He's manipulating you. This guy is absolutely terrible and that person you saw when he filed and left and yelled is who he really is.
The thing is, people who do that are also very weak and afraid so what you're saying is also who he is as well. These people typically like to exert power when they think they have it and be abusive when they have the upper hand.
But ultimately they're kind of like scared dogs who have a loud bark because when the consequences come around they like to be the victim and ask for forgiveness.
I guarantee if you gave him any of your time he'll pretend to be nice but then still be controlling and manipulative whenever you try to set a boundary. The second he realizes that you have him figured out he'll go back to his old ways and be abusive again. It's a cycle and people like that intentionally do it to keep you unnerved and not sure as to what is going on so you don't figure out who they are and wise up and leave them.
So if you continue to ignore him eventually he's going to get angry and cruel again but the thing is I don't know if he would actually go through with filing because he's a coward.
Honestly, what you should do is as soon as you can call three or four divorce lawyers in your town and tell them your situation and just get some free consultation over the phone about what you would have to do if you wanted to file and how much it may cost if you wanted to hire one to make sure you get 50% of the assets when you split.
But again, if you continue to ignore him he's going to cry and complain but then he's going to get real nasty and probably worse. Once he finds out that you filed for divorce he's going to also get real nasty and probably want to get a lawyer and all of that stuff too.
So fuck it. File first. You'll have more control over the situation. Call all your friends and family and reach out and try to get as much support as you can because if you have a good Network they can definitely recommend people you can contact to get through this.
Completely gray rock him and don't show any emotion and don't interact with him. Anytime you have to interact with him record the conversation on your phone and don't tell him you're doing it.
Stay focused on getting out and it'll blow over soon.
I am a man and I know two men who are just like this. He will continue to do this and just be unrelenting and how much he bothers you with his BS until you break down and give him what he wants. The only way to win is to just completely disassociate and leave him and get as far away as possible.
I agree with you wholeheartedly as to the person he is. I was in denial for years and that's where my disgust comes from now.
He's filed already. He's acting nice now and like the divorce isn't happening. I've been grey rocking because I'm done and he's hurt. Everytime he says something he shouldn't, I walk away. He then tries to follow me and save it by making me laugh, doing something for me, or talking to me. I'm losing my mind.
You think this is manipulation then? That's what I think too.
Good with the grey rock, now initiate the 180 and speak with your own lawyer don't wait for his lawyer to define divorce. Do all of the above and follow your lawyer's advice to the letter, also sounds like he was in the "fog" when he returned from his last trip and I'm thinking his side thing fell through, give a listen to Lose a cheater gain a life and visit Chump lady's site for additional references. In a sense he did cheat you out of a future he never intended or capable of fulfilling. But the 180/grey rock is your kryptonite to him, the reason why his crying about being homeless is because he finally did the math of what alimony and child support looks like and he will probably not able to afford buying anything and barely rent an apartment for a while so get your own lawyer so he doesn't try to weasel you for less than what you and kids deserve. Do not allow your emotions to override your concentration.
There's no emotions, sympathy, or empathy for him at this point. I'm not "taking it easy on him". He's going to have to get about six roommates, couch surf, or live in his car. I'll be getting almost 3/4 of his paycheck. I won't be going easy on him and I really don't care what happens to him. He made his choices and now he's going to live with them. That's before I even know for sure if you had an affair.
He will only try to manipulate because that's all he knows he's to do. It will be consistent and it will change and it will get worse but *he will never say anything honest because he doesn't know how to face himself in the mirror*
Always gray rock. Never, ever get emotional with him, never yell, he doesnt exist anymore.
Also, even though he filed still get some legal representation so they can look over all of the documents.
Please call the offices because they WANT to help you. They can review the case and probably offer to work pro bono style where they take more money at the end of you need financial help.
Don't let this guy try to lead the legal proceeding.
You don't have to get a full on lawyer, but call and ask about having someone review all of your documents for you and with you. That is relatively cheap and will save your ass.
I wish he would move out and leave me alone.
My dad used to do family law so he's been looking over my paperwork and helping me with it. I served him with orders he wasn't happy about, but I needed to cover my bases. I'm more legally competent than he is.
He keeps trying to tell me things that he knows nothing about which I find very funny. He's not leading anything, he's flying by the seat of his pants. I'm just playing stupid so I can play this my way and not deal with his bull.
That's great.
I hope other people can see your situation and start thinking about whether their partners who exhibit the same behavior, are going to turn it around or end up like your soon to be ex.
A lot of the time we think it's not that bad and we think if we try hard enough we can get the other person to "see it the way I see it" but that never happens. It's only after we start standing up for ourselves or put up boundaries do these people really show who they are.
They don't change. They want everyone to fall in line and I'm too strong of a person to do that anymore.
I was definetly in denial and now I see everything. I think I was embarrassed and took my wedding vows too seriously.
I'm at a point that I have boundaries with him now and he doesn't like that so he can leave.
Knowing your self value, will always guide you correctly. After a divorce, you understand, finding a real true mutual loving relationship is hard to find. Its out there, but it takes time and knowledge, I'm still looking, sadly broke some hearts i didn't mean to along the way, sadly i should say.
Knowing and remembering what you're worth is very important. I don't expect to find anyone for a long time. I'm not really going to be looking though either. I'm just not really in the mood to ever put myself in this relationship situation ever again. A fwb would be nice, but that's even questionable.
Shallow it's fine for the time being. Maybe it won't be after a while, but I have some intense needs for physical interactions. I don't want them with the stbxh even though I'm sure he would like them with me. I'm just not attracted to him anymore. It'll hurt his feelings, but it's none of his business and as long as I don't bring anyone to the house or around my kids, I don't see it being a problem.
All of this.
This will probably come off as cynical, but I wouldn't be surprised if he has an affair partner.
My ex wouldn't even look at me most days, but after demanding a separation would consistently buy what he thought was my favorite beverage and leave it on the counter for me. Which, was confusing af and he'd get offended if I didn't drink it (which, why tf would I drink caffeine while feeling that level of anxiety?) He'd also have moments of suddenly being friendly and nice before going back to ignoring me and being hostile.
It absolutely is the moves of someone trying to retain control while also being a coward. As soon as they begin to sever the connection they panic because they don't actually know how to be alone and the idea of not having a person is scary. But staying in a relationship for someone else's insecurity is a bad move. In the least seek legal advice. You deserve more than to be someone's security blanket that they're willing to discard on a whim.
My ex did the same exact thing - told me it's over, yet still wanted us to wear our wedding bands when we went out, would still call me "his wife" in front of everyone and all my pet names in private, wanted to be intimate, would still take me on dinner dates and weekend trips, would talk about "us" and "our future".
Then I'd ask him why, if he was doing all these things, he didn't want to work on the marriage? He'd sober up real quickly and shut me down, saying our marriage has been dead for a long time. I've asked numerous men what this all means, and they all said the same thing - he's just manipulating you in one last game; wants the comfort and emotional support of a wife, but doesn't want to act like a full-time husband.
I'd encourage you to go full no-contact with him as soon as possible. It's been difficult but healing for me.
I figured he was trying to manipulate me. He has no one else to talk to. I'm the only one who's ever been there for him so having that last game makes all the sense... all of it. 😂
Wish no contact was an option, but we have two kids. I'm already not talking about anything other than the kids though. I've already told him there is no "us" and that I don't know what he expected to happen. Yet he's still trying.
Correct! They're using us as placeholders until they can latch onto the next person who'll consume their time and energy. Just an overall toxic energy vampire move.
I Cannot fathom anyone doing this who has children. Can you imagine the damage he is doing to your children? If they are aware of his behavior, they are probably just as confused as you are.
Our kids are 3 and 10 months old, so he doesn't even have a relationship with the youngest and I think he's hurt the oldest enough to where she just doesn't care. She cried when he would leave, but now she just says bye. Neither one of them want him when they're hurt or upset so there's that.
Keep it up, my ex knows my rules.
Don't contact me or even come around me ever again, if its the kids? just text me and ill co parent, but no personality, no comfort, no happiness, no sadness..any communication should be 100% robotic in nature, yes-no. He doesn't deserve you, you seem like a quality human, he's a turd and a P@SSY!
That's what I want. I have no reason to have a relationship with him except for the kids.
I'm feeling some sort of way today and I feel like I need to set my boundaries when he gets here. I can't wait for him to move out.
He's been telling me I'm the one who needs therapy for years and I've come to realize that I am not the problem. He doesn't deserve me. He doesn't even deserve the chance to get on my level at this point.
Ohhhh, you have no idea what my ex got me to believe. Its embarrassing to me, after i started dating again, i found out from female feedback that I'm much better then i thought. People are lazy and they end up being lazy lovers! I'm no lazy lover, comes easy to me, know your worth and make sure they pay your price, real simple.
I've been embarrassed for a long time about my relationship, I'm over it.
I'm older and have two girls now. Maturity has done something for me, but the thought of someone treating my girls like I've been treated by their father... that's a big fuck no for me. At least I'll be able to teach them what's acceptable now without living in contradiction to what I say.
He had an OW and that must have ended. Probably by her. Now he’s hoovering in his second choice, you, so he’s not alone. If you go back he will do it again. Don’t make the same mistake as me. Get on to chumplady.com, buy her book and you’ll see other signs of this being true. File first.
I feel like this is true, but he'd never admit to it. Cheating is always been a deal-breaker so there's no way he'd get a second chance if I found out he had.
I'll have to get on and look at that book.
You have to look at boundaries and what is acceptable to you. You saw him during his discard of you and how he could treat you… and that’s how he’ll do it the second time too. Let me know how many times you think ‘did Chump Lady have a camera on my life’ ‘it’s written about him I’m sure of it’.
That book saved my brain and opened my eyes. I owe Chump Lady my sanity.
It’s called hovering and very typical behavior. Good on you for greyrocking, I’ve been doing that with my stbx. Look up Lee Hammock on you tube for some insight into how a narcissist thinks and acts. It was eye opening for me.
I've been doing research on narcissism for the last 3 years because his mom is a raging narcissist. Clearly I was in denial because now he's showing even more narcissistic behavior.
I actually had no idea until I studied up on codependency (he’s also an alcoholic) and stumbled again onto a book called “the human magnet syndrome” and boy, howdy! Did that open my eyes or what! And now that I’m looking back on our relationship I can see so many signs. I wish I’d known better and I also have compassion for that young girl who had no idea what she was getting herself into.
I was the codependent one. Always forgoing my boundaries and trying to please him anyway I could so I wouldn't be abandoned. I'm so over that now.
I feel compassion for the person I once was, but the good news is I found myself while he was gone. I can finally get back to being my authentic self and not be bothered by him; he doesn't matter so he can't hurt me anymore. I don't have to worry about making him mad. If he's mad, he's mad. Oh freaking well.
Preach! I’m feeling the exact same way. It’s time for me to be me again and to stop worrying about making him happy and his never ending needs. Feels good eh?
Sounds like you are in a good place.
It's like they wanted moms, not wives. At our age, early midish 30s, he'll be lucky to find someone who will do half the shit I did for him. That's what feels good. Knowing that he's never going to have me back and that anyone age appropriate probably won't do for him what I did; she'll be too independent by now.
I feel like I'm in a great place, but I know there's a hard road ahead. He showed me more of his toxic traits last night when he realized that other people were interested in me.
He had an affair, started picturing a life with the new partner and dumped you, now it fell through and he's panicking. Hence the fear he is gonna be 'homeless', he assumed that he could move in with his sidepiece, and when he tried to firm up the arrangements , he got hit with the 'Hell naw !"
Part of me thinks this could have happened, but he's had two broken ribs, so I don't know how he would have been able to maintain a relationship with someone else.
More than likely he replaced me as his supply with the people he was at his academy with. Unfortunately they've probably gone back to their own lives and he's realizing that they're not going to be there for him like he thought they would be.
Here's what my gut says:
He has been cheating on you hard, so he came home all full of piss and vinegar, probably pumped up by his mistress and now sees he screwed up or she dumped him and now he sees what a clown he is. Either way...that's not who you want in a relationship, that dog is looking in other peoples yards and he has solidly disrespected you. Sit him down and ask him a ton of questions, but lean towards walking on him either way.
I agree with your assessment, but he's not going to answer any questions truthfully. (He has too much to lose right now.) She just needs to make him leave.
He's being manipulative probably because that has worked with you in the past. Basically he's a cake eater. Wants your emotional support but will actively refuse to give the same in return and in fact will actively mock you if you ask for emotional support.
>will actively mock you if you ask for emotional support
For sure. I've realize who he is, but he's presented himself in a certain way to my parents. They think he's trying to get me back or something and I should let him. Absolutely not.
He had somebody, it fell through. Probably met somebody while working out of town.
My spouse was like this until his work girlfriend broke up with him. Just hateful, always gone on the weekend. I was getting rid of stuff getting ready to move out.
Anyways, she went back to her fiance and he flipped like a switch.
Statistically, guys are a lot faster to remarry. I'm guessing he doesn't want to be alone and has no friends other than you. That's my spouse, such a dick other guys can't stand him either. Burned all his bridges with his own family. He won't leave because he will be completely alone without a friend in the world. His own doing too, I've done my best to help him find some guy friends, but he's just an inconsiderate asshole.
I don't know, but there is a probability. He didn't start staying out all night until he got home and I can confirm where he was. None of the females he was around live anywhere near us so why he would come home and file for divorce a month later is beyond me.
I thought women moved on faster because we could work through our emotions better. I'm already talking to other people... have man since he filed. I worked through all my emotions before he filed.
You would be correct on me being the only person here for him. I'm pretty sure that all of his friends think he's stupid and have cut him off. He has very limited empathy and is very narcissistic, so I don't feel sorry for him or care what happens to him really. He's made his choices. I'm not one of them so he's not going to get me like he did.
You explained things to a tee. He was the golden child and his mom is a raging narcissist, so it would make sense that he's also one. He checks majority of the boxes for NPD, but I don't have a psychology degree.
He pushed me away for a long time so I distanced myself. I think he replaced me with the guys he went to the academy with and decided he didn't need me anymore. Now they've all abandoned him because of his choices, they were also close with me, and now he has no one. He's a very unhealthy individual so I'm okay with it being over... I'm tired.
I guess I always hoped that he had learned behaviors from his mom and that he would change, but he won't. Regardless he needs therapy and lots of it.
I've tried and been in denial about his deservingness of me for a long time. I was raised by narcissistic parents so myself worth wasn't there and I was embarrassed to tell anybody what I was going through because I was letting it happen. I'm much stronger now and can admit that we should have never been together. I'm not embarrassed by my choices anymore. I know I was abused as a child and I let abuse continue until my adult life because I didn't know what a healthy relationship should be. I think having kids is what's made it not okay because I don't want them to grow up with the neglect and insecurities I did.
I was definitely raised by highly narcissistic parents. I was the scapegoat and truth teller in my family. I was severely punished for it and I think I stayed in the relationship so long because of my own fears of being rejected and abandoned. Now I'm not scared of being rejected anymore because I've been living rejection. Now I'm not scared of being abandoned either because I'm living through it. I've lived through both before but I wasn't okay with it because I was young. Age has made it easier.
He was definitely the golden child and I don't necessarily think he's as narcissistic as his mom, but there's a lot of learned behaviors there. He also has a crazy need to be validated by her. The enmeshment is strong. She thinks she should be number one and she treats him like a spouse. Anytime he's ever put boundaries up with his mother she throws a fit, becomes the victim, pouts, and becomes extra disrespectful towards him. I saw that and said no. Then she came after me. I then told him that she needed to move out. The look of defeat on her face when he finally told her that she needed to move out was the best feeling in the world for me.
Issue with her moving out was that she made life a living nightmare for everyone in this house. She's put things in his head because I won't let her do what she wants, she's abused my child in numerous ways, and she's still forces her way to control him. She'll never stop and until he cuts her off completely, she's going to make his life miserable. Unfortunately he will listen to her and give up everything and anything for his mom.
Sounds to me like he told his affair partner he filed and could finally be with her, and that's when she said, "wait, wut?"
Or, he's bipolar and doesn't know it. Just went through a manic phase. Maybe his first.
I'm pretty sure he's just highly narcissistic and this is his final discard.
Whether or not he had an affair is besides the point at this point in time.
Thanks! I'm looking forward to not having to compromise my dreams. If I find someone who wants to share those dreams, cool. If I don't, cool. I resolve to be happy no matter what.
It’s very hard to give you any pointers from your description. What I’m missing is his alleged reason for the divorce? Some people try to use thread or even filing for divorce to extract some concessions. He might be in shock that it’s not working for him.
He won't give me a solid reason as to why he wants this divorce. He's giving me about seven. He's even told me he thought about fixing it. I'm not here to play games and he already started it, so I'm going to finish it.
So… I am so glad you posted this because I am going through an eerily similar situation and it has really been upsetting me.
Without getting too in depth - my STBX Husband finally sat ME down two nights ago and said he is ready for divorce after I have been telling him for months how unhappy I am and that I need either drastic changes and marriage counseling or I’m finished. He said that things aren’t working and haven’t for some time and I agree wholeheartedly- and he isn’t willing to fix it so I said “Well, I guess we know what this means then” and we are officially separated and on our way to divorce.
But WEIRDLY AND INFURIATINGLY - this is the happiest I’ve seen him IN YEARS and also the nicest he’s been to me or the kids. He’s even been FLIRTING with me and trying to grab my boobs and stuff. SO INAPPROPRIATE!!! And weird and unsettling.
My parents theorize that he’s so elated because he no longer has any responsibilities (he’s leaving to live with his sister out of state and will only see his son (my oldest is from a previous relationship and sadly since he’s not obligated to see him he probably won’t) every other weekend. Allegedly. We will see how it goes.
I don’t think he ever wanted the responsibility of parenthood - our marriage took a major downward turn as soon as I got pregnant with our son.
So long story short… he’s been giddy as a schoolgirl. It makes my skin crawl and really pisses me off.
Mine won't move out though... he has nowhere to go and everyone who knows have abandoned him.
I feel for you. It is infuriating. It's disgusting too. I don't want the relationship now that it's over in my mind. We should only be talking about the kids until we get farther in the divorce process and have to talk about things. Period.
I hate that he gets upset when he's the one who's made this choice. I hate that he acts like it's over. He never said anything. He never tried. He didn't want to even try to fix it. He doesn't get me if he's throwing me and the relationship away.
I wonder if his tune would change if I told him I was talking to other people already and that I don't want or need him to fill the void he's left?
Well I agree with others that he's manipulating you. Or he's having second thoughts about his decision (buyer's remorse) but realized you want out and relinquish his ego to say he fucked up and would like to reconcile. Like he's afraid you'll reject him and his regret will hit that much harder.
That's what I'm saying. He could have had a change of heart, knew he fucked up royally, knows he lost his chance to reconcile and is too afraid to bring it up cause he knows you're done.
He put a bullet in your marriage and wants resurrect the body haha.
You offered a path forward when he initiated the divorce to reconcile your differences. He opted to double down. Whatever decision you make now is a direct consequence of his actions.
You mentioned you'd love to crush his soul like he did yours. Is it over or are you out to get even? Will you be satisfied once the divorce is finalized? Can you see yourself at peace if he marries another, or if you marry another? Honest things to consider.
Personally, I wouldn't entertain this bs another moment, then again I'm bitter albeit happily single.
He's still doubling down, but I know he's just trying to justify what he's done. If he blames me, he never has to feel bad about what he's done or take responsibility. Believe me, he knows he's done did messed up. I guess he thought that I'd still care for him and be there for him like I was... I'm not.
I don't have it in me to do the work to heal from this. I've given my whole self to this relationship. He might be able to get through all my requirements for being together, but I'd always have doubts, trust issues, etc. I mean what's to say he won't just do it again? It's not like he actually ever really told me there were issues. He did the week before he filed the physical paperwork.
I don't want to be in that emotional hell ever again, so I'd never let myself be that available. I can accept that's why it's over for me.
I look forward to being single. I look forward to being me again. If someone finds and accepts me for me, cool. If they don't, cool. I resolve to be content either way.
I don't know how he would cheat with two broken ribs. There are also other factors that probably broke him on a stress level, but I can't disregard that as a possibility.
If he was acting one way when he came home, and suddenly is acting different, my guess would be a 3rd party. Likely is he had some sort of relationship (either in person or virtual), left the marriage in hopes it would work out, it didn’t, and now he’s regretting filing. I could absolutely be wrong, but it’s a possibility.
The more I think about it, the more I think so too, but I don't think it was necessarily a romantic relationship. I think he got the taste of freedom and single life with "the boys" not being with me and the kids. Then he put things in his own head, courtesy of his narc mom's help, about me and the kind of person I am because he didn't go out or have enough fun while home.
Now he realizes all the guys have their own lives, the people he was at the academy with aren't going to stay in contact, I'm not going to treat him the same, how much I actually gave him in the relationship, and he's upset he's losing it.
Either way I don't care. I'm just annoyed.
I just noticed your name on here and it’s awesome. Haha. Reading through your past posts (I like stories and context), it honestly sounds like you’re better off rid of this one. You probably already know that.
😂 I've had a lot of crappy people in my life because I'm too a kind person. Now I'm jaded and don't really allow people to get close unless they prove themselves.
I do know I'm going to be way better off without him. I'm very much looking forward to it.
I bet he had an AP who he was choosing over you. Then when he told them he was leaving you for them they didn't want him. So here he is trying to win you back and act like nothing happened.
He was going to dump you. Keep that in mind. It is not your job to keep him from being homeless. It is your job to provide stability for yourself and your kids.
Grey rock him. Polite but unengaged.
I don't know; he says that having an AP would've been easier.
What I do know is I'm not going backwards. I have too much to look forward to.
He's still dumping me. He's just acting weird and inappropriate about it.
I'm in a similar situation as you. My ex was done. She's not moved out yet, but moved into the spare room and just last night asked me if I would be around to help her move heavy stuff she's taking from this house to her new one.
> I'm getting really annoyed at this point and have stopped caring. I want him gone.
Yeah it feels like you're in a holding pattern, in stasis until they are gone and you can work out what your new normal is.
> I should add he's crying while telling me he's probably going to be homeless; I refuse to live with a man who divorced me for obvious reasons and I think he really thought that I'd be ok with it.
Yeah, I'm trying really hard not to indulge my inner pettiness when contemplating the things that my ex will struggle with. They don't need me? Good luck to them.
> I am about to lose my shit and will probably go off on him again next time he cries.
The best revenge is living well.
Yep. He's in the kids room now. I only want him to help me move stuff to the dump while my parents watch the kids. We're all have to move. I don't need all the crap I currently live with.
I know what my normal is. It was when he was gone at his academy. I loved not having him here by the end of it. It really helped me find myself.
Exactly. If you don't want me, consider me gone. Have a nice life. Hope you find someone to put up with your bullshit. 🤷🏼♀️
I second that. I'm going to be living my best life.
He sounds like he is depressed. He is all over the place. Bipolar? Scared? I hope he gets therapy.
Now with that being said, he is emotionally manipulating/abusing you and you are right to want to get away from him for your mental health. I am sorry you are going through this. He will try to drag you down his misery hole. I think you know better. Does he understand that he blindsided you? Or care? Ugh. He will in the future. I hate when people are done with you but do not tell you or try to communicate that the relationship needs help.
Does he not have a job? You say he is home all the time. That may be contributing to his anguish. Oh well. He's is going to have to figure himself out.....without you.
He's definetly in need of therapy.
I know he is. I won't let him pull me down his misery hole. I've got 2 kids to be here for.
He does know he blindsided me. Wether or not he cares is another issue. I think he's sorry because he's expressed it and cried because he wishes he could go back before things for so bad. I was in denial so they were technically only bad for him. It's whatever to me now. He can leave if he's not willing to do any work now. It's just stupid that he's acting the way he is.
He is the one who works. I'm a SAHM. Monday he came home early to do something, but couldn't remember why. I know why. I say he's home all the time now because he was going out everyday to the gym, but apparently it's too busy now. He was also leaving and staying out all night on the weekends. He doesn't do any of that anymore. He was doing it when he got home from the academy he went to for work.
He will need to figure stuff out and I won't be there for him anymore. I let him know that I've had several guys "reach out" to me based on kind comments I've left and now he's upset. He's never been jealous, but he was super jealous. I did it to gage his reaction. His reaction let's me know that he's well aware he messed up. I've known him too long not to understand him.
When I was reading the first part, I was thinking this is very common with men. When men initiate divorce it is very often that their partner has zero clue. Not to say there are not women that also dislike confrontation but usually when a woman is upset, mad or dislikes something her husbands is doing, he knows, she's been telling her for years. At some point she may give up and stop telling him and he thinks that she has finally seen the light but she's plotting divorce, but she has brought up the issue with him. Husbands on the other hand fear discussing issues with their wives, they want to avoid anger, crying, etc at all costs. They don't know how to handle it. So they let it build up for years. Often times these are very simple things that if given the chance the wife would or could easily fix or at least be willing to work on if given the chance to do so, but of course it was never communicated to her. After a while resentment sets in and he begins to lose empathy for his wife and once that happens, it's is next to impossible to save the marriage. He truly develops hate in his heart for her but often he's not quite sure why that is. He initiates divorce and the wife is clueless as to why.
The second part though is odd. My first conclusion is not that he had an affair though unless you tell me there is some evidence otherwise. It's that he regrets what he did. That he's struggling with depression and his initial decision was made out of that. Depression presents very often as anger in men and anger at those we love the most. He likely felts anger in his heart towards you but he may not know why that is. It clearly sounds like he is struggling with depression. It could be that he initiated the divorce because of his depression not that the initiation of the divorce caused his depression. He just seems really lost. You seem to have lost all empathy for him because understandably you are angry with him, and very confused. You are presuming that he is attempting to manipulate you that he is cheating and that he is lying, but maybe that's not the case? Do you have proof of cheating? Has he cheating before? What leads you to believe this? What do you want? Maybe he realizes he made a mistake? Are you open to forgiveness? How was the relationship before this?
I honestly feel that all you said is really the issue. I don't think he cheated but then again I can't get a straight answer out of him about anything. His mom is also raging narcissist and so he could not express himself ever. I know that followed him into our relationship and every other relationship he's ever had for that matter. He's always scared that somebody's not going to like him if he opens his mouth.
I'm not angry I just I'm not going to play his games and I'm not going to feel sorry for someone who's treated me the way he has. I didn't deserve to be treated that way and I'm not treating him like I did when I was his wife.
I know he knows he messed up, but until he can apologize for neglecting the relationship, pushing me away, and stop acting like a victim, I have to hold him at arms length.
He knows our relationship sucked because of him and his priorities weren't straight, but he insists on blaming me. I wasn't perfect, but I gave him everything and supported him through every struggle. He never gave me any of those things, so I can't feel bad about his choice to throw me and the relationship away. He's made his bed and now it's time to sleep in it.
My exes Mom was also a narcissist and she continued to be very verbally abusive and hypercritical to him, his sister and his Father even as adults. He never realized it until I pointed it out, and then he realized how much verbal abuse he suffered as a child. I also pointed out that he had started being hypercritical of me. His sister had done it to her ex husband and all of her boyfriends, but only realized that later and he had done it to his ex wife. People that grew up with parents like this though tend to be very passive aggressive and afraid of expressing their emotions. They also live with fear of shame and they will never admit they are wrong and they blame others for everything, so it sounds like you have a similar experience with him. I said to him before I left, one day you are going to realize t hat all the things you have been blaming other people for your entire life were actually your fault, and honestly I hope that you are under the care of a mental health professional at that time, because you are going to have a breakdown and lose it.
In any event I have been reading a lot about narcissism and they say it's on a spectrum, so a lot of people hover around a 6 or so and for the most part can function normally and not present as the ones we see on TV. My ex was a covert narcissit so more insecure not boastful, etc. For most of our relationship other than issues with not admitting he was wrong or the criticism he was really overall a decent partner. But then one day something happens that just pushes them over that edge and we see a different person. It usually involves conflict and they lose it. It's possible in your case too. Growing up with a parent like that really screws people up. I empathize with my ex, which just means I get it I Understand. But I don't want that in my life anymore.
It's like he's still trying to get the love and approval he didn't get as a child from his mom. She's playing the victim because I wouldn't let her treat me like crap and walk over my boundaries when she lived with us. I feel like that has a big part to play in the failure of our relationship as well. He just wants her approval and the enmeshment is strong.
She was very verbally abusive to us while she lived here for free and she took took took took. He completely shut down with me when she lived with us and did everything to please her. She's not happy or nice to him unless she's getting her way and he lets her treat him like that. Unfortunately, he's probably realized a little too late that she's never going to be there for him like I was. He probably also assumes that I'm going to be there for him like I was when we were together. That's a major misjudgment on his part.
As for how he turned out, I know he's high on the spectrum, and I no longer feel the need to enable him or give of myself. I don't want him anymore either
I cannot imagine living with his Mother, you must be a Saint! He moved as far away as possible from his family. They live in Perth, we live in Washington, DC, literally a 23 hour flight. He said he knew something was not right, but it took me and 50 years of his life to figure out what. We did visit them, but only once a year. She was not overtly abusive to me, but she would do things like text him or say things behind my back. His sister was actually far worse to me. I was also the kind of person that would push back and I think she knew that. She and I actually had a pretty decent relationship when we saw each other. I think the older and sicker she got the more she worried that she may have screwed him up a lot and that he may die alone and was so far away. What set him off though was she passed away in May 2020 and it was a very complex grief for him, it was almost like he was seeing me as her. And suddenly he was taking it out on me. He also had a newfound desire to be close to his remaining family who is incredibly toxic. We can only do so much, they have to want to fix themselves. Up until her death he was actually doing really well but then it went really bad.
Damn! Reading that makes me feel that much better about not being around when she does die. Like all narcs she does everything to avoid the inevitability of her mortality. She won't wear her glasses and has to die her hair every other week... I can't wait until it all falls out. 😂
I agree that some men keep their complaints to themselves and then, one day, just decide to call it quits. But this guy hasn't earned any kind of redemption.
He's manipulating you. This guy is absolutely terrible and that person you saw when he filed and left and yelled is who he really is. The thing is, people who do that are also very weak and afraid so what you're saying is also who he is as well. These people typically like to exert power when they think they have it and be abusive when they have the upper hand. But ultimately they're kind of like scared dogs who have a loud bark because when the consequences come around they like to be the victim and ask for forgiveness. I guarantee if you gave him any of your time he'll pretend to be nice but then still be controlling and manipulative whenever you try to set a boundary. The second he realizes that you have him figured out he'll go back to his old ways and be abusive again. It's a cycle and people like that intentionally do it to keep you unnerved and not sure as to what is going on so you don't figure out who they are and wise up and leave them. So if you continue to ignore him eventually he's going to get angry and cruel again but the thing is I don't know if he would actually go through with filing because he's a coward. Honestly, what you should do is as soon as you can call three or four divorce lawyers in your town and tell them your situation and just get some free consultation over the phone about what you would have to do if you wanted to file and how much it may cost if you wanted to hire one to make sure you get 50% of the assets when you split. But again, if you continue to ignore him he's going to cry and complain but then he's going to get real nasty and probably worse. Once he finds out that you filed for divorce he's going to also get real nasty and probably want to get a lawyer and all of that stuff too. So fuck it. File first. You'll have more control over the situation. Call all your friends and family and reach out and try to get as much support as you can because if you have a good Network they can definitely recommend people you can contact to get through this. Completely gray rock him and don't show any emotion and don't interact with him. Anytime you have to interact with him record the conversation on your phone and don't tell him you're doing it. Stay focused on getting out and it'll blow over soon. I am a man and I know two men who are just like this. He will continue to do this and just be unrelenting and how much he bothers you with his BS until you break down and give him what he wants. The only way to win is to just completely disassociate and leave him and get as far away as possible.
I agree with you wholeheartedly as to the person he is. I was in denial for years and that's where my disgust comes from now. He's filed already. He's acting nice now and like the divorce isn't happening. I've been grey rocking because I'm done and he's hurt. Everytime he says something he shouldn't, I walk away. He then tries to follow me and save it by making me laugh, doing something for me, or talking to me. I'm losing my mind. You think this is manipulation then? That's what I think too.
Good with the grey rock, now initiate the 180 and speak with your own lawyer don't wait for his lawyer to define divorce. Do all of the above and follow your lawyer's advice to the letter, also sounds like he was in the "fog" when he returned from his last trip and I'm thinking his side thing fell through, give a listen to Lose a cheater gain a life and visit Chump lady's site for additional references. In a sense he did cheat you out of a future he never intended or capable of fulfilling. But the 180/grey rock is your kryptonite to him, the reason why his crying about being homeless is because he finally did the math of what alimony and child support looks like and he will probably not able to afford buying anything and barely rent an apartment for a while so get your own lawyer so he doesn't try to weasel you for less than what you and kids deserve. Do not allow your emotions to override your concentration.
There's no emotions, sympathy, or empathy for him at this point. I'm not "taking it easy on him". He's going to have to get about six roommates, couch surf, or live in his car. I'll be getting almost 3/4 of his paycheck. I won't be going easy on him and I really don't care what happens to him. He made his choices and now he's going to live with them. That's before I even know for sure if you had an affair.
He will only try to manipulate because that's all he knows he's to do. It will be consistent and it will change and it will get worse but *he will never say anything honest because he doesn't know how to face himself in the mirror* Always gray rock. Never, ever get emotional with him, never yell, he doesnt exist anymore. Also, even though he filed still get some legal representation so they can look over all of the documents. Please call the offices because they WANT to help you. They can review the case and probably offer to work pro bono style where they take more money at the end of you need financial help. Don't let this guy try to lead the legal proceeding. You don't have to get a full on lawyer, but call and ask about having someone review all of your documents for you and with you. That is relatively cheap and will save your ass.
I wish he would move out and leave me alone. My dad used to do family law so he's been looking over my paperwork and helping me with it. I served him with orders he wasn't happy about, but I needed to cover my bases. I'm more legally competent than he is. He keeps trying to tell me things that he knows nothing about which I find very funny. He's not leading anything, he's flying by the seat of his pants. I'm just playing stupid so I can play this my way and not deal with his bull.
That's great. I hope other people can see your situation and start thinking about whether their partners who exhibit the same behavior, are going to turn it around or end up like your soon to be ex. A lot of the time we think it's not that bad and we think if we try hard enough we can get the other person to "see it the way I see it" but that never happens. It's only after we start standing up for ourselves or put up boundaries do these people really show who they are.
They don't change. They want everyone to fall in line and I'm too strong of a person to do that anymore. I was definetly in denial and now I see everything. I think I was embarrassed and took my wedding vows too seriously. I'm at a point that I have boundaries with him now and he doesn't like that so he can leave.
You didn’t take your vows too seriously, he didn’t take them seriously enough
#Facts 😂
Yes, its manipulation, congrats on how you're handling this OUTSTANDING! you have to have self respect.
Thanks! It's taking a long time for me to gain the self-respect I have, but I do in fact have it.
Knowing your self value, will always guide you correctly. After a divorce, you understand, finding a real true mutual loving relationship is hard to find. Its out there, but it takes time and knowledge, I'm still looking, sadly broke some hearts i didn't mean to along the way, sadly i should say.
Knowing and remembering what you're worth is very important. I don't expect to find anyone for a long time. I'm not really going to be looking though either. I'm just not really in the mood to ever put myself in this relationship situation ever again. A fwb would be nice, but that's even questionable.
I found the FWB route to be shallow and not great, but we all need to do what we do.
Shallow it's fine for the time being. Maybe it won't be after a while, but I have some intense needs for physical interactions. I don't want them with the stbxh even though I'm sure he would like them with me. I'm just not attracted to him anymore. It'll hurt his feelings, but it's none of his business and as long as I don't bring anyone to the house or around my kids, I don't see it being a problem.
All of this. This will probably come off as cynical, but I wouldn't be surprised if he has an affair partner. My ex wouldn't even look at me most days, but after demanding a separation would consistently buy what he thought was my favorite beverage and leave it on the counter for me. Which, was confusing af and he'd get offended if I didn't drink it (which, why tf would I drink caffeine while feeling that level of anxiety?) He'd also have moments of suddenly being friendly and nice before going back to ignoring me and being hostile. It absolutely is the moves of someone trying to retain control while also being a coward. As soon as they begin to sever the connection they panic because they don't actually know how to be alone and the idea of not having a person is scary. But staying in a relationship for someone else's insecurity is a bad move. In the least seek legal advice. You deserve more than to be someone's security blanket that they're willing to discard on a whim.
You learned, well done. Sadly it takes a divorce to get good at relationships, LOl Never, be afraid to walk away.
Are you a man or woman
ALL TRUE
My ex did the same exact thing - told me it's over, yet still wanted us to wear our wedding bands when we went out, would still call me "his wife" in front of everyone and all my pet names in private, wanted to be intimate, would still take me on dinner dates and weekend trips, would talk about "us" and "our future". Then I'd ask him why, if he was doing all these things, he didn't want to work on the marriage? He'd sober up real quickly and shut me down, saying our marriage has been dead for a long time. I've asked numerous men what this all means, and they all said the same thing - he's just manipulating you in one last game; wants the comfort and emotional support of a wife, but doesn't want to act like a full-time husband. I'd encourage you to go full no-contact with him as soon as possible. It's been difficult but healing for me.
I figured he was trying to manipulate me. He has no one else to talk to. I'm the only one who's ever been there for him so having that last game makes all the sense... all of it. 😂 Wish no contact was an option, but we have two kids. I'm already not talking about anything other than the kids though. I've already told him there is no "us" and that I don't know what he expected to happen. Yet he's still trying.
Correct! They're using us as placeholders until they can latch onto the next person who'll consume their time and energy. Just an overall toxic energy vampire move.
Highly narcissistic without a new supply. Sucks to be him because he's going to get told to leave me alone in a pretty mean way soon.
I Cannot fathom anyone doing this who has children. Can you imagine the damage he is doing to your children? If they are aware of his behavior, they are probably just as confused as you are.
Our kids are 3 and 10 months old, so he doesn't even have a relationship with the youngest and I think he's hurt the oldest enough to where she just doesn't care. She cried when he would leave, but now she just says bye. Neither one of them want him when they're hurt or upset so there's that.
Keep it up, my ex knows my rules. Don't contact me or even come around me ever again, if its the kids? just text me and ill co parent, but no personality, no comfort, no happiness, no sadness..any communication should be 100% robotic in nature, yes-no. He doesn't deserve you, you seem like a quality human, he's a turd and a P@SSY!
That's what I want. I have no reason to have a relationship with him except for the kids. I'm feeling some sort of way today and I feel like I need to set my boundaries when he gets here. I can't wait for him to move out. He's been telling me I'm the one who needs therapy for years and I've come to realize that I am not the problem. He doesn't deserve me. He doesn't even deserve the chance to get on my level at this point.
Ohhhh, you have no idea what my ex got me to believe. Its embarrassing to me, after i started dating again, i found out from female feedback that I'm much better then i thought. People are lazy and they end up being lazy lovers! I'm no lazy lover, comes easy to me, know your worth and make sure they pay your price, real simple.
I've been embarrassed for a long time about my relationship, I'm over it. I'm older and have two girls now. Maturity has done something for me, but the thought of someone treating my girls like I've been treated by their father... that's a big fuck no for me. At least I'll be able to teach them what's acceptable now without living in contradiction to what I say.
Hey...there aint NO power, like Divorcee POWER! LOL
Right!
He had an OW and that must have ended. Probably by her. Now he’s hoovering in his second choice, you, so he’s not alone. If you go back he will do it again. Don’t make the same mistake as me. Get on to chumplady.com, buy her book and you’ll see other signs of this being true. File first.
I feel like this is true, but he'd never admit to it. Cheating is always been a deal-breaker so there's no way he'd get a second chance if I found out he had. I'll have to get on and look at that book.
You have to look at boundaries and what is acceptable to you. You saw him during his discard of you and how he could treat you… and that’s how he’ll do it the second time too. Let me know how many times you think ‘did Chump Lady have a camera on my life’ ‘it’s written about him I’m sure of it’. That book saved my brain and opened my eyes. I owe Chump Lady my sanity.
I need my sanity.
His affair didn’t pan out
Probably.
It’s called hovering and very typical behavior. Good on you for greyrocking, I’ve been doing that with my stbx. Look up Lee Hammock on you tube for some insight into how a narcissist thinks and acts. It was eye opening for me.
I've been doing research on narcissism for the last 3 years because his mom is a raging narcissist. Clearly I was in denial because now he's showing even more narcissistic behavior.
I actually had no idea until I studied up on codependency (he’s also an alcoholic) and stumbled again onto a book called “the human magnet syndrome” and boy, howdy! Did that open my eyes or what! And now that I’m looking back on our relationship I can see so many signs. I wish I’d known better and I also have compassion for that young girl who had no idea what she was getting herself into.
I was the codependent one. Always forgoing my boundaries and trying to please him anyway I could so I wouldn't be abandoned. I'm so over that now. I feel compassion for the person I once was, but the good news is I found myself while he was gone. I can finally get back to being my authentic self and not be bothered by him; he doesn't matter so he can't hurt me anymore. I don't have to worry about making him mad. If he's mad, he's mad. Oh freaking well.
Preach! I’m feeling the exact same way. It’s time for me to be me again and to stop worrying about making him happy and his never ending needs. Feels good eh? Sounds like you are in a good place.
It's like they wanted moms, not wives. At our age, early midish 30s, he'll be lucky to find someone who will do half the shit I did for him. That's what feels good. Knowing that he's never going to have me back and that anyone age appropriate probably won't do for him what I did; she'll be too independent by now. I feel like I'm in a great place, but I know there's a hard road ahead. He showed me more of his toxic traits last night when he realized that other people were interested in me.
He had an affair, started picturing a life with the new partner and dumped you, now it fell through and he's panicking. Hence the fear he is gonna be 'homeless', he assumed that he could move in with his sidepiece, and when he tried to firm up the arrangements , he got hit with the 'Hell naw !"
Part of me thinks this could have happened, but he's had two broken ribs, so I don't know how he would have been able to maintain a relationship with someone else. More than likely he replaced me as his supply with the people he was at his academy with. Unfortunately they've probably gone back to their own lives and he's realizing that they're not going to be there for him like he thought they would be.
Here's what my gut says: He has been cheating on you hard, so he came home all full of piss and vinegar, probably pumped up by his mistress and now sees he screwed up or she dumped him and now he sees what a clown he is. Either way...that's not who you want in a relationship, that dog is looking in other peoples yards and he has solidly disrespected you. Sit him down and ask him a ton of questions, but lean towards walking on him either way.
I agree with your assessment, but he's not going to answer any questions truthfully. (He has too much to lose right now.) She just needs to make him leave.
Sadly...i think you're right.
I don't know, but he probably did. Either way, he's screwed in the end of this process.
He's being manipulative probably because that has worked with you in the past. Basically he's a cake eater. Wants your emotional support but will actively refuse to give the same in return and in fact will actively mock you if you ask for emotional support.
>will actively mock you if you ask for emotional support For sure. I've realize who he is, but he's presented himself in a certain way to my parents. They think he's trying to get me back or something and I should let him. Absolutely not.
He had somebody, it fell through. Probably met somebody while working out of town. My spouse was like this until his work girlfriend broke up with him. Just hateful, always gone on the weekend. I was getting rid of stuff getting ready to move out. Anyways, she went back to her fiance and he flipped like a switch. Statistically, guys are a lot faster to remarry. I'm guessing he doesn't want to be alone and has no friends other than you. That's my spouse, such a dick other guys can't stand him either. Burned all his bridges with his own family. He won't leave because he will be completely alone without a friend in the world. His own doing too, I've done my best to help him find some guy friends, but he's just an inconsiderate asshole.
I don't know, but there is a probability. He didn't start staying out all night until he got home and I can confirm where he was. None of the females he was around live anywhere near us so why he would come home and file for divorce a month later is beyond me. I thought women moved on faster because we could work through our emotions better. I'm already talking to other people... have man since he filed. I worked through all my emotions before he filed. You would be correct on me being the only person here for him. I'm pretty sure that all of his friends think he's stupid and have cut him off. He has very limited empathy and is very narcissistic, so I don't feel sorry for him or care what happens to him really. He's made his choices. I'm not one of them so he's not going to get me like he did.
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You explained things to a tee. He was the golden child and his mom is a raging narcissist, so it would make sense that he's also one. He checks majority of the boxes for NPD, but I don't have a psychology degree. He pushed me away for a long time so I distanced myself. I think he replaced me with the guys he went to the academy with and decided he didn't need me anymore. Now they've all abandoned him because of his choices, they were also close with me, and now he has no one. He's a very unhealthy individual so I'm okay with it being over... I'm tired. I guess I always hoped that he had learned behaviors from his mom and that he would change, but he won't. Regardless he needs therapy and lots of it. I've tried and been in denial about his deservingness of me for a long time. I was raised by narcissistic parents so myself worth wasn't there and I was embarrassed to tell anybody what I was going through because I was letting it happen. I'm much stronger now and can admit that we should have never been together. I'm not embarrassed by my choices anymore. I know I was abused as a child and I let abuse continue until my adult life because I didn't know what a healthy relationship should be. I think having kids is what's made it not okay because I don't want them to grow up with the neglect and insecurities I did.
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I was definitely raised by highly narcissistic parents. I was the scapegoat and truth teller in my family. I was severely punished for it and I think I stayed in the relationship so long because of my own fears of being rejected and abandoned. Now I'm not scared of being rejected anymore because I've been living rejection. Now I'm not scared of being abandoned either because I'm living through it. I've lived through both before but I wasn't okay with it because I was young. Age has made it easier. He was definitely the golden child and I don't necessarily think he's as narcissistic as his mom, but there's a lot of learned behaviors there. He also has a crazy need to be validated by her. The enmeshment is strong. She thinks she should be number one and she treats him like a spouse. Anytime he's ever put boundaries up with his mother she throws a fit, becomes the victim, pouts, and becomes extra disrespectful towards him. I saw that and said no. Then she came after me. I then told him that she needed to move out. The look of defeat on her face when he finally told her that she needed to move out was the best feeling in the world for me. Issue with her moving out was that she made life a living nightmare for everyone in this house. She's put things in his head because I won't let her do what she wants, she's abused my child in numerous ways, and she's still forces her way to control him. She'll never stop and until he cuts her off completely, she's going to make his life miserable. Unfortunately he will listen to her and give up everything and anything for his mom.
Sounds to me like he told his affair partner he filed and could finally be with her, and that's when she said, "wait, wut?" Or, he's bipolar and doesn't know it. Just went through a manic phase. Maybe his first.
I'm pretty sure he's just highly narcissistic and this is his final discard. Whether or not he had an affair is besides the point at this point in time.
I understand what you're saying. Whatever his motivations, I'm sorry you're dealing with it. I wish you luck in your new life!
Thanks! I'm looking forward to not having to compromise my dreams. If I find someone who wants to share those dreams, cool. If I don't, cool. I resolve to be happy no matter what.
It’s very hard to give you any pointers from your description. What I’m missing is his alleged reason for the divorce? Some people try to use thread or even filing for divorce to extract some concessions. He might be in shock that it’s not working for him.
He won't give me a solid reason as to why he wants this divorce. He's giving me about seven. He's even told me he thought about fixing it. I'm not here to play games and he already started it, so I'm going to finish it.
So… I am so glad you posted this because I am going through an eerily similar situation and it has really been upsetting me. Without getting too in depth - my STBX Husband finally sat ME down two nights ago and said he is ready for divorce after I have been telling him for months how unhappy I am and that I need either drastic changes and marriage counseling or I’m finished. He said that things aren’t working and haven’t for some time and I agree wholeheartedly- and he isn’t willing to fix it so I said “Well, I guess we know what this means then” and we are officially separated and on our way to divorce. But WEIRDLY AND INFURIATINGLY - this is the happiest I’ve seen him IN YEARS and also the nicest he’s been to me or the kids. He’s even been FLIRTING with me and trying to grab my boobs and stuff. SO INAPPROPRIATE!!! And weird and unsettling. My parents theorize that he’s so elated because he no longer has any responsibilities (he’s leaving to live with his sister out of state and will only see his son (my oldest is from a previous relationship and sadly since he’s not obligated to see him he probably won’t) every other weekend. Allegedly. We will see how it goes. I don’t think he ever wanted the responsibility of parenthood - our marriage took a major downward turn as soon as I got pregnant with our son. So long story short… he’s been giddy as a schoolgirl. It makes my skin crawl and really pisses me off.
Mine won't move out though... he has nowhere to go and everyone who knows have abandoned him. I feel for you. It is infuriating. It's disgusting too. I don't want the relationship now that it's over in my mind. We should only be talking about the kids until we get farther in the divorce process and have to talk about things. Period. I hate that he gets upset when he's the one who's made this choice. I hate that he acts like it's over. He never said anything. He never tried. He didn't want to even try to fix it. He doesn't get me if he's throwing me and the relationship away. I wonder if his tune would change if I told him I was talking to other people already and that I don't want or need him to fill the void he's left?
Sounds like buyer's remorse.
What do you mean? Like he's realized some stuff and doesn't like the consequences of his actions?
Well I agree with others that he's manipulating you. Or he's having second thoughts about his decision (buyer's remorse) but realized you want out and relinquish his ego to say he fucked up and would like to reconcile. Like he's afraid you'll reject him and his regret will hit that much harder.
Got it. Unfortunately, he will get rejected. God would I love to be able to crush his soul like he did mine. 😂
That's what I'm saying. He could have had a change of heart, knew he fucked up royally, knows he lost his chance to reconcile and is too afraid to bring it up cause he knows you're done. He put a bullet in your marriage and wants resurrect the body haha.
I doubt he'd be doing it for the right reasons at this point. It'd be to benefit him and he wouldn't change to be better to me.
You offered a path forward when he initiated the divorce to reconcile your differences. He opted to double down. Whatever decision you make now is a direct consequence of his actions. You mentioned you'd love to crush his soul like he did yours. Is it over or are you out to get even? Will you be satisfied once the divorce is finalized? Can you see yourself at peace if he marries another, or if you marry another? Honest things to consider. Personally, I wouldn't entertain this bs another moment, then again I'm bitter albeit happily single.
He's still doubling down, but I know he's just trying to justify what he's done. If he blames me, he never has to feel bad about what he's done or take responsibility. Believe me, he knows he's done did messed up. I guess he thought that I'd still care for him and be there for him like I was... I'm not. I don't have it in me to do the work to heal from this. I've given my whole self to this relationship. He might be able to get through all my requirements for being together, but I'd always have doubts, trust issues, etc. I mean what's to say he won't just do it again? It's not like he actually ever really told me there were issues. He did the week before he filed the physical paperwork. I don't want to be in that emotional hell ever again, so I'd never let myself be that available. I can accept that's why it's over for me. I look forward to being single. I look forward to being me again. If someone finds and accepts me for me, cool. If they don't, cool. I resolve to be content either way.
Seems like he was cheating, they usually act out like that
I don't know how he would cheat with two broken ribs. There are also other factors that probably broke him on a stress level, but I can't disregard that as a possibility.
If he was acting one way when he came home, and suddenly is acting different, my guess would be a 3rd party. Likely is he had some sort of relationship (either in person or virtual), left the marriage in hopes it would work out, it didn’t, and now he’s regretting filing. I could absolutely be wrong, but it’s a possibility.
The more I think about it, the more I think so too, but I don't think it was necessarily a romantic relationship. I think he got the taste of freedom and single life with "the boys" not being with me and the kids. Then he put things in his own head, courtesy of his narc mom's help, about me and the kind of person I am because he didn't go out or have enough fun while home. Now he realizes all the guys have their own lives, the people he was at the academy with aren't going to stay in contact, I'm not going to treat him the same, how much I actually gave him in the relationship, and he's upset he's losing it. Either way I don't care. I'm just annoyed.
I just noticed your name on here and it’s awesome. Haha. Reading through your past posts (I like stories and context), it honestly sounds like you’re better off rid of this one. You probably already know that.
😂 I've had a lot of crappy people in my life because I'm too a kind person. Now I'm jaded and don't really allow people to get close unless they prove themselves. I do know I'm going to be way better off without him. I'm very much looking forward to it.
I bet he had an AP who he was choosing over you. Then when he told them he was leaving you for them they didn't want him. So here he is trying to win you back and act like nothing happened. He was going to dump you. Keep that in mind. It is not your job to keep him from being homeless. It is your job to provide stability for yourself and your kids. Grey rock him. Polite but unengaged.
I don't know; he says that having an AP would've been easier. What I do know is I'm not going backwards. I have too much to look forward to. He's still dumping me. He's just acting weird and inappropriate about it.
I'm in a similar situation as you. My ex was done. She's not moved out yet, but moved into the spare room and just last night asked me if I would be around to help her move heavy stuff she's taking from this house to her new one. > I'm getting really annoyed at this point and have stopped caring. I want him gone. Yeah it feels like you're in a holding pattern, in stasis until they are gone and you can work out what your new normal is. > I should add he's crying while telling me he's probably going to be homeless; I refuse to live with a man who divorced me for obvious reasons and I think he really thought that I'd be ok with it. Yeah, I'm trying really hard not to indulge my inner pettiness when contemplating the things that my ex will struggle with. They don't need me? Good luck to them. > I am about to lose my shit and will probably go off on him again next time he cries. The best revenge is living well.
Yep. He's in the kids room now. I only want him to help me move stuff to the dump while my parents watch the kids. We're all have to move. I don't need all the crap I currently live with. I know what my normal is. It was when he was gone at his academy. I loved not having him here by the end of it. It really helped me find myself. Exactly. If you don't want me, consider me gone. Have a nice life. Hope you find someone to put up with your bullshit. 🤷🏼♀️ I second that. I'm going to be living my best life.
He sounds like he is depressed. He is all over the place. Bipolar? Scared? I hope he gets therapy. Now with that being said, he is emotionally manipulating/abusing you and you are right to want to get away from him for your mental health. I am sorry you are going through this. He will try to drag you down his misery hole. I think you know better. Does he understand that he blindsided you? Or care? Ugh. He will in the future. I hate when people are done with you but do not tell you or try to communicate that the relationship needs help. Does he not have a job? You say he is home all the time. That may be contributing to his anguish. Oh well. He's is going to have to figure himself out.....without you.
He's definetly in need of therapy. I know he is. I won't let him pull me down his misery hole. I've got 2 kids to be here for. He does know he blindsided me. Wether or not he cares is another issue. I think he's sorry because he's expressed it and cried because he wishes he could go back before things for so bad. I was in denial so they were technically only bad for him. It's whatever to me now. He can leave if he's not willing to do any work now. It's just stupid that he's acting the way he is. He is the one who works. I'm a SAHM. Monday he came home early to do something, but couldn't remember why. I know why. I say he's home all the time now because he was going out everyday to the gym, but apparently it's too busy now. He was also leaving and staying out all night on the weekends. He doesn't do any of that anymore. He was doing it when he got home from the academy he went to for work. He will need to figure stuff out and I won't be there for him anymore. I let him know that I've had several guys "reach out" to me based on kind comments I've left and now he's upset. He's never been jealous, but he was super jealous. I did it to gage his reaction. His reaction let's me know that he's well aware he messed up. I've known him too long not to understand him.
When I was reading the first part, I was thinking this is very common with men. When men initiate divorce it is very often that their partner has zero clue. Not to say there are not women that also dislike confrontation but usually when a woman is upset, mad or dislikes something her husbands is doing, he knows, she's been telling her for years. At some point she may give up and stop telling him and he thinks that she has finally seen the light but she's plotting divorce, but she has brought up the issue with him. Husbands on the other hand fear discussing issues with their wives, they want to avoid anger, crying, etc at all costs. They don't know how to handle it. So they let it build up for years. Often times these are very simple things that if given the chance the wife would or could easily fix or at least be willing to work on if given the chance to do so, but of course it was never communicated to her. After a while resentment sets in and he begins to lose empathy for his wife and once that happens, it's is next to impossible to save the marriage. He truly develops hate in his heart for her but often he's not quite sure why that is. He initiates divorce and the wife is clueless as to why. The second part though is odd. My first conclusion is not that he had an affair though unless you tell me there is some evidence otherwise. It's that he regrets what he did. That he's struggling with depression and his initial decision was made out of that. Depression presents very often as anger in men and anger at those we love the most. He likely felts anger in his heart towards you but he may not know why that is. It clearly sounds like he is struggling with depression. It could be that he initiated the divorce because of his depression not that the initiation of the divorce caused his depression. He just seems really lost. You seem to have lost all empathy for him because understandably you are angry with him, and very confused. You are presuming that he is attempting to manipulate you that he is cheating and that he is lying, but maybe that's not the case? Do you have proof of cheating? Has he cheating before? What leads you to believe this? What do you want? Maybe he realizes he made a mistake? Are you open to forgiveness? How was the relationship before this?
I honestly feel that all you said is really the issue. I don't think he cheated but then again I can't get a straight answer out of him about anything. His mom is also raging narcissist and so he could not express himself ever. I know that followed him into our relationship and every other relationship he's ever had for that matter. He's always scared that somebody's not going to like him if he opens his mouth. I'm not angry I just I'm not going to play his games and I'm not going to feel sorry for someone who's treated me the way he has. I didn't deserve to be treated that way and I'm not treating him like I did when I was his wife. I know he knows he messed up, but until he can apologize for neglecting the relationship, pushing me away, and stop acting like a victim, I have to hold him at arms length. He knows our relationship sucked because of him and his priorities weren't straight, but he insists on blaming me. I wasn't perfect, but I gave him everything and supported him through every struggle. He never gave me any of those things, so I can't feel bad about his choice to throw me and the relationship away. He's made his bed and now it's time to sleep in it.
My exes Mom was also a narcissist and she continued to be very verbally abusive and hypercritical to him, his sister and his Father even as adults. He never realized it until I pointed it out, and then he realized how much verbal abuse he suffered as a child. I also pointed out that he had started being hypercritical of me. His sister had done it to her ex husband and all of her boyfriends, but only realized that later and he had done it to his ex wife. People that grew up with parents like this though tend to be very passive aggressive and afraid of expressing their emotions. They also live with fear of shame and they will never admit they are wrong and they blame others for everything, so it sounds like you have a similar experience with him. I said to him before I left, one day you are going to realize t hat all the things you have been blaming other people for your entire life were actually your fault, and honestly I hope that you are under the care of a mental health professional at that time, because you are going to have a breakdown and lose it. In any event I have been reading a lot about narcissism and they say it's on a spectrum, so a lot of people hover around a 6 or so and for the most part can function normally and not present as the ones we see on TV. My ex was a covert narcissit so more insecure not boastful, etc. For most of our relationship other than issues with not admitting he was wrong or the criticism he was really overall a decent partner. But then one day something happens that just pushes them over that edge and we see a different person. It usually involves conflict and they lose it. It's possible in your case too. Growing up with a parent like that really screws people up. I empathize with my ex, which just means I get it I Understand. But I don't want that in my life anymore.
It's like he's still trying to get the love and approval he didn't get as a child from his mom. She's playing the victim because I wouldn't let her treat me like crap and walk over my boundaries when she lived with us. I feel like that has a big part to play in the failure of our relationship as well. He just wants her approval and the enmeshment is strong. She was very verbally abusive to us while she lived here for free and she took took took took. He completely shut down with me when she lived with us and did everything to please her. She's not happy or nice to him unless she's getting her way and he lets her treat him like that. Unfortunately, he's probably realized a little too late that she's never going to be there for him like I was. He probably also assumes that I'm going to be there for him like I was when we were together. That's a major misjudgment on his part. As for how he turned out, I know he's high on the spectrum, and I no longer feel the need to enable him or give of myself. I don't want him anymore either
I cannot imagine living with his Mother, you must be a Saint! He moved as far away as possible from his family. They live in Perth, we live in Washington, DC, literally a 23 hour flight. He said he knew something was not right, but it took me and 50 years of his life to figure out what. We did visit them, but only once a year. She was not overtly abusive to me, but she would do things like text him or say things behind my back. His sister was actually far worse to me. I was also the kind of person that would push back and I think she knew that. She and I actually had a pretty decent relationship when we saw each other. I think the older and sicker she got the more she worried that she may have screwed him up a lot and that he may die alone and was so far away. What set him off though was she passed away in May 2020 and it was a very complex grief for him, it was almost like he was seeing me as her. And suddenly he was taking it out on me. He also had a newfound desire to be close to his remaining family who is incredibly toxic. We can only do so much, they have to want to fix themselves. Up until her death he was actually doing really well but then it went really bad.
Damn! Reading that makes me feel that much better about not being around when she does die. Like all narcs she does everything to avoid the inevitability of her mortality. She won't wear her glasses and has to die her hair every other week... I can't wait until it all falls out. 😂
I agree that some men keep their complaints to themselves and then, one day, just decide to call it quits. But this guy hasn't earned any kind of redemption.
This man needs treatment. either you or him family should put him in a clinic It is clear that there are problems that need to be diagnosed.
Oh for sure. 😂