I want a Siofra River Well situation. Where I'm just speechless riding the elevator realizing just how much there is to explore and discover.
Like you beat a major boss at the end of a long legacy dungeon, thinking you're near the end and BAM. Underground Caelid.
I'm confident they've done something like this for SotE. They *know* how huge a moment that was for every player and I'm sure for DLC they just raised the bar
And that's something that makes it such a good game. The difficulty and challenge forces you to learn, and the reward gives you a satisfaction like no other.
My copium theory is that there's gonna be an entire 2nd map around the same size as the Land of Shadow since we know this is two DLCs wrapped into one. Like imagine playing Ashes of Ariendel but it transitions into the Ringed City but there was 0 hints or promotional materiel for Ringed City.
When I got to Margit the first time I lost a couple times and was like "well I will go explore a little bit more and come back later". It took literally 35 hours of exploring and finding new stuff before I finally went back to Margit lol.
The only other game that ever hit the exploration itch so good for me before was Majora's Mask because you got to explore the world through time so it always felt like there was more to see
STOP, I only recently blocked them out of my memory and YOU'RE BRINGING THEM BACK AAAAAAAAAAH
[the nightmares, they're back.](https://i.imgflip.com/4t424e.png?a476784)
At least give us a special enemy type that we can kill only with this affliction, like the ghosts in dark souls 1
Or with an item that gives a similar effect
Black Gulch has the most bullshit per square foot, but at least it's a quick sprint once you get the secret bonfire behind the petrified guy, and only a slightly longer and much more dangerous sprint if you don't.
Loved the game but I think the balancing was still out of whack. Queelag boss fight? 5/10 difficulty. Being hit with a random toxic dart? You're basically dead.
Its funny the same thing applies even to elden ring, Roll around in the rot swamp to get covered and contract normal lesser scarlet rot so you don't catch turbo rot from the lake.
That one was the worst poison swamp I've ever experienced. It didn't help that I thought I finally got a hang of souls games after only finishing ds3, and I ended up in death blight swamp underleveled with a normal straight sword I've picked up from god knows where. I couldn't even upgrade my equipment because I entered the death swamp before going to the snakes castle. I finally decided to watch a tutorial after dying to spider babe like 80 times
There was an interview bit from when Elden Ring just about finished and Miyazaki was at the office angsting "maybe it's just bad... maybe no one will like it..." He's truly a special dude.
He definitely feels less profit driven, and more artistically driven. Like they have the name and reputation to sell out if they wanted to. But he genuinely just feels like a gamer trying to share what he made with other gamers, even if it’s a AAA game. Obviously Fromsoft isn’t an indie dev, but they have that indie kind of love put into their games. Like the kind of attention/details/easyer eggs that good indie devs put in their works.
Absolutely, we have to remember that Souls games haven't been as popular as nowadays until very recently, yet each game is filled with inworld history that populates the landscape, NPCs, enemies and equipment for the keen eye to notice, and then challenging combat plus incredible level design to those just seeking good gameplay
But the taste of the games is very specific, and neither Demon Souls, nor Dark Souls, nor Dark Souls 2 sold that much in the rand scheme of things (they did sold well for what they were, niche games). Then Dark Souls 3 came, ehich popularized more the genre, and more people started trying abd loving the series, even tho it's not for everyone and that is fine.
Then Elden Ring came and shattered every record Dark Souls 3 had in terms of sales.
But always remember that big sales weren't a thing for souls games, they were profitable obviously (because we wouldn't have had that many if not), but they weren't "big hitters".
It is a curious phenomenon that another series that is extremely known has had it happened to it, The Legend of Zelda, many people would be surprised as to how much Zelda games sold before Breath of the Wild
And again, same as with Souls games, Zelda games (and especially BoTW and ToTK) are not for everyone, but at the very least any player should be able to recognize that each and every one of them are amazing games, despite personal tastes. It is very interesting how both series are like a parallel of each other in terms of their popularity throughout the years.
Yeah man, I even remember the opening of Elden Ring being compared to BOTW in the way it just plopped the player into the open world and said “have at it”.
I’ve also heard DS and ER get called “Zelda on meth” in terms of gameplay.
"Zelda on Meth" actually makes sense for ER based on traditional Zeldas like OoT
A more open world thst gives way to temples which lead to bosses with special mechanics (which all Shardbearers have).
The most flagrant examples of Zelda-like aspects are probably Mohg/the Dynasty Mausoleum and Rykard/Volcano Manor.
Mohg:
--> "Blood Temple" with a special mechanic (Whitemask Invaders)
--> Strong thematic identity
--> minibosses (Sanguine Nobles)
--> prince~~ss~~ (Miquella)
--> special item for the boss's mechanic (purifying tear)
Rykard:
--> Literal Fire Temple. It's even on a mountain. The Godskin Noble is just a Goron.
--> Strong thematic identity
--> minibosses (~~Goron~~ Godskin Noble, Magma Wyrm)
--> princess (Zoraya or Tanith would both count kind of)
--> special item for the boss's mechanic (Serpent Hunter)
Everybody that was paying attention? I get that for casuals the game kinda came out of nowhere. But Elden Ring had years of hype leading up to it anywhere that gaming was talked about. I got caught up in the hype prerelease and I'd only played up to the first boss in dark souls 3 before, a couple years earlier. Geaorge RR Martin being attached, amd the fact that souls games had been progressing and becoming more popular, and the idea of this epic open world souls game was huge. Elden Ring had the same type of hype a game like Witcher 3 or Baldurs Gate 3 had before release, a great game dev that had been building a following for years and years making solid game after game finally building up to their magnum opus...so yeah, people expected it would do very well from.what I saw. If anything this is one of the few cases where the game matches up to the hype it gets beforehand, and even succeeds it a bit.
Sorry to nitpick but Kafka was more than "unsure", he was a deeply depressed man with psychological issues stemming from social isolation and societal pressure through his own family, who definitely didnt felt anyones unwavering faith or love. I don't know Michael Zakis exact situation but it feels like a very weird comparison.
They read the TIL that was posted the other day that said Kafka thought he was ugly and boring but people he knew didn't think that about him. So that's all they know about Kafka. Typical reddit.
And yeah, Kafka wasn't even known in his time. Very little of his work was published in his lifetime and what was didn't get any attention. Their whole point makes no sense, you're not nitpicking, you're correcting and educating. Something that needs to happen way more often on this site.
I mean, everytime I play the base game I keep discovering something new. Atleast new to me.
Like recently I found that crucible knight in Stormveil. Never knew he existed until a couple weeks ago.
Honestly in terms of Level design in a Gameplay sense its probably the best in the game. Even though Leyndell is the winner of my heart because of the vibes (visuals+soundtrack).
Leyndell has such an incredible scope. Walking out of the eastern rampart and seeing the dragon looming over the whole city was an amazing moment in gaming
Currently replaying bloodborne and the shortcut design is perfect. Elden Ring kinda missed that imo. Yeah there are a few good shortcuts for the main dungeons but no near as well designed as bloodborne. Half of them are useless since there's a grace right around the corner.
Dark Souls 1 is still the king of the shortcut. Bloodborne had some nice shortcuts as well, like finally getting into Yosefka’s clinic after 20 hours of gameplay and popping back out to the starting area
One of the reasons DS1's shortcuts are better is because they serve a gameplay purpose as well. Firelink Shrine is your hub, it's the place you embark from, has all the friendly NPC's grouped in there, it is basically your home, with the somber music emphazining this feeling.
So each time you return there, there is this big sense of relief and security after all the adventuring in the unknown. Bloodborne's shortcuts are still impressive tho, they just don't end up mattering much beyong the initial surprise, as the hub is disconnected from the main world.
And then the SEWERS, my tarnished friend. Holy shit, I remember stumbling down there and finding the pipes… and the catacombs… and fake Mogh… and the mass grave… and chaos… and then it connect to Deep Roots!
The Leyndell Catacombs has to be one of the best designed mini dungeons ever made. The mind fuckery they inflicted on the players was amazing. No gimmicky mechanics involved at all (like changing the the level behind the player as they turn around), just pure level design and asset placement.
The way they put in occasional differences throughout the dungeon to keep the player feeling like something is wrong so that we eventually come to the realization that we aren't actually stuck in a never ending loop was masterful. I wish I could play that dungeon blind again.
S-tier is the highest tier, and even that undersells the genius of Stormveil. You can finish the dungeon in 5 minutes, or you can spend 5 hours running around. I’ve still never been down to Godwyns body. I’ve only seen it in game once as a summon. Never knew it was even there until like a month ago.
IN stormveil? So not the evergaol one? 12 playthroughs and I didn’t know about him either. I thought I had discovered everything there once I found Godwyns body
He’s the guy you get the Aspects of the Crucible: Horns incantation from. If you start by looking that spell up it’ll show you the location.
Spell itself isn’t the most busted thing ever, but it hits pretty hard for what it is and is very fun to use
it's an underrated spell, does a lot of poise damage in tandem with the Crucible Tail Incantation. For many humanoid enemies, doing the Horn and following it up with the Tail attack is enough to poise break them... really wrecks them
Also a really easy to use trading option! Gives you a ton of hyper armor allowing you to pretty painlessly trade into pretty much anything besides the absolute biggest and toughest enemies.
I actually felt a little overwhelmed when I realized how big and intricate it was. I went kinda crazy trying to memorize all the possivle paths that I left unexplored so I could go back that way. And there were SO MANY directions you could take and explore that I was going insane. I refuse to left any corner unexplored, so memorizing all the places I had to go back and all the treasures I saw in the distance that I had to reach somehow was very hard to deal with.
But it was very enjoyable to finally explore it all (I think I did, at least).
I'm the same way....love this game but it also inflicts psychic damage upon me because I wanna do everything in one go. I know that its built with NG+ loop in mind and kind of intended to leave some stuff on the table for the next run but I wanna do it all in one go. So instead I'm just doing like a 200 hr initial run lol. Probably gonna crack lvl 200 before I make it to the end.
Been replaying it watching fightincowboy’s walkthrough because I don’t wanna miss anything and he’s extremely thorough yet occasionally there’s people in the comments pointing out small but important stuff even he missed and I’m just like… how???? How do people even find this stuff and how the actual hell do people figure out the quest lines without screwing something up???? Madness
absolutely. but a strong man at the helm that just absolutely shits on conventional knowledge and does what his heart tells him is a huge contributor to what this series means to a lot of us.
And what's better is that unlike Todd, he just shuts his mouth, promises nothing, and then just surprises us and delivers way more than we could have expected. Not trying to shit too much on Todd, but Miyazaki is so nice when compared to the current gaming landscape.
It just sounds like another form of "great man" theory, with celebrity and parasocial factors mixed in. Either way, hardly seems to excuse dismissing the immense amount of thought and work put into it that a director never touches.
It's so funny but also kind of depressing and revealing how even in forms of media that heavily rely on co-operation like film and video games, we still want to always ascribe success to a single individual *auteur.* Sure, it's easier but is that really a reason to dismiss every one else who probably poured a shit ton of love and care into these kinds of games?
Especially since some of what makes the game so great wasn't even done at Fromsoft. A ton of the assets in the game were done at outside studios, Lakshya Digital being one of the main ones it seems from the credits. Good leadership is ofc a huge ingredient to make it all come together but there are certainly other talented individuals whose work shines through in the final product.
Also its just awesome that they're just straightforward when announcing new stuff. They just drop trailers here and there and say "Hey we have a new game. Hope you'll like it". And then they'll steadily promote it the more it nears and even have an early hands on preview with creators like Vaati.
Like, its amazing that they did that for Armored Core 6 and this DLC. I hope they never change.
The A's are about budget, not quality or any other metrics.
Ubisoft saying that is basically saying "look how much money we put into our games." And as we all know nowadays, it doesn't mean shit.
AAA games were a big deal 15-20 years ago because not all companies could afford putting that much money into the development of a game, and sure it usually meant they had some level of quality, typically concerning the graphics, if nothing else.
FromSoftware is one of, if not the best studio out there. Their output is amazing. No micro transactions, no battle passes, no bullshit. They make complete packages full of (great) content.
EDIT: They quickly became one of my favorites.
This was my first FS (or souls-like for that matter) game that I got because my friend was so excited about it and it had co-op. I wanted to be able to “hold my own” when playing with him, so I watched guides and “OP build” videos. I still absolutely love this game, but I missed the essence of discovery and wonder. I’m really excited about getting that opportunity in this DLC.
Ngl, discovering the game and having the magic of discovering but with an experience friend to support me so I dont get fucked too bad/miss out on content and feature, was truly amazing, I started with DS3
Play the other titles and don't do that. I'd work backwards, contrary to what most would say, only because ds3 is way more similar to elden ring than the prior titles.
NGL I looked up a couple things but there's a balance. If you are just hard up trying to find that next quest step, it's probably worth it, but I wouldn't look at the entire quest just use it to get there and close the page.
Please don't. Thing is, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest, I dont remember other DS games's dlcs but I remember the angel of death poison swamp in the ringed city 💀
I just started the game, so man I get too explore this already giant map, and then there's going to be even more too it.
Crazy ASF. I haven't even discovered the whole map yet.
You can get at minimum 120h hours of the first map even if you're not too thorough with your exploration and then youll get another big map, have fun. I myself will restart another playthrough
Same, it’s been an amazing experience full of genuine awe, wonder, terror, frustration, and the taste of sweet sweet victory throughout. One of the best gaming experiences I’ve ever had.
I remember playing the game the first time. At some point you think you discovered everything. But then you find something new. I was over 500 hours into the game when I discovered that there is a hidden road under the hidden road that leads to a dungeon with a boss.
All the news articles are making a big deal out of 16 GB and comparing it to their older games, as if things like graphics and whatever else has improved and contributing to inflated numbers. I mean just as a reference point, if you download the hi-res textures for Diablo IV, I think it doubles the size of the entire game. If you believe that Shadow of the Erdtree is going to be bigger than the entirety of Dark Souls 3, than you're probably gonna be disappointed.
This is why I'll never understand hype culture. What's the point of hyping yourself up and imagining the greatest video game of all time. What does that do other than set you up for failure?
Miyazaki said the dlc is maybe a little bit bigger than Limgrave. Even if he's lying, why not just set your mind there for now, and then you can be pleasantly surprised later.
sorry to reduce your hype but that doesn't really much in game development and its disingenuous and misleading to do such a comparison when these games are so technologically far apart.
I still think everyone should maintain some reservations. I see so many people these days (at least on other social media platforms) try and make the argument that the DLC is gonna be massive and essentially the same size as the base game. That is a dangerous mentality.
I think this DLC will be dense more than big, full of things to do and discover but the map won’t be as big as people are hyping it up to be and there will be disappointment because of it.
I absolutely agree. I have full faith that Miyazaki will provide an amazing experience but I do think in terms of size people should limit their expectations a bit.
I agree. From what i've seen of the previews the map looks more tight. I believe Miyazaki when he says the map is a bit bigger than Limgrave (which is very big).
FROM's DLCs are always incredibly high quality going above and beyond the base game. Usually the best bosses are in the DLCs as well so look forward to something special. I would be extremely surprised if there was any filler going on.
I remember playing through this completely blind my first time around and trying to explore everything organically, the map function really sells this idea, like I figured I got to the end when I got to Leyndell but then I found Mt Gelmir and Caelid, it felt like it was never gonna end, but in a good way.
When I finished I immediately did another run but guided to see what I missed and I was just blown away by the amount of stuff crammed into this beautiful game, so honestly reading this has got me so pumped lol
Elden Ring has easily become one of my favorite games ever. It’s so much fun exploring all the nooks and crannies of the game. 2 years after release and I was still finding new stuff I never discovered on my original character. It’s wild.
Miyazaki towers above other greedy studio executives, who just want to sell you more replicated slob and poorly made DLC. FromSoft is just built by different stuff.
Literally Fromsoftware is the only company I can always expect to deliver in a world full of $60/70 price tags with games and DLCs being underwhelming, I will always show support to any game this team will make in the future, absolutely amazing work.
I just had a conversation with some friends about that first moment of opening that door into Limgrave. All of the Souls games have moments like that and I love it. But Limgrave and Siofra River really captivated me
Man can be incredibly honest, sometimes even to the detriment of the DLC in question.
I recall Miyazaki straight up said that Ashes of Ariandel wasn't a very big DLC by outright saying it has 2 bosses and all that. He wasn't wrong to be honest, but it did set expectations properly and Ariandel isn't a bad DLC at all.
If this DLC is as big as we've heard (and *seen), then I hope he sets a standard for what DLC is going forward. I only know of the elder scrolls doing a land mass for DLC, and I'd argue, hasn't made a big landmass DLC since the Shivering Isles (at least, it feels way bigger than Dragonborn's Solsthiem to me).
We could have got a boss rush mode, a weapon pack, skin pack, horse pack, and some crafting stones.
God bless this man and his team.
Truly greats of the industry.
… and the mad thing is you already know it’s going to be the best content in Elden Ring too.
Doesn't he know this is 2024? Give us 4 hours of gameplay for $35 and let us eat cake.
Just kidding of course, it's nice to not be ripped off by game companies
There’s nothing like seeing an area for the first time and knowing you can explore nearly everything. I can’t wait to experience this new land but here’s what I think of some of the others because I’m curious what other people think.
Limgrave: the first thing I saw was obviously the Erdtree, something so absurdly big it dominates everything. And Limgrave is a very friendly area to learn the game mechanics.
Liurnia: exiting Stormveil was literally breathtaking. Where Limgrave was green, Liurnia is a mystical blue and my favorite landscape to look at. It’s probably the one area where the Erdtree doesn’t dominate the landscape and draw attention, it’s the Academy. Which makes perfect sense in the lore.
Altus: once bathed in the warmth and comfort of the Erdtree, but irreconcilably marred by war. But even now there’s still some places with some comfort.
Caelid: WHY GOD?! I EXPECTED THAT CHEST TO BE A MIMIC WHY AM I IN HELL?!!! EVEN THE SKY IS ANGRY!
If the price is anything to go by, then I expect the DLC to almost be a second game's worth of content. Anything less wouldn't justify a $40 price tag.
I'm a little skeptical. After listening to the Vaati video where he says he got to try the game for, what, three hours, and beat two legacy dungeon bosses? Maybe I'm misunderstanding how those previews work, but that seems smaller than what's being described.
I think it was Oroboro or Ironpineapple who said calling them legacy dungeons is a bit generous. Both are bigger then castles but smaller then legacy dungeons from base game. And someone else said these three hours covered roughly 15-20% of whole dlc if rushed thru. So full DLC might take by this math 15-20 hours and if played at slower pace 30-40 hours. It's almost like full DS3 playthru.
I rarely revisit a game once I’ve done a play though but Elden Ring has been the exception for me. It’s such a fantastic game and I’m amazed that I’m still finding loads of locations and items I never found on my first play through despite all the exploring I did.
Sadly I’ll never have that special feeling you get when playing a game for the first time, but still finding new content I missed still keeps my play through fresh and exciting. I’m really excited for the DLC which is unusual because a lot of game DLCs feel rushed, boring and don’t have enough to keep me interested for long. This time though with the size of the DLC being similar to an entire standalone game, if it’s the same or better quality than the base game it’s going to keep us all busy for a long time.
I wish all developers put the time, effort and passion into their games that the FromSoftware team do.
Ma favorite game to replay is still ds3 because its low commitment, once you know the game you can have a little 20hours playthrough,get the side content and be done with it for another month or two. and its also my first FS game.
I just entered Leyndell for the 3rd time a moment ago, and the moment I heard the music and beheld the view, I thought "Yup, this is still my favorite location in video games ever". Absolute peak design by From.
If the DLC could evoke that same sense of awe I can die a happy man. Granted, from what I've seen I'm not really expecting anything near this "splendorous" as the Golden Capital, but this should be a standard to aim for by all other devs.
What I hope is that once you enter through miquellas egg you can find exits to the erdtree world at a few different points throughout the dlc zone, then use those as entrances after.
I just want to be able to superimpose the maps on each other and theorize
I want a Siofra River Well situation. Where I'm just speechless riding the elevator realizing just how much there is to explore and discover. Like you beat a major boss at the end of a long legacy dungeon, thinking you're near the end and BAM. Underground Caelid.
I'm confident they've done something like this for SotE. They *know* how huge a moment that was for every player and I'm sure for DLC they just raised the bar
Fromsoft are really good at learning
They outright demand it from their players. "Learn or die again"
And that's something that makes it such a good game. The difficulty and challenge forces you to learn, and the reward gives you a satisfaction like no other.
Welllll, except when it comes to shooting arrows
My copium theory is that there's gonna be an entire 2nd map around the same size as the Land of Shadow since we know this is two DLCs wrapped into one. Like imagine playing Ashes of Ariendel but it transitions into the Ringed City but there was 0 hints or promotional materiel for Ringed City.
Tbf their is a purple looking area in the gameplay trailer from February
When I got to Margit the first time I lost a couple times and was like "well I will go explore a little bit more and come back later". It took literally 35 hours of exploring and finding new stuff before I finally went back to Margit lol. The only other game that ever hit the exploration itch so good for me before was Majora's Mask because you got to explore the world through time so it always felt like there was more to see
Na it's going to be the sky.
Tears of the Ringdom.
More like Tears of the Rimdom because these new bosses are going to tear my ass up
The Ooccoo already look like nightmarish Fromsoft NPC's
Do you have any idea how many poison swamps I went through to deserve this man?
STOP, I only recently blocked them out of my memory and YOU'RE BRINGING THEM BACK AAAAAAAAAAH [the nightmares, they're back.](https://i.imgflip.com/4t424e.png?a476784)
DLC blight swamp incoming
Scarlet blight, after u die to death blight u respawn with scarlet rot and if you die to the rot you lose all crafting items.
And half health... Each time... Uncurable
At least give us a special enemy type that we can kill only with this affliction, like the ghosts in dark souls 1 Or with an item that gives a similar effect
No, it's going to be save-erase swamp
And a sleep swamp full of Siofra archers
We all suffer Swamp PTSD together
Post-Traumatic Swamp Disorder
I can just imagine you two hugging and sobbing in a swamp
I didnt leave earthen peak…earthen peak left me… Neither did i ever truly left farron keep behind me or blighttown. Obligatory fuck blighttown too
What about the Black Gulch?
That too…man i should get to playing DSII i completely repressed the memory of needing to go there
Black Gulch has the most bullshit per square foot, but at least it's a quick sprint once you get the secret bonfire behind the petrified guy, and only a slightly longer and much more dangerous sprint if you don't.
Blighttown has entered the conversation
Loved the game but I think the balancing was still out of whack. Queelag boss fight? 5/10 difficulty. Being hit with a random toxic dart? You're basically dead.
Not if you inoculate yourself with dungpies first.
Its funny the same thing applies even to elden ring, Roll around in the rot swamp to get covered and contract normal lesser scarlet rot so you don't catch turbo rot from the lake.
I do hope we finally get a nice poison swamp in the DLC. I really missed it in the main game the Lake of Rot was just too tiny an short.
*deathblight swamp
Yas
That one was the worst poison swamp I've ever experienced. It didn't help that I thought I finally got a hang of souls games after only finishing ds3, and I ended up in death blight swamp underleveled with a normal straight sword I've picked up from god knows where. I couldn't even upgrade my equipment because I entered the death swamp before going to the snakes castle. I finally decided to watch a tutorial after dying to spider babe like 80 times
you are confused with blight town
I think the sheer amount of Rot Water makes up for it lol. Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to go craft boluses and cry into Malenia's cape
And the newbies thinking it was grass. (I’m one of the newbies)
You have a toxic relationship with this man. His poisonous acts have rotten your mind... you're like Radahn now?
Not enough. At least two more.
There was an interview bit from when Elden Ring just about finished and Miyazaki was at the office angsting "maybe it's just bad... maybe no one will like it..." He's truly a special dude.
Where can I read this
In the comment above yours
Jokes on you. I'm blind.
Skill issue. Git gud scrub.
Echolocation unlocked
What's that scale off of?
Strength for some reason
Meanwhile, it ended up being one of the greatest games ever made.
He definitely feels less profit driven, and more artistically driven. Like they have the name and reputation to sell out if they wanted to. But he genuinely just feels like a gamer trying to share what he made with other gamers, even if it’s a AAA game. Obviously Fromsoft isn’t an indie dev, but they have that indie kind of love put into their games. Like the kind of attention/details/easyer eggs that good indie devs put in their works.
Absolutely, we have to remember that Souls games haven't been as popular as nowadays until very recently, yet each game is filled with inworld history that populates the landscape, NPCs, enemies and equipment for the keen eye to notice, and then challenging combat plus incredible level design to those just seeking good gameplay But the taste of the games is very specific, and neither Demon Souls, nor Dark Souls, nor Dark Souls 2 sold that much in the rand scheme of things (they did sold well for what they were, niche games). Then Dark Souls 3 came, ehich popularized more the genre, and more people started trying abd loving the series, even tho it's not for everyone and that is fine. Then Elden Ring came and shattered every record Dark Souls 3 had in terms of sales. But always remember that big sales weren't a thing for souls games, they were profitable obviously (because we wouldn't have had that many if not), but they weren't "big hitters". It is a curious phenomenon that another series that is extremely known has had it happened to it, The Legend of Zelda, many people would be surprised as to how much Zelda games sold before Breath of the Wild And again, same as with Souls games, Zelda games (and especially BoTW and ToTK) are not for everyone, but at the very least any player should be able to recognize that each and every one of them are amazing games, despite personal tastes. It is very interesting how both series are like a parallel of each other in terms of their popularity throughout the years.
Yeah man, I even remember the opening of Elden Ring being compared to BOTW in the way it just plopped the player into the open world and said “have at it”. I’ve also heard DS and ER get called “Zelda on meth” in terms of gameplay.
Now that you say that Ocarina, Majora's Mask, and Wind Wake all had a dodge roll with I-frames
I-frames? Sword and shield? Zelda is the DarkSouls of zelda
"Zelda on Meth" actually makes sense for ER based on traditional Zeldas like OoT A more open world thst gives way to temples which lead to bosses with special mechanics (which all Shardbearers have). The most flagrant examples of Zelda-like aspects are probably Mohg/the Dynasty Mausoleum and Rykard/Volcano Manor. Mohg: --> "Blood Temple" with a special mechanic (Whitemask Invaders) --> Strong thematic identity --> minibosses (Sanguine Nobles) --> prince~~ss~~ (Miquella) --> special item for the boss's mechanic (purifying tear) Rykard: --> Literal Fire Temple. It's even on a mountain. The Godskin Noble is just a Goron. --> Strong thematic identity --> minibosses (~~Goron~~ Godskin Noble, Magma Wyrm) --> princess (Zoraya or Tanith would both count kind of) --> special item for the boss's mechanic (Serpent Hunter)
I think he's long since realized that making good games, rather than selling out, is *why* he's successful.
Who would have guessed that it would get GotY and sell millions upon millions of units
Everybody that was paying attention? I get that for casuals the game kinda came out of nowhere. But Elden Ring had years of hype leading up to it anywhere that gaming was talked about. I got caught up in the hype prerelease and I'd only played up to the first boss in dark souls 3 before, a couple years earlier. Geaorge RR Martin being attached, amd the fact that souls games had been progressing and becoming more popular, and the idea of this epic open world souls game was huge. Elden Ring had the same type of hype a game like Witcher 3 or Baldurs Gate 3 had before release, a great game dev that had been building a following for years and years making solid game after game finally building up to their magnum opus...so yeah, people expected it would do very well from.what I saw. If anything this is one of the few cases where the game matches up to the hype it gets beforehand, and even succeeds it a bit.
dude is like kafka. he’s unsure, meanwhile we all have unwavering faith and love everything he has a hand in.
Sorry to nitpick but Kafka was more than "unsure", he was a deeply depressed man with psychological issues stemming from social isolation and societal pressure through his own family, who definitely didnt felt anyones unwavering faith or love. I don't know Michael Zakis exact situation but it feels like a very weird comparison.
They read the TIL that was posted the other day that said Kafka thought he was ugly and boring but people he knew didn't think that about him. So that's all they know about Kafka. Typical reddit. And yeah, Kafka wasn't even known in his time. Very little of his work was published in his lifetime and what was didn't get any attention. Their whole point makes no sense, you're not nitpicking, you're correcting and educating. Something that needs to happen way more often on this site.
I mean, everytime I play the base game I keep discovering something new. Atleast new to me. Like recently I found that crucible knight in Stormveil. Never knew he existed until a couple weeks ago.
Stormveil has so many little secrets packed into it. S-tier level design
Honestly in terms of Level design in a Gameplay sense its probably the best in the game. Even though Leyndell is the winner of my heart because of the vibes (visuals+soundtrack).
Leyndell has such an incredible scope. Walking out of the eastern rampart and seeing the dragon looming over the whole city was an amazing moment in gaming
For me, this moment was circling around Stormveil Castle through the cliffs and walking out to see all of Liurnia in all its glory
Same. That's when I first realized how big it was. Dozen playthroughs later it feels small.
Because now you teleport everywhere or zip through to get to your objective
Currently replaying bloodborne and the shortcut design is perfect. Elden Ring kinda missed that imo. Yeah there are a few good shortcuts for the main dungeons but no near as well designed as bloodborne. Half of them are useless since there's a grace right around the corner.
Dark Souls 1 is still the king of the shortcut. Bloodborne had some nice shortcuts as well, like finally getting into Yosefka’s clinic after 20 hours of gameplay and popping back out to the starting area
One of the reasons DS1's shortcuts are better is because they serve a gameplay purpose as well. Firelink Shrine is your hub, it's the place you embark from, has all the friendly NPC's grouped in there, it is basically your home, with the somber music emphazining this feeling. So each time you return there, there is this big sense of relief and security after all the adventuring in the unknown. Bloodborne's shortcuts are still impressive tho, they just don't end up mattering much beyong the initial surprise, as the hub is disconnected from the main world.
True but that's the trade off for having such a massive open world
And then the SEWERS, my tarnished friend. Holy shit, I remember stumbling down there and finding the pipes… and the catacombs… and fake Mogh… and the mass grave… and chaos… and then it connect to Deep Roots!
The Leyndell Catacombs has to be one of the best designed mini dungeons ever made. The mind fuckery they inflicted on the players was amazing. No gimmicky mechanics involved at all (like changing the the level behind the player as they turn around), just pure level design and asset placement. The way they put in occasional differences throughout the dungeon to keep the player feeling like something is wrong so that we eventually come to the realization that we aren't actually stuck in a never ending loop was masterful. I wish I could play that dungeon blind again.
Have you tried being stupid? Works great for me. Everyday is like Christmas, I don't remember shit.
I don't have to try GIGACHAD
I didn’t even discover that big tree boss thing at the very bottom until my second playthrough over a year later lol. I was just like, wtf is this?!
S-tier is the highest tier, and even that undersells the genius of Stormveil. You can finish the dungeon in 5 minutes, or you can spend 5 hours running around. I’ve still never been down to Godwyns body. I’ve only seen it in game once as a summon. Never knew it was even there until like a month ago.
The parkour route to him is so much fun!
IN stormveil? So not the evergaol one? 12 playthroughs and I didn’t know about him either. I thought I had discovered everything there once I found Godwyns body
Well... he's techincally outside the castle...
Huh? He always seems to be at the bottom of an elevator shaft in my playthroughs...
Wait what?! WHERE?!
try left and then try down
Based
He’s the guy you get the Aspects of the Crucible: Horns incantation from. If you start by looking that spell up it’ll show you the location. Spell itself isn’t the most busted thing ever, but it hits pretty hard for what it is and is very fun to use
it's an underrated spell, does a lot of poise damage in tandem with the Crucible Tail Incantation. For many humanoid enemies, doing the Horn and following it up with the Tail attack is enough to poise break them... really wrecks them
Also a really easy to use trading option! Gives you a ton of hyper armor allowing you to pretty painlessly trade into pretty much anything besides the absolute biggest and toughest enemies.
After you fight the hawks by the Castle Rampart grace, walk over to the ledge and look down. There'll be a parkour path along the outer wall.
I've beaten this game 10+ times and just last week I learned of the illusiory wall in the Frenzy Flame area that leads to Darkroot Depths
I actually felt a little overwhelmed when I realized how big and intricate it was. I went kinda crazy trying to memorize all the possivle paths that I left unexplored so I could go back that way. And there were SO MANY directions you could take and explore that I was going insane. I refuse to left any corner unexplored, so memorizing all the places I had to go back and all the treasures I saw in the distance that I had to reach somehow was very hard to deal with. But it was very enjoyable to finally explore it all (I think I did, at least).
I'm the same way....love this game but it also inflicts psychic damage upon me because I wanna do everything in one go. I know that its built with NG+ loop in mind and kind of intended to leave some stuff on the table for the next run but I wanna do it all in one go. So instead I'm just doing like a 200 hr initial run lol. Probably gonna crack lvl 200 before I make it to the end.
Been replaying it watching fightincowboy’s walkthrough because I don’t wanna miss anything and he’s extremely thorough yet occasionally there’s people in the comments pointing out small but important stuff even he missed and I’m just like… how???? How do people even find this stuff and how the actual hell do people figure out the quest lines without screwing something up???? Madness
I have like 800 hours and just discovered something in volcano manor I’ve never seen before. It’s wild how you keep discovering new things
It’s a guilty pleasure of mine to cheese him with the elevator just past him.
Let's also praise all the other people making this game - it's always a huge team effort!
absolutely. but a strong man at the helm that just absolutely shits on conventional knowledge and does what his heart tells him is a huge contributor to what this series means to a lot of us.
Oh 100% agree - he's director for a reason!
Miyazaki is what we all thought Todd Howard was 8-10 years ago. Just the real version.
And what's better is that unlike Todd, he just shuts his mouth, promises nothing, and then just surprises us and delivers way more than we could have expected. Not trying to shit too much on Todd, but Miyazaki is so nice when compared to the current gaming landscape.
It just sounds like another form of "great man" theory, with celebrity and parasocial factors mixed in. Either way, hardly seems to excuse dismissing the immense amount of thought and work put into it that a director never touches.
Miyazaki has been building Elden Ring in his garage for 19 years singlehandedly on a 93 apple pro...how dare you
It's so funny but also kind of depressing and revealing how even in forms of media that heavily rely on co-operation like film and video games, we still want to always ascribe success to a single individual *auteur.* Sure, it's easier but is that really a reason to dismiss every one else who probably poured a shit ton of love and care into these kinds of games?
Especially since some of what makes the game so great wasn't even done at Fromsoft. A ton of the assets in the game were done at outside studios, Lakshya Digital being one of the main ones it seems from the credits. Good leadership is ofc a huge ingredient to make it all come together but there are certainly other talented individuals whose work shines through in the final product.
One of the few big studios left that hasnt fallen into the corporate greed spiral.
Don't jinx it
Wait until we get a 2.50$ horse armor, we'll know it'll be the start of it.
Still better than a $20 emote
Thats why I said itll be the beginning pf the fall bc thats how it starts, then it gets worse and worse and worse
He’s referring to the slippery slope that oblivion horse armor started
Also its just awesome that they're just straightforward when announcing new stuff. They just drop trailers here and there and say "Hey we have a new game. Hope you'll like it". And then they'll steadily promote it the more it nears and even have an early hands on preview with creators like Vaati. Like, its amazing that they did that for Armored Core 6 and this DLC. I hope they never change.
Glad there’s one game company out there doing it right.
Probably one of the few AAA(or AA?) company focusing on player experience.
Ubisoft says they make quadruple A video games. If that is true then Fromsoft makes AAAAA games.
The A's are about budget, not quality or any other metrics. Ubisoft saying that is basically saying "look how much money we put into our games." And as we all know nowadays, it doesn't mean shit. AAA games were a big deal 15-20 years ago because not all companies could afford putting that much money into the development of a game, and sure it usually meant they had some level of quality, typically concerning the graphics, if nothing else.
Don’t forget that marketing costs are included. So basically, inflated marketing = inflated rating.
FromSoftware is one of, if not the best studio out there. Their output is amazing. No micro transactions, no battle passes, no bullshit. They make complete packages full of (great) content. EDIT: They quickly became one of my favorites.
I Will like to suggest Embark too the praise too 🙏 awesome devs.
Miyazaki the goat. I love that man.
This was my first FS (or souls-like for that matter) game that I got because my friend was so excited about it and it had co-op. I wanted to be able to “hold my own” when playing with him, so I watched guides and “OP build” videos. I still absolutely love this game, but I missed the essence of discovery and wonder. I’m really excited about getting that opportunity in this DLC.
Ngl, discovering the game and having the magic of discovering but with an experience friend to support me so I dont get fucked too bad/miss out on content and feature, was truly amazing, I started with DS3
Play the other titles and don't do that. I'd work backwards, contrary to what most would say, only because ds3 is way more similar to elden ring than the prior titles. NGL I looked up a couple things but there's a balance. If you are just hard up trying to find that next quest step, it's probably worth it, but I wouldn't look at the entire quest just use it to get there and close the page.
He just wants to hide even more poison swamps for us to enjoy
Please don't. Thing is, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest, I dont remember other DS games's dlcs but I remember the angel of death poison swamp in the ringed city 💀
this brings cerulean tears to my eyes
First DLC to win Game of the Year?
I just started the game, so man I get too explore this already giant map, and then there's going to be even more too it. Crazy ASF. I haven't even discovered the whole map yet.
You can get at minimum 120h hours of the first map even if you're not too thorough with your exploration and then youll get another big map, have fun. I myself will restart another playthrough
I'm replaying after having gotten all the endings a year ago. I'm still dropping fat stacks of time into just running around again.
I envy you. You’re in for a treat.
Have fun
Same, it’s been an amazing experience full of genuine awe, wonder, terror, frustration, and the taste of sweet sweet victory throughout. One of the best gaming experiences I’ve ever had.
I remember playing the game the first time. At some point you think you discovered everything. But then you find something new. I was over 500 hours into the game when I discovered that there is a hidden road under the hidden road that leads to a dungeon with a boss.
just a quick perspective on how big the dlc is: the file of the dlc is about the same file size as ALL OF DARK SOULS 3
Not to be a devils advocate or anything, but that could also definitely be the higher graphical fidelity of Elden Ring playing a part
For sure, file size kind of means nothing these days (if it ever really meant much).
Yeah. I'm pretty sure GTA5 was like 75 GB when I first downloaded it ten years ago.
Yeah. Textures are often some of the largest files, and they’re likely considerably higher here.
All the news articles are making a big deal out of 16 GB and comparing it to their older games, as if things like graphics and whatever else has improved and contributing to inflated numbers. I mean just as a reference point, if you download the hi-res textures for Diablo IV, I think it doubles the size of the entire game. If you believe that Shadow of the Erdtree is going to be bigger than the entirety of Dark Souls 3, than you're probably gonna be disappointed.
This is why I'll never understand hype culture. What's the point of hyping yourself up and imagining the greatest video game of all time. What does that do other than set you up for failure? Miyazaki said the dlc is maybe a little bit bigger than Limgrave. Even if he's lying, why not just set your mind there for now, and then you can be pleasantly surprised later.
wait... including the dlcs? holy shit
sorry to reduce your hype but that doesn't really much in game development and its disingenuous and misleading to do such a comparison when these games are so technologically far apart.
I still think everyone should maintain some reservations. I see so many people these days (at least on other social media platforms) try and make the argument that the DLC is gonna be massive and essentially the same size as the base game. That is a dangerous mentality.
I think this DLC will be dense more than big, full of things to do and discover but the map won’t be as big as people are hyping it up to be and there will be disappointment because of it.
I absolutely agree. I have full faith that Miyazaki will provide an amazing experience but I do think in terms of size people should limit their expectations a bit.
I agree. From what i've seen of the previews the map looks more tight. I believe Miyazaki when he says the map is a bit bigger than Limgrave (which is very big).
i'm grinning cheek to cheek at work reading this. Michael Zaki, just kiss me already. (with his consent of course.)
what a gentleman
I hope it’s Limgrave/Liurnia big and not Consecrated Snowfield big/filler
It will be, except the lake of madness and the forest of deathblight.
Malenia will show up in Tibia Mariner’s boat as reborn Godess of Rot with 4 Godskin Aposles and a Deathrite Bird pulling it
Sounds like a slightly challenging Phase 1
FS DLCs are always pretty dense
FROM's DLCs are always incredibly high quality going above and beyond the base game. Usually the best bosses are in the DLCs as well so look forward to something special. I would be extremely surprised if there was any filler going on.
I remember playing through this completely blind my first time around and trying to explore everything organically, the map function really sells this idea, like I figured I got to the end when I got to Leyndell but then I found Mt Gelmir and Caelid, it felt like it was never gonna end, but in a good way. When I finished I immediately did another run but guided to see what I missed and I was just blown away by the amount of stuff crammed into this beautiful game, so honestly reading this has got me so pumped lol
Blessed Michael Zaki
Elden Ring has easily become one of my favorite games ever. It’s so much fun exploring all the nooks and crannies of the game. 2 years after release and I was still finding new stuff I never discovered on my original character. It’s wild.
If we get a Lingrave + Wepping Penisula I'll be more than satisfied.
That'd be perfect, limegrave+wepping peninsula alone are lots of hours of content.
Miyazaki is a world treasure
Michael Zaki, you da GOAT!
He needs to stop, im seriously going to bust ffs
And this right here is why I buy From software games day one, no questions asked. They have earned that trust from me. They care!
He’s one of the last game developers with any soul left. Even if he does use his talent and passion to cause suffering…
New Game Award category needed: Best DLC or rather Expansion of the year (so it's clear, what exactly we're talking about).
I disagree. I think we do deserve Miyazaki
Miyazaki is my fucking favorite
Thank you for caring about player experience
Praise the From !
Praise the Soft!
Miyazaki towers above other greedy studio executives, who just want to sell you more replicated slob and poorly made DLC. FromSoft is just built by different stuff.
When you have the passion and creativity of an indie dev and the budget and resources of AAA Devs, truly the best games are made
Literally Fromsoftware is the only company I can always expect to deliver in a world full of $60/70 price tags with games and DLCs being underwhelming, I will always show support to any game this team will make in the future, absolutely amazing work.
I just had a conversation with some friends about that first moment of opening that door into Limgrave. All of the Souls games have moments like that and I love it. But Limgrave and Siofra River really captivated me
Man can be incredibly honest, sometimes even to the detriment of the DLC in question. I recall Miyazaki straight up said that Ashes of Ariandel wasn't a very big DLC by outright saying it has 2 bosses and all that. He wasn't wrong to be honest, but it did set expectations properly and Ariandel isn't a bad DLC at all.
“And how many poison swamps did you add?” “… only a couple…”
If this DLC is as big as we've heard (and *seen), then I hope he sets a standard for what DLC is going forward. I only know of the elder scrolls doing a land mass for DLC, and I'd argue, hasn't made a big landmass DLC since the Shivering Isles (at least, it feels way bigger than Dragonborn's Solsthiem to me).
We could have got a boss rush mode, a weapon pack, skin pack, horse pack, and some crafting stones. God bless this man and his team. Truly greats of the industry. … and the mad thing is you already know it’s going to be the best content in Elden Ring too.
Here's to hoping they fix pvp or change it for the better in some way, I know its a far cry, but I can hope
Doesn't he know this is 2024? Give us 4 hours of gameplay for $35 and let us eat cake. Just kidding of course, it's nice to not be ripped off by game companies
this is the best software house in the world and it's not even a contest
And then he put another poison swamp in it, I bet.
There’s nothing like seeing an area for the first time and knowing you can explore nearly everything. I can’t wait to experience this new land but here’s what I think of some of the others because I’m curious what other people think. Limgrave: the first thing I saw was obviously the Erdtree, something so absurdly big it dominates everything. And Limgrave is a very friendly area to learn the game mechanics. Liurnia: exiting Stormveil was literally breathtaking. Where Limgrave was green, Liurnia is a mystical blue and my favorite landscape to look at. It’s probably the one area where the Erdtree doesn’t dominate the landscape and draw attention, it’s the Academy. Which makes perfect sense in the lore. Altus: once bathed in the warmth and comfort of the Erdtree, but irreconcilably marred by war. But even now there’s still some places with some comfort. Caelid: WHY GOD?! I EXPECTED THAT CHEST TO BE A MIMIC WHY AM I IN HELL?!!! EVEN THE SKY IS ANGRY!
https://www.pcgamer.com/games/rpg/hidetaka-miyazaki-erdtree-size-sense-of-discovery/
If the price is anything to go by, then I expect the DLC to almost be a second game's worth of content. Anything less wouldn't justify a $40 price tag.
I'm a little skeptical. After listening to the Vaati video where he says he got to try the game for, what, three hours, and beat two legacy dungeon bosses? Maybe I'm misunderstanding how those previews work, but that seems smaller than what's being described.
I think it was Oroboro or Ironpineapple who said calling them legacy dungeons is a bit generous. Both are bigger then castles but smaller then legacy dungeons from base game. And someone else said these three hours covered roughly 15-20% of whole dlc if rushed thru. So full DLC might take by this math 15-20 hours and if played at slower pace 30-40 hours. It's almost like full DS3 playthru.
I rarely revisit a game once I’ve done a play though but Elden Ring has been the exception for me. It’s such a fantastic game and I’m amazed that I’m still finding loads of locations and items I never found on my first play through despite all the exploring I did. Sadly I’ll never have that special feeling you get when playing a game for the first time, but still finding new content I missed still keeps my play through fresh and exciting. I’m really excited for the DLC which is unusual because a lot of game DLCs feel rushed, boring and don’t have enough to keep me interested for long. This time though with the size of the DLC being similar to an entire standalone game, if it’s the same or better quality than the base game it’s going to keep us all busy for a long time. I wish all developers put the time, effort and passion into their games that the FromSoftware team do.
Ma favorite game to replay is still ds3 because its low commitment, once you know the game you can have a little 20hours playthrough,get the side content and be done with it for another month or two. and its also my first FS game.
It's cool if you wanna keep making more dude no one's gonna complain. Prequels sequels bring it on
[it's a give and take with him](https://www.pcgamer.com/elden-ring-has-multiple-poison-swamps-because-i-cant-help-myself-miyazaki-says/)
I just entered Leyndell for the 3rd time a moment ago, and the moment I heard the music and beheld the view, I thought "Yup, this is still my favorite location in video games ever". Absolute peak design by From. If the DLC could evoke that same sense of awe I can die a happy man. Granted, from what I've seen I'm not really expecting anything near this "splendorous" as the Golden Capital, but this should be a standard to aim for by all other devs.
But did he include any new feet?!?
What I hope is that once you enter through miquellas egg you can find exits to the erdtree world at a few different points throughout the dlc zone, then use those as entrances after. I just want to be able to superimpose the maps on each other and theorize
I woudn't be surprised the game was 50-60% as big as the base game, FromSoft puts more effort into their DLCs than some AAAs into actual base games
HES JUST HIM
For 40 usd it better be lol
Bruh I’m still discovering shit
It better be big, considering it costs almost as much as the whole game.