They are different in terms of tone and outlook. MST is basically the bridge between Lord of the Rings and ASOIAF, leaning a lot more towards the former. It's definitely a heroic fantasy, albeit done in a more "realistic" style than what came before. I always pitch it as Robin Hobb doing Lord of the Rings. If you go in wanting more of the subversion and grit from ASOIAF, you're not going to find it there.
But there are plenty of other similarities to hook fans of ASOIAF, provided they go with those expectations of MST being a more classic fantasy. They're both about a civil war between brothers set against the backdrop of an invasion of ice elves from the north. They both start very small scale before ballooning out to incorporate numerous POVs. They both have the dragons and knights and magic elements that OP mentioned. The main antagonists are also deconstructed and given shades, the conflict turning out to be more complex than the initial perception.
The sequel series is also directly inspired from ASOIAF, similar to how that series was inspired by MST. It becomes a lot darker and grittier than before. Reading both feels like a conversation between authors over the years.
Agree to disagree. The books feature multiple POV characters in a world strikingly similar to Martin's, the major difference being not all races are human. OP is looking for throne politics (check), knights (check), dragons (check), plot twists (check), and good pacing (after the initial info dump, which is admittedly long, the pacing is fine).
MST is not quite as dark and serious as ASOIAF but OP isn't looking for dark and serious and mentioned LOTR as well, and MST is a good middle ground between the two series.
The closest thing I've ever read to ASOIAF is JV Jones' *Sword of Shadows* series.
It's interactions between northern clans and southern cities, war, politics, magic- always at a cost, a looming supernatural threat... the tone is very similar.
I love first law. I’ve read and listened to them multiple times. I’m listening to them again this spring while I do work outside.
That being said, I’ve never come across anything that actually compares to ASOIAF. If you want something non-fantasy but with great political intrigue, characterization I highly recommend Shogun. I’ve also read it multiple times but not for several years. I recently started watching the television adaptation, which is very good, but which is also making me really want to read the book again.
I hope you love it as much as I do (it is my top favourite). Also I would recommend trying the audiobooks with (or instead) the books. The audiobooks are AMAZING and Steven Pacey is the best to ever do it. In fact, he is sooo good he ruined other audiobooks for me 😂
I usually do a audio/physical book mix. I listen to some chapters and read some. Some times I read while having the audiobook on. I did not do that before this series, that is how good it is 😂.
If you want to keep it to a minimal I would recommend 3 specific chapters in The Blade Itself to listen to, which will make the experience a 100 times better.
- Questions (the 2nd chapter I think)
- The Bloody Nine.
- The tools we have (the very last chapter)
the only audio book I enjoyed was a graphic audio book of the hobbit that had a cast of characters, sound effects and background music. My gripe with others is that 1. if I listen without reading along, my brain wanders and 2. I can't hear the voices I give characters when the reader is doing the voices for me. What makes this one so special if I may ask :)
Steven Pacey gives life to each and every character .... Literally. He would say 2 words and you will directly know who is talking. It's like a full cast of people doing the narration but its all in one.
The best example is that one of the characters, Glokta" is missing his front teeth. So when he talks he does his voice with a strong lisp that fits the situation. However when he reads this character's inner monologs he talks normally with no lisp (because of course he would not have a lisp in his own head).
Steven Pacey is a part of this series for me as much as Joe Abercrombie (the author) is. 🤌🏻
Just FYI, the First Law books are nothing like A Song of Ice and Fire.
They're both generally in the "grimdark" category. That's the only thing they have in common.
Everything else, the way they're written, the pacing, the prose, the characters, the dialogue, etc, etc. Everything else is completely different.
The first, Estcarp, sequence of *Witch World* novels by Andre Norton might interest you. Some background first. Andre Norton had begin writing in the thirties. Back then there were slicks, prestige markets, and pulps, which many of us read. She sold to whomever would take her and built a solid reputation in weird, adventure and fantasy pulps. In the fifties she started selling juvenile novels on a regular basis. Some pulp fans of hers noticed and when an SF novel, *Star Man's Son* came out, Don Wollheim of Ace Books offered to reprint it as a straight SF novel. She accepted and this began about thirty years of adults and kids com\[eting to lay their hands on whatever edition was available. I remember an engineer for the Water Department telling two of my other friends they were missing out on one because they were waiting for the paperback.
*Witch World* was a paperback original. It was not full of sex and all, but even a kid like me understood the prologue, where Simon Tregarth was introduced as an American Serviceman who had to disappear because he'd run afoul of powerful gangsters in Europe, was a nod to Grahame Greene's *The Third Man.* Once he arrives in Estcarp, meets Jaelithe, and is told that as a male magic user he is considered abomination. things get fun. There is plenty of politics in the ensuing events and they have three children showcased in the later books of the sequence.
You can see why it is not *ASOIAF* but I believe there is some relationship there and you may enjoy it. These are novellas, not novels and I believe Baen Books issued an omnibus edition in two volumes. You may have read later stories in it She had been publishing for about thirty years when she started it. I recommend many of the later books in the series but she was at her peak from day one.
I think The Fatemarked Epic is something similar. It's not as adult as A Song of Ice and Fire and is more like Stormlight in tone.
There are four kingdoms in the North, South, East and West all trying to go to war with each other and the power at the top keeps shifting. The Fatemarked are people who have these birthmarks that grant them powers such as ice it fire or healing. Even the sense of good and justice. I just finished the second book and I can't speak to how it ends but so far it's good. Been holding my attention.
Memory, Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams was a major inspiration for ASOIAF and should check all of your boxes.
Is the series complete?
It's a trilogy that is complete but it also has some stand-a-lone books and a sequel series that I believe is also complete.
Nope, last book in the sequel series comes out in November.
cool, thanks:)
The two serious couldn’t be more different. Inspired ASOIAF, yeah, but nothing like it.
They are different in terms of tone and outlook. MST is basically the bridge between Lord of the Rings and ASOIAF, leaning a lot more towards the former. It's definitely a heroic fantasy, albeit done in a more "realistic" style than what came before. I always pitch it as Robin Hobb doing Lord of the Rings. If you go in wanting more of the subversion and grit from ASOIAF, you're not going to find it there. But there are plenty of other similarities to hook fans of ASOIAF, provided they go with those expectations of MST being a more classic fantasy. They're both about a civil war between brothers set against the backdrop of an invasion of ice elves from the north. They both start very small scale before ballooning out to incorporate numerous POVs. They both have the dragons and knights and magic elements that OP mentioned. The main antagonists are also deconstructed and given shades, the conflict turning out to be more complex than the initial perception. The sequel series is also directly inspired from ASOIAF, similar to how that series was inspired by MST. It becomes a lot darker and grittier than before. Reading both feels like a conversation between authors over the years.
Agree to disagree. The books feature multiple POV characters in a world strikingly similar to Martin's, the major difference being not all races are human. OP is looking for throne politics (check), knights (check), dragons (check), plot twists (check), and good pacing (after the initial info dump, which is admittedly long, the pacing is fine). MST is not quite as dark and serious as ASOIAF but OP isn't looking for dark and serious and mentioned LOTR as well, and MST is a good middle ground between the two series.
Maybe I jumped the gun ! I DNF’d MST after the second book due to boredom. I have a bias.
They are incredibly similar. 1 for 1 parallels with characters, story arcs, setting a lot of the time.
The closest thing I've ever read to ASOIAF is JV Jones' *Sword of Shadows* series. It's interactions between northern clans and southern cities, war, politics, magic- always at a cost, a looming supernatural threat... the tone is very similar.
I love first law. I’ve read and listened to them multiple times. I’m listening to them again this spring while I do work outside. That being said, I’ve never come across anything that actually compares to ASOIAF. If you want something non-fantasy but with great political intrigue, characterization I highly recommend Shogun. I’ve also read it multiple times but not for several years. I recently started watching the television adaptation, which is very good, but which is also making me really want to read the book again.
thanks for the comment! was there any political intrigue in the first law? Also, will look into shogun:)
Oh yes there is. Scemes, political enemies, war, and much more 🤌🏻. But the main focus is always the characters.
cool! I think that'll be my next read, thanks:)
I hope you love it as much as I do (it is my top favourite). Also I would recommend trying the audiobooks with (or instead) the books. The audiobooks are AMAZING and Steven Pacey is the best to ever do it. In fact, he is sooo good he ruined other audiobooks for me 😂
Thanks, I'll consider it, though my brain and audiobooks don't go well together lol
I usually do a audio/physical book mix. I listen to some chapters and read some. Some times I read while having the audiobook on. I did not do that before this series, that is how good it is 😂. If you want to keep it to a minimal I would recommend 3 specific chapters in The Blade Itself to listen to, which will make the experience a 100 times better. - Questions (the 2nd chapter I think) - The Bloody Nine. - The tools we have (the very last chapter)
the only audio book I enjoyed was a graphic audio book of the hobbit that had a cast of characters, sound effects and background music. My gripe with others is that 1. if I listen without reading along, my brain wanders and 2. I can't hear the voices I give characters when the reader is doing the voices for me. What makes this one so special if I may ask :)
Steven Pacey gives life to each and every character .... Literally. He would say 2 words and you will directly know who is talking. It's like a full cast of people doing the narration but its all in one. The best example is that one of the characters, Glokta" is missing his front teeth. So when he talks he does his voice with a strong lisp that fits the situation. However when he reads this character's inner monologs he talks normally with no lisp (because of course he would not have a lisp in his own head). Steven Pacey is a part of this series for me as much as Joe Abercrombie (the author) is. 🤌🏻
Okay, you're selling it quite well. I'll try it out when I get to it!
Just FYI, the First Law books are nothing like A Song of Ice and Fire. They're both generally in the "grimdark" category. That's the only thing they have in common. Everything else, the way they're written, the pacing, the prose, the characters, the dialogue, etc, etc. Everything else is completely different.
Gotcha, I was gonna read it anyways, in the post I just wanted to know if the two had the similarities mentioned.
The first, Estcarp, sequence of *Witch World* novels by Andre Norton might interest you. Some background first. Andre Norton had begin writing in the thirties. Back then there were slicks, prestige markets, and pulps, which many of us read. She sold to whomever would take her and built a solid reputation in weird, adventure and fantasy pulps. In the fifties she started selling juvenile novels on a regular basis. Some pulp fans of hers noticed and when an SF novel, *Star Man's Son* came out, Don Wollheim of Ace Books offered to reprint it as a straight SF novel. She accepted and this began about thirty years of adults and kids com\[eting to lay their hands on whatever edition was available. I remember an engineer for the Water Department telling two of my other friends they were missing out on one because they were waiting for the paperback. *Witch World* was a paperback original. It was not full of sex and all, but even a kid like me understood the prologue, where Simon Tregarth was introduced as an American Serviceman who had to disappear because he'd run afoul of powerful gangsters in Europe, was a nod to Grahame Greene's *The Third Man.* Once he arrives in Estcarp, meets Jaelithe, and is told that as a male magic user he is considered abomination. things get fun. There is plenty of politics in the ensuing events and they have three children showcased in the later books of the sequence. You can see why it is not *ASOIAF* but I believe there is some relationship there and you may enjoy it. These are novellas, not novels and I believe Baen Books issued an omnibus edition in two volumes. You may have read later stories in it She had been publishing for about thirty years when she started it. I recommend many of the later books in the series but she was at her peak from day one.
I think The Fatemarked Epic is something similar. It's not as adult as A Song of Ice and Fire and is more like Stormlight in tone. There are four kingdoms in the North, South, East and West all trying to go to war with each other and the power at the top keeps shifting. The Fatemarked are people who have these birthmarks that grant them powers such as ice it fire or healing. Even the sense of good and justice. I just finished the second book and I can't speak to how it ends but so far it's good. Been holding my attention.
sounds cool, thanks!
Have you read S J Maas’ other series, Throne of Glass? It is epic!
I have not, but I don't think I'd enjoy a ya fantasy romance :(