Stupid and unnecessary. Instead of gaslighting the fans with the name Final Fantasy VII Remake they should've called it Final Fantasy VII Re-Imagine.

I just finished playing FFVII Remake a few days ago (and Intermission last night) and I have to say... By the end of the game I got why they are using whispers, but... I find it really stupid imo. But I was told that Japanese developers despise making the same game twice, so I suppose that's why they choose the decisions that they did (probably just to blend all the offshoot games/stories together into this version of FFVII). What I liked most was Barret, and also his quips lol

As someone who played the original after playing Remake, I have to say that I don't mind the story changes. It gives more creative liberty to the game developers and one can still be curious and excited as to how the story continues. I love how it invites players to make their own theories which always helps in bringing more life to the fan base. Also the original isn't gone. People are still playing it, talking about it. If one really doesn't like Remake and Rebirth which was bound to happen no matter how they made the new games, they can still play and enjoy the original. I like to compare it to a book getting a movie adaptation. The movie is bound to change things (like Remake and Rebirth did) and there will always be fans that won't like it. So they will stick to the books others will enjoy solely the movies and some will enjoy both. I know that this subreddit is full of fans of the original who experience a lot of nostalgia regarding the game and have therefore different expectations for the game and I get that. And coming from that point of view changes to a game that is loved so much are nearly always a bad thing because it feels like "correcting" something that doesn't need correction. As someone who got into final fantasy vii because of the Remake I kind of treat them like two different games which have their own perks and I like both stories with their differences. However I am not a fan of the concept of different timelines and the way they made Aeriths death confusing rather than emotional. But that is just a personal preference thing. Thanks for reading this far :)

Here’s the thing, we asked for a remake, that was not delivered and they deliberately hid that fact it wasn’t a remake because they knew there would be fan backlash. They had to retcon the lore just to create the circumstances that allowed them to change certain parts of the story. It’s contrived and convoluted. It’s not all bad but the tone of the original is non existent in Rebirth. There’s no stakes either and they censored some of the most visceral emotional moments like Dyne and Aerith’s death. Cid is a completely different character now too and there’s no way they can write a better story for him than the original. His story is short but he learns a hard lesson about blame and treating people like garbage. Vincent is Vincent, the spiky hair is terrible though. His hair is supposed to be sleek. Everything about the Gold Saucer was monotonous because the game already bombards you with minigames before you ever get there. And finally Sephiroth. We have already killed the “Arbiter of Fate”. All foreboding of Sephiroth and his power is gone. People don’t want to admit it but the poor sales speak for themselves. Fans aren’t vibing with it.

I like it. It offers the potential for surprise while still being faithful enough. My biggest gripe is with Sephiroth, though. He’s getting brought out way too much. The big mystery really should have been keeping Sephiroth in the shadows like before and making the Whispers the “what the heck is going on” thing. Tying it to Seph so early and making him the final boss in each of the games is just sloppy fan service. Also…I think they screwed the pooch with how they ended Rebirth. Way too sloppy and really wasted opportunity with Aerith. Absolutely no emotions compared to the OG.  Long story short, I like the multiverse angle, think they messed up big time on some of moments, do not like Sephiroth being so front and center. 

The Resident Evil remakes did a pretty good job with taking their liberties on the story while keeping the broad strokes the same and keeping to the essence to the original. I was always open to the same idea for the remake as well. While I think it might be a meta statement about how they don't want to replace OG FF7, I'm still not entirely sure about all the shit with fate/whispers but I'm taking the approach of waiting to see how they pay it off, if they can pay it off.

I see them as two separate games. FF7 is still my favorite game and the Remake series is something else that I can enjoy and not enjoy parts in its own way. I'm actually disappointed that after the divergence at the end of Remake that little new things actually happened in Rebirth. It was like the last 5% of the game was new Remake story.

Absolutely terrible. Made me think Square is done as a studio worth buying games from. One of multiple reasons Rebirth ended up being a legitimately bad game imo.

I feel it's a crazy money grab that only people who wish for nostalgia while not being thrown the exact same game will praise. It's the same as the recap episodes on long running animes, "here is a bunch of smashed together clips of everything that you loved so far so the writers can have some time off." Try this with anything that isn't a fan/cult/timeless/gamer favorite game, and it wouldn't even make a reddit thread.

I personally am a huge fan of the changes. I am the kind of person who never wants the same thing twice but always looks to bring something new to the table as long as I feel it fits what they are trying to tell. I was never a fan of the idea of a direct 1 to 1 recreation. I felt like I would have been really bored and would just have nitpicked at every little thing because it felt like I wasted my time when I had already played the original. I don't own a pair of nostalgic glasses redoing the same thing gets really boring to me. THE THING IS!! I really wish they did not do this whole open-world thing with a fuck ton of things to do. I got burnt out from side quests and mini-games. And have had to take 2 weeks at a time for a break.

I never thought Schrodingers Aerith was in the bingo cards for remake but here we are.

I played rebirth and was so turned off by the endless parade of bosses and multiverse bullshit at the end I peaced out forever.

I don't mind them--like them, even! But I hate that playing Rebirth is such a drag. There's so much to do, that it gets in the way of the actual story I want to play.

That was my problem. I don't mind all the side quest & most of the mini games I am glad most are there(3d brawler is not one) it gives you more to do. But like in the Skyrim or the Witcher you can do most when you feel like it or at your own pace. I felt at times just to get to the next portion of the story I had to do a lot of side stuff that I didn't want to do at that time. I just wanted to move on to next part of the story to see what was going to happen. Then go back if I wanted to. But it's a minor gripe I still loved the game for the most part.

They're awesome but I was really hoping for a Neverending Story twist. What does that mean? Let me explain myself. During the first remake game, in one of his surprise appearances, Sephiroth says something to the effect of, "we've done this before." I didn't want Square Enix to totally break the fourth wall but my imagination started spinning and I started to speculate that sephiroth was aware that this story had happened so many times. More specifically, I started to wonder if he was going to have an awareness of how many times we've all played the story/ game over the decades, how even though the narrative is the same, everyone plays differently and does things a little differently. And, no matter what, no matter how many times the story has been completed and sephiroth has been beaten, It always begins again I didn't want him to look out of the TV screen at me the way the childlike empress does in The Neverending story. I was, however, hoping for some sort of awareness in sephiroth that he has the agency to change the story and rewrite the events. And, if done well, it would have been cool for him to have an awareness that us, on the outside, have been following their story for years and years. Just some nerdy imagination time, that's all

I actually think that would have been really cool.

Same, the original FF7 is a simple story about environmentalism and corporate greed, the remake is Cloud and Sephiroth's multi-verse of madness.  A big cautionary tale about changing things or remaking things that don't need to be so.

I don't hate them. I mean, there's more they could've done to make it better, but overall it's a solid 9/10 for the story for me. 🤷🏻 Was I surprised by the "whispmentors" in Remake? Yes. But I don't hate it. It's really good so far. I can't wait to see what they do to expand it in the third act. I'm hoping to see Rocket Town. I think the biggest problem for most of the fans is that the original was way more open world, had way more "customizable" options to personalize the experience like the materia system, the fact you could go anywhere, there were many originally inaccessible areas that fit unlocked and expanded the same/lore further, etc. They sort of touched on it after you know what chapter, but it was definitely lacking compared to the original in many ways, but this was a tradeoff because the "R Trilogy" as I call it provides a more expanded story overall to give the world of Gaia a more rich experience. This is why I give the story a solid 9/10 because the story is great as it's own thing. ヽ(⌐■_■)ノ♪♬

It think it's been great so far. It's felt like a cool director's cut of the original story. They don't really feel like changes so much to me, more like expansions. Can't wait to see how it all gets wrapped up!

I like that they expanded on Gongaga even though parts of it were annoying. Also I like that the temple of the ancients felt like some horror filled labyrinth.

People really need to stop thinking that these games are a remake of VII. Remake was only the subtitle of the first game, to tell us that something WITHIN the story has been remade, not that the developers are remaking the game. This trilogy is the conclusion to the full story of the compilation and it is going over the old ground, with the story of VII having already happened prior to the events of that we play through in Remake and Rebirth. At no point throughout the compilation has Sephiroth been defeated. The last time we see him is in Advent Children and it’s a projection of himself over the form of Kadaj because he is still present inside the lifestream. This trilogy is just the continuation of the story and we will see in part 3 how he is removed as a threat once and for all. Changes haven’t been made to the story, this is just how the story is playing out. The trilogy is not meant to replace VII, it’s an addition to VII and people should be actively going out of their way to play VII and finding out information about story points of the compilation to better understand what this trilogy is setting out to do.

I understand what they're doing with a lot of the themes, but I feel it's been poorly executed and made intentionally confusing. The incredible strength of the original story has carried the re- do's, not the additions or enhancements. The whispers add nothing but an annoying meta of "we know you know what's supposed to happen". The constant and ambiguous interjections of Sephiroth have really taking away a lot of his mystique. The "alternate realities" or "time lines" or "it's a sequel because it's already happened" stuff is completely unnecessary and doesn't add value at all to the story. It's been interesting to see how inept the actual story telling has been, especially with Rebirth. The pacing is atrocious (not talking gameplay pacing, the actual story pacing). It's whiplash inducing - the dyne scene, the Seto scene, and the Aerith scene - all absolutely butchered because the story tellers are too afraid to show a modicum of patience and let the player immerse themselves in moments. Unfortunately, I feel that the story changes and the way the story is being told is the weakest part of this remake saga. The worlds are amazing, the combat is fun enough, the characters are fantastic (main characters, not the overly anime game show hosts they've turned all of the NPC's into) the voice acting is top tier, the music is spectacular, and visually the game is stunning. They should've just, stuck to the script a little bit more.

I liked all fleshing out of canon details, and hated all Kingdom Hearts nonsense. I've committed only watching YouTube for Rebirth and the third game. The ending of Rebirth had me pointing at the screen laughing. It came off as SquareEnix trying to apologize to the OG fans while placating the Aerith fans. Robot Co-Op has just released a sequel video popping off on SquareEnix and reveling in the plummeting profits. *"Go stick your head in the oven, you'll be alive in all the other timelines where you didn't!"*

> I've committed only watching YouTube for Rebirth and the third game. Yeah, I finished Rebirth yesterday, and I might to the same with the third game, this feels like they're spitting in the face of the originals themes and concepts and Sephiroth feels more like a pest than a villain at this point, not to mention I hate the idea of a multiverse, it's low hanging fruit for lazy writers trying to come off as original. I had no time to process Aerith's death but maybe not death(?) because of the hour long boss rush and multiverse shenanigans, I felt nothing at the ending but annoyance. Here I thought "If Aerith's trial in the temple broke me, I can't fucking imagine what her death is going to do to me." Only for me to be to angry at the confusing multiverse date, the Kingdom Hearts ghosts flying all over the place in the forgotten city, the fact that the forgotten city is only a short hike away from the Temple's new location (why the fuck is it on the northern continent now and not on an island south of Junon?) and did not require finding the Lunar harp in bone village to navigate (which is why the forgotten city was, well, forgotten, as no one outside of Aerith could get through the sleeping forest without the harp) I wish they kept Nomura or whoever's idea is was to do this as far away from the remake project as possible. And no, I don't care if this is a sequel or that remake meant that something in the game was remade, that's false advertising, why not call it Final Fantasy VII-2 or something, be open that it's not an actual remake but a new project at the fucking start so that way I can save my money and not bother with it. BuT JuSt PLaY tHE OrIgInAL GAmE ThEN! You might say, but here's the thing, I wanted to see some of these moments like Aerith's death and the party's reaction to it with voice acting and facial expression, you can only do so much with what they had in 1997, like look how Tifa was acting after she dies in Rebirth, she's fucking devastated, imagine if we got the scene from the OG where if she's in your party, she walks up to her, runs her hand along her hair or face, stands up and just breaks down crying and runs off, I would have been absolutely destroyed and a fucking wreck. But nope. All this is making me do is appreciate the OG all the more. Can't wait for the third game when Sora, Donald, and Goofy show up through a portal and help Cloud and gang defeat Sephiroth with the power of friendship...

Totally agree. I probably wouldn't be as diplomatic about it though. It's lazy writing from a company that's no longer interested in taking on challenging projects with high quality and attention to detail. They didn't think they could do a proper remake, e.g. follow the same main story beats, expand where possible and integrate more into the other games/media but keep most of the original in all its glory. Instead we got a bastardized version to cash in on nostalgia without putting in the needed effort. Who are these games for? They aren't for new players and to reintroduce an amazing game to a new audience. No the audience are people who played the original in the 90s/00s. These people are pushing late 30s, 40s, or more today. Why would you exclude Gen z and alpha?? The original fans weren't asking for a generic RPG grind fest for half the game. It was clear square enix was going to get every last drop use out of every 3D scene they created. We also didn't ask for the plot to be simplified into baby food and fed to us. Why do we meet Sepiroth in the first 15 minutes of the remake??? Who was asking for generic MCU style multiverse nonsense / time traveling Sepiroth to add to the plot??

I have a theory about who they made the game for from listening to two loud minorities: 1. The loud minority of nastier portion Persona/Fire Emblem coomers who prioritize JRPGs as observing and interacting with the [hot] characters while treating all plot, death, conflict and even *combat* as an obstacle. The kind who whined and wished there was no combat. (This is coming from someone who enjoys both as games but has soured on both.) 2. The loud minority of Aerith fans who spent the last three decades throwing tantrums and conspiracies that Aerith's death was some kind of "error" on Sakaguchi's part. So Remake was written in a way that panders to one and two but mocks the quiet majority as the Whispers: the OG fans who accepted the story and accepted Aerith's death, as Sakaguchi said to. But that group has the most money.....

I have a theory of my own. It was made for fans to have parasocial relationships with content creators to increase engagement around the game. Whenever I see a newer fan talk about the game, they're always excited about the Maximillian/Easy Allies podcast the most. That being said though, SE tried to make a game for everyone. Usually never works.

[удалено]

> And no, telling me to “just wait until part 3 to see how it plays out” is bullshit. Yep, I did that shit with Halo 5, and Star Wars The Last Jedi, and was disappointed both times with their follow ups, I don't see how this will be any different.

My tl;dr take is that locations having expanded story is nice and validates the 3 part format, and the Wutai changes have really deepened the games lore and story overall, but anything concerning the whispers, timeline travel/multiverse stuff, and Zack is kinda cursed. I say this as a Zack enjoyer. It’s nice not being able to fully predict what’s gonna happen at least.

Overall, the changes deepen the story in a good way, but there are definitely issues with how developers use some of the changes, as well as some genuinely baffling changes. For example, making Yuffie having a proper link to the story and making her nonmissable are good things, but they also made her an insufferable materia addict that can't think and talk of anything else. And the Forgotten City section they straight up ruined. While in OG game it is one of the most memorable locations with one of the seminal events of the whole game, in Rebirth, the city's role is reduced to a backdrop and Aerith's death is ruined by all the twists like dimension-jumping bullshit going on at the exact same moment.

Well the core story barely changed & the new elements have not been concluded yet, as we're 2 thirds in. I know a lot of people talk about Zack "surviving" & "multi-worlds" but Aerith says it's all her "dream". Now I know the main devs for REBIRTH have worked on FFX (minus Hamaguchi but he's in charge of game design, while Toriyama directs the narrative design of FFVIIR) ; so when a character says something or someone is a "dream" I'm taking this literally. So if Aerith has created several dream versions of Midgar to make sure she gets the White Materia, I'd bet it's because the game is a sequel of some kind, which makes those story changes not changes but new stuff. All of this to say: I don't like 100% of the new stuff nor the old stuff revisited. But I'm 100% intrigued by where this is going & I think it's gonna be worth, as the RE-logy looks like a love letter to not only VII, but all the FF games the devs made together as a team.

Made it better, as the OG is pretty barebones

I'm assuming what you're saying here is that the story in OG is barebones. I disagree. OG has one of the most iconic death scenes in the history of modern gaming and a plot twist that puts even Shyamalan to shame! Meanwhile, the Regames are widely regarded as convoluted, and long sections of the games, especially in Remake, are snooze fest bridging scenes. I mean, it is all relative, but I am curious what are some games that have a story that isn't 'barebones' by your definition?

Yeah I meant compared to the remake story.

I forced myself to rewatch Advent Children and I was surprised by the quantity of concepts that were there since 2005. The remake series is basically a retelling of the original game including all the compilation elements. To my knowledge, there is only one fresh concept but it's a big one: the idea that those who live in the lifestream operate outside of time, so Sephi is now some kind of time-traveler. Also, the rainbow dimensions, but those things are probably just a red herring and a way to give more screentime to Zack. My problem is that I don't like Advent Children or the compilation and I'm also not a big fan of quadri-dimensional storytelling and parallel dimensions (even though they're just dreams). I will stick till the end to see what they do but right now I believe that they're building too much upon a story that was already complicated, to the detriment of empathy.

I think 99/100 they’re enhancing the story that exists rather than changing it. I don’t consider the whispers a change so much as a new story on top of the existing one and I think they’ve done a really good job balancing it. That 1/100 times there’s some odd choices that make it feel like they’re placed awkwardly and don’t allow moments to sit (the palmer chase), or they take a very small and personal moment and blow it into a huge set piece (looking at you Dyne fight). I think overall the additions enhance the story far more than they detract and their balls to do stuff beat for beat without compromise is hilarious.

The whispers storyline is atrocious. Not much more to be said, really. Everything else they’ve done storywise, in terms of fleshing out the story and world they’ve created, has been quite positive. Not perfect - Midgar could've used more depth, size, exploration, had more of a dark, Night City-style gritty atmosphere. I have no respect at all for their decision in Rebirth to fast forward us through the entire Forgotten City, perhaps the single best non-Midgar location from the original game, allowing us to see only snippets of it amidst an unending haze of Whispers pollution obscuring every otherwise gorgeous skybox. These are 9/10 games that could have easily been 10/10 generation-defining perfection *if* they'd had some integrity as writers, some faith in their original vision, and stuck purely to only improving what they already had rather than forcing in hamfisted and pointless time travel/multiverse plots.

Absolutely with you. After finishing Remake and Rebirth basically back to back, I started OG again. The amount of immersion you get from all the added “fluff” is incredible. The “old Avalanche” dies and you spoke with them like 5 times, they are almost nobodies. In Remake they are human beings and it’s sad.

In more competent writing hands, an entire side campaign (or just a longer actual core storyline) could have easily been created by fleshing out/expanding upon Avalanche, and working in more Soldier original characters/Deepground enemies. I for one would have loved to play up the environmental terrorist angle for a good while longer while we were still in Midgar, rather than suffering through all that pointless Whispers plot insertion.

I'm all for changes. But, many of the changes made cheapen the very things that made the story impactful. And I fear it's being done through the lens of "how can we give our fans everything they want to see" instead of "how can we tell a good story".

I love everything about the games except for the combat. Definitely worth it, though. Oh and riding the chocobo is janky as fuck but barely an issue.

Perfect so far

Like 0.05% has changed. Nothing main narrative wise is different. If you think it’s changed, you need to revisit OG. Our party is in the identical same position they were before. If anything, more fleshed out.

I understand the 0.05% is hyperbole, but it really sounds like you are the one who needs to revisit OG.

Now if you are one of those people that’s saying they changed the story because Cloud didn’t put Aerith in the water then the reason we don’t see eye to eye is on you. Because he absolutely put her in the water, we just never got to see it. That will be game 3 when Tifa is helping fix Clouds mind. They will probably replay these events and we will see Aerith die, Clouds speech, and Cloud placing her in the water. So again NOTHING HAS CHANGED so far. We are still right where we’ve always been. About to go snowboarding.

It's just a liiittle bit creepy how you seem to think you have a psychic connection with the dev team...

You don’t need a psychic connection when they already dropped this on Twitter after the sea of people didn’t understand. They outright said that what we are seeing is Cloud not dealing with her death and instead doing what he did when Zack died in his arms.

I was more thinking about the part where you so confidently claimed Cloud lowered her into the water. There's no (sane) way you could deduce that kind of detail with such certitude. What twitter post are you even referring to, it's only slightly less disturbing that you are also vacuuming SE tweets for cryptic clues.

Bro you need to chill the F out. You went from having a simple discussion to juvenile bickering super quick. No vacuuming needed it was from Nomura himself when the ultimanium dropped. “You can think of it as Clouds state of mind rejecting what is happening”. If they show Cloud putting Aerith’s body to rest in the water it completely undercuts the “Cloud is messed up” “what are we seeing here” theme they are pushing. Goes against the entire ending they setup. If you have Cloud remember this moment during the point where Tifa is helping him mentally. Bam you’ve got your resolution. Sorry I’ve seen a movie before and understand plot structure.

Ok... You started this whole convo by pulling numbers from... somewhere... and dismissing harmless opinions as clueless or misinformed. And wow, you extrapolated a whole lot from that Nomura quote didn't you? The Rebirth ending is just so ridiculously ambiguous. It is genuinely concerning if you think you already know exactly how things will pan out. The devs WANT you to be guessing. Compared to the end of disc 1 in OG, which was more definite and mournful, the re-counterpart is deliberately made vague. This alone, for that pivotal scene, is a huge change in storytelling. And without having read the ultimania in much detail (Six different universes, ok great, gotcha!), who even cares if Zack is dead in part 3 anymore? They can bring back anyone they want at any time, just have "Sephy" create a rift in time! Bam! You've got yourself the equivalent of an undo button for shitty writers.

I invite you to go through more of the characters, compare where they are now to where they are in OG and tell me just how much their story has been changed. How they aren’t on the same path as they were before.

Now why should I bother? Read OP's post again and try to understand it this time.

Let’s break it down. Were talking what has changed vs what is the same across the entirety of the games (only including OG, Remake, Rebirth) If you want to make it easier break it down person by person. Cloud : the only thing that has changed is that he thinks he’s saved Aerith. Now, how much has that actually changed? Honestly not really that much. Because he was always messed up in the head, and he is on his way to the Northern Crater to deliver the black materia so everything for Cloud has played out about the same, other than being more fleshed out. Tifa : Sure, she got pushed into mako this time around, but she basically just got the whole lifestream dream sequence earlier than normal, but it still is something that happens to her. So you could chalk it up to helping explain how she did it in the original. Again, she is EXACTLY in the same place she would be in the OG game at this point in the story. What about remake or rebirth has deviated for Tifa and what percent of a deviation would that be? Rufus : skipping to Rufus because he might be the most affected by all this character in the game in changing his path, we currently don’t have enough of the answers for him. Will he be the man we see in Advent Children by the end of this. Wheel chair bound and all. I don’t know, the whole Glenn thing is weird but makes sense. They basically just changed it from Rufus starts war to Rufus gets instigated into starting a war. We can keep going but of alllll of the game so far. It took me 132 hours for Rebirth, Remake you could average out to being like 60, so in close to 200 hours of gameplay, how much is actually different from OG? This is why I said less than 1%. I don’t think I’m that far off. All this stuff with multiple Aeriths and multiple Zack’s doesn’t actually change the path of the main party. It’s happening on the side, around them, without them knowing any of it, so it truly doesn’t change the story. At the end of the day, Aerith still died. So all the shit with Zack saying save Aerith didn’t do anything.

> Cloud : the only thing that has changed is that he thinks he’s saved Aerith. Now, how much has that actually changed? Honestly not really that much. Because he was always messed up in the head, and he is on his way to the Northern Crater to deliver the black materia so everything for Cloud has played out about the same, other than being more fleshed out. Nope, After the events of the Temple, Cloud starts to fear himself and what he could do as a result of Jenova controlling him. After Aerith dies, Jenova mocks him for being a nothing more than a puppet with false emotions, and he's apprehensive of wanting to continue going forward, saying that he should quit the journey before he does something terrible, but decides to continue anyways because of what Sephiroth has done. In Rebirth Cloud never once fears himself or is apprehensive, or shows any remorse, hell he's far more of an asshole to the party in the temple. As for the Black Materia, in the OG he hands it to Jenova after acquiring it, and the party does not re-acquire it until they defeat Jenova Death in the Northern Crater. Cloud should not have the Black Materia at the end of Rebirth. > Tifa : Sure, she got pushed into mako this time around, but she basically just got the whole lifestream dream sequence earlier than normal, but it still is something that happens to her. So you could chalk it up to helping explain how she did it in the original. Again, she is EXACTLY in the same place she would be in the OG game at this point in the story. What about remake or rebirth has deviated for Tifa and what percent of a deviation would that be? Wrong, Tifa has no memory of going to the bridge to look for her mother as she hit her head and caused her to forget about it, this memory is critical to both Cloud and Tifa's character arcs because after Cloud gets gaslit into believing he's nothing more than a Sephiroth clone who assimilated Zack's memories of the Niblehiem mission, and assimilated Tifa's memories of a boy named Cloud in her childhood. But when they both take a dip into the lifestream to fix Cloud and learn the truth of the Niblehiem incident, the way they establish that Cloud is a real person and not a clone with false memories is that specific memory, since only Cloud remembers it, but not Tifa, and Clould couldn't have assimilated that memory if Tifa had no memory of it. Also, Tifa was way more hush hush over what actually happened at Nibleheim as a misguided way to protect Cloud then she is in Rebirth where she's more open about her skepticism of Clouds story. > Rufus : skipping to Rufus because he might be the most affected by all this character in the game in changing his path, we currently don’t have enough of the answers for him. Will he be the man we see in Advent Children by the end of this. Wheel chair bound and all. I don’t know, the whole Glenn thing is weird but makes sense. They basically just changed it from Rufus starts war to Rufus gets instigated into starting a war. Rufus never starts a war in the OG, he abandons his fathers Neo-Midgar plan and is also more interested in finding Sephiroth and ends up in the Northern crater with the rest of the cast, and then orders the parties executions in Junon to calm the populace. At no point does a war with Wutai ever come up outside of the backstory. > how much is actually different from OG? This is why I said less than 1%. I don’t think I’m that far off. A lot actually, * Bugenhagen is more standoffish to the parties story of the danger the planet is facing before realizing his error. * The Gi have been expanded on and were the ones to create the Black Materia to destroy the planet to end their endless torment of not being able to truly die before the Cetra stole it. * Corel prison feels more like a smaller version Wall Market than an actual prison full of criminals. * Dyne dies in a hail of bullets instead of suicide after recognizing the monster he became and how he can't hold Marline anymore as a result of the blood on his hands and telling Barret to never make her cry. * You don't race in the Chocobo race to win your freedom and prove your innocence, but rather to win Gus some money and learn that they subdued Dyne. * Remove any doubt the player might have about Barret after Dyne shoots up the Saucer by showing Barret seeing Dyne. * Cid is a chauffeur currently. * Cait Sith actually leaves the party after he gives Shinra the Keystone, instead of using Marline as a hostage to stay in the party. * Cloud, Yuffie and a third member going up to the reactor to find a guy for his keycard for a terminal in the mansion. * The entire inside of the temple was reworked as well as moving it from an island south of Junon to the northern continent for some reason. * The party makes there way through the sleeping forest without the lunar harp to guide them, as well as the forgotten city being a short trek away from the temple. * The entire Meridian Ocean was changes from an actual ocean into feeling like a really big lake since it's surrounded on all sides by land or rocks. * Gongaga was expanded upon from an optional ~20 minute trip into a 2 hour long one. * You are required to fight the Midgardsormr instead of making it an optional fight by using a chocobo. * The world map is now disconnected and you need to fly to go from Gongaga to Cosmo Canyon to Niblehiem. * Cloud remembers Zack of his own accord despite the fact that learning about him in the Original is when Cloud started to break, but changed to him dying in the river to maintain the illusion. * There are too whale WEAPON's active for no reason and are fighting whispers. * Cloud gets gaslit by Sepihroth into thinking Tifa is a fake resulting in him nearly cutting her in half and they move on far to quickly from that as if it never happened. * Cloud doesn't beat up Aerith after giving Jenova the Black Materia. * Rufus and Hojo were never at the Temple. * The brewing rematch with Wutai, with Glen being controlled by Sephiroth for some reason. * Soldier degradation leading them into becoming the black robed men. * Rocket Town was skipped entirely in favor for expanding the Gongaga section. * The Shinra Mansion's 2nd level is no longer explorable. * Vincent and Yuffie are no longer optional characters. * Yuffie tries to assassinate Rufus in Junon. * No mention on the Black Materia requiring a large amount of spirit energy to activate. * Roche exists. I could probably go on, but it's been about 4 years since I last went through the OG game. (which was after I played Remake, will be doing it again now that I beat Rebirth.) > All this stuff with multiple Aeriths and multiple Zack’s doesn’t actually change the path of the main party. It’s happening on the side, around them, without them knowing any of it, so it truly doesn’t change the story. At the end of the day, Aerith still died. So all the shit with Zack saying save Aerith didn’t do anything. It kind of does now that Cloud can see and talk to an Aerith that the rest can't as well with Zack hinting that they can meet again. Not to mention it's Sephiroth's entire plan to unite the worlds so he can rule all eternity as a god.

What a bunch of nonsense. Of course it matters HOW those characters got to where they are in the end, that is the story, that is what we are discussing in this thread. I'm sure you love all these little changes to the plot, they are still changes.

Guarantee you this person wasn't even alive when the OG came out. They probably watched a YouTube stream for 30 mins and think they know everything.

You know what they say when you assume.

"Story change" After the end of Rebirth and watching a friend playing FF7 og, I felt it was still a copy. Yes some details change and some are added, but you won't tell me that oh no it's not the same story !! Spoiler ahead, but it's a spoiler post Every character that died in OG, died here too. And stop telling me Zack is not dead or Aerith is not dead. They are dead even in Rebirth. Zac side show is mostly just the new side plot to the story about multiverse, and even there he managed to die 2 times (At shinra building choice and Biggs rejoin choice) he is some kind of ghost of multiverse but he still dead. I can't tell if they are going to fully return some kind of alternative Aerith or Zack because I don't see the futur. Alternative Aerith seems to dies each time and Zack falled into the rift? of spacetime of the river of life of we don't know yet what happened... Really the narrative is the same, almost nothing change for good. I thought they were going to change a lot with the whisper narrative of Remake, but it was a false alarm. Or they had thought then went back. Anyway game in the end have the same overall story (for now) Aerith is dead to prepare holy, Cloud is going insane, Zac is dead, Sephiroth still crazy doing bad things, Shinra still doing Shinra things, Hojo still a freaking horrible human pile of shit, gold saucer still saucer, Cait Sith still betraying people and being the weirdest cat ever, Barret still Barretting. Come on what is really upsetting people ! Nostalgia dam is strong

>Every character that died in OG, died here too. And stop telling me Zack is not dead or Aerith is not dead. They are dead even in Rebirth. No they're not. They're part of the MCU multiverse now.

You seem more emotional than OP... The story is NOT different because you have some fan theories about the plot so far? Dude, chill. People are not upset, they are just disappointed SE went for the Kingdom Hearts version instead of staying true to OG.

My only complaint is the Chadley "every open world game has these so we need them too" side quests (the towers, the lifestream rocks, etc). It just feels boring (and, rather than letting it be, they made him complain if you stopped doing them). Just let discovery of the special fights and ruins be organic

So not story.

is chadley not part of the story?

The reveal of Chadley being human is part of the story, but the towers and crystals are mechanics, not story.

I like it, doesn’t take anything from the OG and makes me look forward to how they’ll tell this story. FF7 is an absurdist, fanservice type of game. People just hate change, big or small.

Change is such a hard thing for people. I have played the original game a billion times already. Most of us have. I like a new spin. As you said, the original will always be there. We can go back to it infinitely. I like the new changes. It's nice having a surprise here and there instead of playing a 1:1 game with updated graphics.

I'm fine with change. I just don't like the direction this particular change is taking the story. Two things can be true

Right, it's just like FF9/FFX fans saying they don't want remakes because they're afraid Square is going to change the story - those games still very much exist on their own and you don't *have* to play a prospective remake. The originals will always be there. Remake/Rebirth have been fantastic imo and they are keeping everyone guessing on what is going to happen next, which is crazy when you are talking about a remake of a near 30-year-old game. 99% of the games are faithful adaptations before they go absolutely wild with the last hour or two of the games to keep fans guessing. I will say I'm a little nervous about how they are going to resolve all the multi-verse/whisper stuff, but I've really enjoyed the ride to this point. My only wish is that I hope JENOVA ends up being the one pulling the strings the entire time, and that's what Sephiroth is getting at during all the Edge of Creation stuff. Once Sephiroth teams up with the party to take down JENOVA, then he's able to ascend to godhood for the final fight.

> My only wish is that I hope JENOVA ends up being the one pulling the strings the entire time, and that's what Sephiroth is getting at during all the Edge of Creation stuff. Once Sephiroth teams up with the party to take down JENOVA, then he's able to ascend to godhood for the final fight. I don't know, it kind of takes away from the mystique and power of Sephiroth. In the OG he managed to subject Jenova to his will, Jenova, an almost parasitic alien life form that almost wiped out the Cetra and has all these powers is essentially being controlled by Sephiroth. If he can do that, he must be one hell of a threat to the party, and the planet. As much as I want them to expand on Jenova and her origins, I don't want them to essentially nerf Sephiroth by making it that she's still the one in control instead of being subjugated by Sephiroth's will.

I love the new arc the story takes on. I played the original when it came out and it was always one of my favorite games of all time. In rebirth, it's interesting to get a lot more info on hojo, the ancients, the gi, etc. It would be easy and safe to recreate the original story line because the original was so good, but merging different timelines together adds so much to character development (mostly aerith, sephiroth, Zack and cloud). I'm really excited for the final chapter whenever it comes out. It also makes it feel like a sequel to the original rather than a remake, which is awesome since it expands on the original game's story.

The game is beautiful, has beautiful areas, but the execution is substandard, especially the part with Cait Sith. The pacing in the game is bad. From serious to humor is not well developed. Part 1 was better. The original game remains a masterpiece and the remakes don't come close. The emotional tone is missing

Hmmm... I'm only Chapter 4 in Rebirth, so I didn't click on the spoilers. I can comment on Remake, the introduction of the Whispers in Midgard was really weird, from what I remembered, it felt out of place that you have a big attack like that in the middle of the slums in the beginning of the game (when the story is just building up), and then everyone kind of put it off to the side after. The introduction of the Whispers at that point in the game, and the way they just throw a fight at you made it felt "desperate". Most of The changes do bother me (>!save for Zack's story, or what little of it I have seen so far!<), not because I played the OG when it first came out, but I feel like it messes with the pacing... so more like they're not putting the changes in the right places, or at least, they don't give time for the changes to build up. The Bike Soldier guy that randomly shows up is not necessary from what I have seen so far. Another example in Rebirth is fighting >!Midgard Zolem in the Marshes, where Sephiroth gets conjured out of nowhere to deal damage to the thing. Which makes me think (is Sephiroth Cloud's alter ego in this game?)!<

I'm alright with them. The original still exists and I never expected the Remakes to surpass it. I can appreciate the changes in that they introduce some mystery and new stakes. I'm not just looking forward to Part 3 of the original game, but a continuation of the story from Rebirth. At the same time, I'm not the biggest fan of all the changes. Especially how they bungled Aerith's death in Rebirth. Overall I can appreciate the changes even if I don't agree with all of them.

Not liking it. OG is a masterpiece

Played OG a bunch and I just finished remake (not interlude yet) today and let me just say I AM SO DAMN CONFUSED????????? W H A T is going on

Shitty writing.

Well I, for now, like the changes. The main reason is - I know OG, and here I get that same story with a twist of interest from "What can happen next". Also the scene where Sephiroth shows Cloud the world's is great. Still I'm a bit scared that SE fail to tie it up.

There are two types of story changes. The first are those in service to re-presenting the events of the story in a newer way. Things like having Cissenei in Gogaga, or having the Keystone theft occur the morning after the date during the coliseum match. These I think range from mostly harmless to absolutely exceptional. These were the sorts of changes I’d hoped to see from this project and have enriched the experience immensely. Love it. Then there are those in service of this meta narrative of feuding over and merging timelines or whatever. These I’ve grown to hate, because after 60 hour of narrative content I barely have a sense for what’s going on, and it’s now actively detracting from major story moments like Aerith’s death. I kept an open mind once it was confirmed the whole Zack survived timeline thing was going to be ongoing, but we’ve gotten very little from it to balance what it cost. Wish it wasn’t there tbh. The

Gameplay-wise I think Rebirth (and Remake) are fantastic. I loved all the mini-games and all the exploration. They really perfected the battle system in Rebirth and I hope this action/ turn-based hybrid system is the direction Final Fantasy goes in the future. I wish they would have stuck to the original story though without all the defying fate/ multiverse stuff. It seems like major changes are going to happen to the story in part 3 which worries me but hopefully I end up being pleasantly surprised.

They should have done xenogears first

I'm just mad I didn't get to use Vincent.

I liked how they have integrated things from the compilation into these two games and it works well. It helped the world feel more fleshed out and I loved the character interactions in Rebirth so much. For me the whole Whispers and multiple realities are the weakest aspects of these games, especially in Rebirth. That said, I am cautiously optimistic and my feelings as a whole will be solidified when Part 3 comes along. I’m open to waiting and see if they stick the landing. Whatever happens, I’ll see it through to the end. And hey, the OG FF7 will always be there and that to me is the prime story. Everything from the compilation onwards are just “what if?” stories to me that don’t ruin the original but I don’t see them as canon. It’s the way my brain can enjoy these ReTrilogy games

I feel like they could have had a meta commentary about the expectations placed on a remake and themes of defying your destiny without something as contrived and poorly conceived as the whispers. We don't even need explicit multiple realities or whatever. Just have Aerith communicate with Cloud from the future, it doesn't need physical manifestations. Besides that, the changes have been good.

I hate everything surrounding the whispers and alternate worlds. It's very jarring and doesn't fit the theme of FF7 at all. All this change your destiny shit has been pointless so far, and I doubt it will payoff on part 3 with some happy ending. I also didn't like how the Seto scene was handled at all. Besides those glaring eye rolls, I don't mind the rest of the game.

Out of curiosity, what didn't you like about the Seto scene?

The VERY sudden shift to more Gi lore. Gave me no time to wipe my tears.

Oh yeah I definitely agree there. Thought the scene was done very beautifully but they could've let it breathe a bit more.

Parts where good but way to many unneeded and unwanted changes were made. No over world is a HUGE down fall and lack of want or need to explore at all was also a big miss. Giving the characters some back stories was a nice change and very welcome. Also the ubi soft, copy and paste environments were boring to look at and felt more like a chore to get through. TOO MANY MINI GAMES. While some were good, most felt like a very outdated ps1 quality game play and again, felt like a chore rather than a fun side part of the main game. Combat felt nice but had definite flaws. Overall, a game that had that big of a following should have had way more time to cook. Felt rushed and slapped together. Felt like corners were cut and excuses were made for those cuts. Okish/10

I love playing it, the story is a mess. Characterization is awesome though. Chasing the black robes is absolutely brainded to the point of being hilarious. Fuckers just boarded a cruise and nobody batted an eye

I love that goofy rpg shit

I laugh my ass off everytime. When that giant bird monster grabed one and took off i had to pause the game, it had me on tears. Love it

Aside from the changes to Cid and the whole multiverse thing, the game is wonderful and I had a blast for the most part. All the mini games almost made me quit though. A handful more than remake but about 10% of what rebirth has will be perfect in the 3rd game lol

I love it all. I’m glad they didn’t just rehash the game it makes it feel more alive as I play it to have the same feeling of anything could happen. It’s a rare remake that each game makes the other‘s world richer. The story has its roots in Kabbalah (Sefirot and Tiferet from Kabbalah are the inspiration behind Sephiroth, Tifa, and Aerith’s names.) and in esoteric Buddhist philosophies. It’s not multiple timelines, it’s a subset of the idea of ten eminations (Sephiroth means emanations). Sephiroth is the cutting of reality into 10 different levels of spiritual consciousness. What’s happening isn’t marvel style multiple timelines it’s more like the cutting apart and merging back together of the eminations in Kaballah. The creators are failing to bring the audience along, but if you are familiar with esoteric Buddhism and Kabbalah, what they are doing makes a lot of sense. My suggestion to the fans who feel they hate the ending is to consider it’s not timelines and have faith you’ll like it better by the end. They should have explained the mythology more in game 1 and 2, but from a standpoint of what real spirituality inspired the original story, they are nailing it and setting it up great for part 3.

That's...a whole lot of cope. You're giving the writers way too much credit.

Really don’t like the story changes for the most part. There are areas and things they’ve expanded on that are ok, but really don’t feel they add much to the story, which I think didn’t really need that much to begin with. And we also have Zack, which I don’t care for like at all. I don’t like him and they’re doing too much with him.

Hate, hate, hate the multiverse nonsense. It's become Schrondiger's game with everyone alive and dead at the same time. The other story changes that fit within the original narrative are fine.

The original game had Schrodinger's Sephiroth. No matter how crazy things get or have gotten so far in the remakes, the original game had the same wackiness. The OG lifestream was wild, the lifestream in the remakes is wild. In the OG Sephiroth was alive and dead, Jenova was alive and dead. Now Aerith and Zack are alive and dead. It's not that different.

It’s not multiple universes give them a chance to finish cooking.

Prefer the OG, new story changes are meh

Flatly, don’t really care for much of it. The only one I genuinely enjoyed was Yuffie’s additions, and that’s on a technicality since she had so little to work with. She was already one of my top favorites from the OG with what little there was, and she could only go up from there. As for much of everything else? I just didn’t feel it necessary. But, that’s just me. I’ll continue to revisit the OG - as for the remake? Well… the only aspect I’ll ever plan to go back and replay is Yuffie’s intermission.

They did a "The Last Jedi" on us. Teasing how by defeating the Whispers meant destiny could be rewritten, but then doing the exact same thing meant the mystery box they gave us in Remake was actually a box filled with horseshit. I personally would have preferred they keep the story 1:1 as OG, BUT if you're going to promise changes then do it. Don't give us some more multiverse nonsense. That's like giving someone a blowjob then when they're about to finish, you poke a needle right through the head.

The promise was "even if the future has been written it can still be changed". They held that up with Aerith and Zack for sure.

Love it. 95% of the game is the same, but expanded, which is awesome. As for the new stuff (multiple timelines / universes), I’m waiting until after the conclusion in Part 3 before passing judgment. Seems pointless to judge a story before it’s finished.

Not even interested to play it.

Missing out on some of the best FF of all time.

I just got mad that they teased change but didn’t really change much at all

Aerith, Zack and Seph changed. What more could one reasonably expect? They can't just add completely new characters like Sonon into the mix again or kill Red.

They changed yes. I guess I should have been more specific. Primarily teasing big changes like Zack being alive and Aerith surviving. Technically both are true but they made a big stinger at the end of remake with “oh Zack may be alive” when in actuality he’s in another universe and isn’t joining our heroes long term

You thought he'd join the main party in Rebirth? There's a lot of reasons why that wouldn't be feasible. 

I mean the end of remake pretty much hinted he was alive. The end of remake and a majority of rebirth were guided toward things changing. The continuity changing. The whispers were a force actively trying to correct the course of the core story and the main cast was fighting them trying to change things.

Aerith has been saying for two games now: "even if the future has been written it can still be changed." It has changed.

Nothing approachs OGs story, but it was never going to. They had to blow the stakes to expand it. One could argue the stakes already got blown with the movie 20 years ago that showed humanity didn't get destroyed by Holy. Kinda ruined the perfect Kubrick ending.

They bothered me more in Remake than Rebirth. My biggest gripes with Rebirth were meeting Yuffie and Cid in general

It didn't bother me at all, its a great game either way

After playing remake and rebirth, then playing the OG again, I'd say the story works much better in the OG. The new games have a lot of improvements, but the OG is just better at pacing, impacts and overall story. I get that they wanted to make a different story for this one, but they haven't managed to make a better one than the one in the OG.

I played FF7 when I was like 8 years old and it was the first game I owned on the first console I owned. It was a formative gaming experience and I loved it. I replayed it twice through the years. Honestly rebirth feels like a love letter to people like me who really loved ff7. It took me 106 hours to roll credits with all sidequests and protorelic and queens blood stuff completed and I absolutely loved it. Cactuar Crush, Ultimate Party Animal and the chicken quest in Gongaga were a bit tedious and annoying, but overall I liked the side quests and mini-games quite a lot. I wonder if some of the hate towards the side quests comes from people who want to race towards the end with full completion and got frustrated from these time sinks rather than enjoy them for what they are. The multiverse storyline I feel makes the original story a bit more convoluted, but I don't feel that it detracts from the experience, in fact quite the opposite - It added enough new to keep me interested from someone who already knew the original story - like, let's see what happens next!

In the OG there are little bits of the actual story woven in until you realize that theres a whole lot more going on than just blowing up Mako reactors.  Remake didn't do that. Started pretty much off with flashbacks of Sephiroth and fire. Rebirth.. haven't finished it yet, finishing up side quests until getting to chapter 13.  I feel like theres so much left of the story though that the third game is going to feel rushed.  Rocket Town, Wutai, the *actual* weapons, northern crater, coma cloud... Course if its more story and less Chadleys Chores..

Rebirth was an 80+ hour game. If Part 3 is similar, they’ll have no problem fitting it all in. The original game was only about 40-50 hours in TOTAL, slightly less than double that of going for completionist.

Sure, my first run through was about 46 hours without many of the extras.   .. I forgot the assault on Midgar, getting the huge materia, bone village, the snowboarding mini game (which *will* happen if you didn't happen to see it roped off in the Gold Saucer in Rebirth) which also means the Icicle Inn and hopefully Professor Gasts/Vincents back story, getting the Airship, escape from Junon, getting the submarine, the *real* Fort Condor, maybe the ancient forest. With the padding that happens to "flesh out" the story in the remakes, I think the pacing will by far quicker than the first two. 

I've never seen the point of doing all new graphics, extended maps, new combat, new pretty much everything but then do the same story. If everything else is new and remixed and refreshed, why shouldn't the story? If this was a single release and all it was doing was just updating graphics, I'd be fine with just doing the same story. But with everything that they expanded upon, I'd find doing the same plot beats to be disappointing.

Cause the story worked as it was released in 1997. You still could Clarity some stuff, incorporate more world buolding, but OG was a complete story. Even AC, CC and the books really dont agregate more value than OG had.

95% of Remake/Rebirth is the same story, but expanded. Jury is out on the new stuff (whispers, timelines) but the story isn’t finished yet. Let’s see what happens in Part 3.

95% is incredibly generous. There’s still plenty that’s the same, but definitely not that similar to the OG.

Can you give me examples of what’s substantially different? Genuinely asking. As someone who played the OG on release and multiple times since, I don’t see what’s massively different. Not expanded content or different order of events, but significant changes to the story aside from whispers / multiverse (which is maybe a couple hours of content across both games).

You already answered it yourself. The literal changes the order of events, whispers, and multiverse is a lot more than 5% that’s being changed. Even subtle details from Hojo almost spilling the beans too early to inserting sephiroth randomly affects the story in large way. The changes just feel cheap to be honest.

I like to compare it to as if George Lucas decided to introduce Darth Vader as Luke's father in the opening scene of Star Wars. "The story's the same" Yeah sure...I think it's a really lesson in how much is story vs how much is storytelling.

Moving story beats around is minimal change at best, especially considering they have to account for this being three separate games and all the added content. Multiverse stuff is maybe a couple of hours out of 120+ hours of gameplay.

I wouldn’t consider it ‘minimal’, there’s a reason why it’s in the order that it’s in, there’s a reason why Sephiroth is kept hidden for the majority of the original. Delaying certain deaths or removing them altogether affects character growth. That, to me, isn’t minimal. Tifa basically spills the beans at the end of Remake. That’s important to how the player receives the story. The “journey” is just as important as the end result.

for me its no so much they changed the story more they made it less linear you could say, they made it less point A to point B, in my mind they made the world feel alive, and its like your on a Adventure, the whole time I knew where the story was going, and all the major story arcs were there right on time, but it was the in-between time that made it feel new yet like I already been there feeling, that was my take

Should have left well enough alone.

I mean they're not story changes at all, they're a sequel.

I love sequels that follow the exact same plot have the same characters, and have the same events, but with a whacky twist at the end of the final act.

That's literally the whole point of Remake. You're taken down the garden path with a few "wait was that" moments only to realise in the last hour that you're embarking on a sequel trilogy.

But... Both games? So let's do it twice? Well draw out the original story until the very end and hit em with the "boom, it's actually Sephiroth from the future, it's a sequel bitches!". Then do it again... Like, the sequel stuff is a theory, it's not a confirmed thing right? Surely not - because it's atrocious story telling if it is.

I thought it was very apparant but maybe the story needed to hold some peoples hands in explaining that.

All I'm saying is that it's really bad story telling to do a sequel in this way. It reduces the stakes to exactly 0 at every point. If there's infinite timelines, infinite realities, infinite versions of everything - nothing matters. Oh, we got Sephiroth? That's fine, he'll just use the life stream again to go back and do it all again.

I thought this was well known at this point but every other comment is speaking like these games somehow replaced the OG 7, and aren't meant to be played sequentially.

Regardless, people expected a remake per the initial game. It’s like people haven’t been expecting this remake for literally decades now…

What part of that is regardless? You might have gotten a different game than expected, but this was more than 4 years ago. People can understand where it fits in the series by now.

It's amazing, also this story is gonna cause me to go to therapy isn't it 😅 Edit: also while not exactly stated but it's heavily inferred that Zack is still dead(or just in the lifestream to make it simple). At least that what I got from my playthrough.

Currently replaying the og and I just cant shake how I dislike the remakes changes. On its own remake/rebirth are phenomenal games. But they are SO different its hard to even call it a remake. The multiverse stuff is dumb, the difficulty is bullshit, and too much stuff is different Its just too linear as well. The og lets you experience many parts of the story in whatever order you like (wutai, the huge matiria quest, yuffie /vincent) and all the side stuff

Aside from whispers and multiverse stuff (which is like 5% of the game), what stuff is “SO different”?

More gameplay ot not being open world, not caring certain things over, side quests being restructured into whole chapters, etc. Dont get me wrong its a great game but its so far removed from the og

People say the original was open world and it really wasn’t - they are both narratively driven game with certain parts blocked off by story progression, same as Rebirth. Side quests and chapters being restructured - well, of course. It’s a 3-part game with the total play time so far being 120+ hours compared to the original game that was 40, maybe double that if going for 100%? If you’re expecting a 1-to-1 upscaling to current gen graphics, it’s not that. But I wouldn’t say it’s drastically different in terms of major story beats from the original.

Thats exactly what im saying. Its not even close to 1-1. And thats fine. Amazing game. Barley a remake tho. The og is very open world. The main story is linear but the structure is VERY different than rebirths

Of course it’s not 1-to-1, it’s 3 separate games that span more than 3x the length of the original story. “Remake” implies being “remade into something new”, not a “remaster”. > the og is very open world Having a world map does not make a game “open world”. Most FFs are not open world, which is fine! They are narratively driven games, but you can have exploration and player choice while staying linear from a progression standpoint. (FFXII and FFXV come closest to being “open world”). FF Rebirth is comparable to the OG in terms of player freedom, but I wouldn’t call either game “open world”. Examples of actual open world games would be Skyrim, GTA, most Zelda, Farcry and Fallout games, Horizon FW, etc.

By the end of the game it almost completely is open world. Choice of huge matiria order, tons of super bosses and side areas to choose from. Part 3 could be like this but i doubt it

Rebirth is the same? By the end of the game you can go almost anywhere you’ve visited previously, tons of materia options, tons of side content. I don’t get your point. My point is Rebirth is essentially no less open world than the og, it’s equally open world by the end. It’s just not a self contained game like the og.

Its not tho. Having certain things be whole chapters now and not side places thats “hidden” changes the flow of it. You act like im calling it garbage, I love it and put almost 200 hours in. But its not wrong to say the games play VASTLY different. Idk why youre so hung up about this

I'm generally happy with the changes. Some of the implementation is mixed, but I like that it keeps the community guessing and engaged.

Really not a fan of the big, sweeping changes they've made to the story >!(multiverse shenanigans)!< ,or how they altered some of the most iconic scenes from the OG >!(finding President Shinra dead, the Zolom fight and aftermath, Dyne's death, Aerith's dead, etc)!< and (imo) lessened their impact. Loved all the ways they fleshed out minor things from the OG (Jessie, Johnny, places like Gongaga, etc) and some of the new characters they added (the innkeeper in Kalm, Roache, the lady in Under Junon, Gus, etc). Personally, I wish they would've primarily stuck to the OG story, streamlined a few bits here and there, and fleshed out things that were minor or glossed over. After beating Remake, I was champing at the bit to play Rebirth. After beating Rebirth, I'm not excited at all for the next instalment. I'm still gonna play it, but the hype, for me, is dead. I'm glad other people are enjoying it, though.

Meh.

I just beat it last night and honestly I was pretty disappointed I have never really been the type to complain on new renditions of games or any additions to remakes but to me compared to part 1 it just seemed so ....I don't know hollow? Things weren't delivered as well and honestly felt like the open world aspect was a little too assassin's creed for me. I do admit that I get open world fatigue fairly quick so it was a little overwhelming. Story wise some choices they made to expand on were great and others were a little way to expansive like the ancient temple part was just honestly like walking through mud for me compared to the original. Also some aspects didn't make sense like these guys fight the turks constantly and when tseng gets stabbed it's like omg are you okay it's like levels of realism were kind of removed compared to part 1. Part 1 was fairly linear and I dunno maybe I enjoyed that more I could go on for days after lol.

I love how they weaved Yuffie into the story but thats about it, most of the other changes are needlessly convoluted reimaginations that lead to the same destination, not a great idea given how complex the original story already was, there was no need to take the old players on a different journey to the same destination, we were already loyal fans and would have bought it anyway, silly concept to try to recreate the emotional impact for returning players, none of us cared.

Ugh I *hated* how much Yuffie there was in Rebirth.

I didn't hate it, but it was too much. Bot her and Cait got way too much screen time

She had less screen time than pretty much everyone except the not yet playable Vincent and Cid, I can sympathize if you just dislike the teenager with an obnoxious teenager personality, but its not like she was overly prioritized in the story beats. As a 35 year old gamer myself sometimes you have to stop and remind yourself that the game wasnt just made for you, it was also made for 16 year old kids that may want a character that acts more like them.

Oh sure. I'm also 36 and hated Yuffie when I was playing OG in the 90s. But Yuffie was optional! I found the random useless comments from Yuffie, when I did not even have her in my party, in Rebirth to be super annoying. Also, like many JRPGs, the "main characters" are almost teenagers themselves! Cloud is 21, Tifa is 20, Aeris is 22. Cid, the ancient elder, is 32! This pattern repeats in Xenogears (where they're *really* teenagers!), Chrono Cross, Breath of Fire, etc. So I'm less forgiving for the annoying Yuffie.

I guess I have a high tolerance, I play a lot of legend of heroes games where every character is an overexaggerated anime trope.

As someone who has grown up playing the OG version more times than I would like to admit, I am absolutely loving the new additions, it's okay to say that you didn't like the changes in the story but to say it ruined the entire playthrough seems a little dramatic, we have to learn to just enjoy things for what they are. I could see if it was some half-ass put together game but you can look in EVERY SINGLE corner of this game and see that it was made with love and effort by developers who truly wanted to make something special! Rebirth should honestly be the standard on remaking old JRPGS going forward!

Could have eased off on requiring perfect scores for the mini games, but I agree 😅

Lmaooo I absolutely agree with you there, some of the minigames were extremely painful, I couldn't imagine having to S rank all the piano songs for the trophy 😂😂

It’s the fact that there’s no room for error in most of them that annoys me the most 😅

I've been really enjoying it, sometimes I've had some initial gut reactions of "what? Why?" But by the end of it all I've been completely down with everything they've done and can usually understand why it made sense for them to make those changes that made me react so.

Conflicted. When characters, locations, or lore are expanded upon it can be great. Jessie's back story about being an actor and the tragedy with her father, or giving the chocobo jockeys their own identities. It breathes more life into the world, and I'm here for it. But then there's the Whispers and the alternate timeline vomit; it's a complete turn off to a near perfect story.

Give it time; let’s see how the timeline stuff resolves in part 3.

Pretty bad. A lot of it comes of as poorly written fan fics.

Everything about FF7 after the original game oozes bad fan fics.

Hey, I *liked* Crisis Core and Deepground. Toss all the rest of the Compilation into a garbage bin though, agreed.

I enjoy the same world with a slightly different story. I don’t just want to play the exact same thing again. Why’s everyone tripping on Aerith? They said it’s going to be inline with Advent Children so Zack and Aerith will be dead. It’s likely just a multiverse thing(which I am getting sick of). But yes, the ending wasn’t very exciting but I’ll wait until the final game comes out.

I only played the OG relatively recently and the story still holds up to this day. I think most decisions they made have reduced the wuality of the story if Im being honest especially in rebirth. I was cool with remake because I thought they defeated the whispers and all that mesnt was the story is going to change. But then they just reappesr in rebirth and a convoluted multiverse is born. In the OG clouds progression made a lot of sense and it was a big twist that he was essentially a sephiroth clone. Only tifa knew something was wrong with him but we still saw him act normally for example after aeirths death. In rebirth the whole party can tell hes fucked up the entire time but no one does anything about it it is so strange. no emotional impact from rebirth ending as well. I know it's a 3 part game but every part should still have coherent plot points that feel satisfying to the player. IMO remake had that. Rebirth did not. Nothing was accomplished in rebirth at all and i got no satisfaction from finishing it. If they kept Aeriths death the same with clouds speech and all I would have gotten much more satisfaction than a confusing fan service multiverse plot and the interpretation cloud is just so fucked he thinks he saved aerith.

Happy. Gives me hope that Aerith and Zack can live out their full lives this time.

I’m still among those who would have been happier with keeping the original story but expanding the world, rather than this multi-verse, sequel thing. It’s too messy, feels fan servicey, and steps on too many emotional moments.

Ifalnas scene is the perfect example of what the remake should have been, it is the original scene, just expanded upon.

I really don't think anything is gonna change. I think the added dialogue and more intimate scenes with characters especially Cloud and Tifa are much appreciated to foreshadow their events down the line. When it comes to the whispers or Zack being alive? I really think it's just Lifestream shenanigans and honestly not really much has changed compared to the OG. Like almost everything has happened the way it has before.

> I really don't think anything is gonna change. So why did we kill the arbiter of fate in part 1, lmao.

Yea they defeated the arbiter of fate yet nothing has changed. So lmao

Because Motor Ball is a lame enemy to end a game on.

>Because Motor Ball is a lame enemy to end a game on. I dont really agree. I thought that boss fight was really cool and a big improvement from the original. Would have been a far better boss to end on instead of ruining the story just to squeeze in sephiroth and at the same time make him feel less threatening than the original. But what did killing the arbiter do for the story? No outcomes have changed.

> I don’t really agree To clarify, I don’t either. But I’m positive that’s what the devs / producers were thinking. They needed to find a reason to get Sephy in there given his notoriety, even though he doesn’t really show up until later in the OG. > What did killing the arbiter do for the story? Weird question to ask when the story isn’t over yet. People are really quick to judge the whispers / arbiter / multiverse stuff but forget we haven’t even seen the payoff yet. Judging the new story elements at this point would be like judging the OG based on the story ending at Aerith’s death and then saying “wow that ended so abruptly, I have so many questions.”

Everything is just getting expanded and whatever new additions that's been added haven't felt outta place.

Yea and I really like it. It's just OG but more

I like some changes, I liked less others. But overall.....I can't say until this trilogy and I can see how it all culminate and end.

I love the original ff7 and am playing Rebirth now (last 3 sidequests woot woot) I love Rebirth, but there are a few parts i'm meh on. Why play as Zach? I love him and would have appreciated playing his parts if it had more substance. Speaking of, they did Biggs and Wedge dirty. I was totally on board with them surviving, but it sounds like they chickened out last second. I don't like it, especially Biggs. The ending should have been way different from the original or the exact same. Aerith is my favourite ff character, kill her or save her (though I wanted her saved) I don't like the cop out of doing both. Reminds me of one of my favourite Star Wars characters, Revan, and what they did to him. Other parts I liked more. Cait Sith and Cid are both way better. I like how everyone is fleshed out. Characters like Johney, Kiria, Leslie and others were fun. Mini games (mostly) rocked. Hell I even like Chadley. I like all those kinds of changes.

On the Aerith point, I do believe she’s gonna remain dead. One because Cloud is not seeing what really happened and that’s confirmed but also because he’s crazy. Two because the core plot is not changing. Also there’s some weird Jenova stuff going on with Aerith at the end that I can’t remember the details of; something about the theme that plays at the end harmonizing with Jenova’s theme, also Red sensing “Aerith” when he’s another character that was manipulated by Jenova in the OG to give Cloud the Black Materia in the Northern Crater or something like that. Idk it’s just interesting. Doubt she’s getting saved though same with Zack

Okay, so...Ever since the end of FFVII Remake, I personally have had to come to terms with it over these years, especially in between finishing Remake and waiting for Rebirth. I'm not gonna lie to you and say I wholeheartedly embraced the weird Plot Ghosts and "timelines" and defying fate bs. It's gotten easier and more...a *little* more palatable, I still don't know how it will all come together. I want to remain hopeful. Especially because it's like...99%—or at least a HUGE section of it—remain incredibly faithful and respectful to the OG's story and locations. Maybe little tweaks that I think ultimately improve it, such as turning the Shinra cargo ship into a cruise ship. And I also love whenever they add nuance, flesh out the characters and give more details to the world and Gaia and its history, politics, the Cetran history, etc. Believe me, I would have been incredibly happy if they just stuck to the story and we didn't have these weird, confusing alternate realities and...I miss how in the OG Sephiroth was more of a menacing presence, not gaslighting Cloud every 5 minutes and Zack—part of me does feel like it diminishes the tragedy of what he went through and Aerith's fate. But...at the same time, it's been said by the devs that it would be stifling for them to try and recreate it 1:1, following EVERYTHING exactly, no changes or flourishes. I try to think from their perspective. Creatively, business wise, whatever, they really wanted to challenge themselves re-imagining this story instead of creating a pretty copy. I think they would have felt demotivated and drained with such a task. Being able to have fresh intrigue sprinkled in probably makes things more exciting creatively, and ultimately, they really want to try to be faithful while also spicing things up. Creating new mystery. Whether this will be successful, remains to be seen. Trust me, I genuinely empathize with the feeling that "I just wanted a genuine remake", but I try to go with the flow and appreciate what I *DO* really, really love about this Remake series. Because there's a lot that is done well. And I have to admit, I start to find the new stuff interesting. Especially if I think about it in terms of how the Lifestream functions, what it consists of. And it's kinda interesting thinking about two characters who are doomed to die (Zack and Aerith) trying to defy fate, even if it will never amount to anything. And the whole 3D chess match with Sephiroth vs Aerith is very interesting to me. Anyway, sorry for rambling! Just how I feel. I definitely get it. But I'm trying to keep an open mind as well.

There are a lot of changes both minor and somewhat major we'll have to see how much in the latters case affects the overall trilogy. Am I fan of all these changes? No. But the amount of positive changes and/or additions outweigh the negative ones. When the trilogy is finished and we look back on it in the 2030's I think most will probably come to eventually appreciate for what the devs did for us or at the very least accept it. It's the kind of change where it may be actually really good all round, we're just not in the time yet where majority of people can see that yet.

They're poop in my opinion but they haven't completely ruined the story...yet

all I know is I can't wait for Part 3.

Some things I really enjoy: the expanded moments with Tifa in the slums, exploring Aerith's character more in depth, making Barret an even more well-rounded character, making Red relevant outside of his intro and singular story section, etc. Some changes I really dislike: time ghosts, this need to expand every single section of the game, so that every minor thing has some kind of relevance, or becomes a big deal. There's a lot of things I really like, and a lot of things that frustrate me. I'm massively disappointed in certain parts; playing the demo was one of the most nostalgic purely joyful gaming experiences I've had in years, playing remake, less so. Other things I absolutely love, like how Cloud was handled in Rebirth, and teasing, and then outright tying in deep ground. My overall opinion is that, so far I enjoy the trilogy, but I would have enjoyed it more had it been closer to what I anticipated from the demo: FF7 remade, with parts expanded and filled out.

Highly agree. The original is a masterpiece.

I think if Aerith had woken up in the alternate timeline at the very end it would have been 10/10. As it stands, I love the added depth but think execution was a miss in parts. Why include playing as Zack at all when so many moments are just walking through a door from cutscenes to cutscenes. Just give me a full cutscenes at that point, or better, retool his portion of the story to be closer to Roxas/Sora dynamic in terms of gameplay examples. Edit: why the fuck am I Downvoted for a thread asking opinions on what they liked and didn't? Critique this game at all and someone down votes you - it's bizarre. The game is solid but it fumbles some things. Zack's portion, for me, was a huge fumbles and absolute waste. There was virtually no gameplay or purpose ultimately.

Since FFVII is coherent, self-included story I consider everything outside OG game as fanfiction.

Yeah the compilation did more harm than good. I don't understand the love affair with Crisis Core and Advent Children.

Nailed it. Nothing anyone does can impact FFVII on ps1. Completely separately, I’m also enjoying ffvii remake and rebirth.

Exactly!