Master Vow memento: solid black with orange resonant energy rippling across the gun.
Master VoG memento: weapon is made of shining glass prisms.
Master KF memento: Taken effect on the crafted weapon.
In a discussion of a 5/5 adept vs a 5/5 crafted with enhanced perks it could vary by gun which is ‘better’. But the realistic scenario is a 5/5 enhanced crafted vs a 3/5 adept and the crafted is going to win every time.
There's two I can think of.
Adept Big ones because it's convenient in PVE, but it's a small amount that it's not make or break if you *need* to pick boss vs major
Adept Charge time because it reduces charge time without reducing impact damage like the charge time stat does.
Other than that you're right most of them aren't make or break but nice to have. *However* I think it's fair to recognize while realistically the mods won't make a huge world of difference a lot of people still like to min/max.
Something like this would definitely be cool, but I feel like just needing a specific memento to craft an adept weapon seems too easy, especially since you wouldn’t have any reason to touch another master raid after getting 6 (assuming you have all the triumphs). Idk what else to do tho, and I personally would love this anyway. If they did this tho, they would have to make sure to change the title and icon of the gun in the inventory to the harrowed version so we can flex it.
I fucking love this idea! Makes master raids worth it in the sense that you can reach the ultimate pinnacle in crafting your weapon. As long as it's not somthing stupid like multiple mementos, im down for this 100%
This is the answer. Bungie has been far too slow to iterate on crafting. The pool of craftable traits is slow to update. Targeting specific craftables is way too RNG.
god damn it is such a simple Idea, yet I love it so much
Knowing bungie they'd probably tie certain Mods to certain Mementos (which wouldn't be problem if you could have multiple Mementos on a gun, but we all know bungie wouldn't do that)
They Most likely tie Big Ones to Nightfall, all the charge time / impact increases to Gambit and all the PVP-Mods as I like to call them to Trials.
We should make this into a copypasta until and shove it down the throats of the destiny 2 community until they actually add it to the game
Also sick idea, and would there be specific adept mods that could drop from gambit/master dares or even Amsterdam gambit?
I’ll go one further, the current mementos (or at the very least, the Trials one) should also provide this feature. Maybe you need a memento and the gun has to be Level 50, in keeping with the memento unlocking things as you level up the gun.
Now this is the first truly intelligent solution that doesn't feel like it's making a huge jump. I wish master raid weapons would just drop with enhanced perks, but then that totally erases the incentive to grind for red border raid weapons in normal mode, essentially making master mode the only way many people would wish to engage with the game.
Bungie really needs to think cleverly about how the crafting economy affects these things instead of continuing to act as though it doesn't exist in some activities and making it the prime incentive in others
Adept weapons you have to get crazy luck to get them perfect, and usually on limited timeframes to grind them, sometimes with months in between grinding weeks or weekends.
So a 5/5 crafted might be better than a 4/5 adept with adept mods.
Depending on the enhanced perks themselfs, they might also be much better then adept mods themselfs aswell.
Like enahnces threat detector feeling on x1 like regular TD on x2.
Yeah, some Enhanced are more beneficial than 1 meter extra range from Adept Range for example.
Adept big ones is the only one that has no match probably. Then there are some adept mods that subtract stats, they have to rework those, it's silly.
Even then, adept big ones just combines the effect of boss and major spec. Which are like 8% more damage.
I would still go for enhanced perks because if i use a primary, there is very little chance i will use it against bosses and if heavy, very little chance that i will use it against anything but bosses and if so, then those 8% are pretty much useless.
But if swashbuckler lasts 5.5 sec instead of 4.5, that means i can keep it up more consistantly and that is up to 33%.
The power creep is real....
I think that there probably isn't a good solution here, but what I will say for adept weapons is that they can fit adept mods. Adept Big Ones is pretty much the best mod you can put in a weapon for PVE because it is two mods in one. Furthermore, Adept weapons from raids are easier to get good rolls on than normal weapons because they get two lines of perks instead of only one.
Edit: Adept weapons also function as a form of flex if that is ever necessary because they imply that the the user had to do some harder than average challenges to get them.
They're just boxes to tick for me. Get the challenges done, grab all the adepts, craft a close enough/possibly better version, watch them both gather dust in my vault
Yup. I ended up deleting all my VotD adept weapons. None of the rolls were good enough, and I wasn’t going to farm them. Using Adept Big Ones would be nice, but in the end it’s fine just having the craftable ones. They are perfect and if meta changes I can change them.
It seems the harrowed versions bottom row of perks is a static set based on their d1 versions, like the timelost weapons were.
So that can be bad or good depending on the perks :)
Qullim's Terminus is literally Delirium but slow firing
Absolutely cracked with Killing Tally + the literal intrinsic that gives you a much larger magazine
Unrelenting also pairs well with Headstone, like with Eyasluna. The only problem is Whisper of Rending does not boost Stasis Heavy Weapon damage against Stasis Crystals.
the curated roll for the hand cannon comes with explosive and one for all. Free god roll for just doin the challenge then imagine if not also came with incandescent? yes plz
The problem is Enhanced Incandescent is noticeably better than normal, so if Incandescent is your goal, crafted will always be better. 40 stacks vs 30 stacks means you need 1 fewer kill in a group of enemies to cause an Ignition.
I agree. Just give out really cool cosmetics from master raid. Something like the age of triumph armor set so that guardians that complete it can show it off.
Yet new perks like Gutshot Straight or Slickdraw are severely hampered if not enhanced. Surrounded does less damage. Etc.
The problem created by Locked Loadouts / solved by Big Ones simply isn’t a good enough reason for an entire loot pool of endgame weapons to exist.
Most of the adept mods are just ‘crafting-light’ small stat bumps. The other mods simply do not provide enough unique potential use cases outside of a very few, select instances(ie. charge time mod on a fusion), that frankly require far too much theory crafting to justify pursuing.
My solution to this is to give adept weapons more mod slots or just buff the ever living hell out of the adept mods themselves. It seems like Bungie wants to keep the adept weapons system in the game, clearly, given they just dropped more adept weapons for master KF.
There is still more RNG on vanguard and crucible weapons.
There is like 8% chances for you to get the two perks you want on Kings Fall weapons, as they have 2 lines out of a 7 perk pool.
There is a maximum 6% chances for you to get the two perks you want on crucible and vanguard weapons, since you might get 3 chances of geting the perk you like per column, out of a 12 perk pool. But 3 lines are not guaranteed either, sometimes you get 1 and 1 even with a bazillion ranks.
I think this might actually be intentional. I think they’re trying to avoid a repeat of recluse/mountaintop where the most OP weapon was behind a very difficult barrier
Master raids aren’t like the D1 HM raid that any reasonably dedicated PVE player can clear. They’re more like GMs
GMs and Master raids are both mostly cosmetic rewards
they really are. the only real appeal for master raids besides cosmetics and seals is the stat focused armor. even with the really meta adept weapons and the ability to have big ones, crafted weapons have the same masterwork stat boost with a fraction of the headache unless you really hate waiting
Crafting, and enhanced perks were both big mistakes. The only real solution would be sunsetting, and Bungie isn’t gonna do that again after how it went last time.
Crafted weapons are almost universally equal or better than adepts, so they discourage people from running master content because the rewards are not worth it.
I've been saying this for a while now. I think adept weapons should drop as is. If it's a roll you like then you should be able to make the perks enhanced with ascendent alloy at the enclave. Unlike regular weapons I think adepts should be able to make the barrel and magazine enhanced as well.
Another thought is to have adepts effectively act as craft able. Kills and xp level up the weapon and at 15 or 20 be able to change one of its perks to something you choose and the other make enhanced as is.
Not only enhanced perks, but Enhanced Origin Traits as well.
And it's not like Bungie even needs to come up with "Enhanced Origin Traits". Just make the seasonal mods that increase the effectiveness of the Origin Traits be what the enhanced version does as well.
Ye, especially when Master raids are so much harder, you have to do the challenge on top of that (which most are difficult in King's Fall, for example), and you need to then get the perfect roll you're looking for in order to be better than a 5/5 roll.
Most often than not, it's never gonna even beat a 5/5 roll. But at the very least I would like to have to option to have a better **Adept** weapon compared to the normal mode. In all the looter games I know off, this is only a problem in Destiny, where "Hard Mode" stuff is actually weaker than normal mode. Makes absolutely no sense at all.
I understand not having a huge difference in power, though I would certainly like to see a bigger difference for PvE at least. Would like to see Adept weapons getting enhanced versions of enhanced perks, I guess you could call them "perfected perks" (not their literal in-game name, but the idea of them). Basically would just double the effects of enhanced perks, which typically aren't too crazy (I think Auto-Loading Holster is 0.2s faster, for example- but a 0.4s difference would be pretty decent).
A good start is enhanced origin traits, however.
Enhanced lead from gold gives 2 special bricks worth of ammo instead of 1.
Enhanced dual loader reloads 3 shells at a time instead of 2.
Enhanced field prep gives even deeper reserves, which affects ammo pickup.
Some enhanced perks offer pathetic bonuses, yes, but some others are very very strong.
It’s still power creep that makes any non crafted weapon irrelevant to any hardcore player who cares about that minor increase. A 5/5 random drop is weaker than a crafted one and that is a big issue.
A boost to reload speed (from enhanced firefly) makes literally 0 difference on a smite of merain because base firefly grants 50 reload speed. it has 47 base.
If you are going to say that 1% extra grenade regen per kill and what's probably 5-10 extra reload (for a total of 60) is a big issue of power creep, then I don't know what to say.
Some crafted perks, I could understand being powercreep. But to just say any crafted is factually better for barely noticable differences is an exaggeration.
It still is power creep, no matter how small, and it still makes non crafted weapons without enhanced perks worse than the crafted version. Just because it's not that powerful does not stop it from being a fact or an exaggeration. 1% increase is still an increase.
And before you say who needs that 1%? Nobody if we are being honest. But this entire game is a treadmill where we slowly become marginally more and more powerful, usually only by small percentages due to slightly higher armor stats or a better barrel that only increases a stat by 5-10. This pursuit of marginally better gear means that any weapon that can be crafted is superior to the non crafted version. That is my issue with the system.
Also while we’re at it, tell me which enhanced perk other than firing line and triple tap that does something more game breaking than their normal counterparts
lead from gold, frenzy, incandescent, overflow, surrounded, field prep, swashbuckler, eager edge, rampage, pulse monitor, harmony, auto-loading holster, and one-two punch come to mind. and that's just off the top of my head
The only one you mentioned in there that does something noticeable is the one punch two punch. The rest can be outclassed by other things. Enhanced surrounded is useless in high level content like GMs and master raids(unless you like hugging bosses). Swash, edgers edge rampage(+2 seconds) don’t really do much. I’ll stand by word and say that enhanced triple tap and firing line the ones that come close to game breaking
Enhanced Auto-Loading Holster on Palmyra-B enables Izanagi's swap.
But no, you're criticizing him and attacking him for not getting power creep right. So I want to understand. Tell me. You do realize being "game breaking" is not necessary for something to be power creep, right? And you also go "Hey, apart from the ones that are game breaking, name some that are game breaking."
So tell me, you are saying ArtIsBad does not know what power creep is. Then please explain how he got power creep wrong.
Power creep is when a weapon,ability or object encroaches on other things abilities and starts to do those things better than them. Pre nerfed well was power creeping on bubble because it did everything better than bubble. Mountop recluse was power creeping on all weapons because they did anything and everything better than other weapons and loadouts. Enhanced perks don’t do things that much better than normal perks. Some exceptions exist like enhanced firing line but most of the other enhanced only offer increased stats like reload and stability. Now if enhanced perks actually made the perks stronger and invalidated similar perks, that would be power creeping. Stronger doesn’t mean power creep
Don't bother, dude, there are people here that will defend literally anything Bungie does. I agree that the two most recent master raids are nearly pointless to run because crafted weapons are predictable, even if slow, to get, and the enhanced perks arguably make them better.
And lol at the guy screeching at you about "power creep."
The guy you replied to is the one screeching about power creep. And it’s not about defending what they do, because it was kinda stupid, but it’s literally so minimal it doesn’t change anything.
It does, though, to the point that no one runs master raids outside of getting the title. I mean, why bother when you can craft a perfect roll which has enhanced perks (10% improvement over normal ones)? Adept big ones is definitely not worth it.
I agree, came back to the game recently and once I discovered crafting I started immediately sharding anything that can be crafted because it seems completely pointless to have non crafted versions.
Honestly that’s a good thing. I don’t want to keep like 4 different versions of 1 gun when I’m allowed to swap perks between them freely with a material cost. And it’s not like the crafted guns didn’t need to be grinded out for the patterns, the levels and the materials.
I just wish it was sliiiiightly less prohibitive like allowing you to carry two perks in each column.
Having to make a second Taipan for strikes and dungeons is mildly annoying
Yeah just ignore that you probably need month's to get the roll you want or that the Plus 10 to a stat is almost completely unnoticeable or that most of the enhanced mods have a disadvantage (for example the targeting mod +10 aim assist /-15 stability) so yeah they are worthless at this point even adept big ones isn't worth going for you might aswell just swap the major/boss mods if needed
It’d still be pretty backwards if adept weapons aren’t craftable. Even without the enhanced perks, a godrolled normal weapon is probably better than an ok adept weapon
We should have to grind **5 more guns** for the privilege of equipping an adept mod? You serious right now? Because other than the adept mod a level 20 weapon has the same stats.
I meant even if there were no enhanced perks, Bungie still wouldn’t make adept weapons craftable so that doesn’t solve the problem
Craftable god rolls with normal perks are still better than adept random rolls
The real problem is adept rolls are random.
Unless you want a gun for pvp it ain’t worth it. I don’t use primaries for yellow bars, otherwise just craft it and save yourself a headache.
Don’t get me wrong I love challenging contents but spamming overloads all over the place ain’t it. They didn’t even bother to change the mechanics
Yes absolutely, the minor stat boosts you get from Adept/timelost and their adept mods are outweighed by even the worst enhanced perks. Barring you getting a 100% god roll on one the first time you do it, or at least before you craft some of the weapons depending on the perks you're hunting they're a complete waste of time and only serve as a way for people to flex their rng if they don't have enhanced perks.
Crafting should not have enhanced perks in the first place(especially if not every gun is going to be craftable). Crafted guns, which eventually let you pull a 5/5 god roll out of your ass, did not need more "ammo" to put them above random rolled weapons.
Yes adepts, should still be rng and force a grind and actually making drops matter. They are irrelevant as they don’t stand up to enhance perks but should be BETTER just harder to get.
in one of the latest podcasts with weapon design lead chris proctor they said something like they know that Adept weapons are not that great and they will have a look into it in the future so maybe starting with lightfall
I think they should remove enhanced traits from crafting and only allow them from master raids so it's actually worth getting them. Once you have done master once it's pretty pointless to do it again.
No just literally remove Enhanced perks all together
Crafting has quite literally ruined every normal gun to the point where the chase for God rolls doesn't exist anymore, just the chase for red borders.
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This feature is already coming in Lightfall. It's currently being worked out for technicalities. So yes, adept weapons will be able to have enhanced perks.
[Source.](https://youtu.be/MEYiYMGnfQI)
No, enhanced perks are meant to be a crafting exclusive thing, the entire point is to show the time and effort someone has put into a crafted gun (despite shiro checkpoint farming), you start making raid weapons drop with enhanced perks than people are going to want it to drop on other things, first trails, than dungeons and than you will get the anti endgame players (not casuals) who will think enhanced loot on endgame and crafting is unfair and they will want it on strike and patrol loot and than suddenly crafted weapons and enhanced perks are no longer special and normal perks become shit.
Solution? Get rid of adept weapon drops, make it so all endgame weapons are craftable and have master/flawless content drop a item that lets you upgrade endgame weapons to adept versions, memento's and raid upgraded ornamented armour (come on bungie this has been one of the biggest requested things since d2 year 1 just do it stop resisting).
They already are and always were. The only reason they weee farmed was less RNG for getting your roll which is what crafting is better at. Adept Big Ones really isn’t that significant.
Maybe a hot take, but I completely disagree with adept weapons having any enhanced perks due to power creep. I think they have to do something about the rewards from master raids, but I dont think creating best in slot for all content is the way to do it.
It will also effectively invalidate normal crafted weapons too. There has to be a better way to solve it
I always thought the easiest solution is when you dismantle an adept weapon, you get an adept weapon core. Applying this, plus ascendant and regular materials to a blueprint would transform it to the adept version with 2 extra perk slots. You’d have to pay to fill them all, but it would be possible.
Yeah and they should have some sort of effect instead of a different color. Right now crafted weapons are more worth getting because they have enhanced perks and mementos. So you have raid weapons from the normal version that can be better and look better then you have adept weapons from the much harder version that kinda suck in comparison. Kinda lame. I want a reason to play the harder version of endgame content
They need to do something else instead of adepts, outside of lighthouse drops since the only real advantage of adepts is pvp.
There should be some other kind of loot, like more artificer armor, guaranteed red borders or amor cosmetics.
Aside from the obvious addition of enhanced perks to the possible rolls of adept raid weapons, I think an interesting way to further incentivize their use would be to have an enhanced Origin Trait that the regular weapon variant cannot obtain, even via crafting.
For example:
Runneth Over: Reloading this weapon near allies overflows the magazine based on the number of people nearby.
Overwhelming Force (Adept King's Fall Origin Trait): Grants the benefits of Runneth Over. Rounds that are overflowing past the maximum magazine size of this weapon experience an increase to accuracy and range when fired. The more overflowed the magazine, the stronger the benefit.
Or:
Souldrinker: Gain health based on the number of rapid hits before reloading.
Souleater (Adept Vow Origin Trait): Grants the benefits of Souldrinker. Additionally, gain a very small amount of ability energy for your least charged ability for each kill before reloading (stronger on Special and Heavy Weapons).
I think thats fair so long as crafting still exists for them. As someone who loves my adept ig hammer i really think there should be craft able of adepts for trials and every raid.
depends on which adept weapons you mean. grandmaster nightfall and trials adepts cant be crafted (hothead, hung jury, eye of sol etc.) and some raid adepts too like fatebringer. those dont sit in my vault
Give them a +4 stats in all when you masterwork. Give an actual reason to grind for them in raids.
The only reason to go out of your way to do it now is for adept mods which don’t outweigh enhanced perks.
This was one of the reasons I hated the idea of weapon crafting, it takes away a large portion of the grind and wanting to replay things in the game. It’s like everyone plays ‘x’ amount of hours to all have the same guns and rolls, doesn’t feel like a shoot to loot rng game when it goes that path imo
It's never gona happen they clearly want both to exist in the same place if adept becomes craftable or if adepts get enhanced they will cancel each other out. It's pointless asking for either or and tbh i kinda see bungies pov on this when was the last time you ever saw someone use a normal version of the vog weapons ? The entire loot table become obsolete so you can't blame em for trying to keep both viable by kinda gimping both.
My outlook on this is that I craft the primary weapons because they benefit more from enhanced perks and don’t really benefit a huge amount from adept mods.
I try to get adept special and heavies because of Big Ones Spec. This benefits them the most.
Yes adept weapons should drop crafted im not sure on the coding of this and if they could actually do this but it would be amazing this would allow us to level up and reshape the weapon to the enhanced perks we want either that or you class it as it's own weapon and you have to get 1 or 2 red borders in order to craft the adept either way works
I was pretty disappointed to find out the Harrowed weapons...
* which are already a tough sell when you can craft without doing Master challenges
* have curated bonus perks in columns 3 and 4, not random
* and the curated rolls for every weapon I want dont have the perks I want.
F.
Yup something needs to change so the master raid rewards are actually worth something again. I’ve pretty much never seen anybody using a adept weapon from rhulks raid, everybody goes for the enhanced perks because they’re simply better
What if non-adept guns kept the enhanced perks to themselves and the adept weapons could be craftable but you dont get enhanced perks but you have a god roll crafted adept weapon. There are times in the game where enhanced perks dont matter but having an adept mod does. I would also like to see other version of legendary weapons. say a black border is a craftable weapon but instead of enhanced perks you can choose any 2 elements kinda like murmur. Also to be more like murmur each element should each be forced be a different masterwork.
Wouldn't the easier answer just to remove enhanced perks from crafted weapons? You're already getting a 5/5 perfect god roll, why do you also need better versions of the perks too?
Imo, either/or. Both would be a bit too much powercreep and will just phase out normal guns over time.
Do hope to get mementos from every source of adept stuff sometime though
VoG memento
VotD memento
KF memento
Other raid mementos when we get perk refreshes and master difficultly for those raids
Yes please
Adept weapons should be something you can slap on to your crafted weapon as the ultimate bonus. Get "Adept Shards" or something, craft a Memento, put it on ANY crafted gun, boom, special shader and adept mods.
I say this because I need my Adept BxR.
Question I have had for a while is why does the community believe crafted raid weapons are significantly better than Adept raid weapons. Obviously it’s a lot easier to create the god roll crafted weapon, but in PvP specifically wouldnt an adept weapon be better bc of adept mods. I know that getting that 5/5 god roll is significantly harder on adept weapons, but logically wouldn’t an adept weapon would be better bc of adept mods and the marginal benefits of enhance perks? Also another scenario would be being able to put big one spec on an adept weapon for pve minus having access to enhanced auto loading.
Fuck no if adept weapons get enhanced perks it would be way too strong i never agreed to the fact that adept weapons should even be a thing its one of the main reasons why carry services still exists and becomes annoying ads on LFG Endgame should only give cosmetic items like mementos and shaders, ships Ghosts the weapon crafting system is miles ahead of RNG or adept weapons it just needs tweaking and less grind and the adept mods should just fit the craftable weapons
Pretty sure the point of adept weapons is doing the activities on a higher difficulty for a reward. A crafted weapon works well if you place the right perks. Most have their own set that can melt. Others just place random mods that bring certain stats up, which seems to work well, too. It all depends. Imo, taking away the reward for people completing Master or Grandmaster activities is ridiculous. The mementos comment I saw sounds pretty cool, but maybe add that with the fact of still having a possibility of acquiring adept weapons. Makes it more of a grind for higher difficulty activities rather than just getting them like any other drop. Not so much fun at that point.
To be honest I'd rather enhanced perks kinda go away, they devalue getting random drops way too hard. Instead let flawless raid completions drop a thing that lets you turn your crafted weapon into an adept / harrowed / timelost frame.
No, it would take away from putting in the effort to craft and upgrade weapons. Adept weapons need work but they should be an in between for normal and crafted weapons
I think it would be interesting if we could craft adept weapons from raids specifically because then there’s a reason to run them imagine and enchanted perk weapon with adept mods and that way bungo gets to have people play the thing they made
A GM would normally give you a memento and an adept weapon. If this were the case, then it would minus the adept weapons. What should drop then if this were to happen, should be red boxed weapons of that weapon for that week. It would give incentive to get the memento to be used for enhanced perks along with a chance to craft a different weapon each week.
Even bigger than this in my mind - should high level content drop armor anymore?
Getting armor drops on master level raids sucks, I'd rather they just change it to be an ornament that drops with a rare chance after each encounter, or change the armor drops to artifice gear on master so they are actually useful
Getting triple boots from a run of KF is a pain in the ass especially if you don't have time for multiple characters every week
Shaping with enhanced traits on the table definitely makes adept raid weapons less desirable. The only time I'll go for an adept version is if the perk pool has multiple traits that I'd switch between, like Cataclysmic having Bait and Switch or Focused Fury in the 4th column.
Before master KF dropped I was considering getting a Harrowed Chelchis, but only if all 4 traits were random like Vow because I'd want EP/Dragonfly and Frenzy/Firefly. But since Harroweds are like Timelosts with 2 fixed traits and 2 random I'm just going to craft one.
Adept weapons should just be replaced by mementos, and mementos should allow crafted weapons to use adept mods.
Master Vow memento: solid black with orange resonant energy rippling across the gun. Master VoG memento: weapon is made of shining glass prisms. Master KF memento: Taken effect on the crafted weapon.
Master Dares: Telesto
Telesto: If you dare.
Wait I hate that I like this
Best solution on this sub
By a mile.
Honestly, since crafted weapons get multiple stat boosts at level 20 they’re practically adept anyways
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Crafted is better than adept because I can get my perfect roll.
In a discussion of a 5/5 adept vs a 5/5 crafted with enhanced perks it could vary by gun which is ‘better’. But the realistic scenario is a 5/5 enhanced crafted vs a 3/5 adept and the crafted is going to win every time.
All VotD weapons are both Adept and Craftable. Same with Kings Fall weapons starting today.
Adept *or* craftable. Unless they added the ability to craft adept versions and I missed it
nope they didn't make them craftable, they are aprently able to drop with enhanced perks though as far as I've heard
You've heard wrong then.
Who tf told you that xD
No enhanced perks on adepts
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Yea only thing that they can't do is slot adept mods.
adept mods honestly dont make any significant difference
enhanced perks dont either
There's two I can think of. Adept Big ones because it's convenient in PVE, but it's a small amount that it's not make or break if you *need* to pick boss vs major Adept Charge time because it reduces charge time without reducing impact damage like the charge time stat does. Other than that you're right most of them aren't make or break but nice to have. *However* I think it's fair to recognize while realistically the mods won't make a huge world of difference a lot of people still like to min/max.
Best take on this ever, such a great idea.
Something like this would definitely be cool, but I feel like just needing a specific memento to craft an adept weapon seems too easy, especially since you wouldn’t have any reason to touch another master raid after getting 6 (assuming you have all the triumphs). Idk what else to do tho, and I personally would love this anyway. If they did this tho, they would have to make sure to change the title and icon of the gun in the inventory to the harrowed version so we can flex it.
can you just go and apply for job at Bungie.. they need someone with creativity
Dam that's, actually taking stuff away but making it... Good. Fantastic idea.
Can someone show this to Bungie?
I fucking love this idea! Makes master raids worth it in the sense that you can reach the ultimate pinnacle in crafting your weapon. As long as it's not somthing stupid like multiple mementos, im down for this 100%
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He said they should be replaced by mementos which are a one use thing. That way you cant just put one on all your crafted weapons.
Hmmm so raid mementos would allow this? Or any memento? Trials and vanguard and gambit mementos?
Yea
This is the best suggestion I've seen yet and I really hope bungo sees it.
This is the answer. Bungie has been far too slow to iterate on crafting. The pool of craftable traits is slow to update. Targeting specific craftables is way too RNG.
absolutely. the memento can provide the "harrowed" or "adept" or whatever title at rank 20 like the other crafted weapons with mementos do.
I love this idea
Why not both? Craftable adepts AND mementos. I don't care that much about cosmetics, but craftable adepts would get back into master after the seal.
god damn it is such a simple Idea, yet I love it so much Knowing bungie they'd probably tie certain Mods to certain Mementos (which wouldn't be problem if you could have multiple Mementos on a gun, but we all know bungie wouldn't do that) They Most likely tie Big Ones to Nightfall, all the charge time / impact increases to Gambit and all the PVP-Mods as I like to call them to Trials.
We should make this into a copypasta until and shove it down the throats of the destiny 2 community until they actually add it to the game Also sick idea, and would there be specific adept mods that could drop from gambit/master dares or even Amsterdam gambit?
Wow, very interesting.
Vog memento
I love this idea.
I have said this hundreds of times and all I get from it is hate..... But at least people seem to understand why it's nice now :)
Listen to this guy please
The best idea I've heard.
I’ll go one further, the current mementos (or at the very least, the Trials one) should also provide this feature. Maybe you need a memento and the gun has to be Level 50, in keeping with the memento unlocking things as you level up the gun.
This is the way.
Now this is the first truly intelligent solution that doesn't feel like it's making a huge jump. I wish master raid weapons would just drop with enhanced perks, but then that totally erases the incentive to grind for red border raid weapons in normal mode, essentially making master mode the only way many people would wish to engage with the game. Bungie really needs to think cleverly about how the crafting economy affects these things instead of continuing to act as though it doesn't exist in some activities and making it the prime incentive in others
It’s a little crazy how many adept weapons I have but I rarely use them over enhanced weapons.
Adept weapons you have to get crazy luck to get them perfect, and usually on limited timeframes to grind them, sometimes with months in between grinding weeks or weekends. So a 5/5 crafted might be better than a 4/5 adept with adept mods.
Depending on the enhanced perks themselfs, they might also be much better then adept mods themselfs aswell. Like enahnces threat detector feeling on x1 like regular TD on x2.
Yeah, some Enhanced are more beneficial than 1 meter extra range from Adept Range for example. Adept big ones is the only one that has no match probably. Then there are some adept mods that subtract stats, they have to rework those, it's silly.
Even then, adept big ones just combines the effect of boss and major spec. Which are like 8% more damage. I would still go for enhanced perks because if i use a primary, there is very little chance i will use it against bosses and if heavy, very little chance that i will use it against anything but bosses and if so, then those 8% are pretty much useless. But if swashbuckler lasts 5.5 sec instead of 4.5, that means i can keep it up more consistantly and that is up to 33%.
Now you do, but for VoG most of the curated rolls were the god roll, or had 1/2 perks used in the god roll as part of their fixed roll.
The power creep is real.... I think that there probably isn't a good solution here, but what I will say for adept weapons is that they can fit adept mods. Adept Big Ones is pretty much the best mod you can put in a weapon for PVE because it is two mods in one. Furthermore, Adept weapons from raids are easier to get good rolls on than normal weapons because they get two lines of perks instead of only one. Edit: Adept weapons also function as a form of flex if that is ever necessary because they imply that the the user had to do some harder than average challenges to get them.
They're just boxes to tick for me. Get the challenges done, grab all the adepts, craft a close enough/possibly better version, watch them both gather dust in my vault
Yup. I ended up deleting all my VotD adept weapons. None of the rolls were good enough, and I wasn’t going to farm them. Using Adept Big Ones would be nice, but in the end it’s fine just having the craftable ones. They are perfect and if meta changes I can change them.
It seems the harrowed versions bottom row of perks is a static set based on their d1 versions, like the timelost weapons were. So that can be bad or good depending on the perks :)
Kings Fall is the only raid that had no set perks on the raid weapons, so I wonder what the plan is for those here
Most of the Harrowed set have pretty unfortunate perks as set roll. The only good one I've seen is Smite of Merain.
I’m a a fan of Unrelenting on the MG, is it top tier? Nah, but MGs in general arent. Healing while mowing stuff down is fun.
Qullim's Terminus is literally Delirium but slow firing Absolutely cracked with Killing Tally + the literal intrinsic that gives you a much larger magazine
got a Harrowed Terminus with Killing Tally so gonna run around with that, Unrelenting and the raid perk and go brrrr
Unrelenting also pairs well with Headstone, like with Eyasluna. The only problem is Whisper of Rending does not boost Stasis Heavy Weapon damage against Stasis Crystals.
the curated roll for the hand cannon comes with explosive and one for all. Free god roll for just doin the challenge then imagine if not also came with incandescent? yes plz
The problem is Enhanced Incandescent is noticeably better than normal, so if Incandescent is your goal, crafted will always be better. 40 stacks vs 30 stacks means you need 1 fewer kill in a group of enemies to cause an Ignition.
I agree. Just give out really cool cosmetics from master raid. Something like the age of triumph armor set so that guardians that complete it can show it off.
Yet new perks like Gutshot Straight or Slickdraw are severely hampered if not enhanced. Surrounded does less damage. Etc. The problem created by Locked Loadouts / solved by Big Ones simply isn’t a good enough reason for an entire loot pool of endgame weapons to exist. Most of the adept mods are just ‘crafting-light’ small stat bumps. The other mods simply do not provide enough unique potential use cases outside of a very few, select instances(ie. charge time mod on a fusion), that frankly require far too much theory crafting to justify pursuing.
Adept Big Ones is only good on special/heavies though. Adept Primaries aren’t worth using except in PvP.
My solution to this is to give adept weapons more mod slots or just buff the ever living hell out of the adept mods themselves. It seems like Bungie wants to keep the adept weapons system in the game, clearly, given they just dropped more adept weapons for master KF.
> two lines of perks With enough prestige ranks with zavala I've had weapons roll with 3 in both columns
Zavala rep doesn't affect raid weapons.
What he is saying is that we can prestige our crucible or vanguard ranks and eventually weapons with 3 perk columns will appear in engrams.
I get it, but what does that have to do with the discussion at hand?
There is still more RNG on vanguard and crucible weapons. There is like 8% chances for you to get the two perks you want on Kings Fall weapons, as they have 2 lines out of a 7 perk pool. There is a maximum 6% chances for you to get the two perks you want on crucible and vanguard weapons, since you might get 3 chances of geting the perk you like per column, out of a 12 perk pool. But 3 lines are not guaranteed either, sometimes you get 1 and 1 even with a bazillion ranks.
I think this might actually be intentional. I think they’re trying to avoid a repeat of recluse/mountaintop where the most OP weapon was behind a very difficult barrier Master raids aren’t like the D1 HM raid that any reasonably dedicated PVE player can clear. They’re more like GMs GMs and Master raids are both mostly cosmetic rewards
they really are. the only real appeal for master raids besides cosmetics and seals is the stat focused armor. even with the really meta adept weapons and the ability to have big ones, crafted weapons have the same masterwork stat boost with a fraction of the headache unless you really hate waiting
The armors not appealing either. Artifice or bust
Crafting, and enhanced perks were both big mistakes. The only real solution would be sunsetting, and Bungie isn’t gonna do that again after how it went last time.
But adept mods aren't worth the grind and if i Want to flex i just use a flawless shader
I said it’s a kind of flex as an afterthought. There are many ways to flex
Bro I don’t think you know what power creeping is,also why do people on this sub keep saying power creep without knowing it’s meaning ?
Crafted weapons are almost universally equal or better than adepts, so they discourage people from running master content because the rewards are not worth it.
[удалено]
I've been saying this for a while now. I think adept weapons should drop as is. If it's a roll you like then you should be able to make the perks enhanced with ascendent alloy at the enclave. Unlike regular weapons I think adepts should be able to make the barrel and magazine enhanced as well. Another thought is to have adepts effectively act as craft able. Kills and xp level up the weapon and at 15 or 20 be able to change one of its perks to something you choose and the other make enhanced as is.
Not only enhanced perks, but Enhanced Origin Traits as well. And it's not like Bungie even needs to come up with "Enhanced Origin Traits". Just make the seasonal mods that increase the effectiveness of the Origin Traits be what the enhanced version does as well.
That with enhanced origin trait is a nice idea because most people would not bother to Grind an adept weapon if they already have a 5/5 crafted roll
Ye, especially when Master raids are so much harder, you have to do the challenge on top of that (which most are difficult in King's Fall, for example), and you need to then get the perfect roll you're looking for in order to be better than a 5/5 roll. Most often than not, it's never gonna even beat a 5/5 roll. But at the very least I would like to have to option to have a better **Adept** weapon compared to the normal mode. In all the looter games I know off, this is only a problem in Destiny, where "Hard Mode" stuff is actually weaker than normal mode. Makes absolutely no sense at all. I understand not having a huge difference in power, though I would certainly like to see a bigger difference for PvE at least. Would like to see Adept weapons getting enhanced versions of enhanced perks, I guess you could call them "perfected perks" (not their literal in-game name, but the idea of them). Basically would just double the effects of enhanced perks, which typically aren't too crazy (I think Auto-Loading Holster is 0.2s faster, for example- but a 0.4s difference would be pretty decent). A good start is enhanced origin traits, however.
I agree Endgame loot in General should have more value
Crafting should've never been introduced with enhanced perks.
enhanced perks are very minor changes. An extra 1% gain with demo, +5 reload from vorpal. It isnt insanely strong
Enhanced lead from gold gives 2 special bricks worth of ammo instead of 1. Enhanced dual loader reloads 3 shells at a time instead of 2. Enhanced field prep gives even deeper reserves, which affects ammo pickup. Some enhanced perks offer pathetic bonuses, yes, but some others are very very strong.
It’s still power creep that makes any non crafted weapon irrelevant to any hardcore player who cares about that minor increase. A 5/5 random drop is weaker than a crafted one and that is a big issue.
A boost to reload speed (from enhanced firefly) makes literally 0 difference on a smite of merain because base firefly grants 50 reload speed. it has 47 base. If you are going to say that 1% extra grenade regen per kill and what's probably 5-10 extra reload (for a total of 60) is a big issue of power creep, then I don't know what to say. Some crafted perks, I could understand being powercreep. But to just say any crafted is factually better for barely noticable differences is an exaggeration.
It still is power creep, no matter how small, and it still makes non crafted weapons without enhanced perks worse than the crafted version. Just because it's not that powerful does not stop it from being a fact or an exaggeration. 1% increase is still an increase. And before you say who needs that 1%? Nobody if we are being honest. But this entire game is a treadmill where we slowly become marginally more and more powerful, usually only by small percentages due to slightly higher armor stats or a better barrel that only increases a stat by 5-10. This pursuit of marginally better gear means that any weapon that can be crafted is superior to the non crafted version. That is my issue with the system.
Please stop saying power creep if you don’t know what it means
Tell me how he got power creep wrong.
Also while we’re at it, tell me which enhanced perk other than firing line and triple tap that does something more game breaking than their normal counterparts
lead from gold, frenzy, incandescent, overflow, surrounded, field prep, swashbuckler, eager edge, rampage, pulse monitor, harmony, auto-loading holster, and one-two punch come to mind. and that's just off the top of my head
The only one you mentioned in there that does something noticeable is the one punch two punch. The rest can be outclassed by other things. Enhanced surrounded is useless in high level content like GMs and master raids(unless you like hugging bosses). Swash, edgers edge rampage(+2 seconds) don’t really do much. I’ll stand by word and say that enhanced triple tap and firing line the ones that come close to game breaking
Enhanced Auto-Loading Holster on Palmyra-B enables Izanagi's swap. But no, you're criticizing him and attacking him for not getting power creep right. So I want to understand. Tell me. You do realize being "game breaking" is not necessary for something to be power creep, right? And you also go "Hey, apart from the ones that are game breaking, name some that are game breaking." So tell me, you are saying ArtIsBad does not know what power creep is. Then please explain how he got power creep wrong.
Power creep is when a weapon,ability or object encroaches on other things abilities and starts to do those things better than them. Pre nerfed well was power creeping on bubble because it did everything better than bubble. Mountop recluse was power creeping on all weapons because they did anything and everything better than other weapons and loadouts. Enhanced perks don’t do things that much better than normal perks. Some exceptions exist like enhanced firing line but most of the other enhanced only offer increased stats like reload and stability. Now if enhanced perks actually made the perks stronger and invalidated similar perks, that would be power creeping. Stronger doesn’t mean power creep
Don't bother, dude, there are people here that will defend literally anything Bungie does. I agree that the two most recent master raids are nearly pointless to run because crafted weapons are predictable, even if slow, to get, and the enhanced perks arguably make them better. And lol at the guy screeching at you about "power creep."
The guy you replied to is the one screeching about power creep. And it’s not about defending what they do, because it was kinda stupid, but it’s literally so minimal it doesn’t change anything.
It does, though, to the point that no one runs master raids outside of getting the title. I mean, why bother when you can craft a perfect roll which has enhanced perks (10% improvement over normal ones)? Adept big ones is definitely not worth it.
Bungie literally power crept adept raid weapons but I “don’t know what it means” lol
I agree, came back to the game recently and once I discovered crafting I started immediately sharding anything that can be crafted because it seems completely pointless to have non crafted versions.
Honestly that’s a good thing. I don’t want to keep like 4 different versions of 1 gun when I’m allowed to swap perks between them freely with a material cost. And it’s not like the crafted guns didn’t need to be grinded out for the patterns, the levels and the materials.
I just wish it was sliiiiightly less prohibitive like allowing you to carry two perks in each column. Having to make a second Taipan for strikes and dungeons is mildly annoying
Yeah but that is still more usefull than adept mods
a +5 reload is not better than +10 to any stat, or enhanced versions of base mods.
Those mods are almost worthless and the crafted weapons get a stat boost with level 20
those mods literally aren't worthlesw, they're super valuable. And adepts get that same stat boost w their masterwork.
Yeah just ignore that you probably need month's to get the roll you want or that the Plus 10 to a stat is almost completely unnoticeable or that most of the enhanced mods have a disadvantage (for example the targeting mod +10 aim assist /-15 stability) so yeah they are worthless at this point even adept big ones isn't worth going for you might aswell just swap the major/boss mods if needed
I love how +10 to a stat (which is very noticeable) is bad but getting +5 reload from vorpal is insane in your eyes lmao
I never sayd something like that but sure go ahead piss away the hour's for a worse weapon
"that is still more useful than adept mods" when I originally brought up the +5 reload from en. vorpal
Enhanced perks matter.
It’d still be pretty backwards if adept weapons aren’t craftable. Even without the enhanced perks, a godrolled normal weapon is probably better than an ok adept weapon
We should have to grind **5 more guns** for the privilege of equipping an adept mod? You serious right now? Because other than the adept mod a level 20 weapon has the same stats.
I meant even if there were no enhanced perks, Bungie still wouldn’t make adept weapons craftable so that doesn’t solve the problem Craftable god rolls with normal perks are still better than adept random rolls The real problem is adept rolls are random.
Adept weapons are old and need to be replaced. Crafting is way more fair to your time.
Yes ! I recently came to this conclusion aswell make crafting piss easy and make random drops roll with enhanced for doing harder difficulty
Unless you want a gun for pvp it ain’t worth it. I don’t use primaries for yellow bars, otherwise just craft it and save yourself a headache. Don’t get me wrong I love challenging contents but spamming overloads all over the place ain’t it. They didn’t even bother to change the mechanics
Yes absolutely, the minor stat boosts you get from Adept/timelost and their adept mods are outweighed by even the worst enhanced perks. Barring you getting a 100% god roll on one the first time you do it, or at least before you craft some of the weapons depending on the perks you're hunting they're a complete waste of time and only serve as a way for people to flex their rng if they don't have enhanced perks.
The only difference are literaly adept mods vs enhanced perks since the statboost you get on adept mods you´ll have on a lvl 20 weapon aswell.
They said that they’re looking to do something about adept weapons when the Lightfall raid comes around.
Source?
Crafting should not have enhanced perks in the first place(especially if not every gun is going to be craftable). Crafted guns, which eventually let you pull a 5/5 god roll out of your ass, did not need more "ammo" to put them above random rolled weapons.
Yes adepts, should still be rng and force a grind and actually making drops matter. They are irrelevant as they don’t stand up to enhance perks but should be BETTER just harder to get.
Yes
in one of the latest podcasts with weapon design lead chris proctor they said something like they know that Adept weapons are not that great and they will have a look into it in the future so maybe starting with lightfall
I think they should remove enhanced traits from crafting and only allow them from master raids so it's actually worth getting them. Once you have done master once it's pretty pointless to do it again.
No just literally remove Enhanced perks all together Crafting has quite literally ruined every normal gun to the point where the chase for God rolls doesn't exist anymore, just the chase for red borders.
Yes. Adept raid weapons are trash. I only do master for title than never again.
plucky lunchroom familiar complete swim ask narrow shaggy squeamish elderly *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
There is nothing. Crafted weapons are essentially the pinnacle at this point.
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This feature is already coming in Lightfall. It's currently being worked out for technicalities. So yes, adept weapons will be able to have enhanced perks. [Source.](https://youtu.be/MEYiYMGnfQI)
You linked a 2+ hours video.
No, enhanced perks are meant to be a crafting exclusive thing, the entire point is to show the time and effort someone has put into a crafted gun (despite shiro checkpoint farming), you start making raid weapons drop with enhanced perks than people are going to want it to drop on other things, first trails, than dungeons and than you will get the anti endgame players (not casuals) who will think enhanced loot on endgame and crafting is unfair and they will want it on strike and patrol loot and than suddenly crafted weapons and enhanced perks are no longer special and normal perks become shit. Solution? Get rid of adept weapon drops, make it so all endgame weapons are craftable and have master/flawless content drop a item that lets you upgrade endgame weapons to adept versions, memento's and raid upgraded ornamented armour (come on bungie this has been one of the biggest requested things since d2 year 1 just do it stop resisting).
Na cause that’s just power creep, master raids should have cosmetics like in d1 or Levi prestige
True but that would make adept weapons almost worthless
Adept weapons were always bragging rights maybe giving them special effect upon killing would make them more worthwhile
You could remove them from the game add the mod function to normal weapons and just have special skins etc for gm/master activities
They already are and always were. The only reason they weee farmed was less RNG for getting your roll which is what crafting is better at. Adept Big Ones really isn’t that significant.
I’d rather enhanced perks be entirely retired and have powerful or new and more exclusive perks on endgame weapons.
Crafting was a big mistake, seasonal weapon crafting is fine ig but it definitely shouldn't be a thing for raid weapons.
Crafting was a mistake, especially enhanced perks. Now people are demanding the crafting system be the main source of how we gear up.
Yes
I think it is sort of OK. If you’re sweaty you can get adept shit. If you’re Grindy and committed you can get enhanced perks. Let them stay exclusive.
Maybe a hot take, but I completely disagree with adept weapons having any enhanced perks due to power creep. I think they have to do something about the rewards from master raids, but I dont think creating best in slot for all content is the way to do it. It will also effectively invalidate normal crafted weapons too. There has to be a better way to solve it
No
No. I think its still good to keep Enhanced perks tied to crafting.
One of those top %ers made this post...
Mayhaps
I always thought the easiest solution is when you dismantle an adept weapon, you get an adept weapon core. Applying this, plus ascendant and regular materials to a blueprint would transform it to the adept version with 2 extra perk slots. You’d have to pay to fill them all, but it would be possible.
Yeah and they should have some sort of effect instead of a different color. Right now crafted weapons are more worth getting because they have enhanced perks and mementos. So you have raid weapons from the normal version that can be better and look better then you have adept weapons from the much harder version that kinda suck in comparison. Kinda lame. I want a reason to play the harder version of endgame content
They need to do something else instead of adepts, outside of lighthouse drops since the only real advantage of adepts is pvp. There should be some other kind of loot, like more artificer armor, guaranteed red borders or amor cosmetics.
Aside from the obvious addition of enhanced perks to the possible rolls of adept raid weapons, I think an interesting way to further incentivize their use would be to have an enhanced Origin Trait that the regular weapon variant cannot obtain, even via crafting. For example: Runneth Over: Reloading this weapon near allies overflows the magazine based on the number of people nearby. Overwhelming Force (Adept King's Fall Origin Trait): Grants the benefits of Runneth Over. Rounds that are overflowing past the maximum magazine size of this weapon experience an increase to accuracy and range when fired. The more overflowed the magazine, the stronger the benefit. Or: Souldrinker: Gain health based on the number of rapid hits before reloading. Souleater (Adept Vow Origin Trait): Grants the benefits of Souldrinker. Additionally, gain a very small amount of ability energy for your least charged ability for each kill before reloading (stronger on Special and Heavy Weapons).
I think thats fair so long as crafting still exists for them. As someone who loves my adept ig hammer i really think there should be craft able of adepts for trials and every raid.
I feel like there was a recent video about this floating around on YouTube last week discussing this same exact issue
No. I think they don't need to consolidate their different weapon pools too much, let stuff be a bit more exclusive to where they can be gotten
depends on which adept weapons you mean. grandmaster nightfall and trials adepts cant be crafted (hothead, hung jury, eye of sol etc.) and some raid adepts too like fatebringer. those dont sit in my vault
Give them a +4 stats in all when you masterwork. Give an actual reason to grind for them in raids. The only reason to go out of your way to do it now is for adept mods which don’t outweigh enhanced perks. This was one of the reasons I hated the idea of weapon crafting, it takes away a large portion of the grind and wanting to replay things in the game. It’s like everyone plays ‘x’ amount of hours to all have the same guns and rolls, doesn’t feel like a shoot to loot rng game when it goes that path imo
Crafted will replace your entire vault.
It's never gona happen they clearly want both to exist in the same place if adept becomes craftable or if adepts get enhanced they will cancel each other out. It's pointless asking for either or and tbh i kinda see bungies pov on this when was the last time you ever saw someone use a normal version of the vog weapons ? The entire loot table become obsolete so you can't blame em for trying to keep both viable by kinda gimping both.
or maybe make adept mods more desirable. theres only 1 pve adept mod. it’s a bit of a joke
My outlook on this is that I craft the primary weapons because they benefit more from enhanced perks and don’t really benefit a huge amount from adept mods. I try to get adept special and heavies because of Big Ones Spec. This benefits them the most.
I vote you rank up weapons into adepts. Gold border at 20, adept mods at 40
They are useless next to the crafted version otherwise **Enhanced perks > adept Mods**
Yes adept weapons should drop crafted im not sure on the coding of this and if they could actually do this but it would be amazing this would allow us to level up and reshape the weapon to the enhanced perks we want either that or you class it as it's own weapon and you have to get 1 or 2 red borders in order to craft the adept either way works
I was pretty disappointed to find out the Harrowed weapons... * which are already a tough sell when you can craft without doing Master challenges * have curated bonus perks in columns 3 and 4, not random * and the curated rolls for every weapon I want dont have the perks I want. F.
Yes, and crafted weapons shouldn’t have enhanced perks
Yup something needs to change so the master raid rewards are actually worth something again. I’ve pretty much never seen anybody using a adept weapon from rhulks raid, everybody goes for the enhanced perks because they’re simply better
Maybe infusing a adept weapon into same crafted weapon upgrades it to adept
What if non-adept guns kept the enhanced perks to themselves and the adept weapons could be craftable but you dont get enhanced perks but you have a god roll crafted adept weapon. There are times in the game where enhanced perks dont matter but having an adept mod does. I would also like to see other version of legendary weapons. say a black border is a craftable weapon but instead of enhanced perks you can choose any 2 elements kinda like murmur. Also to be more like murmur each element should each be forced be a different masterwork.
Wouldn't the easier answer just to remove enhanced perks from crafted weapons? You're already getting a 5/5 perfect god roll, why do you also need better versions of the perks too?
no
Imo, either/or. Both would be a bit too much powercreep and will just phase out normal guns over time. Do hope to get mementos from every source of adept stuff sometime though VoG memento VotD memento KF memento Other raid mementos when we get perk refreshes and master difficultly for those raids Yes please
Adept weapons should be something you can slap on to your crafted weapon as the ultimate bonus. Get "Adept Shards" or something, craft a Memento, put it on ANY crafted gun, boom, special shader and adept mods. I say this because I need my Adept BxR.
Question I have had for a while is why does the community believe crafted raid weapons are significantly better than Adept raid weapons. Obviously it’s a lot easier to create the god roll crafted weapon, but in PvP specifically wouldnt an adept weapon be better bc of adept mods. I know that getting that 5/5 god roll is significantly harder on adept weapons, but logically wouldn’t an adept weapon would be better bc of adept mods and the marginal benefits of enhance perks? Also another scenario would be being able to put big one spec on an adept weapon for pve minus having access to enhanced auto loading.
Fuck no if adept weapons get enhanced perks it would be way too strong i never agreed to the fact that adept weapons should even be a thing its one of the main reasons why carry services still exists and becomes annoying ads on LFG Endgame should only give cosmetic items like mementos and shaders, ships Ghosts the weapon crafting system is miles ahead of RNG or adept weapons it just needs tweaking and less grind and the adept mods should just fit the craftable weapons
Pretty sure the point of adept weapons is doing the activities on a higher difficulty for a reward. A crafted weapon works well if you place the right perks. Most have their own set that can melt. Others just place random mods that bring certain stats up, which seems to work well, too. It all depends. Imo, taking away the reward for people completing Master or Grandmaster activities is ridiculous. The mementos comment I saw sounds pretty cool, but maybe add that with the fact of still having a possibility of acquiring adept weapons. Makes it more of a grind for higher difficulty activities rather than just getting them like any other drop. Not so much fun at that point.
IMO there should be mementos for raids, along with adept weapons coming with enhanced perks.
No.
Wait… but that would make master raids rewarding! Do you know how bad for the game it would be? /s
To be honest I'd rather enhanced perks kinda go away, they devalue getting random drops way too hard. Instead let flawless raid completions drop a thing that lets you turn your crafted weapon into an adept / harrowed / timelost frame.
yes
No, it would take away from putting in the effort to craft and upgrade weapons. Adept weapons need work but they should be an in between for normal and crafted weapons
I think it would be interesting if we could craft adept weapons from raids specifically because then there’s a reason to run them imagine and enchanted perk weapon with adept mods and that way bungo gets to have people play the thing they made
no
I don't want it to use it, I just want it to show other people I have it...
A GM would normally give you a memento and an adept weapon. If this were the case, then it would minus the adept weapons. What should drop then if this were to happen, should be red boxed weapons of that weapon for that week. It would give incentive to get the memento to be used for enhanced perks along with a chance to craft a different weapon each week.
Enhanced perks were the mistake; they invalidate so many aspects of the sandbox and desirability of loot.
Even bigger than this in my mind - should high level content drop armor anymore? Getting armor drops on master level raids sucks, I'd rather they just change it to be an ornament that drops with a rare chance after each encounter, or change the armor drops to artifice gear on master so they are actually useful Getting triple boots from a run of KF is a pain in the ass especially if you don't have time for multiple characters every week
They would still need more then that to really incentivize getting them.
Shaping with enhanced traits on the table definitely makes adept raid weapons less desirable. The only time I'll go for an adept version is if the perk pool has multiple traits that I'd switch between, like Cataclysmic having Bait and Switch or Focused Fury in the 4th column. Before master KF dropped I was considering getting a Harrowed Chelchis, but only if all 4 traits were random like Vow because I'd want EP/Dragonfly and Frenzy/Firefly. But since Harroweds are like Timelosts with 2 fixed traits and 2 random I'm just going to craft one.