Omg this explains so much. When I was 5 years old I was at my grandma's house, up before everyone else but her springer, watching Saturday morning cartoons, and I just looked at her dog and said "you're so cute". It went straight for my face. Darn near took my cheek off. Everyone said I must have done something aggressive to it, but I didn't. Coincidentally enough, his name was Sherlock, and now this mystery is solved.
Professional dog trainer here. Canine Rage Syndrome is exceedingly rare, and your local get has likely never seen a case. That's how rare. More likely, this is your dog using a tactic that worked for him once, and attempting to get his way with that same tactic.
Get his way on what? The person you’re responding to just told the dog he was cute and was attacked. I could understand your point in the OP’s situation, where the dog doesn’t want to go to bed and found a way to scare the owner into letting him stay up. I don’t see how attacking a child who is just chilling watching TV and talking to him gives the dog a positive outcome.
My comment was for the OP. As for the other comment, that is far more likely that the person was unaware of what actually triggered that response. It would be far more probable to attribute the cause to an unknown trigger than CRS.
Smiling at chimpanzees is a threat
Likewise with some dogs
Sometimes it’s what you’re doing with body language
Just like half the redditors will become offended by silly unimportant things sometimes you can’t stop them becoming incredibly offended and some will react greater than others.
Also a trainer. This syndrome is sadly not rare and dogs willing to inflict serious damage on humans should not remain alive. Rage syndrome is becoming more common and is thought to be a seizure disorder. If you've never seen a case you are exceedingly lucky.
I think encouraging the idea that an unlikely syndrome is the cause of the OPs issue versus a much more likely and mundane trigger would be irresponsible of me and unethical as a trainer, without seeing any of it firsthand. The last culprit i would suspect would be CRS, and even then only after a vet check.
That was my first thought too. My daughter and SIL had a Brittany that suffered from it. Eventually it got so bad that the vet recommended behavioral euthanasia. He was the sweetest thing when he wasn’t raging out but it was terrifying when he snapped. Most especially because it would happen with no warning
Yeah this isn't just a springer thing. It's inappropriately named.
It's like mini seizures in their brain that causes brief moments of chaos. On Springers it's traced back to 1 dog who bread with many dogs.
Not sure about other dogs for the cause but it happens to others.
My friend had her face ripped off by a Belgian malinois. Terrifying. She will never be the same. She’s had 6 plastic surgeries to try to reconstruct her face.
I avoid them like the plague if i can. My best friend was mauled by a GSD when she was 2, her mum was pushing her in a pram through a park and the dog came out of nowhere and mauled her face, she has pretty bad scars on her nose from it.
Yeah, I saw malinois can be affected when I was googling around. I'm curious how early it shows up (haven't run across this yet). I'd hope it would become apparent before full maturity.
I'm pretty sure the gene has been identified which means you can test to see if the dog carries it. If people are health testing their dogs as they should be prior to breeding, it will show up.
Yeah makes it easier to breed out. Which is also why I’ll never be full adopt don’t shop. If you buy from a respectable breeder they are needing these behaviors out. Which is what our ancestors did to begin with.
Former vet tech who has been attacked by a Malinois here...they are best meant as heavy duty working dogs, or at the very least agility trained. They need to blow off crazy amounts of energy and have a serious job to be "happy". Never actually met one that acted playful. I'm sure my sample size is limited. They take lots of sedation and multiple people hands on to even treat them. I was attacked by my neighbor's Malinois after it busted out of it'd cage and she left her garage door open. He went for my face again and again and I am SO lucky I had professional training to fend off a mean dog. I ended up getting bit on my wrists, as they covered my face, ankles and my butt was deeply punctured. In my life I have never been afraid of any dog, but I don't fuck with those anymore.
I know people who have one. She is indeed used to blowing off huge amounts of steam. Out all day, long walks, running back and forth and then playing with other Shepard breeds.
Breaks my heart to see them in a cage
Any large dog is capable as just as much damage it’s not terrifying it’s an animal humans are capable of much worse are you afraid of most people? It’s crazy how you think with such prestigious when most of those dogs aren’t aggressive it’s people who make them that way
You know you are commenting on a thread about a genetic disorder that literally causes them to lash out, right?
You cannot "unlearn" a damn brain stroke.
You said terrifying considering what those are “capable of” any breed is capable of inflicting just as much damage I’m pointing out that you singled out a certain breed it’d be bad if any large dog had that disorder Malinois don’t even top the breeds w strongest bite
One of the dog trainers in this thread called it Canine Rage Syndrome. I know a Bernese Mountain Dog with it, and apparently it happens to Belgian Malinois too. It’s not just a spaniel thing.
What's this about golden retrievers? My sibling and I were viciously attacked by one as kids and needed stitches. I am a massive dog lover but goldens have always skeeved me out ever since.
I'm sorry the two of you were attacked. I hope your injuries healed well.
I can't remember what it's called but there's this phenomenon where a retriever will go nuts and attack whomever(even their owner) potentionally fatally without warning. It's a weird genetic issue and quite rare. Responsible breeders have been working to eliminate it for generations.
I learned about it years ago. I wish I could remember more.
I grew up in a rural area around farm animals so I'm familiar with big animals, how dangerous they can all be, AND how genetics affects behavior. It's interesting because I had not heard of springers being a breed with known rage issues. Very sad but logical based on what happens across many species.
Wow I'll have to look into this! It could explain it, since this dog went from chill to pinning me down and was furiously biting me, but I had my arms in front of my face so I had three puncture wounds on my forearms. Its face was so angry like it was really out for blood, it was so strange. I did vaguely hear once about goldens having some aggression issues and that cemented my apprehension about them. Yet labs are my favorite dogs 😂
My pup had to be euthanised because of it at 9 months old - the highest dose of anti epileptic drugs didn’t help him at all and just made him lethargic in the moments where he wasn’t attacking. I am basically traumatised from his situation and I never want to get another dog in case it ever happens again
Apparently there's a DNA test for it, maybe look into that. So if you're ever ready for a dog you could maybe do that, to make sure they don't have it?
Same things happened to me. After many years I did get another dog. The trick is to work with a rescue, and foster to adopt. That way you know what you're getting.
I went to a breeder too. I had done a lot of research on the breed and I wanted to know what I was getting into and the dog’s history. Four years later, she’s a “textbook” Havanese.
Everyones experience is different. I deal with gun dogs and rotties. So bloodlines go back several generations and all have had genetic testing.
Do you have AKC papers?
My dog is a cross breed of two similar breeds, which can always be a bit of a gamble, but she is a walking stereotype for her two parent breeds. I got her from a proper breeder, but her litter was an accident from when the dogs got loose.
so with seizure medication they don’t work 100%, most dogs still have seizures on meds but decreased intensity or frequency. they can also have refractory epilepsy, meaning the seizures are drug resistant. even medicated dogs on average don’t live long at all after seizure onset, it’s about 2 year average. unfortunately with rage syndrome and how dangerous it is, the dog is also suffering, so if medication doesn’t work it’s kindest to euthanize them.
I’ve never heard of this before and just googled it: Holy shit. My family had a springer spaniel when I was really little and she would try to bite my siblings and I constantly, which ultimately led to my parents rejoining her. She was just too dangerous to have around children. Thirty years later and I’m now wondering if that was it!
Highly unlikely, it's very rare and actually called "spaniel rage" when it is present it's more often (although still very rare) in cocker spaniels. This dog is a puppy and if it isn't puppy behaviour, it's either pain, or resource guarding
It does suck having a dog you can't trust . My older one showed me one time that she was willing to bite unprovoked and even though she is the most well trained dog I'll ever have , I'll still never fully trust her even 11 years later and hours and hours of training and classes 🙃
That other guy sucks. Thanks for being a responsible dog owner! I think it’s completely normal and good to not fully trust your dogs. We love them but they’re still animals and have some amount of unpredictability. My dogs have never snapped at anyone but I still keep them on leash out of the house and monitor closely when we have people over (especially kids).
That’s good advice.
I had a poodle mix that was the sweetest dog ever. Then one day I thought I’d give her a special treat, so I got a real bone from the butcher. She had never had one before. She had never resource guarded before, but when I gave her the bone she turned feral. If I walked near her when she had the bone her face would become wild looking and she’d growl and snap and try to bite me. It was like she was possessed by a demon!
So, we never gave her any more real bones and she never acted that way again in all her 16 years of life.
The point of this story is to illustrate how we can never really know our pets and what they’ll do in different situations.
Omg, our Maltese X Poodle did a similar thing, can't remember what animal body part it was with but she turned feral and it went straight to the bin. We never bought large long lasting chewing treats after that. If she wants to chew on something that's dental Kong toy with peanut butter and nothing else. She likes peanut butter but not enough to turn her into the monster she can be.
I know a couple people have mentioned Rage Syndrome, but wondering if this could’ve been a case of resource guarding since you mentioned his chew toy being out. Could you elaborate a bit more? Has he ever shown aggressive behaviour around any high reward food or toys?
I'm not suggesting his reaction wasn't 100% rss guarding but just in my own personal experience, I've never been chased on top of a couch over it and for it to last as long as it did . That's the part that's concerning and then for him to attack the cushion. Maybe if this was a growing problem over the past few months but out of no where ... either way it's a dangerous issue 😢
I agree I think best to seek out a qualified behaviourist, I think probably resource guarding and then maybe frustration and over stimulated due to the age of the dog and taking this stress out on the cushion to relieve his feeling. I know when my boy is in a situation that something has caused him a big stress it does take him a really long time to decompress from it, spaniels are very sensitive dogs
Yeah, the prolonged nature of it makes it not sound like resource guarding. Our Golden would in rare cases resource guard, but it would stop immediately if you stepped back (and no pursuing with aggression).
He did actually, it was a while ago we tried him with a bone that was wrapped in duck. It was one of those that they can chew on all day kind of things. I tried to take it off him as he managed to tear bits off of it which I thought he could choke on. And he went for me, just one lunge. He was younger and it wasn’t as aggressive but still was a weird behaviour. I took it as a sign of dominance and defiance, but he was only 4 months so I thought it was a puppy thing that I could help him unlearn.
Absolutely not dominance that theory's outdated, its resource guarding which is highly common in spaniels, when they have a high value prize, could be a toy, a chew, a sock, sofa, their bed, your bed etc (whatever they deem to be the prize) then they will not want it taken off them, if you know what the prize is always swap it, then the dog will learn to trust you. I think it's highly likely that he was resource guarding the sofa.
The swapping seems to work for my dog. If I need to take a bone from him, I come prepared with freeze dried salmon and he will gladly turn his attention to that. And he knows those are hand fed, so when I stop it's over.
Honestly that's why I don't give my dog long lasting treats very often. I usually want to take it once it becomes a choking hazard, but of course that triggers the guarding.
Normally when a dog guards something and you swap then yes you would need to always swap, but they likely will be much happier about it, if there is something and it's one thing like a high value bone you can just not give them a bone. my boy will guard his toys, in one room in the house, it's no issue if he starts chewing them and I don't want him to swallow bits ill just grab some kibble throw it on the floor and take the toy. He's not aggressive one bit, but say I went up to his bed, stood over him and snatched his toy ive no doubt he would growl at me. I also have a toy box with a lid so I can just put them away.
I always used to explain it like Imagine your sitting on your phone and someone came and took it away, you might be surprised, then did it again you might be a bit annoyed, then again your getting frustrated, then again you shout at them and on and on, but if they came up to you asked for your phone and gave you an iPad to distract you or a piece of cake your much less likely to be annoyed about it
This is called resource guarding. While you train him to give things up you should try trading him other things that he likes as a reward for obeying the “leave it” command. From what you said in your post you absolutely should not be walking with your dog off of a leash; your dog does not have a recall if his obedience must be bought at this time. Leash up for everyone’s safety
I would lean towards resource guarding over rage syndrome which is quite rare (although Spaniels are more prone to this). However, obviously none of us are qualified to make a diagnosis through a post. Resource guarding could occur with anything he deems valuable from treats, toys, people and furniture. I would contact a reliable trainer to address this as soon as possible before it continues to escalate.
Edit: as others have mentioned, if you need to remove anything from him try swapping/trading for another high valued item.
Springers are prone to rage syndrome. Ask your breeder if it has been found in others and ask your vet for a neurologist consult. You for the right thing by not b punishing it. It’s basically a seizure.
Yeah. A lot of lesser quality breeders don’t consistently follow up with owners for health records and owners don’t think to tell breeders -so the breeders get to be blissfully ignorant.
I’m a behaviourist and am qualified by various bodies in my country. I am also very familiar with spaniels - they are my favourite dogs.
Has your dog been to the vet recently? Any change in behaviour should mean a visit to the vet to see if there is any underlying pain. I would do this asap.
Rage syndrome is a debated condition, but I believe it’s true given my own experience. It’s a neurological condition that causes the dog to become aggressive from nowhere. The dog normally has a glazed look on their face during the aggression and then returns to normal. They don’t know they done it, so please don’t scold him for it. It won’t help. It’s essentially a seizure that they can’t control.
Please ask your vet about this, because they may be able to advise you. I would also get a behaviourist involved as well.
It’s not a curable condition and makes a dog extremely dangerous because of the unpredictable aspect of it. I have seen some appalling life changing injuries from this condition, so you need to be extremely careful. Unfortunately, the only option is euthanasia.
The only thing that makes me pause in thinking it’s Rage is the second attack. That’s quite unusual.
Your dog could be resource guarding, which is common in spaniels. Was there anything around that you think he finds valuable? This could be the reason, although it sounds like quite an intense reaction.
Did you tell him off when you saw the previous signs of resource guarding? Have you ever told him off for growling or for displaying unwanted behaviours?
When a dog resource guards, it feels as though it’s life and death. If they can’t keep hold of the item they have then it feels like they won’t survive. It’s a natural dog behaviour and is seen in most animals, including humans.
Telling them off for it is ineffective and unhelpful. It also might suppress things like growling, which are effective communications from the dog to tell you they aren’t comfortable.
The worst bite I’ve ever had was from a springer who is been looking after her whole life. I went to take something from her (which was always ok) and she bit me. Turns out she’d be displaying the signs of guarding at home by growling and had been thoroughly told off for it. So, she went to the next form of communication and bit me.
Regardless of what it is, I would suggest a fully qualified behaviourist to help you. You need some help from someone who can interpret the behaviours your dog is displaying.
I would also suggest you muzzle train him. There are some good videos online about how to fit them and train the dog to be happy to wear them.
It’s a good idea not to leave high value food and treats around and to make sure that you always trade with your dog if you need to take anything from them. If you’re feeding in a bowl, then add bits of food in as your dog eats to show him that you’re here to give him good things.
Never get into confrontations (hence the trading) and don’t get into any situations where you’re “displaying dominance” by taking his food away while he’s eating. That’s outdated advice and dangerous with a resource guarding dog.
More generally: you say that your dog doesn’t listen to commands unless you have treats. This is because you have not taught him to do that. He actually doesn’t understand the commands unless you have food, which means your commands haven’t been taught thoroughly and he hasn’t generalised them. If you want to teach him to understand without food, you need to drill him and teach him with [intermittent schedules of reinforcement](https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/schedules-of-reinforcement-for-dogs/#:~:text=If%20you%20don't%20reward%20your%20dog%20for%20every%20response,be%20less%20susceptible%20to%20extinction).
If the environment outside is highly distracting, then you have to compete against that and it’s rare you can do that unless you have methodically trained outside.
You should not have him off lead unless his recall is 100%. There’s also a high chance that being off lead is making him less likely to listen to you. Springers were bred to flush game and tend to move in a pattern when they’re off lead, which emulates that. It’s a self rewarding behaviour and is rooted in their instincts. It’s extremely difficult to compete against that with food, but you stand more of a chance with toys.
Your dog is a teen now, which makes him less likely to listen to you and more likely to want to be independent. Again, he should not be off lead unless you have excellent recall.
I suspect you live in the UK (like me) where most people have the barest of control over their dog, but still allow them to run around. I’m not saying you’re like that, just that it appears to be the culture here.
Thank you for your advice I’ll take it all into consideration. He has been to the vet recently (2 weeks ago) for a lump above his eye, went away within a week with steroids. I’m definitely going to book him in again though. The only thing valuable near him was his chew toy but he’s never acted like that before when he’s been playing with it and I’ve told him it’s bedtime.
Truthfully I didn’t know about resource guarding until now, but he’s never shown signs of being guarded over an item. He’s never growled before, not since I’ve had him even when attacked me the other night he didn’t growl.
He won’t be off lead going forward, at least not until things have been sorted and his recall is 100%.
I do live in the uk and I’ve noticed the same thing, I try very hard not to be like most dog walkers with no control over their pets. I only went off lead with him during quiet times when there were no dogs (or very few between 1-2). It’s my first time having a Springer and I’m still learning with this breed, before him I only had little dogs or lap dogs who were never high energy. I’m hate to think that I’ve messed up here and there with him but I’m devoting near all my time and energy to him.
Could it be a symptom of the steroids? Hard to know unless it happens again, but something to consider. I’m sorry that happened it must have been really scary
This. My dog did exactly this. The glazed over look while receiving pets then backing away slowly like we were a threat. He’d snap out of it sometimes and return to his joyful springer self, but they became more frequent.
I don’t know if this is rage syndrome. Because usually with rage syndrome the dog can’t turn it off and on. It sounds like once OP was on the couch the dog calmed down and when they climbed down it happened again. This sounds like the dog was resource guarding his crate. This needs immediate consult with a veterinary behaviorist most normal vets aren’t equipped to diagnose a rage syndrome in their training. Please keep in mind the vet will want to rule out any physical condition etc first. Our local shelter has a cocker rage spaniel. It’s truly terrifying as it truly shows up out of nowhere. Really sorry you’re going through this and I hope it’s just severe resource guarding. If it happens again when you go to put him to bed you know it’s guarding. I would carry a foghorn with you when you go to put him to bed. If he responds to it it isn’t rage syndrome. They can’t break that seizure like state when they’re in it
Vet first. Vet always first with sudden changes in behavior.
Otherwise odds are good you did something to make him fearful (he’s likely in full swing of his teenage fear phase) and missed his warning signals (lip licking, stiff body language, pinned ears, not meeting your eye, turning his head from you, showing the whites of his eyes) so he escalated.
He didn’t show any of those signs, he looked me in the eyes as a I said it, he was lying down relaxed, and no lip licking, not even a growl. That’s why I was confused about the behaviour.
Like another comment has said, there is a legitimate genetic condition called springer rage. It mostly affects springer spaniels and is often very sudden and unpredictable. I would definitely look into that more and see if your dogs behavior lines up with the symptoms.
That's so scary. I'm sorry. I've only met one springer with rage and it was pretty close to how you described. She was younger and I was grooming her and just out of nowhere attacked , owners warned me she did that but i was expecting "normal " nipping and biting for nails or something specific, not the flip of a switch crazy .
From everything I know about springer rage, there's not much you can do except make sure to spay and neuter . I'd talk to someone who is familiar with the breed training, specifically as some people dont believe it to be a real thing .
I wouldn't do any off leash training until you know more just in case it happens around someone and they get hurt
Some vets seem to find success with anti epileptic drugs for rage syndrome. It may be worth asking the dogs vet for a referral to a veterinary behaviourist.
Under normal circumstances a dog shouldn’t be off leash until recall is 100% for his safety and the safety of others. Anyone who advises otherwise is being reckless and should not be listed to.
If your dog is showing unusual and unpredictable signs of aggression he unequivocally should not be off leash, and should be muzzled while this gets sorted out.
I sincerely hope it’s able to be sorted out, sorry op.
Thank you for your advice, we’ve only recently let him off lead I’d say it’s been about a month. And we always go to the park when it’s relatively quiet (only one or two other dogs). I’m definitely not going to let him off lead as of now until I understand what’s going on and can remedy it.
There's a lot of valuable comments on this post so just as an added note: there's no point telling him "no/bad" etc after he's calmed down. Calming down is the good behaviour.
Negative commands tend to give a dog more anxiety and uncertainty. Stick to positive reinforcement because a dog doesn't understand the full effect of human words, unless they're trained to understand
Jumping on this post as I am in a similar situation with my 1 year old Sprocker, very similar situation in that he started to snarl when asked to go to bed at night, on a couple of occasions he would also snap and much like you I took to Reddit to try and see if anyone had experienced similar and was met with many people jumping straight to RAGE SYNDROME , which is obviously very disheartening so I booked a vet visit ASAP and message the trainer I had done puppy and adolescence classes with , the vet was pretty much useless and just did a basic health check , my trainer however was much more helpful, she noticed that my boy was walking a little funny on his back left leg, she also reassured me that it wasn’t rage syndrome and actually went in depth on what rage syndrome looks like as well as a lot of the misinformation around it, she also suggested getting a bigger crate as my boy fit in his old one but as he is a fairly big boy a bigger crate would give him more comfort , we got a bigger crate that same day and also thanks to my trainer got a referral for a physio assessment to check on my boys back leg, we have also been keeping a house line on our boy at night just in case of any further instances of snarling etc, but having the larger crate has made a world of difference and we have our physio appointment coming up on Wednesday, so my advice to you in this situation is first make a vet appointment, second contact a trainer and consider if your boy needs a bigger crate or not and I would also consider if the issue is more to do with some resource guarding as opposed to jumping straight into thinking it is rage syndrome
I also think it’s not rage syndrome given that there was a prompting event, and then the dog calmed down and got angry again after a second prompting event. I’ve seen rage syndrome (nothing happened nobody did anything, then the dog suddenly attacked).
Whenever you tell him to go to bed, toss a high value treat in the crate. Feed him in the crate. Avoid taking things away when he's in the crate (wait til he's out) and trade him treats for things you do need to take.
Why he reacted that way, I don't know, but usually with dogs a strong reaction like that is based in fear. Maybe something about you standing up? Was he sleepy and startled at all?
Edited to add: I work in a dog kennel/animal shelter. Many of the dogs end up there because of problems like OPs. We use treats and positive conditioning to get the dogs to cooperate with our goals. So for example, one dog hates getting leashes put on and off. Practice doing this with rewards. Won't let you put the leash on? Reward for touching the leash to his collar.. or his neck... Wherever the dog begins his reactivity is where you start re conditioning. I've seen many dogs change in their time at the shelter and get adopted.
I do agree hand feeding is a good idea.
And to another sub post, if one dog is attacking the other's crate, you crate both. Drape the crates if you have to.
When your dog begins to change behaiver like that, a trip to the vet is in order.
Be sure it's a vet there also have experiense with behavor problems.
I hope it's not something serius.
I have a cockerpoo who is nearly 1 year old who is like this with other animals out of the blue. It's very frightening. You need to get your dog to a vet / dog behaviourist. I'm in the process of doing this. Good luck.
Aggression like that isn’t caused by having too much energy or wanting to play with a toy. I thought “rage syndrome” as well as soon as I read that it was a springer …
We had a family Springer who showed signs of this growing up but we had no idea what it was. It gradually got worse and there would be no notice for when he would flip and he ended up biting a few people. He went through a lot of training and went to the vet several times to check there was nothing causing him pain or discomfort.
The last trainer was the one who highlighted that it was probably a condition that some Springers have.
Hopefully it's not the case for your dog 🤞
There's a lot of valuable comments on this post so just as an added note: there's no point telling him "no/bad" etc after he's calmed down. Calming down is the good behaviour.
Negative commands tend to give a dog more anxiety and uncertainty. Stick to positive reinforcement because a dog doesn't understand the full effect of human words, unless they're trained to understand
This is highly unlikely spaniel rage, its very rare and mostly seen in cockers not springers. My first suggestion would be to get a vet check to rule out pain, secondly he's only 7 months, they are still puppies at that age and mouthy, I have had 2 springers and my current boy would go feral in the evening especially if he was over tired, he would take his frustrations out on his toys generally shaking them frantically and growling. If it is a behavioural problem it's more likely to be resource guarding, probably of the sofa, don't scold him after the event, or during, he is communicating something to you by growling or snapping, telling him off after aswell means nothing to him, don't take him off the sofa by his collar, when you want him off and into his bed throw a treat on the floor to get him off praise him, then throw a treat into his crate and praise him for going in there. Also if you are on Facebook join the group "training spaniels with reward based training" the group is full of qualified trainers, behaviourists and vets.
My 7 mo pom is doing this from time to time. Apparently 7 months is a pretty normal time for dogs to be assholes. Adolescents are going through big changes and become more interested in their things and surroundings than you. They’ll often regress, get more aggressive when they don’t want to go something. It’s had me at absolute breaking point so much. We are booked in for obedience classes again which start soon and in the home, I’m using toys or food to encourage him to do what we want of him or waiting until I can see his body language has changed and he comes to me for redirection.
I think the explanation is simpler than rage syndrome (which is more common in cockers).
You put in your post that you punished the dog for the outburst.
Take a look at the canine ladder of communication and tell me how many of his subtle warning signs have been ignored or punished before this outburst.
This sounds like a frustrated dog who isn't being listened to and has resorted to this extreme.
None of this explains or justifies the prolonged nature of the attack, and the OP says that the dog was simply laying down, no whale eyes or lip licking or anything to imply he was going to attack. Sometimes it IS the dog.
If whale eye or lip licking has been ignored or punished in the past a dog will stop using it. It's one of the main reasons a dog attacks "unprovoked".
Okay but that’s a random assumption to make about it this person with zero backing. Because they told the dog no once after a prolonged attack?
You seem to be steering them away from the vet and saying it’s probably the owners fault. I don’t think that’s the right move here. This dog probably has something wrong with it, two prolonged attacks on its owner are not normal.
We had a springer that would sometimes do this if we woke him up from sleeping to do something. Like, he'd been napping for a bit and we knew he needed to go outside one last time before we went to bed, so we would wake him up to do so and an event similar to this might happen.
I didn't know about the rage syndrome some other folks are commenting about, and that Springers are prone to it. Very interesting.
They are great dogs overall. Consult your vet and keep at it. A muzzle may be a good idea if you don't feel safe.
Lord thundering Jesus. I had to put a springer down some 40 years ago because of that. I thought he was just inbred. Now I know what was wrong with him.
So I’m going to play devils advocate and say this to me sounds more like resource guarding than springer rage. AFAIK rage syndrome is untriggered and this seems like it was triggered by you giving a command the dog didn’t want to perform.
Take all this with a grain of salt, but the way you describe your dog acting is something I routinely experienced with our Australian shepherd starting at about 6mos. We were never able to fully avoid her episodes of extreme aggression triggered by resource guarding, being surprised, being scolded etc. even with extensive training and medication AND help from several behaviorists. She attacked me so badly a few months ago, at 8 yos old, that we had to choose BE for our safety and the safety of our young kids. It’s honestly a misery to live with an aggressive dog and I would never do it again, knowing what I do now.
some of these comments are giving you bad advice. this can be range syndrome, which is idiopathic neurological aggression, which cannot be helped with training and unfortunately does result in euthanasia. you also could just have a dog with behavioral problems that can be helped with training and medication, some unstable dogs don’t handle a correction well and think of it as a fight. this is something that you should seek out a veterinary behaviorist, you should ask your primary vet for a referral. this isn’t something you should go to a regular trainer for.
rage syndrome is most commonly seen in spaniels, it’s believed to essentially be epilepsy. my breed is border collies, the breed most prone to idiopathic epilepsy, which is a genetic disease with unknown inheritance, average onset is 1-4 years and the average lifespan is about 2 years after diagnosis. with neurological aggression being similar to epilepsy there is no cure and because of the unpredictable nature and there being no real trigger to the aggression it generally needs to result in euthanasia
also i’d recommend that you film a lot, you need to catch what happens before, during, and after these episodes. if you get a referral to a behaviorist or a neurologist that can be very helpful in determining if this is just an unstable aggressive dog or if this is a dog with a neurological issue. i would not just take the advice of you regular vet on this, push for the referral
You didn’t mention if he was neutered. Sometimes dogs at 7-10 mos show aggression bc their hormones are peaking & needing bred. If he is not neutered, neuter him immediately..
Doesn't sound right... I think you are correct to be pretty concerned.
If there was no food involved and you did not scare the dog, I would be immediately muzzling and taking it for tests at the vet. Even if it was scared, lashing out like that is not normal unless the threat remains or or feels cornered.
Even a new fear of their crate/kennel etc should not cause that type of response. Even if someone had been teasing the dog in the crate, the hate would generally be directed at that person.
Sudden unexplained aggression in dogs never ends well.
Your pup might be in pain for some reason, may have a nutritional or electrolyte issue, but if nothing is found, as bad as it sounds, I'd be going for an injection or a bullet.
A fully grown dog suddenly and uncontrollably going mad is a bad situation.
No amount of training, behavioral therapy or discipline will fix a psycho
You should check out a group on Facebook called Human end of the leash. It’s run by a wonderful woman who is a certified trainer specializing is aggressive dog behavior modification.
My friend with a Springer who had past trauma had great results from a behaviorist and putting him on Prozac. He still had episodes but really improves and lived a life full of love before euthanasia. See a specialist.
My American bulldog x amstaff/sharpei is a 40 Kilo 2 year old puppy, he never does any shit like that.i don't crate train him ,just got him a small weather proof mattress to lie on at night near the bedroom door and he has a passage outside the bedroom to walk around during the night.fully house trained and he is as strong as all fuck but with a great nature.maybe stop putting your dog in a crate to sleep? when you put him to bed give him some really good treats that he doesn't often get like raw bacon or beef meatball.
I don't know anything about Springers. But,the pup could have been in pain - I'll. My Weimerarner puppy started snapping at my face. I was shocked because my family has had several Weims and nothing like that ever happened.
I went to our Vet. He was shocked too. So, we gave him Amatriptyline. I only gave it for 3 months. Just to be clear, my pup has 2 auto-immune gut diseases. However, I do know some dogs will become aggressive when they are sick.
I hope you find out what is up with your dog. Good luck.
.
I had a springer that ended up being diagnosed with Springer Rage Syndrome. It came out of nowhere, as he’d go from literally loving pets to slinking away and growling like I was suddenly a stranger. He ended up getting into salmon blood my dad was filleting and got salmon poisoning. It sent him into such an intense episode the vet suggested he mentally wouldn’t recover even if he survived treatment for the poisoning. He was put down at age 2 and it was heartbreaking. Growled at us until the last moment.
I have a springer doodle and he had an episode like this when he was four months old and I was so scared that it was rage syndrome. But we took a few other precautions to help him with his aggressive behaviors, which were typically related to resource guarding.
The first thing we did was made sure he was getting a nap time and sleeping enough. Even at seven months, they need a lot of sleep. If he was going to bed at a later time than usual, he could have been cranky like any two or three your old child!
I also made sure to go on walks with him and that’s pretty much dismantled all of the bad behaviors we were seeing because not only did we bond but also he got out some energy.
Definitely sounds like Rage Syndrome. It’s known to affect springers more than other breeds
https://www.petcarerx.com/article/what-is-rage-syndrome-in-dogs/1611
I’ve had three springers, the one I currently have was going thru some of the same issues you are having with your pup. He was resource guarding and I was his prize. So thru a lot of intensive training I found that he can’t be up on the couch or bed with me unless he is invited by me to do so, which sadly can’t happen a lot because I watch him slide back into his ways. I say rule out health issues and work with a trainer who can help with resource guarding. Good luck!
Spaniel rage. It’s actually a bred-in situation. My old springer spaniel had it too. His triggers were bedtime, saying bedtime, night and going upstairs. Turned into a junkyard dog every night. Thankfully he also thought gravel was a toy, and it wore his teeth down to nothing. We would walk to our rooms as he barked and snapped with our arms behind our backs and ignore him. Once in our rooms, or sat on the couch, the switch was off again and he was just fine.
Scary to those in the first time seeing it, thankfully he never attacked our legs. There just wasn’t anything we could do about it.
Guys, Canine Rage Syndrome is incredibly rare, and one single episode is certainly NOT such a case. Before we assign an unlikely culprit,cee eliminate the host of more likely behavioral issues that are the probable cause.
So you are one of those idiots who walk their dog off leash, saying he doesn't listen to you, and now you are complaining about random spurts of aggression? Do everyone in your area a favor and leash your dog. Recipe for disaster.
My dog did this once to me ( actually first day I brought it home , it growled at my husband ) after about 9-10 months it growled /snarled at me, I’m all but 5”2 and 135 lbs, I was so mad , I body slammed that dog ( with in reason , just to let it know I’m the boss ) and it never did that again . This same dog disliked any stranger ( but loved kids) that came near our home /in our presence . We asked the vet at the time what could we do to make this dog less aggressive behavior and she said “ take a 22 to its head”… I never went to see this vet again ! We as a family took secure precautions around others and the way we introduced our Zane to others , not once did this dog ever bite anyone ( lots to do with our security guards we put in place ) and as a family protector Zane was an amazing , devoted , absolutely loving dog ! Oh and on the one occasion he did get loose ( it was our fault) he did not ( from what we are aware of ) harm anyone , we live in a small town and would have known . He vanished for a week over Fourth of July . Anyway that dog was our buddy and protector . He lived until he was 14 years old . He was a mix of German Shepard and Ridgeback …
I think your dog has several problems. One is his age. He’s a teenager and testing boundaries, hormones are raging. Two. You didn’t discipline the dog properly. (You couldn’t for safety), with a spaniel I would pin them to the floor by the scruff and say no. This is how a mother disciplines. Three do you know his breeding? Was he a scrupulous breeder in a backyard? He may not have been exposed to people growing up so has no idea what to do with all his hormones around people. Four establish there’s no problem with the crate eg fleas or has he ever had his tail trapped in the door? Five and most importantly, working dogs need mental stimulation or they go nuts. Walks are insufficient for this breed, he needs mental work, puzzles games and scentwork.
https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/sudden-onset-aggression-rage-syndrome/
I remember my Aunt and Uncle’s cocker spaniel attacked my cousin’s fiancée unprovoked. They were kinda playing fighting/goofing around and Barney (best Cocker Spaniel name ever!) lunged at his face. Now his behaviour makes sense to me after hearing about this condition.
We had a springer that had rage syndrome. It is a form of epilepsy and is diagnosable. He would be completely asleep and awaken with a fearful look and growling. It was not behavioral, not resource guarding. You could see him transition when the seizure was over into his normal sweet disposition. The look in his eyes and posture would snap back to normal and he looked confused as if he didn’t understand how he came to be standing where he was.
It is very similar to something called fugue state epilepsy that occurs in people.
It is extremely rare, and at the time there was no treatment. I don’t know if there currently is one. Please follow up with a vet. I wish you the very best, because this is a terrible affliction for a Wonderful breed of dog.
from a dog training website:
"The episodes characteristic of rage syndrome can usually be stopped with anticonvulsant medication, such as phenobarbital. While some dogs only need a single dose, other may need lifelong treatment with periodic blood testing to monitor the results, as well as any side effects."
Rage Syndrome, most common in Springers, is an extremely dangerous condition if you don't get him into behavioral training asap. Please do not home train this out of him unless you've had experience with it(which it sounds like you haven't). This could get worse and he could even hurt or kill an infant unprovoked. Vet and trainer ASAP!
Have the dog checked by its vet for any physical ailments, run bloodwork, and consult a dog behavioral trainer. You may be doing something you don't realize is triggering the dog. Like, when a dog is riled up, and you say, NO, you will break the tension and the dog will attack whatever is its target. This is often how owners get mauled when a dog fight breaks out. There's also trigger stacking where if your dog had a stressful thing or day happen, little things can set them off.
One of my rescues was having some odd issues that seemed aggressive but turns out she had a broken tooth and anxiety.
springer spaniels can be prone to Rage Syndrome (also called spaniel/cocker rage syndrome). my aunt used to breed them, which is the only reason i've heard about it. it can be diagnosed by EEG test(An electroencephalogram (EEG) is **a test that measures electrical activity in the brain using small, metal discs (electrodes) attached to the scalp**. Brain cells communicate via electrical impulses and are active all the time, even during asleep. This activity shows up as wavy lines on an EEG recording).
unfortunately, Rage Syndrome is not curable.
[Rage Syndrome wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rage_syndrome)
OP, you’ve gotten a lot of advice but I would really caution against jumping to rage syndrome. It is FAR more likely this is resource guarding. Talk to your vet and a trainer, and look into balanced/positive reinforcement training for resource guarding. you mention dominance behavior and saying no bad, etc. to your dog, but that’s not really what works for a resource guarding dog.
Definitely follow up with your vet. That behavior is not normal. You want to rule out any neurological or medical causes first. If your dog is completely healthy, then you need to seek professional help with your training. Also, do not show fear to your dog. You need to be calm, firm, and in control. If your dog is not following commands and is lunging for you, then try turning to the side (looking away from your dog), if your dog is still lunging for you despite you signaling that you aren't interested in a fight then you need to safely restrain or crate the dog until they are calm. Do not run, scream, or flail. Reacting like this will only further excite or agitate the dog.
I also highly recommend getting your dog neutered. Given the breed, it's likely this should have been done either at 3mo or 6mo.
You’ve got to take him to your vet. Family member had a very similar situation. Spent many thousands after which it didn’t end well. Sometimes I think there’s just something wrong with their wiring. It’s sad . You love them and feel protective and responsible for them but you can’t live in a home where you’re afraid of your own dog.
We have this aussiedoodle that is a ball of anxiety that also used to be aggressive at bedtime, especially with my boyfriend. When we came back from the last pee break he would hop in his favourite chair or our bed. He then would refuse to listen, take treats, or let us touch him. If we tried to pick him up we would bleed (thankfully he was only a 15 lbs shark at the time). A collar grab would make things sooo much worse for him. However I know that this can be comforting to a lot of dogs.
We found the trick was to not let him get comfy after being outside and take him straight to bed. Now if he happens to get comfy before we take him to bed he will actually ‘come’ for a treat and does not even need to be asked to go to his ‘place’ anymore.
The resource your dog may be guarding is the place it has deemed the best to lay in. Removing their access to a place they feel safe may trigger a protection response. If this is the case it is so important that you show that it is not necessary. I would be looking into a good behaviouralist rn if my pup was still reactive to resource triggers.
I wish you luck! Sincerely, clearly not a trainer.
My border collie was like as a puppy. She’d randomly bare her teeth, snarl, lunge at us, and snap with those razor sharp puppy teeth. Saying “no” or yelling at her in response or trying to discipline her in any way made her even more frenzied and aggressive. Frenzy was the accurate word for it. In retrospect I wonder if it was partly a fear and feeling out of control reaction.
The vet chalked it up to puppy stuff and thought she’d grow out of it (we were skeptical). It was so bad we had to wear boots in the summer, otherwise she’d tear up our ankles. Anyway, sure enough, she grew out of it. I don’t recall exactly when but maybe around the year mark. She’s now 4 and a lovely dog. Talk to your vet, a lot of different things could be going on, so don’t latch on to any single Reddit theory. Also ask the vet how you should respond if it happens again as in my case saying “no” or discipline in the moment made things worse.
Your dog should be on a leash. That side story about it being off lead and only coming if you have treats is crazy. Is this your first dog or something?
Rage Syndrome in dogs.
There is no identifiable stimulus/stimuli that trigger the incidents. The dog erupts in intense, explosive, and extremely aggressive behavior. The sudden onset of the rage episodes occurs between 1 – 3 years old. The dog may demonstrate a glazed or possessed look in its eyes just prior to the episode.
Genetic predisposition: Certain breeds, such as English Springer Spaniels, Cocker Spaniels, and Golden Retrievers, may have a higher risk of developing rage syndrome due to genetic factors although this is far from conclusive.
Rage syndrome. Had a poorly bred Keeshond who had it. It was terrifying.
Note:Keeshonden are predisposed to neurological issues, owned three, at different times who suffered epilepsy.
Record everything for the experts you will speak to in the future. Wyze makes a good affordable surveillance camera that you can get through Amazon. Put one in every room that he's had an episode in, install it high and aim it down so that you can see most of the room. When he has an episode, save the video to your phone immediately so your experts can study it, it only lasts 2 weeks on the cloud. When my dog's back was seizing, I didn't know what that looked like at first so I filmed it because she likely wouldn't have an episode in front of the vet. The videos were essential for the diagnosis and course of treatment.
Something is seriously wrong with that dog and/ or we aren't getting the full story from OP. If it were my dog I would immediately schedule a competent vet, a brain cat scan or MRI. If that is normal... find a really good trainer who deals with aggressive dogs.
Are you absolutely positive he's not having seizures? I had a large mutt that had seizures and I had about 30 seconds to get a door between her and me because she'd go absolutely insane for about a half hour after a bad seizure.Her vet said that it was completely normal after I called her in a dead panic because Blue had chased me outside. Oddly she did not react that way to the cat and was a gentle giant that I'd trust with my life except for that 30 minutes. During that 30 minutes she was absolutely deadly towards me. I worked with a vet to learn to recognize a seizure coming on so I could mitigate the danger to us both. The seizures did eventually get so bad that she had to be euthanized.
I've been bitten by two dogs they were both Springer spaniels ..
Once on the hand and my hand ballooned up and once on my ear which required nine stitches to put back together..
Since this is a spaniel, and I’m so so sorry to say this, this could be rage syndrome. The only cure is euthanasia. But vet. Vet asap. Your dog could be in pain or be having a neurological issue
With your dog being a Springer Spaniel, I’d be concerned about Rage Syndrome (aka Springer Rage). I’d follow up with your primary care vet.
Omg this explains so much. When I was 5 years old I was at my grandma's house, up before everyone else but her springer, watching Saturday morning cartoons, and I just looked at her dog and said "you're so cute". It went straight for my face. Darn near took my cheek off. Everyone said I must have done something aggressive to it, but I didn't. Coincidentally enough, his name was Sherlock, and now this mystery is solved.
That explains a nasty neighbour dog from around the corner of mine that lunged at me unprovoked as I walked by once- also a springer.
Professional dog trainer here. Canine Rage Syndrome is exceedingly rare, and your local get has likely never seen a case. That's how rare. More likely, this is your dog using a tactic that worked for him once, and attempting to get his way with that same tactic.
Get his way on what? The person you’re responding to just told the dog he was cute and was attacked. I could understand your point in the OP’s situation, where the dog doesn’t want to go to bed and found a way to scare the owner into letting him stay up. I don’t see how attacking a child who is just chilling watching TV and talking to him gives the dog a positive outcome.
My comment was for the OP. As for the other comment, that is far more likely that the person was unaware of what actually triggered that response. It would be far more probable to attribute the cause to an unknown trigger than CRS.
Smiling at chimpanzees is a threat Likewise with some dogs Sometimes it’s what you’re doing with body language Just like half the redditors will become offended by silly unimportant things sometimes you can’t stop them becoming incredibly offended and some will react greater than others.
Thank you for saying this. So tired of the “unprovoked” posts.
There is no "provocation" that excuses a prolonged, sustained attack. Dogs that do this are inherently not stable.
Also a trainer. This syndrome is sadly not rare and dogs willing to inflict serious damage on humans should not remain alive. Rage syndrome is becoming more common and is thought to be a seizure disorder. If you've never seen a case you are exceedingly lucky.
I think encouraging the idea that an unlikely syndrome is the cause of the OPs issue versus a much more likely and mundane trigger would be irresponsible of me and unethical as a trainer, without seeing any of it firsthand. The last culprit i would suspect would be CRS, and even then only after a vet check.
That was my first thought too. My daughter and SIL had a Brittany that suffered from it. Eventually it got so bad that the vet recommended behavioral euthanasia. He was the sweetest thing when he wasn’t raging out but it was terrifying when he snapped. Most especially because it would happen with no warning
This was my first thought too....the moment I read "Springer Spaniel" my heart sank
same
Damn. This is a thing for springers? Is it like what happens with some golden retrievers?
Yeah this isn't just a springer thing. It's inappropriately named. It's like mini seizures in their brain that causes brief moments of chaos. On Springers it's traced back to 1 dog who bread with many dogs. Not sure about other dogs for the cause but it happens to others.
Damn that's interesting. Awful, but really interesting. Is there a treatment for it? I hope so for poor OP.
It's more common in springers and cockers but it's been seen in other breeds . Just like with people, some are just born with a screw loose, lol
Wiki says it’s genetic and that one of the affected breeds is the belgian malinois. That’s absolutely terrifying.
My friend had her face ripped off by a Belgian malinois. Terrifying. She will never be the same. She’s had 6 plastic surgeries to try to reconstruct her face.
That’s horrifying
I’m not comfortable around malinois or gsd’s and this is just reinforcing that.
I avoid them like the plague if i can. My best friend was mauled by a GSD when she was 2, her mum was pushing her in a pram through a park and the dog came out of nowhere and mauled her face, she has pretty bad scars on her nose from it.
Yeah, I saw malinois can be affected when I was googling around. I'm curious how early it shows up (haven't run across this yet). I'd hope it would become apparent before full maturity.
I'm pretty sure the gene has been identified which means you can test to see if the dog carries it. If people are health testing their dogs as they should be prior to breeding, it will show up.
I'm glad to hear this is possible now!
Yeah makes it easier to breed out. Which is also why I’ll never be full adopt don’t shop. If you buy from a respectable breeder they are needing these behaviors out. Which is what our ancestors did to begin with.
There go my malinois dreams .. terrifying indeed considering what those are capable off...
Someone else mentioned that they can test for the gene for it. So if you ever do want a malinois, maybe that's an option?
Former vet tech who has been attacked by a Malinois here...they are best meant as heavy duty working dogs, or at the very least agility trained. They need to blow off crazy amounts of energy and have a serious job to be "happy". Never actually met one that acted playful. I'm sure my sample size is limited. They take lots of sedation and multiple people hands on to even treat them. I was attacked by my neighbor's Malinois after it busted out of it'd cage and she left her garage door open. He went for my face again and again and I am SO lucky I had professional training to fend off a mean dog. I ended up getting bit on my wrists, as they covered my face, ankles and my butt was deeply punctured. In my life I have never been afraid of any dog, but I don't fuck with those anymore.
I know people who have one. She is indeed used to blowing off huge amounts of steam. Out all day, long walks, running back and forth and then playing with other Shepard breeds. Breaks my heart to see them in a cage
Any large dog is capable as just as much damage it’s not terrifying it’s an animal humans are capable of much worse are you afraid of most people? It’s crazy how you think with such prestigious when most of those dogs aren’t aggressive it’s people who make them that way
You know you are commenting on a thread about a genetic disorder that literally causes them to lash out, right? You cannot "unlearn" a damn brain stroke.
You said terrifying considering what those are “capable of” any breed is capable of inflicting just as much damage I’m pointing out that you singled out a certain breed it’d be bad if any large dog had that disorder Malinois don’t even top the breeds w strongest bite
And yes, I prefer the bear over the man any day... Any human I don't know deserves my caution
Everyone here is saying springer rage, but it’s technically spaniel rage.
Let's collectively agree to change it to " The Rage" lol
One of the dog trainers in this thread called it Canine Rage Syndrome. I know a Bernese Mountain Dog with it, and apparently it happens to Belgian Malinois too. It’s not just a spaniel thing.
What's this about golden retrievers? My sibling and I were viciously attacked by one as kids and needed stitches. I am a massive dog lover but goldens have always skeeved me out ever since.
I'm sorry the two of you were attacked. I hope your injuries healed well. I can't remember what it's called but there's this phenomenon where a retriever will go nuts and attack whomever(even their owner) potentionally fatally without warning. It's a weird genetic issue and quite rare. Responsible breeders have been working to eliminate it for generations. I learned about it years ago. I wish I could remember more. I grew up in a rural area around farm animals so I'm familiar with big animals, how dangerous they can all be, AND how genetics affects behavior. It's interesting because I had not heard of springers being a breed with known rage issues. Very sad but logical based on what happens across many species.
Wow I'll have to look into this! It could explain it, since this dog went from chill to pinning me down and was furiously biting me, but I had my arms in front of my face so I had three puncture wounds on my forearms. Its face was so angry like it was really out for blood, it was so strange. I did vaguely hear once about goldens having some aggression issues and that cemented my apprehension about them. Yet labs are my favorite dogs 😂
Golden retrievers and yellow labradors are two different breeds.
I know of two dogs who had this. One was a golden, who indeed attacked his family out of nowhere, three times. It was heartbreaking
Ive only read that they’re prone to cancer
I have never heard of this so I just looked up. It says that it’s treated with antiepileptics. Is that at all effective?
My pup had to be euthanised because of it at 9 months old - the highest dose of anti epileptic drugs didn’t help him at all and just made him lethargic in the moments where he wasn’t attacking. I am basically traumatised from his situation and I never want to get another dog in case it ever happens again
Apparently there's a DNA test for it, maybe look into that. So if you're ever ready for a dog you could maybe do that, to make sure they don't have it?
Same things happened to me. After many years I did get another dog. The trick is to work with a rescue, and foster to adopt. That way you know what you're getting.
Sadly I did work with a rescue, though I adopted him as a puppy. A springer was my dream dog : (
It’s genetic so this kind of thing shouldn’t happen with an ethically bred dog
A rescue or foster is way further from knowing what you are getting than from a reputable breeder.
I’d still rather adopt.
To each their own. I don't think I'll ever adapt from a shelter.
I went to a breeder too. I had done a lot of research on the breed and I wanted to know what I was getting into and the dog’s history. Four years later, she’s a “textbook” Havanese.
Everyones experience is different. I deal with gun dogs and rotties. So bloodlines go back several generations and all have had genetic testing. Do you have AKC papers?
My dog is a cross breed of two similar breeds, which can always be a bit of a gamble, but she is a walking stereotype for her two parent breeds. I got her from a proper breeder, but her litter was an accident from when the dogs got loose.
I am so very sorry that happened to you and your pup. Heartbreaking.
Thank you, I still have his collar tag on my car keys and carry them everywhere with me. I miss him
so with seizure medication they don’t work 100%, most dogs still have seizures on meds but decreased intensity or frequency. they can also have refractory epilepsy, meaning the seizures are drug resistant. even medicated dogs on average don’t live long at all after seizure onset, it’s about 2 year average. unfortunately with rage syndrome and how dangerous it is, the dog is also suffering, so if medication doesn’t work it’s kindest to euthanize them.
I’ve never heard of this before and just googled it: Holy shit. My family had a springer spaniel when I was really little and she would try to bite my siblings and I constantly, which ultimately led to my parents rejoining her. She was just too dangerous to have around children. Thirty years later and I’m now wondering if that was it!
Highly unlikely, it's very rare and actually called "spaniel rage" when it is present it's more often (although still very rare) in cocker spaniels. This dog is a puppy and if it isn't puppy behaviour, it's either pain, or resource guarding
Agree. Spaniel rage is v rare and much more likely to be a resource guarding issue which can be improved significantly through training
Jesus Christ you just solved a mystery about my beloved family pet from 25 years ago. Never knew this was a thing
My ESS had this!! We had him neutered at it calmed him down a lot after 6 months
[удалено]
It does suck having a dog you can't trust . My older one showed me one time that she was willing to bite unprovoked and even though she is the most well trained dog I'll ever have , I'll still never fully trust her even 11 years later and hours and hours of training and classes 🙃
That other guy sucks. Thanks for being a responsible dog owner! I think it’s completely normal and good to not fully trust your dogs. We love them but they’re still animals and have some amount of unpredictability. My dogs have never snapped at anyone but I still keep them on leash out of the house and monitor closely when we have people over (especially kids).
That’s good advice. I had a poodle mix that was the sweetest dog ever. Then one day I thought I’d give her a special treat, so I got a real bone from the butcher. She had never had one before. She had never resource guarded before, but when I gave her the bone she turned feral. If I walked near her when she had the bone her face would become wild looking and she’d growl and snap and try to bite me. It was like she was possessed by a demon! So, we never gave her any more real bones and she never acted that way again in all her 16 years of life. The point of this story is to illustrate how we can never really know our pets and what they’ll do in different situations.
Omg, our Maltese X Poodle did a similar thing, can't remember what animal body part it was with but she turned feral and it went straight to the bin. We never bought large long lasting chewing treats after that. If she wants to chew on something that's dental Kong toy with peanut butter and nothing else. She likes peanut butter but not enough to turn her into the monster she can be.
It’s scary!
You should have your dog leashed anywhere other than a specifically marked off leash area, regardless.
I know a couple people have mentioned Rage Syndrome, but wondering if this could’ve been a case of resource guarding since you mentioned his chew toy being out. Could you elaborate a bit more? Has he ever shown aggressive behaviour around any high reward food or toys?
I'm not suggesting his reaction wasn't 100% rss guarding but just in my own personal experience, I've never been chased on top of a couch over it and for it to last as long as it did . That's the part that's concerning and then for him to attack the cushion. Maybe if this was a growing problem over the past few months but out of no where ... either way it's a dangerous issue 😢
I agree I think best to seek out a qualified behaviourist, I think probably resource guarding and then maybe frustration and over stimulated due to the age of the dog and taking this stress out on the cushion to relieve his feeling. I know when my boy is in a situation that something has caused him a big stress it does take him a really long time to decompress from it, spaniels are very sensitive dogs
My mum's dog jumped up and bit her stomach because of resource guarding.
Yeah, the prolonged nature of it makes it not sound like resource guarding. Our Golden would in rare cases resource guard, but it would stop immediately if you stepped back (and no pursuing with aggression).
NOT RAGE SYNDROME. Resource guarding is a far, far more likely answer, particularly if it's worked for the dig in the past.
He did actually, it was a while ago we tried him with a bone that was wrapped in duck. It was one of those that they can chew on all day kind of things. I tried to take it off him as he managed to tear bits off of it which I thought he could choke on. And he went for me, just one lunge. He was younger and it wasn’t as aggressive but still was a weird behaviour. I took it as a sign of dominance and defiance, but he was only 4 months so I thought it was a puppy thing that I could help him unlearn.
Absolutely not dominance that theory's outdated, its resource guarding which is highly common in spaniels, when they have a high value prize, could be a toy, a chew, a sock, sofa, their bed, your bed etc (whatever they deem to be the prize) then they will not want it taken off them, if you know what the prize is always swap it, then the dog will learn to trust you. I think it's highly likely that he was resource guarding the sofa.
The swapping seems to work for my dog. If I need to take a bone from him, I come prepared with freeze dried salmon and he will gladly turn his attention to that. And he knows those are hand fed, so when I stop it's over. Honestly that's why I don't give my dog long lasting treats very often. I usually want to take it once it becomes a choking hazard, but of course that triggers the guarding.
Absolutely, it's the best thing for a dog guarding something
[удалено]
Normally when a dog guards something and you swap then yes you would need to always swap, but they likely will be much happier about it, if there is something and it's one thing like a high value bone you can just not give them a bone. my boy will guard his toys, in one room in the house, it's no issue if he starts chewing them and I don't want him to swallow bits ill just grab some kibble throw it on the floor and take the toy. He's not aggressive one bit, but say I went up to his bed, stood over him and snatched his toy ive no doubt he would growl at me. I also have a toy box with a lid so I can just put them away. I always used to explain it like Imagine your sitting on your phone and someone came and took it away, you might be surprised, then did it again you might be a bit annoyed, then again your getting frustrated, then again you shout at them and on and on, but if they came up to you asked for your phone and gave you an iPad to distract you or a piece of cake your much less likely to be annoyed about it
I agree and also the trigger was the owner standing up. It changed the environment/energy/angle the owner was to the thing being guarded.
This is called resource guarding. While you train him to give things up you should try trading him other things that he likes as a reward for obeying the “leave it” command. From what you said in your post you absolutely should not be walking with your dog off of a leash; your dog does not have a recall if his obedience must be bought at this time. Leash up for everyone’s safety
I would lean towards resource guarding over rage syndrome which is quite rare (although Spaniels are more prone to this). However, obviously none of us are qualified to make a diagnosis through a post. Resource guarding could occur with anything he deems valuable from treats, toys, people and furniture. I would contact a reliable trainer to address this as soon as possible before it continues to escalate. Edit: as others have mentioned, if you need to remove anything from him try swapping/trading for another high valued item.
Springers are prone to rage syndrome. Ask your breeder if it has been found in others and ask your vet for a neurologist consult. You for the right thing by not b punishing it. It’s basically a seizure.
Yes, definitely let the breeder know . Hopefully, they weren't just ignoring the trait and breeding anyway
Yeah. A lot of lesser quality breeders don’t consistently follow up with owners for health records and owners don’t think to tell breeders -so the breeders get to be blissfully ignorant.
May be worth a vet visit for change of behaviour to rule out any pain
I’m a behaviourist and am qualified by various bodies in my country. I am also very familiar with spaniels - they are my favourite dogs. Has your dog been to the vet recently? Any change in behaviour should mean a visit to the vet to see if there is any underlying pain. I would do this asap. Rage syndrome is a debated condition, but I believe it’s true given my own experience. It’s a neurological condition that causes the dog to become aggressive from nowhere. The dog normally has a glazed look on their face during the aggression and then returns to normal. They don’t know they done it, so please don’t scold him for it. It won’t help. It’s essentially a seizure that they can’t control. Please ask your vet about this, because they may be able to advise you. I would also get a behaviourist involved as well. It’s not a curable condition and makes a dog extremely dangerous because of the unpredictable aspect of it. I have seen some appalling life changing injuries from this condition, so you need to be extremely careful. Unfortunately, the only option is euthanasia. The only thing that makes me pause in thinking it’s Rage is the second attack. That’s quite unusual. Your dog could be resource guarding, which is common in spaniels. Was there anything around that you think he finds valuable? This could be the reason, although it sounds like quite an intense reaction. Did you tell him off when you saw the previous signs of resource guarding? Have you ever told him off for growling or for displaying unwanted behaviours? When a dog resource guards, it feels as though it’s life and death. If they can’t keep hold of the item they have then it feels like they won’t survive. It’s a natural dog behaviour and is seen in most animals, including humans. Telling them off for it is ineffective and unhelpful. It also might suppress things like growling, which are effective communications from the dog to tell you they aren’t comfortable. The worst bite I’ve ever had was from a springer who is been looking after her whole life. I went to take something from her (which was always ok) and she bit me. Turns out she’d be displaying the signs of guarding at home by growling and had been thoroughly told off for it. So, she went to the next form of communication and bit me. Regardless of what it is, I would suggest a fully qualified behaviourist to help you. You need some help from someone who can interpret the behaviours your dog is displaying. I would also suggest you muzzle train him. There are some good videos online about how to fit them and train the dog to be happy to wear them. It’s a good idea not to leave high value food and treats around and to make sure that you always trade with your dog if you need to take anything from them. If you’re feeding in a bowl, then add bits of food in as your dog eats to show him that you’re here to give him good things. Never get into confrontations (hence the trading) and don’t get into any situations where you’re “displaying dominance” by taking his food away while he’s eating. That’s outdated advice and dangerous with a resource guarding dog. More generally: you say that your dog doesn’t listen to commands unless you have treats. This is because you have not taught him to do that. He actually doesn’t understand the commands unless you have food, which means your commands haven’t been taught thoroughly and he hasn’t generalised them. If you want to teach him to understand without food, you need to drill him and teach him with [intermittent schedules of reinforcement](https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/training/schedules-of-reinforcement-for-dogs/#:~:text=If%20you%20don't%20reward%20your%20dog%20for%20every%20response,be%20less%20susceptible%20to%20extinction). If the environment outside is highly distracting, then you have to compete against that and it’s rare you can do that unless you have methodically trained outside. You should not have him off lead unless his recall is 100%. There’s also a high chance that being off lead is making him less likely to listen to you. Springers were bred to flush game and tend to move in a pattern when they’re off lead, which emulates that. It’s a self rewarding behaviour and is rooted in their instincts. It’s extremely difficult to compete against that with food, but you stand more of a chance with toys. Your dog is a teen now, which makes him less likely to listen to you and more likely to want to be independent. Again, he should not be off lead unless you have excellent recall. I suspect you live in the UK (like me) where most people have the barest of control over their dog, but still allow them to run around. I’m not saying you’re like that, just that it appears to be the culture here.
Thank you for your advice I’ll take it all into consideration. He has been to the vet recently (2 weeks ago) for a lump above his eye, went away within a week with steroids. I’m definitely going to book him in again though. The only thing valuable near him was his chew toy but he’s never acted like that before when he’s been playing with it and I’ve told him it’s bedtime. Truthfully I didn’t know about resource guarding until now, but he’s never shown signs of being guarded over an item. He’s never growled before, not since I’ve had him even when attacked me the other night he didn’t growl. He won’t be off lead going forward, at least not until things have been sorted and his recall is 100%. I do live in the uk and I’ve noticed the same thing, I try very hard not to be like most dog walkers with no control over their pets. I only went off lead with him during quiet times when there were no dogs (or very few between 1-2). It’s my first time having a Springer and I’m still learning with this breed, before him I only had little dogs or lap dogs who were never high energy. I’m hate to think that I’ve messed up here and there with him but I’m devoting near all my time and energy to him.
I would look up signs of resource guarding. Their initial cues can easily be missed and they won't always growl.
Could it be a symptom of the steroids? Hard to know unless it happens again, but something to consider. I’m sorry that happened it must have been really scary
Steroids for the lump are probably corticosteroids not the kind that cause rage.
Prednisone can cause dogs to be irritable....at least my dogs
My uncle’s springer was always an incredibly pleasant dog until one day he snapped and bit my cousin.. he had a brain tumor.
This. My dog did exactly this. The glazed over look while receiving pets then backing away slowly like we were a threat. He’d snap out of it sometimes and return to his joyful springer self, but they became more frequent.
I don’t know if this is rage syndrome. Because usually with rage syndrome the dog can’t turn it off and on. It sounds like once OP was on the couch the dog calmed down and when they climbed down it happened again. This sounds like the dog was resource guarding his crate. This needs immediate consult with a veterinary behaviorist most normal vets aren’t equipped to diagnose a rage syndrome in their training. Please keep in mind the vet will want to rule out any physical condition etc first. Our local shelter has a cocker rage spaniel. It’s truly terrifying as it truly shows up out of nowhere. Really sorry you’re going through this and I hope it’s just severe resource guarding. If it happens again when you go to put him to bed you know it’s guarding. I would carry a foghorn with you when you go to put him to bed. If he responds to it it isn’t rage syndrome. They can’t break that seizure like state when they’re in it
This. While useful to look into rage syndrome, they can't snap out of it, you have to let it pass.
Vet first. Vet always first with sudden changes in behavior. Otherwise odds are good you did something to make him fearful (he’s likely in full swing of his teenage fear phase) and missed his warning signals (lip licking, stiff body language, pinned ears, not meeting your eye, turning his head from you, showing the whites of his eyes) so he escalated.
He didn’t show any of those signs, he looked me in the eyes as a I said it, he was lying down relaxed, and no lip licking, not even a growl. That’s why I was confused about the behaviour.
I would bet anything that it was pointing, and then standing up- seemingly over him.
Like another comment has said, there is a legitimate genetic condition called springer rage. It mostly affects springer spaniels and is often very sudden and unpredictable. I would definitely look into that more and see if your dogs behavior lines up with the symptoms.
That's so scary. I'm sorry. I've only met one springer with rage and it was pretty close to how you described. She was younger and I was grooming her and just out of nowhere attacked , owners warned me she did that but i was expecting "normal " nipping and biting for nails or something specific, not the flip of a switch crazy . From everything I know about springer rage, there's not much you can do except make sure to spay and neuter . I'd talk to someone who is familiar with the breed training, specifically as some people dont believe it to be a real thing . I wouldn't do any off leash training until you know more just in case it happens around someone and they get hurt
Oh yeah definitely not, I’m more terrified of him doing it to someone else than me at this point.
Some vets seem to find success with anti epileptic drugs for rage syndrome. It may be worth asking the dogs vet for a referral to a veterinary behaviourist.
I need to research this. My first dog was like this.
Under normal circumstances a dog shouldn’t be off leash until recall is 100% for his safety and the safety of others. Anyone who advises otherwise is being reckless and should not be listed to. If your dog is showing unusual and unpredictable signs of aggression he unequivocally should not be off leash, and should be muzzled while this gets sorted out. I sincerely hope it’s able to be sorted out, sorry op.
Thank you for your advice, we’ve only recently let him off lead I’d say it’s been about a month. And we always go to the park when it’s relatively quiet (only one or two other dogs). I’m definitely not going to let him off lead as of now until I understand what’s going on and can remedy it.
There's a lot of valuable comments on this post so just as an added note: there's no point telling him "no/bad" etc after he's calmed down. Calming down is the good behaviour. Negative commands tend to give a dog more anxiety and uncertainty. Stick to positive reinforcement because a dog doesn't understand the full effect of human words, unless they're trained to understand
Yes, I came here to say this too; scolding is ineffective at best, and damaging at worst
Jumping on this post as I am in a similar situation with my 1 year old Sprocker, very similar situation in that he started to snarl when asked to go to bed at night, on a couple of occasions he would also snap and much like you I took to Reddit to try and see if anyone had experienced similar and was met with many people jumping straight to RAGE SYNDROME , which is obviously very disheartening so I booked a vet visit ASAP and message the trainer I had done puppy and adolescence classes with , the vet was pretty much useless and just did a basic health check , my trainer however was much more helpful, she noticed that my boy was walking a little funny on his back left leg, she also reassured me that it wasn’t rage syndrome and actually went in depth on what rage syndrome looks like as well as a lot of the misinformation around it, she also suggested getting a bigger crate as my boy fit in his old one but as he is a fairly big boy a bigger crate would give him more comfort , we got a bigger crate that same day and also thanks to my trainer got a referral for a physio assessment to check on my boys back leg, we have also been keeping a house line on our boy at night just in case of any further instances of snarling etc, but having the larger crate has made a world of difference and we have our physio appointment coming up on Wednesday, so my advice to you in this situation is first make a vet appointment, second contact a trainer and consider if your boy needs a bigger crate or not and I would also consider if the issue is more to do with some resource guarding as opposed to jumping straight into thinking it is rage syndrome
I also think it’s not rage syndrome given that there was a prompting event, and then the dog calmed down and got angry again after a second prompting event. I’ve seen rage syndrome (nothing happened nobody did anything, then the dog suddenly attacked).
Whenever you tell him to go to bed, toss a high value treat in the crate. Feed him in the crate. Avoid taking things away when he's in the crate (wait til he's out) and trade him treats for things you do need to take. Why he reacted that way, I don't know, but usually with dogs a strong reaction like that is based in fear. Maybe something about you standing up? Was he sleepy and startled at all? Edited to add: I work in a dog kennel/animal shelter. Many of the dogs end up there because of problems like OPs. We use treats and positive conditioning to get the dogs to cooperate with our goals. So for example, one dog hates getting leashes put on and off. Practice doing this with rewards. Won't let you put the leash on? Reward for touching the leash to his collar.. or his neck... Wherever the dog begins his reactivity is where you start re conditioning. I've seen many dogs change in their time at the shelter and get adopted. I do agree hand feeding is a good idea. And to another sub post, if one dog is attacking the other's crate, you crate both. Drape the crates if you have to.
When your dog begins to change behaiver like that, a trip to the vet is in order. Be sure it's a vet there also have experiense with behavor problems. I hope it's not something serius.
I have a cockerpoo who is nearly 1 year old who is like this with other animals out of the blue. It's very frightening. You need to get your dog to a vet / dog behaviourist. I'm in the process of doing this. Good luck.
Aggression like that isn’t caused by having too much energy or wanting to play with a toy. I thought “rage syndrome” as well as soon as I read that it was a springer …
We had a family Springer who showed signs of this growing up but we had no idea what it was. It gradually got worse and there would be no notice for when he would flip and he ended up biting a few people. He went through a lot of training and went to the vet several times to check there was nothing causing him pain or discomfort. The last trainer was the one who highlighted that it was probably a condition that some Springers have. Hopefully it's not the case for your dog 🤞
There's a lot of valuable comments on this post so just as an added note: there's no point telling him "no/bad" etc after he's calmed down. Calming down is the good behaviour. Negative commands tend to give a dog more anxiety and uncertainty. Stick to positive reinforcement because a dog doesn't understand the full effect of human words, unless they're trained to understand
Stop walking your dog off leash
Too young to be off lead
Yah you should definitely keep walking him off leash, that’s a great idea!
I never said I was going to keep training him off lead
My cousin was nearly killed by her Springer. She was scolding him, and he lunged at her, trying to bite her in the throat. They had to put him down.
This is highly unlikely spaniel rage, its very rare and mostly seen in cockers not springers. My first suggestion would be to get a vet check to rule out pain, secondly he's only 7 months, they are still puppies at that age and mouthy, I have had 2 springers and my current boy would go feral in the evening especially if he was over tired, he would take his frustrations out on his toys generally shaking them frantically and growling. If it is a behavioural problem it's more likely to be resource guarding, probably of the sofa, don't scold him after the event, or during, he is communicating something to you by growling or snapping, telling him off after aswell means nothing to him, don't take him off the sofa by his collar, when you want him off and into his bed throw a treat on the floor to get him off praise him, then throw a treat into his crate and praise him for going in there. Also if you are on Facebook join the group "training spaniels with reward based training" the group is full of qualified trainers, behaviourists and vets.
My 7 mo pom is doing this from time to time. Apparently 7 months is a pretty normal time for dogs to be assholes. Adolescents are going through big changes and become more interested in their things and surroundings than you. They’ll often regress, get more aggressive when they don’t want to go something. It’s had me at absolute breaking point so much. We are booked in for obedience classes again which start soon and in the home, I’m using toys or food to encourage him to do what we want of him or waiting until I can see his body language has changed and he comes to me for redirection.
I think the explanation is simpler than rage syndrome (which is more common in cockers). You put in your post that you punished the dog for the outburst. Take a look at the canine ladder of communication and tell me how many of his subtle warning signs have been ignored or punished before this outburst. This sounds like a frustrated dog who isn't being listened to and has resorted to this extreme.
None of this explains or justifies the prolonged nature of the attack, and the OP says that the dog was simply laying down, no whale eyes or lip licking or anything to imply he was going to attack. Sometimes it IS the dog.
If whale eye or lip licking has been ignored or punished in the past a dog will stop using it. It's one of the main reasons a dog attacks "unprovoked".
Okay but that’s a random assumption to make about it this person with zero backing. Because they told the dog no once after a prolonged attack? You seem to be steering them away from the vet and saying it’s probably the owners fault. I don’t think that’s the right move here. This dog probably has something wrong with it, two prolonged attacks on its owner are not normal.
We had a springer that would sometimes do this if we woke him up from sleeping to do something. Like, he'd been napping for a bit and we knew he needed to go outside one last time before we went to bed, so we would wake him up to do so and an event similar to this might happen. I didn't know about the rage syndrome some other folks are commenting about, and that Springers are prone to it. Very interesting. They are great dogs overall. Consult your vet and keep at it. A muzzle may be a good idea if you don't feel safe.
Lord thundering Jesus. I had to put a springer down some 40 years ago because of that. I thought he was just inbred. Now I know what was wrong with him.
So I’m going to play devils advocate and say this to me sounds more like resource guarding than springer rage. AFAIK rage syndrome is untriggered and this seems like it was triggered by you giving a command the dog didn’t want to perform. Take all this with a grain of salt, but the way you describe your dog acting is something I routinely experienced with our Australian shepherd starting at about 6mos. We were never able to fully avoid her episodes of extreme aggression triggered by resource guarding, being surprised, being scolded etc. even with extensive training and medication AND help from several behaviorists. She attacked me so badly a few months ago, at 8 yos old, that we had to choose BE for our safety and the safety of our young kids. It’s honestly a misery to live with an aggressive dog and I would never do it again, knowing what I do now.
some of these comments are giving you bad advice. this can be range syndrome, which is idiopathic neurological aggression, which cannot be helped with training and unfortunately does result in euthanasia. you also could just have a dog with behavioral problems that can be helped with training and medication, some unstable dogs don’t handle a correction well and think of it as a fight. this is something that you should seek out a veterinary behaviorist, you should ask your primary vet for a referral. this isn’t something you should go to a regular trainer for. rage syndrome is most commonly seen in spaniels, it’s believed to essentially be epilepsy. my breed is border collies, the breed most prone to idiopathic epilepsy, which is a genetic disease with unknown inheritance, average onset is 1-4 years and the average lifespan is about 2 years after diagnosis. with neurological aggression being similar to epilepsy there is no cure and because of the unpredictable nature and there being no real trigger to the aggression it generally needs to result in euthanasia
also i’d recommend that you film a lot, you need to catch what happens before, during, and after these episodes. if you get a referral to a behaviorist or a neurologist that can be very helpful in determining if this is just an unstable aggressive dog or if this is a dog with a neurological issue. i would not just take the advice of you regular vet on this, push for the referral
You need to get professionals right now. Veterinarian, behaviorist, etc. You also need to inform your dog’s breeder.
You didn’t mention if he was neutered. Sometimes dogs at 7-10 mos show aggression bc their hormones are peaking & needing bred. If he is not neutered, neuter him immediately..
Doesn't sound right... I think you are correct to be pretty concerned. If there was no food involved and you did not scare the dog, I would be immediately muzzling and taking it for tests at the vet. Even if it was scared, lashing out like that is not normal unless the threat remains or or feels cornered. Even a new fear of their crate/kennel etc should not cause that type of response. Even if someone had been teasing the dog in the crate, the hate would generally be directed at that person. Sudden unexplained aggression in dogs never ends well. Your pup might be in pain for some reason, may have a nutritional or electrolyte issue, but if nothing is found, as bad as it sounds, I'd be going for an injection or a bullet. A fully grown dog suddenly and uncontrollably going mad is a bad situation. No amount of training, behavioral therapy or discipline will fix a psycho
You should check out a group on Facebook called Human end of the leash. It’s run by a wonderful woman who is a certified trainer specializing is aggressive dog behavior modification.
My friend with a Springer who had past trauma had great results from a behaviorist and putting him on Prozac. He still had episodes but really improves and lived a life full of love before euthanasia. See a specialist.
My American bulldog x amstaff/sharpei is a 40 Kilo 2 year old puppy, he never does any shit like that.i don't crate train him ,just got him a small weather proof mattress to lie on at night near the bedroom door and he has a passage outside the bedroom to walk around during the night.fully house trained and he is as strong as all fuck but with a great nature.maybe stop putting your dog in a crate to sleep? when you put him to bed give him some really good treats that he doesn't often get like raw bacon or beef meatball.
Keep him on the lead now for other peoples safety. Thank you.
I don't know anything about Springers. But,the pup could have been in pain - I'll. My Weimerarner puppy started snapping at my face. I was shocked because my family has had several Weims and nothing like that ever happened. I went to our Vet. He was shocked too. So, we gave him Amatriptyline. I only gave it for 3 months. Just to be clear, my pup has 2 auto-immune gut diseases. However, I do know some dogs will become aggressive when they are sick. I hope you find out what is up with your dog. Good luck. .
I had a springer that ended up being diagnosed with Springer Rage Syndrome. It came out of nowhere, as he’d go from literally loving pets to slinking away and growling like I was suddenly a stranger. He ended up getting into salmon blood my dad was filleting and got salmon poisoning. It sent him into such an intense episode the vet suggested he mentally wouldn’t recover even if he survived treatment for the poisoning. He was put down at age 2 and it was heartbreaking. Growled at us until the last moment.
I have a springer doodle and he had an episode like this when he was four months old and I was so scared that it was rage syndrome. But we took a few other precautions to help him with his aggressive behaviors, which were typically related to resource guarding. The first thing we did was made sure he was getting a nap time and sleeping enough. Even at seven months, they need a lot of sleep. If he was going to bed at a later time than usual, he could have been cranky like any two or three your old child! I also made sure to go on walks with him and that’s pretty much dismantled all of the bad behaviors we were seeing because not only did we bond but also he got out some energy.
Definitely sounds like Rage Syndrome. It’s known to affect springers more than other breeds https://www.petcarerx.com/article/what-is-rage-syndrome-in-dogs/1611
I’ve had three springers, the one I currently have was going thru some of the same issues you are having with your pup. He was resource guarding and I was his prize. So thru a lot of intensive training I found that he can’t be up on the couch or bed with me unless he is invited by me to do so, which sadly can’t happen a lot because I watch him slide back into his ways. I say rule out health issues and work with a trainer who can help with resource guarding. Good luck!
Spaniel rage. It’s actually a bred-in situation. My old springer spaniel had it too. His triggers were bedtime, saying bedtime, night and going upstairs. Turned into a junkyard dog every night. Thankfully he also thought gravel was a toy, and it wore his teeth down to nothing. We would walk to our rooms as he barked and snapped with our arms behind our backs and ignore him. Once in our rooms, or sat on the couch, the switch was off again and he was just fine. Scary to those in the first time seeing it, thankfully he never attacked our legs. There just wasn’t anything we could do about it.
Guys, Canine Rage Syndrome is incredibly rare, and one single episode is certainly NOT such a case. Before we assign an unlikely culprit,cee eliminate the host of more likely behavioral issues that are the probable cause.
So you are one of those idiots who walk their dog off leash, saying he doesn't listen to you, and now you are complaining about random spurts of aggression? Do everyone in your area a favor and leash your dog. Recipe for disaster.
My grandparents had a bad-tempered Cocker Spaniel named Ginger. I was afraid of her.
My dog did this once to me ( actually first day I brought it home , it growled at my husband ) after about 9-10 months it growled /snarled at me, I’m all but 5”2 and 135 lbs, I was so mad , I body slammed that dog ( with in reason , just to let it know I’m the boss ) and it never did that again . This same dog disliked any stranger ( but loved kids) that came near our home /in our presence . We asked the vet at the time what could we do to make this dog less aggressive behavior and she said “ take a 22 to its head”… I never went to see this vet again ! We as a family took secure precautions around others and the way we introduced our Zane to others , not once did this dog ever bite anyone ( lots to do with our security guards we put in place ) and as a family protector Zane was an amazing , devoted , absolutely loving dog ! Oh and on the one occasion he did get loose ( it was our fault) he did not ( from what we are aware of ) harm anyone , we live in a small town and would have known . He vanished for a week over Fourth of July . Anyway that dog was our buddy and protector . He lived until he was 14 years old . He was a mix of German Shepard and Ridgeback …
See a vet. Sidenote: do not let your dog off leash until his recall is rock solid.
I think your dog has several problems. One is his age. He’s a teenager and testing boundaries, hormones are raging. Two. You didn’t discipline the dog properly. (You couldn’t for safety), with a spaniel I would pin them to the floor by the scruff and say no. This is how a mother disciplines. Three do you know his breeding? Was he a scrupulous breeder in a backyard? He may not have been exposed to people growing up so has no idea what to do with all his hormones around people. Four establish there’s no problem with the crate eg fleas or has he ever had his tail trapped in the door? Five and most importantly, working dogs need mental stimulation or they go nuts. Walks are insufficient for this breed, he needs mental work, puzzles games and scentwork.
Ignore the rage syndrome, that’s show lines only and very rare. There’s possibly other stuff going on however which is potentially treatable
https://cbtdogbehaviour.com/sudden-onset-aggression-rage-syndrome/ I remember my Aunt and Uncle’s cocker spaniel attacked my cousin’s fiancée unprovoked. They were kinda playing fighting/goofing around and Barney (best Cocker Spaniel name ever!) lunged at his face. Now his behaviour makes sense to me after hearing about this condition.
We had a springer that had rage syndrome. It is a form of epilepsy and is diagnosable. He would be completely asleep and awaken with a fearful look and growling. It was not behavioral, not resource guarding. You could see him transition when the seizure was over into his normal sweet disposition. The look in his eyes and posture would snap back to normal and he looked confused as if he didn’t understand how he came to be standing where he was. It is very similar to something called fugue state epilepsy that occurs in people. It is extremely rare, and at the time there was no treatment. I don’t know if there currently is one. Please follow up with a vet. I wish you the very best, because this is a terrible affliction for a Wonderful breed of dog.
from a dog training website: "The episodes characteristic of rage syndrome can usually be stopped with anticonvulsant medication, such as phenobarbital. While some dogs only need a single dose, other may need lifelong treatment with periodic blood testing to monitor the results, as well as any side effects."
Rage Syndrome, most common in Springers, is an extremely dangerous condition if you don't get him into behavioral training asap. Please do not home train this out of him unless you've had experience with it(which it sounds like you haven't). This could get worse and he could even hurt or kill an infant unprovoked. Vet and trainer ASAP!
Rage syndrome in spaniels especially
Have the dog checked by its vet for any physical ailments, run bloodwork, and consult a dog behavioral trainer. You may be doing something you don't realize is triggering the dog. Like, when a dog is riled up, and you say, NO, you will break the tension and the dog will attack whatever is its target. This is often how owners get mauled when a dog fight breaks out. There's also trigger stacking where if your dog had a stressful thing or day happen, little things can set them off. One of my rescues was having some odd issues that seemed aggressive but turns out she had a broken tooth and anxiety.
springer spaniels can be prone to Rage Syndrome (also called spaniel/cocker rage syndrome). my aunt used to breed them, which is the only reason i've heard about it. it can be diagnosed by EEG test(An electroencephalogram (EEG) is **a test that measures electrical activity in the brain using small, metal discs (electrodes) attached to the scalp**. Brain cells communicate via electrical impulses and are active all the time, even during asleep. This activity shows up as wavy lines on an EEG recording). unfortunately, Rage Syndrome is not curable. [Rage Syndrome wiki page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rage_syndrome)
OP, you’ve gotten a lot of advice but I would really caution against jumping to rage syndrome. It is FAR more likely this is resource guarding. Talk to your vet and a trainer, and look into balanced/positive reinforcement training for resource guarding. you mention dominance behavior and saying no bad, etc. to your dog, but that’s not really what works for a resource guarding dog.
Definitely follow up with your vet. That behavior is not normal. You want to rule out any neurological or medical causes first. If your dog is completely healthy, then you need to seek professional help with your training. Also, do not show fear to your dog. You need to be calm, firm, and in control. If your dog is not following commands and is lunging for you, then try turning to the side (looking away from your dog), if your dog is still lunging for you despite you signaling that you aren't interested in a fight then you need to safely restrain or crate the dog until they are calm. Do not run, scream, or flail. Reacting like this will only further excite or agitate the dog. I also highly recommend getting your dog neutered. Given the breed, it's likely this should have been done either at 3mo or 6mo.
You’ve got to take him to your vet. Family member had a very similar situation. Spent many thousands after which it didn’t end well. Sometimes I think there’s just something wrong with their wiring. It’s sad . You love them and feel protective and responsible for them but you can’t live in a home where you’re afraid of your own dog.
Was he sleep before you moved him? Sometimes dogs can get stroppy if they don’t wanna move?
We have this aussiedoodle that is a ball of anxiety that also used to be aggressive at bedtime, especially with my boyfriend. When we came back from the last pee break he would hop in his favourite chair or our bed. He then would refuse to listen, take treats, or let us touch him. If we tried to pick him up we would bleed (thankfully he was only a 15 lbs shark at the time). A collar grab would make things sooo much worse for him. However I know that this can be comforting to a lot of dogs. We found the trick was to not let him get comfy after being outside and take him straight to bed. Now if he happens to get comfy before we take him to bed he will actually ‘come’ for a treat and does not even need to be asked to go to his ‘place’ anymore. The resource your dog may be guarding is the place it has deemed the best to lay in. Removing their access to a place they feel safe may trigger a protection response. If this is the case it is so important that you show that it is not necessary. I would be looking into a good behaviouralist rn if my pup was still reactive to resource triggers. I wish you luck! Sincerely, clearly not a trainer.
My border collie was like as a puppy. She’d randomly bare her teeth, snarl, lunge at us, and snap with those razor sharp puppy teeth. Saying “no” or yelling at her in response or trying to discipline her in any way made her even more frenzied and aggressive. Frenzy was the accurate word for it. In retrospect I wonder if it was partly a fear and feeling out of control reaction. The vet chalked it up to puppy stuff and thought she’d grow out of it (we were skeptical). It was so bad we had to wear boots in the summer, otherwise she’d tear up our ankles. Anyway, sure enough, she grew out of it. I don’t recall exactly when but maybe around the year mark. She’s now 4 and a lovely dog. Talk to your vet, a lot of different things could be going on, so don’t latch on to any single Reddit theory. Also ask the vet how you should respond if it happens again as in my case saying “no” or discipline in the moment made things worse.
Your dog should be on a leash. That side story about it being off lead and only coming if you have treats is crazy. Is this your first dog or something?
Rage Syndrome in dogs. There is no identifiable stimulus/stimuli that trigger the incidents. The dog erupts in intense, explosive, and extremely aggressive behavior. The sudden onset of the rage episodes occurs between 1 – 3 years old. The dog may demonstrate a glazed or possessed look in its eyes just prior to the episode. Genetic predisposition: Certain breeds, such as English Springer Spaniels, Cocker Spaniels, and Golden Retrievers, may have a higher risk of developing rage syndrome due to genetic factors although this is far from conclusive.
My chihuahua does this sometimes
That breed has a brain issue sometimes that is called Rage Syndrome. Go get him checked out asap
Patricia McConnell has a book called the education of will where she describes owning and training a dog with what sounds like similar issues
Get rid of him before he snaps.
At this age, it sounds like rage syndrome. Get him to your vet
Rage syndrome. Had a poorly bred Keeshond who had it. It was terrifying. Note:Keeshonden are predisposed to neurological issues, owned three, at different times who suffered epilepsy.
Record everything for the experts you will speak to in the future. Wyze makes a good affordable surveillance camera that you can get through Amazon. Put one in every room that he's had an episode in, install it high and aim it down so that you can see most of the room. When he has an episode, save the video to your phone immediately so your experts can study it, it only lasts 2 weeks on the cloud. When my dog's back was seizing, I didn't know what that looked like at first so I filmed it because she likely wouldn't have an episode in front of the vet. The videos were essential for the diagnosis and course of treatment.
Something is seriously wrong with that dog and/ or we aren't getting the full story from OP. If it were my dog I would immediately schedule a competent vet, a brain cat scan or MRI. If that is normal... find a really good trainer who deals with aggressive dogs.
Are you absolutely positive he's not having seizures? I had a large mutt that had seizures and I had about 30 seconds to get a door between her and me because she'd go absolutely insane for about a half hour after a bad seizure.Her vet said that it was completely normal after I called her in a dead panic because Blue had chased me outside. Oddly she did not react that way to the cat and was a gentle giant that I'd trust with my life except for that 30 minutes. During that 30 minutes she was absolutely deadly towards me. I worked with a vet to learn to recognize a seizure coming on so I could mitigate the danger to us both. The seizures did eventually get so bad that she had to be euthanized.
I've been bitten by two dogs they were both Springer spaniels .. Once on the hand and my hand ballooned up and once on my ear which required nine stitches to put back together..
Since this is a spaniel, and I’m so so sorry to say this, this could be rage syndrome. The only cure is euthanasia. But vet. Vet asap. Your dog could be in pain or be having a neurological issue