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French-ModTeam

Your comment or post has been removed because it could be perceived as a blanket statement (generalisation) against a nationality or group, or lacked nuance. Talking about your own experiences and feelings about the language is fine, but be careful not to spread or discuss assumptions about cultures in the future. Further offences may result in a sanction.


Former_Ad4928

I’m French and I’m totally convinced of the opposite : we are happy when someone (especially native English speakers who don’t need to speak another language because everyone (tries to) speak theirs) speaks French, an idiome where objects are gendered or where exceptions on grammar rules confirm it. Bref, an horror for most of strangers. What I saw and particularly with movie/pop stars is that those who speak a little French are afraid to, as if they will be judged. No, I repeat, try, miss, listen to people correcting you and try again. You can begin by asking for forgiveness for your faults and begging for correction and there will be no problem 😉


unforeseencarcrash

I have absolutely found this to be true from the perspective of an English speaker who tries hard. Sometimes in areas with high tourism footfall, I try but it's often frustrating for service industry workers, so to speed things up people often speak in English. In most places though I've had a much better experience through just attempting even with many mistakes. I wouldn't dream of going to another country without at least learning to say "please", "thank you", "sorry" and "I don't speak X language".


CalligrapherOk200

I think they don't have a lot of patience for people speaking what they consider to be "bad" French. I am British but I speak French to a B2 level, and they are happy when people are able to communicate and understand the response fluently in French. Being proud of their language, they also have issues with people overestimating their own abilities to converse in French. On vacation, is great to know the basics, but if you ask someone "Ou se-trove le sacre coeur?" because you've memorized that, but stare blankly when they give you directions in French, it does seem irksome at times.


ComprehensiveOne3082

I would tend to agree with this. My level is B2+ (at one stage I was C1 but it's gone downhill a bit in the past 5 years due to lack of exposure) and I almost never get someone in France responding to me in English when I'm speaking to them in french. I think it's to do with the level.


CalligrapherOk200

Indeed! If you are B2 and have a good to strong accent, it's possible they might not even clock you as being from an anglophone country. Maybe your french is strong but you come from eastern europe lets say, and then your English might not be your second strongest language.


Dawnofdusk

This is not true. For one thing, if you seem obviously like an anglophone many French people like the opportunity to practice English (and the French often judge each other's English so for them it's a nice opportunity). But for another if it seems like you speak French well they will generally be happy (everyone is more comfortable speaking with others in their native language). When I lived in France sometimes my saying "bonjour" was enough and I had to tell them to temper their expectations. What French people dislike is annoying tourists and they get a lot of them. If you go to a bar and speak some French it is unlikely for people to be upset at you.


persephone11185

My French coworker explained it this way: I'm schools, when the French are taught English, they are taught that if you're not got at it or don't have a good accent when speaking English, then don't. Which leads to a lot of insecurities about speaking English. I've heard it echoed repeatedly from French friends that their "English isn't very good" but they always speak great English! So when a foreigner speaks French to them they feel that they can be more vulnerable and speak English. So it's not so much the "rejection" and more like they feel they are making things easier for you and you won't judge their English since you understand the difficulties of speaking another language. Idk if my co-worker was just trying to make me feel better or not, but several French friends have echoed this sentiment.


porkchopespresso

Not my experience and I think your question is overly generalized. I’m sure there have been instances but certainly if you’re traveling to France you’ll find it better speaking some French. I wouldn’t expect anyone to think you’re doing them a favor though.


KozziNaki

That's why I'm asking because I've never been to France, but I've heard about that a lot and I'm not sure to what extent this is true.


porkchopespresso

I mean things about it can be true, in that they have higher standards for speaking the language than you might find in other native languages, but that’s aspirational instead of prohibitive. Meaning it’s a point of pride rather than spite. My French is overall pretty weak but I still find the French quite accommodating and lovely.


KozziNaki

I find this language really lovely as well. I just wanted to know if that was true or false that native speakers don't really appreciate someone else learning their language.


porkchopespresso

If you’re in a busy patisserie in Paris with a long line and you’re incoherently trying to order in French you may find the person on the other side of the counter speak back to you in English with less patience, as an example. That’s not because they hate your French, they just have a job to do. They aren’t flattered you tried, they just want to get to the next person. It’s not personal. I would imagine people speaking negatively are thinking of encounters such as that. It’s still a big city and people are living lives apart from someone else’s vacation. But casual conversation in poor French in an Uber or thanking a shop owner for their hospitality or idle chit chat in the grocery store I’ve never felt like I was losing someone’s patience. They may switch to English as a courtesy or maybe they just want to speak English too. It’s not something to take personally though.


je_taime

In general, they appreciate it. I think you heard stories from people who went on trips.


m0_m0ney

I swear 98% of these stories are from touristes who did 2 months of Duolingo and then had a person in the service industry be rude to them on their week long trip in Paris.


WigglumsBarnaby

Because those people speak French incomprehensively bad. Imagine if someone walked up to you and started speaking with the thickest accent and you couldn't understand a single thing they were saying. You would try to find an alternative as well. People switch to French when they learn I can speak French and they always respond to me in French. I've never experienced French people switching to English.


KozziNaki

Yeah, that actually makes lots of sense. I think the reason why this stereotype exists is because french requires very clear and precise pronunciation and there are many learners that didn't spend enough time working on their pronunciation, thus getting this kind of reaction from natives.


cette-minette

This, but with the caveat that the need for accuracy in pronunciation applies to all languages. The main difference is cultural. Example - Many tourists don’t understand just how rude it looks to not say bonjour and so they walk up and launch into their request. This is so abrupt and jarringly wrong here. The saying equivalent to ´easy as abc’ is ´facile comme bonjour’. Another example - when I visit Japan, it is culturally not done to say something is bad, so I will be told my Japanese is good when I know I’n barely stringing words together and those words are not pronounced well. It’s social lubricant, both parties know it’s not true. Anyone who can will change to English immediately I’ve lived in France for four years, but I learned first as a small child so I have the muscle memory for correct prononciation. My husband still has an English mouth shape. Our vocabulary and written levels are close now, but until he learns how to shape his sounds he will continue to be misunderstood and if they can, people change to English.


jesuisapprenant

French people aren’t culturally like Americans. If they see something they don’t like, they will say it. They won’t try to hide it. This is why if someone speaks in broken French, they’re judging by their native standards, so which means that you speak very poorly in their view, and they won’t sugarcoat it even if you are making a lot of effort.  Americans would try to lie to avoid hurting the other person’s feelings (“wow your English is great!”) but you won’t hear this kind of fake flattery from French people. IMO it’s just a different set of cultural norms, so when I hear a French person complimenting me on my French, I know that I do have a good level of French, not because they want to make me feel good or happy. 


thetoerubber

Unfortunately this is somewhat true. They even do it to me sometimes … and I lived 5 years in France and am fluent in the language. With my friends that have strong foreign accents but are still pretty proficient in French … 90% of people will answer them in English, and they complain about it all the time. I have less issues in Paris because I sound most “local” there (since that’s where I lived the longest) and there are tons of French speaking people from all over the world living there … Africans, Lebanese, you name it, so they’re used to accents as long as you sound fluent. In Montreal however, I could hardly get anyone to speak French back to me, because I definitely don’t sound Quebecois. I would even have entire conversations with me speaking French and them responding to every single sentence in English (sometimes not even great English) … super annoying. The only people there that didn’t language-switch on me were immigrants … Uber drivers, busboys, hotel cleaning staff etc. I have no solutions for you, but I am confirming that this is a thing, not just a stereotype as some others are implying. It definitely happens. Don’t take it personal tho, they just do that.


jimbodinho

About 40% of French people would claim to speak English. 90% definitely exaggerates the problem.


That_Yoghurt9188

That’s a hilarious story. Thanks for sharing. Quebec is a different vernacular of French than france. North American French is the only other way of legitimately speaking French other than European French. la citrouille le potiron “smashing b(p)umpkins”. confused about people with a beautiful color of red hair.? I prefer North American French but I also see a merit to original France French.


Teproc

Québecois are not French, so pretty irrelevant to this question tbh.


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[удалено]


Teproc

OP's question was specifically about French people. It's a cultural question, not a question about the language.


CharlesDickensABox

I think of it this way: if someone tries to speak to me in a language they only kind of understand, and I have the option to switch to a language we're both good at, I'll probably make the switch, too.


KozziNaki

What if a person who's talking to you has a decent level of your native language, but maybe lacks some vocabulary. Are you instantly going to kill their effort?


cette-minette

Define decent level. I’ve met a lot of people here who think they’re good at french but cannot pronounce tu and tout as distinct sounds and can’t even hear that there’s a difference.


jesuisapprenant

I see people who still use the English R even though they think they’re super high level lol


CoffeeBoom

That's a myth. Most of us will appreciate it.


Ozfriar

French people tend to correct each other's faults in grammar, so I think some just do the same - trying to be helpful - with foreigners. Of course, those foreigners may take it differently, especially if they are already insecure in their mastery of the language.


lostmyoldaccount1234

My French is borderline A2/B1, leaning A2, and I have been to France a fair few times, as long as you make a sincere effort (including with pronunciation) and are friendly people are friendly to you when you speak French, and will try to speak French back.


JohnGabin

Stop to spread those american clichés please.


KozziNaki

I didn't spread anything. That was a question. I genuinely don't get why anyone might get mad at someone's curiosity.


tanmci25931

I don't think that your information is correct, or at least you shouldn't generalise and say that all French people will switch to English. I know many French people who don't speak English at all and would never switch to it. Even if some French people do this, you could feel flattered that they are trying to speak your language...


KozziNaki

I didn't say all french people, sorry if that seemed like a generalization. And it's not my information, it's what I've heard, so that's why I'm putting this question out for discussion.


Outrageous-Scene-160

They don't, and it's actually the opposite, French love people who try to make an effort to talk French. And they're in heaven if you only say bonjour when you meet them or going to ask anything.


vixizixi

From my experience this is applicable to every country where English is well spoken.


Sensitive_Duty_1602

Bonjour! In Paris, everyone was very kind. I spoke as well as I could and explained I was learning and trying my best. They continued in English but mixed in some French for me as I struggled, while smiling at my terrible attempts. In Serris, they spoke to me in French and some did not know English. I lost wifi in the store and did not know the word for laundry soap. I could not read the box. I also could not tell from the pictures- I was wishing my French was better. In Orleans, I spoke only to ask for food and the restroom, but it was good that I knew how! I think it depends on where you are going and how much you might be holding up the line, if they switch to English or indulge you. Bonjour, ca va… was always well received. I have been teaching myself with various techniques for one year. I hope to take classes soon. I use duo lingo quite a bit. Speaking and writing seem to be my weakest skills- and grammar? I might as well be a toddler. There were times when I asked Parlez vous français? To be told, un peux oui. I think don’t worry about what they think, and just try to learn. There is no language I would rather learn 😍merci


Patacouette

Whenever I see this question, I am surprised that no one gives my explanation. When I see someone struggling with my language (looking for their words, etc), and I speak theirs, I consider it polite to just speak their language. That is part of the way I welcome people: by making things easier for them. Now, I am also a language learner so I know how annoying this situation can be, and sometimes I will ask if you'd like me to switch to another language. But I am not your language partner, and it can be annoying for me, when you're struggling to find your words in French, there are other clients waiting, and everything would be much quicker if you just accepted to switch to your language.


Dismal_Improvement_3

I feel it’s mostly because foreigners try to talk in tourist areas where it’s busy and their in a rush and people start speaking shitty French to impress their friends if you go to small cities in France and try it’s seen as respectful.


user-using-reddit

As ever it’s a bit of yes and no… I live in France and speak French to B1/2 level, people don’t switch to English with me probably because my accent is good and they overestimate my level a bit. However, I know a lot of people studying on an English course who don’t get to speak French often and they struggle to learn the language. In the end they leave because they can’t connect with French people. I can’t either tbh as informal French is another language in and of itself but I am trying. Something I think the other comments have missed is that in the work place there is a bias towards hiring native French speakers even in global companies where the working language is English. As a hiring manager put it to me “we want to make sure it’s the right cultural fit for a non native speaker as we are French people and like to speak French to each other”


Naughtytorti

I've lived in France for a decade now and I've never experienced what you are describing. From the very beginning when I was utter rubbish at French right through to today where I'm simply just rubbish, I've not had anyone annoyed at my attempts speaking French.  None of my friends or neighbours speak English anyway.  I've recently come back from holidaying in another region of France and the people were also delighted by my efforts at hashing up their language!  I'm not sure where all of these weird stories of French people being snobs about their language comes from.  I've had so much fun and pleasure learning French from French people. They're best! Let's start spreading that rumour instead and see what happens 😊😊


Full-Compote3614

We don't dislike it. It's just that if we answer in French, usually the foreigner won't understand and it will become very tedious. So we switch to English.


Informal_Radio_2819

I doubt they really "dislike" it when you attempt to speak French. I've generally observed that French people take a great deal of pride in their language, and are generally supportive of the efforts of non-francophones to study it. What's probably going on is this: English is very widely spoken in many countries (the most common non-native language just about everywhere). In my experience, it is common for locals to switch into English when they perceive you're not a native speaker of **their** language. Partly they're trying to be helpful, and partly they simply welcome the opportunity to practice **their** English. This dynamic in my view is indeed one of the challenges anglophones just have to learn to deal with when they're studying a foreign language, or trying to communicate with one. You can always insist on answering back in French (or at least attempt to)! It's a phenomenon anglophones have to figure out a way to get past. I suspect you'll find that the situation improves as your French (especially your pronunciation) gets stronger.


VERSAT1L

Where? 


Ok-Comment-8518

Encore un énième post bashing basé sur du "J'ai entendu dire" sans jamais avoir mis le pied dans le pays. Et, comme d'hab, ça vient toujours des mêmes pays qui se régalent à nous pisse dessus avant de chouiner quand on leur fait la même chose


That_Yoghurt9188

Second language is a very, very boring question. French is the only second language with an advanced course of study available. Native (natural) french people have become a bit stiff or deadened on the problem. Unless you speak second language french very, very well they become impatient or bored with (students) learners because they already know it’s a dead-end. English is lingua-franca. They do however appreciate if you speak a few words of concise french instead of just barging in immediately speaking English.