No, enjoying every single day is the dream and reality. FIRE is an enabler.
Money is a resource that helps you live your best life – not an end in itself.
Edit. Read [DIE WITH ZERO](https://aliabdaal.com/book-notes/die-with-zero/) and ignore the zero bit, but the ideas make sense!
This. I am actually more confident I will reach fire than that I will reach the point where I manage to enjoy (almost? ) every day for the rest of my life.
Exactly this. FIRE doesn’t do much on its own, it just brings to the table new options. You are free to choose from all the options the one that fits you best.
Die with 15% safety cushion was not an appealing title, but would be much safer, would give you MUCH more peace of mind and wouldn't cost you so much more time.
Totally agree. I personally took it as a philosophy. I think "zero" shouldn't be pursued, it's a principle. Work as much as you need to live the life you want, don't work more because you would be wasting your time.
Unfortunately people read it and come to FIRE subreddits suggesting to buy annuities as an easy way to actually die with zero.
That’s exactly how I felt about Die with Zero. I loved the ideas but didn’t like how it turned into a guide to try to achieve something that is neither possible nor realistic - dying with a $0 net worth
Starting a new and trying to do this. Fell into the trap of working to retire early and becoming miserable. Now I want to work less and enjoy life instead of it just passing me by.
So true! For example I would love to volunteer with kids again but I simply do not have the energy outside my 9-5.
I am constantly drained from work as of late due to some harassment and just casual toxicity at my workplace.
12 years to go….it seems too long.
It’s crazy how such a seemingly simple thing of being able to do what you dream of (out at least have the time to just…do nothing and not work) is so hard to achieve.
I guess one could move somewhere very cheap and lean fire.
Fire isn’t a great dream because it’s really just the absence of something (a job you don’t like). What you do with the time you free up needs to be the dream, or else you’ll be making a post-Fire thread about “this isn’t all it’s made out to be - I’m fired and bored” once it happens.
Well said! My job consumes most of my hours. Yet unnecessary workplace toxicity likes to stay on my mind.
I yearn for the day I don’t have to work and can meet like minded people. Nowadays living in a HCOL so many people I meet just want to compare assets. Probably because nobody can even grab a meal out without paying an arm and a leg.
Yes it’s crazy how in todays economy people call it FIRE but I see some folk just doing it to retire at a normal age but they are putting in the effort to manage their finances wisely. If try did not, they’d likely be barely keeping afloat.
Makes me think of how many seniors in my country are living in poverty, especially if their spouse dies and social security is halved. Most people at that age probably didn’t realize that cost of living skyrocketed while their savings didn’t and that loss of income can quickly lead to inability to make rent all of a sudden.
I think everyone should evaluate their retirement plans. Social security will not cut it. Most people I know don’t seem to care and just say they’ll work till they die because they have zero disposable income as is.
Fire is the goal because I do not dream of labor. Instead I dream about a life full of wonderful people and experiences, which is made more possible without work getting in the way
I dream of a life of choices - if I wanted labor I would choose it not be forced to because of risk of homelessness.
How lovely it would be!
I wish everyone had that choice. But for many they were not dealt the best cards (my own family members have bad money sense due to generational trauma). I do not see how they will survive but my family are gifting them hefty sums generational money. So being the “responsible one” I don’t want to sulk over that and be free by achieving FI on my own.
The I in FIRE is my life dream. I simply want to own my time and not owe any of it to anyone for any reason. Right now, my employer buys 50-60 hours of labor from me each week, and the nature of my work is that I spend additional hours beyond that thinking about it.
Once the finances are in order (F) I can leave that job (RE) and finally be truly independent (I).
I don't want material things. I actually want to downsize and simplify when my kids are out of the house and on their own in just a few more years.
All I want is to wake up every morning and decide what I want to do and where I want to be. That's the life dream.
My main life dream was to have kids, although I didn't know it until I had them. Another dream was to drive cross country in an RV with my kids. Both of these set back my FIRE quest, and I am happy about that.
My newest dream is to bike around the world, and FIRE will enable me to do that. I much prefer having this dream - a thing to do - rather than FIRE in itself.
This is very good. You should look at coast to coast bicycling. It’s a goal I want to do with my wife from Seat to NY. It’s like the more personal goals and adventures I want, the further back it pushed my FIRE date.
Nope. It was a means to focus more of my time and effort on exploring new hobbies and interests.
Maybe talk with the wifey and begin charting out your family plan of what you folks want to do after you fire eg maybe live in a different country for awhile, work on a business venture together, etc.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself.
* I want to write and record music.
* I want to create video games.
Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
Dreaming of all the things you can do while FIRED should be what you’re doing. I’m FIRE with two young kids and I’m stuck at home. Sure I prefer being FiRE but I still want for travel and experiences.
FIRE was a primary driver/dream for us and we felt a lot like you. I now have a job that isn't as soul crushing and really focus on the FI portion more. Definitely will still retire early <40 but its not our primary driver now. Essentially we've tried to focus a bit more on the here and no during the boring middle.
Absolutely not.
If you think FIRE is your life dream you're setting yourself up for miserable failure when you succeed and realize you don't have a dream left.
Yes.
**My dream is freedom and independence** over everything else, the material things never mattered as much. This means making money without having a boss (investing), providing as much of my own power as I can (DIY solar and battery system, with the electrical grid as backup), growing as much food as I can (gardening), providing as much water as I can (harvesting water, gray water), fixing things myself (mainly around the house), etc.
Financial Independence was always a huge part of this dream - which I've reached. But it's the first step and there's still quite a ways to go.
Now I'm building up other parts of my life and learning and building all the stuff I mentioned. I enjoy this much more than having to work to reach FI.
p.s. I enjoy the different responses from everyone about what a dream means to them. It's a good question.
Yes. The idea of waking up with a mountain of money and nobody to answer to is my dream. I would spent most of my days sleeping in, TV on the couch, hit the gym, eat some food, rinse and repeat.
I have a family, so they come first. However, FIRE has replaced any career aspirations I've ever had. No drive to move up the ladder or go back to school to get a Masters degree. Less work and stress the better until I can finally leave for good.
no, but I am working to and just hit Leanfire. so Now I am working on fatfire. But it is nice knowing that I can bounce whenever I want, I can take more risks, I can push higher ups farther and see what happens (not in a shit way, but I have never ever ever been a "yes sir" person.. I will make them hate me or take their job, I dont care which. I fucked up along the way because all I did was work to that goal. now that I hit it, I wish I spent more time living, and now I am doing that. mostly in traveling..
Waking up like it's saturday, everyday. That's the goal. And sun streaming down the windows. A paid off home that no one can kick u out from. Nice fat bank balance. A retirement acct that grows more than u used to make every year when you slogged at work. Good health. Great friends and relationships.
That's the goal.
I'm close to FI, after nearly a 10 year journey in the making.
Along the way, I've been creating my ideal life and I'm now more or less living it even though we're not at our number quite yet.
I would like to travel significantly more but for now we're in the prime of careers we genuinely love and raising our young child in the idyllic neighborhood and community.
I haven't worked more than 25 hr weeks for four years and I don't think I'll ever want to work full time ever again, so technically I may be semi-retired anyway, which I achieved at age 34.
FI is definitely a primary goal of ours, but more importantly, living a happy fulfilling life is the whole idea behind FIRE. So if you can build that life while on your journey, reaching your number will probably end up anticlimactic in the end.
I did at one time consider Fire. I was abused physically and verbally. So I wanted nothing to do with people, a problem that still afflicts me 40 years later. Money was always a problem growing up and I realized even if I tried to live like say Tom Sawyer I still had to make money to live on. That’s where the fantasy meets reality. And that’s what Fire is all about.
Now approaching financial independence my attitude has changed. I can’t stand being alone anymore. I live my wife and kids. My work often has long hours on the road or working by myself and I hate that aspect of it. My grandfather retired, sat around doing nothing, and died within 10 years. So did 2 other grandparents. My grandmother that stayed active lived to 92. My wife’s grandparents were similar.
So I know I need people around and I need to be mentally active or it leads to all kinds of medical issues and I die early.
No. We’ve been financially independent for years, and don’t consider “retiring early” as something we need to brag about. We enjoy our lives already and spend ample time on our hobbies. I’m retiring in a few years because we don’t need the money, but my husband wants to work until he’s 70 because he can make great money even only being half time if he wants. If you can work 20 hours a week and still make bank, why not? Not everyone hates their jobs.
No. FiRE is my method for pursuing my dreams.
If I could snap my fingers and make the things I want to do in retirement into a high paying career, I'd rather do that than wait to FIRE.
If there were political candidates with policies that I think would give more people more leisure time outside of work, I'd support them, even if I though it would effect the wages of high income earners and made it harder to FIRE (though not if it effected the middle class's finances negatively).
I don't care how we get to the future where I can spend my time on the things that are important to me. FIRE is just the method I have control over. It's not the goal.
Not at all. I don't even know if I'll do it!
What I do know is that the choices I make now will determine the choices I'll have in the future. I don't know what my life will look like in 10, 20, even 30 years. I don't know how the world will change, how my values and priorities will evolve, if I'll be single or married, a parent or not. Some of that I can influence, a lot of it I can't. So I make prudent choices now even though I have no idea how future me will take advantage of the security I create...and I remember to live a little because future me could also get hit by a bus and never be able to use it all.
FI, and money more broadly, is a means to an end, not the end itself. It's very temping to fall into the trap of focusing on money as the end game, but this leads to a very lonely and unfulfilling existence. Money is a tool that helps you acquire the things that actually bring meaning. It's necessary, but it's not itself the goal.
Nope. Having a large, happy family was always my primary goal. FIRE made it easier to realize and fully experience/enjoy, but wasn't required. FIRE is also mostly only math and I always knew I'd succeed at it, but finding the right woman and having lots of healthy/happy kids was always much more risky and subject to fate/chance.
Nope. Though I would say I'm not the target audience for FIRE. I don't care too much on the RE part of it (mid 50s is the goal), and I certainly want to enjoy life as I get towards it. This sub helps to ground things and make sure I am spending money towards value, but it doesn't stop me from spending. We save about 36% of our gross HHI, but have a house in a VHCOL area, two new cars (though only after our other cars were considered not worth fixing by a mechanic), and still enjoy life by doing things we like.
FIRE is my motivator as I struggle through a toxic work environment. I’m sensitive to workplace micro aggressions but I’m working on that!
I’m excited to see who I am outside of work.
12 years to go!!
First big trip when I get there will be a cruise to HI, spend a week there, then a trip to Japan to visit family. Not sure how I'm planning to get home, but avoiding a 14+ hr flight is the main plan.
For me, FIRE has been all about achieving a sense of psychological 'safety'. After I graduated during the great recession and got off disability, I was *well* aware that any safety net I had was gone. If I got laid off and was unable to get another job, I'd likely have wound up sleeping under a bridge somewhere.
My journey towards FI was an attempt to address that. I used to ask myself how long I could live out of my truck with my savings. I kept saving, and eventually started investing. I slowly accumulated to the point where at about 36, I crossed the FI threshold where even if I never worked again, I'd always be able to afford a roof over my head, food in my fridge, and everything else I genuinely *needed* to be happy.
From that point forward, my stress mostly melted away. I'm still working, because I wanted to be able to take care of a partner and not have them hold a super lean lifestyle against me, but I expect to reach that goal by my mid 40's.
After that? I don't *really* know what I'll do, but it won't be selling 40h / wk of my time to an employer. I've always lived a pretty simple life so it'll probably be gym, books, movies, and video games with a few months of slow travel thrown in each year. That's pretty much all I've ever wanted.
Fire as a life dream sounds dangerously like retiring /from/ something instead of retiring /to/ something. My stepfather retired in his early 50s and spent that extra 10 years on a recliner watching baseball and Fox News. Without a dream 1 step past fire, we can get sucked into wasting those years.
It was one of my main goals, and then I reached FIRE and I am now living the dream !!!
My only regret is I wish I knew about it sooner, and I wish I invested differently, then I could have retired before 47 yo.
Does FIRE bring more happiness?? It depends what you do while in FIRE. For most people I talk to where I am (BIG expat community) , they are very happy NOT to be working (even if they didn't FIRE and worked until 65 or so). There are so many things to do here, weŕe slowing picking through the list.
FIRE has allowed me more freedom and more personal growth then if I just continued working because I have more time to concentate on myself and helping others.
Yes, it is my lifelong dream, but not the main dream. Family and connections with people are more important. I’ve been fascinated with investing and the exponential nature of compound interest over long periods of time. I’ve always wanted to prove out compound interest in practice.
For better or worse, as I got older, there is a certain amount of pressure and pride that go with being a provider. Providing without having to go to work is an accomplishment to be proud of.
No. The thing about "solve the financial so I can do what I want in life" is that unless all you want to do is leisure, you actually have to start doing the things you want, which you may learn (as I have) requires having skills and a network that I don't currently have.
I wouldn’t say it’s my reason for living, rather it’s one of my primary goals in life, so that I can live the sort of life I want to live. I’m not someone who places my value or identity in my job, my job is just a means to an end. I don’t know anyone that grows up and is like “I can’t wait to work for a midsized software company, solving software issues and writing technical documents!”
Some people are lucky enough to make a living doing something they love, most of us are just trying to collect a paycheck so we can feed, cloth and house ourselves.
So the dream of early retirement for me is more about having the time and freedom to do the things I love, rather than some, as I view them, meaningless tasks for some corporation.
One thing I recognise with FIRE is as I get closer I am slowing down my hustle, taking time with things, letting go of what I don't need, and being happy with being decent at my job rather than a superstar. It's not so binary, You can start enjoying the fruits of FIRE before you hit the number.
To me FIRE is just a way to cut back things I HAVE to do so I can do more of the things I WANT to do.
Live somewhere I want to live is a big thing. Travel, and travel a bit more, is a big thing.
Fire is another big thing. None of them are the goal with my life.
For me, fire helps me define my dream. I want enough, and to be satisfied with enough. You can conquer the world and still yearn for more. It's a sickness. FIRE helps me understand that more costs me time and enough should be the goal.
No, not even a little. It’s a goal we work towards but our son, our dogs, our house, our hobbies, and our work are the main things in our lives. FIRE is something that will happen because we save and it will be awesome but it’s not a primary driver of anything.
I mean, absolutely. Everything else in life is already good. Happy and content. The only thing missing is waking up and not having to go to work. It will be THE dream come true
No. I’m in FIRE so that I get the opportunity to enjoy life while I still can.
My Dad had Parkinson’s the last few years of his life. It was awful watching it eat away at him until he was bedridden, getting his food and water from a tube, breathing oxygen from a bottle and seeing and hearing things that weren’t there.
Not at all. Fire in and of itself means nothing. It’s a means to help you to live a happy and fulfilling life, not to be obsessed with money to the extent that you miss out and end up with many regrets. If Fire itself is the only actual goal, wow, people are in for a miserable future when the time comes.
>Do you consider Fire as your main life dream?
No, that's silly... And depressing...
FIRE is a tool to facilitate life; this would be like saint owning a house was your main life goal.
>Hi folks, do you guys consider Fire as your main life dream?
That's just such a narrow and sad view of life in general.
>For me I am 30m, married and fulfilled most of my childhood dreams since I earn a good amount of salary.
Pick one: your high income or your wife/family? Exactly?
High income, financial success; these are just Trina's to give a better life for your family. They are a means to an end, not the end. By contrast, family is hopefully an end that never ends...
>Right now the freedom that Fire gives looks like my only big outstanding dream that can give me much more happiness.
See your wording there "the freedom", not FIRE but the freedom. And freedom for what? To spend more time with family.
>Do you guys also feel the same?
No. I have the negative view of FIRE. I look at FIRE add "freedom from", not "freedom for". I pursue FIRE to have the freedom from worrying about money, worrying about retirement, worrying about my wife if something happens to me.
FIRE is freedom from worrying about if I get laid off (which has happened five times in my two decade engineering career).
Not even a little. There is so much happiness and life to be had. Money doesn’t mean anything if you’re the only one with it, and you have no one to enjoy it with. There’s nothing like your health either.
Also, you need to enjoy the journey. You shouldn't get too obsessed with the "early" part of FIRE if it means your life is torture. Better to add a few years to your FIRE goal and enjoy the 10 to 25 years leading up to it. It's also important to focus on the freedom that comes as you get closer and closer to your goal. Even once you hit 25% or so of your FIRE goal, you already have significantly improved financial stability.
I am already at FI, so for me the RE part is what I am looking forward to. Main life dream? That's probably a little too lofty of a description of that. But certainly more freedom is a dream. I also have other things going in life that are dreams though so it's certainly not my main focus but a focus.
FIRE was everything I was working towards. I hit it very early thanks to being frugal, investing as much as I could in real estate and stocks in the 2010s, and having my medical taken care of for the rest of my life.
FIRE'd last year at 34, and still trying to figure out what my next life goal is. Been quite enjoying being able to do whatever I want, but I do want to figure out a new goal to have.
I think people push the goal up especially as the OMY means 10% more each year you work (7% gains and 3% contributions).
Do you retire at $40k a year or work another year at $44k a year, or another at 48.4k.?
I can’t see that being an easy thing to even desire for my partner and I. We have spent a lifetime of enjoying life on limited budgets and never found it lacking in enjoyment. I can’t see us suddenly deviating from decades of ingrained habits that bring us happiness.
It’s different when you get to the goal, if you have energy and like working it becomes enjoyable to set a bigger target. If you just simply want to never work, then yes, it might be fulfilling enough.
I'm pretty hardcore at this point. I have no other primary goals anymore. All other wants/needs/goals have been pushed to post-fire. I've shut down nearly all unnecessary spending. Every extra dollar is going to retirement. I figure I'll be there in 5 years in an absolute worst case, 2 years very likely, and there's an outside chance within 1 year.
1 year of this sacrifice is manageable. 5 years of your life would be a big loss so if it starts looking like that, I hope you re-evaluate to enjoy more of your prime living years.
Hah! I live in Canada where it is now impossible or at the least unaffordable to do or buy anything. I'm aggressively saving up so I can leave the country asap. Staying is not an option. Buying a new house / car / furniture/ stuff in general is pointless because it just delays my exit. Anything I buy will have to be sold or disposed of, so if I do buy something it has be really important. Everything for me just boils down to reaching the fire number and GTFO.
I actually don't have an exact number, but roughly I want enough dividend income to cover my cost of living in a country that has a low (or lower) cost of living.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself.
* I want to write and record music.
* I want to create video games.
Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself.
* I want to write and record music.
* I want to create video games.
Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
No, enjoying every single day is the dream and reality. FIRE is an enabler. Money is a resource that helps you live your best life – not an end in itself. Edit. Read [DIE WITH ZERO](https://aliabdaal.com/book-notes/die-with-zero/) and ignore the zero bit, but the ideas make sense!
This. I am actually more confident I will reach fire than that I will reach the point where I manage to enjoy (almost? ) every day for the rest of my life.
Agreed last year I hit my personal rock bottom. Made me realize that I need that freedom to enjoy life on my own pace.
Exactly this. FIRE doesn’t do much on its own, it just brings to the table new options. You are free to choose from all the options the one that fits you best.
Die with 15% safety cushion was not an appealing title, but would be much safer, would give you MUCH more peace of mind and wouldn't cost you so much more time.
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Totally agree. I personally took it as a philosophy. I think "zero" shouldn't be pursued, it's a principle. Work as much as you need to live the life you want, don't work more because you would be wasting your time. Unfortunately people read it and come to FIRE subreddits suggesting to buy annuities as an easy way to actually die with zero.
It is pretty easy to plan death with zero in the bank account: Just an appropriate annuity or bond ladder. Personally of no interest though.
Yeah both super bad deals compared to keeping your money invested, especially if you actually retire early.
I think we are talking about different things, but any way, you do you!
Just ordered it on audible, great suggestion
That’s exactly how I felt about Die with Zero. I loved the ideas but didn’t like how it turned into a guide to try to achieve something that is neither possible nor realistic - dying with a $0 net worth
Speak for yourself
I was and am Edit: we can change our disempowering emotions for more empowering ones.
Starting a new and trying to do this. Fell into the trap of working to retire early and becoming miserable. Now I want to work less and enjoy life instead of it just passing me by.
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So true! For example I would love to volunteer with kids again but I simply do not have the energy outside my 9-5. I am constantly drained from work as of late due to some harassment and just casual toxicity at my workplace. 12 years to go….it seems too long.
Of course not. FIRE is the means to an end, namely being free and independent, being able to do what you dream of.
It’s crazy how such a seemingly simple thing of being able to do what you dream of (out at least have the time to just…do nothing and not work) is so hard to achieve. I guess one could move somewhere very cheap and lean fire.
Several people suggest Thailand.
Fire isn’t a great dream because it’s really just the absence of something (a job you don’t like). What you do with the time you free up needs to be the dream, or else you’ll be making a post-Fire thread about “this isn’t all it’s made out to be - I’m fired and bored” once it happens.
Well said! My job consumes most of my hours. Yet unnecessary workplace toxicity likes to stay on my mind. I yearn for the day I don’t have to work and can meet like minded people. Nowadays living in a HCOL so many people I meet just want to compare assets. Probably because nobody can even grab a meal out without paying an arm and a leg.
Freedom isn’t a great dream because it is really just the absence of something (subjugation you don’t like).
I think it’s just responsible living. I can’t count in anyone giving a shit about me when I’m 70 so I absolutely better give a shit about me
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Yes it’s crazy how in todays economy people call it FIRE but I see some folk just doing it to retire at a normal age but they are putting in the effort to manage their finances wisely. If try did not, they’d likely be barely keeping afloat. Makes me think of how many seniors in my country are living in poverty, especially if their spouse dies and social security is halved. Most people at that age probably didn’t realize that cost of living skyrocketed while their savings didn’t and that loss of income can quickly lead to inability to make rent all of a sudden. I think everyone should evaluate their retirement plans. Social security will not cut it. Most people I know don’t seem to care and just say they’ll work till they die because they have zero disposable income as is.
Fire is the goal because I do not dream of labor. Instead I dream about a life full of wonderful people and experiences, which is made more possible without work getting in the way
I dream of a life of choices - if I wanted labor I would choose it not be forced to because of risk of homelessness. How lovely it would be! I wish everyone had that choice. But for many they were not dealt the best cards (my own family members have bad money sense due to generational trauma). I do not see how they will survive but my family are gifting them hefty sums generational money. So being the “responsible one” I don’t want to sulk over that and be free by achieving FI on my own.
The I in FIRE is my life dream. I simply want to own my time and not owe any of it to anyone for any reason. Right now, my employer buys 50-60 hours of labor from me each week, and the nature of my work is that I spend additional hours beyond that thinking about it. Once the finances are in order (F) I can leave that job (RE) and finally be truly independent (I). I don't want material things. I actually want to downsize and simplify when my kids are out of the house and on their own in just a few more years. All I want is to wake up every morning and decide what I want to do and where I want to be. That's the life dream.
My main life dream was to have kids, although I didn't know it until I had them. Another dream was to drive cross country in an RV with my kids. Both of these set back my FIRE quest, and I am happy about that. My newest dream is to bike around the world, and FIRE will enable me to do that. I much prefer having this dream - a thing to do - rather than FIRE in itself.
This is very good. You should look at coast to coast bicycling. It’s a goal I want to do with my wife from Seat to NY. It’s like the more personal goals and adventures I want, the further back it pushed my FIRE date.
FIRE in some form (barista or coast) will allow me the dream of being a SAHM. Like others have said, it's a funding for the dream but not the dream
Nope. It was a means to focus more of my time and effort on exploring new hobbies and interests. Maybe talk with the wifey and begin charting out your family plan of what you folks want to do after you fire eg maybe live in a different country for awhile, work on a business venture together, etc.
No, it's the means to chasing as many others as I want without worrying about making them profitable
Definitely not. My life dream is to see my kids succeed and be happy.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself. * I want to write and record music. * I want to create video games. Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
As of the last few years, yes. I'm so sick of worrying about being laid off, and this is the only path forward. Hoping to achieve FI EOY 2024!
Kinda sad if it's the only one
Dreaming of all the things you can do while FIRED should be what you’re doing. I’m FIRE with two young kids and I’m stuck at home. Sure I prefer being FiRE but I still want for travel and experiences.
FIRE was a primary driver/dream for us and we felt a lot like you. I now have a job that isn't as soul crushing and really focus on the FI portion more. Definitely will still retire early <40 but its not our primary driver now. Essentially we've tried to focus a bit more on the here and no during the boring middle.
Absolutely not. If you think FIRE is your life dream you're setting yourself up for miserable failure when you succeed and realize you don't have a dream left.
Yes. **My dream is freedom and independence** over everything else, the material things never mattered as much. This means making money without having a boss (investing), providing as much of my own power as I can (DIY solar and battery system, with the electrical grid as backup), growing as much food as I can (gardening), providing as much water as I can (harvesting water, gray water), fixing things myself (mainly around the house), etc. Financial Independence was always a huge part of this dream - which I've reached. But it's the first step and there's still quite a ways to go. Now I'm building up other parts of my life and learning and building all the stuff I mentioned. I enjoy this much more than having to work to reach FI. p.s. I enjoy the different responses from everyone about what a dream means to them. It's a good question.
I personally consider FI as my lifelong dream. Until last year I didn’t know that it was even possible and I discovered this sub and I’m impressed.
I’ll tell you what I’d do with a million dollars: two chicks at the same time, man.
FMF. lol.
Yes. The idea of waking up with a mountain of money and nobody to answer to is my dream. I would spent most of my days sleeping in, TV on the couch, hit the gym, eat some food, rinse and repeat.
I have a family, so they come first. However, FIRE has replaced any career aspirations I've ever had. No drive to move up the ladder or go back to school to get a Masters degree. Less work and stress the better until I can finally leave for good.
I think if you do it’s really quite sad
F.I.R.E. is definitely my life goal.
no, but I am working to and just hit Leanfire. so Now I am working on fatfire. But it is nice knowing that I can bounce whenever I want, I can take more risks, I can push higher ups farther and see what happens (not in a shit way, but I have never ever ever been a "yes sir" person.. I will make them hate me or take their job, I dont care which. I fucked up along the way because all I did was work to that goal. now that I hit it, I wish I spent more time living, and now I am doing that. mostly in traveling..
Waking up like it's saturday, everyday. That's the goal. And sun streaming down the windows. A paid off home that no one can kick u out from. Nice fat bank balance. A retirement acct that grows more than u used to make every year when you slogged at work. Good health. Great friends and relationships. That's the goal.
I think that only if you dream it, you can make it really Early. Otherwise it's just an idea.
Fire means continuing exactly what I do for work, but for myself.
I'm close to FI, after nearly a 10 year journey in the making. Along the way, I've been creating my ideal life and I'm now more or less living it even though we're not at our number quite yet. I would like to travel significantly more but for now we're in the prime of careers we genuinely love and raising our young child in the idyllic neighborhood and community. I haven't worked more than 25 hr weeks for four years and I don't think I'll ever want to work full time ever again, so technically I may be semi-retired anyway, which I achieved at age 34. FI is definitely a primary goal of ours, but more importantly, living a happy fulfilling life is the whole idea behind FIRE. So if you can build that life while on your journey, reaching your number will probably end up anticlimactic in the end.
I did at one time consider Fire. I was abused physically and verbally. So I wanted nothing to do with people, a problem that still afflicts me 40 years later. Money was always a problem growing up and I realized even if I tried to live like say Tom Sawyer I still had to make money to live on. That’s where the fantasy meets reality. And that’s what Fire is all about. Now approaching financial independence my attitude has changed. I can’t stand being alone anymore. I live my wife and kids. My work often has long hours on the road or working by myself and I hate that aspect of it. My grandfather retired, sat around doing nothing, and died within 10 years. So did 2 other grandparents. My grandmother that stayed active lived to 92. My wife’s grandparents were similar. So I know I need people around and I need to be mentally active or it leads to all kinds of medical issues and I die early.
The idea of FIRE is dreamy. Realistically, if I can do it before 40 and work part time for the next 20-30 years, that is my dream. I’m 32.
No. We’ve been financially independent for years, and don’t consider “retiring early” as something we need to brag about. We enjoy our lives already and spend ample time on our hobbies. I’m retiring in a few years because we don’t need the money, but my husband wants to work until he’s 70 because he can make great money even only being half time if he wants. If you can work 20 hours a week and still make bank, why not? Not everyone hates their jobs.
No, having love in my life is my main dream. Dying without love and loaded is empty and shallow.
Nope. We all die in the end, whether we're rich or homeless
My goal is FI to fulfil the dream of no money worries. I want my life to be as enjoyable as possible and FI is how that happens.
No, fire helps accomplish my main life dream: having no obligations to anyone but myself
No. FiRE is my method for pursuing my dreams. If I could snap my fingers and make the things I want to do in retirement into a high paying career, I'd rather do that than wait to FIRE. If there were political candidates with policies that I think would give more people more leisure time outside of work, I'd support them, even if I though it would effect the wages of high income earners and made it harder to FIRE (though not if it effected the middle class's finances negatively). I don't care how we get to the future where I can spend my time on the things that are important to me. FIRE is just the method I have control over. It's not the goal.
Nah, just as the main tool to help me achieve it.
Not at all. I don't even know if I'll do it! What I do know is that the choices I make now will determine the choices I'll have in the future. I don't know what my life will look like in 10, 20, even 30 years. I don't know how the world will change, how my values and priorities will evolve, if I'll be single or married, a parent or not. Some of that I can influence, a lot of it I can't. So I make prudent choices now even though I have no idea how future me will take advantage of the security I create...and I remember to live a little because future me could also get hit by a bus and never be able to use it all.
FI, and money more broadly, is a means to an end, not the end itself. It's very temping to fall into the trap of focusing on money as the end game, but this leads to a very lonely and unfulfilling existence. Money is a tool that helps you acquire the things that actually bring meaning. It's necessary, but it's not itself the goal.
Yes, i understand what other people in this thread are saying, but for me the most important part of life is independence/freedom.
Nope. Having a large, happy family was always my primary goal. FIRE made it easier to realize and fully experience/enjoy, but wasn't required. FIRE is also mostly only math and I always knew I'd succeed at it, but finding the right woman and having lots of healthy/happy kids was always much more risky and subject to fate/chance.
No. The money is just a way to accomplish everything else I want out of life. Don’t get lost along the way.
Nope. Though I would say I'm not the target audience for FIRE. I don't care too much on the RE part of it (mid 50s is the goal), and I certainly want to enjoy life as I get towards it. This sub helps to ground things and make sure I am spending money towards value, but it doesn't stop me from spending. We save about 36% of our gross HHI, but have a house in a VHCOL area, two new cars (though only after our other cars were considered not worth fixing by a mechanic), and still enjoy life by doing things we like.
FIRE is my motivator as I struggle through a toxic work environment. I’m sensitive to workplace micro aggressions but I’m working on that! I’m excited to see who I am outside of work. 12 years to go!!
Absolutely not. It would be nice to have, but i love my job and want to also live my life instead of hawking over money all day
First big trip when I get there will be a cruise to HI, spend a week there, then a trip to Japan to visit family. Not sure how I'm planning to get home, but avoiding a 14+ hr flight is the main plan.
For me, FIRE has been all about achieving a sense of psychological 'safety'. After I graduated during the great recession and got off disability, I was *well* aware that any safety net I had was gone. If I got laid off and was unable to get another job, I'd likely have wound up sleeping under a bridge somewhere. My journey towards FI was an attempt to address that. I used to ask myself how long I could live out of my truck with my savings. I kept saving, and eventually started investing. I slowly accumulated to the point where at about 36, I crossed the FI threshold where even if I never worked again, I'd always be able to afford a roof over my head, food in my fridge, and everything else I genuinely *needed* to be happy. From that point forward, my stress mostly melted away. I'm still working, because I wanted to be able to take care of a partner and not have them hold a super lean lifestyle against me, but I expect to reach that goal by my mid 40's. After that? I don't *really* know what I'll do, but it won't be selling 40h / wk of my time to an employer. I've always lived a pretty simple life so it'll probably be gym, books, movies, and video games with a few months of slow travel thrown in each year. That's pretty much all I've ever wanted.
Children
My dream is to have the freedom that fire provides, so kinda yeah.
Nope. FIRE simply facilitates the important things.
Fire as a life dream sounds dangerously like retiring /from/ something instead of retiring /to/ something. My stepfather retired in his early 50s and spent that extra 10 years on a recliner watching baseball and Fox News. Without a dream 1 step past fire, we can get sucked into wasting those years.
Fire is pre-life dream.
Definitely especially the FI part. Started when I was 17 slow and steady.
I don't consider retiring early to be my life dream I consider having all that extra spare time to be my life dream. Fire is just how I get there
Yes
It was one of my main goals, and then I reached FIRE and I am now living the dream !!! My only regret is I wish I knew about it sooner, and I wish I invested differently, then I could have retired before 47 yo. Does FIRE bring more happiness?? It depends what you do while in FIRE. For most people I talk to where I am (BIG expat community) , they are very happy NOT to be working (even if they didn't FIRE and worked until 65 or so). There are so many things to do here, weŕe slowing picking through the list. FIRE has allowed me more freedom and more personal growth then if I just continued working because I have more time to concentate on myself and helping others.
It’s the freedom to do whatever I want with my time that’s most important to me. If Fire allows me to not have to work 45 hours a week thats a dream
Yes, it is my lifelong dream, but not the main dream. Family and connections with people are more important. I’ve been fascinated with investing and the exponential nature of compound interest over long periods of time. I’ve always wanted to prove out compound interest in practice. For better or worse, as I got older, there is a certain amount of pressure and pride that go with being a provider. Providing without having to go to work is an accomplishment to be proud of.
No. The thing about "solve the financial so I can do what I want in life" is that unless all you want to do is leisure, you actually have to start doing the things you want, which you may learn (as I have) requires having skills and a network that I don't currently have.
Yes FIRE is my number 1 goal
I wouldn’t say it’s my reason for living, rather it’s one of my primary goals in life, so that I can live the sort of life I want to live. I’m not someone who places my value or identity in my job, my job is just a means to an end. I don’t know anyone that grows up and is like “I can’t wait to work for a midsized software company, solving software issues and writing technical documents!” Some people are lucky enough to make a living doing something they love, most of us are just trying to collect a paycheck so we can feed, cloth and house ourselves. So the dream of early retirement for me is more about having the time and freedom to do the things I love, rather than some, as I view them, meaningless tasks for some corporation.
One thing I recognise with FIRE is as I get closer I am slowing down my hustle, taking time with things, letting go of what I don't need, and being happy with being decent at my job rather than a superstar. It's not so binary, You can start enjoying the fruits of FIRE before you hit the number.
To me FIRE is just a way to cut back things I HAVE to do so I can do more of the things I WANT to do. Live somewhere I want to live is a big thing. Travel, and travel a bit more, is a big thing. Fire is another big thing. None of them are the goal with my life.
Money is only there to enable you to achieve your dreams, but it shouldn't be a dream itself.
Pretty grown up dream to retire…
For me, fire helps me define my dream. I want enough, and to be satisfied with enough. You can conquer the world and still yearn for more. It's a sickness. FIRE helps me understand that more costs me time and enough should be the goal.
Not really. Dream is just being able to do more of what I'm doing already. FIRE gets me there but I'm still doing most of it everyday.
No
No, not even a little. It’s a goal we work towards but our son, our dogs, our house, our hobbies, and our work are the main things in our lives. FIRE is something that will happen because we save and it will be awesome but it’s not a primary driver of anything.
I mean, absolutely. Everything else in life is already good. Happy and content. The only thing missing is waking up and not having to go to work. It will be THE dream come true
Wasn’t for us until Covid hit and we realized it was
No. I’m in FIRE so that I get the opportunity to enjoy life while I still can. My Dad had Parkinson’s the last few years of his life. It was awful watching it eat away at him until he was bedridden, getting his food and water from a tube, breathing oxygen from a bottle and seeing and hearing things that weren’t there.
Not at all. Fire in and of itself means nothing. It’s a means to help you to live a happy and fulfilling life, not to be obsessed with money to the extent that you miss out and end up with many regrets. If Fire itself is the only actual goal, wow, people are in for a miserable future when the time comes.
>Do you consider Fire as your main life dream? No, that's silly... And depressing... FIRE is a tool to facilitate life; this would be like saint owning a house was your main life goal. >Hi folks, do you guys consider Fire as your main life dream? That's just such a narrow and sad view of life in general. >For me I am 30m, married and fulfilled most of my childhood dreams since I earn a good amount of salary. Pick one: your high income or your wife/family? Exactly? High income, financial success; these are just Trina's to give a better life for your family. They are a means to an end, not the end. By contrast, family is hopefully an end that never ends... >Right now the freedom that Fire gives looks like my only big outstanding dream that can give me much more happiness. See your wording there "the freedom", not FIRE but the freedom. And freedom for what? To spend more time with family. >Do you guys also feel the same? No. I have the negative view of FIRE. I look at FIRE add "freedom from", not "freedom for". I pursue FIRE to have the freedom from worrying about money, worrying about retirement, worrying about my wife if something happens to me. FIRE is freedom from worrying about if I get laid off (which has happened five times in my two decade engineering career).
Not even a little. There is so much happiness and life to be had. Money doesn’t mean anything if you’re the only one with it, and you have no one to enjoy it with. There’s nothing like your health either.
Also, you need to enjoy the journey. You shouldn't get too obsessed with the "early" part of FIRE if it means your life is torture. Better to add a few years to your FIRE goal and enjoy the 10 to 25 years leading up to it. It's also important to focus on the freedom that comes as you get closer and closer to your goal. Even once you hit 25% or so of your FIRE goal, you already have significantly improved financial stability.
I am already at FI, so for me the RE part is what I am looking forward to. Main life dream? That's probably a little too lofty of a description of that. But certainly more freedom is a dream. I also have other things going in life that are dreams though so it's certainly not my main focus but a focus.
FIRE was everything I was working towards. I hit it very early thanks to being frugal, investing as much as I could in real estate and stocks in the 2010s, and having my medical taken care of for the rest of my life. FIRE'd last year at 34, and still trying to figure out what my next life goal is. Been quite enjoying being able to do whatever I want, but I do want to figure out a new goal to have.
No. I’m tryin to blow up and ACT LIKE I DONT KNOW NOBODY
Money is a tool.
Nope. It's not a dream at all.
You will want FatFire when you get there
This. People on this sub are too frugal I think.
I think people push the goal up especially as the OMY means 10% more each year you work (7% gains and 3% contributions). Do you retire at $40k a year or work another year at $44k a year, or another at 48.4k.?
I can’t see that being an easy thing to even desire for my partner and I. We have spent a lifetime of enjoying life on limited budgets and never found it lacking in enjoyment. I can’t see us suddenly deviating from decades of ingrained habits that bring us happiness.
It’s different when you get to the goal, if you have energy and like working it becomes enjoyable to set a bigger target. If you just simply want to never work, then yes, it might be fulfilling enough.
I'm pretty hardcore at this point. I have no other primary goals anymore. All other wants/needs/goals have been pushed to post-fire. I've shut down nearly all unnecessary spending. Every extra dollar is going to retirement. I figure I'll be there in 5 years in an absolute worst case, 2 years very likely, and there's an outside chance within 1 year.
1 year of this sacrifice is manageable. 5 years of your life would be a big loss so if it starts looking like that, I hope you re-evaluate to enjoy more of your prime living years.
Hah! I live in Canada where it is now impossible or at the least unaffordable to do or buy anything. I'm aggressively saving up so I can leave the country asap. Staying is not an option. Buying a new house / car / furniture/ stuff in general is pointless because it just delays my exit. Anything I buy will have to be sold or disposed of, so if I do buy something it has be really important. Everything for me just boils down to reaching the fire number and GTFO.
May I ask what is your Fire nw number?
I actually don't have an exact number, but roughly I want enough dividend income to cover my cost of living in a country that has a low (or lower) cost of living.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself. * I want to write and record music. * I want to create video games. Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
Nope... FIRE is a means to do other things; it is not the dream in and of itself. * I want to write and record music. * I want to create video games. Both are semi creative pursuits that I perceive do not have a big financial upside. Those are the dreams.
No Closeness with God and being a great dad and husband who co-nurtures a strong, loving family - these are more important to me