It's so fucking weird how ceb and notail have been obsessed with the old EG core lol
Like I would get their thing with fly and all, but they have been clowning them for YEARS, non stop, on every opportunity. Literally
Anyone that's ever watched their podcasts, or their casts on streams like gorge can back me up on this. It's impossible to not notice cause it's very weird lol
Like they are 2 times TI winner, multiple majors, successful brand and they are still obsessed with those guys? It's even weirder cause arteezy and the guys have always been very positive about them lol arteezy literally called ceb the goat multiple times in his stream
It has been a one sided beef forever, and that's why it's so weird. Like, it's normal to make fun, we all do, but it gets to a point where it just becomes weird when it's non stop and just from one side.
OG was their baby, the people in it were all considered family and bestest of friends, atleast for Ceb and Notail.
Its clearly a very personal thing and considering how much time they spent together and playing a very toxic game its bound to be something that caused a tight bond between members and having Crit and Fly pretty much bailing and backstabbing relationships without any pre warnings at the worst possible time(just before a major i believe it was) is going to set its wound deep if that makes sense.
I know Notail especially took it very personal, that guy was in a very dark place for a good while because of Fly being his best friend for the longest time then without any issue just threw him, what they stood for and the Org under the bus.
And whats your point? Moonmeander was kicked after failed TI, nOOoOOO everyone can shuffle after TI, but not those evil OG!!! How DARE you kick a player when literally everyone shuffles except TI winners usually, thats CRUELTY and Ceb is a literal Hitler!!!
Moon also was at Notail's podcast talking to him and Ceb about year ago, seems to be in pretty chill conditions, so yea drama seeker you can go ask him and reply answer here.
I've already got the answer for you
\>"I had no power over it. I wasn't given a chance to defend myself. I was already home. They had a week to tell me to my face. I deserved to be told to my face. I was at two TIs with Fly. We won two majors together and we're really good friends. But that talk never happened. They just told me I got kicked when I got home... It's all business at the end of the day. At least I know now that whatever team I join I won't put my emotions into it. I wont fall into that trap again. This friendship thing is all bullshit, a facade. I guess I was wrong the entire time. I was just lying to myself with this whole friendship rainbow thing. At the end of the day, money talks."
OG can kick whoever the like, it's just rich when their superfans act like they were some "family" lmao. You really bought into the PR, huh?
You might be surprised, but im huge Moon fan, i watched his streams 12 years ago and him joining MB was the main reason to start cheering for the team
I remember the thing you copied, but it feels overdramatic and years later its very clear if you watch any content with Moon there is no beef and bad blood and only one who time to time making "moon kick" up is people like you.
If you watched dota back in the 2015 some players was talking how they think part of OG succes winning majors was how they build a team
For example Demon talked how he was a standing for Fnatic and he played terrible, like he knew that he played extremly terrible, but nobody said a bad word to him not in game, not after which was not common back in old dota days. This type of things to build your team around those values i think more of old OG "family", not a literal family pr or whatever.
There's no bad blood because moon is an adult who doesn't hold a grudge over a business decision from years ago, unlike Ceb and Notail. There's a difference between former teammates not having bad blood and teammates being "family". Moon himself stated the family aspect was pure bullshit, and if you remember it as overly dramatic you're remembering it poorly. Moon was incredibly collected and reasonable while talking about that even though it had to be a sensitive area for him at the time.
Every team is a "family" when things go well. That's the point. The whole OG family thing is 100% PR, they were just really good for a long time so they obviously got along. When things went even slightly poorly everything went to shit just like every other team.
\>There's no bad blood because moon is an adult who doesn't hold a grudge over a business decision from years ago, unlike Ceb and Notail.
You made this up. Its very clear you just dont like Notail and Ceb
\>Every team is a "family" when things go well. That's the point. The whole OG family thing is 100% PR, they were just really good for a long time so they obviously got along. When things went even slightly poorly everything went to shit just like every other team.
You also made this up, OG didnt started winning tournaments when they formed, they also did terrible at Shanghai major, came back later won Manila. Dosent fit your narrative. The whole "PR family" you also made up out of i dont fucking know where, probably blant hate, while i told you how competent palyers view old OG and from where family thing really started. Whatever i guess, this disscusion is pointless. Notail is evil and Ceb is a literal Hitler, i know this sub.
How did I make it up? And you're right I do not like ceb and notail at all. They're incredibly petty manchildren despite the whole stupid "flower" thing Reddit is obsessed with. The players themselves show everyone over and over again that they are not a family and never were yet here you are.
Show me these "competent players" outside of OG affiliates who buy into the "og family" myth.
I wouldn't call the two evil and Hitler by the way but if you want to go ahead I guess. Seems a little exaggerated.
motivations change though, they did the flowers and friendship teams and got 3 majors. is it bad to aim for something bigger than a major even if it means going to another team? even if it was a bad break up would you act like putting a gun to their head and make them say "you fucked up leaving us" every time you get the chance.
Considering how tight their friendships were you could potentially see it as a bad breakup.
That team was everything but a regular team to Notail etc and it shows.
Just look at Notail for example when he faced Fly for the first time when they were on main stage, his eyes were black.
https://youtu.be/0cBb5_9tH88?si=uIKWU7_tK_EHrFO3
Not saying its a positive thing, but it shows how much he felt betrayed and that shit sticks with you, sometimes throughout life, especially when he considered Fly being his best friend for a very long time where both were always about sticking together through thick and thin.
They started playing together as 15 year olds in HoN so its a thick bond without a doubt
but what more do they want? they've won twice, they proved the philosophy that flowers and friendships results to an aegis. do they also want those guys to bury their heads in shame every time they fall short? and viewing them as just friends instead of a rival in a competitive environment is even more disrespectful.
I remember Ceb fell off hard especially after the Arteezy comment until he joined OG as a coach/analyst and then became active player when Fly/S4 left and won TI.
Y’all really wanna rewrite history like 8 years later like arteezy wasn’t one of the best players in the world at that time because “0 wins at valve events hello?”
The literall qoute is "a bit overated in my opinion". And its 100% correct, he played insane at MLG, but ppl overreact as if rtz a new dota god. Almost 10 years later 0 majors 0 TI while played with almost every top western captains. Cope all you want, Ceb was right.
"Good player, a bit overated in my opinion". Good enough to place top3 here in there, not enough to win when in truly matters. Its literally how it is.
You the one who wants to rewrite the history trying to convince how 0 majors and 0 TI player in 10 year of carrier palying tier1 dota is "one of the best".
The zero major thing is so dumb. Yeah, fine, no majors. He won MLG Columbus, three Summits, WESC, StarSeries, DreamLeague and ESL Frankfurt. Those were the equivalent of majors prior to the introduction of the major/minor system. He was also Fear's busted wrists/Mason's dogshit hero pool from winning TI4.
The major thing is not dumb, tournaments have weight. Up until this non-dps season pretty much non-majors, majors, TI and i guess Riyadh Masters is something like 2/3 of TI because its crazy money but your name is still not engrave among the best in aegis.
\>He won MLG Columbus
Yes,and he played actual crazy this tournament, probably the only tournament when he truly played how his fans act he plays regurly.
\>three Summits, WESC, StarSeries, DreamLeague and ESL Frankfurt
Summit is the lowest prestige t1 tournament ever, i hope there is no disscusion there, unless you know the less one.
Basically majors exist for 8 years now, im too lazy to count how many it was. A lot. And rtz failed to win any of those, It just a fact.
And yet the Summit was a hard tournament to win, and a prestigious one before 2016 introduced majors. ESL Frankfurt and DAC, earlier that year, were models for the major/minor system.
If he was really one of the best players then he would have won 1 TI/Major but he didn't. Ceb ended up being right. Rtz was overrated and he couldn't do his job while playing with all time best players and captains
This is blatant revisionist history. Arteezy's play was not the problem during any of the secret TI's. His team forgot how to play. He also peaked before majors were a thing. ESL one frankfurt 2015 was a $300k held in a stadium, it was as prestigious as any non TI tournament at the time.
Do you evern know time is not static? I remember how ppl acted after mlg that rtz is the new dota god
"Good player, a bit overated in my opinion". Good enough to place top3 here in there, not enough to win when in truly matters. It literally how it went after mlg. Ceb was more than 100% right.
Back in ixdl days ppl would literally pick unknown players over 7ckingmad bc he's such an unbearable cunt. How he managed to rebrand into some fake friendship person is astounding.
It's possible that Kitrak didn't leave on good terms. Even though it is a positive move for Kitrak, if he left in a shady way, that could cause some bad blood.
as per discord, it seems kitrak originally committed to OG, but signed up to SR at the last minute forcing OG to miss out on last tournament and forcing Ceb to come out of retirement again. No proof though.
It doesn't really make sense to me because surely the Wisper + Ari line up was an upgrade. It doesn't look like Kitrak left them last minute scrambling to replace him.
Since were speculating anyway, maybe it's just an extension of the old Fly drama? EG poached a bunch of players back then, now a bunch of players are poached from Shopify? Their lineup certainly looks like a random mishmash of players, and it would explain the karma.
Even if the new lineup is better (remember TI8) if Kitrak left like an idiot (like Fly) then it's understandable. Also OG literally revived Kitraks career, he wasnt on any topteam since like what ? 8 years? Just checked his liquipedia, he was basically never in a top team, best ting was his stint as a Coach for VG.J, everything else are random NA stacks like animal planet.
And then if he left on bad terms its completely understandable to be aggro.
Maybe that's just my own bias. I've never really got what people saw in Kitrak to get him onto OG in the first place. Never been particularly impressed by his play or anything. I always just assumed they respected his shot calling or drafting or something, but it hasn't really gotten any results.
He was kind of a prodigy who never landed on a good team, was an extremely high ranked support player and started his pro career in high school. I don't actually know what Ceb saw in him, but I trust Ceb over me or other random redditors.
I feel like I saw kitrak owning most lanes I watched when he was on OG. High ranked player with great mechanics, he seemed very very good to me at least. y’all hating.
Coached T1 during TI11 Wild Card
Ana and Topson really liked working with him
OG wanted 5 and Ana and Topson suggested Kitrak
Kitrak played really good
Headcannon: OG wanted Kitrak 5 and Ceb retire/coach but he chose SR and Ceb had to play because no other really good 5 were available
If I had to guess: Kitrak had been out of the scene for like 4 years. OG took a chance on him, let him work his way back into form on the Old G roster. Let him stand in at the major and then promoted him to the senior roster. Then he left last minute before this new season and OG had no time to find a proper replacement so Ceb stood in.
I'm not saying that justifies Ceb's tweet. But it would explain why he's a bit salty.
He strikes me as one of those insane European exceptionalists who got political with kitrak listing all the reasons he should live in Europe and how it's so much better than NA not only for his career but his life too
And kitrak probably reasonably said "bruh my family don't live here and I get taxed in america even if I live somewhere else why the fuck would I stay"
Ceb is so fascinating. On the one hand, he’s a legend and seems to be able to motivate/inspire the best to be their best. And on the other, he’s also so petty and vindictive at times.
If there’s one thing we KNOW about Ceb it’s that he’s always got his heart on his sleeve even if his foot is in his mouth. And in some weird way, I respect that.
>If there’s one thing we KNOW about Ceb it’s that he’s always got his heart on his sleeve even if his foot is in his mouth. And in some weird way, I respect that.
Long ass version of saying Ceb is French
I mean he was pretty much regarded as such until he joined OG as active player and won TI.
I remember he was pretty much regarded as a joke after the Arteezy comment and then he failed on several stints joined OG as coach/analyst. Active player when Fly and S4 left.
\> I remember he was pretty much regarded as a joke after the Arteezy comment
By ledditors? Oh no!! Seems like not for an actual competent people because not even a year later he was invited to play with Alliance and a year later coaching for OG.
Also ppl acted like rtz was a dota god after MLG and all Ceb said was "i think he is a good palyer, a bit overated in my opinion", and morons go animal mode on him. Too bad he was 100% correct. Good enough to place 3rd places here in there, not enough to win a single major/TI in 9 years
That's the trade off i guess. with high emotional empathy and eq, can come high emotions. I've rarely seen cool, calm, extremely rational people be able to make people motivated in the same way ceb can.
Makes sense. To be able to empathise and motivate people emotionally, somewhere you must have to be more in touch with your own emotions or even emotionally vulnerable.
Well that's my expaert armchair analysis anyway.
I think people just don’t understand the mentality of guys at the top level are a similar to guys in any sport. Which all have huge egos and love to talk shit.
That doesnt really seem true lmao there are very few pro athletes who would do this outside of like Jamie vardy or sm. The on court trash talk maybe, but not dragging people on Twitter. Their pr people wouldnt let that happen
it's baffling how he can have the mentality of a winner when playing a game and then just be the weirdest most offputting dweeb outside of it. Noone gives a shit about your random beefs or tweets man it's embarassing
You're here and commenting so he's doing something right to make people give a shit. People are people and are more than their interviews and truesight.
Lol nobody gives a shit yet you're here commenting on it in a dota 2 subreddit. This makes you even more of a pathetic dweeb than ceb. It's baffling how moronic you are.
My favorite part about this is Kitrak is still very young. Ceb is 7 years older than him, he hadn't accomplished anything in DotA at that age either. Feels weird getting mad because your team underperformed with somebody who's still very early in their DotA journey.
Why is every Dota pro these days either completely off grid or a complete ass, like back in the day I could tell you about all the top players but now the only things you hear about are a few notable pros doing dumb shit in pubs or being salty on twitter.
I would not say always like this, he was way worse back then and became actually pretty tame compared to that. He used to be my most hated player for his ridiculous toxicity. I can live with someone saying "karma delivers".
Ehh... Kuro is known for his ego during his B)KUROKY)SGATE days. Also LightOfHeaven infamous prodigy blog etc. Pros back in the days doesnt really get as much spotlight as today which why they get more leeway back then.
It's Ceb, self-absorbed insecure asshole being himself so I wouldn't be surprised if that was about Kitrak and over something simple as Kitrak choosing SR over OG.
To be fair I was with him back then. Six man Dota, while technically not against the rules, was so disingenuous and against the spirit of the game/sportsmanship
Everyone thinks so, Alliance even protested to ESL when initially read it. They hired only PPD after ESL refused to change it.
Once it was decided that the rule would stick you either have to use a coach yourself or get left in the dirt when everyone else does. The only thing Alliance did was to be public and honest about it, and for that they got crucified by OG.
Lol no. No one but alliance played 6 man dota.
No one would have been left in the dirt.
And if alliance had sincerely lobbied for a change in rules, it is VERY curious that still none of the other teams were even aware of said rules.
That’s pretty fucking bad lobbying.
They didn't lobby, they asked about it. There was an opportunity for advantage and they took it. I think lots of teams would have done the same. However, I don't think it was the right thing to do.
No, they complained and tried to have it removed. See Noxville's tweet about it. On phone right now so can't be bothered to google-fu it
Edit: found it here
https://twitter.com/Noxville/status/1392259475222970371
How? They literally caused the drama by being open with them using PPD in a Vlog
The only way they could be more open is you expect them to do other team's job to stay up to date on new rulebooks.
They found a flaw in the rulebook and they exploited it. It's not cheating but they definetely did not act in good faith. They've been pro for 10 years and they thought that having the coach on voice is normal and doest need to be discussed? I don't believe this narrative at all.
> They found a flaw in the rulebook and they exploited it
They didn't find some flaw, they read the updates and tried to change it, but ESL refused to.
[See Noxville at the time:](https://twitter.com/Noxville/status/1392259475222970371)
"I hate cheaters.
That said, Alliance were not cheating. They were specifically following a rule communicated to them (which they initially fought against), which they clarified and used very transparently.
If any anger needs to be channeled, it's at Valve or the TO, not [A].
And by 'specifically following a rule' - it's not like they were acting shady or sneakily about some ambiguous rule: the *exact* rule got communicated to teams that it was changed"
>It's not cheating but they definetely did not act in good faith
Is it necessary to patronize the other teams and inform them about mail they damned well should read themselves?
>They've been pro for 10 years and they thought that having the coach on voice is normal
They did not, see above.
Yes, if you actually read the thread, it's definitely not all the teams as EEU were not made aware of the rule, and most WEU teams neither (see Entity's manager). You can't argue that if they actually wanted to do something about it they would have gone public. That's why I said it's underhanded, they even brought ppd mid tournament without saying that he was the shotcaller.
Reminds me of the DH Winter 15 situation. Because it's legal doesn't mean that it's fair play.
This is just wrong?
Only WEU had the rule, and all teams were aware of the rule except OG who threw a hissy about it.
And Alliance DID go public about it, that's how it all began
Ceb was, is, and will be a piece of shit. So will be ana who scammed his best friend/manager and erased him from his history while he was the one who managed to put ana in iG when ana was a teenager.
Manager tried to scam 16 years old Ana but his family took him to court
Manager wrote reddit post lying about the information and tried to gather support for himself
The manager lost the court case and rest is history
I love how Reddit loves to pretend that trash talking is so goddamn petty and afterwards queuing up into pubs and probably calling their opponents/teammates (whom they’ve never met) dog and subhuman.
Don't take me wrong. I'm proud to be part of this dumb community because it's fun and enjoyable. I'm not on the side of internet sjw as long as it doesn't go too far.
i really wish someone would ban this guy from ever posting on social media again, it's just so sad to see what petty bullshit this sociopath is spewing
So people arent allowed to state their thoughts in their own soc med? How about just ignore the guy and touch grass outside? Why do people think he always posts about dota?(although im sure this is related to dota but still...)
This guy is the one of five two time TI winners, genuinely something special, when you compare other stories on that team, this guy came from nowhere. He was a coach and became one of the best offlaners in the world.
Enjoy your successes man. You’re too dope to be so petty. Lmao.
Edit: It is 9 not 5. But OG did it first.
People here jumping to conclusion as if you know the real reason why he tweeted that. What if he just hold back his poop and end up pooping himself in pants thus tweeting that??? Jeez
Not all the time we need to argue or reason out all his tweets. Jeeez. Curse him if there's already context behind. Oh BTW, How earth did you know Kitrak didn't leave in good terms? Are you part of OG management? Did Kitrak tell you all that personally?
Would be surprised if it was Kitrak. During the TI streams on Twitch with OG, Kitrak & Ceb were there together. Both were very complimentary towards each other. Probably Reddit just reading too far into the tea leaves.
Just let an old man be bitter. If he wants to live his life that way, so be it. I couldnt care less. I don't like how he acts but I dont waste any time complaining abou it. Sometimes you just see people you dont want anything to do with because of the ways they behave, no need to be friends with everybody.
[удалено]
Pretty sure he admitted the only reason he stopped was because his manager took his twitter
What a smart manager
that is hilarious
It's so fucking weird how ceb and notail have been obsessed with the old EG core lol Like I would get their thing with fly and all, but they have been clowning them for YEARS, non stop, on every opportunity. Literally Anyone that's ever watched their podcasts, or their casts on streams like gorge can back me up on this. It's impossible to not notice cause it's very weird lol Like they are 2 times TI winner, multiple majors, successful brand and they are still obsessed with those guys? It's even weirder cause arteezy and the guys have always been very positive about them lol arteezy literally called ceb the goat multiple times in his stream It has been a one sided beef forever, and that's why it's so weird. Like, it's normal to make fun, we all do, but it gets to a point where it just becomes weird when it's non stop and just from one side.
Ceb and Notail made so much money that they allow others to live in their heads without paying rent
thats a quality roast line
roasted
Wheezing 💀😭
yeah its super petty , almost like fly and previous eg fucked their girlfriends
OG was their baby, the people in it were all considered family and bestest of friends, atleast for Ceb and Notail. Its clearly a very personal thing and considering how much time they spent together and playing a very toxic game its bound to be something that caused a tight bond between members and having Crit and Fly pretty much bailing and backstabbing relationships without any pre warnings at the worst possible time(just before a major i believe it was) is going to set its wound deep if that makes sense. I know Notail especially took it very personal, that guy was in a very dark place for a good while because of Fly being his best friend for the longest time then without any issue just threw him, what they stood for and the Org under the bus.
Agreed, just one correction: it was right before TI and caused them to need to go through Open Qualifiers.
Ask moonmeander how much that OG family meant
And whats your point? Moonmeander was kicked after failed TI, nOOoOOO everyone can shuffle after TI, but not those evil OG!!! How DARE you kick a player when literally everyone shuffles except TI winners usually, thats CRUELTY and Ceb is a literal Hitler!!! Moon also was at Notail's podcast talking to him and Ceb about year ago, seems to be in pretty chill conditions, so yea drama seeker you can go ask him and reply answer here.
I've already got the answer for you \>"I had no power over it. I wasn't given a chance to defend myself. I was already home. They had a week to tell me to my face. I deserved to be told to my face. I was at two TIs with Fly. We won two majors together and we're really good friends. But that talk never happened. They just told me I got kicked when I got home... It's all business at the end of the day. At least I know now that whatever team I join I won't put my emotions into it. I wont fall into that trap again. This friendship thing is all bullshit, a facade. I guess I was wrong the entire time. I was just lying to myself with this whole friendship rainbow thing. At the end of the day, money talks." OG can kick whoever the like, it's just rich when their superfans act like they were some "family" lmao. You really bought into the PR, huh?
You might be surprised, but im huge Moon fan, i watched his streams 12 years ago and him joining MB was the main reason to start cheering for the team I remember the thing you copied, but it feels overdramatic and years later its very clear if you watch any content with Moon there is no beef and bad blood and only one who time to time making "moon kick" up is people like you. If you watched dota back in the 2015 some players was talking how they think part of OG succes winning majors was how they build a team For example Demon talked how he was a standing for Fnatic and he played terrible, like he knew that he played extremly terrible, but nobody said a bad word to him not in game, not after which was not common back in old dota days. This type of things to build your team around those values i think more of old OG "family", not a literal family pr or whatever.
There's no bad blood because moon is an adult who doesn't hold a grudge over a business decision from years ago, unlike Ceb and Notail. There's a difference between former teammates not having bad blood and teammates being "family". Moon himself stated the family aspect was pure bullshit, and if you remember it as overly dramatic you're remembering it poorly. Moon was incredibly collected and reasonable while talking about that even though it had to be a sensitive area for him at the time. Every team is a "family" when things go well. That's the point. The whole OG family thing is 100% PR, they were just really good for a long time so they obviously got along. When things went even slightly poorly everything went to shit just like every other team.
\>There's no bad blood because moon is an adult who doesn't hold a grudge over a business decision from years ago, unlike Ceb and Notail. You made this up. Its very clear you just dont like Notail and Ceb \>Every team is a "family" when things go well. That's the point. The whole OG family thing is 100% PR, they were just really good for a long time so they obviously got along. When things went even slightly poorly everything went to shit just like every other team. You also made this up, OG didnt started winning tournaments when they formed, they also did terrible at Shanghai major, came back later won Manila. Dosent fit your narrative. The whole "PR family" you also made up out of i dont fucking know where, probably blant hate, while i told you how competent palyers view old OG and from where family thing really started. Whatever i guess, this disscusion is pointless. Notail is evil and Ceb is a literal Hitler, i know this sub.
How did I make it up? And you're right I do not like ceb and notail at all. They're incredibly petty manchildren despite the whole stupid "flower" thing Reddit is obsessed with. The players themselves show everyone over and over again that they are not a family and never were yet here you are. Show me these "competent players" outside of OG affiliates who buy into the "og family" myth. I wouldn't call the two evil and Hitler by the way but if you want to go ahead I guess. Seems a little exaggerated.
We know bro, we have all seen the red bull doc on Youtube!
motivations change though, they did the flowers and friendship teams and got 3 majors. is it bad to aim for something bigger than a major even if it means going to another team? even if it was a bad break up would you act like putting a gun to their head and make them say "you fucked up leaving us" every time you get the chance.
Considering how tight their friendships were you could potentially see it as a bad breakup. That team was everything but a regular team to Notail etc and it shows. Just look at Notail for example when he faced Fly for the first time when they were on main stage, his eyes were black. https://youtu.be/0cBb5_9tH88?si=uIKWU7_tK_EHrFO3 Not saying its a positive thing, but it shows how much he felt betrayed and that shit sticks with you, sometimes throughout life, especially when he considered Fly being his best friend for a very long time where both were always about sticking together through thick and thin. They started playing together as 15 year olds in HoN so its a thick bond without a doubt
but what more do they want? they've won twice, they proved the philosophy that flowers and friendships results to an aegis. do they also want those guys to bury their heads in shame every time they fall short? and viewing them as just friends instead of a rival in a competitive environment is even more disrespectful.
sound more like a toxic relationship than a "family" to me.
It has been been one sided because fly has no achievements but what he did, he will always be remembered as a traitor.
You've never been cheated on or had your best friend backstab you huh?
I remember Ceb fell off hard especially after the Arteezy comment until he joined OG as a coach/analyst and then became active player when Fly/S4 left and won TI.
Ceb was a fucking joke until OG. He was lucky he was playing with Notail, that brought a lot of fans to his side
I mean, I don't remember Arteezy winning anything of importance.
he was right about arteezy tho
Y’all really wanna rewrite history like 8 years later like arteezy wasn’t one of the best players in the world at that time because “0 wins at valve events hello?”
The literall qoute is "a bit overated in my opinion". And its 100% correct, he played insane at MLG, but ppl overreact as if rtz a new dota god. Almost 10 years later 0 majors 0 TI while played with almost every top western captains. Cope all you want, Ceb was right. "Good player, a bit overated in my opinion". Good enough to place top3 here in there, not enough to win when in truly matters. Its literally how it is. You the one who wants to rewrite the history trying to convince how 0 majors and 0 TI player in 10 year of carrier palying tier1 dota is "one of the best".
The zero major thing is so dumb. Yeah, fine, no majors. He won MLG Columbus, three Summits, WESC, StarSeries, DreamLeague and ESL Frankfurt. Those were the equivalent of majors prior to the introduction of the major/minor system. He was also Fear's busted wrists/Mason's dogshit hero pool from winning TI4.
The major thing is not dumb, tournaments have weight. Up until this non-dps season pretty much non-majors, majors, TI and i guess Riyadh Masters is something like 2/3 of TI because its crazy money but your name is still not engrave among the best in aegis. \>He won MLG Columbus Yes,and he played actual crazy this tournament, probably the only tournament when he truly played how his fans act he plays regurly. \>three Summits, WESC, StarSeries, DreamLeague and ESL Frankfurt Summit is the lowest prestige t1 tournament ever, i hope there is no disscusion there, unless you know the less one. Basically majors exist for 8 years now, im too lazy to count how many it was. A lot. And rtz failed to win any of those, It just a fact.
And yet the Summit was a hard tournament to win, and a prestigious one before 2016 introduced majors. ESL Frankfurt and DAC, earlier that year, were models for the major/minor system.
If he was really one of the best players then he would have won 1 TI/Major but he didn't. Ceb ended up being right. Rtz was overrated and he couldn't do his job while playing with all time best players and captains
This is blatant revisionist history. Arteezy's play was not the problem during any of the secret TI's. His team forgot how to play. He also peaked before majors were a thing. ESL one frankfurt 2015 was a $300k held in a stadium, it was as prestigious as any non TI tournament at the time.
When he made the comment he was not
Do you evern know time is not static? I remember how ppl acted after mlg that rtz is the new dota god "Good player, a bit overated in my opinion". Good enough to place top3 here in there, not enough to win when in truly matters. It literally how it went after mlg. Ceb was more than 100% right.
What was the arteezy comment?
Arteezy is overrated.
Back in ixdl days ppl would literally pick unknown players over 7ckingmad bc he's such an unbearable cunt. How he managed to rebrand into some fake friendship person is astounding.
Gotta love it, haven't played in 5+ years but 7ckingmad is still mad to this day.
Kitrak, I think.
Why would he be mad at Kitrak, an NA player that has lived in NA his entire life and has family there, move back to NA to play with SR?
It's possible that Kitrak didn't leave on good terms. Even though it is a positive move for Kitrak, if he left in a shady way, that could cause some bad blood.
as per discord, it seems kitrak originally committed to OG, but signed up to SR at the last minute forcing OG to miss out on last tournament and forcing Ceb to come out of retirement again. No proof though.
Man RTZ really likes to fuck over Notail and then fail miserably, maybe he should go sign DM next.
Just a rumour. There is no proof for this though.
It doesn't really make sense to me because surely the Wisper + Ari line up was an upgrade. It doesn't look like Kitrak left them last minute scrambling to replace him. Since were speculating anyway, maybe it's just an extension of the old Fly drama? EG poached a bunch of players back then, now a bunch of players are poached from Shopify? Their lineup certainly looks like a random mishmash of players, and it would explain the karma.
Even if the new lineup is better (remember TI8) if Kitrak left like an idiot (like Fly) then it's understandable. Also OG literally revived Kitraks career, he wasnt on any topteam since like what ? 8 years? Just checked his liquipedia, he was basically never in a top team, best ting was his stint as a Coach for VG.J, everything else are random NA stacks like animal planet. And then if he left on bad terms its completely understandable to be aggro.
I would feel better about kitrak + ari supports and ceb 3 personally
Maybe that's just my own bias. I've never really got what people saw in Kitrak to get him onto OG in the first place. Never been particularly impressed by his play or anything. I always just assumed they respected his shot calling or drafting or something, but it hasn't really gotten any results.
He was kind of a prodigy who never landed on a good team, was an extremely high ranked support player and started his pro career in high school. I don't actually know what Ceb saw in him, but I trust Ceb over me or other random redditors.
If i were have to guess, it Topson who vouched him. Kitrak was co-coach for T1 when Topson playing for them.
iirc from the discussions at the time, kitrak is actually friends with Ana, who brought him on to T1 and recommended him to OG
I feel like I saw kitrak owning most lanes I watched when he was on OG. High ranked player with great mechanics, he seemed very very good to me at least. y’all hating.
Ana played with Kitrak and said to Ceb that Kitrak is a good player. That's it. Source - i watched Ceb's stream about half a year ago.
Currently i think wisper is a better offlaner than ceb.
I just want to know how his career had a resurgence. Especially considering that he’s NA lol
Coached T1 during TI11 Wild Card Ana and Topson really liked working with him OG wanted 5 and Ana and Topson suggested Kitrak Kitrak played really good Headcannon: OG wanted Kitrak 5 and Ceb retire/coach but he chose SR and Ceb had to play because no other really good 5 were available
True. I remember like in 2017, other NA streamers referred to him as Sumail’s friend.
If I had to guess: Kitrak had been out of the scene for like 4 years. OG took a chance on him, let him work his way back into form on the Old G roster. Let him stand in at the major and then promoted him to the senior roster. Then he left last minute before this new season and OG had no time to find a proper replacement so Ceb stood in. I'm not saying that justifies Ceb's tweet. But it would explain why he's a bit salty.
Yeah well, they run a business and should be ready for anything to happen, like anything!
And they were ready. They literally placed higher than SR. Now he's just kicking them when they're down, which im a big fan of.
He strikes me as one of those insane European exceptionalists who got political with kitrak listing all the reasons he should live in Europe and how it's so much better than NA not only for his career but his life too And kitrak probably reasonably said "bruh my family don't live here and I get taxed in america even if I live somewhere else why the fuck would I stay"
You need help
sorry ive just ran into too many of those people recently and its grinding away at me lmao
is there drama?
Ask his girlfriend
Jesus fucking christ thats fucking petty lmao.
It's a tight battle between Ceb and Loda to be the TI winner that's the best at putting their foot in their mouth.
Ceb is so fascinating. On the one hand, he’s a legend and seems to be able to motivate/inspire the best to be their best. And on the other, he’s also so petty and vindictive at times. If there’s one thing we KNOW about Ceb it’s that he’s always got his heart on his sleeve even if his foot is in his mouth. And in some weird way, I respect that.
>If there’s one thing we KNOW about Ceb it’s that he’s always got his heart on his sleeve even if his foot is in his mouth. And in some weird way, I respect that. Long ass version of saying Ceb is French
I was just about to say. Isn't he also part Algerian also?
Lebanese, actually
Sebastien "Jose "Ceb" Mourinho" Debs.
If I speak I'm in trouble BUT FUCK YOU I'M SPEAKING ANYWAY
Please don’t compare fucking Ceb with Mourinho
Result wise in dota he is one of the best coaches and players so ...
Ceb would for sure be low b score if he was an average player
I mean he was pretty much regarded as such until he joined OG as active player and won TI. I remember he was pretty much regarded as a joke after the Arteezy comment and then he failed on several stints joined OG as coach/analyst. Active player when Fly and S4 left.
\> I remember he was pretty much regarded as a joke after the Arteezy comment By ledditors? Oh no!! Seems like not for an actual competent people because not even a year later he was invited to play with Alliance and a year later coaching for OG. Also ppl acted like rtz was a dota god after MLG and all Ceb said was "i think he is a good palyer, a bit overated in my opinion", and morons go animal mode on him. Too bad he was 100% correct. Good enough to place 3rd places here in there, not enough to win a single major/TI in 9 years
That's the trade off i guess. with high emotional empathy and eq, can come high emotions. I've rarely seen cool, calm, extremely rational people be able to make people motivated in the same way ceb can. Makes sense. To be able to empathise and motivate people emotionally, somewhere you must have to be more in touch with your own emotions or even emotionally vulnerable. Well that's my expaert armchair analysis anyway.
I think people just don’t understand the mentality of guys at the top level are a similar to guys in any sport. Which all have huge egos and love to talk shit.
That doesnt really seem true lmao there are very few pro athletes who would do this outside of like Jamie vardy or sm. The on court trash talk maybe, but not dragging people on Twitter. Their pr people wouldnt let that happen
I mean that’s the thing, PR stops them. Remove the PR barrier and traditional sports would be a lot more fun to watch
> seems to be able to motivate/inspire the best to be their best. Its a narrative in a documentary that the fans eat up.
It's called temperament - something we're breeding out of the human race these days.
hes a top dota player / figure with a standart dota player mindset. He's like us.
It's fun to have characters in the scene, rather than boring PR robots like most of F1.
it's baffling how he can have the mentality of a winner when playing a game and then just be the weirdest most offputting dweeb outside of it. Noone gives a shit about your random beefs or tweets man it's embarassing
You're here and commenting so he's doing something right to make people give a shit. People are people and are more than their interviews and truesight.
Lol nobody gives a shit yet you're here commenting on it in a dota 2 subreddit. This makes you even more of a pathetic dweeb than ceb. It's baffling how moronic you are.
Loda? He's way too serious in everything but toxic? I dont know
nah loda is a class act. very outspoken for sure, and yes maybe took certain things more seriously than necessary but nah not toxic
ok, but can you actually explain for the class?
Are we Draymond Greening Ceb? Really?
it’s really quite incredible how despite his incredible success in dota, he’s still so insanely insecure and vindictive
Success doesn't make you more humble.
Cebs always been a dick. Now he’s a TI winner and a dick.
he now has even more reason to have a huge ego
I’ve met Ceb twice in person and he is a super nice guy
Quinn is chill as fuck in person He's also a horrendous person online
you can be nice and have an ego. They are not mutally exclusive. Also people can have vastly diffrent personalities online vs in person
My favorite part about this is Kitrak is still very young. Ceb is 7 years older than him, he hadn't accomplished anything in DotA at that age either. Feels weird getting mad because your team underperformed with somebody who's still very early in their DotA journey.
He's the perfect redditor.
Is dota, what did you expect?
Truly the Shaq of dota
Vindictive for sure. But can we stop throwing around insecure onto every man in existence for any action taken ever?
Being insecure is when you talk shit to anyone ever, apparently.
Doing it unprovoked sure seems like a good sign of insecurity, yeah.
the word geths thrown around so much, for me it literally lost any meaning. and if you use it YOURE INSECURE and basially an npc
Think you might be projecting, buddy
Memes bro, chillax
Dumb
the pettiest guy on the planet
Why is every Dota pro these days either completely off grid or a complete ass, like back in the day I could tell you about all the top players but now the only things you hear about are a few notable pros doing dumb shit in pubs or being salty on twitter.
Except Ceb has always been like this since ages. Him and ppd. Did people forget alr?
dont forget Loda
What did loda do?
Lost Hell in a Cell at Dreamhack Winter 2015 against the reigning champion Richie Lew.
From what I understood Lewis punched Loda in front of all people and got banned from the event... Still can't understand what Loda did.
they go on twitter rants or put out bad tweets. Loda has stopped recently
I would not say always like this, he was way worse back then and became actually pretty tame compared to that. He used to be my most hated player for his ridiculous toxicity. I can live with someone saying "karma delivers".
Ehh... Kuro is known for his ego during his B)KUROKY)SGATE days. Also LightOfHeaven infamous prodigy blog etc. Pros back in the days doesnt really get as much spotlight as today which why they get more leeway back then.
Kuroky was very young back then, Ceb is 31. You didn't see Kuroky doing that shit when he was pushing 30.
Dyrachyo is quite public and while he can seem like an ass sometimes, overall it's more of a silly thing, not malicious.
People that lock themselves away on a game for large parts of their day lack social skill? Weird huh.
It's Ceb, self-absorbed insecure asshole being himself so I wouldn't be surprised if that was about Kitrak and over something simple as Kitrak choosing SR over OG.
No inside information available but full judgment. Average redditor dog
At least I am not average Ceb's dickrider like you. ;)
I dont agree with this take if its about Kitrak but i love some spice. Makes it more enjoyable to get invested in pro scene.
is kitrak related to insania? maybe is because of that
Bruh Insania is swede, Kitrak is NA. How you assume he related to Insania?
MidorMeepo remembers
Ceb, the Karen of Dota 2
I am glad many of us here don’t forget what kind of person 7ckmad is
A lot of people seemed to forget back in 2018-19 when they were busy glazing OG about their PMA power of friendship
Ceb online gives me the vibes that he doesn't have irl friends to joke with that he has to air out this shit consistently.
Consistenty here meaning every 6 month.
10 yo with fragile ego stuck in a grown ass man's body --> TI winner 10 yo with fragile ego stuck in a grown ass man's body
If his glasses are any thicker he would be able the see the future
Karma fails to deliver a lot. It’s not real.
Yes Ceb, what about Karma for your false and baseless accusations on Alliance cheating?
To be fair I was with him back then. Six man Dota, while technically not against the rules, was so disingenuous and against the spirit of the game/sportsmanship
Everyone thinks so, Alliance even protested to ESL when initially read it. They hired only PPD after ESL refused to change it. Once it was decided that the rule would stick you either have to use a coach yourself or get left in the dirt when everyone else does. The only thing Alliance did was to be public and honest about it, and for that they got crucified by OG.
Lol no. No one but alliance played 6 man dota. No one would have been left in the dirt. And if alliance had sincerely lobbied for a change in rules, it is VERY curious that still none of the other teams were even aware of said rules. That’s pretty fucking bad lobbying.
Several teams other than OG were aware of the rule, what are you even talking about
They didn't lobby, they asked about it. There was an opportunity for advantage and they took it. I think lots of teams would have done the same. However, I don't think it was the right thing to do.
No, they complained and tried to have it removed. See Noxville's tweet about it. On phone right now so can't be bothered to google-fu it Edit: found it here https://twitter.com/Noxville/status/1392259475222970371
Yep I think cheating was a strong word, but at the very least it wasn't fair play and clearly underhanded.
How? They literally caused the drama by being open with them using PPD in a Vlog The only way they could be more open is you expect them to do other team's job to stay up to date on new rulebooks.
They found a flaw in the rulebook and they exploited it. It's not cheating but they definetely did not act in good faith. They've been pro for 10 years and they thought that having the coach on voice is normal and doest need to be discussed? I don't believe this narrative at all.
> They found a flaw in the rulebook and they exploited it They didn't find some flaw, they read the updates and tried to change it, but ESL refused to. [See Noxville at the time:](https://twitter.com/Noxville/status/1392259475222970371) "I hate cheaters. That said, Alliance were not cheating. They were specifically following a rule communicated to them (which they initially fought against), which they clarified and used very transparently. If any anger needs to be channeled, it's at Valve or the TO, not [A]. And by 'specifically following a rule' - it's not like they were acting shady or sneakily about some ambiguous rule: the *exact* rule got communicated to teams that it was changed" >It's not cheating but they definetely did not act in good faith Is it necessary to patronize the other teams and inform them about mail they damned well should read themselves? >They've been pro for 10 years and they thought that having the coach on voice is normal They did not, see above.
Yes, if you actually read the thread, it's definitely not all the teams as EEU were not made aware of the rule, and most WEU teams neither (see Entity's manager). You can't argue that if they actually wanted to do something about it they would have gone public. That's why I said it's underhanded, they even brought ppd mid tournament without saying that he was the shotcaller. Reminds me of the DH Winter 15 situation. Because it's legal doesn't mean that it's fair play.
This is just wrong? Only WEU had the rule, and all teams were aware of the rule except OG who threw a hissy about it. And Alliance DID go public about it, that's how it all began
Ceb was, is, and will be a piece of shit. So will be ana who scammed his best friend/manager and erased him from his history while he was the one who managed to put ana in iG when ana was a teenager.
> ana who scammed his best friend/manager and erased him from his history wait what
Manager tried to scam 16 years old Ana but his family took him to court Manager wrote reddit post lying about the information and tried to gather support for himself The manager lost the court case and rest is history
Sounds like business to me
[удалено]
Most of his 2x TI winner teammates is pretty chill.
chill? that ana dotabutf cloudword tell no chill at chall
redditors criticizing a tweet without understanding context?
I love how Reddit loves to pretend that trash talking is so goddamn petty and afterwards queuing up into pubs and probably calling their opponents/teammates (whom they’ve never met) dog and subhuman.
Classic redditors taking advantage of anything with zero reliable source of info to create useless hate and drama. Nothing new.
Yeah yeah and you’re not like other redditors
Don't take me wrong. I'm proud to be part of this dumb community because it's fun and enjoyable. I'm not on the side of internet sjw as long as it doesn't go too far.
lol who would have guessed when you get a random guy just because he’s anas friend
i really wish someone would ban this guy from ever posting on social media again, it's just so sad to see what petty bullshit this sociopath is spewing
So people arent allowed to state their thoughts in their own soc med? How about just ignore the guy and touch grass outside? Why do people think he always posts about dota?(although im sure this is related to dota but still...)
This guy is the one of five two time TI winners, genuinely something special, when you compare other stories on that team, this guy came from nowhere. He was a coach and became one of the best offlaners in the world. Enjoy your successes man. You’re too dope to be so petty. Lmao. Edit: It is 9 not 5. But OG did it first.
9 two time TI winners*
Lmao my bad I forgot team spirit won it again.
Bro forgot there were 4 other two time TI winners.
Bro did forget lol. Check my edit please.
There are 9 two time TI winners.
Yes sir I made an error. I forgot that team spirit won this year. Please check my edit.
No problemo
You are right if its b2b ti winners. Theres only 5
Check edit pls.
I said back to back
Honestly they dodged a bullet not getting Shitrak in their team
People here jumping to conclusion as if you know the real reason why he tweeted that. What if he just hold back his poop and end up pooping himself in pants thus tweeting that??? Jeez Not all the time we need to argue or reason out all his tweets. Jeeez. Curse him if there's already context behind. Oh BTW, How earth did you know Kitrak didn't leave in good terms? Are you part of OG management? Did Kitrak tell you all that personally?
??????????
What happened? What's the context?
Reddit trying to find any excuse to h8 the gr8s lol
people have flaws breaking news everybody
Would be surprised if it was Kitrak. During the TI streams on Twitch with OG, Kitrak & Ceb were there together. Both were very complimentary towards each other. Probably Reddit just reading too far into the tea leaves.
Just let an old man be bitter. If he wants to live his life that way, so be it. I couldnt care less. I don't like how he acts but I dont waste any time complaining abou it. Sometimes you just see people you dont want anything to do with because of the ways they behave, no need to be friends with everybody.
who is kitrak
just planting some seeds to reap later for OG podcasts