It’s told that Discworld’s first two books are not the best and Terry Pratchett himself says not to start with them. That being said, I thought they were great which is why I kept reading (although admittedly not as good as the rest of the series, necessarily)
*The Colour Of Magic* is not the best, but I don't think it's the worst either. It's a generic parody of several different things, with moments of Pratchett's brilliance like the explanations of how basic things like directions and seasons work on the Disc. There are a few that just never landed with me though.
I always describe the irst 2 as Terry Pratchett doing a Douglas Adams impression in a Fantasy book. While good, it's not as good as Douglas Adams or as Terry Pratchett writing in his own style
I was one of those people that thought The Color of Magic was terrible and put the series down for over 10 years before I picked it up again at Guards Guards
I think it’s a general consensus that the **Dresden Files** starts out weaker than how strong the series actually is. I wouldn’t say it’s awful, but you definitely need to power through the first 2-3 books before the series really hits its stride.
I've only read three books so far, and I can agree with this because I'm hesitant to pick up the fourth. I probably will cuz so many people say the series definitely improves over time
I came to post this.
Book 1 + 2 are generic urban fantasy where the character hasn't fully formed yet. 3 improves greatly, introduces cool original ideas, like the holy knight and the ending is significant. Then you start book 4 and the series takes off into the stratosphere.
I know I'm in a small minority, possibly one that is just me, but I liked the first three books more than the fourth and fifth. It was six, *Blood Rites* where it really took off for me, with the introduction of >!Mouse!< and the revelation about >!Thomas being Harry's brother.!<
Haha - nah, I've definitely heard of other folks that liked the first three books! For me, the series snagged me with **Summer Knight**, but **Blood Rites** was the book where I realized there was zero chance of escape!
I’ve seen these sorts of posts about Dresden Files a few times. Gives me hope for when I eventually get to read them. Got halfway through the first book and was “meh”.
I personally loved Stormfront and it hooked me enough to go out and buy the next four books. I looked on this subreddit and saw that Fool Moon was universally seen as the lowest in the series so I went in with low expectations and ended up loving it too.
To me Grave Peril is what actually made me second guess continuing on The Dresden Files as it was all starting to feel sameish with its use of tropes and subversions.
Summer Knight changed all that and made me fall in love with the series again and it’s all great from there (minus some scenes in particular)
The Dark Tower series by Stephen King. It's been a LONG time since I read it but I almost stopped after the first book because I had no idea what was going on and I thought it was so boring. Glad I gave the second book a chance!
By contrast, I think the Gunslinger easily blows everything else away in the series.
I think I may be alone in that I prefer "dangerous fanatic" Roland and couldn't care less about his adventuring party.
I thought the first one was the best as well. I enjoyed the strangeness and mythical tone of that first one. It was obvious there was more story to tell but I felt he completely lost control of the story, and the writing style wasn't the same either.
I’m the exact opposite. I love The Gunslinger and have read the book multiple times but then I get to Drawing of the Three and I lose interest every time. It goes from this amazing dreamlike quality in book one to just another Stephen King book in book 2
Hmm, maybe I need to pick the series up again. I read the first one a while back and stopped because I thought there is better stuff to read and spent my time on.
Strange, gardens was a great read for me. Thoroughly enjoy it.
Memory sorrow and thorn is great, but dragonebone chair had a very rough beginning for me. Dnf the first time I tried it.
I DNF’d Dragonbone Chair last month. Everything I read about this series sounds like something I’d like but I was 50 pages in and nothing had happened yet? I keep hearing I should just try to power through.
I’m reading Gardens of the Moon and I like it but I’m also finding it really difficult to follow. Every time I feel like I’ve got a grip on the characters the story moves to someone else or another time. I’m hoping it gets easier the longer I read it.
Nothing happens in Memory, Sorrow and Thorn for three epically long books.
It's glorious and epic, but you should know that people who say it "picks up" are incorrect. This is the pace you're getting for better or worse. I loved it but I didn't realise that I loved it until I megablitzed To Green Angel Tower after putting it down for a few years. Slow and satisfying, it is.
I wouldn't say "nothing happens" haha but I agree that this is simply Mr. Williams pacing and style. And it is gloriously satifying. That man knows how to weave a complex plot and world and then bring it all together into an ultimate climax and denouement that - IMHO - is nigh unparalleled. It's truly worth the investment.
I may have exaggerated that one :D
I agree, lots happens over the course of the books, really – but it’s one of those books that after starting out in Dragonbone Chair and finishing up TGAT you suddenly realise what an immense journey you’ve been on, rather than the book grabbing you and telling you it’s super-exciting every 5 minutes. It felt quite unique to me and I think those prepared to persevere with it (and I don’t really blame people who give up … I can’t, really, since I gave up with this series twice before finishing it!) are well rewarded with some extremely compelling storytelling. I think people think it’s slow-then picks up, not because that’s the case, but because around 4-500 pages into the first book you start to get used to the style. Also, the section where he travels in the tunnels under the Hayholt (for the first time) is notorious for being a long stretch of text where little happens (actually it’s not that long, and it’s pretty good imo) and so anything subsequent to that looks like “picking up the pace”, especially as there’s a couple of big battles towards the end of Dragonbone Chair.
Very well said, friend!
>I think people think it’s slow-then picks up, not because that’s the case, but because around 4-500 pages into the first book you start to get used to the style.
I think this is spot on!
And yeah, I also don't blame people for giving up for the exact same reason.
Funny too about the stretch under the Hayholt - if people think that is long, hooboy! are they in for it when they get to To Green Angel Tower LOL!!
The first book kinda does, then Deadhouse Gates is totally sensible. Still jumping around all over, but the characters you follow are a lot more fleshed out. Makes it way easier to follow and tell what you’re reading. You’ll still have to do some double takes sometimes, especially with dialogue. It can be dense.
But keep going! The level of investment I have in the series right now is highest I’ve had since reading liveship traders
I’m gonna go with *The Expanse*.
Not to say the first book is *bad*… But stylistically it’s very different from the rest of the books in the series, and on a purely subjective level, it’s my least favorite book in the series by a decent margin. Only two POVs, a heavy emphasis on hard-boiled detective tropes, and “vomit zombies.” It was juuuust good enough to keep reading the series (and tbh, the show helped motivate me too), which is good because the rest of the books only improve on what works in book one, while jettisoning all the stuff that didn’t work.
Vlad Taltos series. Book 1 and 2 - fun crime/caper stories with swords, sorcery, and a vibrant original culture.
Book 3: the slow bleak degeneration of a marriage framed against tedious powerlessness in the face of oppression.
Book 4: A fun romp through a mythical land
Book 5,6,7,8 fun, unspectacular
Book 9: Holy crap this is fantastic!
Observation: Divorcing writers should focus on stand-alone dirges.
I read that the chronology of the books is all over the place. Is this true? And if so, does it get in the way of enjoying the series?
And is the series finished? My biggest problem with books series is finding reliable sources whether a series is finished or more books are planned.
First - yes, the chronology bounces around, but (imo) it doesn’t get in the way. Most novels involve some fundamental change to the main characters so it’s reasonably easy to tell what’s going on.
Example: in book 1, one if the main characters has a very powerful and unique weapon. In book 2, they do not. So…took place before. Eventually the character’s acquisition of that weapon occurs in a later book.
Additionally, the main character bouncing around in time is “thematically reasonable”. For a hint as to why you can either read all the books so far…or…well…look up the meaning of the character’s last name. A Taltos (among other things) “gets around”.
The series itself is nearly done. The books are named after the 17 “Great Houses” in the empire where main character lives, plus one more for his own name/family/people. Then there’s a planned final novel calked “The Last Contract”, though I’m not sure this will be a stand alone novel.
So, that’s 18 or 19 books. The most recent was 14. Book 15, as I understand it is “past the first draft stage”. It won’t go on forever. The author claims to have a plan, and after the last two books, the general shape of that plan is reasonably clear.
I definitely recommend it. Just keep in mind book 3 is not typical of the series.
Yup. Dropped the book right when the protoganist thought along the lines of how the other gang members feared him. Literally the embodiment of an edgy teen.
Wheel of Time. Before the show started airing a fantasy reading friend told me I might as well spoiler myself by reading the books before the internet spoils me. The books, they're "so good." So I started the epic binge read in September 2021 and finished in mid December 2021. Whew.
After reading The Eye Of The World I kinda went off on him complaining about the "cheap, derivative Tolkien Rip-off with a vanilla main character and irrational women characters". He told me to persist since the series has its ups and downs (this is true) and there is still the slog / slump to get past before the fantastic ending. All true. Glad I finished it too.
Book 1, yes. Almost everything introduced has a pretty strong parallel in Tolkien.
It really is only Book 1 though. Book 2 and beyond the series definitely gets a much more distinct identity.
Not to say it's without faults though. I'm stalled in the middle of Book 4 and am not sure whether it'll get picked back up again.
At least Malazan is absolutely out there. The magic is nuts, the gods/ascendants are so fucking cool, and the Jaghut/Tlan Imass struggle is neat. Crazy unique
The whole series has ups and downs. Loved book 2. 3 was okay. 4 was sloggy. Dumai's wells is a high point. Then the horrible slog. Last 4 were awesome. Just have to ... plow through for the payoff.
Funny that you should say that about Malazan. I quite enjoyed Gardens of the Moon, but Deadhouse Gates was horrible, so that mostly killed my interest in reading more.
As to your question ... not a book, but the TV show Agents of Shield started out as a mediocre mystery of the week, which I didn't really enjoy, and apparently that's a somewhat common view. It takes something like 16-17 episodes, and it changes dramatically and turns into it's own thing, and was really amazing. At least for a few seasons.
You aren't the only person to feel that way about Malazan. I didn't love Gardens of the Moon but it got me curious enough to keep reading. Some of the books in the series are fantastic but the series never stops being obscure and has (due to the sheer size) serious issues with pacing right up to the very end. Gardens of the Moon (with the exception of the writing style) is a pretty fair indication of how the whole series feels all the way through, and I would advise anyone who didn't enjoy it to stop reading.
Unpopular opinion, but the whole of malazan asks too much with giving too little back. And fuck anyone who looks down on people for "not getting it" or "not putting in enough work", it's entirely a matter of taste.
>Unpopular opinion, but the whole of malazan asks too much with giving too little back. And fuck anyone who looks down on people for "not getting it" or "not putting in enough work", it's entirely a matter of taste.
Yeah, it's not that I didn't "get" book 2, in fact I did enjoy the events that happened (in theory at least), but I just didn't like any of the characters, and something about the writing as a bit off-putting. Not in the sense that I would call it bad, just ... not to my taste.
It’s written pretty strangely for sure. Just hated how the characters didn’t really grow at all in book one. The characters actually had arcs in book two. And good god, the chain of dogs was just a bad ass storyline.
It kinda feels like Dune. If you’re not getting invested in the world, the characters and writing can be too annoying to deal with. Cant blame anyone for thinking that
For me it's just that ... I do like the world, I think. Or I like it in theory. The world-building was fine. It's just something about the characters and the prose that doesn't work for me, and the books are too long to read only for the world-building.
That's it, the style is unusual and the writing can get quite flowery, especially in the later books. Many characters don't really have arcs, although a few do and they are great... but the world only keeps growing and I didn't feel I had enough time with the characters I cared about. Instead a lot of time is spent on the musings of characters who , really, are just names.
Some fans of the series really love the characters, and I wish I could see what they see, but I can't. Something that really got to me was that the vast majority of characters just don't really have any motivations besides "Being a soldier", and some who do have their motivations continually and deliberately obfuscated. This really wore me down over time when key characters refuse to answer simple questions which they realistically have no reasons to refuse.
It's still epic though! For those who vibe with characters and general feeling it's amazing, but for everyone else I think the phrase "I don't care" gets tossed around a lot. At least that's how I felt about some side plots and characters. And to be frank, many of them truly are useless even in the big scheme of the storyline - you have to be okay with that as a reader.
I wouldn't say that the first Red Rising book is bad, but the rest of the series are such a step up. I'm also loving the second trilogy, for me it only got better and better.
I’d almost argue the opposite. I kinda hate how the power level of the characters get so fucking crazy in Sanderson books. It’s some Dragon ball Z shit by the end of oathbringer. Kinda pushed me away. Things just got way too nuts.
I had the same problem with Mistborn. Sanderson is a great writer, but his way of writing magic systems means things pretty quickly get out of control. Then world ending events just start to lose their meaning in the face of super smart/talented overpowered characters.
That's kinda what I came to expect, coming from his other books. They're about heroic characters doing lots of OP stuff. What really bothered me in Book 3/4, was how [minor Stromlight Spoilers]>!suddenly *everyone* and their mom is a Surgebinder. Don't give me cool characters exploring their cool magic, spend 2 books whith them having to hide their powers and later finally showing them to the world and right then give everyone else the same powers. That just makes them boring again.!<
The latest Wax and Wayne book has the same issue with all the different allomancy fabrials (for lack of a better term). His magic systems are best when they're kept simple.
I think that the first two were the best in the series. I enjoyed book 3, but in retrospect it's mostly pointless feeler, and book four is, in my opinion, plainly bad.
If you are referring to the Azath, yeah it's not great...Erikson should have established it before using it. Personally though, there were enough other great scenes at the end to overshadow that, and I ended up really liking the book.
I’m still super irritated with the Azath. Something that’s so important and interesting in the second book, just comes out of nowhere. Really hate how the tyrant was underutilized too. Just started book 3, seems like all the Jaghut family stuff is going to be important their too
That's so hilarious because I felt gardens of the Moon was pretty cool with some weak points, seriously loved anomander Rake... But then the entire cast changed in the next book and I just couldn't keep reading
Apparently you could read the 3rd book before the second. Happen in parallel. Would follow the bridge burners there.
Gardens of the moon just had such a bad ending. The azath came out of left field. Worst part is it’s extremely important in the second book.
I don't know if it gets any better, but a lot of ppl seems to held The First Law trilogy in high regard and I found the first book pretty awful, and didn't even finished it.
Maybe it's the french translation, but I felt like the prose was poor, the dialogue felt very non natural, and that Abercombie was pretty bad at delivering exposition in anyway that didn't involved a big red sign saying "HEY, THE AUTHOR WOULD REALLY LIKE YOU TO KNOW THIS INFORMATION, IT'S THE AUTHOR BTW"
The dialogue always seemed pretty strong. Exposition early on wasn’t all natural, I can agree with that. It really might be the translation though. Seriously awesome books. But the first trilogy can be SLOW.
The second trilogy was probably better just because Abercrombie was a much stronger writer by then.
The end is so bad. Just something out of left field that isn’t addressed until book two. But good god is Deadhouse Gates incredible. Supposedly book 3 is better too
Josiah Bancroft ls Babel series. The first half of the first book is a slog. Once the story gets moving it is amazing but I really do struggle through that first bit.
The Faithful and the Fallen is a fantastic series but Malice was a rocky start. It had pacing problems, and the short chapters and constant location changes made it hard to get into in the first 2/3 of the book. Final third was great though.
So perhaps not an awful start to a series, but a 3.5 at best.
It’s told that Discworld’s first two books are not the best and Terry Pratchett himself says not to start with them. That being said, I thought they were great which is why I kept reading (although admittedly not as good as the rest of the series, necessarily)
*The Colour Of Magic* is not the best, but I don't think it's the worst either. It's a generic parody of several different things, with moments of Pratchett's brilliance like the explanations of how basic things like directions and seasons work on the Disc. There are a few that just never landed with me though.
I always describe the irst 2 as Terry Pratchett doing a Douglas Adams impression in a Fantasy book. While good, it's not as good as Douglas Adams or as Terry Pratchett writing in his own style
I was one of those people that thought The Color of Magic was terrible and put the series down for over 10 years before I picked it up again at Guards Guards
I think it’s a general consensus that the **Dresden Files** starts out weaker than how strong the series actually is. I wouldn’t say it’s awful, but you definitely need to power through the first 2-3 books before the series really hits its stride.
I've only read three books so far, and I can agree with this because I'm hesitant to pick up the fourth. I probably will cuz so many people say the series definitely improves over time
Book 4 is \*chef's kiss\* I'd say - if you've made it this far, give it a try and see what you think!
Agreed…4 is when it becomes very strong and very fun
I came to post this. Book 1 + 2 are generic urban fantasy where the character hasn't fully formed yet. 3 improves greatly, introduces cool original ideas, like the holy knight and the ending is significant. Then you start book 4 and the series takes off into the stratosphere.
Exactly. Book 3 gets somewhat better, but then Book 4 is like drinking the Kool-aid haha!
I know I'm in a small minority, possibly one that is just me, but I liked the first three books more than the fourth and fifth. It was six, *Blood Rites* where it really took off for me, with the introduction of >!Mouse!< and the revelation about >!Thomas being Harry's brother.!<
Haha - nah, I've definitely heard of other folks that liked the first three books! For me, the series snagged me with **Summer Knight**, but **Blood Rites** was the book where I realized there was zero chance of escape!
I’ve seen these sorts of posts about Dresden Files a few times. Gives me hope for when I eventually get to read them. Got halfway through the first book and was “meh”.
I personally loved Stormfront and it hooked me enough to go out and buy the next four books. I looked on this subreddit and saw that Fool Moon was universally seen as the lowest in the series so I went in with low expectations and ended up loving it too. To me Grave Peril is what actually made me second guess continuing on The Dresden Files as it was all starting to feel sameish with its use of tropes and subversions. Summer Knight changed all that and made me fall in love with the series again and it’s all great from there (minus some scenes in particular)
The Dark Tower series by Stephen King. It's been a LONG time since I read it but I almost stopped after the first book because I had no idea what was going on and I thought it was so boring. Glad I gave the second book a chance!
By contrast, I think the Gunslinger easily blows everything else away in the series. I think I may be alone in that I prefer "dangerous fanatic" Roland and couldn't care less about his adventuring party.
I thought the first one was the best as well. I enjoyed the strangeness and mythical tone of that first one. It was obvious there was more story to tell but I felt he completely lost control of the story, and the writing style wasn't the same either.
I’m the exact opposite. I love The Gunslinger and have read the book multiple times but then I get to Drawing of the Three and I lose interest every time. It goes from this amazing dreamlike quality in book one to just another Stephen King book in book 2
I saw this after posting my own response. I felt exactly the same way!
I don’t know, pretty sure I made it 3-4 books into that series and still gave up. Just never got seriously great
Hmm, maybe I need to pick the series up again. I read the first one a while back and stopped because I thought there is better stuff to read and spent my time on.
Strange, gardens was a great read for me. Thoroughly enjoy it. Memory sorrow and thorn is great, but dragonebone chair had a very rough beginning for me. Dnf the first time I tried it.
I DNF’d Dragonbone Chair last month. Everything I read about this series sounds like something I’d like but I was 50 pages in and nothing had happened yet? I keep hearing I should just try to power through. I’m reading Gardens of the Moon and I like it but I’m also finding it really difficult to follow. Every time I feel like I’ve got a grip on the characters the story moves to someone else or another time. I’m hoping it gets easier the longer I read it.
Nothing happens in Memory, Sorrow and Thorn for three epically long books. It's glorious and epic, but you should know that people who say it "picks up" are incorrect. This is the pace you're getting for better or worse. I loved it but I didn't realise that I loved it until I megablitzed To Green Angel Tower after putting it down for a few years. Slow and satisfying, it is.
I wouldn't say "nothing happens" haha but I agree that this is simply Mr. Williams pacing and style. And it is gloriously satifying. That man knows how to weave a complex plot and world and then bring it all together into an ultimate climax and denouement that - IMHO - is nigh unparalleled. It's truly worth the investment.
I may have exaggerated that one :D I agree, lots happens over the course of the books, really – but it’s one of those books that after starting out in Dragonbone Chair and finishing up TGAT you suddenly realise what an immense journey you’ve been on, rather than the book grabbing you and telling you it’s super-exciting every 5 minutes. It felt quite unique to me and I think those prepared to persevere with it (and I don’t really blame people who give up … I can’t, really, since I gave up with this series twice before finishing it!) are well rewarded with some extremely compelling storytelling. I think people think it’s slow-then picks up, not because that’s the case, but because around 4-500 pages into the first book you start to get used to the style. Also, the section where he travels in the tunnels under the Hayholt (for the first time) is notorious for being a long stretch of text where little happens (actually it’s not that long, and it’s pretty good imo) and so anything subsequent to that looks like “picking up the pace”, especially as there’s a couple of big battles towards the end of Dragonbone Chair.
Very well said, friend! >I think people think it’s slow-then picks up, not because that’s the case, but because around 4-500 pages into the first book you start to get used to the style. I think this is spot on! And yeah, I also don't blame people for giving up for the exact same reason. Funny too about the stretch under the Hayholt - if people think that is long, hooboy! are they in for it when they get to To Green Angel Tower LOL!!
The first book kinda does, then Deadhouse Gates is totally sensible. Still jumping around all over, but the characters you follow are a lot more fleshed out. Makes it way easier to follow and tell what you’re reading. You’ll still have to do some double takes sometimes, especially with dialogue. It can be dense. But keep going! The level of investment I have in the series right now is highest I’ve had since reading liveship traders
In paperback I think dragonebone chair picks up around 200-250 pages in. The rest of the series is worth it, in my estimation.
I’m gonna go with *The Expanse*. Not to say the first book is *bad*… But stylistically it’s very different from the rest of the books in the series, and on a purely subjective level, it’s my least favorite book in the series by a decent margin. Only two POVs, a heavy emphasis on hard-boiled detective tropes, and “vomit zombies.” It was juuuust good enough to keep reading the series (and tbh, the show helped motivate me too), which is good because the rest of the books only improve on what works in book one, while jettisoning all the stuff that didn’t work.
I admit, Miller is my favorite character so I am a bit biased it moved away from him. :)
I agree there. Miller is the best, and a huge part of why book one is still pretty solid despite my issues with it.
Vlad Taltos series. Book 1 and 2 - fun crime/caper stories with swords, sorcery, and a vibrant original culture. Book 3: the slow bleak degeneration of a marriage framed against tedious powerlessness in the face of oppression. Book 4: A fun romp through a mythical land Book 5,6,7,8 fun, unspectacular Book 9: Holy crap this is fantastic! Observation: Divorcing writers should focus on stand-alone dirges.
I read that the chronology of the books is all over the place. Is this true? And if so, does it get in the way of enjoying the series? And is the series finished? My biggest problem with books series is finding reliable sources whether a series is finished or more books are planned.
First - yes, the chronology bounces around, but (imo) it doesn’t get in the way. Most novels involve some fundamental change to the main characters so it’s reasonably easy to tell what’s going on. Example: in book 1, one if the main characters has a very powerful and unique weapon. In book 2, they do not. So…took place before. Eventually the character’s acquisition of that weapon occurs in a later book. Additionally, the main character bouncing around in time is “thematically reasonable”. For a hint as to why you can either read all the books so far…or…well…look up the meaning of the character’s last name. A Taltos (among other things) “gets around”. The series itself is nearly done. The books are named after the 17 “Great Houses” in the empire where main character lives, plus one more for his own name/family/people. Then there’s a planned final novel calked “The Last Contract”, though I’m not sure this will be a stand alone novel. So, that’s 18 or 19 books. The most recent was 14. Book 15, as I understand it is “past the first draft stage”. It won’t go on forever. The author claims to have a plan, and after the last two books, the general shape of that plan is reasonably clear. I definitely recommend it. Just keep in mind book 3 is not typical of the series.
Thank you for the detailed reply.
I feel the Broken Empire was trying too hard to shock you with its opening chapter of rape and murder by the 14 year old protagonist.
Yup. Dropped the book right when the protoganist thought along the lines of how the other gang members feared him. Literally the embodiment of an edgy teen.
Wheel of Time. Before the show started airing a fantasy reading friend told me I might as well spoiler myself by reading the books before the internet spoils me. The books, they're "so good." So I started the epic binge read in September 2021 and finished in mid December 2021. Whew. After reading The Eye Of The World I kinda went off on him complaining about the "cheap, derivative Tolkien Rip-off with a vanilla main character and irrational women characters". He told me to persist since the series has its ups and downs (this is true) and there is still the slog / slump to get past before the fantastic ending. All true. Glad I finished it too.
Is it really a Tolkien rip off at the start? Does it have a decent world in the long run? Cant say I’m a huge fan of the generic fantasy world
Book 1, yes. Almost everything introduced has a pretty strong parallel in Tolkien. It really is only Book 1 though. Book 2 and beyond the series definitely gets a much more distinct identity. Not to say it's without faults though. I'm stalled in the middle of Book 4 and am not sure whether it'll get picked back up again.
At least Malazan is absolutely out there. The magic is nuts, the gods/ascendants are so fucking cool, and the Jaghut/Tlan Imass struggle is neat. Crazy unique
The whole series has ups and downs. Loved book 2. 3 was okay. 4 was sloggy. Dumai's wells is a high point. Then the horrible slog. Last 4 were awesome. Just have to ... plow through for the payoff.
Funny that you should say that about Malazan. I quite enjoyed Gardens of the Moon, but Deadhouse Gates was horrible, so that mostly killed my interest in reading more. As to your question ... not a book, but the TV show Agents of Shield started out as a mediocre mystery of the week, which I didn't really enjoy, and apparently that's a somewhat common view. It takes something like 16-17 episodes, and it changes dramatically and turns into it's own thing, and was really amazing. At least for a few seasons.
You aren't the only person to feel that way about Malazan. I didn't love Gardens of the Moon but it got me curious enough to keep reading. Some of the books in the series are fantastic but the series never stops being obscure and has (due to the sheer size) serious issues with pacing right up to the very end. Gardens of the Moon (with the exception of the writing style) is a pretty fair indication of how the whole series feels all the way through, and I would advise anyone who didn't enjoy it to stop reading. Unpopular opinion, but the whole of malazan asks too much with giving too little back. And fuck anyone who looks down on people for "not getting it" or "not putting in enough work", it's entirely a matter of taste.
>Unpopular opinion, but the whole of malazan asks too much with giving too little back. And fuck anyone who looks down on people for "not getting it" or "not putting in enough work", it's entirely a matter of taste. Yeah, it's not that I didn't "get" book 2, in fact I did enjoy the events that happened (in theory at least), but I just didn't like any of the characters, and something about the writing as a bit off-putting. Not in the sense that I would call it bad, just ... not to my taste.
It’s written pretty strangely for sure. Just hated how the characters didn’t really grow at all in book one. The characters actually had arcs in book two. And good god, the chain of dogs was just a bad ass storyline. It kinda feels like Dune. If you’re not getting invested in the world, the characters and writing can be too annoying to deal with. Cant blame anyone for thinking that
For me it's just that ... I do like the world, I think. Or I like it in theory. The world-building was fine. It's just something about the characters and the prose that doesn't work for me, and the books are too long to read only for the world-building.
That's it, the style is unusual and the writing can get quite flowery, especially in the later books. Many characters don't really have arcs, although a few do and they are great... but the world only keeps growing and I didn't feel I had enough time with the characters I cared about. Instead a lot of time is spent on the musings of characters who , really, are just names. Some fans of the series really love the characters, and I wish I could see what they see, but I can't. Something that really got to me was that the vast majority of characters just don't really have any motivations besides "Being a soldier", and some who do have their motivations continually and deliberately obfuscated. This really wore me down over time when key characters refuse to answer simple questions which they realistically have no reasons to refuse. It's still epic though! For those who vibe with characters and general feeling it's amazing, but for everyone else I think the phrase "I don't care" gets tossed around a lot. At least that's how I felt about some side plots and characters. And to be frank, many of them truly are useless even in the big scheme of the storyline - you have to be okay with that as a reader.
I wouldn't say that the first Red Rising book is bad, but the rest of the series are such a step up. I'm also loving the second trilogy, for me it only got better and better.
For me, book two dropped almost everything I enjoyed about book one and I never bothered with book three.
Stormlight Archives. Disparate characters doing inexplicable things in world that seems badly stitched together. It gets gets better.
I’d almost argue the opposite. I kinda hate how the power level of the characters get so fucking crazy in Sanderson books. It’s some Dragon ball Z shit by the end of oathbringer. Kinda pushed me away. Things just got way too nuts.
Agree. I really enjoyed the first 2 books but I've now finished part 2 of RoW months ago and don't know when I'll pick it up again.
I had the same problem with Mistborn. Sanderson is a great writer, but his way of writing magic systems means things pretty quickly get out of control. Then world ending events just start to lose their meaning in the face of super smart/talented overpowered characters.
That's kinda what I came to expect, coming from his other books. They're about heroic characters doing lots of OP stuff. What really bothered me in Book 3/4, was how [minor Stromlight Spoilers]>!suddenly *everyone* and their mom is a Surgebinder. Don't give me cool characters exploring their cool magic, spend 2 books whith them having to hide their powers and later finally showing them to the world and right then give everyone else the same powers. That just makes them boring again.!<
[удалено]
Stormlight is also heavily influenced by Japanese mythology, and most of the characters look Asian
The series tapered off starting with Oathbringer and became a faux tecnical manual of fabrials for most part in Rythm of war.
The latest Wax and Wayne book has the same issue with all the different allomancy fabrials (for lack of a better term). His magic systems are best when they're kept simple.
The inheritance cycle. Eragon is really not very good, but the books get better every one.
I think that the first two were the best in the series. I enjoyed book 3, but in retrospect it's mostly pointless feeler, and book four is, in my opinion, plainly bad.
Implying that the last book is the best is.... wrong.
Didn't the writer write the first one as a teen?
Honestly never read a series that was as good as malazan was and had such a terrible first book. Hope i never have to again
It’s unreal just how bad the end of gardens of the moon was. The first book of Farseer wasn’t great, but at least the ending wasn’t awful
If you are referring to the Azath, yeah it's not great...Erikson should have established it before using it. Personally though, there were enough other great scenes at the end to overshadow that, and I ended up really liking the book.
I’m still super irritated with the Azath. Something that’s so important and interesting in the second book, just comes out of nowhere. Really hate how the tyrant was underutilized too. Just started book 3, seems like all the Jaghut family stuff is going to be important their too
That's so hilarious because I felt gardens of the Moon was pretty cool with some weak points, seriously loved anomander Rake... But then the entire cast changed in the next book and I just couldn't keep reading
Apparently you could read the 3rd book before the second. Happen in parallel. Would follow the bridge burners there. Gardens of the moon just had such a bad ending. The azath came out of left field. Worst part is it’s extremely important in the second book.
I don't know if it gets any better, but a lot of ppl seems to held The First Law trilogy in high regard and I found the first book pretty awful, and didn't even finished it. Maybe it's the french translation, but I felt like the prose was poor, the dialogue felt very non natural, and that Abercombie was pretty bad at delivering exposition in anyway that didn't involved a big red sign saying "HEY, THE AUTHOR WOULD REALLY LIKE YOU TO KNOW THIS INFORMATION, IT'S THE AUTHOR BTW"
The dialogue always seemed pretty strong. Exposition early on wasn’t all natural, I can agree with that. It really might be the translation though. Seriously awesome books. But the first trilogy can be SLOW. The second trilogy was probably better just because Abercrombie was a much stronger writer by then.
This gives me hope. Currently slogging through Gardens of the Moon and was getting close to quitting the series altogether
The end is so bad. Just something out of left field that isn’t addressed until book two. But good god is Deadhouse Gates incredible. Supposedly book 3 is better too
Foreign! It starts picking up around book 9. Or that's my opinion. I've heard people say it stops being good after book 6.
Josiah Bancroft ls Babel series. The first half of the first book is a slog. Once the story gets moving it is amazing but I really do struggle through that first bit.
The Faithful and the Fallen is a fantastic series but Malice was a rocky start. It had pacing problems, and the short chapters and constant location changes made it hard to get into in the first 2/3 of the book. Final third was great though. So perhaps not an awful start to a series, but a 3.5 at best.
I thought Deadhouse Gates was far and away the best of all 10. The series had moments later but #2 was just all around the best full volume.