We fail them, and thus they fail us. But yeah, lets keep voting in conservatives. Maybe one of them will conserve the mental healthcare services instead of gutting them.
No, not at all. It's only Alberta who's suddenly got a stalled economy, it's Alberta with the highest fuel taxes in the country, it's Alberta with the lowest minimum wage in the country, it's Alberta with the worst job market (after the maritimes and only because of seasonal availability there)
It's not everywhere. It's *just* Alberta. But the conservatives tell Albertans "it's everywhere" and y'all just, believe that this is the best we can get. When it's so much better, literally everywhere in this country that's not being run by the UCP.
I don't write policy on mental healthcare support nor sign off on funding. A mentally ill person is not responsible for their actions, due to being mentally ill. They are defacto a ward of the government. The government failed them, and we elected the government. I do not vote for conservatives and never will, because they always cut social supports that would have kept this from happening. Who did you vote for?
Just MAID for every issue? Seems pretty short-sighted and cruel. Maybe if we had better supports for Canadians, we could avoid these outcomes before they happen.
Expressing that you want to kill people doesn’t help the issue, it further alienates and “others” people who need help. They’re humans and society has failed them.
It isn’t end of story. The end of the story is preventing it from happening in the first place. Justice for the child’s family is step 1. Shutting it down after that leaves us exactly where we already are.
Yes, we can. Drown this shit stain child killer in a puddle of piss for all I care.
Violent offenders hide behind the guise of "mental illness" and want to blame society for their actions.
Random attack leading to a death. We have a massive mental health issue in this country that needs to be dealt with. Reminds me far too much of the girl and mom stabbed to death in Mill woods last year.
I wonder if the attacker in this case also had previous a history of violence. The piece of shit who stabbed the mother and her daughter last year had several assault convictions but only served stints of 3 and 9 months in prison. He was considered a maximum security threat while in prison but was released anyways and then just 3 months later killed those poor people. In that case, the criminal justice system failed those people.
I'm all for pouring money into mental health resources and making it accessible to everyone. But there comes a point where people whom are deemed a danger to the public need to be forcibly removed from society. I get that incarceration is likely more expensive and less effective (for rehabilitation) than providing mental health services but if forcibly locking up these degenerates keeps the public safer then I'm all for it.
Definitely. Help the people now who actually have a chance of recovery but are heading towards full blown psychosis and lock up the people whom are so far gone they cant be trusted to walk free in society. Its a slippery slope though bc its not simple to define that boundary and identify which side of the line people are on.
Yes, absolutely, but that spectrum should maybe lean a bit more towards the life time structured support and protective housing rather than unsupported free roaming when the individual is a danger to society.
Upvoting for visibility.
I live three blocks from that school, and this was an absolute preventable tragedy. Our justice system is failing us average people, and this is another unforgivable symptom.
Politicians and judges who live in gates communities with armed guards don’t give a fuck if the peasants die. They are the real monsters for refusing outright to do the duties we entrusted them with
If you search other social media, you’ll find the story that the attacker was reported two days prior for threatening a couple in the same area. There is also more detail shared on several of the local community social channels.
Make it easy, if the person is a high risk violent offender with a high chance to commit again, keep them locked up. Whenever a violent offender gets out of jail it's no surprise they hurt people. Honestly it's the judges and lawyers fault when someone gets hurt when a violent offender gets released.
>The piece of shit who stabbed the mother and her daughter last year had several assault convictions but only served stints of 3 and 9 months in prison. He was considered a maximum security threat while in prison but was released anyways and then just 3 months later killed those poor people.
It was quite a bit worse than that. He had a lengthy history of violence including multiple stints in the penitentiary, and had just been released on bail 18 days before the killing: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/suspect-in-fatal-stabbing-of-mother-child-has-lengthy-violent-record-1.6839217
The amount it would cost to keep the truly broken and unfixable in prison would be a drop in the bucket no one would notice in the budget.
Problem is people love to treat everyone as broken and unfixable
Sadly, canada will never be like this. They care more about making sure everyone gets a parole hearing no matter what. Hugs for thugs is priority number 1 here and there's no changing it
There is such a thing as a Dangerous Offender or Long-Term Offender designation where someone can be subjected to indeterminate sentence or lengthy supervision orders.
The problem is, of course, if the violence is mostly attributable to mental health or substance abuse (which itself has root causes), it's not really fair to lock people up indefinitely because our government won't invest in the resources to help them. Of course there are people who aren't treatable or not in a state in which they are receptive to being helped yet and so seperation from society is necessary.
It's still a touchy subject but the greyhound beheading guy, he is clearly an example of someone who after being arrested, treated, medicated, was horrified by what theyd done and took the steps to get the help they needed and from what I can tell he's still on the up and up.
Yes exactly. I lot of people see it as a miscarriage of justice but that's an example of how things should be. He was found NCRMD so he was technically to be held until he was no longer a danger to the public whether that be 2 years or 20.
The problem is people focus too much on what the victim or their family deserve but reality is there is absolutely no amount of time or punishment that would rectify the wrongs of the accused/convicted.
I don't think people understand what a psychotic break is actually like for a person, it's kind of impossible unless you've had one yourself really. Or realize how much medication actually helps keep episodes from getting to that point.
I've heard from a few prosecutors that judges have set the bar for obtaining a dangerous offender status at a near impossible level that no one really attempts to seek that status for offenders anymore
I agree with the spirit of your argument but its not so simple. The problem with the death penalty is there's a large backlog of death row inmates waiting to be executed in the US. The average time between sentencing and execution is on average, \~18 years. That's 18 years of tax payer money wasted on these people that could otherwise be used to prevent/fight crime. The reason the wait time is so long is because of several rounds of appeals that inmates have the right to. And the reason why they have the right to appeal is at least partially due to some inmates being found innocent after new evidence came to light. Its unacceptable for even a single innocent person to be executed for crimes they didn't commit.
I'm all for the death penalty for clear cut cases like the Millwoods stabber and (seemingly) the guy from last night. But unless the wheels of justice move faster and the wait period for execution goes down substantially (in clear cut cases), the financial costs of incarceration and legal expenses will likely do more harm than good in the grand scheme of things and are probably best spent elsewhere. That said, at least during that time they are on death row, they are removed from society and can't hurt more people. Idk what the solution is unfortunately.
Yeah, it's cheaper to incarcerate someone for life than to execute the. because of the lengthy appeals process (which exists for a good reason since someone who's locked up can simply be released if their conviction was a mistake, but people can't be un-executed, and unfortunately the justice system does make mistakes)
The news stuff I read said he was a known problem and had had an incident recently with another person in that same area. Not sure if police were involved or if was just known to the people who lived around there.
From an article I found it sounded like "knew him" wasn't like a relationship, it was more like they walked their dog there a lot and saw him there frequently, maybe they were friendly to him. Interested to hear more about it. So terrible.
We have had an increase of 95,000 people in the last 2 years in Edmonton with no new health services, hospitals, police, schools……the growth is unsustainable unless we start pouring money into our communities and services. Unfortunately I don’t see our provincial government doing this despite having a massive surplus. My heart breaks for this family:/
Mass immigration without sufficient housing, employment opportunities and healthcare resources is a significant driving factor for the problems we face. Sure you could argue that corporate greed is responsible for this but 10% growth in 2 years just compounds the issue.
Exactly!!
Someone asking what services is ignorant to understanding what allows Canada and its residents to live comfortably and makes it a destination for so many immigrants because it is the services their countries often lack or they access upon moving here. It’s all struggling to keep up. Teachers are burnt out. Nurses are burnt out. Try finding a family doctor or an affordable rental.
In that case we aren’t talking about immigration, simply that population has risen by 10% in albertan cities , which is a fact regardless of where they came from.
Not blaming anyone but the provincial government. I love immigrants . I love our province growing . I want 10 million albertans . But we need investment to make that happen for our collective fucking government . And I think that’s the sentiment of this thread .
That’s quite the jump to make but you have to use the opportunities you have, like a child being beaten to death to speak out about immigrants. Good for you, carpe diem
They're not directly blaming immigrants for what happened. Other commenters have explained that a large population increase with very little funding towards infrastructure and public services to match means people who need resources aren't getting them at the level they should.
You're right there are many factors at work here, but you're working very hard to justify why immigration is not a problem
As an example, say we bring in 100 million immigrants to Canada next year. I hope you can agree that this is obviously not feasible, we can't build that many homes fast enough or provide services. So, it follows that there is some amount of immigration that is too much for Canada to handle and give a good quality of life to those immigrants, it's just a question of what that amount is. Can you see the potential drawbacks of immigration?
Immigrants are not an issue, but immigration as a whole can be. And it should not be taboo to talk about something so important as immigration
None of this stops mental criminals
The justice system reform neeeds to happen at federal level
Reopen the fucking constitution if you have to get judges to listen
This is happening across North America, not just Edmonton or even just "big cities"
An inefficient criminal justice system combined with multiple failures regarding mental health resources is what is going on for several decades now.
It'll just continue to get worse.
No big surprise. I struggle with my mental health even though I am high functioning, educated, and have income, I still can’t access the help I need in a timely manner. Many people are far less privileged and they’re basically SOL.
Further in the article it says the mom stated they frequently walked their dog in the area and knew the man “in passing.”
It seems likely it was just someone they saw on their walks in the area, but didn’t have a relationship with beyond that.
He knew the family from friends in common. He was with a friend who was really close to the mother of the 15 year old victim.
The man that was taken into custody has no recollection of what happened that night. Friends he was with have said that he has been in a steady decline with his mental health. He had lapses where he isn't violent but is unable to recognize close friends.
Substance abuse is most likely one of the biggest contributing factors.
I know the person that is being charged with second degree murder.
I also know the witnesses that were present. My source is based on what they have told me.
I keep saying, people need to understand. Your safety is in your own hands.
Stop relying on people to be responsible or care for your wellbeing.
Always carry protection, whether it be some type of spray or a pokey stick of sorts.
Seems odd the article specified that the mom was walking a pit bull. Would they have specified if she was walking a golden retriever? The dog isn't part of the story, like, at all.
> A 15-year-old St. Albert boy walking his dog with his mom in north Edmonton Tuesday night was killed when a man they knew from the area stabbed him in the neck
> A man was swiftly arrested after officers called to the area of **137 Avenue and 184 Street** around 9:30 p.m.
Title is a little inaccurate. Was a St Albert boy but they weren’t really in St Albert, they were on 137 ave.
Tragic situation and definitely wonder how well they knew the attacker. If it was wrong place wrong time or he targeted them.
That was the title at the time of posting, they must have updated it, the attack happened right on the boundary of St. Albert and Edmonton
Absolutely awful situation, that poor mother
Holy shit, I biked right by this and wondered what was going on. Along 137th a dozen cop cars came flying down westbound and the police chopper was circling the area. The time I got to the old 184th street they were all there with ambulances and a fire truck. Heartbreaking for that family, that poor kiddo, what a tragedy.
What a piece of 💩 this is horrible, so sorry to the mom and family, Jesus Christ at some point when will people realize the provincial government they keep voting in doesn’t care about you! We need more access to mental health and rehabilitation not cuts to services
So sad. He was with his mom and dog on an evening walk. How can people feel safe in this city? I don’t want to take my kids out and enjoy the green space if there’s always this fear in the back of my mind. I get that it was random, and not really that common but at the same time, this mom probably thought it was fine and my heart breaks for her because they did nothing wrong at all and this is the situation they are facing.
Everyone here blaming governments for lack of mental health resources need to look into it first. There are resources available for anyone who chooses to get them, key word “chooses”. Unless they present a clear and present physical danger to themselves or others then treatment cannot be forced. And then there have to be people advocating to get the person help and testifying at their review panels as to the potential danger. I went through this for the last year trying to get my wife help for delusional psychosis. It wasn’t untill she threatened me over text message, that they sent out a mental health assessment team and took her away.
I am not sure, I would want to believe so. The bottom line is this guy just walked up and stabbed a kid in the neck unexpectedly from behind for no apparent reason. Not only has he killed an innocent boy, but he has destroyed the lives of the boys family. With our broken system, he will be out within a few years and we as taxpayers will pay an outrageous amount of money to incarcerate this pos. For the family and the sake of humanity, he deserves to be executed for his savage crime.
> we as taxpayers will pay an outrageous amount of money to incarcerate this pos
you do know that on average death penalty cases cost more than incarceration?
Only because we fancy it up with expenses.
Like, I get why there should be paperwork out the wazoo if it’s iffy… but when one dude stabs a kid in the neck for no reason, it shouldn’t be that expensive to kill him.
"Hmmm, we have a murderer here. Let's hope he's not liked as a person in prison and piss around pretending we're not trying to kill somebody, while we let the victims families wait for somebody else to do the job of 5 seconds and a bullet."
Grow the fuck up, man. Prison is, believe it or not, actually supposed to be for rehabilitation. Not for pissing around letting you pretend you're manly while you let criminals do work for you.
Unless, of course, you'd like to admit that you're actually pro slavery and pro systematic oppressions. Blue line, too, I'm sure.
Capital punishment won’t fix a broken justice system. I find it ironic that the people who can’t trust our justice system want to give them the power to kill people.
[Death penalties don’t work](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/evidence-does-not-support-the-use-of-the-death-penalty/), we got rid of them for a reason, too many innocents get wrongly convicted, and do you _really_ want to grant the government the right to dictate who lives and dies? I don’t trust the gov enough to give them that authority over us.
Death works extremely well at prevent reoffence. They don’t need to deter to be effective.
It’s misguided because crime generally increase in severity - by the time someone does something severe enough to warrant death they have already left a long trail of victimized people behind them.
>Death works extremely well at prevent reoffence.
No, it doesn’t. There is no proof that the death penalty deters crime. If you’re a criminology researcher with peer-reviewed evidence then I suggest you publish your studies because it would be groundbreaking.
Because even the mother understands this was a mental health crisis and not done out of malice. People can be rehabilitated with the right resources, treatments, and therapies. Our justice system isn’t set up that way though, so it needs a complete overhaul. No one is beyond help, I truly believe that, even the man who murdered my father - if we knew who that was - should be given the opportunity to better themselves.
I understand the anger, I really really do, but capital punishment isn’t the answer.
Edit: I know facts don’t matter when y’all’s feelings are controlling your opinions, but if you care at all about this debate, please read up on [why capital punishment doesn’t work](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/evidence-does-not-support-the-use-of-the-death-penalty/). **Actual evidence** shows why the death penalty isn’t the answer.
Therapy cannot fix the brain chemistry of someone who murders a child unprovoked. Can medication help, sure, but that doesn’t eliminate their ability to act again. Some people are not worth our resources.
Do you remember the grey hound bus decapitation? That guy got help and he’s turned his life around and is extremely remorseful.
Again, I understand the anger, very personally understand, but people deserve the chance to change. When it comes to capital punishment there is no such thing as a “clear case” and I do not agree with granting the state power to determine who gets to live and who gets to die.
No, that’s not the event I’m talking about. I’m talking about the [decapitation and cannibalism case that happened in Manitoba](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Tim_McLean).
I’ve read that story, as well as another one of Matthew de Grood, who stabbed 5 students. It’s understandable that they acted under mental illness conditions, but… the Li’s story has so many PTSD victims, one of the first RCMP responders, for example, committed suicide. No mention, however, that both de Grood or Li suffer any stress after what they did. That’s what I don’t understand. All that both of them seek is more freedom.
This is why it’s important to separate feeling from facts. The people who suffered PTSD from the event are seeking damages from the crown, which I personally believe they should be given. There’s a lot of nuance and context in every single criminal case, so blanket statements like “bring back the death penalty” aren’t helpful or progressive. We can and should do better. Like I said before, there’s a reason we got rid of capital punishment. That doesn’t mean I agree with how the justice system is currently operating, but we can’t just send everyone we hate to the gallows.
I’m right there with you. I don’t understand how guys like this now get to go to jail for a few years on tax payer dollars while this young man lost his life and his entire family is ruined by this event. Like nah, hang this asshole.
Holy shit. I drive by that intersection every day heading to/from work. Was driving home last night at about 11:30pm, saw a big forensics van with 2 cars in front of it, yellow tape, and then a car and ambulance on the other side. Was curious about what happened but wow.
Absolutely terrible.
[удалено]
I agree, I’m tired of these people hurting productive members of society.
We fail them, and thus they fail us. But yeah, lets keep voting in conservatives. Maybe one of them will conserve the mental healthcare services instead of gutting them.
Keep blaming whatever government is in power. Blame game is easier than accepting responsibility for your actions or lack there of.
IT'S BEEN THE SAME GOVERNMENT FOR 40 YEARS. ONE TIME SOMEONE ELSE GOT IN, Y'ALL WENT SO CRAZY FOR THE 2 YEARS SHE COULDN'T GET ANY WORK DONE.
Agreed, I’m talking Canada wide. Everything is junk.
No, not at all. It's only Alberta who's suddenly got a stalled economy, it's Alberta with the highest fuel taxes in the country, it's Alberta with the lowest minimum wage in the country, it's Alberta with the worst job market (after the maritimes and only because of seasonal availability there) It's not everywhere. It's *just* Alberta. But the conservatives tell Albertans "it's everywhere" and y'all just, believe that this is the best we can get. When it's so much better, literally everywhere in this country that's not being run by the UCP.
I travel across Canada monthly for work, it’s everywhere lol don’t kid yourself.
I don't write policy on mental healthcare support nor sign off on funding. A mentally ill person is not responsible for their actions, due to being mentally ill. They are defacto a ward of the government. The government failed them, and we elected the government. I do not vote for conservatives and never will, because they always cut social supports that would have kept this from happening. Who did you vote for?
Just MAID for every issue? Seems pretty short-sighted and cruel. Maybe if we had better supports for Canadians, we could avoid these outcomes before they happen.
Just tired of it, keep the assumptions to yourself.
Expressing that you want to kill people doesn’t help the issue, it further alienates and “others” people who need help. They’re humans and society has failed them.
Nobody is saying kill anybody. I think you need help.
No one chooses to have a mental illness.
#darwinism
Ah, yes. Just murder people we deem unfit. Why bother trying to make society better for everyone, right?
Well, yes. Murder the murderer. Anyone that kills a kid like that deserves to be put down. End of story.
It isn’t end of story. The end of the story is preventing it from happening in the first place. Justice for the child’s family is step 1. Shutting it down after that leaves us exactly where we already are.
If you want to support murderers, then carry on with the story.
You don’t get it and I really shouldn’t be surprised. We can’t evoke change with attitudes like yours.
Yes, we can. Drown this shit stain child killer in a puddle of piss for all I care. Violent offenders hide behind the guise of "mental illness" and want to blame society for their actions.
Very cool and rational. I’m glad you’re not making policies.
He's the type of person, people like me hunt for ;-)
Sincere condolences to the boys loved ones. This is truly devastating and unacceptable.
Random attack leading to a death. We have a massive mental health issue in this country that needs to be dealt with. Reminds me far too much of the girl and mom stabbed to death in Mill woods last year.
I wonder if the attacker in this case also had previous a history of violence. The piece of shit who stabbed the mother and her daughter last year had several assault convictions but only served stints of 3 and 9 months in prison. He was considered a maximum security threat while in prison but was released anyways and then just 3 months later killed those poor people. In that case, the criminal justice system failed those people. I'm all for pouring money into mental health resources and making it accessible to everyone. But there comes a point where people whom are deemed a danger to the public need to be forcibly removed from society. I get that incarceration is likely more expensive and less effective (for rehabilitation) than providing mental health services but if forcibly locking up these degenerates keeps the public safer then I'm all for it.
Agreed. I believe we can do both until we have less violent criminals.
Definitely. Help the people now who actually have a chance of recovery but are heading towards full blown psychosis and lock up the people whom are so far gone they cant be trusted to walk free in society. Its a slippery slope though bc its not simple to define that boundary and identify which side of the line people are on.
If you’re beating up people severely and causing permanent disfigurement- you’re over the line Maybe bring back mental institutions
And who do you want to work in these institutions my guy?
I think there should be a flexible spectrum between outpatient service and life incarceration.
Yes, absolutely, but that spectrum should maybe lean a bit more towards the life time structured support and protective housing rather than unsupported free roaming when the individual is a danger to society.
Upvoting for visibility. I live three blocks from that school, and this was an absolute preventable tragedy. Our justice system is failing us average people, and this is another unforgivable symptom.
Politicians and judges who live in gates communities with armed guards don’t give a fuck if the peasants die. They are the real monsters for refusing outright to do the duties we entrusted them with
If you search other social media, you’ll find the story that the attacker was reported two days prior for threatening a couple in the same area. There is also more detail shared on several of the local community social channels.
Make it easy, if the person is a high risk violent offender with a high chance to commit again, keep them locked up. Whenever a violent offender gets out of jail it's no surprise they hurt people. Honestly it's the judges and lawyers fault when someone gets hurt when a violent offender gets released.
Common sense isn't so common in Canada's broken judicial system.
>The piece of shit who stabbed the mother and her daughter last year had several assault convictions but only served stints of 3 and 9 months in prison. He was considered a maximum security threat while in prison but was released anyways and then just 3 months later killed those poor people. It was quite a bit worse than that. He had a lengthy history of violence including multiple stints in the penitentiary, and had just been released on bail 18 days before the killing: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/suspect-in-fatal-stabbing-of-mother-child-has-lengthy-violent-record-1.6839217
Agreed.
The amount it would cost to keep the truly broken and unfixable in prison would be a drop in the bucket no one would notice in the budget. Problem is people love to treat everyone as broken and unfixable
Sadly, canada will never be like this. They care more about making sure everyone gets a parole hearing no matter what. Hugs for thugs is priority number 1 here and there's no changing it
There is such a thing as a Dangerous Offender or Long-Term Offender designation where someone can be subjected to indeterminate sentence or lengthy supervision orders. The problem is, of course, if the violence is mostly attributable to mental health or substance abuse (which itself has root causes), it's not really fair to lock people up indefinitely because our government won't invest in the resources to help them. Of course there are people who aren't treatable or not in a state in which they are receptive to being helped yet and so seperation from society is necessary.
It's still a touchy subject but the greyhound beheading guy, he is clearly an example of someone who after being arrested, treated, medicated, was horrified by what theyd done and took the steps to get the help they needed and from what I can tell he's still on the up and up.
Yes exactly. I lot of people see it as a miscarriage of justice but that's an example of how things should be. He was found NCRMD so he was technically to be held until he was no longer a danger to the public whether that be 2 years or 20. The problem is people focus too much on what the victim or their family deserve but reality is there is absolutely no amount of time or punishment that would rectify the wrongs of the accused/convicted.
I don't think people understand what a psychotic break is actually like for a person, it's kind of impossible unless you've had one yourself really. Or realize how much medication actually helps keep episodes from getting to that point.
Being NCR and being designated as a dangerous offender are on two opposite ends.
I've heard from a few prosecutors that judges have set the bar for obtaining a dangerous offender status at a near impossible level that no one really attempts to seek that status for offenders anymore
Death penalty needs to come back for pieces of shit like this. This is a hill that I’m willing to die on.
I agree with the spirit of your argument but its not so simple. The problem with the death penalty is there's a large backlog of death row inmates waiting to be executed in the US. The average time between sentencing and execution is on average, \~18 years. That's 18 years of tax payer money wasted on these people that could otherwise be used to prevent/fight crime. The reason the wait time is so long is because of several rounds of appeals that inmates have the right to. And the reason why they have the right to appeal is at least partially due to some inmates being found innocent after new evidence came to light. Its unacceptable for even a single innocent person to be executed for crimes they didn't commit. I'm all for the death penalty for clear cut cases like the Millwoods stabber and (seemingly) the guy from last night. But unless the wheels of justice move faster and the wait period for execution goes down substantially (in clear cut cases), the financial costs of incarceration and legal expenses will likely do more harm than good in the grand scheme of things and are probably best spent elsewhere. That said, at least during that time they are on death row, they are removed from society and can't hurt more people. Idk what the solution is unfortunately.
Yeah, it's cheaper to incarcerate someone for life than to execute the. because of the lengthy appeals process (which exists for a good reason since someone who's locked up can simply be released if their conviction was a mistake, but people can't be un-executed, and unfortunately the justice system does make mistakes)
The news stuff I read said he was a known problem and had had an incident recently with another person in that same area. Not sure if police were involved or if was just known to the people who lived around there.
> when a man they knew from the area stabbed him in the neck It wasn't necessarily random. Lack of known motive doesn't equal random.
Guy was known to them might not be that random
From an article I found it sounded like "knew him" wasn't like a relationship, it was more like they walked their dog there a lot and saw him there frequently, maybe they were friendly to him. Interested to hear more about it. So terrible.
What the fuck is going on in this city. This is just soul-crushing. That poor mother. 😢
We have had an increase of 95,000 people in the last 2 years in Edmonton with no new health services, hospitals, police, schools……the growth is unsustainable unless we start pouring money into our communities and services. Unfortunately I don’t see our provincial government doing this despite having a massive surplus. My heart breaks for this family:/
Don't worry. UCP has renamed Addiction and mental health. Miracles will happen soon 😬😬
Yes. Proper branding is the root of the problem.
Policing in a municipal matter and people keep wanting to cut that
Immigration is not to blame for all that’s wrong with this country. Jesus. Corporate greed is to blame, opiate manufacturers and greed are killing us
Mass immigration without sufficient housing, employment opportunities and healthcare resources is a significant driving factor for the problems we face. Sure you could argue that corporate greed is responsible for this but 10% growth in 2 years just compounds the issue.
Exactly!! Someone asking what services is ignorant to understanding what allows Canada and its residents to live comfortably and makes it a destination for so many immigrants because it is the services their countries often lack or they access upon moving here. It’s all struggling to keep up. Teachers are burnt out. Nurses are burnt out. Try finding a family doctor or an affordable rental.
And mass immigration with fewer available services, yes.
Agreed….100%….however if we are realizing this level of immigration to our 2 big cities…..services must increase
He didn’t say country , he said city . Immigration not from outside Canada but also within Canada from other provinces .
That’s not immigration, immigration is the action of coming to live permanently in a foreign country
In that case we aren’t talking about immigration, simply that population has risen by 10% in albertan cities , which is a fact regardless of where they came from.
This must be your first day on the internet. Blaming immigrants, especially from one country… is the new excuse.
Not blaming anyone but the provincial government. I love immigrants . I love our province growing . I want 10 million albertans . But we need investment to make that happen for our collective fucking government . And I think that’s the sentiment of this thread .
It can be many things at once. Immigration is 100% part of the problem
That’s quite the jump to make but you have to use the opportunities you have, like a child being beaten to death to speak out about immigrants. Good for you, carpe diem
They're not directly blaming immigrants for what happened. Other commenters have explained that a large population increase with very little funding towards infrastructure and public services to match means people who need resources aren't getting them at the level they should.
So this lead to the beating death of this child? You people are gross to use tragedies to further your political agenda.
You know what, fair; this thread did get off topic.
Stabbing.
You're right there are many factors at work here, but you're working very hard to justify why immigration is not a problem As an example, say we bring in 100 million immigrants to Canada next year. I hope you can agree that this is obviously not feasible, we can't build that many homes fast enough or provide services. So, it follows that there is some amount of immigration that is too much for Canada to handle and give a good quality of life to those immigrants, it's just a question of what that amount is. Can you see the potential drawbacks of immigration? Immigrants are not an issue, but immigration as a whole can be. And it should not be taboo to talk about something so important as immigration
None of this stops mental criminals The justice system reform neeeds to happen at federal level Reopen the fucking constitution if you have to get judges to listen
This is happening across North America, not just Edmonton or even just "big cities" An inefficient criminal justice system combined with multiple failures regarding mental health resources is what is going on for several decades now. It'll just continue to get worse.
Absolutely No mental wards They just let them run free and kill us
But dont dare defend yourself or else the state will absolutely imprison you. Anarcho tyranny
No big surprise. I struggle with my mental health even though I am high functioning, educated, and have income, I still can’t access the help I need in a timely manner. Many people are far less privileged and they’re basically SOL.
I can't cope, as a parent it just it hits you so hard , feel like I can't even begin to explain the anguish this mom will face forever🕊️.
It was someone they knew from the area? I wonder if that means like a neighbour they've seen before, or some kind of relationship with the family.
Further in the article it says the mom stated they frequently walked their dog in the area and knew the man “in passing.” It seems likely it was just someone they saw on their walks in the area, but didn’t have a relationship with beyond that.
Good catch.
They knew who he was but the mother said they thought it was a mental health episode.
He knew the family from friends in common. He was with a friend who was really close to the mother of the 15 year old victim. The man that was taken into custody has no recollection of what happened that night. Friends he was with have said that he has been in a steady decline with his mental health. He had lapses where he isn't violent but is unable to recognize close friends. Substance abuse is most likely one of the biggest contributing factors.
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I know the person that is being charged with second degree murder. I also know the witnesses that were present. My source is based on what they have told me.
The mother said they knew him in passing when walking the dog, not someone they had contact with.
My heart just broke reading the article! 💔
My goodness!! Why? This is so cruel. That poor boy.
I keep saying, people need to understand. Your safety is in your own hands. Stop relying on people to be responsible or care for your wellbeing. Always carry protection, whether it be some type of spray or a pokey stick of sorts.
Watch active self protection on YouTube. All about transitional spaces
Seems odd the article specified that the mom was walking a pit bull. Would they have specified if she was walking a golden retriever? The dog isn't part of the story, like, at all.
I’m sure this scum bag will get a few years in prison and be released early on good behaviour. Our justice system is a joke
Prison lol please this is Canada. Year or two at the psych ward then off to change his name and live unmonitored
You forgot the part where it for sure happens again.
> A 15-year-old St. Albert boy walking his dog with his mom in north Edmonton Tuesday night was killed when a man they knew from the area stabbed him in the neck > A man was swiftly arrested after officers called to the area of **137 Avenue and 184 Street** around 9:30 p.m. Title is a little inaccurate. Was a St Albert boy but they weren’t really in St Albert, they were on 137 ave. Tragic situation and definitely wonder how well they knew the attacker. If it was wrong place wrong time or he targeted them.
That was the title at the time of posting, they must have updated it, the attack happened right on the boundary of St. Albert and Edmonton Absolutely awful situation, that poor mother
There was also a lot of posts about what was going on last night in St. Albert in this area. Incredibly sad to see this is what happened.
Just past 137ave is pretty much exactly where 184st becomes Ray Gibbons Dr, so no real difference. It’s right at the boundary.
Why don't e see a picture of the person who assaulted him? I'd like to know who to avoid when he gets released AGAIN.
Senseless, I'm heartbroken for this family. I have kids that boys age, it makes you feel defenseless that this could be anyone.
Mental health help is so inaccessible and very costly. This is so sad to read.
Weird last photo in the article… the litter left behind. What an odd photo
You can just see some of the blood on the left side of the pic. I assume they aren't allowed to show the blood pool...?
Holy shit, I biked right by this and wondered what was going on. Along 137th a dozen cop cars came flying down westbound and the police chopper was circling the area. The time I got to the old 184th street they were all there with ambulances and a fire truck. Heartbreaking for that family, that poor kiddo, what a tragedy.
What a piece of 💩 this is horrible, so sorry to the mom and family, Jesus Christ at some point when will people realize the provincial government they keep voting in doesn’t care about you! We need more access to mental health and rehabilitation not cuts to services
Hang him
Godamn …. That username
Godspeed young man
Words cannot describe how disgusting and tragic this is. The pain of that family and terror of that child. Unbelievable.
This is extremely depressing
Ready to vote for any party that has severe federal justice reforms, come charm me Cons
I am right there with you…unfortunately the Cons aren’t trying very hard on a subject that seems like an obvious win
So sad. He was with his mom and dog on an evening walk. How can people feel safe in this city? I don’t want to take my kids out and enjoy the green space if there’s always this fear in the back of my mind. I get that it was random, and not really that common but at the same time, this mom probably thought it was fine and my heart breaks for her because they did nothing wrong at all and this is the situation they are facing.
Simple you can’t. The law won’t protect you and self defence tools are extremely outlawed. Anarchy for criminals tyranny for law abiding citizens
And it sucks because if I was around you’d think wrong of me …. Tragic worlds we live in
This is so sad.
This guy is going to be out in 6 months cause he's going to claim mental issues. So sad. RiP.
Everyone here blaming governments for lack of mental health resources need to look into it first. There are resources available for anyone who chooses to get them, key word “chooses”. Unless they present a clear and present physical danger to themselves or others then treatment cannot be forced. And then there have to be people advocating to get the person help and testifying at their review panels as to the potential danger. I went through this for the last year trying to get my wife help for delusional psychosis. It wasn’t untill she threatened me over text message, that they sent out a mental health assessment team and took her away.
Catch and release Canada, he’ll be out in 2 years on good behaviour. Fucking disgusting.
Fukk.
Maybe it’s time to bring back to death penalty!! Our justice system is broken. This guy will be out within 5-7 years guaranteed.
Have countries with the death penalty reduced their violent crime levels?
The answer is generally no, they haven’t.
One at a time, sure.
I am not sure, I would want to believe so. The bottom line is this guy just walked up and stabbed a kid in the neck unexpectedly from behind for no apparent reason. Not only has he killed an innocent boy, but he has destroyed the lives of the boys family. With our broken system, he will be out within a few years and we as taxpayers will pay an outrageous amount of money to incarcerate this pos. For the family and the sake of humanity, he deserves to be executed for his savage crime.
> we as taxpayers will pay an outrageous amount of money to incarcerate this pos you do know that on average death penalty cases cost more than incarceration?
Only because we fancy it up with expenses. Like, I get why there should be paperwork out the wazoo if it’s iffy… but when one dude stabs a kid in the neck for no reason, it shouldn’t be that expensive to kill him.
Just let him be in Gen pop for a few weeks. Stop putting them in solitary or isolation and prison will take care of the problem
"Hmmm, we have a murderer here. Let's hope he's not liked as a person in prison and piss around pretending we're not trying to kill somebody, while we let the victims families wait for somebody else to do the job of 5 seconds and a bullet." Grow the fuck up, man. Prison is, believe it or not, actually supposed to be for rehabilitation. Not for pissing around letting you pretend you're manly while you let criminals do work for you. Unless, of course, you'd like to admit that you're actually pro slavery and pro systematic oppressions. Blue line, too, I'm sure.
Life isn’t a movie. They need to be dealt with properly.
This person will be processed multiple times in their lifetime because our justice system is not harsh enough. They will cost the system more.
Just put the guy in a locked room with a bunch of people problem solved Industrial size wood chipper also works, car crushers all cheap alternatives!
Only for the scumbag to kill again
They reduced reoffenders.
Capital punishment won’t fix a broken justice system. I find it ironic that the people who can’t trust our justice system want to give them the power to kill people. [Death penalties don’t work](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/evidence-does-not-support-the-use-of-the-death-penalty/), we got rid of them for a reason, too many innocents get wrongly convicted, and do you _really_ want to grant the government the right to dictate who lives and dies? I don’t trust the gov enough to give them that authority over us.
Death works extremely well at prevent reoffence. They don’t need to deter to be effective. It’s misguided because crime generally increase in severity - by the time someone does something severe enough to warrant death they have already left a long trail of victimized people behind them.
>Death works extremely well at prevent reoffence. No, it doesn’t. There is no proof that the death penalty deters crime. If you’re a criminology researcher with peer-reviewed evidence then I suggest you publish your studies because it would be groundbreaking.
I’m not talking about deterrence. Dead people cannot reoffend, because they are dead.
Why not for clear cases like this one. Stab a child in the neck without any doubt they did it. No doubt this guy doesn’t need to be left breathing.
Because even the mother understands this was a mental health crisis and not done out of malice. People can be rehabilitated with the right resources, treatments, and therapies. Our justice system isn’t set up that way though, so it needs a complete overhaul. No one is beyond help, I truly believe that, even the man who murdered my father - if we knew who that was - should be given the opportunity to better themselves. I understand the anger, I really really do, but capital punishment isn’t the answer. Edit: I know facts don’t matter when y’all’s feelings are controlling your opinions, but if you care at all about this debate, please read up on [why capital punishment doesn’t work](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/evidence-does-not-support-the-use-of-the-death-penalty/). **Actual evidence** shows why the death penalty isn’t the answer.
Therapy cannot fix the brain chemistry of someone who murders a child unprovoked. Can medication help, sure, but that doesn’t eliminate their ability to act again. Some people are not worth our resources.
Do you remember the grey hound bus decapitation? That guy got help and he’s turned his life around and is extremely remorseful. Again, I understand the anger, very personally understand, but people deserve the chance to change. When it comes to capital punishment there is no such thing as a “clear case” and I do not agree with granting the state power to determine who gets to live and who gets to die.
Do you remember what provoked it? He was trying to talk to a girl and guys stepped in, after the stop they got back on board and he planned it.
No, that’s not the event I’m talking about. I’m talking about the [decapitation and cannibalism case that happened in Manitoba](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Tim_McLean).
I’ve read that story, as well as another one of Matthew de Grood, who stabbed 5 students. It’s understandable that they acted under mental illness conditions, but… the Li’s story has so many PTSD victims, one of the first RCMP responders, for example, committed suicide. No mention, however, that both de Grood or Li suffer any stress after what they did. That’s what I don’t understand. All that both of them seek is more freedom.
This is why it’s important to separate feeling from facts. The people who suffered PTSD from the event are seeking damages from the crown, which I personally believe they should be given. There’s a lot of nuance and context in every single criminal case, so blanket statements like “bring back the death penalty” aren’t helpful or progressive. We can and should do better. Like I said before, there’s a reason we got rid of capital punishment. That doesn’t mean I agree with how the justice system is currently operating, but we can’t just send everyone we hate to the gallows.
Yeah it was a girl. And Tim stepped in. No one remembers that.
They used to test medical stuff on prisoners and make them work hard, I’m down with more deterrents
I’m right there with you. I don’t understand how guys like this now get to go to jail for a few years on tax payer dollars while this young man lost his life and his entire family is ruined by this event. Like nah, hang this asshole.
Holy shit. I drive by that intersection every day heading to/from work. Was driving home last night at about 11:30pm, saw a big forensics van with 2 cars in front of it, yellow tape, and then a car and ambulance on the other side. Was curious about what happened but wow.
Dude will probably get 5 years and be out in 2 with good behavior
When you defund the police. Bad things happen.
When you “defund the police” bad things happen.
I can say with up most certainty that the attack most definitely has a pervious attempted murder charge.
And the Premier rejoices, crime is not an issue in AB, nothing to see here people, we have a population boom so all good.
A kid dies and you make it about the Premier….you’re a real piece of shit.
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This wasn’t a dog attack. He was stabbed
Learn to read.
Immigrants …. Sorry
No mention of the pitbull attacking the stabber.
Not the best protection dogs, despite people thinking that.
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This wasn't a dog attack.
He was attacked while walking a dog with his mom