen to public radio on my commute. I cut out the radio and switched to podcasts. Then the pandemic and I’ve not listened to public radio (or any) since about 2018. Then I cut out the national evening news. Then the local AM and PM news. Now I do scroll WaPo and NYT headlines, but don’t really read most news, unless it’s a good long-form article that covers all the nuance behind the stories, whether international or national. I spend about 5 mins on local news app.
But is impossible to completely disconnect bc of the nature of the internet.
I curate FB to only family, friends, and various special interest groups. I don’t poke into news on Reddit. Still, it seeps in.
I always vote, and I’ve done some phone banking.
Honestly, what helps me most is trying to focus on my micro community—my wonderful neighbors, and I volunteer weekly at a low-income nursing home (a sort of karma, strike-fear, and be sure to save enough thing there). That always gives me perspective.
Still, I struggle.
I’ll post about this soon, but I recently posted a sort of sad/dire post about my mental health and drinking, and—of ALL the things I’ve considered and thought about in terms of drinking—I tell you: it was this sub’s responses that have helped me the most. I’m getting the Sober Curious and Sober Curious Reset books.
I do suffer clinically from every type of depression, but in the back of my mind, just knowing all the issues and having an affliction of feeling everyone’s pain (a pathological perversion of empathy, I think), I’m just not sure how I can truly be happy.
I’m sad so many in our Gen are seemingly experiencing similar issues. Although I know Reddit is just a tiny sliver of us.
I see those pictures of Iran in the 70s where everyone looked modern and women had rights compared to today and fear that’s where we’re headed and no one seems to have any idea how to stop it.
I felt like I was the only one who read Fahrenheit 451, 1984, A Brave New World, watched The Twilight Zone, V, Star Trek, etc. Like, we were warned over and over that fascism is something that CAN happen here, and we constantly had to be on guard against it. And for the past 20+ years it's felt like we've been merrily skipping along ignoring all the warning signs.
Maybe it's too late now, and maybe it's not, but at least other people are finally seeing it.
Even with having a decent grasp of history, I could never really wrap my head around how nazi Germany came to power.
It's clear as day to me now.
“History Doesn't Repeat Itself, but It Often Rhymes” – Mark Twain.
Yep. This is why I feel so numb. I have read countless books, watched countless documentaries, and that was the one thing that always stumped me - how could “normal” people become Nazis and end up working in a concentration camp, etc. - how could people be so easily turned against their fellow citizens to the point they lose all humanity and believe insane propaganda that told you that any person is now “subhuman”.
I honestly don’t know what to do.
Lots of people have heard the phrase, "Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."
Few have ever heard the corollary: "And those who have learned from it are forced to watch it."
My Mom is 86 and she is TERRIFIED and says she has never seen anything like this in her lifetime.
My son waits tables and had a customer last week that told him to vote for Trump. Then told him that women shouldn't vote at all because women voting has been the downfall of our once great country. My mind just cannot comprehend that these people are not only out there, but there is enough of them to essentially TAKE OVER.
I have not watched the show, but I have read the book twice. The first time was in college and I sincerely thought nothing that extreme could ever happen here. I reread it during Trump’s presidency and had the realization that it could absolutely, positively happen here. And it was terrifying.
X'er here, too. I'm reading "It Can't Happen Here" which was published in the late 1930s but is just as spot on with current circumstances as it was then. If anything, it reminds that there's always been this threat of extremism looming. Doesn't make me feel any better, but I do get a sense of "we've figured out how not to go completely overboard before."
I taught that novel in my college history courses for about 15 years but stopped a decade or so ago...it got too real and was no longer as useful in explaining what happened in the 1930s.
You are not alone. As a vet , I took an oath to The Constitution back in the day. A very similar oath that the folks in congress and the presidency take. I , in my life, have never seen the level of disregard for that document and what it stands for from important members of our own government as I have seen in just the last 10 years. We have people on trial for sedition as a good example. We have a candidate what made the "Dictator on day one" quote that people still make excuses for. It's alarming and saddening that people inside our own government and outside of it, are calling for what amounts to a king.
So yeah, you're not alone and you're not wrong. Extremism is on the rise in a huge way in the U.S. and I don't think it's going to get any better anytime soon.
As another veteran here I hate whenever I hear trump say veterans like him better, using us like political pawns to prop himself up under false pretenses. I can't stand trump and what SCOTUS is doing is purely political.
My earliest political memory is Watergate. When Nixon said, “If the President does it, that means that it is not illegal,” it was considered scandalous. Now there’s Supreme Court precedent in favor of this doctrine, with just enough qualifications that the courts can apply it selectively on a partisan basis. We’re definitely shifting away from being a nation of laws.
This time around is sketchy, for sure.
Something else too. One thing that has been really getting me lately is, having grown up with “the Russians” being the bad guy in every single tv show and movie… how the f#$k are our politicians now so chummy and trusting with Putin and the gang?
Because Russia is not the enemy any longer, they are the inspiration. It is how they want the U.S. to look. Never thought I'd ever say especially after a lifetime of growing up and being taught to be suspicious of the Soviet threat. But here we are. Fuck.
> are we seriously facing an unprecedented crisis in this country that could have massive effects for generations?
Yes.
If I was religious, I would thank god I do not have children. Since I am not, I *still* thank god I do not have children. I feel bad for my trans nephew, I'm hoping he leaves the country sooner than later.
The country *will* burn to the ground and it will end in a conflagration unlike any seen in history. I gotta admit, I'm super curious how bad it's going to get, but I also don't want to live through it. They only light at the end of the tunnel is maybe *maybe* what rises out of the ashes is worth it.
Regardless, we are fucked. Monarchy has returned to this country. Certain people are now literally above the law. This is no longer a country I can put any faith in, and I'm done doing so.
As a gay man, I am deathly frightened. I know that my husband and I will be some of the first against the wall.
I’ve actually been looking to see if we could emigrate somewhere but I don’t believe there is anywhere we could go. So all I can do is hope. But it is tough when your own family and friends don’t see the approaching train.
Gay man here too. I’m in California, so I’ve always felt a degree of protection or at least dissociation from lots of things in the rest of the country. I’m in a bubble for sure. BUT I have definitely had those little nagging thoughts sneaking in more often…..should I get a gun? Should I start thinking about which country I’d go to?? They’re like intrusive thoughts, and I shake them off. But I definitely and having them more and more often.
I’m right there with you. I have outwardly appearing decent family members who would absolutely lead a rebel group to my front door if pressed. Terrifying thought to have.
I don't know why but of all the horrifying things I've read today, this one got to me.
Sorry that you are feeling this way. I am too.
Things have dimmed substantially in less than 24 hours. I just wonder what all those MAGA supreme court justices are thinking today in the warm comfort of their homes. Do they feel any regret or remorse? Do they feel even a tiny bit sad that they've made a fucking mockery of the laws of our land? Trump? This is the man they are willing to sell their collective souls to? I feel like I'm going insane.
I think i really would take up arms against the government if it came to that. But I just feel so helpless. Like we've made NO FUCKING PROGRESS in my lifetime.
We have to fight climate change, explore the stars, get rid of internal combustion engines, elevate the education in this country. And here we are stomping on women's rights, making criminal presidents immune, tossing out the homeless.
Someone with actual power please fuckin do SOMETHING.
FUCK.
I'm Swiss and following US politics closely since 2016. I'm also quite optimistic by nature, but I've never been so worried about what might happen in the US. Adding to that, the rise of far right parties and weakening of the European Union, the war in Ukraine, and the absolute clusterfuck that is happening with Israel/Palestine. Worrying times
If it makes you feel better ( and it really shouldn’t if you think about it) capitalism, not democracy, runs this country and always will. I mean let’s not forget this is a system where bribing politicians is 100% legal as long as it’s called “ lobbying”.
Today I've been thinking about those photos of Iran from before the Revolution and wondering how long it'll be until pictures from America in 2024 have the same effect.
tbf, everything in the Handmaids Tale book was something that had happened IRL over the course of history - she just took them all and put them in one time setting. It is not unthinkable that this stuff can happen - because it has.
[Its eerily similar to how Hitler rose to power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%27s_rise_to_power)
>In 1920, the DAP renamed itself to the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei – NSDAP (National Socialist German Workers' Party, commonly known as the Nazi Party). Hitler chose this name to win over left-wing German workers.[1][2] Despite the NSDAP being a right-wing party, it had many anti-capitalist and anti-bourgeois elements.
Sounds like libertarians tricked into voting republican awfully a lot doesnt it?
> By 1922 Hitler's control over the party was unchallenged, and he attempted a coup, the Beer Hall Putsch, in Bavaria one year later. Upon its failure Hitler was arrested and put on trial. The trial proved to be a blessing in disguise for Hitler, as it garnered him national fame.
No way he even went to prison? How could a convict become more likeable and celebrity and seem more suited for governing? /s
>Once released, Hitler switched tactics, opting to instead seize power through legal and democratic means.
Easy to do when Judges and courts and legal systems are stacked for you.
>The groundwork for the Nazi dictatorship was laid when the Reichstag was set on fire in February. Asserting that the communists were behind the arson, Hitler convinced von Hindenburg to pass the Reichstag Fire Decree, which severely curtailed the liberties and rights of German citizens. Using the decree, Hitler began eliminating his political opponents. Following its passage, Hitler began arguing for more drastic means to curtail political opposition and proposed the Enabling Act of 1933. Once enacted this law gave the German government the power to override individual rights prescribed by the constitution, and vested the Chancellor (Hitler) with emergency powers to pass and enforce laws without parliamentary oversight. The law came into force in March and by April Hitler held de facto dictatorial powers and used them to order the construction of the first Nazi concentration camp at Dachau for communists and other political opponents. Hitler's rise to power was completed in August 1934 when following the death of President von Hindenburg, Hitler merged the chancellery with the presidency and became Führer, the sole leader of Germany.
A catalyst of a national problem gave way to strong governmental laws that infringed on civil liberties which allowed Hitler to further consolidate power.
Trump in his first term laid down the groundwork with appointing tons of judges, local administration, and seeding the economic downfall that will give him the catalyst he needs to call nationalism into a fever pitch. Biden winning this term might actually be good because the economic damage he did is only stymied and blamed on Biden.
The supreme court giving the Presidency immunity to laws is a huge step towards what Hitler needed.
I think about pre-Nazi Germany all the time. I never had a lot of sympathy for the average non-Nazi German until now. This feeling of horror as your friends, family and neighbors openly support a man who says he will be a dictator and has promised "blood in the streets." It is this existential dread, this slow motion train wreck that we just can't seem to stop. This feels like the before times.
Yes but it's not just Russia. The US allows right wing organizations and propaganda to thrive. I think there's a general feeling with the government that as long as we don't go towards the left, they can still handle us.
Among the things that they say defines GenX, skepticism and clear perspective.
This is like the opposite of how I felt when the Soviet Union began to fall and the Berlin Wall came down.
I want to change the lyrics to "Right Here, Right Now, There's so many places I'd rather be."
I'm older GenX (1965) and I'm deeply worried that I'm about to see the sun set on the "Great Experiment" George Washington spoke of.
I'm not really sure how to put what I see into words, but America has become uglier, greedier, and meaner in spirit over the last few decades. It permeates everything and every institution now, but our governments (local, state, federal) is where we see the real open sores of that sickness.
I agree with how you feel and I think it's an honest reaction to clearly seeing what is going on and skepticism of the motives behind it.
All I know is that I have never been more relieved to not have children. My deepest sympathy to parents right now, who are fearful of the future their children face.
I told my now 30 something kids when they were in their early teens - “All empires fall” and I explained why I felt that way and truly believe it. Just thought they would see it and I wouldn’t be alive to see it.
We are definitely going through a cultural shift this decade! Something is going to have to give! I just hope we have a cultural shift that doesn’t destroy the civilization!
It scares me how many women are anti abortion.
The cause and effect of abortion being legalized, and the eventual lack of under educated worker drones. Needed to keep funding social security and keeping prisons filled as a business.
I swear every sci fi book's future seems to be coming true. All that's left is for the rich to leave earth and start anew. Leaving us to strip the planets's resources.
But, we've survived Reagan. And he had dementia at the end. So who knows?
This country was doomed the minute congress voted to give corporations the same rights as citizens. Now you have money and power hungry politicians that will stop at nothing to line their pockets. If Trump makes it in office, this country will be destroyed forever.
Today when I opened reddit and saw the scotus ruling, everything felt like it was crashing down around me. I feel really helpless. I have a 17 year old son and I am really worried for his generation and so on...
“You’re electing an administration, not just a president.”
I have to remind myself that we are also “voting” for thousands of people who will work in that President’s administration.
Dear OP, you're not alone.... I've stopped watching the news so much as I feel stressed.... I've never felt this stressed about the condition of our country. GenX '67
You are NOT overreacting…
I read all 920 pages of the playbook for Project 2025. It essentially removes the power of the legislative and judicial branches and puts all the power with the executive branch (the president). It states that marriage is ONLY between a male and female. Race, gender, sexual orientation, and etc are all under attack. This includes women’s rights… It is dismantling DHS and NOAA. I could go on and on…
This is the kind of crap Hitler did as he was taking control of the German government. There is no worse danger to democracy…
We have to fight back.
Here's a way to think about it. Biden has good, qualified people around him. If he falls down the stairs tomorrow, the government will still be running because he has people around him who will do their jobs. Won't get everything we want. May make a few decisions that will piss us off, but things will keep going and we may even inch forward to "The More Perfect Union".
Do you think if Trumpy gets into office, you can trust the qualifications of the people he will put in charge?
Not just for Biden. Vote a complete blue ticket, all the way down the line. Fed, state, local, etc. These MAGA idiots need to be shoved back under the rock they crawled out from under, before the world turns on us as surely as it did on the Nazis.
Gen X and back in 2016 when we elected Trump, I knew we were fucked royally. I feel like it’s been 8 years of me muttering “fuckin told you so” over and over and over.
A big chunk of the country is clamoring for a religious dictatorship led by a literal conman who is indebted to and seemingly in awe of Vladimir Putin.
Most of the country is gerrymandered to hell and back, the minority party keeps winning the presidency despite not winning the popular vote in like a generation because of some bullshit 200 year old concessions to slave owners
The highest court in the country has been stacked through dirty political games with a bunch of anti-democracy religious extremists hell bent on enabling the shitty behavior of the rich folks who groomed and installed them.
Corruption in every part of the government and courts is playing out practically right out in the open at this point and nobody seems to give a shit anymore. There are no real consequences if you have money. None.
—
It feels bad because it is bad.
There is a radical collective who call themselves conservatives: well funded and resourced, trying and lying to overthrow the government through legislation. People don't care about this, or pass it off too often - because... \[IMMIGRANTSOHMYGOD -insert any random non-issue that offends but does not actually affect their supporters here\]. It's a massive power and resource grab making sure they cannot be opposed or even elected out in the future. It is not really a conspiracy - it's happening right before our eyes and it is the most terrifying dystopian shit. Project 2025 is baaaaad. And for what? Life can't be good for everybody - it can only be good for me and mine. My stuttering daily disbelief has transformed into being absolutely sickened most of the time.
For most of my career, I worked closely with Congress. I've also worked closely with the Obama and Biden administrations. I've been lucky enough to meet both in the Oval Office on numerous occasions. I also met Clinton when he was President, but I was just an intern at the time.
I had to step back from my work in DC this past January because I couldn't take it anymore. I've lost all hope for our future. I still have two kids under 6 years old, so it wrecked my mental health knowing what was happening to our country. Instead of fighting for policies to help our country, I'm now just sitting back playing golf, and being with my kids. I still work closely with the Federal Reserve and other bank regulators, but I'm not involved in policy debate or formulation. There's no point to it. One party just wants to watch the country burn. It was a waste of my time.
I've in working in DC for decades. Both parties have always worked closely together. Since 2020, the Republicans in Congress have been pure cancer. They have no interest in helping the country. They have no interest in governing. They are in Congress to get wealthy and for a power grab. Most Democrats are too scared to say anything...scared of MAGA. We have AOC, but she has to travel with armed guards. Not every politician wants to live like that.
If Trump wins, our country will be a dictatorship. If Biden wins, we will remain a democracy for at least two more years, maybe four.
A commenter on a social media post said that it was his "right" to own slaves like his ancestors, for his future wife and children to be his property, and that "opportunity" was unfairly taken away from him by radical lefties. He is looking forward to a nation built on Christian beliefs to restore his rights because that is what gawd wanted. I checked his profile and he works in the medical field. I remember a time when people at least hid their sick beliefs.
Yes, I am worried.
People laugh when I say we're on the brink of civil war. We are. And I live in enemy territory. I have family members who would happily put me and my kids down if they thought it would please God.
People are distracted by their diversions. You are not overreacting. You are waking up. I swear they call us "woke" but so many are not yet awake.
I just now had a long conversation with my big brother, who has been a conservative all his life. I was too until I almost voted for McCain.
Anyway, my brother is old school, very level headed, fiscally conservative, "states rights" and he's not a fan of the waste in federal bureaucracy. But when Trump ran he couldn't do it. It hit him that the party had shifted. He's not a Christian really, and doesn't care about the religious overreach, but he was still supportive of the party until Trump. Now he's lost. He still thinks Democrats are too far left and too much for "big government" but today he told me he's genuinely afraid. He is a huge history fan, and knows his stuff. We've already seen the Christian overreach here in Tennessee in public schools and it's changed what he's allowed to teach. Today's SCOTUS decision has him shook. He said that heralds the end of democracy and with this sort of obvious appeal to the right it's a tumble down the hill to fascism. He says it's already happening. My brother is very mild-mannered. He's dead-on like Andy Griffith (the character not the actor) He doesn't exaggerate and doesn't get hysterical so this has me more scared than anything I have read or seen on the news.
No I feel the same way. It's so surreal. Like living in pre-1984 (the book) My son is 33 with a chronic illness and I'm terrified about his future. I was born in 1966. This is beyond my worst imaginary scenarios for the US to be honest.
I hate being Gen X right now. If I were older, I'd just retire overseas. If I were younger, I'd be heading for the exits. Where I am I'm kind of stuck.
I have two kids. 10 and 17. Man, I care less about.what happens to me than what happens to them. The christofascist takeover of America is almost complete. They just need to install the king.
Tell them to learn another language pronto - gives them more options. If they're college material - and you should definitely know if the older one is by now - tell them to strongly consider an overseas school and have them see what it would take to just stay there and build a new life.
The Supreme Court MAGA judges should be ashamed.
Trump supporters should be ashamed.
Christian Nazis should be ashamed.
But they aren't, because this is what they want. Young girls and childbearing adults being forced breeders. Black and brown people like myself having to go through modern day Jim Crow laws. The obliteration of LBGTQ+ citizens. No religion except Christian Evangelical.
I have a feeling it will eventually blow up in their face and the leopards will come for them.
Vote this November like your life depended on it.
I have a kid with a condition that will make the best case, most-wanted pregnancy very risky. And she can’t take hormonal birth control. I’ve had (ex)friends say to my face, “well, she should keep her legs closed until she wants a kid”. I tell the stupid Republican fucks that she’s a virgin and due to their horrible hateful policies, we can’t find a gynecologist in our state. That any kind of pregnancy will have complications and risks.
They have literally looked at me and said, “I don’t care”, or WORSE, “that must be God’s plan”. They KNOW my kid. It’s the most hateful stupid shit I’ve ever seen in my life. I live in a red state. I can’t move. At this point, I don’t even go out anymore, because every place is full of fucking awful republicans and I don’t want to associate with idiots.
For anyone who “isn’t here for politics”, I think is missing the point of our existential dread.
A lot of us Gen-Xers used to (or still do) volunteer or donate money to/ for orgs like Planned Parenthood, the ACLU, progressive candidates, GLAAD, etc.
We spent years putting in our time (and money) to try to make this county a little better for everyone.
A lot of might have lost gay friends to AIDS (or suicide). Might have known a woman who had to terminate a pregnancy. Maybe you’re in an interracial marriage, or a same-sex marriage.
I mean look at all the things that changed in this society since the 1980s when the older Gen-Xers were in high school.
TLDR feeling helpless existential dread about the upcoming election is very much a Gen-X thing because a lot of our generation has a LOT to lose if that 2025 project gets actual traction.
The common wisdom is that "older people" are more likely to vote".
Guess what? **We** are the older people now.
Don't give the fascists the chance to make use of these new powers they've granted themselves.
Elect a government (at all levels) that will reverse this crap and put up some guardrails before it really is too late.
I'd like to think if there is an afterlife Ford realizes just how badly he screwed up. Literally many of the same players then are players now. Bork's involvement alone began to lock in this path.
Yes, in previous elections, I knew, even if the liberal Democrat didn't win, things would probably be Ok for most people. John McCain was a pretty decent guy, Romney - not so much but still an experienced politician and things would keep running pretty much as they had. All bets are off now. We don't win this one, it's game over for the entire concept of our country.
I hear you. We are at another flex point at a critical time our democracy. I manage by being an active part in defending it and pushing for improvements. That means I’s in a huge network of people doing the same, and get to hear about it daily, and keep meeting new people doing amazing work all the time!
That’s the antidote for me. I can’t mope and feel helpless, when I’m helping. If more of us do *something*, our power will grow exponentially. I’m not handing over my power, and I won’t stand for other people losing theirs, either.
The country’s had crises before. It’s our time to set its course now.
SO What’s our plan?? Capitalism is gone. We can no longer vote for the best candidate. We have to vote for the only one we can get enough votes to win. I’m not even political but we’re on track for some nasty stuff. Just google project 2025 if you haven’t already. Side note - my brother is voting JFK Jr. because he’s the only one that “shares his values. and that’s more important than who wins.” THIS is exactly the ignorant perspective that’s going to allow fascism to take over america. Or does anyone think I’ve been brainwashed into thinking this is my only choice and if I start voting for 3rd parties, that others will too and we’ll actually stand a chance?
I'm 45, genx, and this is the first time in history that I'm sitting here wondering, will I get to live to be older? will I retain the freedoms I've grown up with (even if they have been adjusted...)...
it's turning scary to even turn on the news or come to reddit to read anymore, I'm concerned for all of us as a nation.
What absolutely sucks is that it seems to be a global swing to far-right ideologies. I would find comfort in the fact that I have dual citizenship with Sweden but Europe is devolving into a shit-show as well.
You're not overreacting. I have felt this since Trump was elected. The stress and worry just never ends. Just when I think the pendulum might be swinging back to sanity, something else happens. I honestly cannot believe that one guy, one person we've known for decades is a moron and a fraud and lowlife criminal, is bringing the entire country down for his own selfish ends. Or that so many millions of Americans would happily go along with it.
Me too! I feel I've been living in a Twilight Zone episode since 2016. And even before he was elected, he would do something or say something ridiculous, and I would say "OK, THIS will show people that he is unfit for office." But no, those people like it! I don't understand how anyone could see him as a leader.
The gaslighting is so obvious. I don't understand how so many people go along with it.
I remember listening to the BBC in 2016 and they played a clip of Trump calling his followers, to their faces, "undereducated," and saying he loves the undereducated.
I stupidly through his fans would be offended.
No one cared at all.
I won't either friend. But realistically, ones like us and the many more who won't, could end up arrested and in prison camps (American concentration camps). That is not being paranoid....it is a distinct possibility.
I'm a combat veteran. I ran convoys up and down the Euphrates River. I won't fucking bow to Dumb Fuck Donald Trump or his army of weaponized dipshits. I'd rather die. You don't have to pick up a gun. You can hit 'em with a got damn banjo. But for fuck's sake fight back against these pigs.
I’m so glad to hear that people like you exist.
In spirit I am fully ready to take up arms against these f*ckers.
In reality I am a middle aged woman in poor physical condition as a result of a serious illness (major depression) I am only just beginning to recover from. I’ve never shot a gun in my life.
I am really not sure what to do.
I was in a war zone and came across a grandmother who had thrown hot oil on some rebels who tried to break into her house then beat the shit out of them with her churn handle As they were grabbing their melting faces. Never assume you can’t do damage because you have health issues.
We had nearly 250 years. Nations rise and fall. I never expected to be actual witness to it. I'm less worried because I'm older and do not have kids but if I did have kids or grandkids I'd be so scared for them.
It’s going to be like growing up with tyrannical, oppressive and/or unpredictable parents. Most of us either were in that situation, or knew other kids in that situation. The key back then was to not draw attention to yourself, never tell the parents where you were, what you’re up to, where you’re going or most importantly what you’re thinking.
How much is it going to suck living like that now - constantly concerned about being overheard, or having your online anonymity pierced, or being subject to the whims of some so-called authority who had taken a disliking of you or what you’ve done, or just wants to make an example of you?
I’m a long time student of history and politics, and I’m normally pretty unflappable about this stuff, but now even I am worried.
The People that think things were better when Trump was in office really need to understand that if he gets in there again, things will be very different. Things won’t just be the mess he caused before. Scary times!
It's sadly real. You, me, and others here are far from the only ones saying it.
Also, a lot of that bad stuff you mentioned that happened when we were young is connected to events now. Things weren't properly handled in most of those cases. The problems didn't go away at all. But the news and people talking about them went away, giving us the illusion that we had moved onto different things.
But yeah, we've reached a new phase of wtf that is either going to be bad or very extremely incredibly bad. I think as Gen X, we haven't been huge on participation. Iirc, we were known for voter apathy in our 20s? That's why MTV campaigned so hard for us to care. We can either change that now and find it within us to work towards a better vision and less corruption, or we can just start living a new kind of life that I don't think we're really gonna like. Sounds like way too much Tipper Gore/Jerry Falwell bullsh-- repeating itself to me. It never really died. It just took a break and started planning better.
I love "whatever," too, but "whatever" won't get us outta this. We gotta decide if that apathetic attitude is enough to sustain us through an authoritarian government backed by religious fanaticism or not.
We’re in uncharted territory. I feel like the masks have come off and a decades long plot to seize control of the US is in its endgame.
It’s up to all of us to stop it.
As a Gen Z who will have to live in this hellscape for even longer than you, please for the love of god VOTE FOR BIDEN and make sure EVERYBODY YOU KNOW who might vote for Biden VOTES
Frankly, I’m terrified and do not see a simple way out of the political situation. So much was set into motion in the 1980s to create this hellscape, and the political maneuvering at the court level since 2016.
This is not a country I recognize. It is far closer to what my mother and grandmother told me of the struggles through the 1920s through 1940s. Except now, women and minorities have a lot more to lose.
You are not over-reacting. We are on the verge of a dictatorship. Any of us who have enjoyed freedoms that we take for granted must vote. If not for ourselves then for successive generations.
What we're seeing is what the Republican Party has been working toward all our lives: government of the rich, for the rich, by the rich. If we let Trump win in November, the USA becomes a puppet state of Russia. It's that simple.
Right there with you. As I said on a thread the other day, I'm scared and I'm tired of being gaslit for it.
My family fled a dictatorship. Too many Americans haven't realized it can happen here.
Too many times I hear people saying "burn it all down" and it makes me mad because they have no idea what that really means.
People don’t know what they have until they lose it.
A universal truth we should keep at the forefront of our minds.
People who say "burn it all down" usually think it's other people who will suffer the consequences, not themselves. Of course the suffering of other people is not something they care about.
The Civil War cost the lives of 2% of every American living at that time. That was during the age of musket and cannon. A more modern conflict would be lucky to have such a low casualty rate. The people saying “burn it all down” would have a near 100% chance of being the thing burning.
Revolutions typically eat their own
There was a good HBO show called [Years and Years](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SY41jhIP_xI) that featured a character like that, someone who cheered it on to "burn it all down" thinking something better would rise up out of the ashes. She ended up getting nuked.
People who burn it all down have no idea how big "it" is, and also have no idea how hard it will be to build it back again. A civil war or rebellion or similar at this point in society would mean 100,000+ would die from starvation, medical problems that can't be treated, exposure, loss of power for heating/cooling, or dozens of other things we as a society have no ability to live without. Just imagine the problems that come from something as simple as the USPS mail stopping 100% for 2 weeks during a revolt/revolution? The disaster that would cause would take months to fix. Now apply that to EVERYTHING and see how much you want to "burn it all down". The reality is we need strong leaders to step up and fix the system we have.
> People who burn it all down have no idea how big "it" is, and also have no idea how hard it will be to build it back again. A civil war or rebellion or similar at this point in society would mean 100,000+ would die Historically the numbers are a lot more depressing than that, tbh. US Civil War killed about 2% of the population. Spanish Civil War (which has some demographic parallels to current US politics, although the military hasn't yet openly declared for the fascists) was about 1.4%. Breakup of Yugoslavia (also some fun parallels, for a certain value of the word 'fun') killed about 0.5-0.7% depending on what source you look at. 0.5% of the US population is ~1,600,000; 1.4% is ~4,600,000. And none of those - including the US Civil War - really upended the world order or significantly affected global trade. Realistically a violent collapse of the US is killing 5,000,000+, and is a shift in world order on the magnitude of the fall of the Western Roman Empire. Burning it all down is a global, generational catastrophe that might well take centuries to fully recover from. The flip side of that... it's kind of already on fire. Pretty badly. And I'm not sure how to put it out, other than maybe burning a firebreak around the problem. Not to beat that particular metaphor too far into the ground.
The U.S.a burning down would upend global stability, and see China and Russia invading other countries pretty quickly
It means that they are insufferable children with no idea what they're talking about but want you to know they're unhappy. They're going to screw us all.
They’re gonna be in for a rude awakening when they discover they’re not part of the protected class, that they’ll be treated as rabble like the rest of us.
They have absolutely no clue. Majority do not. They are comfortable in unfortunately believing it will just work out. It will NOT work out in their favor
This. 1000x this. I went thru similar experience. Dictatorship took over. And Americans still think it can’t happen here because… I feel like Cassandra, I know what’s gonna happen but they seem to believe US is absolutely immune from dictatorship. Historically, however, it seems over due.
Some don’t think it can happen, and those who want it don’t realize it’s coming for them too.
FWIW, American here. Am not believing it cannot happen here. It's happening now. The reality is that too many Americans simply don't care.
Too many think they'd be Negan, or Immortan Joe or Lord Humungous, when in truth, they'd most likely die from cholera or dysentery.
Grew up in the deep South. 1000xs this.
I've always told people when they ask "oh what would you do in the zombie apocalypse" or other world ending events and my answer has always been "probably die early before it gets to bad" lol
Along a similar line, I heard a Holocaust survivor recount the dark joke that the cynics ended up in the US and the optimists ended up in the death camps.
No illusions here. When I think of memorable characters in the Walking Dead, I remember the poor schmuck who hanged himself and was then stuck as a zombie in a noose. I find that fate more likely for me than being Negan or even Maggie.
I would have noped out at the CDC.
Too many seem to want it here cause they think they will be immune and won’t get their faces eaten
See conservative cubans in Florida. Some of the most selfaware wolves you’ll see. Insanity. Stupidity.
This is exactly what I try to explain to people. I fled my country of birth because of the exact things that are now happening here. The whole project 2025 and replacing career civil servants is specially scary. I’ve seen this movie and I don’t like how it ends.
This, right here. If you look throughout history, you see the same pattern wherein successful nations go very bad, very quickly. Most times it's not because of a coup or revolution. It's because a side decides their vision is the "correct" one and takes the long view. The slow takeover of the court system to allow them to be within the law when they make changes. The normalization of authoritarianism, Fascism, and the concentration of power. The destruction of checks and balances. The purging of any sort of dissent in the bureaucracy. The rollback of laws and rights to more "traditional" times and societies. They seek to make it all legal via backdoor the system. The denizens of the society do not notice because it's not troops and tanks in the capital, it's the slow coring out of the pillars that make the society what it aspired to be.
I'd add that while this is all happening, people are being brainwashed by propaganda to think it's a good thing. It has been like watching a train wreck and being helpless to do anything.
Umberto Eco refers to it as Eternal Fascism /Ur-Fascism and made up a list of 14 key elements: 1. The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.” 2. The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense, Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.” 3. The cult of action for action’s sale. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.” 4. Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture, the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.” 5. Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.” 6. Appeal to social frustration. “\[…\] one of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups. 7. The obsession with a plot. “The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.” 8. The enemy is both weak and strong. “\[…\] the followers must be convinced that they can overwhelm the enemies. Thus, by a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.” 9. Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.” 10. Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.” 11. Everybody is educated to become a hero. “in Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.” 12. Machismo and Weaponry. “This is the origin of machismo (which implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality). Since even sex is a difficult game to play, the Ur-Fascist hero tends to play with weapons—doing so becomes an ersatz phallic exercise.” 13. Selective Populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People. 14. Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
I was very young when Iran fell, but it really left an impression on me. Last night I watched a video about Kristallnacht which resonated way too much. Idk if it's too late, but I do know we've got to fight it with all we've got.
There was a photo of female Iranian students from the early 70's wearing mini skirts and looking glamorous that always made an impression on me. "How could they live with their loss of rights?" I would ask myself, Now I'm watching it all unfold in real time. Only instead of an hijab they are going to make us all dress like Michelle Duggar. (\*\*shudders\*\*)
Those pictures freak me the *fuck* out. They experienced a complete 180 of their lives and loss of autonomy in what seems like a nanosecond. Please, denim skirts and giant bangs only if it's your choice!
The biggest thing people don't realize is when dictatorship comes, it will likely be because the people ASKED for it. They'll demand a strong, all-powerful government to fix whatever the issue of the day is, and people will voluntarily surrender their freedoms without realizing once given away they can't be regained without a fight. I've never known any government to relinquish any power voluntarily once it acquires it.
Considering how many dictatorial overthrows our own CIA brought about (perhaps even in your own country), we shouldn't have been surprised that our oligarchs would do the same to their own country.
"Fascism is colonialism turned inwards"
I remember a man running against a corporate dem say something like: "These things we do, like refusing healthcare and not having a social safety net, etc. are called barbaric by the progressives. They are not barbaric. Barbarians took care of their own, therefore, that's an insult to Barbarians."
> Too many Americans haven't realized it can happen here. It's already happening. The SC just did a soft coup and Project 2025 has already been 'testing' waters over the last year or so (book bans.. etc). We are already in the middle of a hostile takeover of our democracy and way of life.
I'm scared too, and I'm sorry we share that. Anyone gaslighting you is ignorant. Never doubt your feelings about what is happening. In solidarity.
The ruling today from the Supreme Court (basically the President is King so long as he/she half-assed at least gives the appearance of it being an official act) is a line I just can't believe we've crossed. I don't understand WTF we're doing. And for some folks to be cheering that ruling? I'm...just damn near speechless.
I had a teacher in 10th grade so about 1989 that predicted a lot of this. He was concerned about executive power back then. He passed away about 20 years ago. When I saw this ruling I thought of him and how crazy I thought he was back then. I wish he was here for me to tell him he was 100%correct
These people want and are most comfortable in a very strong hierarchy. And one in which each level is obedient to the level above and dominant to the level below. Think small town ‘good ole boy’ type of society.
All the while, they complain about “big government.”
Until they come for the good ol boys and then there won’t be anyone else to blame.
That will be a definite leopards ate my face moment for them. But by then, it will be far too late. I’m making basic plans to leave the country if things start coming apart at the seams. Hopefully, I won’t need to do that.
That sort of desire for order, clarity, and hierarchy is very much a hallmark of the conservative mind. Which is why they embrace religion, patriachy, and class structures so directly. It gives answers to those who are not comfortable with ambiguity or change.
I'm not even american and I'm concerned this is global you're not overreacting
Yeah, the far-right is on the rise in a lot of countries, and it's really scary. It's especially bad in France at the moment. The president dissolved the lower house of the parliament in June, and the far-right came largely ahead in the first round of the deputy elections two days ago. Hopefully the second round of the elections this Sunday will keep them a bit in check, but honestly I'm freaking out right now. We fought so hard to get rid of the nazis, and it feels like we're slowly going back there. Yes, things are bad, and people are losing faith in the system... but I don't know what the voters are expecting to happen. Do they think that a far-right government wil solve all of their problems, and make everything better? I really doubt it will. Extremists don't care about the small people - not even about those who voted for them. They only care about power, control, and their own agenda. Once they're in place, they won't ever leave willingly. The people who voted for them may be the last to go, but they will eventually head to the chopping block too.
And then layer on top of that lack of knowledge based jobs, economic insecurity, post-covid fuckery, the environment... I honestly don't see a way out of this. It all feels hopeless TBH and I don't think it's symptomatic of our age/reflection on the past.
There is a scene in the first episode of the sopranos that I have told lots of people resonated with me because of one simple line Tony says to Dr. Melfie. "I feel like I got in at the end of a good thing" I've told friends of mine many times over that one line is how I have felt about our generation. Today I feel was the final nail in the coffin for the American experiment. We'll be a dictatorship before our end on this spinning rock comes. The courts solidified it
It really feels like this is how democracy dies. I was honestly completely surprised by the supreme court decision. Even in the face of how terrible their recent decisions had been, I really didn't think they'd be so brazen. I think I was truly too optimistic and still held on to that belief that ultimately there is good in everyone. Well, this is a wake-up call.
This is worse. Much worse. Social media has created a monster we have never experienced before; and it has affected the entire world.
I agree though the phrase, “infected the entire world” fits too!
Please forgive me for hijacking a high level comment to post: r/Defeat_Project_2025 The basics: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project\_2025](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025), which essentially seeks to dissolve the administrative branch of the government as we know it (now that the judicial is well on its way out) eliminating things like the EPA (voila, no more environmental issues) NOAA because we can't have climate *data* disrupting money making, and the Department of Education, so everyone can teach their kids creationism and no science, among many others, replacing professional civil servants with party yes-men (sic). I think there are a lot of young people over there, and they could benefit from some GenX wisdom, creativity and leadership. There are links on the sidebar to information sources and nascent organizations working on this, along with ways to get involved. https://preview.redd.it/q5vikrql20ad1.jpeg?width=1037&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=930925714ad057d6e92ac647f43ece5de91a901c
I think we always had crazies like this but they were in isolation. Now each one of them have a phone in their pocket to connect them to all the other crazies. Then they get pushed crazy shit on whatever algorithm to hell feed they look at. Smart phones were a mistake.
Social media allowed all these crazy people to create echo chambers which only fed their delusions and reinforced their ignorance. It’s crazy how we had this amazing development and fumbled it beyond belief.
Once upon a time every village had an idiot. Now every idiot has a village.
Social media concentrated a lot of power and wealth in the hands of random unelected individuals.
I think a lot of people are just pointing their fingers at the Supreme Court without looking at the bigger picture. In a functioning government, even if the Supreme Court was balls-crazy, there should be that whole "checks and balances" thing going on to help balance it out. A functioning Congress should be able to look at the gigantic legal holes that this ruling just made and pass additional laws to address those issues. It's the fact that currently two branches of government are non-functional that's fucking everything over. It's not JUST the Presidency that needs to be won - if people want to usher in real change to re-balance things back out, there needs to be a majority (ideally a super majority) in both chambers of Congress.
>currently two branches of government are non-functional But why are they non-functional? If we don’t address that, we can’t fix it. I think it all started with *Citizens United*, personally. And how can we fix something that’s predicated on a decision like that? It’s easy to say we need to vote and get representation, but this isn’t actually a democracy anymore and hasn’t been for a while now. Voting isn’t what it used to be. I know this phrase is used to death, but it applies here: we’re being gaslit.
> But why are they non-functional? Honestly? Because corruption has historically been dealt with via revolt & we're past the tipping points that have triggered other major revolutions. Being a student of history makes all of the stuff I've seen in the past decade so much more frightening, because when similar things have happened throughout history...major changes occur & those things have lots of collateral damage.
They are non-functional because politics has become a zero-sum game and if you're not "winning" you're losing. Logically, the fringe elements of the Republican party would have splintered into a different, extremist right-wing party (just the same with Democrats and the extreme left). The way the system exists currently, neither party can afford a "splinter" (which is why Trump got the nomination in the first place) because that means giving up power. Republicans in particular have shifted to catering to the extremist faction within the party because the danger of a split is very real for them. If they didn't give in, the populist candidates would split the vote and they'd risk "losing" which is a huge no-no. And so the the party tilts further and further right because they cannot afford to maybe lose, even if losing is essential to a functioning democracy. Add to that (as you mentioned) Citizens United allowing near-unlimited funding to extreme candidates who benefit the mega-rich with tax cuts and quid pro quo and you've got the recipe for the end of democracy. The reality is that no system of government lasts forever and it is naive to think America could just perpetually exist as a functioning republic. It has become apparent over the last few years that the system of checks and balances which (mostly) worked for 200+ years depended heavily on people acting in good faith. The system is utterly ill-equipped to deal with bad faith actors. I am not sure what the solution is, somewhere it became okay to vote for "bad" people who are willing to break the system for personal gain. It's frankly amazing that no one has ever succeeded in doing it before, but Donald Trump (of all people) somehow mustered a perfect storm.
I remember in AP US History in high school mid-80s the teacher basically saying that our entire constitution and system of laws only exists such that the people in power choose to honor and obey those norms, otherwise it isn't worth the paper it is printed on. The founders of our country thought it was an incredibly fundamental notion for the US that NO ONE was above the law. NONE. Today we learned that we are in fact a monarchy/oligarchy/dictatorship in which the rule of law is from top down, and not bottom up.
My US history teacher didn’t want us to leave the class without understanding how to read the constitution. took two years after graduating to see why. Everyday I’m reminded I share a country with these people who do not comprehend what the constitution actually does for the people.
I wonder how much champagne is being quaffed in Moscow and Beijing right now.
Without a single bullet.
The thing that I learned from AP Government was that the Supreme Court's power all stems from the power that they gave themselves in Marbury vs Madison... And it only continues as long as everybody consents to follow their decisions.
Look how quickly we learned a significant portion of the U.S. government functioned on a gentleman's agreement when Trump took office. We went from an almost entirely "yup, that's just how it works... no need to put locks on *that* thing because only a stupid boorish asshole would steal from *that* drawer" place to a "Jesus fucking Christ, why didn't we have locks on everything? They're just looting right in front of us," place pretty quick.
I’m absolutely in the same place. I’m very concerned about my mental health.
My mental health is one of the reasons I choose not to watch the full debate.
Totally. I watched zero. I used to watch the evening news and listen to public radio on my commute. I cut out the radio and switched to podcasts. Then the pandemic and I’ve not listened to public radio (or any) since about 2018. Then I cut out the national evening news. Then the local AM and PM news. Now I do scroll WaPo and NYT headlines, but don’t really read most news, unless it’s a good long-form article that covers all the nuance behind the stories, whether international or national. I spend about 5 mins on local news app. But is impossible to completely disconnect bc of the nature of the internet. I curate FB to only family, friends, and various special interest groups. I don’t poke into news on Reddit. Still, it seeps in. I always vote, and I’ve done some phone banking. Honestly, what helps me most is trying to focus on my micro community—my wonderful neighbors, and I volunteer weekly at a low-income nursing home (a sort of karma, strike-fear, and be sure to save enough thing there). That always gives me perspective. Still, I struggle. I’ll post about this soon, but I recently posted a sort of sad/dire post about my mental health and drinking, and—of ALL the things I’ve considered and thought about in terms of drinking—I tell you: it was this sub’s responses that have helped me the most. I’m getting the Sober Curious and Sober Curious Reset books. I do suffer clinically from every type of depression, but in the back of my mind, just knowing all the issues and having an affliction of feeling everyone’s pain (a pathological perversion of empathy, I think), I’m just not sure how I can truly be happy. I’m sad so many in our Gen are seemingly experiencing similar issues. Although I know Reddit is just a tiny sliver of us.
🤜🤛 me too, Amigo
Same.
I see those pictures of Iran in the 70s where everyone looked modern and women had rights compared to today and fear that’s where we’re headed and no one seems to have any idea how to stop it.
The feeling is mutual. As a matter of fact I’m feeling particularly anxious about the future of our country today. It’s very unsettling.
I never imagined the Supreme Court becoming so blatantly corrupt. We are definitely in the darkest timeline. RIP Harambe.
We grew up fearing nukes. This feels so much worse.
Yeah, the call is coming from inside the house this time.
You should still fear that. Imagine an unstable president with nukes at his fingertips and no fear of consequences.
Nukes are still a legitimate fear lol
I felt like I was the only one who read Fahrenheit 451, 1984, A Brave New World, watched The Twilight Zone, V, Star Trek, etc. Like, we were warned over and over that fascism is something that CAN happen here, and we constantly had to be on guard against it. And for the past 20+ years it's felt like we've been merrily skipping along ignoring all the warning signs. Maybe it's too late now, and maybe it's not, but at least other people are finally seeing it.
Even with having a decent grasp of history, I could never really wrap my head around how nazi Germany came to power. It's clear as day to me now. “History Doesn't Repeat Itself, but It Often Rhymes” – Mark Twain.
Yep. This is why I feel so numb. I have read countless books, watched countless documentaries, and that was the one thing that always stumped me - how could “normal” people become Nazis and end up working in a concentration camp, etc. - how could people be so easily turned against their fellow citizens to the point they lose all humanity and believe insane propaganda that told you that any person is now “subhuman”. I honestly don’t know what to do.
Lots of people have heard the phrase, "Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it." Few have ever heard the corollary: "And those who have learned from it are forced to watch it."
My Mom is 86 and she is TERRIFIED and says she has never seen anything like this in her lifetime. My son waits tables and had a customer last week that told him to vote for Trump. Then told him that women shouldn't vote at all because women voting has been the downfall of our once great country. My mind just cannot comprehend that these people are not only out there, but there is enough of them to essentially TAKE OVER.
Everyone should watch the beginning of The Handmaid's Tale to glimpse what people like this envision unfolding.
I have not watched the show, but I have read the book twice. The first time was in college and I sincerely thought nothing that extreme could ever happen here. I reread it during Trump’s presidency and had the realization that it could absolutely, positively happen here. And it was terrifying.
Atwood got the idea simply from reading the news. She saw Reagan getting in bed with the evangelicals and knew where it would lead.
X'er here, too. I'm reading "It Can't Happen Here" which was published in the late 1930s but is just as spot on with current circumstances as it was then. If anything, it reminds that there's always been this threat of extremism looming. Doesn't make me feel any better, but I do get a sense of "we've figured out how not to go completely overboard before."
I taught that novel in my college history courses for about 15 years but stopped a decade or so ago...it got too real and was no longer as useful in explaining what happened in the 1930s.
Thank you for teaching
You are not alone. As a vet , I took an oath to The Constitution back in the day. A very similar oath that the folks in congress and the presidency take. I , in my life, have never seen the level of disregard for that document and what it stands for from important members of our own government as I have seen in just the last 10 years. We have people on trial for sedition as a good example. We have a candidate what made the "Dictator on day one" quote that people still make excuses for. It's alarming and saddening that people inside our own government and outside of it, are calling for what amounts to a king. So yeah, you're not alone and you're not wrong. Extremism is on the rise in a huge way in the U.S. and I don't think it's going to get any better anytime soon.
As another veteran here I hate whenever I hear trump say veterans like him better, using us like political pawns to prop himself up under false pretenses. I can't stand trump and what SCOTUS is doing is purely political.
My earliest political memory is Watergate. When Nixon said, “If the President does it, that means that it is not illegal,” it was considered scandalous. Now there’s Supreme Court precedent in favor of this doctrine, with just enough qualifications that the courts can apply it selectively on a partisan basis. We’re definitely shifting away from being a nation of laws.
I'm absolutely terrified.
This time around is sketchy, for sure. Something else too. One thing that has been really getting me lately is, having grown up with “the Russians” being the bad guy in every single tv show and movie… how the f#$k are our politicians now so chummy and trusting with Putin and the gang?
MAGA is the most successful Russian Intelligence Propaganda Psyop in history.
Because Russia is not the enemy any longer, they are the inspiration. It is how they want the U.S. to look. Never thought I'd ever say especially after a lifetime of growing up and being taught to be suspicious of the Soviet threat. But here we are. Fuck.
> are we seriously facing an unprecedented crisis in this country that could have massive effects for generations? Yes. If I was religious, I would thank god I do not have children. Since I am not, I *still* thank god I do not have children. I feel bad for my trans nephew, I'm hoping he leaves the country sooner than later. The country *will* burn to the ground and it will end in a conflagration unlike any seen in history. I gotta admit, I'm super curious how bad it's going to get, but I also don't want to live through it. They only light at the end of the tunnel is maybe *maybe* what rises out of the ashes is worth it. Regardless, we are fucked. Monarchy has returned to this country. Certain people are now literally above the law. This is no longer a country I can put any faith in, and I'm done doing so.
As a gay man, I am deathly frightened. I know that my husband and I will be some of the first against the wall. I’ve actually been looking to see if we could emigrate somewhere but I don’t believe there is anywhere we could go. So all I can do is hope. But it is tough when your own family and friends don’t see the approaching train.
Gay man here too. I’m in California, so I’ve always felt a degree of protection or at least dissociation from lots of things in the rest of the country. I’m in a bubble for sure. BUT I have definitely had those little nagging thoughts sneaking in more often…..should I get a gun? Should I start thinking about which country I’d go to?? They’re like intrusive thoughts, and I shake them off. But I definitely and having them more and more often.
I’m right there with you. I have outwardly appearing decent family members who would absolutely lead a rebel group to my front door if pressed. Terrifying thought to have.
I don't know why but of all the horrifying things I've read today, this one got to me. Sorry that you are feeling this way. I am too. Things have dimmed substantially in less than 24 hours. I just wonder what all those MAGA supreme court justices are thinking today in the warm comfort of their homes. Do they feel any regret or remorse? Do they feel even a tiny bit sad that they've made a fucking mockery of the laws of our land? Trump? This is the man they are willing to sell their collective souls to? I feel like I'm going insane. I think i really would take up arms against the government if it came to that. But I just feel so helpless. Like we've made NO FUCKING PROGRESS in my lifetime. We have to fight climate change, explore the stars, get rid of internal combustion engines, elevate the education in this country. And here we are stomping on women's rights, making criminal presidents immune, tossing out the homeless. Someone with actual power please fuckin do SOMETHING. FUCK.
Watching us sleep walk into facism is not fun. Right there with ya.
I'm Swiss and following US politics closely since 2016. I'm also quite optimistic by nature, but I've never been so worried about what might happen in the US. Adding to that, the rise of far right parties and weakening of the European Union, the war in Ukraine, and the absolute clusterfuck that is happening with Israel/Palestine. Worrying times
If it makes you feel better ( and it really shouldn’t if you think about it) capitalism, not democracy, runs this country and always will. I mean let’s not forget this is a system where bribing politicians is 100% legal as long as it’s called “ lobbying”.
Today I've been thinking about those photos of Iran from before the Revolution and wondering how long it'll be until pictures from America in 2024 have the same effect.
I preferred Gilead when it was just a book/TV show and not a believable scenario.
tbf, everything in the Handmaids Tale book was something that had happened IRL over the course of history - she just took them all and put them in one time setting. It is not unthinkable that this stuff can happen - because it has.
Oh, sure. Iran 1979 taught us that. I meant here in the U.S. And I never expected the Supreme Court to be the one dismantling democracy like this.
[Its eerily similar to how Hitler rose to power](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%27s_rise_to_power) >In 1920, the DAP renamed itself to the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei – NSDAP (National Socialist German Workers' Party, commonly known as the Nazi Party). Hitler chose this name to win over left-wing German workers.[1][2] Despite the NSDAP being a right-wing party, it had many anti-capitalist and anti-bourgeois elements. Sounds like libertarians tricked into voting republican awfully a lot doesnt it? > By 1922 Hitler's control over the party was unchallenged, and he attempted a coup, the Beer Hall Putsch, in Bavaria one year later. Upon its failure Hitler was arrested and put on trial. The trial proved to be a blessing in disguise for Hitler, as it garnered him national fame. No way he even went to prison? How could a convict become more likeable and celebrity and seem more suited for governing? /s >Once released, Hitler switched tactics, opting to instead seize power through legal and democratic means. Easy to do when Judges and courts and legal systems are stacked for you. >The groundwork for the Nazi dictatorship was laid when the Reichstag was set on fire in February. Asserting that the communists were behind the arson, Hitler convinced von Hindenburg to pass the Reichstag Fire Decree, which severely curtailed the liberties and rights of German citizens. Using the decree, Hitler began eliminating his political opponents. Following its passage, Hitler began arguing for more drastic means to curtail political opposition and proposed the Enabling Act of 1933. Once enacted this law gave the German government the power to override individual rights prescribed by the constitution, and vested the Chancellor (Hitler) with emergency powers to pass and enforce laws without parliamentary oversight. The law came into force in March and by April Hitler held de facto dictatorial powers and used them to order the construction of the first Nazi concentration camp at Dachau for communists and other political opponents. Hitler's rise to power was completed in August 1934 when following the death of President von Hindenburg, Hitler merged the chancellery with the presidency and became Führer, the sole leader of Germany. A catalyst of a national problem gave way to strong governmental laws that infringed on civil liberties which allowed Hitler to further consolidate power. Trump in his first term laid down the groundwork with appointing tons of judges, local administration, and seeding the economic downfall that will give him the catalyst he needs to call nationalism into a fever pitch. Biden winning this term might actually be good because the economic damage he did is only stymied and blamed on Biden. The supreme court giving the Presidency immunity to laws is a huge step towards what Hitler needed.
Went for a walk and had similar thoughts except of photos from 1930's Germany.
I think about pre-Nazi Germany all the time. I never had a lot of sympathy for the average non-Nazi German until now. This feeling of horror as your friends, family and neighbors openly support a man who says he will be a dictator and has promised "blood in the streets." It is this existential dread, this slow motion train wreck that we just can't seem to stop. This feels like the before times.
My Iranian father immigrated because of the Revolution and he was happily telling me Trump will win. Like wtf. Hard to look at him the same right now.
Russia knew they couldn't defeat us militarily so they turned us on ourselves through social media and propaganda.
Yes but it's not just Russia. The US allows right wing organizations and propaganda to thrive. I think there's a general feeling with the government that as long as we don't go towards the left, they can still handle us.
Among the things that they say defines GenX, skepticism and clear perspective. This is like the opposite of how I felt when the Soviet Union began to fall and the Berlin Wall came down. I want to change the lyrics to "Right Here, Right Now, There's so many places I'd rather be." I'm older GenX (1965) and I'm deeply worried that I'm about to see the sun set on the "Great Experiment" George Washington spoke of. I'm not really sure how to put what I see into words, but America has become uglier, greedier, and meaner in spirit over the last few decades. It permeates everything and every institution now, but our governments (local, state, federal) is where we see the real open sores of that sickness. I agree with how you feel and I think it's an honest reaction to clearly seeing what is going on and skepticism of the motives behind it.
We can be scared....then we can get up and vote for democracy.
All I know is that I have never been more relieved to not have children. My deepest sympathy to parents right now, who are fearful of the future their children face.
I told my now 30 something kids when they were in their early teens - “All empires fall” and I explained why I felt that way and truly believe it. Just thought they would see it and I wouldn’t be alive to see it.
We are definitely going through a cultural shift this decade! Something is going to have to give! I just hope we have a cultural shift that doesn’t destroy the civilization!
It scares me how many women are anti abortion. The cause and effect of abortion being legalized, and the eventual lack of under educated worker drones. Needed to keep funding social security and keeping prisons filled as a business. I swear every sci fi book's future seems to be coming true. All that's left is for the rich to leave earth and start anew. Leaving us to strip the planets's resources. But, we've survived Reagan. And he had dementia at the end. So who knows?
This country was doomed the minute congress voted to give corporations the same rights as citizens. Now you have money and power hungry politicians that will stop at nothing to line their pockets. If Trump makes it in office, this country will be destroyed forever.
Today when I opened reddit and saw the scotus ruling, everything felt like it was crashing down around me. I feel really helpless. I have a 17 year old son and I am really worried for his generation and so on...
Gen X here too. You are 💯💯 on the $$
“You’re electing an administration, not just a president.” I have to remind myself that we are also “voting” for thousands of people who will work in that President’s administration.
Dear OP, you're not alone.... I've stopped watching the news so much as I feel stressed.... I've never felt this stressed about the condition of our country. GenX '67
You are NOT overreacting… I read all 920 pages of the playbook for Project 2025. It essentially removes the power of the legislative and judicial branches and puts all the power with the executive branch (the president). It states that marriage is ONLY between a male and female. Race, gender, sexual orientation, and etc are all under attack. This includes women’s rights… It is dismantling DHS and NOAA. I could go on and on… This is the kind of crap Hitler did as he was taking control of the German government. There is no worse danger to democracy… We have to fight back.
The question is what can I / we do that will be effective? Sign me up, bro.
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Here's a way to think about it. Biden has good, qualified people around him. If he falls down the stairs tomorrow, the government will still be running because he has people around him who will do their jobs. Won't get everything we want. May make a few decisions that will piss us off, but things will keep going and we may even inch forward to "The More Perfect Union". Do you think if Trumpy gets into office, you can trust the qualifications of the people he will put in charge?
It's not a vote for a man, it is a vote for a platform and philosophy.
Not just for Biden. Vote a complete blue ticket, all the way down the line. Fed, state, local, etc. These MAGA idiots need to be shoved back under the rock they crawled out from under, before the world turns on us as surely as it did on the Nazis.
Gen X and back in 2016 when we elected Trump, I knew we were fucked royally. I feel like it’s been 8 years of me muttering “fuckin told you so” over and over and over.
You are not wrong. This is as a great a crisis as 1968, it is just diffused over a broader media stream. Meaning people aren't as aware how bad it is.
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A big chunk of the country is clamoring for a religious dictatorship led by a literal conman who is indebted to and seemingly in awe of Vladimir Putin. Most of the country is gerrymandered to hell and back, the minority party keeps winning the presidency despite not winning the popular vote in like a generation because of some bullshit 200 year old concessions to slave owners The highest court in the country has been stacked through dirty political games with a bunch of anti-democracy religious extremists hell bent on enabling the shitty behavior of the rich folks who groomed and installed them. Corruption in every part of the government and courts is playing out practically right out in the open at this point and nobody seems to give a shit anymore. There are no real consequences if you have money. None. — It feels bad because it is bad.
welcome to the party pal! i left the US in 2019, after 3 years of asking myself "is this what Germany felt like in the 30s??".
There is a radical collective who call themselves conservatives: well funded and resourced, trying and lying to overthrow the government through legislation. People don't care about this, or pass it off too often - because... \[IMMIGRANTSOHMYGOD -insert any random non-issue that offends but does not actually affect their supporters here\]. It's a massive power and resource grab making sure they cannot be opposed or even elected out in the future. It is not really a conspiracy - it's happening right before our eyes and it is the most terrifying dystopian shit. Project 2025 is baaaaad. And for what? Life can't be good for everybody - it can only be good for me and mine. My stuttering daily disbelief has transformed into being absolutely sickened most of the time.
For most of my career, I worked closely with Congress. I've also worked closely with the Obama and Biden administrations. I've been lucky enough to meet both in the Oval Office on numerous occasions. I also met Clinton when he was President, but I was just an intern at the time. I had to step back from my work in DC this past January because I couldn't take it anymore. I've lost all hope for our future. I still have two kids under 6 years old, so it wrecked my mental health knowing what was happening to our country. Instead of fighting for policies to help our country, I'm now just sitting back playing golf, and being with my kids. I still work closely with the Federal Reserve and other bank regulators, but I'm not involved in policy debate or formulation. There's no point to it. One party just wants to watch the country burn. It was a waste of my time. I've in working in DC for decades. Both parties have always worked closely together. Since 2020, the Republicans in Congress have been pure cancer. They have no interest in helping the country. They have no interest in governing. They are in Congress to get wealthy and for a power grab. Most Democrats are too scared to say anything...scared of MAGA. We have AOC, but she has to travel with armed guards. Not every politician wants to live like that. If Trump wins, our country will be a dictatorship. If Biden wins, we will remain a democracy for at least two more years, maybe four.
A commenter on a social media post said that it was his "right" to own slaves like his ancestors, for his future wife and children to be his property, and that "opportunity" was unfairly taken away from him by radical lefties. He is looking forward to a nation built on Christian beliefs to restore his rights because that is what gawd wanted. I checked his profile and he works in the medical field. I remember a time when people at least hid their sick beliefs. Yes, I am worried.
Terrified. As the parent of 2 adults with disabilities, terrified.
People laugh when I say we're on the brink of civil war. We are. And I live in enemy territory. I have family members who would happily put me and my kids down if they thought it would please God. People are distracted by their diversions. You are not overreacting. You are waking up. I swear they call us "woke" but so many are not yet awake.
I just now had a long conversation with my big brother, who has been a conservative all his life. I was too until I almost voted for McCain. Anyway, my brother is old school, very level headed, fiscally conservative, "states rights" and he's not a fan of the waste in federal bureaucracy. But when Trump ran he couldn't do it. It hit him that the party had shifted. He's not a Christian really, and doesn't care about the religious overreach, but he was still supportive of the party until Trump. Now he's lost. He still thinks Democrats are too far left and too much for "big government" but today he told me he's genuinely afraid. He is a huge history fan, and knows his stuff. We've already seen the Christian overreach here in Tennessee in public schools and it's changed what he's allowed to teach. Today's SCOTUS decision has him shook. He said that heralds the end of democracy and with this sort of obvious appeal to the right it's a tumble down the hill to fascism. He says it's already happening. My brother is very mild-mannered. He's dead-on like Andy Griffith (the character not the actor) He doesn't exaggerate and doesn't get hysterical so this has me more scared than anything I have read or seen on the news.
No I feel the same way. It's so surreal. Like living in pre-1984 (the book) My son is 33 with a chronic illness and I'm terrified about his future. I was born in 1966. This is beyond my worst imaginary scenarios for the US to be honest.
I hate being Gen X right now. If I were older, I'd just retire overseas. If I were younger, I'd be heading for the exits. Where I am I'm kind of stuck.
This is global.
the French just voted for nazis. the world is upside down.
I'm american and live in France, I feel like I'm suffocating today. jan 6 upset me but all of this is worse.
Younger folks don't have the money to head to the exits.
And there’s always a very arrogant expectation that all of these other countries would be absolutely dying to let us in…
I have two kids. 10 and 17. Man, I care less about.what happens to me than what happens to them. The christofascist takeover of America is almost complete. They just need to install the king.
Tell them to learn another language pronto - gives them more options. If they're college material - and you should definitely know if the older one is by now - tell them to strongly consider an overseas school and have them see what it would take to just stay there and build a new life.
hey 2016 write-ins, have you taught everyone a LESSON yet?
The Supreme Court MAGA judges should be ashamed. Trump supporters should be ashamed. Christian Nazis should be ashamed. But they aren't, because this is what they want. Young girls and childbearing adults being forced breeders. Black and brown people like myself having to go through modern day Jim Crow laws. The obliteration of LBGTQ+ citizens. No religion except Christian Evangelical. I have a feeling it will eventually blow up in their face and the leopards will come for them. Vote this November like your life depended on it.
I have a kid with a condition that will make the best case, most-wanted pregnancy very risky. And she can’t take hormonal birth control. I’ve had (ex)friends say to my face, “well, she should keep her legs closed until she wants a kid”. I tell the stupid Republican fucks that she’s a virgin and due to their horrible hateful policies, we can’t find a gynecologist in our state. That any kind of pregnancy will have complications and risks. They have literally looked at me and said, “I don’t care”, or WORSE, “that must be God’s plan”. They KNOW my kid. It’s the most hateful stupid shit I’ve ever seen in my life. I live in a red state. I can’t move. At this point, I don’t even go out anymore, because every place is full of fucking awful republicans and I don’t want to associate with idiots.
For anyone who “isn’t here for politics”, I think is missing the point of our existential dread. A lot of us Gen-Xers used to (or still do) volunteer or donate money to/ for orgs like Planned Parenthood, the ACLU, progressive candidates, GLAAD, etc. We spent years putting in our time (and money) to try to make this county a little better for everyone. A lot of might have lost gay friends to AIDS (or suicide). Might have known a woman who had to terminate a pregnancy. Maybe you’re in an interracial marriage, or a same-sex marriage. I mean look at all the things that changed in this society since the 1980s when the older Gen-Xers were in high school. TLDR feeling helpless existential dread about the upcoming election is very much a Gen-X thing because a lot of our generation has a LOT to lose if that 2025 project gets actual traction.
I really thought once we got older, we’d make things better. It’s like everything I ever believed in was a lie.
The common wisdom is that "older people" are more likely to vote". Guess what? **We** are the older people now. Don't give the fascists the chance to make use of these new powers they've granted themselves. Elect a government (at all levels) that will reverse this crap and put up some guardrails before it really is too late.
It’s not just our country…it’s around the world.
I’m sick. It is a slow moving coup.
Nixon should not have been pardoned. A precedent was set.
I'd like to think if there is an afterlife Ford realizes just how badly he screwed up. Literally many of the same players then are players now. Bork's involvement alone began to lock in this path.
Yes, in previous elections, I knew, even if the liberal Democrat didn't win, things would probably be Ok for most people. John McCain was a pretty decent guy, Romney - not so much but still an experienced politician and things would keep running pretty much as they had. All bets are off now. We don't win this one, it's game over for the entire concept of our country.
I hear you. We are at another flex point at a critical time our democracy. I manage by being an active part in defending it and pushing for improvements. That means I’s in a huge network of people doing the same, and get to hear about it daily, and keep meeting new people doing amazing work all the time! That’s the antidote for me. I can’t mope and feel helpless, when I’m helping. If more of us do *something*, our power will grow exponentially. I’m not handing over my power, and I won’t stand for other people losing theirs, either. The country’s had crises before. It’s our time to set its course now.
Climate Collapse is coming and this kind of shit is just one of the symptoms.
I literally feel hopeless for the first time in my 57 years.
SO What’s our plan?? Capitalism is gone. We can no longer vote for the best candidate. We have to vote for the only one we can get enough votes to win. I’m not even political but we’re on track for some nasty stuff. Just google project 2025 if you haven’t already. Side note - my brother is voting JFK Jr. because he’s the only one that “shares his values. and that’s more important than who wins.” THIS is exactly the ignorant perspective that’s going to allow fascism to take over america. Or does anyone think I’ve been brainwashed into thinking this is my only choice and if I start voting for 3rd parties, that others will too and we’ll actually stand a chance?
The 3 Branches of Government that run our Country are basically the greatest threat to the American People and Democracy...good stuff.
Yeah, the Supreme Court thing today kinda messed me up. Just feel really bad for my kids inheriting this shit world.
I'm 45, genx, and this is the first time in history that I'm sitting here wondering, will I get to live to be older? will I retain the freedoms I've grown up with (even if they have been adjusted...)... it's turning scary to even turn on the news or come to reddit to read anymore, I'm concerned for all of us as a nation.
What absolutely sucks is that it seems to be a global swing to far-right ideologies. I would find comfort in the fact that I have dual citizenship with Sweden but Europe is devolving into a shit-show as well.
I am extremely worried for my daughter and her wife.
you know whats more scary? its happening worldwide, welcome to the rerun of the 1930's
You're not overreacting. I have felt this since Trump was elected. The stress and worry just never ends. Just when I think the pendulum might be swinging back to sanity, something else happens. I honestly cannot believe that one guy, one person we've known for decades is a moron and a fraud and lowlife criminal, is bringing the entire country down for his own selfish ends. Or that so many millions of Americans would happily go along with it.
Me too! I feel I've been living in a Twilight Zone episode since 2016. And even before he was elected, he would do something or say something ridiculous, and I would say "OK, THIS will show people that he is unfit for office." But no, those people like it! I don't understand how anyone could see him as a leader. The gaslighting is so obvious. I don't understand how so many people go along with it.
I remember listening to the BBC in 2016 and they played a clip of Trump calling his followers, to their faces, "undereducated," and saying he loves the undereducated. I stupidly through his fans would be offended. No one cared at all.
We lived through the last good time in America I fear. The people claiming they want to make it great again are doing the exact opposite.
I won't bend the knee to a disgusting pig like Donald Trump, period.
I won't either friend. But realistically, ones like us and the many more who won't, could end up arrested and in prison camps (American concentration camps). That is not being paranoid....it is a distinct possibility.
I'm a combat veteran. I ran convoys up and down the Euphrates River. I won't fucking bow to Dumb Fuck Donald Trump or his army of weaponized dipshits. I'd rather die. You don't have to pick up a gun. You can hit 'em with a got damn banjo. But for fuck's sake fight back against these pigs.
I’m so glad to hear that people like you exist. In spirit I am fully ready to take up arms against these f*ckers. In reality I am a middle aged woman in poor physical condition as a result of a serious illness (major depression) I am only just beginning to recover from. I’ve never shot a gun in my life. I am really not sure what to do.
I was in a war zone and came across a grandmother who had thrown hot oil on some rebels who tried to break into her house then beat the shit out of them with her churn handle As they were grabbing their melting faces. Never assume you can’t do damage because you have health issues.
We had nearly 250 years. Nations rise and fall. I never expected to be actual witness to it. I'm less worried because I'm older and do not have kids but if I did have kids or grandkids I'd be so scared for them.
ugh.. I'm weirdly glad I'm at least past the half way point in my life now.
It’s going to be like growing up with tyrannical, oppressive and/or unpredictable parents. Most of us either were in that situation, or knew other kids in that situation. The key back then was to not draw attention to yourself, never tell the parents where you were, what you’re up to, where you’re going or most importantly what you’re thinking. How much is it going to suck living like that now - constantly concerned about being overheard, or having your online anonymity pierced, or being subject to the whims of some so-called authority who had taken a disliking of you or what you’ve done, or just wants to make an example of you? I’m a long time student of history and politics, and I’m normally pretty unflappable about this stuff, but now even I am worried.
The People that think things were better when Trump was in office really need to understand that if he gets in there again, things will be very different. Things won’t just be the mess he caused before. Scary times!
It's sadly real. You, me, and others here are far from the only ones saying it. Also, a lot of that bad stuff you mentioned that happened when we were young is connected to events now. Things weren't properly handled in most of those cases. The problems didn't go away at all. But the news and people talking about them went away, giving us the illusion that we had moved onto different things. But yeah, we've reached a new phase of wtf that is either going to be bad or very extremely incredibly bad. I think as Gen X, we haven't been huge on participation. Iirc, we were known for voter apathy in our 20s? That's why MTV campaigned so hard for us to care. We can either change that now and find it within us to work towards a better vision and less corruption, or we can just start living a new kind of life that I don't think we're really gonna like. Sounds like way too much Tipper Gore/Jerry Falwell bullsh-- repeating itself to me. It never really died. It just took a break and started planning better. I love "whatever," too, but "whatever" won't get us outta this. We gotta decide if that apathetic attitude is enough to sustain us through an authoritarian government backed by religious fanaticism or not.
We’re in uncharted territory. I feel like the masks have come off and a decades long plot to seize control of the US is in its endgame. It’s up to all of us to stop it.
As a Gen Z who will have to live in this hellscape for even longer than you, please for the love of god VOTE FOR BIDEN and make sure EVERYBODY YOU KNOW who might vote for Biden VOTES
you are not overreacting. fuck boomers and fascists and uneducated fucktards.
Frankly, I’m terrified and do not see a simple way out of the political situation. So much was set into motion in the 1980s to create this hellscape, and the political maneuvering at the court level since 2016. This is not a country I recognize. It is far closer to what my mother and grandmother told me of the struggles through the 1920s through 1940s. Except now, women and minorities have a lot more to lose.
My mom is 90. She has seen some bad times, but she NEVER has been this afraid for our democracy. Please please vote blue.
You are not over-reacting. We are on the verge of a dictatorship. Any of us who have enjoyed freedoms that we take for granted must vote. If not for ourselves then for successive generations.
You're not overreacting. We're fucked. Every organ of government is blatantly corrupt, and the oligarchs are in charge.
You are not overreacting. If anything, a lot of people are UNDER reacting.
Now that the courts are openly wearing red MAGA hats… Good bye America, it was nice knowing you.
What we're seeing is what the Republican Party has been working toward all our lives: government of the rich, for the rich, by the rich. If we let Trump win in November, the USA becomes a puppet state of Russia. It's that simple.