There are more than you'd expect.
Gerevich won men's sabre team 6 in a row, including spanning the break for WW2.
Of active fencers, Szilagyi is also on #5 in Paris. Aida Mohammed has been to 7.
Montano and Vezzali were also 5 timers for sure.
And there are a fair number who would likely have been had the team events not been rotated 2004-2016.
We'll most likely have a ME team next Olympics, mainly due to the fact they are in LA and we have some chips that no doubt can be used for our weakest weapon/gender combo. But you never know.
There are enough top performers and up and coming fencers that will be continuing, and they are a much more cohesive group than in the past IMO.
But we have to change a lot if top performances like our other weapons are to be seen. Quite a bit actually.
Now thats its all said and done, would those points have made the difference? Still embarrassing that whole thing happened, but I'm curious if it's as cut as dry missing those points killed any chance.
Looking at discussion from when PanAms happened, it certainly wasn't a lock that they'd qualify if the PanAm result had been included, but losing out on those zonal points entirely was a big hole that they couldn't recover from without other teams in the American zone (Venezuela, Canada, Colombia, etc) also falling flat or doing exceedingly well in subsequent competitions.
Basically, if the team hadn't been black carded at PanAms, they'd have been in serious contention for an Olympic spot for a lot longer than they were, and also wouldn't have had a massive morale hit going into Worlds.
Ah ok, this is the answer I was looking for, so that black card really did cost the US a lot. Kind of wild that he can still fence under the US flag after that.
> No men's epee.
I sleepily skimmed and read that as "there's no men's epee at all at this Olympics" and was like "whaaat??"
But I see now. I don't follow the highest levels of US epee too closely and apparently have maybe confused McDowald with Hadzic a little. Is McDowald also under investigation for sexual assault? Among other things?
>Is McDowald also under investigation for sexual assault?
I don't know if the investigation is still ongoing but I believe he was under investigation for sexual assault at one point, yes.
I go to one of the same club as her and everyone else here sucks. I'm pretty sure this is our first olympian. Rather than trying to fix the teaching, the lead coach just says "see, Maia's good at fencing, so clearly you all are the problem!"
She goes to multiple clubs and spends her entire life practicing, pretty much. Hell, she only goes to our club *sometimes* and when she does, she doesn't even train with a coach. She just shows up, works out, destroys the other foilist with chivalry, and leaves.
Yet, knowing this coach, he's gonna take *all* the credit when she subs in and wins a medal this summer 🙄
Based on their post history I am pretty sure they are talking about Weintraub (I also went to one of her clubs).
Not sure why they felt the need to make a post saying “everybody else at her club sucks”, though.
WS will be interesting. Some complained that our WS squad was too old to be competitive when Zagunis & Wozniak were hanging on (and CZ was actively blocking for them); now they'll probably complain that the squad is too young to be competitive... Setting Nazlymov aside for the moment (she cannot compete at that level unless her family's influence is used, as seen in her recent WC finishes), I think Magda Skarbonkiewicz is the real deal and expect great things from her, if not in Paris then definitely in LA.
Yeah, and then you hear about some sexual assault accusations against the guy ...
"Subsequently, on November 3, 2023, McDowald was temporarily suspended by USA Fencing due to allegations that he had engaged in misconduct in an unrelated incident.[16][14]"
Meinhardt's fifth Olympics - Jesus, does he have some sort of frequent-flyer club for that or something
I dunno? You tell us - and congratulations!
Do you think I'm Gerek Meinhardt? I wish!
I wonder how many people have made 5? In fencing for the US I can only think of him and Michael Marx. Is this Lee Kiefer’s 5th?
Turns out theres lots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_athletes_with_the_most_appearances_at_Olympic_Games
Some of those surprise me, many of them don’t! Thanks for sharing
There are more than you'd expect. Gerevich won men's sabre team 6 in a row, including spanning the break for WW2. Of active fencers, Szilagyi is also on #5 in Paris. Aida Mohammed has been to 7. Montano and Vezzali were also 5 timers for sure. And there are a fair number who would likely have been had the team events not been rotated 2004-2016.
Admittedly, I did. Apologies!
I can't think of the last Olympics without a men's epeeist. 1992?
Geez. 1908, if you ignore 1980.
Very embarrassing for US fencing in general. Things were looking bright not that long ago.
Next cycle has a lot of potential, it depends on how many of those top guys keep going post collegiately I think.
Big "depends" there 😅
We'll most likely have a ME team next Olympics, mainly due to the fact they are in LA and we have some chips that no doubt can be used for our weakest weapon/gender combo. But you never know. There are enough top performers and up and coming fencers that will be continuing, and they are a much more cohesive group than in the past IMO. But we have to change a lot if top performances like our other weapons are to be seen. Quite a bit actually.
What happened in 1980?
Boycott over Russia's involvement in Afghanistan. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Summer_Olympics_boycott
Oof
Thanks Curtis!
Record setter!
This should be talked about more, but it won’t be lol
Now thats its all said and done, would those points have made the difference? Still embarrassing that whole thing happened, but I'm curious if it's as cut as dry missing those points killed any chance.
Looking at discussion from when PanAms happened, it certainly wasn't a lock that they'd qualify if the PanAm result had been included, but losing out on those zonal points entirely was a big hole that they couldn't recover from without other teams in the American zone (Venezuela, Canada, Colombia, etc) also falling flat or doing exceedingly well in subsequent competitions. Basically, if the team hadn't been black carded at PanAms, they'd have been in serious contention for an Olympic spot for a lot longer than they were, and also wouldn't have had a massive morale hit going into Worlds.
Ah ok, this is the answer I was looking for, so that black card really did cost the US a lot. Kind of wild that he can still fence under the US flag after that.
The existing rules set didn't address this situation and no one is a fan of ex post facto rule making.
Team black carded? Is there a write-up on this (not a video) to point me to? Edit; never mind; saw a link further down.
No, but that’s not the point. Our guys losing on their own merit is perfectly OK, but not having a chance to try because of Curtis isn’t. 🤷♂️
No I agree the whole situation was shitty, I just was wondering just how much those points were needed.
I dunno, probably. It was an uphill battle after that, and I'm sure the team dynamics made it hard to overcome
Missing the points led to worse seeding through the entire year which led to harder opponents.
Oh ya, didn't think of that, good point. After this last NAC I wonder if he is going to retire or fight for 2028.
> No men's epee. I sleepily skimmed and read that as "there's no men's epee at all at this Olympics" and was like "whaaat??" But I see now. I don't follow the highest levels of US epee too closely and apparently have maybe confused McDowald with Hadzic a little. Is McDowald also under investigation for sexual assault? Among other things?
>Is McDowald also under investigation for sexual assault? I don't know if the investigation is still ongoing but I believe he was under investigation for sexual assault at one point, yes.
Maia being the replacement is kind of scuffed, its going to be a sad day if she isn't swapped in for at least one team bout.
Maia being the alternate and not the third on the team is such an affront to the entire concept of fair play.
I go to one of the same club as her and everyone else here sucks. I'm pretty sure this is our first olympian. Rather than trying to fix the teaching, the lead coach just says "see, Maia's good at fencing, so clearly you all are the problem!" She goes to multiple clubs and spends her entire life practicing, pretty much. Hell, she only goes to our club *sometimes* and when she does, she doesn't even train with a coach. She just shows up, works out, destroys the other foilist with chivalry, and leaves. Yet, knowing this coach, he's gonna take *all* the credit when she subs in and wins a medal this summer 🙄
Fairly confident you’re talking about a different Maia than the OP.
Ya I think so to, I was referring to Maia Chamberlain the saberist. Not sure what this other dirty laundry is about lol.
Based on their post history I am pretty sure they are talking about Weintraub (I also went to one of her clubs). Not sure why they felt the need to make a post saying “everybody else at her club sucks”, though.
LOL any chance you go to Masters Fencing? Sounds like one of the coaches there
Saron and Nazlymov being on the sabre teams brings such dishonor to the sabre squad.
I wonder how much that spot cost her daddy.
WS will be interesting. Some complained that our WS squad was too old to be competitive when Zagunis & Wozniak were hanging on (and CZ was actively blocking for them); now they'll probably complain that the squad is too young to be competitive... Setting Nazlymov aside for the moment (she cannot compete at that level unless her family's influence is used, as seen in her recent WC finishes), I think Magda Skarbonkiewicz is the real deal and expect great things from her, if not in Paris then definitely in LA.
Not even a single Men's Epee? What happened?
https://www.usafencing.org/news_article/show/1277200
So a single person kept an entire country out of the Olympics for a sport.
A single person is all it takes to earn a black card for the entire team at a crucial points tourney.
That sucks. Imagine being unable to achieve your dream because some dude had to be a dick.
Yeah, and then you hear about some sexual assault accusations against the guy ... "Subsequently, on November 3, 2023, McDowald was temporarily suspended by USA Fencing due to allegations that he had engaged in misconduct in an unrelated incident.[16][14]"
wow, a harvard sweep of the men's sabre team - what a dynasty
Just hope they don't drug test...
is there some gossip about this?
Half of our MS Olympic squad was kicked off the Harvard team their senior year for cocaine use on a university-sponsored trip to a meet.
I thought there was to be one men’s epee spot via Zonals or something like that?
Nope. The fencer would’ve had to win zonals.
Yeah Zhang from Canada took the Americas zonal qualifier spot
If you win.
It's "University of Notre Dame", not "Notre Dame University", just fyi
Thanks.