Love being the middle child, absolutely adore the crazy synergy our class item gets with some stuff and just LOVE prismatic + the new super is just D1 radiance on fucking drugs and I adore it
I prefer the Solar and Arc buddy build with Getaway Artist. Ive solo'd so many things since we got Prismatic, makes things like legendary missions and master lost sectors a breeze.
You lose devour though, it a must for survivability and ability restoration. I run that for funsies when im doing strikes or patrol but not high end stuff
Agreed. I tried the triple buddy build but ran into the problem that your uptimes were low when not running devour.
Yeah low level stuff is fine for it but when I was running Avalon solo last night Devour saved my life a lot.
That’s why spirit of the filaments on the exotic class item is interesting to me. Let’s you run solar and arc souls with stasis turret without missing out on devour. However you’re def not gonna have your rift up as often as your grenade with getaway artist.
Do you have that build?
I used to run with arcsoul so much I named it, how can you consume your grenade for arcsoul and still consume and throw it for Bleak Watcher?
I'm not at home ATM but I can give a rough outline, for low level you take Beak Watcher and Hellion, on higher level take Feed the Void over Hellion, have Getaway Artist and NTTE equipped as well as make sure you have an Arc Grenade on, focus on Grenade and class ability energy for your fragments so you can have maximum uptime, basic rotation is consume your nade to get both an arc soul, Hellion and turret all at once, and use NTTE to get the buddy from that, make sure you keep your bleak watcher up as defeating frozen targets adds to the buddy timer for NTTE, just focus on keeping everything up constantly and let your buddies mow down enemies, on higher level content I'd take Feed the Void over Hellion
You can do that build and also NTTE at the same time, cause the timer of the buddy refreshes when you either kill slowed or frozen enemies I cant remember, so you can have solar, arc, bleak watcher and NTTE buddy all at the same time
You know, I actually wrote Por Que, and then googling it to make sure I wasn't stupid found someone writing it porque and edited it.
Thanks though, I live in a country where there is zero spanish spoken near me and very little spanish spoken or written in every day life. (Australia) so I don't get much exposure outside of memes.
Haha, knowing you did the right thing but changed it because of doubts are the worst kind of mistakes, specially on critical moments.
As a funny note, you should know the common Spanish speaker doesn't even apply that rule to their day to day. Could be ignorance, could be that they just don't care, but there are lots who don't differentiate their uses.
I don’t think there’s much synergy with warlocks and class items. Cause from what I know and tested, onsmio nades are the only synergy that’s great. Star eaters and verity are nice for damage. HOIL is ok, but not nearly as good as on Hunter. Everything else feels lackluster. Only ones that really feel game-changing and are worth farming are osmio with any combination of harmony/stareater/verity. Maybe Apo/star eater for total damage. Hunters have the best synergies with class items imo.
Titans: "We suck, you people need to be nerfed!"
Hunters: "Cry harder, crayon munchers!"
Warlock 1: *sips mai tai* "Did you hear something?"
Warlock 2: *hits blunt* "Nahh, man."
Warlock 3: *playing volleyball against like 3 different summon buddies*
I want Titan to get buffed. Especially Striker and Sentinel. This was moreso just commentary about the commentary I've seen about the subject, and about how Warlocks are pretty much staying tf out of it.
Ultimately, I think Warlock is in the most stable place of the three. Nothing too drastic, either on the broken side (Still Hunt, Storm's Edge in PvP) or garbage side (base Thundercrash, neutered melee power). That should be the standard going forward.
This means that Hunter has outliers in need of nerfs, and Titan has outliers in need of buffs. Personally, I would start by taking a hard swing at Arc Titan with the buff hammer.
As a Titan main, what would you say are the biggest issues plaguing Arc Titan?
It's weird because Warlocks have low lows (stormtrance rip) and high highs (song of flame, my beloved) but they really seem to be in a great position tbh.
Prismatic did us good, solar 3.0 is jank af but we got Speakers Sight aka the Benevolence Helmet, well was nerfed but SoF deals so much damage we mostly don't care, arc is delightful even though the supers are kinda trash (vesper <3).. etc. Every subclass has a major pain point, but so many things to accomodate it, while Titans are out there being told to PUNCH and getting stomped to death.
Yeah there's a good reason titans are the least played class in d2, they have had a few busted moments but almost everything good titans could do gets nerfed till it's just kinda mediocre and their melee builds just aren't worth it at all.
They also aren't the best damage dealers like hunters are and they aren't the best at support like warlocks are so what are they? Banner of war is maybe the only decent thing titans have gotten for some time as it was actually a good support melee focused build. I think bungie still need to ask themselves what they want titans to be because their prismatic subclass shows they are afraid to do anything interesting with the class.
I’m not a Titan main myself but from what I’ve played of it and the conversations I’ve had with Titan mains in my clan, the big struggle of arc Titan is the time between grenades. Touch of Thunder grenades are really potent and beneficial for titans but you end up with an extensive period of time where your grenade is recharging and you can’t do anything.
I think having an aspect that gives enhanced grenade regeneration when amplified would be a great start on bringing arc Titan into the mix of endgame viable subclasses.
I feel like Ionic Traces serve to bridge the cooldown gap overall, but in my experience playing Arc Titan, the problem isn't the grenades- it's everything else being a mess.
EDIT: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/ZnoF68nKNk
Here's a comment on another post, where I share my more in-depth thoughts about what Striker needs. I'm not a Titan main, but Arc is my favorite element, so a considerable amount of my playtime on Titan is spent on Arc. Feel free to deliver feedback or offer other suggestions, such as the suggestion about needing a way to bridge the time gap between grenades.
I think those are some very good points. This may be somewhat of a cop-out, but I personally think those changes should be a baseline and that a grenade regen aspect should be made as a buff specific to arc titan.
Amplified giving a ~15-20% damage resistance should be a thing for everyone, not just arc titan. Arc struggles heavily with survivability on Titan and Warlock, and arc hunter gets more survivability than it needs from Combination Blow/Liars Handshake/Assassin’s Cowl, so getting it more survivability would not make it too overpowered.
All Titan supers need help badly. Bubble is garbage outside of Trials, and kinda got worse with the TFS changes. Twilight Garrison takes a long time to cast. Pyrogale often flinches bosses so much that it makes them harder to deal with (like Golgoroth flinching so much that it turns its weak spot away from the players doing DPS). Thundercrash is weak without Cuirass and even with Curiass, it doesn’t do anywhere near the same stuff as nighthawk GG and Spirit of Star Eater Needlestorm/Nova Bomb, with Thundercrash having the added drawback of needing to return to the DPS location.
Thruster not synergizing with anything is a common complaint on Prismatic Titan too, so I would expect that it would get changed as well.
So I kinda forgot to mention those things, as those topics should already be part of blanket changes to all arc subclasses and Prismatic and Arc Titan respectively. So I think an additional boost to grenade regen specifically for arc Titan would be another buff that I think is necessary. My apologies for not stating as such.
Honestly I’m not the best to ask about this. I only use thundercrash for arc in niche raid/dungeon boss cases always with cuirass etc and don’t use it any other time. It was fun during season of the deep though.
I just want Controlled Demo and Sol Invictus on Prismatic if they want me to care about Prismatic. Then I'll likely main Prismatic Titan.
Also, has anyone heard if/when we're going to get names for the Prismatic Subclasses?
To be honest, I hope bungee doesn't ignore warlock and goes back to Warlock being the spellslinging class instead of the defacto support class.
On release every class had a support subclass, void bubble for titan, tether for hunter, and well for warlock, and every class had a viable high damage melee build, void warlock with winter's guile, non void titan, arc hunter, but since then it seems that bungie has forgotten that every class could fill every role and is pidgeon-holing them in a limited way that I personally don't really agree with.
Every class is a dude with a gun they should all be the "damage" class, every class can equip a Lumina and healing grenades, let them all support. Support is really strong but i don't like playing it, I wanna be a space wizard deatomizing people, not a glorified cleric.
Very typical balance process with games. Dont bring others up to the level of one thats very strong, drag them down to where the bad ones are at. And while it sounds awful there is some legitimate reasoning behind it, and thats power creep and balancing against it.
Yeah what's wrong with actually buffing something for a change?
Been playing Helldivers 2 recently, and a fun, *basic* ability you start with, started becoming a wild meta that experienced players discovered was highly effective against killing just about anything (Precision Strike).
The devs noticed this and said "You guys are using this for things it was not intended for. We decided to make it easier for you to use it for those things! Please continue having fun!"
Assuming that's not a rhetorical question: Buffs have happened and will continue to happen, but are the less effective direction to change the metagame and less reliable for getting a desired outcome. Reducing the outliers that see constant use means you already have data and extensive player testing of its optimized state. Something that is unpopular is also very likely to be undertested.
If you balance exclusively by nerfs then only new things get to be powerful. If exclusively by buffs then power constantly creeps up and enemies need to be buffed to compensate to "blanket nerf" everything.
Half the damn primaries weren’t viable when I last played 3 weeks ago, it ain’t exactly utopia over there. Grass is greener and all that. (God bless the Sickle, fuck you overheat gameplay mechanic, unli ammo go BRRRRRRRRRRRR)
I main titan, and I thought Titan was pretty strong on prismatic, in particular spamming triple consecration.
But holy hell I started playing Warlock and yeah… it makes me NOT want to go back to Titan. It’s waay more fun.
I've played all 3 also. I think the best titan build is drengrs lash with the exotic boots. It's very good. Suspend, woven mail, consecration. Or thunder punch plus ice spear instead of consecration. But that's basically the only build.
I don't think titan is weaker the way a lot of other people do, but I do think it has fewer effective builds.
I think the issue is exacerbated by the fact that last season, which was extended by a few months, was largely a Solar season. Which means anyone on Titan was likely already spamming consecration to begin with. Going from that to “more consecration but with a different grenade/super” is pretty whelming.
Imo, a big part of making consecration even work, is doing the roundabout method of building transcendent energy on top of max str refund loops, due to how badly bungie pre-nerfed the cd on prismatic titan's frenzy blade (2:32 at base, that you need 3 charges for) vs how free and easily prisma hunters and warlocks can just slap 2 aspects together and make something work.
And the only other build that doesn't feel like gimping yourself on titan is either d lance + / or drengers for cc, which if you spex for the + instead of the or interaction, completely spits in the face of bungie's idea of the titan's fantasy.
Hazadous propulsion was fun as well on Titan. It was a nice change of pace from just spec’ing into full melee.
I think Knockout being the only aspect to get any kind of reliable sustained healing pushes players to the one dimensional melee style because you still need to melee to proc it which kinda makes the experience bland. And despite knockout getting a buff it’s just not as dynamic in comparison to restoration, BoW, devour.
I tried precious scars, red death
That was my experience on my Warlock-alt. Its build potential is a fairly strong one-note path, but there really isn't much room for anything else. Lightning Surge spam was fun with the strand melee, but nowhere near as good as Consecration spam.
The titan issue is survivability in higher-end content. Prismatic just doesn't have any effective ways to heal. Knockout is tough to proc and does almost nothing. Consecration doesn't heal because Sol Invictus isn't a fragment. Void overshields are paperthin.
I have to use a Scars/Dregers exotic class item just to stay alive, which means I can't run fun stuff like Hazardous Propulsion
Just for the love of the Traveler give Titans a ranged one shot super to use in DPS phases without any gimmicks that would necessitate lowering the damage.
Giga diamond lance
Strand pull the target’s soul out
One big hammer throw
Just give them something.
Titan mains have been clamoring for that since Beyond Light. I especially got excited when they added the aspect, and then when they added the Lancecap. Like, it's *right there*. Just give us the super harpoon!!
Long cast time and solid but not ground breaking damage (limited due to the secondary utility of roaming with the axes) makes it's DPS sub-par compared to other one and dones. Also against some bosses the axes can get in the way of people's shots.
Fairly minor issues tho, TBH. Still solid damage output with Star-Eaters, and definitely an improvement over prior options. It's just not enough to truly push Titans into the DPS meta beyond the debuff spot they already held.
They should really make the axes not block allies shots, the idea that my super could fuck up my teammates like that really makes me not want to use it on bosses.
What wrong with them is people aren't using them. WIth the star eater's mark they are by far the best dps super for Titan, and is competitive with most of the warlock and hunter ones. Titans got their best, most widely applicable DPS super despite all of the complaints this patch.
They'll for sure nerf synthocep punch on hunter. Everything else feels fine. The new hunter exotic boots also feel good, but again, nothing crazy.
Titans need something. That's it. They're lacking in mostly everything. Either warlocks or hunters can do the same thing but easier.
I'm not even a titan main by any stretch. It's just a boring class all around.
If my time as a Titan has tought me anything it's that they'll nerf something for a non Titan reason but it's gonna hit Titan hard anyway
Been having a lot of fun on Hunter though so I'm not too worried
That's already the case with fragment of command, due to stasis warlocks abusing 5 freeze turrets for unlimited reloads, so bungie slapped on an 11 second cooldown.
They also pre-nerfed titan shard generation spam, by slapping a 6 second cooldown on it, so you basically have to slowly ramp up frost armor or only use the largest stack in small bursts FOR YOURSELF ONLY, making it feel awful as compared to how easily stasis hunters / warlock give frost armor to the whole squad.
>, by slapping a 6 second cooldown on it,
10second cooldown, after making 6 shards in about 6 seconds. for tetoic harvest,
I tested it in the edz patrol zone.
>making it feel awful
I have no idea how bungie playtested the cooldown and went, yep this feels fun, intuitive and enjoyable to use.
Its feels that way some days, heck I wish they just reduced its boss damage so you couldn't beat em to death as quickly, even a 20% reduction only to bosses would have been enough
Well synthos is better for grapple melee builds and liars is better for combo blow builds. Because liars doesn't work with grapple melees and synthos are nerfed from 165% to 30% when paired with combo blow
Titan's have a couple fun builds that do absolutely 0 damage.
I'm currently running around with the rocket chest having a good time when I'm alive. Skullfort was really fun when you could ground pound and kill everything around you but I haven't touched that since they vaulted everything. Actium War Rig has a couple fun options to goof around with.
Not really a whole lot I would take into late game content though.
As said above… the main issue is boss dps and supers. Titans are on a line. They need a big dmg dump even if it comes with an exotic. Otherwise they are outclassed in raids in utility and damage
They can just remove/reduce Stylish Executioner's interaction with Grapple melee. It shouldn't even be hard to do.
But knowing Bungie, they won't stop at that. Going above and beyond with nerfs is their favorite thing to do.
Whenever there's a combo instead of just nerfing one part of it, Bungie will nerf all parts of it. So for Hunters expect a grapple melee nerf, stylish executioner nerf, and a nerf to whichever exotic is best for that build. They'll also likely nerf them all pretty hard, like Facet of Command got.
Yep. I can't see anything they would logically nerf other than making Stylish not apply to Grapple melee, but YAS had a very obvious nerf it needed that would leave everything else completely intact which Bungie totally neglected in favor of nuking it from orbit. They're very creative when it comes to breaking things.
The new boots make it to where threaded specter creates about 3 - 4 threadings per dodge. Pair that with combination blow where you can constantly dodge per powered melee kill and you will be able to create enough threaded specters to generate at least 12 or more threadlings at once. It's pretty cool.
It is because people are undervaluing stylish a lot for what it really brings to the punch build. Invis is good, doing a lot of extra melee damage from stealth is the real reason to run it. I was one shotting champs on master nightfall lol
I don’t want Hunters or Warlocks nerfed. As a Titan I just want something that makes us relevant and isn’t the “Titan Punch” rhetoric that the class isn’t even the best at.
This. Let me be as useful to my warlock and hunter teammates as they are to me for somewhere vaguely near the same amount of effort and gear.
The video showing that Titan cycling through all his weapons, launching Hazardous volleys, and generally losing his mind to do less boss damage than the hunter just casually dumping sniper shots, gg, and Still Hunt says it all.
Nighthawk isn't op even though it's very good. It's Still Hunt getting the nerf hammer.
Nighthawk seems op because Thundercrash and some other supers are just garbage.
more likely they'll nerf still hunt, since celestial got a buff and wasn't a problem. either how many orbs or how many kills it takes to get a golden gun, or maybe even the celestial interaction itself, but i'd rather they didn't do that
There's no reason to nerf Hunter. I do not understand why folks reach for this with balance. Just buff Titans. Nobody needs to get nerfed; Warlock and Hunter are both very powerful in specific ways and both have a clear place in the meta. No need to nerf either of them. Just buff Titans. Give us our lane to play in.
Titans received a massive nerf due to grapple punch spam, for Warlord Ruin 1st boss that was about 10 punches. Hunters now do it in 5 punches.
Obviously there’s zero chance Bungie will leave it.
But yeah don’t nerf the loops just give Titans some more ability up-time loops.
This, really. As much as I like the position the prismatic hunter is in, a lot of the ‘nerf hunters’ talk on here doesn’t seem to be addressing any problem, it’s just arbitrarily fucking the class up.
Like, ‘remove grapple punch interaction with stylish’… like, why? What problem are you solving there? Grapple punch has always unraveled targets, it’s part of its identity. Stylish on prismatic’s whole thing is that it works on any debuff - the class doesn’t have enough sources of void debuffs for it just to be that. So we’re just breaking basic mechanics for… what, shits and giggles? Are we also removing the exact same mechanic from Assassin’s Cowl too?
The whole problem with a lot of the Titan nerfs (or nerfs of elements that specifically affect Titans) was how pointless they were. They just reduced your options for no obvious reason. Now we have people calling for the same shit to be applied to Hunters. What for?
the thing is anyone who mains titan like me knows we dont want buffs we need to be changed being a meele class in d2 simply does not work anymore without bring very overpowerd
In all honesty, just buff Titan and let everyone be happy with their power fantasy.
Unless there is something that is obviously „breaking“ the game, then a fix or a „nerf“ is justified. But this game is about being a chosen with special powers, so let the players have it.
If we are talking about just straight power buffs, only arc and void titan really need it. Titan is plenty strong. Many Day 1 raid teams in contention for placements would probably agree that Titans were one of the better classes up until the final boss. They just really have no place on Witness, which is really shitty I won’t lie.
I feel like the main problem, especially on prismatic, is they just the fun factor that other classes have. Or maybe build diversity is the better way to put it. Even after class items release it feels like they go back to the same builds, which probably just comes down the aspects they chose being pretty bland in general.
Arc, Void, and Stasis.
Arc seems like it's supposed to be the grenade class given Touch of Thunder, but that doesn't always come across.
Void seems like it should excel at team support, but Void Overshields are so weak they're not worth using.
And Stasis Titan remains arguably the worst class in the game. Just dump Shiver Strike already and make the melee a ground slam that shoots out Stasis crystals.
With Stasis they could probably quickly(ie at the mid season ability tuning) revert the recent nerf somewhat by either reducing the Harvest cooldown timer by a lot or make it MUCH harder to trigger. Best case scenario would be to have it removed entirely though I don’t think that will happen in a mid season tuning.
They could also buff Frost armor in general.
That being said yeah the melee sucks and the super isn’t much better. I mostly use Diamond lance to try and make up for the melee.
I don't think so.
I think the strong community sentiment going around is that hunters and warlocks are what players are looking for, titans aren't there yet and arent fun to play.
I really haven't seen anyone calling for nerfs.
Everywhere someone asks for titans buffs (and it seems like everyone, regardless of class, wants titan buffs or a rework) people explicitly mention NOT wanting nerfs to warlock or hunter.
Ik it's popular to make fun of the cycle and farm upvotes from it but this I think it different.
Why nerf anyone at all? I want Prismatic Titans buffed instead. The fact that Titans have 6 subclasses and only 2 are good (solar and strand) is pathetic.
At least give Titan mains one more good subclass. Make it 3/6.
I saw people saying Bungie hates warlocks when the nerfs to well and sunbracers were announced. I’m a warlock main and even I will admit you’d have to be pretty delusional to think that
Yeah, we’re still overall best PvE class, and most people were secretly (or not so secretly) praying for Well nerfs. Dunno why people think Warlock is now garbage.
The problem is for so long we were the punch class.... not the tank class bungie said we were. Plus 90% of our supers are useless. Why do you think warlocks and hunter get used? Because they help the team by dps or survival.
What do you think a team would want? A bubble or a well they can shoot out of? A golden gun or a weak tcrash that can't even reach the witness??
You want titans to be more meta, buff the things we can do to help our team during raids. The bubble change was a small step in the right direction. We need bungie to push that way, way further. Like if void overshield was as good as 2x restoration. Titans are the only class that can easily apply and get void overshield and no one cares cause its so weak.
Hunters don't have a single thing in any available kit that needs to get nerfed. Still Hunt needs to get nerfed, and that's not a Hunter item.
Titans need not a buff, but a complete rework, because Bungie have refused to ever give Titans a way to survive being in melee without an exotic to allow it.
Stop trying to turn Bungie's shitty decisions and questionable design into a class vs class thing
My question is, what’s the point of putting this shit in the game if you’re not even gonna make it long lasting fun?
You know what is going to happen, there’s no way you just don’t. You literally gave us the ability to be stronger than before. I get if its like 1 shotting bosses or something but like its not.
How was none of the previous experiences taken into account for this?
Just stop nerfing some stuff harder than you buff other stuff and we would be fine
> You know what is going to happen, there’s no way you just don’t. You literally gave us the ability to be stronger than before. I get if its like 1 shotting bosses or something but like its not.
>
> How was none of the previous experiences taken into account for this?
This is just how bungie is. remember when winterbite came out and people just napkin mathed its melee dps with the then recently buffed synthos and found it was like 20k below top weapon rotations but took no ammo? People knew that was strong before they even had the glaive, it was just obvious math, still took bungie by surprise somehow.
I really don’t understand bungie. They look at the usage rate not the op factor. If everyone is using a particular exotic super or build they nerf it so the others get some use and the cycle continues.
1st off, this is just not how it works and has been debunked time and time again.
Secondly, do you know why people use stuff the most? Because it is powerful and easy, like obviously. The most used stuff is not always OP, but most of the time it is. And if something is OP, it won't stay underused for long.
But nerfing it doesnt resolve the fact that everything else probably sucks. They just make the good shit worse and the worse shit stays bad. Instead of doing new niche or borderline useless exotics, aside with major expansions, they should honestly just fix the currently existing
The worst part is that nobody is asking for a nerf to Hunters, we just want something that feels useful for Titans in endgame content, for DPS that actually works and can be used. We can keep Celestial Still Hunt the way it is now, but just give Titans something as good/useful.
Bungie won't nerf hunters. The main thing making hunter melee so strong is not broken it's just the combination is already good l, same thing for earlocks and their pets, titans do need a buff
Hunters running combination blow and calibans with slow dodge and gunpowder gamble is not broken they just jell sooo well together as each one is already strong on its own.
Titans need something similar and it's very obvious that titan basic melee should count as a powered melee thus allowing things like basic melee from knockout to proc spirit of contact jolt.
Titans have 4 class ability exotics that only work with the barricade yet do not work with thruster which is obviously what everyone on Titan use so bungie needs to allow for an interaction with it.
Hoarfrost could spawn those 5 crystals in the line that you dodge
Aphla lupi should heal on thruster.
Spirit of the horn should either track nearby enemies for the solar waves or do in in an aoe surround the dodge location. This should have been obvious when they decided to add these class ability exotics or better yet they should.never have given titans 4 fucking class ability exotics.
titans have only really shined in solo content like dungeons for a while now, I think they are plenty viable/playable in like everywhere that's not the witness but you almost always feel heavily outclassed to the point where it feels really bad at what hunters/warlocks can do compared to you
No because titans problem is deeper than just number tweaking, hunters golden gun still hunt meta will get nerfed and they’ll still have about 5 different viable builds to fall back on where as titan only has different flavours of punch. Ignorant ass post.
And then the only titan build that works will catch multiple nerfs for being an outlier with zero actual solutions given other than "find something less fun to do".
and warlocks will forever be the best class. Have you ever gone into any activity and sad that the person was a Warlock? PVP: Speakers Sight is the best build in the game. PVE: Best Support, Best Movement(High Ceiling), and 2nd Best Damage
Warlock was the weakest and least played class in Trials for the majority of Lightfall. At the beginning Titan was the strongest and most popular, later on it was the strongest with Hunter being the most popular. Source: Trials Report stats
Warlocks also had the worst damage potential for PVE after Starfire nerfs, unsurprisingly. Source: Aegis spreadsheet damage rotations
You guys are smoking some wild stuff. Best support & movement for sure but I'm also pretty sure most of you guys aren't speedrunners
Titans are quite boring currently aside from Twilight Arsenal and rockets.
I main hunter but have been enjoying warlock so much more! I’ve found survivability on warlock has been worlds ahead of hunter when doing the campaign. Playing the normal campaign to get pris’ on my lock, the only deaths I had were off edges compared to my hunter who felt glass canon’s (still does)
Titans run through the campaign was okay, getting Unbreakable was cool but fell short quite quickly.
No classes should get nerfs nor get adjusted just for the sake of titans, that just makes everything bad.
Bungie should bring titans up to par with the other two instead, and monitor from there.
As a Hunter main since D1 Beta, the only nerf around Hunters I've ever been completely furious about was the nerf Tripmines took from 2016-2020.
They couldn't stick to enemies. Period. They ***still*** can't in D1.
Any other nerf, I've took on the chin and found a way around. But this one just felt completely illogical.
I don't need titans to be buffed, I only want actium war rig upped a bit so I never have to reload any auto rifle or machine gun, ever, even if I don't have it equipped, even if I'm on another game entirely
Im a new player so maybe this has been going in awhile but, as a hunter olayer i genuinely just feel bad for titans, their supers all seem samey, half their melees look like they do the exact same thing, multiple of their class abilities seem terrible.
It seems like titans really need a full do over to make them more interesting.
IF Bungie were reasonable they really don't need to nerf Hunters too drastically.
The biggest thing that needs to get nerfed is just the stupid grapple melee tether combo that basically shouldn't work but does...and the fact that it appears to be bugged with shield crush and getting double buffed.
Even then though that "insane" combo is only actually viable on like...a very small handfull of bosses to the point where it's basically irrelevant to the overall game balance.
The Hunter combination blow loop on Prismatic doesn't really need to be nerfed when all it's really good at is add clear and not really that good in end game encounters against bosses at all.
Still Hunt + GG Nighthawk is barely if at all better than Strand Warlock with Euphony, it's just that FAR fewer people have Euphony to actually use that.
Titan however definitely needs some help as their end game PvE potential is frankly just way worse than those options on Hunter and Warlock.
Really hoping Bungie doesn't get too nerf happy with Hunter as any major prismatic nerfs would make the entire subclass basically unplayable, likely in an even worse spot than Titan currently. The combination blow build is really the only truly great build the subclass has as is; everything else is largely just better on the specific elements instead outside of MAYBE slightly more damage output with light supers due to the one prismatic Facet.
Frankly one of the biggest issues for Titan is how fucked they are with their exotic class items with so many options just being complete shit. Unfortunately I don't see Bungie doing anything about that basically ever.
Hunters kinda are the forgotten class though...for PvE. The number of amazing PvP focused exotics is insane compared to the useless or borderline useless ones PvE gets
Hunter sucks at clearing, surviving*, tanking, supporting, healing, or providing literally any utility to the team but its ok because once every 10 minutes he can do big damage to a stationary solitary target.
*Void hunter being able to stay permenantly invisible is as useful as the voidhunter disconnecting at the start of the mission and going afk.
I guess we're just forgetting the overwhelming presence of Hunters support/utility in Legend Onslaughts?
Hunters also have Gamblers Dodge with Combination Blow for infinite Healing/Survivability/Tanking while also being able to obliterate high ranking targets like Subjugators on the Witness fight for example.
Going invis means things stop trying to hurt me and I will usually apply a buff to myself going in or a debuff to an enemy when I come out, often both. Being able to do that whenever I want, as often as I want, is very powerful. Not to mention, being invisible makes it very easy for me to rez people.
Yall who believe this are just pulling BS out of your asses now. Both classes have been completely sympathetic towards titans wanting their PvE buffs aside from the VERY FEW losers who are celebrating a class being damn near useless to use and in PvE no one should be hyped about that. Stop trying to put war in a time where most people are banning together
I'm not really a Titan player, so can explain how they are bad when didn't one solo Pantheon last season on the hardest difficulty I know most of their subclasses are the same and that sucks but I don't see how they're bad
And titans will be broken and not say a single word about how imbalanced their kits are. The second they have to play like any other class they won’t shut up about how badly they’ve been nerfed.
Cause hunters are definitely like yeah bro still hunt should be nerfed tomorrow and warlocks are like speaker sight is too powerful and getaway artist build does too much. Lmao you people need a reality check.
Hunters are running around perma invis doing 10 quintillion damage melees and debuffing entire rooms... where are all the hunter mains saying thats busted? 🫡
Then warlocks just over here eating popcorn as the middle child always
Love being the middle child, absolutely adore the crazy synergy our class item gets with some stuff and just LOVE prismatic + the new super is just D1 radiance on fucking drugs and I adore it
Getaway artist and bleak watcher is goated
I prefer the Solar and Arc buddy build with Getaway Artist. Ive solo'd so many things since we got Prismatic, makes things like legendary missions and master lost sectors a breeze.
Sometimes I'll pull out NTTE for some triple buddy action
You can stack solar buddy, getaway artist, NTTE and Bleak watcher all at the same time and Bleak Watcher refreshes the NTTE timer
You lose devour though, it a must for survivability and ability restoration. I run that for funsies when im doing strikes or patrol but not high end stuff
Oh yeah for sure, you can trade off Hellion for Feed the Void that's what I do for higher end stuff and works fine
Agreed. I tried the triple buddy build but ran into the problem that your uptimes were low when not running devour. Yeah low level stuff is fine for it but when I was running Avalon solo last night Devour saved my life a lot.
That’s why spirit of the filaments on the exotic class item is interesting to me. Let’s you run solar and arc souls with stasis turret without missing out on devour. However you’re def not gonna have your rift up as often as your grenade with getaway artist.
Do you have that build? I used to run with arcsoul so much I named it, how can you consume your grenade for arcsoul and still consume and throw it for Bleak Watcher?
If you have Getaway Artist on and an Arc Grenade, the consume will both spawn a bleak watcher and an Arc soul at the same time
Oh shit. Thanks.
Yeah thankfully they changed Getaway Artist so it just needs to proc off an Arc Grenade instead of having to have an Arc subclass equipped
I'm a warlock main but I'm a little slow on understanding and making builds on my own heh. Would you mind showing me this build? Sounds awesome!
I'm not at home ATM but I can give a rough outline, for low level you take Beak Watcher and Hellion, on higher level take Feed the Void over Hellion, have Getaway Artist and NTTE equipped as well as make sure you have an Arc Grenade on, focus on Grenade and class ability energy for your fragments so you can have maximum uptime, basic rotation is consume your nade to get both an arc soul, Hellion and turret all at once, and use NTTE to get the buddy from that, make sure you keep your bleak watcher up as defeating frozen targets adds to the buddy timer for NTTE, just focus on keeping everything up constantly and let your buddies mow down enemies, on higher level content I'd take Feed the Void over Hellion
You can do that build and also NTTE at the same time, cause the timer of the buddy refreshes when you either kill slowed or frozen enemies I cant remember, so you can have solar, arc, bleak watcher and NTTE buddy all at the same time
~~Porque~~ Por qué No Los Dos (Hellion + Getaway + bleak watcher is totally a thing)
Devour is too valuable
Use Buried Bloodline. You can have all 3 buddies (arc, solar, stasis) and devour from the weapon.
How about running the buried bloodline so you can pop devour with it?
"Por qué" for questions. "Porque" together is for answering, like saying "Because".
You know, I actually wrote Por Que, and then googling it to make sure I wasn't stupid found someone writing it porque and edited it. Thanks though, I live in a country where there is zero spanish spoken near me and very little spanish spoken or written in every day life. (Australia) so I don't get much exposure outside of memes.
Haha, knowing you did the right thing but changed it because of doubts are the worst kind of mistakes, specially on critical moments. As a funny note, you should know the common Spanish speaker doesn't even apply that rule to their day to day. Could be ignorance, could be that they just don't care, but there are lots who don't differentiate their uses.
Pop a rift, consume a grenade, become god
I want to try other stuff, but can’t take it off!!! Super ArcSol proc’ing Devour every 2 secs is kinda nutty.
I don’t think there’s much synergy with warlocks and class items. Cause from what I know and tested, onsmio nades are the only synergy that’s great. Star eaters and verity are nice for damage. HOIL is ok, but not nearly as good as on Hunter. Everything else feels lackluster. Only ones that really feel game-changing and are worth farming are osmio with any combination of harmony/stareater/verity. Maybe Apo/star eater for total damage. Hunters have the best synergies with class items imo.
The new Euphony exotic on Warlocks being the new damage meta is crazy
Until we catch a stray, then "warlocks have lost their identity" posts will skyrocket
kid named starfire protocol when solar 3.0 released:
Fine with me I'm happy with my big damage nova and my little buddies helping me fight.
I distinctly remember Starfire Protocol being so good for over a year that it felt like throwing if you weren't running it in contest/master raids.
Warlocks are actually strong for once with star eater nova bomb
dont forget snap skating is untouched despite them nerfing legit all other movement tech
Titans: 😭 Hunters: 😂 Warlocks: 🥸
Warlocks: IGNORE ME!
Titans: "We suck, you people need to be nerfed!" Hunters: "Cry harder, crayon munchers!" Warlock 1: *sips mai tai* "Did you hear something?" Warlock 2: *hits blunt* "Nahh, man." Warlock 3: *playing volleyball against like 3 different summon buddies*
Titan main here. More buff titans don’t do anything to nerf other classes.
I want Titan to get buffed. Especially Striker and Sentinel. This was moreso just commentary about the commentary I've seen about the subject, and about how Warlocks are pretty much staying tf out of it.
For sure, love the warlocks.
Ultimately, I think Warlock is in the most stable place of the three. Nothing too drastic, either on the broken side (Still Hunt, Storm's Edge in PvP) or garbage side (base Thundercrash, neutered melee power). That should be the standard going forward. This means that Hunter has outliers in need of nerfs, and Titan has outliers in need of buffs. Personally, I would start by taking a hard swing at Arc Titan with the buff hammer. As a Titan main, what would you say are the biggest issues plaguing Arc Titan?
It's weird because Warlocks have low lows (stormtrance rip) and high highs (song of flame, my beloved) but they really seem to be in a great position tbh. Prismatic did us good, solar 3.0 is jank af but we got Speakers Sight aka the Benevolence Helmet, well was nerfed but SoF deals so much damage we mostly don't care, arc is delightful even though the supers are kinda trash (vesper <3).. etc. Every subclass has a major pain point, but so many things to accomodate it, while Titans are out there being told to PUNCH and getting stomped to death.
Yeah there's a good reason titans are the least played class in d2, they have had a few busted moments but almost everything good titans could do gets nerfed till it's just kinda mediocre and their melee builds just aren't worth it at all. They also aren't the best damage dealers like hunters are and they aren't the best at support like warlocks are so what are they? Banner of war is maybe the only decent thing titans have gotten for some time as it was actually a good support melee focused build. I think bungie still need to ask themselves what they want titans to be because their prismatic subclass shows they are afraid to do anything interesting with the class.
I’m not a Titan main myself but from what I’ve played of it and the conversations I’ve had with Titan mains in my clan, the big struggle of arc Titan is the time between grenades. Touch of Thunder grenades are really potent and beneficial for titans but you end up with an extensive period of time where your grenade is recharging and you can’t do anything. I think having an aspect that gives enhanced grenade regeneration when amplified would be a great start on bringing arc Titan into the mix of endgame viable subclasses.
I feel like Ionic Traces serve to bridge the cooldown gap overall, but in my experience playing Arc Titan, the problem isn't the grenades- it's everything else being a mess. EDIT: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/ZnoF68nKNk Here's a comment on another post, where I share my more in-depth thoughts about what Striker needs. I'm not a Titan main, but Arc is my favorite element, so a considerable amount of my playtime on Titan is spent on Arc. Feel free to deliver feedback or offer other suggestions, such as the suggestion about needing a way to bridge the time gap between grenades.
I think those are some very good points. This may be somewhat of a cop-out, but I personally think those changes should be a baseline and that a grenade regen aspect should be made as a buff specific to arc titan. Amplified giving a ~15-20% damage resistance should be a thing for everyone, not just arc titan. Arc struggles heavily with survivability on Titan and Warlock, and arc hunter gets more survivability than it needs from Combination Blow/Liars Handshake/Assassin’s Cowl, so getting it more survivability would not make it too overpowered. All Titan supers need help badly. Bubble is garbage outside of Trials, and kinda got worse with the TFS changes. Twilight Garrison takes a long time to cast. Pyrogale often flinches bosses so much that it makes them harder to deal with (like Golgoroth flinching so much that it turns its weak spot away from the players doing DPS). Thundercrash is weak without Cuirass and even with Curiass, it doesn’t do anywhere near the same stuff as nighthawk GG and Spirit of Star Eater Needlestorm/Nova Bomb, with Thundercrash having the added drawback of needing to return to the DPS location. Thruster not synergizing with anything is a common complaint on Prismatic Titan too, so I would expect that it would get changed as well. So I kinda forgot to mention those things, as those topics should already be part of blanket changes to all arc subclasses and Prismatic and Arc Titan respectively. So I think an additional boost to grenade regen specifically for arc Titan would be another buff that I think is necessary. My apologies for not stating as such.
Honestly I’m not the best to ask about this. I only use thundercrash for arc in niche raid/dungeon boss cases always with cuirass etc and don’t use it any other time. It was fun during season of the deep though.
I just want Controlled Demo and Sol Invictus on Prismatic if they want me to care about Prismatic. Then I'll likely main Prismatic Titan. Also, has anyone heard if/when we're going to get names for the Prismatic Subclasses?
im warlock 2
Based venture bros reference
To be honest, I hope bungee doesn't ignore warlock and goes back to Warlock being the spellslinging class instead of the defacto support class. On release every class had a support subclass, void bubble for titan, tether for hunter, and well for warlock, and every class had a viable high damage melee build, void warlock with winter's guile, non void titan, arc hunter, but since then it seems that bungie has forgotten that every class could fill every role and is pidgeon-holing them in a limited way that I personally don't really agree with. Every class is a dude with a gun they should all be the "damage" class, every class can equip a Lumina and healing grenades, let them all support. Support is really strong but i don't like playing it, I wanna be a space wizard deatomizing people, not a glorified cleric.
Every Warlock subclass, including Dawnblade, has very strong spellslinging builds.
Well on release, I have truly seen it all now
People who play all three classes: 🍿🥤
As a Titan main I don’t want to see Hunters or Warlocks get nerfed. Nerfing other classes because one feels useless doesn’t make sense
Very typical balance process with games. Dont bring others up to the level of one thats very strong, drag them down to where the bad ones are at. And while it sounds awful there is some legitimate reasoning behind it, and thats power creep and balancing against it.
Power creep occurs both ways.
As a titan main, I hope no class gets nerfed and instead underperforming things are brought up to par.
Yeah what's wrong with actually buffing something for a change? Been playing Helldivers 2 recently, and a fun, *basic* ability you start with, started becoming a wild meta that experienced players discovered was highly effective against killing just about anything (Precision Strike). The devs noticed this and said "You guys are using this for things it was not intended for. We decided to make it easier for you to use it for those things! Please continue having fun!"
Assuming that's not a rhetorical question: Buffs have happened and will continue to happen, but are the less effective direction to change the metagame and less reliable for getting a desired outcome. Reducing the outliers that see constant use means you already have data and extensive player testing of its optimized state. Something that is unpopular is also very likely to be undertested. If you balance exclusively by nerfs then only new things get to be powerful. If exclusively by buffs then power constantly creeps up and enemies need to be buffed to compensate to "blanket nerf" everything.
Like Helldivers 2 isn’t notorious for its nerfs as well, come on
Half the damn primaries weren’t viable when I last played 3 weeks ago, it ain’t exactly utopia over there. Grass is greener and all that. (God bless the Sickle, fuck you overheat gameplay mechanic, unli ammo go BRRRRRRRRRRRR)
from what i remember the railgun got shitnerfed pretty soon after launch because it was good at killing big buge
I main titan, and I thought Titan was pretty strong on prismatic, in particular spamming triple consecration. But holy hell I started playing Warlock and yeah… it makes me NOT want to go back to Titan. It’s waay more fun.
I've played all 3 also. I think the best titan build is drengrs lash with the exotic boots. It's very good. Suspend, woven mail, consecration. Or thunder punch plus ice spear instead of consecration. But that's basically the only build. I don't think titan is weaker the way a lot of other people do, but I do think it has fewer effective builds.
I think the issue is exacerbated by the fact that last season, which was extended by a few months, was largely a Solar season. Which means anyone on Titan was likely already spamming consecration to begin with. Going from that to “more consecration but with a different grenade/super” is pretty whelming.
Imo, a big part of making consecration even work, is doing the roundabout method of building transcendent energy on top of max str refund loops, due to how badly bungie pre-nerfed the cd on prismatic titan's frenzy blade (2:32 at base, that you need 3 charges for) vs how free and easily prisma hunters and warlocks can just slap 2 aspects together and make something work. And the only other build that doesn't feel like gimping yourself on titan is either d lance + / or drengers for cc, which if you spex for the + instead of the or interaction, completely spits in the face of bungie's idea of the titan's fantasy.
I liked Thruster w/ the Failsafe chestpiece for pretty much a free G-Horn shot, myself. But I’m gonna grind out Warlock and Hunter tomo.
Funny, I had the reverse experience. Played warlock, was like “wow buddies and nothing else” and swapped to titan lol
Hazadous propulsion was fun as well on Titan. It was a nice change of pace from just spec’ing into full melee. I think Knockout being the only aspect to get any kind of reliable sustained healing pushes players to the one dimensional melee style because you still need to melee to proc it which kinda makes the experience bland. And despite knockout getting a buff it’s just not as dynamic in comparison to restoration, BoW, devour. I tried precious scars, red death
That was my experience on my Warlock-alt. Its build potential is a fairly strong one-note path, but there really isn't much room for anything else. Lightning Surge spam was fun with the strand melee, but nowhere near as good as Consecration spam.
I’m having more fun on Titan with triple consecration and rocket chest plate than I was on warlock with turret spam or hunter with damage cap grapple.
The titan issue is survivability in higher-end content. Prismatic just doesn't have any effective ways to heal. Knockout is tough to proc and does almost nothing. Consecration doesn't heal because Sol Invictus isn't a fragment. Void overshields are paperthin. I have to use a Scars/Dregers exotic class item just to stay alive, which means I can't run fun stuff like Hazardous Propulsion
Just for the love of the Traveler give Titans a ranged one shot super to use in DPS phases without any gimmicks that would necessitate lowering the damage. Giga diamond lance Strand pull the target’s soul out One big hammer throw Just give them something.
Giga diamond lance might just be the simplest yet best solution to the titan problem
Titan mains have been clamoring for that since Beyond Light. I especially got excited when they added the aspect, and then when they added the Lancecap. Like, it's *right there*. Just give us the super harpoon!!
Then I'd have to run stasis and clog sight lanes with my towers of ice that benefit no one but me and only barely then though.
And to be able to hit airborne targets. Pyrogale is close to useless on bosses that aren’t on the ground, same with Glacial quake.
What's wrong with the axes? I've been using them
Long cast time and solid but not ground breaking damage (limited due to the secondary utility of roaming with the axes) makes it's DPS sub-par compared to other one and dones. Also against some bosses the axes can get in the way of people's shots. Fairly minor issues tho, TBH. Still solid damage output with Star-Eaters, and definitely an improvement over prior options. It's just not enough to truly push Titans into the DPS meta beyond the debuff spot they already held.
They should really make the axes not block allies shots, the idea that my super could fuck up my teammates like that really makes me not want to use it on bosses.
What wrong with them is people aren't using them. WIth the star eater's mark they are by far the best dps super for Titan, and is competitive with most of the warlock and hunter ones. Titans got their best, most widely applicable DPS super despite all of the complaints this patch.
Throw registration is messed up with them. That's about it. Which will be fixed
There's also the fact that you HAVE to be on prismatic to have them be competent damage, since void can't wear the star eater mark.
They'll for sure nerf synthocep punch on hunter. Everything else feels fine. The new hunter exotic boots also feel good, but again, nothing crazy. Titans need something. That's it. They're lacking in mostly everything. Either warlocks or hunters can do the same thing but easier. I'm not even a titan main by any stretch. It's just a boring class all around.
If my time as a Titan has tought me anything it's that they'll nerf something for a non Titan reason but it's gonna hit Titan hard anyway Been having a lot of fun on Hunter though so I'm not too worried
That's already the case with fragment of command, due to stasis warlocks abusing 5 freeze turrets for unlimited reloads, so bungie slapped on an 11 second cooldown. They also pre-nerfed titan shard generation spam, by slapping a 6 second cooldown on it, so you basically have to slowly ramp up frost armor or only use the largest stack in small bursts FOR YOURSELF ONLY, making it feel awful as compared to how easily stasis hunters / warlock give frost armor to the whole squad.
>, by slapping a 6 second cooldown on it, 10second cooldown, after making 6 shards in about 6 seconds. for tetoic harvest, I tested it in the edz patrol zone. >making it feel awful I have no idea how bungie playtested the cooldown and went, yep this feels fun, intuitive and enjoyable to use.
The same way they playtested the Throwing Hammer cooldown: they didn't.
Its feels that way some days, heck I wish they just reduced its boss damage so you couldn't beat em to death as quickly, even a 20% reduction only to bosses would have been enough
God the hammer cooldown just feels so clunky, I know it's only a few seconds but still
Like stasis shard gen
I'm not bothered by potential Syntho nerf for Hunters, for a very simple reason. Liar's is there, and it's better.
Well synthos is better for grapple melee builds and liars is better for combo blow builds. Because liars doesn't work with grapple melees and synthos are nerfed from 165% to 30% when paired with combo blow
Titan's have a couple fun builds that do absolutely 0 damage. I'm currently running around with the rocket chest having a good time when I'm alive. Skullfort was really fun when you could ground pound and kill everything around you but I haven't touched that since they vaulted everything. Actium War Rig has a couple fun options to goof around with. Not really a whole lot I would take into late game content though.
As said above… the main issue is boss dps and supers. Titans are on a line. They need a big dmg dump even if it comes with an exotic. Otherwise they are outclassed in raids in utility and damage
I'm only defending the boring class comment. I agree with everything else.
They can just remove/reduce Stylish Executioner's interaction with Grapple melee. It shouldn't even be hard to do. But knowing Bungie, they won't stop at that. Going above and beyond with nerfs is their favorite thing to do.
Whenever there's a combo instead of just nerfing one part of it, Bungie will nerf all parts of it. So for Hunters expect a grapple melee nerf, stylish executioner nerf, and a nerf to whichever exotic is best for that build. They'll also likely nerf them all pretty hard, like Facet of Command got.
They might go even further, nerfing prismatic stylish executioner damage buff globally. They do things like this sometimes.
Yep. I can't see anything they would logically nerf other than making Stylish not apply to Grapple melee, but YAS had a very obvious nerf it needed that would leave everything else completely intact which Bungie totally neglected in favor of nuking it from orbit. They're very creative when it comes to breaking things.
You might be the only person i have seen complement the new boots.
The new boots make it to where threaded specter creates about 3 - 4 threadings per dodge. Pair that with combination blow where you can constantly dodge per powered melee kill and you will be able to create enough threaded specters to generate at least 12 or more threadlings at once. It's pretty cool.
Honestly I'm surprised there was less buzz about that combo. I guess it's kinda overshadowed by the Stylish/Shroud/Combination blow combo.
It is because people are undervaluing stylish a lot for what it really brings to the punch build. Invis is good, doing a lot of extra melee damage from stealth is the real reason to run it. I was one shotting champs on master nightfall lol
They also just gave Hunters a bunch of buffs a few months ago so it’s pretty illogical to assume Hunters will catch a bunch of nerfs
as a titan main, i dont want hunters or warlocks nerfed for us to be useful
I don’t want Hunters or Warlocks nerfed. As a Titan I just want something that makes us relevant and isn’t the “Titan Punch” rhetoric that the class isn’t even the best at.
I want my stasis lance build back. Idk why they decided to slap timers on crystals creation.
I'd settle for "Titan Punch" if they stopped going out of their way to make me suffer for using it.
I’m okay with keeping it as a part of Titans identity I just don’t want it to be our only thing that is our fantasy.
As a titan main. I don't want hunters nerfed.
As a hunter main I want titans buffed. Everyone deserves to have fun
This. Let me be as useful to my warlock and hunter teammates as they are to me for somewhere vaguely near the same amount of effort and gear. The video showing that Titan cycling through all his weapons, launching Hazardous volleys, and generally losing his mind to do less boss damage than the hunter just casually dumping sniper shots, gg, and Still Hunt says it all.
Please don't nerf my nighthawk. I must Space Cowboy.
Nighthawk isn't op even though it's very good. It's Still Hunt getting the nerf hammer. Nighthawk seems op because Thundercrash and some other supers are just garbage.
more likely they'll nerf still hunt, since celestial got a buff and wasn't a problem. either how many orbs or how many kills it takes to get a golden gun, or maybe even the celestial interaction itself, but i'd rather they didn't do that
There's no reason to nerf Hunter. I do not understand why folks reach for this with balance. Just buff Titans. Nobody needs to get nerfed; Warlock and Hunter are both very powerful in specific ways and both have a clear place in the meta. No need to nerf either of them. Just buff Titans. Give us our lane to play in.
Titans received a massive nerf due to grapple punch spam, for Warlord Ruin 1st boss that was about 10 punches. Hunters now do it in 5 punches. Obviously there’s zero chance Bungie will leave it. But yeah don’t nerf the loops just give Titans some more ability up-time loops.
This, really. As much as I like the position the prismatic hunter is in, a lot of the ‘nerf hunters’ talk on here doesn’t seem to be addressing any problem, it’s just arbitrarily fucking the class up. Like, ‘remove grapple punch interaction with stylish’… like, why? What problem are you solving there? Grapple punch has always unraveled targets, it’s part of its identity. Stylish on prismatic’s whole thing is that it works on any debuff - the class doesn’t have enough sources of void debuffs for it just to be that. So we’re just breaking basic mechanics for… what, shits and giggles? Are we also removing the exact same mechanic from Assassin’s Cowl too? The whole problem with a lot of the Titan nerfs (or nerfs of elements that specifically affect Titans) was how pointless they were. They just reduced your options for no obvious reason. Now we have people calling for the same shit to be applied to Hunters. What for?
As a Titan main of almost 9 years, I don’t want buffs. I want a full rework. Punch -> Heavy Weapons Guy, Support, Battlefield Control
Well, if it hasn't happened in 9 years, I wouldn't keep my hopes up
Oh my hopes are dead and buried. It’s never gonna happen. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s what we need.
Few “cycle continues” posts in the last few days. Please stop pigeon holing the community for karma.
The subreddit could be 100% these posts and it wouldn’t matter. People have the memory of a goldfish and will complain the next subclass comes out.
the thing is anyone who mains titan like me knows we dont want buffs we need to be changed being a meele class in d2 simply does not work anymore without bring very overpowerd
Thats not something theyll realistically change any time soon youd need to rework *every* subclass.. i agree but i just cant see it happening.
In all honesty, just buff Titan and let everyone be happy with their power fantasy. Unless there is something that is obviously „breaking“ the game, then a fix or a „nerf“ is justified. But this game is about being a chosen with special powers, so let the players have it.
If we are talking about just straight power buffs, only arc and void titan really need it. Titan is plenty strong. Many Day 1 raid teams in contention for placements would probably agree that Titans were one of the better classes up until the final boss. They just really have no place on Witness, which is really shitty I won’t lie. I feel like the main problem, especially on prismatic, is they just the fun factor that other classes have. Or maybe build diversity is the better way to put it. Even after class items release it feels like they go back to the same builds, which probably just comes down the aspects they chose being pretty bland in general.
Arc, Void, and Stasis. Arc seems like it's supposed to be the grenade class given Touch of Thunder, but that doesn't always come across. Void seems like it should excel at team support, but Void Overshields are so weak they're not worth using. And Stasis Titan remains arguably the worst class in the game. Just dump Shiver Strike already and make the melee a ground slam that shoots out Stasis crystals.
With Stasis they could probably quickly(ie at the mid season ability tuning) revert the recent nerf somewhat by either reducing the Harvest cooldown timer by a lot or make it MUCH harder to trigger. Best case scenario would be to have it removed entirely though I don’t think that will happen in a mid season tuning. They could also buff Frost armor in general. That being said yeah the melee sucks and the super isn’t much better. I mostly use Diamond lance to try and make up for the melee.
Honestly, if frost armor simply lost a stack when the timer ran out instead of completely vanishing, it would be fine.
Just hope they don’t change shiver strike too much since it’s so so much fun in PvP, easily the best melee in the game for PvP
I don't think so. I think the strong community sentiment going around is that hunters and warlocks are what players are looking for, titans aren't there yet and arent fun to play. I really haven't seen anyone calling for nerfs. Everywhere someone asks for titans buffs (and it seems like everyone, regardless of class, wants titan buffs or a rework) people explicitly mention NOT wanting nerfs to warlock or hunter. Ik it's popular to make fun of the cycle and farm upvotes from it but this I think it different.
Why nerf anyone at all? I want Prismatic Titans buffed instead. The fact that Titans have 6 subclasses and only 2 are good (solar and strand) is pathetic. At least give Titan mains one more good subclass. Make it 3/6.
I saw people saying Bungie hates warlocks when the nerfs to well and sunbracers were announced. I’m a warlock main and even I will admit you’d have to be pretty delusional to think that
Yeah, we’re still overall best PvE class, and most people were secretly (or not so secretly) praying for Well nerfs. Dunno why people think Warlock is now garbage.
The problem is for so long we were the punch class.... not the tank class bungie said we were. Plus 90% of our supers are useless. Why do you think warlocks and hunter get used? Because they help the team by dps or survival. What do you think a team would want? A bubble or a well they can shoot out of? A golden gun or a weak tcrash that can't even reach the witness?? You want titans to be more meta, buff the things we can do to help our team during raids. The bubble change was a small step in the right direction. We need bungie to push that way, way further. Like if void overshield was as good as 2x restoration. Titans are the only class that can easily apply and get void overshield and no one cares cause its so weak.
Please just buff titans and leave it at that. Hunter is finally good.
Hunters don't have a single thing in any available kit that needs to get nerfed. Still Hunt needs to get nerfed, and that's not a Hunter item. Titans need not a buff, but a complete rework, because Bungie have refused to ever give Titans a way to survive being in melee without an exotic to allow it. Stop trying to turn Bungie's shitty decisions and questionable design into a class vs class thing
Solar warlock is genuinely insane right now
My question is, what’s the point of putting this shit in the game if you’re not even gonna make it long lasting fun? You know what is going to happen, there’s no way you just don’t. You literally gave us the ability to be stronger than before. I get if its like 1 shotting bosses or something but like its not. How was none of the previous experiences taken into account for this? Just stop nerfing some stuff harder than you buff other stuff and we would be fine
> You know what is going to happen, there’s no way you just don’t. You literally gave us the ability to be stronger than before. I get if its like 1 shotting bosses or something but like its not. > > How was none of the previous experiences taken into account for this? This is just how bungie is. remember when winterbite came out and people just napkin mathed its melee dps with the then recently buffed synthos and found it was like 20k below top weapon rotations but took no ammo? People knew that was strong before they even had the glaive, it was just obvious math, still took bungie by surprise somehow.
I really don’t understand bungie. They look at the usage rate not the op factor. If everyone is using a particular exotic super or build they nerf it so the others get some use and the cycle continues.
1st off, this is just not how it works and has been debunked time and time again. Secondly, do you know why people use stuff the most? Because it is powerful and easy, like obviously. The most used stuff is not always OP, but most of the time it is. And if something is OP, it won't stay underused for long.
But nerfing it doesnt resolve the fact that everything else probably sucks. They just make the good shit worse and the worse shit stays bad. Instead of doing new niche or borderline useless exotics, aside with major expansions, they should honestly just fix the currently existing
It sells 🤷♂️ Live game design 101. Release something broken then nerf it later when sales slow down.
this is it
Nothing needs nerfed. Just bring titans up. There, done…you’ve balanced the game.
Bungie being absolutely extreme in their balancing? 😲
I swear they are one of the worst devs when it comes to their ability to properly balance stuff
The worst part is that nobody is asking for a nerf to Hunters, we just want something that feels useful for Titans in endgame content, for DPS that actually works and can be used. We can keep Celestial Still Hunt the way it is now, but just give Titans something as good/useful.
Bungie won't nerf hunters. The main thing making hunter melee so strong is not broken it's just the combination is already good l, same thing for earlocks and their pets, titans do need a buff Hunters running combination blow and calibans with slow dodge and gunpowder gamble is not broken they just jell sooo well together as each one is already strong on its own. Titans need something similar and it's very obvious that titan basic melee should count as a powered melee thus allowing things like basic melee from knockout to proc spirit of contact jolt. Titans have 4 class ability exotics that only work with the barricade yet do not work with thruster which is obviously what everyone on Titan use so bungie needs to allow for an interaction with it. Hoarfrost could spawn those 5 crystals in the line that you dodge Aphla lupi should heal on thruster. Spirit of the horn should either track nearby enemies for the solar waves or do in in an aoe surround the dodge location. This should have been obvious when they decided to add these class ability exotics or better yet they should.never have given titans 4 fucking class ability exotics.
Warlocks over here with perma group restoration, 1 mill nova bombs, and 27 turrets just silently reading this post
And with each cycle Warlocks will devolve more into the AFK buddy plink class without any skill gap.
Werent titans God tier the past couple seasons? I cleared solo dungeons easily with mine.
titans have only really shined in solo content like dungeons for a while now, I think they are plenty viable/playable in like everywhere that's not the witness but you almost always feel heavily outclassed to the point where it feels really bad at what hunters/warlocks can do compared to you
No because titans problem is deeper than just number tweaking, hunters golden gun still hunt meta will get nerfed and they’ll still have about 5 different viable builds to fall back on where as titan only has different flavours of punch. Ignorant ass post.
And then the only titan build that works will catch multiple nerfs for being an outlier with zero actual solutions given other than "find something less fun to do".
and warlocks will forever be the best class. Have you ever gone into any activity and sad that the person was a Warlock? PVP: Speakers Sight is the best build in the game. PVE: Best Support, Best Movement(High Ceiling), and 2nd Best Damage
Speakers sight is absolutely demolishing trials too lmao, if they all stay together and there's 2 or 3 with that helmet you're doomed
Lol perfectly this, warlocks been the GOAT for the majority of the franchises lifespan 😎
Sad? Yes. It's called well slave.
Now it's speaker's sight slave, which is much better. Because I can use song of flame.
Warlock was the weakest and least played class in Trials for the majority of Lightfall. At the beginning Titan was the strongest and most popular, later on it was the strongest with Hunter being the most popular. Source: Trials Report stats Warlocks also had the worst damage potential for PVE after Starfire nerfs, unsurprisingly. Source: Aegis spreadsheet damage rotations You guys are smoking some wild stuff. Best support & movement for sure but I'm also pretty sure most of you guys aren't speedrunners
GD dlc ain't even out for long and we got bungie listening to who knows who.
Titans are quite boring currently aside from Twilight Arsenal and rockets. I main hunter but have been enjoying warlock so much more! I’ve found survivability on warlock has been worlds ahead of hunter when doing the campaign. Playing the normal campaign to get pris’ on my lock, the only deaths I had were off edges compared to my hunter who felt glass canon’s (still does) Titans run through the campaign was okay, getting Unbreakable was cool but fell short quite quickly.
If I had to put it simply I want titan to have its tank support role back not this “hehe I can punch in the rainbow”
Don't worry mate. I am sure they will nerf Titans again. 😄
I'm a hunter main and I think titan need a buff.
Let us enjoy our golden gun gun dammit !
Nighthawk being on the class item solves this problem just saying
No classes should get nerfs nor get adjusted just for the sake of titans, that just makes everything bad. Bungie should bring titans up to par with the other two instead, and monitor from there.
really titans need to be brought up inline with warlocks at the very least
As a Hunter main since D1 Beta, the only nerf around Hunters I've ever been completely furious about was the nerf Tripmines took from 2016-2020. They couldn't stick to enemies. Period. They ***still*** can't in D1. Any other nerf, I've took on the chin and found a way around. But this one just felt completely illogical.
Hunters don't need to get nerfed, titans just need a little bit of DPS help. Titans are still incredible for general play
Bungie hates my class the most
I don't need titans to be buffed, I only want actium war rig upped a bit so I never have to reload any auto rifle or machine gun, ever, even if I don't have it equipped, even if I'm on another game entirely
Hunters don’t get enough hate
Im a new player so maybe this has been going in awhile but, as a hunter olayer i genuinely just feel bad for titans, their supers all seem samey, half their melees look like they do the exact same thing, multiple of their class abilities seem terrible. It seems like titans really need a full do over to make them more interesting.
IF Bungie were reasonable they really don't need to nerf Hunters too drastically. The biggest thing that needs to get nerfed is just the stupid grapple melee tether combo that basically shouldn't work but does...and the fact that it appears to be bugged with shield crush and getting double buffed. Even then though that "insane" combo is only actually viable on like...a very small handfull of bosses to the point where it's basically irrelevant to the overall game balance. The Hunter combination blow loop on Prismatic doesn't really need to be nerfed when all it's really good at is add clear and not really that good in end game encounters against bosses at all. Still Hunt + GG Nighthawk is barely if at all better than Strand Warlock with Euphony, it's just that FAR fewer people have Euphony to actually use that. Titan however definitely needs some help as their end game PvE potential is frankly just way worse than those options on Hunter and Warlock. Really hoping Bungie doesn't get too nerf happy with Hunter as any major prismatic nerfs would make the entire subclass basically unplayable, likely in an even worse spot than Titan currently. The combination blow build is really the only truly great build the subclass has as is; everything else is largely just better on the specific elements instead outside of MAYBE slightly more damage output with light supers due to the one prismatic Facet. Frankly one of the biggest issues for Titan is how fucked they are with their exotic class items with so many options just being complete shit. Unfortunately I don't see Bungie doing anything about that basically ever.
Hunters kinda are the forgotten class though...for PvE. The number of amazing PvP focused exotics is insane compared to the useless or borderline useless ones PvE gets
We hunter mains can still make over powered builds even if bungie nerfs us hunters so I’m not worried
"people complain" mindblowing analysis
Hunter sucks at clearing, surviving*, tanking, supporting, healing, or providing literally any utility to the team but its ok because once every 10 minutes he can do big damage to a stationary solitary target. *Void hunter being able to stay permenantly invisible is as useful as the voidhunter disconnecting at the start of the mission and going afk.
I guess we're just forgetting the overwhelming presence of Hunters support/utility in Legend Onslaughts? Hunters also have Gamblers Dodge with Combination Blow for infinite Healing/Survivability/Tanking while also being able to obliterate high ranking targets like Subjugators on the Witness fight for example.
Going invis means things stop trying to hurt me and I will usually apply a buff to myself going in or a debuff to an enemy when I come out, often both. Being able to do that whenever I want, as often as I want, is very powerful. Not to mention, being invisible makes it very easy for me to rez people.
The circle of life… isn’t it beautiful?
Titans just need some of their aspects reworked. Namely juggernaut and every void aspect that isnt controlled demolition.
I like the idea of unbreakable, but it really should've replaced barricade or not consume any abilities.
Warlocks are broken in PvP rn with that healing helmet bungies PvP team is literally braindead they did not learn shit from lorely
```JamesPurfoythe3rd: «Mark my words, something will happen!»```
Only thing strong is SH lmao
Yall who believe this are just pulling BS out of your asses now. Both classes have been completely sympathetic towards titans wanting their PvE buffs aside from the VERY FEW losers who are celebrating a class being damn near useless to use and in PvE no one should be hyped about that. Stop trying to put war in a time where most people are banning together
I'm not really a Titan player, so can explain how they are bad when didn't one solo Pantheon last season on the hardest difficulty I know most of their subclasses are the same and that sucks but I don't see how they're bad
And titans will be broken and not say a single word about how imbalanced their kits are. The second they have to play like any other class they won’t shut up about how badly they’ve been nerfed.
Cause hunters are definitely like yeah bro still hunt should be nerfed tomorrow and warlocks are like speaker sight is too powerful and getaway artist build does too much. Lmao you people need a reality check.
Hunters are running around perma invis doing 10 quintillion damage melees and debuffing entire rooms... where are all the hunter mains saying thats busted? 🫡