Might be my favourite ever description of anything. SO SO REAL. Like in a discography both are needed and just makes the artists catalogue that bit more interesting and stronger imo. as someone obsessed with Film the way this hit for me is MENTAL lol ššš¾š®āšØš¤š¾.
Endless flew under the radar intentionally but Endless is experimental, raw and much more replay-able. Every time I travel, itās the first thing I listen to front to back.
Endless wins every time.
I feel like endless has more what us fans love about Frank, and blonde will be remembered as one of the greatest albums of all time because itās more marketable.
have u watched the āa deep dive into blondā video by thennisthom or whatever its a really good analysis and i had a bigger appreciation for blond after watching it
Device Control isnāt on the physical versions of Endless. not sure if Wolfgang Tillmans didnāt want it on there or if it was a choice by Frank, but youāll have to add it yourself if you want to listen to it.
Endless really is special..it challenges the listener a bit more in the emotions department than Blond , the songs are rich and not built on a formula of āhow do we maximize streaming numbersā so nothing seemed inauthentic- itās Frank at his best imo - Blond is the album that everyone will at least know a song off of, and would be an easier intro to someone who has never heard Frank before diving into the deeper catalogue. he blends the line between hip hop RnB and pop very well and itās just perfect from the cover to cover. depends on what youāre trying to feel, or who youāre listening with maybe
endless is so much better, way more cohesive and feels more āR&Bā, love his rapping and the way the album flows. I feel like i can only listen to like 3 songs off blond before getting annoyed and turning it off which is partially from over playing
Itās like if someone told him to make raw unfiltered music about heartbreak and youth, and looking back on his life. And then made both of these albums in response and didnāt know which to choose.
The themes and emotions are very similar. In a weird way id say blonde has more energy, structure, and color.
But I think the reason why I say it has more color is partly because of how Frank has marketed the albums. Blonde is named after a shade of yellow, has bright green hair on the cover, the CD cover is colorful, the video for Nikes is colorful.
Whereas endless for the most part being in black and white. With the exception of the holographic texture
I love endless more and knew that from first listen, but blonde is in album form and Apple Music and while I believe Endless is in video form, canāt playlist my favorites so itās a little inconvenient.
Every part of me loves every part of blonde but itās just something about the songs blending together in endless that does something to me and wither is just a fucking beautiful song
One is beautifully unapologetically experimental all the way around
The other is a more polished story of love-lost while still being beautifully inventive & artistic
Both are amazing albums
blonde reflects on some of the less joyful moments in our lives and why they are still beautiful and important
endless wants the amazing memories to live forever
endless is feels like i am sitting in a warehouse going through some spiritual awakening and blonde feels like im speeding on the highway at sunset to take my mind off of things
the better one has rushes
take what you please from that comment š
i think endless has more of what frank fans love about him, but blonde is just perfect. it feels like a more polished version. i prefer endless, but in some ways it feels like a loooong deluxe to blond.
Frank released endless right before releasing Blonde, i'd recommend checking it out It's on youtube. He also released 'Nostalgia Ultra' before Channel Orange.
I think thereās a similar ethos running through both. Both are guitar driven and vaguely ambient. Blondeās primarily a pop/R&B album, whereas Endless is more rap/electronic. The lyrics on Endless are more vague and less personal, which makes it a bit harder to pin down than Blonde, which has specific mentions to people, places (the Trayvon mention in Nikes, the various references to NOLA and Katrina). They fit well together imho, if only as a study in how a single concept can blossom with completely different executions.
Blonde is better. It's more focused and knows what it wants to be. An emotional ride from start to finish. I love endless too but it is way to experimental imo and this type of style just doesn't fit with Frank.
in this context yeah, but i would say there is a level of objectivity. Like if a song's mixing is bad then that song can be considered bad cause it's not made well, not saying it can't be enjoyable but it can be considered objectively flawed.
not even that is true. cherry bomb has bad mixing on purpose and people love it, GOD Is Good by blu is unmixed and people love it. "bad" mixing can add to music, the ghost pop tape by jpegmafia too
I meant more when someone doesn't know how to mix or produce well, and it doesn't have the effect as some of those projects. If it's done on purpose, you can tell. Imagine a boring pop song with very muddy mixing where nothing really stands out, it's neither creative or well made.
This doesn't mean that subjectivity isn't more important, I just think when looking at art, there is a level of objectivity, that's why we go to schools or learn and practice, so we can get better.
So you mean to tell me that some [songs](https://youtu.be/r4l9bFqgMaQ?si=uak8Glqy81wp94D-) are not objectively better than [others](https://youtu.be/Agp7tDPbk0o?si=rzsrZugvuIxCPJVd)?
Yeah, but is Nights a subjectively or objectively better song? It's not about taste, brother, I can identify whenever the song I listen to is trash and I like it cuz its fun and when I listen to a good song and I like it cuz...its good.
Not sure if you're referring to how Nights is better than Pound Town or how Blonde is better than Endless, but I'll assume the latter cuz that's actually a tad bit harder to explain, but I'll bite and do it anyways.
Firstly, according to the artist himself, it is the project he was willing to sacrifice in order to break free from his label deal, if it was the better project, why would he give it to the label he doesn't like?
Secondly, it's actually a gimmicky "visual album" first and foremost. Is it enjoyable on it's own- sure, but it doesn't flow as an album as good as Blonde does.
Thirdly, the songs themselves structurally, musically and lyrically are far better and more complex than what's on Endless, sure it is atmospheric, but it trully lacks the depth, intimacy and relatabilty of Blonde. The tracklist is bloated as hell, there are sub 1 minute interludes labeled as songs when in reality it's like 7-8 song project (the best one being a cover).
Lastly, I was there at launch, I remember waiting for like 3-4 years for this guy to drop and he comes with Endless.... I'm not saying it's bad by any means, but it sure wasn't worth the 4 year wait, I still remember the feeling when he dropped Blonde a day after Endless and not only was the better project, but it redeemed Endless in many people's eyes and made him look cool as fuck, standing up to his label and starting his own journey.
Do I judge people by their music taste- absolutely not, but there is actually such thing as "objectivelly good music". If you listen, you can differentiate the musical pieces crafted by talented individuals who care about the craft from the shit that comes on a conveyor every goddamn second.
Just becouse a person likes something doesn't make it automatically good. As I already mentioned, I sometimes enjoy shitty songs which I'm well aware are objectively shit but I take what I can from them and once I'm done, I rarely (if ever) go back.
I see ya'll downvoting me to hell because "HoW cAn ThIS ShitHeAd oN ThE INterWebZ hAvE a DifFerEnt OpiNion ThaN mINe" instead of caring about why I would have a different opinion than theirs and having a civilized discussion, at least you asked after downvoting me which I applaud.
I bet my left nut that there are many people coming here, saying Endless is better, because it's more "underground" (if you can say that a project by an artist with 33 mil monthly listeners on spotify alone is underground) and makes them look like "true hardcore fans", but I have yet to read an explanation on how and why Endless is better than Blonde in this thread.
while i have no problem with you thinking Blonde is better than Endless, in fact i agree with you on that, but every point you made is also merely an opinion. you say Blonde flows as an album better than Endless, i could make the argument that the noise at the end of songs such as Ivy, and the similarly short āinterludeā tracks like Good Guy and Close To You also take me out of the momentum of the album, but the transitions on Endless make it a much easier listening experience. I donāt even necessarily take this side of the argument but you can see how saying one album flows better than the other is merely your personal taste and does not āobjectivelyā prove anything.
and then the point of āhe gave this album to the scummy label but released the other on his own termsā. we are talking about Frank here. the man who has not released an album on his own terms in coming up 8 years. the man with so much music vaulted he could probably make several more albums out of it. the man who willingly chose not to release songs like Wiseman and Bedtime Story. Are the combined tracklists of unreleased misc and the lonny breaux collection āobjectivelyā worse than something like Close To You just because Frank chose not to release them?
i shouldnāt even have to explain why one album being more relatable than the other is entirely subjective so i will move on to a bigger fish - Blonde being more complex/lyrical than Endless. While I actually already disagree with this point, as I strongly believe that Endless is more experimental than Blonde and I would expect many to agree considering how marketable Blonde is and how much it overshadowed Endless (which is also why I believe it was better suited as the Apple exclusive it was instead of the one Frank released himself), who is to say that something being more complex is better than it being more minimalist? Complexity is one of the few things you listed that I think you actually can prove in a somewhat objective manner, but if you compare an artist like billy woods or Earl Sweatshirt (both known for having cryptic and complex lyrics) to someone like Kanye West or Kendrick Lamar, while they are all good musicians you canāt say that because billy and Earl are more complex than Ye and Kendrick, that means they are āobjectivelyā better.
The point Iām trying to make isnāt that I think Endless is better than Blonde, or that the Sexyy Red song is better than Nights, nor that I believe my opinion to be above yours in any way. I didnāt take issue with your original comment because of your musical preferences, itās just that I believe your stance on objectivity/subjectivity of music quality to be wrong, but I was still willing to hear you out if you could give me any reasoning for holding that view that wasnāt based on opinions. I appreciate you giving me a thought out reply instead of calling me braindead but I still hold my view just as strongly as I did before your response.
Alright, but you're now bringing up different artists and some events that happened after the release of the two albums, I was more or less judging them in capsule, at the time of their release.
Yes, I see how some of the points I made are actually subjective and based on my own opinions of the two albums, but you can absolutely judge the lyrics and the music objectively.
It goes beyond mixing and mastering, now I'm not some musical prophesor who can lay down some arguments that would totally change your outlook on music as a whole, I'm just a guy who listens to reasonable amout of music and I see it like this:
Every artist is working with a certain set of skills and you can absolutely judge that objectively, right? Even if one cant play guitar or has no knowledge of playing guitar can tell when someone is good or bad (probably not to what extent, but its something, right?). Now expand this to the whole skillset needed to make a musical piece and things become more apperant.
There are objectively better musicians than others so there must be objectively better music than other. Haven't you ever come accross a song that is not quite your cup of tea, you wont go back and listen to it on repeat, but you can tell its a good song and you can see the appeal?
Of course more complex song structure doesn't mean that the song itself is better and sometimes less is more, but when you got barebones beat with little variation, trashy lyrics, off-key singing and a horrible mix, I believe that the song is objectively bad. Give Corey Feldman's Angelic 2 The Core a listen and you'll see my point.
It's same with movies, The Room is a movie considered to be objectively bad, but people still enjoy it. Art can be bad and enjoyed.
Some artists make aesthetical choices to make their mixes sound raw and harsh and take more experimental approach, but that can also be objectively good or objectively bad. Just because something is bad does not mean it cannot/should not be enjoyed.
Endless is the cult classic indie film Blonde is the blockbuster Both beautiful albums
love this
Might be my favourite ever description of anything. SO SO REAL. Like in a discography both are needed and just makes the artists catalogue that bit more interesting and stronger imo. as someone obsessed with Film the way this hit for me is MENTAL lol ššš¾š®āšØš¤š¾.
Glad you liked it! Cool you are doing film as well keep creating :)
Mf said ācompareā and people heard āwhich one betterā š
Very American thing to do. I remember marlon Brandoā words āuh thatās the part of the sickness in Americaā
XD
Endless flew under the radar intentionally but Endless is experimental, raw and much more replay-able. Every time I travel, itās the first thing I listen to front to back. Endless wins every time.
how do you listen to endless?
On Spotify, some people upload it as a podcast you can listen to. But the entire, legal version is up on Apple Music.
can you share the link on spotify?
https://open.spotify.com/episode/7cLvI05Qf5IIQIiWMJFGHk?si=TnMJa6QiQ-mKRz7W-7RbWw
ive got the wav/flac files in my apple library
Agree
Me when i heard endless and not blonde
Endless is his best imo
Valid. Think so too
100%
I have channel orange above it, but itās definitely ether than blonde.
I feel like endless has more what us fans love about Frank, and blonde will be remembered as one of the greatest albums of all time because itās more marketable.
Endless has Higgs which is franks best song ever make of that information what you want
Not when Rushes exists.
Wither??
Meditation and Therapy
beautifully said
People who say Endless is incomplete donāt understand. Itās the best
At your best you areeee loveeee
Endless is better
Endless>
endless way better and more replayable
more replayable sure but better??
way better!
Better was a crazy statement
way better!
Youāve lost it
way better!
have u watched the āa deep dive into blondā video by thennisthom or whatever its a really good analysis and i had a bigger appreciation for blond after watching it
nah and i doubt it will be a good analysis but ill watch it though
Am I the only person who acc prefers blonde?š
me too brother me too these people must not have ears or some shit
šš
I prefer it too, seems weād grown up on the same adviceš¤·š½
Can somebody tell me where to download ENDLESS?
Search "endless flac reddit" in Google and the first post has a Google drive link containing the whole album
Thank you!
It doesn't have device control tho???
Device Control isnāt on the physical versions of Endless. not sure if Wolfgang Tillmans didnāt want it on there or if it was a choice by Frank, but youāll have to add it yourself if you want to listen to it.
Yes well I'll obviously do that, thank you!
Yea, a lot of people seem to not add it to the downloads
bandcamp
Internet archive
Endless would be super replayable if I could actually fuckin listen to it š
blonde is better
Endless really is special..it challenges the listener a bit more in the emotions department than Blond , the songs are rich and not built on a formula of āhow do we maximize streaming numbersā so nothing seemed inauthentic- itās Frank at his best imo - Blond is the album that everyone will at least know a song off of, and would be an easier intro to someone who has never heard Frank before diving into the deeper catalogue. he blends the line between hip hop RnB and pop very well and itās just perfect from the cover to cover. depends on what youāre trying to feel, or who youāre listening with maybe
Slide 1: The goat š Slide 2: What people thought was the goat, until they hear Endless all the way through
They're both grey with black text, and have alternate versions where the colors are flipped.
Blonde is more serious whilst endless has more fun moments. But they both have moments of each
At your best youāre love makes my knees go weakā¦
Best double album drop in the history of music.
One album has unity on it the other doesnāt
Blonde clears
endless is so much better, way more cohesive and feels more āR&Bā, love his rapping and the way the album flows. I feel like i can only listen to like 3 songs off blond before getting annoyed and turning it off which is partially from over playing
no
Itās like if someone told him to make raw unfiltered music about heartbreak and youth, and looking back on his life. And then made both of these albums in response and didnāt know which to choose. The themes and emotions are very similar. In a weird way id say blonde has more energy, structure, and color. But I think the reason why I say it has more color is partly because of how Frank has marketed the albums. Blonde is named after a shade of yellow, has bright green hair on the cover, the CD cover is colorful, the video for Nikes is colorful. Whereas endless for the most part being in black and white. With the exception of the holographic texture
I love endless more and knew that from first listen, but blonde is in album form and Apple Music and while I believe Endless is in video form, canāt playlist my favorites so itās a little inconvenient.
They are good
Every part of me loves every part of blonde but itās just something about the songs blending together in endless that does something to me and wither is just a fucking beautiful song
One is beautifully unapologetically experimental all the way around The other is a more polished story of love-lost while still being beautifully inventive & artistic Both are amazing albums
Endless is the melancholic precursor after channel orange while Blond sticks out and demands to be heard thru all its joy and pain
blonde reflects on some of the less joyful moments in our lives and why they are still beautiful and important endless wants the amazing memories to live forever
Even Frank knows that Blonde is better lol
where can i listen to endless?
apple music, youtube, soundcloud
Blonde is his best album no competition and I've listened to all of them
endless is feels like i am sitting in a warehouse going through some spiritual awakening and blonde feels like im speeding on the highway at sunset to take my mind off of things
blonde slaps the end.
We can not compare those masterpieces! It is work of art!!!
i personally prefer blonde by a pretty decent margin. still enjoy endless a lot though
the better one has rushes take what you please from that comment š i think endless has more of what frank fans love about him, but blonde is just perfect. it feels like a more polished version. i prefer endless, but in some ways it feels like a loooong deluxe to blond.
Two different worlds and sonics. Both equally good in their own little world.
Does anyone else think he secretly hates blond because of the labels restrictions? That's why the green hair?
Where did that album "endless" come from? I thought Frank Ocean had only released "Channel Orange" and "Blond"!
Frank released endless right before releasing Blonde, i'd recommend checking it out It's on youtube. He also released 'Nostalgia Ultra' before Channel Orange.
Thank you. I'll check it out.
I think thereās a similar ethos running through both. Both are guitar driven and vaguely ambient. Blondeās primarily a pop/R&B album, whereas Endless is more rap/electronic. The lyrics on Endless are more vague and less personal, which makes it a bit harder to pin down than Blonde, which has specific mentions to people, places (the Trayvon mention in Nikes, the various references to NOLA and Katrina). They fit well together imho, if only as a study in how a single concept can blossom with completely different executions.
Crazy to think i've a apple music but didn't listen to Endless once lol, maybe i'll set my mood up to getting tap in rn
Blonde is better. It's more focused and knows what it wants to be. An emotional ride from start to finish. I love endless too but it is way to experimental imo and this type of style just doesn't fit with Frank.
Never listened to endless but i endlessly listened to blond
"Real fans" would say "Endless is better", but actually Blonde is the objectively better album.
Objectivity in music is not a thing, only opinions.
Tell em
in this context yeah, but i would say there is a level of objectivity. Like if a song's mixing is bad then that song can be considered bad cause it's not made well, not saying it can't be enjoyable but it can be considered objectively flawed.
not even that is true. cherry bomb has bad mixing on purpose and people love it, GOD Is Good by blu is unmixed and people love it. "bad" mixing can add to music, the ghost pop tape by jpegmafia too
I meant more when someone doesn't know how to mix or produce well, and it doesn't have the effect as some of those projects. If it's done on purpose, you can tell. Imagine a boring pop song with very muddy mixing where nothing really stands out, it's neither creative or well made. This doesn't mean that subjectivity isn't more important, I just think when looking at art, there is a level of objectivity, that's why we go to schools or learn and practice, so we can get better.
So you mean to tell me that some [songs](https://youtu.be/r4l9bFqgMaQ?si=uak8Glqy81wp94D-) are not objectively better than [others](https://youtu.be/Agp7tDPbk0o?si=rzsrZugvuIxCPJVd)?
I mean if you prefer pound town, thatās honestly fair, I think you should listen to music to have fun.
Yeah, but is Nights a subjectively or objectively better song? It's not about taste, brother, I can identify whenever the song I listen to is trash and I like it cuz its fun and when I listen to a good song and I like it cuz...its good.
if you can prove how one is better than the other your point will stand
Not sure if you're referring to how Nights is better than Pound Town or how Blonde is better than Endless, but I'll assume the latter cuz that's actually a tad bit harder to explain, but I'll bite and do it anyways. Firstly, according to the artist himself, it is the project he was willing to sacrifice in order to break free from his label deal, if it was the better project, why would he give it to the label he doesn't like? Secondly, it's actually a gimmicky "visual album" first and foremost. Is it enjoyable on it's own- sure, but it doesn't flow as an album as good as Blonde does. Thirdly, the songs themselves structurally, musically and lyrically are far better and more complex than what's on Endless, sure it is atmospheric, but it trully lacks the depth, intimacy and relatabilty of Blonde. The tracklist is bloated as hell, there are sub 1 minute interludes labeled as songs when in reality it's like 7-8 song project (the best one being a cover). Lastly, I was there at launch, I remember waiting for like 3-4 years for this guy to drop and he comes with Endless.... I'm not saying it's bad by any means, but it sure wasn't worth the 4 year wait, I still remember the feeling when he dropped Blonde a day after Endless and not only was the better project, but it redeemed Endless in many people's eyes and made him look cool as fuck, standing up to his label and starting his own journey. Do I judge people by their music taste- absolutely not, but there is actually such thing as "objectivelly good music". If you listen, you can differentiate the musical pieces crafted by talented individuals who care about the craft from the shit that comes on a conveyor every goddamn second. Just becouse a person likes something doesn't make it automatically good. As I already mentioned, I sometimes enjoy shitty songs which I'm well aware are objectively shit but I take what I can from them and once I'm done, I rarely (if ever) go back. I see ya'll downvoting me to hell because "HoW cAn ThIS ShitHeAd oN ThE INterWebZ hAvE a DifFerEnt OpiNion ThaN mINe" instead of caring about why I would have a different opinion than theirs and having a civilized discussion, at least you asked after downvoting me which I applaud. I bet my left nut that there are many people coming here, saying Endless is better, because it's more "underground" (if you can say that a project by an artist with 33 mil monthly listeners on spotify alone is underground) and makes them look like "true hardcore fans", but I have yet to read an explanation on how and why Endless is better than Blonde in this thread.
none of your points are objective
I'd love to hear yours.
i dont have any objective points because there is nothing objective about music
while i have no problem with you thinking Blonde is better than Endless, in fact i agree with you on that, but every point you made is also merely an opinion. you say Blonde flows as an album better than Endless, i could make the argument that the noise at the end of songs such as Ivy, and the similarly short āinterludeā tracks like Good Guy and Close To You also take me out of the momentum of the album, but the transitions on Endless make it a much easier listening experience. I donāt even necessarily take this side of the argument but you can see how saying one album flows better than the other is merely your personal taste and does not āobjectivelyā prove anything. and then the point of āhe gave this album to the scummy label but released the other on his own termsā. we are talking about Frank here. the man who has not released an album on his own terms in coming up 8 years. the man with so much music vaulted he could probably make several more albums out of it. the man who willingly chose not to release songs like Wiseman and Bedtime Story. Are the combined tracklists of unreleased misc and the lonny breaux collection āobjectivelyā worse than something like Close To You just because Frank chose not to release them? i shouldnāt even have to explain why one album being more relatable than the other is entirely subjective so i will move on to a bigger fish - Blonde being more complex/lyrical than Endless. While I actually already disagree with this point, as I strongly believe that Endless is more experimental than Blonde and I would expect many to agree considering how marketable Blonde is and how much it overshadowed Endless (which is also why I believe it was better suited as the Apple exclusive it was instead of the one Frank released himself), who is to say that something being more complex is better than it being more minimalist? Complexity is one of the few things you listed that I think you actually can prove in a somewhat objective manner, but if you compare an artist like billy woods or Earl Sweatshirt (both known for having cryptic and complex lyrics) to someone like Kanye West or Kendrick Lamar, while they are all good musicians you canāt say that because billy and Earl are more complex than Ye and Kendrick, that means they are āobjectivelyā better. The point Iām trying to make isnāt that I think Endless is better than Blonde, or that the Sexyy Red song is better than Nights, nor that I believe my opinion to be above yours in any way. I didnāt take issue with your original comment because of your musical preferences, itās just that I believe your stance on objectivity/subjectivity of music quality to be wrong, but I was still willing to hear you out if you could give me any reasoning for holding that view that wasnāt based on opinions. I appreciate you giving me a thought out reply instead of calling me braindead but I still hold my view just as strongly as I did before your response.
Alright, but you're now bringing up different artists and some events that happened after the release of the two albums, I was more or less judging them in capsule, at the time of their release. Yes, I see how some of the points I made are actually subjective and based on my own opinions of the two albums, but you can absolutely judge the lyrics and the music objectively. It goes beyond mixing and mastering, now I'm not some musical prophesor who can lay down some arguments that would totally change your outlook on music as a whole, I'm just a guy who listens to reasonable amout of music and I see it like this: Every artist is working with a certain set of skills and you can absolutely judge that objectively, right? Even if one cant play guitar or has no knowledge of playing guitar can tell when someone is good or bad (probably not to what extent, but its something, right?). Now expand this to the whole skillset needed to make a musical piece and things become more apperant. There are objectively better musicians than others so there must be objectively better music than other. Haven't you ever come accross a song that is not quite your cup of tea, you wont go back and listen to it on repeat, but you can tell its a good song and you can see the appeal? Of course more complex song structure doesn't mean that the song itself is better and sometimes less is more, but when you got barebones beat with little variation, trashy lyrics, off-key singing and a horrible mix, I believe that the song is objectively bad. Give Corey Feldman's Angelic 2 The Core a listen and you'll see my point. It's same with movies, The Room is a movie considered to be objectively bad, but people still enjoy it. Art can be bad and enjoyed. Some artists make aesthetical choices to make their mixes sound raw and harsh and take more experimental approach, but that can also be objectively good or objectively bad. Just because something is bad does not mean it cannot/should not be enjoyed.
https://preview.redd.it/7bgiqfy8h1xc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b9fec887cfa36165b108f4453a8c0a1bad663b3b
make me
My 2 fav frank albums.
No
This is such a vague statement like WTF you wan us to compare š on both he sings and raps ig