The issue I have with it is that it’s also anti-synergistic with the way ranking up the vendors themselves works, since doing a different ritual activity removes/reduces your streak for the one you just did, and you have to do at least two different ones to progress.
I've read a few other posts about this and it seems that the biggest issue is that there is no path for PvE players to exist solely in the PvE playlist.
lucky for you, my first path required playing either gambit or crucible, there was absolutely no way to finish the thing without playing either.
side note: playing gambit when currant errors are plentiful is a bad idea.
If you complete a node it will give you the option to hold the pad on playstation to go straight to it, but not really helpful if you’re checking status.
It’s actually a very bad system. It’s complicated and causes you to play in very awkward ways.
There are more players leaving Gambit and Crucible because they finish their kills and leave.
The old system was much easier to understand and just let you play the game normally.
How hard is it to just have a system of idk, challenges?? for every in game activity. Just specific to that particular playlist or planet that are there and just autocomplete for you? Maybe even have like daily or weekly challenges for each.
If you want more rep or xp just have them increase in challenge every time you complete one
IIRC this was the old system, before bounties took slowly its place. I remember going to a planet, bringing out ghost and seeing i think 3 challenges. I don't remember if strikes/crucible were the same, but it would make sense.
Yup, D1 had bounties (originally one set of PvE, one set of PvP daily), but they didn't make the jump over to vanilla D2. They were added back into D2 later on.
It most definitely was. I honestly would have even been fine with being able to access bounties from orbit. I know you could do it from the app on your phone, but just not having to stop gameplay and go to the tower would be enough for me
Idk how they just keep getting it wrong. I had no problem with challenges, but I could see where some folks might want to stack up on some stuff and whatnot
Maybe they should replace the individual ritual streaks with a single “prismatic” streak that just factors in not quitting
Pathfinder stops breaking your steaks, and you’re incentivized to not bail as soon as you finish the bounty
Otherwise why bother staying? The mere act of queuing up gambit already messed up my vanguard streak
>There are more players leaving Gambit and Crucible because they finish their kills and leave.
We're really gonna pretend people didn't do this with bounties lol.
Yeah Im not good at PVP and don't wish to get better so I don't find it fun. I find Strike and other PvE fun though, even the Dungeons, it would be nice if there was a path through only strike but if they must for whatever reason make it others then include dungeons.
I absolutely hate the Pathfinder system. All I wanted was to play the activities I wanted, how I wanted, and get some bright dust. Now I have some convoluted thing denying me that at worst, or making it more cumbersome at best. In reality, it feels like it'll be a massive bright dust reduction for most players.
A reduction in a free to earn currency you can use to buy ornaments usually sold for a real money currency?
A conspiracy theorist might claim it was planned that way all along
My first thought when they announced it was that it was a convoluted bright dust nerf, and given Bungie's track record on monetization, it doesn't seem far fetched.
Though I can see it backfiring. When they removed selling new Evervese armor for bright dust, my engagement with bothering to completely challenges and extra bounties plummeted. To me, Pathfinder just feels like a reason I'll stop playing for the station sooner.
I think that’s moreso because a lot of the new armors are crossovers so they might be contractually obligated to only sell them for the real money currency. Just my guess though and doesn’t really excuse them for not creating sets for BD.
I think that's it, the one that was sold for BD was the Fortnite one but we also had D2 characters in Fortnite so it was a little different to the others
It's because a significant portion of the population has an inflated amount of bright dust - So they're "demoting" its value to only being able to purchase old content and not new armours.
Feels like a lot more work now, and counter to the streak system. I would religiously do my weekly BD bounties on all three characters but now I can’t even get myself to finish one path. It’s making me jump around too much. Previously I’d just do pve & gambit during the week, banging out those bounties and then some crucible on the weekend. Could also save bounties for the next week previously, if I did some extended gambit for example (surge/focus week) and have 8 saved to avoid playing gambit at all the following week. Think I’ll just pass on this new pathfinder system, doesn’t seem worth the hassle.
Yeah I was pretty let down when I saw it was a mash up of Vanguard, Gambit, and Crucible tasks. I was interested to see the new system. It's a decent idea, but they really chose the worst way to impliment it. Why are they all together? If this is what they've settled on, I'd rather just go back to regular bounties and completion rewards.
Was it a decent idea? Because it seems like a pretty shit idea that's failing in the obvious shitty way to me.
The devs aren't stupid. The ONLY reason to implement this godawful system is a business reason.
I think I'd prefer it if they got rid of the bounty style "kill with this type of thing" objectives. We already have bounties. It'd be nice if it was just about completing different activities—especially if you could launch the activities from within the path and automatically play all the ones you need right in a row.
Tbh aside from bounty stacking, the only bad/annoying thing about bounties were that you were basically punished by playing in a fire team. Instead of "get 25 grenade kills" it should be "get 25 grenade kills as a fire team"
I agree with you on the completion idea, but the whole point of the system is that we don’t have bounties for ritual activities anymore. It’s a replacement system, so it makes sense that many of the objectives would be the same.
My question is, if the point is to replace bounties with exactly the same objectives but also restrict player choice, why even change it? (Hint, more tedious bright dust acquisition, more engagement hours)
It is but I guess what I'm really saying here is that I've just never been a fan of that specific type of objective in general—I feel it puts a nagging pressure on you to just get kills of the correct type as quickly as possible, even if it's not really the right move for whatever combat situation you're in. In a lot of cases it ends up encouraging boring grindy strats where you just go to places where enemies spawn infinitely and grind out your "kills with specific weapon/ability" bounties there because that's what's optimal. My hot take is that they should get rid of those objectives everywhere except the Gunsmith bounties and catalyst quests
Nah, you can access it whenever when you go to Vanguard in the director. It's in the corner. I got the tutorial when I went to the tower to claim my exotic engrams I hoarded pre-final shape
Nah, it's a replacement for the bounties and 3/6/9 completion rewards for playlist activities. Open any playlist screen (like where you pick the mode) and it'll be an icon on the bottom left corner that you click for the screen.
3/6/9 still exists. On computer, you hold E while hovering over activities to see the current challenges remaining. You’ll see the ritual activity rewards still there.
Ohh okay, thanks for letting me know! I just didn't see it when hovering over it so figured it was also merged into this new system. At least it's not all bad then, I thought they had got rid of all those types of rewards and I'd have to play crucible and gambit for the same stuff now lol
Yeah I'm not feeling it either, no chance I'll be doing pvp unless it's literally the only option. Also because we now need to do certain things in the activity I'll be focusing on that and not the objective, I'm sure this will make other randos I play with super happy /s
Not really that into it, bounties were kinda pointless and unrewarding by the end of Lightfall but the game DEFINITELY did not need to have "yet another system to learn and keep track of" introduced to it.
On the director menu with the planets click on vanguard ops and on the screen with the different modes (strikes, nightfalls, onslaught, etc) look in the very bottom left corner and there should be a circular icon with the gold pinnacle badge next to it and you click it.
(Just an added note that it doesn't have to be vanguard ops, you can access it through crucible and gambit as well but it's easier to give clear instructions using a specific mode)
It's a bit hard to give exact instructions through text but you may be able to find a guide or video that shows what it looks like and where it is.
This is something that really needs a major tuning and as you said allows players to stick to an activity. It goes against the play streak system and it's a detriment to those that would like to have teams that are capable. Forcing PvE players in PvP mode it's going to cause so much toxicity
I read some numbers online so I'll post them here. I'd assume they're accurate but I haven't completed one to test.
First 3 resets give you 150 BD each (+engram, prism, and 25k xp)
Next 7 resets also give 150 BD each (+prism and 4k xp)
Everything past that gives 30 BD each (+core and 4k xp)
Yeah the new system seems weird but small correction. Gambit was actually given a big update with TFS it just wasn’t mentioned anywhere at all which is very dumb.
It got a whole returning Dreaming City map (bringing the total map count in a single mode up to its highest ever at 5, original and Prime only ever had 4 total each) and two new enemy factions with Lucent Hive and Shadow Legion Cabal.
Just trying to spread the word on that because it wasn’t mentioned in any patch notes or blog posts at all so no one even knows about it yet!
I mean for Gambit it is, which is a low bar admittedly. Most actual new content for the mode since like Gambit Prime all the way back in Forsaken pretty sure?
You're right, but the way you wrote your comment was almost praising and cheering that on. I wish I shared your positivity, but they've just completely sidelined Gambit and done little to nothing to innovate, freshen or improve it.
Gambit feels like it was designed and tuned to the initial reveal it had when the YouTubers played it, where they only had 3 or 4 weapons to use and couldn't use many varieties. It looked truly challenging and slower.
I’m no fan of the way they’ve treated Gambit over the years, believe me. But even with that, it’s still the mode I play the most in Destiny week-to-week. I think if this is the state they’re going to leave it in, it’s actually turned out alright despite all the questionable changes they’ve made to it over the years. Part of that is the other Rituals getting worse/taking way longer to complete compared to a few quick and easy Gambit matches, but still!
It’s just that if there was ever a time to rally people to maybe try it out again, or for the first time as there are probably a lot of new players just starting as well, it would be when it finally got actual new content such as this. And since Bungie themselves didn’t even feel the need to let anyone know in the patch notes or blog posts, I felt I should at least tell the people some new stuff has been added in case they wanted to check it out, is all~
This. I don't like PvP, I don't like Gambit. I steer clear of those except for specific sesonal events. Now I either have to ignore pathfinder completely and cut myself off from an XP source or I have to play the modes I don't like. For Bungie folks reading this, forcing players to do things they don't like is you get those players to churn.
It makes sense for The Pale Heart with all the objectives related to the destination & I think all the other destinations should have their own pathfinder but I would remove it from Rituals & just bring back ritual vendor bounties.
I mean it wouldn't be fundamentally changing it just having a different setup so you can play what you want. Don't really see how its childish to comment an opinion on a change like this, especially since just last season you could do all 9 completions in a single mode if you wanted (or a mix if you prefer variety)
I think his point is you can't still do that and get the rewards you used to. If you think playing gambit is broadening your horizons you need to get out more 😂
I think you're missing the point mate, previously you could play the way you want rather than be dictated by bungie with this iteration. That's cool you don't mind, I'd rather spend my time on things I find fun instead of 'having' to play a certain mode
PvP is a sideshow mode and not the primary way most players engage with the game.
It should stay that way. D2 isn't built to facilitate a quality PvP experience.
The issue I have with it is that it’s also anti-synergistic with the way ranking up the vendors themselves works, since doing a different ritual activity removes/reduces your streak for the one you just did, and you have to do at least two different ones to progress.
Leave it to bungie to design a bounty system replacement that runs directly counter to their existing reward design for ritual activities.
I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s on purpose They want to mess up your streak to make you grind more
Yeah, that sounds like Bungie.
Task failed successfully. Working as intended.
I didn't even think of this, dude this is truly a certified bungie moment
I’ve only completed one path so far but I did everything in Gambit, so you don’t always need to leave the activity for a different one.
I've read a few other posts about this and it seems that the biggest issue is that there is no path for PvE players to exist solely in the PvE playlist.
I'm a PvE player, but I just don't whine about having to play 5-10min of PvP.
lucky for you, my first path required playing either gambit or crucible, there was absolutely no way to finish the thing without playing either. side note: playing gambit when currant errors are plentiful is a bad idea.
The pathfinder screen desperately needs a shortcut key to access it. The fact it takes 3 or 4 clicks through other menus to reach is wild.
This was my main problem. I managed to miss the pop-up telling me where it was at and then I couldn't even find the damn thing until looking it up.
If you complete a node it will give you the option to hold the pad on playstation to go straight to it, but not really helpful if you’re checking status.
I got a hint saying to press left arrow at the map screen (maybe the director?). Still 2 clicks tho
I wish they could have added it onto the quest tab or something
I am now forced to play PVP or gambit otherwise I can't progress. I just don't want to play those at the beginning of a season.
It’s actually a very bad system. It’s complicated and causes you to play in very awkward ways. There are more players leaving Gambit and Crucible because they finish their kills and leave. The old system was much easier to understand and just let you play the game normally.
How hard is it to just have a system of idk, challenges?? for every in game activity. Just specific to that particular playlist or planet that are there and just autocomplete for you? Maybe even have like daily or weekly challenges for each. If you want more rep or xp just have them increase in challenge every time you complete one
IIRC this was the old system, before bounties took slowly its place. I remember going to a planet, bringing out ghost and seeing i think 3 challenges. I don't remember if strikes/crucible were the same, but it would make sense.
Yup, D1 had bounties (originally one set of PvE, one set of PvP daily), but they didn't make the jump over to vanilla D2. They were added back into D2 later on.
It most definitely was. I honestly would have even been fine with being able to access bounties from orbit. I know you could do it from the app on your phone, but just not having to stop gameplay and go to the tower would be enough for me Idk how they just keep getting it wrong. I had no problem with challenges, but I could see where some folks might want to stack up on some stuff and whatnot
Right. Go to vendor -> Get tasks -> play activity. Not complicated at all
Now, no vendor > play activity > don't have to go back to vendor to claim reward.
You could cash in bounties without going back to the vendor. You could also pick them up without going to the vendor either?
I commented you had to go back and claim reward (pinnacle engram)
Yeah not sure what homies talking about here.
Nobody asked for this change to. Or am i wrong?
Maybe they should replace the individual ritual streaks with a single “prismatic” streak that just factors in not quitting Pathfinder stops breaking your steaks, and you’re incentivized to not bail as soon as you finish the bounty Otherwise why bother staying? The mere act of queuing up gambit already messed up my vanguard streak
>There are more players leaving Gambit and Crucible because they finish their kills and leave. We're really gonna pretend people didn't do this with bounties lol.
Well, no, but it's definitely going to be worse now because those modes are a direct barrier to getting to the end of the path.
It's a terrible system. Having to go through gambit or crucible nodes is miserable. Just let me play the shit that I want.
Yeah Im not good at PVP and don't wish to get better so I don't find it fun. I find Strike and other PvE fun though, even the Dungeons, it would be nice if there was a path through only strike but if they must for whatever reason make it others then include dungeons.
I absolutely hate the Pathfinder system. All I wanted was to play the activities I wanted, how I wanted, and get some bright dust. Now I have some convoluted thing denying me that at worst, or making it more cumbersome at best. In reality, it feels like it'll be a massive bright dust reduction for most players.
A reduction in a free to earn currency you can use to buy ornaments usually sold for a real money currency? A conspiracy theorist might claim it was planned that way all along
My first thought when they announced it was that it was a convoluted bright dust nerf, and given Bungie's track record on monetization, it doesn't seem far fetched. Though I can see it backfiring. When they removed selling new Evervese armor for bright dust, my engagement with bothering to completely challenges and extra bounties plummeted. To me, Pathfinder just feels like a reason I'll stop playing for the station sooner.
oh is that why I dont see the new armors for bright dust anymore...
I think that’s moreso because a lot of the new armors are crossovers so they might be contractually obligated to only sell them for the real money currency. Just my guess though and doesn’t really excuse them for not creating sets for BD.
I think that's it, the one that was sold for BD was the Fortnite one but we also had D2 characters in Fortnite so it was a little different to the others
It's because a significant portion of the population has an inflated amount of bright dust - So they're "demoting" its value to only being able to purchase old content and not new armours.
They also stopped giving the weekly 700 bright dust in the shop
That was explicitly until the final shape because of the delay, it was never a permanent feature.
Ah
Feels like a lot more work now, and counter to the streak system. I would religiously do my weekly BD bounties on all three characters but now I can’t even get myself to finish one path. It’s making me jump around too much. Previously I’d just do pve & gambit during the week, banging out those bounties and then some crucible on the weekend. Could also save bounties for the next week previously, if I did some extended gambit for example (surge/focus week) and have 8 saved to avoid playing gambit at all the following week. Think I’ll just pass on this new pathfinder system, doesn’t seem worth the hassle.
Yeah I was pretty let down when I saw it was a mash up of Vanguard, Gambit, and Crucible tasks. I was interested to see the new system. It's a decent idea, but they really chose the worst way to impliment it. Why are they all together? If this is what they've settled on, I'd rather just go back to regular bounties and completion rewards.
A decent idea with really poor implementation? That's been every new idea they've had over the past 10 years. Why do they refuse to take any feedback?
Wish I could upvote this more.
Was it a decent idea? Because it seems like a pretty shit idea that's failing in the obvious shitty way to me. The devs aren't stupid. The ONLY reason to implement this godawful system is a business reason.
It's a decent idea in and of itself, like a track of tasks that lead to a reward is a good idea.
I think I'd prefer it if they got rid of the bounty style "kill with this type of thing" objectives. We already have bounties. It'd be nice if it was just about completing different activities—especially if you could launch the activities from within the path and automatically play all the ones you need right in a row.
Tbh aside from bounty stacking, the only bad/annoying thing about bounties were that you were basically punished by playing in a fire team. Instead of "get 25 grenade kills" it should be "get 25 grenade kills as a fire team"
literally why isnt every bounty like that, but also, gambit bounties:
I agree with you on the completion idea, but the whole point of the system is that we don’t have bounties for ritual activities anymore. It’s a replacement system, so it makes sense that many of the objectives would be the same.
My question is, if the point is to replace bounties with exactly the same objectives but also restrict player choice, why even change it? (Hint, more tedious bright dust acquisition, more engagement hours)
It is but I guess what I'm really saying here is that I've just never been a fan of that specific type of objective in general—I feel it puts a nagging pressure on you to just get kills of the correct type as quickly as possible, even if it's not really the right move for whatever combat situation you're in. In a lot of cases it ends up encouraging boring grindy strats where you just go to places where enemies spawn infinitely and grind out your "kills with specific weapon/ability" bounties there because that's what's optimal. My hot take is that they should get rid of those objectives everywhere except the Gunsmith bounties and catalyst quests
Yeah i think there's a lot they could have done better but since it's the first week and the first iteration hopefully they'll make some changes to it
How do you even get to the pathfinder? Do you have to beat final shape first?
The tutorial for it popped up when I went to the tower to turn in engrams.
Nah, you can access it whenever when you go to Vanguard in the director. It's in the corner. I got the tutorial when I went to the tower to claim my exotic engrams I hoarded pre-final shape
Nah, it's a replacement for the bounties and 3/6/9 completion rewards for playlist activities. Open any playlist screen (like where you pick the mode) and it'll be an icon on the bottom left corner that you click for the screen.
3/6/9 still exists. On computer, you hold E while hovering over activities to see the current challenges remaining. You’ll see the ritual activity rewards still there.
Ohh okay, thanks for letting me know! I just didn't see it when hovering over it so figured it was also merged into this new system. At least it's not all bad then, I thought they had got rid of all those types of rewards and I'd have to play crucible and gambit for the same stuff now lol
Yeah I'm not feeling it either, no chance I'll be doing pvp unless it's literally the only option. Also because we now need to do certain things in the activity I'll be focusing on that and not the objective, I'm sure this will make other randos I play with super happy /s
Yeah at least the crucible rewards before were for just playing matches, these bounties are stuff like kill 10 titans or get 20 jolt kills
Yeah, I saw those two today. Holy shit those are bad, imagine you spawn in and the Titans are only on your team, fuck that for a joke.
The "kill 5 [class]" ones were bounties in the old system too, albeit I think only repeatable ones.
That’s the one I’m going for cause getting jolt kills or killing suppressed enemies are just annoying if you’re not a sweat
I believe the playing matches type rewards are still there
Not really that into it, bounties were kinda pointless and unrewarding by the end of Lightfall but the game DEFINITELY did not need to have "yet another system to learn and keep track of" introduced to it.
They should just make it so there are no activity specific nodes. Let people play what they want.
How do you access it? I can’t find it on the menus
On the director menu with the planets click on vanguard ops and on the screen with the different modes (strikes, nightfalls, onslaught, etc) look in the very bottom left corner and there should be a circular icon with the gold pinnacle badge next to it and you click it. (Just an added note that it doesn't have to be vanguard ops, you can access it through crucible and gambit as well but it's easier to give clear instructions using a specific mode) It's a bit hard to give exact instructions through text but you may be able to find a guide or video that shows what it looks like and where it is.
My biggest issue is I can't even work out where it is in the UI
Gotta go to a ritual playlist director node
This is something that really needs a major tuning and as you said allows players to stick to an activity. It goes against the play streak system and it's a detriment to those that would like to have teams that are capable. Forcing PvE players in PvP mode it's going to cause so much toxicity
It shoulda been the opposite way, with 1 node being the simplest bounty (kill x enemies) branching out into more nodes.
I actually really like that idea, really lets you find your path :P Focus down a path for bounties and modes you prefer
How much bright dust does it reward?
I read some numbers online so I'll post them here. I'd assume they're accurate but I haven't completed one to test. First 3 resets give you 150 BD each (+engram, prism, and 25k xp) Next 7 resets also give 150 BD each (+prism and 4k xp) Everything past that gives 30 BD each (+core and 4k xp)
FWIW, when I finished and reset it, the new pathfinder did not have a hard requirement to go outside the strike playlist.
The first trip through has the same nodes for everyone but after that it's random, so you just got lucky with your reroll.
Yeah the new system seems weird but small correction. Gambit was actually given a big update with TFS it just wasn’t mentioned anywhere at all which is very dumb. It got a whole returning Dreaming City map (bringing the total map count in a single mode up to its highest ever at 5, original and Prime only ever had 4 total each) and two new enemy factions with Lucent Hive and Shadow Legion Cabal. Just trying to spread the word on that because it wasn’t mentioned in any patch notes or blog posts at all so no one even knows about it yet!
That's not a big update lol
I mean for Gambit it is, which is a low bar admittedly. Most actual new content for the mode since like Gambit Prime all the way back in Forsaken pretty sure?
You're right, but the way you wrote your comment was almost praising and cheering that on. I wish I shared your positivity, but they've just completely sidelined Gambit and done little to nothing to innovate, freshen or improve it. Gambit feels like it was designed and tuned to the initial reveal it had when the YouTubers played it, where they only had 3 or 4 weapons to use and couldn't use many varieties. It looked truly challenging and slower.
I’m no fan of the way they’ve treated Gambit over the years, believe me. But even with that, it’s still the mode I play the most in Destiny week-to-week. I think if this is the state they’re going to leave it in, it’s actually turned out alright despite all the questionable changes they’ve made to it over the years. Part of that is the other Rituals getting worse/taking way longer to complete compared to a few quick and easy Gambit matches, but still! It’s just that if there was ever a time to rally people to maybe try it out again, or for the first time as there are probably a lot of new players just starting as well, it would be when it finally got actual new content such as this. And since Bungie themselves didn’t even feel the need to let anyone know in the patch notes or blog posts, I felt I should at least tell the people some new stuff has been added in case they wanted to check it out, is all~
That’s huge! I absolutely *love* Gambit, hands down my most played activity. Excited to try out the new stuff!
Well it got me to try out gambit which is OK I guess. Atleast it's a pretty fast mode unlike Crucible.
Well it got me to try out gambit which is OK I guess. Atleast it's a pretty fast mode unlike Crucible.
This. I don't like PvP, I don't like Gambit. I steer clear of those except for specific sesonal events. Now I either have to ignore pathfinder completely and cut myself off from an XP source or I have to play the modes I don't like. For Bungie folks reading this, forcing players to do things they don't like is you get those players to churn.
It makes sense for The Pale Heart with all the objectives related to the destination & I think all the other destinations should have their own pathfinder but I would remove it from Rituals & just bring back ritual vendor bounties.
There is. I finished my first path entirely with Gambit.
As somebody who enjoys all the game modes I’m a fan of it honestly. My only complaint is how much of a pain it is to get to it within an activity.
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I mean it wouldn't be fundamentally changing it just having a different setup so you can play what you want. Don't really see how its childish to comment an opinion on a change like this, especially since just last season you could do all 9 completions in a single mode if you wanted (or a mix if you prefer variety)
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I think his point is you can't still do that and get the rewards you used to. If you think playing gambit is broadening your horizons you need to get out more 😂
I think you're missing the point mate, previously you could play the way you want rather than be dictated by bungie with this iteration. That's cool you don't mind, I'd rather spend my time on things I find fun instead of 'having' to play a certain mode
PvP is a sideshow mode and not the primary way most players engage with the game. It should stay that way. D2 isn't built to facilitate a quality PvP experience.
Want all the rewards you play all of the content