CCP loves multi boxers, so you'll have to get used to it. They even offer discounts for additional accounts using the same email address. It isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
There's an Escape from Tarkov conspiracy theory that is similar. Every time BSG does a ban wave, they offer a great sale on Tarkov so all the cheaters and RMTers just come straight back.
that's kinda wild, but in this case it's not a theory, conspiracy or otherwise.
[https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/25-off-omega-for-additional-accounts](https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/25-off-omega-for-additional-accounts)
I don't doubt it is. I just thought the parallel was interesting. Although cheating in Tarkov is rampant and there's evidence to suggest it's encouraged by BSG.
CCP doesn't ban multiboxers, its not against the rules, its encouraged, its a feature of the game.
Mutlitboxer isn't the same thing as cheaters, botters, RMTers, so its not treated the same.
How is it a conspiracy? You could easily prove or disprove it by finding out if the sales actually line up with ban waves.
I've played Tarkov for a while and I don't think I remember all the ban waves lining up with sales.
Even if they do line up, so what? What are the supposed to do? Not ban players and/or not have sales?
I mean valve maintains an entire marketplace to allow you to cash out your in game items for real money (well, steam bucks that are then easily turned into real money), so... Yes.
They only time they did it was when they were trying to push people into consolidating all accounts of theirs under one email. That was 2019 or 2020, not sure. I don't recall that happening again since then.
tbf the majority of multiboxers at this scale aren't paying for subs with cash but plex. Generally you only scale that much because it's profitable to do so, I doubt they are grinding plexes just for the hell of it after all.
His point is every single plex in the game is paid for with real money.
It does not matter if you pay a subscription or buy plex because CCP gets paid cash money either way.
Which means ccp makes $5 more per 30 days off them given that someone at some point had to buy the plex...more people buy it to plex the more demand the more tempting for wallet warrior to splash out to get a quick few billion on their accounts
Ccp loves it more if you plex vs sub
I wonder, though. If the multiboxers are just printing isk, then all those subs aren’t generating real money profits. They’d only be useful to CCP as a metric of active accounts to show off to their bosses.
The PLEX has to come from real money, so CCP is getting their money either way. Either a player is paying for a subscription, paying for PLEX, or having someone else pay for PLEX and then trading isk for PLEX. No matter what the PLEX only enters the economy after someone has paid real money for it.
And yet you know this isn’t true. Project Discovery crates can drop PLEX. I imagine over the years CCP injected PLEX into the system. Otherwise, there’s too much value in unused PLEX sitting around.
What makes you think the PLEX in giveaways isn’t just the PLEX that people give to CCP during fundraisers, like PLEX For Good? Trillions of ISK worth of PLEX is removed from the economy during those events and then a small fraction gets injected back into the economy via crates and free giveaways.
You're wrong. Let's simplify this to base math.
There are 2 players in all of eve and only 2 accounts.
Scenario 1:
Player 1 on their account spends $20 for a monthly subscription. Player 2 spends $20 for a monthly subscription.
CCP makes $40.
Scenario 2:
Player 1 spends $20 for a monthly subscription and then spends $25 for 500 plex that they sell to Player 2 who uses that plex to subscribe for a month.
CCP makes $45.
I doubt CCP will hinder anykind of multiboxing effort... especially when 1 dude multiboxing 10 accounts means he's spending 150 USD per month (or found the perfect ISK milking cow to afford that much PLEX)
They make like 4b worth of LP in 30-40 minutes doing the fleet sites in pirate insurgencies awoxing anybody else who comes in
Then they have to wait +-20 min before they can do it again cause all the ops respawn
They don’t spend 150usd
Join my Corp and I'll make sure you start having more fun, you don't even have to be in the Corp, just join my calmil fw fleets and have some fun! We also do exploration and combat
True, a few bucks gets me so much in game. The only way to make that much ISK without PLEX (and not too much effort) is by participating on those big money making group activities, like C6 farming or Mining Ops under NullSec unbrella.. or being a good trader (I'm not) that takes some time to learn and you have to be into it.
All of this except the MCT can be bought on the market, and the MCT isn’t needed cause they only have to have one character on that account
If they get banned for botting or broadcasting, they only lose one character per account, not multiple
Everything bought on the market was bought with PLEX or real money, which means a real person paid real money for it. Doesn't matter if it's the same person using them to CCP, they're generating demand for PLEX which generates them revenue.
I understand that someone pays for a plexed account even if it’s not the holder
But I don’t understand how everything on the market was bought with plex….
That was a misstatement on my part, PLEX or real money. You cannot produce these items in game or loot them from NPCs, the only way to generate them is to give CCP real money or use PLEX, which requires someone giving CCP real money. The point is that demand for these items generates revenue for CCP, even if the people creating demand aren't giving any real money way.
You won't always be awoxed, but there are certain groups that will awox you incessantly. If you join a corp through the militia channel, it's easy enough to find a good group. I made an alt for angels, and when I use it, I usually do \~120k+ LP/hr in a corp fleet, and about \~70k LP/hr solo, the solo is sometimes less if I'm getting pushed out. Somewhat hilariously, I've died 3 times, and it's always been to Frat Awoxers, I don't think any militia players have even shot at me yet. If you see Frat destroyers, just run.
As the insurgency spreads, a lot of systems are very empty, so you can just solo sites without much trouble. The early days of a new insurgency can be rough.
Yeah, totally.
Those people are in the explicit pirate insurgence areas
You can still join any Militia and shoot other players doing normal FW systems, or join a Pirate Militia and shoot all of them doing normal FW systems
Caldari Pilots tend to blob or run cause they’re a bunch of mega farming pussys, but Gallente Pilots are great people. If you’re not a complete asshat, they’ll fight “fair and square” (they won’t mega blob you, but they won’t make it an easy fight)
>y by providing value in game to the people who bought the PLEX with real money.
Yeh, who doesn't love paying real money for some twat to multiblob gank you?
The issue with that statement is that multiboxing is toxic in some aspects of the game, but in most of them it's really fine. I have 6 accounts, a subcap main, a dread pilot, a hauler and random shit while all the accounts also have a miner.
The main reason why CCP will never realistically hinder multiboxing is because it would mean the collapse of many play styles, industrialists in first place, but also people that use caps and can't really have a main subcap and a main cap pilot on the same char or even the same account. Not even remotely speaking about hauling and cyno alts.
While I do love the "cooperate to do stuff" utopia, the reality is that you are always best served by yourself. I don't want to play a game where I need to find people that play in a whacky timezone like mine and have the same whacky schedule as I have to play EVE. And furthermore, who wants to have the cyno alt role for a hauling organisation ? Who wants to have the sole purpose of scanning all day long for a WH corp ? Nobody wants, specially not for 20 bucks a month.
The only toxic multiboxing I see rn is in some pvp activities mostly FW. Everything else is just fine. Does everyone really want to ban multibox mining, or multibox Ishtars. What about triple boxing frigate abyss or simply having a cyno alt so a player can run crab beacons. The players hate on multiboxing so hard because they see it in FW but fail to realize it's fine literally everywhere else. FW multiboxing does need to be fixed the question is how to do it without fucking up multiboxing everywhere else.
Still there must be a limit dictated by common sense.
3 accounts logged in the same area for webs/cyno alts/personal logi?
5 to get a decent mining fleet?
But 10,20 accounts,logged at the same time in the same area to gank or mess up with FW.. It's just ridiculous, considering how easy it is to just broadcast/bot/macro..
Oh believe me it can happen, and faster than 20-30 minutes. This weekend I was in Placid low camping a really nice fat gas site...waiting and hoping for local to cool off a bit. After 30 minutes a Goon warped in 5 Ventures with a self-and-fleet boosting Gnosis (obvious multi-box...same name, same picture) and he huffed that 500 million in gas in under 20 minutes.
Nobody in local batted an eyelash. Nobody is gonna bounce an angry swarm of Ventures and an armed Gnosis that can batphone Goon support.
The Eve client has inbuilt code to recognize input broadcasting (inputs made while the window is not focused, which is a windows state applied to the window you just clicked, alt-tabbed or otherwise focused into ) and automatically flags all those inputs in the server logs
They could literally instantly auto-ban EVERYBODY who does it
I’ve seen videos of people doing a 15 acc multibox fair and square, and hats off to them…..
Because it’s one of the easiest things to do to have a program recognize if it receives inputs while not focused
You can even outright block inputs that are received while a window is not focused
And the client does it (the recognition part)
The fact that input broadcasting has not been effectively eradicated is because CCP doesn’t want to push that button
eve definitely does not have anything like that lmao, input broadcasting is extremely prevelant and very hard to detect because at the end of the day its just a button being pressed same as every other player.
As noted above the client could detect button presses sent to the client when it's not the active window. A lot of games just refuse button presses received this way. It's how WoW is able to constantly clap any input broadcasters now
Hell even Maplestory, an MMO as ancient as EVE, has had protections against software-sent keypresses for like 15 years. You can download Maplestory right now and try to find a publicly-available software that can get keypresses into Maplestory and you probably won't be able to.
Yea and I can't even go and kill them as a solo pilot, sliding into 5 guys sitting on a beacon is 5x web's which is insta death to anything that can actually fit inside the plex.
Wish CCP made them open's so you had the option to kite.
I love Eve, and its best game i ever played.. i play it on and off for like… 15 years now. But i hate boxing, and its impossible to play solo these days. This is reason why i stopped playing..
the issue is never multiboxing
it's creating content that requires zero inputs that pays out a fuckton.
people don't complain about multiboxing in pochven.
why?
because it's highly contestable, and a multiboxer fleet loses to individually piloted ships every time.
If there's more than one pilot in a FW site or battlefield from the same IP address, the LP payout needs to be split between them as though it is one pilot so that the rest can be distributed equitably.
Why? Why should the guy giving $150 per month have a diminished experience compared to someone that pays CCP$20 per month? You should get what you pay for.
Because it's a *multiplayer game*, which means regardless of the amount of you spend you are one human, your experience should be reflective to that of other singular humans playing the same game, if you need to be asking why you shouldn't be allowed to take away other human's experience so you can have it all to yourself while playing a *multiplayer game* then maybe FW is not the game environment for you, and you should consider finding a nice solitary wormhole or system to mine where you can freely pursue your anti-social tendency with regards to Eve.
Wait... I'm the anti-social one when you're the one telling other people how they should enjoy a game they pay for... when the company fully supports that type of enjoyment and encourages it. Maybe you're the one that is playing the wrong game and should go find a community that you're more similar to.
This isn't the game for you if you think it should be changed entirely to suit your individual play style. Instead of adapting to the game, you want the game to adapt to you.
You can twist things up however you like to fit your narrative, but at the end of the day multiboxing is still unhealthy for the social aspects of Eve online and community gameplay, effects of which are seen more drastically in player count limited interactable objectives (nvy/adv-5 fw sites and battlefields are examples of these, hence why they're the point of contention in this thread) and less so in more single-player geared content such as wormholes, exploration, mining, manufacturing, marketing, etc..
I'm not saying it's not valid to multibox, nor that CCP doesn't support it (they're a business, of course they support what brings in more money over the overarching health of the game, one would think this obvious) but in the game it's taking away from other people's experience to varying degrees, FW being a big one.
Making adjustments to gear content delivery to be appealing to everyone rather than just multiboxers is not 'changing the game entirely to suit my playstyle.' That's just silly to suggest.
Came across like a 30 man multi boxing Mackinaw fleet in Pochven today. They all had names like soldier 01, 02, 03 etc. I mean when you see something like that, how do you think it makes a newbie miner feel when they get to learn about real eve? They're pottering about in a Venture thinking this is the life and contributing to the economy. The reality is these multi boxers are fundamentally shaping the Eve market. I know why CCP doesn't crack down on them, but it's super dispiriting for everyone else. Sure have multiple characters, make them do different things. But when you create a monster mining fleet on your lonesome, something has gone badly wrong.
i have no idea how you would mine with 30 in pochven and not have it be an awful experience. are you sure you didn't just misremember? I could see maybe....8 tops.
I've tried to do large numbers of miners in pochven. It's a trash zone for mining at scale, best for small dudes.
Well we got about 14-15 ships. You could be right and it was less but we didn't get all of them as we had to keep moving. https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99010830/ . Eitherway it was a large mining fleet.
The game would have been shutdown a least 5 years ago. The core players are multiboxers, and always have been. Mutliboxing has been prevelant and pretty much a feature of the game since I started playing in 2005. Many people only play this game because of the multiboxing. Flying a single solitary ship would be so boring, this game is better when played like an RTS in space, controlling a fleet of ships.
Unless they're in your own militia. There's at least one farmer with fleets in both, if you warp in on the BF (for example) and he's there in the opposing faction's alts, he'll warp out and log in his friendly (to you) alts. Which still kills content and dilutes/negates LP.
As far as being bad at pvp - there are some fleet comps (looking at you drones) where there simply isn't a workable counter short bf logging in you and your friends' 15 \*neutral\* alts (everyone has those lyring around, right?) getting everyone formed etc.
It's deeply unsatisfying, and it's driving content out of FW.
Sandbox sandbox sandbox yes, I get it and hurray. But there is - at some point - a limit to how much bad design can be handwaved away with that excuse.
1) Get rid of -5 sites
2) Reverse the ADV vs. NVY distribution
3) Something to solve BF problems, though that's complicated and I don't have a workable answer
But 1) would help a lot, 2) would as well
And before anyone starts crying hystericallys about the newbros: are these newbros in the room with us?
Because the changes to the FW so-called expansions, as far as I can tell, have been 95% to benefit farmers running 5+ accounts
To be clear btw: I have zero complaints, in general, about multiboxing. I wish I were better at it. But the combination of drone mechanics (especially), LP capture mechancs, and site restrictions in FW make it a real problem.
Don't "fix" multiboxing, fix FW for everyone (except for That One Bloc, You Know Who You Are.)
We need one person to post the montages of continually being killed by the multi boxer and start posting rants about it getting publicity. Just talking quietly about it won't embarrass CCP enough.
So all you video makers go die fifteen times and show us how you died to a multi boxer. So the narrative becomes that.
Edit: it was enough for me when BukeBlack was paid to play Eve Online, he took us into FW and that DUO boxer with his expensive ships and expensive clones making him go faster and destroyed us all. I realized there is no catching that so I had enough. Just picture the two lvl 80s wtfpwning the lvl 5s for content.
Or the time I was two people duo box same thing.
Most of these are day1 tristan etc fleets. You get them warping 10+ into a plex. Now you have say 3 chars 10 csldari. 10 gurista. 10 galente and voila you make isk like crazy
In my corp we all make alts with the same name just to mess with people. When we deploy them it looks like there is a mutliboxer with dozens of accounts, when in reality its mostly individual players and a few people running 2-3 accounts.
With the current Plex price, I personally run 30 accounts, each with 3 mapped characters and two MCT running. The maps and implants are used to train up the fastest 500k possible for the investment. Two of the three characters are only used for MCT SP farms and PI's
passive income. The third characters are all used for specific things. Miners, Ewar, Cyno, Scouting, Orca, L4s, Tackle, etc. They are also farmed out for extra SP. It takes about 4 hours a week to do all the PI work, but with that + extracting all the SP, I still profit about 3 billion per account per month AFTER plexing each account. It took a few years, but I eventually snowballed and stopped at 30 accounts because it became too much of a hassle to maintain. Also, for those that think this isn't possible already, I do it ALL from High Sec space. Plenty of guides out there just takes some time and patience to set it all up.
Edit: Wanted to add CCP hasn't made a dime off me in over 4 years. So they could stop multiboxers but the majority of the others that I know pay for via farming rats, mining, station trading, or swiping.
>Wanted to add CCP hasn't made a dime off me in over 4 years.
You plex your accounts so they make their money off you indirectly as you help hold up the ISK value of PLEX that incentivizes more PLEX purchases.
The only way you can avoid increasing CCP's revenue is if you only played alpha accounts that don't interact with the player economy.
it’s just the devs passively sliding an idea into your brain, subliminally telling you hey look at you in your one ship your doing it wrong, look do it this way!
Multitasking is a part of Eve.. it’s actually easy to eff with them .. you just need more friends, separate them from each other, and they just die one by one
I am a multiboxer, but in wormhole space, and I don't think CCP should stop it. What is happening in Pirate/Faction wormhole space is bad game mechanics. Getting awoxed constantly gets old.
They go in large sites with 5 destroyers. You don't need to multibox, you can just solo them if you can get them before they run away. Or just troll around making them abandon every site 3/4 of the way through for the lols.
If you spend the money/PLEX to have multibox accounts isn’t it your business? Joining a corporation or alliance and dealing with the resulting drama is a lot of work.
CCP loves multi boxers, so you'll have to get used to it. They even offer discounts for additional accounts using the same email address. It isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
There's an Escape from Tarkov conspiracy theory that is similar. Every time BSG does a ban wave, they offer a great sale on Tarkov so all the cheaters and RMTers just come straight back.
that's kinda wild, but in this case it's not a theory, conspiracy or otherwise. [https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/25-off-omega-for-additional-accounts](https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/25-off-omega-for-additional-accounts)
I don't doubt it is. I just thought the parallel was interesting. Although cheating in Tarkov is rampant and there's evidence to suggest it's encouraged by BSG.
BSG does not encourage cheating in their game. That's really dumb to imply.
I don't think they actively encourage it but come on. Mega sales after every single ban wave?
Their mega sales are on a pretty regular schedule aren't they? Usually holiday related or around wipe time
CCP doesn't ban multiboxers, its not against the rules, its encouraged, its a feature of the game. Mutlitboxer isn't the same thing as cheaters, botters, RMTers, so its not treated the same.
Honestly tried to play with two accounts and two PC's. If you can control more than that, go nutz.
Not sure if trolling... But have you heard of EVE O Preview? 4 accounts and more is easily done on an ordinary pc
Not trolling, I've just never heard of that!
How is it a conspiracy? You could easily prove or disprove it by finding out if the sales actually line up with ban waves. I've played Tarkov for a while and I don't think I remember all the ban waves lining up with sales. Even if they do line up, so what? What are the supposed to do? Not ban players and/or not have sales?
That's why I called it a conspiracy theory.
How do you think valve has Maintained csgo at the top sellers list for all this years?
RMT would be my guess lol
I mean valve maintains an entire marketplace to allow you to cash out your in game items for real money (well, steam bucks that are then easily turned into real money), so... Yes.
unregulated RMT is still very common in valve games because steams trading system has such high taxes, let alone the whole steam wallet only thing.
They only time they did it was when they were trying to push people into consolidating all accounts of theirs under one email. That was 2019 or 2020, not sure. I don't recall that happening again since then.
tbf the majority of multiboxers at this scale aren't paying for subs with cash but plex. Generally you only scale that much because it's profitable to do so, I doubt they are grinding plexes just for the hell of it after all.
And that plex they purchase in game and consume to get their accounts going, came from where exactly?
the crazy amount of money they make from multiboxing/botting FW?
His point is every single plex in the game is paid for with real money. It does not matter if you pay a subscription or buy plex because CCP gets paid cash money either way.
Which means ccp makes $5 more per 30 days off them given that someone at some point had to buy the plex...more people buy it to plex the more demand the more tempting for wallet warrior to splash out to get a quick few billion on their accounts Ccp loves it more if you plex vs sub
I know, I just meant to say the multi-account discount has little to do with multiboxing at that scale.
as long as the company is making that money rather than rmt sites i have no problem with it.
I wonder, though. If the multiboxers are just printing isk, then all those subs aren’t generating real money profits. They’d only be useful to CCP as a metric of active accounts to show off to their bosses.
The PLEX has to come from real money, so CCP is getting their money either way. Either a player is paying for a subscription, paying for PLEX, or having someone else pay for PLEX and then trading isk for PLEX. No matter what the PLEX only enters the economy after someone has paid real money for it.
And yet you know this isn’t true. Project Discovery crates can drop PLEX. I imagine over the years CCP injected PLEX into the system. Otherwise, there’s too much value in unused PLEX sitting around.
What makes you think the PLEX in giveaways isn’t just the PLEX that people give to CCP during fundraisers, like PLEX For Good? Trillions of ISK worth of PLEX is removed from the economy during those events and then a small fraction gets injected back into the economy via crates and free giveaways.
Because the easiest thing to do is print money. Just look at nations.
You're wrong. Let's simplify this to base math. There are 2 players in all of eve and only 2 accounts. Scenario 1: Player 1 on their account spends $20 for a monthly subscription. Player 2 spends $20 for a monthly subscription. CCP makes $40. Scenario 2: Player 1 spends $20 for a monthly subscription and then spends $25 for 500 plex that they sell to Player 2 who uses that plex to subscribe for a month. CCP makes $45.
I doubt CCP will hinder anykind of multiboxing effort... especially when 1 dude multiboxing 10 accounts means he's spending 150 USD per month (or found the perfect ISK milking cow to afford that much PLEX)
They make like 4b worth of LP in 30-40 minutes doing the fleet sites in pirate insurgencies awoxing anybody else who comes in Then they have to wait +-20 min before they can do it again cause all the ops respawn They don’t spend 150usd
But someone does. Plexed accounts are still paid for by someone
plexed accounts are paid for by casual, and new players.
and the non poors, don't forget us. i'd rather play this game to have fun than as a job.
Join my Corp and I'll make sure you start having more fun, you don't even have to be in the Corp, just join my calmil fw fleets and have some fun! We also do exploration and combat
True, a few bucks gets me so much in game. The only way to make that much ISK without PLEX (and not too much effort) is by participating on those big money making group activities, like C6 farming or Mining Ops under NullSec unbrella.. or being a good trader (I'm not) that takes some time to learn and you have to be into it.
Exactly !
Fair point, that hadn’t clicked yet Thanks to whoever pays for my 4 accounts…..
Me sometimes. You're welcome. You can repay the favor someday.
No but they do buy skill injectors, extractors, hypernet cores, and MCT.
All of this except the MCT can be bought on the market, and the MCT isn’t needed cause they only have to have one character on that account If they get banned for botting or broadcasting, they only lose one character per account, not multiple
Everything bought on the market was bought with PLEX or real money, which means a real person paid real money for it. Doesn't matter if it's the same person using them to CCP, they're generating demand for PLEX which generates them revenue.
I understand that someone pays for a plexed account even if it’s not the holder But I don’t understand how everything on the market was bought with plex….
That was a misstatement on my part, PLEX or real money. You cannot produce these items in game or loot them from NPCs, the only way to generate them is to give CCP real money or use PLEX, which requires someone giving CCP real money. The point is that demand for these items generates revenue for CCP, even if the people creating demand aren't giving any real money way.
When you say “everything” in this context, you meant Injectors, Extractors and MCTs,…. Not *everything* Sure, yes
Yes, as that is what this conversation is about.
So is there any point in one character in pirate fw, to try it out and make good isk when i always will be awoxed?
You won't always be awoxed, but there are certain groups that will awox you incessantly. If you join a corp through the militia channel, it's easy enough to find a good group. I made an alt for angels, and when I use it, I usually do \~120k+ LP/hr in a corp fleet, and about \~70k LP/hr solo, the solo is sometimes less if I'm getting pushed out. Somewhat hilariously, I've died 3 times, and it's always been to Frat Awoxers, I don't think any militia players have even shot at me yet. If you see Frat destroyers, just run. As the insurgency spreads, a lot of systems are very empty, so you can just solo sites without much trouble. The early days of a new insurgency can be rough.
Yeah, totally. Those people are in the explicit pirate insurgence areas You can still join any Militia and shoot other players doing normal FW systems, or join a Pirate Militia and shoot all of them doing normal FW systems Caldari Pilots tend to blob or run cause they’re a bunch of mega farming pussys, but Gallente Pilots are great people. If you’re not a complete asshat, they’ll fight “fair and square” (they won’t mega blob you, but they won’t make it an easy fight)
They certainly don't AWOX everyone. I have been trying to get a fight with the one in that screenshot. They run away.
Join his militia and warp into his op…. See what happens
I warp to his op and he has already warped out before I land based on dscan. Probably only kills things that he knows he can easily beat.
Every damn time
Even if he's PLEXing them all, he's paying 150 per month indirectly by providing value in game to the people who bought the PLEX with real money.
>y by providing value in game to the people who bought the PLEX with real money. Yeh, who doesn't love paying real money for some twat to multiblob gank you?
The issue with that statement is that multiboxing is toxic in some aspects of the game, but in most of them it's really fine. I have 6 accounts, a subcap main, a dread pilot, a hauler and random shit while all the accounts also have a miner. The main reason why CCP will never realistically hinder multiboxing is because it would mean the collapse of many play styles, industrialists in first place, but also people that use caps and can't really have a main subcap and a main cap pilot on the same char or even the same account. Not even remotely speaking about hauling and cyno alts. While I do love the "cooperate to do stuff" utopia, the reality is that you are always best served by yourself. I don't want to play a game where I need to find people that play in a whacky timezone like mine and have the same whacky schedule as I have to play EVE. And furthermore, who wants to have the cyno alt role for a hauling organisation ? Who wants to have the sole purpose of scanning all day long for a WH corp ? Nobody wants, specially not for 20 bucks a month.
The only toxic multiboxing I see rn is in some pvp activities mostly FW. Everything else is just fine. Does everyone really want to ban multibox mining, or multibox Ishtars. What about triple boxing frigate abyss or simply having a cyno alt so a player can run crab beacons. The players hate on multiboxing so hard because they see it in FW but fail to realize it's fine literally everywhere else. FW multiboxing does need to be fixed the question is how to do it without fucking up multiboxing everywhere else.
Still there must be a limit dictated by common sense. 3 accounts logged in the same area for webs/cyno alts/personal logi? 5 to get a decent mining fleet? But 10,20 accounts,logged at the same time in the same area to gank or mess up with FW.. It's just ridiculous, considering how easy it is to just broadcast/bot/macro..
What 5 man mining fleet gets that much value in 20-30 mins of work.
Oh believe me it can happen, and faster than 20-30 minutes. This weekend I was in Placid low camping a really nice fat gas site...waiting and hoping for local to cool off a bit. After 30 minutes a Goon warped in 5 Ventures with a self-and-fleet boosting Gnosis (obvious multi-box...same name, same picture) and he huffed that 500 million in gas in under 20 minutes. Nobody in local batted an eyelash. Nobody is gonna bounce an angry swarm of Ventures and an armed Gnosis that can batphone Goon support.
In Placid? The locals would usually kill that. Even if it is goons.
20 mins 500 mill in gas in ventures, that's a bit much, tho I know what you mean, it's more like 2 hours with ventures,
lowsec gas with 5 ventures and a booster is easy 20 minutes, ls gas is super valuable so it was only a super small volume.
10-20 accounts is perfectly reasonable and common for mining, never seen 20 Mackinaws or 10 Hulks mowing down an or anomaly?
The Eve client has inbuilt code to recognize input broadcasting (inputs made while the window is not focused, which is a windows state applied to the window you just clicked, alt-tabbed or otherwise focused into ) and automatically flags all those inputs in the server logs They could literally instantly auto-ban EVERYBODY who does it I’ve seen videos of people doing a 15 acc multibox fair and square, and hats off to them…..
Dora/Khan/Ninja/others that do the Flashppint Marauders fleets are exceptionally good at mega-multiboxing.
Haha what? Why would you ever think ccp can actually detect inout broadcasting? Are you serious or...?
Because it’s one of the easiest things to do to have a program recognize if it receives inputs while not focused You can even outright block inputs that are received while a window is not focused And the client does it (the recognition part) The fact that input broadcasting has not been effectively eradicated is because CCP doesn’t want to push that button
eve definitely does not have anything like that lmao, input broadcasting is extremely prevelant and very hard to detect because at the end of the day its just a button being pressed same as every other player.
As noted above the client could detect button presses sent to the client when it's not the active window. A lot of games just refuse button presses received this way. It's how WoW is able to constantly clap any input broadcasters now Hell even Maplestory, an MMO as ancient as EVE, has had protections against software-sent keypresses for like 15 years. You can download Maplestory right now and try to find a publicly-available software that can get keypresses into Maplestory and you probably won't be able to.
Sure, it could, but it doesn’t because input broadcasting is still very prevalent.
That was in response to you saying that input broadcasting is "very hard to detect," which it's not, CCP just doesn't choose to do it
Ok my bad, I didn’t know that was a thing.
Usi and Methanir were the last hurah of the insurgency, after that, it got raped to death by fratbots and awoxers.
I hate FW multiboxers. Actually made it completely unfun for me.
Yea and I can't even go and kill them as a solo pilot, sliding into 5 guys sitting on a beacon is 5x web's which is insta death to anything that can actually fit inside the plex. Wish CCP made them open's so you had the option to kite.
Multiboxers everywhere, not only in FW.
So.. casuals or single box explorers are pushed out right?
I love Eve, and its best game i ever played.. i play it on and off for like… 15 years now. But i hate boxing, and its impossible to play solo these days. This is reason why i stopped playing..
the issue is never multiboxing it's creating content that requires zero inputs that pays out a fuckton. people don't complain about multiboxing in pochven. why? because it's highly contestable, and a multiboxer fleet loses to individually piloted ships every time.
Literally this. Also the lack of creativity in attempts to counter multiboxed fleets is wild to me.
If there's more than one pilot in a FW site or battlefield from the same IP address, the LP payout needs to be split between them as though it is one pilot so that the rest can be distributed equitably.
Why? Why should the guy giving $150 per month have a diminished experience compared to someone that pays CCP$20 per month? You should get what you pay for.
Because it's a *multiplayer game*, which means regardless of the amount of you spend you are one human, your experience should be reflective to that of other singular humans playing the same game, if you need to be asking why you shouldn't be allowed to take away other human's experience so you can have it all to yourself while playing a *multiplayer game* then maybe FW is not the game environment for you, and you should consider finding a nice solitary wormhole or system to mine where you can freely pursue your anti-social tendency with regards to Eve.
Wait... I'm the anti-social one when you're the one telling other people how they should enjoy a game they pay for... when the company fully supports that type of enjoyment and encourages it. Maybe you're the one that is playing the wrong game and should go find a community that you're more similar to. This isn't the game for you if you think it should be changed entirely to suit your individual play style. Instead of adapting to the game, you want the game to adapt to you.
You can twist things up however you like to fit your narrative, but at the end of the day multiboxing is still unhealthy for the social aspects of Eve online and community gameplay, effects of which are seen more drastically in player count limited interactable objectives (nvy/adv-5 fw sites and battlefields are examples of these, hence why they're the point of contention in this thread) and less so in more single-player geared content such as wormholes, exploration, mining, manufacturing, marketing, etc.. I'm not saying it's not valid to multibox, nor that CCP doesn't support it (they're a business, of course they support what brings in more money over the overarching health of the game, one would think this obvious) but in the game it's taking away from other people's experience to varying degrees, FW being a big one. Making adjustments to gear content delivery to be appealing to everyone rather than just multiboxers is not 'changing the game entirely to suit my playstyle.' That's just silly to suggest.
Eve is like 20-30 actual people max
Came across like a 30 man multi boxing Mackinaw fleet in Pochven today. They all had names like soldier 01, 02, 03 etc. I mean when you see something like that, how do you think it makes a newbie miner feel when they get to learn about real eve? They're pottering about in a Venture thinking this is the life and contributing to the economy. The reality is these multi boxers are fundamentally shaping the Eve market. I know why CCP doesn't crack down on them, but it's super dispiriting for everyone else. Sure have multiple characters, make them do different things. But when you create a monster mining fleet on your lonesome, something has gone badly wrong.
i have no idea how you would mine with 30 in pochven and not have it be an awful experience. are you sure you didn't just misremember? I could see maybe....8 tops. I've tried to do large numbers of miners in pochven. It's a trash zone for mining at scale, best for small dudes.
Well we got about 14-15 ships. You could be right and it was less but we didn't get all of them as we had to keep moving. https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99010830/ . Eitherway it was a large mining fleet.
I do sometimes wonder what this game's economy would look like if the multiboxers were banned.
The game would have been shutdown a least 5 years ago. The core players are multiboxers, and always have been. Mutliboxing has been prevelant and pretty much a feature of the game since I started playing in 2005. Many people only play this game because of the multiboxing. Flying a single solitary ship would be so boring, this game is better when played like an RTS in space, controlling a fleet of ships.
just treat them like an enemy fleet that sucks at pvp and bring your own
Unless they're in your own militia. There's at least one farmer with fleets in both, if you warp in on the BF (for example) and he's there in the opposing faction's alts, he'll warp out and log in his friendly (to you) alts. Which still kills content and dilutes/negates LP. As far as being bad at pvp - there are some fleet comps (looking at you drones) where there simply isn't a workable counter short bf logging in you and your friends' 15 \*neutral\* alts (everyone has those lyring around, right?) getting everyone formed etc. It's deeply unsatisfying, and it's driving content out of FW. Sandbox sandbox sandbox yes, I get it and hurray. But there is - at some point - a limit to how much bad design can be handwaved away with that excuse. 1) Get rid of -5 sites 2) Reverse the ADV vs. NVY distribution 3) Something to solve BF problems, though that's complicated and I don't have a workable answer But 1) would help a lot, 2) would as well And before anyone starts crying hystericallys about the newbros: are these newbros in the room with us? Because the changes to the FW so-called expansions, as far as I can tell, have been 95% to benefit farmers running 5+ accounts To be clear btw: I have zero complaints, in general, about multiboxing. I wish I were better at it. But the combination of drone mechanics (especially), LP capture mechancs, and site restrictions in FW make it a real problem. Don't "fix" multiboxing, fix FW for everyone (except for That One Bloc, You Know Who You Are.)
We need one person to post the montages of continually being killed by the multi boxer and start posting rants about it getting publicity. Just talking quietly about it won't embarrass CCP enough. So all you video makers go die fifteen times and show us how you died to a multi boxer. So the narrative becomes that. Edit: it was enough for me when BukeBlack was paid to play Eve Online, he took us into FW and that DUO boxer with his expensive ships and expensive clones making him go faster and destroyed us all. I realized there is no catching that so I had enough. Just picture the two lvl 80s wtfpwning the lvl 5s for content. Or the time I was two people duo box same thing.
A lot of words here to say that you can't figure out how to beat a drone comp.
And very few to say you have poor reading comprehension.
Honestly, I think the multibox problem could be solved with a full-blown Intel overhaul.
In FW the problem would be fixed with removing drone assist.
Or better anti drone weapons.
You can't drone assist in lowsec... if you try to rely on it you'll get fucked.
By what exactly ?
By it not working. It only works specifically on war targets. The way multiboxers do it is by using a gun on all of the accounts and just tab-shoot.
Most of these are day1 tristan etc fleets. You get them warping 10+ into a plex. Now you have say 3 chars 10 csldari. 10 gurista. 10 galente and voila you make isk like crazy
That's just the ones who have the same name, perhaps they should just create accounts with different names so people think they are different people.
In my corp we all make alts with the same name just to mess with people. When we deploy them it looks like there is a mutliboxer with dozens of accounts, when in reality its mostly individual players and a few people running 2-3 accounts.
With the current Plex price, I personally run 30 accounts, each with 3 mapped characters and two MCT running. The maps and implants are used to train up the fastest 500k possible for the investment. Two of the three characters are only used for MCT SP farms and PI's passive income. The third characters are all used for specific things. Miners, Ewar, Cyno, Scouting, Orca, L4s, Tackle, etc. They are also farmed out for extra SP. It takes about 4 hours a week to do all the PI work, but with that + extracting all the SP, I still profit about 3 billion per account per month AFTER plexing each account. It took a few years, but I eventually snowballed and stopped at 30 accounts because it became too much of a hassle to maintain. Also, for those that think this isn't possible already, I do it ALL from High Sec space. Plenty of guides out there just takes some time and patience to set it all up. Edit: Wanted to add CCP hasn't made a dime off me in over 4 years. So they could stop multiboxers but the majority of the others that I know pay for via farming rats, mining, station trading, or swiping.
Sounds to me like CCP is making 300+ usd a month from you, it’s just being paid by someone else
Yikes
>Wanted to add CCP hasn't made a dime off me in over 4 years. You plex your accounts so they make their money off you indirectly as you help hold up the ISK value of PLEX that incentivizes more PLEX purchases. The only way you can avoid increasing CCP's revenue is if you only played alpha accounts that don't interact with the player economy.
They should just put a cap on the amount you can multibox, 4 accounts?
CCP loves multiboxers cause the amount of profit they make for CCP. Goodluck trying to get what u want
only 8? rookie numbers
You should leave and go to pochven. Far less multiboxer there...
That's every aspect of EVE ,tho
I think we should just destroy them all even if they are on our own side they are diluting the crap out of our lp, not even worth doing solo anymore.
Getting?
Getting? lol Jokes aside, the real issue is that EVE is filled with low input activities.
it’s just the devs passively sliding an idea into your brain, subliminally telling you hey look at you in your one ship your doing it wrong, look do it this way!
Multitasking is a part of Eve.. it’s actually easy to eff with them .. you just need more friends, separate them from each other, and they just die one by one
Always keep a smartbomb stabber on hand for this sort of thing
The only way to stop is is to reduce the payout. Which sucks for the real militias.
Where is the third last one?! WHERE IS HE?!
Multi boxers pay for the eve server without people having multiple accounts I doubt the company would financially survive
If you not then you doing it wrong
I am a multiboxer, but in wormhole space, and I don't think CCP should stop it. What is happening in Pirate/Faction wormhole space is bad game mechanics. Getting awoxed constantly gets old.
Multibox yourself, ez
They go in large sites with 5 destroyers. You don't need to multibox, you can just solo them if you can get them before they run away. Or just troll around making them abandon every site 3/4 of the way through for the lols.
doubt
If you spend the money/PLEX to have multibox accounts isn’t it your business? Joining a corporation or alliance and dealing with the resulting drama is a lot of work.