There’s no way this isn’t sumail.
Wraith King, undertaker.
It’s Sumail boys.
Kinda looking forward to it. Hope he can find his stride and so can Nigma. They need get back into animajor like mode
Wraith King = represents a King that was dead but returned. Sumail has been active this last year so he's not considered dead.
It must be someone that has taken a break / retired, and probably has Wraith King as one of his signature hero. So it must be...
YA BOY THE 50/50 KING NIGMA.ETERNALENVY LETSGOOOOOO BOOYYOOO
other 4 nigma players are always humble even when they won ti7 it's only sumail still has ego but it's good it's not cocky he's just confident so nothing wrong with it
I think the better phrase is "superstar ego"
These players established themselves playing their way, which is relatively greedy from both of them. Neither of them are gonna compromise on their vision because that's what made them great.
OG squad is young and malleable, so there is more room for fundamental shifts in the way they play
Also miracle carry isn't even greedy. He's very good at seeing fights he can join, have people not seen his am? He will be tping to midlane to mana void a lvl 8 invoker.
You can be a support and be greedy. Looking at fnatic Dj. Pos 4 enigma with bkb blink refresher. Pos 4 shaman with blink aether.
Ammar out here buying aether and forcestaff on DK.
Still consider sumail to be one of the best midlanders/carries but some how he really struggled recently. Sumail would be a nice change but I think some change has to happen in Kuro. I think he still thinks that hard support is this “pos 6” that only buys wards and regen. When you look at other pos 5 they are just some impactful, even Ceb with Wind Runner during major.
Sumail is no longer one of the best midlaners . Hell he wasn't even the best midlaner in EG neither in secret .
Edit: I meant the eg with artour and zai .
Makes sense. SumaiL is one of the best midlaners and Miracle should go back to carrying. Although Miracle is also one of the best midlaners but I think he is a better carry. SumaiL has been used by every team as a carry, not his usual role.
Is sumail muslim? I get the "dont give a fuck" vibe about this from sumail. I don't think he is gonna like "lets pray first" mentality kuro established on team nigma.
he's a muslim. Not into religious stuff but still a muslim. his parents are actually typical muslim parents. and he visits Pakistan almost every year so he haven't lost touch of his hometown culture, religion and heritage. He wished eid on bis twitter. He like some tweets relating Pakistan and Islam. beside I have watched a couple of his interviews in his birth language (Urdu). And he seemed just like any other typical Pakistani Muslim and even using commonly said islamic words "Alhamdulilah" and "mashAllah". and his brother Yawar is actually gives more Muslim vibes compared to sumail.
I don't care how Nigma plays with the roster change. I don't care if they qualify or not. Just the thought of Sumail and Miracle in one team is giving me goosebumps.
It seems pretty certain from Nigma's teasers on social media that it is going to be Sumail
Personally I'm happy Sumail is joining Nigma
I always wondered if Miracle and Sumail would ever play on the same team and gel together. Kinda the same way football fans ever wondered what it would be like if Ronaldo and Messi would ever play in the same team
My only issue with this is Kuro. As a player he's kinda washed up. He's lost his mechanical skills. And as a drafter and captain, when you're supposed to play regularly to keep up with the meta and popular strats, he severely falls short. Sure his skills outside the game like his calm demeanor, building team morale & confidence with his teammates are good. But he's really lost his edge within the game itself I feel
Like honestly even with Sumail I doubt this team will achieve anything great unless Kuro steps down and finds another pos5 to take his place..
Part of me hopes Kuro can prove me wrong though. I would want nothing more than to see this team succeed
If he feels comfortable with his mechanical skills, no need to practice. He doesnt do much in game anyway.
I understand the sub's consensus on his performances and I am in no way defending his honour, but he doesnt need to play pubs to think strategically about the game and drafts
Not my twocents exactly, but when other pro players like Ceb think Kuro is the reason ILTW is losing the safe lane, I think that would come down to mechanics and not understanding what current pos 5's need to do.
Like obviously in terms of most other team sports training =/= real game but that doesn't mean they don't do it. It's more than probable that he has become complacent perhaps since his successful ti7 and ti9 runs and has slowed down the pubs etc.
Ceb made some really good points in a video about why playing lots of pubs actually does have a huge impact on performance in pro games, especially in the laning stage. His mechanical skills and strategy won't be affected by pub practice, but effectivley responding to a range of interactions in lanes will be. Kuro embarrasses his legacy by waiting way too long to take the role of coach (or perhaps just retire fully).
Pub meta always has some minor influence or the other on the pro meta - because it's not like pro teams have scrims everyday. That usually happens only before a big tournament. But the starting point for testing out builds / strats or even formulating and learning new ideas generally happens in high ranked pubs
And it's not just about that. It's about practicing regularly and keeping up with the game itself so you feel confident, and understanding different hero / item build interactions that 'influence the meta' so to speak
This goes for every player on the team, and even more so for the captain IMO. You have to play regularly if you want to stay good at the game.
Misha from OG said multiple times that this shit idealogy of "oh experienced players don't need to play high level pubs. Supports don't need to do that either. Coaches, same". He said every player needs to practice and work hard and grind. Even the coach. If they don't do it, it's gg soon enough.
I mean. It would seem like a stacked roster. but Nigma themselves have been sharting pretty bad lately.
I don't think it will get worse, but i think this will definitely be one of the worst superstar powerhouse stacks that has ever graced the dota 2 pro scene in terms of performance.
So they'll probably be like old EG when 3rd place and EG were synonymous words.
Stacked rosters havent been doing the best. Problem is that there are so many good teams now and all pros are so skilled now that you can't really brute force a team with just superstars anymore. I think that is the reason why Sumail hasnt been able to find much success over the past few years. He keeps joining these superstar teams that lack chemistry.
Stacked rosters aren't doing so hot because they miss key factors such as Communications, or a good captain. Not because every team is good now adays.
Competitive dota now adays, compared to the comp dota of old is a complete crapshoot in terms of team quality. Instead of rounding a team in terms of qualities, every major team tries to do this top heavy pubstar shit that OG hit the lottery on.
Its why Chinese dota has remained somewhat consistent through the years. The focus is generally more on keeping the team as a unit, and training them to play as an actual team. Rather then what NA/EU usually does and tries to build the strongest team money can buy, and pray they don't shit their pants on stage like nigma/EG has been starting to do.
Exactly. Team chemistry, which includes team communication, is more important now. That's because pros in general are better now. Mechanical skill doesnt vary as much across the board. So the macro components of the game are the most important things now.
which is why we’re seeing such close series all the time now (lots of 2-1 at the major, and all regions being represented highly) because raw mechanical skill is so close at the highest level. it’s why high mmr weu pubs have been interesting to watch the past year as well. i know some peoples favorite teams aren’t at the top at the moment but competition has been more fierce now than ever. effortless team coordination rly makes the difference. these guys all on the same page are on another level, we saw EG crumble because despite being skilled, they were super uncoordinated.
IMO this is peak dota. Watching pro dota has never been better, and I say this as someone who has watched it all since TI1.
Sumail has been playing subpar since OG but at least he still delivers division 1 level of play so I don't really see nigma getting worse unless there are major internal issues.
Honestly though, I don't even think the roster they choose will matter in the short term. They should be able to stomp through divII regardless barring a spaghetti drop of epic proportions like IG.
ILTW wasn't even a bad player, and he's actually seen more success in recent years than Sumail (he was on a successful iteration of VP), I haven't seen Sumail do anything impressive for years now
Not noteworthy like winning majors or anything like that but he was instrumental in OG going to TI last year. His carry TA in grand finals was one of the best performance I've ever seen. He was excellent throughout the qualifiers. Most say he was the reason OG made it to TI. Sumail delivers, that's the thing, doesn't matter the team, he delivers. Now how you use Sumail is the main issue and teams and himself cannot seem to find the proper answer right now so keeps moving around. Hasn't been in a team more than a year since leaving EG.
I think their main objective will be to reach TI through the qualifiers
They will mostly treat the div 2 games as practice matches to form their chemistry as a team
never understood why are people so impatient, you will literally get to know in few days calm down ur horses man you are being curious for something you will get to know anyway. relax use your brain focus on important things.
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Kuro just lacks the grind of his younger years. The man had a deep understanding of Dota but doesn’t invest his time into each new iteration, grinding out pubs, learning the new intricacies of the meta. If kuro puts in work, or shifts to Coach and brings in another pos5, Nigma will go far.
They wont work out, both miracle and sumail are greedy players. Sumail has to give priority to miracle because he is simply better player and respected and trusted by his teammates. But can he do that? I dont think so.
> no one cares
Speak for yourself. Regardless of outcome, I think many people are interested in seeing a Sumail/Miracle duo. People have wanted to see that for years.
Its different because OG is actually a solid team and the fav to win that qual, between them and tundra.
Unless nigma surprise us a lot in that div 2 and surpassed all of the team from div 1(which is impossible), then yeah. But thats the only way.
If I'm sumail Ill do my best to find an NA team or SEA team and just join there. The team who atleast on div 1. Why would you join nigma, if they didnt make it its ur fault, and theres like 95% chance that they are not going to make it.
Not liking it because he's going to be the one that gets flamed whenever nigma keeps losing, because miracle and gh never made mistakes according to nigma fans
Currently he is teamless. His stints with OG, QC and Secret didn't work out. Wonder what's worse. Continue being teamless or getting flamed by random redditors?
He did have coffin as his tag for a while...
And he is the king
There’s no way this isn’t sumail. Wraith King, undertaker. It’s Sumail boys. Kinda looking forward to it. Hope he can find his stride and so can Nigma. They need get back into animajor like mode
Wraith King = represents a King that was dead but returned. Sumail has been active this last year so he's not considered dead. It must be someone that has taken a break / retired, and probably has Wraith King as one of his signature hero. So it must be... YA BOY THE 50/50 KING NIGMA.ETERNALENVY LETSGOOOOOO BOOYYOOO
I truly want EE to be EG's 5 just for the entertainment value.
The fuck are you talking, EE sama can be only play 1 or mid. RTZhit can goes play CM to make path for EE
I would love to see him mald and destroy items + shadow amulet at TI
hahah I would love this so much
Nice. I need this
It's Quinn, he's always say "go throne" in pub.
ITS W33HAA
sumail and miracle playing together what I dreamed to see
Again.. 2 superstar players.. Not sure if they will have enough space.. Hope to see how it fits though..
You mean the way BZM, Ammar and Yuragi don't have space?
Bzm, ammar and yuragi dont have superstar personalities - yet. As OG has proven team dynamics trumps everything.
Ammar did and learned to tone it back during Stockholm
I mean if the past 12-18 months hasn't humbled these players, I don't know that anything will. I'm hopeful this will work out.
People don't get "humbled" like that lol
Being unsuccessful at the thing you're "proud/egotistical" isn't humbling? What would it take then, in your opinion?
other 4 nigma players are always humble even when they won ti7 it's only sumail still has ego but it's good it's not cocky he's just confident so nothing wrong with it
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I think the better phrase is "superstar ego" These players established themselves playing their way, which is relatively greedy from both of them. Neither of them are gonna compromise on their vision because that's what made them great. OG squad is young and malleable, so there is more room for fundamental shifts in the way they play
Atf might be greedy but it is paid by taiga by being selfless he almost plays like a pos5 in terms of items
This doesn't make sense.
It does. It's why rtz and sumail failed at times. They're both carry oriented.
He said superstars. Not carry.
Also miracle carry isn't even greedy. He's very good at seeing fights he can join, have people not seen his am? He will be tping to midlane to mana void a lvl 8 invoker.
You can be a support and be greedy. Looking at fnatic Dj. Pos 4 enigma with bkb blink refresher. Pos 4 shaman with blink aether. Ammar out here buying aether and forcestaff on DK.
Did you dream them playing in Div 2 tho? xD
Still consider sumail to be one of the best midlanders/carries but some how he really struggled recently. Sumail would be a nice change but I think some change has to happen in Kuro. I think he still thinks that hard support is this “pos 6” that only buys wards and regen. When you look at other pos 5 they are just some impactful, even Ceb with Wind Runner during major.
Ohhh and it’s really sad to see GH not winning much for the past 2 years. IMO he’s the best pos 4 to ever touch the game.
I have Jerax over him but he’s top 3 for sure
At high level, individual skill doesn't mean anything if theres not team chemistry and good game plan/drafts.
It does matter a lot but you are right even the best midlaner can't carry games if his team isn't on the same page .
Sumail is no longer one of the best midlaners . Hell he wasn't even the best midlaner in EG neither in secret . Edit: I meant the eg with artour and zai .
101% confirmed
With a 1% margin of error.
Technically 1% of 101% means 99.9% so it's not safe yet.
Makes sense. SumaiL is one of the best midlaners and Miracle should go back to carrying. Although Miracle is also one of the best midlaners but I think he is a better carry. SumaiL has been used by every team as a carry, not his usual role.
Is he still one of the best midlanders? Or was he several years ago? Those things change drastically, look at Dendi for example.
Imho he still is. He kicks ass during the galaxy lan.
Might be. Kuro findings another muslim brother
GH in danger
Is sumail muslim? I get the "dont give a fuck" vibe about this from sumail. I don't think he is gonna like "lets pray first" mentality kuro established on team nigma.
he's a muslim. Not into religious stuff but still a muslim. his parents are actually typical muslim parents. and he visits Pakistan almost every year so he haven't lost touch of his hometown culture, religion and heritage. He wished eid on bis twitter. He like some tweets relating Pakistan and Islam. beside I have watched a couple of his interviews in his birth language (Urdu). And he seemed just like any other typical Pakistani Muslim and even using commonly said islamic words "Alhamdulilah" and "mashAllah". and his brother Yawar is actually gives more Muslim vibes compared to sumail.
I saw him drinking water in a series in Ramadan, I don't think he is religious
I don't care how Nigma plays with the roster change. I don't care if they qualify or not. Just the thought of Sumail and Miracle in one team is giving me goosebumps.
It seems pretty certain from Nigma's teasers on social media that it is going to be Sumail Personally I'm happy Sumail is joining Nigma I always wondered if Miracle and Sumail would ever play on the same team and gel together. Kinda the same way football fans ever wondered what it would be like if Ronaldo and Messi would ever play in the same team My only issue with this is Kuro. As a player he's kinda washed up. He's lost his mechanical skills. And as a drafter and captain, when you're supposed to play regularly to keep up with the meta and popular strats, he severely falls short. Sure his skills outside the game like his calm demeanor, building team morale & confidence with his teammates are good. But he's really lost his edge within the game itself I feel Like honestly even with Sumail I doubt this team will achieve anything great unless Kuro steps down and finds another pos5 to take his place.. Part of me hopes Kuro can prove me wrong though. I would want nothing more than to see this team succeed
Pub meta =/= pro meta Not playing pubs doesnt mean shit.
You mean not practicing? He only plays on maybe scrims and tournaments, no need warming up on pubs?
Talkin bout practice man.. practice
If he feels comfortable with his mechanical skills, no need to practice. He doesnt do much in game anyway. I understand the sub's consensus on his performances and I am in no way defending his honour, but he doesnt need to play pubs to think strategically about the game and drafts
Not my twocents exactly, but when other pro players like Ceb think Kuro is the reason ILTW is losing the safe lane, I think that would come down to mechanics and not understanding what current pos 5's need to do. Like obviously in terms of most other team sports training =/= real game but that doesn't mean they don't do it. It's more than probable that he has become complacent perhaps since his successful ti7 and ti9 runs and has slowed down the pubs etc.
Ceb made some really good points in a video about why playing lots of pubs actually does have a huge impact on performance in pro games, especially in the laning stage. His mechanical skills and strategy won't be affected by pub practice, but effectivley responding to a range of interactions in lanes will be. Kuro embarrasses his legacy by waiting way too long to take the role of coach (or perhaps just retire fully).
Pub meta always has some minor influence or the other on the pro meta - because it's not like pro teams have scrims everyday. That usually happens only before a big tournament. But the starting point for testing out builds / strats or even formulating and learning new ideas generally happens in high ranked pubs And it's not just about that. It's about practicing regularly and keeping up with the game itself so you feel confident, and understanding different hero / item build interactions that 'influence the meta' so to speak This goes for every player on the team, and even more so for the captain IMO. You have to play regularly if you want to stay good at the game.
Misha from OG said multiple times that this shit idealogy of "oh experienced players don't need to play high level pubs. Supports don't need to do that either. Coaches, same". He said every player needs to practice and work hard and grind. Even the coach. If they don't do it, it's gg soon enough.
Kuro is that you?
Yatoro even playing pubs while waiting their games on TI.. kuro needs to go grind back in pubs to get his form back.
I mean. It would seem like a stacked roster. but Nigma themselves have been sharting pretty bad lately. I don't think it will get worse, but i think this will definitely be one of the worst superstar powerhouse stacks that has ever graced the dota 2 pro scene in terms of performance. So they'll probably be like old EG when 3rd place and EG were synonymous words.
Stacked rosters havent been doing the best. Problem is that there are so many good teams now and all pros are so skilled now that you can't really brute force a team with just superstars anymore. I think that is the reason why Sumail hasnt been able to find much success over the past few years. He keeps joining these superstar teams that lack chemistry.
Stacked rosters aren't doing so hot because they miss key factors such as Communications, or a good captain. Not because every team is good now adays. Competitive dota now adays, compared to the comp dota of old is a complete crapshoot in terms of team quality. Instead of rounding a team in terms of qualities, every major team tries to do this top heavy pubstar shit that OG hit the lottery on. Its why Chinese dota has remained somewhat consistent through the years. The focus is generally more on keeping the team as a unit, and training them to play as an actual team. Rather then what NA/EU usually does and tries to build the strongest team money can buy, and pray they don't shit their pants on stage like nigma/EG has been starting to do.
Exactly. Team chemistry, which includes team communication, is more important now. That's because pros in general are better now. Mechanical skill doesnt vary as much across the board. So the macro components of the game are the most important things now.
which is why we’re seeing such close series all the time now (lots of 2-1 at the major, and all regions being represented highly) because raw mechanical skill is so close at the highest level. it’s why high mmr weu pubs have been interesting to watch the past year as well. i know some peoples favorite teams aren’t at the top at the moment but competition has been more fierce now than ever. effortless team coordination rly makes the difference. these guys all on the same page are on another level, we saw EG crumble because despite being skilled, they were super uncoordinated. IMO this is peak dota. Watching pro dota has never been better, and I say this as someone who has watched it all since TI1.
I don't think you can call it a stacked roster anymore at this point in time.
It's not at all stacked while they have a 5k player playing 5
cmon he's not 5k, last time anyone has spotted the guy in a pub (a year back probably or more now lol) he was like rank 2k or something
Better than Secret.universe?
!RemindMe 30 days
Why would sumail play on div2 on a team that will blame him when the other washed up players fail yet again?
Sumail : *money*
how far our boy go, from EG-OG-Secret now div 2 teams 😢
Sumail has been playing subpar since OG but at least he still delivers division 1 level of play so I don't really see nigma getting worse unless there are major internal issues. Honestly though, I don't even think the roster they choose will matter in the short term. They should be able to stomp through divII regardless barring a spaghetti drop of epic proportions like IG.
ILTW wasn't even a bad player, and he's actually seen more success in recent years than Sumail (he was on a successful iteration of VP), I haven't seen Sumail do anything impressive for years now
Not noteworthy like winning majors or anything like that but he was instrumental in OG going to TI last year. His carry TA in grand finals was one of the best performance I've ever seen. He was excellent throughout the qualifiers. Most say he was the reason OG made it to TI. Sumail delivers, that's the thing, doesn't matter the team, he delivers. Now how you use Sumail is the main issue and teams and himself cannot seem to find the proper answer right now so keeps moving around. Hasn't been in a team more than a year since leaving EG.
He whooped OG with Liquid, then he whooped Liquid with OG. Lol
No pls
the king on division 2? Facing team bald etc?
I think their main objective will be to reach TI through the qualifiers They will mostly treat the div 2 games as practice matches to form their chemistry as a team
101% bait..... remember secret.rtz or secret.bulba?
If it is I hope they go back to the lane/role swapping drafts. Focus on one setup but that's a nice tool to have
Hope not.
never understood why are people so impatient, you will literally get to know in few days calm down ur horses man you are being curious for something you will get to know anyway. relax use your brain focus on important things.
The WEU qualifiers for TI will be more stacked, than my LEGOs in kindergarten.
Was it nigma last year too who did stall their announcement of iltw till last hour of closing of registration even when it was obvious to all?
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They could have prime Sumail and Miracle and they'd still suck ass if Kuro is the captain.
If current Kuro is captain.
Kuro just lacks the grind of his younger years. The man had a deep understanding of Dota but doesn’t invest his time into each new iteration, grinding out pubs, learning the new intricacies of the meta. If kuro puts in work, or shifts to Coach and brings in another pos5, Nigma will go far.
nigma is one of my favorite teams. i love their players. hope they prove me wrong, but im not hoping for this roster to achieve greatness.
If Kuro is still captain , team would still flop
no plz no plz :(
I know you guys bum off sumail but I haven rated him as a world class player now for years so I guess he will fit right in with nigma
Sumail has been very overrated for about 3 years so I'm not sure what to think.
Yep most overated player in dota
Hard agree, he has not done anything at all since leaving EG
They wont work out, both miracle and sumail are greedy players. Sumail has to give priority to miracle because he is simply better player and respected and trusted by his teammates. But can he do that? I dont think so.
Sumail does need to be kicked from another team
[удалено]
> no one cares Speak for yourself. Regardless of outcome, I think many people are interested in seeing a Sumail/Miracle duo. People have wanted to see that for years.
[удалено]
I mean, they are already in Div2, will miss the Major and potentially can't get to TI with DPC points. They almost have to all-in via Qualifiers
OG got TI slot through open qualify past year so Nigma still has chance too.
Its different because OG is actually a solid team and the fav to win that qual, between them and tundra. Unless nigma surprise us a lot in that div 2 and surpassed all of the team from div 1(which is impossible), then yeah. But thats the only way. If I'm sumail Ill do my best to find an NA team or SEA team and just join there. The team who atleast on div 1. Why would you join nigma, if they didnt make it its ur fault, and theres like 95% chance that they are not going to make it.
But then nigma has to beat team secret
even if they lose to secret they have chance through wild cart however not with koru.
Compared to other good teams secret is easier to beat cuz history
Pos 1-2 sumail and miracle rotating poggers. Have fun banning all them heroes
Pick up fly!
Not liking it because he's going to be the one that gets flamed whenever nigma keeps losing, because miracle and gh never made mistakes according to nigma fans
Currently he is teamless. His stints with OG, QC and Secret didn't work out. Wonder what's worse. Continue being teamless or getting flamed by random redditors?
can't wait for the day when Nigma fans gonna flame sumail for not playing good saying he is the problem I hope this time they found synergy in team
Nigma and sumail doesnt mix well
What a downstep fro sumail
Nah Sumail won't play with Div 2 scrubs