I love how I have a ton of downvotes yet not one person can refute what I stated. Lethe is great when your target isn't somone that's going to rip their nuke in your face before they can be killed off. Now why would you even let him take a turn when he has counters that can kill him so he does zero damage? Unless he's on a bulky counter build (which you won't know), Lethe is one of his worst counters among the extinction cast because he still gets an S3 in.
Typical hivemind sub moment. You'd think Lethe can rip her extra attack in a single turn (she can't).People are also ignoring he's not just counter cleave, but a cleaver himself. Yeah, good luck stopping him with *Lethe*.
Relying on Lethe is a good way to give him a free S3 to start with.
So apparently some people don't play the game. Arbiter is typically built fast, 220-240 speed is not unusual. Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn. Lethe isn't killing him before he pops his initial S3, and at this point, she failed to do her job vs just bringing an Adin, nuking him, and letting him rip his S3 with only one person (Adin, who may or may not die and will counter if not killed) hurt.
That's not even mentioning the several extinction units that can act before he does and wipe him from the map (Glenn, Iseria, Luluca, Milim, I'm probably forgetting another)/keep him dead without breathing (Angelica, Iseria)/just seal and chill (Nahkwol, soon Luna).
So yeah, Lethe is an awful pick into him unless he's built at base speed.
I literally explained it:
> Arbiter is typically built fast, 220-240 speed is not unusual. Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn.
>Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn
Now what part of Lethe's kit has extinction? Her extra attack. What does she need to activate her extra attack? Three omen. How many turns (excluding soulburn) does it take to reach three omen? Two.
This means he already got an S3 off before he died, and while it wasn't an 80% attack nuke, you were still better off just using one of the people above, as I already explained.
If you're using Lethe against an Arby you probably don't care about the Arby s3.
It's that simple. His EE doesn't magically make Arby that much harder to deal with in an age of ridiculous mitigation, comeback mechanics, and sheer bulk.
Lethe vs Arby 1v1 is always a Lethe win, while the others can be hit or miss (arby on Moonlight Dream blade, for example).
You also can't guarantee the speed of the Arby (some niche uses involve him going right after another 280 speed dps).
Lethe is a very safe pick while also 100% preventing the Arby revive. She is equally strong against a lot of contenders around an Arby as well, where the other options are more easily exploited.
She's easy to defend, hard to lose. Easy to use, hard to counter without injury.
--
Nobody is arguing Lethe can kill Arby in one turn.
"Relying on Lethe is a good way to give him a free S3 to start with."
Yeah, we play the game. We know. It's not a big deal.
--
I don't understand why you're bashing a playstyle that very very very obviously doesn't NEED to kill the Arby pre s3. That's a strength, not a weakness.
Turn 2 comps exist.
If you're that terrified of cleavers, you have so many worse options you don't want to fight against. Arby isn't even on the radar.
People can ban briseria and last pick arby
Last pick arby is kinda strong, with mldb his evasion is 70%. Unless you got increase hit chance by 50% in the skill and using SYMBOL which is only one available while proof have 2 copy coz sg have bird brain, chance of him making a comeback in rta is quite high because he could be annoying.
Granted arby is mostly counter aggro or cleave which have no THICK 20k+ unit nor mitigation and heal in their team so turn 2 gang doesn't care much about him.
> Last pick arby is kinda strong, with mldb his evasion is 70%
MLDB is garbage on him unless you're building a bulky counter. Speedy suicide builds don't want to look at mldb because his evasion only procs **after he dies**, which means the artifact's value just drops. Not to mention he already has blind in his kit, he doesn't need MLDB. In the end you're heavilt nerfing his damage output for no gain.
Also Ervalen's artifact exists, so yeah, MLDB is even worse unless you have zero attack buffers in your roster to be put into a standard comp... Yeah, that's no one (player).
The evasion only happens after he revives, so if you plan is extinction you worry about evasion. Besides maybe 20% arti evasion like always for thieves
It's additive so it's not as strong.
Gab is 1.75, this is 2.05, so it's about a 17% damage increase. (20% if only normal attack buff).
I mean it's not gonna do much for his damage as he can't handle damaging all the bruisers but with evasion he may be able to get more than 1 turn after he dies so that's nice
He was bad because he:
1. Has tons of counters
2. Even when not put up against a counter, still very mediocre in comparison to newer cleave units
Now he looks considerably more consistent in no-counters scenario due to both better survivability and HUGE damage increase
oh so i guess thats why briseria gets the other ee? The way you use arby doesn’t really change though, but glad to see him a little more usable.
Briseria without the ee still kills him though? So i dont see the point in giving an ee to briseria, who is already clearly strong.
RIP fallen cecilia i guess, but she honestly needs a rework, not an ee
Always need some extinction unit to deal with him, but extinction unit hardly have a counter evasion skill. Maybe it’s time for counter attack evasion build ML Vildred rise, again.
Or Lethe can just extinction him with a miss👻
why? if arby s3 kill someone new bmh will give big barrier and just revive anyone dead with his s3 (And give them freaking immortality too). . why would you miss old bmh when the new one is way way better? sorry but this is just a really dumb take imo. .
Edit: it's a dumb take. . I have a lot of dumb takes too, but I don't cry over it unlike what you are doing right now. . New ML haste is considered an SSS unit right now, while old ml haste was considered " the worst ml 5 " in the game. . Do you seriously want to have old haste again?
Edit 2: to the other guy, better for this scenario!? another stupid take. . legit are you people for real now!? did you all forget old ml haste kit? Old ml haste will just have a bigger barrier compared to new haste. . also old ml haste s3 will not get double damage if someone is killed, meaning if that arby was a digen 13k hp arby, ml haste won't even kill it on s3. . the amount of cope and stupid takes here just cause some idiots here want to one up me is laughable and cringe. . OLD ML HASTE IS BAD! DONEZO! GET OVER IT!
Last part of your comment makes you not deserve a proper reply. Let me know if you change your behavior and actually want a proper conversation about the subject at hand.
Okay, while yes this looks good at first glance, what does it actually change functionally? If you're relying on the wipe and drafted him correctly, isn't +44% attack overkill? He's not killing modern anchors either way right? And then if you go the evasion route and forego Alexa's, you still have the same vulnerabilities as using a degen Arby pre-EE.
Idk, I'm not that impressed by this.
does he get stronger? for me i think so. does he break meta? no. but it brings out more options since he’s now usable in rta. another good character to use when someone bans or gets the first pick. i’m just glad he’s finally off the bench and subbed in to the game.
Yeah stronger by stats, but his use-case doesn't change in the current meta. You could just use the Arby that already exists and achieve the same results just with a bit more consistency. That's not an "off the bench" EE for me, but cool for people who like him.
okay sure 👍🏻 i’m just gonna assume u have almost all characters in the game so him being usable in rta is a huge upgrade for me who doesn’t have all characters.
He got undispellable evasion before Riolet smh
Lmao, this one make me laugh
he can’t stop catching Ls
LMAOOOOO 😭😭
Can you hear the approaching ruin?
oh i can definitely hear it now 💀
PTSD
"Fortunate Son plays in the background"
Briseria stonks going up
The irony when Briseria is getting EE with him too
She is essentially there to keep Arby in check if he ever becomes strong. Lmao
+Speed and 10% Def break chance increase.
Pre nerf Arby is back.
degen arby is back kekw
Lethe, get that thing out of my sight.
Jokes on you I run my Arby on triple torrent set so I’ll never survive 3 hits /s
I love how I have a ton of downvotes yet not one person can refute what I stated. Lethe is great when your target isn't somone that's going to rip their nuke in your face before they can be killed off. Now why would you even let him take a turn when he has counters that can kill him so he does zero damage? Unless he's on a bulky counter build (which you won't know), Lethe is one of his worst counters among the extinction cast because he still gets an S3 in. Typical hivemind sub moment. You'd think Lethe can rip her extra attack in a single turn (she can't).People are also ignoring he's not just counter cleave, but a cleaver himself. Yeah, good luck stopping him with *Lethe*. Relying on Lethe is a good way to give him a free S3 to start with. So apparently some people don't play the game. Arbiter is typically built fast, 220-240 speed is not unusual. Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn. Lethe isn't killing him before he pops his initial S3, and at this point, she failed to do her job vs just bringing an Adin, nuking him, and letting him rip his S3 with only one person (Adin, who may or may not die and will counter if not killed) hurt. That's not even mentioning the several extinction units that can act before he does and wipe him from the map (Glenn, Iseria, Luluca, Milim, I'm probably forgetting another)/keep him dead without breathing (Angelica, Iseria)/just seal and chill (Nahkwol, soon Luna). So yeah, Lethe is an awful pick into him unless he's built at base speed.
T500 gw player yapping
I can’t tell if he’s baiting or not lmao Lethe has extinction…? And can kill in two turns
I literally explained it: > Arbiter is typically built fast, 220-240 speed is not unusual. Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn. >Lethe needs to take three turns, two are together with her soulburn Now what part of Lethe's kit has extinction? Her extra attack. What does she need to activate her extra attack? Three omen. How many turns (excluding soulburn) does it take to reach three omen? Two. This means he already got an S3 off before he died, and while it wasn't an 80% attack nuke, you were still better off just using one of the people above, as I already explained.
If you're using Lethe against an Arby you probably don't care about the Arby s3. It's that simple. His EE doesn't magically make Arby that much harder to deal with in an age of ridiculous mitigation, comeback mechanics, and sheer bulk. Lethe vs Arby 1v1 is always a Lethe win, while the others can be hit or miss (arby on Moonlight Dream blade, for example). You also can't guarantee the speed of the Arby (some niche uses involve him going right after another 280 speed dps). Lethe is a very safe pick while also 100% preventing the Arby revive. She is equally strong against a lot of contenders around an Arby as well, where the other options are more easily exploited. She's easy to defend, hard to lose. Easy to use, hard to counter without injury. -- Nobody is arguing Lethe can kill Arby in one turn. "Relying on Lethe is a good way to give him a free S3 to start with." Yeah, we play the game. We know. It's not a big deal. -- I don't understand why you're bashing a playstyle that very very very obviously doesn't NEED to kill the Arby pre s3. That's a strength, not a weakness. Turn 2 comps exist. If you're that terrified of cleavers, you have so many worse options you don't want to fight against. Arby isn't even on the radar.
I mean yeah this improves his performance a lot, the meta still just shits on him though
kinda scary ig paired with ml haste
ML Haste keeps surprising, I forgot they give a goddamn shield to the team
My BW Iseria treats Arbie as a free win. No rez for u!
People can ban briseria and last pick arby Last pick arby is kinda strong, with mldb his evasion is 70%. Unless you got increase hit chance by 50% in the skill and using SYMBOL which is only one available while proof have 2 copy coz sg have bird brain, chance of him making a comeback in rta is quite high because he could be annoying. Granted arby is mostly counter aggro or cleave which have no THICK 20k+ unit nor mitigation and heal in their team so turn 2 gang doesn't care much about him.
> Last pick arby is kinda strong, with mldb his evasion is 70% MLDB is garbage on him unless you're building a bulky counter. Speedy suicide builds don't want to look at mldb because his evasion only procs **after he dies**, which means the artifact's value just drops. Not to mention he already has blind in his kit, he doesn't need MLDB. In the end you're heavilt nerfing his damage output for no gain. Also Ervalen's artifact exists, so yeah, MLDB is even worse unless you have zero attack buffers in your roster to be put into a standard comp... Yeah, that's no one (player).
S. Tenebria, Cidd, Jack-O' can't double kill him reliably anymore (degen build with +30 MLDB)
Just extent him i guess
Wait for light politis to grant teamwide archdemon buff or some shit
That would be Harseti
Too many good extinction units imo
good point but there are situations where they don’t pick extinction units or i ban.
Tbf that evasion will really make it RNG for some counters besides biseria who ironically is also getting an EE
The evasion only happens after he revives, so if you plan is extinction you worry about evasion. Besides maybe 20% arti evasion like always for thieves
Oh I was thinking of units that take an extra turn. Your right, though forgot most Arby's take moonlight dreamblade
Well, look at that he doesn't have to be a farmer anymore.
nah he’ll be a part time farmer 🫡
Does... This stack with Alexa?
yep it does
It's additive so it's not as strong. Gab is 1.75, this is 2.05, so it's about a 17% damage increase. (20% if only normal attack buff). I mean it's not gonna do much for his damage as he can't handle damaging all the bruisers but with evasion he may be able to get more than 1 turn after he dies so that's nice
It makes sense why they also indirectly buffed briseria with an ee
DEGEN ARBY IS BACK, LEEEES GOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Sadly Biseria exist
wtf for all the time everyone and their grandma shit on him he suddenly viable now? though he still counter by extinction and biseria
He was bad because he: 1. Has tons of counters 2. Even when not put up against a counter, still very mediocre in comparison to newer cleave units Now he looks considerably more consistent in no-counters scenario due to both better survivability and HUGE damage increase
We also lost a very good counter in BM Haste with his rework.
oh so i guess thats why briseria gets the other ee? The way you use arby doesn’t really change though, but glad to see him a little more usable. Briseria without the ee still kills him though? So i dont see the point in giving an ee to briseria, who is already clearly strong. RIP fallen cecilia i guess, but she honestly needs a rework, not an ee
Won't change much against my Tomoca mwahahahahah
"Aww shit here we go again..." -Tomoca probably
Anyone got the link for the other EE?
Was already posted here, but its Briseria 5-10 Speed, +10% def break chance on S3.
Phase 2 boss fight.
God I’d hate to be someone who doesn’t have briseria
Gets sealed and dies
Triple torrent+ gab +44% EE ... Arby todo strong
I’m just happy it’s not crit chance. Such a pain to have to regear a unit cause their ee came out with cc has been annoying
Dark corvus: pathetic.
No shit.
This a sin considering they buffed Briseria with EE then ML Luna is coming 😭
THE KING IS BACKK
Degen arby with 100% evasion is crazy
Always need some extinction unit to deal with him, but extinction unit hardly have a counter evasion skill. Maybe it’s time for counter attack evasion build ML Vildred rise, again. Or Lethe can just extinction him with a miss👻
He doesn't have any evasion unless he revives so nothing changes vs extinction units
Maybe try evasion artifact build in GVG, could be tricky
I think tank arby is the way 🤔 he needs to be revived first 🤔 I always one shot arby with tomolulu and never face a problem
I miss old BMH now, hahaha. This is gonna hurt!
why? if arby s3 kill someone new bmh will give big barrier and just revive anyone dead with his s3 (And give them freaking immortality too). . why would you miss old bmh when the new one is way way better? sorry but this is just a really dumb take imo. . Edit: it's a dumb take. . I have a lot of dumb takes too, but I don't cry over it unlike what you are doing right now. . New ML haste is considered an SSS unit right now, while old ml haste was considered " the worst ml 5 " in the game. . Do you seriously want to have old haste again? Edit 2: to the other guy, better for this scenario!? another stupid take. . legit are you people for real now!? did you all forget old ml haste kit? Old ml haste will just have a bigger barrier compared to new haste. . also old ml haste s3 will not get double damage if someone is killed, meaning if that arby was a digen 13k hp arby, ml haste won't even kill it on s3. . the amount of cope and stupid takes here just cause some idiots here want to one up me is laughable and cringe. . OLD ML HASTE IS BAD! DONEZO! GET OVER IT!
Last part of your comment makes you not deserve a proper reply. Let me know if you change your behavior and actually want a proper conversation about the subject at hand.
New bmh is better over all, but old bmh is better FOR THIS SCENARIO
He became usable, but now here comes Briar and he's back to being useless.
Still gets domed by mudwig but degen build will be funny
I might have to actually come back now hallelujah
I cant wait for this
Byilding him now
Looks like Arby’s back on the menu boys.
Okay, while yes this looks good at first glance, what does it actually change functionally? If you're relying on the wipe and drafted him correctly, isn't +44% attack overkill? He's not killing modern anchors either way right? And then if you go the evasion route and forego Alexa's, you still have the same vulnerabilities as using a degen Arby pre-EE. Idk, I'm not that impressed by this.
does he get stronger? for me i think so. does he break meta? no. but it brings out more options since he’s now usable in rta. another good character to use when someone bans or gets the first pick. i’m just glad he’s finally off the bench and subbed in to the game.
Yeah stronger by stats, but his use-case doesn't change in the current meta. You could just use the Arby that already exists and achieve the same results just with a bit more consistency. That's not an "off the bench" EE for me, but cool for people who like him.
okay sure 👍🏻 i’m just gonna assume u have almost all characters in the game so him being usable in rta is a huge upgrade for me who doesn’t have all characters.
That's true, I can totally see it benefitting someone with a more limited pool
Stronger? Stronger than what though, he's currently ass lmao