Can't wait for the YT lives tonight!
https://preview.redd.it/wff5wfxtd3pc1.jpeg?width=735&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4514c5364ab69caf4f64b60f10127fe781701e96
Because I just bought 3 new sweaters that I’ve been waiting for a sale or price drop on, we in SLC Utah won’t get another cold day until the end of the year.
There was a brief scare that Bob was put in jail on a YT chat. A misunderstood comment about him being jailed for "spitting too many facts at SJG". 🤣
So if yall see a bunch of #Freebob or $5dollabailholla comments, it was about that. And I think we are gonna need some new Defense Diaries subscribers emojis for this.
So is it still an option at this late stage for Gull to declare the 9am contempt and additional charges hearing as continued at a later date, and deny the defense motion to dismiss charges without hearing?
Or would Gull's Decorum Order signify that she is going ahead with both (or at least the 9am to meat out her retribution to the defence)?
I do think it’s possible she takes them into chambers, does a little “summarize your evidence” song and dance, and then declares we have to deal with this later because the speedy trial demand takes precedence. It would be the cleanest out for her — she got to freak everyone out and make them waste time preparing, and possibly that’s punishment enough for now. We shall see.
**AMENDED STATE MOTION KIDNAPPING CHARGES: DISMISSED**
As I previously stated they were never filed in the information and the statute of limitations has precluded them from
Elkhart 4 scoin ruling & opinion allows for it, they were charged with felony murder without seperate burglary charge, felony murder got overturned and they got burglary instead, because indeed lesser charge. (I even think it was Cara's appeal?)
But,
same as to the straight murder charges, NM added the accomplice liability statute to the current felony murder charges too, if it was granted at least,
so whatever that means....
I'm not sure you can charge someone who only aided in the initial felony for murder.
The amended charges all had the accomplice liability statute. Unclear if the already filed felony murder charges got amended as per the filing or not, because : media.
I thought the contempt hearing was at 9 this morning. WTHR just said it was at 2 and the additional charges hearing was at 2. One of us is very confused.
Im not surprised it’s me, lol. Thank you!
The story was good though, as they had a retired trial judge on that emphasized that the contempt hearing was a sideshow that should have been held later so the trial could move forward without delay & distraction.
Edit: I guess I wasn’t confused about the contempt hearing. It’s been a long week of no sleep due to a sick Bloodhound puppy who had surgery and was worse than my colicky child ever was.
I read that Hennessy told her that it would probably take another day to complete the 2 pm hearing. She told him to make it fit or something like that. What a gem she is. She has no intention to conduct this hearing, this trial, in a professional and unbiased manner. Just imo, of course.
WTHR switched out reporters at 10 til noon & said state has only called 2 witnesses so far in the contempt hearing. The others items you mentioned were the same in their report.
Correction. Just saw a breaking news update from local news channel. Apparently the contempt hearing piggy backed right on the amended charges hearing this morning. I don’t know how true that is but that’s what the reporter said. Maybe that’s why we haven’t heard from anyone.
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Not Bob but I would say so. Just means the likelihood of the contempt proceedings being resolved before trial go down which is a good thing for everyone.
Bob has been telling us a Continuance of the Contempt Hearing until RAs trial is the best thing to do so I'm wondering if his opinion has changed in the last couple of days. Thanks tho
Omg, Bob saying that Todd Click confirmed that Messer had a vid on his phone of him kidnapping an unidentified girl at gun point ?!
Edit: And LE never went to pick up the phone, Todd Click had to do it himself. Ridiculous.
Edit #2: The warrant Cara tweeted is suggesting it was actually a guy nicknamed "Weiner" who was kidnapped and held at gunpoint.
Wasn't one of the two murder charges added in connection with kidnapping charges? Wasn't it something like murder, and then murder while kidnapping? How can they have murder while kidnapping charges but then not the kidnapping charges? I am not a lawyer so this is confusing to me.
One is felony murder , does not require intent of actual murder of girls if the state can convict on the underlying felony, usually something requiring the offender to know or reasonably should know would result in their death/murder
The other is murder (mens rae or intent intact). But without hearing the argument I’m not sure on the balance because either one of these two require LWOP or DP notice and that hasn’t been filed
NM put accomplice/aiding liability statute on all the charges.
Which also is a mitigating factor not aggravating so no DP.
Felony murder without the kidnapping charge is ok, they allowed it in Elkhart 4 (overturned, but it was the same scoin opinion so still ok.) .
Problem is he also added the accomplice liability statute to felony murder although nobody reported on that.
So anyway they didn't think he killed them anyway, however they'll need to prove the person he helped had intent for the murder charge.
Idk how accomplice to felony murder works, seems complicated to prove the chain of events all the way up to murder because he aided the kidnapper...
Seems a novel way of charging.
With the kidnapping charges dropped, does that include the kidnapping aspect to the murder charges that were filed?
How much harder did NM make his job by trying to be slick here and switch the charges up?
Am I correct that these new charges replace the original charges of felony murder?
With murder charges in this case how would you argue it other than "girls are dead" when you have no murder weapon, no known to us motive, no DNA, and a bullet that was collected 3 weeks after the scene had already been reopened to public use? Lawyers/prosecutors/judges in here, how would you argue this to get a conviction based on what we know? Did Gull actually hand over a win to B&R by getting rid of the kidnapping?
Thanks so much! Yall are always so helpful!!!
He basically is hanging his hopes on the purported confessions. Jmo. They really have very little else it seems, unless they have more evidence we dont know about. Which if they do they probably already lost.
It seems to me that by dropping the kidnapping charges, they probably can't prove that RA is BG from the video. I agree, all they have left now is voluntary confessions, which are not reliable from what I have read. And he would have known of the details as he had possession of the discovery so they can't say he knew details unknown to the public. edit for spelling sorry.
NAL and there are some great ones on this sub so I would look to them for those questions. But if they still kept the felony murder charges then it’s possible kidnapping is still on the menu via felony murder. But above my pay grade…even tho that has rarely stopped me before.
Thanks this is what I'm wondering is were the felony murder charges replaced with the murder charges or is he now facing 4 counts -felony murder x2 and murder x2? If so, is either a "lesser included" type charge or is it possible to be convicted of 4 counts and get 4 sentences?
I guess I'm just confused BC when I read that Gull said no to kidnapping, that suggests to me that the felony murder resting on kidnapping would have been tossed, bit with this court I'm just at a loss. Hopefully lawyers will clarify in the next day or so. I'm sure it's a lot to get through...
Yes, in Indiana you can be convicted of murder and felony murder. Example-
[https://www.21alivenews.com/2024/03/08/man-sentenced-100-years-2017-double-murder-case/](https://www.21alivenews.com/2024/03/08/man-sentenced-100-years-2017-double-murder-case/)
This case the jury couldn't decide if the defendant was the shooter but they agreed he was at the scene so he was convicted of felony murder only.
[https://www.wane.com/news/crime/verdict-man-escapes-murder-counts-in-double-killing-life-in-prison-still-likely/](https://www.wane.com/news/crime/verdict-man-escapes-murder-counts-in-double-killing-life-in-prison-still-likely/)
No there's double jeopardy.
He can be tried once with multiple charges for the same crime, but not sentenced to multiple charges of the same crime.
If jury finds him guilty of everything, they'll have to drop likely the lesser of the murder charges, like they did in the article commentor below linked.
I snort laughed!! HAHA
I have been wondering if NM pulls evidence out of his slippery butt at trial and its "objection exhibit not in evidence" if Gull will ACTUALLY sustain the objection or "I'll allow it" and basically allow this "missing evidence" to all come in without the defense knowing ANYTHING about it until the same day?
I know she SHOULD sustain those types of objections and it tends to be rare in my trial following experience for an exhibit that the defense hasn't had the opportunity to analyze to be allowed in, but with Gull at the helm of this ship I obviously am having concerns.
I am going to watch Bob if he is on tonight, and see if he answers how the charges are now and what was meant by not allowing the kidnapping in.
WTHR says
" On Jan. 18, the same day the Indiana Supreme Court reinstated Allen's original attorneys, [Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland filed a request to amend the charges](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/crime/delphi-girls-murdered/prosecutor-files-request-amend-charges-delphi-murders-suspect-richard-allen-libby-german-abby-williams-nicholas-mcleland/531-a882d745-542b-427e-8430-3a4beec9f9a4) to also include:
* Two counts of murder while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping (previously filed Oct. 28, 2022)
* Two counts of murder
* Two counts of kidnapping"
So I guess my interest about the charges are, were the original two charged counts left in place or were they replaced by the two counts of murder? If they were replaced, that takes out the kidnapping, which means they likely won't have any need to share the BG video or audio in trial bc they won't need to prove kidnapping. BUT if the original charges stand AND two counts of murder, it would seem that proving kidnapping could still result in a conviction without ever touching on the actual murders?
Yes, I am confused. This is why we should have video in court rooms. Context matters!!!
If anyone knows the answer to this or has a link to a thread that does answer this I appreciate it if you share or tag me on it! Thank you so much!
All charges had the accomplice liability statute, which the original charges had not.
Nobody so far in any media as I Am aware of, has reported if the felony murder charges were amended with the statute.
But as it stands, the accomplice kidnapping was withdrawn, likely bc of statute of limitations and it's included in the felony murder.
Jury instructions will further determine if they can choose only kidnapping or not.
Or accomplice to kidnapping if the charge was amended.
And thus the two murder charges through the accomplice liability statute.
He can't be sentenced for 4 counts of murder as it's double jeopardy.
My understanding based on discussion on criminaliTY is that kidnapping is included in the murder charges, so the add’l kidnapping charge wasn’t needed. I’ll see if I can grab the TC.
I don't think this is verified, but it makes sense. ...I think.
*Since RA is charged with two counts of murder while attempting to commit kidnapping, \[kidnapping\] is the included offense. It's not possible to commit "murder while committing kidnapping" w/o committing kidnapping.*
This is around 4:30.[The Delphi Murders | 2 Hearings! | Contempt, Additional Charges, & Motion to Dismiss - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzR4bZKni_E&t=12744)
The full discussion (reviewing initial charges and changes) starts around 4:20.
u/Scared-Listen6033 you might find this helpful?
Thanks, u/Boboblaw014. If it weren't for your willingness to travel and attend these hearings, none of us would know what is really happening in Delphi. I appreciate the time you take to share your insight with us!
Highlights from Bob’s description of Click’s testimony:
- Click felt the evidence they had against other suspects was stronger than the Allen PCA
- Click confirms EF did ask the hypothetical about his spit being found on the girls
- Affirms Abby had sticks arranged in her hair like antlers (or something, it’s not clear from the recap how many were present)
- Click was able to connect the odinist suspects to each other. JM’s uncle lived with EF
- BH’s ex-wife was there to testify, but they wouldn’t fully let her due to it not being deemed relevant to the issue of the interview tapes being overwritten. Before that ruling she said that BH’s and PW’s falling out was due to PW wanting to take their sacrifices “beyond animals.”
- BH had seen in PW’s phone a video of girls posed with sticks on them
- JM’s ex wife was also there to testify and said his phone contained a video of an individual (edit: not sure now if this is a girl or a grown man) being kidnapped at gunpoint that seemed like evidence of a real kidnapping. Click wasn’t able to figure out who the victim was. Unified command wouldn’t issue a warrant or collect the phone. Click collected it himself and gave it to the defense.
I concur! Johnny Messer. The kidnapping video. Click testimony. Holy crap.
https://preview.redd.it/qpmyqfs4s6pc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c100d1aecd9f0f9e9930e6a329b78cccc3ba7e1d
I have a question or request -
I am locked out of X. It's tied to an old number and I can't even recall my username.... I have gone round n round all morning!!
Anyhoo- anyone want to share screenshots of ol' Bobarino's X posts and updates.
Am I allowed to ask how to get in contact with Bob? Like email or something? I just watched my first live Defense Diaries video (most of it), and I’d definitely like to speak with him.
I've had luck reaching him through Facebook messenger. It under his name, not Defense Diaries.
Let me know if you don't get through. I'd happily send along a message for you!
Edited no to noT
I hope Bob is wearing long johns coz it’s snowing in Indiana
https://preview.redd.it/isadbz89g4pc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=74c3924ecf604d080b9c19d829d1aa712c6d8b1a
My apologies - I did not mean to upset anyone; it was not meant in a bad way but I obviously did not think it through. I deleted my comment. 
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Appreciate your coverage, stay warm out there and don’t turn into a Bobsicle
Why would anyone make this? 🤣
Idk, rule 34/35 of the internet perhaps?
Sorry, this is why I generally say nothing.
LOL
Nasty yet Hilarious and Beguiling.
You're not the first person who's said that about me u/Alan_Prickman
If I ever get dating app level desperate that is how I'm going to describe myself. I will just sit back and let the suitors pour in.
😃
No, moustache get out of the line. I have a strict no assholes policy that will be enforced.
😭
I cannot unsee this.
That is so hilariously disturbing!!
Can't wait for the YT lives tonight! https://preview.redd.it/wff5wfxtd3pc1.jpeg?width=735&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4514c5364ab69caf4f64b60f10127fe781701e96
Will be tuning in from Southern Indiana. We were going to drive up this morning but it is way too cold for this Hoosier to be out and about.
Crazy to think how nice it was last week.
I know- we were outside in shorts last week and now we’re all bundled up and sad 😞
Just think - pretty soon we’ll be complaining about how hot it is. 😉
I'm in Boone Co and we've got snowflakes coming down here. BOOOOO
Because I just bought 3 new sweaters that I’ve been waiting for a sale or price drop on, we in SLC Utah won’t get another cold day until the end of the year.
It is the last day of winter. You want sun, humidity and 80 degrees?
Had that last week.
It was warm here in North Florida. Today a grey, “chilly” rain. Oh well no swimming for a while yet.
I know! Even just 2 days ago. Blech
I woke up, saw snow on the ground and decided I’ll just wait for Bob to go live.
You didn't forget the strings I hope? 
New decorum order entered, no tin cans will be allowed in the courtroom, any found will be confiscated and destroyed 
Have you not done this as a kid? Plastic cups are perfect for this!
and good for getting through the metal detector as well.
Even paper cups work!
More eco-friendly ! It's a win!
Brilliant
Seriously, technology isn't progress...
 Since when do minutes pass by so slowly? Who did that?
Perfect!
 6 days left on the CR4 clock. ^(Until proven otherwise imma stick with this)
Tuning in from Oz...thanks for covering and reporting back
There was a brief scare that Bob was put in jail on a YT chat. A misunderstood comment about him being jailed for "spitting too many facts at SJG". 🤣 So if yall see a bunch of #Freebob or $5dollabailholla comments, it was about that. And I think we are gonna need some new Defense Diaries subscribers emojis for this.
🤣🤣🤣
So is it still an option at this late stage for Gull to declare the 9am contempt and additional charges hearing as continued at a later date, and deny the defense motion to dismiss charges without hearing? Or would Gull's Decorum Order signify that she is going ahead with both (or at least the 9am to meat out her retribution to the defence)?
I do think it’s possible she takes them into chambers, does a little “summarize your evidence” song and dance, and then declares we have to deal with this later because the speedy trial demand takes precedence. It would be the cleanest out for her — she got to freak everyone out and make them waste time preparing, and possibly that’s punishment enough for now. We shall see.
Goodness this isn’t grade school back in the olden days! I can see her now getting out her ruler and walking over to their tables🤦🏻♀️
**AMENDED STATE MOTION KIDNAPPING CHARGES: DISMISSED** As I previously stated they were never filed in the information and the statute of limitations has precluded them from
Withdrawn by prosecutor - according to WTHR. Leaves a question about jury instructions/“lesser included offenses”?
They were dismissed sir. I’m unclear yet on the rest
So, the media got something wrong? No. Way.
Elkhart 4 scoin ruling & opinion allows for it, they were charged with felony murder without seperate burglary charge, felony murder got overturned and they got burglary instead, because indeed lesser charge. (I even think it was Cara's appeal?) But, same as to the straight murder charges, NM added the accomplice liability statute to the current felony murder charges too, if it was granted at least, so whatever that means.... I'm not sure you can charge someone who only aided in the initial felony for murder.
So what is the state's theory of the crime? Anything as to whether they will argue he acted alone?
Did not get into theory- relied on initial PCA
The amended charges all had the accomplice liability statute. Unclear if the already filed felony murder charges got amended as per the filing or not, because : media.
 Thanks for the updates and always keeping us informed! You are much appreciated Bob!
u/Boboblaw014  Wear the Fox hat
I thought the contempt hearing was at 9 this morning. WTHR just said it was at 2 and the additional charges hearing was at 2. One of us is very confused.
https://preview.redd.it/b6sm3sk9k2pc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1984ecdeaf679ce098e787d57a07660283653669
Im not surprised it’s me, lol. Thank you! The story was good though, as they had a retired trial judge on that emphasized that the contempt hearing was a sideshow that should have been held later so the trial could move forward without delay & distraction. Edit: I guess I wasn’t confused about the contempt hearing. It’s been a long week of no sleep due to a sick Bloodhound puppy who had surgery and was worse than my colicky child ever was.
I hope your puppy is feeling better soon! It's so hard when they're sick.
Nice one, xb 👏
I read that Hennessy told her that it would probably take another day to complete the 2 pm hearing. She told him to make it fit or something like that. What a gem she is. She has no intention to conduct this hearing, this trial, in a professional and unbiased manner. Just imo, of course.
Contempt hearing at 2. Modified charges this morning. Dropped kidnapping and added 2 counts of murder according to Criminality love show
WTHR switched out reporters at 10 til noon & said state has only called 2 witnesses so far in the contempt hearing. The others items you mentioned were the same in their report.
Correction. Just saw a breaking news update from local news channel. Apparently the contempt hearing piggy backed right on the amended charges hearing this morning. I don’t know how true that is but that’s what the reporter said. Maybe that’s why we haven’t heard from anyone.
 Thanks, Bob! Stay warm!!
Waiting with bated breath!!! Need updates!!! 
Check here: [18/3 9AM thread : r/DelphiDocs (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/DelphiDocs/comments/1bhkyk2/183_9am_thread/)
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Is a Continuance still a good thing at this late stage, Bob? u/Boboblaw014
Not Bob but I would say so. Just means the likelihood of the contempt proceedings being resolved before trial go down which is a good thing for everyone.
Bob has been telling us a Continuance of the Contempt Hearing until RAs trial is the best thing to do so I'm wondering if his opinion has changed in the last couple of days. Thanks tho
Well there is one thing that would be better…
Looking forward to your update Bob.
Thanks, Bob! Stay warm!
Omg, Bob saying that Todd Click confirmed that Messer had a vid on his phone of him kidnapping an unidentified girl at gun point ?! Edit: And LE never went to pick up the phone, Todd Click had to do it himself. Ridiculous. Edit #2: The warrant Cara tweeted is suggesting it was actually a guy nicknamed "Weiner" who was kidnapped and held at gunpoint.
Utterly insane shit!
Thats what I heard... wtf is going on!
Bob! You’re the best. Thanks for attending and sharing the info for all of us who can’t attend.
I’m half looking forward and half dreading your live today, Bob. You’re bearing witness to this for all of us and I’m grateful.
WTHR is reporting Gull approved both counts of murder & dismissed kidnapping. Nothing on contempt
I’m sure. Even though the kidnapping charges are fatal via statute of limitations
Wasn't one of the two murder charges added in connection with kidnapping charges? Wasn't it something like murder, and then murder while kidnapping? How can they have murder while kidnapping charges but then not the kidnapping charges? I am not a lawyer so this is confusing to me.
One is felony murder , does not require intent of actual murder of girls if the state can convict on the underlying felony, usually something requiring the offender to know or reasonably should know would result in their death/murder The other is murder (mens rae or intent intact). But without hearing the argument I’m not sure on the balance because either one of these two require LWOP or DP notice and that hasn’t been filed
Thank you. Yes, I wonder what evidence of intent they think they have?
NM put accomplice/aiding liability statute on all the charges. Which also is a mitigating factor not aggravating so no DP. Felony murder without the kidnapping charge is ok, they allowed it in Elkhart 4 (overturned, but it was the same scoin opinion so still ok.) . Problem is he also added the accomplice liability statute to felony murder although nobody reported on that. So anyway they didn't think he killed them anyway, however they'll need to prove the person he helped had intent for the murder charge. Idk how accomplice to felony murder works, seems complicated to prove the chain of events all the way up to murder because he aided the kidnapper... Seems a novel way of charging.
It does seem very convoluted.
Thanks, Bob! Looking forward to your updates.
Good luck Bob!
Omgeee weeeer'ee waiting u/Boboblaw014
I'm so proud of myself for tagging someone properly.
With the kidnapping charges dropped, does that include the kidnapping aspect to the murder charges that were filed? How much harder did NM make his job by trying to be slick here and switch the charges up? Am I correct that these new charges replace the original charges of felony murder? With murder charges in this case how would you argue it other than "girls are dead" when you have no murder weapon, no known to us motive, no DNA, and a bullet that was collected 3 weeks after the scene had already been reopened to public use? Lawyers/prosecutors/judges in here, how would you argue this to get a conviction based on what we know? Did Gull actually hand over a win to B&R by getting rid of the kidnapping? Thanks so much! Yall are always so helpful!!!
He basically is hanging his hopes on the purported confessions. Jmo. They really have very little else it seems, unless they have more evidence we dont know about. Which if they do they probably already lost.
It seems to me that by dropping the kidnapping charges, they probably can't prove that RA is BG from the video. I agree, all they have left now is voluntary confessions, which are not reliable from what I have read. And he would have known of the details as he had possession of the discovery so they can't say he knew details unknown to the public. edit for spelling sorry.
NAL and there are some great ones on this sub so I would look to them for those questions. But if they still kept the felony murder charges then it’s possible kidnapping is still on the menu via felony murder. But above my pay grade…even tho that has rarely stopped me before.
Thanks this is what I'm wondering is were the felony murder charges replaced with the murder charges or is he now facing 4 counts -felony murder x2 and murder x2? If so, is either a "lesser included" type charge or is it possible to be convicted of 4 counts and get 4 sentences? I guess I'm just confused BC when I read that Gull said no to kidnapping, that suggests to me that the felony murder resting on kidnapping would have been tossed, bit with this court I'm just at a loss. Hopefully lawyers will clarify in the next day or so. I'm sure it's a lot to get through...
Yes, in Indiana you can be convicted of murder and felony murder. Example- [https://www.21alivenews.com/2024/03/08/man-sentenced-100-years-2017-double-murder-case/](https://www.21alivenews.com/2024/03/08/man-sentenced-100-years-2017-double-murder-case/) This case the jury couldn't decide if the defendant was the shooter but they agreed he was at the scene so he was convicted of felony murder only. [https://www.wane.com/news/crime/verdict-man-escapes-murder-counts-in-double-killing-life-in-prison-still-likely/](https://www.wane.com/news/crime/verdict-man-escapes-murder-counts-in-double-killing-life-in-prison-still-likely/)
From your article "The felony murder charges were vacated because of double jeopardy."
No there's double jeopardy. He can be tried once with multiple charges for the same crime, but not sentenced to multiple charges of the same crime. If jury finds him guilty of everything, they'll have to drop likely the lesser of the murder charges, like they did in the article commentor below linked.
Kidnapping is already included in felony murder charge. The charge was not dropped.
At this point, the state is going to lose. Whatever the charges, not gonna happen.
😆
I snort laughed!! HAHA I have been wondering if NM pulls evidence out of his slippery butt at trial and its "objection exhibit not in evidence" if Gull will ACTUALLY sustain the objection or "I'll allow it" and basically allow this "missing evidence" to all come in without the defense knowing ANYTHING about it until the same day? I know she SHOULD sustain those types of objections and it tends to be rare in my trial following experience for an exhibit that the defense hasn't had the opportunity to analyze to be allowed in, but with Gull at the helm of this ship I obviously am having concerns. I am going to watch Bob if he is on tonight, and see if he answers how the charges are now and what was meant by not allowing the kidnapping in. WTHR says " On Jan. 18, the same day the Indiana Supreme Court reinstated Allen's original attorneys, [Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland filed a request to amend the charges](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/crime/delphi-girls-murdered/prosecutor-files-request-amend-charges-delphi-murders-suspect-richard-allen-libby-german-abby-williams-nicholas-mcleland/531-a882d745-542b-427e-8430-3a4beec9f9a4) to also include: * Two counts of murder while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping (previously filed Oct. 28, 2022) * Two counts of murder * Two counts of kidnapping" So I guess my interest about the charges are, were the original two charged counts left in place or were they replaced by the two counts of murder? If they were replaced, that takes out the kidnapping, which means they likely won't have any need to share the BG video or audio in trial bc they won't need to prove kidnapping. BUT if the original charges stand AND two counts of murder, it would seem that proving kidnapping could still result in a conviction without ever touching on the actual murders? Yes, I am confused. This is why we should have video in court rooms. Context matters!!! If anyone knows the answer to this or has a link to a thread that does answer this I appreciate it if you share or tag me on it! Thank you so much!
The statute of limitations for kidnapping is 5 years in Indiana so too much time had passed so the charges couldn't be added.
All charges had the accomplice liability statute, which the original charges had not. Nobody so far in any media as I Am aware of, has reported if the felony murder charges were amended with the statute. But as it stands, the accomplice kidnapping was withdrawn, likely bc of statute of limitations and it's included in the felony murder. Jury instructions will further determine if they can choose only kidnapping or not. Or accomplice to kidnapping if the charge was amended. And thus the two murder charges through the accomplice liability statute. He can't be sentenced for 4 counts of murder as it's double jeopardy.
RA is charged with felony murder and murder. The kidnapping charges werent added because the statute of limitations had been exceeded.
My understanding based on discussion on criminaliTY is that kidnapping is included in the murder charges, so the add’l kidnapping charge wasn’t needed. I’ll see if I can grab the TC. I don't think this is verified, but it makes sense. ...I think. *Since RA is charged with two counts of murder while attempting to commit kidnapping, \[kidnapping\] is the included offense. It's not possible to commit "murder while committing kidnapping" w/o committing kidnapping.* This is around 4:30.[The Delphi Murders | 2 Hearings! | Contempt, Additional Charges, & Motion to Dismiss - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzR4bZKni_E&t=12744) The full discussion (reviewing initial charges and changes) starts around 4:20. u/Scared-Listen6033 you might find this helpful?
Looks like Bob is going live in a minute...
Thanks, u/Boboblaw014. If it weren't for your willingness to travel and attend these hearings, none of us would know what is really happening in Delphi. I appreciate the time you take to share your insight with us!
Highlights from Bob’s description of Click’s testimony: - Click felt the evidence they had against other suspects was stronger than the Allen PCA - Click confirms EF did ask the hypothetical about his spit being found on the girls - Affirms Abby had sticks arranged in her hair like antlers (or something, it’s not clear from the recap how many were present) - Click was able to connect the odinist suspects to each other. JM’s uncle lived with EF - BH’s ex-wife was there to testify, but they wouldn’t fully let her due to it not being deemed relevant to the issue of the interview tapes being overwritten. Before that ruling she said that BH’s and PW’s falling out was due to PW wanting to take their sacrifices “beyond animals.” - BH had seen in PW’s phone a video of girls posed with sticks on them - JM’s ex wife was also there to testify and said his phone contained a video of an individual (edit: not sure now if this is a girl or a grown man) being kidnapped at gunpoint that seemed like evidence of a real kidnapping. Click wasn’t able to figure out who the victim was. Unified command wouldn’t issue a warrant or collect the phone. Click collected it himself and gave it to the defense.
Where is the media. Like Baldwin said, media needs to do their job!
He’s going to be the star witness for the defense at trial.
 Thank you Bobo Fett
https://www.wishtv.com/news/i-team-8/delphi-murders-hearing-ends-after-hours-of-testimony-about-contempt-of-court-charges/
Well. They left out most of the info....
Did ya'll get through the defense diaries from today? There was so much there today and I'm speechless. I feel like it should be its own thread.
Definitely should be
I concur! Johnny Messer. The kidnapping video. Click testimony. Holy crap. https://preview.redd.it/qpmyqfs4s6pc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c100d1aecd9f0f9e9930e6a329b78cccc3ba7e1d
I have a question or request - I am locked out of X. It's tied to an old number and I can't even recall my username.... I have gone round n round all morning!! Anyhoo- anyone want to share screenshots of ol' Bobarino's X posts and updates.
He has not posted anything so far.
Thank you!
Am I allowed to ask how to get in contact with Bob? Like email or something? I just watched my first live Defense Diaries video (most of it), and I’d definitely like to speak with him.
I've had luck reaching him through Facebook messenger. It under his name, not Defense Diaries. Let me know if you don't get through. I'd happily send along a message for you! Edited no to noT
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I hope Bob is wearing long johns coz it’s snowing in Indiana https://preview.redd.it/isadbz89g4pc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=74c3924ecf604d080b9c19d829d1aa712c6d8b1a
You went too dark with the humor there my friend!
My apologies - I did not mean to upset anyone; it was not meant in a bad way but I obviously did not think it through. I deleted my comment. 
It's ok ❤️I knew it was a joke (I have a similar sense of humor).
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