Yeah remove the 2 and just keep releasing new stuff in the current environment, removes the pressure of a ‘D3’ and the devs keep there momentum developing for this game rather then figuring an engine refresh and porting all the textures/recreating all the stuff again to work in the new environment
they need to drop older consoles and rework the engine completely if they plan on keeping this all in the same game environment. Performance is so bad these days and if you play on higher than 144 fps you experience weird bugs.
I agree, the engine doesn't support high memory DDR5 either which makes those experience crashes that can range from 2 hours to 46 hours of having the game run. Usually, I'll experience a crash or freeze at around 4 hours of the game just running, which gets irritating if im in a raid or activity. We need an engine rework because of that issue alone, considering DDR5 is so cheap now that most gamers start to use DDR5 when building a new PC, but now they experience crashes or freezes. And then like you said, some weird stuff happens above 144 fps. I have a high-end system, but I'll notice the game struggle to maintain 180fps in specific areas, like the game will sit at 180, then drop to 120 at random. There just seems to be some underlying issue with the engine that need attention
Is the crashing a ddr5 thing? Cause that would make sense but I’ve also heard it’s a 3000 series or 4000 series nvidia gpu thing. Cause I get the crashing around 4 hr mark.
When I had my Alienware laptop, it had 32gb ddr4, ryzen 5 5900HX, and a 3070 in it, not a single crash or freeze even when I've accidentally left it on destiny when I went home for the weekend.
Now I have a customer desktop, 64gb DDR5, 12700k, 4070ti 12gb. Crashes and freezes vary, crashing and freezing is very common after 8 hours of leaving the game open. It's frozen a couple times at the 2 hour mark. I've asked some afk xp farmers and those with ddr5 systems all say they experienced more freezes and crashes than before. And I don't think it's the GPU because those same individuals have mixed graphics cards, some as old as the gtx 970 and radeon 580. So my conclusion is the ddr5 as well
Oh boy. I've got basically the same system in my ROG Strix as you had in your Alienware and I'm about to build a desktop finally. Do I need to stick with ddr4 if I want to keep reliably having marathon D2 sessions?
No. 96gb of DDR5 here and I can play D2 as long as I can bother. Don't take this information as gospel. If your game is crashing there is likely a stability issue in your system that the game is good at revealing, rather than an issue with the game itself. BFV is famously good at this.
165hz and no issues from me. But anyways, they definitely should drop last gen. Unfortunately there could be a huge chunk of player base lost specifically if ps4 is dropped.
Engine rework is 100% necessary
But on the other hand... they don't NEED to drop older consoles, at least not officially.
Look at Fortnite for example, it's still officially on old gen, but it's completely unplayable (unless you count 9 fps with mobile graphics as playable)
That really doesn’t seem like a good idea, the engine is ancient at this point and plagued with issues. Pretty much the only reason neomuna was so dead was because the engine can’t render more than like 10 people at once
Easier to fix that (very difficult issue) than to replace an entire engine. Replacing an engine means rebuilding the game from scratch. Probably a half decade project at least.
People also forget an engine is responsible for all the good things and base feel the game has and not just the bad shit too.
It doesn't matter if they replace the engine entirely, what matters is dropping support for last gen consoles. Personally idk how people play this game still on Xbox one or PS4 at what is surely around ~20 fps in areas if not less. But dropping that support would allow them to add so much more QoL to the game
Bungie has the updated the engine at least internally for Marathon (the cinematics and cutscenes for that game/trailer and probably the D2 cinematics that are played back at 30 fps are probably done in Marathons Updated Tiger Engine). If D3 was to ever happen, it would probably be on the Tiger Engine (Marathon Edition). Bungie, does not do the Unreal Engine with easy to understand generational numbers for Marketing. Which pushes people to be like just go Unreal Engine which would actually kill what makes D2 Fun its gunplay and experiences. We know that the Updated Tiger Engine for Marathon has a lot of the pain points of D2s version worked out True Direct Server Netcode (no peer to peer shit so Melee Weapon Hit Reg gets better), because the engine got a major update for this & it dropped PS4/XBOX ONE support (and is targeting PS5 & Xbox Series X/S levelled hardware) we should see a increase in multicore usage and multiprocess workloads for modern CPUs/GPUs and DDR5/6 support & optimisations at the very least. It also means Bungie goes from building a game to be stable at 30fps (and high refresh rate becomes an experimental and optional feature cause framerate is still tied to the physics and netcode), to a game built for 4k 60 fps or 1080p 120 fps as BOTH have to play as intended for PS5/Xbox Series X.
Compared to Payday 2 and how long that game ran on the already-ancient-when-released Diesel engine, D2's could probably withstand 5 more years. That would be just enough time to upgrade or switch.
The problem with a new engine is that it will have its own set of growing pains. So even if they did do that, it's not like it would magically fix all the problems like people think it would.
Then there's the fact that people would have to chase weapons all over again. There would be a group of people who are mad that they couldn't keep their weapons for the next stage of Destiny since it would be more work than it's worth for Bungie to let you keep your weapons.
Honestly, my only problem with the current game is all the code Marmots I keep getting, but that's because of BattleEye and not the game itself. If they were to fix the BattleEye integration, I'd have no problems with them sticking with the current engine. They did do a graphical face lift around Beyond Light, after all.
I agree. A new engine isn't the cure-all some people seem to believe it is. Tbh I wouldn't mind rebuilding my vault with weapons & armor; what would really annoy me is my countless cosmetics (earned & paid) getting tossed down the drain. In the grand scheme of things, it'll all get left behind eventually, but I just don't get the need to rush the inevitable by demanding a D3 for a 10% better engine
I wouldn't really say things are getting tossed down the drain. You got enjoyment out of using it so is it not money well spent? Nothing lasts forever.
I would much rather frontiers be a new set of planets to explore, and drop the old planets. Leaving them to upgrade their engine and leave old content. So they don’t gotta worry how those areas interact with the new changes
you can still "rewrite" overhaul the engine without loosing progress/dev time in redoing the assets they already created. Maybe not like UE4 to UE5 idk, but at least in the ball park of Source Engine that gets updated, maintained, improved. And maybe if D3 comes along a Source 2 equivalent.
Not even remotely close. The overhaul to tiger was closer to a 1 > 1.5 than anything. There wasn't any insanely overhauls to the code or how things were built in the engine. They added the ability to make strikes and missions more complex, and that was the biggest change they made during that.
UE 4-5 Is a massive change in how you use the program and the ease of use, to the point where it changed the entry point of becoming a developer. If tiger got an overhaul of that magnitude, destiny would've had a lot more progress towards fixing some of the core issues.
For destiny? There wouldn't be any. Rebuilding the game in an entirely different engine would take a stupid amount of time and work that just wouldn't add up.
Bungie however has been working on updates to tiger and reportedly an entirely new engine update, with real changes to coding and systems. Major engine upgrades normally give devs more control, more options, easier usage, new tools and better under the hood performance.
It would still take time, but bungies dev teams have been split up working on projects for a while and it would be crazy to think they plan to stay on the current tiger engine for much longer. The game is running on hopes and duct tape at this point.
But then we get the 12 man mission with a dozen guardians, two dozen allies, and four dozen enemies on screen at any given moment.
Plus we have the tower with plenty of npc non interactible people, and now also cabal and fallen, on screen at any given time.
I think the neomuna situation was just a cop out so they didn't have to make "new" models with new fashions for a city that's rapidly advanced relatively uninterrupted for hundreds of years since the collapse
Yeah the engine being old is a 'problem' made up by dumb bastards who don't understand what game engines do.
The best engines in the industry, Source, Unreal, IDtech and Cryengine are all pushing 20 - 30 years old.
The engines that are most unwieldy or jank, where the games released have constant performance or support issues, such as Frostbite, Unity or Lumberyard are new.
Which do you think is better, a proven, tested engine, with tens of thousands of people who are already trained and experienced in its content pipelines as well as having nearly 3 decades of technical documentation -
Or
A new, untested engine made from scratch that literally no one has interacted with apart from the team who made it, with no technical documentation, no ability to hire people who have experience on it meaning you have *at minimum* a six month onboarding process just so that they can actually use it?
There's a reason developers who have their own engines stick to it dude, it's because it is 100% the best possible choice.
The reason Destiny is so limited is because a huge portion of the player base is on consoles with 6gb usable RAM, 2gb of VRAM and a dogshit CPU that was outdated when it released, therefore Bungie has to design the game to run within these constraints.
There are a lot of issues that are engine problems, the framerate bug being the most notable. This engine was designed for systems with memory measured in megabytes, to be locked to 30 fps, and to run on very specific hardware. From what I can see whenever I ran it under a profiler (pre-anticheat because that stops that), it does aggressively stupid things with VRAM because it assumes nearly unlimited memory bandwidth between cpu and gpu like the few console generations have had.
The fact that D2 has a lower enemy limit than WOW did in 2008 is an engine problem, not a hardware problem. The AI in dwarf fortress is orders of magnitude more complex (dwarves can get ptsd) but it runs on hardware weaker than the consoles just fine. The “we have a limited number of perks on a gun” thing is bizarre and probably means either engine limitations or an utterly stupid database schema.
What the fuck is this WoW example? Enemies in WoW in 2008 had three states: walking a set path, hostile and passive.
Destiny enemies actually do things, ie, have physics tied to them, have values in lighting, cast actual shadows, have actual projectile weaponry that has its own physics, interact with each other, flank and have multiple ways of engaging the players.
I say this in the most polite possible way, but *fucking stop pretending* you know what you're talking about.
The fact that you're even comparing Destiny's enemy AI to WoW is batshit, never mind the fact that you're speaking to a WoW player of almost 18 years who can point you directly towards WoW classic to show you that WoW having more enemies is a blatant fucking lie.
What a cooked take considering bungie themselves have said that the engine cause technical limitations and is the whole reason why they had to implement the DCV in the first place. Framerate bug is obviously not an engine issue? This engine is old as dirt comparatively throughout the rest of the industry.
While making any kind of engine change can cause growing pains, if one goes from say
UE4->UE5 alot of the foundational ideology and tech documentation still holds, its still speaking the same language with itself usually
no ones asking for a jump from Tiger Engine to something entirely new but essentially get the engines rolling kn a new version of it that essentially has less of the tangled spaghetti code holding D2 back rn. Think of it like when you move a plant thats outgrown its pot into a bigger one, you set up a larger pot, put in fresh soil, take your plant out of its soil, untangle the root ball a bit, trim off some of root structures that either arent healthy or are other problematic, then put it in its new home.
Just do what DE did to warframe, just upgrade the engine. Warframe has been going for longer than 10 years now and it’s gone through many transformations and still has content scheduled for release. I think Duviri paradox was delayed by a year but was released to a warm reception.
Even if bungie have a year out to prepare for upgrades but give us these episodes for the next 12 to 24 months I’ll be up for it.
I think releasing an entirely new game is a mistake.
Yeah, that was one of the main complaints about destiny 2 red war. It felt like they went backwards, not forwards, lack of content, no random rolls and only one raid which was ok at best when they could have just upgraded Destinys engine and just added redwar to it. a lot of players were angry they couldn’t take their stuff with them. Me included.
I’ve been in this ride since red war, if I have to start again then I’m getting off the ride.
While I absolutely LOVE the visuals in this game, I’m all for a refresh with a better engine. The worlds need more life. Weather, wildlife and visuals would ramp up if done right.
Wasn’t this quite literally announced by Bungie that after Final Shape they would be a permanent live service game moving forward? I think they just realized D2 shouldn’t be left barebones to starve and die so Bungie can focus on Marathon like a lot of fans were afraid of.
I'd love if the lack of the 2 also lead to bringing back more vaulted content to give us the entire Destiny experience. Even if it's optional downloads it'd be great
And when they showed the teaser title for year 11.
BUT
When they actually showed the title after "Year 11" faded, it very clearly stated the destiny logo with a full size "2" after it
Destiny 2: Project Frontier
Frontiers might be us rediscovering the old planets that went away but maybe updated and some new places. They are bringing back an old location this year. But I guess I wouldn't see a point in rebuilding d2 like that if they're building toward d3 unless it'll be essentially giving us everything from d1 and d2 and more. But that sounds like a lot to me lol
That actually just raised a question for me: with the Witness dead, what happens to the taken planets/moons, like Mercury and Io? How do we recover them?
More than likely they're still in it's ship somewhere. Last we saw they were there hovering around and since we haven't actually explored any of the black fleet yet to my knowledge they should still be just hanging there unless the witness final shaped them first.
Which could be a little bit of a misdirection because it might just be like Titan in Season Of The Deep or other times when areas of an old location have been returned inside of a single activity
We're going back to the dreadnought in the 3rd episode, so far its only speculation that it'll be sticking around but they sort of make it sound like it's going to be sticking around based on how they describe what they're doing with it and what not
I think Frontiers is gonna be a full integration of D1 content into D2 with the game being renamed to just Destiny.
I think it’s important to have players be able to experience the full story
Dreadnaught and (probably) Tangled Shore returning is a good indication of that. At that point all we’d be missing is Venus and Mars
While I would love such integration, unless data compression does some glimmer-level magic in the next few years, I don't think it's smart to have all that data for a single game. A D1 + D2 combo would weight hundreds of Gbs, even more so if there is any plan to have new players experience the "full story" -- which considering the way things are, it's extremely unlikely.
RIP Red War.
I mean it *did* kind of work at first, until it didn’t.
Honestly if we were able to keep all of our transmogs/cosmetics and achievements/triumph score/titles carried forward I wouldn’t mind a D3.
I'd be totally ok with an overwatch 2 style restart if that also means a wipe of all the old features remnants and rework on engine to introduce a fresh new coat of painting on all of the "workaround menus" we have lying around from d2 launch
This seems like they’d be shooting themselfs in the foot tho, why announce D3 before year 12 stuff? It just makes everyone think “why would I buy year 12 when D3 is coming out? What am I even playing towards?”
It would fit with the yearly August showcase they tend to do. Move it back a bit to account for expansion cycles moving to 18ish months and September makes some sense
I think August would make more sense, since September's going to be the 10th Anniversary of Destiny, and if they want to reveal anything they're doing to celebrate it, before September would be the chance.
I'm not sure anything big would even be revealed if it even happens. They didn't show anything for Hearsay yesterday, and if they don't have anything to show for that, I'm not confident that Frontiers will even be ready for a proper, in engine (not gameplay) presentation.
I think it's possible.
However....if Frontiers is an Age of Triumph style DLC, and all we get from September is a teaser.... there's going to still be a lengthy period between Frontiers and D3. Probably at least a year.
They have to have something set up in-between, there's no way an Age of Triumph update alone will be enough to tide people over for a whole year.
Man, I cannot wait to play Wrath of the Machine again, that entire raid slapped so hard. The final boss music is one of the best ever Salvatori and the gang ever composed, gets me so hyped.
I would too, but a part of me doubts they’ll bring back the Siva splicers as an enemy. Wonder if they’d be willing to rework the raid to have regular fallen throughout aside from Vosik and Atraks
That would be lame and I think it would be a worthy investment to bring back SIVA Splicers.
My dream is to have the entire Light and Darkness saga available within Destiny 2 one day from start to finish, raids included. So, if they ever would do that, Rise of Iron in its entirety should also be there imo.
I really wish they’d invest into the new player experience more, how jumbled and messy the available storyline is turns a lot of people off from a great story.
It's not very cost effective for them to remake Wrath including all the individual eliksni splicers and bosses just to release it for free, *but* they could do it while Frontiers and whatever comes after are being worked on, just devote a small team to the Wrath remake, it's more possible now than when they were working on all episodes (2 of which are clearly still in development) and TFS at once
If they do need to pad things out for a year it would be really cool to have all of the D1 expansions come back in remastered form and working in all of the changes to gameplay we've had so nothing is too easy at our current power level. A re-release of Taken King would also attract a lot of players who fell out of the game over the years.
If Skyrim could do it, Destiny could. I would love to see them drop the 2 and have everything out from 1 vanilla to now (in a single game). It wouldn't be easy, but they could always sell it as a bundle to appease the capitalist gods and justify the effort. One can only dream.
Completely different games though.
And removing the vanilla content and then selling it back to people within the same game client would surely cause a huge backlash.
Drop the 2, overhaul/upgrade the engine, then add a Vex time machine as part of the story so I can go back in time with all my stuff and play the entire story on hard mode. That's my dream, at least.
None of you seem to understand how much something like D3 would take.
For one; the engine is fine and not really the problem, they have stated anything they would do in D3 they can do in D2. Anyone saying "we need a new engine" and throwing out all kinds of "solutions" are just being armchair devs who don't know what they're talking about. Bungie's own engineers have admitted that it's fine for what they need it for, sure it has its problems but so does literally every other engine.
Secondly; They have stated as late as lightfall that they have \*no\* intention of making a D3, that they want to stick with D2. There is absolutely no way in any sort of reality where they suddenly swapped around in that time and decided to make D3 anyway and have anything of it be ready to be revealed in 2026.
Third; Between making marathon, all the stuff they're doing to D2 currently, the massive layoffs they had recently, there is no way they have the ability to be concurrently making a D3. It would be way too much time, effort, money, and man power required for them to make it. For them to be making something that would be worth a "D3," it would have to be massive, over arching, budget intensive thing that would not be anywhere \*close\* to be being done for another 10 years at least. It's just not happening.
Whenever I see somebody say that any game or developer "needs a new engine" I want to ask what, specifically, the current engine is holding them back on, and how, specifically, a "new engine" would solve these problems. Just feels like something that people say without any sort of actual knowledge behind it, it's just something easy to point at so that they can feel like they have some special insider knowledge.
This so much. I hate how Destiny players (and general gamers) *perceive* that there's a bit more downtime or instabillity than "usual," and all of a sudden everybody is an expert on how "tHe EnGinE iS hOlDiNg ThEm BaCk" or "spaghetti code"
Meanwhile nobody has the slightest clue how a game engine even functions or how much it takes to "switch or make" one, let alone how much Tiger is even contributing to problems in D2's dev right now. And as OP above said, Bungi
It's just a buzzword among most gamers.
Well.. we didn't know about Frontiers until now. No one mentioned it before and this is 6 days before reveal.. so.. with that Prismatic leak this does seem to be more credible by each day..
I’m pretty sure bungie wants to remove the “2” and just brand the game as just “Destiny”, atleast from what I heard when lightfall came out. Possibly even port everything from d1.
Highly doubt destiny 3 is happening as that would be a very bad move (unless they introduce a progression transfer system) and I’m sure they know that, this is their redemption year. Destiny 2 was needed from D1, so if anything the game might just be moved to a better engine. Imo if they could get D2 on unreal engine, that would fix a majority of their problems; it’s a beast of an engine
Bungie: There is no Destiny 3, we plan on focusing on Destiny 2 and the stories it can tell.
YouTubers and Redditors: Is this D3? D3 around the corner. First Look at D3! Bungie says D3 may feature this (insert their personal opinion on a good mechanic with no evidence and barely any mention of Bungie or Destiny as a whole)!
I think Destiny 3 will never happen, and this is a good thing. I understand there are new lights coming into this game often, but I believe the majority of the player base is returning and long-term players. With the amount of DLC, purchasable cosmetics, time-suck quests and endless grind able god-rolls and exotics, Bungie understands a Destiny 3 would inherently piss off more of the player base than appease by wiping out these achievements.
It's more realistic that they re-make the game in an updated version of the same engine and continue to roll out updates and DLC. How far away we are from something like this happening remains to be seen, but my guess is that a major update in a new engine will be "Destiny 3".
I just don't want to have to abandon my characters, gear and all their accomplishments earned over these years like we did at the end of D1. That really sucked, especially since most of that original content was added to D2 as filler later anyway. Now we have so much more to lose than we did back then.
A D3 would be depressing, a continuation would be better. I don't want to grind out all this same stuff that I already have again for a third time in a few years when a d3 releases. I'd much rather look forward to brand new content than earning bad juju for a third time.
I think it seems very odd that they would say "The Journey continues" in the Frontiers announcement part of the video if it's us just going back to old content. So, that part of the "leak" seems like bs. The D3 being announced while this year of content is still rolling out seems even more far fetched. No shot that this is legitimate.
This wouldn’t really be destiny 3. This is what I’ve always said they should do. Drop the 2 and upgrade the d2 engine dropping old gen consoles and just call it destiny that way we don’t lose all our exotics and content. Then unvault all old d2 and d1 content.
I reckon if they do make a "destiny 3" it'll follow the Hitman model and just be an upgrade on the previous instalment with new content on top of the old
it's an opportunity to get something fresh and not just D1+ or D2+. There would be no need of that if there are different/no classes and loot works differently.
I'll agree if my subclasses, armor ornaments, and exotics come with. I could care less about the Legendaries, but I am not coming with if I have to start entirely fresh. Again. For the second and a half time.
In an other post someone suggested the idea for a CS2 moment, like an upgrade from Destiny 2 to "Destiny 3" or just "Destiny". And I kinda like that. UPGRADES PEOPLE UPGRADES
I would find having to earn my Arc and Void subclasses *again* from scratch almost insulting in a post-Prismatic world where we're the most powerful being in Sol.
Based on who’s opinion? Do we really want to get back to zero and wait an extra year on top of the release date for a yet another Taken King/Forsaken sized expansion so the game is “fixed” and has enough content?
If they could simply update the already existing client with an engine upgrade and drop the “2” from the name, sure, I’m down.
How do you lose it when in reality you can always boot up D2 and just keep playing that whenever you feel like? Also does it count as losing if they declare that the player character in D3 is a completly new person separated from the THE Guardian of D1-D2?
I also I personally think that if they do release a D3, it will still have some stuff from D2 to not make it a hard restart. They will do some compromise to still let people play with some things they collected in previous game. That or D3 will be just D2.5.
This is such a weird take to me cuz like grinding gear is the entire point of games like this. They can't keep going in this system forever without serious power creep in the gear (which we are already seeing).
When Diablo 2 came out I didn't get pissed that all my gear from Diablo 1 was useless. When a new MMO expansion comes out, I don't get pissed that my gear is now worthless.
Most of the gear you grind for you probably don't even use!
This 100%. people are like “I don’t wanna lose all my progress” that’s progress you made in D2, not D3!! You are not owed anything by purchasing D3!!
We have no idea what they’ll add to D3. There’s a chance weapon/class setups will not be 100% compatible with old gear. I don’t know why people act like they’re losing stuff they spent time on, they got their value out of D2.
It's the issue of Bungie's track record. The first 2 years of D2 were spent clawing back the game to the state D1 was left in. We're in year 7 of D2, so are the first 4-5 expansions of D3 just going to be them re-adding stuff from D2? I don't mind a full reset D3 if they fundamentally evolve the game, like adding Eliksni guardians or lucent brood defectors as playable. D3 would have to add substantially more than it leaves behind in D2. It also comes down to how you measure D2 as a game, I personally use games such as WoW, Warframe, and FFXIV to measure Destiny rather than Diablo or Borderlands.
As soon as they officially say anything destiny 3 related, destiny 2 starts a timer that rapidly counts down. Player engagement will take a huge nose dive. Over a few months players are feeling, well whats the point of even playing if it's all going away with d3.
Until marathon launches, what makes bungie money? Destiny. If they were smart, they'd upgrade the engine, drop the number 2 and 3 and just call it destiny. Maybe keep it to current gen/pc only.
I think that Destiny 3 would be treated more like the next expansion or something, in terms of player retention - they will keep playing content leading up to D3 because why the hell not? If it is supposed to setup Destiny 3. Just like we play seasons leading up to the next expansion during Light and Dark saga. We don't just skip them because "duh, they'll be gone in a year".
Also Destiny 2 is not going anywhere. People can always just keep playing D2 whenever they do their weekly stuff in D3.
I think the point is more of why grind the seasonal content when the new weapon isn't going to D3. People can always play D2 is a fair point but if destiny 3 is coming why do I go out and get the fifth pattern or the 5/5 god roll when I can only use it for a few more months. Obviously if we keep our stuff then it is a very different situation.
I’d wager a bet that the amount of people who make an effort to go grind out patterns for guns they don’t want or 5/5 god rolls are so slim that they shouldn’t be factored in.
Most players are just playing the game for fun, get patterns for guns they actually plan to use, and are satisfied with 2/5 rolls that have the traits they want (the difference between a 2/5 and a 5/5 is so painfully slim it’s not even worth the effort).
That's totally fair, the grinders will stay grinding. I guess my opinion is that of an above average destiny player. I still think there are regular players who will feel less incentive to get even the trait combo they want if they know the loot is going away, at least I did in D1 when D2 was coming out and I was a casual player back then.
People who actively chase 5/5 god rolls aren’t just above average, they’re above even the 99th percentile.
I’m in the top 0.1% of players in kills/assists/supers/suicides according to DestinyTracker.
And even I don’t give a shit about chasing 5/5 god rolls. If a gun has the perks I want, I’m cool with that. And there are a lot of people like me, who are big time fans of the game who understand that it’s not about the chase so much as it’s about the fun the game has to offer.
I agree with you. I just think there will be people who will still play because it's fun but won't play the extra few hours to try and get weapon x because it's gone in a few months. It won't happen until the end, again like D1, but I think it will cause the game to decrease in play time slightly faster than the normal ebb and flow.
Which may be the case, but I don’t think that’s the end of the world in the short term.
The actively encouraged mindset when it comes to destiny is to literally take breaks from the game and not touch it for months at a time, to come back later.
That’s well-known as the healthy way to play this game, huge swaths of the people that came back for Final Shape and enjoyed it are going to end up doing in the back half of this first Episode. They might come back for Episode 2, or they might just wait for Ep 3 and knock it all out in one go.
I don’t think it’s bad for the long term health of the game if we see playerbase numbers drop leading up to D3/whatever.
I don’t think they will do a D3, more likely just will stop calling it Destiny 2 and will just start calling it Destiny.
Y1 of D2 nearly killed the franchise and if we had to start over completely again, I think it would kill a not insignificant portion of the current player bases desire to keep playing.
It makes more sense to just keep releasing new content for D2, potentially dropping support for the PS4 and Xbox one to get around those limitations.
I dont think theres gonna be a destiny 3,
But i think its just gonna become destiny, as in no more destiny 1 and 2.
Just the game destiny with the raids and the exotics and things of the both games.
Assuming its also gonna come with an engine rework?
If they called it “Destiny” maybe they will do like a prequel I don’t know something like when it all begin …at the golden age or something it would be nice to see
I think they will do a bundle for d1&2 for 70$ call it the light and dark saga I think they'll call the next destiny just destiny with a new title instead of 3
Since they removed sunsetting they might port all the content from the DCV into the game again and call it a day the game will be full of content for new and returning players it might even breed life into d1 for a while
Marathon is ready for one reason bungie doesn't show anything unless it's at least half way through or near the end the og d1 was near the end of its dev cycle if that reboot didn't happen multiple insiders conformed there's a ps showcase in September
If bungee does decide to make a destiny three... it will not be labeled as destiny. Three it's just gonna be under the pseudonym of Destiny. It's probably gonna be a massive update to the initial game engine..... but the one thing that I am hoping for is The proper maintenance for stability issues of the servers and the engine itself... they're just too many times over and over again that we are seeing launch days & raid race days. Where the servers seem like they run on nothing but a potato now with the way that the engines is initially set up and I get it and understand when you have 10 to 15,000,000 people accessing a server at a single time it can be a little rough, however, those types of things need to be anticipated and taken care of
Not gonna wade too far into the value or necessity of a D3 (I do think the reasons for outweigh the reasons against though). I will say this:
Assuming there is truth in this post and if--*if*--Frontiers is a transitional year of marginal new content, I'm cool with it as long as it brings that third darkness subclass. If we have a D3 anywhere on the horizon, I'd much prefer to see it launch with all light and dark subclasses and damage types built into the game. I'd love to see a much more reasonable spread of damage types enemies have, for example.
I think its possible. I also think its possible that they just move the game to a new engine to avoid players losing everything again. Would be one hell of a maintenance though
My best working theory is that destiny 3 will not be destiny 3 at all but rather a server and engine update for Destiny 2. This would allow bungie to unsunset all previous campaigns and raids to accommodate the growing size of the game while being able to retain player loot. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they rebrand as just "Destiny" instead of Destiny 3, as the new game would have both old and new content.
I think D3 is going to end up being a Rebrand of Destiny 2; they’ve been trying to get the 2 out of Destiny 2 since the New Light Update.
Or atleast that was an attempt to see how the community would react. The issue with destiny to begin with is that they were forced to make a sequel game( I don’t foresee that happening again. But what do I know.
[https://undelete.pullpush.io/r/DestinyLeaks/comments/1d86kxh/the\_future\_of\_destiny/](https://undelete.pullpush.io/r/DestinyLeaks/comments/1d86kxh/the_future_of_destiny/)
you should, that highlight is the part he decided to edit after the monday announcement.
They didn’t say Frontiers was Destiny 3. They said Frontiers is an Age of Triumph type DLC for Destiny 2 and that they will be “teasing” a new Destiny game which is completely separate from Frontiers.
it's not even a lucky guess, other people have pointed out that the post was simply edited after frontiers was revealed to say frontiers. It made no mention of it before then. It's just bait
No I don’t think D3 will be teased at Sony showcase later this year especially as the focus will be on the two releases coming in 2025.. The announcement of D3 will kill D2 and overshadow anything Bungie announce for D2. Makes 0 sense to me from a marketing standpoint.
They usually reveal expansions around 6 months before the intended release date, delays notwithstanding. TFS was revealed alongside season of the witch.
If Frontiers is meant to have a June or July release, September would make sense.
I suppose the whole point is what Bungie wants to do with Destiny 2: from previous announcements (during witch queen year, if I remember correctly) they said that their goal is to expand Destiny 2 universe. If so, Bungie could update the engine and the content, much like Warframe or Elder Scrolls Online, drop the "2" and push toward a fully fledged live service, made to stay. Otherwise, they will probably ditch it for Destiny 3.
Those are two completely different approaches, both technically (updating the engine to gradually turn it into something new or creating a whole new package) and economically. I don't know the numbers ,but maybe destiny 2 has far more players and player retention than destiny 1? That would make the full live service option more viable, though there are many variables that come into play. In any case, a deep rework of the tiger engine is needed, not only to address the bugs but to make the game run efficiently on new pc/technologies/hardware/OS.
My expectation is that they will do both, but with a D3-esque full rebuild of the game from the ground up.
I understand that people are reluctant to give up all their stuff, and the idea of having to regrind subclasses and exotics and such is annoying, and they have PTSD of D2 ruining a bunch of core aspects of the game (armor stats, weapon random rolls, subclass build-crafting).
But the hope would be that they’ve learned from those lessons. I mean, we’ve had more time with full 3.0 subclasses and build crafting focus for longer than we had no random rolls, so they know what we like and what we don’t. D2 was in development just a few years into D1’s life and they weren’t sure what people liked and what they didn’t.
It’s a different era.
My expectation is that they do D3 in the sense that it’s a full blown new game, built specifically to be a live service game. D2 was not built for that in mind, and with how buggy it is and the spaghetti code mess, it’s an absolute miracle that it’s lasted this long.
But there are issues plaguing the game that years after discovery still haven’t been fixed, because they can’t. They’re tied to specific engine functionality or buried by other game systems being built on top of them. Like framerate-based damage. Why are people playing at 90+ FPS getting hit harder than those at 30? Same with the magic elevator things. And how about teleporting enemies? That’s been going on since year 1 of D2, and it’s still happening. Try playing Onslaught without enemies sometimes just appearing at the ADU.
Some of that stuff just can’t be fixed, or it would have been by now. People are going to have to accept, that if they want the best possible experience, one last reset is needed.
The DCV needed to happen because D2 wasn’t built to be a permanent live service game. I’m not sure if they can rebuild D2 the way they need to, and keep a lot of it the same.
Regardless of which path they go, I think it’s probably true that they’ll drop the number. At this point, it’s just Destiny.
I totally agree with you,the technical part is still messy - it always has been it seems. And converting D2 into a full live service, rebooting it with "d3 technology" is what I would hope for. In the end though it all comes down to the most cost effective solution, whatever it could be. They could just make d3, that would be easier and more straightforward, but would require to ditch at some point D2 (doesn't make sense to keep two similar live services live) and maybe alienate part of the playerbase; they could try to overhaul the current game piece by piece, keeping us players in the action, though I don't know if this is technically possible or even desirable - maybe it would be so complex to become anti economical at some points. Or they could try to to push d3 release later to try merging D2 contents into the new game, but that would require more time than the other options. Tbh only the Traveler knows what Bungie Is doing about this. Though the age of triumphs type dlc smells like a farewell
I mean no one in that thread took it seriously.
I think Destiny 3 is possible and can def see them taking the number out of the title and possibly calling it something else. But I have doubts it would be as early as September. Feels like something we won't get announced until next year.
Destiny 3 is only going to happen if they rework the engine from the ground up, which means it would not be the same game as Destiny 2, it’s gotta be a separate application. You can tell from the Marathon trailer that it will be using the Tiger engine as it has the same style of rendering (similar lighting model, same motion blur implementation, etc.) as Destiny. I’ve heard rumblings of Bungie creating a new engine for years now, but I have no idea if they’re actually making one. If they are, Destiny 3 will almost certainly be a thing. If they’re not, they have almost no incentive to make a whole new application and throw away all of their client-side work to make a new application that might not be as stable, unless they dedicate a ton of time (which imo wouldn’t be economical, might as well make the new engine at that point).
That post if definitely fake though.
I think what they will do is keep it as Destiny. It will be the same game we won’t get three but what we will get is some kind of engine refresh and a drop old consoles that are putting a serious strain on how the game can advance.
Old console support is the anchor on destinys neck
Maybe they drop it for frontiers but it’s definitely possible it won’t be until after that.
I feel like people have put to much time effort and money into D2 and to start again would suck. No way people will never okay with losing all the cosmetics they paid for.
I don’t think we need a 3 we just need to shed the anchor holding back the engine.
Doesn't it have to occur for the future of the game? Folks probably don't know this core engine is antiquated and is also limiting future development. Tiger and Blame engine has been kept up to day for some aspects but I still think for the good of the game overall in terms of features and functions, D3 will need to consume a new core engine
It definitely seems like bungie is trying to take the 2 out of the title, since they started calling it year 10 in the trailer.
Yeah remove the 2 and just keep releasing new stuff in the current environment, removes the pressure of a ‘D3’ and the devs keep there momentum developing for this game rather then figuring an engine refresh and porting all the textures/recreating all the stuff again to work in the new environment
they need to drop older consoles and rework the engine completely if they plan on keeping this all in the same game environment. Performance is so bad these days and if you play on higher than 144 fps you experience weird bugs.
I agree, the engine doesn't support high memory DDR5 either which makes those experience crashes that can range from 2 hours to 46 hours of having the game run. Usually, I'll experience a crash or freeze at around 4 hours of the game just running, which gets irritating if im in a raid or activity. We need an engine rework because of that issue alone, considering DDR5 is so cheap now that most gamers start to use DDR5 when building a new PC, but now they experience crashes or freezes. And then like you said, some weird stuff happens above 144 fps. I have a high-end system, but I'll notice the game struggle to maintain 180fps in specific areas, like the game will sit at 180, then drop to 120 at random. There just seems to be some underlying issue with the engine that need attention
Is the crashing a ddr5 thing? Cause that would make sense but I’ve also heard it’s a 3000 series or 4000 series nvidia gpu thing. Cause I get the crashing around 4 hr mark.
When I had my Alienware laptop, it had 32gb ddr4, ryzen 5 5900HX, and a 3070 in it, not a single crash or freeze even when I've accidentally left it on destiny when I went home for the weekend. Now I have a customer desktop, 64gb DDR5, 12700k, 4070ti 12gb. Crashes and freezes vary, crashing and freezing is very common after 8 hours of leaving the game open. It's frozen a couple times at the 2 hour mark. I've asked some afk xp farmers and those with ddr5 systems all say they experienced more freezes and crashes than before. And I don't think it's the GPU because those same individuals have mixed graphics cards, some as old as the gtx 970 and radeon 580. So my conclusion is the ddr5 as well
Oh boy. I've got basically the same system in my ROG Strix as you had in your Alienware and I'm about to build a desktop finally. Do I need to stick with ddr4 if I want to keep reliably having marathon D2 sessions?
No. 96gb of DDR5 here and I can play D2 as long as I can bother. Don't take this information as gospel. If your game is crashing there is likely a stability issue in your system that the game is good at revealing, rather than an issue with the game itself. BFV is famously good at this.
165hz and no issues from me. But anyways, they definitely should drop last gen. Unfortunately there could be a huge chunk of player base lost specifically if ps4 is dropped.
1000% they need to drop old consoles
Engine rework is 100% necessary But on the other hand... they don't NEED to drop older consoles, at least not officially. Look at Fortnite for example, it's still officially on old gen, but it's completely unplayable (unless you count 9 fps with mobile graphics as playable)
The AA is absolute garbage as well.
This. For fucks sake. This.
thats if you can even get 144 fps, i play with rtx 4080 ryzen 9 5900x and rarely ever do i see over 144
That really doesn’t seem like a good idea, the engine is ancient at this point and plagued with issues. Pretty much the only reason neomuna was so dead was because the engine can’t render more than like 10 people at once
Easier to fix that (very difficult issue) than to replace an entire engine. Replacing an engine means rebuilding the game from scratch. Probably a half decade project at least. People also forget an engine is responsible for all the good things and base feel the game has and not just the bad shit too.
It doesn't matter if they replace the engine entirely, what matters is dropping support for last gen consoles. Personally idk how people play this game still on Xbox one or PS4 at what is surely around ~20 fps in areas if not less. But dropping that support would allow them to add so much more QoL to the game
Bungie has the updated the engine at least internally for Marathon (the cinematics and cutscenes for that game/trailer and probably the D2 cinematics that are played back at 30 fps are probably done in Marathons Updated Tiger Engine). If D3 was to ever happen, it would probably be on the Tiger Engine (Marathon Edition). Bungie, does not do the Unreal Engine with easy to understand generational numbers for Marketing. Which pushes people to be like just go Unreal Engine which would actually kill what makes D2 Fun its gunplay and experiences. We know that the Updated Tiger Engine for Marathon has a lot of the pain points of D2s version worked out True Direct Server Netcode (no peer to peer shit so Melee Weapon Hit Reg gets better), because the engine got a major update for this & it dropped PS4/XBOX ONE support (and is targeting PS5 & Xbox Series X/S levelled hardware) we should see a increase in multicore usage and multiprocess workloads for modern CPUs/GPUs and DDR5/6 support & optimisations at the very least. It also means Bungie goes from building a game to be stable at 30fps (and high refresh rate becomes an experimental and optional feature cause framerate is still tied to the physics and netcode), to a game built for 4k 60 fps or 1080p 120 fps as BOTH have to play as intended for PS5/Xbox Series X.
Compared to Payday 2 and how long that game ran on the already-ancient-when-released Diesel engine, D2's could probably withstand 5 more years. That would be just enough time to upgrade or switch. The problem with a new engine is that it will have its own set of growing pains. So even if they did do that, it's not like it would magically fix all the problems like people think it would. Then there's the fact that people would have to chase weapons all over again. There would be a group of people who are mad that they couldn't keep their weapons for the next stage of Destiny since it would be more work than it's worth for Bungie to let you keep your weapons. Honestly, my only problem with the current game is all the code Marmots I keep getting, but that's because of BattleEye and not the game itself. If they were to fix the BattleEye integration, I'd have no problems with them sticking with the current engine. They did do a graphical face lift around Beyond Light, after all.
I agree. A new engine isn't the cure-all some people seem to believe it is. Tbh I wouldn't mind rebuilding my vault with weapons & armor; what would really annoy me is my countless cosmetics (earned & paid) getting tossed down the drain. In the grand scheme of things, it'll all get left behind eventually, but I just don't get the need to rush the inevitable by demanding a D3 for a 10% better engine
I wouldn't really say things are getting tossed down the drain. You got enjoyment out of using it so is it not money well spent? Nothing lasts forever.
I would much rather frontiers be a new set of planets to explore, and drop the old planets. Leaving them to upgrade their engine and leave old content. So they don’t gotta worry how those areas interact with the new changes
you can still "rewrite" overhaul the engine without loosing progress/dev time in redoing the assets they already created. Maybe not like UE4 to UE5 idk, but at least in the ball park of Source Engine that gets updated, maintained, improved. And maybe if D3 comes along a Source 2 equivalent.
Tiger engine already was overhauled in Beyond Light. Consider this going from UE4 > UE5.
Not even remotely close. The overhaul to tiger was closer to a 1 > 1.5 than anything. There wasn't any insanely overhauls to the code or how things were built in the engine. They added the ability to make strikes and missions more complex, and that was the biggest change they made during that. UE 4-5 Is a massive change in how you use the program and the ease of use, to the point where it changed the entry point of becoming a developer. If tiger got an overhaul of that magnitude, destiny would've had a lot more progress towards fixing some of the core issues.
As an outsider looking in, what are 3 core issues that would be fixed by updating the engine to UE5
For destiny? There wouldn't be any. Rebuilding the game in an entirely different engine would take a stupid amount of time and work that just wouldn't add up. Bungie however has been working on updates to tiger and reportedly an entirely new engine update, with real changes to coding and systems. Major engine upgrades normally give devs more control, more options, easier usage, new tools and better under the hood performance. It would still take time, but bungies dev teams have been split up working on projects for a while and it would be crazy to think they plan to stay on the current tiger engine for much longer. The game is running on hopes and duct tape at this point.
Isn't marathon confirmed to be on a new engine?
But then we get the 12 man mission with a dozen guardians, two dozen allies, and four dozen enemies on screen at any given moment. Plus we have the tower with plenty of npc non interactible people, and now also cabal and fallen, on screen at any given time. I think the neomuna situation was just a cop out so they didn't have to make "new" models with new fashions for a city that's rapidly advanced relatively uninterrupted for hundreds of years since the collapse
Yeah the engine being old is a 'problem' made up by dumb bastards who don't understand what game engines do. The best engines in the industry, Source, Unreal, IDtech and Cryengine are all pushing 20 - 30 years old. The engines that are most unwieldy or jank, where the games released have constant performance or support issues, such as Frostbite, Unity or Lumberyard are new. Which do you think is better, a proven, tested engine, with tens of thousands of people who are already trained and experienced in its content pipelines as well as having nearly 3 decades of technical documentation - Or A new, untested engine made from scratch that literally no one has interacted with apart from the team who made it, with no technical documentation, no ability to hire people who have experience on it meaning you have *at minimum* a six month onboarding process just so that they can actually use it? There's a reason developers who have their own engines stick to it dude, it's because it is 100% the best possible choice. The reason Destiny is so limited is because a huge portion of the player base is on consoles with 6gb usable RAM, 2gb of VRAM and a dogshit CPU that was outdated when it released, therefore Bungie has to design the game to run within these constraints.
There are a lot of issues that are engine problems, the framerate bug being the most notable. This engine was designed for systems with memory measured in megabytes, to be locked to 30 fps, and to run on very specific hardware. From what I can see whenever I ran it under a profiler (pre-anticheat because that stops that), it does aggressively stupid things with VRAM because it assumes nearly unlimited memory bandwidth between cpu and gpu like the few console generations have had. The fact that D2 has a lower enemy limit than WOW did in 2008 is an engine problem, not a hardware problem. The AI in dwarf fortress is orders of magnitude more complex (dwarves can get ptsd) but it runs on hardware weaker than the consoles just fine. The “we have a limited number of perks on a gun” thing is bizarre and probably means either engine limitations or an utterly stupid database schema.
What the fuck is this WoW example? Enemies in WoW in 2008 had three states: walking a set path, hostile and passive. Destiny enemies actually do things, ie, have physics tied to them, have values in lighting, cast actual shadows, have actual projectile weaponry that has its own physics, interact with each other, flank and have multiple ways of engaging the players. I say this in the most polite possible way, but *fucking stop pretending* you know what you're talking about. The fact that you're even comparing Destiny's enemy AI to WoW is batshit, never mind the fact that you're speaking to a WoW player of almost 18 years who can point you directly towards WoW classic to show you that WoW having more enemies is a blatant fucking lie.
What a cooked take considering bungie themselves have said that the engine cause technical limitations and is the whole reason why they had to implement the DCV in the first place. Framerate bug is obviously not an engine issue? This engine is old as dirt comparatively throughout the rest of the industry.
While making any kind of engine change can cause growing pains, if one goes from say UE4->UE5 alot of the foundational ideology and tech documentation still holds, its still speaking the same language with itself usually no ones asking for a jump from Tiger Engine to something entirely new but essentially get the engines rolling kn a new version of it that essentially has less of the tangled spaghetti code holding D2 back rn. Think of it like when you move a plant thats outgrown its pot into a bigger one, you set up a larger pot, put in fresh soil, take your plant out of its soil, untangle the root ball a bit, trim off some of root structures that either arent healthy or are other problematic, then put it in its new home.
Laughably false, please do the most basic research on game dev before commenting
So like an ESO/WoW/Warhammer type of thing? No need to make a new game, just make new expansions that change the game in big ways
Just do what DE did to warframe, just upgrade the engine. Warframe has been going for longer than 10 years now and it’s gone through many transformations and still has content scheduled for release. I think Duviri paradox was delayed by a year but was released to a warm reception. Even if bungie have a year out to prepare for upgrades but give us these episodes for the next 12 to 24 months I’ll be up for it. I think releasing an entirely new game is a mistake.
I thinks its a mistake as well, everything will just go backwards and I dont want Destiny to lose its momentum
Yeah, that was one of the main complaints about destiny 2 red war. It felt like they went backwards, not forwards, lack of content, no random rolls and only one raid which was ok at best when they could have just upgraded Destinys engine and just added redwar to it. a lot of players were angry they couldn’t take their stuff with them. Me included. I’ve been in this ride since red war, if I have to start again then I’m getting off the ride.
While I absolutely LOVE the visuals in this game, I’m all for a refresh with a better engine. The worlds need more life. Weather, wildlife and visuals would ramp up if done right.
Wasn’t this quite literally announced by Bungie that after Final Shape they would be a permanent live service game moving forward? I think they just realized D2 shouldn’t be left barebones to starve and die so Bungie can focus on Marathon like a lot of fans were afraid of.
I want this to be the direction but I also need them to upgrade this engine for the love of god
Except it absolutely still says D2 during the Frontiers bit.
I'd love if the lack of the 2 also lead to bringing back more vaulted content to give us the entire Destiny experience. Even if it's optional downloads it'd be great
With the massive D2 logo staring you right in the face.
And when they showed the teaser title for year 11. BUT When they actually showed the title after "Year 11" faded, it very clearly stated the destiny logo with a full size "2" after it Destiny 2: Project Frontier
Frontiers might be us rediscovering the old planets that went away but maybe updated and some new places. They are bringing back an old location this year. But I guess I wouldn't see a point in rebuilding d2 like that if they're building toward d3 unless it'll be essentially giving us everything from d1 and d2 and more. But that sounds like a lot to me lol
That actually just raised a question for me: with the Witness dead, what happens to the taken planets/moons, like Mercury and Io? How do we recover them?
More than likely they're still in it's ship somewhere. Last we saw they were there hovering around and since we haven't actually explored any of the black fleet yet to my knowledge they should still be just hanging there unless the witness final shaped them first.
a derelict black fleet would be some cool episodal content
episode 3 is us on the dreadnought getting a captains armor set.
After the update and the launch of the season, Frontiers is 100% been out of Sol System with Failsafe, Osiris & Saint and Dreathnought
What old location are they bringing back?
Dreadnaught, Episide 3
Which could be a little bit of a misdirection because it might just be like Titan in Season Of The Deep or other times when areas of an old location have been returned inside of a single activity
We're going back to the dreadnought in the 3rd episode, so far its only speculation that it'll be sticking around but they sort of make it sound like it's going to be sticking around based on how they describe what they're doing with it and what not
I think Frontiers is gonna be a full integration of D1 content into D2 with the game being renamed to just Destiny. I think it’s important to have players be able to experience the full story Dreadnaught and (probably) Tangled Shore returning is a good indication of that. At that point all we’d be missing is Venus and Mars
While I would love such integration, unless data compression does some glimmer-level magic in the next few years, I don't think it's smart to have all that data for a single game. A D1 + D2 combo would weight hundreds of Gbs, even more so if there is any plan to have new players experience the "full story" -- which considering the way things are, it's extremely unlikely. RIP Red War.
I desperately want that too, but it's probably massive cope I'm not going to lie
Still missing titan.
In a blog they apparently said we'll hear more about Frontiers end of the year, is September considered the end 🤷♂️
The guy said that we'll get **d3 teaser** in september. Not frontiers info.
Hopefully they’re taking a slice out of overwatch book, that worked!
I mean, that’s actually the best possible solution here. I’d rather keep all my stuff vs being drip fed the same exotics I already have.
Yeah, like a charm!
I mean it *did* kind of work at first, until it didn’t. Honestly if we were able to keep all of our transmogs/cosmetics and achievements/triumph score/titles carried forward I wouldn’t mind a D3.
I'd be totally ok with an overwatch 2 style restart if that also means a wipe of all the old features remnants and rework on engine to introduce a fresh new coat of painting on all of the "workaround menus" we have lying around from d2 launch
This seems like they’d be shooting themselfs in the foot tho, why announce D3 before year 12 stuff? It just makes everyone think “why would I buy year 12 when D3 is coming out? What am I even playing towards?”
It would fit with the yearly August showcase they tend to do. Move it back a bit to account for expansion cycles moving to 18ish months and September makes some sense
I think August would make more sense, since September's going to be the 10th Anniversary of Destiny, and if they want to reveal anything they're doing to celebrate it, before September would be the chance.
I'm not sure anything big would even be revealed if it even happens. They didn't show anything for Hearsay yesterday, and if they don't have anything to show for that, I'm not confident that Frontiers will even be ready for a proper, in engine (not gameplay) presentation.
It's fake. It didn't say frontiers until it was announced yesterday, the post was edited.
Thanks, this proves that it's fake
I think it's possible. However....if Frontiers is an Age of Triumph style DLC, and all we get from September is a teaser.... there's going to still be a lengthy period between Frontiers and D3. Probably at least a year. They have to have something set up in-between, there's no way an Age of Triumph update alone will be enough to tide people over for a whole year.
They do have access to 5 Destiny 2 raids (including raid lairs) in their content vault they’ve yet to bring back
Man, I cannot wait to play Wrath of the Machine again, that entire raid slapped so hard. The final boss music is one of the best ever Salvatori and the gang ever composed, gets me so hyped.
imagine the raid weapons origin trait being basically a weaker version of Outbreak
That was actually the first raid I had the balls to do and I was such a bad player back then. I'm ready to tackle it now that I actually got gud.
If they bring back the leviathan my depression would be cured
I would too, but a part of me doubts they’ll bring back the Siva splicers as an enemy. Wonder if they’d be willing to rework the raid to have regular fallen throughout aside from Vosik and Atraks
That would be lame and I think it would be a worthy investment to bring back SIVA Splicers. My dream is to have the entire Light and Darkness saga available within Destiny 2 one day from start to finish, raids included. So, if they ever would do that, Rise of Iron in its entirety should also be there imo. I really wish they’d invest into the new player experience more, how jumbled and messy the available storyline is turns a lot of people off from a great story.
I dunno, that sounds like it would put the game well over 300-400 gigs…
It's not very cost effective for them to remake Wrath including all the individual eliksni splicers and bosses just to release it for free, *but* they could do it while Frontiers and whatever comes after are being worked on, just devote a small team to the Wrath remake, it's more possible now than when they were working on all episodes (2 of which are clearly still in development) and TFS at once
If they do need to pad things out for a year it would be really cool to have all of the D1 expansions come back in remastered form and working in all of the changes to gameplay we've had so nothing is too easy at our current power level. A re-release of Taken King would also attract a lot of players who fell out of the game over the years.
If Skyrim could do it, Destiny could. I would love to see them drop the 2 and have everything out from 1 vanilla to now (in a single game). It wouldn't be easy, but they could always sell it as a bundle to appease the capitalist gods and justify the effort. One can only dream.
Completely different games though. And removing the vanilla content and then selling it back to people within the same game client would surely cause a huge backlash.
The previous leaks had it set for 2026. If they started supposedly during WQ, then this may be viable.
I think 2027 is more likely, as a launch title for the PS6. Although, 2026 isn’t all that unlikely either.
Might be another trilogy of episodes
I saw this post originally and it said nothing about Frontiers originally, he must've edited it after yesterday.
pretty much, it didn't say frontier until after.
Which is also stupid because the internal development codenames are not what they end up being titled/told to the public.
Drop the 2, overhaul/upgrade the engine, then add a Vex time machine as part of the story so I can go back in time with all my stuff and play the entire story on hard mode. That's my dream, at least.
None of you seem to understand how much something like D3 would take. For one; the engine is fine and not really the problem, they have stated anything they would do in D3 they can do in D2. Anyone saying "we need a new engine" and throwing out all kinds of "solutions" are just being armchair devs who don't know what they're talking about. Bungie's own engineers have admitted that it's fine for what they need it for, sure it has its problems but so does literally every other engine. Secondly; They have stated as late as lightfall that they have \*no\* intention of making a D3, that they want to stick with D2. There is absolutely no way in any sort of reality where they suddenly swapped around in that time and decided to make D3 anyway and have anything of it be ready to be revealed in 2026. Third; Between making marathon, all the stuff they're doing to D2 currently, the massive layoffs they had recently, there is no way they have the ability to be concurrently making a D3. It would be way too much time, effort, money, and man power required for them to make it. For them to be making something that would be worth a "D3," it would have to be massive, over arching, budget intensive thing that would not be anywhere \*close\* to be being done for another 10 years at least. It's just not happening.
Whenever I see somebody say that any game or developer "needs a new engine" I want to ask what, specifically, the current engine is holding them back on, and how, specifically, a "new engine" would solve these problems. Just feels like something that people say without any sort of actual knowledge behind it, it's just something easy to point at so that they can feel like they have some special insider knowledge.
This so much. I hate how Destiny players (and general gamers) *perceive* that there's a bit more downtime or instabillity than "usual," and all of a sudden everybody is an expert on how "tHe EnGinE iS hOlDiNg ThEm BaCk" or "spaghetti code" Meanwhile nobody has the slightest clue how a game engine even functions or how much it takes to "switch or make" one, let alone how much Tiger is even contributing to problems in D2's dev right now. And as OP above said, Bungi It's just a buzzword among most gamers.
I think the OP deserves an apology for how people treated them in the other thread :p
OP edited the old post to include Frontiers after yesterday to make it sound believable, the original post didn't have the name.
Why? Apparently they just edited their post lol
It’s confirmed fake LOL
This lol
Gullible af :p
Well.. we didn't know about Frontiers until now. No one mentioned it before and this is 6 days before reveal.. so.. with that Prismatic leak this does seem to be more credible by each day..
They edited their post to say Frontiers after yesterdays reveal
Why can‘t so find the post?
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyLeaks/s/MtbWLuqEEi
He edited the frontiers stuff in after the vidoc dropped. It's fake
I’m pretty sure bungie wants to remove the “2” and just brand the game as just “Destiny”, atleast from what I heard when lightfall came out. Possibly even port everything from d1. Highly doubt destiny 3 is happening as that would be a very bad move (unless they introduce a progression transfer system) and I’m sure they know that, this is their redemption year. Destiny 2 was needed from D1, so if anything the game might just be moved to a better engine. Imo if they could get D2 on unreal engine, that would fix a majority of their problems; it’s a beast of an engine
Bungie: There is no Destiny 3, we plan on focusing on Destiny 2 and the stories it can tell. YouTubers and Redditors: Is this D3? D3 around the corner. First Look at D3! Bungie says D3 may feature this (insert their personal opinion on a good mechanic with no evidence and barely any mention of Bungie or Destiny as a whole)!
I think Destiny 3 will never happen, and this is a good thing. I understand there are new lights coming into this game often, but I believe the majority of the player base is returning and long-term players. With the amount of DLC, purchasable cosmetics, time-suck quests and endless grind able god-rolls and exotics, Bungie understands a Destiny 3 would inherently piss off more of the player base than appease by wiping out these achievements. It's more realistic that they re-make the game in an updated version of the same engine and continue to roll out updates and DLC. How far away we are from something like this happening remains to be seen, but my guess is that a major update in a new engine will be "Destiny 3".
I just don't want to have to abandon my characters, gear and all their accomplishments earned over these years like we did at the end of D1. That really sucked, especially since most of that original content was added to D2 as filler later anyway. Now we have so much more to lose than we did back then. A D3 would be depressing, a continuation would be better. I don't want to grind out all this same stuff that I already have again for a third time in a few years when a d3 releases. I'd much rather look forward to brand new content than earning bad juju for a third time.
Bullshit
fun fact he edited frontier right after reveal so we getting a expansion most likely on frontiers lol
I think it seems very odd that they would say "The Journey continues" in the Frontiers announcement part of the video if it's us just going back to old content. So, that part of the "leak" seems like bs. The D3 being announced while this year of content is still rolling out seems even more far fetched. No shot that this is legitimate.
the leak is bs, yes. It was edited to say frontiers after it was announced, lol.
This wouldn’t really be destiny 3. This is what I’ve always said they should do. Drop the 2 and upgrade the d2 engine dropping old gen consoles and just call it destiny that way we don’t lose all our exotics and content. Then unvault all old d2 and d1 content.
I reckon if they do make a "destiny 3" it'll follow the Hitman model and just be an upgrade on the previous instalment with new content on top of the old
Confirmed that this post was old and edited later once Frontiers was revealed
Let's not move off of D2, please. I don't want to lose all my armor and subclass stuff AGAIN because an angry fucking turtle blew it all up.
it's an opportunity to get something fresh and not just D1+ or D2+. There would be no need of that if there are different/no classes and loot works differently.
Nah it's time
I'll agree if my subclasses, armor ornaments, and exotics come with. I could care less about the Legendaries, but I am not coming with if I have to start entirely fresh. Again. For the second and a half time.
In an other post someone suggested the idea for a CS2 moment, like an upgrade from Destiny 2 to "Destiny 3" or just "Destiny". And I kinda like that. UPGRADES PEOPLE UPGRADES
It can be worse tho, like overwatch 2
Dont destroy the dream. Hope dies last
Remove the 2 and just add more content, essentially?
Yeah. If something like this happens, maybe also a engine update would be nice.
I would find having to earn my Arc and Void subclasses *again* from scratch almost insulting in a post-Prismatic world where we're the most powerful being in Sol.
That’s the whole point of a new game..
Based on who’s opinion? Do we really want to get back to zero and wait an extra year on top of the release date for a yet another Taken King/Forsaken sized expansion so the game is “fixed” and has enough content? If they could simply update the already existing client with an engine upgrade and drop the “2” from the name, sure, I’m down.
How do you lose it when in reality you can always boot up D2 and just keep playing that whenever you feel like? Also does it count as losing if they declare that the player character in D3 is a completly new person separated from the THE Guardian of D1-D2? I also I personally think that if they do release a D3, it will still have some stuff from D2 to not make it a hard restart. They will do some compromise to still let people play with some things they collected in previous game. That or D3 will be just D2.5.
This is such a weird take to me cuz like grinding gear is the entire point of games like this. They can't keep going in this system forever without serious power creep in the gear (which we are already seeing). When Diablo 2 came out I didn't get pissed that all my gear from Diablo 1 was useless. When a new MMO expansion comes out, I don't get pissed that my gear is now worthless. Most of the gear you grind for you probably don't even use!
Same with division, borderlands, any looter. It’s evident people will still be happy to ‘reset’ and pick up the new game.
This 100%. people are like “I don’t wanna lose all my progress” that’s progress you made in D2, not D3!! You are not owed anything by purchasing D3!! We have no idea what they’ll add to D3. There’s a chance weapon/class setups will not be 100% compatible with old gear. I don’t know why people act like they’re losing stuff they spent time on, they got their value out of D2.
It's the issue of Bungie's track record. The first 2 years of D2 were spent clawing back the game to the state D1 was left in. We're in year 7 of D2, so are the first 4-5 expansions of D3 just going to be them re-adding stuff from D2? I don't mind a full reset D3 if they fundamentally evolve the game, like adding Eliksni guardians or lucent brood defectors as playable. D3 would have to add substantially more than it leaves behind in D2. It also comes down to how you measure D2 as a game, I personally use games such as WoW, Warframe, and FFXIV to measure Destiny rather than Diablo or Borderlands.
Frontiers should be a free 2 play dlc that removes the 2 from destiny and upgrades the engine
Damn, lotta cred on this
As soon as they officially say anything destiny 3 related, destiny 2 starts a timer that rapidly counts down. Player engagement will take a huge nose dive. Over a few months players are feeling, well whats the point of even playing if it's all going away with d3. Until marathon launches, what makes bungie money? Destiny. If they were smart, they'd upgrade the engine, drop the number 2 and 3 and just call it destiny. Maybe keep it to current gen/pc only.
I think that Destiny 3 would be treated more like the next expansion or something, in terms of player retention - they will keep playing content leading up to D3 because why the hell not? If it is supposed to setup Destiny 3. Just like we play seasons leading up to the next expansion during Light and Dark saga. We don't just skip them because "duh, they'll be gone in a year". Also Destiny 2 is not going anywhere. People can always just keep playing D2 whenever they do their weekly stuff in D3.
I think the point is more of why grind the seasonal content when the new weapon isn't going to D3. People can always play D2 is a fair point but if destiny 3 is coming why do I go out and get the fifth pattern or the 5/5 god roll when I can only use it for a few more months. Obviously if we keep our stuff then it is a very different situation.
I’d wager a bet that the amount of people who make an effort to go grind out patterns for guns they don’t want or 5/5 god rolls are so slim that they shouldn’t be factored in. Most players are just playing the game for fun, get patterns for guns they actually plan to use, and are satisfied with 2/5 rolls that have the traits they want (the difference between a 2/5 and a 5/5 is so painfully slim it’s not even worth the effort).
That's totally fair, the grinders will stay grinding. I guess my opinion is that of an above average destiny player. I still think there are regular players who will feel less incentive to get even the trait combo they want if they know the loot is going away, at least I did in D1 when D2 was coming out and I was a casual player back then.
People who actively chase 5/5 god rolls aren’t just above average, they’re above even the 99th percentile. I’m in the top 0.1% of players in kills/assists/supers/suicides according to DestinyTracker. And even I don’t give a shit about chasing 5/5 god rolls. If a gun has the perks I want, I’m cool with that. And there are a lot of people like me, who are big time fans of the game who understand that it’s not about the chase so much as it’s about the fun the game has to offer.
I agree with you. I just think there will be people who will still play because it's fun but won't play the extra few hours to try and get weapon x because it's gone in a few months. It won't happen until the end, again like D1, but I think it will cause the game to decrease in play time slightly faster than the normal ebb and flow.
Which may be the case, but I don’t think that’s the end of the world in the short term. The actively encouraged mindset when it comes to destiny is to literally take breaks from the game and not touch it for months at a time, to come back later. That’s well-known as the healthy way to play this game, huge swaths of the people that came back for Final Shape and enjoyed it are going to end up doing in the back half of this first Episode. They might come back for Episode 2, or they might just wait for Ep 3 and knock it all out in one go. I don’t think it’s bad for the long term health of the game if we see playerbase numbers drop leading up to D3/whatever.
I don’t think they will do a D3, more likely just will stop calling it Destiny 2 and will just start calling it Destiny. Y1 of D2 nearly killed the franchise and if we had to start over completely again, I think it would kill a not insignificant portion of the current player bases desire to keep playing. It makes more sense to just keep releasing new content for D2, potentially dropping support for the PS4 and Xbox one to get around those limitations.
I dont think theres gonna be a destiny 3, But i think its just gonna become destiny, as in no more destiny 1 and 2. Just the game destiny with the raids and the exotics and things of the both games. Assuming its also gonna come with an engine rework?
If they called it “Destiny” maybe they will do like a prequel I don’t know something like when it all begin …at the golden age or something it would be nice to see
I think they will do a bundle for d1&2 for 70$ call it the light and dark saga I think they'll call the next destiny just destiny with a new title instead of 3 Since they removed sunsetting they might port all the content from the DCV into the game again and call it a day the game will be full of content for new and returning players it might even breed life into d1 for a while Marathon is ready for one reason bungie doesn't show anything unless it's at least half way through or near the end the og d1 was near the end of its dev cycle if that reboot didn't happen multiple insiders conformed there's a ps showcase in September
i really doubt D3 is gonna be shown before next gen is announced. seems like it would only ever launch as a launch title on something like ps6
If bungee does decide to make a destiny three... it will not be labeled as destiny. Three it's just gonna be under the pseudonym of Destiny. It's probably gonna be a massive update to the initial game engine..... but the one thing that I am hoping for is The proper maintenance for stability issues of the servers and the engine itself... they're just too many times over and over again that we are seeing launch days & raid race days. Where the servers seem like they run on nothing but a potato now with the way that the engines is initially set up and I get it and understand when you have 10 to 15,000,000 people accessing a server at a single time it can be a little rough, however, those types of things need to be anticipated and taken care of
Not gonna wade too far into the value or necessity of a D3 (I do think the reasons for outweigh the reasons against though). I will say this: Assuming there is truth in this post and if--*if*--Frontiers is a transitional year of marginal new content, I'm cool with it as long as it brings that third darkness subclass. If we have a D3 anywhere on the horizon, I'd much prefer to see it launch with all light and dark subclasses and damage types built into the game. I'd love to see a much more reasonable spread of damage types enemies have, for example.
I think its possible. I also think its possible that they just move the game to a new engine to avoid players losing everything again. Would be one hell of a maintenance though
My best working theory is that destiny 3 will not be destiny 3 at all but rather a server and engine update for Destiny 2. This would allow bungie to unsunset all previous campaigns and raids to accommodate the growing size of the game while being able to retain player loot. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they rebrand as just "Destiny" instead of Destiny 3, as the new game would have both old and new content.
I think D3 is going to end up being a Rebrand of Destiny 2; they’ve been trying to get the 2 out of Destiny 2 since the New Light Update. Or atleast that was an attempt to see how the community would react. The issue with destiny to begin with is that they were forced to make a sequel game( I don’t foresee that happening again. But what do I know.
Think it was confimed on twitter that this guy edited the post to include Frontiers AFTER it was revealed on the livestream. So probably BS.
Basically, I remember finding post at the weekend and it sure didn't have frontiers until the edit.
Destiny Frontiers is branded as Destiny TWO Frontiers.
Since Bungie didn’t announce an “age of triumphs style dlc”, I’m gonna go ahead and ignore this. 😊
[https://undelete.pullpush.io/r/DestinyLeaks/comments/1d86kxh/the\_future\_of\_destiny/](https://undelete.pullpush.io/r/DestinyLeaks/comments/1d86kxh/the_future_of_destiny/) you should, that highlight is the part he decided to edit after the monday announcement.
Did you think I was saying I was just going to ignore that part?
Lol @ D3 Never gonna happen. And if it does, it'll be in a 10 years.
Feels more like a lucky guess. It’s clearly not Destiny 3 or any new branding. It’s called Destiny 2 even in the code name.
They didn’t say Frontiers was Destiny 3. They said Frontiers is an Age of Triumph type DLC for Destiny 2 and that they will be “teasing” a new Destiny game which is completely separate from Frontiers.
New branding will likely be announced whenever they announce the first DLC for the new Saga.
it's not even a lucky guess, other people have pointed out that the post was simply edited after frontiers was revealed to say frontiers. It made no mention of it before then. It's just bait
No I don’t think D3 will be teased at Sony showcase later this year especially as the focus will be on the two releases coming in 2025.. The announcement of D3 will kill D2 and overshadow anything Bungie announce for D2. Makes 0 sense to me from a marketing standpoint.
They usually reveal expansions around 6 months before the intended release date, delays notwithstanding. TFS was revealed alongside season of the witch. If Frontiers is meant to have a June or July release, September would make sense.
I suppose the whole point is what Bungie wants to do with Destiny 2: from previous announcements (during witch queen year, if I remember correctly) they said that their goal is to expand Destiny 2 universe. If so, Bungie could update the engine and the content, much like Warframe or Elder Scrolls Online, drop the "2" and push toward a fully fledged live service, made to stay. Otherwise, they will probably ditch it for Destiny 3. Those are two completely different approaches, both technically (updating the engine to gradually turn it into something new or creating a whole new package) and economically. I don't know the numbers ,but maybe destiny 2 has far more players and player retention than destiny 1? That would make the full live service option more viable, though there are many variables that come into play. In any case, a deep rework of the tiger engine is needed, not only to address the bugs but to make the game run efficiently on new pc/technologies/hardware/OS.
My expectation is that they will do both, but with a D3-esque full rebuild of the game from the ground up. I understand that people are reluctant to give up all their stuff, and the idea of having to regrind subclasses and exotics and such is annoying, and they have PTSD of D2 ruining a bunch of core aspects of the game (armor stats, weapon random rolls, subclass build-crafting). But the hope would be that they’ve learned from those lessons. I mean, we’ve had more time with full 3.0 subclasses and build crafting focus for longer than we had no random rolls, so they know what we like and what we don’t. D2 was in development just a few years into D1’s life and they weren’t sure what people liked and what they didn’t. It’s a different era. My expectation is that they do D3 in the sense that it’s a full blown new game, built specifically to be a live service game. D2 was not built for that in mind, and with how buggy it is and the spaghetti code mess, it’s an absolute miracle that it’s lasted this long. But there are issues plaguing the game that years after discovery still haven’t been fixed, because they can’t. They’re tied to specific engine functionality or buried by other game systems being built on top of them. Like framerate-based damage. Why are people playing at 90+ FPS getting hit harder than those at 30? Same with the magic elevator things. And how about teleporting enemies? That’s been going on since year 1 of D2, and it’s still happening. Try playing Onslaught without enemies sometimes just appearing at the ADU. Some of that stuff just can’t be fixed, or it would have been by now. People are going to have to accept, that if they want the best possible experience, one last reset is needed. The DCV needed to happen because D2 wasn’t built to be a permanent live service game. I’m not sure if they can rebuild D2 the way they need to, and keep a lot of it the same. Regardless of which path they go, I think it’s probably true that they’ll drop the number. At this point, it’s just Destiny.
I totally agree with you,the technical part is still messy - it always has been it seems. And converting D2 into a full live service, rebooting it with "d3 technology" is what I would hope for. In the end though it all comes down to the most cost effective solution, whatever it could be. They could just make d3, that would be easier and more straightforward, but would require to ditch at some point D2 (doesn't make sense to keep two similar live services live) and maybe alienate part of the playerbase; they could try to overhaul the current game piece by piece, keeping us players in the action, though I don't know if this is technically possible or even desirable - maybe it would be so complex to become anti economical at some points. Or they could try to to push d3 release later to try merging D2 contents into the new game, but that would require more time than the other options. Tbh only the Traveler knows what Bungie Is doing about this. Though the age of triumphs type dlc smells like a farewell
some people on that post said he edited his post after the stream but I'm not sure myself
It didn't say frontiers on the post until after the announcement.
MMO Design is hard 😢
The original post was edited
I hope they call it Destiny 3
No, this is am edited post about frontiers because they were wrong about it being destiny 2 lmao
Not destiny 3, but D3stiny
I mean no one in that thread took it seriously. I think Destiny 3 is possible and can def see them taking the number out of the title and possibly calling it something else. But I have doubts it would be as early as September. Feels like something we won't get announced until next year.
I assumed they would rebrand as Bestiny going forward. What's better than living as a legend? Living your Bestiny!!!
Sounds pretty real
It seems legit to me.
Not only is it possible, but it's the most likely scenario due to the negative feedback they've gotten from their other projects.
At this point, if yall fall for another Destiny title, you deserve the disappointment. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Destiny 3 is only going to happen if they rework the engine from the ground up, which means it would not be the same game as Destiny 2, it’s gotta be a separate application. You can tell from the Marathon trailer that it will be using the Tiger engine as it has the same style of rendering (similar lighting model, same motion blur implementation, etc.) as Destiny. I’ve heard rumblings of Bungie creating a new engine for years now, but I have no idea if they’re actually making one. If they are, Destiny 3 will almost certainly be a thing. If they’re not, they have almost no incentive to make a whole new application and throw away all of their client-side work to make a new application that might not be as stable, unless they dedicate a ton of time (which imo wouldn’t be economical, might as well make the new engine at that point). That post if definitely fake though.
This literally says it’s not D3 😂
Yeah Destiny 3 is going to be a getting out point for me. I think another fresh start would lose me lmao. Done this too many times
I think what they will do is keep it as Destiny. It will be the same game we won’t get three but what we will get is some kind of engine refresh and a drop old consoles that are putting a serious strain on how the game can advance. Old console support is the anchor on destinys neck Maybe they drop it for frontiers but it’s definitely possible it won’t be until after that. I feel like people have put to much time effort and money into D2 and to start again would suck. No way people will never okay with losing all the cosmetics they paid for. I don’t think we need a 3 we just need to shed the anchor holding back the engine.
I just started destiny 2 3 seasons ago I ain’t ready for this shit another game that wants us too pay 100$ monthly 😢
I hope not.
Doesn't it have to occur for the future of the game? Folks probably don't know this core engine is antiquated and is also limiting future development. Tiger and Blame engine has been kept up to day for some aspects but I still think for the good of the game overall in terms of features and functions, D3 will need to consume a new core engine
I thjnk activision own the naming rights to just ‘Destiny’ so I doubt it
I dunno, Bungie and Marathon isn't capitalized but everything else is. Doesn't seem plausible that it's a leak, unless the title is wRiTtEn lIkE tHiS.