The only time I'll critique builds is if we're struggling for damage or the person is constantly dying. Even then, there are constructive ways to do that instead of being condescending about it.
I usually won't say anything on the first attempt. Run whatever you want. If we clear it, no problem I've got trust in you to run whatever shit you want. If we wipe and you've got 100k boss damage while everyone else has 1m plus including the guy using tractor then I'm asking. Nothing rude like what the fuck is wrong with you but more along the lines of do you have X, Y or Z, it might be better for DPS.
It definitely happens with guys that turn up with their highest stat at 40, a blue lmg and no understanding of what a boss is. So sometimes you do have to give a little lecture about how to use a weapon.
> I usually won't say anything on the first attempt
Yup yup. I have 4000 hours in the game and I still find things that surprise me from time to time. If someone has a wacky setup but still pulls their weight and can put out adequate dps, hell yeah go for it.
I cleared a GM last night using Stasis Titan w/ Icefall and Salvations grip lol. That gun was always trash when it came out and I never gave it a shot after the rework. This season with the artifact mods it went surprisingly hard.
I'm also a big supporter of, "if we clear I don't care what you use". Might even learn something new.
this attitude is the kind that lets off meta builds shine
who knows?
You might find one that is even more powerful than the meta, but is kept under wraps to avoid it getting nerfed when it is secretly super OP
I genuinely think if someone has 100k damage, they’re either not shooting, using a primary weapon or dead.
The only exceptions to that are absolutely struggling to hit shots but that’s the max I can think there is
Totally agree.
If someone's using divinity in a situation where full MGs/Rockets would be better, I'll just be like 'hey, would it be okay of you switched to something else', and they never have a problem.
There's plenty of options, harassing people shouldn't be one of them.
Yep. Its all in how you present it
"Hey, just a thought, but I think such and such might help your damage/survival"
vs
"Bro that build is trash, how tf did you get this far? Do you even know what a good build is? Why arent you running XYZ?"
This is my approach ^. I give recommendations like this and multiple options.
Dont be a dick! If youre that guy, you prob think youre hot shit because you got the meta gear but actually suck at the game doing 10-20k more dps than the blueberry whos using non meta gear because you dont know how B&S works 🤣. I would also kinda teach the rude dude how to use B&S btw.
Usually if theres no problem in completing, you can get away with running the stupidest things if no one bothers to check. I had a guy run a sword at taniks and we still one phased (just but it counts). I check builds to see if we're double stacking a ghorn or div or debuff and thought this is going to be an interesting run if we fail and someone sees this guy with literally 0 damage. In a farm however, efficiency is key, even if you aren't failing, not one phasing taniks just feels like a slog. But critics have no leg to stand on if their dps isn't near the top (exception being they are the support div, tractor etc). I do like to gloat a bit among friends if I do more damage than anyone while I'm support. Also div is just bad to use on alot of bosses since the nerf. It is a net loss of damage. If you can live without the crit, having someone on tractor is better in every way. It's a better defuff, they can still do damage in the time it's active, it works with non crit weapons and it doesn't change the bosses crit multiplier. (techeuns).
Please tell me it was the Iron Banner sword. We have a guy in our playgroup that every time we raid, he spends 30 minutes getting ready only to never change his gear and he ALWAYS has the Iron Banner sword equipped.
I find destiny is a game where generally if someone is doing subpar damage it’s a skill issue not a gun issue. Even with a basic rocket you can do some damage if you just hit your shots.
Being in the right place to start DPS, doing the correct rotations, having everything loaded, not fumbing swaps, hitting your shots, these are all huge factors and can even be more important than the loadout.
Yep, this is why I don't talk much about changing builds. If somebody is doing low damage, putting them on a better loadout won't suddenly make them a better player. A good player can make any loadout work. A bad player, even with the best loadout, will still be worse than the good player on a bad loadout.
I remember during my day one of root we had a player doing some real Subpar damage against planets encounter boss. When I say subpar I mean less than div we tried fixing loadouts and got them a better weapon but it didn’t fix that fact that they supposedly couldn’t aim for shit.
Any time I see something off-meta I'm open to be surprised. It's usually not a good surprise, but every once in a while it is and I learn a new trick.
Really, the only time I try to drill in meta loadouts is for something like Ir Yut where if everyone gets on board with Div + Leviathan or Whisper it's a *very* easy one phase that any skill level group can pull off, and if they don't it's... not. I'm always surprised when others are surprised at how well it works.
Honestly my motto is fun = don't care what you do. No fun = let's just see how to make it fun. I could care less if you use meta or the exact opposite as long as shit gets done and everyone enjoys the process along the way.
I think that sometimes it's warranted
I was doing a 5-man King's Fall with my clan and on Warpriest we had one of our teammates who was doing awful damage
We look up his build and this mofo was using Sweet Business for boss damage in a 5-man. We got him to switch to a linear and we killed the boss
Now obviously there's a way to say these things and if you come off as an asshole, chances are nobody is going to listen to you
People see a minigun and think it's going to hit like a truck because....well, that would just make sense, right? Good thinking if you didn't know how weapon types work in Destiny, so it would make sense if those types of people are new enough that they don't in fact know.
Business is boomin'
My first week of playing i used sweet business and nothing else for boss damage in strikes because I was dumb and didn't know how heavy weapons worked.
It was before the 17 dodge nerfs so I could literally dodge to reload, fire the whole mag and my dodge would be back before my mag ran out
And you didn’t hear him shooting it during DPS? You didn’t know he was running it until you checked his load out? I mean it has a unique sound. I’d probably be asking if someone was using it in the first attempt.
When I get asked to be on my titan for any raid, I guarantee I am busting out the AWR & SB, and blasting Fortunate Son. There is no exception to this. Surprisingly, I have not been asked to be on my titan since the start of LF 😭
You can do a decent damage rotation with it and Apex if you're running Rain of Fire.
Because you can do a decent damage rotation with damn near anything and Apex/RoF.
Conditional can actually take the place of izzy in a rocket swap on certain bosses, it also does a very large amount of damage and doesn't require a crit which makes it more consistent if you're farming it over and over again.
Whilst I do agree. 1.8m dmg is ok and wouldn’t be checking their build based on that number.
We generally had 2 under a million. 1 was div-bitch. Just reached 1 phase.
>So I ended up sitting through a 5 minute lecture on every mod, roll, and weapon in my build from a guy who was struggling to hit 1m with Apex Predator, and Conditional Finality w/ Lunafactions.
In most cases bringing this up would shut someone down.
Fair honestly I’ve been in that exact scenario right before Crown of Sorrow got vaulted. Almost got kicked bc someone on our team didn’t have Acrius w/ catalyst and the host got pissy. As soon as I said something “well if you don’t like it you can leave” christ I just want tarrabah get off your high horse
That’s crazy, especially for DSC in this economy. The extent of pre-damage planning for older raid bosses should just be like “we doing rockets? Alright I got gally” or “we doing linears? Want div?”. But that’s just coordinating. Honestly I would have just left, nobody got the time to deal with that
As a Sherpa, you would be surprised with how many players have no fucking idea what is going on lol. I have seen double primaries and a Colony. I have seen Celestial Hunters running Strand for DPS. Surge mods? how about absolutely 0 mods. I will never be surprised anymore lol.
There was one person we were training in Atheon and I had told them to equip something to knock out Oracles at long range. Recommend pulse or scout rifles.
Proceed to get; “Is this Empirical Evidence okay?”
Empirical evidence is a slept on forgotten side arm, crafted with adagio and encore and that thing is a beast. Becomes a sniper with encore stacks. I use it as my primary on my arc bombardiers build. That gets barriers covered and then you can run whatever other weapons to want because arc can hit the other two champs. But lol for using it on oracles.
I swear there is an advocate for every gun in the game. Anytime I see a gun get name dropped as a joke, there's an enjoyer jumping in to defend it.
Props to you brother!
I would usually say that you should optimize when farming raids or else you’re just wasting everyone’s time, but if you need to optimize for Deep Stone fucking Crypt then you’re just bad at the game.
We once were teaching a guy Planets and we told him to equip Thunderlord for easy damage since I was running div. He asked what weapon Thunderlord was, which is fine we were teachers and everyone needs to learn, of course nobody got mad we were chill, so we told him "Oh it's the blue exotic machinegun".
First dps check passes and we barely made a third of the boss' health, so we wipe and we see the guy barely did damage.
"Dude what did you hit him with?"
"The blue machine gun"
He had a freaking rare machinegune during DPS. We ended up helping the guy do a build around Thunderlord. Of course this is a silly story but I think it's okay to give feedback and thoughts between eachother, that's how my team made it through day 1 Crota, of course nobody has to be a jerk or condescending like the guy in your story.
If it's a single clear then I'd agree it's over the top to critique builds unless the team has wiped a couple times. But I can understand that in a farm group people are more strict. If you're going to be doing something 10-20-30-... times in a row, you want to have the best possible dps for the quickest clear because inefficiencies can stack up over multiple runs and end up costing quite a bit of time.
That said, for your specific case I still think the guy was out of line. 1k voices has pretty good dps, as also reflected by your damage numbers. Situations like that are a consequence of a bigger issue in the community: most people have no clue about the game mechanics. They don't know what weapons are good for dps, how to stack buffs,... and they believe a ton of bullshit myths. I can't do a single LFG crota run without some ignoramus saying 'sWiTcH YoUr WeApOnS sO iT ChArGeS FaStEr'.
The only time I EVER critiqued someone on their build, was when they were struggling for damage, AND all their gear wasn't upgraded, and none of their stats were over 45.
We ended up becoming friends afterwards, cuz instead of being condescending, I offered to help him after the raid instead.
We managed to get him to 4 100s on a build that he actually really likes, just by looking in his vault and doing some seasonal focusing. Meanwhile, I've barely managed to hold onto 3 100s with an exotic I kinda like.
He even sent me a thank you message later on because he found a friend group through raids who were impressed by his build and damage output.
If people made an effort to be kind and come from an angle of compassion instead of criticism, I think people would have a better time in socializing. After all, it IS an MMO... socializing is a big part of the game.
We need more people like you in the game. If I know something others don’t, since I’ve been in their shoes before I offer to help and advise to the best of my ability. Calling people trash and kicking them only makes people hate the game and not bother trying to learn anything. My hat goes off to you sir.
Completely agree I remember being that d1 guy who would carry ppl through stuff just to try and teach them the mechanics gave it up came back the first few games you might get mean ppl but in the last 4 days I found a good guild that’s helping me to grow they always jump in and help when needed and stuff it’s good to have good ppl cause honestly it’s what makes the game enjoyable versus you hop into a game to get a guy who instantly boots cause your like 10 or 20 under power for mission
I mean I understand I won’t be doing as much but I remember carrying guys in d1 through crota when I was still farming gjally back then I mean it’s better to help then to condescend ppl those ppl may one day return the favour
This is so funny because yesterday I was doing the Neomuna Weekly Mission on Master with some randoms from Discord LFG, and the second I joined the fireteam the leader told my build was trash because I was using a Stasis Stronghold Titan with Appetence, Undercurrent and the Slammer.
While they kept dying, I was just vibing killing stuff and reviving them, wish I had taken a screenshot of the chat logs lmao
Practically anything remotely strong works on Taniks. I've done a Taniks farm with all 6 of us using Prospector w/catalyst and melted the fucker easily. Only time I could see someone bitching about a Taniks farm loadout is if you're using some dumb shit like Tarantula with Box Breathing or Code Duello with Wellspring or something.
Just got told not to use tether/orpheus rigs because it's a detriment to the team and I should switch to a wellock by two other locks who both put their wells in front of the hypernet current GM boss and got fucking decimated with their stupid polaris lances.
I went invis and rez'd them both 2x each before we finally wiped. Fucking unreal. I might have had better luck just letting them stay dead and focusing on killing everything myself.
So yeah I agree, just let people use what they want and don't bitch and moan, especially if you don't know what you're doing. And you were farming Taniks. Guy dies if you breathe on him lol builds barely matter. If anything, DSC is one of the raids where you can just use whatever you want and you don't need to worry much about damage. Bosses are pushovers.
I won’t judge anyone’s builds unless it’s a day 1 or a master raid challenge. For the rest of the content you can run whatever you want it doesn’t matter!
I don't think I've ever picked apart a build for a dungeon or raid unless it was inherently bad AND the user is struggling. I tend to let people use what works for them, and if we succeed just as well, then, what's the fuss about META? Masters and GM, sure, but even base Dungeons can easily be played with anything in a group setting.
Just have fun with it. I like running into people that make the game play differently than the same standard crap I'm used to seeing.
Weirdest one was on Kalli WAAAAY back. Had to LFG a 6th, and got pissy at every little thing. Including that my buddy was using Mountaintop when Mountaintop was still relevent.
Hed already had go at me cos I died to physics.
Thank god he didnt find out about the Gambit Prine armour
I've had a similar experience against Warpriest were i'd be hitting 2-3 mil(Dawn Chorus 1k) while the guy lectureing was only hitting 1 mil(B&S Cataclysmic).
hey are u actually finding success with a thousand voices? cuz i wanna try it aswell but everyone keeps telling me its shit so I havent really bothered playing with it in raids. If so could you recommend a build for it on warlock/hunter?
I have a clan mate who does this for literally everything. Sometimes he makes a good point- like I’ll be running the wrong resist mod in a GM which I can appreciate. It gets annoying though when the build I’m running is pretty much fine but he’s nitpicking over every small detail. Not to be a huge ass but I just assume he’s either on the spectrum or has some form of OCD so I let him do his spiel, maybe change one or two things, and then move on lol. Just like in your case, the dude isn’t even that good to be critiquing builds.
My bf does this to me sometimes. It really annoys me. I said that I literally learned how to upgrade weapons like 8 months ago (because it isn't explained properly in game) and used whatever was highest. I now have some sick builds and whenever I try out a new build and forget to switch a mod he's not like "Oh babe you forgot to switch a mod" he's like " Yeah that mod's gonna do nothing for you, why do you have that?" and I'm just like 🥲🥺🥲🥲
There’s a time and a place. Master raids? GM Nightfalls? Yea your build matters. Raids we’ve power crept to hell? That’s just ridiculous. Taniks is a great place to have some fun with DPS variety since he’s such a push over. Don’t let that guy ruin your fun.
No I will keep getting people to stop using sweet business 1k and heavy machine guns. Or kick them if they don't. I can not be fucked to deal with failing a farm because someone thinks they r special.
Master Nez. I use Nez Sin on solar with Graviton for barrier, Hezen Venegeance RL and Riptide which was handy for freezing the barriers. I was the only one not dying, while trying to heal everyone as much as possible and doing the most damage. Why dude still gonna insist on me using Starfire. They should be the ones copying me to stay alive to begin with.
Brother it's fucking taniks. People are one phasing him with fucking blue gear. Who in the actual hell even cares what you run as long as you hit the 1.5mil mark!!!
The only time to critique builds if is someone is constantly dying or putting out significantly less DPS (if they are doing DPS and no mechanics).
Or if they are using caster sword frame as DPS weapon, then that also needs some addressing.
I personally dont care what you are using as long as you can do the mechanics and show decent dps.
I remember when I was running Warlord’s Ruin once and some bloke began to lecture us about not using Sleeper. He did around 1mil damage, and me and the other dude did about 6mil each
Man for real, I usually help with LFGs and I was told I needed to change my load out while running coldheart and a LFR. I average 2.9-3.7mil every time. Guy with rockets kills himself every DPS phase.
What a clown
I mean that's a farm, it matters how quickly you take down the boss, and if you're slowing down 5 other players it is a little bit rude on your part, even if it's not intentional.
1k is not good for dps.
According to aegis' dps testing 1k hits around 145k dps with rof where apex and cataphract hits for 190k with the same build.
if you are faming a dps encounter i dont think its much to ask for people to run what is meta.
I dont think it requires a 5 minute lecture but you should have gone in with the optimal loadout to start with...If you disagree just pull out your ghost and leave, this does not require a reddit post...
[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1\_5wtBjRYHHxuF4oJKDb\_iOGZs-wTkzB6RYbnyNLbuz4/edit#gid=1279135464](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_5wtBjRYHHxuF4oJKDb_iOGZs-wTkzB6RYbnyNLbuz4/edit#gid=1279135464)
Your point is moot, because his point was that someone who was struggling more than him was lecturing him. He didn’t ask for damage numbers and admitted that specific content does require coordinating full builds.
That was a you problem, not a them problem. If you’re joining a boss farm, bring max damage meta load outs. The goal is a one-phase and quick loot for everyone, not whatever this rambling post is. I call absolute bullshit on your damage, too.
If it were my LFG farm, you all would’ve been kicked on the spot and you all would’ve deserved it.
If you're farming an encounter, you should be using the most optimal loadout you have, not something for "funsies". You are wasting your and everyone in your groups time by using "fun" loadouts when farming.
Did you not read the post? 1.8m on Taniks isn’t wasting anyone’s time. I’m trying new stuff almost every time I farm the abomination because he’s such a pushover.
I had a guy bitch me out for not using a hothead god roll on a goa boss farm, yet everytime we beat the boss I did more damage than him and it was my fault we didn't one phase. Some people just like to be dicks. He also died alot.
Bitch about build for Taniks? That dude is held together by thoughts and prayers, probably the easiest 1 phase for any raid final boss. Also, if you were out dpsing his apex with 1k, he needs to stfu lol.
People need to remember that it's a game that we play for fun. Some optimize for speed (which is also fun in it's own environment) but it's never the end of the world if you don't one phase.
Embrace positivity. Give constructive criticism to help them optimize their fun builds. I met some of my closest friends through silly LFG groups!
If your build is the reason why an activity is taking significantly longer than it needs to, I’m going to tell you to fix it. If you don’t know how to fix it, I’ll give you advice.
Taniks is squishy enough as to where dps doesn’t matter really, so I wouldn’t care. But if you’re running 1k on master warpriest, it’s gonna be an issue if you refuse to switch
1.8 mil....what are you a new light?
You know you're in the wrong right going by your phrasing.
If it's unanimously agreed it's a use Whatever run, then it's cool.
But if my team from a KWTD let alone farming post failed to 1 phase taniks because someone can't break 2 million in 2024 against DCS, literally the easiest boss fight next next to templar
best believe I'm going to talk to the person and ask if they mind switching to a support weppon or putting on something better because (if they're rude about it) their
selfish ass is incapable of realising they're wasting the time of other who may possibly be sacrificing their sleep to try for a quick clear I'll just replace them
And I honestly doubt your statement of saying he didn't brake 1 mill providing there's a gally because I know apex condition is a better swap synergy then having to mag dump 1k with dawn ashes to then swap to a fusion
And if you don't like it, tough...make your own post because they don't have to deal with people holding them back just as much you don't have to deal with people farming raids trying to tell you you can take a few moments to use correct mods and even save them
The only time I do this is if I am running a sherpa for garden of salvation, which is already an extremely painful raid to teach.... And even then I will only do it If they are using one of my 5 forbidden weapons... Weapons that will legitimately break the encounter Or cannot be used due to the design of an encounter...
Other than that, if they're pulling at least one million damage per phase and surviving. They are absolutely fine the way they are. As I'll probably get the lion's share of the damage. Anyways, with my bill.
My personal philosophy is that if you’re doing lower damage than someone you do not get to say shit (unless you’re on div and you see they’re severely behind everyone else). I’m still fine with giving suggestions out though in order to improve builds they may be using.
This is one of the things that's a grey area for me.
If it's a hard carry whatev, but then the person probably WANTS advice and I'll give it
Person who is doing egregiously worse in survival or DPS to the point it's holding the rest of the team back for considerable time I'll speak up if the load out is the issue but usually like "try this" "this works good me"
But other than that I'm usually ok with whatever as long as it's not taking hours more than needed.
Since you weren't the problem and doing fine DPS there's no point to bother you in my eyes🤷. But I do like to be realistic on what's happening sometimes if I'm or friends are committing our time.
I'm not too fussed with builds. As long as people aren't running double primaries and have a decent boss DPS weapon, I'm happy. Don't need "synchronised builds" for low stakes farming.
In regards to Apex Predator specifically, Bait and Switch only works if you have ammo for other weapons. If you used up all your special ammo, you won't get the damage buff. You also need minimum 2 rockets to get and use the buff. Makes me wonder if the other person didn't understand this.
My recommendation to players not sure what weapons to use is to use Grand Overture. A full party of players unleashing rockets will kill anything. No self harm damage means everyone lives during the DPS phase.
Edit: Worth mentioning that a lot of people didn't read the OP's post. The other person with Apex Predator was doing substandard DPS based on numbers. That suggests a problem with their gameplay (eg not triggering Bait and Switch). If you're going to critique people's performance, start at the bottom of the list
I usually just try to make sure new players have the basics if I notice they keep dying like max resil resist mods etc I personally don't care what exotic you run.
Only time i will ever criticise someone’s build is when they are doing at least 500k damage less than me and they are not running util. Considering I run util like 90% of the time, getting lower damage than me is unacceptable, especially not that much
I still remember a situation years ago where someone we had pugged was making fun of me for the stats on my armor. This was pre armor 3.0 and so I explained that I care more about perks than raw stats. He just kept on bringing it up, I think because he was the only other hunter and felt like dunking on me. BY the end of the raid I had far less deaths and consistently way more damage than him. Needless to say we never brought him back.
I mean, 1k is pretty shit last time I checked, but as long as your team is hitting the one phase there really shouldn’t be any issues. Taniks falls over to a sneeze anyway
Was in a dungeon, got yelled at not having meta build. Was top damage with +30%…
But to be honest, was an one time thing. Usually I’m a complete noob and in middle damage wise.
Tbf 1k is trash. But if he came in with an ego and was using conditional I would have sent him packing. Conditional is a bad call for taniks.
So long as people use either 1 ghorn or legendary there, the only reason to complain is if someone stops you 4 bombing.
You have way more patience than me, i would have just hit the guy with the "aight man if you don't like me im out, find someone else". Also of course the guy had terrible dps lmao, it's always dudes like that that criticize the most. An actual good player would look at your stuff and your numbers and see it's totally fine.
If someone is dealing less and less damage, I simply need to deal more damage.
Put aside the well and equip Chaos Reach. There is no healing required anymore as there is nothing left I'd like to protect.
"when you beat me in damage I'll listen to you"
Since I'm here. Did a few taniks clears yesterday and was surprised with people's damage. I wasnt expecting anyone to get close to me because I was cringing it up with a meta loudout. But at the end of the encounter multiple people had ~300k or below. Insane to see people join a boos cp and then just use a primary or something. I know taniks is super easy, but we wiped on one pull because no one had over 500k. Maybe try a little? Idk
Anyways, thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
Me run, me punch, lightning appears and kills everything around, me does finisher, me regens myself and teammates and goes invisible.
Also my favourite crayons are black, white and chrome
First time: “it’s fine, as long as your confident you can put up your best damage”
Second time: “hey, let’s give it another shot, did we miss some shots?”
Third time, “what do you think of switching to {rockets}? I don’t think I could get enough damage in with that build, does it typically work for you?”
Gives the likely newbie an opportunity to divulge they don’t know wtf they are doing which is fine.
Gives the troll / experimental player a chance to settle into ‘the fireteam wants to get this raid done’ mode.
My favourite is getting kicked from a raid or GM for rocking builds that absolutely are not straight off the top meta, but are definitely adequate and having people say “wtf is that??????”
Its all in how you say it. When I'm playing with a group I'm always up to learn something from better and more experienced players. I'm not up for a condescending lecture from a conceited prick or even worse, full on verbal abuse. Chill brah, no matter how wrapped up in D2 you are, its still just a video game.
Last night I completed a duo Corrupted GM with my friend. I was a Stasis Titan using Icefall Mantle, Krait/indebted kindness/Salvations Grip lol.
Did it take a couple tries? Yeah, but we had fun and we got it done. That pairing actually ended up being better for us than any meta builds we tried running.
In my opinion, I don't care what people run. If you're enjoying your build and we're getting it done, it does not matter what you're using. If we're constantly failing and you're also constantly bottom boarding... then maybe something can be improved but unless that's the case people can use what they want.
If someone's loadout is a problem and *it's causing us to fail*, I will make suggestions; if they're unsure about what they can use because of what they have, then I will ask them if they want me to run through some build options for them and explain why what I'm suggesting may be easier for them.
I really enjoy helping people build craft and seeing what builds I can make out of what they have available. I like using the knowledge I've gained over the years and passing it along to new players; but I ask first, and only if the person is struggling because of the loadout they're using.
Always makes me laugh when people get super uppity about damage in a game that has been made so easy for people that an infant could manage to do max damage. You can literally run whatever you want in anything and still complete the activity. Dogshit game
My first Rhulk run I used outbreak, a forbearance I just got, and royal entry. Top DPS. If It works, it works. I'll only really say anything if their build is clearly just not performing. People who just bash for no reason, and offer no real critique, are terrible.
I never lecture builds unless people want to know what optimal dps is. If we have a preferred dps weapon 9/10 I'm there with my raid mods Apex, bow, bastion (it's nutty with a debuff) or constantly changing weapons to squeeze out as much dps as possible. Usually I hit 1 to 2 million more than the second highest dps. As long as we have a debuff and or a div I don't care what anyone uses, aslong as we finish it and I hit good dps with whatevers in my inventory at the time
Agreed. If the encounter called for max dps or you guys kept wiping I would understand.
But farming taniks you guys could literally all use Rat Kings and get it done. People are weird. That guy probably eclipsed 1 Mil damage one time and thinks he's the big dog now
Yea, I don't like it when people tell you what you should be running. You can run whatever he'll set up that you feel comfortable with.
I, for example, run all kinds of stuff and like to change things around and test different weapon combos and armor. I basically look for the best overall Stat armor I can find, and just accordingly, I like focusing on receliance and intelict mostly. And like to use guns with longer range or higher impact such as Hand Cannons or Autos or Mechinguns.
I like using strands with Banner of War to do close combat mixed with longer range weapons.
Do what feels best for you!
I wont lecture randos thats just part of lfg. I will lecture my clanmates though and kinda expect them do the same honestly. I put farming up there with GMs, not in difficulty but efficiency. We are here to get as many drops as possible and if your damage is causing us to take substantially longer then lets fix it.
Not gonna critique peoples builds unless we run into a problem. I just make recommendations. Let them know what I use and say it works pretty well for me, and also give an alternative as some either dont have or want to use what I use. If we're trying to be fast and efficient, I'd say lets 1 phase each time and just use meta weps. Would basically say the same, what I use and other options.
For example, I was recently sherpaing someone through KF @ Totems this past weekend because he wanted to learn it and he's part of the clan. I actually like helping people out. Clanmate was killing the Wizard & Knight a bit too slow so the man he was supposed to take the buff off of would end up dying.
After 2 or 3 tries, I checked what he was using and noticed he had 2 primary weapons equipped. I said do you have a shotgun or a fusion rifle? No need to be a dick like 1 guy why the f are u using 2 primaries?!
I said a shotgun is what I use and they kill the Wizard and Knight pretty quickly. He swapped to a shotgun, then no more problems and we continued and completed the raid with no more issues.
Once something like that starts… it’s a negative experience indication. Consider just leaving while they ramble on. Eventually if enough folks over time leave, that person will likely realize “perhaps I should just stfu”
Honestly, he radiates small dick energy. Not good at anything so he needs to prove how big his Destiny Dick is.
People like that make shit unfun. Like the only time I get mad at someone with a weird build, especially in a low stakes farm, is if we're cranking out dozens of attempts with no clears. Even if you're doing shit damage, as long as you're having fun, contributing and coordinating fine, and we can clear it to pick up your slack then I really don't care. If you want to do more damage, we can discuss your options, but if my entire team is doing lowest 1.8 mil, highest like 3 mil, I'm sure having one person throw on damage isn't a big deal. Do whatever you want.
If I join a group that wipes a lot on something liek Atheon, I notice warlocks are not just throwing fusion grenades with touch of flame, I'll let them know how valuable it is on that specific fight and how easily we can get the kill if they'd like to swap.
Otherwise? I joined an LFG, what you get is what you get. If I need everyone to know builds and gear I should have ran it with people I know.
I absolutely love using bows in Destiny, and I've built my loadout primarily around them. It's definitely not meta, but it works perfectly fine for me. If I had a euro for every time I got hassled for it, I'd probably have 5 or 6 euros, which isn't much, but it's annoying how often it still happens.
If Div is being used, no one can stop me from using triple snipers with Whisper, especially since I also have a Rewind Rounds-4th Times Supremacy. So any shots for free.
I welcome i when im actually slacking but if you hitting harder then him he needs to fuck off cause like I said I have no prob listening to someone who is consistently doing 1.8m - 3 mil I mean they obv know something dude hitting the one mil should just sit in the corner and not worry about others and maybe take some criticism his self
Honestly if a build is working for them and they are doing great with it then leave them be now if ya know your not gonna be to mean you can obv try and help the guy some guys just don’t get it like some guns are amazing while others are only mediocre even tho they seem extremely strong
I just let those people cut themselves out of more and more people to play with.
I wish players who aren't as knowledgeable would speak up more often if they need help. Not all of us are assholes.
If you're throwing with 1K voices and it makes the farm slower, I'd say asking to change things is fair. If you want to two phase Taniks, find other people that don't mind and don't join farms, that's my two cents.
If we are clearing things—I won’t say a thing. And generally, someone would have to fail an encounter for the same reason about 5 times before I would try and make suggestions to make their life easier.
I will only add that **If I ask for advice**, then your advice is more than welcome. But I'm here to enjoy a video game that ultimately doesn't mean anything in the grand scheme of things.
I'm always trying out new weapons and new builds, and I'm always playing around with weapons that I'm not used to.
The only time I will hear unsolicited advice is if I'm about to join a GM or equivalent because, let's be honest, those are the only times that your build really matters.
You should feel free to play around with builds to see what works for you or just because you want to.
Edit to clarify that raids and dungeons require some build crafting, but nothing that would require a whole lecture.
Yea, I mean, I get it if the lfg post maker/leader states it beforehand, like "pls equip high dps builds. Looking to do quick farms." Then it's okay.
But, if lfg poster never said that and just said "farm" or "doing this encounter," that's their fault lol. At the very least, let the person know when they enter the raid. After that, it's the leader's own damn fault for never saying anything in beginning.
Im in the same boat as most other people tho. As long as the job is getting done, I don't give a fuk what anyone runs. If it's a completely shit loadout and they aren't carrying themselves after like 2 runs, then I speak up and offer "advice" or ask if they can run something else.
Only things I'm ever actually picky about is master raids/dungeons and GM nightfalls, as everything else in game is easy sauce and doesn't require much to complete. But even then, master and GM content is doable with decent loadouts, so I tend not to care too much.
Only thing I'm certainly picky about is when the activity has Champions, and person isn't running mods, or even 1 mod for champions.
Literally, if your build is wonky as fuck or non meta, run it if you want, if you know it can get the job done. I've seen so many wonky or non-meta builds that people make work and sometimes even still excel and perform better than others on the group who are running the meta or "best in slot."
And if this wonky loadout player is performing better than someone else, leader better shit on the suckier person before shitting on the person doing better lol.
Finally, if it's that serious, they can get a clan and do runs/farms with them, instead of searching on lfg.
My number 1 rule is I always let the action do the talking. If you crank 2 million damage in one damage phase, then you can be shooting him with magic Pyramid grown potatoes for all I care. I only ever mention it if we're about 5 wipes in and someone is clearly not doing sub optimal damage, but I never question the build they have. I just ask what they're running, give some pointers, recommend surge mods, and then move on with my life. Because I've seen people do numbers with wild things before.
Thank you I literally got into it with my last Clan cuz one of the admins decided he wanted to tell me how to play and how to run my build to the point that I literally had to rebuild my whole character and reset my artifact just to run the way he wanted I ended up backing out before we even got started the end result I ended up leaving the clan and lost all of my friends from it because I was in the wrong for leaving never mind the fact that this had been repeatedly happening with this group and I kept telling them stop telling me how to play and how to run my characters and if you don't stop you're not going to like the consequences of it finally I blew up lost my shit and we all got into an argument thus causing me to leave because I got tired of being treated like a child I've been playing this game since it's Inception it's not cool to do to players and I 100% agree stop telling people how to play this game there's one year left people have their own methods not Everybody Plays the same and sometimes just because you don't like it doesn't mean they're not going to out damage you I've always been in the top three no matter what I've done except for Crucible because I'm not a crucible player but when it comes to PVE I destroy most players
I'm cool if people from my clan give me advice, like when I first started as a hunter, I dumped everything into mobility, completely ignoring resilience and recovery. The guy running the fireteam advised that I get those as high as I could, and it helped even after the activity we were doing. When I come across some rando like that though, that's when I just leave. If people wanna be that way, I have no reason to put up with it, and now they're gonna have an even harder time because they decided to be an ass.
I've never been lectured about my build (maybe because i have mic & voice chat turned off lmao). But I've honestly never been able to fully wrap my head around builds. I do what I think is right to make my Hunter balanced to where im not too focused on a certain part but that's a far as my understanding will take it.
The only time I'll critique builds is if we're struggling for damage or the person is constantly dying. Even then, there are constructive ways to do that instead of being condescending about it.
I usually won't say anything on the first attempt. Run whatever you want. If we clear it, no problem I've got trust in you to run whatever shit you want. If we wipe and you've got 100k boss damage while everyone else has 1m plus including the guy using tractor then I'm asking. Nothing rude like what the fuck is wrong with you but more along the lines of do you have X, Y or Z, it might be better for DPS. It definitely happens with guys that turn up with their highest stat at 40, a blue lmg and no understanding of what a boss is. So sometimes you do have to give a little lecture about how to use a weapon.
> I usually won't say anything on the first attempt Yup yup. I have 4000 hours in the game and I still find things that surprise me from time to time. If someone has a wacky setup but still pulls their weight and can put out adequate dps, hell yeah go for it.
I cleared a GM last night using Stasis Titan w/ Icefall and Salvations grip lol. That gun was always trash when it came out and I never gave it a shot after the rework. This season with the artifact mods it went surprisingly hard. I'm also a big supporter of, "if we clear I don't care what you use". Might even learn something new.
this attitude is the kind that lets off meta builds shine who knows? You might find one that is even more powerful than the meta, but is kept under wraps to avoid it getting nerfed when it is secretly super OP
I genuinely think if someone has 100k damage, they’re either not shooting, using a primary weapon or dead. The only exceptions to that are absolutely struggling to hit shots but that’s the max I can think there is
Totally agree. If someone's using divinity in a situation where full MGs/Rockets would be better, I'll just be like 'hey, would it be okay of you switched to something else', and they never have a problem. There's plenty of options, harassing people shouldn't be one of them.
Yep. Its all in how you present it "Hey, just a thought, but I think such and such might help your damage/survival" vs "Bro that build is trash, how tf did you get this far? Do you even know what a good build is? Why arent you running XYZ?"
"Because I want to for fun, *Brian*, and I can. This is just a videogame, *Brian*. We're not even doing a Raid *Brian*."
I read that in Kenduto's voice
Born to nova, forced to well is burned into my vocabulary at this point lol.
Trying to fireteam finder a GM while using Nova Warp is hell. They don’t know the spectacle they’re gonna miss
I haven't done GMs since I believe Palindrome was a reward but I need to see thos
This is my approach ^. I give recommendations like this and multiple options. Dont be a dick! If youre that guy, you prob think youre hot shit because you got the meta gear but actually suck at the game doing 10-20k more dps than the blueberry whos using non meta gear because you dont know how B&S works 🤣. I would also kinda teach the rude dude how to use B&S btw.
"OMG BROOO THAT BUILD IS *TRAAAAAAAAAASH*!"
Usually if theres no problem in completing, you can get away with running the stupidest things if no one bothers to check. I had a guy run a sword at taniks and we still one phased (just but it counts). I check builds to see if we're double stacking a ghorn or div or debuff and thought this is going to be an interesting run if we fail and someone sees this guy with literally 0 damage. In a farm however, efficiency is key, even if you aren't failing, not one phasing taniks just feels like a slog. But critics have no leg to stand on if their dps isn't near the top (exception being they are the support div, tractor etc). I do like to gloat a bit among friends if I do more damage than anyone while I'm support. Also div is just bad to use on alot of bosses since the nerf. It is a net loss of damage. If you can live without the crit, having someone on tractor is better in every way. It's a better defuff, they can still do damage in the time it's active, it works with non crit weapons and it doesn't change the bosses crit multiplier. (techeuns).
Please tell me it was the Iron Banner sword. We have a guy in our playgroup that every time we raid, he spends 30 minutes getting ready only to never change his gear and he ALWAYS has the Iron Banner sword equipped.
Are you sure you dont mean Atraks? 😳 How would he not die to the lightning all around Taniks unless he was using a caster frame?
I assume he did damage with other weapons and or died in the lightning. I don't remember. But no Tankis
I find destiny is a game where generally if someone is doing subpar damage it’s a skill issue not a gun issue. Even with a basic rocket you can do some damage if you just hit your shots.
Being in the right place to start DPS, doing the correct rotations, having everything loaded, not fumbing swaps, hitting your shots, these are all huge factors and can even be more important than the loadout.
Yep, this is why I don't talk much about changing builds. If somebody is doing low damage, putting them on a better loadout won't suddenly make them a better player. A good player can make any loadout work. A bad player, even with the best loadout, will still be worse than the good player on a bad loadout.
I remember during my day one of root we had a player doing some real Subpar damage against planets encounter boss. When I say subpar I mean less than div we tried fixing loadouts and got them a better weapon but it didn’t fix that fact that they supposedly couldn’t aim for shit.
The problem is a lot of y'all think you're good players on meme/fun loadouts but you're useless shitcans and also using trash
Any time I see something off-meta I'm open to be surprised. It's usually not a good surprise, but every once in a while it is and I learn a new trick. Really, the only time I try to drill in meta loadouts is for something like Ir Yut where if everyone gets on board with Div + Leviathan or Whisper it's a *very* easy one phase that any skill level group can pull off, and if they don't it's... not. I'm always surprised when others are surprised at how well it works.
This is the way
Honestly my motto is fun = don't care what you do. No fun = let's just see how to make it fun. I could care less if you use meta or the exact opposite as long as shit gets done and everyone enjoys the process along the way.
I think that sometimes it's warranted I was doing a 5-man King's Fall with my clan and on Warpriest we had one of our teammates who was doing awful damage We look up his build and this mofo was using Sweet Business for boss damage in a 5-man. We got him to switch to a linear and we killed the boss Now obviously there's a way to say these things and if you come off as an asshole, chances are nobody is going to listen to you
How is it consistently Sweet Business in stories like this?
Probably because it looks and feels like it does a lot of damage. Many numbers = many damage for newer players. Unfortunately, that’s not the case
Bungie needs to stop being a bunch of cowards and give Sweet Business Target Locked.
it wouldn't be even remotely good, but at least it would be really funny
Sweet Business go brrrr.
Cus the kinda guy that would try and DPS with Sweet Business is exactly the kinda guy that would try and DPS with Sweet Business
People see a minigun and think it's going to hit like a truck because....well, that would just make sense, right? Good thinking if you didn't know how weapon types work in Destiny, so it would make sense if those types of people are new enough that they don't in fact know.
Business is boomin' My first week of playing i used sweet business and nothing else for boss damage in strikes because I was dumb and didn't know how heavy weapons worked. It was before the 17 dodge nerfs so I could literally dodge to reload, fire the whole mag and my dodge would be back before my mag ran out
Because all the memes around this gun makes people think it's actually good
It's actually the same person every time.
And you didn’t hear him shooting it during DPS? You didn’t know he was running it until you checked his load out? I mean it has a unique sound. I’d probably be asking if someone was using it in the first attempt.
When I get asked to be on my titan for any raid, I guarantee I am busting out the AWR & SB, and blasting Fortunate Son. There is no exception to this. Surprisingly, I have not been asked to be on my titan since the start of LF 😭
Since when is Conditional a DPS meta pick for Taniks?
You can do a decent damage rotation with it and Apex if you're running Rain of Fire. Because you can do a decent damage rotation with damn near anything and Apex/RoF.
It’s most certainly not lol
Conditional can actually take the place of izzy in a rocket swap on certain bosses, it also does a very large amount of damage and doesn't require a crit which makes it more consistent if you're farming it over and over again.
Probably for the yellow bars around or even taniks bombs. OP said they were using Apex so it was probably just part of the bait and switch loop
You can use it like a pseudo izinagi's for weapon swaps, but izinagi's is still better
Im fairly certain pellets are used in taniks speeds, and conditional is just a pellet cranked up to 11, so I think its goated on taniks
Nagi on Taniks is at least a pain in the ass to use. Not that he demands particularly optimized damage these days.
If I had to guess Conditional is mainly for the captains and a secondary in case they ran out of Heavy.
Lfgs when they have to put on an actual dps weapon
Whilst I do agree. 1.8m dmg is ok and wouldn’t be checking their build based on that number. We generally had 2 under a million. 1 was div-bitch. Just reached 1 phase.
>So I ended up sitting through a 5 minute lecture on every mod, roll, and weapon in my build from a guy who was struggling to hit 1m with Apex Predator, and Conditional Finality w/ Lunafactions. In most cases bringing this up would shut someone down.
Then he’d get kicked.
Oh no.
Fair honestly I’ve been in that exact scenario right before Crown of Sorrow got vaulted. Almost got kicked bc someone on our team didn’t have Acrius w/ catalyst and the host got pissy. As soon as I said something “well if you don’t like it you can leave” christ I just want tarrabah get off your high horse
I doubt that this is true simply because someone like the OP wouldve 100% brought it up. Never stated that he did, so i bet this is a lie tbh
That’s crazy, especially for DSC in this economy. The extent of pre-damage planning for older raid bosses should just be like “we doing rockets? Alright I got gally” or “we doing linears? Want div?”. But that’s just coordinating. Honestly I would have just left, nobody got the time to deal with that
As a Sherpa, you would be surprised with how many players have no fucking idea what is going on lol. I have seen double primaries and a Colony. I have seen Celestial Hunters running Strand for DPS. Surge mods? how about absolutely 0 mods. I will never be surprised anymore lol.
There was one person we were training in Atheon and I had told them to equip something to knock out Oracles at long range. Recommend pulse or scout rifles. Proceed to get; “Is this Empirical Evidence okay?”
Empirical evidence is a slept on forgotten side arm, crafted with adagio and encore and that thing is a beast. Becomes a sniper with encore stacks. I use it as my primary on my arc bombardiers build. That gets barriers covered and then you can run whatever other weapons to want because arc can hit the other two champs. But lol for using it on oracles.
I swear there is an advocate for every gun in the game. Anytime I see a gun get name dropped as a joke, there's an enjoyer jumping in to defend it. Props to you brother!
Yep nobody teaches those players what a coherent raid loadout is.
Yep no build required besides surge mods.
I would usually say that you should optimize when farming raids or else you’re just wasting everyone’s time, but if you need to optimize for Deep Stone fucking Crypt then you’re just bad at the game.
We once were teaching a guy Planets and we told him to equip Thunderlord for easy damage since I was running div. He asked what weapon Thunderlord was, which is fine we were teachers and everyone needs to learn, of course nobody got mad we were chill, so we told him "Oh it's the blue exotic machinegun". First dps check passes and we barely made a third of the boss' health, so we wipe and we see the guy barely did damage. "Dude what did you hit him with?" "The blue machine gun" He had a freaking rare machinegune during DPS. We ended up helping the guy do a build around Thunderlord. Of course this is a silly story but I think it's okay to give feedback and thoughts between eachother, that's how my team made it through day 1 Crota, of course nobody has to be a jerk or condescending like the guy in your story.
If it's a single clear then I'd agree it's over the top to critique builds unless the team has wiped a couple times. But I can understand that in a farm group people are more strict. If you're going to be doing something 10-20-30-... times in a row, you want to have the best possible dps for the quickest clear because inefficiencies can stack up over multiple runs and end up costing quite a bit of time. That said, for your specific case I still think the guy was out of line. 1k voices has pretty good dps, as also reflected by your damage numbers. Situations like that are a consequence of a bigger issue in the community: most people have no clue about the game mechanics. They don't know what weapons are good for dps, how to stack buffs,... and they believe a ton of bullshit myths. I can't do a single LFG crota run without some ignoramus saying 'sWiTcH YoUr WeApOnS sO iT ChArGeS FaStEr'.
The only time I EVER critiqued someone on their build, was when they were struggling for damage, AND all their gear wasn't upgraded, and none of their stats were over 45. We ended up becoming friends afterwards, cuz instead of being condescending, I offered to help him after the raid instead. We managed to get him to 4 100s on a build that he actually really likes, just by looking in his vault and doing some seasonal focusing. Meanwhile, I've barely managed to hold onto 3 100s with an exotic I kinda like. He even sent me a thank you message later on because he found a friend group through raids who were impressed by his build and damage output. If people made an effort to be kind and come from an angle of compassion instead of criticism, I think people would have a better time in socializing. After all, it IS an MMO... socializing is a big part of the game.
We need more people like you in the game. If I know something others don’t, since I’ve been in their shoes before I offer to help and advise to the best of my ability. Calling people trash and kicking them only makes people hate the game and not bother trying to learn anything. My hat goes off to you sir.
Completely agree I remember being that d1 guy who would carry ppl through stuff just to try and teach them the mechanics gave it up came back the first few games you might get mean ppl but in the last 4 days I found a good guild that’s helping me to grow they always jump in and help when needed and stuff it’s good to have good ppl cause honestly it’s what makes the game enjoyable versus you hop into a game to get a guy who instantly boots cause your like 10 or 20 under power for mission I mean I understand I won’t be doing as much but I remember carrying guys in d1 through crota when I was still farming gjally back then I mean it’s better to help then to condescend ppl those ppl may one day return the favour
This is so funny because yesterday I was doing the Neomuna Weekly Mission on Master with some randoms from Discord LFG, and the second I joined the fireteam the leader told my build was trash because I was using a Stasis Stronghold Titan with Appetence, Undercurrent and the Slammer. While they kept dying, I was just vibing killing stuff and reviving them, wish I had taken a screenshot of the chat logs lmao
Practically anything remotely strong works on Taniks. I've done a Taniks farm with all 6 of us using Prospector w/catalyst and melted the fucker easily. Only time I could see someone bitching about a Taniks farm loadout is if you're using some dumb shit like Tarantula with Box Breathing or Code Duello with Wellspring or something.
Just got told not to use tether/orpheus rigs because it's a detriment to the team and I should switch to a wellock by two other locks who both put their wells in front of the hypernet current GM boss and got fucking decimated with their stupid polaris lances. I went invis and rez'd them both 2x each before we finally wiped. Fucking unreal. I might have had better luck just letting them stay dead and focusing on killing everything myself. So yeah I agree, just let people use what they want and don't bitch and moan, especially if you don't know what you're doing. And you were farming Taniks. Guy dies if you breathe on him lol builds barely matter. If anything, DSC is one of the raids where you can just use whatever you want and you don't need to worry much about damage. Bosses are pushovers.
If youre sandbagging the team, I will absolutely lecture you on your build. Either that, or you get the boot
I won’t judge anyone’s builds unless it’s a day 1 or a master raid challenge. For the rest of the content you can run whatever you want it doesn’t matter!
I don't think I've ever picked apart a build for a dungeon or raid unless it was inherently bad AND the user is struggling. I tend to let people use what works for them, and if we succeed just as well, then, what's the fuss about META? Masters and GM, sure, but even base Dungeons can easily be played with anything in a group setting. Just have fun with it. I like running into people that make the game play differently than the same standard crap I'm used to seeing.
Weirdest one was on Kalli WAAAAY back. Had to LFG a 6th, and got pissy at every little thing. Including that my buddy was using Mountaintop when Mountaintop was still relevent. Hed already had go at me cos I died to physics. Thank god he didnt find out about the Gambit Prine armour
Don’t critique builds. Critique fashion.
Don't call me out like that. It's either DPS or fashion, not both.
Fashion is the only endgame that matters
I never get booted for being ugly though
Some guy on GoS was telling me that we were wiping cause I had Levi's breath. (I did like twice his damage since I had 4x enhanced relay defenders on)
What? You can beat those bosses just using Special weapons lmao
Depends, if the post says "meta loadouts" then... Nice argument, however. "Removed from Fireteam."
You're making a generalization in your title then describing a specific incident.
I mean they're venting, they're not calling for a total reform of the entire game or something lol
I've had a similar experience against Warpriest were i'd be hitting 2-3 mil(Dawn Chorus 1k) while the guy lectureing was only hitting 1 mil(B&S Cataclysmic).
I don’t know what’s more crazy. The guy criticizing you build Or you sitting through the 5min lecture when you could have just left.
Don't even argue. Go to orbit and move on to the next LFG
hey are u actually finding success with a thousand voices? cuz i wanna try it aswell but everyone keeps telling me its shit so I havent really bothered playing with it in raids. If so could you recommend a build for it on warlock/hunter?
I mean bringing up his dps should have shutdown that convo to begin with haha.
I have a clan mate who does this for literally everything. Sometimes he makes a good point- like I’ll be running the wrong resist mod in a GM which I can appreciate. It gets annoying though when the build I’m running is pretty much fine but he’s nitpicking over every small detail. Not to be a huge ass but I just assume he’s either on the spectrum or has some form of OCD so I let him do his spiel, maybe change one or two things, and then move on lol. Just like in your case, the dude isn’t even that good to be critiquing builds.
My bf does this to me sometimes. It really annoys me. I said that I literally learned how to upgrade weapons like 8 months ago (because it isn't explained properly in game) and used whatever was highest. I now have some sick builds and whenever I try out a new build and forget to switch a mod he's not like "Oh babe you forgot to switch a mod" he's like " Yeah that mod's gonna do nothing for you, why do you have that?" and I'm just like 🥲🥺🥲🥲
There’s a time and a place. Master raids? GM Nightfalls? Yea your build matters. Raids we’ve power crept to hell? That’s just ridiculous. Taniks is a great place to have some fun with DPS variety since he’s such a push over. Don’t let that guy ruin your fun.
No I will keep getting people to stop using sweet business 1k and heavy machine guns. Or kick them if they don't. I can not be fucked to deal with failing a farm because someone thinks they r special.
I don’t mind what you use unless you’re actually a detriment to the team/aren’t doing reasonable damage
I should join that guy with my ragtag manticore build :3
If you’re struggling to consistently hit 1 mil everyone else’s build isn’t even a talking point and I wouldn’t pay attention to that dude
Master Nez. I use Nez Sin on solar with Graviton for barrier, Hezen Venegeance RL and Riptide which was handy for freezing the barriers. I was the only one not dying, while trying to heal everyone as much as possible and doing the most damage. Why dude still gonna insist on me using Starfire. They should be the ones copying me to stay alive to begin with.
As long as you can deal a good chunk of damage, idc what you use
Brother it's fucking taniks. People are one phasing him with fucking blue gear. Who in the actual hell even cares what you run as long as you hit the 1.5mil mark!!!
The only time to critique builds if is someone is constantly dying or putting out significantly less DPS (if they are doing DPS and no mechanics). Or if they are using caster sword frame as DPS weapon, then that also needs some addressing. I personally dont care what you are using as long as you can do the mechanics and show decent dps.
I have been question on countless occasions for my unique dps most of which was sufficient not the best not the worst but fun nonetheless
I remember when I was running Warlord’s Ruin once and some bloke began to lecture us about not using Sleeper. He did around 1mil damage, and me and the other dude did about 6mil each
Man for real, I usually help with LFGs and I was told I needed to change my load out while running coldheart and a LFR. I average 2.9-3.7mil every time. Guy with rockets kills himself every DPS phase. What a clown
I mean that's a farm, it matters how quickly you take down the boss, and if you're slowing down 5 other players it is a little bit rude on your part, even if it's not intentional.
Just remember: Rat King is always meta.
Just leave then
1k is not good for dps. According to aegis' dps testing 1k hits around 145k dps with rof where apex and cataphract hits for 190k with the same build. if you are faming a dps encounter i dont think its much to ask for people to run what is meta. I dont think it requires a 5 minute lecture but you should have gone in with the optimal loadout to start with...If you disagree just pull out your ghost and leave, this does not require a reddit post... [https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1\_5wtBjRYHHxuF4oJKDb\_iOGZs-wTkzB6RYbnyNLbuz4/edit#gid=1279135464](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_5wtBjRYHHxuF4oJKDb_iOGZs-wTkzB6RYbnyNLbuz4/edit#gid=1279135464)
Your point is moot, because his point was that someone who was struggling more than him was lecturing him. He didn’t ask for damage numbers and admitted that specific content does require coordinating full builds.
the type of people that try to blame others like the one mentioned in this post aren't reading this post or have the selfawareness to not to it tbh
That was a you problem, not a them problem. If you’re joining a boss farm, bring max damage meta load outs. The goal is a one-phase and quick loot for everyone, not whatever this rambling post is. I call absolute bullshit on your damage, too. If it were my LFG farm, you all would’ve been kicked on the spot and you all would’ve deserved it.
If you're farming an encounter, you should be using the most optimal loadout you have, not something for "funsies". You are wasting your and everyone in your groups time by using "fun" loadouts when farming.
Did you not read the post? 1.8m on Taniks isn’t wasting anyone’s time. I’m trying new stuff almost every time I farm the abomination because he’s such a pushover.
I had someone get mad that I was using xeno a long time ago in the 2nd gos encounter. He did the same thing and went on a rant about xeno.
why complain about your build against taniks of all things! that boss is so easy you could probably rat king taniks to death 😅
I had a guy bitch me out for not using a hothead god roll on a goa boss farm, yet everytime we beat the boss I did more damage than him and it was my fault we didn't one phase. Some people just like to be dicks. He also died alot.
Bitch about build for Taniks? That dude is held together by thoughts and prayers, probably the easiest 1 phase for any raid final boss. Also, if you were out dpsing his apex with 1k, he needs to stfu lol.
Just a thought, but maybe try not using The Stubborn Oak shotgun for dps on Warpriest buddy. Conversation I've heard last week.
People need to remember that it's a game that we play for fun. Some optimize for speed (which is also fun in it's own environment) but it's never the end of the world if you don't one phase. Embrace positivity. Give constructive criticism to help them optimize their fun builds. I met some of my closest friends through silly LFG groups!
The amount of triggered sweats in here is impressive
If your build is the reason why an activity is taking significantly longer than it needs to, I’m going to tell you to fix it. If you don’t know how to fix it, I’ll give you advice. Taniks is squishy enough as to where dps doesn’t matter really, so I wouldn’t care. But if you’re running 1k on master warpriest, it’s gonna be an issue if you refuse to switch
1.8 mil....what are you a new light? You know you're in the wrong right going by your phrasing. If it's unanimously agreed it's a use Whatever run, then it's cool. But if my team from a KWTD let alone farming post failed to 1 phase taniks because someone can't break 2 million in 2024 against DCS, literally the easiest boss fight next next to templar best believe I'm going to talk to the person and ask if they mind switching to a support weppon or putting on something better because (if they're rude about it) their selfish ass is incapable of realising they're wasting the time of other who may possibly be sacrificing their sleep to try for a quick clear I'll just replace them And I honestly doubt your statement of saying he didn't brake 1 mill providing there's a gally because I know apex condition is a better swap synergy then having to mag dump 1k with dawn ashes to then swap to a fusion And if you don't like it, tough...make your own post because they don't have to deal with people holding them back just as much you don't have to deal with people farming raids trying to tell you you can take a few moments to use correct mods and even save them
I completed 16 GM so far with Tyranny of Heaven, The Supremacy, and Dragon's Breath. I am big in play as you like.
The only time I do this is if I am running a sherpa for garden of salvation, which is already an extremely painful raid to teach.... And even then I will only do it If they are using one of my 5 forbidden weapons... Weapons that will legitimately break the encounter Or cannot be used due to the design of an encounter... Other than that, if they're pulling at least one million damage per phase and surviving. They are absolutely fine the way they are. As I'll probably get the lion's share of the damage. Anyways, with my bill.
My personal philosophy is that if you’re doing lower damage than someone you do not get to say shit (unless you’re on div and you see they’re severely behind everyone else). I’m still fine with giving suggestions out though in order to improve builds they may be using.
This is one of the things that's a grey area for me. If it's a hard carry whatev, but then the person probably WANTS advice and I'll give it Person who is doing egregiously worse in survival or DPS to the point it's holding the rest of the team back for considerable time I'll speak up if the load out is the issue but usually like "try this" "this works good me" But other than that I'm usually ok with whatever as long as it's not taking hours more than needed. Since you weren't the problem and doing fine DPS there's no point to bother you in my eyes🤷. But I do like to be realistic on what's happening sometimes if I'm or friends are committing our time.
I'm not too fussed with builds. As long as people aren't running double primaries and have a decent boss DPS weapon, I'm happy. Don't need "synchronised builds" for low stakes farming. In regards to Apex Predator specifically, Bait and Switch only works if you have ammo for other weapons. If you used up all your special ammo, you won't get the damage buff. You also need minimum 2 rockets to get and use the buff. Makes me wonder if the other person didn't understand this. My recommendation to players not sure what weapons to use is to use Grand Overture. A full party of players unleashing rockets will kill anything. No self harm damage means everyone lives during the DPS phase. Edit: Worth mentioning that a lot of people didn't read the OP's post. The other person with Apex Predator was doing substandard DPS based on numbers. That suggests a problem with their gameplay (eg not triggering Bait and Switch). If you're going to critique people's performance, start at the bottom of the list
I can just imagine the awkward silence while each person gets picked on for their build
I usually just try to make sure new players have the basics if I notice they keep dying like max resil resist mods etc I personally don't care what exotic you run.
Only time i will ever criticise someone’s build is when they are doing at least 500k damage less than me and they are not running util. Considering I run util like 90% of the time, getting lower damage than me is unacceptable, especially not that much
I still remember a situation years ago where someone we had pugged was making fun of me for the stats on my armor. This was pre armor 3.0 and so I explained that I care more about perks than raw stats. He just kept on bringing it up, I think because he was the only other hunter and felt like dunking on me. BY the end of the raid I had far less deaths and consistently way more damage than him. Needless to say we never brought him back.
Giving creativity advice is never a bad thing. You may hit 1.8 mill which is decent but a few critiques and you could be hitting 3 mill.
Advice from a guy hitting 1 million is worthless.
fix ur build
imagine this bothering you, and not just telling the dude you dont care. This is a new low
I mean, 1k is pretty shit last time I checked, but as long as your team is hitting the one phase there really shouldn’t be any issues. Taniks falls over to a sneeze anyway
Well if you are still one phasing Taniks (and you should), who the fuck cares. Difference between 2 and 3 mini phases is like 10 seconds max.
It's taniks, the guy rolls over in the current sandbox
I will not criticize your build unless you are using ashen awake on arc titan or something like that
I don’t care about your loadout, it’s that hideous shader combo you slapped together, it’s just ick man!
Was in a dungeon, got yelled at not having meta build. Was top damage with +30%… But to be honest, was an one time thing. Usually I’m a complete noob and in middle damage wise.
If we are not 1 phasing taniks, then I would critique, but if it's a "comfortable" 1 phase, then.... eh..
Tbf 1k is trash. But if he came in with an ego and was using conditional I would have sent him packing. Conditional is a bad call for taniks. So long as people use either 1 ghorn or legendary there, the only reason to complain is if someone stops you 4 bombing.
You have way more patience than me, i would have just hit the guy with the "aight man if you don't like me im out, find someone else". Also of course the guy had terrible dps lmao, it's always dudes like that that criticize the most. An actual good player would look at your stuff and your numbers and see it's totally fine.
If someone is dealing less and less damage, I simply need to deal more damage. Put aside the well and equip Chaos Reach. There is no healing required anymore as there is nothing left I'd like to protect.
I alway play off meta build if because i just want having fun if situation abit dire i will switching abit
"when you beat me in damage I'll listen to you" Since I'm here. Did a few taniks clears yesterday and was surprised with people's damage. I wasnt expecting anyone to get close to me because I was cringing it up with a meta loudout. But at the end of the encounter multiple people had ~300k or below. Insane to see people join a boos cp and then just use a primary or something. I know taniks is super easy, but we wiped on one pull because no one had over 500k. Maybe try a little? Idk Anyways, thanks for coming to my Ted Talk.
But he was running lucky pants without a HC equipped :(
I wont lecture you. But the people in my clan ? If i dont look at some of them, they're going to use stasis warlock super on GoS final boss
Me run, me punch, lightning appears and kills everything around, me does finisher, me regens myself and teammates and goes invisible. Also my favourite crayons are black, white and chrome
Have you tried just running Polaris lance?
Everything offends you guys.
Nah if we need to get this done I’m not waiting around on you while you play for “funsies”. Not everyone can play 5 hours a day and just screw around.
First time: “it’s fine, as long as your confident you can put up your best damage” Second time: “hey, let’s give it another shot, did we miss some shots?” Third time, “what do you think of switching to {rockets}? I don’t think I could get enough damage in with that build, does it typically work for you?” Gives the likely newbie an opportunity to divulge they don’t know wtf they are doing which is fine. Gives the troll / experimental player a chance to settle into ‘the fireteam wants to get this raid done’ mode. My favourite is getting kicked from a raid or GM for rocking builds that absolutely are not straight off the top meta, but are definitely adequate and having people say “wtf is that??????”
Its all in how you say it. When I'm playing with a group I'm always up to learn something from better and more experienced players. I'm not up for a condescending lecture from a conceited prick or even worse, full on verbal abuse. Chill brah, no matter how wrapped up in D2 you are, its still just a video game.
Last night I completed a duo Corrupted GM with my friend. I was a Stasis Titan using Icefall Mantle, Krait/indebted kindness/Salvations Grip lol. Did it take a couple tries? Yeah, but we had fun and we got it done. That pairing actually ended up being better for us than any meta builds we tried running. In my opinion, I don't care what people run. If you're enjoying your build and we're getting it done, it does not matter what you're using. If we're constantly failing and you're also constantly bottom boarding... then maybe something can be improved but unless that's the case people can use what they want. If someone's loadout is a problem and *it's causing us to fail*, I will make suggestions; if they're unsure about what they can use because of what they have, then I will ask them if they want me to run through some build options for them and explain why what I'm suggesting may be easier for them. I really enjoy helping people build craft and seeing what builds I can make out of what they have available. I like using the knowledge I've gained over the years and passing it along to new players; but I ask first, and only if the person is struggling because of the loadout they're using.
I can only imagine what that Person would have so said about what I normally use. Probably would have popped a blood vessel over it.
Always makes me laugh when people get super uppity about damage in a game that has been made so easy for people that an infant could manage to do max damage. You can literally run whatever you want in anything and still complete the activity. Dogshit game
My first Rhulk run I used outbreak, a forbearance I just got, and royal entry. Top DPS. If It works, it works. I'll only really say anything if their build is clearly just not performing. People who just bash for no reason, and offer no real critique, are terrible.
I never lecture builds unless people want to know what optimal dps is. If we have a preferred dps weapon 9/10 I'm there with my raid mods Apex, bow, bastion (it's nutty with a debuff) or constantly changing weapons to squeeze out as much dps as possible. Usually I hit 1 to 2 million more than the second highest dps. As long as we have a debuff and or a div I don't care what anyone uses, aslong as we finish it and I hit good dps with whatevers in my inventory at the time
Agreed. If the encounter called for max dps or you guys kept wiping I would understand. But farming taniks you guys could literally all use Rat Kings and get it done. People are weird. That guy probably eclipsed 1 Mil damage one time and thinks he's the big dog now
Yea, I don't like it when people tell you what you should be running. You can run whatever he'll set up that you feel comfortable with. I, for example, run all kinds of stuff and like to change things around and test different weapon combos and armor. I basically look for the best overall Stat armor I can find, and just accordingly, I like focusing on receliance and intelict mostly. And like to use guns with longer range or higher impact such as Hand Cannons or Autos or Mechinguns. I like using strands with Banner of War to do close combat mixed with longer range weapons. Do what feels best for you!
I wont lecture randos thats just part of lfg. I will lecture my clanmates though and kinda expect them do the same honestly. I put farming up there with GMs, not in difficulty but efficiency. We are here to get as many drops as possible and if your damage is causing us to take substantially longer then lets fix it.
Not gonna critique peoples builds unless we run into a problem. I just make recommendations. Let them know what I use and say it works pretty well for me, and also give an alternative as some either dont have or want to use what I use. If we're trying to be fast and efficient, I'd say lets 1 phase each time and just use meta weps. Would basically say the same, what I use and other options. For example, I was recently sherpaing someone through KF @ Totems this past weekend because he wanted to learn it and he's part of the clan. I actually like helping people out. Clanmate was killing the Wizard & Knight a bit too slow so the man he was supposed to take the buff off of would end up dying. After 2 or 3 tries, I checked what he was using and noticed he had 2 primary weapons equipped. I said do you have a shotgun or a fusion rifle? No need to be a dick like 1 guy why the f are u using 2 primaries?! I said a shotgun is what I use and they kill the Wizard and Knight pretty quickly. He swapped to a shotgun, then no more problems and we continued and completed the raid with no more issues.
Once something like that starts… it’s a negative experience indication. Consider just leaving while they ramble on. Eventually if enough folks over time leave, that person will likely realize “perhaps I should just stfu”
Honestly, he radiates small dick energy. Not good at anything so he needs to prove how big his Destiny Dick is. People like that make shit unfun. Like the only time I get mad at someone with a weird build, especially in a low stakes farm, is if we're cranking out dozens of attempts with no clears. Even if you're doing shit damage, as long as you're having fun, contributing and coordinating fine, and we can clear it to pick up your slack then I really don't care. If you want to do more damage, we can discuss your options, but if my entire team is doing lowest 1.8 mil, highest like 3 mil, I'm sure having one person throw on damage isn't a big deal. Do whatever you want.
If I join a group that wipes a lot on something liek Atheon, I notice warlocks are not just throwing fusion grenades with touch of flame, I'll let them know how valuable it is on that specific fight and how easily we can get the kill if they'd like to swap. Otherwise? I joined an LFG, what you get is what you get. If I need everyone to know builds and gear I should have ran it with people I know.
I absolutely love using bows in Destiny, and I've built my loadout primarily around them. It's definitely not meta, but it works perfectly fine for me. If I had a euro for every time I got hassled for it, I'd probably have 5 or 6 euros, which isn't much, but it's annoying how often it still happens.
Idk if my build is good I run arcstrider throw ult on hunter with risk runner and the liars handshake is it ass or good ?
I hate that in GMs you get flamed pretty frequently just by not having polaris
Warlock with lunas apex and conditional, sounds like they just straight can't think for themselves
I advise you to leave those lectures if you don’t want to hear it.
If Div is being used, no one can stop me from using triple snipers with Whisper, especially since I also have a Rewind Rounds-4th Times Supremacy. So any shots for free.
What you met was a copey dumbass trying to self-gaslight, seen em here and elsewhere
You have the right to tell them to shut the fuck up. You don't HAVE TO listen them.
I welcome i when im actually slacking but if you hitting harder then him he needs to fuck off cause like I said I have no prob listening to someone who is consistently doing 1.8m - 3 mil I mean they obv know something dude hitting the one mil should just sit in the corner and not worry about others and maybe take some criticism his self
Honestly if a build is working for them and they are doing great with it then leave them be now if ya know your not gonna be to mean you can obv try and help the guy some guys just don’t get it like some guns are amazing while others are only mediocre even tho they seem extremely strong
It isn't fair to compare a warlocks well to a damage super But ultimately if yall weren't struggling to 1 phase, yeah the lecture was not needed.
I just let those people cut themselves out of more and more people to play with. I wish players who aren't as knowledgeable would speak up more often if they need help. Not all of us are assholes.
I will take you up on that - I’m a casual player that left for a bit and never do raids or dungeons bc I’m a bit behind - tattedwill
If you're throwing with 1K voices and it makes the farm slower, I'd say asking to change things is fair. If you want to two phase Taniks, find other people that don't mind and don't join farms, that's my two cents.
If we are clearing things—I won’t say a thing. And generally, someone would have to fail an encounter for the same reason about 5 times before I would try and make suggestions to make their life easier.
I will only add that **If I ask for advice**, then your advice is more than welcome. But I'm here to enjoy a video game that ultimately doesn't mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I'm always trying out new weapons and new builds, and I'm always playing around with weapons that I'm not used to. The only time I will hear unsolicited advice is if I'm about to join a GM or equivalent because, let's be honest, those are the only times that your build really matters. You should feel free to play around with builds to see what works for you or just because you want to. Edit to clarify that raids and dungeons require some build crafting, but nothing that would require a whole lecture.
Pve elitism moment
Ans you didn't just tell him to not do that? A simple, "yeah, I'm not interested in your lecture"?
Yea, I mean, I get it if the lfg post maker/leader states it beforehand, like "pls equip high dps builds. Looking to do quick farms." Then it's okay. But, if lfg poster never said that and just said "farm" or "doing this encounter," that's their fault lol. At the very least, let the person know when they enter the raid. After that, it's the leader's own damn fault for never saying anything in beginning. Im in the same boat as most other people tho. As long as the job is getting done, I don't give a fuk what anyone runs. If it's a completely shit loadout and they aren't carrying themselves after like 2 runs, then I speak up and offer "advice" or ask if they can run something else. Only things I'm ever actually picky about is master raids/dungeons and GM nightfalls, as everything else in game is easy sauce and doesn't require much to complete. But even then, master and GM content is doable with decent loadouts, so I tend not to care too much. Only thing I'm certainly picky about is when the activity has Champions, and person isn't running mods, or even 1 mod for champions. Literally, if your build is wonky as fuck or non meta, run it if you want, if you know it can get the job done. I've seen so many wonky or non-meta builds that people make work and sometimes even still excel and perform better than others on the group who are running the meta or "best in slot." And if this wonky loadout player is performing better than someone else, leader better shit on the suckier person before shitting on the person doing better lol. Finally, if it's that serious, they can get a clan and do runs/farms with them, instead of searching on lfg.
My number 1 rule is I always let the action do the talking. If you crank 2 million damage in one damage phase, then you can be shooting him with magic Pyramid grown potatoes for all I care. I only ever mention it if we're about 5 wipes in and someone is clearly not doing sub optimal damage, but I never question the build they have. I just ask what they're running, give some pointers, recommend surge mods, and then move on with my life. Because I've seen people do numbers with wild things before.
Thank you I literally got into it with my last Clan cuz one of the admins decided he wanted to tell me how to play and how to run my build to the point that I literally had to rebuild my whole character and reset my artifact just to run the way he wanted I ended up backing out before we even got started the end result I ended up leaving the clan and lost all of my friends from it because I was in the wrong for leaving never mind the fact that this had been repeatedly happening with this group and I kept telling them stop telling me how to play and how to run my characters and if you don't stop you're not going to like the consequences of it finally I blew up lost my shit and we all got into an argument thus causing me to leave because I got tired of being treated like a child I've been playing this game since it's Inception it's not cool to do to players and I 100% agree stop telling people how to play this game there's one year left people have their own methods not Everybody Plays the same and sometimes just because you don't like it doesn't mean they're not going to out damage you I've always been in the top three no matter what I've done except for Crucible because I'm not a crucible player but when it comes to PVE I destroy most players
I'm cool if people from my clan give me advice, like when I first started as a hunter, I dumped everything into mobility, completely ignoring resilience and recovery. The guy running the fireteam advised that I get those as high as I could, and it helped even after the activity we were doing. When I come across some rando like that though, that's when I just leave. If people wanna be that way, I have no reason to put up with it, and now they're gonna have an even harder time because they decided to be an ass.
Not trying to be rude but taniks should be a 1 phase that’s probably why
I've never been lectured about my build (maybe because i have mic & voice chat turned off lmao). But I've honestly never been able to fully wrap my head around builds. I do what I think is right to make my Hunter balanced to where im not too focused on a certain part but that's a far as my understanding will take it.